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GameStop Opening Deus Ex Boxes, Removing Free Game Coupon
DisKurzion writes "A leaked GameStop memo indicates that employees are to open the regular PC release of Deus Ex: Human Revolution and discard the included OnLive coupon. From the article: 'GameStop spokesperson Beth Sharum confirmed the practice, telling Ars that "Square Enix packed the competitor's coupon with our DXHR product without our prior knowledge and we did pull these coupons.'"
Isn't this tampering with a new product?
So... let me get this right.
If you're competing against a fast-growing distribution method that has the potential to completely under-cut your own business model, the best way to do that is to... engage in behaviour that will really piss a good portion of your customers off?
It's not actually the removal of the coupons that bugs me - it's the opening of the game boxes. I know that some retailers do this a lot - fortunately, it's rarer here in the UK than it is in the US. But I really don't like it - I've certainly bought "new" DS games in the past in the US that had saves already on the cartridge (presumably a staff member's).
It's not as if they're just competing against download distribution. I've never bought a game from Amazon or play.com that had been opened before it arrived (well, aside from the time our local post-office staff decided that stealing was fun, but that's another story) - and those are almost always cheaper. Seriously, do these bricks and mortar retailers even want to stay in business?
Actually, IANAL, but is there a legal issue here? If there's a reasonable expectation that every copy of the game includes this coupon and Gamestop are removing it, are they committing fraud or theft or something? Either from the consumer or from Square-Enix? I mean, surely Square-Enix must have a civil case here - and it's almost at the kind of level where it starts to sound criminal (if it happened in the UK at least).
ok so - why would they want to do this again - especially when Square didn't give them that authority..
Cool. I can violate every provision of the EULA, and it's GameStop that has to agree to the terms.
I wonder if that'll hold up in a court of law?
If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
This would be like my grocery store opening my cereal box to get the toy out so that I'm more likely to buy toys from the store.
Fucked. Up.
Attention deficit disorder is a complicated issue, spanning several major... HEY LET'S GO RIDE BIKES!
Smells like a lawsuit coming. Anti-competitive business practice, I believe. Something about using their market position.
Luckily, my crystal ball is back from the shop. It shows they will stop the practice, not pay any fine, and admit no wrongdoing. It will be clarified as a communication mistake and they will implement unspecified training to ensure it doesn't happen again.
... and this is why I don't buy my games from the galactic empire (gamestop) anymore...
Nom de dieu de putain de bordel de merde de saloperie de connard d encule de ta mere.
To think I wanted to work there as a child...
I don't know what the reasoning is, but they do it. They reseal them when they sell them. So it is nothing different for this one. If you demand factory sealed games, Gamestop was never a place you shopped.
Also to note Onlive isn't a distribution method. Onlive is a service where they run the games on their servers and stream you the video. The idea being you don't need to have a good computer to run the game. In reality it sucks badly since you only get a low bitrate 720p steam, meaning it does not look like you get with a high end system, more like with a low end one, and there's interface lag because of the network round trip.
In terms of digital distribution, Gamestop actually is in that business, they purchased Impulse some time ago so they now sell games online as well as in stores.
What a bunch of deusbags.
All that we see or seem is but a dream within a dream.
When I purchase something that is advertised as "New" I expect it to BE new. I want it to be sold to me as it was shipped from the distributor. By opening these boxes and removing whatever the fuck they want, are these games even allowed to be called "new" anymore? I avoid shopping at Game Stop to begin with (There is fortunately a local store that has better prices and more selection), but when I DO need to buy a "new" game from them... I'm going to start insisting that they only give me sealed boxes. If a game is not still factory sealed, I'm going to demand it be sold at the used price point, as this is essentially now an "open box" item.
True story. I went to Gamestop once to pick up Dragon Age: Origins. I'd seen the DLC advertised with a new copy, and that sounded like a good deal. The clerk offered me a used copy for slightly below the $60 asking price. I specified I wanted a new copy for the DLC, so he took the box out from behind the counter, I paid for it and left.
I got the game home, opened it, and there was no code for DLC included. Then I noticed the game had been unsealed and re-wrapped. I took it back to the store, presented the receipt and said, "Hey, you sold me a used game at full retail." The guy tried to backpedal, saying it was a new copy that had been opened for display purposes, and maybe someone had stolen the DLC code. It was late, so at that point I offered to take the used copy he'd previously offered if he gave me the right price for it. He then said that was the only copy they had (though he'd previously tried to sell me on a used copy before presenting me with the "new" one). He hastily provided me with a full refund.
Then I went to a competitor's store nearby, where I found a new (i.e. sealed) copy for $40, DLC included. I have not set foot inside a GameStop since. My definition of a "new game" is one that's gone from the factory to my hands without the contents of the box seeing daylight. GameStop, it seems, has other ideas.
I'm not surprised. Gamestop is a company without even the hint of decency. I stopped shopping there years ago. Ripoff trade-ins, irritating salesmen- no, I don't to preorder a game that's two year away asshole, inconsistent pricing, and worst of all- selling games as new after the employees opened them, played them, then put them back on the shelf. That's a used game, not a new game.
I've not purchased new games from GameStop in quite some time, however I have heard from a couple other people that they open every new copy and keep the CD or DVD behind the counter as an "anti-theft" measure. (There is no incentive to shoplift, as there is no media and/or key in the box.) At least one of the people I have heard this from complained to someone at id Software, with the concern over unscrupulous employees making copies of the keys to use themselves or sell.
I've got a better crystal ball - this is a tempest in a teapot, gamers will bitch and moan and do nothing about it, and life will go on. No lawsuit. No reckoning. Nothing.
My guess is that Square will sue not the gamers. They likely have contracts on what can be done to their product while it is in the hands of Gamestop before it's sold to the end customer.
Because they thought they wouldn't get caught?
Demanding constant attention will only lead to attention.
The Wired article on this does a more balanced job at handling the legal ramifications:
http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2011/08/gamestop-onlive/
Basically, Gamestop may be in the right, legally, if Square-Enix has a pre-existing contract with them with a non-compete clause. As the article states: “Existing contracts between GameStop and Square may have barred this kind of promotion, and so GameStop may actually be justified in their action if Square is in breach of some promotion/marketing agreement”
But they can also be in legal trouble over this, as the article also points out, for a number of different reasons.
Nowhere on the packaging does it say "Free OnLive coupon", apparently. I haven't looked at the packaging myself.
Does this mean I can get an Open box/Scratch & Dent price?
I quit shopping at Gamestop because they opened many of their boxes. Since they are selling new games along with used for consoles, how do you know which you will end up with? Case in point, I purchased a Nintendo DS game for my daughter. Christmas Day when she opened it up and put it in her DS there were saved games on it already - it had obviously been used. When I bought it, I mentioned that the box was not sealed, and they claimed that they had to do that else they would get shoplifted. I replied that other stores have less employees in the store but don't have their games opened and behind the counter.
Another time in a different Gamestop my son bought the PS2 game Devil May Cry, again the package was open and the had the discs behind the counter. A few days later while playing it asks him to insert Disc 2, which was not in the box. We went back to the store and they still had the 2nd disc.
In both cases they made good, but after those experiences they lost me as a customer, and I had been shopping there nearly every week since they were Babbages. It sounds like they have still haven't learned not to open packages.
In this case it's even worse - don't they have to break the security seal to get the coupon? In the old days they could just re-shrink wrap it, these days most games come with a security seal as well.
They likely have contracts on what can be done to their product while it is in the hands of Gamestop before it's sold to the end customer.
Doubtful. GameStop owns the product at that point and can do with it as they want. Anyone who is surprised by this news that GameStop opens these packages before selling them is apparently rather clueless because this is something they've done for years. Back in 2009 there was a big hullabaloo over it as well with a supposed FTC investigation but as you can see, nothing happened.
I don't see the gray area here. Imagine if they had removed the other collector's edition content so they could keep it for themselves, yet still sold it at full price as the collector's edition. It may be legal for them to take the content while they own it, but reselling it without disclosure after modifying it has to be fraud.
Plus you really have to wonder, if a retailer is willing to screw you over this way, what else are they willing to do to you?
Fortunately there are dozens of choices for who to buy games from. There's no hardship to removing Gamestop from the list.
49.99. Stores are so 2004.
If so, why? The few times I've gone in there ( "well, it's been a while, they have to have gotten better" ), I have left disappointed.
Mod me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
This is a shame. GameStop is a provider not a creator. They sell the products created by another party. They are a middleman between the creator and consumer (and certainly not the only one). They have stolen from the both production team and the gamers who purchased this product (be it legal or otherwise). Both should be outraged! This action is out of bounds and will, and should, lose them a great deal of credibility in the gaming market. I am looking forward to purchasing this game, but it will not be from GameStop. I will not be purchasing future games from them either.
Manufacturers never include coupons like this out of the goodness of their hearts (not that many of them have hearts!) - its entirely likely that these coupons have been paid for by OnLive as a promotional thing (They pay the game maker, who make money without doing anything, people redeem the vouchers, and a percentage carry on paying for the service - everyone profits.) In this case - wouldn't GameStop be defrauding OnLive of potential revenue they have paid for?
Original contents as provided by the manufacturer are now missing? By definition this is now a used game.
No one mentioned the first sale doctrine in the entire thread here. Obviously no one that has owned a business that buys merchandise wholesale and sells it retail cared to comment.
Unless they have an agreement that says otherwise they can do anything they want with merchandise they purchase before they resell it.
The stealing codes is semi-new. But opening the box and storing the disks somewhere else is something they've done for years.
The employees will even take the games home and play them, then they'll sell the games to you as 'new'. Except when activation codes don't allow that.
And claim they want another game in compensation for the theft.
When asked what game they want, I think i'd pay a grand to see the face of gamestop's staff when they say:
"do you have battletoads?"
Are there any lawyers (as in, licensed to practice law) who are gamers who are reading this willing to take this one pro-bono?
Everybody gets what the majority deserves.
Legal or not, this is pretty clearly poor practice for the customer and rather shady. But it's nothing new. Gamestop is little more then a pawn shop these days anyway. Their PC selection has been so pathetic for years that I'm surprised they even sell this game.
I stopped going there years ago when I went to buy a game and was instead lectured about how I should pre-order. I then walked across the street to a big box store and bought it without the lecture. This is a terrible company and as soon as their pawn shop business is taken away by the console makers they will go under. Can't say I'll miss them in the slightest.
-- "So they told me that using the download page to download something was not something they anticipated." - Bill Gates
Its pretty easy to get any computer software. Dues ex is already on torrents. The Key is what you have to pay for. Someone has opened the package and scene the key.
Now I get home and try to install and find my key has already been used. I call up Square Enix and tell them that i bought it at game stop. I think that gamestop will have a few irate customers and a pissed off manufacture
ok so - why would they want to do this again - especially when Square didn't give them that authority..
The coupon was for a digital download of the game via OnLive, or something similar -- Gamestop has a vested interest in killing off and preventing the rise of digital distribution.
People still buy things at Gamestop? Oh yeah wait, console people. Hahahaha, couldn't happen to a nicer bunch. What are you complaining about? This is all being done to protect you from nasty pirates, right? Enjoy the taste of someone else's distribution channel. After all, you are paying for this.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
I just got back from Gamestop and asked if they had any boxed copies that wasn't victimized by removing the coupon. The guy over the counter said he had no idea what I was talking about. It was extremely apparent the boxes had been opened however. Either he really had no idea as someone else did it (quite possible) or he was lying to my face.
More reasons not to buy from Gamestop. Regardless if I would want the coupon or not, essentially stealing from their customers by way of taking things we should be getting is just dirty. I don't care for the reasoning that "It's theirs before it's mine." They're a store, they should simply be the middleman to a sale. I should be getting the experience that the game developer and publisher is offering, not what Gamestop wants me to have. Not that Gamestop is above doing dirty things, seeing as they love to sell used games new. They're still doing that too. My girlfriend got a "New" DS game with a save already on it several months back.
This is PC copies of the game.
*shrug*
This doesn't bother me at all.
Unless they are re-sealing the boxes and are representing them as unopened, I don't see the problem.
Caveat emptor used to mean something.
Price, Quality, Time. Pick none. What, you thought you had a choice?
I could see a lawyer getting involved. Class action suit. End result being every Gamestop buyer of the game gets a new coupon mailed to them, and the lawyer gets a half million. There are strong incentives for lawyers to file class actions suits.
I think this has a reasonable chance, because Gamestop is selling something which doesn't match reasonable expectations. If asked, the manufacturer, and any other vendor, would tell you this had a coupon in it. Gamestop is getting rid of it without notice. Would it be ok if they ditched the manual? Obviously not.
Instant satisfaction is nice and all but we're done. I sent a nice to their customer service with a "before" jpg, my new power up card, which I was thinking of getting the "elite" version for. Then the new "after" one, shredded.
I though it was weird that the box was opened ! I quizzed the store employee and he assured me everything was in there. LYING BASTARDS ! They just lost my business (i bought all my games there)
People still buy things at Gamestop? Oh yeah wait, console people. Hahahaha, couldn't happen to a nicer bunch. What are you complaining about? This is all being done to protect you from nasty pirates, right? Enjoy the taste of someone else's distribution channel. After all, you are paying for this.
RTFA, even the summary before you spout off elitist crap and show us all what an intelligent bunch PC gamers are.
Wanna buy a shirt?
https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
If their return policy prohibits returning software after opening the box, why should I expect to pay full price for a product I don't even have the option of returning?
Then I go back to my opening statement - people still buy things at Gamestop? I don't own a console and honestly after giving up 3 years ago because all the Gamestops in my neighborhood only stocked console games (or a very limited selection of used PC titles), I vowed never to buy a game again from a brick and mortar store. Guess what - I don't have any problems using Gamersgate or better yet buying directly from the publisher and downloading. It saves me a drive and it helps keep a useless store clerk job out of the economy.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
I don't really game much anymore and so don't follow gaming news., but Deus Ex was an old favorite and I've thought about getting the new iteration. Good job Gamestop, your tactics made it made it to slashdot and my radar, introducing me to OnLive, something I hadn't heard of (or had and mistook it for a branding of Microsoft Live). Although I wonder how well it will actually work for me it seemed worthwhile enough to at least download the free client and watch some games in progress -- on a Mac where Deus Ex sn't otherwise available at that.
Not quite the Streisand Effect, but mostly because few here are as clueless about OnLive as I was. Gamestop, you don't yet seem to understand that every company memo is a public document these days.
I guess i won't be going to GameStop anymore. I hope they go out of business!
OnLive allows one to stream and play a game running on there servers. This way you don't need high powered hardware and can play on virtually any device (as long s there is a client).
one troll doesn't define a group
warning pointless sig
The PC Retail version is activated against a steam account just as if one went and bought half-life 2, counterstrike source, portal, cod: mw2... in a shop. So, all they've done is limited the use of one of 2 digital distribution methods included. This also begs the question though, why don't they give onlive codes to those of us who bought it on steam directly, or steam codes to those that bought it on onlive directly?
Square Enix should have printed the code on the manuals!
Or the disc itself
I've never bought games at Gamestop. Locally here I can get games at Target, Walmart, and Best Buy. All of which have a lot of stores Target and Walmart have a lot more than Gamestop) so it isn't like I have to go out of my way or anything. Online, hell I've got options, options and more options. Amazon would be the big one, good service and massive selection, but Newegg would be another major choice.
Gamestop has nothing near a monopoly.
had the coupon. But my local GameStop have always been kind of loose cannons who have managed to somehow get away with not giving a shit about what corporate tells them to do.
I have to admit this puzzles me. Who the hell goes to buy new PC games at Gamestop(I will admit I bought a 'new' copy of the BGII SoA and ToB edition, but this was in 2008 when it was 12 bucks)?
People who collect sealed box games like me could be held legally liable if we sell an item we believe to be unopened but later find out from the purchaser that this is not the case. Gamestop sells many special collector edition games and if they don't clarify their policy on this type of product tampering they stand to lose considerable business.
If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be-T J
If they have a "no return box openned policy" , jsut open the box, return it, and make a TERRIBLE STINK that your coupon for online is not in it and insist to have it returned.
I've tried out OnLive (disclaimer: my housemate is an employee) and I thought it was pretty good. Enjoyed playing Metro 2033 on it. I think people should give it a try and decide for themselves.
There's a free trial. http://www.onlive.com/service?autoplay=yes
game discs and manuals are usually stored in a separate location to the box for security.
so it would be technically opening the plastic pouch and removing the coupon.
OP was happy enough for one troll to define the group. I play both PC and console games - I play console games not because I care about piracy or being "hax0red" but because sometimes I don't want the hassle of installations and driver incompatabilities and badly thought out DRM solutions. Hell, Steam is one of the most popular distribution channels on the PC and that's even more locked down than consoles (I can let anyone with physical access to my copy of the game play it on their account on the console, or I can choose to sell the game on - neither option is available to me under Steam, so far as I can see), so I'm really not sure what his point was.
What they should have done is take the coupon out and replace it with one of their own. GameStop relies on the goodwill of their customers... this damages this good will.
Yes Francis, the world has gone crazy.
"the product is not a food item or medication, so there is no risk that their tampering causes bodily injury or death.. "
I believe that, the above quote being from mysidia, that yes, they DO understand that those rules exist because "they can become fatal when opened in wrong environment".
The question to ask now, is CAN YOU READ????
Or was this just you LEAPING to the defence of a company because you are so in love with the taste of their collective dick, and therefore couldn't see the post over the hairy ballsack?
I honestly can't believe we're still having this conversation. I stopped shopping there years ago, but obviously the whole "selling used goods at new prices" debacle didn't bother anyone else enough to actually make them change their behavior. I keep seeing more and more of the GameStop stores popping up all over the place, so it's the only conclusion I can draw. Stop bitching, and stop shopping there. Tell other people to stop shopping there. If they don't understand why, explain to them that they've been paying full price for used merchandise. I don't know how much simpler it could be.
Well...if you have been buying sealed collectible games for any amount of time you would already know to avoid Gamestop. They don't give a shit if it's collectible, special edition, if a Moogle jumps out and sings to you in Japanese. They will pocket the Moogle and charge you $20 over retail for the trouble.
There is one, and only one, reason to buy at Gamestop: Gameboy Advance used carts are often less than on eBay after shipping is figured in. If you don't have a GBA or DS that can play GBA carts, the store is pointless.
Then how can I be in a contractual relationship with the company distributing it (the EULA)?
And if it's owned by Gamestop, then isn't it a pre-owned game?
Or is that statement you made complete bollocks?
If GameStop "owns the product at that point" then they can't sell it as new, only as pre-owned.
You're a temporary arrangement of matter sliding towards oblivion in a cold, uncaring universe
You don't need to buy any games in a store, ever again (if you are on a pc/mac :whistle: )
Sounds like there may be cases of Gamestop employees distributing the free game codes elsewhere. So not only removing items from a package, but taking what is effectively a digital copy code for the same item and giving it away, creating a new copy of the item and possibly costing a Deus Ex sale. That would be pretty serious right?
http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?589922-Gamestop-removing-OnLive-vouchers-from-Deus-Ex&p=14315880#post14315880
This is funny... I don't see what the big deal is anyhow. Technically you don’t own the game anyhow when you do buy it. You simply own the right to use it. For anyone that is buying the PC version, they should know by now that buying a game in the store is pointless when you can just download it from such providers like Steam. As long as they don’t scratch the DVD's or crack open a collector’s edition, then who cares about a stupid coupon that you can get for free online. The only people that should be pissed is the game manufacturer due that the coupon was a sponsor and probably paid them to put it in there. However, GameStop purchased the game to sell it... So before you own the box, they own it and can do what they want with it. If anything the games manufacturer should just not do business with them for a bit or ship their product out a day later to teach them a lesson. What hurts a business more then not having the greatest product on your shelf before anyone else?
I am the Store Manager at a top-tier gaming retailer in rural Australia.
Why do we open boxes/cases? Because the disc and relevant DLC coupon/manual for an $80 game would be stolen five seconds after it was put on the shelf as shipped. Want an untouched copy? Pay the (less than normal retail, usually) price and pre-order a copy.
I will be more than happy to look out for great games for you, advise you in spending your hard-earned dollar, and offer considerate after-sales service.
If you want to walk in, make me price match somewhere 200km away, and never come back -- you get what you get. Which is: shut up.
so there is no risk that their tampering causes bodily injury or death..
Oh, I don't know... It sounds like an awful lot of people on this board are upset about this, which could in an edge case cause bodily harm or death to GameStop employees..
//not that I condone violence...
If they really want to hurt their competitor, shouldn't they be stuffing the "get something from our competitor for $0" coupons into everything they sell??
I used you simply because you were convenient, the closest game retailer to my apartment.
But if you're telling me that practices like this are A-OK in your book? Just...no. This is wrong both morally and legally.
I'll be buying my ps3/3ds games from amazon from now on.
What do I know, I'm just an idiot, right?
im not op, nor do i defend his actions,
btw console gaming sucks because the indie market is a 2nd thought
warning pointless sig
This is about the PC version, you illiterate moron.
I guess they're too dumb to use a scanner and an empty DVD case.
Twinstiq, game news
Standard operating procedure. Gamestop even opens PC games if you can find one in their store, even the boxes that say "Not valid for sale if opened." I made the mistake of buying a PC game there once and they didn't give me the CD key card. I had to call the store when I got home, and they read it to me over the phone. Never again.
I used to work at Babbage's, which would later become GameStop. Policy allowed employees to "check-out" software, take it home and then come back and seal it. This was all sold as new software (Babbage's didn't sell used software or games). This gave the employees an opportunity to use the software (or games) gaining experience with it, and thus better able to work with customers. For example, knowing whether a customer would like game X or knowing if some software would be more useful than another. The last time I was in a GameStop you could hardly find the section with PC software, so I'm not really sure why this is an issue. I bought Portal 2 from them and they had to retrieve it from a back room (was not out on the shelf).
So it wouldn't surprise me if GameStop still allows their employees to check-out software and re-seal it. In this day with pervasive DRM, I'd just avoid them all together.
Or used the same authentication code that the user needs to key in to install and run the game on their computer to be the same code that is used to play it on OnLive's servers.
Seriously people!