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Being Honest In Exit Interviews Is Pointless
Esther Schindler writes "Say that you're leaving a job, either on your own volition or because they decided it was time for you to 'pursue other opportunities.' Before you leave, the HR department wants to chat with you about the employment experience, in an exit interview. 'Oh goodie,' you think. 'Now I can really tell them what I really feel.'
Don't do it. If your employer couldn't find the time to ask you what was good or bad about working at the company while you were still working there, writes Lisa Vaas, why bother with honesty and potentially burned bridges now? (If they did ask, give them constructive feedback before you leave this job; they deserve it). Discuss."
Easier headline: exit interviews are pointless.
Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
Any slashdot submission that ends in 'Discuss' should be rejected.
Let be honest, you must lie at EVERY interview. Exit, Enter, Middle, Top, Bottom, Pointless, etc interview. You may NOT tell the truth. You MUST lie like...like politician. At the end of the day, all the HR do believe that you LIE. So why disappoint them?
Suck it.
Same goes for college exit interviews. Completely pointless. They wouldn't to me when I was going to school there, why should I care if they will or won't listen to me once I'm done.
How do I tell my HR drone that the boss is a greedy Jew rat that's too busy counting shekels to notice that he's a curse upon the earth?
Redundant. They know he's a greedy number cruncher, that's why he was promoted.
And sure, I've only ever worked anywhere for a day, but at least I can hold my head high. If I ever find somewhere that lets come back for a second day, I think I've found a winner.
I have a scorched earth policy.
Happened to me when they ran out of people to do the work.
The same way you said this garbage ... as an anonymous COWARD. Don't bother. You'll just confirm that you are a assmaster.
Tell me what you believe...I'll tell you what you should see.
Exit interview conclusions about you could be used against you to deny you future employment at that company or elsewhere. No sense in burning bridges, and also no sense in inadvertently closing bridges either.
Posting anonymously for obvious reasons.
If it is someone that can actually make changes be honest. If its an HR person forget it.
I love Jesus, except for his foreign policy.
Don't post a story to /. and end it with "Discuss". That is condescending and pointless, and removes much of my desire to actually participate in the discussion.
Say nothing but good things -
Tell the boss how good they are even tho they are the worst type of asshole in the universe
Thanks the co-workers for their generous help and guidance even tho they are clumsy back-stabbers
Give great praises the company even tho they are giving you the pink slip
That will make them happy, and happy people (often) do not find time to do more harm to you, leaving you plenty of peaceful time to look for new jobs
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
Discuss.
How did this make the front page?
Why would you? Exit interviews are for the employer's benefit, not yours. Any changes they make will be after you're long gone. All you're doing is providing free consulting. Unless you think saying positive things about a boss will get back to them, don't waste your time.
I have to disagree. Being honest can serve two purposes: a) it can be extremely satisfying, if you have had a very bad time of things and they are coming to an end, and b) it can highlight bad managers or other employees that have caused you so much grief and they might be reined in so that they don't continue to make life hell for others.
I had an appallingly bad manager some time ago who made my life hell with his ultra-micromanagment and his constant snooping. He finally drove me to leave and there was a bit of a showdown - I wouldn't exactly call it an exit interview but his boss was there. I told him exactly what I thought of him and why he was such a bad manager. I think he was actually surprised that his 'style' caused so much friction. Interestingly (though too late) several people came forward afterwards and told me they had had the same experiences with the same guy, and had asked for transfers to get away from him. My response of leaving was more extreme, but driven by the same problems. I heard a few weeks later he did get moved (not fired, unfortunately) and given a role that did not involve direct people-management. So these things can have a positive result for those you leave behind.
Baby, it's not me, it's you. If you'd have treated me better, I'd stay but this has been going on for too long.
Look, I've already begun seeing someone else and I don't want to cheat on you. Let's still be friends. Really, there's someone out there in this big world who is just right for you but that's not me. I really want you to be happy but I want to be happy too. I gotta go. I'll pick up my things later.
Then set in the west.
There's nothing for anyone to gain, no follow-up, no repercussions, etc.
Move on.
Advice is not free.
I had a worthless boss at a job I left, I requested an exit interview with the head of HR. They didn't normally do exit interviews, but I had been there for 6 years, so they wanted to know why I was leaving. Took a few months after I left to find time for a meeting, but I laid it all out. How I felt, why I left... 2 months later I got a call to come back. They fired my old boss after I opened their eyes to the BS he was pulling. I went back.. with a nice raise and a $4k signing "bonus". It works in certain cases. YMMV.
-Guns kill people like spoons made Rosie O'Donnell fat-
I worked for the biggest jerk in the world, and when I quit, I told H/R the things he had done to me, and urged them to not just take my word but to ask around.
Later that week, they fired him and escorted him out (not typical there).
The next day, my former coworkers had a going-away party for him, but they didn't invite him (and they did invite me).
Just because you weren't treated the with respect doesn't mean you can't be a better person and treat them professionally along with respect. Why be an asshole just because you can? Life has an uncanny habit of "What goes around, comes around." Plus you can use this as an opportunity to practice your diplomacy skills.
That's the problem with the world -- people just don't care. Maybe if enough people set a proper example there would be less apathy.
I think my "Bite My Hairy Ass" speech is both informative and entertaining.
Thank you, Captian Obvious! You've saved the day once again!
When my contract for Hewlett Packard was terminated a couple of years ago, I never got an exit interview - and why should I have? I was just a lowly contractor (who HP considered hiring directly, but my contract forbid it). Had they interviewed me, I would've had positive things to say, some suggestions, all very constructive as that's my style when it comes to communication in working environment. Instead what I got was various incompetent people talking shite about my work behind my back after I had already left. And I would never have heard of it, had I not met an ex-colleague in a bar who told me years later just how bad it was... and this was not the only thing HP screwed up when terminating my contract.
My opinion: make sure you get your exit interview, you can affect just how badly your career can be sabotaged without you necessarily ever knowing why you're not getting that job you applied for.
PS. Only after writing this I noticed this article is hosted by, who else than, HP. Oh the irony.
I gave a good honest exit interview when i left my first fulltime software job.. Wasnt a asshole, and kept it professional, mixed in what i didnt like and what i thought they did real well. The company has hired me back 3 times. Did the same thing at all 4 exit interviews, and maybe if i ever need a job again (with this market one never knows) i will get hired back, and that is worth a lot to me personally. But theres been a couple other places i burned the bridge down from shore to shore, not even a splinter left. Assholes had it coming....and i delivered.
-KI
#include bier;
Sometimes the best exit interview involves gasoline and a plane ticket to the Bahamas. All work and no play makes Milton a dull boy.
If you're leaving otherwise secure employment for greener pastures, is it really worth your time to do an exit interview? If your leaving for money, realize that your time is now worth what you're getting paid at the new place!
I say Politely Decline!
Or if they insist, schedule one for the last day you are there, and don't show up.
Here's why,
1. It's too easy to say stuff you might regret. Your leaving, your shoulders are light, and your tongue is heavy. You never know who is friends w/ that HR guy.
2. Even if you are rational enough to point out exactly what was wrong w/ this company w/o belittling anyone, How can you articulate that in a way that won't burn a bridge or how will HR interpret that?
3. You can't resist telling them off? Write a letter to HR, and whomever else you think might need to know. It'll be quicker than an interview, and you can sit on it before sending it. You will probably have someone actually read it.
4. Plan to leave like you're coming back next year. The grass isn't always greener (trust me, I made a lateral move for a higher end potential only to take a per hour pay cut north of 30%, My former boss only has to slightly hint that one day they'll need additional staff before I tell them I'm ready to come back. In my personal hypothetical future case, it won't be my boss, I'm actually quite fond of their leadership, it'll be the guy 2 levels up, who publicly mocked how we had to work all this OT, but not 1 breath later mentioned he's getting a fat bonus check for meeting our deadlines.
(This really happened in front of > 75 people.)
How much is your data worth? Back it up now.
Be professional. Offer positive recommendations. Don't crap in the pool cause no matter how large the city, everybody knows everybody.
The article seems to assume being honest also means being a dick. It doesn't. It's possible to give honest and constructive opinions during the exit interview without burning bridges. Being dishonest isn't going to help them improve and it won't give you any satisfaction. Be honest, but be constructive and specific, sometimes it really does help. (Often it doesn't, but you won't know unless you try.)
I just left my employer of nearly six years and, at my exit interview, said that everything was peaches and cream, lying through my teeth the whole time. I figured, yeah, I could vent like hell, but a) it wouldn't do any good - as a huge company, they're not going to change based on my opinion; and b) I might need to go back, someday. I'd rather gargle with a mixture of glass, shards of razor blades, and lye, but never say never. So I was "nice" and said all the "right things," even though I hate lying.
Your particular case is THE exception that proves the rule, on a number of levels:
(Rule#1) Never be honest in an exit interview, particularly if you expect to ever work again;
(Rule#2) Especially never be honest with anyone in HR -- they have an acute sensory perception of Bravo Sierra;
(Rule#3) Normal corporate SOP is the Peter Principle (like promotion to VP), not the Firing of a bad boss.
With your good luck / fortune / karma, you shouldn't even need to work. Why haven't you bought that lottery ticket yet?
YMMV? Ha, ha , ha, ha ... LOLZ. ROTFLMAO.
Or if they insist, schedule one for the last day you are there, and don't show up.
I like this one. What are they going to do? Fire you?
1. Complement them on their company and its direction
2. Tell them they shouldn't have to wait for the exit interview to communicate effectively with their employees.
3. "Thanks! Bye!"
Exit interviews are about statistics, not about gathering opinionated solutions. If they seem to act on your advice after you've left, it'll be due to the stats, not your once off rant.
Task Mangler
I have worked with a lot of HR types over the years and the vast majority of them are worthless steaming piles. Harassment legislation here in the US gives them an overinflated sense of worth and power. Anyone that has been around for a while knows how to game the system when it comes to interviews with HR types. You just throw around a few buzz words, enough to baffle their feeble pea-sized brains, and it's off to round two. Once you are an employee you can expect nothing useful from them. You'll get the annual benefits signup, which is most likely self service anyway. If you dare ask any questions it will surely be met with a condescending sneer. You'll get a notification that it's time to take the BS harassment seminar that everyone sleeps through. At the end of it all you'll get the exit interview. Now if I thought it would do any good to tell them what I really thought of their company I might open up. But the exit interview only occurs under one of two circumstances - I got pissed off and quit or they fired/laid me off. In neither case am I going to be in a great mood. If I quit it's because the company is messed up. What good is it going to do to tell them it's messed up? I'll just end up looking like a malcontent. If I get laid off I might end up saying something that I'll regret later so better to just bite your tongue and move on. Here's the dirty little secret - the HR drones don't give a shit what you think either way. They'll just laugh about it in the lunch room later that day. Here's the other dirty little secret - even if you did tell the HR drone how to improve their company nobody on the business side will listen to them. They are the hall monitors of the business world. Remember that kid in high school that got stuffed into a gym locker? He's working in HR now.
I left a bloated University bureaucracy and there was nothing I could do or say that would have made one iota of difference in the political warfare that was the IT Depts. I could have ranted on about the mismanagement and waste and it would have been good chuckle-fodder for the Division head as he went to his next meeting with the president to spend another million on the buzz word gotta have of the day. I took the high road said almost nothing in my exit.
Now.. if you are in an organization that gives a crap..thats a different story and they might use the exit as a tool but imho, any company over a thousand or so..its just a waste of time and paper to push.
The article also says they sometimes fire bad managers over exit interviews. And let's be honest, that's the effect you want from exit interviews, right?
In any case, be a politician. Don't be TOO honest. But if your boss was a total dick and you know he's not going to help you in the future anyway, go ahead and tell on him.
Of course, some companies don't listen, but you can laugh at them when they go out of business so much more satisfyingly if you done told 'em.
Democracy Now! - your daily, uncensored, corporate-free
Don't be honest. Smother them with nice words to the point ridicule.
Don't be delusional and think everyone plays nice.
Most people are awful creatures that take peverse pleasure out of hurting you (in my experience - and no don't tell me I've had a unique experience. I've lived and worked in 4 countries in several different industries, and several companies per industry/country).
I have met a few nice people though too, and they are the ones you stay in contact with.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
01. Keep a diary of your managers and co-workers actions in all their asserholery. Secretly tape meetings and keep copies of all emails. Also email back a confirmation of any mutually contradictory directive any one of your line manager(s) may give you.
...
02. Say nothing but good things -
03. Tell the boss how good they are even tho they are the worst type of asshole in the universe
04. Thanks the co-workers for their generous help and guidance even tho they are clumsy back-stabbers
05. Give great praises the company even tho they are giving you the pink slip
06. That will make them happy, and happy people (often) do not find time to do more harm to you, leaving you plenty of peaceful time to look for new jobs
07. When you've found a new job post evidence derived from 01 to their competitors and online
Realistically, feedback is feedback. When you take away the way it was delivered, you're left with the simple message. No matter when your former company asked you for the feedback, they still asked the question. Besides, giving feedback with tact can still be as pleasurable and it may show of qualities in you that you may have not previously demonstrated, which could ultimately leave the door open for reemployment...if you had to. You could also help out now former coworkers improve their current situation.
/. post! =d
The important part of all of this, and where some people go wrong, is the way the feedback was delivered. Often when people are in these kinds of situations, especially if you're on the getting canned side of things, their emotions are running high. This will sometimes mean that you're running in more of a 'primal' mode rather than thinking about your message. As a result, it can look like a impassioned rant or a blubbering pile of incoherent blabbering (on the extremes). If providing feedback, it's important to place this kind of feedback in an actionable, realistic way. Keep emotion out of the situation.
When responding, try to answer in capsules of information presented in a very factual, respectful manner and including details along the way. For example, "I find that the relationship I had with Peggy Sue was great in many ways. She always greeted me. Though, there were some challenges that ultimately resulted in my decision to terminate our employment relationship. I found that her style was a little too hands on and I felt like she didn't trust me to run with a project to the finish line. For example, recently we were working on using genetic cloning to make a white horse that also grew a unicorn horn. I almost had the base sequences aligned and only needed a few more days to make it perfect. Peggy Sue surprised me with a check up regarding this project and was in the impression that I had finished my plot and decided that she would now take over the project and assigned me to start figuring out how to make pigs fly. This is one example of this type of behavior, I can provide more if needed."
Another critical part of delivering the how is making sure your tone of voice remains neutral, even slightly positive and forward thinking. Since this is text based, I'll try to explain my meaning... Think about a time when you've gone out for dinner and the server you've had is simply amazing. The kind of experience you walk away from saying 'yeah, they were good!' What did their tone of voice sound like? I'm not really saying you have to sound like a sultry temptress (damn you, hooters girls!) or that really flaming gay dude at the gap....but they were into their job and had passion in their voice enough to say that they really cared about the situation, but not enough to get creepy about it.
PS: Huzzah for first registered
Saying negative things about people is rarely in your interest.
Seriously.
Try not to answer any of the questions directly. They want to know if litigation is imminent, if you'll be applying for unemployment or disability, if you'll be a security risk or breach confidentiality. You answer all that by saying;
"Thanks for the opportunity here. I have a new opportunity that I just can't turn down."
Find creative ways of answering every question they pose with some facsimile of the above.
There's no point in telling them more about their company -- it's not your problem anymore. Move on. If they really want you and make a counter-offer, tell them that you'll consider it, and then do. Consider it. And what would have to change to make staying worthwhile.
If they don't ask. Don't offer.
I don't normally reply to anon or trolls, but what the devil are you smoking? What a total misuse of "THE exception that proves the rule" you blithering monobrowed goatbanger. This instance the exception BREAKS the rule, making it not a rule. Dear lord.
Here, read up on it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exception_that_proves_the_rule
http://www.zombieapocalypse.tv/
I was painfully honest. They had real issues. I had previously on several occasions told my boss what they were. Nothing changed. I asked for a layoff and was told the company would never lay someone who was skilled off. So I quit for unemployment. Told them so. Won't change anything I'm sure, but my conscience is clear.
andy
...and then be blandly pleasant. Otherwise, just don't do it. What are they going to do, fire you?
I'm always amused at the naive goodwill that people extend to their employers. Most of us live in at-will states, without unions, and without any real workers' rights that can be exercised without spending more than they're worth retaining counsel. These are the people who can fire you at any time for any reason, but they want two weeks' warning if you leave on your own. Why give them extra freebies?
Look, forget the employer-employee bullshit. You are a vendor, selling a service. Your employer is a customer. As long as they're buying what you're selling at the best price you can get (which includes work conditions and perceived job security as well as pay and benefits), the customer is always right. As soon as they stop buying, or you find someone willing to pay more, then go attend to your new customer. The old customer wants to take more of your time for free? Politely decline. You're running a business -- you -- and the only point in giving something away free is if it leads to another sale.
Don't bother with work ethic or pride in your job at this point. Those are good concepts and they have their place, but that place is well before anyone starts talking about exit interviews. If you're leaving voluntarily, they treated you well, and you feel like extending the courtesy, sure. But even then, don't say anything that can be used against you later. It's just business, and that's how they see it. Go and do likewise.
Proud member of the Weirdo-American community.
They can tell all their buddies that you're a sore thumb that won't stay nailed down.
Be gracious and complementary where you can with honesty. Most jobs should have something you can appreciate.
Then go post a review on Glassdoor or some other company review site. It's somewhat satisfying and you'll do more good for others that might work there than you ever could in an exit interview. Plus if management really is interested in honest opinions it's there for them to seek out.
If you really might be interested in ever working at the place again, someday, then sure -- make sure your exit interview reflects the positives you saw in the company. If not though? I really don't believe most places would bother doing exit interviews at all if they never paid any attention to what was said in them. (Yeah, I know some of you insist these are only to make some busy work for the H.R. department. But at least in the small to medium-size companies I've worked for, H.R. was quite busy just navigating all the red tape involved in the company's health insurance program, plus any 401K or other benefits programs, not to mention all the "little stuff" they were asked to do each day, like adding up hours on people's time-cards and recording the data in Excel spreadsheets used by managers, or handing out paychecks each week, or keeping up with people's vacation requests. I don't think they needed more "busy work"!)
I doubt it will do anything but potentially burn a bridge if you "vent", ranting and raving about how horrible the place was. They're more likely to remember you as that "bitter guy who we're all glad left this place" than anything else.
BUT, I do think if you're honest, but diplomatic and professional in your exit interview, you could definitely still single out problem managers or bad policies, explaining why they posed problems for you (while still talking about anything good you noted while working there). I know such comments DO get kept on file and help build a case against certain employees over time.
For example, I once knew a guy who was considered a "lifer" at the company he was in. It was clear HE intended to stay until the day he retired, and he seemed to have enough respect with the owners so they regarded him as an asset worth keeping. In reality, he constantly requested assistants or interns to help him with his job and in case after case, those people were fired by him or voluntarily quit, because they couldn't stand him any longer. Even managers in one of the other buildings would talk about him behind his back regularly, asking how it was possible he needed extra help to do his job, yet a simple request they asked him to do would take days or weeks to accomplish. By doing it themselves, it got done far more quickly.
I know for a fact he was blasted repeatedly in exit interviews - and all of those people probably decided their comments had no effect, since he still had a job after they were gone. But guess what? When the economy slowed down, he was one of the first people they decided they'd have to do without due to budget cuts. (And while they'd never admit it officially? Off the record, H.R. expressed a lot of unhappiness with the guy's attitude and failure to "straighten up" after warning him.)
Change can be maddeningly slow in companies, especially when they're afraid of lawsuits and/or it's a matter of convincing a whole group of managers to get on the same page about what starts out as someone's opinion. But in the long haul, yes, I think those negative exit interview comments have a cumulative effect.
Tell them to go fuck themselves and walk out with your head held high.
The only benefit to you in an exit interview is data you can glean from them, and any satisfaction from acting out will burn you in the long run. So get outside yourself and attempt to join forces with the person interviewing you so you both can avoid having to do this in the future. You'll have time for complaining about the bad times when you're with your buddies at the bar.
The ideal exit interview gets to the heart of the problem without pointing fingers. It is impartial, it gets information as often as it gets, and it helps you grow as a person:
It's not "my boss was the worst asshole in the world," it's "I couldn't find a way to improve my work relationship with my manager. Maybe it was a personality clash, but I had taken these steps [insert steps], and felt that my attempts were rebuffed. Can you think of ways I might have done better?"
It's not "you guys are so great I'm so sad and you'll do great," it's "I know we didn't really get along, please be honest, what do you think most damaged our work relationship? [hear answer] Oh, good points, I thought it was also this [insert problems]"
And if you're being polite and constructive and they're they opposite, then ask to cut it short and move on with your life.
I think you must have miss-read the subject. Everyone knows that people who can fuck themselves never leave the house, much less hang around a workplace waiting for exiting employees to storm out of the building,
This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
To boil it down, does it ever make sense to say fuck you to somebody you will never see again? Some may even draw satisfaction from that response. Sometimes, a respectful farewell is the biggest fuck you of all.
Was a very unique case since the company focused on a market outside of Software Development, which I was hired to do.
* Company blindly hires bad management - A bullshitter gets far nowadays
* The management convinces HR my boss is no longer needed because they find them as a threat - he ran multiple departments and was well respected.
* My boss is laid off and lets HR know the gritty details of his boss - it should be obvious to HR when a manager is hiring all of his unemployable friends.
* In the process, the teams managed by employee realize the injustice that just took place.
* Within weeks, almost everyone resigns, including myself - everyone I worked with had no problem finding a new job - leaving the company without a product.
* In our exit interviews. I, plus many others spoke the truth about the events and injustice done by management, reinforcing how our boss felt.
* HR sees this as a problem and escalates the issue straight up the ladder.
* Management (and friends) are terminated and company announces mistake at a company meeting.
Too bad the damage was already done, and based on what I heard from friends that still work there, the company paid for it dearly in losses.
Employees given exit interviews are slightly less likely to sue. The firing side could care less about your input, it's a last gasp opportunity to manage you.
"Who is the Journal of Quantum Physics going to believe?" --Stephen Hawking
Be polite. Be professional. Be prepared to kill everyone you meet.
OK... Just kidding about one of those.
A single answer to this question misses the context. You have to judge the situation to determine what kind of an exit interview to have. Is the organization open to feedback? If you have worked any length of time in an org, you should have a pretty good idea of whether honest feedback would be useful or not. Using the exit interview for venting maybe cathartic in the short term but not very useful for the long term.
I don't even _go_ to exit interviews. My responsibilities are to ensure a smooth handover of work, not partake of some airy-fairy feel-good exercise to justify HR's existence.
... what if I'm ACTUALLY going to lunch? Should I tell them I'm visiting a titty bar?
Mate, that's one of the BEST mixed metaphors I've ever encountered. Congrats for raising a chuckle.
"Shoot straight you bastards! Don't make a mess of it."
Have gnu, will travel.
If a business can't handle honesty, they are probably not running very well. Let them have it.
Nothing to see.
A extremely wise manager once told me, people do not quit their jobs, they fire their bad managers.
Got Code?
I've never told anyone how I've felt about working with them: "be careful of the toes you step on today, as they may be connected to the arse you have to kiss tomorrow"
If you're in an industry where NDA's and Non-competes are normal, you have to be especially careful at Exit Interviews because they can later be used against you. I know someone who was leaving for a competator working on a non-related product, and his exit interview was basically them grilling him trying to find anything to use to grant an injunction. When I eventuially leave my company, I am pretty much going to skip the interview for this reason.
I left them hanging a bit. I never ever said anything bad, and was very guarded about saying anything good (I was vague about the good stuff, but make it sound positive). My outlook was like what others have stated. If they want to know so badly how much I think of the place, they could have asked for input when I wasn't on the way out. They were damn uninterested when I was there. Mind you I never heard hardly anything about anything anyway. I was a unix guy in a very pro-microsoft shop. When the unix boxes went out the door, I wasn't long after. There wasn't a lot of writing on the wall. They had security, stability, scalability and configuration problems. They had people wanting to play games on servers and high end machines that were only to have very specific programs loaded onto them (and loading games on microsoft machines means the game overrides libraries that are needed by core applications so the games can run). By loading I mean overwriting. When the game is over and the critical application is needed "hey, this thing suddenly broke!?! Help support people...." Some part of me wanted to leave: the systems I was used to stayed 'up' for years, not days. Rebooting weekly for stability seemed like a stupid waste of time, but that was the plan. They built a flaky system, chose a flaky O/S, and deserved all the problems it gave them.
Is an assmaster some sort of exercise device?
Not unlike your ex calling you to discuss the "reason" for the break up yeah? Nothing good comes out of whatever reason there were, ever. Why? Because every single relationship is complex and different, much like jobs. The lessons you learned in the last one can mean diddly in the next, well, some are valuable and might help with the next.. ..Until you break up again. Now explain that.
I only say good things when I go as that's the least you can do.
I don't think exit interviews are pointless. When I left Nortel they gave me an exit interview, and I told them all the things wrong with the company. They must have taken what I said to to the executive management, because not long after I left they folded up the operation. Hardly a waste of my time, if I say so myself.
Bet this is not noticed or upvoted or however it works here, but I will post anyways. I mainly read the articles and many of the comments and appreciate this site. I rarely comment on items, as others have already said it better than I. It is the 2nd site I go to everyday.
But maybe this may be interesting:
Before I was in Tech. I worked in Insurance as a Field Adjuster working on Commercial Claims, Public Body Claims and just about anything that could create a Claim. I worked for the 2nd largest Company in the World at the time. They went through a major merger in the early 80's. They brought in an outside Claims Manager for our 150 - 200 person Office. Said Office handled Underwriting, Loss Control, Claims and support services.
The Manager took it upon himself to harass those in the Claims Department as a soon as he arrived. I had already had been in the business for 7 years and knew what I was doing. He started with the Adjusters first of which I was one of 12. He made life hell for 6 of us and then came to me.
I did not take any of his shit. And dished it back and then some. We had some heated one way discussions, where I took the lead pointing out where he was a prick and wrong. My language was that of a raging sailor and I was not shy as to whether others heard me. When he took me on, I had already started to network and was actively looking for a job. To give myself time, I filed a Stress Claim with the backing of my Doctor and took 2 weeks of paid time off. Claim was accepted by Workman's Comp. Very soon I secured a job at a different company with no difficulty that gave me more benefits and a 15% increase in wages. My responsibilities actually were decreased in the new position.
I got the new job on a Tuesday evening. On Wednesday morning, I gave notice that I was taking my 2 weeks vacation, starting on Friday, that I had a new job and my last day there was Friday of that week. Wednesday morning I ceased answering my phone [had a very good relationship with the main receptionist and she supported me and routed "all" my calls to the Manager and I received many calls in a day]. I sat at my desk Wednesday, Thursday and Friday doing nothing. I read the paper. Called friends. Read books. Took long lunches. And just behaved myself in my cubicle. I did this until Friday at 4:00pm, the time for the Exit Interview. Being a Field Adjuster I had an assigned Company Car which I continued to drive.
On Friday I had my "exit" Interview. I left nothing out. Every gory detail was given. I had kept notes. Although it was not my purpose, I had the H.R. person in tears. I apologized to her profusely, said it was not her fault. She was in tears because she knew this guy had destroyed a department and affected others in other departments.
I finished up at about 5:45pm. The Manager approached me, I told him to fuck off and have a good life. No one had made arrangements about the Company Car, so I had driven my wife's new Nissan 300xz that day and left the Company Car at home. I gave him the keys and had him sign a document I had prepared, absolving me of any responsibility as to the Company Car parked in front of my house.
Did I burn my Bridges? No. The Claims Community in my major PNW metro area was close knit. The message had gotten out.
The Manager was fired 6 weeks later. I also learned that he stopped his harassment immediately. The other 5 Adjusters in line later thanked me.
To the best of my knowledge he never worked in the Insurance Field again.
9 months later, I received a call from Bill H., an Owner of an Elite and well respected, Independent Adjusting Company. I was happy where I was at with my new Company, but he persuaded me to come and talk to him anyway. I ended up taking that job and a very substantial increase in Salary and Bonuses. Independents work on the Billable hour, so in less than a year I had doubled my Income, not including more benefits and a better Company Car. And as an Independent, I was as c
Everything depends on why you are leaving.
Case 1: You are leaving because you had a better offer from another company. In this case, you have nothing in particular to gain by telling the exit interviewer anything at all. You neither benefit by telling the truth nor by lying.
Case 2: You have been fired. Again, you have nothing to gain by either telling the truth or lying.
Case 3: You have been laid off as part of a reduction in force and there is a possibility that if business improves they'll hire you back. In this case you have something to gain by flattering the company and its people. Tell them how much you regret leaving. Tell them they were great to work with and you wish things were different.
Case 4: You are leaving because you didn't like the working conditions, had moral objections to the way management runs the company, your boss was a giant prick, etc. You have nothing to gain by telling the truth or lying.
But in the absence of having anything to gain, there are still motivations that come into play. Would you like to make working conditions better for the people you're leaving behind? Chances are you don't despise all of them. Identify the wasteful and counterproductive practices, useless or abusive bosses and meaningless makework that were part of your job. Tell your interviewer how they made your job harder and are still making others lives harder. Maybe, just maybe, this information will get to the right people, especially if you were a highly productive employee. Somebody knows that. In all likelihood your boss and maybe your boss's boss know that. And now they know they are losing productive employees in part because of their working environment.
In most cases, you should lie about salary. Tell them you are taking a job that pays more, allows you more control of your work and offers more benefits. HR is always trying to find the lowest total cost of benefits and salary at which they can hire and retain the people they need. It is in all workers' best interest if their estimates are pushed to the high side. And the HR people at the company you're leaving talk, directly or indirectly, to the people at the company you're going to, and to every other company where you or someobody you care about might eventually work.
What I want to do after leaving the job, why I want to leave the job is no one else's business.
You have the right to decline any requests for an exit interview.
Are you trying to make the world a worse place than it already is? Fuck you! Honestly.
Forget all the "hey burning bridges rulz!" talk posted here; regardless of how bad it gets. You never know when a former boss might end up some place else you apply, or word-of-mouth spreads in some innocuous conversation about your application. The reality is the hiring process is loaded with ceremonial BS like trap questions and dress-up clothes you wear only to interviews. You can play the game or "keep it real" as Dave Chapelle would say.
It's stupid fudging the odds out of your favor for grievances; petty or not.
Someone pointed out that if you're going to be critical in your exit interview, keep it constructive, don't just blow off steam. I think the exit interview is a good place to provide feedback on issues that would... not be career enhancing... should you volunteer your opinions while employed. But even then, keep it constructive. "That business venture was not a good idea, and resulted in the following collateral damage (a) (b) (c)" rather than "That was the stupidest decision since the redneck lit the fuse and said "watch this!!!"
And for Fudd's sake, don't do it until you have signed the papers on your new job. Just in case.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
I had the opportunity to burn bridges that needed burning in an exit interview once.
I took complains, issues, and documentation. They took it seriously, and shook the hell out of the department when I left. My manager was "promoted" to a position where he had no staff. Soon after, he 'left.'
Exit interviews are situational, like everything else in life. Treat accordingly.
"People who do stupid things with hazardous materials often die." -- Jim Davidson on alt.folklore.urban
I left recently for another job with better pay and no weekend or evening work; the manager of our department was new, inexperienced and dangerously inept, a true careerist. Half the senior staff had left for other jobs in the previous 4 months and all given the same feedback at exit interview "insulting, inept manager"; I gave similar feedback but emphasised that I was leaving for better pay and a less senior role so I could rebalance my life and enjoy my children more (which you can't do when you have 60 hour weeks and a boss who makes you miserable). I emphasised that this was primarily a lifestyle choice and that the manager was a secondary but salient concern. I don't think there's anything wrong with giving feedback like this, especially if you've been somewhere a while and grown with the company as I had, as seeing departments and staff torn open by bad management can be very upsetting. However, be constructive.
Never get involved with any such arrangement. Attend no such interview. Assume they are hostile whatever you say or do, pack up your stuff and leave. Entrust no reference system as they are all assaultive by their very design. Leave. Set up your own business. Trade ...
The purpose of existence is to make money.
What you decide to do in this situation is part of defining who you are. If you want to lie, if you want to be honest, if you don't want to say anything, it's up to you.
It all depends on what actions are taken with the information - and who does the interviews.
A few years ago now - over a period - my company lost several key developers - and tech experts. I don't work for our HR department - but I was working as a peer (with 15+ years experience) to those that had left. I rapidly got fed up with seeing some really good colleagues leave - and so I requested to as many as I could to exit interview them. Noone that I asked declined - as they knew that I wasn't from HR - and I explained that the main reason was to improve the company - and try to fix the issues that they had with it. I had quite a detailed set of questions - and collected answers in the same manner from all. Then I went through the answers - and came up with suggestions to improve things. One of the key things for our company was - that when tech experts / devs get to a certain level - the only career paths open to them - was management or sales - and most wanted neither. I started the changes such that we managed to introduce a technical expert career track - which means that you can now be a tech expert all the way up to the second to top level in our company (top level being director / CEO). Subsequently I got comments from those that left that if this had happened earlier - then they might not have left. There were many other issues that we took forwards and tried to address - some with success - some not. I've always believed that it is best to try to fix the company I work for before looking outside. If the company I work for ever becomes closed to these fixes - then I will up sticks and go elsewhere.
OK, not really, but it's a fun thought to entertain.
Vote monkeys into Congress. They are cheaper and more trustworthy.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I once had an exit interview that ended with lawyers after the company tried to get me to sign a document taking the blame for years of business failure in return for a reference. In my opinion, you should arrange a reference from somebody somewhere in the organization that will vouch for you, and then avoid the exit interview at all costs. If you have to attend then take in a union or legal representative if you've had a bad run with the organization. Never mistake the fact that HR is just the fist of management. They do the jobs the management doesn't have the balls to do themselves. They're the hatchet men of the company and should be treated as such. avoid avoid avoid.
An exit interview is giving information for nothing in return. I appreciate much more when people post their own reviews on Glassdoor.com rather than just sharing their thoughts with HR.
I've had it both ways. Sealed letters in academia can be ruthlessly honest
Sealed letters effectively don't exist in the UK (probably the EU). A freedom of information request can be used to unseal anything held about the applicant. Also, for hiring, especially if you hire someone foreign, records of all applicants have to be kept for a year (then destroyed), incase immigration want to do an audit.
It's rare to receive a bad reference. A neutral reference is usually considered bad, but one has to take care if you don't know the referee and doubly so if there are cultural differences (e.g. German referee, applicant applying to the UK).
A relatively common way is to put in a clanging hint that the person doing the hiring should telephone the referee. This is usually code for "so bad I can't put it in writing".
But yes, academics tend to be brutally honest when given the chance. A bad student is a timesuck and a bad postdoc can poison a lab. It's alomost always better not to hire than to hire bad people. Most academics know this and know each other, and rely on each other for collaboration, thesis reviews, passing students out to be postdocs, etc etc. Therefore, academics tend to be pretty honest with each other over this kind of thing.
SJW n. One who posts facts.
So we're here to close a gentleman's agreement:
Boss: "Hey, we might be kind of a shitty company, but we wanted to do this awkward ceremony so that you're less likely to talk about how shitty we are."
Employee: "I know you guys didn't always get the best from me, but I'm happy to do this awkward ceremony in which I show you that I can also be gracious and nice, so that in case anyone asks, you won't talk shit about me. Also, I need something from you for LinkedIn. Sorry to bring this up now."
Done!
I realize not all managers are like me, but I have to imagine that many of us want feedback, be it good or bad.
No they don't.I neve met a manager or higher that wasn't vain, conceited, arrogant and did not want anyone challenging their authority, opinions, or even suggesting that they aren't the infallible God's gift that they think they are.
Anyone want to work for me?
Absolutely NOT!
Because I don't think you really want it. In my many years of experience in the corporate world, whenever someone in authority asks for honest feedback and you give it to them, they become angry, defensive, and inevitably retaliate.
It's real easy to say you want honest feedback but it's completely different to actually get it.
No thank you. I would wait until someone else gives you honest feedback and I see how you take it. And even then, that person maybe someone you like or your drinking buddy and they and only them are allowed to give honest feedback.
You either do it because you were born this way, or because you enjoy it.
One must had horribly twisted mind to be good person for money/business/career.
My 2 cents.
(I am implying here that being honest on exit interview would be common behavior of good person. And yes, if you lie, for whatever your imaginary goal is, it does not portray you as being good).
Once in my life I was honest in an exit interview and it came back to haunt me later...
I had an exit interview after I had worked for a automotive-related company in the Netherlands. At the time, it was promised to me that whatever I said in this interview would remain a private matter between me and the HRM department and would be used in an anonymous context to improve things. Even so, I refrained from making any remarks towards the functioning of individual colleagues or my boss, and only commented on the serious flaws in research and development strategy the company (and my department) deployed, which were actually the reasons I decided to leave. It was constructive feedback. No ranting, nothing of the kind. I outlined a strategy that would, in my opinion, work out. My arguments seemed to be taken seriously and I went away with the feeling that at least I did what I could to steer things in the right direction...
About three years later I was invited back for an interview by a different department of the same company who had specific needs for my expertise and I felt that in this department I could do some useful work. However, before I was hired, I was invited by my former department head for an interview. In this interview the gloves came off: He had an exact copy of everything I had said in the previous exit interview before him and he was NOT amused. He said the interview was "to see if I had learned something in the meantime" but it was blatantly obvious that he was going to block me from being hired back. Didn't need to because I declined immediately after I learned how HRM had handled this.
In the end, it turned out for the better, because it was one of the events that prompted me to start my own company and I am now making more money that I could ever have made over there and I am sure having a lot more fun doing it. Still it sucked at the time...
What a total misuse of "THE exception that proves the rule" you blithering monobrowed goatbanger. This instance the exception BREAKS the rule, making it not a rule. Dear lord.
Dude, did you even read the first sentence of your wiki link? "The presence of a specific exception demonstrates the existence of a general rule." If an anecdote about someone actually accepting constructive criticism is noteworthy and surprising, it is outside of people's general experience. ie: that people's general experience (the rule) is that constructive criticism is dismissed and useless.
Congratulations on confusing rule-of-thumb with law-of-physics, though. High marks on the autism spectrum.
I am 40 years old. Five years ago I arranged my life and my finances in such a way that when I have had enough, I get up and walk out, without a seconds notice. I don't say a word to anyone, and I go find another job. I don't worry about technical references, and the best I can expect is for a company to confirm I worked there, nothing more, nothing less.
I have never been happier. I am no longer a slave to bad jobs and bad companies.
Because of my cavalier attitude, bad things may be said about me from time to time, and it may occasionally torpedo a job I am looking at, and I will most certainly never be well-off, but that stuff doesn't matter to me. It allows me more freedom than most can imagine.
Now, the things that allowed me to do this are no kids, no alimony and a damn strong resume with a skillset that is constantly in demand. What I have found is that as much as companies and recruiters would like to vett me, they are willing to overlook a lot for the right candidate or that recruiter dollar.
Also, I have never signed up for or used twitter, myspace, facebook, or any other social media except linkedin, which I deleted after they were hacked. I think this is very important to keeping a low profile in the jobs industry.
I had an excellent boss, a very good one above him, and a decent one above him. Next came Loony Toons, who would do stuff like scan the internet records of every employee in the billion-dollar company looking for weather.com. If he found it, a stern rebuke was to be given to the unlucky soul who dared to check the forecast while at work.
I could list at least twenty-five more incidents that prove that this executive couldn't land a job as a box stacker at any company but his family's.
In my case, it was in the midst of an ice storm, and I wanted to know the prospects for making it home on my 25-mile drive.
When I was downsized, I laid into that fruitcake with both barrels. I know I'll never work for that self-righteous, pseudo-religious family-owned again, but it felt good, it didn't affect my finding another job, and maybe, just maybe, it will help the rest of the family grow cojones and pay that idiot to stay away.
I have a lifetime better-than-50% rate of turning interviews into job offers, and I don't lie in interviews. Maybe my success rate is *because* I present myself plausibly. I know on the other side of the table the only hiree I've been delighted with as a co-worker is someone who was modest and honest in the interview.
Right, and none of this can help the interviewees that leave before the problem is fixed. The interviewees, take on considerable risk to themselves for _maybe_ helping others? Yeah, the guy above who said "fuck that" is wholly correct, if a bit blunt.
Thank you for being a friend
Traveled down the road and back again
Your heart is true
Your a pal and a cosmonaut
And if you threw a party
Invited every one you knew
You would see
the biggest gift would be from me and the card attached would say
DIE NIGGER SCUM
Well said! I've often wondered why people think all exceptions prove the rule, and accept that as logical fact, while being totally illogical about the phrase. :)
This is going to be used over and over again. Bravo!
There are a few places (more often lower paying jobs) where answering honestly while on the job will COST YOU THE JOB. It gives middle management a chance to single out and cull the potential boat-rockers. I think this is in part why most people have waited *until* the exit interview to say anything.
Years back, my mom worked as a manager for a Lifetouch photo studio located in a Target store. She had started as a photographer and moved up. The pay wasn't much, but she didn't have to travel like her previous jobs, and my dad was making good money, so for her it was something to do, and she enjoyed working with the type of people who want to get portraits, and capturing smiles. She was happy and effective. Her store ranked well regionally.
After a while (maybe 2 or 3 years in), they did surveys, and she responded truthfully and without spite. Constructive criticism. She told them that, for example, some of the frames the store sold tarnished too easily and were overpriced, resulting in a common complaint / customer issue she was dealing with, as well as other miscellaneous things. A week or two later, near the close of the business day, the Target store security came and escorted her out of the store, telling her that Lifetouch had terminated her employment.
If you want to talk to someone, *talk* directly to your immediate superior, and if that doesn't help, either HR or their superior. Be very wary of providing feedback to the company itself while you are gainfully employed. And it goes without saying, be diplomatic and CYA.
Refuse to have an exit interview. I refused to tell them where I was going to or even if I had another job at all. Never put it past your former employer to contact them and talk shit about you, threaten to sue them make non compete noises etc anything. They didn't care if you lived or died when you worked for them they're only looking to screw you over now. And in fact, if you're going to somewhere else vaguely related to what you used to do, it's GOOD for them to continue to fail and screw up. Let them do more of that or at least be clueless. Because they are shit, so fuck them with a radioactive knife to the eye.
Either they will fire you soon anyway or outsource you, or, you will be even angrier and wind up quitting under worse terms than before. At best, at the very best you can consider coming back as a contractor a-la IBM 'outplacements' if you really have to. It's always for far less money and they use you up like candy in a vending machine. But at least the fuck-you relationship is out in the open. Like we used to say in the CCCP "We pretend to work they pretend pay us."
I was very unhappy at my old job (with management). I was polite in my exit interview, but certainly did not give them any praise, including the people conducting the interview. I had no concern about the repercussions, simply because the company I was moving from was hated in the industry, and the company I was moving to had a long history of disagreement with them.
In this case, the management of the company I was leaving telling the new company that I was "not a team player" and all the other drivel serves me better than a glowing review. Of course, it's worth noting that I had been a liaison to the new company prior to moving there, so they already knew I was a hard worker and competent.
Just another ignorant American.
That's the most fucking pretentious thing modern hipsters have come up with. Discuss.
Corporations deserve nothing.
Corporations are legal entities entitled to nothing except by legal contract.
This is the law.
By contract, people may agree to do stupid things; they shouldn't.
While employed, an employee exchanges skills and knowledge for payment.
Corporations have made it very clear that this is the entire understanding of their employment contract; that said, Corporations often try to negotiate advantage to themselves related to intellectual property and copyright without additional payment other than salary; valuable employees negotiate on these issues.
Some states allow corporations to apply restrictions on future employment of an employee after they leave; some states do not.
Work without payment is voluntary; the demand for work without any payment is called slavery.
Who can not be honest even when people are willing to listen and the chance of personal consequences is far-fetched, I have to say that your current employer is not losing anything by you living.
Just speak your mind. The company may not put much weight on any one opinion, but they most probably do care about a statistical picture of people leaving the whole company or a specific department.
I used to work at a place where the local director was the absolute power king over every employee, every division, every task in the geographic area. He had to report up the line to someone from a different city, but if it happened in or around Houston he was responsible for it. Call him a "choke point" if you like but there was no "stovepiping" in the organization. Such would be impossible since he knew everything that was going on.
He also knew every name of all 2000 of his employees, their spouses names, and most of their kids names. The guy was amazing to work for and almost no one ever left.
Anyone who did leave (most via retirement) got an hour of his time. It was an unstructured time. He asked few if any questions. Anything you said was heard by the only person in the place who could unilaterally fix any problem. He was there to thank you for your years of service and hear anything you had to say.
Understand, please, that this was a guy who fixed problems. I once saw him suspend an entire working group for a day and send them home because of the way they had treated a retail customer. He then called all the first and mid-level managers in that department and ordered them to drive in from their outlying offices, stand at the counter, and serve the walk-in customers for the rest of the week while he personally conducted customer service training for the suspended employees. Sweetest guy you'd ever want to meet but, boyohboy, he could kick ass when he was forced.
Given all that, not much changed after he heard an exit interview because few people had witnessed enough continuing bad behavior to warrant a change. Still, the few bad managers we had would try, years in advance, to transfer out employees who were nearing retirement. If you were a jerk boss and you let someone retire out of your group, The Director would hear about you. And you would, quite likely, find yourself demoted to working alongside the people you used to boss around. If he was told about a real equipment safety problem, you'd see him talking to the maintenance guys and their boss, personally, to find out how to fix it. If he was told that the paper workflow in a certain place was screwy, you'd see him drop in to shadow some low-level employee for a day.
Hell, he shadowed two field employees per year for an entire day of public interaction out of general principle. Truly a great guy.
That was a quarter-century ago. I realize times are different now and people are much more mobile. No executive could spend an hour with everyone who leaves; there aren't enough hours in the day. Thus, exit interviews, even if they happen, are conducted by an HR drone.
Exit interviews to an HR department are a waste of time. Exit interviews with the big boss can be something completely different.
F-U, F-U, F-U, UR COOL, F-U, i'm out. Really everyone should leave their jobs like that.
There is some interesting points from the /. crowd here.
As for TFA, well I'm not going to base my professional behavior on an article whose central character chooses to call himself "TurdMurder."
At my work, I am one of the members of the "workers council" (Netherlands). Few years ago we had a period when employees left citing the working conditions and pay as major motives. I mean, they said that to the council. However, everyone completely "forgot" to mention this in their exit interviews.
Therefore, when the council brought the question to the management the answer was "No-one has left because of working conditions or wages - here are the exit interviews. Case closed."
I say "circle closed". There is something deeply troubling about the absolute egoism, which seems to be the major characteristic of western societies. People want the council to make a difference yet we cannot get them to even state the issues in front of authority. Suddenly everyone becomes a pussy and goes into "have wife and kids to feed" mode. Well, how do you make ANY progress in such society where people self-censor themselves and lie to themselves just because there MIGHT be some (however minor) repercussions. And we are not talking here of being sent to Gitmo, but the remote possibility that your new boss calls the old boss or some such. Everyone likes to endlessly bitch at the coffee-corner but when the authority is present the cat steals their tongues...
I have to say that my experience in life has thought me that the real enemy of the common people is....the common people - all of us. Not the people in power - they won't stand a chance against the rest. True, they would use any trick in the book to stifle opposition and yet....they wouldn't stand a chance should the people decide to hold them accountable.
Go in front of the mirror and say 100 times pointing with your finger "You are my greatest enemy" and "Hell is other people".
suck my cock, asspie
I have just handed in my resignation and working off my notice and was pondering what to say at my exit interview .
Basically the reason I did hand in my notice was that I think that this place has changed over the last two years but is now being so appalling managed that there is no future in this company any more. The changes and new processes they are forcing us to follow have nothing to do with improving the quality of our work, but to provide evidence for finger pointing in case a mistake is made. The ability to fill in a tick-box is now more highly rated than your technical qualifications and experience (Annual Appraisal rates you against following process, but has nothing to rate how good you are at the actual job!) What is really sad is that I love what I am doing and would really prefer to continue just that.
I did think of saying exactly these reasons, but I am conflicted. I care enough about the job, the customer and the work I have done there for the last ten years to really try to hit home the seriousness of the situation. However I do not want to burn any bridges and, probably more important, I think that the exit interview will be treated by HR as another process having been followed, rather than their chance to gauge any serious problems with the company. I have no confidence that it would go any further than the HR leaving form. Even if they listened to what I had to say, I honestly think it would be treated as the ravings of another bitter and twisted ex-employee and dismissed.
On balance I shall probably swallow hard, smile sweetly, tell them that my life is going through a change in direction and thank them for the last 10 wonderful years and express my sadness at leaving.....and just leave
1 make it clear that if they want you back after your severance has paid then it will take X in salary Y in benefits ect
2 Optional step : tell them where all that "undocumented" stuff is actually documented
3 be as truthful as you think would help
Any person using FTFY or editing my postings agrees to a US$50.00 charge
You're clearly missing my point then. I'm talking about a long term view. If you're doing the exit interview in the first place, you already decided to leave - so even if the problems were fixed quickly, it wouldn't make a difference to you in the short term.
My point is, you never know if years later, you might want to work at the same company again? I've worked for 2 or 3 places where former employees came back. In one case, the guy had retired, but decided to come back out of retirement and asked if the company would consider re-hiring him.
If you helped contribute to a positive change or improvement at the place upon your exit, it will simply make it that much better if you do decide you'd like to take a job there again someday.
I don't think it's taking on any risk if you're tactful in your exit interview. It sounds like some of you are just hot-heads who probably deserve not to have the jobs you're complaining about, if you can't even figure out how to explain both the pros and cons of your workplace to an H.R. person without it sounding like you're a danger to re-hire!
FTFY.
I disagree. As I type this I am sitting in an expensive, company paid for class because the last few engineers who quit complained that our company doesn't provide enough training/continuing education. It is too bad that they had to quit to make this happen but at least some good came of it.
Calling your boss a big fat bastard may be pointless but providing constructive feedback is not.
Was this article needed? I can see it being useful for someone out in the real world with their first professional job, but for anyone who has had a few jobs and who has common sense I don't see the need for such an article.
Um, you are leaving the company, YOUR PROBLEM, is solved. You have nothing to gain from an exit interview and the potential of offending people who future employers might call for a reference.
If the company cared about your issues they would have done something about it while you were still there....assuming your brought it up. As far as those left behind go, they are adults, it is up to them to bring up any problems they have.
If you are burning to vent, invite a friend out for a few drinks and a meal.
Exit interviews exist for the benefit of HR departments. It makes them look like they providing useful information and a useful service to the company.
I worked somewhere for enough time to be coming up on my second paid sabbatical. I gave a two week notice three weeks before I would have taken it. I really liked my manager, but felt it was time to leave the area.
My exit interview turned into the HR person saying, "[CEO of our parent company] was really impressed that you didn't wait until your sabbatical. He told [CEO of this company] to pay an exit bonus of the amount that would have been paid for the sabbatical."
Exit interviews are the first thing to go when times are hard, which tells us that these companies definitely assess the value proposition of doing them and aren't just doing them for the hell of it,"
The fact that they're the first thing to go shows they have value....
I agree. You don't have to be negative, but you don't have to be positive either.
Q: "How did you get along with your boss?"
Don't be brutally honest and say "I didn't, he's a clueless asshole". You could just as easily say "We didn't see eye to eye on a lot of things"... if they ask you to expand on that, you can say "I'd rather not". Saying you don't want to talk about something does actually say something. Or you can talk about things/processes without targeting individuals.
There are ways to say things, and those people paying attention will get your meaning. I find it much more effective whether in an exit interview or not. I've gone into exit interviews with the intention of telling them everything that I thoguht was wrong, and always ended up just not doing it. I just wanted to walk away. With the one exception being where they let me go for telling them I couldn't do something they asked of me (which was impossible BTW). They told me they brought in someone who could do it. I said "he won't be able to". That guy was gone in 3 months, and the company folded after another 6. That company got exactly what it deserved. I've since received linkedin requests from the clueless execs of that company, and again - instead of telling them to fuck off I just ignored the requests. I'm at peace with that.
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
I think it pays not to lose your cool in any professional environment. The key (as far as is humanly possible) is to be polite, respectful and easy to work with or for, in any professional context. Bottom line, chances are that you will cross paths with these people again, and the probability increases significantly when you meet people who know other people etc. Case in point. I used to work with a fellow developer who was just an ass. Unhelpful, condescending, backstabbing - just a plain awful human being (good coder but soft skills were a real issue for this jerk). In the last 10 years I've been asked multiple times to provide a reference for this guy via mutual contacts simply because I worked with him in the past - and have refused every time. Politely and legally. It speaks volumes. Lots of doors have closed for him just because he couldn't take the time to act like a decent human being. ...and it costs so much energy to be a dick, why bother burning bridges?
should result in a stiff ass kicking from the labor board
Regulatory capture: In economics, regulatory capture occurs when a state regulatory agency, created to act in the public interest, instead advances the commercial or special interests that dominate the industry or sector it is charged with regulating.
Direct experience with one, second hand experience with three other cases. Trust me, the labor board is not there to help you any more than your arbitration hearing is interested in coming to a fair decision.
He put his boots up on the table and made a face. "The sig," he smirked. "You can waste your life in search of the sig."
If your employer couldn't find the time to ask you what was good or bad about working at the company while you were still working there, why bother with honesty and potentially burned bridges now?
...you sound like a confused 16-year-old kid, and the ex-teacher in me feels like giving it one more try...
The Soviet Union was officially working under Marxist-Leninist Communism, not Socialism. By the way, they stopped Hitler cold, made it to space first, fielded the MiG series of aircraft and created the world's most popular rifle. Unlike Al-Qaeda, the Russkies were enemies you could be proud of. :-)
Albania, also Communist and not Socialist, "was led by Enver Hoxha (died 1985) and the Party of Labour of Albania. During this period Albania became industrialised and saw rapid economic growth, as well as unprecedented progress in the areas of education and health. The average annual rate of increase of Albania's national income was 29% higher than the world average and 56% higher than the European average.[34]"
Cambodia descended into an orgy of blood led by Pol Pot, another dictator who was ostensibly Communist. It was your basic rerun of the French Days of Terror. The killing started with richly-deserved revenge from the peasants, slipped on the blood and slid into a horror movie to make Joseph Conrad blanch.
North Korea, again ostensibly Communist, led by incompetent dictators since the armistice of their civil war.
We still having talked about any Socialist states yet, but there are two more Communist ones worth mentioning. China is still definitely Red, at least on paper. We owe them 1.2 trillion dollars, and every major corporation of note in the US does business there.
Finally, we have God's view on Communism. If you're an Evangelical "Born Again" Christian, here's a couple of lines from Acts worth keeping in mind:
Acts 2:44 And all the believers met together in one place and shared everything they had.
Acts 4:32 All the believers were one in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of his possessions was his own, but they shared everything they had.
OK, so that's the skinny on Communism. It's had a few successes, a lot of shambling horrors, and it seems to be the economic system favored in Heaven.
Below let's talk about the horrendous horrors of truly socialist countries like Sweden, France, Canada and Japan.
Well, Sweden seems to suffer from a lot of insufferably tall and blonde people who look like they belong in beer commercials. France is still filled with arrogant people who seem to have the benefit of regular health care and actual vacations. Canada is definitely further north than Chicago, and their main export seems to be comedians. Nothing interesting ever happened in Japan.
OK, time for the quiz at the end of the chapter.
1. Socialism is:
a. spelled "C-O-M-M-U-N-I-S-M"
b. an economic system employed by almost every Western democracy
c. a stupid sound-bite off FOX news that I parrot at every opportunity because I have no idea what I'm talking about.
Grades will be posted outside my office by Friday at 6.
He put his boots up on the table and made a face. "The sig," he smirked. "You can waste your life in search of the sig."
If I must be a sore thumb I'd prefer to been whacked than nailed down...
You will need them, at least as a further reference for next jobs.
Even if working at this company was the worse experience you ever had, say goodbye with a big smile on your face. It is the most aggressive attitude you can have,
and don't worry they will understand (at least last company I left, did).
Newbies won't know about this, you just have to trust the oldies: it is a small world and anyone you might have backstabbed (or vice versa) is remembered in a job interview. Obviously the exit interview is pointless; but there is no point in conveying your dissatisfaction about anyone and having that stick. You're leaving...what's the point in tossing a grenade that could land on you later?
This does happen, and has happened three times in my career so far....the candidates were became redflagged during interviews as "troublemaker from the past". They were not hired. It may feel good at the time to blast that a-hole, but it is never beneficial to YOU.
Humour...People of all ages and cultures respond to humour. The majority of people are able to experience humour, i.e., to be amused, to laugh or smile at something funny, and thus they are considered to have a sense of humour. The hypothetical person lacking a sense of humour would likely find the behaviour induced by humour to be inexplicable, strange, or even irrational. ...
He put his boots up on the table and made a face. "The sig," he smirked. "You can waste your life in search of the sig."
HR are, almost without exception, useless parasites, intent only on covering their own arses and justifying their parasitism. If your company grows/ develops / acquires a HR department, then now is probably a good time to be leaving.
(There may be a case for a HR department if your weekly hires/ fires is in the dozens or more. But then they're treating people like a commodity, and that's not good. Even if they are a commodity, like a burger-flipper, or a shovel-pusher.)
Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
I think if they want an exit interview, I'm just going to email them a link to this.
I gave a pointed and honest exit interview at law firm, Paul Hastings, twenty years ago. It wasn't emotional, just forthright.
I said that my boss was wonderful, but one co-worker was trollish and created a difficult working environment, hence the revolving door in the department, with me included. However, despite that, I was really leaving for personal reasons.
I have gotten several strong recommendations from my boss since then. The troll is still there, AFAIK. Still a revolving door.
Things are the way they are because they WANT them that way. Leave them to it, and move on.
Oh, I meant to include the point that HR departments are relatively unimportant and, in the end, often have little say in the real decisions made. The HR rep was kind and I was merely confirming what she already thought was going on, but it didn't amount to any actual change of ridding the department of this truly emotionally abusive, immature, unhappy, and troubled person.
I actually agree. I had one exit interview where I left voluntarily because I felt like I was stuck doing very uninteresting work for too long a time before being promoted. I brought this up at the interview - I was careful not to disparage the company or it's supervisors and to keep my complaint totally in terms of my own feelings and interests, because quite honestly it was no one's fault that I found the work boring. The HR guy actually tried to argue me out of my opinion.The second time I was fired for taking time off to care for a child with strep throat. Under the terms of my employment, I knew they couldn't legally do that so I went back to my desk and called a lawyer after the talk with my supervisor. Right after that, a security guy and a counselor from HR showed up with boxes and to take my exit interview while I cleaned out my desk.I nearly bit my tongue in two refraining from saying "I'm suing your ass," Business organizations are wierd.
Or, note the "Loose rhetorical sense" common usage as well, in the same link.
It's okay to have issues with grammar, language, etc. It's annoying when someone uses that to demonstrate their superior grasp of trivial values. It's damned frustrating when they are WRONG about it.
Rather than being fully honest, I once told the H.R. interviewer the sole reason I was leaving was because of The One Pointless Process Which Every Single Employee Hates, Except For The Guy Who Owns The Place. A couple of months later, that process was discontinued, and I like to think I played a role in that, for the sake of the friends who I still have at that place.