Slashdot Mirror


Snapchat Sued For Facilitating 107 MPH Car Crash (patch.com)

An anonymous reader writes: A Georgia couple is suing Snapchat, a popular instant messaging and photo sharing app, after a car accident last year seriously injured the husband, leaving him permanently brain damaged. According to media reports, Wentworth Maynard, the victim, was driving in a 55-mile-per-hour zone when 18-year-old Christal McGee crashed into him traveling at 107 miles per hour. McGee, according to lawsuits, was attempting to use Snapchat's "speed filter" -- a feature that overlays the speed one is traveling on a picture. "Snapchat's speed filter facilitated McGee's excessive speeding," reads the lawsuit. "McGee was motivated to drive at an excessive speed in order to obtain recognition through Snapchat by the means of a Snapchat 'trophy.'"

496 comments

  1. Fast enough to crash by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    But not fast enough for first post!

    1. Re:Fast enough to crash by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wish I had mod points for this, or an account to give mod points.

    2. Re:Fast enough to crash by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm glad you don't because it's a shitpost, just like yours.

    3. Re:Fast enough to crash by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      I think the term you're looking for is frosty piss post, actually.

    4. Re: Fast enough to crash by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As if this comment of yours adds anything insightful to the topic at hand...

  2. Dangerous Precedent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I suggest total anarchy and societal result if this is given any merit by the system.

  3. Frivolous lawsuit by cyberzephyr · · Score: 0, Troll

    I hate frivolous lawsuits.

    --
    I'm here for the experience, not the Hyperbole.
    1. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by mysidia · · Score: 0, Troll

      Is it frivolous, however? By assigning a "Trophy" for traveling a certain speed, they are creating an addicting experience, and could be argued to be using gamification to encourage/promote risky behavior.

    2. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I hate frivolous lawsuits.

      So do I.

      But, since it's Snapchat, I hope they get sued into oblivion.

    3. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think the lawsuit has merit. The kid was specifically driving at high speeds in order to take part in a phone app feature.

    4. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 4, Informative

      There is no evidence that Snapchat has a "speed" trophy. There is a site that tracks them.

    5. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 4, Insightful

      1. On a train.
      2. On a bus.
      3. On an aircraft.
      4. As a passenger in a car.

    6. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      More precisely, what purpose does showing your speed in a photo serve, other than to brag? The feature is mainly designed for show-offs. So, not a frivolous lawsuit.

    7. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by kuzb · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's time for people to start taking responsibility for their own actions. Reasoning like yours is fucking retarded beyond all reason or logic. It doesn't take a genius to figure out what he was doing was dangerous.

      --
      BeauHD. Worst editor since kdawson.
    8. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      By assigning a "Trophy" for traveling a certain speed

      They don't.

    9. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I read the article, it made no mention of the trophy system.

      I looked for a trophy list, and found a few pages with the same as this list.

      No speed related trophies in any list I found, so either snapchat coordinated the removal of speed trophies on all fan-pages once this case came to their attention, or blaming it on a trophy is completely and provably false.

    10. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think the lawsuit has merit. The kid was specifically driving at high speeds in order to take part in a phone app feature.

      1. She isn't "a kid", she was 18, which is both biologically and legally an adult.
      2. The feature works at zero miles per hour. Going over the speed limit is not a requisite for the app feature.

    11. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 3, Insightful

      By assigning a "Trophy" for traveling a certain speed, they are creating an addicting experience

      I crave Slashdot mod points. I get an endorphin rush every time one of my insightful posts (like this one) goes to +5. Sometimes I post while driving. If I crash, should I be able to sue Slashdot? Should I be able to sue the people that mod me down, thus requiring me to make even more posts to get high?

    12. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Insightful

      why not sue the vehicle manufacturer as he was taking part in one of that vehicles features as well, or the city/state who builds and maintains the highway. Or the petro chemical company that provided the fuel to do so.

    13. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's wrong with that if the speeding is LEGAL??! Maybe you're in a rally, auto cross event. Maybe taking the maglev in Shanghai; which BTW does post the speed up above on a screen.

      This dumb bimbo thought it as cute to break the law and ruin lives.

    14. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by sinij · · Score: 1, Informative

      If the only way to get to +5 post was while driving, then yes /. would share some of the responsibility for your stupidity.

    15. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly this. I thought the "addicting experience" argument was a troll but, dear Christ, some collection of idiots have it at +4 Insightful already. Waitaminnit... if creating a popular app is also an "addicting experience" SnapChat may be absolved of any culpability! They were just trying to be successful and popular when they added that feature, so not their fault.

    16. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by GLMDesigns · · Score: 1

      Of course. Get with the times. :-)

      And if people disagree with you then don't forget to demand a safe room to hide from all the mean criticism. /sarc

      --
      If you're scared of your govt then you need to further restrict its powers
      Vote 3rd Party in 2016 and beyond
    17. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Smidge204 · · Score: 1, Offtopic

      I get an endorphin rush every time one of my insightful posts (like this one) goes to +5. Sometimes I post while driving. If I crash, should I be able to sue Slashdot?

      If you could directly correlate posting to Slashdot with the risky behavior... by, say, basing mod points on how fast you were driving when you posted... then yes.
      =Smidge=

    18. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by U2xhc2hkb3QgU3Vja3M · · Score: 4, Informative

      It doesn't take a genius to figure out what he was doing was dangerous.

      Excuse me, what he was doing? He's the one who got ran into!

      Wentworth Maynard, the victim, was driving in a 55-mile-per-hour zone when 18-year-old Christal McGee crashed into him traveling at 107 miles per hour.

    19. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by GrumpySteen · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It's time for people to start taking responsibility for their own actions.

      Unless their actions involve encouraging dangerous behavior, in which case you seem to think they deserve a free pass.

    20. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by LiENUS · · Score: 2

      But that achievement doesn't exist, so how is it snapchats fault?

    21. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by lgw · · Score: 1

      If you pay someone $100 to punch someone else in the face, you've still committed a crime. Encouraging irresponsible behavior in others is irresponsible.

      It doesn't take a genius to figure out what he was doing was dangerous.

      The victim here wasn't speeding, or doing anything dangerous. It's not the person speeding who is suing.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    22. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by liquidsin · · Score: 1

      Can you point us to any proof that a trophy for speed exists? I can't find any information indicating that this trophy actually exists other than info on this lawsuit saying the teen was trying to get it. Unless anyone can prove that this trophy is real, or that snapchat is somehow encouraging people to drive over the speed limit then this looks pretty frivolous.

      --
      do not read this line twice.
    23. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by GLMDesigns · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This thinking is disgusting. No. You are responsible for your actions. Anything can be incentive.
      Example:
      I think your idea is stupid and that is incentive for me to slap you. Therefore you are responsible (or partly responsible) for the slap.

      Or (a less funny more real life expample)

      Someone finds a girl to be pretty. She's obviously "asking for it." Therefore she asked to be raped.
      No. "Incentive" is not an excuse. People are responsible for their actions,

      --
      If you're scared of your govt then you need to further restrict its powers
      Vote 3rd Party in 2016 and beyond
    24. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I guess if your legal system exists in imaginary schizoid fantasyland (as most people clearly imagine it to), then your logic has some validity.

      In the real world, imaginary motivations derived from the imaginary motivations of imaginary designers do not absolve one of the responsibility of the actions thereby motivated.

    25. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by da_guy2 · · Score: 0

      I hate frivolous lawsuits.

      I hate frivolous lawsuits too... but this isn't one. Do they not have anyone vet ideas before they implement them? Anyone with common sense would agree that an app that encourages the reckless breaking of laws is a terrible idea.

    26. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by sanosuke001 · · Score: 0

      Except an 18 year old girl was the one using snapchat and the 55-year-old man's wife is suing them. He wasn't doing anything except driving. The girl that hit him was to blame. Now, should the man's wife be suing the girl instead of snapchat? Probably. However, I wouldn't call this lawsuit frivolous because you think the person who was in the wrong shouldn't be suing over their mistake.

      --
      -SaNo
    27. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jittles · · Score: 1

      There is no evidence that Snapchat has a "speed" trophy. There is a site that tracks them.

      Snapchat does not keep a list of the trophies publicly available. Read the comments on your link and you will see people claiming to have found trophies not in the list.

    28. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by StikyPad · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's not that the victim's mother (the plaintiff) doesn't want to hold the other driver responsible; it's that Snapchat has a shitload more money to go after, so if she can get a jury to agree that they were complicit, she can recover damages (money) from them. Few rational people probably believe on the surface that Snapchat is responsible for the reckless behavior of its users, but lawyers in courtrooms can be very convincing. That's how they put food on their tables, and Mercedes in their garages.

    29. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Encourages how? It simply records the speed you are going. There is no encouragement. By your logic, better make all speedometers go no higher than 65, all those extra numbers are encouraging people to speed.

    30. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by da_guy2 · · Score: 1

      If I said to someone. I'll give you $100 to drive as fast as possible, they did and killed someone then I could be held criminally responsible. How is this any different?

    31. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by bplipschitz · · Score: 1

      I'm sure it's not frivolous for the victim -- they're just going after who has the most money.

      --
      In Theory, Theory and Practice are the same; in Practice, they're different.

    32. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by MBGMorden · · Score: 1

      Simply going at that speed isn't risky. Most people are going faster than that in an airplane.

      Just because they award a trophy for something that you can be a complete idiot and try to achieve in an unsafe way, doesn't mean they company is at fault.

      --
      "People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
    33. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I crave Slashdot mod points. I get an endorphin rush every time one of my insightful posts (like this one) goes to +5. Sometimes I post while driving. If I crash, should I be able to sue Slashdot?

      Not you, but if you get more mod points the faster you drive, then perhaps the person you hit would consider Slashdot to have some responsibility.

    34. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by MBGMorden · · Score: 2

      Ok - so the users were morons, but there are plenty of completely legitimate ways to go 100MPH.

      If they offered a trophy for snapping a picture of 10 Snickers bars and someone goes and steals them to achieve it, the company isn't at fault for "encouraging" theft - they would be offering a trophy for something achievable using completely legitimate and legal means, and the idiotic user decided to do something illegal as a shortcut.

      --
      "People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
    35. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unless they're Snapchat that is. They don't need to think twice before implementing a bone headed feature.

    36. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by MitchDev · · Score: 1

      "It's time for people to start taking responsibility for their own actions. Reasoning like yours is fucking retarded beyond all reason or logic. It doesn't take a genius to figure out what he was doing was dangerous."

      No shit, people like the suit filers are why the human race can be declared a failed species that needs to be eradicated...

    37. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by kruug · · Score: 1

      Unless their actions involve encouraging dangerous behavior, in which case you seem to think they deserve a free pass.

      Sounds like SnapChat says "Hey, dipshit, don't drive and use our app!" when you first open that feature.

    38. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      imaginary motivations derived from the imaginary motivations of imaginary designers do not absolve one of the responsibility of the actions thereby motivated.

      What teenager or early-20's guy is gonna post a snapchat photo with him driving 30 or 40 mph? Maybe a few. Quite a few will want photos with "trophy" 80-120 mph speeds. This snapchat feature directly encourages such behavior. Pretend all you want that it's only the driver's fault, but both snapchat and the reckless drivers are responsible for accidents caused using this feature.

    39. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by MitchDev · · Score: 1

      And is why lawyers needs to be held responsible for the damage they've done to this country.

    40. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by mitcheli · · Score: 1

      It's all fun in games until lawyers are involved.

      --
      Select from tblFriends where interesting >= 4;
    41. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by kruug · · Score: 1

      In this case, it was #4. A passenger in the car wanted the "Go 100MPH" achievement that Snapchat gives you, so the driver accelerated to 113 MPH to help her friend get the trophy.

      No, it was the driver that was trying to get the trophy.

      Passengers in McGee's vehicle have said she was trying to take a picture of herself while traveling over 100 mph when she hit Maynard./quote

    42. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's your thinking that was the incentive, not their idea.

      This is not about excusing anyone, it's about (attempting to) hold a contributing party accountable. Now you may think they didn't contribute but that doesn't make the lawsuit frivolous. The judicial system can determine the level to which they contributed since there's clearly a dispute about it, that's what they are for.

    43. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Motherfucking+Shit · · Score: 4, Informative

      How is this any different?

      Snapchat isn't paying you, and their app says not to use it while driving. That's pretty much the complete opposite of your scenario. I agree that they'll probably share some culpability in the end, but having this dumb speed filter thing is absolutely not the same as telling someone to drive as fast as possible with reckless abandon. The latter is a feature built-in to most teenagers, phone/app/camera or not.

      --
      "BSD: Free as in speech. Linux: Free as in beer. Windows 10: Free as in herpes." --Man On Pink Corner in #52607549.
    44. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by NotDrWho · · Score: 5, Funny

      I wish Snapchat would offer an IQ overlay filter. If the highest one broke 90, I would be surprised.

      --
      SJW's don't eliminate discrimination. They just expropriate it for themselves.
    45. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yep, and this sort of extreme case is just what every corporate lawyer means when they make the "frivolous lawsuits" claim.
      Yes sir, just things like this and not justifiable lawsuits against companies that produce dangerous products.

    46. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by kruug · · Score: 1

      Unless their actions involve encouraging dangerous behavior, in which case you seem to think they deserve a free pass.

      Sounds like SnapChat says "Hey, dipshit, don't drive and use our app!" when you first open that feature.

      A warning when users first open the speed filter feature urges them not to use it while driving.

    47. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Initial reports from the Lovejoy Police Department suggested Maynard was at fault for pulling out in front of McGee. But later interviews with passengers revealed how fast she is believed to have been driving and that she was using her phone.
      The "victim" made a bad call to cut in unsafely.

    48. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 3, Informative

      Here is the link to the new trophies (the link is in the update of the article). "Speed" is still not there.

    49. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      1. She isn't "a kid", she was 18, which is both biologically and legally an adult.

      It's not if you live in a state that gets federal highway funding.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    50. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by StikyPad · · Score: 1

      Yeah, we'll just hire a few lawyers to.. uh.. oh. Good luck with that.

    51. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Can you even read? It was an 18 year old *female* that was driving multiples of the speed limit while attempting to obtain a snapchat "trophy".

    52. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jellomizer · · Score: 1

      Well it would depend. If you take a flight you may be able to safely take a snap going at faster speeds. Or you are taking a train.

      I think the Trophy system wasn't to encourage risky behavior but to explore the world in different ways. Taking a plain or train, vs just sitting at home and taking selfies all the time.

      --
      If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
    53. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just because the drinking age is 21 does not mean an 18 year old is not legally an adult. You're not eligible to be a representative until 25 or a senator until 30, but that doesn't mean you're not an adult at 24.

    54. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You really don't see anything wrong with the alleged Snapchat feature? It's not at all foreseeable that your skewed-younger-and-less-risk-adverse user population might try to get high numbers on a speed 'filter' to show their friends? Do you think teens use it to show off how appropriate-for-driving-conditions their speed was at the time?

      Seriously, think for a second about how much unsafe driving that thing could actually be promoting. But we should damn well insulate them from the worst-case consequences?

      I get that this wouldn't have happened without a bad decision (frankly, series of bad decisions) by the speeding driver. But it also may not have happened in the absence of that feature. Can you really say Snapchat had nothing to do with this? That it'd be just like suing some Arabic porn site never visited by the driver? Georgia has comparative negligence, for crying out loud, so it's not even like Snapchat would be on the hook for anything beyond their own actual liability as determined by a jury.

    55. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by tnk1 · · Score: 1

      Actually, yes, it is dangerous to go at that speed. In the air, there are no hills, or curves and you can avoid people in three dimensions. On the road, you're stuck to the road and every bump, pothole or curve represents a danger to you.

      Additionally, you are generally sharing the road with a lot more people than a plane would. The speed of aircraft is why they work hard to keep planes miles from one another in the air. On the road, you can measure the distance between cars in feet and a change in a few yards to the right or left can happen frequently, and relatively suddenly. If you're going 100 mph, you are going to have significantly reduced reaction time to a lane change like this one. If this guy had changed lanes suddenly and possibly without a turn signal, like many people around here do, he'd bear some fault, but at normal speeds you'd generally be able to brake fast enough. If you're doing 100 mph, it is possible that you might not even be able to stop for someone who made a relatively lazy, and fully signaled turn.

      You may be able to get away with 100 mph on a straightaway with no one else around, but most roads are not engineered for that speed in the US, and it is clear that this girl was not driving on an empty road.

      I think this lady is suing Snapchat for one reason: the girl has no money to pay her to make it worth going to court to get recompense, so she is looking for money elsewhere. Depending on her situation after her husband's death, this may be something she feels she needs to do in order to not suddenly lose a significant amount of income overnight due to this girl's actions. I sympathize, but I wonder if this has any merit as an actual lawsuit.

    56. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Roger+W+Moore · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If you pay someone $100 to punch someone else in the face, you've still committed a crime. Encouraging irresponsible behavior in others is irresponsible.

      There is a huge difference between paying someone to do something which is clearly illegal and having a daft game where people can compete completely legally. If you believe snapchat is guilty then does that also make say a day care centre which charges exorbitant late pick up fees liable too because it encourages parents to speed so they get there in time? or would whoever delayed them be liable?

      Going this route leads to madness. If a person chooses to avoid a legal way to complete some task and makes a conscious decision to choose an illegal route in order to get a better outcome then the responsibility for that decision must lie with them. Let's face it the only reason snapchat is getting sued here is because they have money. The person at fault here is the idiot driving at 107mph but they probably won't make much money of someone stupid enough to be doing that so they go after the person with the money no matter how unjustifiable it is.

    57. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by hey! · · Score: 1

      You didn't read the summary. The person suing wasn't a user; he was hit by a user. In fact his car was rear-ended, so he bears no responsibility for the accident.

      Now speaking as someone who has actually designed products to people, I advocate a different strategy than blaming people who get hurt by products: common sense. If someone uses your balloon as a condom and it doesn't work, that's not your fault. But if you design a balloon that's supposed to rise into the air and burst into flame, if your users light someone else's house on fire, that's your fault because anyone with the brains of a sea cucumber would anticipate that outcome.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    58. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by SirSlud · · Score: 0

      "It's time for people to start taking responsibility for their own actions."

      Congratulations. You've won a prize for this being the 800,000,000,000,000th time a person has said this under the mistaken assumption they were adding something useful to the conversation.

      --
      "Old man yells at systemd"
    59. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Brilliant. Republican tort reformers everywhere are celebrating your logic. We'll just put stickers on everything.

      "Don't order a drink if you're already intoxicated." Voila, no more dram shop liability.
      "Don't spill this burning liquid on yourself." No more suing McD's for coffee so hot it burns off your genitals.
      "Don't use a defective product." Goodbye, product liability.

    60. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Triklyn · · Score: 2

      wait... i get rear ended, by a car going 50 miles over the speed limit... i don't care what the fuck you're doing... you could be black out drunk and stopped and i'd still say it wasn't your fault.

    61. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by tnk1 · · Score: 1

      Right. This is most likely because the girl is completely at fault, but has no money to speak of to pay recompense for the loss of this lady's husband. She could be in very dire straits now if the husband contributed significantly to their shared income and she needed that money for mortgage payments, or health insurance or whatever.

      I don't think this case has much merit, but I can see why this lady would try this tactic. She has nothing to lose even if it is deemed frivolous.

    62. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Triklyn · · Score: 1

      one of the things is going to be, is it a conclusion that the average person could come to. If you make a trophy for going faster while taking a picture. Do you imagine it will promote, and may be involved in, situations where the driver is taking a selfie while going faster?

      In a climate where we've got PSAs over the dangers of driving and texting, and we've got people dying over taking "interesting" selfies... I think a reasonable person would come to the logical conclusion that there are people out there that will take "interesting" selfies while driving, where "interesting" is a very high speed.

      we want corporations to work toward the betterment of society. This feature was negligent, pure and simple.

    63. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by ogdenk · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Unfortunately, the 18 year old very likely only had basic liability insurance that wouldn't cover 1/10th of this guy's current and future medical bills. Suing her would at most get you a court judgement she'll never be able to honor and she'll be back on the road soon enough once her suspension is up.

      He was nearly killed because she wanted a "cool" picture to show her friends how badass she is... brain damage usually means part of him is dead and he'll never be the same. Snapchat offering an asinine feature that encourages people to be stupid makes them partially at fault. And they have the money to cover his medical bills which will likely be in the many hundreds of thousands of dollars. Along with the years of PT, psychological therapy and medications he'll need.

      This guy is ruined for life and will probably never be able to work again. I don't blame them for going after SnapChat, it's likely the only way he'll be able to get medications and care after he leaves the hospital. The kid won't be able to pay for shit.

    64. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      No trophy for speed. Snapchat encouraged the crash no less than Mercedes who placed a speedometer in the car, and allowed the car to be sold in a state it could reach 120+.There was no active encouragement by Snapchat for speed, and given there were 3 people in the car, and the one doing the selfies was the driver, Even if there were some encouragement for a high number, there's no requirement that you be the driver to do it. She was doing 100+ while taking selfies. Taking selfies was a greater contributor than the speed. The speed just magnified the result of the inevitable crash (caused by stupid, not speed).

      Christal McGee should be tried for kidnapping and attempted murder. She was asked by her passengers to stop, and she refused. That's kidnapping. She performed an action she knew to be dangerous that caused life-threatening injuries. That's attempted murder.

      Place the blame on the person who deliberately did stupid, not the company that allowed it.. If you are doing that, sue Goodyear, they made tires that didn't spontaneously combust at 60 mph in a 55 mph zone, stopping her crime spree.

    65. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      The app works as a passenger. That the driver felt the need to drive and snapchat points to the driver being the obvious idiot.

    66. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      She was taking selfies while driving. It wasn't about speed, it's about being an idiot while driving. The rest is distraction.

    67. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      The news report indicated the driver was snapchating, and at least one of the passengers request she stop.

    68. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by in10se · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It only takes 2 seconds to travel the length of a football field while going 100mph. The car may not even have been in view when they started pulling out and then suddenly it smashed into them.

      --
      Popisms.com - Connecting pop culture
    69. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Clearly things like duress and entrapment are merely excuses and need to be excised from the books since people are merely and always and only responsible for their actions.

    70. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      5. Skydiving

    71. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by skids · · Score: 1

      McGee is lucky to be alive. She attempted to take a selfie at 107mph at got a crotch shot on some other car's bumper. But thanks to advances in stem cell research and the fine work of Doctors Krinsky and Altschuler, she should regain full reproductive function again.

    72. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by WarJolt · · Score: 2

      If fairly certain snapchat can delete entire trophies from their system.

      Can someone explain to us folks who have already graduated high school why the world needs another messaging that is capable of sending photos and why the fuck does it needs trophies?

      My generation pioneered social networks and frankly I'm disappointed that the only thing they've added to messaging apps in the last decade or so has been trophies.

    73. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Please explain how a speedometer is encouraging breaking the law? Should they take them out of vehicles now too? Or did you consider your brain to be encouraging reckless ideas and remove that too.

    74. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      If fairly certain snapchat can delete entire trophies from their system.

      There will always be evidence that it existed. I have yet to see any.

    75. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by MBGMorden · · Score: 1

      You completely missed my point by bringing it back to a road. My whole point was that speed doesn't have to be associated with driving at all.

      If they are showing the speed on a photo, or doing trophies based on a speed, there are plenty of other ways to do that. You can safely get those trophies by travelling in an airplane, train, or conveyance other than a car.

      --
      "People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
    76. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It only takes 2 seconds to realize that speed isn't the problem here. It's the people involved.

    77. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by lgw · · Score: 1

      Would a reasonable person believe that people would stay within the bounds of the law in such a competition? I don't think so. Seems pretty obvious how this would play out.

      so they go after the person with the money no matter how unjustifiable it is.

      Well, a jury will decide how unjustifiable it is. I'm not sure myself, but it clearly rises above "frivolous".

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    78. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Verdatum · · Score: 2

      The idea behind Snapchat is that after you send a photo, it disappears in a few moments. You can screencap it, but the sender gets an alert when you do that. So, it's like popular for sending dickpics and stuff.

    79. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      6. on a speed boats
      7. skiing (especially speed skiing, downhill, and ski jumping)
      8. roller coaster or most other amusement part rides
      9. bobsledding
      10. luge
      11. snowmobiling
      12. aboard a spaceshuttle / rocket

      Heck - the fastest human powered bicycle went 85.71 mph! There are tons of ways to go fast that where it's not illegal to take selfies.

    80. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jemenake · · Score: 1

      It doesn't take a genius to figure out what he was doing was dangerous.

      True, but, by attaching a reward to the behavior, they're altering the risk/reward ratio. Maybe 90mph is as fast as the person is willing to go without any recognition, but, throw in the possibility of being atop some leaderboard somewhere for something, and maybe that goads him into being a little more stupid.

      It also doesn't take a genius is figure out that gamifying reckless behavior is an unwise move for a company. Strava made this same mistake. They let runners/cyclists upload their fitness-gps results and it places them on leaderboards for the fastest times on various "segments" of roads. Originally, it was just uphill sections, but, later, came more flats and even downhill sections. I couldn't understand why they were maintaining leaderboards for downhill segments, as that wasn't a test of one's fitness, but, rather, their sanity. Sure enough, some dude in Berkeley, CA died while trying to reclaim his top spot on the leaderboard for a downhill (in traffic) segment, and his family sued the company. The suit was, eventually, dismissed, but Strava could have saved a lot of legal fees if they had just thought through whether downhill segments would ever entice someone into doing something ill-advised.

    81. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by medv4380 · · Score: 1

      By your logic Incentivising Murder wouldn't be wrong. Giving people Money, incentive, for murder is wrong. Giving people Sex, incentive, for murder is wrong. Giving people Candy, incentive, for murder is wrong. And giving people a Hug, incentive, for murder is wrong. Just because the Murderer is responsible for their own actions doesn't make the person who incentivised them not in some way responsible.

    82. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If a person's judgement is so impaired that they are incapable of following applicable road laws, they should not have a license. Full stop. The girl should never be able to drive again.

      Is it Snapchat's fault? Of course it isn't. It's any idiot that thinks to use it on roadways that have set speed limits.

    83. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by aaronb1138 · · Score: 1

      Wait, wait, maybe we should get them into Congress to enact laws and guidance to correct the dama... well crap.

    84. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, 100 MPH isn't exactly breaking a record, by any means. There are street cars capable of 200+ MPH!

    85. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by DigiShaman · · Score: 1

      Let me ask you. Say there's a hooker walking down the street late at night. She's wearing a hot outfit too. So some predator drags her into the back ally and rapes her. Later, the rapist find out he contracted HIV from the hooker. So the rapist proceeds to sue the garment label because the "hot outfit" urged him to rape. Should he receive compensation for his loss of health?

      --
      Life is not for the lazy.
    86. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Half-pint+HAL · · Score: 1

      Can you point us to any proof that a trophy for speed exists?

      Well I don't know about trophies, but I know the "speed filter" exists, and I can't see any purpose for that other than showing off risky behaviour.

      --
      Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
    87. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by GLMDesigns · · Score: 1

      If I said - do x in return for y then yes I am giving an incentive (x) for action (y). But the incentive is explicit.

      If a man rapes a woman with no incentive other than whats between his ears (thinking she's cute, thinking she is provocatively dressed, unattended by a husband or brother and therefore deserves to be raped). Then this man should rightfully be prosecuted for rape.

      Someone can have a nice car parked on the street. I want it and think that the owner is mocking me therefore he is provoking me to key his car.

      There is a difference between an agreement, an exchange, a quid pro quo, and the idle thoughts that go through someone's head.

      If I think wouldn't it be cool to go fast and take pictures of drivin fast. It would make a great youtube video; I'll get tons of hits and get famous. Therefore if I get arrested for speeding I can sue Google for giving me incentive for speeding.

      No. I don't think so.

      --
      If you're scared of your govt then you need to further restrict its powers
      Vote 3rd Party in 2016 and beyond
    88. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by mysidia · · Score: 1

      It's time for people to start taking responsibility for their own actions.

      In no way do I suggest people not take responsibility for their actions. Snapchat should take responsibility for their actions and pay for his medical bills, and possibly chip in a percentage of his car replacement cost, or provide in cash, if he cannot drive again after that.

      The guy who was doing Snapchat at 100 MPH should have his driver's license suspended. He should go to jail for a year, for reckless endangerment of the public.

      He should be required to pay a fine, and do 1000 hours of community service.

    89. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by mysidia · · Score: 1

      Well-intentioned though it may be; Snapchat the company is responsible for other consequences of their actions, if they promulgate risky behavior, and make their app increase danger to the public.

    90. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Encouraging a behavior is completely different than being responsible for it. Here, I'll show you: go take a long walk on a short pier.

      ...(pause)...

      Did you? I think instead of doing that, you thought something along the lines of "You go take a long walk on a short pier, AC!" You see, what happened there is that you thought about my advice, and rejected it. OTOH, if you had followed my advice and someone then asked you why you were drying off, you probably would not have hastily said something like, "Some asshole on the Internet told me to do it! It wasn't my fault!" It'd be almost as though you actually know who is really responsible for doing what.

    91. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by GoodNewsJimDotCom · · Score: 1

      Its like bringing a breathalizer to a bar. People don't make sure they're safe before they go drive, they compete to see who can get the highest blood alcohol level.

    92. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by kuzb · · Score: 3, Insightful

      So, because I made a minor typo, the entire message was lost on you? God damn you're a fucking idiot. Let me spell it out: Snapchat isn't forcing you or anyone else to make bad decisions. If you make a bad decision that's on you and nobody else.

      --
      BeauHD. Worst editor since kdawson.
    93. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by kuzb · · Score: 1

      By your logic gun makers should be sued for every gun-related death ever.

      Fork makers should be sued for every fork-related injury ever.

      Glue makers should be....

      Are we getting the point here? Where do we draw the line? Where do we start saying "you know, this person is a fucking idiot doing something dumb" instead of "lets sue random company who had zero to do with the incident"?

      --
      BeauHD. Worst editor since kdawson.
    94. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In my jurisdiction, if the passenger is being a cunt, inciting reckless behaviour by the driver, both the passenger and the driver might lose their licences.

    95. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I hate frivolous lawsuits.

      And it is entirely frivolous.
      In the article : "Wentworth Maynard was pulling onto Tara Boulevard in Clayton County in September when he was rear-ended by 18-year-old Christal McGee." So..... he failed to yield right-of way and then got hit as a result?
      Sorry, Wentworth, you should pay more attention.

    96. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Shortguy881 · · Score: 1

      I weep for the future. We have an entire generation reaching adult hood that is so sheltered and coddled they cannot function as adults. It's all: they are not medicated enough, or medicated too much, or not held enough as a child, or not enough attention from the teacher. But, god forbid that anything is actually their responsibility. It's not long before micro aggressions and trolling are made illegal; That we seek out "problems," like why don't more women play rugby or why are there not more male OB\GYN's or why don't Latinas play more frisbee golf, proactively.

      So here is my crazy idea: lets hold the stupid driver, going 107 mph in a 55, responsible.

      --
      Brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.
    97. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by lgw · · Score: 1

      lets sue random company who had zero to do with the incident

      The obvious and predicable consequence of Snapchat's decision was to encourage reckless behavior. They certainly had more than "zero" to do with this. Enough to be liable? I don't know. But enough that it's not frivolous.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    98. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by delt0r · · Score: 2

      Everything in the newspaper is true, except the things i know about.

      Don't kid yourself. Same shit different day. My generation, or yours was no better, and no worse.

      --
      If information wants to be free, why does my internet connection cost so much?
    99. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by dotgain · · Score: 1

      You can't find out about trophies you don't already have, so...
      You can only guess, so...
      You poke around doing things trying to discover what the trophies are.

    100. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by delt0r · · Score: 1

      No i see a feature that can be fun and safe, if there is no PEBKAC issues. On a high speed train in France for example. There are roads in Germany with no speed limit, yet the road toll is better than the US. Also most people don't drive too fast anyway despite the fact it is perfectly legal to. If you let everyone blame everything else they take no responsibility for what they do.

      --
      If information wants to be free, why does my internet connection cost so much?
    101. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by delt0r · · Score: 1

      Of course people to take videos and photos from there phones will driving fast to show off *without snap chat*.

      --
      If information wants to be free, why does my internet connection cost so much?
    102. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by amicusNYCL · · Score: 1

      Well then obviously you need to immediately contact the defense council and inform them that, via your rigorous research, you have determined that Snapchat does not offer a trophy for posting while moving faster than 100mph, that there is not a speed filter, and that the passenger in the car who described exactly what the driver was doing is delusional or lying. I'm sure they will offer their profound thanks for your services.

      You should also contact change.org to have them remove this petition, since it is no longer an issue. Again, thanks to your exhaustive research.

      You also need to get in Wikihow and amend this page, which describes how to use the non-existent speed filter. Make sure to note that this is based on your extensive personal use and deep understanding of the Snapchat app, and clarify that it's not just based on you doing a couple Google searches and thinking you know all the features of Snapchat.

      Oh yeah, when you contact the defense council, make sure you also give them your evidence that there was no trophy offered by Snapchat at the time of the accident. The judge might ask for something like that, you just want to cover all of your bases. I'm sure they'll be happy to take you out to lunch or something.

      --
      "Our two-party system is like a bowl of shit looking at itself in a mirror." - Lewis Black
    103. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      Where in any of your comment is there any evidence that a "speed trophy" actually exists? I have presented my evidence that it does not exists. Please present yours.

      That petition, with 348 supporters, just says "don't let us do stupid things". It also never mentions a supposed "speed trophy".

      I never said there was no speed filter. Everything you post talks about the filter and nothing about the supposed "trophy".

      The defence attorney probably knows a "speed trophy" does not exist so those bases are covered.

      The speed filter exists and has valid uses if you are not an idiot. A "speed trophy" would be a bad idea but that is moot because there is no "speed trophy".

    104. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by R3d+M3rcury · · Score: 1

      IANAL, but interesting angle could also be that the filter is an Attractive Nuisance.

      Basically, "Attractive Nuisance" is the reason that you have to put up appropriate signs and fences and such around your pool. The idea is that young children could sneak onto your property on a hot day to go swimming and drown. The argument is that the child is not old enough to understand the concepts of private property and is unable to comprehend the dangers of a swimming pool. It's history goes back to the late 1800s, when it was deemed that things like railroad yards and the like had to put up protective fencing because trains and such are extremely cool things for children to check out and they can be injured. Construction sites and the like have fences around them for that purpose also.

      There are issues with claiming that the filter is an Attractive Nuisance, though. First, the law has never been applied in this way, so you'd definitely be breaking new ground. Second, the person using the filter was 18--she was not legally a child. Third, there is a warning which appears when you use it saying that you shouldn't be using this in dangerous situations. To go back to the swimming pool analogy, if I have a sign up that says, "Private Property: No Swimming in the Poo Without Permissionl" and an illiterate four year-old drowns in my pool, I can be liable. However, if a literate 14 year-old drowns in my pool, I may not be because it's reasonable to assume that a 14 year-old can read a sign. So it'd be tough to show that an 18 year-old couldn't read the warning dialog that comes up in the Snapchat App.

      Still, it'd be an interesting angle for them to take.

    105. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by mysidia · · Score: 1

      Correct. Also the 18-year-old teenager probably has few resources to pay the millions it's going to cost for the victim's lifelong care....

      The teenager should arguably be imprisoned for a very long time, AND Snapchat kind of facilitated this by deliberately encouraging cell phone use in a motor vehicle.

    106. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by mysidia · · Score: 1

      Of course not.... it's Snapchat. Trophy categories are random and might disappear at a whim, so no evidence is left of them.

      Anyways, they have trophies for the other filters, so users could reasonably expect there would be a Trophy on the speed filter, Or they're just going to see how fast they can go, so they can find out if they will win a trophy.......

    107. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      Trophy categories are random and might disappear at a whim, so no evidence is left of them.

      Where is your evidence for this statement. As far as I have found new trophies come out with new releases. They are quickly found and publicized.
      The site I referenced has all the trophies and "high speed" is not one of them. People have been posting about Snapchat trophies for a while and there are no posts about a "high speed trophy".

      Anyways, they have trophies for the other filters, so users could reasonably expect there would be a Trophy on the speed filter,

      That would be stupid logic. Snapchat has a temperature filter and a trophy for taking a snap below freezing. If someone stays in a car in the hot sun to try to get a non-existent "high temperature trophy" and dies should the temperature filter be removed? Just because there is a filter does not mean there is a trophy for going extreme.

    108. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      Actually it was the driver who was taking the snap and the "trophy" does not exist.

    109. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by amicusNYCL · · Score: 1

      Where in any of your comment is there any evidence that a "speed trophy" actually exists? I have presented my evidence that it does not exists. Please present yours.

      What made you think I want to engage in some stupid argument about the features of Snapchat, an app that I have never used? I see plenty of evidence that it has a feature which overlays the GPS-measured speed on top of a picture. You're welcome to debate the meaning of phrases like "trophy", but I have no desire to engage in a discussion about the features of an app that I have no plan to use. Instead, I would invite you to read the actual complaint which alleges things like a speed filter exists, that Snapchat awards "points" and "trophies", and that the driver was using the speed filter in the hope of receiving a "trophy". What it does not claim is that Snapchat offers a "speed trophy". Your entire argument is pointless because it's completely irrelevant to the case that was actually filed.

      If you want to have stupid arguments on the internet, at least stick to the facts. The facts in this case are enumerated in that document, read those and then go find someone who wants to argue with you. If you're willing to do research about the features of Snapchat, maybe instead start with reading the actual complaint to see what is being claimed.

      --
      "Our two-party system is like a bowl of shit looking at itself in a mirror." - Lewis Black
    110. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by murdocj · · Score: 2

      Well, maybe Snapchat creating a way to overlay your speed on a picture was a "bad decision". As in, what are people going to do ... oh yeah, that's right, they are going to see how FAST THEY CAN GO.

    111. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      What made you think I want to engage in some stupid argument about the features of Snapchat, an app that I have never used?

      You posted a reply so it is pretty reasonable to assume you are willing to discuss the issue. Posting a second reply adds further evidence further .

      You're welcome to debate the meaning of phrases like "trophy",

      There is no debate over the meaning of Snapchat trophy. They are emojis that appear on the trophy case.

      Your entire argument is pointless because it's completely irrelevant to the case that was actually filed.

      The complaint claims the following;

      McGee was motivated to drive at an excessive speed in order to obtain recognition through Snapchat by means of a Snapchat "trophy"

      Whether or not the "trophy" exists is very relevant. If it did exist Snapchat would be in trouble. Since it does not exist Snapchat should not be involved. Would Snapchat be liable if someone died in an overheated car because they attempted to get the, also non-existent, "high temperature trophy"?

    112. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by sexconker · · Score: 0

      If you pay someone $100 to punch someone else in the face, you've still committed a crime.

      No, you haven't.
      STFU you don't know shit about shit.

    113. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by U2xhc2hkb3QgU3Vja3M · · Score: 1

      And how am I supposed to know that it's a typo and not your comprehension of the situation? I'm not psychic.

    114. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by RealRav · · Score: 1

      While they are at it, sue the car manufacturer for creating a car that exceeds the speed limit, sue the state for issuing a drivers license to an irresponsible person, sue the phone manufacturer for allowing a distraction, sue every movie studio for making a movie with a car chase or race, sue nascar, sue .........

    115. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Dread_ed · · Score: 1, Troll

      They got their trophy. It's a Darwin Award.

      --
      When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
    116. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by slazzy · · Score: 1

      I agree. But often common sense and law are unrelated.

      --
      Website Just Down For Me? Find out
    117. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by liquidsin · · Score: 1

      Being a passenger in any vehicle is risky? This could be used on a plane or a boat or from the passenger seat while someone else is driving. You can't sue Budweiser for every DUI accident, which makes sense because no matter how drunk I am on shitty American piss-water, it can't be Anheuser-Busch's fault that I broke the law and just happened to do so while using their product. Same rules need to apply here; Snapchat already tells you in the TOS that every user agrees to that you should use the app safely and responsibly, which likely includes DON'T DO DANGEROUS ILLEGAL THINGS LIKE TRY TO TAKE SELFIES WHILE DRIVING TWICE THE POSTED LIMIT. She was already breaking distracted driving and speeding laws, you can't honestly hold Snapchat any more responsible than Apple for making a phone that you can use to distract you while driving.

      --
      do not read this line twice.
    118. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Shut up you stupid asshole.

    119. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Too bad this Darwin award could have taken 5 other people with it.

    120. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "So here is my crazy idea: lets hold the stupid driver, going 107 mph in a 55, responsible."

      Don't be ridiculous.

    121. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, he's right. If you pay someone to commit a crime, you become an accomplice, at very least.

      But by all means, continue raging.

    122. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe we should just shoot them all.

    123. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Every car has a speedometer. Does that mean I have no choice but to try and see how far it can go?

    124. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh my, poor fireworks industry.

    125. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by cbhacking · · Score: 1

      Depends on the state, but around here, 50MPH over the limit (especially if you run into somebody at that speed) is less a "license is suspended" and more a "have a nice stay in prison", and if you're really lucky and also don't live in an urban area, you might eventually be allowed to have a restricted license that allows you to commute to work (assuming you can find any with that record) and nothing else.

      Mind you, I don't agree with this country's general stance against rehabilitation of criminals (and then letting them be productive citizens again afterward). This is no "got caught with some drugs" or "stole a TV" crime, though; depending on the damage, she may have effectively ended the guy's life. Apparently her response to this scenario included taking a selfie of it. She could probably benefit from a few years of having fewer opportunities to make the wrong decisions. Maybe she'd even learn something...

      --
      There's no place I could be, since I've found Serenity...
    126. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just because a gun factory creates a gun, you don't always shoot yourself. Only extremely retards make a selfie with a loaded gun.
      Same here.

    127. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by bingoUV · · Score: 1

      Actually, it will be : Don't drink coffee from your genitals.

      --
      Bingo Dictionary - Pragmatist, n. A myopic idealist.
    128. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Richard_at_work · · Score: 1

      This is what is pretty ridiculous about US motor vehicle insurance requirements - you can buy cover which has limits for third parties.

      In the UK you get three options:

      1. Fully comprehensive
      2. Third party, fire and theft
      3. Third party only

      In all three options, damage and injury to third parties is fully and completely covered, no matter how high the medical bills are (sure, the NHS will piece you back together, but when you need long term care that is where the insurance money comes into play).

      There is no option in the UK to limit third party liability - you can only limit the amount of money you would receive for your own property in the situation where you are deemed to be at fault.

      Why the hell can you limit third party liability in the US?! It makes no sense!

    129. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      If I crash, should I be able to sue Slashdot? Should I be able to sue the people that mod me down, thus requiring me to make even more posts to get high?

      Yes. You should always be able to sue someone. Now whether you win or not will be determined by whether you can prove that your rush was achievable while doing something incredibly dangerous and that Slashdot directly promoted this.

      So please give us the full data correlating your speed to your moderation score. I'm going to start by assuming you were at sitting stationary when you're now at +3. Do you think you would have gotten a better score if you were posting behind the wheel of a fast travelling car?

    130. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Ok - so the users were morons, but there are plenty of completely legitimate ways to go 100MPH.

      Having a set of legitimate ways does not change the fact that the simplest way is incredibly dangerous, most accessible to people, even more accessible to idiots, and that it's a dumb idea to promote idiotic behaviour.

      I mean how was this not a predictable outcome?

    131. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by goose-incarnated · · Score: 1

      If you pay someone $100 to punch someone else in the face, you've still committed a crime. Encouraging irresponsible behavior in others is irresponsible.

      There is a huge difference between paying someone to do something which is clearly illegal and having a daft game where people can compete completely legally.

      We'll see how liable snapchat is found to be by the court. If the courts agree with you then I'm starting my own daft game.

      My game is as follows: You place a bet with me. Your bet is simply when and where some famous figure will die, including details of Date, Time, Manner of death, etc. Your bet is encrypted so no one, not even I, can see it.

      When the person dies, you (and all the others who placed bets on the same person) can send me all your keys to decrypt the bets you sent me, and I shall decrypt them all and split the $100k prize between all those who got the details correct.

      Sure, for all practical purposes I have actually taken out a contract on the dead person. But my daft game lets people compete quite legally. If snapchat is not liable, at all, then my game (which has the practical effect of contract killing someone) should not be liable either, and can be fully public.

      --
      I'm a minority race. Save your vitriol for white people.
    132. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Snapchat is encouraging the unsafe behavior, and therefore they are liable for an event that could be reasonably forseen to happen.

    133. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by goose-incarnated · · Score: 1

      This thinking is disgusting. No. You are responsible for your actions. Anything can be incentive.

      Courts can and do split responsibility between parties. I would not be surprised if a court found snapchat to be partially complicit in this.

      --
      I'm a minority race. Save your vitriol for white people.
    134. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A theif once had a vending machine fall on top of him because he was tipping it back and forth in an attempt to rob it.

      He sued and won, now vending machines have warnings about rocking them back and forth.

      IMO, he should have sued the Treasury department too, for printing the money that honest people used in the machine to buy snacks, also all the people that bought snacks.

    135. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Roger+W+Moore · · Score: 1

      It's no longer a "daft" game if serious amounts of money are involved and why the need for encryption of bets if everything is innocent and above board?

    136. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Roger+W+Moore · · Score: 1

      Would a reasonable person believe that people would stay within the bounds of the law in such a competition?

      The standard should be would a reasonable person believe that another reasonable person would stay within the bounds of the law for such a competition. If we have to start worrying about what the stupidest, most irresponsible person out there might do we are in real trouble as a society.

      But I will not disagree that a jury might find them liable which is why they will pay out. I am just arguing that this in no way matches any sense of justice but sadly justice seems to have very little to do with courts nowadays.

    137. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by goose-incarnated · · Score: 1

      It's no longer a "daft" game if serious amounts of money are involved and why the need for encryption of bets if everything is innocent and above board?

      a) Serious amounts of money are involved in these web2.0 unicorns too, you know.

      b) Encryption is needed to prevent ordinary folk reading the "predictions", forming a secondary betting market and going out and killing people to collect on the secondary market. Encryption ensures that the primary betting market will be the *only* betting market.

      c) Whether or not everything is above board and innocent is irrelevant - what is relevant is whether the company (me/snapchat) can plausibly claim everything is above board and innocent. Had snapchat really had a "speed trophy" incentive, then their claim to not being liable for what a third party does is just as good as my claim.

      --
      I'm a minority race. Save your vitriol for white people.
    138. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by oldcarsmell · · Score: 1

      It is foolish to believe that snapchats are transient. Literally everything you put online is there forever. All snaps are archived in case they are subpoenaed, which has happened. User permissions are just set to one-time view.

    139. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by TheCastro1689 · · Score: 1

      The fact that the state requires a license with an exam does add culpability to the state to make sure the people are up to the standards of the licensing requirements. So we're assuming here by your comment that the state felt reasonably sure that the girl in this crash was a capable driver at the time of her exam.

    140. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by kuzb · · Score: 1

      Because it's not hard to see that the difference between "he" and "she" is one letter. Given the context it's not a big leap to come to this conclusion. The fact that you can't make such a basic connection says more about you than it ever will about me.

      --
      BeauHD. Worst editor since kdawson.
    141. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I checked your math and, while rounding considerably, it is close enough. However that only matters if the other car is stationary. As speed is relative, you have to look at the difference in speed.

      I have been passed up by cars going considerably faster than I am (crazy Illinois drivers). It is quite dangerous and scary. That said, if you look before you change lanes, you absolutely will see them. When that happens, the best course of action is to continue with your current speed and trajectory. Considering how often I have people change lanes into me when we are going the same speed, it seems more likely that the person wasn't being careful.

    142. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why not sue the car manufacturer for producing a car that can reach those speeds? Or sue the state for the quite frankly substandard driver education you have in the states? Or sue the retard who decided to do 107 in a 55.

    143. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by lgw · · Score: 1

      If you organize a road race, you're on the hook because it's obvious that people are going to cheat, though you might get away with it if people like the idea so much they make a movie about it. But if you want to avoid the liability risk, you have to organize things differently.

      I'm a fan of both, but there's no question Brock Yates took a substantial liability risk, civil and perhaps criminal, in organizing the "Cannonball Run", a risk he wasn't willing to take as a mature adult.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    144. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by amicusNYCL · · Score: 1

      If I was arguing the case my argument would be something along the lines of the driver having a reasonable expectation of receiving a trophy for reaching a certain speed based on the requirements for other trophies and the existence of the speed filter, or even just that the existence of the speed filter in itself provides sufficient motivation to travel as fast as possible while taking a picture in order to make Snapchat at least partially culpable.

      Mind you, I have very little respect for the way lawyers try to twist things to make a point in court, but if I was arguing the case then that's probably the route I would take. Whether or not Snapchat actually has a trophy for any specific achievement would not be part of my argument. The fact is that the reason the driver was speeding was specifically so that she could use Snapchat to show how fast she was driving.

      --
      "Our two-party system is like a bowl of shit looking at itself in a mirror." - Lewis Black
    145. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      Even if there was a speed trophy, wouldn't your local drag strip be a better place to earn that than a public road that could get you thrown in prison?

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
    146. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      You mean you couldn't get a high speed in the snapchat filter by being a passenger in a drag race vehicle? Also, how is snapchat forcing anyone to go fast when the filter explicitly says to not use it while driving, and gives no trophies for speed related activities?

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
    147. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      OMG, next time I fly, I will totally take a selfie doing 700 mph!

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
    148. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Weirum vs RKO is very, very close to this case. Was the harm reasonably foreseeable? Probably. Did the defendant engage in an affirmative act? Probably just by offering the service and having 'rewards' for using it.

    149. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Even though i agree with you, let me point something out to the generally clueless about the law avg slashdot reader... the driver is always legally responsible. Snapchat Sally faces criminal charges for manslaughter, reckless endangerment (probably ), speeding and possibly things related to racing a car on a public road. She faces civil charges for recklessness, personal injury, IIED and others. If her parents own her car they will be sued for negligent entrustment.

      The real issue here is that snapchat has deep pockets. Treating brain damage is not cheap. Ask yourself if you'd rather have the insurance co pay for it (raising all of our rates Slightly) or the company that at least bears a small amount of responsibility.

    150. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      I agree with you that the lawyer will probably frame it that way. I just don't agree that the argument is valid. By that logic the ability to take a picture of a speedometer is inducement to break the law.

      The fact is that the reason the driver was speeding was specifically so that she could use Snapchat to show how fast she was driving.

      The fact is that the driver chose to break the law and endanger other people for the selfish reason of taking a snap at high speed. If a driver speeds so that they can take a picture of themselves and the speedometer the car manufacturer should be sued? Snapchat didn't force or even tell her to speed. It was the driver's choice. I guess Snapchat should remove the temperature filter before someone chooses to freeze to death or die of heat stroke by trying to go to the extreme./sarcasm

      Anyone can sue anyone not matter how unreasonable the claim. The claim against Snapchat is unreasonable.

    151. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      Weirum vs RKO is very different in that there was a definite prize involved and the contest was basically a race. The prize was specifically for being at a designated place first. That makes it a race. It is perfectly reasonable that people would drive illegally during a race. This is the same reason Dominos no longer does the 30 minutes or less delivery. When you turn somthing into a race it is perfectly reasonable that people will do stupid things.

      In the Snapchat case it is not reasonable that displaying information would make someone want to max it. There was also no prize involved. Should they also remove the temperature filter as it may induce people to freeze to death or die of head stroke?

    152. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by amicusNYCL · · Score: 1

      By that logic the ability to take a picture of a speedometer is inducement to break the law.

      No, that's not the same argument. Snapchat specifically offers (and arguably encourages) overlaying the speed as a feature, not just a general-purpose camera with the ability to take a picture of anything, including a speedometer. Taken to the extreme, you're trying to suggest that camera makers should be responsible for child pornography because a camera can photograph anything, but the camera itself is not the issue.

      The fact is that the driver chose to break the law and endanger other people for the selfish reason of taking a snap at high speed.

      ...using Snapchat and its feature of overlaying the speed on her picture, so that her friends could see, and maybe she might score some points or earn a trophy or something like that. Right, that's the fact.

      If a driver speeds so that they can take a picture of themselves and the speedometer the car manufacturer should be sued?

      I suppose that you could try to argue that car manufacturers encourage speeding by allowing their cars to speed, but I don't think you would get very far with that.

      Snapchat didn't force or even tell her to speed.

      Yes, that is the defense argument. They even specifically say not to drive while using that feature, even while offering the feature to overlay your current speed on a picture.

      I guess Snapchat should remove the temperature filter before someone chooses to freeze to death or die of heat stroke by trying to go to the extreme.

      I have no doubt that there is a lawyer somewhere who would take that case, but in that case the person is only endangering themselves. The driver had 3 passengers (one pregnant) in addition to the other vehicle she hit. She's obviously retarded, but that's not going to stop the lawyer from arguing that Snapchat shares culpability for encouraging her to do it. Whether a jury agrees that Snapchat was encouraging her is left up to them to decide.

      Anyone can sue anyone not matter how unreasonable the claim. The claim against Snapchat is unreasonable.

      If it was me that got hit I would also want to strike out against the culture that enables and encourages self-obsessed idiots to be self-obsessed idiots. It's only a shame that the girl is legally an adult so that her parents who gave her a Mercedes couldn't also be sued.

      --
      "Our two-party system is like a bowl of shit looking at itself in a mirror." - Lewis Black
    153. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      Taken to the extreme, you're trying to suggest that camera makers should be responsible

      I do not think that should happen just as I dont thing Snapchat should be pat of this lawsuit.

      I have no doubt that there is a lawyer somewhere who would take that case, but in that case the person is only endangering themselves.

      And any friend they convinced to do it with them.

      If it was me that got hit I would also want to strike out against the culture that enables a...

      Too bad the law does not allow you to do anything you want.

    154. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      When I was a teenager, the answer was a most resounding YES. I know better now that I'm forty. Teenagers are fucking noobs at life. They do dumb shit all the time. To claim otherwise, is just ignorance on your part.

    155. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No guy. As an outsider looking in, the fact you can't make a post without being a total dick bag says all we need to know. You're rash to come to conclusions, don't bother checking your arguments for correctness whether in facts or presentation, and you prefer to argue via knee-jerk emotions instead of logic. Just from a few posts of yours, I can already make several safe predictions: You're a conservative republican, not fervently devout but still in church every week, and you are and have been from the start, a Trump fan. To me, your entire argument is without merit but that won't stop people in your demographic.

    156. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Stop touching my junk!

    157. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      Can someone explain to us folks who have already graduated high school why the world needs another messaging that is capable of sending photos and why the fuck does it needs trophies?

      It's a way of showing how difficult it is to distinguish your sex organs from those of another gender. Or species.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
    158. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by non0score · · Score: 1

      I take issues with the very last comment (note: the he/she thing was obviously a typo, so I'm not addressing that) -- you clearly haven't taken an engineering ethics course. Classic examples:

      1) Let's say you created a regular looking chair and state on a big tag attached to the chair, in bright red letters, "you can only sit on this chair and this chair isn't designed to be stood upon". If someone later stands on the chair and it broke, then you, the designer/manufacturer/whatever, are still responsible for the injury in the court of laws. "Foreseeable misuse" is what engineering ethics call it, and you're at fault.

      2) If a ceiling fan hits a baby while a parent is throwing the baby up and down, it's not a "foreseeable misuse", and the parent has no grounds of suing the company that made the ceiling fan.

      IANAL, but it's pretty clear from planking and past social network-inspired activities that such a "speeding trophy" falls into category 1 (from my perspective, and probably most jurors).

    159. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by KGIII · · Score: 1

      She... He was in his own car and not breaking the law.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    160. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by KGIII · · Score: 1

      You've never driven that fast, have you? I have - I've driven much, much faster actually. I've taken many, many hours of advanced instruction to be able to drive at those speeds and to do so with a modicum of safety. I once spent almost two weeks in training and then driving rented exotics at Nurburgring. I have driven faster than her speed while on an unpaved surface even.

      Once you get above about 80 MPH things get a bit different. Once you get at a certain speed (it will vary per vehicle) the automobile behaves in a different manner. The effect of downforce is greater, the amount of force needed to brake is different, the amount of under (or over) steer is rapidly changing at those speeds. Add to that the speed at which the suspension works. See, the suspension isn't just about giving you a smooth ride - it's about putting the rubber back on the surface as quickly as it can and with as much force as it can to ensure you're achieving maximum stability.

      When you get up to speeds in the 140 MPH range things really get dicey and things can go to hell really quickly. When you get in the 180 MPH range it gets REALLY hairy at first.

      Now, she was nowhere near those speeds but I'm willing to wager that she's unaccustomed to driving at those speeds and lacks the training to drive at those speeds. I've probably got close to 2500 hours of training - above and beyond what it took to get my license. It also happens that my MOS put me as a motor vehicle operator for quite a while. I was a light to medium vehicle operator and ended up doing a bit of staff car duty which meant I got to take some additional instruction to learn things like asset protection, evasion and pursuit, and things of that nature. That's actually what got my interest going. I've since taken many, many extra classes - across a half-dozen countries. I also (even at my age) still participate in a few driving events but I much prefer rally or street courses to oval track racing. Though there's a certain appeal for oval - you really, really learn to master a few things and shaving a tiny 0.07 off of a lap is the difference between a win and a show.

      So, I guess the point I'm getting at is that you're not capable of driving that speed safely. She's not capable of it (obviously). There are very, very few areas where it's safe to do so. Save your speed for the track. Track days are cheap and a whole lot of fun. You don't even need a fancy car for it to be fun. I've taken a Volvo 245 (mostly stock) and had a ball on a 1/4 mile track. There's a 1/2 mile dirt oval down in West Alna that I've taken it to and the Volvo is heavy and RWD so it's a lot of fun. I have a nice Saab that I use for rally (NEFR) but that's actually not so nice any more - the engine is blown and I've yet to get it repaired - I'm not sure that I will. I've got a small fortune in the engine so I might but I was stupid and tried to finish which means it seized so it's going to be difficult to repair and still trust.

      Unless you're trained, it's unsafe to go those speeds. It really is - as is evidenced here. Remember, nearly every single accident is because someone was driving too fast for the conditions.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    161. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by KGIII · · Score: 1

      They should wait before trying her for attempted murder. This guy is going to die early. That early death will be able to be attributed to this accident. At that point, it becomes homicide - even if just negligent homicide. There are certain people who are a danger to themselves and others and thus have no right to freedom. They should be locked away for very long periods of time, perhaps for the entirety of their lives.

      Yes, we Americans have too many people incarcerated but that's because we have long sentences for stupid things. This is exactly the type of thing that long sentences should be used for.

      I say this as someone who has driven much, much faster than she was driving. The difference was, I was either on a road designed for it, a closed course, or on a track. On the other hand, I've a whole lot of extra instruction and have spent years learning to operate a vehicle at those speeds. Are there public roads where I'd drive that fast? Nope. Not so long as they're open or there's a reasonable chance of their being other people - and I'd sure as hell not do it with other people in the vehicle who wanted me to slow down.

      To go that speed, and to do so safely, you need some very specific equipment. I doubt her tires were rated for that speed. Five or so minutes at that speed and they'd have blown out. Just decelerating too quickly from that speed would cause a blow-out and that's not even from locking them up - that's just the friction building up the heat and the expansion making a sidewall blow. I know the suspension wasn't built for, nor tuned for, handling those speeds. It simply isn't able to keep up. The slightest bump means the tire is coming up off the pavement and the shocks aren't charged enough to push them back down quick enough to avoid break-away. Down-force is not adequate.

      There's a huge difference between 85 and 105 MPH. It might not seem like it but there's a huge difference in the way the car behaves.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    162. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by Half-pint+HAL · · Score: 1

      Whether it's the driver or a passenger using it, I still can't see any reason anyone would use the speed filter other than to show that they're going at a really high speed, and that is always going to be a risky thing. It might have a fringe use among tourists on Japan's bullet train, and it might have momentary popularity when Elon Musk finally builds his first hyperloop, but its biggest use will always be to clock speeding.

      If 90% of Bud was drunk by people who were driving, then Bud might have a similar problem, regardless of any warnings on the bottle. But most drinkers are moderately responsible (as responsible as you can be while killing your liver with an intoxicating substance), so there is a large legitimate market for it.

      In court, Snapchat will doubtless be called to prove a legitimate use for the speed filter. Due to the temporary nature of Snapchat messages, they're not going to be able to call on many stats to help them.

      --
      Got them moderator blues I blieve I walk out the do', With these mod-points I been gettin', I 'most never post no mo'
    163. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A pre-requisite to getting a Darwin award is either dying, or at least removing your own ability to procreate, without having any (surviving) children.

      As the idiot snapchatting driver survived, she is not eligible for a Darwin award.

    164. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      To go that speed, and to do so safely, you need some very specific equipment. I doubt her tires were rated for that speed.

      Let me guess, the last time you bought a new car, it came with bias tires.

      Near as I can find, she was in a '90s C230 with OEM H-rated (or better) tires, or should have been, unless she replaced the OEM with something not 130 mph or better rated.

      I know the suspension wasn't built for, nor tuned for, handling those speeds.

      So a German car designed for the Autobahn isn't capable of 107?

      The equipment is (in practice) never the problem. It's the driver, driving byond their capabilities.

    165. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by KGIII · · Score: 1

      My current car is a '15 6-series.

      Of she had H-rated in GOOD condition tires then yes, what are the odds of that? What are the odds of the suspension having been maintained properly.

      So, probably not - no, it probably was not capable of going 107 MPH for very long. I notice you conveniently skipped that I'd added that it'd likely result in a sidewall blowout *after* a period of time.

      So yes, yes I stand by what I said. I'm gonna go out on a limb and wager the tires where shit, probably NOT OEM, probably NOT H rated, the suspension probably NOT maintained, the brakes probably not even OEM anymore (which might be a good thing - brakes have improved a bunch since the 90s).

      But yeah, I'm gonna suggest that it was not a good choice of car to do that in. It's a 20+ year old car. I'd also add that she was obviously not the person to be driving said vehicle at said speed. Nearly every single accident is caused by someone driving too fast for the conditions.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    166. Re:Frivolous lawsuit by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      I'd also add that she was obviously not the person to be driving said vehicle at said speed.

      Finally, you hit the target. Equipment problems are less than 1% of direct cause (contributing is higher), so mentioning that is just an excuse for the bad drivers, not an actual cause.

      Nearly every single accident is caused by someone driving too fast for the conditions.

      That's closer to 0%. Unless you use the US government's definition, where driving too slow is "too fast for conditions". Everyone who crashes would have avoided the crash if everyone involved were at a complete stop. That makes "speed" an issue of opinion, not fact, and to increase the ability to pull over anyone at any time and subject them to a search and questions, "speed" has become the boogeyman. The only example of a "speed related" crash is the Mercedes CLR going fast enough to get airborne. Sure, you could claim that was not speed related, as the issue was damage from an earlier contact, so it was equipment fault, but that's as close as you can get to "too fast" causing a crash. Driver exceeding skill is 99.44% of what people call "speed related".

    167. Re: Frivolous lawsuit by skids · · Score: 1

      I knew someone would eventually get that. Or bother to google.

  4. Hmm by hondo77 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It does make you wonder what Snapchat was thinking with this feature. Did nobody anticipate that jerks would drive crazy speeds because of this thing?

    --
    I live ze unknown. I love ze unknown. I am ze unknown.
    1. Re:Hmm by Kierthos · · Score: 2, Informative

      I'm going to go with "Hey, here's a feature which might attract a lot of users, and therefore, we'll have a higher valuation. Consequences be damned."

      Never attribute to evil what can be adequately explained by stupidity or greed.

      --
      Mr. Hu is not a ninja.
    2. Re:Hmm by Sydin · · Score: 1

      I'm sure they were thinking the feature would be "innovative", and not about the possible dangers. Why do your due diligence on new feature implementation when all the engineers in the room agree that it sounds really, really cool?

    3. Re:Hmm by chispito · · Score: 2

      It does make you wonder what Snapchat was thinking with this feature. Did nobody anticipate that jerks would drive crazy speeds because of this thing?

      Their EULA makes a gentle suggestion that you not be reckless:

      We also care about your safety while using our Services. So do not use our Services in a way that would distract you from obeying traffic or safety laws. And never put yourself or others in harm's way just to capture a Snap.

      --
      The Daddy casts sleep on the Baby. The Baby resists!
    4. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I can't imagine what this filter looks like aboard the ISS.

    5. Re:Hmm by genghisjahn · · Score: 1

      So we should remove all speedometers from cars?

      --
      Sorry about the mess.
    6. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      where there is greed there is evil, not necessarily true the other way around

    7. Re:Hmm by barc0001 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If you're going to open that can of worms, I suggest we then start suing car manufacturers for not having 80 MPH limiters in place on all new North American sold vehicles. Because it does make you wonder what Ford was thinking selling a Focus that can go 121 MPH. Did nobody anticipate that jerks would drive at crazy speeds because of that?

    8. Re:Hmm by sanosuke001 · · Score: 1

      People in planes, maybe?

      --
      -SaNo
    9. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's entirely possible nobody imagined that.
      True story: when bittorrent first happened, I thought it was a neat idea, and I didn't even realize that of course it would mainly be used for piracy and not "downloading linux cd/dvd images" like everyone pretended was going to happen.

    10. Re:Hmm by DarkOx · · Score: 2

      Oh come one information is information, snapchat isn't responsible for how people use it. Even the OEM GPS in my car keeps track of the "Max Speed" since the unit was reset and makes the info available to the user. One person might use that to check up on their kid in a non intrusive post facto way after lending them the car, for some idiot it might look like a "high score".

      As soon as you crying about letting people measure things you are heading down a slippery slope.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    11. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, it is a pointless "feature"

      BUT.. at the end of the day, nobody forced the driver to use it.
      She made a conscious decision to go against common sense, the law and everything that's drummed into her in drivers ed.

      Maybe instead of suing instagram they should sue the parents for raising an irresponsible shit that doesn't give a damn about her 3 passengers or other road users.

    12. Re:Hmm by netsavior · · Score: 1

      I suggest we then start suing car manufacturers for not having 80 MPH limiters in place on all new North American sold vehicles.

      One of the roads I regularly drive on in Texas has an 85mph speed limit, you insensitive clod.

    13. Re:Hmm by westlake · · Score: 3, Insightful

      it does make you wonder what Ford was thinking selling a Focus that can go 121 MPH. Did nobody anticipate that jerks would drive at crazy speeds because of that?

      Ford isn't awarding trophies for taking the car to 121 mph in city traffic.

    14. Re:Hmm by ItsJustAPseudonym · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Does Ford award an achievement for a common user who drives at high speed? No.

    15. Re:Hmm by mjwx · · Score: 1

      Because it does make you wonder what Ford was thinking selling a Focus that can go 121 MPH.

      Two words: Track Day.

      As someone who can drive at 121 MPH in a 2L turbo, I dont do it on the roads because it's stupid. You can drive your car to its limit safely, you cant use a phone in a moving (or stationary at the lights) car because it's never safe.

      I expect this to get thrown out of court, but we really do need to get the message across to people that think they can phone and drive that "No, no you cant you blithering idiot".

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    16. Re:Hmm by barc0001 · · Score: 2

      Neither is Snapchat, unless of course you can show me their "107 mph in city traffic" award. There are several places people can take their phone and go 107mph legally though. Just like there are several places you can take your Focus and drive 121MPH legally. In fact I am sure there are more places you can take the phone than the car.

    17. Re:Hmm by barc0001 · · Score: 1

      > Track Day

      So a feature should be enabled for 100% of the users when 0.005% of them might avail themselves of it legally? From a liability and life saving perspective I think it would make more sense to either have limiters by default in cars that you need to pay a good chunk of change to have legally removed, or maybe there should be a separate class of vehicle that are not street legal that enthusiasts would purchase to only use on the track. Actually there already are several track only cars so we're part of the way there now.

    18. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it does make you wonder what Ford was thinking selling a Focus that can go 121 MPH. Did nobody anticipate that jerks would drive at crazy speeds because of that?

      Ford isn't awarding trophies for taking the car to 121 mph in city traffic.

      no, cops are... you'll get an attestation of the speed you were goign when they give you your speeding ticket!

    19. Re:Hmm by laxguy · · Score: 1

      and neither is snapchat.

    20. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Who's foot was on the throttle moron?
      why not blame knife manufacturers for you cutting your self how is it possible to blame others for you own stupidity.
      America you drag down humanity with your epic cowardice.
      Ford sue the parents for raising human garbage.

    21. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're supposed to take it to the track, a few (relative) bucks and go as fast as your tires let you without killing anyone. And I sure as hell wouldn't snapchat while on the track. Not only is it monumentally stupid and a danger to you and everyone around you, they'd flag you down and ask you to leave and never come back.

    22. Re:Hmm by watermark · · Score: 1

      It does make you wonder what BMW was thinking by allowing the vehicle to exceed 80 mph. Did nobody anticipate that jerks would drive crazy speeds because it allows them to?

    23. Re: Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Probably works using GPS, so while a 16,000+ mph snap would be awesome, I don't think it would happen.

    24. Re:Hmm by sjames · · Score: 1

      Does your GPS award virtual trophies for your friends to see based on your speed?

      IU guess we'll see i that rises to the level of liability.

    25. Re:Hmm by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      Neither is Snapchat, unless of course you can show me their "107 mph in city traffic" award. There are several places people can take their phone and go 107mph legally though. Just like there are several places you can take your Focus and drive 121MPH legally. In fact I am sure there are more places you can take the phone than the car.

      it's not an award, it's a high score. Ford doesn't keep track of how fast you drive car. Snapchat does, and post it on your photo so you can brag about it to your followers.

      To have Ford do the same would be to equip the car with a big display that shows how fast you were going to everyone around you, and post it online as a high score table per videogames. (Of course, I'm sure the government would love this - proof of speeding). And yes, idiots have been caught who post GoPro video showing them and then taping the speedometer and the road and posting it all on YouTube.

      It's really about bragging "I was doing 107 when I took this photo, beat that!".

    26. Re: Hmm by arth1 · · Score: 1

      Probably works using GPS, so while a 16,000+ mph snap would be awesome, I don't think it would happen.

      It's in a MUCH lower orbit than GPS satellites, so there's no reason why GPS shouldn't work. The ISS actually uses GPS for attitude adjustments.
      The problem would be getting a connection to a cell tower to upload the snap.

    27. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If snapchat doesn't make you tap through one or two pretty obvious disclaimers to use the feature the plantif will probably at least get a heavy settlement.

      Every legit electronic product I've ever used that's intended to be looked at while your are in motion is plastered with warnings like this.

      Fuck, my bicycling gps/computer warns you not to be a dumbshit when you activate certain features.

    28. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      if you've ever been in a room full of engineers you would know they probably didn't think it was cool and maybe even brought up the danger aspect. this was clearly a marketing \ management decision.

    29. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ford isn't awarding trophies for taking the car to 121 mph in city traffic.

      You're right, they're not. Instead they are facilitating the MEANS to exceed the speed limit by providing the vehicle - much worse so than the idiot (snapchat) in the backseat saying, "Do it! Do it!". Without the means, they couldn't exceed the speed limit in the first place.

      We also need to sue gun manufacturers, sports equipment distributors, etc. They are ALL part of the same problem! ....

      Or I guess that we could just blame the operator of the vehicle at the time instead...but then, their pockets are no where near as deep :)

    30. Re:Hmm by Verdatum · · Score: 1

      A feature should be enabled if there is a demand for the feature. It isn't Ford's fault people keep buying features that they don't need.

    31. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      two words.
      PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY

      She did it to herself, no matter what vague online recognition egged her on. She played the stupid game and won the stupid prize. It's sucks, but blaming someone else isn't going to fix the problem.

    32. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What about the cell phone manufacturer who facilitated people writing apps for this sort of thing?!! Why does no one think of the children???

    33. Re:Hmm by crtreece · · Score: 1

      At if you get pulled over for doing 121 mph, you're going to get more trophies than that. A stay at the Grey Bar Motel and the chance to meet a real life judge.

      --
      file: .signature not found
    34. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly. My speedometer tells me that I'm going 115. We should definitely remove them because they cause me to go fast.

    35. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It doesn't seem to be about measuring things, it's about the gamification of them. The summary notes that she was trying for a Snapchat 'trophy'. If you know any game theory, or hell, if you've been on the Internet in the last few years, you know how that motivates and the lengths people will go to for rewards and points that have no meaning beyond their acquisition and bragging rights.

    36. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because it does make you wonder what Ford was thinking selling a Focus that can go 121 MPH.

      The German car manufacturers have agreed to limit all normal cars to 250 km/h (155 mph). Of course, exceptions are still available.

      There are some roads which during some time of the day have typical traffic flow on the left lane at 200 km/h (that's around your Focus example) while being tightly packed with cars.

    37. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Here's there argument, which ends the claim. I'm sure it is in the EULA...

      "By accepting use of this feature, you hereby agree to never use it while operating the wheel of a motor vehicle. Furthermore, if you intend to use this feature incorporated with the 'SnapChat' (R) program, you will only do so as a passenger in a moving vehicle."

      Unless several orders of checks wants to completely throw out personal responsibility, I don't see this moving beyond courtroom day 1, and the judge either tossing it immediately, or the defence squashing all claims.

    38. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Snapchat though took it one step too far by awarding trophies for achievements. Once you put an incentive in I don't think you can remove all blame. If I announce on the web that I will give 1 million in cash to someone for dooring a bicycle rider I don't think it would be unreasonable to have to shoulder some of the blame for those that go out knocking down bike riders in an attempt to get that money.

    39. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Passengers.

    40. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For metric system users :
      107 mph = 172 km/h
      121 mph = 195 km/h

      The driver should not be allowed to drive for 10 or 20 years at least.

    41. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Without any context that's all well and good. But the lawsuit claims that snapcat was running a trophy system that rewarded higher speeds. If that is true then snapchat does share responsibility.

    42. Re:Hmm by davester666 · · Score: 1

      Just like the vehicle manufacturer who enables the vehicle to travel that fast.

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
    43. Re:Hmm by aquacrayfish · · Score: 1

      In the real world this is seen as nothing more than just a company doing the absolute bare minimum to cover their ass. Sure, it fulfills all the necessary legal requirements to pawn off responsibility, so odds are the suit will go nowhere. However, if you truly believe that adding the trophy and issuing this as cover as being a responsible citizen, this yet one more reason why 'corporate personhood' is dangerous.

    44. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Should we sue car makers for having speedos that go over 120km/h or so because some idiot decides to point a camera at it and drive like a tool? What about stand alone gps units that show speed? Garmin bike computers (gasp: you could mount one in a car if you were an idiot!)? Personal breathalyser units for encouraging drinking to excess?

      Imbeciles hell bent on going for a Darwin Award will be imbeciles going for a Darwin Award. Short of heavy sedation and padded cells there's not much you can do about it.

    45. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It does make you wonder what Snapchat was thinking with this feature. Did nobody anticipate that jerks would drive crazy speeds because of this thing?

      They didn't think, that's the problem...

    46. Re: Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's greedy to provide utility to customers?

    47. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      carnival rides

    48. Re:Hmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It does make you wonder what Snapchat was thinking with this feature. Did nobody anticipate that jerks would drive crazy speeds because of this thing?

      What makes you think snapchat was thinking? it's a filter for a silly but very popular app. Why should they have to think about every move an idiot could possibly make at an arbitrary future date? It's not reasonable to assume that a teen will speed because of the application but it is certainly reasonable to assume that a teen will speed because they are a teen. Don't be a fucking idiot.

    49. Re:Hmm by mjwx · · Score: 1

      So a feature should be enabled for 100% of the users when 0.005% of them might avail themselves of it legally?

      Actually the feature is enabled by default, you need to add extra engineering to disable it.

      So you're suggesting that everyone should be punished because 0.000000000000006% may misuse it. That is going to be one hell of a slippery slope. How long until you have a card tracking how many calories you've had or a "TV-like" screen making sure you've done the required amount of exercises.

      Also more than 0.005% of people will go to a "run what you brung" track day. In fact most drivers will have been to one, in their own car or otherwise.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    50. Re:Hmm by hucker75 · · Score: 1

      All I'm wondering is how anyone can blame anybody but the driver who CHOSE TO DRIVE AT 107. If I meet you in the street and tell you to rob a bank, you don't go and do it, you can think for yourself.

    51. Re:Hmm by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      It does make you wonder what Snapchat was thinking with this feature. Did nobody anticipate that jerks would drive crazy speeds because of this thing?

      Jerks do crazy things in any event. Perhaps the automaker should be sued because it created a vehicle that was capable of going 107 miles per hour.

      I use an amateur radio operation called APRS. It tracks my vehicle via sending my GPS location to VHF repeater towers, that in turn broadcast the position to other radios and also to stations known as iGates. The iGates send the info to the internet, to sites like http://aprs.fi/ . Location, speed weather conditions, and twitter-like messages can be sent all over the world.

      But just because my speed is easy to see, doesn't mean I'm going to speed. I have no desire to document myself driving at 107 miles per hour, as yes, if getting into an accident at that speed, that easily findable info would be used as evidence against me. Just proves I am dumb enough to document my stupidity.

      It is a stupid feature on snapchat - which is a stupid application in the first place. But there has to be stupid things for stupid people to do, and an asshole who would drive that fast on the highway is likely to do so anyhow.

      So let's ban Snapchat, APRS, dashboard Cams, or anything that documents the speed someone is going because some asshole dirves too fast using them.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    52. Re:Hmm by cwsumner · · Score: 1

      A few years back when they lowered all of the speed limits to 55 mph, there was serious talk of making auto manufacturers limit the speeds of the cars to 55 mph. Lucky for all of us it did not pass.

      The Interstate highway is specified to allow 120 mph as a design point for banking and curve radius. Of course conjested areas are not expected to run that, but they still do the banking and radius as far as practical.

      Imagine plodding around on a 120 mph highway at 55 mph ... in an emergency like you wife is having a baby?

      There should be a law against people who say "there should be a law" ! 8-)

    53. Re:Hmm by rtb61 · · Score: 1

      No one is trying to excuse the driver and they should face the typical penalty for excessive speed and reckless driving. However there is more than enough blame to spread around and based upon snapchat's behaviour and purposefully promoting criminal activity, keep in mind promoting crime is a criminal activity, they certainly deserve the civil suit and prosecutors should really consider a criminal indictment.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    54. Re:Hmm by KGIII · · Score: 1

      The cops have a radar activated sign that tells you how fast you're going and it displays the speed on the board. They don't have cameras attached to them or anything. It's usually a question of bravado in risking a ticket more than it is a question of driving at outlandishly high rates of travel but a few people will do what they can/dare to get the board to display the highest number possible.

      For the record, I've not seen any register higher than 99 MPH - there is no third number. It goes to 99 and starts blinking quicker than normal. Ideally, you have a passenger with you to take a picture of the sign. No, you don't take a picture of the sign yourself as you're driving. It's based on the honor system. For a while, there was even a whole award system based on this and between a half-dozen friends. I do wonder if the signs store the information somewhere so that they know how fast people go.

      There are systems that do - I've worked with them. But I've not worked with the enforcement signs and I have no idea if those do or not. The old school ones had pneumatic tubes that ran across the road in sets of two. Using simple math they could tell you how fast they were going and they also counted the traffic. The earlier ones simply counted the traffic. They still use the same system of tubes but they're now connected to electronic storage and broadcast the data to a receiver that picks up the data as the DOT truck (or research car) drives by. They also use a laser or infrared beam system to count cars and those can be used to detect speed as well - easier done when there are multiple sensors.

      --
      "So long and thanks for all the fish."
    55. Re:Hmm by crbowman · · Score: 1

      I agree with you, I don't know what they were thinking. Having said that, I think it's sad that they even have to worry about that. The kid that hit them is the one responsible, and the only one. However, I do realize that he probably doesn't have the kind of deep pockets that snapchat does. Again I think this is sad all the way around.

    56. Re:Hmm by anti-disney · · Score: 1

      If we are going to hold snapchat liable for idiots who choose to drive a vehicle at high speeds and crashing then we also need to hold smart phone makers for adding the feature to use the phone (especially for texting) while driving. Many people crash because they are attempting to text while driving even though smart phone manufacturers have repeatedly told users that they should not use their smart phone while driving. It would be reasonable that smart phone makers would have known that people would text while driving so aren't they liable if someone chooses to use their smart phone (against the recommendations of the manufacturer) to text while driving? After all, the smart phone maker should have left out the ability to text from the phone or adding some sensors to will not allow someone who is stupid enough to text while driving to do so. What were car makers thinking putting engines in cars that can reach speeds of 130 MPH or faster. Don't they know that some idiot will attempt to drive a vehicle at high speeds? They strongly recommend that you don't drive a car at such high speeds and will advise you that you could void your warranty if there is evidence that you were driving your vehicle at such speeds but people still are dumb enough to try it and sometimes they crash which is another reason automakers don't recommend you drive at such high speeds.

  5. pfffft... only 107 mph? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    rookie

  6. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Counterproposal: A device that turns off the driver's airbags and seatbelt at speeds more than 30 miles per hour over the limit.

  7. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Sydin · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Why limit it to just millennials? A 50 year old person texting behind the wheel is just as dangerous as a 16 year old texting behind the wheel, and you're lying through your teeth if you tell me you haven't seen idiots of all ages glued to their phones instead of the road while driving. Focusing in on stereotyping one generational group instead of actually trying to address the problem generally fails to get anything of merit accomplished.

  8. grr by fishscene · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Yet another case of holding people who have absolutely NOTHING to do with this situation asking to be held responsible for the actions of another. Why don't we hold the person responsible for this... responsible? And before you say "Why does snapchat even have this filter?". Ever heard of passengers? It's the same reason why locking out the phone while driving doesn't work (n-1) people in a vehicle/boat. I for one don't want a stupid world where people not responsible for a situation are responsible.

    1. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      It was a passenger using the app, if you RTFA.

    2. Re:grr by jfdavis668 · · Score: 1

      The article doesn't state whether the driver is being sued, or not. That would be a separate case, and probably is already happening.

    3. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This isn't a situation where the driver was distracted. Whether the driver or passenger was the one using the snapchat filter is irrelevant.

      And, I daresay you might be creating a straw man argument... no one is saying the driver isn't equally at fault. But the plaintiff probably suspects that Snapchat has deeper pockets than the driver.

    4. Re:grr by Cruciform · · Score: 1

      Not-a-lawyer disclaimer.

      Anyway, in a case like this the decisions will assign responsibility by percents. If the injured parties are suing to cover his medical and continuing care expenses then they're likely not going to get any help by suing the girl alone. Even if a court says SnapChat could have foreseen the consequences and only assigns 2% of the blame to them it could help cover his medical expenses for years.

      The foresight does have an affect legally.

    5. Re:grr by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      The driver in the 107 mph car is most likely dead. No one to sue.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    6. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And exactly what can the brain damaged victim get from an 18 year old that in any way helps toward the probably huge financial burden he now has?

    7. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "McGee and her three passengers suffered various injuries"

    8. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well Leftists like Hillary Clinton want to hold gun dealers and manufacturers accountable when a gun they sold or made is used in a crime. How is this different?

    9. Re:grr by bangular · · Score: 2

      Amazingly not. I read about this a few days ago and she TOOK A FUCKING SELFIE AFTER THE ACCIDENT.

    10. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Would he have been doing the same if this Snapchat's feature didn't existed?, doubtful, since he was doing it for that reason.

    11. Re:grr by DarkOx · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Don't underestimate the self absorbed nature of the millenials

      http://www.npr.org/sections/al...

      I honest think all this identity politics, blacklivesmatter, transrights, green, peta, and other nonsense has to do with the fact that nobody ever told them no. They never learned any real empathy or "mindfulness" that would lead them make basic human considerations like not endangering the lives of others. Since they don't actually care or love anyone but themselves the find the most ridiculous causes they can to latch onto so as to convince themselves they complete narcissists.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    12. Re:grr by Paco103 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The filter encouraged the driver to travel at 107 mph in a 55 zone. It doesn't matter who was holding the phone.

      How do you figure? Let's accept the fact that there is a 100mph trophy, which appears to be in debate, but let's just accept it as true. Then snapchat encouraged users to go fast. Are there many legal and safe ways to go that fast? Yes. Plane, train, passenger on a racetrack (yes there are options for that), etc. It is not an achievement for going 107mph in a 55mph zone. It was not for going faster than the speed limit. It did not encourage illegal behavior. It encouraged, at best, behavior that is the users responsibility to determine a safe time and place to perform.

      My fitbit encourages me to run. It does NOT encourage me to run into traffic. It does not encourage me to plow others out of my way so I can run on a crowded path. My scuba computer tracks my max depth, so is it encouraging me to dive deep? Sure, especially when combined with online dive logs. Is it encouraging me to go deeper than I know by my training to be safe for my training and equipment?

      No. It is my responsibility as a human with a brain to determine when activities are acceptable. It wasn't a death toll counter or encouraging anything with no legal opportunity. It wasn't financially incentivizing illegal behavior (the equivalent argument to paying someone to punch someone else).

      The driver is responsible for their actions. They drove a car at nearly twice the legal speed limit. That was their decision, and that responsibility is on them.

    13. Re:grr by jklovanc · · Score: 2

      From the article:

      Passengers in McGee's vehicle have said she was trying to take a picture of herself while traveling over 100 mph when she hit Maynard.

      The driver was taking the picture.

    14. Re:grr by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      From the article;

      Maynard's lawsuit is seeking unspecified damages from McGee and Snapchat, which it claims encouraged her to drive recklessly.

      The driver is being sued in the same case.

    15. Re:grr by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      The 18 year old has insurance (I hope).

    16. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Driver is not likely being sued. Remember SnapChat has more money to win and that is why they are being sued.

    17. Re:grr by cerberusti · · Score: 1

      GA state minimum is $25,000 per person in bodily injury, likely not close to enough in this case. Sure they can go after the kid too and eventually garnish much of what they make, but that is also likely not to cover it.

      The obvious target for a civil suit is the party with the ability to pay.

      --
      I'm a signature virus. Please copy me to your signature so I can replicate.
    18. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      So basically your hypothesis is that this moron was driving recklessly because the police doesn't shoot enough unarmed black people?

    19. Re:grr by ogdenk · · Score: 2

      I doubt she has coverage that will cover $500,000 in medical bills. With head trauma and several broken bones, hospital stays can be measured in months and they'll happily charge you $20 for an aspirin and $2,500+ per day to sit in the ICU. Not to mention the multi-thousand dollar tests and bills from specialists. Then all the PT, psych therapy, medications and possibly home nurses if he's really bad off.

      I don't know anyone with insurance quite that cool. Hell, I have the state minimum $25,000/$50,000 liability. The 18 yr old covering these expenses is unrealistic. It'd be nice, but the most they'll get is a judgement she'll never be able to pay and he'll still be screwed.

    20. Re:grr by ogdenk · · Score: 1

      On the gun thing, guns have but one purpose.... to kill. They do exactly what they say on the tin. If someone passes a background check, it's not the manufacturer or dealer's fault if someone is illegally killed with one. It WOULD be their fault if a gun being used to stop a crime or defend yourself fails to go bang because of a defect.

      Cars on the other hand are designed to travel roads and get you to a destination. If one is misused by an 18 yr old and that misuse is somehow even partially encouraged by SnapChat, then they have a case.

    21. Re:grr by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      That is why most drivers have uninsured/under insured driver insurance.

    22. Re:grr by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      That is why most drivers cary uninsured/under insured driver insurance.

    23. Re:grr by ogdenk · · Score: 1

      Which helps but still doesn't cover the whole balance generally.

      Once you get torn up bad enough, the insurance softens the blow some but you're still going to be bankrupt.

    24. Re:grr by arth1 · · Score: 1

      Would he have been doing the same if this Snapchat's feature didn't existed?, doubtful, since he was doing it for that reason.

      She.

    25. Re:grr by Shompol · · Score: 2

      By adding a feature to boast your speed, they set up a pissing err... speeding contest that cost someone dearly already.The guy who was crippled didn't even participate!

      This reminds me of a vodka drinking contest someone organized in Russia -- the winner died on the spot, the runner up was hospitalized. Russian authorities DID start a criminal investigation. How is this different?

    26. Re:grr by stilwebm · · Score: 1

      The injury lawyers for the plaintiff are most likely working on a contingent basis, and even if they aren't, they're looking for someone who can pay out significant damages. The driver is 18; Snapchat is valued at around $16 Billion as of March. The injury lawyers smell cash only in the latter.

    27. Re:grr by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      It still does not justify suing involved parties. Why not sue the car companies for not have speed limiters on cars?

    28. Re:grr by OhPlz · · Score: 1

      That's like saying one of those radar enabled speed limit signs that shows your current speed encourages people to speed because it flashes if you go fast enough. Ooo, look, I made it flash!

      I'd expect that to be laughed out of court.

    29. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The driver is responsible for their actions. They drove a car at nearly twice the legal speed limit. That was their decision, and that responsibility is on them.

      Logically, I agree with you. But legally, this is the USofA we're talking about. People have successfully sued after they "dried" their pet in a microwave, because it didn't have a warning sticker that told them not to do it. It's insane, but unfortunately reality.

    30. Re:grr by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      What happens to the victim? Say they sue and win, but the driver can't pay. Clearly not getting treatment isn't an option, or is it? Will the hospital cut them off? What is the likely outcome here, bankruptcy?

      I hate that induce is a few hundred pounds a year, but then I remember that unlimited liability is pretty important.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    31. Re:grr by JustSomeProgrammer · · Score: 1

      Just to put it out there as a possibility, they may be taking this step as a necessity and not because they necessarily think Snapchat is primarily to blame. As the girl's a teenager she probably doesn't have much money and since the accident left the husband permanently brain damaged he's probably lost work and might need special care that the wife can't possibly afford to give. They are probably hoping Snapchat might have the finances needed to support them. In other words it might be impossible due to reality to hold the girl fully responsible. I don't know if this is just, but I can understand why they would take this step for reasons other than greed.

    32. Re:grr by nbauman · · Score: 1

      Christal McGee was driving in her father's Mercedes-Benz, which she totaled. That's $50-100,000 right there.

      I assumed her dad had deep pockets, and insurance to protect it.

      BTW, the reason they might charge you $20 for an aspirin (which I think is an exaggeration) when Walmart charges you $2 for a bottle of 100 is that the bottle of aspirin in a hospital might be sitting on the shelf next to another drug with a similar name that could kill you. A lot of people were killed in hospitals by taking the wrong medicine. The $20 goes for the complicated, redundant system that makes sure you get the right prescription. Instead of being dispensed by a teenage Walmart clerk, that bottle of aspirin in a hospital is dispensed by a nurse who studied organic chemistry and knows all about the thousands of drugs she might dispense. When I was in the hospital the nurses would read my wrist band and ask me to confirm my date of birth before they would give me a drug, to make sure they were giving it to the right patient.

    33. Re:grr by ogdenk · · Score: 1

      Actually, I myself floor it every time I see one of those things. It's like an uncontrollable instinct.... immediate shit-eating grin and my engine redlines before I can stop myself. They do not serve the intended purpose LOL I know a lot of other people who do the same thing. I'd never try hitting 107 like the retarded kid in TFA but still, those stupid things are a waste of tax dollars.

      There's really not much other good use for that SnapChat feature.... who the hell cares if you drive by Touchdown Jesus at 55mph?

    34. Re:grr by ogdenk · · Score: 1

      If you have a choice between trying to sue SnapChat or not getting the care you need to live.... you would sue SnapChat. In countries with socialized medicine this would be less of a problem but here in the US, the victim is responsible for payment or anything but an ER visit and they tell you to f**k off after a couple visits where you can't pay.

    35. Re:grr by ogdenk · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Before you say Medicare and Disability..... Medicare only covers about 80% and it usually takes at least a year to get disability and medicare and usually there's hearings and lawyers involved. He probably wouldn't get Medicaid either if his wife is working.

      Meanwhile, he could lose his health insurance, house and car because he can't work.... and his wife may crack under the stress of trying to take care of someone with brain damage and the financial strain of covering him under her health insurance which her employer won't kick out extra for.

      But we don't want socialized health care in this country cuz.... ya know.... freedom.... and it could never happen to *ME*.

    36. Re:grr by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      I wasn't going to mention either. By your logic why not just send the bill to a random company? They would have as much to blame for this accident as Snapchat.

    37. Re:grr by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      If I was driving a vehicle I would carry sufficient uninsured/under insured coverage to handle these situations.

    38. Re:grr by ogdenk · · Score: 1

      Are you willing to pay HUNDREDS in insurance per month? Often they don't give you many options to choose from for uninsured/underinsured coverage as well.

      Nobody EVER anticipates needing $250,000 to $1,000,000 to cover their own injuries in a car accident and most of the time, you really don't. The minimum will usually cover it for most situations. It's rare that dumbasses will slam into you at 107mph. Most of the time, when this happens to someone all they really need is $10,000 for their family to have a quick closed casket funeral and bury them.

    39. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It did not encourage illegal behavior.

      It obviously did. Some guy unrelated to this irresponsible photo option is in a hospital because of it.

    40. Re:grr by Richard_at_work · · Score: 1

      The fact that there are minimums at all is astounding - here in the UK there is no limit to third party liability (you can limit the amount *you* get paid by *your* insurance, but not how much someone else can get paid by your insurance), so its astounding to us that in the US you can get away with limits.

    41. Re:grr by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't know anyone with insurance quite that cool. Hell, I have the state minimum $25,000/$50,000 liability.

      Hi, I have $1 million worth of liability insurance that relates to me if I am operating a motor vehicle. So now you know someone. Its shockingly not that expensive to have a massive policy like that.

      When I fly an r/c airplane or helicopter I've got $3 million worth of liability insurance at my disposal. That extra $2 mil insurance policy is almost free.

    42. Re:grr by St.Creed · · Score: 1

      Hmm... that is actually a testable hypothesis. One wonders...

      --
      Therefore, by the (faulty) logic you're using, you're just a cow with a keyboard - osu-neko (2604)
    43. Re:grr by DarkOx · · Score: 1

      No my hypothisis is this guy was driving recklessly because he is a narcissist. He does not actually give a damn about anyone but himself or to the extent that he does care about others, he only cares that he is liked, not about their actual well being.

      He is most likely a member or associates with one or more of the above groups. They are easy ways to drape yourself in the mantel of caring and get a large base of support without actually having to do anything or learn about anything.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
  9. not so fast... by supernova87a · · Score: 0, Troll

    I know there can be a kneejerk libertarian argument for personal responsibility, but certainly a rational observer could reasonably entertain the idea of "contributory negligence" against Snapchat. If Snapchat enables very easily some behavior that could be considered negligent or law-breaking, some party could sue them for contributing to a reasonably-anticipated outcome of that contribution.

    If Snapchat started having a feature called "Number of red lights run!" -- would you defend them from liability?

    1. Re:not so fast... by Tinsoldier314 · · Score: 1

      If Snapchat started having a feature called "Number of red lights run!" -- would you defend them from liability?

      Snapchat didn't encourage illegal behavior like your example does. There's nothing wrong with taking a picture of yourself, as a passenger, in a vehicle going below the speed limit.

    2. Re:not so fast... by jklovanc · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Would you hold Snapcat liable if they recorded the surrounding temperature and someone tried to maximize it by sitting in an enclosed car in the hot sun and died? All Snapchat did was to record a readily available piece of GPS data. It is the fault of the driver that she tried to maximize it. Snapchat does not have a "speed trophy". They even show a warning not to use Snapchat while driving.

    3. Re:not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      While I agree that it was a poor decision to include this in the app there are situations where "speeding" is legal. This ultimately comes down to the difference of kids dragging down main street on Friday night versus people who do this at a real drag strip that isn't going to have public traffic and pedestrians.

      So when will it come down to auto makers being sued because they have cars that can outgo the speed limit recognized by the law? Again, there is a time and place for it and sometimes situations that make it reasonable but still illegal. Granted, most people will never be at that time and place nor in that situation but still my car can do roughly twice the highest speed limit posted in my state. Does the fact that the speedometer displays speeds over these speed limits mean that the manufacturer is trying to "gamify" my car's ability?

      You may scoff but there are a number of lawsuits out there already, including lawsuits pursued by government entities, that make me wonder if this is where we're going as a society.

    4. Re:not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I know there can be a kneejerk libertarian argument for personal responsibility, but certainly a rational observer could reasonably entertain the idea of "contributory negligence" against Snapchat. If Snapchat enables very easily some behavior that could be considered negligent or law-breaking, some party could sue them for contributing to a reasonably-anticipated outcome of that contribution.

      If Snapchat started having a feature called "Number of red lights run!" -- would you defend them from liability?

      Ummm the snapchat feature offers the same basic functionality as the car's speedometer...

      Just because it measures speed doesn't mean it encourages speeding, running red lights is illegal.

      Should we sue GM and ford for building vehicles that could achieve a speed higher than 85 MPH (I believe that is the current highest speed in the US though I could be wrong)

           

    5. Re: not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, I might. Especially if the info is public and can be acted upon by police, insurance, parents.

      Or I might support it because I believe that people should take fscking responsibility for their own stupidity, and concepts that allow a burgler or tresspasser to sue me because the pool looked inviting, or because they tripped over a kids toy while robbing the house need to go out the window.

    6. Re:not so fast... by supernova87a · · Score: 1

      That's a very charitable interpretation of the Speed filter. I think most people would recognize that recording and displaying a speed, especially in an app designed to show off your experiences in front of others, might lead to competitive behavior on the speed.

      No one is showing off or competing, or trying to share their environmental temperature in the same way. That logic is a stretch.

    7. Re:not so fast... by Scarred+Intellect · · Score: 1

      I know there can be a kneejerk libertarian argument for personal responsibility, but certainly a rational observer could reasonably entertain the idea of "contributory negligence" against Snapchat.

      Obviously we need to limit speedometers.

      Or cars that go so fast. And GPS that shows speed. And even tachometers (Hey, it's not my fault I blew the engine, it's Ford's because they installed a tachometer that went up to 8000). Also, anemometers; we can't have people putting those on their vehicles to determine excess speed.

      Blame the manufacturers!

      No. A RATIONAL observer cannot reasonably entertain that idea. Blame the PERSON. THEY used it recklessly, NOT the people who designed/built it. The ONLY person responsible for how something is being used is the person using it.

      The kneejerk reaction here is trying to assign blame to anyone other than who actually committed the act. I'm sure suing Snapchat can be much more lucrative than some idiot who's stupid enough to drive 107 in a 55 while taking a picture, but that doesn't justify anything.

    8. Re:not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then why does the car go over 100 MPH? The auto maker is at least as culpable as SnapChat.

    9. Re:not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      or even above the speed limit on a race track, private road or closed circuit.
      Hell - if snapchat capped it at the driving speed limit, the feature would be useless for people in planes, speedboats, and even some no vehicular activities like skiiing, bobsledding, being shot out of a cannon, and many other activities.

      In this case the blame falls squarely with the driver. Going after a company because it has bigger pockets is the worst kind of ambulance chasing lawyering.

    10. Re:not so fast... by supernova87a · · Score: 1

      Well of course there's nothing wrong with taking a picture of yourself as a passenger going below the speed limit! Duh.

      The point is that by the existence of a function that promotes recording your speed -- within an application that is designed to share exceptional experiences -- you might reasonably think that people would be driven to get into situations that would result in exceptional speeds. Hmm?

      And do you really think that most people, even as passengers, are recording photos of themselves marked with the speed, below the speed limit, because that's cool?

    11. Re:not so fast... by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      I think most people would recognize that recording and displaying a speed, ...

      I would think that most people would know that showing off to friends does not justify doing something illegal and dangerous to everyone on the road. Should selfi stick manufacturers be held liable for people who take selfies in dangerous locations and die?

      No one is showing off or competing, or trying to share their environmental temperature in the same way.

      You showed a "red herring", Snapchat does not have that filter, so I showed a more reasonable possibility. Snapchat would never have a "Number of red lights run" filter as the very act is illegal. There is no way to legally use that filter. A speed filter can be used without exceeding the speed limit.

      That logic is a stretch.

      I don't agree. In both cases, speed and temperature, all Snapchat is doing is displaying a piece of data. It is the decision of the user to do something unlawful or unsafe to maximize it.

    12. Re:not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sounds great until you are having to live in poverty because of the crushing bills involved with the lifetime care of your brain damaged spouse because you couldn't get anything out of the broke-assed teenager who was responsible for the situation you are now in.

    13. Re:not so fast... by supernova87a · · Score: 1

      Yeah, lots of inapt examples you gave there. All of the items you quote have many other legitimate uses. In this case, the Snapchat function so intimately related to the sharing of exceptional experiences that a *rational* observer could conclude that Snapchat could have anticipated that their user base would use it in a way that might be dangerous.

      That is enough of a bar to bring suit in court, and not get it immediately tossed out.

      That is also why gun manufacturers are at risk of being on the hook for their products. How do you feel about that one? While guns also have a few other legitimate uses, in the case of say, assault weapons, they can be so intimately linked to contributing to the death of people that a lawsuit against them could be entertained by a reasonable observer.

    14. Re:not so fast... by Paco103 · · Score: 1

      Clearly you've never sat around with people from Arizona and Louisiana arguing whether it's the heat or humidity that's worse.

    15. Re:not so fast... by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      Money should not come from inappropriate sources either. Why not sue the car company for building a car that can go 107mph?

    16. Re:not so fast... by Scarred+Intellect · · Score: 1

      Yea, I disagree with everything you said there. I cannot ever conclude that anyone other than the user is ever responsible for what the user does. Snapchat didn't make the girl's decision any more than Colt made Custer's decisions.

      We certainly aren't going to agree on this, I can tell that now; but I AM interested in how you justify that a manufacturer/designer can be responsible for how their device is used. A common example I often use (no doubt just as inapt as my previous examples) is a bicycle: it is not the bicycle manufacturer's fault that it can be used for theft. That, as you pointed out, also has other legitimate uses. But so does the Snapchat filter (nevermind that I don't think Snapchat itself has any legitimate uses...)

      On another not, thanks for "inapt". New word. I like it.

    17. Re:not so fast... by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 1
      It is difficult to make a car that will accelerate adequately without limiting its top speed. You need power to accelerate. Power for adequate acceleration would also increase the top speed. One could limit the top speed using limiters and electronics. But that is complicated. There is no precedent. And there is no real incentive for automakers to provide one.

      But private companies could install speed limiters in their vehicles driven by their employees. Many do.

      --
      sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
    18. Re:not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bingo. That last sentence is the important one. They told users not to use Snapchat while driving. The users were supposed to photograph themselves doing other activities — maybe a roller coaster (if they had some sort of strap to keep the phone in one's hand) or riding in an airplane. They were told not to do so while driving.

      Then, some guy did. Darwin was almost involved. This guy was stupid and should bear the responsibility for his stupidity. Neither Snapchat nor society should have to pay for his stupidity. Unfortunately, he'll end up on some sort of disability and be bailed out by the taxpayer.

    19. Re:not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Would you hold Snapcat liable if they recorded the surrounding temperature and someone tried to maximize it by sitting in an enclosed car in the hot sun and died?

      A more apt analogy would be Snapchat incentivizing its users to lock someone else in the hottest car possible.

      The injured party (in this lawsuit) isn't the person who was using Snapchat.

    20. Re:not so fast... by Scarred+Intellect · · Score: 1

      It's really not difficult, nor complicated, nor without precedent. I had a 1993 Chevy Silverado that was factory governed at 93 mph...Similar issue on a '94. I'm pretty sure my friend's '04 Ford F350 also had a governor, but I don't quite remember. I know several other vehicles I've had had them; I've had enough vehicles that I don't remember which ones specifically.

      The only part of your post that I agree with is the last two sentences: there is no real incentive for automakers to (consistently) provide governors. They don't lose sales because of it.

    21. Re:not so fast... by laxguy · · Score: 1

      Who are you competing against? (You equally stupid friends?) There is no leaderboard or ranking system to judge yourself against others.

    22. Re:not so fast... by vux984 · · Score: 1

      All Snapchat did was to record a readily available piece of GPS data

      Apparently that's not all Snapchat does. Apparently there is a 'trophy' involved?

      Is there some sort of gamification going on, with "acheivements or trophies", perhaps it even has global rankings and completion stats (I don't know)?

      But if so -- whether that makes them liable here, I'm not convinced of THAT yet -- but if they'd gamified it they WERE doing more than "merely recording data".

    23. Re:not so fast... by SuiteSisterMary · · Score: 1

      By that "logic," every car sold in the US of A should have a mechanically-enforced top speed of 60 mph, LET ALONE that attractive nuisance of a speedometer, which is just DARING you to see if you can get the needle to peg out.

      --
      Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
    24. Re:not so fast... by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      There is no "trophy" in Snapchat for "speed". Here is the list. (Note the link to the 8 new ones). She may have hoped there was a trophy but it does not exist.

    25. Re:not so fast... by sjames · · Score: 1

      I would say the guns (including "assault rifles") don't rise to the level of liability. Now if they came out with one that took pictures of your kills and awarded points and trophies, it would be another story.

    26. Re:not so fast... by whoever57 · · Score: 1

      If a manufacturer provides a "reward" for driving at excessive speeds, then yes, sue them, whoever they are: car companies included.

      Car companies don't provide any incentive to drivers to drive fast. They don't send you a certificate for exceeding the speed limit. That's the crucial difference.

      --
      The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
    27. Re:not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No one is showing off or competing, or trying to share their environmental temperature in the same way.
       
      You must not live or know people from cold climates. I see 12 pictures a day on my Facebook newsfeed from people anytime the temperature goes under 10 F.

    28. Re:not so fast... by WaffleMonster · · Score: 1

      If Snapchat started having a feature called "Number of red lights run!" -- would you defend them from liability?

      I hope you just didn't RTFA or missed "A warning when users first open the speed filter feature urges them not to use it while driving."

      If Snapchat enables very easily some behavior that could be considered negligent or law-breaking, some party could sue them for contributing to a reasonably-anticipated outcome of that contribution.

      Why stop there? Shouldn't the phone manufacturer be held liable for contributing to distracted driving? After all they know full well their products contribute to at least 100k incidents of distracted driving incidents per year with between many hundreds to thousands of fatalities. What about component vendors who make ICs being integrated into phones? They know full well where the product is being used and they have access to the same data on consequences of smart phone use. What's the difference? How is that not "contributory negligence"?

      The lawyers are chomping at the bit to hawk an insane illogical legal environment upon this country simply to enrich themselves.

    29. Re:not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      within an application that is designed to share exceptional experiences

      Really? Do you have a cite on what Snapchat was designed for? I thought it was designed to send nudie pics back and forth, get celebrities exposed, and embiggen the NSA's spank bank, none of which involve automobile moving violations.

    30. Re:not so fast... by supernova87a · · Score: 1

      Really, so having a disagreeing opinion = Troll?

    31. Re: not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Most people seem able to resist that temptation so far, but it may interest you to know that your speedometer is regulated. It is required to fail safe, namely show a higher speed than you may be going in the event of an error.

      Beyond that, supercar manufacturers go to some lengths to discourage going flatout in their vehicles. Bugatti for example has a separate key. But even domestic manufacturers don't push the limits they could. It isn't worth it to them. Even Motorcycles haven't pushed past the Hayabusa line.

      That said, you want that? Call your Congressman and say it.

    32. Re:not so fast... by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      What is the incentive to go faster? There is no "trophy".

      The lawsuit is claiming the driver drove too fast due to Snapchat. The accident was a side effect of the speed.

    33. Re:not so fast... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      within an application that is designed to share exceptional experiences

      Snapchat? No. It's an application designed to harness the power of infinite idiots to create a Shakespearean work.

  10. Uh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Does that mean a speedometer motivates you to speed because the speed is displayed? How you use a device/app is up to you though, if you're an idiot then it's your own fault.

    1. Re:Uh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If someone tacked social sharing onto a speedometer it would be the inverse of this situation. A speedometer by itself is not. What an app or device does is not easily separated from what it will be used for. Smart manufacturers/developers go out of their way to distance themselves from misuse, rather than actively creating features ripe for misuse.

  11. Re:driving lockout when phone active by zlives · · Score: 1

    you mean like in a motor cycle... yeah that will work!! and no one will ever buy a motor cycle again either.

  12. thank god for lawyers by SkyLeach · · Score: 1

    they are the only industry that has figured out how to earn money on stupid

    --
    My $0.02 will always be worth more than your â0.02, so :-p
    1. Re:thank god for lawyers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      they are the only industry that has figured out how to earn money on stupid

      Apple does a fine job of it too...

    2. Re:thank god for lawyers by fnj · · Score: 1

      [lawyers] are the only industry that has figured out how to earn money on stupid

      Error. Illogic detected. Maximization of personal gain is not stupidity.

    3. Re:thank god for lawyers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      i thought that was snapchats entire business model?

    4. Re:thank god for lawyers by sjames · · Score: 1

      He didn't say they are stupid, but that they make money when other people are stupid.

    5. Re:thank god for lawyers by SkyLeach · · Score: 1

      they are the only industry that has figured out how to earn money on stupid

      Apple does a fine job of it too...

      only by using law

      --
      My $0.02 will always be worth more than your â0.02, so :-p
    6. Re:thank god for lawyers by SkyLeach · · Score: 1

      i thought that was snapchats entire business model?

      again, only through legal wrangling (IP)

      --
      My $0.02 will always be worth more than your â0.02, so :-p
  13. Should have known better by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What kind of dumbass tries to pul out on a road where people are driving over 100mph?

  14. I wonder if this guy read the Snapchat TOS by blydro · · Score: 0
    1. Re:I wonder if this guy read the Snapchat TOS by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      The TOS is between Snapchat and a user. This lawsuit is from an accident victim and not a Snapchat user. The TOS does not apply to the accident victim.

  15. Re:driving lockout when phone active by jklovanc · · Score: 1

    How do you tell the difference between the driver's phone and a passenger's phone? These is little issue with passengers using phones.

  16. Why are they not suing the driver? by mark-t · · Score: 1

    While an argument can be made that Snapchat was being idiotic for producing an environment that might entice people to drive faster, the blame still seems to me to fall squarely on the driver that was going too fast. Why are they trying to sue Snapchat? Snapchat wasn't controlling the car in any way, so this whole thing looks very suspect to me.

    1. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by Sydin · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Because they can get more money in damages from a tech company than they can from some idiot Georgia teen and her family. If the kid who crashed into them were a multi-millionaire, Snapchat's involvement would have never even been a talking point. They are making a fringe case of negligence that will be difficult to prove, simply because it's the option that offers the possibility of highest financial gain.

    2. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      They are suing Snapchat and the driver. The more pockets in the suit and the deeper the pockets the higher the likelihood of a settlement.

    3. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by mark-t · · Score: 1

      Here's the thing.... snapchat explicitly gives a warning to users to *NOT* do what this person did... While sure, people can be idiotic and ignore this warning, the fact that they might do so is *NOT* snapchat's fault.

      Really, this is about on par with blaming a gun manufacturer for a wrongful death when the gun itself was not faulty.

    4. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by Nidi62 · · Score: 1

      Really, this is about on par with blaming a gun manufacturer for a wrongful death when the gun itself was not faulty.

      Well, Sandy Hook parents are suing Remington because they made the gun that was used in the shooting....

      --
      The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
    5. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      If the kid who crashed into them were a multi-millionaire, Snapchat's involvement would have never even been a talking point.

      If the multi-millionaire properly structured their finances, the deep pockets won't be so deep for a lawsuit. These lawsuits are always about milking the most money for the attorneys.

    6. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by gfxguy · · Score: 1

      And you're arguing with people who think you should be able to sue the gun manufacturers because someone misused their product.

      --
      Stupid sexy Flanders.
    7. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by mark-t · · Score: 1

      Well, Snapchat explicitly gives a warning to users to *NOT* use the thing while driving (probably intending for people to use it while they are passengers), so I would think that the more pockets one tries to reach into with the suit when the ones with the deepest pockets are not actually at fault, the greater the chance that any legitimate case they might have had against the person who actually *was* responsible will not actually be given as much merit.

    8. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      I think that the lawyer floated the idea that Snapchat would not want the negative publicity associated with fighting a "brain injured accident victim" regardless of the validity of the case. They are hoping Snapchat would settle out of court. I really hope Snapchat doesn't as it just encourages this type of frivolous lawsuit.

    9. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by mark-t · · Score: 1

      Possibly, but it seems risky, since as I said, it diverts some attention away from any legitimate case they might have.

    10. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by jklovanc · · Score: 1

      It has been filed and has yet to go to trial. Anyone can file a lawsuit. It has little chance of success considering the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act which grants gun manufacturers immunity from any lawsuit related to injuries that result from criminal misuse of their product.

    11. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can't get blood out of a stone.

      That 18 year-old probably doesn't have a pot to piss in. And that guy is going to have a couple of million dollars in medical and rehab bills when all is said and done. Insurance won't pay it all and disability won't either.

      In our society you gotta pull this shit when disasters like this happens.

    12. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by mark-t · · Score: 1

      That 18 year-old probably doesn't have a pot to piss in.

      I won't dispute that, but Snapchat even explicitly warns people *NOT* to use that facility while driving. How can Snapchat be justly found to be liable for damages merely because the driver chose to ignore that warning?

    13. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by sjames · · Score: 1

      It's a bit of a desperation play by an injured plaintiff who may now have no real hope of a decent living otherwise. Improve the safety net and you'll see a lot less such desperation plays.

    14. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, Snapchat explicitly gives a warning to users to *NOT* use the thing while driving (probably intending for people to use it while they are passengers)

      And this glass pipe right here is intended "For tobacco use only".

      That's just a CYA, it's clear that it will be used beyond "intentions".

    15. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Only because they found a liberal judge that agrees with them to okay a "loophole" in the law that bars suing manufacturers.

    16. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by mark-t · · Score: 1

      I'm not going to dispute that it's a CYA... it probably is, but my point is that Snapchat's "A" should be considered "C"'d.

    17. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You cannot disclaim yourself away from negligent actions if a reasonable person judges that there's still a risk you should have known about.

      Legal disclaimars/waivers/TOSes rarely hold up in court.

    18. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by mark-t · · Score: 1

      Except that Snapchat's "disclaimer" simply says "Do not use while driving". This is not even so much of disclaimer as simple and straightforward directions that Snapchat expects its users to abide by while using the application. Suggesting that this could somehow make Snapchat responsible for the negative consequences when people choose to ignore that directive is like suggesting that the signs you see in bars that tell people to not drink and drive are somehow partially responsible if people choose to do that.

    19. Re:Why are they not suing the driver? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's ridiculous, they should instead sue everyone who was involved in passing the 2nd amendment, without that then guns surely wouldn't have been so prevalent and available for use in the shooting.

  17. Jerks by JBMcB · · Score: 1

    Do jerks need a reason to drive stupidly fast?

    --
    My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
    1. Re:Jerks by Luthair · · Score: 1

      Judging from this story, at least one did.

    2. Re:Jerks by fnj · · Score: 1

      Judging from this story, at least one did [need a reason to drive stupidly fast]

      Reality check. Whether or not snapchat bore any responsibility[*] for contributing to the tendency to reckless endangerment, the recklessly dangerous driver is completely at fault. Her shitty judgment and lack of impulse control is the one NECESSARY link in the chain of events. Driving with reckless endangerment is ALREADY against the law.

      [*] My opinion is, none whatever, but that is beside the point.

    3. Re:Jerks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wrong, seriously is there anything you Americans will not sue for.
      I am to stupid to live sue someone the real problem is more of you need to die.

    4. Re:Jerks by turbidostato · · Score: 1

      "Reality check."

      Another reality check. While I (mostly) agree with what you say, the victim is suing snapchat because:
      a) She can.
      b) Snapchat has the money.

      In an "ideal" world (but not so ideal that the accident didn't happen), the victim would sue the hell out of the other driver because, certainly, from her point of view all the blame comes from her -and somehow, the victim would be redressed (maybe the government would pay for the part the offender couldn't cover, but that's beside the point).

      The offender, on her side, not the victim, would be free to sue whatever third parties she considered to be helpers to her action: Snapchat for producing such a distracting app, the car builder for producing a car that can go 120mph, the road builder for unproperly signaling the risks... whomever. And then, the courts would decide if her demands had merit or not.

      But since there's no way the victim will be redressed out of a 18 y.o. girl's money, she tries her luck going after snapchat. Not that it's uncommon: take, for instance, a plane wreak and you'll see the victims representatives going after, say, the plane company instead of just the airline, as it should be.

    5. Re:Jerks by hattig · · Score: 1

      But the 18yo girl had car insurance right?

      I also would be surprised if the car insurers won't pay up until snapchat have been ruled to not be at fault in a court of law.

    6. Re:Jerks by turbidostato · · Score: 1

      "But the 18yo girl had car insurance right?"

      Its coverage will depend on the local legislation -and I don't know the Georgia case: the insurance company may very well bail out in case of gross negligence, for instance.

      Pay attention that the insurance is there to cover the risk of the offender, not the victim. It's only indirectly (by means of making insurance compulsory) that the victim takes advantage from the insurance company... up to the point the insurance company can be legally forced not to avoid the payment.

  18. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    new law proposal:

    for millennials to get drivers licenses, they must install a lockout mechanism in the vehicle, similar to a brethalyzer, that will disable the ignition or accelerator if a phone is active in the vehicle.

    right on, maybe using a Bluetooth fence? apple's got a patent for that.

  19. Everyone's missing the obvious... by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Neither the kid nor the kid's family have deep pockets. So the couple is suing Snapchat because it has deep pockets. Of course, the attorneys will milk every dime.

  20. facilitate is a bit of a stretch. by nimbius · · Score: 2

    Before we jump to the assumption that this family went out of their way to file a lawsuit against snapchat because "georgia reasons" lets remember that after an accident, attorneys will market directly to you. Any cut-rate lawyer in the state has probably shilled all parties for relevant interest in a lawsuit. An attorney, however misplaced, has identified a willing party to file a lawsuit against a popular corporation and sadly failed to realize that snapchat has no identifiable revenue stream. Sure, you'll probably enter the courtroom confident in a win..but outside of publicity for winning a suit against a popular online service your billable hours have likely easily usurped Snapchats own guestimate of a one-time 3 million dollar revenue generation.

    the real pisser is that in the event snapchat puts up a fight over your definition of "facilitate" (which isnt the strongest here) you risk dragging real victims into court which they may not be prepared for. since you havent specified damages, its likely youre waiting for a settlement based on your "facilitate" defense, but be prepared for the possibility the parties give up, or the judge decides theres a reasonable cap on what you can bleed from a company that...again...doesnt make money.

    --
    Good people go to bed earlier.
    1. Re:facilitate is a bit of a stretch. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...what you can bleed from a company that...again...doesnt make money.

      You seize assets - bank accounts, computers, etc ....

    2. Re:facilitate is a bit of a stretch. by cerberusti · · Score: 1

      A company valued at $19 billion will pay it one way or another.

      There is effectively zero chance they could not get a loan, or if they willingly ignored the order and the company or some assets were sold at auction as a result, that it would not make that much.

      They are absolutely good for any judgement rendered against them, as it will not be in the billions.

      --
      I'm a signature virus. Please copy me to your signature so I can replicate.
    3. Re:facilitate is a bit of a stretch. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...and this is why I'm happy that judges in Canada do not hesitate to apply Frivolous Lawsuit charges for wasting the court's time.

      Lawsuit Lottery is much lower in Canada.

  21. a "Hold My Beer" function is a bad idea by laurencetux · · Score: 2

    any feature that risks

    http://www.mofo.com/people/a/a...

    being on the other side of the table in a lawsuit

    SHOULD NOT BE CREATED

    i think at MoFo the interns make more money than most of us here

    1. Re:a "Hold My Beer" function is a bad idea by sconeu · · Score: 1

      For those who don't know about the MoFos... MoFo represented Novell against the Litigious Bastards (SCOXQ)

      --
      General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
    2. Re:a "Hold My Beer" function is a bad idea by StikyPad · · Score: 1

      Nah, most "Big Law" firms, including MoFo, use a lockstep pay scale based on NY offices, sometimes with regional cost-of-living adjustments elsewhere. A few are merit-based, but a) they're outliers, and B) they usually pay less. For the lockstep system, first year associates start at $160k, and have annual raises, or get fired and become suicidal because they have huge student loans and are less likely to be hired by a competitor after they've been canned. If you go to "Above The Law," you can find all of the information on most large law firms as, not surprisingly, it's big news among associates. Now partners.. they're the ones making serious money.

      http://abovethelaw.com/2011/02...
      http://abovethelaw.com/2016/01...
      http://abovethelaw.com/2016/05...

  22. Re:driving lockout when phone active by whoozwah · · Score: 4, Insightful

    the problem with this is that people commonly use their phones as a GPS.

  23. Complete asshats all around by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Both the software engineers and the person driving the car were complete asshats in this situation. What kind of utter moron would think this kind of "feature" in software would be a good thing? What kind of utter moron would be stupid enough to use the feature in this way?

    1. Re:Complete asshats all around by Kreplock · · Score: 1

      Both the software engineers and the person driving the car were complete asshats in this situation. What kind of utter moron would think this kind of "feature" in software would be a good thing? What kind of utter moron would be stupid enough to use the feature in this way?

      The answer to your first question is "the kind that ask your second question"

  24. A few things missing here.. by Virtucon · · Score: 1

    Sue Snapchat? While it's probably the most misguided app feature in a long time, I'm still not sure how they're culpable for somebody recklessly driving. Did they say "hey go out and snap a selfie going as fast as you can! We'll give you a prize?" What about the car manufacturer, it ultimately was the weapon in the crash or how about the cell phone manufacturer for allowing selfies to be taken while the car is in motion? How about the cellular carriers, they allowed the pic to be transmitted while at speed.

    I think this is just a blowhard lawyer looking for deep pockets, Snapchat's lawyers will have this out of court in no time. At least their part in the case. This dipshit who caused the crash should be thrown into a deep hole and covered up with peat.

    --
    Harrison's Postulate - "For every action there is an equal and opposite criticism"
  25. Why stop with snapchat? by Darth+Twon · · Score: 1

    They should sue the car manufacturer for making a car that could go 107MPH.
    The DOT for making a road that is decent enough for a car to travel 107MPH.
    The cell company for allowing connections to their cell towers while the user is traveling 107MPH.
    The phone maker for not detecting that the car was traveling 107MPH.
    The police for not pulling him over before he crashed into their car while traveling at 107MPH.


    Snapchat is only the tip of the iceberg here.

    --
    Take this sig and smoke it.
  26. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Cruciform · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I've had two narrowly avoided head-ons with texters holding their phones across the top of their steering wheels, and neither of them were millenials.
    They were people roughly my age -- and my first video game system was Pong.

  27. Driving 100mph by Jason+Levine · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Putting "using Snapchat" (or any other distraction) aside, I've heard of people seeing how fast their cars would go before. Back in college, a close friend of mine went 100mph on a straight, deserted road just to see what it was like. Even then, I told him that was idiotic. I've done 80mph on highways before and I could feel my control of the car slipping. At 85mph, I'd be much more prone to an accident. I couldn't even conceive of doing 100mph. I'm sure there might be some who could do 100mph safely, but this is a minority. Unfortunately, there are a lot more people who think they can do 100mph safely but can't.

    --
    My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
    1. Re:Driving 100mph by Kreplock · · Score: 2

      If your control was slipping on a decent road with reasonable weather conditions at 80 MPH you should get new tires.

    2. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's really more about the car and the road than the driver at these speeds. 100mph in a Chevy IROC with good tires on a smooth road is hardly exciting, the car is incredibly stable. Due to the aero properties it increases traction as speed increases. 100 in a full size van however... well lets just say there's a reason they typically limit them at 95.

    3. Re:Driving 100mph by jratcliffe · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Depends on the highway. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people drive 100MPH or more every week on the Autobahn, and Germany's highway fatality rate is lower than that in the US.

      100MPH on in the rain on a crowded 2-lane road with a 50MPH speed limit? Really dangerous.

      100MPH on a clear day on a multi-lane highway where the average driver in the middle lane is going 80MPH or more? Not a problem.

    4. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      correct. i run for hours at a time on the autobahn at 100mph safely.

    5. Re:Driving 100mph by xvan · · Score: 4, Informative

      Depends on the car, there are cars you won't even realize you're going at 100mph and cars that at 75mph feel like they're falling apart.

    6. Re:Driving 100mph by MerlynEmrys67 · · Score: 1

      Depends on the car you are driving. My last car was a Mercedes SLK convertible. It easily went 80, you could not pay attention on the highway and find out you were doing 80 in a 65. 100 was easy (again on a straight highway) - I didn't feel safe at 120, the car was fine though. I couldn't imagine doing this in your standard Toyota, mid range sedan.

      --
      I have mod points and I am not afraid to use them
    7. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Putting "using Snapchat" (or any other distraction) aside, I've heard of people seeing how fast their cars would go before. Back in college, a close friend of mine went 100mph on a straight, deserted road just to see what it was like. Even then, I told him that was idiotic. I've done 80mph on highways before and I could feel my control of the car slipping. At 85mph, I'd be much more prone to an accident. I couldn't even conceive of doing 100mph. I'm sure there might be some who could do 100mph safely, but this is a minority. Unfortunately, there are a lot more people who think they can do 100mph safely but can't.

      Oh bull. I drive 85 on the interstate all the time and the car is plenty stable. If your control is slipping at 80mph you need to learn how to drive.

    8. Re:Driving 100mph by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      It's really more about the car and the road than the driver at these speeds. 100mph in a Chevy IROC with good tires on a smooth road is hardly exciting, the car is incredibly stable. Due to the aero properties it increases traction as speed increases.

      I owned a 1986 IROC with a 350 from an '87 because something catastrophic happened to the original motor. At about 115 MPH, the front end develops massive lift and the vehicle wants to fly away. Pathetically, the same is true of the Corvette of the same era, but for that you could buy a complete aftermarket fiberglass underpan that solved the problem. Nobody bothered to make such a fix for the third generation Camaro, because it was a boat and nobody cared.

      Who told you that the IROC had downforce, and why would they lie to you like that? And why would you repeat that lie?

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    9. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I've done 80mph on highways before and I could feel my control of the car slipping. At 85mph, I'd be much more prone to an accident.

      Eh, what kind of car are you talking about? Is it a Yugo going downhill perhaps? That would be dangerous. Otherwise 80 is actually bellow the speed limit of many places (most outside the US of course) and very few reasonably modern cars would have any problem at that speed if they are in good condition (including tires), provided that we are talking about a good road. In fact, since many roads in Europe have an 130KPH limit (81 miles) and in general traffic in the fast lanes tends to go at least 10% over it, I often end up driving at around 90mph to avoid having to go to the rightmost lane and even a small van-style car (a Fiat Doblo) which I take or European road trips feels pretty much solid at that speed and it is safe if the road is appropriate for this speed and you leave huge spaces between cars, because the only problem I see with high speed is the breaking - so you have to make sure you will have time/space to stop.
      In fact, driving in California I was very surprised at how low the speed limit was compared to the roads available. They have roads in Germany with higher speed limits which are smaller than many driveways in California. Yeah, forget about the "autobahn" story, the big, fast freeways in Germany are few (and in the North) most of their autobahns are 2 lanes with one of these lanes often closed for sections due to road works (unless I am very unlucky, it has happened to me 4 out of 4 times crossing Germany in the last 2 years at completely different roads).

    10. Re:Driving 100mph by Triklyn · · Score: 1

      i think part of the problem is not only are you encouraging going fast, you're also encouraging snapchat being the sole focus of the user's attention for good fractions of seconds.

    11. Re:Driving 100mph by AthanasiusKircher · · Score: 2

      Depends on the car, there are cars you won't even realize you're going at 100mph and cars that at 75mph feel like they're falling apart.

      Exactly. Also, one has to consider the age. I'm not sure how long "back when I was in college" was for GP's anecdote, but stability at high speeds has increased significantly (in my experience) for "normal" cars in recent years.

      If you drove most cars 25 years ago at 85 mph, they would feel jittery, handle poorly, engine would feel taxed, etc. If you drove a luxury sedan 15 years ago, you might get a smooth ride at 85mph, but your average car would still feel like it was falling apart or at least taxed.

      Nowadays, if you drive a "normal" sedan at 85mph, it often feels as smooth as that luxury car did 15 years ago. And you can easily go up to 90-100mph in many "normal" cars while barely noticing it.

    12. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If your car was becoming unmanageable at 80-85 in a straight line on any US highway (or something comparable), consult a mechanic or driving instructor. Pretty much any modern car (past 30 years?) worthy of passing a basic safety inspection should be able to do this fine. FYI, Texas has a section of highway posted at 85 now, and there's a lot of US highway posted at 75. Guess what standard cruising speed is?

      I suspect you should start with the driving instructor. I think what you perceived as 'control of the car slipping' was simply the car reacting to variations in the pavement in a safe manner. At speed, they become a lot more obvious. I appreciate your desire to remain safe, but I think you severely underestimate what a car's safe limits are. Many cars are going to do 100 fairly well. The problem is that speed differentials become high if anyone else around is well below that and stopping distances increase exponentially. So your friend going out at night in an area all alone? Meh.

    13. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Depends on the driver as well. If you know what you are doing 100 mph isn't that dangerous.

    14. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The Bentley Continental GTC I just sold was rock solid at 150 mph. The suspension adjusted the car to be stable and the tires were rated for that speed. I've never and will never have my Mazda CX5 up to 100 mph. That would be stupid! That car isn't designed for those speeds.

    15. Re:Driving 100mph by Cro+Magnon · · Score: 1

      My first car felt like it was falling apart at 45! Actually, my first car had pieces falling off it when it was sitting in the parking lot!!

      --
      Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
    16. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Straight deserted road" your friend had some foresight and likely kept his eyes on the road. Not saying he was right, but plenty of people drive excessive speeds in the middle of nowhere without causing trouble. The issue is this girl was a complete dumbass doing 100MPH while taking a picture...expecting everyone to be asleep, when she herself was awake...

    17. Re:Driving 100mph by avandesande · · Score: 1

      They would have been at much greater risk of a high speed accident if they were fiddling with a phone at the same time.

      --
      love is just extroverted narcissism
    18. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you feel your control slipping @ 80mph, you are either

      1.) A really bad driver
      2.) Have a really bad/old/poorly maintained car
      3.) some combination of the above.

      It's routine for people to drive 80-90mph (even though posted limit is 75) even on average highways where I am, and my state isn't even the worst for this type of speeding.

      Now, it certainly increases your risks of losing control (any speed increase does), but modern cars with decent drivers don't hit some sort of "wall" @ 80MPH where it's vastly more risky.

    19. Re:Driving 100mph by delt0r · · Score: 1

      I have been on a motorbike at 300km/h (186mph). What a rush. Do i get the medal? Is /. now liable for all car crashed the have "rewarded".

      --
      If information wants to be free, why does my internet connection cost so much?
    20. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've done 100 miles per hour (160 kph). It was back in 2000, maybe 2001, travelling south down the Hume Freeway from Shepparton to Melbourne. The road was clear, it was a dry day, with good visibility - I didn't realise how fast I was going until I looked down at the speedometer, said, "Holy crap!", and slowed down. (Half an hour later the speed was back up there - travelling slower just didn't feel right in the conditions.)

      Point is, how fast is "too fast" is very dependent upon how far you can see down the road, the road conditions, and the condition of your vehicle. I now have a vehicle with cruise control, so I set it to the speed limit and just let it maintain the speed - that way, I don't get pinged by the speed cameras that the government loves to put up. Sometimes doing the speed limit is crazy - I still remember one occasion when the rain was belting down; the road was covered by at least a couple of cm of water; and I was doing around 10 or 15 kph in a 60 kph zone, because I couldn't see far enough ahead of me to go faster, and because if I'd gone faster, I would have aquaplaned and lost control of the vehicle.

      Of course, being able to judge that the speed you're going at is safe... what I was doing felt safe, but if I were to do it again, would it still feel safe, under the same circumstances? I don't know. Maybe not - maybe with the fifteen years' experience I've gained since then, it wouldn't. (Certainly not in my current, much less powerful car.)

    21. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've done it with a rebuilt 1963 Chevy Impala, sweet V8 engine I'd rebuilt with friends, eight lanes of clear one-way highway at 3:00 AM. When the steering started getting... erratic at about 110, I eased off and went home. It was foolish, and the risk was real. But there was *nothing* else on the road, and I could not resist. The car was the same age as me, and similarly overmuscled, and a long time ago.

      Now, with this body and modern "electrically tuned" cars with bodies made out of finely polished paper designed in wind tunnels for "optimized" strength, meaning they've stripped every gram of mass to save money and weight? Not a flipping chance, there's just too much chance of flipping.

    22. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Something I have learned from racing motorcycles is everyone has their comfort zone of speed. We all feel the vibration from the machine and get a different message from it. You are smart not to drive over your comfort zone.

      On the straight tucked under the windshield at 190mph I don't have a lot of reaction time left to deal with sudden problems. I do it and it's "safe" because it's a closed track and all of the other riders are professionals all going around the same speed give or take 20mph or so and the same direction. Even then we sometimes have spectacular accidents. Tires blow out and even professional riders are still human beings that make some huge mistakes.

      You would not catch me dead going 190mph on a public road. Experts say that the human mind "maxes out" at 155mph. At 155mph by the time you see an issue and recognize it's time to take action it's already to late. Different people have different reaction times of course but I have no desire to die smeared all over the side of a minivan. Most German cars are limited to 155mph because of the limitations in human reaction time.

      Cars and bikes can safely go very high speeds. There's cars and bikes that will loaf at 200mph all day long (as long as you could keep them fueled that is). The problem comes with the reaction time of the people in control. Add some distraction of fiddling with a phone at speed and it's often a deadly result.

      On the topic at hand. While based on what I read in the article I don't agree with blaming Snapchat for the accident it is something that merit's exploring more in court. Snapchat has the ability to see the images posted to their service. If there are a lot of people using this feature to break the law and they were aware of it there might be something there. One thing is for certain. The attorneys will go online and pull up every single image of someone doing triple digit speeds on a public road taking a selfie and use them in court against Snapchat. There's really not enough information provided with this short article to see how Snapchat really plays into this whole situation. These issues are rarely black and white. Thank goodness for real courts and judges as everyone would loose in the court of "some idiots opinion on the internet".

    23. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are you driving a car from the 70s?

    24. Re:Driving 100mph by 4im · · Score: 1

      Depends on the highway. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people drive 100MPH or more every week on the Autobahn, and Germany's highway fatality rate is lower than that in the US.

      100MPH on in the rain on a crowded 2-lane road with a 50MPH speed limit? Really dangerous.

      100MPH on a clear day on a multi-lane highway where the average driver in the middle lane is going 80MPH or more? Not a problem.

      Posting to undo moderation that went wrong.

      This! Know when (not) to speed.

      When I drive my Yamaha XT 600 on the highway, I won't go above 120km/h as it gets unstable (speed limit around here is 130km/h). I've driven my Triumph Sprint ST 2005 at over 200km/h and had no problem whatsoever, provided the autobahn was more or less clear of traffic (like, early sunday morning), or on a circuit.

      Also, as someone else posted, tests for the driving license tend to be serious enough in these parts (western Europe), especially for the motorbike.

      As to distracted driving, it suffices to look around even on a short commute - you'll pretty much see someone with their portable phone glued to their ear or doing something else rather than concentrate on their driving. It's a wonder there aren't even more accidents. But, as the germans say: if someone called out: "Lord, let it rain brains", and the Lord actually went with it, that kind of people still would use their umbrellas...

    25. Re: Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I did 100± in my parents car when I was in high school, and 110 in my A6. The A6 was easy. Ask any /. from Germany how hard 100+ is. OK, my prius doing 100? Now that's crazy.

      I'm amazed you were modded up.

    26. Re:Driving 100mph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you feel like you're losing control of your car at 80 mph, then the car, or the driver, needs to be replaced. Or perhaps your car needs new tires, a realignment, or frame-straightening.

  28. why sue only Snapchat?? by kiviQr · · Score: 1

    Choose your poison: ...sue car manufacturer for adding speedometer to dashboard (it allows users to create selfies with speed), ...sue car manufacturer for allowing excessive speeds in the car, ...sue phone maker for not displaying warning do not operate while driving (like garmin does), ...school system for producing mindless creatures that can't connect action with cause, ...Darwin for creating a trophy that some are destined to win, ...self - for not reading instructions called "life"

    1. Re:why sue only Snapchat?? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      (it allows users to create selfies with speed)

      Contortionists are pretty rare.

  29. Re:driving lockout when phone active by fnj · · Score: 1

    How do you tell the difference between the driver's phone and a passenger's phone? These is little issue with passengers using phones.

    Kind of like, just because there was an open container of alcohol in the vehicle, how do we know the DRIVER was partaking? Objections like yours (and mine) do not change anyone's mind because their mind is made up. Authoritarian tools with "go ahead, tread all over me" written on their back will just continue to spout their rote drivel: "well, that proves my point - in both cases the driver MIGHT be fucking up, so screw proof; assume he IS fucking up".

  30. I should get an award by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I used it on a plane and sent a snap of me traveling in excess of 600 MPH.

  31. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    which is why the Garmin and TomTom lobbies will love it! because cell phone gps is killing their standalone gps business.

  32. Re:driving lockout when phone active by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

    How do you tell the difference between the driver's phone and a passenger's phone?

    A weight sensor in the passenger seat. Many cars already have those, so they can warn if the passenger seat belt is unfastened, and adjust the force of the passenger airbag depending on the size of the passenger. If there is no passenger, then the system could assume that any phone in the car belongs to the driver.

    People could bypass the lockout by putting a sandbag in the passenger seat, so it wouldn't be a 100% solution. But an 80% solution may be better than nothing.

    We could also, or alternatively, put more resources into self-driving cars and driver assisting technology, such as lane control and automatic braking.

  33. Re:driving lockout when phone active by jklovanc · · Score: 1

    The "open container" issue is linked to drinking in public and not driving so it is a different issue.

  34. You cannot sue morons by aglider · · Score: 1

    If you are a moron yourself!

    --
    Sent as ripples into the electromagnetic field. No single photon has been harmed in the process.
  35. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Scarred+Intellect · · Score: 1

    new law proposal: for millennials to get drivers licenses, they must install a lockout mechanism in the vehicle, similar to a brethalyzer, that will disable the ignition or accelerator if a phone is active in the vehicle.

    I'll ignore the conundrum of passenger phones this time...

    A lockout doesn't address the actual problem, which isn't the phone. It's poor driving ability and distractedness. Removing the phone will not stop an idiot from being an idiot, it might help, but isn't a solution.

    We need to make the driving tests harder. And not just for new licenses. Teach them about consequences. Perhaps even implement using a phone while on the drive test like this. Simply taking away their toys isn't going to help, they'll find more toys.

    Cell phones are fine, making something other than driving your priority when you're driving is not. It's bad decision making, plain and simple. THAT'S what we need to address.

  36. Apps don't kill people.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    People kill people

  37. Re: driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe, but he/she is right, that is a fucking moronic knee jerk reaction to a problem caused by morons.

    What happens if Mr. MillenialMoron turns their phone on whilst driving ?
    You can't just cut the engine without risking causing an accident. Well, you could but then BlackBox Inc. will end up getting sued out of existance.

    How do you make sure it can only detect mobiles inside the car ?
    Imagine a hot summer day, driving thru town with the windows down.. driving past pedestrians on their phones, and the roads full of crashes caused by moronic black boxes that keep cutting everyones engines off.

  38. What trophy? by dabadab · · Score: 1

    I have never used Snapchat but I googled for their trophies and I just don't see any "speed trophy" - there are trophies for all kinds of things, but speeding is not one of them. Could someone please enlighten me what's this trophy they talk about?

    --
    Real life is overrated.
  39. NO!!!!!! by MitchDev · · Score: 1

    NONONONONONONONONONONONONONONO!!!!

    It is the driver using the app/device's fault NOT the app's fault, not the phone's fault.

    The people filing the suit should be shamed out of the country.

    Better sue the car maker that put a speedometer in the car too!

  40. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    because driving a car without a seatbelt and air bag is just like driving a motorcycle. Yet another Millennial pokes it's head up.

  41. Re:driving lockout when phone active by fnj · · Score: 1

    IMHO, assholish police-state laws are all in the same category. Anyway, the reasoning is very much related.

  42. Re:driving lockout when phone active by MBGMorden · · Score: 1

    Yep - not to mention the problem with passengers in the car having a phone - or people just hacking the phone to disable whatever triggers they car's lockout.

    Besides - with self-driving technology improving as fast as it is, I doubt this will be an issue for much longer anyways. In 15 years very few humans will be "driving" cars.

    --
    "People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
  43. Obviously the responsability is on max speed by xvan · · Score: 2

    Let's sue all car manufactures if their velocimeter range is above the current circulation max speed because, obviously, they're inactivating people to break the law.

    1. Re:Obviously the responsability is on max speed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It would really suck to live in a world where death is illegal. Unless the opposite was eternal youth, vitality, and no overcrowding. :)

    2. Re:Obviously the responsability is on max speed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      velocimeter... speedometer?

      It measures speed, not velocity.

  44. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    new law proposal:

    for millennials to get drivers licenses, they must install a lockout mechanism in the vehicle, similar to a brethalyzer, that will disable the ignition or accelerator if a phone is active in the vehicle.

    Better idea:

    Require drivers to take the driving test while talking on the phone. Everybody is going to do it, legal or not. Those who can't handle the multitasking shouldn't be driving anyways. There are always distractions.

    That, and increase the penalties for causing a crash. It's not right that someone can murder another driver, make 10,000 people late for work, and then walk away with a $50 "Failure to yield right of way" ticket.

  45. Something similar is in fact law by raymorris · · Score: 2

    > I think your idea is stupid and that is incentive for me to slap you. Therefore you are responsible (or partly responsible) for the slap.

    There's a well-established legal principle that the recipient of a slap can indeed incite the slap. For example, if I were to call your wife a nasty hoe, a fucking cunt, and you immediately punched me in the nose, most jurisdictions would recognize that I would indeed have some responsibility for what happened.

    Whether or not you or I LIKE that principle is a different matter, but in fact calling your wife a disease-ridden whore would actually make a punch in the nose likely, and the law does recognise that.

    1. Re:Something similar is in fact law by tnk1 · · Score: 1

      Yes, but that is called "in the heat of passion". There is no way that you can suggest that Snapchat caused an immediate response based on passion in this case. There is no instinctive response that makes you want to take a picture of yourself and get some sort of achievement. The only way that is possible is if someone in the car dared her to or something, and then the incitement came not from Snapchat, but from the passenger.

      That's like saying a speedometer that goes to 150 is incitement to actually go 150.

    2. Re:Something similar is in fact law by Triklyn · · Score: 1

      ask yourself this. you went into this sight unseen. I tell you about an app that displays speed ratings on photos taken. I tell you that texting and driving is incredibly dangerous. I tell you that a certain subset of people are incredibly fond of taking pictures of themselves while doing shocking and/or dangerous things.

      as a reasonable person, would you come to the conclusion that there will be some people that will use that app to take pictures of themselves while driving at high speed, for the explicit purpose of getting a shocking and dangerous photo?

      we want corporations to at least pay lip service to thinking about the consequences of their actions.

      promoting dangerous behavior isn't something we like our companies to do.

    3. Re:Something similar is in fact law by tnk1 · · Score: 1

      I don't see how the corporation encouraged this behavior. If there was a "trophy", yes. However, as far as I know, the trophies are from third party sites and not from Snapchat.

      Again, we offer all sorts of capabilities in smartphones today. We can't say that something that simply provides information has to be completely thought through to the greatest possible degree by every company or you start entering a rabbit hole where you have to think of everything, no matter how ridiculous, and somehow prevent it.

      You can take pictures with phones, didn't Apple consider that the iPhone could be used to do that while driving? Should we be able to sue Apple because it provided a capability that could have been used while driving?

      There is a difference between incitement and merely providing a capability. Back to my example of the speedometer. If you simply allow the speedometer to record speeds above the speed limit, I don't think anyone would call that incitement to go 150. Now, if you made bell sounds and lights and assigned a score to every 10 mph you go, that would be incitement because it provides a reward for using that measurement to its greatest extent.

      Snapchat allows measurement of your speed. However, it provides no incitement to use that in excess of safe operation, and in fact, provides warnings against doing it. The third party trophies would be incitement, but not by Snapchat. If you suggested that Snapchat was responsible for enabling them, you'd hold car manufacturers responsible for anyone who made a speed award for driving on streets at high speed, and there is no such responsibility on a car manufacturer.

    4. Re:Something similar is in fact law by Triklyn · · Score: 1

      i'd say, listing it at all is incitement to use it

      if i made an app, that forget about taking a picture, could take a snapshot of my current speed down to the ... lets say foot per second? and made it so I could send it to my friends as an unbiased record of sorts... I think i'd get in trouble the first time some dumb teen died.

      and i know that some dumb teen would die...

      essentially, is listing the speed anything other than a trophy in and of itself. what exactly is the point of listing the speed on a photo?
      isn't the entire point of listing the speed to encourage behavior that is riskier than taking pictures without a speed rating?

      It seems kinda pointless as information unless it's something to brag about you know.

    5. Re:Something similar is in fact law by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, the "fighting words" doctrine has been in the process of being rolled back case by case ever since it was first established. If the Supreme Court ever had the guts to say "Yeah, those older guys were idiots.", it would have been completely eliminated long ago.

  46. What happened to McGee? by nikkipolya · · Score: 1

    Has McGee been put away behind bars for a good part of his life? His irresponsible behavior of using a smart-phone while driving has caused so much pain and suffering to another family.

    Recently I was in an incident that involved using smartphone while driving. One fellow who was busy looking into his smartphone while driving, apparently looking at driving directions, came and hit my vehicle which was static. Luckily no body was injured. Stupids with smartphones.

    1. Re:What happened to McGee? by JustNiz · · Score: 1

      McGee is female.

  47. Does that also includes Snapchat's geeks? by westlake · · Score: 1

    It's time for people to start taking responsibility for their own actions.

    Fine.

    But someone at Snapchat programmed and approved an app that even those caught in the Mercedes c230 with this eighteen year old girl knew was an open invitation to floor it for the trophy.

  48. Kind of like Periscoping your own DWI by ErichTheRed · · Score: 2

    There are a few cases a year (one recent one was local to us) where a dummy uses Periscope to live-stream their drunk driving. Then they're shocked when the police thank them for providing vital evidence in their case. I read this Snapchat story a couple days ago - obviously it finally got far enough in the court system to be picked up publically because it's being reported everywhere now.

    It seems to me that if Snapchat weren't a hip, cool Internet startup, something like a speed filter and/or trophy would have immediately been squashed by even the most clueless in-house legal team. In "real businesses" it's their job to ensure that products don't get released that can lead to lawsuits, or if they can, to minimize their impact. I can just see the discussion around a conference table in Snapchat's HQ about this awesome new feature that uses the GPS to tag a user's speed -- "Wouldn't that be epic? "Yeah, let's do it!" was probably the only consideration it was given.

    Obviously, the idiot driver was at fault, but if you're an accident victim, you'll try to recover anything you can. Apparently the other driver in the crash is permanently disabled and has traumatic brain injury as a direct result. You can bet that the first thing that Christal's family did after the crash was to hide their assets and declare bankruptcy. Wentworth will wait for decades to get any sort of compensation from insurance companies, let alone punitive damages.

  49. Re:driving lockout when phone active by jklovanc · · Score: 1

    You would need these sensors on every seat in the vehicle. That would be very expensive and error prone.

    People could bypass the lockout by putting a sandbag in the passenger seat, so it wouldn't be a 100% solution. But an 80% solution may be better than nothing.

    Considering that the people who will Snapchat wile driving already know they are breaking the law I would bet that they would override the sensors much more often. I woulds estimate that the sensors would be a 20% solution at best and be financially prohibitive to many new drivers.

  50. Bloom County: Steve's Law Tips by mykepredko · · Score: 2

    The whole thing reminds me of this Bloom County: http://www.gocomics.com/bloomc...

    Chances are the whole lawsuit is predicated on the idea that the plaintiffs will get a lot more from Snapchat than they will from an 18 year old.

  51. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is a bad idea. There's no reason to restrict passengers from using phones. Drivers may have legitimate reasons to use a phone in the event of an emergency. Why do we need a technological solution when it's simple enough for the police to make it a priority to pull over drivers who are using phones?

  52. Where do we draw the line? by zero_out · · Score: 1

    I wonder where we draw the line for responsibility when encouraging reckless behavior. If someone threatens to murder another person's family if they don't perform some reckless act, then the one making the threats clearly bears most of the responsibility. Youtube creates an environment for people to get attention by showing off their reckless behavior, thus encouraging it. However, I don't think it's specific enough in the behavior it encourages, and therefore isn't responsible for it. Snapchat's speed overlay seems to be a strong enough, and specific enough of an encouragement that it's largely responsible for the ensuing recklessness. At the very least, I would say that it's as responsible for the behavior as a person directly 'daring' another to go faster, and mocking them for being a coward if they don't do it. Where do you think we should draw the line for encouraging such behaviors?

  53. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Most millennials I know are addicted to their phones and can't bear to ignore them for even a moment. Most 50+ I know don't even own a smartphone, nor do they spend any time at all on them. But sure, false equivalence all 'round!

  54. I don't see what's frivolous about this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's not the kid saying "it's not my fault -- it's Snapchat's!" Rather, it's a brain-damaged man and his wife, who obviously aren't going to be able to recover their expenses from the kid (because the kid doesn't have millions and the kid's insurance likely has a liability cap), so they're going after the party who *does* have some money: Snapchat. Snapchat played *some* causal role in this. Ultimately the question whether they are at fault, however, depends on whether Snapchat breached a duty owed to the injured man and his wife--and that's for a jury to decide.

  55. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Listen pal, babyboomers have had to listen to this "greatest generation" bullshit for 50 years. It's our turn now, and if we say it's the Millennials fault, then it's the Millennials fault. Get with the program.

  56. This by Lauriy · · Score: 1

    is the world now

  57. It's called deep pockets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Look it, that 18 year old probably doesn't have a pot to piss in.

    Now, we have a guy who is brain damaged and is going to need millions of dollars worth of medical, rehab, and accommodations built into his home over a lifetime.

    And then there's the loss of companionship.

    Insurance won't cover all of that and neither does disability - it's chump change.

    So, where do you think the victim is going to get the money to pay for that?

  58. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If that's the case, then 50+'s should have no issues installing these devices in their cars for when they inevitably lend their car to their children.

  59. Idiots by wkwilley2 · · Score: 1

    I think this quote from TFA sums it up perfectly.

    A warning when users first open the speed filter feature urges them not to use it while driving.

    So why would the couple sue Snapchat? Sue the dumb bitch that thought going over 100mph while trying to take a picture on her iPhone was a good idea.

    --
    Have you ever fallen asleep at the keybhanusdiog?
  60. Pics or GTFO by drew_kime · · Score: 1

    Pics or GTFO

    --
    Nope, no sig
  61. Welcome to America by WindBourne · · Score: 2, Informative

    One person pulls out in front of another, ILLEGALLY (the car sueing was ticketed for pulling out wrongly),
    In addition, we have an 18 y.o driver (2 years of experience), WITH A FRIEND, driving over 100 MPH in a 55, while using a phone illegally, and the car goes after snapchat.

    What our fascists does not destroy, lawyers will.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    1. Re:Welcome to America by in10se · · Score: 1

      A car going 100mph can cover the length of a football field in 2 seconds. It's quite possible the speeding car wasn't even within view when they started pulling out and then suddenly it smashes into them.

      --
      Popisms.com - Connecting pop culture
    2. Re:Welcome to America by jittles · · Score: 1

      One person pulls out in front of another, ILLEGALLY (the car sueing was ticketed for pulling out wrongly), In addition, we have an 18 y.o driver (2 years of experience), WITH A FRIEND, driving over 100 MPH in a 55, while using a phone illegally, and the car goes after snapchat. What our fascists does not destroy, lawyers will.

      Do you have a reference that the driver who was hit was cited for failing to yield? I would be absolutely surprised if the police assigned any fault to someone who was hit by a driver going twice the speed limit.

    3. Re:Welcome to America by TheWindBlows · · Score: 1

      The initial thought was he pulled out illegally. Maybe out of favoritism, they may have assumed she was going a reasonable speed of say 60 to 65. Instead, she was driving with over 4 times the Kinetic Energy of the posted speed limit. If you physically analyze all the factors, you can roughly estimate both perspectives. She was supposedly going 107 at the time of impact, I'm going to call B.S. on that and say it's likely closer to 90. As a 107 MPH crash can easily put the engine in the trunk. Now lets do an analysis. First her minimum slowdown distance from 113 mph to 90 is 175ft assuming she was in an 2005 Audi A4, calculated via Kinetic Energy. Her friend had enough time to scream a full sentence at her, so we can assume a HORRIBLE reaction time of 2 seconds, that equates to 113 mph * 2 seconds =~ 330 ft. Adding up her frame of reference we get that he was mostly pulled out when she was over 500 ft away. Now even the worst driver is going to peek 1 second before actually accelerating on the road, (a good driver initial peek is closer to 4 seconds left-right-left, vs left and go). Lets assume he's a bad driver and that puts her at over 600 ft away when he started pulling out. At the posted speed that's 7.4 seconds without stopping for her to reach his location, which means he should've had over 10 seconds to pull out and get up to 55mph, without her apply the brakes assuming she was going the posted limits. That's not an unreasonable pull out, and probably something he's done before on a similar road (without issue). In actuality he had 5 seconds to get to 100 mph, which is impossible.

    4. Re: Welcome to America by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Police say otherwise.

    5. Re:Welcome to America by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think they're going after her as well though. Snapchat is liker to have deeper pockets though so if they can prove they carry some blame then they're more likely to gain the money necessary to cover the guy's medical care expenses for the next 50 years. The 18yo driver will only be able to provide that if their insurance foots the bill.

  62. You misspelled "crash" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...after a car accident last year...

    Some idiot drove at excessive speeds and crashed into an innocent driver's car, ruining his life. The idiot, Christal McGee, chose to drive recklessly. It wasn't an accident, it was a crash. Calling the crash an accident suggests Christal is somehow innocent of having made the choice to be an idiot. She's lucky it wasn't vehicular manslaughter. It's like cops shooting people and pets and then documenting the incident as "the gun went off" or a political leader starting an illegal war and then washing his hands of responsibility with a passive "mistakes were made".

    "It wasn't my fault, it just suddenly happened. The fact that I happened to be in the vicinity is completely coincidental and irrelevant."

    Bullshit.

  63. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There used to be this large piece of paper that had pictures and lines on it, it folded up really neatly, and it could be placed in a side door or glove box. Responsible persons would pull over on the side of the road to read it and figure out if they were following the right path.

    I forget what this thing was called, because now I can't think for myself when I let my phone do all that.

  64. badges by SpudNYC · · Score: 1

    Just a bit faster and he could have also gotten the Vehicular Manslaughter badge.

  65. Re:driving lockout when phone active by arth1 · · Score: 1

    and you're lying through your teeth if you tell me you haven't seen idiots of all ages glued to their phones instead of the road while driving.

    I honestly have never seen anyone in the preteen or supercentenarian age groups drive while looking at a phone. No lie.

  66. Civil causation, not criminal 2nd degree murder by raymorris · · Score: 1

    "The heat of passion" is a vaguely similar concept related to CRIMINAL culpability, most often mentioned as a difference between 1st degree murder and 2nd.

    Civil law (suing somebody) is concerned with CAUSATION. Did the defendant do something which partially caused the harm? Comparative negligence specifically is the idea that separate actions by two or more people are often involved, so one may be 75% liable and the other 25%.

    The general causation test is the "but for" test. Plaintiff asserts that the harm wouldn't have happened but for the defendant's action or inaction. In other words, is this statement true:
    If Snapchat didn't advertise the speed , the collision would not have occurred.

    If the above is true, they helped cause the accident and share liability unless they have some specific defense. The fact that they knowingly market the app to the 16-22 year old market could suggest they would be negligent (not careful) about promoting unsafe driving, given that they know their users in in age group prone to unsafe driving.

    Nothing above represents my opinion of how the case should be decided. I don't know all of the relevant facts of the case. The above comments are about what the relevant law is, not what I think it -should- be.

  67. Where was snapchat when I was in Germany? by gachunt · · Score: 0

    252 km/h (156 mph) in a Porsche on the Autobahn.

    I took a pic of the speedometer with my phone, but have no independent GPS verification from snapchat that I just didn't adjust the digital display with Photoshop.

    Sigh...

    ( It's $350 to rent one for the day incase you're wondering )

    1. Re:Where was snapchat when I was in Germany? by Cederic · · Score: 1

      Surely if you're renting a car to drive fast you'll get one that can actually go fast?

      Shit, my second hand diesel will do 156mph and it's the electronic limiter stopping it going faster. And the tyres.

      If I was paying $350 a day I'd want something that goes a fuck of a lot faster than 156.

  68. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ummm, no. almost every state disallows open containers of alcohol in any passenger accessible area of the car.

    To comply with the TEA-21 rules of the federal Department of Transportation, a state's motor vehicle open container laws must:

    Prohibit both possession of any open alcoholic beverage container and consumption of any alcoholic beverage in a motor vehicle;[16]
    Cover the passenger area of any motor vehicle, including unlocked glove compartments and any other areas of the vehicle that are readily accessible to the driver or passengers while in their seats;[16]
    Apply to all open alcoholic beverage containers and all alcoholic beverages, including beer, wine, and spirits that contain one-half of one percent or more of alcohol by volume;[16]
    Apply to all vehicle occupants except for passengers of vehicles designed, maintained or used primarily for the transportation of people for compensation (such as buses, taxi cabs, and limousines) or the living quarters of motor homes;[16]
    Apply to all vehicles on a public highway or the right-of-way (i.e. on the shoulder) of a public highway;[16]
    Require primary enforcement of the law, rather than requiring probable cause that another violation had been committed before allowing enforcement of the open container law.[16]
    Currently, 39 states and the District of Columbia are in compliance.[16] Alaska, Louisiana, Tennessee, and Wyoming have similar limits on the possession of open containers in vehicles, but not to the level of TEA-21 compliance.

  69. Re:driving lockout when phone active by sjames · · Score: 1

    Does it matter that much if the passenger yelling "Faster, FASTER! Almost there" does the snapping?

  70. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    who would buy a phone with this feature.

    Either you never text and drive which makes this feature useless
    or
    you text and drive at least sometimes which makes this aggressively anti customer and makes you more likely to buy from a competator

  71. Re:driving lockout when phone active by jklovanc · · Score: 1

    The passenger could be doing the same the from the back seat and using the car speedometer. You can't ban stupid.

  72. Frivolous lawsuit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    People seem to have forgotten where to sue smart phones.
    While driving is NOT one of those places.
    Darwin Runner-up?

  73. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There are states with open container laws in the vehicle even if you blow a null. Cop's discretion (or court's) if you were just taking cans to recycling.

  74. Because money by waspleg · · Score: 1

    who has more to take? The kid/parents or the bullshit web 2.0 company with the hyper inflated valuation?

  75. makes sense... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Makes about as much sense as suing a firearms manufacturer for the murders committed by someone who happened to have their product.

  76. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In 15 years very few humans will be "driving" cars.

    Even if they stopped making human-driven cars today, it would certainly take more than 15 years for your scenario to happen.
    I drive a 1994 Dodge Dakota.

  77. "Fighting words" is CRIMINAL free speech issue by raymorris · · Score: 1

    "Fighting words" is a free speech term, related to the state criminalizing certain actions which include speech as a component of the crime. In other words, "fighting words" means the state can make it ILLEGAL to call someone a "god damn cocksucker".

    Again, civil law (suing someone) is concerned with CAUSATION. Violating a contract isn't a CRIME, but it may cause damages, for which you can be sued. Failing to set the parking brake on your car isn't a crime, but it may cause damage, and you'd be liable for the damage in a civil suit. You're responsible for any damage you cause; whether or not your action is criminal is completely separate.

    Calling someone names may cause a fight. That's all a civil law suit cares about, cause and effect. It doesn't MATTER whether those particular insults constitute a criminal offense in that particular situation, and in that particular jurisdiction. If my actions cause damage to you, I owe you to make right the damage, unless some specific exception applies.

    Here, if Snapchat said to teenagers "we'll give you a trophy if you drive over 100 MPH", that could have caused some teenagers to drive over 100 MPH. It's so far unclear what exactly Snapchat did, what kind of trophy may have been offered.

  78. What are you driving? by gatfirls · · Score: 1

    A 92' Geo metro on a canyon road? 100mph in a decent car feels like 50, aside from things going by faster. 85-90 is speed of traffic in the southwest on 75MPH roads. As someone mentioned, the autobhan *average* speed is 88mph and their fatality rate is much lower than ours. I'll bet it has a lot to do with drivers being much more attentive at higher speeds.

    1. Re:What are you driving? by JustNiz · · Score: 1

      It also has a lot to do with driving tests in the EU being a lot more than just a formality like they are in the US.

  79. like strava by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    what append to law suit against strava? they add a dangerous notice to some segments

  80. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    +1 Funny

    (I am a Millennial)

  81. Brain Damaged by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Given their actions, I would argue that the husband was brain damaged before the accident occured.

  82. Re:driving lockout when phone active by delt0r · · Score: 1

    You may want to get out more and meet more people than just your little sister and your pops.

    --
    If information wants to be free, why does my internet connection cost so much?
  83. My spoon is too big. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is like blaming the fast food restaurant because you're fat.
    If I were the judge in this case, it would be tossed out in seconds.

  84. If there was a warning by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If there was a warning not to do it, then it's proof they knew it could have the ability to incite people to do it.

    1. Re:If there was a warning by mark-t · · Score: 1

      It's also proof that they would have done everything that was legally required by them to discourage people from trying it even though some people still might.

  85. Re:driving lockout when phone active by sjames · · Score: 1

    It's the recording it for all of your friends to see that is alleged to be contributory enough to attach liability. That is what the speed filter is explicitly for.

  86. Personal responsibility by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Subject says it all

  87. Re:driving lockout when phone active by jklovanc · · Score: 1

    The temperature filter also records the temperature when taking the picture. Does that mean that Snapchat should be libel for someone who encloses themselves in a car on a hot day and dies of heat stroke? Displaying a measurement is not an inducement to take that measurement to the extreme.

  88. I don't snapchat will win this one by thogard · · Score: 1

    The speed warning signs that tell people how fast they are going all have maximum speeds they will display and most of them have switches to set the max for a given road so people don't try to get the high score.

    That sets enough precedent that snapchat should have considered a an upper limit and if there are any internal documents even mention "high score" and ways around it, they better have a very good reason not to do it or the jury will award a massive payout.

    It would be trivial to find a traffic professional engineer to show up in court and explain this to the jury.

  89. Re:driving lockout when phone active by sjames · · Score: 1

    At least in that case, only the individual id10t cooks.

  90. Predictible by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This was an easily predictable outcome. Automobiles are a necessity of sorts. An app that puts your speed on a pic is not.

  91. All i'm going to say is: by cyberzephyr · · Score: 1

    Pay attention!

      Kid's don't need to be driving and texting at the same time.

    Someone wanting to defend that?

    Think about this: Your first DUI may be your last :-(

    --
    I'm here for the experience, not the Hyperbole.
  92. "As far as we know" indeed. Need the facts by raymorris · · Score: 1

    > I don't see how the corporation encouraged this behavior. If there was a "trophy", yes. However, as far as I know, the trophies are from third party sites and not from Snapchat.

    The plaintiff says Snapchat has/had a "100 MPH" trophy. Somebody who posted a comment here says they didn't. I don't know. That fact, and the other relevant facts, will come out at trial if not before. I'm not assuming either side is right at this point. I'm just saying that IF Snapchat knowingly, recklessly, or negligently caused an increased risk of crashes, they can be held liable, with comparative negligence (shared fault) in many states.

  93. Re:driving lockout when phone active by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Most 50+ I know don't even own a smartphone, nor do they spend any time at all on them.

    They don't spend any time on the phones they haven't got? Gee, who'da thought it!

  94. Personal responsibility - what's that? by tiggertaebo · · Score: 1

    I have every sympathy for the guy who got wiped out in the crash - he's facing up to what may well be lifelong impairments and I can see why the family might be looking for money because care etc for those sort of injuries is not cheap.

    But I hope they lose the suit against Snapchat because they aren't responsible here - is the filter a bit of a stupid idea? Certainly. Is it aimed at people who traveling in cars or other vehicles at high speed? Sounds like it. But that doesn't make them responsible for what happened, this girl is someone who is supposedly responsible enough to drive, and she is the one who made the decision that driving at 100+ while dicking around on Snapchat was a good idea (Oh and with a pregnant woman in the car as well). Honestly she sounds like someone who shouldn't be trusted to be driving a pedal car!

  95. Suing ford by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Drunk drivers killed my cousin im suing ford.

  96. Too bad you can't sue someone for being stupid. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You CAN fix stupid...it's called "death".

    Unfortunately, it's usually someone else who dies as the result of the actions of the stupid person.

  97. Georgia "Couple"? by DontTrustWhatIType · · Score: 1

    Since it says the couple is suing, I'm more interested in knowing how the husband is managing to pull this one off. There's a snapchat trophy for that, right?

  98. shill by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You're really passionate about this particular issue and a lack of involvement on snap chats part. The data available on the internet was clearly spelled out to you above by NYCL but you are continuing to double down on the derp. I'm a betting man. I feel reasonably comfortable making the claim that you're a snap chat employee. No one else in this entire thread is white knighting them like you are. You care about this case far too much to just be hating on frivolous lawsuits. If course, you'll claim you aren't but your posts indicate something else at work you aren't sharing with us.

    1. Re:shill by Rakarra · · Score: 1

      You're really passionate about this particular issue and a lack of involvement on snap chats part. The data available on the internet was clearly spelled out to you above by NYCL but you are continuing to double down on the derp. I'm a betting man. I feel reasonably comfortable making the claim that you're a snap chat employee.

      I'm not a Snapchat employee, but this story smelled suspicious from the start. It really strains credibility that Snapchat would add a trophy for high high speed snapping. It would, of course, be a lawsuit waiting to happen. This doesn't appear under the lists of trophies that users have discovered and confirmed. Snapchat's official statement is also that this trophy doesn't exist. The only thing we have is word of one person after an accident who claimed that this was a trophy that existed and they drove recklessly because the app encouraged it. A convenient excuse.

  99. How is this the fault of snapchat? by anti-disney · · Score: 1

    This is the fault of the idiot who attempted to drive 107 MPH and only him. If we are going to blame snapchat then perhaps we should blame the manufacturer of this persons car for building an engine that can reach such a speed, other manufacturers for failing to build a car that can withstand any crash including being hit by a car going 107 MPH, all levels of government for designing a highway where someone is capable of driving recklessly without being stopped by law enforcement, etc. Sure a manufacturer will tell you that their car can go a maximum speed of 130 MPH but would also explain that it is highly recommended that you don't attempt to drive at high speeds since chances are you will crash and if you cause damage to your engine, transmission, or other moving parts, they will not cover repairs under warranty since they don't recommend customers drive their vehicle at such speeds. Common sense would also tell you that this is a bad idea.

  100. trophy like cash by peawormsworth · · Score: 1

    Trophies only have meaning to those who want them to.

    The numbers the needle hits on your speedometer is a sort of trophy. I can not think of one teenage friend who has never tried to get that speedometer to 160 kph. Because all kids think that 100 mph is a sort of social trophy. So later they can say: "Yeah, I did that."

    IMO: The only responsible party is a speeding driver. It don't matter who or what encouraged them to get there. That is why we demand age restrictions and a license, because driving is the drivers responsibility. Driving in public is not meant for trophy seekers.