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In addition to banning gay marriage, should we reinstate the penalty for non-virgin brides?
Here you go: http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Deuteronomy+22:20-22&version=NIV
Personally, stoning seems a bit harsh, but hey - the Bible says! Save those wedding-night sheets as proof of virginity, kids!
Seriously, how many Christian brides would be killed if they stuck to their guns and stoned the non-virgins?

Lots of fun and odd stuff in Deuteronomy. http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Deuteronomy+22&version=NIV

In fact, I've violated the prohibition: Do not wear clothes of wool and linen woven together.

But I've never: Make tassels on the four corners of the cloak you wear.

Odd how most Christians cherry-pick the prohibitions, ignoring the ones that might affect them.

Does your house have a parapet around the roof? Better build one before condemning others:
When you build a new house, make a parapet around your roof so that you may not bring the guilt of bloodshed on your house if someone falls from the roof.

And whatever you do, live by this rule, it's guided many over the years: Do not plow with an ox and a donkey yoked together.

In addition to banning gay marriage, should we reinstate the penalty for non-virgin brides?
Here you go: http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Deuteronomy+22:20-22&version=NIV
Personally, stoning seems a bit harsh, but hey - the Bible says! Save those wedding-night sheets as proof of virginity, kids!
Seriously, how many Christian brides would be killed if they stuck to their guns and stoned the non-virgins?

Lots of fun and odd stuff in Deuteronomy. http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Deuteronomy+22&version=NIV

In fact, I've violated the prohibition: Do not wear clothes of wool and linen woven together.

But I've never: Make tassels on the four corners of the cloak you wear.

Odd how most Christians cherry-pick the prohibitions, ignoring the ones that might affect them.

Does your house have a parapet around the roof? Better build one before condemning others:
When you build a new house, make a parapet around your roof so that you may not bring the guilt of bloodshed on your house if someone falls from the roof.

And whatever you do, live by this rule, it's guided many over the years: Do not plow with an ox and a donkey yoked together.

I certainly hope they don't eat shellfish or allow little people into the priesthood. And they better keep their slaves properly and sacrifice birds every time they have their period.

I certainly hope they don't eat shellfish or allow little people into the priesthood. And they better keep their slaves properly and sacrifice birds every time they have their period.

I certainly hope they don't eat shellfish or allow little people into the priesthood. And they better keep their slaves properly and sacrifice birds every time they have their period.

I certainly hope they don't eat shellfish or allow little people into the priesthood. And they better keep their slaves properly and sacrifice birds every time they have their period.

It's not a "fear." If you are a Christian, it is explicitly forbidden. Read verse 22 here.

Here

The problem is that "science" can mean several things. One is the "scientific method": propose a hypothesis, run an experiment that could prove that hypothesis wrong, repeat. This method does not need to be restricted to the natural world; it was used, for instance, by Gideon to prove to himself that God really was talking to him (see Judges 6:33-39).

But a lot of people (including scientists) define "science" to include the assumption that there is no supernatural: i.e., the activity of looking exclusively for natural explanations. That is the philosophical assumption of naturalism. Then they circularly say that science has proven that the supernatural does not exist.

Think about it this way: what evidence would it take for you to believe that a miracle took place -- e.g., that an angel had appeared to someone / a group of people, or that someone had been supernaturally healed? If there is no evidence that could possibly be produced to convince you, I submit that you have accepted the philosophical assumption of naturalism. And that's fine (we all make assumptions), but it's better if you're honest about it.

With all its unicode problems I don't think Slashdot would like hebrew.

Strange, I'm a Christian and I don't see evidence in the Bible that Jesus ever bothered to cast demons out of _places_. My reading is he drove demons out from _people_.

Since they have so much time on their hands, maybe you could ask them to go feed the hungry, provide drinks to the thirsty, hospitality to strangers, care for the sick, or visit the imprisoned.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=matthew%2025:34-46;&version=31;

Yeah , or heres a radical idea - you could have friggin told her.

Ah, the typical response by someone who's never had this happen to them. You do know that you're basically telling this person they "didn't scream loud enough" during the rape, don't you?

Genesis 1 states that God created a "lesser light to govern the night". Where else is your God mentioned?

He said "historical documents", not "works of fiction".

four-week cycles

29.5306 days != four weeks

God-fearing Americans [...] there is no mention of the "moon" anywhere in literature or historical documents -- anywhere -- before 1950.

Genesis 1 states that God created a "lesser light to govern the night". Where else is your God mentioned?

According to the Bible, it's inevitable...

I'm sorry you think I'm a nut. My belief is belief, yes. But its also grounded on logic and reasonability. As well as evidence from the Bible. I know it appears to be illogical in that I'm trying to argue from within a particular system of belief instead of arguing from outside the system to attempt to prove my point. But it actually is more logically correct to argue from the standpoint of internal consistency given that I actually do believe that God is really capable of total sovereignty. There is certainly more evidence than just the Bible to corroborate the existence of Jesus and his actions (Josephus, archeological clues, even the Koran). But because I believe that God is really capable of proving His own existence I rely most on the Bible to describe the truth.

As to your particular points/questions.

1)"how do we know which version of the Bible is his word?"
The version that most closely approximates the earliest manuscripts that most consistently agree. As far as English translations go, most scholars would agree that its either New American Standard Bible (NASB) or the English Standard Version (ESV). It turns out that there really aren't that many inconsistencies amongst the different copies we have access to now-a-days. Most of the differences are things like "the Lord Jesus Christ" vs. "Jesus Christ the Lord" it counts as a difference, but its really not meaningfully different. If you're serious about examining this topic, and I hope you are, take a listen to this presentation by Dr. Dan Wallace. It's excellent. Very academic from one of the world's leading scholars.

2)"You have just as much evidence the fairy exists as you do god."
Actually the main reason I believe in God is because there is an empty tomb where the body of Jesus was initially laid. Its empty because He rose from the dead which sort of serves as a receipt of payment for our sins, thus satisfying God's righteous wrath against those sins. Now if you're going to try and make the "the disciples stole the body" argument, I'm sad to say that the evidence is quite stacked against that one. (1) they were a rag-tag group of laborers who were dispersed and scared when their leader was killed and had no ability or courage to try and 'rescue his body' (2) The body was buried in a tomb with a huge rock rolled down hill, sealed by the Roman seal, and guarded by a bunch of Roman soldiers. See point 1, there's no way they were going to move the stone, break the seal, and defeat a bunch of guards. Matthew 27:57-64 describes all of this.

I hope that answers some of your questions. Please feel free to continue this thread if you want to discuss things further.

why would Paul leave his life of luxury as a Jewish leader stoning Christians if he didn't experience something supernatural?

How many times has the resurrected Christ appeared to mankind since that time? (e.g. 1st Cor. 15:3-6.) Not so many? Why would he not appear to those who pray for him to appear, even though he promised unconditionally to fulfill prayers? (John 14:14 - "Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.")

How do we know Paul was telling the truth? Where's the evidence? Not the faith thought-virus, I want real, verifiable evidence.

But enough with all that. It's time to go lay down some Biblical law on sinners:

• Ever worked a Sunday shift? You are so dead. Exodus 35:2 - "Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death."
• Are you a married woman who fornicated? Watch out for falling rocks! Deuteronomy 22:13-21 - "If any man take a wife ... [and] found her not a maid ... Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you."
• Got a rebellious teen at home? Time to clean house. Deuteronomy 21:18-21 - "If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother ... the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear."
• Know a man who slept with another man? Big trouble. Leviticus 20:13 - "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

The Bible is the literal word and law of God. Obey it. Now. Go on, get busy!

why would Paul leave his life of luxury as a Jewish leader stoning Christians if he didn't experience something supernatural?

How many times has the resurrected Christ appeared to mankind since that time? (e.g. 1st Cor. 15:3-6.) Not so many? Why would he not appear to those who pray for him to appear, even though he promised unconditionally to fulfill prayers? (John 14:14 - "Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.")

How do we know Paul was telling the truth? Where's the evidence? Not the faith thought-virus, I want real, verifiable evidence.

But enough with all that. It's time to go lay down some Biblical law on sinners:

• Ever worked a Sunday shift? You are so dead. Exodus 35:2 - "Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death."
• Are you a married woman who fornicated? Watch out for falling rocks! Deuteronomy 22:13-21 - "If any man take a wife ... [and] found her not a maid ... Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you."
• Got a rebellious teen at home? Time to clean house. Deuteronomy 21:18-21 - "If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother ... the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear."
• Know a man who slept with another man? Big trouble. Leviticus 20:13 - "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

The Bible is the literal word and law of God. Obey it. Now. Go on, get busy!

why would Paul leave his life of luxury as a Jewish leader stoning Christians if he didn't experience something supernatural?

How many times has the resurrected Christ appeared to mankind since that time? (e.g. 1st Cor. 15:3-6.) Not so many? Why would he not appear to those who pray for him to appear, even though he promised unconditionally to fulfill prayers? (John 14:14 - "Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.")

How do we know Paul was telling the truth? Where's the evidence? Not the faith thought-virus, I want real, verifiable evidence.

But enough with all that. It's time to go lay down some Biblical law on sinners:

• Ever worked a Sunday shift? You are so dead. Exodus 35:2 - "Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death."
• Are you a married woman who fornicated? Watch out for falling rocks! Deuteronomy 22:13-21 - "If any man take a wife ... [and] found her not a maid ... Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you."
• Got a rebellious teen at home? Time to clean house. Deuteronomy 21:18-21 - "If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother ... the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear."
• Know a man who slept with another man? Big trouble. Leviticus 20:13 - "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

The Bible is the literal word and law of God. Obey it. Now. Go on, get busy!

why would Paul leave his life of luxury as a Jewish leader stoning Christians if he didn't experience something supernatural?

How many times has the resurrected Christ appeared to mankind since that time? (e.g. 1st Cor. 15:3-6.) Not so many? Why would he not appear to those who pray for him to appear, even though he promised unconditionally to fulfill prayers? (John 14:14 - "Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.")

How do we know Paul was telling the truth? Where's the evidence? Not the faith thought-virus, I want real, verifiable evidence.

But enough with all that. It's time to go lay down some Biblical law on sinners:

• Ever worked a Sunday shift? You are so dead. Exodus 35:2 - "Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death."
• Are you a married woman who fornicated? Watch out for falling rocks! Deuteronomy 22:13-21 - "If any man take a wife ... [and] found her not a maid ... Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you."
• Got a rebellious teen at home? Time to clean house. Deuteronomy 21:18-21 - "If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother ... the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear."
• Know a man who slept with another man? Big trouble. Leviticus 20:13 - "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

The Bible is the literal word and law of God. Obey it. Now. Go on, get busy!

why would Paul leave his life of luxury as a Jewish leader stoning Christians if he didn't experience something supernatural?

How many times has the resurrected Christ appeared to mankind since that time? (e.g. 1st Cor. 15:3-6.) Not so many? Why would he not appear to those who pray for him to appear, even though he promised unconditionally to fulfill prayers? (John 14:14 - "Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.")

How do we know Paul was telling the truth? Where's the evidence? Not the faith thought-virus, I want real, verifiable evidence.

But enough with all that. It's time to go lay down some Biblical law on sinners:

• Ever worked a Sunday shift? You are so dead. Exodus 35:2 - "Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death."
• Are you a married woman who fornicated? Watch out for falling rocks! Deuteronomy 22:13-21 - "If any man take a wife ... [and] found her not a maid ... Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you."
• Got a rebellious teen at home? Time to clean house. Deuteronomy 21:18-21 - "If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother ... the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear."
• Know a man who slept with another man? Big trouble. Leviticus 20:13 - "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

The Bible is the literal word and law of God. Obey it. Now. Go on, get busy!

why would Paul leave his life of luxury as a Jewish leader stoning Christians if he didn't experience something supernatural?

How many times has the resurrected Christ appeared to mankind since that time? (e.g. 1st Cor. 15:3-6.) Not so many? Why would he not appear to those who pray for him to appear, even though he promised unconditionally to fulfill prayers? (John 14:14 - "Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.")

How do we know Paul was telling the truth? Where's the evidence? Not the faith thought-virus, I want real, verifiable evidence.

But enough with all that. It's time to go lay down some Biblical law on sinners:

• Ever worked a Sunday shift? You are so dead. Exodus 35:2 - "Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death."
• Are you a married woman who fornicated? Watch out for falling rocks! Deuteronomy 22:13-21 - "If any man take a wife ... [and] found her not a maid ... Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you."
• Got a rebellious teen at home? Time to clean house. Deuteronomy 21:18-21 - "If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother ... the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear."
• Know a man who slept with another man? Big trouble. Leviticus 20:13 - "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

The Bible is the literal word and law of God. Obey it. Now. Go on, get busy!

I wholeheartedly agree with you and disagree with your father's viewpoint. I am sorry you had to grow up with that. No one deserves to have beliefs forced onto them. And for a Christian to do it is very hypocritical and against what is written in the Bible. It's one thing to speak to someone about your beliefs, and an entirely different thing to force them onto others.

If you mean "fruitful" in the sense of "be fruitful and multiply" -- i.e., go get yourself laid -- buying a Bugatti Veyron is probably the most fruitful thing you could possibly do ;-)

Who will stand before Obama and petition for the people? Would he disconnect those still using analog TV for the sake of those using digital? What if there are 50 people still dependent on analog broadcasts, will he disconnect it then? What if only 10?

Gen 18:22-33

i have it on solid authority

http://www.biblegateway.com/

wait, why won't you have a discussion with me? you say it's older? prove it. show me your numbers. why are you walking away? you're afraid your so called science will collapse under scrutiny? hah! i knew it!

zzz

dude, i have no respect for you. there's nothing to talk about with someone so deluded. you're an asshole with no human conscience

but please, by all means, take this as proof i won't debate you because you've won the argument

a creationist would do the same if i blew him off

like i have a chance to pierce your delusions on a discussion board in a few posts

delusional state: unpunctured and preserved

but here's a parting cluebat for you: maybe your numbers are WRONG you hallucinating fuck?

geee just maybe A LITTLE FUCKING OFF? maybe ORDERS OF FUCKING MAGNITUDE?

naaaaaaah

impossible

but of course, because i won't engage with you, you must be correct, right?

adios douchebag

This shit went down right in Jesus' hometown!

Theft makes baby Jesus cry!

and you somehow think:

age == wisdom

??

refute this, then, if the bible is 'so wise' beign so old.

the bible thinks the earth is flat:
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%204:8&version=9;

the bible says that giants (??) were once on the earth:
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%206:4&version=9;

Those who believe are able to handle snakes and drink any deadly poison without suffering harm.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Mark%2016:17-18&version=9;

shall I REALLY go on and on with all the fucked up errors in the bible?

(how much of an ostrich can you really be?)

there is zero evidence about god but plenty about the PISS POOR JOB the bible did.

if this is the word of god, he's no god.

and you somehow think:

age == wisdom

??

refute this, then, if the bible is 'so wise' beign so old.

the bible thinks the earth is flat:
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%204:8&version=9;

the bible says that giants (??) were once on the earth:
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%206:4&version=9;

Those who believe are able to handle snakes and drink any deadly poison without suffering harm.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Mark%2016:17-18&version=9;

shall I REALLY go on and on with all the fucked up errors in the bible?

(how much of an ostrich can you really be?)

there is zero evidence about god but plenty about the PISS POOR JOB the bible did.

if this is the word of god, he's no god.

and you somehow think:

age == wisdom

??

refute this, then, if the bible is 'so wise' beign so old.

the bible thinks the earth is flat:
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%204:8&version=9;

the bible says that giants (??) were once on the earth:
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%206:4&version=9;

Those who believe are able to handle snakes and drink any deadly poison without suffering harm.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Mark%2016:17-18&version=9;

shall I REALLY go on and on with all the fucked up errors in the bible?

(how much of an ostrich can you really be?)

there is zero evidence about god but plenty about the PISS POOR JOB the bible did.

if this is the word of god, he's no god.

I can't remember any references to burritos in the Bible's chapter of "Exodus."

Exodus 16:14-16:21

Cut the baby in half^W^W^W^W^WPut a newline in the middle and give each one side.

If they need extra power on certain days, they could just have the sun stop in the sky for a while.

I'm no biblical scholar, but I believe that falls under "making shit up to cover your previous nonsense."

See Genesis 6:3. I was off by a couple chapters - but it is there. So, not - that's not "making [stuff] up to cover your previous nonsense&quot";.

Looking at Genealogies later in Genesis it takes a few generations, but does end up being the limit thereafter. By the time of Joseph (Genesis 50), lifespans were becoming around 120 years; and certainly by the time of Moses (who died of "old age" at 120 (Deuteronomy 34).

Again, loking through the various geneologies between Genesis 6 and Deutoronomy 34, we see the various lifespans slowly shrinking.

Seth
... and more

Seth
... and more

But there are exceptions to some of these rules. If your brother died without children, you were supposed to get his widow pregnant.

True, though that exception (and rule) may still fall outside one's definition of incest. Know of any more direct incest examples? I confess I don't have much argument about Adam & Eve's children, but how else is a species of 2 supposed to multiply much more than that?

This was the story of Onan, where some religions get their prohibition against masturbation.

I only know that various denominations of Christianity use that passage. I am unaware of Judaism and Islam's interpretation.

they should have gotten the prohibition against misleading women and failing to fulfill family obligations.

I would think Onan's fate was warning enough, though a penalty was spelled out in Deuteronomy 25:5-10. Seems like a metaphorical slap on the wrist, though. I presume the potency of the social stigma is lost in translation.

You seem to have confused "Biblical scholars" with "corrupt politicians". Jesus didn't like them either.

Churches are tax-exempt for the same reason that other non-profit organizations are tax-exempt, and they're bound by the same laws. Among the restrictions are that a church can't tell its members who to vote for (although they can make publications available that do endorse particular candidates). If you catch a church breaking that rule, report it to the IRS. They'll lose their tax-exempt status.

Gays and people of other religions aren't any more evil than the rest of us, and shouldn't be treated as though they are. They're sinners, but so are the rest of us. In Jesus' day, everybody thought tax collectors were evil, and how did Jesus treat them? He didn't stir up an angry mob, he came over for lunch. People hated the Samaritans; Jesus told a story in which a Samaritan behaved better than a priest.

A Masters in Biblical Studies isn't an imaginary degree; it requires two years of post-graduate study. Here's a list of 81 accredited colleges around the United States that offer that degree.

The "skeptics' annotated bible" puts forward some very strained and weak arguments. Speaking as a commited skeptic and someone who finds the bible deeply unconvincing, I have to say I wish there was a far better equivalent to this website on the internet. If there are any legitimate examples on there they're near impossible to find amongst the haystack of straw men.

The thing about the bible and those passages you linked to in particular is that the whole thing has been translated from another language and the resulting jumbled and ambiguous grammar means it's possible to read it a number of different ways. All those passages do is list a bunch of events. There's nothing explicit in them the indicates what order the events happened in. The fact that it says god brought the animals to adam doesn't require that adam was made before the animals. It just means they didn't come into contact with one another until both existed (which is self evident).

As for the claim that gen1:27 states that god made adam and eve simultaneously, it says nothing of the sort. It just says that he made both of them. It's not even implicit.

These are both weak, grasping examples on the part of the skeptics' annotated bible that do nothing but undermine the credibility of the person arguing them.

There are many glaring inconsistencies in the bible, but few of them are straight forward enough to be a simple case of quoting two short pieces of text that directly contradict one another. That's not to say there are none. For instance Proverbs 15:3 and Hosea 8:4, where it is declared that god is omniscient, but god admits that something occured of which he was unaware.

The "skeptics' annotated bible" puts forward some very strained and weak arguments. Speaking as a commited skeptic and someone who finds the bible deeply unconvincing, I have to say I wish there was a far better equivalent to this website on the internet. If there are any legitimate examples on there they're near impossible to find amongst the haystack of straw men.

The thing about the bible and those passages you linked to in particular is that the whole thing has been translated from another language and the resulting jumbled and ambiguous grammar means it's possible to read it a number of different ways. All those passages do is list a bunch of events. There's nothing explicit in them the indicates what order the events happened in. The fact that it says god brought the animals to adam doesn't require that adam was made before the animals. It just means they didn't come into contact with one another until both existed (which is self evident).

As for the claim that gen1:27 states that god made adam and eve simultaneously, it says nothing of the sort. It just says that he made both of them. It's not even implicit.

These are both weak, grasping examples on the part of the skeptics' annotated bible that do nothing but undermine the credibility of the person arguing them.

There are many glaring inconsistencies in the bible, but few of them are straight forward enough to be a simple case of quoting two short pieces of text that directly contradict one another. That's not to say there are none. For instance Proverbs 15:3 and Hosea 8:4, where it is declared that god is omniscient, but god admits that something occured of which he was unaware.

Don't forget the porn. Good stuff.

... I'm going to go with the Parable of the Talents as my answer to the question.

Yes, I believe in salvation by grace alone (hey, what can I say, my family's Presbyterian. :) ). But I also believe that loving God means working for God as expressed in what we do with what the life we're given. And deciding to end my life on this Earth early, either by hand or someone else's, is taking this marvelous gift of life and throwing it away.
Is that a sin? Dunno, others do, I don't.
Is that taking a gift and throwing it back in the face of the one who gave it? IMO, yes.

Despite what the revisionist historians tell you, there is no mention of the "moon" anywhere in literature or historical documents -- anywhere -- before 1950.

... "I had another dream, and this time the sun and moon and eleven stars were bowing down to me."

-- Genesis 37:9b

It's an interesting theory, and could tie in to Middle Eastern flood stories. There has been some scientific research done suggesting that the Black Sea at one time was dry, until the swelling Mediterranean burst through the Bosphorus and wiped out the settlements in the valley and creating the coastlines that would one day become the playgrounds of Russian communists on holidays.

Meanwhile, an old dude in a boat was bobbing around aimlessly, and after he landed one of the first things he did was get really, really drunk.

Many people (I venture to say that the majority, in the US) think that business success is a clear sign of overall excellence.

It seems to me that business or political success is *usually* more a result of some type animal cunning with a heapin' helpin' of ruthlessness thrown in for good measure.

As for Calvinists, they always seemed to me like the people that Jesus warned us about instead of the ones he advocated becoming.

Oops, my bad, got you mixed up with your half-brother Jubal.

...is the first-half of The Problem.

If I invented, and patented, some tech that all new Intel procs later used, I ought to be able to get compensation for having been first to post the patent.

It doesn't matter how many I employ.

But extortion, that can cost many livelyhoods, ... I seem to recall that in the Jewish/Christian Bible, there is a commandment/law against usury?

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=exodus%2022:25-27;&version=45;

yeah, destroying livelyhoods seems to offend god, according to that...

That is the second-half of The Problem(tm).

Sincerely yers,

      Captain Obvious.

( :

I do find it slightly entertaining that you allowed him to generalize the entire Bible in about 10 words, and yet I bring up something specific and a citation is needed...

Greeks had a word "pornea" that referred to a lot of stuff, including homosexuality, immorality, adultery, etc. The Greeks did not appear to be particularly AGAINST pornea, but New Testament writers used it to refer to things

In addition to the Corinthians passage already cited, I'd bring up Romans 1.

26 For this reason(AV) God gave them up to(AW) dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; 27 and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another,(AX) men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error.

I'm not sure it can be any clearer. Men (and women, respectively) giving up natural relations with women and committing "shameless acts" with men. Pretty clear to me. Especially since Paul is talking very specifically about human depravity in the chapter.

1 Corinthians 6:8-10 (New International Version)

8 Instead, you yourselves cheat and do wrong, and you do this to your brothers.

9 Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders

10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

In the King James version, of course. 2 Kings 18:27

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