Domain: etymonline.com
Stories and comments across the archive that link to etymonline.com.
Comments · 342
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Re:not protects
Of course, this is the newer term or pirate that means one that violates copyright, not the definition that means one that raids ships
Sigh. It's only slightly newer, and I think a definition of a word that dates back over three hundred years can be considered legitimate.
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Re:Overhaul English!
"Cough" doesn't come from German, it comes, ie. is inherited, from *Germanic*. Apparently cognate words exist in Dutch and German. You're right about the probable Old English pronunciation, with a guttural "kh" sound. Also, nearly all words with "gh" pronouned as [f] or mute had such a sound originally.
cough on etymonline
cough at WiktionaryIs it spelled potahto or potayto? Cah or car or core or cower? Chimney or chimbley? Wash or warsh? Unlike Spanish, the regional dialects of American English put the kibosh on your idea.
That's a good argument against "phonetic spelling reform" because *whose English would you base it on*? It would be inconvenient to some if "marry", "merry" and "Mary" were spelt identically. Personally, I'd get rid of some quirks, like "debt" instead of "det" or "dette".
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!encyclopedia
That's a big book at 12 volumes, but it's not an encyclopedia. An encyclopedia is "training in a circle", the "full circle" of knowledge of the world. "Iraq War Jr" is not a full circle; even "everything about its Wikipedia entry" is merely a small point of knowledge in a full education.
Wikipedia is an encyclopedia. Indeed, it's more like a cylinder, since its circle is stacked atop the previous circle of revisions. It's an encylindropedia.
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Re:Social change causes corporate insanity
I'll just leave this here before anyone goes [citation needed].
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=gay -
Re:My childhood called
Or in this case, to a random volume and page.
BTW, go play.
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Re:Richest?
There's nothing wrong with using an apostrophe on a pronoun to indicate possession.
That depends on how you define "right" and "wrong" with respect to changing language over time.
Modern English has shed most of the case system that was present in Old English, but a few old pronouns have held onto these vestiges.
"Thee," "thou," and "thine" have all but disappeared, and are often used incorrectly by people trying to sound archaic (eg. T'Pau in Star Trek TOS using "thee" as a subject pronoun).
The reason "me" in "Bob and me went to the store" is incorrect is because "me" is an object case pronoun, rather than a subject case pronoun. These pronoun cases are also found in "he" (subject) "him" (object) and "his" (possessive) and so on like that.
"Its" is a little more tricky. "Him's" appears to be unattested balderdash, but "it's" seems to have entered the language in that form in the late 16th century, as an alternative to using "his" for the neuter possessive pronoun. In that regard, you are correct in asserting that there's nothing wrong with using "it's" to show possession. No, there isn't, so long as you are not writing modern English.
However, you assert that anyone educated from the '80s onward has the world's shittiest grasp of grammar. Where do we draw the line in time between the 1500s and the 1900s in determining what constitutes correct grammar today in the 21st century? Considering that the language is evolving (some would say devolving), almost anything can be justified, including your current assertion. We are heading for a time when "me," "their," "there," and "your" are all legitimate subject pronouns, because usage eventually defines what the norms are.
Be that as it may, I don't think we've reached that point yet, and we certainly hadn't reached that point in the 1980s, the age of the shittiest grasp of grammar. Let's take a trip back in time then to an English grammar text from 1896, which is a little on the modern side of the middle, yet still somewhere in between. In 1896 they explained:
LESSON 125.
CASE FORMS—PRONOUNS.
The pronouns I, thou, he, she, and who are the only words in the language that have each three different case forms.
+Direction+.—Study the Declensions, and correct these errors:—
Our's, your's, hi's, her's, it's, their's, yourn, hisn, hern, theirn.
--Higher Lessons in English, Alonzo Reed and Brainerd Kellogg, 1896
Take note that "it's" is pulled out as an error to be corrected in this context.
This is good supporting evidence that while the "its vs. it's" convention has changed since its entry into the language, the rules as they are currently enforced by grammar Nazis have been in place in the current form for more than 100 years.
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Matter = mother, at least etymologically
Did you know that "matter" is (likely) derived from "mater", Latin for "mother"? http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=matter That makes your last sentence deliciously tautological
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Re:Why Pirate?
an attempt to reclaim the word, which is currently used as a propaganda term by the copyright lobby in an attempt to link downloading to stealing ships
The first recorded use of the word "pirate" to mean "one who takes another's work without permission" is from 300 years ago (source). This is not a new invention, and that battle is already lost.
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Re:Hmmm
And why would black people have a problem with the word niggardly? It's derived from the same place we get the word nigger.
Wrong. This is the problem. Just because words might sound similar, doesn't mean they come from the same place.
Nigger's earliest appearance in English was in the 16th century, coming from the Spanish word Negro as a pejorative for blacks.
Niggardly comes from Niggard, which first appears in the 14th century and is likely to come from a Swedish word, which just means "stingy". -
Re:Hmmm
And why would black people have a problem with the word niggardly? It's derived from the same place we get the word nigger.
Wrong. This is the problem. Just because words might sound similar, doesn't mean they come from the same place.
Nigger's earliest appearance in English was in the 16th century, coming from the Spanish word Negro as a pejorative for blacks.
Niggardly comes from Niggard, which first appears in the 14th century and is likely to come from a Swedish word, which just means "stingy". -
Re:md5?
Your "woosh" is a classic example of a premature ejaculation.
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Re:Cretin != CretanI hate to keep playing this game, but what's really of interest here is the etymology, so this link is substantially more informative:
1779, from Fr. crétin (18c.), from Alpine dialect crestin, "a dwarfed and deformed idiot" of a type formerly found in families in the Alpine lands, a condition caused by a congenital deficiency of thyroid hormones, from V.L. *christianus "a Christian," a generic term for "anyone," but often with a sense of "poor fellow." Related: Cretinism (1801).
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Re:Daniel Pink's TED talk
[A TED presentation] is pretty decent, insightful, and fascinating.
I'd argue with insightful - the people giving the presentation may be so, but the viewers are not more so. In addition, the presentations are narrow, and shallow. Also, look up the etymology of fascination.
Forcing a complex issue into an arbitrary twenty minute time-slot is the presentation equivalent of Twitter. And, just like Twitter (and Slashdot summaries), the information gives the appearance of understanding - not actual understanding or insight. Perfect for the ADHD generation. TED - just say "No."
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Re:Great idea
Splendid fun, however:"Other types of manufacturing machines driven by wind or water, whether for grinding or not, began to be called mills by early 15c"
'Mill' got attatched to machinery early because for a very long time the only type of large housed machinery around most places was the local grinding mill. For example, I used to work at a 'steel mill', which I can assure you did not grind or pump steel (it is melted, poured, and rolled), nor has there ever been any confusion about the use of the term in that way.
So windmill is indeed a machine driven by wind, whereas a windpump would be, well, that would be good old Fat Tony on Pizza Night. Get a table near the door.
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First there were hackers.
Then there was a new subset, called "computer hackers". Now the former are known as "hardware hackers" and the latter simply as "hackers". (and with only the negative connotations)
Hack goes further back than that.
When *I* think of "hacker", I think of MacGyver. and Scotty. and Junkyard Showdown.
MacGyver yes, Scotty not so much, and Junkyard Showdown I've never heard of. However there's Harry Broderick.
Falcon
Beam me up Scotty!
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Re:The 13 votes
Firstly, If you have representatives, its not a democracy, its a republic.
That's at least a rather outdated use of the word.
As early as 1604 republic meant "state in which supreme power rests in the people".
Falcon
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Re:Oh wellFrom online etymology:
homosexual (adj.) 1892, in C.G. Craddock's translation of Krafft-Ebbing's "Psychopathia Sexualis"
heterosexual (adj.) 1892, in C.G. Craddock's translation of Krafft-Ebbing's "Psychopathia Sexualis"Now a quick search does not reveal who C.G. Craddock actually is, though I suspect he was a man of some science.
His son(?) C.G. Craddock Jr. is attributed as a co-author for
"LEUKEMIC CELL PROLIFERATION AS DETERMINED BY IN VITRO DEOXYRIBONUCLEIC ACID SYNTHESIS* C. G. Craddock and G. S. Nakai"He also is referenced as CRADDOCK CG., Jr The physiology of granulocytic cells in normal and leukemic states. Am J Med. 1960 May;28:711-725
Sometimes it's enlightening to look up the etymological root of terms and this one is certainly worth noting. My original point was only that the poster was being less than honest about the time-frame of the usage of those terms and anyone of some age (anyone being born before the "Age of Aquarius...) knows that.
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Re:Take that china
Copernicium is named after Copernicus http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copernicium#Naming; regarded as the father of modern astronomy and whose heliocentric model http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copernican_Revolution is considered as a crucial starting point of the Scientific Revolution http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_Revolution
Copper is apparently from the Latin cuprum, which is from the word cyprian, a more general word for copper and bronze alloys, itself derived from the name of the island Cyprus where the metal was mined. http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=copper http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper#Antiquity_and_Middle_Ages -
Re:Bring forth ye Olde English Grammar Nazis
It should be spelled jerry-rigged is a slight on World War I Germans.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=jerry-rigged
Jury-rigged is apparently an acceptable term derived from French.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=juryPersonally, I spell it jerry but pronounce it jury.
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Re:Bring forth ye Olde English Grammar Nazis
It should be spelled jerry-rigged is a slight on World War I Germans.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=jerry-rigged
Jury-rigged is apparently an acceptable term derived from French.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=juryPersonally, I spell it jerry but pronounce it jury.
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Research Implications:
Heuristics is expected to make a big come back in Artificial Intelligence research, as the machine represents everything in terms of bromides.
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Re:Pirates
Decades? You mean centuries: http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=pirate
pirate (n.)
... Meaning "one who takes another's work without permission" first recorded 1701Guess what... the word means what it does. It's meant that for a very, very long time.
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Re:Beware! Root access to the world.
That's why sex is sometimes referred to as "nookie".
Not according to the internet:
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=nookienookie -
"sexual activity," 1928, perhaps from Du. neuken "to fuck." -
Re:!Piracy
You might want to read this - 'Meaning "one who takes another's work without permission" first recorded 1701'
It was first used in this way 300 years ago. Like it or not, "pirate" has two meanings, and one of them is "copyright infringer".
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Re:What's genetic about that?
The word 'genetic' predates the discovery of DNA: http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=genetic
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Re:OT: pride and pedantry
You said it isn't one of them. I showed it is one of them. Your backtracking to say it didn't use to be one of them acquiesces in this.
Secondly, tangential to my point, but intersecting your new position:
moot
1154, from O.E. gemot "meeting" (especially of freemen, to discuss community affairs or mete justice), from P.Gmc. *ga-motan (cf. Old Low Frankish muot "encounter," M.Du. moet, M.H.G. muoz), from collective prefix *ga- + *motan (see meet (v.)). The adj. senses of "debatable" and "not worth considering" arose from moot case, earlier simply moot (n.) "discussion of a hypothetical law case" (1531), in law student jargon, in ref. to students gathering to test their skills in mock cases.
Please notice the word hypothetical, as in theoretical, as in not practical. Please also notice the mention of the year 1531, which invalidates your 1983 reference with regards to antecedence.
Conclusions:
- While whether or not you trumped anything is moot, you did overbid.
- As much as I enjoy bickering with you, we should really stop this.
:)
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Re:OT: pride and pedantry
You said it isn't one of them. I showed it is one of them. Your backtracking to say it didn't use to be one of them acquiesces in this.
Secondly, tangential to my point, but intersecting your new position:
moot
1154, from O.E. gemot "meeting" (especially of freemen, to discuss community affairs or mete justice), from P.Gmc. *ga-motan (cf. Old Low Frankish muot "encounter," M.Du. moet, M.H.G. muoz), from collective prefix *ga- + *motan (see meet (v.)). The adj. senses of "debatable" and "not worth considering" arose from moot case, earlier simply moot (n.) "discussion of a hypothetical law case" (1531), in law student jargon, in ref. to students gathering to test their skills in mock cases.
Please notice the word hypothetical, as in theoretical, as in not practical. Please also notice the mention of the year 1531, which invalidates your 1983 reference with regards to antecedence.
Conclusions:
- While whether or not you trumped anything is moot, you did overbid.
- As much as I enjoy bickering with you, we should really stop this.
:)
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Re:Ok, so I got the popcorn ready....
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=robot says otherwise.
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Re:Democratic?
French in origin (I.E. amicus curae)
To be fair, amicus curiae is Latin in origin, not French.
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Re:not unusual
And "organic chemistry" (chemistry of compounds based on carbon) was in use long before "organic farming" (farming free from application of extraneous chemicals).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organic_chemistry
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=organicThat said, most people can figure these things out from context. Some apparently cannot, or choose not to.
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Re:Till, until and 'til
Epic fail with the title? A "till" is a cash register, something you put money into. Do they mean 'til, short for until.
Til(l) was the original form of the word. The redundant prefix un(d) was added later, and nowadays people mistake till as a shortened version of until, which gives 'til. So, there's nothing wrong with the headline.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=till
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=until -
Re:Till, until and 'til
Epic fail with the title? A "till" is a cash register, something you put money into. Do they mean 'til, short for until.
Til(l) was the original form of the word. The redundant prefix un(d) was added later, and nowadays people mistake till as a shortened version of until, which gives 'til. So, there's nothing wrong with the headline.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=till
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=until -
Thank you!
You pointed out nicely what I was about to post. Here are the links I was going to add though:
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=teenage
http://www.answers.com/topic/teenager
http://www.home-school.com/Articles/PlattTeenagers.htmlAs resource bases contract and the world goes back to a solar economy, expect the teenager to disappear.
I wouldn't agree on this though.
Teen and teen-age are a western 1st world invention - now in use globally.
Unless entire western... no... HUMAN civilization disappears COMPLETELY - the term and the stage of human development it describes will remain distinctive from childhood and adulthood.
And I am talking going back to hunter-gatherer stage long enough that current languages are changed and forgotten.
Even then, upper classes WILL continue to pamper their young long after they (the "rulers" and "thinkers" - not the kids) stop writing dictionaries and regulating language. Teenagers would continue to exist in tradition among the upper class even if no one remained who could remember the word any more.The only way it may be replaced or removed from use (other than what I said above) is if it is further broken down to early and late teens.
Into something like earleens and lateens. Or prims and seconds. Or juniors and seniors.But, for something like that to happen you would need a HUGE social difference to appear. Globally.
Like for example giving 15-16 year-olds a right to vote or something similar.
Just like teenagers first appeared when kids globally started being sent to school despite hitting puberty (instead of being sent to work in mines, fields etc.) - a new stage in the society would have to be created first. -
Re:By analogy with "antenna farm".
This really intrigued me, so I looked into the etymology of the word 'farm' a bit.
Going back to its roots, a "server farm" or a "wind farm" make perfect sense, as the basis for the word "farm" is land.
That is, the agricultural connotation of "farm" is a later addition. Really, any tract of land is a farm. It just happens that leased land was rarely used for anything but agriculture back in the middle ages, so eventually a "farm" was only a tract of land used for agriculture.
So the primary meaning of the word "farm" is "land". This fits for wind farms, agricultural farms, etc. For server farms, I think it has more to do with the agricultural similarities. A row of cabbages is similar to a row of servers, etc. Rather than one monolithic production entity (like a city), instead you have rows of servers that equate to rows of crops.
Likely the modern usage is heavily influenced by the character of what is being called a $PRODUCT farm, regardless of land use. But it's interesting to me that this ties in very well with the original meaning of the word "farm". -
Re:Stay away from the Kindle!
examine the wording
atheist
"noun: one who believes that there is no deity" (Merriam-Webster)atheism "can be either the rejection of theism, or the position that deities do not exist." (Wikipedia)
atheist
"1571, from Fr. atheiste (16c.), from Gk. atheos "to deny the gods, godless," from a- "without" + theos "a god" (see Thea)." (Online Etymology Dictionary)atheism
"derived from the Greek word atheos, using the Greek prefix a- (an- not, without) ... derived from the Greek word theos (a deity...)" (MyEtymology)etc.
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Re:Bollocks
Close. It actually comes from the Old French word "defaute", or latin "defalta" or "defallere", meaning a deficiency or failure: de (completely) + fallere (to fault or fail).
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=default
http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1O27-default.html-dZ.
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NonsenseMy first google hit regarding background on default
:http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=default
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c.1225, "failure, failure to act," from O.Fr. defaute, from M.L. defalta "a deficiency or failure," from L. dis- "away" + fallere "to be wanting." The financial sense is first recorded 1858; the computing sense is from 1966.
-------------How I see it, all the word 'default' means is the state an object is in if you don't mess with it. e.g. the default position of a football is on the centre of the playing field, until one of the players kicks it. They didn't need computer science for that.
Please keep your rants to your blog.
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Modern life in 1225
From an etymology dictionary:
c.1225, "failure, failure to act," from O.Fr. defaute, from M.L. defalta "a deficiency or failure," from L. dis- "away" + fallere "to be wanting." The financial sense is first recorded 1858; the computing sense is from 1966.
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Re:Bollocks
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Re:I'm not a statistic!
Australians use it as well, huh?
A googling brought me this, which claims the term originated in the 1940s in the UK.
Wow.
Isn't the WWW amazing?
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Re:Whoosh
"governator" isn't a real word either, and "gubernator" also makes the same word play. The adjective "gubernatorial" retains the original Latin spelling.
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Re:RIP DNF
The term Crap came from John Crapper the inventor of the Toilet.
Common misconception. The term 'crap' predates Thomas Crapper by at least 150 years.
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Re:Why text messages instead of email?
'To lunch' has been a legitimate verb far longer than people have been, *ahem*, texting.
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Re:Android is much older than that...
android
"automaton resembling a human being," 1727, from Mod.L. androides, from Gk. andro- "human" + eides "form, shape." Listed as "rare" in OED (1879), popularized from c.1951 by science fiction writers. -
Re:Android is much older than that...
The word "apple" has been in the English language since time immemorial, but that didn't stop both Apple Corp. and Apple Computer.
The reason "bovine" might be more difficult to use as an exclusive trademark is because it pretty much literally describes the thing it's protecting. This is an example of a descriptive mark being denied trademark exclusivity.
On the other hand, "android" here would be classified as either an arbitrary or suggestive mark, both of which can receive trademark exclusivity through the USPTO.
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Re:wrong word in article title
Dictionaries are descriptivist, meaning they record HOW a word is (ab)used... not what the word actually means.
But a word means, exactly and only, what it is used to mean by educated native speakers of the language. There is no higher authority that determines that a word "actually" means. (Or, for that matter, what grammatical constructions are "proper".)
What other source would you suggest? The meaning of a word cannot be gleaned from etymology. If, to take your example, "decimate" must only be used to mean "reduce by one-tenth" because it comes from a root meaning "ten", then by the same argument "tragedy" ought to only mean a play written for a competition where a goat is awarded as a prize, since it comes from roots meaning goat song.
Anyway, how do you think those Latin and Greek root words got their meaning? By usage.
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Re:Still Sounds Guilty to Me
Do you mean I should have used emigrant instead?
"Emigrant" and "immigrant" are used like this:
He immigrated to the US.
He emigrated from the UK.I'm not sure what you're suggesting. Are you suggesting that if you enter a country illegally, you are not an immigrant? Because dictionaries disagree.
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Re:I think its infected my car.
Why only indeed.
Also to GP:
http://etymonline.com/?term=marry
http://etymonline.com/?term=wed!RELIGIOUS term
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Re:I think its infected my car.
Why only indeed.
Also to GP:
http://etymonline.com/?term=marry
http://etymonline.com/?term=wed!RELIGIOUS term
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Re:Because Gay People Make You Gay
As a member of PFLAG you need to get your etymology straight (haha).