Slashdot Mirror
Mandrake 7.2 Beta (Ulysses) Released
dclatfel writes "Just wanted to let everyone know that the latest beta of
Mandrake for Intel is up - 7.2 Beta - and it's called
Ulysses. (Now where is that Golden Fleece?)" They've got notes regarding it as well - KDE 2 Beta 4, and Gnome 1.2, as well as XFree86 4.01 as the default X server.
"and it's called Ulysses. (Now where is that Golden Fleece?)"
The Golden Fleece was taken from Colchis by *Jason and the Argonauts,* not Odysseus (a.k.a., Ulysses). One shouldn't toss around classical references if one doesn't even know the basic plot of the most prominent greek myths.
apt-get is not analogous to rpm, it's analogous to dpkg. apt-get is more like rpmfind, except it actually works. :)
WWJD? JWRTFM!!!
Thanks!
I tried to install 7.1 from CD, but the media was somewhat messed up, so I just went with what I knew, and did a network install of RH6.2.
How do you like Mandrake? Do you know if it would be faster/slower on an Athlon? (I don't think actual Pentium optimization would necessarily help...)
---
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
Okay, I'm running Mandrake now as well; it looks pretty slick. I hadn't gotten to try out Konquerer yet, so it'll be fun playing with all the installed software. :)
---
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
Cool; I've hacked most of that into my system already, but it would be nice to see it supported out of the box.
;)
Heck, I've got a couple of ReiserFS partitions, one of them as Software RAID-0. I've been playing around too much, I'm pretty happy with my 800 Mhz Thunderbird, myself.
---
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
Hmm. I don't know, my drive doesn't do it, either. I could have tried it out, but I figured it wasn't really worth it. (I read through about enabling ATA/66 on Linux; I might have to patch my kernel for that, and use hdparm, but it didn't sound like even that offered much improvement)
Mandrake has a *lot* of extra stuff; I'm installing it now, from rpmfind.org, and it's taking its time. The installer looks really cool, though, especially their partitioning tool!
---
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
There's a network install image... It was somewhat buried, but I couldn't find it at all before! Has mandrake always supported doing an FTP install, or is this new?
:) and (b) I just got my RedHat installation working decently on my cool new computer; I don't want to mess it up!
/usr, and whatnot, and back stuff up...
I'd love to try it out, but (a) this is a BETA
Oh well, I guess I could use a different partition for
---
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
What are you talking about?
:^)
Are you talking about the Macmillan deal? Macmillan ships Red Hat GPL, too. Seriously, please post a reply, because I'm confused as hell.
Having said that: oh great, I just upgraded from 7.0 to 7.1.
Stating on Slashdot that I like cheese since 1997.
The new Mandrake does have apt-get like ability, at least for those wanting to be on the bleeding edge. The newly updated MandrakeUpdate utility will allow you to keep up-to-date with the latest cooker rpms (cooker is Mandrake's public beta, always a work in progress).
I'm posting this from the 7.2 beta now, and I really like the improvements to the distro so far (the lilo graphical screen, the improved MandrakeUpdate utility, and the enhancements to the installer).
Surprisingly, the X server worked out of the box for my geforce2 card, at least for 2-D.
-- Stephen
I believe binaries compiled for i586 WILL run on 486 based machines, though not as 'optimized'.
As a matter of fact, I just put Storm on a few machines. Pretty slick, but the stuff needs a lot of work in places. Its rough, like RH5.0 era. It tries very hard, and lulls you into a false sense of contentment - "What? It configured this! It insists it did! AGH".
Don't get me wrong, I like the "Debian + more recent stuff" better than, say, Corel. I'm quite happy with Stormix.
ZOMG I WOULD LOVE TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR FEELINGS ON MACINTOSH VERSUS WINDOWS, VI VERSUS EMACS, AND HOW YOU'RE NOT A DORK
Are you sure it wasn't just an obligatory zealous jab at Microsoft? At least that's the picture when I think of software, gold, and fleecing in the same sentence.
not really...
Storm is exactally like Debian, it looks like some kid's Debian box all packaged up with an installer. But Mandrake is years ahaid of RedHat in the desktop market. I would recomend Mandrake to anyone new to Linux. Then RedHat once you have your feet wet. Then on to anything you like after that, maybe just jump into OpenBSD.
think about the 30% improvment your getting one 1 program... that may not be a lot to you, but then you have that 30% improvment on your Kernel, the X server, the WindowManager and the app your running. Overall thats a 120% improvment. now i'll take that anyday!
hey wait a minuite, doesn't SuSE support UDMA66 out of the box?
I also had problems w/ SCSI systems when installing 7.1 (on three different machines). It seems that the mkinitrd image just wasn't working right. I fixed it by using the bootdisk created during install to bring up the machine, then compiling a kernel with the proper SCSI support built in, rather than as a separate module.
Rather unfortunate, as that was really the only stain on an otherwise excellent system.
"It's overkill, of course. But you can never have too much overkill." - Anonymous Slashdot Coward
and insightful and interesting and funny and flamebait and offtopic and troll and .....
you get the point.
(if ya didn't, it means the school kid moderators are hopeless)
> Are there any issues with Mandrake compiling for i586/i686 that concerns AMD owners? Any performance problems with K6-2's ???
> And what about Athlons?
The instructions that have been added to the Pentium chip are also available on the corresponding AMD chip (for the current chips on the market). So, something compiled for Pentium (vs for the 80386 chip) will also perform better on a K6-2 (and up) CPU. I, myself, use Mandrake on an AMD K6-2; it works like a charm!
Mario.
what's your point?
.
Yes, Bastille's hardening scripts for RedHat will also work on Mandrake - but I don't know what it will do on the new versions ... ymmv
n ux/Bastille-1.1.0.tgz
http://www.bastille-linux.org/
http://sourceforge.net/download.php/bastille-li
.
> I am a goat fucker.
that's it - no more goat cheese in my diet.
.
I would have modded this up if I hadn't posted in this thread already. ...)
(Viewing at -1 doing the mod thing
.
Yep,
ftp> ls -l
-rw------- 1 506 523 677361664 Aug 31 20:59 ulysses-inst.iso
Looks like anon users will have to wait.
Pd
.
For one reason.
It's the only distro I've seen so far that supports UDMA66 out of the box. You don't know how nice that is when working with new computers. UDMA 66 has been the only thing that has kept us from installing linux on a friend's computer, and now she has a brand new, shiny OS. Very nice.
What do I do, when it seems I relate to Judas more than You?
Still not dead.
Yeah, it's neat all right until you need to install Linux on an old 486 as a router or server.
Mandrake HAS an ISO compiled for 486's. I know, my friend burned a copy for me. Download/burn that for your router...
Security and stability should come first in a distribution, not convenience.
Since Mandrake 6.0, I've only had minor problems with it. As far as security goes, the installer lets you set up the box as either a server or workstation and it let's you pick how secure you want the installation to be.
Isn't that most of Microsoft's problem?
How dare you mention the Evil Empire and Mandrake in the same breath! Microsoft's problem is that it is an illegal monopoly. Mandrake is doing a good job providing a full-featured and functional Linux (OS + apps) distribution.
I started with Slackware (which also rules), have used Red Hat (given the $$$ RH has spent I'm not impressed) and am currently testing Corel/Debian. So far I had to figure out apt-get (whose CLI is primitive compared to rpm) and upgrade the kernel and a bunch of packages (it came with gcc 2.7 -- give me a break!) and add other vital packages (MySQL and PHP) just to get basic functionality that Mandrake has.
Repeat slowly after me: MANDRAKE KICKS ASS!!!
--
You think being a MIB is all voodoo mind control? You should see the paperwork!
A man who wants nothing is invincible
Package? Eh, I have X 4.0.1 running on this debian machine w/ xinerama as I type. It's just a matter of compiling the source. Now I probably couldn't have done some of the minor tweaking by myself, someone was nice enough to post a howto on linuxgames and if you follow that step by step, it's a piece of cake.
It also has problems with LS-120 drives on SCSI systems, some of them major.
The installer sees the LS-120 drive, but if you use an ext2 formated disk (such as from an old distro or system you no longer use), don't be surprised if you system doesn't boot afterwards.
What it should do to make the bootdisk is reformat the disk (after telling you what it going to do, and giving you the opertunity to back out, first) and after copying the bootloader and other nesscary files to the hard drive, copy those files that it installed to the HD to the bootdisk. What it did instead was to copy the boot files from the old bootdisk to the hard drive. Of course, the system wouldn't boot afterwards...
If you don't use an ext2 fromated disk, it will just say that an error occured, and mkbootdisk failed. Oh, BTW neigher disk was write protected.
If you're thinking "why not use the rescue mode on the install disk?", tried that, it didn't help...it will load the module for the SCSI card, but wouln't reconize the SCSI drives if you try to mount them. Try to load the module manully, same thing.
That's with a fresh install, which I had to do anyways because of another bug in the installer where, if you use the "upgrade" option, the installer upgrades the kernel, but doesn't upgrage the modules. When you tell it to load the old kernel, you'll find that the old kernel is no longer set up to load any modules. This is a real show stopper if you have SCSI drives.
What's annoying, but still a problem, is if you have an LS-120 drive in a SCSI system, even if the installer can see and use the LS-120 drive, it doesn't set it up so the system can, and the drive has to be set up manully.
MD 7.1 is a good distro, once you get it working, and if you can stand some of the annoying bugs in it, hopefuly 7.2 will be better, and wouln't have at least the more serious and more noticeable bugs that 7.1 has.
It used to be true but somewhere in the kernel docs, I read where the i586 stuff will no longer work on lower end machines. It may have been 2.3.99ish or maybe even as early as 2.2.14+.
It clearly states multiple times in the MandrakeUpdate utility that it is not a wise idea to upgrade the kernel through RPM, especially if you have a ReiserFS system.
Chris Hagar
"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance." - Thomas Jefferson
The Debian people spend an excruciating amount of time making sure everything is stable and secure. Consequently, when you get a Stable release of Debian, you can be damn sure it's more secure and stable than any of the bleeding edge releases that the other distros put out so often.
Chris Hagar
"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance." - Thomas Jefferson
You're complaining because it was secure in not letting the average user do much because you told it to? And then you go on to say that you hope things have "improved" beyond this situation with the Paranoid msec setting? I hope not. The Paranoid msec setting is SUPPOSED to lock the system down, that's what it's supposed to do. Secondly, why didn't you just run the msec program again and switch the security levels? Quite easy to do. Consequently, I don't see what you have a problem with with that.
Chris Hagar
"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance." - Thomas Jefferson
MandrakeUpdate doesn't handle dependencies very well at all. I tried the new version tonight, and if you download a package and try to install it without the proper dependencies, it gives you two choices: (1) force the installation of all of the packages, or (2) quit and and install nothing (not even the packages that had no problems). Then it core dumps. That's a long way from apt-get, as I understand it.
- Have a picture
The installer definitely surprised me, but it was pretty nifty. The configuration tools seem pretty good for anyone who doesn't want to poke in config files, but I'll probably dual boot with Debian. Only complaint I had was the default Gnome installation. I don't know what the problem was, but the panel sucked up about 60MB of memory. Worked just fine after upgrading to the Helix gnome RPMs though. I was pleasently surprised to find that it came with XFree 4.0 (which I need for my TNT2 card) but it choked on the NVidia drivers. I had to install X from the official distribution to get the NVidia working.
In short, Mandrake's a great distro for ease-of-configuration, but like all distros needs some incantations for the strange hardware
-- 2 + 2 = 5, for very large values of 2
*sigh*
Certainly. Most, if not all, the spec files are different. Check your facts, not just your FUD...
I hate to reply to myself, but that should be
- do_try_to_free_pages failed()
+ do_try_to_free_pages() failed
and
- Rinse, lather, repeat.
+ Lather, rinse, repeat.
Bloat and Insecurity my ass -
Bloat is as much as you install, it's still like any other distro, if you don't want a package don't install it.
As for security, for those who are concerned about it X3 is still there, and KDE, who concerned with security and stability runs that?
Mandrake is as compact and secure (if not more secure) than other distro's. I use mandrake and I use windowmaker, and no matter what distro it is I set it up the way I want it in the end.
Mandrake offers more leading edge packages, they aren't forcing them on you.
Mandrake's claim to fame: Even my wife can use it. It's the most Windows-like of the distros, it recognizes everything you own and grub rocks the trailer.
If you aren't part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem
How is this informative at all? The only information it seems to contain is "wheee mandrake is great".
Mandrake is a Redhat derivative.
Not anymore. They decided to do their own thing shortly after Red Hat started shipping KDE. That happened sometime around Mandrake 6.1 or 7.0.
I think now they try to maintain RPM compatibility with Red Hat by keeping libs and such in the same location, but the distro is no longer derived from Red Hat.
--
Dunno, KDE2 looks pretty rockin'. As in, faster, slicker and easier to use.
--
At the time I was expecting more along the lines of network security, i.e. closing all ports and disabling stuff like sendmail and linuxconf.
I guess since Mandrake is highly touted as an easy-to-install desktop OS, I expected paranoid security within the context of an operational desktop OS - i.e. working X, sound, etc.
I would point out that Mandrake might want to provide a more clear explanation of the security settings during the install process, since they are aiming their distro at the unwashed masses.
I'm not entirely complaining though - I also thought I would share my experience so that others might avoid the mistake I made.
--
Real clever guys. Rip off the most respected piece of literature written by the most respected author on the planet. Does this yield the most respected distribution of linux?
I'm glad I'm not the only one to catch this flub. Disney mangling the classics is bad enough.When you make a reference like this, make sure you check that it's valid.
-NOC Monkey (OOK!) Experience is what allows you to recognize a mistake the second time you make it.
subject says it all ...
-- "As a human being I claim the right to be widely inconsistent", John Peel
"urpmi" is their "apt-get install"
What I would like is the option to ftp a minimal base & just dload the stuff I want, like I can with Debian.......:o)
--
Full plate and packing steel! -Minsc
Kernel 2.2.17 just came out, time for all the distributors to roll out a new release!
Of course it's also the name of an impressively boring James Joyce novel.
:wq
Is it just me, or does the list of "new" features look a bit skimpy. I'm sure there are more changes then what is listed on the notes. If not, then there is not much point in getting the new release. Perhaps they are just getting tired of writing long articles on what is new. Or is this release just coming out because Red Hat just release PinStripe just a few weeks ago? It makes you wonder if they are just following the crowd so it gives the impression that the software is "new".
If anyone has installed this yet, or has the more recent cookers, what else is new.
WTF?? how is this redundant?? Offtopic, yes, but definatly not redundant. I think some moderators should get out of pre-school and learn wtf redundant means!!
Buying a Dell computer is equivalent to dropping the soap in a prison shower.
I don't know anything about Roman Mythology, but wasn't "Jason and the Argonauts" the name of one of those cheezy 60s/70s R&B Bands?
Buying a Dell computer is equivalent to dropping the soap in a prison shower.
Not necessarily, it depends on where the desktop is deployed. If you are going to use it at home then "really neat features" may well be the attraction. However in a business setting, stability PLUS the support costs are more of a consideration. If more businesses are going to deploy Linux on the desktop then a whole lot more support people will be needed and a lot of these are going to be Windows trained. Until they have got some way up the learning curve any distribution that makes their lives easier, read cheaper for the business, has got to be a good idea and AFAIK Mandrake is about the best as regards installation and general troubleshooting.
That said I would not be happy unless at least some support staff have a grounding in Linux security as it seems too easy to leave holes if the OS is set up by inexperienced staff.
Oddly enough I can't find any kernel rpm other than 2.2.17. The Reiser version string is 3.5.24.
I also really like the mandrake graphic partitioner. And the fact that _all_ my hardware was autodetected and autoconfigured during install :)
:)
I am running debian right now, because I have enough linux know-how to configure my hardware myself, and apt and the debian program base rocks! But a debian with the mandrake install program would be heaven! Someone go port...
Soviet Union, which formally ceased to exist 25 December 1991.
If you want to "read" the page, select View, Character Set, Cyrillic (Windows-1251). Obviously, the Evil Empire is at work in the former Evil Empire.
ftp://ftp.free.fr/mirrors/ftp.mandrake-linux.com/M andrake-iso/7.2beta/i586/
Actually, the 2.2.17 news is good. 2.4.0-test7 and 2.4.0-test8pre4 seem to be still having problems with the truncate bug.
Mandrake is a Redhat derivative. They follow the same sort of release schedule. x.0 = major release and extremely buggy. x.1 = A nice release, most bugs squished out, some nice new packages. x.2 = highly polished, again a few new packages. The 2.4 kernel will show up in Mandrake 8.0.
signature smigmature
- James
How about setting up a usability lab and asking users of varying skill levels in DOS6.2 to sit down and figure out how to perform routine tasks in Windows2000...Or even Windows98 for that matter. It's difficult for the average user to learn a new operating system, after they've spent years learning one. However, for new users, Mandrake would not be much more difficult than learning Windows.
signature smigmature
- James
But go back and read what I said - I wasn't talking about installation, I was talking about any typical, everyday task a user wants to do. Usability tests involve sitting a user (novice, intermediate, expert etc.) in front of PC and asking them to do a bunch of tasks, ranging from just logging on, setting up their PC to log into their ISP, reading email, writing a document, printing it and so forth. It's obvious that few Linux distributors with the exception of Corel even bother with this. As a result a typical distro looks like a bunch of independently developed packages bound together with masking tape. Probably they assume all their users are expert enough to figure it all out for themselves.
Unfortunately that's absolutely the wrong attitude to take.
The unfortunate truth is that if you were to set up a usability study between W2K and Mandrake, Mandrake would lose big time. Even simple changes such as renaming or moving an icon could have a big impact on how usable an OS is.
If someone really wants these things, then it's hardly a chore for them to enable them. Most of them need configuration anyway to be useful. So they should be disabled by default not least for security reasons but also for increased machine performance and faster startup.
And Mandrake is one of the better distros!
True, but Mandrake but this second release since Redhat's last one. MD7.0 came out before RH6.2 and went on to release MD7.1 (my current distro w/ Freebsd4.1) and now MD7.2beta.
They didn't remove support but they added support for 586 and up which is not supported by 386/486. A small detail. There are worse things than Mandrake 7.x servers. We have NT 4.0 servers at work and are looking at Win2000 and Citrix Metaframe. This is going to be a lot of work :( On a sidenote, If you have to run NT servers then check out Vinca/Legato's Co-Standby Server for failover. They were doing failover protection on a 2 node cluster while Microsoft was still just talking about it.
please.. examine the rpm .spec files, not just marketing info...
thanks please...
Xfree86 4.0.1 deb packages are here . They arent apt-getable yet, and are not even beta by debian standards. But I have had good luck with them (except the font server, which seems to crash on init every time) on a geforce card with the binary nvidia drivers.
"My head hurts, My feet stink, and I dont love Jesus." -Jimmy Buffett
I think you may have a point about stability to some degree since the philosophy of Mandrake is to include the latest of everything but I think it's pretty good security-wise.
Ha! I kill me!
Debian waits for a year to upgrade from 2.0 to 2.2, so Mandrake can wait for a couple months, right?
Tell me what makes you so afraid
Of all those people you say you hate
Tell me what makes you so afraid
Of all those people you say you hate
Tell me what makes you so afraid
Of all those people you say you hate
Tell me what makes you so afraid
Of all those people you say you hate
Then there's the five free books in PDF format (Red Hat Linux 6 Unleashed, Sam's Teach Yourself Linux in 24hr, 2e, STY KDE in 24hr, STY Gimp in 24hr, Special Ed. Using Linux 4e), which, while not as good as dead trees, are still a nice touch for reference purposes.
But the biggest part I'd say is the bundling of a limited version of PartitionMagic to create a spot on a Windows box for Linux to inhabit. Sure, there's free partitioning utilities out there, but I haven't heard any accounts of whether they work or not whereas I've used PM before and it has never failed me. BootMagic is included as well.
Yeah, I've had the updater puke on me, and my user account's .kderc file had root as its group and owner at first. I don't know if these have been ironed out in 7.1 and 7.2b, but there's not too much to not like. I did have to shut off a bunch of unneccessary services, though, and the NHFs at http://www.linuxnewbie.org/ were a good resource for finding how to do that.
All in all, it's a really good deal for the money. A much better deal, IMO, than any Windows upgrade.
Has anyone found a working mirror for the ISO download? I'm trying to download the ISO images from RPMFIND.NET to give to a friend who is new to Linux, and I keep getting Permission Denied!!! Despite all the Mandrake detractors out there, you really have to admit: their releases, while they do come really really quick, with almost no time between them, they're getting much better at including some of the newer software packages and kernels... I imagine the reason they used a 2.4 kernel as posted earlier probably has something to do with the fact that right after they released 7.1 with 2.2.15, a certain security advisory told us to upgrade to at least 2.2.16 I imagine this avoids the problem....at least until the 2.4 series of kernels starts to see more usage. What does this all mean? More security holes for crackers to take advantage of? Only time will tell....
"Life ain't interesting till you blow something up" --Anonymous
I think they use pgcc as well for many packages
http://www.goof.com/pcg/
As a history dweeb, I have two problems with that: (1) the ships, though vaguely classical-looking (lanteen mizzens) are too modern to fool the most amateur classicist (ship-rigged, keel-based hull, yada yada); (2) somebody obviously has the Iliad confused with the Odyssey.
I mentioned this to a co-worker expecting something between tolerant silence and "get a life". Instead I got a long list of historical blunders on Delphi packaging. (Lady Delphi, for example, looks more Athenian than Delphic.) You never know where lurks a history dweeb.
Although it does bother me that Fantasia features satyrs without genitals. Now that is obscene!!!
To get rpms and all the rpms that it needs, try using rpmdrake and check "install dependencies"(or something like that). Also, try out the new mandrake update, its pretty cool too. If only they used the helix code installer for everything!
Well... live of paranoid people isn't exactly easy, you know? If you want a handsome system that's clean and easy to use than you have to deal with the (possible) security risk of running it in "High Security" or even "Medium Security".
Freecell granny probably just needs a deck of cards, not a frickin' solitaire server.
J
There was artical only 3 days ago about an helix code RPM manager that does exactly that.
There is nothing built into RPM that means it can't be updated automatically.
If Mandrake started using Deb instead of RPM it would pratically be another distrobution.
The US FTP site for the ISOs get me "Permission denied" even though the files are listed (and the sizes seem correct). Trying now the France mirror... Hm, these ones work.
Also, the fact that mandrake is compiled for pentiums is also pretty neat and convenient.
Yeah, it's neat all right until you need to install Linux on an old 486 as a router or server. Security and stability should come first in a distribution, not convenience. Isn't that most of Microsoft's problem?
-Antipop
i would almost bet that you are using a highoint dma66 card. The 366 AND 370 cards have some issues with linux and drivers, and are also not to friendls with grub, use lilo.
If we had the time, we would all build our own distribution.. but if we can't afford to do so time-wise.. I really think Mandrake is second-to-none.
Also, the fact that mandrake is compiled for pentiums is also pretty neat and convenient.
It's all about convenience i say!!
Really I think if you have the time, always download the sources and compile it yourself on the newest version of gcc that supports i686 optimizations.
if mandrake 7.2 in beta, last i heard it was in alpha with iso's availalbe and a planed release for some time in november, there just doing a lot of debuging and user testing to make sure there release is stable.
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
Has anyone found any mirrors for 7.2? The main site appears to have been "slashdotted".
From the writer's sig, Russian affinity, I guessed this was a CIS type nation cc. Curiously, I visited IANA's database, but, I could not find the corresponding nation this TLD belongs to. Why not? Why isn't it listed?
Doing $ dig kiae.su shows Russia is involved in the picture.
[...]
;; AUTHORITY SECTION:
kiae.su. 2h59m38s IN SOA ns.kiae.ru. noc-dns.relarn.ru.
What does .su stand for?
Me pican las bolas, man!
Thanks
--
Me pican las bolas, man!
Thanks
Jaco
What surprises me greatly is why the .su TLD is not listed in IANA. They're the arbiters of TLDs, shouldn't it absolutely be listed/sanctioned there?
Me pican las bolas, man!
Thanks
--
Me pican las bolas, man!
Thanks
Jaco
it was jason and the argonots with the golden fleece.
...seems to me like a form of Windows-craving.
No, your children are not the special ones. Nor are your pets.
I searched for iso images of 7.2 beta, but couldn't find the new ones on metalab , linuxberg, or linuxiso.org. The linux-mandrake.com site seems /.ed, to make it worse. How long would it take to get this new iso propagated? I don't think it would be a very good idea to post any mirrors in comments right now, for obvious reasons.
-http://MSD.dyndns.org
fine, I agree that mandrake is the MacOS of linux, I even use it daily, but still, my original comment applies.
I recommend mandrake also.
Sneakemail is to spam filters what an ounce of prevention is to a pound of cure.
> Ulysses is Virgil's name for Odysseus.
Both of you are wrong, buddies.
First, the letter y does not exist in the Roman alphabet, so it is impossible for Ulysses to be the Roman translation or Virgil's name for anything. /.: Virgil is big bastard who stole nearly all of his stories from ancient Greece. If he was still alive now, he would be in even deeper shit than 2600 or Napster.
Secondly, Ulysses is the English name for the Greek warrior Ulysseus who got some GPS problems on his way back from the Trojan war.
Third, the Odysseus is the name for the epic masterpiece written by the mystic poet Homer to describe Ulysses' journey back home. And no, I don't know what the Roman version is, and I don't care because it is as much relevant to the case as knowing the Turkish version or the Armenian one.
Finally, this must be said at least once on
I find it funny that Mandrake always releses there new version a few weeks befor redhat does. Its as if they use mandrake as a beta so thay can fix bugs befor they do there offical relese I cOuld be wrong, But it seems fishy to me
We substituted the coffee Slashdot normally drinks with "Sandoz Crystals", Lets see if they notice the difference
Well, to me the multiple ships suggest the Iliad more than the Odyssey (Helen's beauty launching a thousand ships). Although the "Continuing Voyage" fits the Odyssey better.
---------
- Derwen
http://fsfeurope.org/
Why would they? You obviously aren't familiar with Mandrake. They like to be bleeding edge, and the distro won't even work for i386 machines as they've removed support for that to optimize it. I don't know of any other distro (mainstream, at least) where XFree86 4 is the default.
Personally, when it comes to desktop use of Linux, Mandrake is my favorite, mostly because of their lust for the cutting edge; I don't mind if my desktop gets hosed. On the server-side though, this is not my distro of choice, nor should it be yours for the same reasons.
But - apt-get. Oh man, what a program! This is the killer app of Debian. Something isn't working? You see the error message - packageX is missing. Please install before running ProgramY. With apt-get and the .debs - you just can't go wrong. No
downloading RPMs to find you need *another* rpm. Debian's package management is definitely the easiest to master for the
newbie.
On that note, if more package management systems were as nice as perl's CPAN module, life would be a lot easier.
Mosix this new distro and love your super.
I just spent a week downloading the 7.1 ISO's on my crappy 33.6 connection. Now they've released the beta of 7.2!!! Now I know you will say that I don't have to download it but I can't help it... I see something new and I gotta have it. Well my computer will be downloading for another week straight. Well I might just wait till i get back to college... *Yummy* Broadband *Yummy*
Give Slackware a shot. I am no distro king, but of all of them it seemed to be fairly ambivalent to both the desktop and window manager.
First, it's questionable that Debian isn't doing right. It releases very stable and its unstable is fairly uptodate.
If a package is being too slowly maintained, any maintner can offer to NMU it or take over the packaging. As for X, according to Branden Robinson, the only he's the maintainer is because he's the only one who wanted the trouble. If you want X4, then download the debs (see www.debian.org/~branden) and help bug-test them.
Frankly, considering how beta I've heard XFree86 4 is, I'm surprised by the number of distributions shipping it.
Isn't that the idea behind Storm?
"What a waste it is to lose one's mind. Or not to have a mind is being very wasteful. How true that is"
Vidi, Vici, Veni
No. You can do either. -mcpu produces the above behavior, but march produces code that will only run on that processor. Mandrake uses the latter.
Don't use the font server. XFree 4 can support everything natively --- just set the fontpath yourself in the config file.
suse supports it too since 6.4, but I havent tried it...
//rdj
No one can understand the truth until he drinks of coffee's frothy goodness.
--Sheikh Abd-Al-Kadir, 1587
Exactly how much extra performance do those optimizations offer? From a multimedia software performance POV? I've heard that non-Pentium optimized code runs only about 70% as fast as Pentium optimized code on the Pentium. Also, I know that the i686 architecture has several quirks and speed-ups, and I don't know if most Linux distros really take full advantage of my system. Does compiling for i386 exact a peformance hit on Pentiums, and if so, why the hell do it?
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
This could be offtopic, but seeing this kind of progress in Mandrake makes me wonder what Debian isn't doing right?
While I don't particularly like the high level of tweaking performed by Mandrake, I have to give them one thing: they're right on the bleeding edge of technology, plowing through new barriers and actually *releasing* their distro.
This would be a huge challenge for the Debian swarm to pull off, even with their new proposed release scheme. It seems to me Debian gets too bogged down in bureaucracy, hindering their ability to actually get things released.
Perhaps some form of competition within the Debian group could be in order. If a package is being too slowly maintained, someone else could get the chance to pick up the pace?
Meanwhile, (ho hum) I guess we virtual community freaks will just keep on manually installing our own XFree86 4.01 until Debian gets into this millenium -- or ultimately break down and start using Mandrake.
My car gets 40 rods to the hogshead, and that's the way I likes it!
I just hope that the install goes well here. I've tried to install Mandrake 7.1 on 6 systems multiple times -- it worked twice. It has major SCSI problems. The guys at mandrake were no help, they basically "bolfed" it. But I sure do love it when it installs well!
Mike Roberto
- GAIM: MicroBerto
Berto
I've had the best results starting with the medium security level, and turning off the unnecessary services by hand. (At the very least, 'shell' and 'login' services were disabled heh.) Paranoid and High aren't really meant for interactive use, but if you're going to run a server you don't want just anyone logging into your system and running whatever anyway.
I find if you choose the packages properly, MDK is a very secure distribution and quite stable. New versions of software tend to fix security issues, and being a security nut (sometimes a bit overboard) myself I prefer starting with a more recent set of tools.
GPL: Free as in will
> Does compiling for i386 exact a peformance hit on Pentiums, and if so, why the hell do it?
Basically, compiling a program for i386 won't DECREASE the performance on the Pentium (vs the i386); but the same executable will be able to run on a Pentium and on a 80386. (that's the advantage of compiling for i386). Now, the downside: when compiling for i386 instead of Pentiums, you don't use the new instructions of the Pentium chips (that are not present on i386). These new instructions (which can optimize some part of you code by allowing your compiler to use some new assembly instructions) will make the code faster since they have been optimized in the hardware.
Mario.
*sigh* And yet MORE fud.
Mandrake is *not* Redhat simply because it uses rpms. That's like saying Corel is Debian because it uses debs.
7.1 has offers different levels of security on install (which changes things like directory permissions, among others)
I believe the security options are similar to:
a) Welcome Crackers
b) Low Security
c) Medium Security
d) High Security
e) Paranoid
With my Mandrake 7.0 install, I chose 'Paranoid' because, well, I'm extremely paranoid about security.
This caused no end of trouble for me because of the ultra-restrictive directory permissions it slapped on everything. For months (as a nonprivileged user) I ran into programs I couldn't run, global application config files I couldn't read, and devices I couldn't access. I finally got most everything straightened out, but I still run into an occasional glitch because of the settings.
Things may have improved since 7.0, but I would caution you that this may happen if you choose 'paranoid'. I'm choosing 'high' when I install 7.2.
Otherwise, I've found it to be quite stable, and yes, a bit bloated.
I would describe Mandrake as a heavily tweaked desktop distribution that installs the latest bleeding-edge versions of just about everything, including lots of applications you never knew existed.
I would never run Mandrake on a server. Bleeding edge + tons of unnecessary packages = security risk, IMO.
--
hang on... information wants to be free, right? the price of freedom is eternal vigilance? Does this imply that the price of information is eternal vigilance?
Window upgrade: $99
Mandrake 7.2 download: Eternal Vigilance
I think I'll wait till boxing day when it's marked down to "casual observation"
2 1337 4 u!
Somebody got their mythology wrong. Ulysses is the Roman name for Odysseus, the protagonist of the Odyssey, who had an epic journey around the Mediterranean after the Trojan War. The Golden Fleece was the object of Jason and the Argonauts.
Switch the . and the @ to email me.
I would definitely recommend Mandrake to anyone new to Linux. Sure, it isn't the most stable distribution, but compared to Windows, it's a rock. The installation is beautiful - and newbies feel comfortable with it. I've tried several distros (RedHat/Mandrake/Storm/Debian) and Mandrakes is the easiest to use by far. It's not the quickest, but it will get it up and going.
.debs - you just can't go wrong. No downloading RPMs to find you need *another* rpm. Debian's package management is definitely the easiest to master for the newbie.
My beef with it is the update system. It's confusing - and they often include things that can crump a system - like the kernel updates (rpms) that could munge a ReiserFS system. These kinds of things are not good - especially when the end user is a novice and expects these updates to work. Of course, updating a kernel by an rpm isn't the wisest thing to do, but newbies don't necessarilly know that.
What I would *love* to see a distro do is use Mandrake's installer with Debian's package management. I just installed Debian - and while the install wasn't terribly complicated - there were several annoyances that a newbie wouldn't be able to overcome - things like pnp configuration (automagic under mandrake) - X configuration (not as slick as Mandrakes - and I've had to modify some config files by hand) - and sound configuration. These are all relatively small obsticals for someone familiar with linux, but they are show-killers for newbies.
But - apt-get. Oh man, what a program! This is the killer app of Debian. Something isn't working? You see the error message - packageX is missing. Please install before running ProgramY. With apt-get and the
Hopefully, someone will mix the LM installer with the Debian package management - and _THAT_ will be the killer distro...
Linux - Because Mommy taught me to Share.
I recently tried out 2.4.0-test7 with the patch for Reiserfs 3.6.14, and it seemed to work fine.
I'll download the iso for 7.2 tomorrow and see what is there. In the meantime, if anybody knows what is really in 7.2 beta 1, please let us know. Like, which kernel 2.4.0-testX, is it really? And, which version of Reiserfs is supplied? For some benchmarks, test5 seems to be a temporary high water mark.