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Longest Physics Lecture in History?
gfrege writes "Perhaps you remember some long physics lectures from your days at school. But as part of a general strike of students at the Humboldt-Universitaet zu Berlin concerning cuts in funding for the city's universities, some physicists are in the middle of what could be the longest physics lecture in history. It started at noon on Monday, and is planned to run to noon on Thursday. Check out the topics, and if you're in Berlin, come on down. The Babelfish translations of the lecture titles make for some fun reading, too, if you can't make it there yourself."
...by a single professor, rather than a series of lectures on different topics by different people. Or am I missing something?
as long as this musical piece by John Cage, also being performed in Germany.
Back in the days when I went to school (up hill both ways) we had lectures that lasted all winter. We got to school on day, it snowed 30 feet, spring came, snow melted then we got to go home. And we LIKED it. back in the day.
Ride recklessly only when safe to do so.
Again sorry, but you know it's funny.
why? forty-two.
... you'll think nothing of staying awake the entire lecture! (for once)
You haven't heard the Physics lectures at my college. Granted, they may only BE hour-long, but it feels like days. How much can be said about Gauss's Law? REALLY.
Now this is something I have more than a little bit of experience with...
Students at Humboldt-Universitaet zu Berlin will simultaneously break the world record for sleeping in class.
So, are the profs doing this to support the students, or what?
:(
I can't RTFA.
This space available.
Beautifully (HU) of balls and impulses
XXX
XXX means: not intended dates
If nevertheless still someone liked to hold gladly additionally a VL: ask following the last VL on Thursday!
every stain tells a story
I sure hope not.
what the heck does it mean, that the students are on strike? How the heck can students be "on strike" for anything? they're not getting PAID to take classes.
now, they could be "demonstrating". but only WORKERS can "strike".
Russian Ark was a one shot movie... and many others, spannign 300 years. But still too short?
Physics should be a lifelong process.
And... if not... I mean, how much can someone soak up in one sitting?
Longer films required... Warhol meets professor meets Cage meets the horizongal spread of a red oak tree, and all its thousand year circles.
Physics should be a lifelong process. That's my mantra and I'm sticking to it.
The Custom Mary
How many bad physics jokes are going to show up?
.001 and you fail. In Astronomy, you're off by 10^2, and you lose half a point.
Let hope they don't bring up infinity. (wait, that's math.)
So it's a week long nap then!
How much 'force' is required to endure this class?
In Physics, you're off by
...but I was hoping to sleep in that week.
1) Collect tuition from students.
2) Cut funding, make them strike.
3) Save on maintenance.
4) PROFIT!!!
I did it, I solved the gnome's business plan!!!
Wouldn't that be awesome if you could go to lectures for one 24-hour period per week! Then the rest of the week could be used for studying, and doing cool projects and shit. I figure that during the lecturing, you could take some cat naps for like, and hour at a time, and your friend could take notes for you. You could take turns. Ideally all the notes would be available online anyways, so if you took a 6 hour nap, you could get those notes.
I remember many 3 day physics lectures -- unfortunately most were only one hour in length!!!
Then later market and sell audio segments and copies for cliff notes, and pocket PHD books.
I see a master plan here.
Let's keep in mind that patents are in place to keep lawyers employed and keep them litigating. -CatGrep
This sheds new light on the old "look left, look right, look left again" rule when crossing the street: In quantum, by looking at the cars, you can affect their positions!
Doesn't apply to me (I tried, nearly got run over). Maybe it works if you're blond...?
“Our opponent is an alien starship packed with nuclear bombs. We have a protractor.” — Neal Stepnenso
I guess this also makes for the largest act of masochism as well. Does it really make sense to do something so heartless to get their point across? And I thought that the mass deforestation done to protest the WTO in Seattle was bad.
Anyways, what will this accomplish? It seems to me like this will detract from their point, almost as if it's a lighthearted, happy little protest.
Until Slashdot fixes the funny modifier, use insightful or interesting. The poster knows your intentions.
Are they selling tickets or is it first come, first serve? Maybe they'll have it on pay-per-view.
I think I think, therefore I think I am.
...since we don't have an infinite improbablity drive, or a bistro computer, maybe we can harness the time bending properties of physics lectures for space and time travel?
Maybe I am way off in thinking from the status quo, but I believe universities have a responsibility to inspire students, not just "sell a product". I believe this because what happens to people during their college time effects all of society, not just the student. The imagination and creativity of these graduates will determine how much we advance with space exploration, computers, and all sorts of technologies. These new graduates just have to dream it. Just look at the past 40 years, and what graduates have accomplished. Good for the physics faculty to have this lecture marithon. I bet they will be helping themselves recruit more students.
Rosco: "If brains were gunpowder, Enos couldn't blow his nose."
I would love to have the oppertunity to watch lectures on pay-per-view. I bet it might even be cheaper per lesson than to pay for the course. Plus, you could watch it while in your pajama's.
Rosco: "If brains were gunpowder, Enos couldn't blow his nose."
Students in Germany are ridiculous...
1) They get their entire education paid for FREE.
2) While studying they get retirement contributions paid for them by the government.
3) They can take their education as long as they would like. For example if it takes a student 20 years then it takes 20 years all the while the German taxpayer is funding the student.
What they are now trying to do is take away the retirement rights and make them pay a small fee. WELL GEE WHIZ welcome to the real world. Oh I forgot the German Students do not know what the real world is. I was born and am a German citzen, but was educated in Canada and the US. Places where you had to actually study and work...
Oh wait let me cry my croc tears....
"You can't make a race horse of a pig"
"No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
1.) Here in Germany, higher education comes mostly for free, including attending University. This is paid for by state taxes, mostly.
2.) There is a huge financial crunch in local communities and the states (Laender), of which Berlin is one, due to prolonged blissful ignorance of reality (tax revenue down) in crazy public spending. Berlin is one of the worst candidates with huge debt, kind of like CA in the US, even suing federal gvt. to bail them out and unfortunately winning.
3.) Berlin has three full universities plus N colleges and such, sucking up money.
4.) what's an avg. politician to do? Slash university funding big style, amongst other things, potentially closing one of them down for good
5.) what's a university student to do? go on strike (IMO not very creative either, but I digress....) and generally raise awareness that higher education is worth its money.
6.) what's a prof to do? help students out (after all they're in the same boat), by e.g. holding a 3 day continuous physics lecture in the middle of Berlin, for everybody to attend.
That's why they're doing it. If you or I agree with it, is another question...
Everyone's looking at this like it's some crazy publicity stunt to do physics for every waking hour for 3 days. Maybe so, but for those of us who are in physics, this isn't any big deal. I've gone for months at a time thinking about physics every minute I was awake (and losing sleep to it too). Would this have been reported as big news if it were 3 days of biology lectures, I wonder? What about art history?
All I remember from my first-year physics lectures is how they made my neck hurt... well, either that or my knees hurt. There was simply no way to sleep comfortably there, though the professors voice sure made it easier.
we come in peace / shoot to kill
are the apparent showing of pornography the 12 hours before the lecture begins and the 12 hours after it ends. If you look at the schedule, you'll note in those time slots, it does say XXX. :)
This comment is printed on 100% recycled electrons.
I am seeing a similar series of events in Hong Kong. We have seven (7) universities here serving a population of 7.5 million people. The govt is having the biggest ever deficit partly due to the economic downturn, partly due to expanded public spending.
We are getting round to step 4 and 5 recently, too bad our professors are probably not creative enough to try step 6.
Oliver.
Slashdot editors are scraping the barrel's bottom.
Hey, this seems like the perfect place to try to verify an old bit of physics lore that I only vaguely recall. Maybe a native German speaker (or physics lore collectors) can verify it, or shoot it full of holes.
The story as I recall it, describes a brilliant but eccentric German physics lecturer. It described an antiquated German grammar structure, now obsolete, but still used by this lecturer due to his advanced age. It was described as "pushing and popping the stack," each sentence was left incomplete, quickly shifting to a new sentence fragment, but omitting all the verbs. Each time you came to the place where the verb belonged, you just "pushed" it onto your mental stack, and moved on to the next sentence. Then when you got to the conclusion, you'd "pop" all those verbs off the stack and speak the sentence endings in order. So hypothetically it might go something like this:
Mary little lamb, fleece white as snow, everywhere Mary, the lamb; had, was, went, sure to go.
Now I never heard anything so preposterous in my life. That was, UNTIL I read the rest of the anecdote about this lecturer. Apparently he was prone to using run-on sentences that would last nearly half an hour, which he only realized as the allotted time for the lecture was coming to a close. As the story told it, students would listen to the first half-hour of the run-on sentence, baffled by most of what he was saying, and not taking many notes because none of the sentences were complete or even sensible. Then near the end of the lecture, he'd suddenly have to wrap things up so he'd just spit out 15 minutes worth of verbs, popping them off his stack in the correct order, and all the students would frantically try to copy them all down in their notes, moving backwards from the bottom to the top of the pages, to fill in all the gaps in the notes.
I don't speak German so I don't have any evidence pro or con about this grammar structure. And I'm skeptical because it would take a genius to remember the last 30 minutes of your extemporaneous lecturing, let alone all those verbs you used in the correct order. But it wouldn't be completely implausible since the German physicists of that era were some of the greatest minds of all time. The story seemed to be told out of respect for his prodigious feat of eccentric speechmaking, as much as it was told as poking fun at the absentminded idiot-savant professor.
So does this story sound like complete B.S.? Or is it vaguely plausible, if someone straightens out the errors I probably made due to it being about 25 years since I heard this? And if anyone else has heard this anecdote, would you happen to know just WHO it was?
I'm sure most students don't realize that when they're still in university and many will never for the rest of their lives, but having lived and worked in differeny countries with the full range from completely free over subsidized to fully-paid education, I can assure you it's well worth it.
This discussion could fill pages, but e.g. young Americans are sent off into real life with a huge debt to society, which promotes a fight-against-each-other mentality and greed. It's like putting someone in a corner telling them that they are guilty and having to prove they are innocent. To make proud, responsible and social minded citizens with self-esteem, you have to do the contrary and provide some up-front trust and encouragement.
This comment is printed on 100% recycled electrons.
There is also something wrong with the idea that if someone comes out the right vagiana then they everything for free, while others have to struggle for the same oppertunity. Isn't education something everyone has a right to? It is the only thing I can think of which by itself can take a person and improve their quality of life, their job, the amount of money they make, and their happiness.
Rosco: "If brains were gunpowder, Enos couldn't blow his nose."
In Australia, university students are required to join the student union on enrolment in any course at a tertiary institution. The union can thus choose to take action on behalf of the students in exactly the same way as any other workers union.
So even though students are not paid to attend university, their union has legally the same weight as all other trade unions.
In my city the local representatives have been active organising various protests against proposed government regulation changes (effectively govt. wants to reduce spending on education and force universities to obtain funding through research avenues AND raise student fees - in Australia we have a deferred payment scheme called HECS that partially offsets tuition fees).
Some of the recent protests have been a day strike, culminating in a lunchtime rally, storming the state Parliament house. How effective? Who knows but the proposed reform bill has been stymied.
.. that subsidised beer won't drink itself, you insensitive clod.
There are students that study twenty years... These are called never ending students.
The problem with free education is that people abuse the system. Not a little bit, but a whole lot. The idea should not be free education, but education where you pay a bit. Not so much that it is impossible to attend, but enough to make sure people will treat it with respect. For those that do not have the money to attend the government then kicks in the rest.
Also flawed in Germany is the argument that everybody MUST get a higher education. For example in most places on this planet you get to study if your grades are good enough. I know Germany has this "feature" where regardless of how good your grades are you get a place to study. This is a huge drag on the system as there is no competition and no assurances that the student will spend any effort to study.
Your argument about taxing more is flawed. Why should higher income people be taxed more? Lets take the example of people who apprenticed and make a good income. Or how about entrepeneurs that build businesses did not study, and hire the "higher level educated"? They would be taxed extra so that other people could get an education for free? Or how about those that went to other countries? Remember these days there are many immigrants everywhere!
"You can't make a race horse of a pig"
"No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
While they might know their basics, are they doing anything with that?
u ssions/comp-ed.html. BTW This is a German website who wrote this.
Consider the following URL: http://www.rvs.uni-bielefeld.de/publications/Disc
Scroll down to the bottom and look at how Germany manages its education. Not pretty and clearly designed to be abused...
For example catch the statement people enter higher level schooling at 19-20 and leave at 25-30. Geewhiz what are they doing for all that time?
"You can't make a race horse of a pig"
"No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
This is BS. People who claim to have no money for education simply do not want to get educated. Plain and simple. They may be bright, etc., but they're not meant for school.
I've seen people work full time AND get a college education. In fact, that's why most colleges have 'part-time' students.
The reason I'm a bit more than upset is because I had to go through all the crap of working and going to school too, and it's not so bad! If I can do it, anyone can. I had no savings, no extra money coming from 'family', nothing. zip.
Simply saying "oh, work doesn't leave much time for school" is just taking the easy way out. No! If you want to succeed, you gotta make the time. As as you pointed out, work is repetitive, and most people don't realize that 'oh, it was 10 years ago - oh, crap, I've been at this shitty job for 10 years!'. School is one of the things that gets you to succeed in life - IT IS more important than that shitty job.
I work at 3 jobs and attend school full time. I got a bachelors and a masters, and going for a phd. all this time, I'm working probably more than most full time workers.
I view quitting college to persue the $10/h 'career' (or dropping out of high school for that matter) is the most stupid thing that anyone can possibly to do screw up their life (sort of like taking drugs, only worse).
(sorry, just had to vent a bit...)
"If anything can go wrong, it will." - Murphy
It's mentioned on page 130 of Goedel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid..
"The proverbial German phenomenon of the "verb-at-the-end", about which droll tales of absent-minded professors who would begin a sentence, ramble on for an entire lecture, and then finish up by rattling off a string of verbs by which their audience, for whom the stack had long since lost its coherance, would be totally nonplussed, are told, is an excellent example of linguistic pushing and popping. The confusion among the audience that out-of-order popping from from the stack onto which the professor's verbs had been pushed, is amusing to imagine, could engender."
I don't know. I have seen a lot of students who have had someone pay for them simply piss away their time at college because they had no desire themselves to be their. Those that really want an education will make it a priority and find a way.
Whats my point? That those friends of yours that dropped out because it was too difficult, might not have gotten very much out of college had they completed it.
But this has a close relationship with the breadth and depth of studies here and in the US. I got my bachelors (Computer Science) in Spain, with one year in the University of California, and I realized the huge difference between what you learn in the two systems.
On average, a Spanish student takes 6 courses each semester, during 5 years minimum, which makes around 300 units (one unit=ten hours of class) to finish, while at least in U. California, the average is 12 units per quarter, which makes 12*3*4years=144 units.
You could argue that the homework workload is lower in Europe, but my personal experience is that in the US this is much lower. That's why I had so much fun when I came. That's why now I'm a graduate student at UCI :).
Where do you live?
I have never understood this arguement about people not having the money for a good education. As far as I know, federal student loans are automatically available in the US to all full-time university students pursuing a degree.
I went to a state university, and my student loan paid for all my tuition plus enough money to live on (I still worked during the summers to save some extra cash for the school year). So I had plenty of time to study and made good grades. My first year after college I earned about double what I owed in loans.
One of my good friends worked during university and never had time to study. He was afraid loans would put him into bad debt. I think his grades were still pretty good, but I have a better job, and I sure as hell had more fun in college.
Maybe there are some restriction I am unaware of about availability of student loans, but it was my understanding that anyone accepted to a US university is elligible. In fact, low income students sometimes receive grants instead of loans. Your parent's ability to pay really shouldn't keep anyone out of college.
Bullshit.
I have 0$. Nothing, nada, zip, zilch.
Guess what? I'm in college.
Everything is paid for on federal loans, grants, and scholarships.
Those smart people must not have been that smart if they couldn't do the same. Yeah, I'm gonna graduate 30 grand in debt, but I'll pay it back sooner or later.
Kids these days just don't understand that the true point of university is to explore your alcoholic limits and avoid working for 3 years.
When I am king, you will be first against the wall.
I happened to be in Berlin last Saturday. Here's a photo of the Humboldt university on Unter den Linden as it looks now, during the protests.
i don't know about longest lecture, but i just left a two hour lecture which seemed to include some sort of time dialation as the guest lecturer managed to fit about 10 lectures worth of material in there.
Our heads were spinning and it wasn't just from all the coffee!
Wasn't he famous for giving lectures to an empty room?
that is awesome. i am in awe of their ability to talk about absolutely nothing. :-)
/me is glad for physics 'cause it makes
/me thinks because
...
:)
;)
...
working at a 10-12 dollar job so much
more interessting. thinking about
maxwell/magnetism/periodic tabel/etc.
will mopping da floor is fun.
and: if you really want to know you
can still buy a book and do some
learning on your own. many a inventions
where made by people not rich and
with no, poor-education and they did
this not for money but
they where genuinly interessed. that
there might be something that hasn't been
thought or done facinated these people.
and as history shows us, there definetly
aren't alot of people like that in
the world
it's more or less simple to grasp
physical laws etc. and being able
to voice this "knowledge" to other
people but infinetly more difficult
to make a new connection or integration
in a field.
and it seems people who don't go thru
an university "gleichschaltungs" process
tend to have an edge in perciving nuances
in the world 'cause they haven't been
subdued to look a the world in "this-way-
and-this-way-only".
anyway a marathon lecture sounds cool.
and state savings on education will
backfire. prolly not in germany since
they're all smart anyway
i'd prolly be in classe on
montag 16-18 uhr
dienstag 14-16 uhr
dienstag 20-22 uhr
but the beach am at^2 the moment is soo
much more interessting
anyway classes on algorithems/fractals should be
given at the beach me thinks
American students get tuition raise after tuition raise, and they do nothing. Same thing for American workers--we just bend over and take it. But Europeans know how to organize and act together. That is why they have taken their countries to a place beyond what America is or may ever be. They have free or low cost universities. American students have to go into debt $20K even for a public school education.
American workers now work more hours per year than any other country, and our pay just keeps going down.
Brainwashed and politically isolated by the media, we are each like baby wildebeest stranded midstream in an African river, while the investors, business owners and corporations feast on our carcasses.....
eat shiat and bark at the moon
of time/space/stuff that matters/energy?
/. putting stuff that matters into future storIEs? (Score:-1, Troll)
creators, although frequent targets, do no evile (Score:-1, Offtopic)
by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 04, @07:04AM (#7627185)
not yOUR creators anyway.
as with the pateNTdead eyecon0meter kode, the creators' newclear power, & planet/population rescue initiatives/mandates are unbreakable, & wwwork on several (more than 3) dimensions. it's a real nightmare for those involved in unprecedented evile
previously postdead:
hear/see/speak no evile? (Score:mynuts won, what's the hurry?)
by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 03, @05:44AM (#7616889)
that's what we'd tell 'em, adding, 'sell' no evile, which goes without saying?
we're a little suspicious of that miguel guise (& a few others, tell 'em robbIE) motives. but as monIEsucking becomes more&more 'stylish' in the 'community', sort of like corn passing through a bird's butt.
despite the fud0cide depicted buy the phonIE ?pr? ?firm? hypenosys of the fauxking corepirate nazi payper liesense softwar gangster stock markup FraUD execrable, the gnu millennium is well underway.
creators want compensation for planet abuse/damage? (Score:mynuts won)
by Anonymous Coward on Friday November 28, @06:57AM (#7581317)
not really? they just want US to stop wrecking it/killing innocents.
they're not just kidding about that.
you won't be needing any 5000$ hdtv either, or even a model rocket cam, to be able to sense the direction of the wwwinds of change, which are bullowing at gale force/farce.
even more to be thankful about? (Score:mynuts won, don't mention the monIE)
by Anonymous Coward on Sunday November 30, @12:01PM (#7592801)
just kidding?
see also: stuff that really matters/chips ahoya @ a dime # dozen?
eating it/at all? (Score:-1, Troll)
by Anonymous Coward on Sunday November 30, @10:02AM (#7592314)
?eating? in 3rd wwworld countries, for example
score: mynuts won, nothing to buy here?
Posted by CmdrTaco on Sunday November 30, @09:13AM
from the tang-makes-me-ill (how annoying that must be for us, & the folks over at tang.com?) dept.
morons write "What do you think babies aboard the ?other? side of the planet had for Thanksgiving? Roasted turkey? Wrong answer. In "less fortunate" areas, the pateNTdead eyecon0meter tells us, they had little of nothing, and gives details about space in their little bodies, where food ought to be. If the dining view, 200 miles of rough road, is unattractive, preparing 'meals' is even more so. For example, there is no food, so the babies must remain hungry for long periods at +- room temperature. And you need to avoid thinking about this scenario. The real 'stuff that matters' overview contains additional references, and includes directions by the creators, for their/yOUR newclear power, & planet/population rescue initiatives/mandates.
( Read More... | that makes sense )
consult with/trust in yOUR creators... the lights are coming up now in order to assist in the avoidance of overheating the main processor, &, facilitation of the aforementioned ncp/ppr programs/mandates.
for each of the creators' innocents harmed, there is a badtoll that must/will be repaid by you/US, as the execrabilious corepirate nazi perpetraitors of the life0cide against the creators innocents, will not be available to make reparations.
see you there? tell 'em robbIE?
Resume:
http://hemmerling.free.fr/html/cv.en/cvus.html
Main site:
http://www.hemmerling.com
I guess that means if they can't find dates they'll be watching pr0n?
If you can read this sig - the bitch fell off.
I believe what you're referring to must be Schachtelsatze, or "nested sentences", which indeed is a (quite obsolete) rhetorical style in german.
It's not used much, and if it is, it's generally in literature. Probably 95% of its useage is simply to show off, I'd assume.
It works basically more or less like this: you start a sentence, and at some word, where you'd like to add additional information about it, you start a subclause. In that one, you can do the same again. Effectively, you're embedding sentences within sentences. Since in German, the verb often comes at the end, once you're through, you must clean up by adding all the verbs at the end. So it's a bit like pushing and popping indeed.
An artificial, exaggerated example was taken from here:
german:
Schon immer mal wollte ich einen Satz, der zwar grammatikalisch richtig gebildet, jedoch durch die Anfugung von Nebensatzen, die durch ein Komma, welches das Verb bzw. das Hilfsverb, das dieserart jeweils erst nach dem Schachtelsatz, der eigentlich den Zusammenhang, der ebenfalls im Nebensatz, der kurz vor dem Verb, welches das Satzende, das das Verb bzw. das Hilfsverb, das durch das bereits genannte Komma, das ja die Nebensatze, die eingeschachtelt worden sind, abschachtelt, ineinander verschachtelt wurde, endlich bringt, wieder entschachtelt, verschachtelt worden ist, erklart wird, erklaren sollte, genannt wird, somit einschachtelt, getrennt werden, verschachtelt wird, ist, formulieren.
english, (almost) german word order:
I always wanted a sentence, which however gramatically corrently formed, but through the addition of subclauses, that are with a comma, which the verb or the auxiliary verb, which in this way each time only after the nested clause, that actually the context, that also in the subclause, that shortly before the verb, which the end of sentence, which the verb or the auxiliary verb, which through the previously mentioned comma, which now the the subclauses, which have been nested, nests in, has been nested in each other, finally mentions, de-nests again, has been nested in, is explained, should explain, is mentioned, therefore nests in, are separated, is nested in, is, to formulate.
english, understandable (sort-of):
I always wanted to formulate a sentence, that is formed gramatically correct, but that is nested in through the addition of subclauses. These subclauses are separated by a comma, which nests in the verb or auxiliary verb, which then gets only mentioned after the nested clause. The nested clause should explain the context, which also is explained in the subclause that has been nested in shortly before the verb, which de-nests (the sentence) again before the end of the sentence. The subclause thus relates to the verb or auxiliary verb.
The verb nests sentences through the use of a comma, which marks the nesting of the subclauses that were nested in.
Hope that helps or at least doesn't confuse more than before...
In Soviet Russia, when on strike, Professors teach for three days straight?
It was about time dilation.
That's a broad generalization based on your personal experiences.
You're seem very proud of your accomplishments, but that doesn't mean you can look down on your peers who haven't accomplished the same.
Count yourself lucky that you were able to find the jobs to suit your education, lucky that you're in strong enough health to work those hours and study.
And don't forget... it may or may not be your case, but I've heard your argument before... even if you had no money coming from your family, there's a huge difference between that and not having a family to fall back on.
Most irritating is when I hear your argument from people who were raised in large, relatively affluent families where the whole family has a university education. Typically, the person making the argument is not eligable for student loans or grants because their family is too affluent on paper to qualify for loans, however the family's money has been tied up in various investments, such as their primary home or the cottage. They then discount the advantage that their parent's contacts had in putting them into a position where they could get three jobs, when their friends couldn't get one, having the nerve to tell their peers "I could do it, why can't you?"
Of course that may not be the case for you...
Schoell (DO) quantum mechanics for pedestrians
Are we going to hear something like the following:
"If you need to cross a busy street with cars going in both directions, go to a spot where the cars' wavefunctions form a standing wave. Then you can cross safely at the nodes, since the probability of any car being there will be very low."
Tution here at Queens (in ontario, canada) has been rising here for engineering. Engineering got deregulated a little bit ago and they've been jacking it up since. A tuition freeze is on the horizon but last I heard from the dean.. if the freeze happens they have to cut 34 programs (probably tech electives) across all of engineering. Go shooting yourself in the foot. I really wanted to take mine 220 explosives.
You're seem very proud of your accomplishments, but that doesn't mean you can look down on your peers who haven't accomplished the same.
Of course he can.
Now, the question is whether we want to force everyone to go through the large amount of work that he did.
May we never see th
if you are in Darmstadt, drop by at a continous strike lecture series from Monday to Friday as well, more information is at http://www.bildung-nonstop.de/
Greetings, Alech
The average slashdotter will die painfully from even one hour of art history lectures. Physics, on the other hand, we could listen to for a long time.
I knocked up my wife (then girlfriend) 3 months before HS graduation. I supported her and 1 then 2 children through 6 years of college. The wife didn't work outside of the home. I had very little outside help. I did have federal and state grants and loans. I went to an urban university and there were plenty of other students in a simliar situation.
I finished my degree (with a 2nd major - magna cum laude) by working hard (19, 21, & 20 hours the last 3 semesters), sacrificing sleep and leasure, and maintaining a vision of what I wanted my life to look like in 10 years. If guys like me can excell in college and support a family, there is no excuse for a single person to quit school because they can not afford it. If you want a college education in America you can get one. Period.
Simple people talk of people, better people talk of events, great people talk of ideas.
A physics leacture that last for Days, Just think of all the paper planes :-D
in my life God comes first.... but Linux is pretty high after that
Francis Smit
Shhh!! Don't let everyone else into the sekrit Kucinich Kabal. Don't forget to meetup in the streets outside the next WTO or G7 meeting. Wear all black and bring golf balls.
Who do you get to be an expert to tell you something's not obvious? The least insightful person you can find? -J Roberts
If a reduction in budgets cause the professers to give 3-day lectures, maybe if the Universities ELIMINATED the budgets the professors would teach all year!
Sounds like everyone wins.
-Styopa
Same here. I went to a (highly rated) state school instead of an Ivy League college, but I can prove to employers that I have a bachelors in computer science. And despite the grandparent's naysaying, I worked 40 hours the whole time. Yep, literally. I spent the first two years as a night auditor in a motel, which was perfect for someone who wants to do homework while getting paid and without a lot of distractions. After that, I got a job at an ISP and started working toward a career in telecommunications - while still going to school full-time.
Was it easy? No way. But four years after I started, I had a diploma and moved on to better-paying jobs. If I hadn't been going to school, I'd proabably still be working night shift at a motel.
Don't settle for excuses. You can go to school even if you don't have a lot of money. My degree cost about $16,000, and I made that up in higher salary within a year of graduation. Best of all, because of the few years of hard work, I get to go to my office every day to do something that I absolutely love. How many people can say that?
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
Karma, what is it good for, absolutely nothing!
-- Probability does not dismiss possibility --
And I thought I had trouble staying awake for my one hour class.
Ugh...physics...no thanks.
Observation :- In every country that has started requiring the student to also pay for their tertiary education, instead of only meeting an educational standard, the quality of that education has declined. The educational institution feels some obligation to provide the degree to the student because they "paid" for it.
- AndrewN
Not quite, if I were to study mathematics and were to flunk a course, I could still study economics or business even though these include courses in algebra, finance mathematics and statistics. So, while it may apply to engineering or computer science, it wouldn't apply to other courses containing math lectures. And yes, flunking one single part of a degree program twice (sometimes thrice) means that you can't study this program in Germany anymore.
Furthermore, the "Hochschulreife" you mention, usually acquired through the Abitur (or High School Diploma in US, Baccaleaureat in France, but don't hit me for spelling), is not the only way to get higher education in Germany. There are three ways I can think of to get it:
1. Abitur, which means that you could study at every public and private University, Fachhochschule (University for Applied Sciences, Polytechs) and Berufsakademie (professional academy) provided that you meet the entry requirements (NC, special tests, portfolio evidence for arts and architecture).
2. Without Abitur, you can still qualify through apprenticeships and further education in a specific field that would let you study at some Fachhochschulen and Berufsakademien.
3. Obtain a first degree at a foreign university and continue in Germany.
Your degree will state where you got it:
Dipl. Ing. - University
Dipl. Ing. (FH) - Fachhochschule
Dipl. Ing. (BA) - Berufsakademie
In my own experience, Fachhochschulen and Berufsakademien are usually not any worse than normal university education and are sometimes better regarded by some. E.g. the reputation of the TFH Berlin is much better than the other Berlin universities in architecture.
Nevertheless, the point SerpentMage was making was flawed on a number of issues:
Higher education in Germany is not free, we pay for it through the tax system. Berufsakademien and private universities charge you.
Nowhere does it say that you MUST study. Though this might be a socially induced phenomenon.
I feel so sig.
This would be an student insomniac's dream come true!
Socializing with students is not a necessary part of college.
Engineering and the Ultimate
Ummm....yeah...did you get that memo?
eat shiat and bark at the moon
I'm betting if they invited David Hasselhoff as a guest lecturer the strike would be that much more effective.
'cuz we all know: Germans love David Hasselhoff.
I have a second sig, I call it sig#2.
...when professors join the action.
"American students have to go into debt $20K even for a public school education."
Huh? I went to a public university. I lived 'at home' to reduce costs. I worked part-time. I graduated debt-free.
I would mod you up if I had any points :)
But when I did my first maths exam (I'm studying physics) I was told that if I fluke that 2x, I wouldn't be able to study another program that requires this particular maths exam (Higher Mathematics I-III). That covered chemistry, biology and several other programs. I could however study mathematics and then afterwards switch back to physics...
thats just a sidenote, perhaps the guys at the Prufungsamt were totally wrong :)
I'm sure the first note is already available on kazaa
IMHO a High School Diploma has a lower rank than Abitur or any other European "You can now go to university" diploma, but that is certainly a matter of opinion. OTOH most Americans do get it and can go to any College that takes them, and then get a PhD in some phoney art while downloading Gigz of Pr0n and playing Counterstrike non-stop - when not on Spring Break. Weren't us Germans supposed to get the easy end?
Lars T.
To the guy who modded me down from perfect to terrible Karma - Apple haters still suck
Basic education is a right. After that, you're on your own.
The United States was one of the first countries to implement universal primary education. We have a long tradition of supporting and funding free education - through high school. That has traditionally been the amount of education considered necessary for an informed citizenry. Maybe high school is a joke today - but if so, it would be more appropriate to reform the high school curriculum. While the body of knowledge has increased, the basics needed to participate in society should still be covered by high school.
Every state also has a public college system that is (usually) heavily subsidized by the government. Many people do choose to go to public colleges because they are more affordable.
Now, even private colleges have some amount of indirect government funding. Most major schools claim to meet all "demonstrated financial need". What this means is that they apply a government-determined formula that purports to calculate how much of the tuition you (and by extention your parents) can afford to pay based on income and savings. The remainder of the cost is covered by a combination of low- or deferred-interest loans, work-study, or federal grants. While this is far from a perfect system, it does seem to simultaneously allow any sufficiently talented student to obtain a college education, while not socializing private schools or sacrificing intellectual independence to government control.
And don't forget, universities are a limited resource. It isn't as if enrollment is limited by affordability - most schools have full enrollment. Cost isn't a major factor in keeping people away.
Oh, I'm not too sure of that. I graduated from a private university a year and a half ago, debt free, thanks to a combination of scholarships and working summers. If I went to a public school, I could've gotten scholarships to pay for room and board as well as tuition.
The United States is still one of the easier countries in which to create a new idea and run with it. We do have a longer work-week than many countries; and we have private health care, universities, etc. But that also means that we have lower taxes, higher productivity, and less regulation. Don't like where you work? Fine. Start your own business. It's hard work, but it's still possible.
That's not to say that a lot of things aren't messed up, but the lot of the "American worker" or "American student" really isn't that bad.
What I don't get is: how does this constitute a strike? Like yes, they're doing something weird, and that's getting the media to pay attention to their plight. But when only one of the faculty and the students goes on strike, the idea is that the delivery of the education-as-product is being disrupted.
If the students and the faculty protest by holding lectures in a public place instead of university property, then all they're doing is lowering the university's maintenance costs. And if the government is paying attention, then they'll just lower the university's budget an appropriate amount to maintain the public space where lectures are being held. In the end, education becomes more free without the government spending anything.
Oh, no, I've never looked down upon anyone. I know what it is to not be able to afford things. (in fact, I think the spoiled brats are the ones who usually don't go to higher education.)
(I actually try to encourage as many people as possible to stay in school, etc., learn, etc.)
Yet I can't feel sorry for someone who drops out of high school, has a family, seemingly enough money to take care of themselves (if you can buy luxurious items, you got money), and then a few years later complain that they're working day-in and day-out at some supermarket. One kid I know who was financially needy joined the army; hey, anything that gets him out of the supermarket job.
Or what about those folks who buy an expensive car when they're in high school (on who knows what money), then never go to college (because they're to cool for that?) and then 10 years later I see'em working at a gas station.
I know what you're saying, that there are those in the society who WANT to go to college, and actually would go if only they had the resources. Yes, there are those, but the vast majority of the people I've encountered without a college education didn't get it because of their own stupidity - they think they'll be 18 forever, and just sort of never got around to mailing that admissions application, and now that they're 30 and got a kid to support, education is no longer an option.
"If anything can go wrong, it will." - Murphy