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eBay Fraud Vigilantes
firstadopter.com writes "New York Times (free registration needed) is reporting that users are sick of internet fraud on eBay. With lack of help from the company, they are taking the law into their own hands and closing down auctions they think are obvious scams."
Reg Free Link
POWER TO THE PEOPLE!
...and I couldn't find any "Viglanties".
I did get a super deal on my new compter, though.
Really now. We have been complaining for years now. Google News has been around for quite a long time and they have registration free links to it.
How hard is it to include them in the article summary? This smacks of total unprofessionalism.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item =2795846600&category=52476
***Please note, this auction is not selling the electronics themselves,we're selling electronic book packages that get you listed on a revolving list at our website. For list information and any other questions please visit our webpage @ www.revbuys.com--$220.00
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item =2795844320&category=52476
**You are not buying the actual item, you are buying a link to a website where you can obtain the item for around a $250 US dollars. Link also includes lots of other good deals on nice electronics** $5.00
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item =2795281687&category=52476
Please Read Auction Carefully. Winner will recieve information on where they can buy an Alienware Area-51 Extreme for only 275$. This is perfectly legal and I am usuing mine right now. Only one Alienware 275$ computer per household, so you can see why I am not selling the computers, but I am working on that.--$49.99
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item =2795708246&category=40176
Please Read Description Carefully Before You Bid! you are not buying any electronics in this auction. Here are some examples of the amazing deals you will get upon winning this auction:
Products:
JL Audio 10w7 Subwoofer: $100
Sony DVD/CD Changer: $100
Sony Motorized indash 7" LCD: $100
Exhaust Systems from $50
NOS Kits: $100
Body Kits: $100
Playstation 2: $40
Video Games: $20
Gateway 42" Plasma TV: $200
Sony DVD Dream Surround System: $100
Sony Digital Camcorder: $100
40GB Apple iPod: $115
Compaq iPaq PDA: $50
Panasonic Portable DVD Player: $50
Alienware Desktop or Laptop: $275
Sony VIAO Desktop: $150
Sony VIAO Laptop: $100
AND MANY MANY MANY MORE!!!!
Shipping is absolutely free!, If you have any questions, please feel free to email us at http://TankDoggSC@aol.com $3.00
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item =2795726979&category=52476
The item for sale isnt the real PC.the highest bidder will recieve the link to the site where you can purchase it for 160/275$.WHOEVER SAID ''THIS ISNT A REAL PC JUST A BUNCH OF LINKS'' MEANS THEY DID NOT READ THIS. $5.50-6 bids
C:\>
Following is my opinion only:
Don't use paypal's "withdraw from bank account" option. Use the credit card option. If something goes wrong and you go past 30 days - your are screwed. My experience is that Paypal (an ebay company) is the worst in getting problems resolved.
www.paypalsucks.com
About time somebody did something useful. Not like eBay has done anything. With problems like this running rampant over eBay, I wonder what kind of future the company has. Many users are already abandoning the service in favor of other means of purchase. I think people have realized that eBay, with scams, high shipping costs, and long waiting periods before getting a product, is often more expensive and less convenient than just purchasing the product at the store.
Every windows user is a sadomasochist.
this just blows my mind man... I was looking for someplace to report those just a few minutes ago
...but more often than not, it's the banks that are watching out for suspicious things. The one time someone tried to pay me with stolen credit cards, it was the bank that alerted me (thankfully before I sent the laptop).
Really, what should be happening is that eBay should cooperate as much as possible with the banks/credit companies, and that would take care of a lot of fraud then and there.
libertarianswag.com
Oh come on, this link doesn't even point to the full New York Times article. There's a better link posted before this one by a person who isn't trying to karma whore.
Karma: Meh (Mostly from meh.)
...the clever people who've sold things like "genuine air guitars" and "nothing".
Half the fun of e-bay is the really bizarre stuff.
The Dalai Llama .sig available for purchase: $100,000 USD -ebay auction #66666. Buyer pays shipping from Andorra.
This
My sig could be your sig!
How are these scams? They are up front about what they are selling, information.
the advertising is a little misleading, but that can be said about any advertising for almost anything. when was the last time you ate a burger that looked as good as it did in the adverts (or saw a girl that looked like an advert girl for that matter)
This is more in the category of preying on the hopelessly gullible and exploiting their stupidity, rather than scam. Less like nigerian 419, more like religion.
I agree wholeheartedly that ebay should be doing more to stop the scams. However, it is the companies decision to make their own descisions however smart or stupid. I would appreciate it if ebay had moderators, but just because they don't, does that really mean the users should be shutting down auctions?
Many forums have a link right on the post that allows reporting of improper material. Ebay could use this feature.
I've found questionable sales, usually someone asks me "Hey, look at the deal", but when I've looked for a way to report it. Zip nothing. They did not list any contact in safeharbour for this.
Hell, it took way too much time to find the link to report the phish emails I got last year.
Yes, it will mean more overhead, but that's what it's going to take if Ebay expects people to continue to use the site. Allowing a group of moderators that can flag obvious problems will help.
I hate to say it, but if you actually put your faith in such things as online auctions you shouldn't be suprised when you are scammed. I liken it to network administrators that run open relays because "we are behind corporate's network and firewalls", or the person that uses Outlook and wonders why he is infected with worms and viruses every month.
Once someone was selling a car headlight modification they didn't have. The way they were busted was rather unique-- they posted pictures (hosted off-site, of course) of a car that wasn't theirs.
The person who owned the site saw the traffic coming from the ebay page. He then proceeded to change the images to one insulting the scammer in a very something awful-esque way, and photoshopped eyes over the car headlights. It was hilarious-- anyone have a link to it?
---
Never criticize religion on Slashdot. You will be modded down for "Troll" no matter how factual it is.
You make a very fair point, but unfortunately the sites they link to are near always scams run by the people eBaying the links. Several times at work people have told me they're on a list to get x, y or z item cheaper than we are selling it - I enquire what site the list is on and type it into the browser only to find it's mysteriously disappeared off the web. Having said that, if the person selling it doesn't own the site in question then they are not in the wrong since they may earnestly belive that all of the people will recieve their items at 5% of retail value.
You're absolutely right. So they should have their items moved to a section dedicated to sales of information, not actual electronics, and label their auctions accordingly. If the information doesn't provide the user with the ability to get a cheap system like these listings claim, then I would submit that it is a scam.
the advertising is a little misleading, but that can be said about any advertising for almost anything.
Again, you have a good point. These listings, when you see the item titles and parts of the description, are very misleading.
when was the last time you ate a burger that looked as good as it did in the adverts (or saw a girl that looked like an advert girl for that matter)
I can't remember when I ate anything that was as good as the ads.
C:\>
A word to all looking to buy a Playstation 2, Game Boy Advance, or any other modern system: Make sure to check the description of the auction closely, many of these too-good-to-be-true auctions actually are. If they mention anything at all pertaining to instructions or wholesalers, AVOID IT ALLTOGETHER! I've been sucked into one of these auctions, which worded very vaguely that they 'work with a wholesaler to get you this at the lowest possible price', which was another way of saying 'we're giving you instructions on how you MIGHT get it at a lower price', which might not even be a lower price after what you paid on the auction.
Stop bidding on items from Andora and Romania. A little common sense goes a long way.
its usually pretty easy to spot: only takes western union, item is new in box for absurdly low price, eithe rmultiple auctions or a "private auction". You used to tell by low feed back but its getting so that can be a misleader. You send them an e-mail and it gets answered during romanian daylight hours.
My favorite gambit is to ask them some absurd question that makes no sense like is this the power book that had the DVI fibrulator? They will answer "yes". Ask them if they take paypal and they dont answer.
I have to say that for all the problems and accusations about pay-pal, it is a hallmark of an honest seller.
E-bay claims a low fraud rate, but I think that is on a per-sale basis (most fruads dont result in sales, and there are many many honest auctions for $1.99 baseball cards, etc...). On a per dollar basis I'd bet it looks bad for e-bay. And certainly if you restrict the search to high vlaue commondity items i'd bet they average around fifty percent. E-bay needs to get sued and sued hard for knowing letting this go on.
Some lawyer should go get a job ther coverty, find out what they do internally to prevent this, then sue the shit out of them for negligence.
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
I've been ripped off on ebay before, ebay did not help, paypal did not help - only my credit card company helped. I wish these guys would have saved my ass.
Take the law in your own hands!!!
OK, I happen to share that suspicion. Problem is, PayPal limits you to a $2K cumulative transaction total if you don't give them access to an account (which I won't do, at least not an account I use for anything else). How do you deal with that? I suppose one could close the account and open another, but I suspect their terms of use frown on that.
The only solution I can see is opening a special-purpose bank account for PayPal use only, and feeding it only what it needs for the transactions I authorize. Which is rather a lot of inconvenience for the convenience of one-click shopping...
"My strength is as the strength of ten men, for I am wired to the eyeballs on espresso."
I said it isn't really that way and that karma was going to catch up with him one of these days.
How true!
The reason people pay to use eBay rather than setup their own auction script on their web site is because eBay is providing a regulated marketplace, one where eBay makes the rules and enforces them to prevent fraudulent activities from affecting buyers and sellers.
If eBay can't get a grip on their fraud problems, then the door will be wide open for another marketplace to challenge them.
Here I was auctioning off evidence/information on whereabouts of WMDs in Iraq when people got all huffy and decided to shut it down. I nearly got some dude named Dubya bidding oodles of cash for the info but got shutdown before bidding was over.
Why can't you vigilantes just mind your own biz, damn it!!!
Yo, it's a joke -- no need to start a super-secret file on me.
About a year ago I still used Ebay but moved away from it. I found better deals new at local stores (go figure?). I got so tired of buying a DVD and it was a suspicious looking printed label in foreign languages products not quite as described showing up a few months latter.
r otection-program.html
But here is some rules that need to be implemented or followed by any buyer:
1) No credit accepted no thank you and that goes for PayPall too (don't ever link your bank account to any service including tanning salons)
2) AS IS - means it broke guaranteed (I wish I could filter these out)
3) For Me I buy USA - must be a person located in the US of A or no sale
4) Ebay's Fraud Protection is pitiful you're out 25 bucks from the start with a long wait. Ref http://pages.ebay.com/help/confidence/questions/p
5) Don't worry about letting an item go to a higher bidder - It isn't a challenge.
6) Ratings don't mean any thing when your out the money - there should be a better rating system (anyone think Slashdot could help there)
I have had to (more than once!) dispute a charge on a CC I used on PayPal because they were trying to screw me out of my money (or the product). The PayPal folks wouldn't return my calls or letters. I got a live body once and told them I was going to dispute the charges if they didn't stop trying to defraud me. They immediately transfered me to a guy that IMHO does nothing other than threaten to sue PayPal users if they threaten to dispute CC charges. I mean that's all he didn't. He knew nothing about the circumstances. He was just there to read me the riot act (from a script) about what they'd do if I disputed the charge. I told him just exactly what he could do with his business and called my CC company. The CC company credited me my $$ within a week and I never heard any more about it. Paypal, contrary to what many of the horror stories said, didn't freeze my account. It wouldn't surprise me if they did but they didn't to me at least. Always Always ALWAYS use a CC when paying via PayPal. In fact I don't have a valid checking account registered with them anymore. I closed that account nearly 8 months ago when I moved. They already verified the account and I'm not going to try and tell them otherwise. :)
eBay is financially rigged to favor the
auctioneer instead of the customer. As a
fee based system, they derive the bulk of
their income from these same auctioneers.
By joining eBay, the bidders relinquish
any right to sue, and the cap on any
arbitrated settlement is $200. PayPal
might be convenient, but they have next
to zero for security and auditing. A
close friend had their checking account
cleaned out by someone either at PayPal
or one of the auctioneers. I stopped
doing ANY business with eBay after getting
ripped off a few times in rapid succession.
Going on eBay is like walking in the barrio
streets of Rio De Janero with you wallet
hanging half-way out of your pocket. The
old adage "Buyer Beware" doesn't even
come close to the risks. Anyone that
would consider buying an automobile, let
alone a house, on eBay must be daft.
""New York Times (free registration needed) is reporting that users are sick of internet fraud on eBay. With lack of help from the company, they are taking the law into their own hands"
People taking the law into their own hands when traditional (socially acceptable) methods fail. Now were have we seen this before? I predict we will see much more of this, as our society breaks down. The "should know better" warring with the "don't give a damn about knowing better".
I'm still suprised that eBay lets this go on. Having things like this around where the whole purpose is to separate a sucker from his money implacts the reputation of the whole site.
There's a difference between stretching the truth and making statements that serve no purpose other than to mislead and confuse the consumers. Everyone knows that the burger they see on TV is going to be nicer than the one made by some stoned highschool kid working for minimum wage, but it's going to be essentially the same thing. If a 'real business' consistantly practiced the type of deception that these eBay guys are, they'd never be able to stay in business once word got out. Why is it different online?
my sig's at the bottom of the page.
One reason why people are able to place a $2.5 million bid to try to kill off an auction they think is fraudulent is that it doesn't cost anything to place a over-high bid on eBay.
Maybe eBay should set some threshholds at which point bids require a deposit in escrow in order to justify a large bid, money that is returned if the bid doesn't win, but is lost if the transaction doesn't close because its withdrawn while being the high bidder.
Recently bought a router, the seller shipped a hard drive to me by mistake. After emailing back and forth I sent the hd back, but no router. Seller stops responding to emails. So what happens when I fill out the Paypal form to try and get a refund?
They have an item asking if you received ANYTHING in the mail. So I checked that off. Bad mistake! They classified the report as "misrepresented item"!!!! Then a few days later closed the complaint saying they didn't do anything in those cases!
Paypal = SCAM CITY
Lesson: accept Paypal payments for expensive items and mail a jellybean to the buyer. Paypal will support you all the way.
I must admit that I also was the one to suffer from that. After a great deal on an expensive digital camera (Sony F717 :)) that went flawlessly I got too relaxed.
They got me with a road bike for 100 EUR + 50 for shipping and I bought it. It's been a month without the bike and any reply to the emails.
This article motivated me to go to the authorities to try to get the money back. This fraud was stupid enough to give me his bank acount and a postal address. Let's see what the police san do about it!
What I really can't stand about eBay are the loose requirements for being a registered user. All you need to sign up is a valid e-mail address .. no credit card, no verified address, no bank account.
This allows sellers to easily create shill bidders and buyers to hijack auctions with no intent of paying. All this fraud of course benefits ebay since they are only interested in listing and final value fees.
There is an eBay user summit on March 30 and I hope this issue gets hammered home to the top brass.
You mean that Paris Hilton action figure is a fraud!. People auctioning off their life, and those imginary girlfriends are frauds! I for one am shocked. And awed too
MoFscker
No, they are still in the wrong because they are listing the auction under electronic systems, and they are giving it the title "Brand new PS2 never opened!" and when you read it it lists the features of a PS2 and has pictures of one, but if you read the fine print you see they are ACTUALLY selling a link to a website.
ASCII stupid question, get a stupid ANSI
Heh... This reminds me of the Shopper's Edge memberships we'd try and get people into back when i worked in order entry for a mail-order company. Not technically illegal, but built on a foundation of getting people enrolled in a service presented as something other than what they were wanting or expecting.
The P.T. Barnum school of business has no shortage of graduates...
These are the latest variant on a pyramid scheme. Basically, people are paying today for a wait list for a product that will be delivered whenever the waiting list gets long enough to have enough money to buy your item. Early people on the list will in fact get their items, but as the list gets longer, the wait gets exponentially longer until the world runs out of fools to supply and the list stops growing. The people caught "below the line" when the scheme colapses end up paying to wait in a line that has stopped moving... they'll never get their stuff.
By the way, this was just a joke, no need to make an entry of me in the CIA's secret files.
I liked ebay when it was just people selling second hand items, businesses selling surplus etc. Ever since the ebay business model sprung to life ebay imho sucks. Sure they let something like a cell phone faceplate go for $2.00 that you would pay $15 for in the mall. ut then they hit you with a $8 to $10 s/h fee, and you get it in an envlope with 0.95 postage marked on it. They are just using the shipping and handling fee to insure their profit. And good luck if something is broken or incorrect when it comes back with these mega sellers of cheap crap, they glady will take the negative feedback point as it will be lost in the thousands of others were they didnt screw up. And the scams are unblievable. Instructions to build your own projection tv, wholesaler list. errr
Oh man,
You can't even hit up ebay for anything these days without getting billions of those.
Add the professional snipers, and Ebay wasn't what it used to be (well what did we expect ? heh)
Sunny Dubey
eBay could very easily design a "Click here if this looks bogus" button for registered users, and then place the auctions that are reported in a queue for moderator review, with additional trust given to those who have successfully reported violations in the past, and less value given to those who false report.
I'm sick and tired of this as well.
I've been buying and selling low-value items on eBay for some time with nothing but good results. It's fun.
The other day, I remembered an LP I found fascinating when I was a kid, called "Hearing is Believing." RCA put it out--I believe they gave it away for free--in the early fifties. It was an introduction to hi-fi. I suddenly "I'd get a kick out of hearing that again." I went on to eBay, there was a copy up for bid at a starting bid of $3.00, nobody else bid, I got it for $3.00 plus $3.50 shipping, and experienced a intense burst of pleasurable nostalgia at hearing it again.
Nobody can make a fortune scamming people $3 at a time, so most of the low-value weird junk items are legit. And if they aren't--so you're out a few dollars, who cares?
I won't say there are easy answers, but by far the largest number of horror stories seem to all be about one specific category: people that believe they can get new or practically new electronic gadgets for substantially below the new price. Indeed, no doubt you sometimes can, but that is the kind of item where the risk is high.
Of course, trading junk doesn't appeal to everyone, but I think it is one of eBay's highest and best uses.
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
Often times, these people who are auctioning "information" on how to acquire products for cheap are just banking on how lazy and stupid buyers are. Recently I was looking into buying the Zelda Collector's Disc for gamecube, since I purchased my cube too late to get it for free. Doing a quick google search for it, I found that I could get the disc as a free gift if I purhcased a one year subscription to Nintendo Power Magazine. It wasn't a bad deal, but I decided to see if E-Bay could do any better. Looking at the different auctions, I eventually came to one auction that had a price of $3.00 (where other auctions were going for more than $30. Looking at the auction, I saw that the guy was simply selling information on how to buy the game for $20 with no shipping and handling. It was insane to believe that he was getting money from people just to tell them to order Nintendo Power.
Calling the number gives you a guy (who sounds like he just woke up, or just smoked down) that says he's their answering service.
whois revbuys.com
Administrative Contact:
Doctor, Crazy hardcore_bpm@yahoo.com
p.o. box 9193
red bluff, California 96080
United States
5302004131
Technical Contact:
Doctor, Crazy hardcore_bpm@yahoo.com
p.o. box 9193
red bluff, California 96080
United States
5302004131
These are pyramid scam variants called matrix scams. You pay to get put on the list. When enough money is gathered by people on the list, the person at the top of the list gets the item, at a cost close to the actual selling price. Reeks as bad as any other pyramid scheme, just the parameters of the scam are different.
;)
The first link shown by the thread ancestor is a purchase to be put on one of these matrix lists. So in fact the user is basically trying a number of different methods to scam the person, either by directly putting them on the list through ebay, selling people links to the list through ebay, etc.
I hope you don't argue in return that pyramid schemes aren't a scam
....his Phantom console from them....;oPPP
1. No sig. 2. ???? 3. Profit!!!
A while ago some people were auctioning off CD's with all the cartoons from Homestar Runner on eBay. Some fans got pissed at the people selling the CD's and overbid them to millions of dollars. I've seen it happen to people trying to sell CD's of Penny Arcade strips as well.
The ones I love are the descriptions of old electrical items, phonographs, wire recorders, whatnot, that say "I haven't plugged it in" while vaguely implying that it sort of looks as if it ought to work.
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
Vigilanties usually don't fix a problem. They almost always make things worse. If one person is saying an auction is real and another says they are fake then who should you believe? The answer is no one, go other to Yahoo! Auctions or somewhere else.
E-bay will have to restructure and get rid of these fake auctions or die.
So which will it be e-Bay?
You say things that offend me and I can deal with it. Can you?
What about bootleg anime on eBay or half.com? They're often easy to spot, but I don't know what to do about them. Is there an effective way to report them?
This is more in the category of preying on the hopelessly gullible and exploiting their stupidity, rather than scam. Less like nigerian 419, more like religion.
Nigerian 419 scams are also preying on the hopelessly gullible and exploiting their stupidity. My apologies to anyone who fell for one, but really the amount of gullibility required to convince you that a total stranger is going to give you 30% of $30,000,000 dollars is exponentially greater than the amount of gullibility required to think you might get a Playstation 2 cheap in an auction.
Try this search:
ipod -"free ipod" -info
Seems to weed out 90% of the buggers.
Some of the schemes invlove selling of ebooks other are driven entirely like a pyramid with people entering at a low cost, below $50, and then relying on the "members" (fraud victims) marketing the scheme to get their goods.
Examples of schemes like this:
Electronicmatrix.com or Ezdeal4u.com
Melius mori in libertate quam vivere in servitute.
I spent over an hour yesterday trying to find a place to report a suspicious auction and got nowhere. Your idea is a very good one.
Most of the time, you'll find a better price in a regular eShop (hint: http://froogle.google.com/)
Back when the PS2 was due to be released people were selling PS2 boxes on eBay but making it look like the person was getting an actual PS2.
But I really do live in Andorra, you insensitive clod!
I dunno... $3 for the info plus another $20 for a mag subscription is still cheaper than buying the game for $30, right? I too missed out on the deal, and had i really wanted the disk I certainly would have paid $3 for the info, esp. if it only cost $20!
Condemnant quod non intellegunt.
I've been on eBay for I think 5 years now (feedback rating of 530+), buying memorabilia for a particular marque of British auto. Like another poster I buy pretty small things and out of nearly 1000 transactions I've had only a couple items in my "Stiffed" file - 1 from a seller who (apparently) died, 3 or 4 lost in the mail, and a 2 from a seller that was woefully disorganized for their volume. I've paid by PayPal, US$ cheque and cash, and only 1 payment went astray and it was a cheque that I cancelled. I have sent money to various spots around the world that would make people a bit leery, but anything like this is a gamble. I deal in a niche, not in the mainstream consumer products market, so that's probably why my experience is so good. Nobody's wanting to get rich off the stuff I buy. People chasing "deals" on the same stuff everyone else is chasing will always be targets for the unscrupulous.
fraud is never okay, but people think they can get things on the cheap on ebay. you get what you pay for. i see lots of 17" powerbooks for like $999. i'm thinking, yeah right. but i read where some guys got hosed on these "deals". people are stupid for thinking they can find deals on ebay that are too good to be true. my wife buys and sells kids clothes. but she bought her canon 10D at a brick and mortar store, though she could've got it for a lot less on ebay. so why? well, you pay for service. and it is safer. you pay for that too. i have no sympathy for people who drop big dollars to people they have no way of verifying, especially if it's in some BFE country. they should use sense. though ebay has a responsibility, they can't possibly track the millions (and millions) of auctions. it is incumbent on the bidder. there are great deals on refurb'd laptops. but i'd only buy them from legit ebay stores. i wouldn't buy it from a regular user.
My problem? I was perfectly gruntled, until some numbnuts came by and dissed me.
This is how he spotted my hijacked ebay account:
It's easy to spot a scam. Your's was easy because
looking at your feedback,
you had NO or very few "sells" and mostly all
"buys". Also the class of
items you deal in was way different than plasma
TV's. And what is the odds
that all of sudden you would have more than one
plasma TV?
They got into your account by sending fake ebay
emails out to people telling
them that they needed to update their information or
else their account
would be shut down. The email looks very real and
the web page it directs
you to look very real. Once you put in your ID and
password, they use it to
take over your account. The same thing has been
going on with Paypal. I've
got a few fake emails for both Ebay and Paypal. I
notify Ebay and paypal
immediately. But many, many people fall for it.
I do it because: 1. It pisses me off to see this
happen. 2. It's fun to
play with these scammers. 3. I hate to see people
scammed out of hard earned
money. 4. sometimes it's quicker for me to get rid
of them than ebay.
Example :I was wandering around a local church yard sale and stumbled across a book filled with pictures of dead people. So I bought it and put it up on EBay.
"God fights on the side with the best artillery." - Napoleon, Marshal of France - speaking truth to power
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I can't remember when I ate anything that was as good as the ads.
Then you haven't tried this site yet.
God invented whiskey so the Irish would not rule the world.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
You can still get it here. The only thing is that the disc is on back order so it may take a few weeks extra, but you'll get it eventually for much cheaper than anyone on E-Bay is getting it for.
eBay's feedback system is pretty effective. A combintation of eBay feedback and how the seller represents the goods can really help you determine how legit the seller is.
Also, it is reasonable to send the seller and email, or call the seller. You can even have someone visit the seller if necessary.
As both a buyer and a seller, I've had very few problems. I bought one item that didn't work as advertised, but it was only $9. Not a bad loss.
I've sold some stuff to a bunch of people that didn't pay. All said, illegit bidders cost me over $85. That pisses me off, but it's part of business on eBay.
I always make sure that there's a lot of quality feedback when buying. If there are some negative feedbacks, I read them and try to figure out who the loser is. Often times, the loser is a first-time (and last-time) eBay buyer.
A seller with little-to-no feedback is a huge warning sign. I can't imagine someone selling on eBay without first buying several items on eBay. It's OK to buy from a person with little feedback, as long as then item is very little money. I won't panic if I lose a few bucks (like less than $10).
I watch to see where the product is coming from. Something that's in the USA is much safer in my eyes. It's rare that someone will be selling a Plasma TV on eBay from some east Asian country. I simply stay away from that kind of unwieldy, unlikely-to-be-true stuff.
Paypal is easier for me as a buyer and seller. However, PayPal's fee (for the seller) is quite high. I usually sell with some kind of proof-of-delivery. I understand that Paypal doesn't offer me any real protection - so I always think safety first.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
This is more in the category of preying on the hopelessly gullible and exploiting their stupidity, rather than scam. Less like nigerian 419, more like religion.
Or government.
Hell, it took way too much time to find the link to report the phish emails I got last year.
I just keep the page bookmarked now, if anyone can get to this page in less than 10 clicks from the home page, I'm very impressed: http://pages.ebay.ca/help/basics/select-RS.html
I've used their auction alert system for about 2 years and it really works, it's an easy system to tell yahoo that something is wrong with an auction. It allows "you and me" to police auctions - ebay should have something similar.
Yell & scream & rant & rave... it's no use... you need a shaaaave ~ Bugs Bunny
So have YOU bought anything with these "links" that you can say for sure it's not a scam? It sure sounds like a scam to me. $115 for a 40gb iPod? Which is $500, with a razor-thin profit margin? THAT sounds like a serious scam.
If it's legit, share the info so we can all get in on this. My 20gb iPod is feeling a little cramped lately.
These auctions are cluttering up eBay. Get on and try to find an iPod and you see dozens of "Free iPod!" auctions interspersed with occasional real auctions. The sooner they clear those things out the better.
I've been sent a hard drive which I paid for which makes a very loud spinning sound, it's impossible to use. I've requested a refund but the seller hasn't done many sales and isn't selling anymore, so I have a feeling that if worse comes to worse he'd dump that account. I have his full name (that I'm aware of) and his email address is to a university, so if he doesn't cooperate is there anything I can actually do? I paid through PayPal.
Full details on the event are in my advogato diary.
Basically the scam was that this seller puts a laptop model for sale on eBay, dozens of times. Dozens of people bid on the item and he picks the 'n' number of highest bidders to "win" the auction. At no time does he own these laptop models he is selling. He requires that all payment be sent to him within 5 days of the auction close.
After 4-6 weeks of delays, people start sending emails, getting pissed, and mad. "Brian Silverman" emails them back, with excuses about delays at the "warehouse" and other excuses.
Meanwhile, 2-2.5 months later, he purchases the laptop model, at quite a discounted price from the vendor (not being the "newest" model on the market anymore).
So he keeps hundreds of thousands of dollars in auction buyers' money in his account, accruing interest, and then he purchases the laptops, at roughly 30-40% less than his original auction price.
But wait, it gets better... Brian decided that the whole "send the item to the buyer" part of the scam was eating into his profits too much, so he decided to just not send any laptops to anyone.
I was the last person he ever sent a laptop to. I actually tracked him down, and called him at home one night to demand my laptop, or the FBI would be at his door in 30 minutes. He claimed he would send it out that night, and double the RAM "for my troubles". A week later, I did indeed receive the laptop.
But I posted all of the details in my Advogato diary entries. Hundreds of other people who were being scammed by Brian Silverman googled for his "electro_depot" name, and my diary entry was the only one to come up. They would email me directly asking for more details.
I then received a call from the NY Cyber Crime division, asking me if I had any details on the "scam" with Brian Silverman, and if anyone else had contacted me, because they had a "few calls".
I said I had 141 separate people who had emailed me to complain. 141 people!!!
The end result, was that Mr. Silverman was tracked down out of the country, and the FTC caught and nailed him. I even received a nice little letter from the FTC praising me for my efforts in catching him.
My diary entry was THE reason people were brought together, and the FTC and NYPD took notice in the matter.
Vigilante justice does definately work, but you have to be very careful about how you go about it. After people found my diary entry, they created all of those other websites to track and report on Mr. Silverman's scams.
(And that T23 that I "won" is currently at IBM repair, for the 6th time in 2 years, so it wasn't exactly a "win" in my case).
I really don't understand why everyone uses ebay, when Yahoo! Shopping has been around for such a long time, its way cheaper to sell on there and they have very tight security!
Perhaps they don't get as high number of hits that ebay does, but at least you're not going to get screwed over for tons of money!
I say fuck ebay, use Yahoo! Shopping (or perhaps some of the other shopping websites).
firstadopter, you suck hairy new york times dicks
I liked ebay when it was just people selling second hand items, businesses selling surplus etc. Ever since the ebay business model sprung to life ebay imho sucks.
I was just saying this yesterday (not for the first time.) Are there any other sites out there that offer the same quality, quantity, and prices that eBay used to?
As for high shipping charges, you can complain to eBay about excessive shipping charges . Especially when you have the postage on the envelope in front of you, you know they're ripping you off.
EBay, based in San Jose, Calif., has 800 people deployed around the world to fight fraud, he said, and does not need amateur help. "Just like in the offline world," he said, "you can't have people running around taking the law into their hands."
So...what does he think the government is? Robots?
Metamoderation works here, right?
When you look at the state of the world, how can you not become a radical, liberal anarchist?
1. Email Ms. Houkom about having a fake item
2. Outbid her by $.50
3. Repeat 1-2 until winning bid is yours
4. Have a victory espresso from your brand new espresso machine
Happily, all these auctions are clearly designed to catch people who are either stupid, or who simply make a mistake and don't read the fine print.
Happily, the feedback system makes it pretty clear that these people are losers. 93% positive feedback? That sucks. 18 feedback total? That's pretty low. And what's with the mutually-agreed feedback buybacks?
Also, look at the feedbacks... a lot of PURCHASES for low-quality shit. Gee, that doesn't give me any confidence either.
Is this a scam? Yes.
Should eBay remove them? Yep, the pyramid schemes look illegal to me, and the others look like they're mis-categorized in many ways - I'd call that "deception".
Wow, lame.
What's scary is that people bother with this kind of scam. Sure we all laugh and point but somewhere out there, some moron is clicking "Bid" right now (or sending his bank acct number to the Nigerian dudes or whatever). Sad commentary on the human race.
Be happy. Nothing else matters.
I sell Diablo 2 items on ebay. It's good money for very little work. Unfortunately, there's been a recent outbreak of fraud by users who buy items using stolen ebay accounts and pay with stolen paypal accounts. The items are virtual, so they recieve them almost instantly -- when the user reports their account stolen a few weeks later, the sellers have the payments retracted and get stuck with the bill.
These aren't just little kids trying to get items for free. There's a definate pattern here. People, who I imagine don't even play Diablo 2, have taken towards buying D2 items with stolen paypal accounts and on some legitimate account (which actually belongs to them) they resell the items. Thus they end up with money in their paypal accounts which is very cleverly laundered from stolen paypal accounts in a manner which is almost untracable. So all those people phising for paypal accounts have found a way to keep the money without having any sort of records connecting their money with the account they stole.
The only weakness of this plan is that, of course, is that the accoutn which does the actual reselling of the stolen items must be a real account. I have taken a couple hours of my time to track down the legitimate account of a person who ripped me off for roughly 150 dollars, and tried to bring this person to eBay's attention, but they don't care. After all, he's a seller generating seller fees for them -- they're not gonna do anything unless I somehow give them ironclad proof.
You would think would an overwhealming level of circumstancial evidence (he started selling the just a few hours after the first items were purchased using a stolen account, he sells the same items in the same quantities as were stolen by the two accounts I know to have been stolen by the same person, he even recieved his first seller feedback from one of the stolen accounts for his cheapest item) would be enough to convince ebay to even consider some sort of investigation. But they won't even respond to my emails anymore (and I'm a powerseller, supposed to be entitled to "priority support").
Let's face it, ebay is complicit in the fraud committed by these individuals. They do not act strongly to stop them. They do not actively monitor for fraud (if I can search completed listings and tell you who's a fraudulent buyer and who's not, then certainly ebay could).
So then it's not really suprising that ebay users would take to doing ebay's job for them -- someone has to do it. There's no real alternative to ebay at this point (yahoo auctions is a sad, sad shell of ebay) and people depend on ebay to make a living.
Heck, the thought of buying something from the legitimate account of the person who stole 150 dollars from me just so I could request the phone number from ebay and do a reverse look-up had crossed my mind. But even if I did get his home address, what would I do with it then? Show up on his doorstep with a baseball bat?
I'm at a loss for ideas. Now with all my auctions I'm forced to screen my buyers very carefully. Calling long distance to verify that the people using the ebay account are in fact the real users, checking bidding histories for suspicious patterns.
I want to treat my customers like customers, not like criminals. But I see no real alternative as long as eBay continues to drop the ball on halting fraud.
it's a pyramid scheme. They call it "a matrix"
Matrixwatch has a lot of info on how these scams work and are involved in bringing a lawsuit against one of the biggest operators.
They have instructions on how to report those annoying "free link!" auctions to ebay and how to get paypal to close the accounts of people who start new matrix sites.
There are a lot of people out there who are bad at maths and are unable to grasp that if they are the twentheth person to sign up for a plasma TV 50x matrix then they don't get their TV until 1000 people have join that list which will take years even if the matrix operator is not sued, shutdown by his card process and dosn't dissapear with the money or just not pay out when it's your turn.
If you are signing up for place 20 to get a TV the chances are that people 1-19 are non existant or shills.
Ebay is slow to remove "free link!" auctions but they are certainly monitoring for people offering to sell goods outside of ebay.
I doubt it a conincidence that transactions outside ebay reduce their income whereas matrix scams just annoy users.
I reccently bid for a computer. I got half a dozen email message sent via ebay saying "I have ten of those really cheap, email me!" followed by half a dozen warnings from "eBay Singapore customer support" (I'm nowhere near singapore) which began "We recently investigated the possibility that 'newoffretez@yahoo.com's account was compromised and used by an unauthorized third party. Our records indicate that you may have been contacted by this third party about purchasing an item off of the eBay site."
Well apparently I had a 100% success rate at detecting frauds cause no one ever complained.
Sorry, I was was hurrying, that link should have been www.matrixwatch.org
I noticed that if you go to ebay stores and click on the store name, it brings you into a non-https sign in page. Seems like this could be a major source of the problem.
How does it smack of total unprofessionalism? NYT has the right to force users to register before viewing, it's the terms of use of their site. It would be unprofessional to officially support bypassing this mechanism.
While I don't agree to having to register prior to viewing an article, if slashdot openly supports bypassing the registration why shouldn't NYT block slashdot referrals?
I put in a bogus name and password and it passed me right on to the next page where they ask for all your info, including a credit card. I plugged in more bogus info and it responds with yet enother page that looks exactly like eBay's that says congrats you've updated your info. I wonder how many people fall for this?
I also wonder if it would be technically illegal to use curl to submit a few thousand million POST requests with bogus info to that scam page?
http://www.rootstrikers.org/
"How hard is it to include them in the article summary? This smacks of total unprofessionalism."
So Slashdot should be more professional by disrespecting NYTimes wishes? It's their story, not Slashdot's.
"Derp de derp."
I was looking around for an Apple notebook, Ebay/Yahoo/Amazon etc, was looking at the $2999 17" Apple notebook at Amazon and noticed the "X new & used from $1720" I was like "hmm $1720 that's a pretty good price" and I checked it out, the guy who was selling it said his grandmother got him one for Xmas as a going to college present but he'd already gotten one through a school program, etc etc, so it seemed legitimate enough to this point. So I asked how did he want payment, and he wanted to use an "escrow server because it's safer for us both" (uh huh....) well he gave me the URL for the escrow and I whois'd it, the domain was less than a week old (???) Verisign logos, etc yet the certificate was an instant-ssl free certificte (???x2).
Definite scam, emailed Amazon and the hosting provider, site was pulled, Amazon never replied, I forgot all about it, about a month later I get ANOTHER email from this guy, different Amazon account, same URL, new host... the cycle continues...
Apparently Amazon did nuke his account, and his web host pulled the fake escrow site, DNS update, new Amazon account, and he's back up and running.
Kinda makes you want to go to Chuck E Cheese and play whack-a-mole, for all the good you do tracking these bastards down they just pop up out of another hole.
--- www.f-theocean.com
Recently, I was looking for a new stove for my kitchen remodel. Over the course of 2 weeks, I found 2 DCS 36" ranges. Typically around $5000. Both sellers had several hundred positive feedback. But their previous items were nothing like the stoves, little trinkets and crap. So I figured the accounts were hijacked.
I emailed the sellers, and both of them offered to end the auction early and sell me the item for $3k, and include free shipping. This thing weighs 700 pounds, and one of them said UPS would ship it and hold it until they get the Western Union money transfer. I looked at the headers in the emails, and every one of them came from somewhere different. A portscan of the originating machine revealed that it was an open proxy, and they were using this to use yahoo mail and hotmail.
Needless to say, I didn't send them any money. One of them wanted to use a specific escrow service. I looked at the domain info, and it had been registered only 4 days before. And they only took western union. Shady as hell.
This is why I propose someone start a site called thugs4hire.com. If you get ripped off, you can send someone over from a network of thugs to beat the living crap out of the scammer.
Need Free Juniper/NetScreen Support? JuniperForum
When the laws don't protect you, you take the law into your own hands!
.... oh, never mind! first, they would have to make it past all them Harvard Business School graduates with their damned spreadsheets! ain't never gonna happen!
E-bay has known about these problems for a long time. However, when it still serves their interest to let these things continue, they have been more than willing to let them go! It was still making them money!
Now that they've gone a while tho, maybe they'll find that honesty is the best policy; that people will frequent someplace only because they can trust it; that
NYT has =also= agreed to have a registration free google link so they aren't forcing anybody to register anything. There's no reason /. needs to annoy its users with stupid registrations when it isn't necessary.
I have successfully purchased (and sold) many items on eBay. You can get awesome deals on some items, so long as you know what you are doing:
- Check feedback. Not just the number, but the comments. Read the negative and neutral comments and judge whether it was the seller's fault ("you never shipped") or the buyer's fault ("my notebook didn't have an OS" when the auction said so) or neither ("broken item, seller replaced, OK").
- Sanity check prices. A brand new Sony notebook on buy-it-now for $49 is a fraud. A used Dell CSx with a PIII 500, 20GB HDD, DVD/CD-RW, Windows 2000, good battery, and 256MB Memory for $350 is a stupid seller.
- Remember, prices on auctions often start low and go high. SET A HARD LIMIT. DO NOT BID MORE. It is easy to get into a bidding war and end up paying way more than you wanted.
- DO NOT PAY WITH A WIRE TRANSFER. PAY ONLY USING PAYPAL AND ONLY WITH A CREDIT CARD.
- Ask bogus questions. If you are buying a notebook, ask if it has the "hyperspeed math co-processor". If you get a "yes" answer, it's a fraud.
- Know what you are buying. If you have a question, ASK before you bid.
- Compare with similar auctions. Check completed auctions. If something seems off, ask about it.
- Know how much shipping is.
- Make sure you aren't buying pirated software. If it includes Windows, make sure there is a COA (unless you plan on loading Linux).
From what I've heard American Express is the best with dealing with disputed charges. If you pay for an item on ebay with an american express card through paypal and get stiffed just call american express and tell them the charge is being disputed. Because of how paypal works the seller will have already received his money. However paypal would have dug into their own pockets to pay that seller because american express isn't going to hand over any money to paypal until the transaction dispute is resolved. Maybe this will put pressure on ebay and paypal to protect its customers better.
Bzzzt! you're an idiot. You have not sold "hundreds" of high priced commodity items. That would be around $500,000 worth of merchandise.
On the high price commodity items the fraud rate is easily over 50%. Its not easy for new comers to spot these. I'm an expert and I've been roped in too.
I've found that the scammers usually have some long explanation for why they are selling it so cheap. Most of the legit auctions don't have this.
i.e. My girlfriend just got in an accident in Romania and I need to sell this $2000 camcorder for $1000 so I can send her money. I will put you on the buyer list if you agree to pay me through Western Union.
Ebay, Paypal, spam...all of it can be traced to the one inherwent flaw of the internet that, ironically, people continue to outspokenly defend: the anonymity of the net.
You cannot have a well-behaved global village without personal accountability for it's citizens.
Ebay don't seem to care about reported fake auctions. They do jump pretty qucik on reported copyright/trademark infringements (including sometime screwing up and stopping legit auctions), but they don't seem to care about hoaxes. You'd think they would at least spend some time on that, and on working with the legal people to follow back frauds to the original source.
I went and opened a credit union account for PayPal use. Low balance requirement, so I keep next to nothing in it. When it comes time to pay, I always choose "other funding options" and tell PayPal to use my credit card, not the crdit union account. Of course, PayPal always tries to talk me out of it by extolling the wonderful benefits of a chance at a drawing or some such thing, but I just click the button that says to use the CC.
I'm not suggesting anyone attempt this but I am curious if such a thing is possible.
Would an auction for a unique tie get shut down by these guys?
Join Tor today!
The same holds true in the physical retail world. Here in NYC, all the tourist destinations are crammed with dirty electronics markets. Besides cameras and cell phones, all of these stores sell old and new laptops for vastly-or-slightly inflated prices, respectively; price tags (big, colorful) are placed over any and all indentifying marks other than brand. All 'Intel Pentium-x' and 'Made for Windows x' stickers are scraped off. Accidentally done at each store, I am sure.
Whatever urge fools people into buying consumer goods on vacation is probably the same urge that drives people onto Ebay . Unfortunately, I do not see those folks leaving the population anytime soon...after all, you can still make money selling fake watches out of briefcases, and who hasn't heard of that one? The scams will continue, and smart people will simply use eBay for it's original purpose: allowing regular people and small merchants to sell unretailable goods.
===--===
Together, we will drive the rats from the tundra.
THis is even worse than a pyramid scheme. At least with a pyramid scheme some people make money, until the pyramid collapses of course. With this, no one makes any money (except the scammer). What's to stop the scammer from awarding the "prize" to his friend or even himself who happens to be at the top of the list?
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Seeking the meaning of life... @slashdot of all places
Paypal sucks, anyone who is daft enough to bid on an auction where the seller only accepts paypal would be better off using his money for toilet paper.
I just recently bid on one of these auctions by mistake, forgetting to make sure the seller accepted money orders. I sent an apology to the seller and offered to pay another way after I realized my mistake. After getting a nasty reply I even went further to ask the seller if I could just send him the winning total by money order and he could keep the item and resell it, so I could keep my perfect feedback. I got an even nastier response to that. I looked up the seller's contact info and tried to call, because it usually is much harder for a seller to be nasty when they are not hiding behind their email client. I made the mistake of not blocking my caller id info, so all I got was a couple rings and a click as I was hung up on. I did further research and called a relative of the seller, and asked them if they would have him call me, even if he had to call collect. I made every effort to resolve with this scam artist, but so far I have only got a NPB tagged on my account and no negative feedback yet. Obviously this guy had a problem with giving out a snail mail address for some reason, most likely because the item didn't even exist.
It seems lately the bad auctions are really on the rise. I've been burnt a couple times, but usually when bidding on something not too kosher to begin with (like cd's of bootleg tattoo flash or vinyl cutter images) but I have lost money to at least one auction that seemed real, that didn't have any negative tainting to it at all. (For a $40 nokia cellphone data cable.)
Perhaps it's the newbie factor, every year more people get online and on ebay, and there is always someone willing to exploit the easy prey.
Well, to be technical, those MP3 CD auctions aren't fraudulent if they really do have the claimed MP3s on them. They are illegal, but many buyers probably know that and buy them anyway rather than attempting Kaza or Napster or whatever is current.
While the number of illegal (including fraudulent) auctions would be an interesting statistic, there is value in segregating out the fraud cases from the other illegal cases because that is a better indicator of how likely you are to be scammed. I agree that their statistic of 2000 fraudulent items should be taken with a grain of salt.
Compiled these from my own dealings with nefarious characters while buying and selling Apple laptops.
You = Not educated in online purchasing. You need to excersize due diligence in protection yourself. If you recieve the wrong item:
ALWAYS PAY WITH CREDIT CARD. Credit cards offer you the protection of canceling a fradulant charge within 30 days. A misshipped item that they refuse to exchange counts. Contact the seller and demand a refund. If they don't ssue one, stop payment on your card. Contact the seller and let them know you are happy to ship it back to them, at their expense.
Also, if you get ripped off, SUE THEM! Our courts are here for a REASON. Unless you are buying something quite expensive, you should be able to sue in small claims court. The monetary limit is like $2000-$3000 in most jurisdictions. It's usually $20 to file a suit, and you don't need a lawyer. Try to get their personal information from eBay and Paypal. If they can't or won't give it to you, file the suit and subpoena it. They'll give it to the court (they have no choice).
While I agree that PayPal and eBay need to work harder on stopping fraud, you have a good deal of responsibility too. If you get ripped off, online or not, crying about it doesn't get you anywhere. You take action to get your money back. I've been ripped off by Pep Boys. A letter to my bank, an independent expert inspection of my vehicle, and some documentation, and I got my money back.
Don't roll over, just keep upping the stakes till you get what's yours. First try talking to the seller, if they dont' respond try PayPal, if they screw you stop the charges on your card, if that becomes a problem take it to small claims court.
when was the last time you ate a burger that looked as good as it did in the adverts
I used to know a girl who made the food items you see in adverts, and thank god I've never eaten anything that looked like them - they're made from the proper foodstuff, but them have hairspray, varnish, foam that looks like cream, etc etc put on it to make it look like you expect it to look.
The old saying "You can't cheat an honest man" is more truth than BS. I, and plenty of other people I know, buy (and sell) high dollar items on eBay and have never been ripped off. Mostly it's just using your common sense and excersizing due dilligence. Things like if the deal sounds too good to be true, it probably is, calling the seller on the phone, checking transaction history, etc.
I sold a soundcard. As always, I hosted the pictures on my site. I noticed an abnormal number of hits after the auction closed (I generally leave them up there for a bit out of laziness). Hmmmmm. Turns out someone else had nabbed my picture (and description). Dunno if it was a fraud or not, but I have something against people theaving my images. So I took it down. Then, I thought better of it and put up a nice, large, hardcore gay porn pic. That did the trick :)
really? I see a few 'this is xxx television show, recorded on DVD-R' type auctions, and I report them when I can be bothered - not one of them has been pulled, even when the auction listing says its a copy.
IMHO these are tha absolute worst for fraud on Ebay. So many sellers with counterfeit cartridges. 99% you can weed out by the fact that it's cart only, or it's shipping from Malaysia, Hong Kong, the Philippines or wherever else piracy is rife.
The problem is that users just check if the item works and leave feedback, rather then make sure it's legitimate, so even 100% positive feedback shipped from a non-100% warez market isn't any indication. I bought Zelda for GBA from a dealer in the UK, 100% positive feedback, and it turned out to be counterfeit. Did Ebay *or* Nintendo give a rats ass despite his many auctions for cartridges? No.
The coolest thing on the Bidboy site was this cool classic James-Bond-Bad-Guy hide-out. Unfortunately seller's other auctions do not include henchman with big metal teeth, or disposable uniformed drones, or pool of sharks with lasers attached to their heads. So it's a bit of a fixer-upper.
WWJD for a Klondike Bar?
most "militas" I've encountered tend to overlook the "well regulated" bit. I'd imagine this ebay fraud militia is no different...
I have never purchased anything on e-bay but I have always wondered about reliability. For instance, I wonder about purchasing gold and silver on ebay (Examples here, here, and here.) How does anyone know these things are for real?
I know one guy I met online who was investing in gold by buying these bars but how do you even know they are what the ad says they are? Who would invest big money using these bars?
--OFF-TOPIC--
Does anyone here invest in gold (as investment)? If yes, what do you use? And have you invested in gold indices on stock markets? Do you know the symbols for them? Thanks...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Seeking the meaning of life... @slashdot of all places
1. if you have to ask how to trade in gold, how do you know enough to make a informed investment decision.
2. buy a gold index tracker if you still think its a good idea (despite gold being near its 15-year high, you think it'll go higher), eg. Gold Bullion Securities (GBSA on the LSE)
3. buy stock in a gold miner, like Anglo american (AAL on the LSE), or Trans-Siberian gold (TSG on the LSE)
Ways to submit free links...
I can't remember when I ate anything that was as good as the ads.
I can.
She was an advert girl...
For example, I recently bid and won an auction for a Virtuality Visette 2 HMD, with a Polhemus 6DOF tracker board. I got it for around $300.00. I knew it wasn't a scam, because the picture showed the device, and it was definitely a pic of an owned device, not a marketing pic or anything. Not many people even own those HMDs, even fewer are selling them. The transaction went very smooth, and I got a nice HMD. Several emails to various people at Polhemus and Arcadia VR later netted me more information about the devices I had purchased - cool!
I have done this with other HMDs and VR devices, as well as other strange "high-dollar" or unique "junk". I see people selling industrial robots, and other stuff of that nature - and they aren't scams. As you noted, if it is considered "junk", it typically isn't a scam (even if the "junk" is going for a few hundred dollars)...
Reason is the Path to God - Anon
I needed a textbook, Introduction to Electrodynamics, a book that costs $100. My entire family was making big noises about the high costs of textbooks and my roomate offered to buy it online for me. She's not the most technically literate but she has a credit card which gets her more ebay acess than me. She told me about half.com (an affiliate of ebay) and I gave her $50 and borrowed textbooks in the meantime.
At some point, she said that she suspected an ex-friend of hers had sent her a CD-R that she was suspecting of less than honest intentions and she was afraid it would cover her computer with computer viruses. I popped it in my linux box, poked around... and was surprised to find that it contained the solutions manual to my textbook!
I went back and looked at what she had bought. It was listed as "Introduction to Electrodynamics (Hardcover, 1998)" but under the notes it said "Notes: Solutions manual in CD format. Returns not accepted due to possibility of copying."
We've emailed half.com but haven't found any response. We've left bad feedback but that doesn't seem to do anything. All our requests for returning are unheeded.
I understand that he probably thinks (s)he's providing a valuable service offering bootleg copies of the solutions manual, but I found the damn offer misleading, and I don't even want the solutions manual! I want the book! And when no one responds to inquiries... Grr..
--Stanza, who has been burned internet shopping everytime I've ever tried to buy anything online.
I often see DVD fraud auctions. Many of these are for small amounts (about $10) so people won't bother to pay up. Also, box sets that are really bootlegs tend to be common fraud items. Don't buy DVDs from outside the US and if it says it's the asian or chinese box, but the movies are english, then it's a definate bootleg.
Also, at least with DVDs, bs sellers have feedback around 96-97% while legit sellers hve feedback over 99%.
before bidding, ask for a specific photo of the item with an identifier you indicate. Try something like a photo from a specific odd angle, which cant be photoshopped in.
Yes! Evil rules! Good can suck it! Suck it, good!
Worst case scenario: you end up having to pay a reasonable price for the item. Since eBay uses proxy bidding, your infinite bid will only end up costing you one increment more than the highest serious bidder. If you end up winning a legitimate auction, you could probably resell the item to the second highest bidder and eat only a tiny loss. Or you could relist the item thereby only losing shipping and a bit of value if you bought at a market peak.
:)
The only time you're going to get screwed is when two vigilantes go after the same auction.
Just for giggles I thought I'd check out user feedback on some of the sellers listed. Interesting reading. For example:
d back&userid=revbuys
d back&userid=qualityserviceaa
d back&userid=rl0725
http://cgi2.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFee
http://cgi2.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFee
http://cgi2.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFee
A common thread seems to be an overabundance of reviews by individuals listed as sellers. The remarks are very glowing, and the syntax is often the same or very similar. There are a lot of "A+++++++++" comments.
Another common thread seems to be an overabundance of redundant comments by buyers. Often the remark is exactly the same, and the timestamps are minutes apart or shown as the same.
I think the reason why eBay didn't do anything right away was that it can be hard to notice if you're not particularly skeptical. I mean, I not only reviewed the feedback on the sellers listed in the parent post, but I also reviewed the feedback made on the reviewers themselves. The pattern becomes noticeable then.
Also, these sellers had a lot of feedback, in the thousand+ range. I don't eBay much, so perhaps this means nothing, but mathematically, the negative feedback being given tends to get overshadowed by the hundreds upon hundreds of positive feedback; thus masking the con.
I have reported a couple of frauds to EBAY and have seen the auctions disappear only to reappear under a different userid so I reported the new userid and the cycle simply repeated. The EBAY fraud reporting policy has privacy restrictions that I feel "protect" the fraudster and that leaves me a little uncomfortable but I still use EBAY and have not been a direct victim of fraud.
To me, EBAY is like a giant flea-market and old time auction house. You can trust most of the people there but have to rely on your gut to tell you when you should pass on a deal. Too good to be true deals that are legit are few and far between. You are better off passing on something that seems too good to be true or, you will be ripped off. Crooks know human nature and will try to take advantage of greed. It is a weakness they can exploit. This is as true in the virtual marketplace as it is in real life.
So these vigilantes bid up the fraudulent items so high that no real buyer would want it--the article talks about over a million for a telescope worth about two thousand. Isn't that risky? After all, it IS a binding contract, and for such a sum of money, the fraudulent seller can surely come up with the item (i.e., buy it from someone for two thousand and then sell it for a million), even if he didn't have it before.
if you think an item is fictitious and its worth some bucks, request escrow. There are several ebay authorized/sanctioned sources including ebay itself. Also ebay and paypal have insurance and refunds available for people who get stiffed.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I used to buy lots of things on ebay. I also tried selling on eBay a couple of times. After being ripped off twice (once as buyer, once as seller), I'll never use eBay again. I used to use it between 1997-2000 and that's about the point where I quit.
It all comes down to this: I was buying and selling on there *for fun*. There is nothing on eBay I can't live without. I have a real job and do not need to sell anything on eBay to make money. The one time I tried selling something it was because my daughter wanted to sell some dolls and we ended up getting ripped off.
Once it quits being fun, its time to pull the plug! That's why I won't ever use it again. There's just too many other stores where I don't get ripped off (and don't have to worry about it either.)
Looking through auctions on eBay used to be fun around 1997-98. Today, there are enough frauds that its not fun for me anymore.
Avoid Missing Ball for High Score
Do lottery tickets count?
"He who throws mud, loses ground." - proverb
www.buysafe.com
This is the company I'm aware of that actually guarantees sellers performance in auctions. They are not affiliated with ebay, paypal, or any payment scheme. There is no cost to the buyer. Each transaction is INDIVIDUALLY legally bonded to guarantee the sellers performance, with no deductible or seller caps. The bonds are underwritten by The Hartford insurance company (www.theHartford.com), so the guarantee has a strong financial backing.
So what's the catch? As a buyer if you see the auction is bonded with buysafe there is none. Some items buysafe will not bond (real estate for one). Sellers must go through a much more rigorous screening process then paypal or SquareTrade (which basically just check if you have a bank account). After all, buysafe/the Hartford is taking the credit risk for the seller. Sellers have to pay 1% of each auction for the bond, which is how buysafe is compensated. And, the seller probably actually benefits because buyers will be willing to pay more for an item if they know the item/seller is legitimate.
Buysafe is only a few months old, and thus does not have the name recognition of PayPal/SquareTrade. Thus it will not be on as many auctions (search ebay auction descriptions for BuySafe). However, this alternative eliminates virtually all risk for the buyer, at no cost to them, and I think that buyers would be demanding once it is more established in the market.
I'm not surprised e-bay lets this go on. They are probably satisfied with their cut.
UNIX is truth, the Console is life. Use Evolution to send e-mail and not virii.
I think ebay should allow comments on items. Perhaps that would help, similar to review.
Have you read my journal today?
Keeping track of fraud is vigilante? Warning people of fraud is vigilante? Exposing fraud is vigilante? Please , stop the violence!
My favorite are the nuts who sell Cisco IOS images. I'm stupified by the people who will pay them money (for something Cisco will give you for free in many cases -- esp. if you're asking for the image it was sold with.) And I'm further amazed that Cisco let's these people do it.
eBay needs to change their feedback reviewing pages to allow limiting to specific types. If a seller has 1500 positive and 38 negative entries, I don't immediately care about the 1500; I want to see the 38 negatives... when were they posted, who posted them, were they all clustered, were they resolved, and exactly what was the problem... these are all better indicators than 1000 "A++++++++++++++", "WILL BUY FROM AGAIN" bulls***.
I second that. I tried to sell my old copy of Everquest on Ebay, and they took my advertisement down the next day with a letter from their legal department. Sheesh, I would like to get some return on all those hours I wasted killing spiders in EQ, but I guess I will just have to write them off :(
I can't afford a sig!
My objection to them is the miscasification of the item, its clearly not an "electronic goods" but rather information. Note Ebay also does not allow sale of non physical things, like I-tunes tracks.
;-) Others were selling the Education licence version that retails for 50 Pounds Uk for starting at 300+ yes they were clearly labled in the descriptions, which were obviously trying to trick the buyer, its up to you I guess if you think this is a scam (but not fraud), not all scams are illegal, they just trick the buyer.
I was resently on, ebay for a laugh I put in "microsoft project", one guy was claiming is was ok for him to give you a cdr and feed on his "corporate licence" cos the Eula allow it
James
This is more in the category of preying on the hopelessly gullible and exploiting their stupidity, rather than scam.
You are simply wrong. There is no Alienware Area-51 3.2Ghz PC for $275. The scammer is not only preying on the gullible, but is lying about the information being sold. How can you believe that that set of circumstances does not constitute a criminal scam?
when was the last time you ate a burger that looked as good as it did in the adverts
Umm, just because you've been getting ripped off forever doesn't make it right. I'm continually pissed about about that crap. The product they are advertising is NOT the product you get. With models, at least you know the modelling agency is selectively picking the top point-oh-one percent of good looking people and putting their clothes on them. I can buy exactly what they sell, it just won't look so good on me. But, it's not like if I just keep looking, I'll someday find a Whopper that looks like it does on TV.