Wal-Mart Turns Over DVD Rentals to Netflix

prostoalex writes "US retail giant Wal-Mart is turning its DVD rental business to Netflix. No word on how much money the deal is worth but Netflix will feature promotional Wal-Mart links for the 100K customers it gets from the retail chain."

Comments

Wal-mart censorship

[Lovesquid]

Anyone know if Wal-mart censors their DVD rentals like they do with their retail CDs/DVDs? I know I won't shop there for this reason.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[WormholeFiend]

It's not just WalMart that does this.

Whenever I visit such a store, I always stop by the DVD movie department and ask "can you help me find the pr0n section?"

And then I roll my eyes and look all frustrated when they tell me they don't sell anything in that category.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

And you know what? It's your right not to shop there because you disagree with their censoring. And it's Wal-mart's right to censor what they sell so people who WANT the censored material can get it.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[eln]

This is a cross-promotion agreement, not Wal-Mart taking over Netflix's DVD selection. Wal-Mart's DVD rental business was not really very large, with only about 100k customers to Netflix's 3 million. Wal-Mart never really heavily promoted their offering, and I think they just figured it would be a lot more cost efficient to leverage Netflix's massive existing infrastructure specializing in this sort of thing rather than trying to maintain staff of their own for something that is destined to be a very small portion of their overall business. On the radio, they noted that Netflix reported revenue of $506 million for the entire year. Wal-Mart, by contrast, makes that much in revenue in LESS THAN A DAY.

This is not unprecedented of course. Wal-Mart allows other people to provide services under contract rather than providing those services themselves in their own stores. Examples would be things like McDonalds, and the other Cafe-style things that are in the front of every Wal-Mart, and are not owned or run by them.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[killmenow]

I don't know, but I could imagine a scenario wherein NetFlix provides what amounts to a fulfillment service to Wal-Mart under the Wal-Mart name and maintains its own NetFlix branded rental service.

Then, if Wal-Mart says: no NC-17 movies, etc., on our branded service, fine. So long as the people who are interested in it can still get it under the NetFlix name, I don't care if Wal-Mart wants to filter their product.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[rovingeyes]

people who WANT the censored material can get it.

Hmmm...I wonder how a censored pr0n movie will be like

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[TheRealMindChild]

I learned this crap the hard way. Back when Wal-mart started having their bins-o-DVDs for cheap, in the hillbilly hills of somewheres, I was able to get them for $4 a piece... and while I didnt LOVE everything I bought, the movies were well worth $4 (or so I thought).

Then I started watching them... and noticed DUBBING over some swear words... WHAT THE HELL? Scenes were missing... the same ones that USA or TNT would cut out (In the Lawnmower man, the only GOOD parts were removed). Needless to say, I was SO furious, I too refuse to shop at the place

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[ReverendHoss]

Hmmm...I wonder how a censored pr0n movie will be like

Short.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Big_Al_B]

Er, how does a *store* choosing what merchandise to sell to *customers* who choose to shop there constitute censorship again?

If that's censorship then I guess my local whole foods market is guilty too, because they don't carry Cap'n Crunch Peanut Butter Crunch. All they carry is some crappy organic peanut butter puffs. The *bastards*.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Lovesquid]

Well considering that they don't even indicate anywhere on the packages that there were edits made, except in the most extremely small type and only in certain instances, I think they are still in the wrong. I hope you enjoy your 3-minute cut of Kill Bill, though.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[MaineCoon]

Wal-Mart sells DVDs that have had their content edited (dubbed words, cut scenes), and only mention it in small type that you have to know to look for. Otherwise the packages look almost identical to the full length versions.

It's the same kind of editing that TV stations do to show a PG-13 or R rated movie during the day.

The fact that it isn't CLEARLY labelled as such, masquerading as the real thing, IS censorship.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Unfulfilling.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Rude Turnip]

"can you help me find the pr0n section?"

Well that's your problem. They probably think you're looking for small, delicious crustacean.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[It doesn't come easy]

How bizarre if true. Can you image the expense to a single company (even Wal-Mart) of editing movies simply to sell a PG-13 version of an R rated movie? I would bet the movie producer created both versions and Wal-Mart chose to only market the cleaned up one...

Not that it makes any practical difference...

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Lovesquid]

Oh, they will still sell it to you. They'll sell you the latest Green Day CD that looks just like the unedited copy you can get for the same price at Best Buy, except for the tiny print that says "Edited" along the top spine of the case, and the huge blank spaces in the recording. I've been burned by this in both DVD and CD, and there is not always something to indicate the fact that you buying an edited version, let alone that another unedited version even exists.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[damiangerous]

Well, it's not quite censorship, but it's not quite as innocent as you describe either. Wal-Mart only sells "radio friendly" CDs (I don't know about DVDs). A CD you buy at Wal-Mart may not be the same CD you buy at a local CD shop, despite identical packaging. Wal-Mart has the buying power to get labels to press special edited versions of their CDs for sale just in Wal-Mart. This isn't necessarily a problem in and of itelf. The problem is that Wal-Mart doesn't tell anyone about this.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

As a Christian I agree, Walmart shouldn't sell this unwholesome material. Now if you will exuse me I have to pick up some beer, a carton of cigarettes, and a gun at Walmart.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[yotto]

*Hmmm...I wonder how a censored pr0n movie will be like*

Plumber comes in, offers to snake the pipes. Housewife smiles at him seductively... ...And the plumber leaves the house.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Gadgetfreak]

Correct, it's not actually censorship in the true sense of the word. A better description would be that Wal-Mart's business decisions are a "very powerful influence."

My girlfriend works for a label manufacturer that prints labels for a well known motor oil company. They've had to re-design labels entirely, because the bottle that the company uses had changed shape. The exclusive reason is because Wal-Mart did not like the way the bottle handle was positioned when they were put on the shelf. So a multi-million dollar repackaging was set in order.

Any manufacturer of consumer products, or even services as this case seems to be, stands to lose a TON of revenue if Wal-Mart decides that they don't want to play ball with you anymore.

There's no doubt that Netflix would be persuaded to do just about anything that Wal-Mart requests of them.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

I have never gotten a censored DVD from Walmart or even seen one. They sensored cds, but i have never seen it done to a movie.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[kalel666]

Being a Wal Mart DVD customer (by mail), I can say that they don't. I was able to get a few DVD's I was sure they wouldn't carry, like South Park and Team America. I just got the email today about the "merger" with netflix, and I'm not sure whether to go for it. I've read some crappy things about Netflix service.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[ZiakII]

Hmmm...I wonder how a censored pr0n movie will be like probally like the Japanese's Hentai movies

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Jherek Carnelian]

Then I started watching them... and noticed DUBBING over some swear words... WHAT THE HELL? Scenes were missing... the same ones that USA or TNT would cut out (In the Lawnmower man, the only GOOD parts were removed). Needless to say, I was SO furious, I too refuse to shop at the place

I don't believe you. Producing an edited version and an unedited version of a DVD is an expensive proposition and not something a studio is going to do for DVDs that sell for ~$5. It would almost certainly be a money loser even at the volumes wally-world buys at.

I purchased lawnmower man from the same wal-mart dump bins. So, please post the timecode for an example of this editing and I will go and try to confirm it on my copy tonight.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Except that, by now, pretty much everyone knows that Walmart censors their CD/DVD's. Walmart advertises the fact. It's simple. Don't want censored materials or take the risk of doing so? Don't buy from Walmart. Agree with Walmart's definition of "family-friendly?" Then do buy from Walmart. Ultimately, its your choice. Walmart is simply providing a service to those who wish that service.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Quixote]

It's not that they don't carry "objectionable" stuff; it is that they selectively edit out content of movies (dubbing over swear words, etc.). This is censorship.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Dude... are you talking about Peanut Butter Puffins? You're crazy those things are awesome.
*fills bowl*
mmmmmm....

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Why wouldn't they carry them. They sell the movies in the stores. I have no idea what they people are talking about in regards to movies. I have purchased about 60+ DVDs from Walmart with about 90% of them being R or Unrated. I have never came accross any of them that were dubed over or that had scenes missing. I also have never seen them not carry a movie with a "bad" rating.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[robertgeller]

I think the real question is *why* Wal-Mart chooses to censor things, as by not offering unedited versions, they are both losing customers who are now resorting to Best Buy and others and pissing people off who came into the store to buy a couple of decent CDs. I'm sure the thought never even occurs to most people shopping for CDs or DVDs at Wal-Mart that, hey, do I have to look specifically for unedited stuff?

I have never really bought anything at Wal-Mart, and I haven't looked in their CD/DVD section too much, so I never knew that they censored *any* of their stuff, let alone all of it. This is pretty shocking to me, and, again, I just can't fathom why they won't just sell *real* CDs.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[geekoid]

if they weren't marked as edited, start a lawsuit against them, they are committing fraud.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Marthisdil]

Yeah right - like you would ever buy pr0n when you can just hit a torrent site and download it to your hearts content. We all know you were at Walmart for tissues and crackers.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Bill Hicks had a thorough explanation of such a thing. Four words come to mind, though, that should explain it sufficiently: Hairy bobbin' man ass. Ugh.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[great throwdini]

Can you image the expense to a single company (even Wal-Mart) of editing movies simply to sell a PG-13 version of an R rated movie? I would bet the movie producer created both versions and Wal-Mart chose to only market the cleaned up one.

Movies are frequently edited in advance into formats "suitable" for general television audiences and other venues, such as in-flight presentation. I would hazard to guess that in many cases, packaging for retail toned-down titles would cost no more than that of manufacture, as the materials have already been produced. With a marketer as large as Wal-Mart, the additional manufacturing cost is likely negligible.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[EggyToast]

The latter is actually how it works. If there are two versions, Walmart will only stock the cleaner one. American Pie was an early example -- the "unrated" version is not available at walmart. That, of course, encourages movie publishers to push both to market.

Blockbuster does this to some degree, although it has changed its policies somewhat when the "unrated" version is the major release, or when a movie's popularity demands that either the better or at least both versions should be available.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

yeah, good job with that horrible, incorrect, poorly html'd attempt at a joke

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[DirtJeans]

I think he already knows this, which is why he said "I won't shop there for this reason." Now I suppose you'll remind me that I have a right to free speech, and that others have a right to use their mod points on my post. Thanks for the heads-ups.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Hungry Student]

I don't know, but I could imagine a scenario wherein NetFlix provides what amounts to a fulfillment service to Wal-Mart under the Wal-Mart name and maintains its own NetFlix branded rental service.

This is exactly what happens in the UK. One large company (Video Island) run white-label DVD rental services for Tesco and MSN, while maintaining a direct-to-consumer brand, ScreenSelect.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Espacially the crackers. Thats where I find all my dates.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[artifex2004]

When I had service with them, I didn't see any evidence of censorship. I think that the unit was entirely separate from the retail unit, and got its inventory independently. However, they sucked for other reasons, which I've detailed elsewhere here :)

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[swv3752]

Na, it's Wlamart. They said give us a a cleaned version or we won't sell any at all.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Clockwork Apple]

What do you do when Wal-Mart is the only game in town? You see, in lots of small towns Wal-Mart is the only retail outlet left. I'll just leave it to your imagination as to what happened to the others that used to exist before Wal-Mart came to town.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

If that's censorship then I guess my local whole foods market is guilty too, because they don't carry Cap'n Crunch Peanut Butter Crunch.

For your analogy to work, they would sell Cap'n Crunch Peanut Butter Crunch but when you got home with your purchase you'd realise that they'd surreptitiously opened it and removed 5% of the contents.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[jschottm]

if they weren't marked as edited, start a lawsuit against them, they are committing fraud.

Have fun with that one in court. If there's nothing indicating that it's the complete, uncut version, there's no fraud.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Except that, by now, pretty much everyone knows that Walmart censors their CD/DVD's.

Ha! Scroll up the page a little and you'll see there are still people in denial over it.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Big_Al_B]

Wal-Mart sells DVDs that have had their content edited (dubbed words, cut scenes), and only mention it in small type that you have to know to look for. Otherwise the packages look almost identical to the full length versions.

So they *are* labelled then...

It's the same kind of editing that TV stations do to show a PG-13 or R rated movie during the day.

And this was not obvious to who?

The fact that it isn't CLEARLY labelled as such, masquerading as the real thing, IS censorship.

You define "censorship" based on how something is labelled?! Really? You have a differrent understanding of censorship than I do...and the dictionary....and, well, educated people.

Really. Censorship is when an authoritative body prevents you from speaking/viewing/hearing something you want to say/see/hear. Otherwise, it's just not censorship.

Oh, wait! What authority do you believe Walmart has over you? Do they make you come to the store, search their DVD bins, and buy all of your movies from them? If they've started getting that brazen about their world domination efforts, then maybe I really will get concerned.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

It would almost certainly be a money loser even at the volumes wally-world buys at.

Tell that to the hundreds of businesses, large and small, that Wal-Mart puts out of business by doing exactly that. They sell over $285 BILLION a year, and if you don't do everything that they want, then they will simply make a boat-load of money with another supplier.

Oh, you are the only person/entity that owns the movie/DVD rights? Ok, then, if you don't edit EVERYTHING we want in EVERYTHING we buy from you, you lose complete access to the millions and millions who spend billions and billions in the most widespread retailing network on the planet.

It doesn't matter if it's a money-loser for anyone, as long as Wal-Mart can make money. And with the enormous marketshare they have and the retailing power that comes with it, they can make a profit off of anything they choose to, usually at the expense of their suppliers.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[The Bungi]

Well, there is the Normal version, sometimes also called Theatrical Release version. Then there's the Director's Cut and sometimes the Two-Disc Extended Aspect Ratio Cut With Pointless Distracting Commentary And Useless Bonus Features version.

And there's the Praise The Lord and Pass The Ammo version, in which the phrase fuck you has been dubbed over with forget you and holy fucking shit has been replaced with oh my.

They're also much shorter. All the violent scenes and sexual content have been removed, so unless you're renting a crummy teenager bubble gum love story produced by Disney you get opening credits, six minutes of disjointed plot lines by characters that seemingly came out of nowhere, and finally the exciting closing credits.

Very efficient, especially if you, like me, have little time to engage in movie viewing. Sometimes you can even get the soundtrack, assuming it has no hip-hop numbers on it.

God bless Wal-Mart, I say.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Tenebrious1]

The latter is actually how it works. If there are two versions, Walmart will only stock the cleaner one. American Pie was an early example -- the "unrated" version is not available at walmart. That, of course, encourages movie publishers to push both to market.

Which brings up an interesting dilemma. People will rent via Wal-Mart the full versions of movies. They enjoy the movie, and buy a copy from Wal-Mart. When they watch said movie, they discover that many of the scenes are missing! It never happened before because they'd always rented the edited versions from Blockbuster and thus didn't know they were scenes cut in the first place.

So what's WM going to do when customers start trying to return videos because they're not unedited versions?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Incorrect. Ever wonder why 4:3 versions say they are modified? Because if the version is in anyway different than the theatrical version and they don't mention they've changed it they are perpetrating a fraud.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Big_Al_B]

What do you do when Wal-Mart is the only game in town?

Well, I'd mosey over to the next town, I s'pose. Course'n I might need an auto-mo-bile fer that.

Or I may shop online. Or by mail order. Or have a cityslicker cousin buy movies for me.

Inconvenience is not censorship.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[brontus3927]

However, the fact of the matter is than everyone knows this already.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

But his speeling was fantastek!

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[winkydink]

Chances are, you won't be happy with Netflix either.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[MrLint]

When I visited Taipei, the porn was on the shelves right next to the anime and kids movies

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[danheskett]

I have had this argument with people before. There is no place in the country where Wal-Mart is the only place you buy DVDs. Find me a place. Give me a name. I've been looking because I used to have the same opinion as you, until I started to try to find the name of place that fit the bill!

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[JaxGator75]

When I still lived in N. FL, they could only rent "softcore" and "simulated" pr0n movies. I didn't know this until I worked up enough balls to rent a pr0n movie one day (WAY back when my 2400 Hayes wasn't bringing the b00bs fast enough to launch a good one).

Apparently, they would take a normal pr0n movie and only show the scenes where you couldn't actually see penetration. Showing genitals was not a problem, but ANY kind of penetration was edited out. Then, right as the dude would get all excited and groany, fade to black and que the next scene. Very weird, and not at ALL gratifying.

I think there are also movies made specifically to be "Simulated", but I couldn't see that business model working too well in the Information Age. . .

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[minus_273]

"Then, if Wal-Mart says: no NC-17 movies, etc., on our branded service, fine. So long as the people who are interested in it can still get it under the NetFlix name, I don't care if Wal-Mart wants to filter their product."

I dont think you can get porn on netflix anyway

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

(In the Lawnmower man, the only GOOD parts were removed).

oh, so the movie was essentially untouched and exactly as it was released, correct? (snicker)

(was this comment even worth the time it took to write, let alone for you to read it? probably not)

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Clockwork Apple]

No but the reason I have to go to any inconvenience to get uncensored DVD movies is due to the censored movies at Wal-Mart. Censorship IS censorship.

Or are you going to tell me the censored movies are not censored?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[malraid]

basically in asia aime==porn==kids movies==hentai. the content of many animes are more hardcore than many R movies in the US. One of my favorite lines is from Saint Seiya:
"but we sent you to hell!!"
"yes! but they kicked me out!"
and this was actually a "kids" anime.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[dr_dank]

Agreed. Wal-mart's buyers are notorious. They can and will dictate how a supplier can do business with Wal-mart, to the point where a supplier (Rubbermaid was a well known example) would have to open their books to Wal-mart to see where "inefficiencies" could be found.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Wal-Mart allows other people to provide services under contract rather than providing those services themselves in their own stores.

A better example would be the Walmart Photo Center which is just a rebranded site.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[tOaOMiB]

Errr, pardon me for inquiring, but why is it so expensive to produce both an edited and unedited version of a DVD? All the edits have already taken place (for TV, VHS, whatever)...so where's the expense?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Lord Dimwit Flathead]

This is fine in the primary (i.e. new) market, but if the packaging is indeed identical, when these CDs make it into the secondary (i.e. used) market, the purchaser has lost the ability to differentiate between an edited and an unedited CD.

Of course, this actually provides the record companies with an incentive to ship multiple versions with identical packaging (or with differentiation only on disposable outer-packaging such as spine stickers), as it allows them to assert that the only way to be sure that you're getting the version you want is to buy it new at retail.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[NeMon'ess]

Mail order, like overpriced columbia house? Online works I 'spose if someone has a credit card and a 'puter not infected with spyware, or they trust using it at the public library. Cityslicker cousin, what part of instant gratification now! don't you understand?

BTW, is it still not censorship if I have to go to another country to see or get something?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[bozojoe]

You mean a clam? or a hairless starfish?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[MBGMorden]

While CD's might be a different story, I've never heard of Wal-mart selling censored DVD's (though I'll admit that I could be wrong on this). I'm sure there are some things that they might refuse to carry, but IMHO that's vastly different than buying a movie and having a nude scene removed for language bleeped out just for Wal-mart.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[chaotixx]

Netflix doesn't depend on Wal-mart for revenue at all. I don't see why they would let Wal-mart push them around on anything.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[pantycrickets]

Hmmm...I wonder how a censored pr0n movie will be like

You ever watch the USA Network late at night?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Big_Al_B]

Or are you going to tell me the censored movies are not censored?

In short, yes. They are modified, surely (which probably makes them suck a lot), but Walmart is just a huge sales channel for content providers, who in this case are movie distributors.

If distributors own the rights to the content, and choose to modify the content to meet Walmart's policies, it's their choice.

I'm not surprised the choose to modify content. That way they can exploit Walmart's retail channels. For a lot of money. For the distributors. And it's their movie. That they modified. Ergo, no one "censored" it.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Clockwork Apple]

http://skyways.lib.ks.us/towns/Wellington/shopping .html

Have a look, as far as I know there is no other place here that sells retail dvds. I am told that the two video rental places only sell old rental dvds, selection is VERY limited.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[damiangerous]

That's an interesting assertion, do you have any evidence for it? Not even "everyone" on Slashdot seems to know, since it comes up nearly every time there's a related discussion here.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Big_Al_B]

BTW, is it still not censorship if I have to go to another country to see or get something?

Is an authoritative body here (i.e. some executive branch of local/state/fed government) preventing you, by statute, from seeing or getting it here? Then that's censorship.

Is it just a rare, unimported, overseas version of Shania's latest? Then that's inconvenience.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[damiangerous]

You've basically described any movie shown on Cinemax (Skinemax) or Showtime after 10pm.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, if it starts to SUCK, we can always head over to http://greencine.com/. Corporate life can be gruesome, but it can also be very beneficial... as long as you can opt-out.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

They do have censored DVD's, but it isn't some exclusive Walmart kind of thing, Target and a bunch of other places do it also. I got suckered into buying the edited version of Requiem for a Dream and didn't realize it until after I had opened it.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

I guess you have never stayed in a Las Vegas hotel!

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[pantycrickets]

A CD you buy at Wal-Mart may not be the same CD you buy at a local CD shop, despite identical packaging.

The lack of a parental advisory sticker should be your first clue.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[killmenow]

I dont (sic) think you can get porn on netflix anyway

No, but you can get stuff like this.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[dq5 studios]

Did you happen to check the deleted scenes? Because what they show on tv is the extended cut. The dvd has the theatrical cut.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Big_Al_B]

So a multi-million dollar repackaging was set in order.

But you've left out a major part of this story. Let me suggest this modification:

"My girlfriend's company wanted a gagillion-million dollars from selling oil on Walmart shelves worldwide, so they voluntarily initiated a multi-million dollar repackaging project to satisfy Walmart's corporate buyers."

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Johnny5000]

However, the fact of the matter is than everyone knows this already.

Didn't the tobacco companies try to use that as a defense? I don't think it worked out so well for them.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[wo1verin3]

It's horrible actually. In Japan they have to cover the male and female private areas... so it's like watching an episode of cops where the penis is the suspect.... break and entering?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Afrosheen]

It'd be a hell of alot longer than 3 minutes if it was edited. Particularly in Kill Bill 2, there's an insane amount of dialog and ponderous pauses.

Not that I don't like dialog in my action movies but there wasn't very much 'memorable' dialog like other Tarantino films have had.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[jdbo]

Wow, I'm sad that its such an expensive proposition to redub/otherwise edit a film.

It's too bad that it's such an expensive proposition - otherwise we might have gotten to watch Japanese Monster and Hong Kong Kung fu films shown on Saturday afternoon TV. As it is, we've never been able to see Godzilla, Bruce Lee, and so many films of that genre, which I hear are much beloved overseas, but which I have never seen!

It's also too bad that Hollywood hasn't been able to re-distribute its films world-wide - it's just much too expensive to produce a French version of a film. I'll bet Sar Wars might be popular in non-English-speaking countries, too!

And it's just far too expensive despite the fact that all-digital editing suites have drastically reduced the costs of the editing/dialog replacement process. Only kings can afford such things!

Yes, it's all too bad that it's such an expensive proposition.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[soft_guy]

Move out of that crappy town.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

anime sucks, shut the hell up

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[dangitman]

Er, how does a *store* choosing what merchandise to sell to *customers* who choose to shop there constitute censorship again?

Given that governments often give financial incentive to companies like Wal-Mart to move into town, and use eminent domain to acquire land for Wal-Mart. Once Wal-Mart is in town, it drives other businesses out.

So, in places where the government has helped Wal-Mart it does amount to censorship indirectly, because the government has no place funding that kind of activity.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[cpotoso]

Last week I asked in Schnucks (a grocery store in MO that has a video club) if they had "Badass". The clerk smiled and said that the corporation would probably not find such a name acceptable...

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[TerminaMorte]

So, please post the timecode for an example of this editing and I will go and try to confirm it on my copy tonight.

Mmm, mmm. Smells like defensism.

Wouldn't it be easy to just ask him what parts he remembers being removed, so you can watch it and see for yourself?

Who the hell would waste the time to look up timecodes to appease some random guy on slashdot?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[I'm Spartacus!]

Companies don't censor anything. Governments do. Companies choose to sell or not to sell a product or service based on the economic repercussions of doing so.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[|/|/|||]

"but we sent you to hell!!" "yes! but they kicked me out!"

Uh, I fail to see what isn't "kid friendly" about those two lines. Am I missing something?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[nigelc]

Conversely, Wal-Mart will gain a lot of business from people (stereotypically identified as "fundies") who want to shop somewhere where they are not in any danger of finding a copy of "Anal Entries 16", "Cum Gargling Whores 11" and so forth.

Wal-mart has made a business decision that there is more money to be made by catering to the "genteel" (i.e. non-pr0n) market than there is to be lost from us^h^hyou perverted people. And you know what, they are probably right. There's a fairly small retail OTC market for pr0n, when you can buy/rent/download over the Internet. But there are a lot of people worried about "moral decay" in present society who will shop in a pr0n-free zone, and who will tell two friends, and they tell two friends and so on.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Aggrazel]

"He fixes the cable?"

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[|/|/|||]

Yeah, because I already know which albums are supposed to have a parental advisory.

Not a very realistic strategy. I've got a more effective one, though - I never buy anything from Wal-Mart.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[TheRealMindChild]

Sure. The whole part where the monkey comes to Job's house (Job thinks he is CyboMan), then he gets blown to smitherines... that was taken out.

When Job later is all twisted and Evil and he goes and makes the doctors wife go out and start shooting at the men in black, while they blow her to bits.... that part is removed as well.

kthx

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[negativeview]

Very few movies are made and targetted for the ~$5 price-point.

Most movies are made by people who are so wrapped up in their idea and so convinced of their talent that they expect to be another Star Wars. If censored versions are made it's before they realize just how big of a flop their movie was destined to become.

Also, a lot of those movies were at one time decent-selling movies. They just don't sell well anymore. I can't count the amount of John Wayne movies in there.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[|/|/|||]

I can't speak for everyone else, but I'm happy with Netflix. I think turnaround time depends on where you live, but my returns get there the next day and my new movie usually shows up the day after that.

I've heard people complain about their interface, but I really can't understand that. I guess maybe it's complicated if you don't use computers (or GUIs?) much, but it's really quite simple and useful. It works fine in Firefox, even when doing things (browsing, adding/removing movies, etc) from multiple tabs.

I've gotten a few broken and scratched DVDs, but not enough to make it annoying.

As for the "merger", I would be leery of having some sort of Wal-Mart/Netflix combo account - you might be better off just opening a new Netflix account from scratch. Who knows, though - you would need to look into the details of the planned transition.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

> The fact that it isn't CLEARLY labelled as such,
> masquerading as the real thing, IS censorship.

Not isn't, its FRAUD.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[EggyToast]

I believe the "return" issue has come up in the past. Since it's marked on the packaging, Walmart doesn't have to honor a return. And since you can't return DVDs that are opened, they don't need to allow consumers to return DVDs.

IIRC, Walmart's response is "they can buy their DVD somewhere else if they don't like it." Many of us do just that, although it doesn't deter many regular walmart shoppers.

Generally, those that disagree with Walmart's DVD and CD practices are those of us who also have a long-standing boycott on the company, so I'm not sure whether it really bothers them.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Big_Al_B]

But Walmart isn't editing the content. It's the music/movie distributors who own the rights to the content, and who want oodles of cash from selling oodles of CDs/DVDs. I assure you, they modify the content voluntarily to satisfy Walmart corporate buyers.

When the content providers voluntarily change the content themselves, it's not censorship. It's "editing the content in exchange for (lot's of) money."

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[resin8]

"Don't be fatuous, Jeffrey"

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[WindBourne]

No. She fixes the cable. He was suppose to fix the pipes.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[denidoom]

Yeah, in N.FL back in the day you couldn't even rent movies like "The Last Temptation of Christ" because the stores wouldn't carry it out of fear.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[denidoom]

don't forget the spray paint for huffing and the Enquirer for feeding your need to pry into others lives and rightiously criticize them.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[damiangerous]

Why? The music I buy doesn't usually have any sort of sticker. The occasional four letter word doesn't really warrant that, but it's apparently too much for Wal-Mart. On the last CD I bought from Wal-Mart, probably a dozen years ago, the only swearing was the word "fucked" appearing three time in three successive sentences. Apparently that was too much for Wal-Mart since they changed it to "messed". It's not a big deal in the scheme of things, but the fact that they needed to lie about it (even the CD insert lyrics had the word fuck!) ensured I wouldn't buy CDs from them anymore.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[qurk]

Actually, until I was reading these comments, I was unaware that Walmart edits the DVD's they sell. I knew they edited the cd's, which is extraordinarily rude. I never have understood why they don't put a big label on the cd's explaining that they have taken liberties with the content and they are not selling the original. I'm actually kindof mad about this, as I bought like 10 DVD's for Christmas presents last year at Wal-Mart, I had no idea I was giving my friends and family a wacked out "Wal-mart special". Wal-mart will be hearing from me about this!

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Jherek Carnelian]

Errr, pardon me for inquiring, but why is it so expensive to produce both an edited and unedited version of a DVD? All the edits have already taken place (for TV, VHS, whatever)...so where's the expense?

There is a whole lot more to DVD production than simple video editing. It requires duplication of the mastering process, duplicate production runs, etc. Essentially it is the same thing as producing two entirely different DVDs. That might be reasonable for a title that sells for $20, but the given example of "The Lawnmower Man" is one that was actively stocked for only a few few months and then only in the Wal-mart "$5-$6" dump bins. Those discs have seriously little margin to begin with and don't sell in the kind of volume that the major new releases sell in that there is no way it would be profitable for the studio to go to the effort - they would just not sell the title to wal-mart in the first place.

Furthermore, wal-mart's point-of-sale system is set up so that if you are buying a DVD with scenes that walmart thinks are inappropriate for children it prompts the cashier to verify that the buyer is at least 17 years of age. If walmart were selling watered down DVDs, they would have no need to make such verifications in the first place.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Mochatsubo]

[Insert blue collar worker here] comes into the scene. Smiles at woman....Woman wipes off egg whites from her face. Fade to black.

-mim

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[damiangerous]

So they *are* labelled then...

Maybe they are now, I have no idea. The last CD I bought from them about a dozen years ago most assuredly was not. In fact, the word "fucked" still appeared in the lyrics sheet despite it being dubbed to "messed" in the song.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Old Telco Guy]

Plumber comes in, offers to snake the pipes. Housewife smiles at him seductively... ...And the plumber leaves the house.

Dude! It's more like "Plumber comes in, offers to pray with the lady for her everlasting soul. She is saved. Jesus is Lord."

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

They have to make cleaned up versions for television broadcast, because 1 bible thumper can put in a claim against the local tv/cable provider with the FCC and if the complaint isn't a compeltely fabricated one bam they get hit with a fine..

The fact that wal-mart demands the cleaner version doesn't mean the cleaner version was made for them... it was made by studios because it's quite profitable to sell the rights to the show to numerous television channels etc..

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Inebrius]

Walmart isn't the only game in town, and neither is Netflix or Blockbuster for online rental stores. There are at least 4 competitive adult rental stores that can be found easily by googling.

Here's one: http://www.sugardvd.com/

They work basically like netflix. The only drawback I see is there is limited availability on the more popular movies, but since you can have an unlimited queue and most of the Adult movies are basically the same, this is generally not a problem.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[siriuskase]

It was the movie maker who had to create two versions if he expected to be carried by Walmart. It doesn't cost Walmart anything at all.

If the market economy works, it doesn't cost the filmmaker anything either since he more than makes up the cost with the additional sales. If you live in some parts of the country, it's the Walmart version or no version at all.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Er, how does a *store* choosing what merchandise to sell to *customers* who choose to shop there constitute censorship again?

If that's censorship then I guess my local whole foods market is guilty too, because they don't carry Cap'n Crunch Peanut Butter Crunch. All they carry is some crappy organic peanut butter puffs. The *bastards*.

I'm going to *guess* that you're the *kind of guy* that uses *air-quotes* quite often when *speaking* to *others*.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[siriuskase]

"Wal-Mart sells DVDs that have had their content edited (dubbed words, cut scenes), and only mention it in small type that you have to know to look for."

That's not any different than finding Macintosh software at Walmart, you just have to know which fine print to look for. But, maybe that's another form of censorship.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Kadin2048]

Uh...slow down there. I don't think anyone actually said that WalMart edits their DVDs, they were just asking whether they do.

Furthermore, the controversy is over censorship in the *selection*, i.e. they don't sell porno movies, not in the content of the films they do sell.

I think it's very unlikely that you'd buy a movie at WalMart and find that it was any different from the exact same movie if you'd rented it at Blockbuster. The only exception might be where two different versions of a DVD were released (Eurotrip or American Pie, for instance, had R-rated theatrical versions and Unrated director's cuts...there I suspect that WalMart probably sells the R-rated version, although maybe not), and even then, you'd be able to tell by looking at the MPAA rating on the back.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[siriuskase]

Ah, eminent domain, if a thread gets long enough, all our favorite topics get into it.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Moofie]

Well, there's nothing on the Kool Aid label that says it doesn't contain Drano...does that mean it's OK to put Drano in the Kool Aid?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[d1v1d3byz3r0]

The problem is that Walmart shouldn't have the right to censor someone else's artistic work. If an artist intended to be offensive, then you should be the offensive record or not buy the offensive record. Buying a watered-down version is an insult.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Big_Al_B]

That would be an "incorrect" guess. :^)

The * is a lazy man's (i.e. me) bold tag.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[d1v1d3byz3r0]

Netflix does much of their production on-demand anyway, so I don't think that will be much of a problem. The DVDs you rent are burned and silk screened by Netflix more often than not (to replace the ones that are broken or damaged in shipping). So I don't think the mastering or production runs would be much of a problem.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[siriuskase]

" "but we sent you to hell!!" "yes! but they kicked me out!""

Sounds like the punch line for a preacher's joke, you know, the kind of joke they might include in the sermon.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Kadin2048]

Check the box of the movie you bought. If it says "Rated R" and really is missing scenes that were in the original release (which was rated R), then you might have a case. But I have a feeling that it probably says "Rated PG" or "PG-13" because it's the broadcast-edited version. In which case you got was exactly what was advertised...you just didn't read the fine print well enough.

It's not hard to check stuff like this. If the rating seems unusually low, then it's probably an edited version. You can easily find the original rating by searching IMDB...which won't help you if you're impulse-purchasing from the bargain bin, but then again if that's what you're doing I have very little sympathy for you. (Alternately you could just check them when you get home before you take the shrink-wrap off, and they're still returnable.)

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Dan Up Baby]

Yeah, we're pretty much all like that.

Seriously, did somebody with a fish magnet on their car kill your dog or something?

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[qurk]

Hehe, thanks. Ya I realised I should do a little investigation before I got on the phone. Several of the movies I bought there don't seem to be edited, so :) Will probably ask next time, just to be sure!

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[notthe9]

Now if you will exuse me I have to pick up some beer, a carton of cigarettes, and a gun at Walmart.

I don't see how any of those would be inconsistent with being Christian or are unwholesome. Hell, Jesus drank... his critics even accused him of being a drunkard for it.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[jschottm]

Well, there's nothing on the Kool Aid label that says it doesn't contain Drano...

You mean besides the ingredient label?

Please cite a law [in .us] stating that there's any regulation on what can and can't be said on a box, so long as it's not false. If I really wanted to, I could hire the same actors to be in two movies with the same name and put one version out on film and one version out of DVD. It would be a really stupid idea as consumers would return it and stores would refuse to stock it. But it wouldn't be fraud.

P.S. Don't drink the Kool Aid.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Bander]

I would almost rather see the edited version. Netflix has sent me the unedited versions of everything I've asked for... As much as I like Jennifer Connelly without clothes, Requiem for a Dream was a lot less sexy than I imagined such a scenario could be.

I was pissed with Hollywood Video when I discovered the only version of Y Tu Mama Tambien (sorry about the lack of accent marks) was the expurgated one. Not that they care, but that was the last time I was ever in their store.

Bander

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[AmberBlackCat]

I bought an R-rated DVD at Wal-Mart last week and the cash register insisted the cashier determine that I was over 17 years old. So I assume their censorship only applies to music. Also, the cashier never asked for ID. Just saying you're over 17 is enough.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Fuck that! You are wrong.

They do NOT advertise that there material is censored, and you can't returned opened movies.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

I saw the movie in the theater and neither of those scenes were part of the movie.

Looking at the DVD (which I did not purchase from wal-mart), the first scene you describe is in the deleted scenes section on side 2 as "1. Cyberman Sequence" and the second scene you describe is "12. Death of Caroline."

I suggest you put your disc in, play side 2 and look for the same. I am 100% certain that you will find the same thing because there has never been a single DOCUMENTED case of wal-mart (or blockbuster) selling/renting custom-edited DVDs. All the claims are urban legends and yours is not the first to have been debunked on slashdot either.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Ender_Wiggin]

Christians think that. Muslims say that Jesus, peace be upon him, never drank alcohol, and when he comes back, will be a prohibitionist.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[roseblood]

I know this is offtopic but,

No never had my dog ran over by an overly proud christian but I got to see one INTENTIONALY put two childrens life at risk, commit a few other crimes, and get arrested.

I didn't see any turns signals flashing (I'm not saying the driver didn't signal, but I sure as hell didn't see it) before a vehicle pulled infront of me, over a double-yellow line, from the HOV (carpool) lane to my left leaving very little sapce between that van/suv (if you must ask the Mercedes Minivan that's marketed as an SUV) and my car (was driving the "solo car"[as opposed to the minivan for whoever is driving with our daughter], a Honda Civic 2 door.) Well, I honked. The driver slammed on their brakes while showing the world the middle finger.

The civic sheds speed faster than her huge "worldly treasure that will be beset upon by rust, worms, and thieves." Frustrated (assumption) by the fact she didn't kill me with her rear bumper the first time, she repeated this break-slam process until we were both below 10 MPH on a 4 lane highway with a posted 65MPH speed limit. At this time I got a great look at her Harvest Crusade stickers (for the last 2 years,) a silverized plastic fish, and a "in case of rapture" sticker.

Needless to say I dialed 911 and got off the freeway to get away from the psycho woman (didn't know it was a woman at the time.) She exited behind me. I pulled into a well lit gas station and asked the gentleman at the counter to dial 911 (yes, I was also on my cell phone at the same time but could not tell the CHP dispatcher my current location as I had no clue beyond the name of the exit I had just taken.) The woman durring this time had pulled up next to my car (and this is when I first was able to ID her as a woman) and began to beat on the hood of my car with an umbrella (not, it wasn't raining.) She put in a few small dents, scatched the hell out of my hood, and destroyed her umbrella.

A CHP officer pulled into the parking lot when she was entering the gas-station store with the handle of her umbrella (and the sharp bit of metal still sticking out of it.)

After she was in handcuffs in the back seat of the CHP car three city police officers arived. The woman was promptly forgiven by her savior, but she was arrested on charges of vandalism, reckless endangerment, brandishing a weapon, making terrorist threats (no, she wasn't a terrorist, but that's what the officers called it) and child endangerment. While I was stuck spending my evening giving statements, her husband (asumption on my part) came and took home two children she had in the van/suv with her.

I wasn't asked to testify at any trial. I assume she had made some sort of plea, she was defenitely on tape working my car over and then coming into the store threatening to "shove this thing up your[my] stupid Arab ass." (I'm not even Arab, I'm of Hispanic descent, for what that's worth.) I don't know if the cameras in that store also recorded audio, but the man at the store also heard her well enough to tell the police on the phone that she was "going to try and kill" me.

I really hope for those childrens' sake that she has had some professional help. As a parent what she did with those kids in the car has a much greater impact on me than what she did to me.

Putting those two kids at risk with her driving, her attempts to cause an accident, and exposing them to the stress of seeing police who have their guns drawn point them at their mommy then put her in handcuffs... I can't even make sentences now, I still get worked up over the terrible things she did to those children that night.

I'm not the GP in this thread, but let's start with the least hyporitcal thing going on with that psycho woman.

No, I won't... I'm going to click submit and look at my sleeping baby and be thankful that my daughter will NEVER have to experience a mother like that woman.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[notthe9]

The question was of consistency within a Christian worldview. The gospels record on several occasions that Jesus drank alcohol.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[TheRealMindChild]

Sorry Sancho...

Both of those scenes were in the theater version... I remember them distinctly. They are also in the VHS release I have... and the Phillips pressed CD-i VCD. And my wal-mart DVD HAS NO side two.

The only think that got debunked here is your pride. Please drive through.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Jherek Carnelian]

The DVDs you rent are burned and silk screened by Netflix more often than not (to replace the ones that are broken or damaged in shipping)

You are just making that up. For one, netflix's dvds are not burned, I have never seen a single DVD-/+R disc from them, they are all factory pressed originals. Nobody does onesies and twosies of pressed discs.

So I don't think the mastering or production runs would be much of a problem.

You've lost the context of the discussion. This is about whether or not WAL-MART (not netflix) SELLS (not rents) specially censored versions of DVDs.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[|/|/|||]

Yeah, I guess that's not really appropriate for kids then. Too susceptible to brainwashing.

No, I'm kidding. Fantasy is perfectly fine for kids, as long as they have supportive adults to help them distinguish reality from fancy. They (hopefully) will understand that in reality nobody can fly, and that there are no dragons or wizards or angels or any of that stuff. It's harmless fantasy, until you have some crazy adult that actually believes in it.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Jherek Carnelian]

He's right, you are wrong.

I went home as promised and looked at my walmart purchased lawnmower man DVD. It is double-sided and it has exactly the same deleted scenes as he specified. You are wrong about seeing them in the theater, imdb specifically lists them as part of a director's cut.

As for your DVD being single-sided, Sony-tristar-columbia has a despicable practice of silently converting their double-sided releases into single-sided ones to save a few pennies. They do this without changing the UPC and sometimes the first pressings still use the old artwork that claims double-sided. Usually this means dropping the widescreen side and keeping the foolscreen side. These discs often show up in wal-marts dump bins before they show up anywhere else, but eventually they replace the title at all retailers. Also, when wal-mart first adds a title to a dump-bin it is still double-sided and only turns into single-sided after a few restocks.

Now, that is sony and Lawnmower man is Newline, but maybe they do the same kind of thing too - which would be terrible but like Sony would be Newline's fault and not wal-mart. Again, my lawnmower man that I purchased from wal-mart is double-sided, but I bought it a long time ago.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[evan1l38]

Except that if they are going to censor what they sell, they should actually TELL you they are censoring it. It should be quite clear, like a big sticker that says "Censored edition" on the box, and not be done in such a way that most folks have no idea that this is being done at all. That is what bothers me - not that they do it, but that they do it so quietly so that you don't realize you're buying it.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[denidoom]

What do you mean "we're?"
Are you a big Wal-mart goer or something?
What does one call a Wal-mart goer anyhow? A Wal-martian?

just trying to lighten up

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Rakarra]

I went home as promised and looked at my walmart purchased lawnmower man DVD. It is double-sided and it has exactly the same deleted scenes as he specified. You are wrong about seeing them in the theater, imdb specifically lists them as part of a director's cut.

I never saw the theatrical/dvd releases, but I do remember the wife being controlled and getting blown away by the law when it was shown on USA back in the mid-90s.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[d1v1d3byz3r0]

No, they do produce CDs On Demand. I'm not making it up. I've had NetFlix since the first month the service existed. They used to send out DVDs with the original full-color artwork. They don't anymore. They are now almost always silver-on-grey, burned single-color discs. Netflix is licensed by the movie studios to rent out a certain number of discs to their customers. If I rent a disc in Chicago, but the only available licensed discs are in California, they hold the one in California and burn a disc on-demand in Chicago. It's cheaper for them to make a new disc than it is to send the disc from California. From my understanding, they've been doing that way for the past 2 years or so.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Let's see some sort of supporting evidence for your claims.

Perhaps you are unfamiliar with recordable DVDs, their data layer is a distinct purple color. They are the only kind of DVDs for which it is economically feasible to make on demand.

It is FAR more likely that they have a contract with the big studios that allows them to warehouse plenty of excess copies in advance and as long as they keep good inventory control, the studios "trust" netflix not to send out more DVDs simultaneously than they have officially licensed.

Re:Wal-mart censorship

[Anonymous Coward]

Given that governments often give financial incentive to companies like Wal-Mart to move into town, and use eminent domain to acquire land for Wal-Mart. Once Wal-Mart is in town, it drives other businesses out.

As I said in another response, it would be naive to believe that Wal-Mart will act in a host community's best interest--or, frankly in its employees, customers, suppliers, or competitors interests. Wal-Mart's bad rep is absolutely well deserved.

However, local governments are hot for larger tax roles, hot for new job growth, and hot for attracting consumer traffic to their communities. Therefore, they court enterprises such as Wal-Mart--and many, many others.

So, in places where the government has helped Wal-Mart it does amount to censorship indirectly, because the government has no place funding that kind of activity.

Since movie distributers who own the movie rights do the editing in order to please Wal-Mart corporate buyers, there is no censorship. It's voluntary content modification for increased profit through Wal-Mart sales.

Maybe it's about the Patent netflix has?

[iKaz]

Hmm?

Re:Maybe it's about the Patent netflix has?

[iKaz]

http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/06/24/145822 3

Re:Maybe it's about the Patent netflix has?

[The Jonas]

Probably not:

"We're studying our options about what to do about the patent, but our primary strategy doesn't rely on patents. Our primary strategy is to have a service that works better than any other service -- that consumers not only like but rave about to their friends -- and that's what's propelling our growth"

From this link to an interview with Netflix CEO, Reed Hastings.

Here a link to radio interview with him as well.

Blockbuster campaign

[E IS mC(Square)]

New Blockbuster campign "No late fees! And this time its for real!!"

Re:Blockbuster campaign

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't understand Blockbuster's latest promotion. They say you don't pay a late fee for X amount of days after the due date. Well... doesn't that mean the due date isn't on the date they tell you, but instead the due date is REALLY on that date plus X amount of days? I'm confused.

Re:Blockbuster campaign

[Lovesquid]

I managed a Blockbuster for 2 years. Worst job I ever had. Seemed like every single day there was either a lawsuit pending from someone who got screwed over, or a mistake on late fees that I had to accept being screamed at about (like it was my own personal fault), or $500 in shoplifting loss (it happens when you have enough hours to staff only 1 employee most of the time). Nothing is more mind-numbing that repeatedly opening then closing like 2000 video/DVD cases per day to verify their contents.

I mean all retail jobs blow monkey dick, but this one blew Kong. I've never set foot in any Blockbuster store since I left.

Re:Blockbuster campaign

[sandman935]

The problem is that you need a new frame of reference. Try working in the agriculture or construction field and it won't take long before you wax nostalgic about the good ole days at Blockbuster.

Re:Blockbuster campaign

[Anonymous Coward]

I was planning on doing just that, but I have to get these TPS reports out.....

Re:Blockbuster campaign

[sandman935]

Ummmm.... yeah... okay... great...

Hey Blockbuster...

[LegendOfLink]

You can kiss your ass goodbye...Always.

Re:Hey Blockbuster...

[0110011001110101]

Actually the article that I read on this (different source) said that 100K customers is almost nothing in the battle between Netflix and Blockbuster. I guess that was sort of the point, Walmart had so few customers (relatively) that they were never catching up to Netflix (3 million?) which is why they got out of game.

Re:Hey Blockbuster...

[cdrudge]

Blockbuster has around 750k customers. Netflix has four times that amount with 3m customers. 100k one way or another isn't exactly huge, but it is still quite significant. It's more then 1/8th of Blockbuster's business that Netflix doesn't have to immediately fight for if Wal-mart would have just discontinued the service and let people fend for themselves.

oh no!

[Anonymous Coward]

... no more R rated movies from netflix! only good christian fare :(

Re:oh no!

[Stop Error]

What are you talking about? There are R rated movies on Netflix.

Re:oh no!

[__aaitqo8496]

Before: "Sure, we can't vote, but we get military protection - what a sweet deal!"

After: "Oh shit! Netflix doesn't deliver to Puerto Rico"

I feel that fate has run it's course... what sweet justice.

I am kind of surprised...

[Stop Error]

I am a Netflix die hard but I figured Wal Mart with all it's capital and brand recognition would crush Netflix.

Good turn of events.

Re:I am kind of surprised...

[tazan]

I thought so too, especially as they were planning on being able to return at any walmart. That would have really increased the number of movies I watched. All in all though it's not a bad thing. Some of the more obscure movies I wanted walmart didn't carry and I think netflix will.

Re:I am kind of surprised...

[Anonymous Coward]

Read up on how Walmart kills off competition. Give it time.

Re:I am kind of surprised...

[ultramk]

Well, the thing is that the WM brand is big in rural areas where they are THE sole bastion of high technology. Stop laughing.

I mean, have you seen those commercials where the hip teenager explains how these new DVD thingys are just da BOMB?

-shudder-

Come on, these people have never even heard of Netflix. The geeks among them have AOL.

For everyone else, was there really any question who would win?
m-

Re:I am kind of surprised...

[tono]

That's kind of offensive to me. In VERY rural areas I'm talking less than 4,000 people your comment holds some weight. However, anyting larger and you're just talking out your ass, yes wal-mart has horrifying commercials. They don't really understand the concept of "hip." But those of us who work at wal-mart aren't entirely stupid. During the tech bubble deflation we had electrical engineers from HP working our electronics department and still have a lot of very knowledgable people. However, the store in your area may be different, but here in FC, CO we're fairly good. And I've been a big NetFlix supporter since 1999 but thanks.

Re:I am kind of surprised...

[CodeArtisan]

That's kind of offensive to me. In VERY rural areas I'm talking less than 4,000 people your comment holds some weight.

And I'm sure that for the inhaibtants of VERY rural areas of less than 4000, your comments are equally offensive to them.

Re:I am kind of surprised...

[tazan]

Yes, I'm offended. Maybe in very rural areas of less than 40 people:) The big difference from living in the big city is I hear gunshots slightly more often. Of course I no longer run to lock my door when I do.

Re:I am kind of surprised...

[essell]

In Fort Collins, CO? You're on the inside looking out then. People from the big city may have an entirely different impression of Ft. Fun and its inhabitants. Being from Denver, I assert this to be true.

I commend you on your grammar, but you do not speak for the common denominator of the city you live in. :)

Re:I am kind of surprised...

[gregoryc]

"That would have really increased the number of movies I watched." Why's that? Is your local Wal-Mart closer than you're mailbox? Or is it a speed thing?

Re:I am kind of surprised...

[ultramk]

Well, I'm sorry you're offended. It wasn't my intention.

My observations are based on who shops at (and works at) the closest one to me (30 miles away, in a semi-rural area), as well as the one that my cousin manages at (way out in the boonies).

Mind you, this isn't a terribly rural area, and WM's wages aren't even slightly competitive here. The result here is that anyone competent/informed got a better job a long time ago. YMMV.

I never said anyone was stupid, btw. Just not tech-savvy. ...and if you're going to be offended by negative comments about WM, you must spend a lot of your time being offended.

m-

Re:I am kind of surprised...

[tazan]

If I could return them at walmart I'm assuming they could scan them as returned and I would save the 3 days it takes to mail them back. Not neccessarily a valid assumption I suppose, but it seems likely to me they would scan them there just to make sure they have a record of what went into the system.

100k customers..

[LewsTherinKinslayer]

.. who die a little inside.

Re:100k customers..

[Neil Blender]

.. who die a little inside.

Not possible. WalMart customers are the walking dead.

Re:100k customers..

[Anonymous Coward]

I thought they hired the walking dead as the store front greeters?

WalMart = Microsoft of retail

[KingVance]

Wal mart is actually giving up a market instead of pricing them out of business?

Re:WalMart = Microsoft of retail

[geoffspear]

Nah, it's just outsourcing. Giving up the market would involve shutting down their service altogether instead of getting someone else to do it.

And apparently they were smart enough to realize that a DVD-by-mail service for US customers just can't be run out of China for cheaper.

Re:WalMart = Microsoft of retail

[AviLazar]

That would imply that Wal mart is paying netflix. They are doing cross-advertising. Wal mart recommends netflix, for rentals and netflix recommends wal mart to purchase the dvd's.

So yes, wal mart is shutting down their rental service entirely...they are giving their customer base to netflix for a promise of advertisement. Businesses do it all the time "we not only sell you our physical store which is worth 100k, but we are selling you client-base which is worth 1 million."

As a Netflix customer, I have to say...

[Anonymous Coward]

In return, Netflix will remind its subscribers that they can buy DVDs from Walmart.com.

No thanks

Re:As a Netflix customer, I have to say...

[tono]

Especially considering Wal-Mart doesn't sell most of the DVD's that Netflix rents. This could pose a serious problem for the big W. As someone who works at a Wal-Mart I can attest to the problems they're having with the website and stores not carrying the same thing. This will only exacerbate the problem.

Re:As a Netflix customer, I have to say...

[MaineCoon]

Just click the little "close" box on the Ad, they'll go away (so far, it hasn't come back, and I've logged out/in, close and open new browser window, etc).

Re:As a Netflix customer, I have to say...

[Locke2005]

Huh? I'm running FireFox on Linux, and I don't get any ads...

Re:As a Netflix customer, I have to say...

[frogbucket]

I'm not fond of Netflix being in bed with the devil (Walmart) But that won't stop me from keeping my dvd-r humming.

Mmmm, sweet irony...

[NeuroManson]

Usually it's the other way around with Wal-Mart.

Re:Mmmm, sweet irony...

[jschottm]

Usually it's the other way around with Wal-Mart.

I expect they did a market analysis. The DVD rental business will fail in not too many years when internet delivery of movies becomes the preferred way of viewing them. Rather than building their own expensive internal business that will only last a short amount of time, they can ride on someone else's coattails, reaping a reasonable profit without having to take much of a risk or invest in infrastructure. All without the cost that an advertising was with Netflicks would have.

Plus they can use the word synergy.

Uh-oh

[thermal_noise]

...maybe, after a while, Wal-mart will force Netflix to carry only movies made in China?

Re:Uh-oh

[Anonymous Coward]

...maybe, after a while, Wal-mart will force Netflix to carry only movies made in China?

I, for one, am looking forward to the DVD release of Levenge of the Sith.

A Win For The Little Guys

[blueZhift]

Hooray for a rare win for the little guys! I've been a Netflix customer since the beginning so I'm happy to see a deal that promises to keep Netflix around a little longer. That just leaves Amazon and Blockbuster. Personally, I'd like to see Amazon do a similar deal with Netflix rather than try to crush them. Why? Because Netflix has become a good brand in the DVD mail rental space, so Amazon may have more to gain teaming up with them than fighting.

Re:A Win For The Little Guys

[mzwaterski]

Netflix is the new guy, I wouldn't really call them the little guy!

Re:A Win For The Little Guys

[shdragon]

Netflix is not a "little guy". Netflix is a publicly traded company NFLX ticker with a goal of reaching 4 million subscribers by year's end. I honestly think Walmart's going to walk away the winner here. They get to ditch their profit losing segment while simotaneously gaining free virtual endorsement from Walmart as their pick as the place to buy DVDs. FWIW, I don't think Netflix is evil like Walmart is, but calling them a "little guy" hardly seems apt given their situation.

Re:A Win For The Little Guys

[Anonymous Coward]

netflix was the company that started the whole online rent-it-by-mail dvd business... I remember watching the founders of netflix on TSS when TSS was a _Real_ show and had _Real_ hosts....

Wal-mart and amazon, and even blockbuster all tryied to immitate netflix's success.. The fact that wal-mart had to switch over from being a competitor to being a branded version of netflix shows that they not only did it first, they did it Right.

Re:A Win For The Little Guys

[kansas1051]

Obviously you havent been subject to Netflix's dubious (illegal?) practice of "throttling", whereby they stop sending DVDs to long-term customers because their market strategy is to target new customers who forget to rent movies.
I was forced to quit Netflix a year ago [as a 2+ year customer, my average wait time for a movie was 4 months near the end].
The "throttling" process is well documented in the NY Times and elsewhere (http://www.manuelsweb.com/netflixjournal2.htm), by hundreds of cheated customers.
Netflix IS the bad guy, so its bad news for them to merge with their 3rd largest competitor, as only evil (netflix) and evil (blockbuster) are left.

Competition

[MyLongNickName]

It seems to me that the there is really only room for one DVD rental-by-mail service. It is one of those commodity items that becomes cheaper to run on a per-customer basis the more customers you have. Netflix got rid of a potential competitor and gained an influential ally in the process. Now, they have to deal with Blockbuster.

In five years, only one will remain. Who will win? My money is still on Blockbuster, but the odds have definitely shifted.

Re:Competition

[tont0r]

im not sure if blockbuster will be the remaining one. rumor has it that they will be upping their prices for their online rental service plus there are people (like me) who dont really care for blockbuster anymore after their fake 'no more late fee' campaign. not to mention that netflix just absorbed walmarts customers. i think netflix will be the winner. unless video on demand takes hold then they are both screwed :P.

Re:Competition

[Anonymous Coward]

It is one of those commodity items that becomes cheaper to run on a per-customer basis the more customers you have.

You mean like software? Aside from some very low-cost fabrication (a pressed disk that, by volume cost pennies, a nice box, etc) and marketing to gain new customers, the cost of developing software ends when it's released. By that reasoning, Windows should cost no more than $20 per copy, and probably less. But you don't see that happening.

Re:Competition

[mattmentecky]

It seems to me that the there is really only room for one DVD rental-by-mail service. It is one of those commodity items that becomes cheaper to run on a per-customer basis the more customers you have. Netflix got rid of a potential competitor and gained an influential ally in the process. Now, they have to deal with Blockbuster.

*bangs head against his Capitalism Fundamentals 101 book*

Excuse me?! I really really hope you didnt mean to imply that your perceived one-player-DVD rental system is a *good* thing but good gosh man, it certainly certainly will not be cheaper!

Too often people such as the parent here get tangled up in a business idea that seems simple to reproduce or that there are many players (businesses) that are identical and then cast that area of business as needing only one of said businesses to exist. To that I say no! No no no no. Look at Coke and Pepsi. Virtually the same damn thing and both do very well! And we as consumers benefit. Microsoft has a 90% stranglehold on marketshare, would you say that we benefit in quality, cost and inovation in their one-player-sytem?

Re:Competition

[tont0r]

i remember once i went to a conference where the president of a game developer was speaking and someone asked what he thought about the prices of video games being $50 and what he feels about some games getting to $55. his reponse was 'the only thing i see wrong with the price of video games is that people wont pay more than $50 for them'

now for someone sellings millions of copies that might not be the case. but he went on explaining about risks smaller companies take in trying to earn their money back. there is a lot more to the cost of software than manufacturing and shipping costs. they actually have to pay people and lots of them to make the software. but this is extremely off topic.

MS has to worry about things like up keep on software. movies themselves are made once and just pumped out the door. so the more customers they have, the cheaper it can be.

Re:Competition

[Anonymous Coward]

Blockbuster and Netflix have different strong points. I'm betting on Netflix for the DVD rental by mail market, but rental by mail isn't really a good deal for everybody. If you only rent the occasional movie, it's cheaper and more convenient to drive to a rental place like Blockbuster, pick up a movie to watch that night, watch it at home and then drop it off the next day. At this point, Netflix is a household name for what it does, so it has a strong advantage there. On the other hand, Blockbuster could potentially offer faster delivery times by leveraging the distributed nature of its stock (mail discs from a store that's normally overnight delivery for USPS), but I'm not sure how strong such a move would be in the rental by mail market. But then, I don't rent movies so I wouldn't know.

Re:Competition

[Elwood P Dowd]

It seems to me that the there is really only room for one DVD rental-by-mail service.

Dunno why you say that. Yes, it is "one of those commodity items that becomes cheaper to run on a per-customer basis the more customers you have" but it is also a service that can vary in quality. You might prefer Netflix because it is cheaper or has a better website, while someone else may prefer ChristianFlix because it provides them with censored movies. Someone else might prefer IndieFlix because the website is better suited to their tastes.

Yes, the company with the biggest scale may be the cheapest, but I don't see why there isn't room for niche players. Greencine is profitable and not dying, and it's *tiny* compared to Netflix. If Greencine can make money doing what they do, I bet if other companies find their niche, they'll survive too.

Re:Competition

[imsabbel]

of course he meant cheaper for the COMPANY.

Re:Competition

[Minna Kirai]

In five years, only one will remain.

Yeah, just like how there is only one Cola company, and Pepsi is completely bankrupt. And like how Amazon.com is the ONLY place to buy books online.

Monoplies only happen if there is a measuable barrier-to-entry in the market, either technical or legal. Postal DVD rental doesn't have a barrier like that, so there will probably stay two companies (functionally interchangable with each other).

Re:Competition

[zbik]

In five years, only one will remain.

In five years, I will be surprised if the DVD-by-mail model is still viable. Hopefully FttP or WiMax or some other high-bandwidth protocol will make video downloading more attractive.

Netflix ought to replace their snail-mail distribution centers with Video LAN servers all over the country. That would spare the Internet from the congestion of transcontinental video traffic, and the Video LAN servers could still be updated with all the latest DVD's by mail (never underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of tapes).

Now if only there weren't so many lawyers...

Re:Competition

[The Jonas]

It is one of those commodity items that becomes cheaper to run on a per-customer basis the more customers you have.

Not exactly, because of the revenue-sharing contracts:

Vertical revenue-sharing contracts allow manufacturers and retailers, or rental companies, the ability to better manage their "coordination of inventory decisions where both firms separately maximize profits. Historically, the use of simple, linear pricing rules between manufacturers and retailers may lead to suboptimal supply of the good in that market. "Vertical" contracts, signed between an upstream manufacturer and a downstream retailer, offer more flexibility for coordinating supply decisions. Specifically, revenue-sharing contracts, in which the retailer pays the manufacturer a fee per unit of inventory as well as a percentage of the revenue generated from the inventory, allow firms greater flexibility than simple linear pricing (that is, a wholesale price per unit of inventory only)." It has been found that "firm profits decrease with the elimination of inventory restrictions, but consumers are generally better off. Eliminating both the inventory restrictions and the linear-pricing contracts generally improves consumer surplus and increases the upstream firm's profits for this set of retailers; however, it lowers downstream firms' profits.". Online video rental companies like Netflix determine profit on a per-subscriber basis. To be responsive to their customer's needs while competing on price and implementing a growth strategy they have to offer a compelling selection of products that are not readily available offline. Therefore, per Netflix CEO Reed Hastings, "So we might make slightly less per subscriber because people watch more movies, but they're happier with the service, and they tell their friends about it. Marketing is our biggest cost, so we look at it as a straight-ahead win, because doing that helps us to grow faster".

Most of this info is from here and here, respectively.

Re:Competition

[alecks]

Uhmm.. I benefite from Microsoft. XP makes it quite easy to do small video editing, import photos, and regular family stuff, like share pictures, email/net and ofcourse office. Ofcourse, I could do the same with a Mac, but I definitely have the benefit of all the games I can play on MSFT's one-player-system.

Re:Competition

[Anonymous Coward]

* Bang your head on Reading Comprehension, Remedial book *

Re:Competition

[Anonymous Coward]

Um... why.

What seems that there is only room for one service, why is the per-customer cost something that'd continue to ramp downward in your mind (after all, damaged discs and postage seem as significant as the marketing, website, database or manpower costs... beyond a certain point, you're still stuck with the cost of a stamp and a replace-ever-n-rentals average), what about amazon (they have a UK rental program, I'm told)?, what about google, etc?

And what about the day Netflix wakes up, smells the coffee, and diversifies into other markets? I mean, as a satisfied customer I'd *buy* music and movies (stripped of all that liner-notes/box crap, even) from them if they became a vendor. I'm sure there are other markets that'd lend well to regular mail-outs. What'll that do to their overall viability? What if they partner further with walmart to take advantage of walmart's distribution network to allow DVD returns (or other services) at walmart?

Seems to me, doesn't much matter what anything seems to you...

Re:Competition

[westlake]

Microsoft has a 90% stranglehold on marketshare, would you say that we benefit in quality, cost and inovation in their one-player-sytem?

well, yes. strip out the commodity hardware designed and sold for the mass-market Windows platform and what is left of your Linux PC? probably an empty box.

Re:Competition

[utexaspunk]

It seems to me that the market, at least in terms of big nationwide brands, tends toward mostly duopolies with a few other minor players. They often are red and blue, as well- Coke vs. Pepsi Target vs. Wal-Mart Costco vs. Sam's Home Depot vs. Loews Netflix vs. Blockbuster Petsmart vs. Petco Nike vs. Reebok Republicans vs. Democrats Anyone else notice this? Can you think of any more?

Re:Competition

[utexaspunk]

(fixing formatting...)

It seems to me that markets, at least in terms of big nationwide brands, mostly tend toward duopolies with a few other minor players. They often are red vs. blue, as well-

Coke vs. Pepsi
Target vs. Wal-Mart
Costco vs. Sam's
Home Depot vs. Lowe's
Netflix vs. Blockbuster Petsmart vs. Petco
Nike vs. Reebok
Marlboro vs. Camel
Republicans vs. Democrats

Anyone else notice this? Can you think of any more?

Re:Competition

[Michael O-P]

Less filling vs. Tastes great!

Re:Competition

[Shawn Parr]

Microsoft has a 90% stranglehold on marketshare, would you say that we benefit in quality, cost and inovation in their one-player-sytem?

I will probably be modded as troll for this, but so be it.

Yes, I do benifit in quality, cost and innovation from this, as I use Macintosh and Linux.

Since most of the slimy business players out there are busy trying to hijack the large & easy to break into kid on the block, that gives them less incentive to try to mess with our more secure and smaller market share workhorses.

I can get lots of work done efficiently without having to have a dual-core/dual processor system to run my extraneous firewalls, anti-spyware, anti-virus, and malware processes.

While I would gladly never have to deal with a Windows system again (or at least a lot less than I do now), I would gladly like to see them continue to be a big player as they will very likely always create code that has more holes than swiss cheese.

And that gives yet another layer of protection for those of us using OS's that allow us to work efficiently and just get work done.

Re:Competition

[ultramk]

Yeah, I can't wait till that damn Blockbuster Petsmart goes under so I don't get kitty litter in my microwave popcorn anymore!

m-

Re:Competition

[CaymanIslandCarpedie]

In five years, only one will remain.

My guess.... In five years none will remain. OK, maybe a bit over five, but not much. There are already on-line movie services. Just a bit more bandwidth going to the average home or a tech inovation where movies are more compressed with still retaining quality. I'd guess this should come pretty quickly and when it does why get movies in the mail?

Re:Competition

[bill_mcgonigle]

Stop that. The red/blue thing is freaking me out.

Re:Competition

[utexaspunk]

yeah, yeah- formatting error (on the second try, no less!) ... I do have these dog treats that I got at Petsmart called "pup-corn" that are some kind of meat-flavored popcorn-like substance...

Re:Competition

[George Tirebuyer]

Godzilla vs Mothra

Re:Competition

[susano_otter]

Okay, just for the record, I understood what "no more late fees" meant as soon as I heard it. I also intuited *immediately* that there would still be fees of some kind associated with keeping movies past their return date.

I don't know what you're talking about "fake" for. Anybody acting shocked that Blockbuster wouldn't actually let you keep their inventory indefinitely, free of charge, is either a moron or a scam artist or both.

That said, Blockbuster clearly failed to factor in the fact that 90%+ of their customers are, in fact, morons or scam artists or both. That's why their "no more late fees" program failed: Not because it was a "fake" program, but because their customer base is real asshats.

Re:Competition

[MyLongNickName]

Thanks for seeing the obvious. Apparently you are brighter than most of the mods out there :)

Re:Competition

[mdfst13]

Yes, but the niche players aren't really competitors. That's like saying that Harley Davidson is a competitor of GM. Yes, both produce wheeled vehicles, but people looking for a motorcycle aren't going to settle for a Chevette instead.

The question is if there is room for two general purpose services in DVD rental by mail. Wal-mart apparently decided that there wasn't room for three.

It's also quite possible that it might turn into a regional business. Blockbuster will dominate LA because it has a warehouse there; meanwhile, Netflix will dominate Sacramento.

A side note is that your scenario suggests a new market for Netflix. They should offer fulfillment and site management services to niche organizations. Much like Amazon does for Target, etc. That could be what kills Greencine, a competitor with their focus that uses the Netflix distribution system for economies of scale.

Re:Competition

[Darby]

Okay, just for the record, I understood what "no more late fees" meant as soon as I heard it. I also intuited *immediately* that there would still be fees of some kind associated with keeping movies past their return date.

So you magically understand that "no more late fees" means that there will be more late fees. i.e. that it is a bald faced lie and you have the audacity to claim that people who actually can think clearly, read, and process the information that they read are morons?

The fact is that they flat out lied and they got busted for their lies. There is nothing unclear in what they said.

The fact that you are defending them and attacking those who assumed that Blockbuster was telling the truth really shows your character (or utter lack thereof).

Minor Setback

[__aanmcy3303]

...the world's largest retailer couldn't beat the Internet upstart at its own game.

I doubt that it isn't going to stop Wal-Mart from squashing thousands of other upstarts.

Strike one for the good guys

[Jukashi]

Apparently there was no way to exploit the chinese to deliver dvds to hip americans!

Don't under estimate the power of the Dark Side

[multiOSfreak]

Netflix has been turned to the Dark Side. All hail the mighty Wal-Vader!

Re:Don't under estimate the power of the Dark Side

[Anonymous Coward]

Not funny.

Re:Don't under estimate the power of the Dark Side

[StalinsNotDead]

Yeah. To follow naming conventions for turners to the Dark Side, it should be Darth Mart.

Canceled

[floop]

This is as good a time as any to cancel my subscription. I really wasn't getting my money's worth anyway. Before it was choice between convenience and how much their sight design sucked but wal-mart is just evil.

Re:Canceled

[RobertB-DC]

This is as good a time as any to cancel my subscription. I really wasn't getting my money's worth anyway. Before it was choice between convenience and how much their sight design sucked but wal-mart is just evil.

I know I'm replying to flamebait, but don't you get it? YOU WON! WE WON! Wal-Mart didn't buy out the little guy. Instead, Wal-Mart decided they couldn't beat Netflix, and decided to cut their losses and make a deal while they could still pretend they didn't get their hind end handed to them.

Potential downsides abound -- Wal-Mart is notorious for its bullying of its suppliers. But Netflix has shown the determination to survive, so I think they'll make it. But I'll be keeping an eye on Hacking Netflix to see what happens next.

Re:Canceled

[east coast]

don't you get it? YOU WON! WE WON! Wal-Mart didn't buy out the little guy.

We won? Who's this we in "we won"? Do you own netflix or shares there of? Are you an employee?

Don't fool yourself. Netflix is only seen as small because they don't have the customer base yet. Given time and bad luck on the part of Blockbuster you'll see that Netflix is another corporation. Netflix isn't on a crusade, it's trying to make money and grow. That's the nature of all profitable business.

Not trying to be an ass about it but a small company getting a bit of advantage from a large company doesn't mean the small company isn't just as greedy or just as left-handed about their business practices. Not that I feel that Netflix is bad in any way, at least no more so than any other corporation.

The stuff billionaires are made of

[RealProgrammer]

Wow, hooray for Netflix, I guess.

Netflix should figure out a way to use Wal-Mart as a local cache. For the hottest releases, you don't have to wait for the thing to be delivered (or even downloaded and burned >-). You hand the Wal-Mart electronics guru your Netflix card, and they put your name in the computer.

There's got to be a way to make that work more cheaply than mailing each one.

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[Anonymous Coward]

So you want to be able to go to a store and pick up a dvd rental by just giving them your card? That's an amazing idea. Some company like blockbuster or hollywood video should offer such a service.

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[merreborn]

Retail space is expensive. A big warehouse in the middle of nowhere and some bulk, presorted postage is cheap.

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[yotto]

That's a really cool idea. Maybe you bring them a DVD you got in the mail, they scan it, drop it in their own mailbox, and hand you a new rental. That way, you still only have 3 (or whatever) movies out at any one time.

It would likely cost extra. You gotta pay for the shelf space, and the wage for the guy doing the scanning.

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[revery]

You hand the Wal-Mart electronics guru your Netflix card

guru?!?!

In which parallel dimension have you been shopping and how do I get there?

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[RealProgrammer]

>guru?!?!
>
>In which parallel dimension have you been
>shopping and how do I get there?

Yeah, right.

Recently, I had a bundle of CD blanks or something to buy, and took them to the electronics counter. The 18-year-old wunderkind behind the counter, next to the cash register, was talking to her boyfriend (or a prospect, anyway).

I asked to purchase the item. "I can't do that, you'll have to go up front", she said, and continued with her conversation about what someone went and then somebody else was like.

Thanks for standing next to the cash register, anyway.

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[CMonk]

Ha. Tha will actually involve entering a Wal Mart store. That's not a good idea, I don't think I'm up to date on my tetanus shots. Have you ever been in a Wal Mart store?

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[emc]

Agreed.

Wal-Mart can keep their 'prices are falling' advertising, and their 'quality of living is falling' corporate reality to themselves.

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[MightyMartian]

Oh Wally God, who art in heaven, right next to towels and linnens,
Hallowed be thy name, let thy monopoly come,
Let thy will be done, let thy employees work for crap wages with no overtime,
In suburban malls as it is in larger centers.
Give us today our cheap white bread,
And forgive us if we shop once in a while at Target,
As we forgive others who do the same.
Do not lead us into trial,
But give us great savings.
Amen

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[roror]

I am sure I have a Netflix dc nearer to my home in Pittsburgh than a Wallmart store.

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[bill_mcgonigle]

Something is afoot at Netflix though I'm not sure if it involves WalMart. My turnaround time has sucked in the past month and the new mailers say "Nearest Netflix Distribution Center" on them with an address in MA - last month the address was in the next town and it was great. I'm not sure if that address is meaningful or not with with "Nearest" title, maybe the USPS is doing some of the sorting work for them?

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[bill_mcgonigle]

Heh. Yeah, WalMart is full of poor people. Poor people have rabies and tetanus and stuff. Heh, they're like, dirty, Bevis... Heh...

whatever.

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[Anonymous Coward]

In which parallel dimension

Apparently the parallel dimention of California where dot bombers have fallen so low as to work in the wal-mart electronics section.. I could be wrong -- I'm just guessing here...

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[Deliveranc3]

Don't argue... go in open software box read CD-Key. Leave store...

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[NaruVonWilkins]

There is a well-documented phenomenon whereby those who are renting a lot of movies are having their deliveries slowed down to keep Netflix from losing money.

Re:The stuff billionaires are made of

[nahdude812]

But Netflix gets to save on shipping by doing a bulk shipping daily or weekly. Wal*mart gets extra income from people who come in for the movie and get attracted by other stuff (games, munchies).

good

[tont0r]

im glad walmart pulled out. im actually amazed they just didnt throw more money at it until netflix died . thats usually their business policy. actually, has walmart ever pulled out of anything before? this might be a first. what even more interesting that blockbuster has hinted that they will raise prices on their online renting so i wonder if they will be able to keep up with netflix considering they dont really have too much else to offer. wonder if soon netflix will be the only ones again to be in the online movie rental business.

It will all be over soon

[Anonymous Coward]

Once Video on Demand takes off people wont need netflix or blockbuster.

Re:It will all be over soon

[CrazyJim1]

Do you think its going to be Video on Demand that takes off, or an internet based clone. Download any television program or movie that's been ever made. It will happen. Now will it be Video on Demand on cable, or will it be something from the internet.

Re:It will all be over soon

[kob43]

Like how ebooks eliminated the need for printed books. I'm looking across the street at the demolishion teams at Barnes & Nobel and Borders right now.

Re:It will all be over soon

[yotto]

*Once Video on Demand takes off people wont need netflix or blockbuster.*

And we'll be able to watch it in our flying cars!

Re:It will all be over soon

[ultramk]

Right. I've been hearing this for about the last 10 years, but last time it was Blockbuster that would be going down the tubes due to VoD.

All we need to do is equip every home in the US with a gigabit-class network connection and a computer that can handle the flow.

Simple, right?

(perhaps your definition of "soon" is different than mine?)

m-

Re:It will all be over soon

[CaseM]

How do you think "digital cable" is already being piped to your home? Over the internet. My cable box has its own IP address and all, and I'm sure Insight Cable isn't exactly a pioneer in this regard.

Re:It will all be over soon

[Anonymous Coward]

> (perhaps your definition of "soon" is different than mine?)

No idea, but I'm pretty sure the OP has a different definition of 'humor' and 'satire' than you do.....

Re:It will all be over soon

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't be ridiculous. Books/eBooks is a terrible comparison. There are huge differences in the quality of the reading experience between an on-screen ebook and a paper book. A much better parallel would be CDs vs. online music downloads. Guess what: CDs are losing. Have you been in a record store, or in Media Play, etc lately? They are going down the shitter. I have gone from buying 100% of my music in a physical format just three years ago to buying 100% of it from iTunes at present.

Re:It will all be over soon

[Anonymous Coward]

How do you think "digital cable" is already being piped to your home? Over the internet. My cable box has its own IP address and all, and I'm sure Insight Cable isn't exactly a pioneer in this regard.

Boy, I think you sure are confused.

Re:It will all be over soon

[Gallandro]

Yeah...if Video on Demand didn't suck. In all the ones I've seen, there's a delay before any button you push takes effect. Plus, the cable company decides what programs are available. An HTPC of just about any kind (TiVO, Mythtv, etc.) offers *so* much more freedom. Plus, HD-DVDs aren't too far away. Even now, DVD quality movies are pretty big. Imagine the time and bandwidth it will take to move an HD quality movie around.

I'm sticking with my Netflix subscription. I don't know what it is about them, but I love 'em. Maybe it's something they put in their patented envelopes. Hmmmm...

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

An interesting observation about this deal

[Anonymous Coward]

Wal*Mart and NetFlix. Large companies. Agreements, money, partnership, and, ultimately, a done deal. Companies like this don't talk the talk for nothing. They have business motives. They have shareholders. They have shit to do. They can't stay stuck in today, they have to strike while the iron's hot and be living in tomorrow.

That explains the deal. They're companies with things to do and they'll stick to the things they do best.

Re:An interesting observation about this deal

[YrWrstNtmr]

Wal*Mart and NetFlix. Large companies

Both large companies in the way that elephants and mice are large compared to fleas (us).

This is a case of the elephant giving up one of it's peanuts (out of a 25lb bag) to the mouse.

Obviously

[Anonymous Coward]

You should ask for the porn section instead. Sheesh.

Re:Summary has it backwards

[east coast]

Walmart bought Netflix, not t'other way round.

From what I read no one bought anyone. Netflix is going to get the old Wal-Mart customer base but NetFlix is going to offer a sales link to Wal-Mart. I don't see it as a buy and sell but rather allowing each company to focus on either rental or retail. If anything both sides stand to profit from this; NetFlix gets the customer base on rentals and Wal-Mart can focus on the retail DVD market while dumping what was probably a less than profitable side venture along with what is basically free advertising from NetFlix.

Big story

[Golias]

In other news, it appears that Wal-Mart used to rent out DVD's.

Pleazzze tell me what i'm missing!?!?

[Halvy]

i red the article, but... how is netflix suppose to make any money when the are FORCED (via contract/agreement) to advertise for walFart on their web site!

i'm sorry, but i'v NEVER seen where a company advertises DIRECTLY for their competitors for the EXACT same products that they are tyring to sell!!

Re:Pleazzze tell me what i'm missing!?!?

[E-Rock]

Really? I see this all the time now on the web. Either in google adwords pointing to a competitor or amazon links.

Just yesterday I was adding a book to my Buy.com wishlist and on a search with the book title, the item I actually wanted was item 23 but a sponsor link (that appeared between entries 3 and 4) was a direct link to the book at amazon.com.

Re:Pleazzze tell me what i'm missing!?!?

[Halvy]

ok, i see that. i re-rtfa and it looks like walmaart is 'getting' outa the business.. but i still think since this 'deal' was done with walmart, netflix at least must feel they sold a pounda flesh now they have2 put up ads for the m$ of the retail business. :)

Re:Pleazzze tell me what i'm missing!?!?

[Anonymous Coward]

Netflix isn't going to show Walmart ads to all their customers, just the 100K or so that transfer over as part of this deal.

Re:Pleazzze tell me what i'm missing!?!?

[Anonymous Coward]

An understanding of grammer, spelling, and perhaps punctuation. Oh, and I suppose control over shift-key spasms.

Re:Pleazzze tell me what i'm missing!?!?

[Anonymous Coward]

A brain for one apparently....

Doesn't cost a whole hell of a lot of money for Netflix to put a banner on its web page saying "Buy DVD's AT WALMART"

How is Walmart a competitor? Walmart is ending its DVD rental business effective June 16, and Netflix doesn't sell DVD's.

Re:Pleazzze tell me what i'm missing!?!?

[E-Rock]

Not true. I wasn't a walmart customer and I got a banner ad when I logged in this morning. I've only seen it the one time, which is nice, but it's not ONLY for converts.

Re:Pleazzze tell me what i'm missing!?!?

[Halvy]

i'd rather have balz than a brain ANY day, coward. :)

ahhhnd.. it doesn't look like you have much of a brain either cuz the article sez;

Wal-Mart is offering its existing online DVD rental customers the chance to continue their subscriptions with Los Gatos-based Netflix at their current price for the next year.

The terms: 'existing..customers..' and '..current price for the next year..' doesn't sound or mean that walmart is getting outa the business immediately, or even for the next year at least... plenty of time for walfart to change their minds and make arswholes outa themselves once again in this particulare areana.

Re:Pleazzze tell me what i'm missing!?!?

[Halvy]

uhh, ok. buhht i thought this waz the internet, you know, like the wild, wild west! maybe your the one who needs to bone-up on your schoolin, suhhnnnn ahhnd take a course on net-citizenery or somethin like that. ;)

Walmartization

[3D Monkey]

Wal-Mart had no chance in succeding in this market to begin with. The reason they are so huge in retail and goods trade is because they buy in such huge volume that they can virtualy control the companies who supply their stores.

Vlasic Pickles was an unfortunate tragedy of the Wal-Mart Empire.
http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/77/walmart.htm l

It's good to see them lose some ground either way.

Re:Walmartization

[No Such Agency]

I am familiar with this famous article, so I was surprised when I recently noticed Vlasic pickles for sale at my local grocery store here in Ontario. Before there were only Strub's and Bick's (I think). So the company clearly still exists, but in what form?

Re:Walmartization

[boomgopher]

I really wish everyone who bad-mouths Wal-Mart would actually stop shopping there. None of this pussy-footing around of "oh, it's just some T-shirts", or "hey, I've got kids, life's expensive enough", etc. I haven't set foot in a Wal-Mart in life 3 years after I found out what they were doing to America, and I'd hardly call myself an activist.

I've got bills too, and while it would be nice to save a few bucks, I fucking refuse to shop there..

Don't you mean "Extended Viewing" Fees!

[Anonymous Coward]

I loathe the revisionism Blockbuster pulls
and too have vowed never to set foot in
one again.

When you returned a movie late, it was
an "Extended Viewing" fee. Now that someone
has affected their business, they rename
the term "Late Fee".

Blockbuster can go pound sand!

Yup

[chowdmouse]

The ads are already there...

WalMart Ads on Netflix = Optional!

[MaineCoon]

There is a little close box on the ads, top right corner. Click it. No more ads!

So far the ads haven't returned, even after closing the browser window and opening a new window.

I logged out, and logged back in, still no ads.

So those of us who are morally opposed to WalMart's business practices don't have to deal with their banner ads. One click makes it go away.

Great for me...

[PortHaven]

My $1,700 of stock which dropped to like $1,000 looks to now be at $1,800 :)

Re:Great for me...

[pukka]

YES! 36% on my VERY FIRST DAY of stock investing. Time to get drunk!

100K-1

[jmichaelg]

I got an email from Walmart this morning telling me about the change over. The email had a link that took me to a page on Walmart's site explaining they were shutting down. On the page was a button that said "Click here to get your account transfered to Netflix" along with some text that explained my rental queue and terms of service would be transferred intact by clicking on the button.

Didn't work that way. Got transferred to Netflix's new account page with the wrong service option selected and everything else blank. Had the software worked properly, I would now be a Netflix customer but it didn't so I checked out Blockbuster's offer. So if anyone at Netflix is reading this, especially if you're the developer, your bug cost you a customer. Blockbuster looks to have a better deal than Netflix - something I probably wouldn't have noticed had your code worked properly.

It's a shame Walmart quit. When they entered the market, Netflix raised their monthly service fee, realized that wasn't the brightest thing to way to compete with the world's largest retailer and subsequently lowered their fees to match Walmart's. Both companies then proceeded to add a whole lot more titles to their mix - or at least claim they did. The overall effect of Walmart's entry into this field was to increase competition and improve the offerings. I frequently saw a 2 day turnaround from mailing a DVD to receiving its replacement. With Walmart's exit, I wouldn't be surprised to see a concurrent dimunition of service from the remaining players.

Re:100K-1

[Anonymous Coward]

how exactly do you equate a walmart email, a walmart page, a walmart link, and a walmart account transfer to be netflick's fault?

Re:100K-1

[artifex2004]

Sucks to be you. I think you'll check out NF's offerings in a couple months, though. I've posted elsewhere in this storyline how bad BB is :) I like NF and GC the best.

Re:100K-1

[DirtJeans]

The Wal-Mart service actually had customers -- let alone tech savvy customers?

Re:100K-1

[verloren]

I've found that Blockbuster doesn't have a *better* deal than Netflix, though it is cheaper. In return for being cheaper, however, it takes longer to get the next item on the list, I'm a lot less likely to get the top choice in my queue, the UI is generally less usable, the recommendations system is not as good, and it generally seems trickier to happen upon the lesser-known films that can turn out to be so enjoyable.

And yes, I am cancelling, at the end of the month.

Re:100K-1

[Anonymous Coward]

> So if anyone at Netflix is reading this, especially if you're the developer, your bug cost you a customer.

So, you bemoan how crappy wally-world is, and yet, the 'programming' problem is with Netflix. Yes, I'm not surprised you are a wal-mart customer.....

Re:100K-1

[TooMuchToDo]

Wow, I'm sure your $20 with be sorely missed.

Nevermind the other Wal-mart customers who will probably switch anyway, even with the code problem.

Remember, there's always another consumer who can replace the monthly fee you pay.

Re:100K-1

[jmichaelg]

You're the Netflix manager in charge of the transition from Netflix's side. Do you

• A - Let Walmart assign the coding task to one of their programmers who is about to get laid off or
• B - Do you claim that task as one of yours? Remember that Netflix is allegedly getting 100K customers out of this transaction. Lose 5% of them because of a coding screwup and you've cost Netflix $75,000 per month.

If you chose A, then you shouldn't be working for Netflix.

If you chose B and you still screwed it up,...did you know Wendy's is hiring?

Re:100K-1

[Aggrazel]

I agree with the parent here... its a 8-9 day turnaround on mailing off my old DVDs and getting new ones from Blockbuster. With netflix it was a 4-5 day turnaround. The only reason I keep my BB membership is because I get two free in-store video game rentals per month. But if you're more of a movie person, netflix is much better.

Re:100K-1

[Anonymous Coward]

You probably don't realize this, because you were never a netflix customer... But netflix has regional dvd distribution centers all across america, so that the average turn around time on a dvd is, was and has been 1-2 days since inception of the service in early 2000's. Wal-mart was the one playing catch up with netflix..

The post office is the main hold up in terms of 1 day turn arounds, if you happen to be in the same city as a distribution center you should get 1 day turnarounds pretty frequently, though...

Re:100K-1

[ahem]

I'm the web QA manager at Netflix, and I'm sorry that you didn't have a seamless transition experience. I'd be interested in seeing your notification email so I can determine what went wrong. Learning from this mistake is important to us, mostly because it annoyed a customer, but also so that we can reduce the chance of making a similar mistake elsewhere on the site.

Please forward the email to rfagen at netflix dot com and I'll pass it on to the relevant engineers.

I certainly hope that you will give us a try. If you have any further difficulty signing up so that you get your Walmart price lock-in, please call our customer service department at 1-888-638-3549, and they can help you out.

Thanks,

Rob

Re:100K-1

[Anonymous Coward]

so what your saying is... if it was a walmart programmer that fucked up... its netflix's fault... and if it was a netflix programmer that fucked up... its netflix's fault...

WHAT?!?

[__aaitqo8496]

Wait... are you telling me that Wal-mart entered a market and wasn't able to successfully drive everyone else out by lowering prices below cost then gouge once there were no competitors left?

Someone tell Bill Quinn, author of How Wal-Mart is Destroying America and The World and What You Can Do About It

Re:WHAT?!?

[bill_mcgonigle]

lowering prices below cost then gouge once there were no competitors left?

I admit, I haven't been to some of the small towns where WalMart is the only store left, but I've never seen this practice at WalMarts in the Northeast. You have to know your prices and shop wisely, even at WalMart.

Who Cares?

[hydroxy]

I will continue to drive the 1 mile to Blockbuster to get upto 2 DVDs at a time for $15 a month. Did I mention I dont have to wait a few days to get the DVD I want?

Re:Who Cares?

[Anonymous Coward]

> Did I mention I dont have to wait a few days to get the DVD I want?

No, but you also didn't mention how BB edits the DVD, so you aren't even seeing "the DVD I want."

change to NetFlix's site code...

[natophonic]

if (customer.isWalMartCustomer() == true)
{
filmList.setSafeForJesusLand(true);
}

Re:change to NetFlix's site code...

[tOaOMiB]

Who uses "if (X.isY() == true)". SO ineffecient! AND less readable. Can we please stick with "if(XisY())"?

Thank you for your cooperation.

Re:change to NetFlix's site code...

[discstickers]

I've seen this in a Java project I was working on:

boolean x;
...
if(x == true) {

}
else if(x == false) {

}
else {
//And there was code here!!
}

Re:change to NetFlix's site code...

[Dogtanian]

Doesn't surprise me if it was Java code... Java seems to bitch about everything, even if *you* know that the variable will always be initialised (or bail out before it gets there).

No netflix for Puerto Rico

[Jherek Carnelian]

Can anyone here point me to a netflix-like service that provides service to Peurto Rico? All of them that I have tried so far won't support residents of PR. I guess none of them have a local distribution center and the cost of mail to the mainland is too much.

great...

[patrick.whitlock]

I live in north Alabama (stop laughing). and yes, Wal-mart is big in my neck of the woods. But if you think Microsoft is evil, you should look at Wal-mart a bit more closely. A town near me at one time had 3 grocery stores. now, they have A wal-mart. 3, count em...3 locally owned buisnesses have been shoulderd out of the picture by a large multi-national company. 3 economy helping buisnesses have closed thier doors. so, now.. you have to shop at wal-mart, or drive 20+ mins to the closest grocery store. I figure that each store had at least 40 employees. that's 120 people now out of a job, and wally world hasn't got that many employees. so... we've increased the unemployment, decreased the number of locally owned buisnesses, and made one hell of a traffic jam. now they want to take out the movie rental places. Somehow i don't think Sam Walton would appreciate this

Re:great...

[Crapshoot]

and yet, people voted for that decision with their wallets. What is it about decision-making like this that scares you ? You may not like Walmart- its certainly your right to frequent only the local grocery stores. On the other hand, the local family that does want cheaper food can go to Wal-Mart, and apply their savings elsewhere. What part of this excercise is evil ?

Re:great...

[Anonymous Coward]

> What part of this excercise is evil ?

Something to do with the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer?

Re:great...

[Radical Moderate]

How about the part where Walmart's wages are so low that their employees qualify for public assistance...food stamps, etc? That's right, build a Walmart, watch your tax base shrink and your demand for taxpayer funded services rise. May not be evil, but it's pretty damned close.

Re:great...

[NeMon'ess]

What is it about decision-making like this that scares you ?

That stupid masses of people may eventually be responsible for ruining most of this country by voting with their ignorance and stupidity, while only the upper-classes enjoy a decent life.

Re:great...

[NerveGas]

Wal-Mart didn't shoulder those businesses, the local townspeople did. Really. Wal-Mart didn't walk in and raid their coffers, your neighbors (and perhaps YOU) made a decision to stop giving your money to the local businesses.

Myself, I don't shop at Wal-Mart if there's any way I can avoid it. I've bought something there about twice in the last year - I nearly always spend my money somewhere else.

steve

Re:great...

[fermion]

I recently heard on thing that I never thought of before. Most Wal Marts are not close to anything, and require a bit of time and fuel. Also, Walmart customers do not have a lot of money, so the increased gas prices can mean significantly less money for other stuff. Therefore in the world of huge gas prices, Walmart might find itself in a pickle, and other stores, such as Target, that staying in the city and close to residential, might be a better deal, even if the prices are higher. Certainly my time is seldom worth so little that Walmart makes sense. Add in the public costs of roads, and the tax breaks to get a Walmart, one wonders if it does not cost tax payers more than is 'saved.'

Re:great...

[Crapshoot]

exactly. I made this point earlier. I don't shop at Wal-Mart, but I don't attempt to dictate to people why they shouldn't shop their especially if it makes economic sense for them to do so. Wal-Mart has some of the poorest customers around - these are people for whom that 50 cent markup repeated ad nauseum makes a difference. To whit, this year- higher gas prices have affected Wal-Mart's margins more than other retailers, due to their market.

Re:great...

[tazan]

Yes, this free market thing's just not working out. Maybe we could have everyone that wants to open a store check with a central planning office in DC first.

Re:great...

[prostoalex]

Walmart's wages are not low, they are at state-mandated minimums. Plenty of other places pay the same - your local gas station, McDonald's, or other shops that do not require skilled labor.

A good way to avoid a low-wage Walmart job is not to apply for it, and yet if some people still do, that means they cannot apply their skills anywhere else for better money.

Re:great...

[Anonymous Coward]

I live in a small town in wisconsin, before wally world opened up here there were 2 grocery stores, and a pamida, now there are 2 grocery stores, a wally world and a pamida, the pamida looks to be hurting real bad, the two grocery stores are doing okay... Wally world's grocery section does pretty good in terms of frozen foods, but no-one buys anything from thier produce, or meat sections...
Why? the local grocery stores work on having better quality produce and meat than wally world, and people shop at the local stores because of that effort.

If three grocery chains went out of business where you live it's pretty clear they were run badly... Wally world might drive the local pamida out of buisness, but the other two grocery stores are doing fine, and this is a town of 5000 people.

Actually there is one benefit to there being a wal-mart in town, all the towns gfas stations are about 10 cents a gallon below twhat other nearby towns charge, because wal-mart skirts the law here in wisconsin, (gas prices are artificially inflated by law to prevent oil monopolies from driving 'small town gas stations' out of business)

Re:great...

[sv0f]

Walmart's wages are not low, they are at state-mandated minimums.

What makes you think these are mutually exclusive?

[Hint: The good guys also want to increase the minimum wage, which has lagged well behind inflation, but the bad guys are against this too.]

Re:great...

[numark]

You also have another problem with Wal-Mart. If they are able to kick out other stores in the area that happen to provide at least basic health insurance for their employees, and then those people who lose their jobs go into positions at Wal-Mart or the local gas station, it raises the end cost for all of us. Some of that does depend on people focusing on short-term financial gain instead of long-term issues by shopping at Wal-Mart. However, Wal-Mart's tactics in dealing with suppliers border on predatory and offer little room for real competition among retailers.

Wal-Mart and gas stations tend to offer virtually no health insurance (Wal-Mart being more guilty, as they have the means to pay for insurance, whereas many gas stations admittedly don't), while many grocery stores do. Therefore, when those grocery stores go out of business, we the taxpayers get to pay for things like Medicaid when the former employees get sick. You're basically straining the local and state budgets, all for the promise of a cheap pack of hot dogs. Face it, not everyone can be as lucky as most of us are, at least having the means to somewhat pick and choose our jobs. Life deals some people a heavy blow, and there's some serious ethical and financial questions that affect all of us when Wal-Mart or low-scale jobs are the only things left in some towns.

If they

[geekoid]

don't tell people they are doing it, then it wold seems to me they are sensoring. Or perhaps commiting fraud.

Also, I would say the if a company controlled enough of a market, they could enforce sensorship. not in this case, but I can see scenerios where this happens.

Historically sensorship only applied to governments, however now that corporations have gotten to the point where they run things, and control people who don't even wish to use them I would say they can sensor.
example:
Microsoft incorporated into there OS a filter that removes all anti MS talk.

Under the counter

[Locke2005]

As part of the deal, will Wal-Mart keep Netflix supplied with cheap Chinese bootleg DVDs? Would any of Netflix's customers know or care if they were watching "pirated" movies?

wel-fare-mart-- always low wages-- ALWAYS!!

[Halvy]

the article says:

..Despite its size and merchandising savvy, Bentonville, Ark.-based Wal-Mart couldn't overcome Netflix's head start in the rapidly expanding niche of online DVD rentals...

yea, right.. walfarts 'savy'.. completly fostering 'slave labor' in a commie country (who is becoming amerika's 'loan-shark' by buying our 'debt'), and selling the cheap-garbage in their commie looking stores, paying 'commie' wages to it's mostly 'disabled' and 'poor' (on welfare) workers!!

it couldn't 'compete', because wel-fare-mart DOESN'T compete, it only knows how to put (good) competition outa business like the other great ameriCAN't -- m$.

Blockbuster pulls this shit too

[Anonymous Coward]

Blockbuster pulls this shit too. They edit many of their rentals for content. I wouldn't have a problem with this if they had the editted and uneditted versions side by side and clear labeling as to which was which. However, they just cut out the parts which offend Wayne Huzenga's bible thumping brain without any sort of disclaimer.

Re:Blockbuster pulls this shit too

[Milican]

No kidding. I rented "Y Tu Mama Tambien" from Blockbuster and a "steamy" scene was edited that totally blew the plot out of the water. From then on I was like, "what the hell happened". Luckily, my girlfriend at the time had seen it previously and could tell me what had happened.

Without her telling me what happened I would have just thought he movie was inconsistent. Maybe there is some info about the content chops in the DVD that I missed?

JOhn

Re:Blockbuster pulls this shit too

[Anonymous Coward]

You rented the R-rated DVD release of Y Tu Mama Tambien and not the Un-rated version.

So by your definition Amazon, and just about all the other DVD resellers "pull this shit too." Not only that, but Blockbuster rents both the R-rated and unrated versions of Y Tu Mama Tambien, I've seen them both on the shelf at more than a few corporate-owned stores.

Now straight from the horse's mouth:

Question: Does BLOCKBUSTER censor its movies?

Answer:
We do not edit or otherwise alter movies ourselves. We leave the methodology as to how ratings are applied specifically and completely to the studios involved. We are retailers and not members of the MPAA (Motion Picture Association of America), so we take no position on individual scenes or the overall artistic merits of a film. We are not in the content business. We are in the business of exceeding the expectations of our members and customers, and thus our goal is to offer the widest possible selection.

BLOCKBUSTER has always tried to provide our customers with a variety of choices while maintaining our family orientation. As you know, we will not generally carry "X" rated or "NC-17" rated films. However, there are unrated film titles we feel may contain content unsuitable for children, and we designate these titles with a "YRV" designation, for "Youth Restricted Viewing". Although not pornographic, only members older than 17 are allowed to select these films.

Re:Blockbuster pulls this shit too

[geoffspear]

And, more to the point, what he saw was almost certainly what was shown in the theatrical release, so if anything didn't make sense it's the fault of whoever did the final cut.

Good - WalMart SUCKED as a rental service

[artifex2004]

WalMart shipped from Arkansas, so you can imagine how long it took for disks to travel back and forth to the rest of the country. It was usually a 2-3 day trip each way here to Dallas, Texas, for example. And the selection was even worse than Blockbuster's online service, if you can believe it.

I've belonged to 4 rental services, and this is the order I rank them:

customer service:
1) Greencine (usually a few hours for email reply during the day, some of the staff seem to remember you by name, and they also often show up in the discussion boards),
2) Netflix (known for throttling service sometimes (less often these days), and takes a couple days to answer emails)
3) WalMart
4) Blockbuster far behind. 3-4 days to answer emails, empty slots when I had a queue of hundreds for a couple days at a time and each of them was supposedly "available now" - and I live within 30 miles of the national headquarters and the main distribution center.

selection:
1&2) Netflix, Greencine. GC has a better anime selection for now, as well as more hard to find foreign titles. Netflix has much better availability on almost every title it actually stocks, and is edging up on the anime. But it's still not there with foreign titles, either. Best selection for most people, however.
3) Blockbuster had mostly the same titles you'd see in its stores. But as I said earlier, a lot of them weren't really available when they claimed they were.
4) WalMart basically had a subset of what Blockbuster did. They did keep the slots full, however.

speed:
1) Netflix! They win by a landslide, having dozens of distribution centers, so there's probably one near you. However, they have been known to throttle customers after the grace period, and some of those "shipping tomorrow" or "shipping in [two days]" messages look suspicious. They don't do shipping or receiving on Saturdays, unfortunately.
2) Blockbuster. They have a number of distribution centers, but they are slower to process returns and mailing out. Not to mention that I had empty slots for days, several times. I think I may have seen them ship/receive on Saturdays, though.
3) Greencine. Unfortunately, their one center in California is their Achille's heel, as it takes days for anyone outside the region to get DVDs or send them back. It usually takes 2-3 days for a disc to get to Dallas, and 4-5 days to get back to California. The postal service seems spotty in this regard. Note, they DEFINITELY work on Saturdays as well, which is very important in their case.
4) Walmart's center is in Arkansas. They're about as slow as Greencine. No, I don't think they work on Saturdays. Sometimes I wondered if they worked on Mondays and/or Fridays, either...

overall value:
Netflix is the best overall value for most people; I usually get 15 discs a month on the standard 3-out plan. I get 9 discs from Greencine on average with their 3-out plan, but I'm a foreign film fan who sometimes watches anime, so I'm keeping them around. I will say that last fall I dropped NF and kept GC, but GC had some customer service and shipping problems in January and February, so I restarted NF to supplement. Blockbuster shipped somewhere between Netflix's average and Greencine's, but their selection and customer service makes them not worth the trouble. Seriously. I canceled at the end of last year. And WalMart shipped about as many as GC, so they'd have been a nonstarter even if they weren't shutting down, now. I cancelled within 2 or 3 months, I think :)

Re:Good - WalMart SUCKED as a rental service

[Anonymous Coward]

What he said. I too did a eval between NF and BB - keeping both services over a 4 and a half month period. In terms of selection and speed NetFlix was the winner. The two extra coupons from BB for in store service were nice but eventually I ran out of stuff I wanted from their stores. Also BB's "short wait" and "long wait" both lie: they really mean never. I had several items that just never moved whereas the "short waits" on NF's site in fact did get delivered in a week or two.

After my eval, due to their lack of selection, inaccurate waits, and slooow turn around times of films I dropped BB. I can't rememeber the final numbers between the two but I do recall that I got 33% more discs from NF over the same time frame than from BB and during the testing I made an effort to watch the moves on the day I received and mail back the next day.

So if you really want to get your money's worth I think NetFlix, of the two, is better. BB may look cheaper but even with the 2 in-store movies, you are still getting fewer films from a much more limited selection. And I'm not talking obscure films but like old B/W classics from the 40's/50's, some lesser known but mainstream Hollywood films from the 60s-90's just weren't on BB whereas pretty much everything "in print" seems to be on NF...

I actually cut back on the number of films after that since it was getting to be too much but still like NetFlix. Their Search engine sucks and BB's website seems newer/fresher but in terms of actual films, NetFlix seemed to be the better deal.

adam

Re:Good - WalMart SUCKED as a rental service

[jmichaelg]

WalMart shipped from Arkansas, so you can imagine how long it took for disks to travel back and forth to the rest of the country. It was usually a 2-3 day trip each way here to Dallas, Texas, for example. And the selection was even worse than Blockbuster's online service, if you can believe it.

Perhaps for Texas clients they shipped out of Arkansas but here in Northern California, they were shipping out of the SF Bay Area. My turnaround was frequently 2 days after I mailed in a DVD.

As to availability, my choices were 50-50 labeled "Available Now" and "Very Long Wait." I'm not sure what distinguished "Very Long Wait" because those selections came as quickly as the "Available Now" selections. In one case, Deadwood, the labeling transitioned to "Available Now" as I went through the first season. I'm guessing that they were building their inventory depending on which "Very Long Wait" titles were getting ordered.

For me Walmart was fine. It had a decent enough selection that I could keep my queue active. Clearly, we had different experiences.

Re:Good - WalMart SUCKED as a rental service

[artifex2004]

Hey, I'm glad to hear you had a good experience! Maybe you got in after I left, or maybe the west coast crew just had its act together better than the Bentonville crew. Your experience was much different from mine. Will you stick around for Netflix?

Re:Good - WalMart SUCKED as a rental service

[MojoStan]

selection:
1&2) Netflix, Greencine. GC has a better anime selection for now, as well as more hard to find foreign titles. Netflix has much better availability on almost every title it actually stocks, and is edging up on the anime. But it's still not there with foreign titles, either. Best selection for most people, however.

Um, I'm not suggesting Slashdot readers watch porn. However, Greencine (unlike the others) actually stocks movies of the "Adult" genre. Maybe this should be mentioned when talking about "selection."

I apologize in advance for suggesting that some Slashdot readers watch porn.

Re:Good - WalMart SUCKED as a rental service

[jmichaelg]

I started up with Walmart when they got going so it's possible the West Coast crew did their job better or they were closer to a major mail hub than the Arkansas site.

As to going back to NF, I don't think so - leastwise not today. Perhaps I'll check out greencine. My son swears by it.

It's ironic that Walmart pointed me back at Netflix. Netflix pulled a fast one back when Walmart was just getting going and switched their terms of service while claiming that the terms hadn't changed. They capped the two-dvd service at 4 dvds/month and introduced an uncapped 2 dvd service simultanously. Instead of pitching the capped service as a way to avoid a price rise, they chose to claim the old cap had always been there. Since it hadn't been, I felt Netflix was being dishonest and left Netflix for Walmart. Now Walmart points me back to NF.

Re:Good - WalMart SUCKED as a rental service

[Anonymous Coward]

Despite Wal-Mart's corporate HQ being in Arkansas, I can assure you that, like Netflix, BB, and the rest, their DVD-rental business operation was never centralized. They all face the same basic latency issue - the USPS. And the best way to reduce that latency is to ship/receive from multiple locations across the country, presumably near areas of high concentrations of customers/prospects. And building out such a distrbuted network takes time and significant $$$.

Wal-Mart DVD-Rental's *real* service issues (narrow selection, shallow stock depth) are probably the result of a concious decision to limit capex, since as noted in previous posts, even with 100% of the market, the annual revenue would represent less than 8 hours of their physical store chain revenue.

In the end, it's just too low-margain a business, with high capex entry costs, complicated operations, and little reward, especially if you already sell $280B worth of stuff every year. From the Wal-Mart perspective, this is not a 'surrender' to Netflix, it is a recognition that for Wal-Mart, the cost of 'taking over' the DVD rental business area simply isn't worth it, and remaining as 'just another player' is guaranteed to lose money (note that Netflix is not yet profitable).

Remember, unlike Netflix, BB, etc., Wal-Mart does not NEED to rent DVD's to make money.

Re:Good - WalMart SUCKED as a rental service

[MicroBerto]

Wal-Mart is smart. Too smart, in fact. They know that this type of business is NOT their strength, so why let it bring them down? Just not a segment of the market that they can dominate... so why kill themselves trying when they can have a strategic alliance with a leader?

Re:Good - WalMart SUCKED as a rental service

[pardonne]

> I usually get 15 discs a month on the
> standard 3-out plan. I get 9 discs

Wow... Be sure to take care of those eyes artifex.

I have a question about selection. I like to rent out some British comedies but I couldn't find them on NF. I also couldn't find a good foreign selection so far. Since you are the expert, which of these services have the best Brit com. + foreign mix?

Pardonne

Re:Good - WalMart SUCKED as a rental service

[artifex2004]

I like to rent out some British comedies but I couldn't find them on NF. I also couldn't find a good foreign selection so far.

Weird. You missed this and this and this? I got those by searching for "To the Manor Born" and clicking on the lists/genres on the side :) Many britcoms never make it to the US, at least not released as DVDs. So you have to look for one you know is a DVD, first.
Here's a link to the genre at GC, too.

I'm not going to start posting links to foreign films :) You should try to spend a little more time looking. For me, overall, GC has a better selection of both categories. But Netflix has much better availability of most of the titles it carries, and they're faster for people who don't live right near GC. I'd say if you can have only one subscription, start with NF, unless you know the films you want to see are only carried at GC.

Walmart was 2.5% the size of netflix

[goombah99]

Walmart had 100,000 customers. netflix has ow shouldhave about 4 million paying customers. so this addition of customers is lost in the noise: a 2.5% increase. Plus they are paying less than the ususal so it even costs netflix some money to buy them!

The nice thing for net flix is the cross marketing.

I hope you don't want uneditted DVDs

[Anonymous Coward]

Blockbuster edits their movies for content, without a disclaimer on the box. Fuck Blockbuster.

If you really want pr0n rentals

[Anonymous Coward]

go to Greencine. Not as many as an all-adult rental service, but plenty of titles anyway for straight and gay tastes alike.

maybe i'm blind?

[Halvy]

or, mabye u dint' rtfa. where, oh were does it say walmart 'bought' netflix! the article only says walmart is getting outa the business, and passing their current customers to netflix web-site.

in return, netflix must do the un-thinkable, and advertise for the commies at wel-fare-mart.

In other news....

[Aqua OS X]

Netflix development staff has now been replaced by poorly paid elderly people and downs syndrome kids working on adult assistance programs.

Moreover, users of Netflix.com will experience audio tracks which simulate an atmosphere consisting of rednecks beating their children and people buying firearms at 1am.

Also, Netflix.com be the first website to smell weird.

Re:In other news....

[Aqua OS X]

Troll? Dude this is plus five funny!

No, they don't censor DVDs

[Anonymous Coward]

They even rent out hentai!

Great Move for Netflix and Walmart

[HackingNetflix]

This is an excellent move for Walmart because it gives them the chance to exit the DVD-by-Mail business gracefully. They had between 100,000 and 250,000 subscribers, and didn't want to be in an expensive business during a price war (Blockbuster is spending over $100 million to compete). Walmart sells about 30% of all DVD's and this is where the bulk of the revenue is now.

Walmart is probably getting paid very each time someone subscribes to Netflix (Netflix pays $20 or more for each new subscriber). This could be a lot more profitable than doing the service themselves.

Netflix gets a bunch of new subscribers and the blessing of Walmart. While Netflix isn't predicting a huge amount of revenue from the deal, it's very strategic: Walmart is actually recommending Netflix.

I have more info and pictures of the Netflix and Walmart ads on my blog: http://www.hackingnetflix.com/.

MikeK

www.HackingNetflix.com

Re:Amazon?

[The Jonas]

didn't Netflix go into a partnership with Amazon a while ago?

No, Amazon was shopping around for a partner but no final deal with anyone has been announced ... yet.

Here is one of many links to similar stories.

BB editing?

[CoderBob]

What on earth are you people talking about? I've rented from BB (only the brick and mortar version, in case there's a difference) for about 8 years now, and I've never had a DVD I rented from them be "edited". Even the anime is uncut. As I tend to buy DVDs that I like (usually from Best Buy or another retailer), I would assume I'd have noticed one of these "edits" by now. Can you give an example, at least?

Re:BB editing?

[HackingNetflix]

I did some research into this. About 4,000 of the Blockbuster stores are franchises, and they buy the full, unedited copies of movies. My local BB is a franchise.

The company stores usually buy the "rated" vs. "unrated" editions of movies, such as Harold & Kumar Go To White Castle.

Your store is probably a franchise. Ask the next time you're there.

- MikeK

http://www.hackingnetflix.com/

Re:BB editing?

[CoderBob]

Okay, that makes sense then. I didn't realize BB sold franchises.

They did carry the "unrated" version of things as well as the rated ones.

Crap

[JumperCable]

I switched from Netflix to Walmart due to Netflix's poor quality control. I worked with their system and Netflix's ultimate response was to stop complaining. You can only reuse those DVDs so many times before they get worn out due to mailing & poor handling from other customers. Now I am stuck with them again.

Re:Crap

[Anonymous Coward]

Who cares. Neither rent out XXX pr0n, so what's the difference? I mean are you going to see a good anal reaming from a Walmart/Netflix rental? How about girl-on-girl action? Yeah, no rug munching. I'll bet finding a movie that shows pubes is going to be impossible.

Please

[Rei]

Because most of their directors are Republican radicals? The Waltons give millions to Republican causes, and are gun-loving Chistian conservatives (as are the people that they put atop the company, such as Soderquist, who Sam personally sought out). Wal-Mart itself was the #2 corporate campaign contributorin 2004 according to the Center for Responsive Politics, and gave the vast majority of its money to Republicans. Essentially everything about the company is "conservative" - gun-loving mysogynistic anti-union pro-censorship jingoistic anti-competitive sweatshop-loving et al.

If you think I'm being reactionary and exaggerating the case, please take the time to read The Wal-Mart Way by Soderquist himself, who credits the "the core values based on Judeo-Christian principles and maintained by leaders" for its success.

Re:Please

[Anonymous Coward]

What if I think you're being "reactionary and exaggerating the case" when you equate "conservative" with:

* mysogynistic
* pro-censorship
* jingoistic
* anti-competitive
* sweatshop-loving

(For the record, I don't think there's anything wrong with being gun-loving or anti-union.)

Re:Please

[Rei]

Here's a challenge for you: Go over to a conservative forum like FreeRepublic.com, and make the following posts:

* One declaring that there's no difference between women and men except structurally OR women should serve in the front lines in the military OR any such thing that puts women on the same footing as men

* One declaring that banning liberal artists/authors/journalists/etc from bookstores/tv/radio/etc is a bad thing OR a post declaring that journalists should be allowed to criticize the president/military during wartime OR (if only surrounded by conservative xians) stores should never censor content, even if it contains pornographic content and/or vulgar language and/or blasphemic content

* A post declaring that the US might - just might possibly, remotely - be wrong. Or that we're not the "Greatest Nation On Earth", or whatnot. Or that you don't like seing the American flag wave every last place that you look. Or that Europe (especially France) might be right, about anything. Or that unilateralism is bad. Or any of about a dozen other things.

* A post supporting minimum wages OR a post supporting maximum working hours before overtime OR a post supporting bans/restrictions on trade with countries that use sweatshop labor OR any such thing.

Any one of those will likely get you banned from the forum, especially if you defend them.

Re:Please

[Anonymous Coward]

WTF does that prove.

Free (Freak) Republic no more defines traditional conservatism than Democratic Underground defines traditional liberalism. It's just a forum for extremely reactionary Bushbots and GOP partisans.

Hell, RimJob (JimRob), owner of Free Republic has a purge of dissenting conservatives every 6 months or so; lately he's been banning anyone who objects to Bush's de facto open borders policy. Illegal immigration is not the problem according to him; groups like the Minutemen Project are, merely for demonstrating that Bush, like several presidents before him, has no real intention of defending our borders.

Try other sites like Liberty Forum if you want to talk to various libertarians and traditional conservatives who don't toe to a single party line.

Re:Please

[sv0f]

Free (Freak) Republic no more defines traditional conservatism than Democratic Underground defines traditional liberalism. It's just a forum for extremely reactionary Bushbots and GOP partisans.

Your right, they don't define "traditional conservativism." But then, those currently in control of the Republican party and the Federal Government are not traditional conservatives either. The grandparent's post is accurate with respect to the post-Contract-for-America Republican party. You don't like it? Then stop voting for those wackos.

Ooh... good idea

[ahdeoz]

Inserts. Think figurines with credit card bills. With an Oracle telling them what brand of detergent most fans of Kurosawa prefer. Or which celebrity endorsement will be most persuasive when selling sweaters.

Might be true

[JoeBuck]

Wal-Mart demands, and gets, censored versions of CDs from major record companies. Also, many filmmakers record alternative versions of some dialog to make it easier to show the film on network TV later on (where the "seven words you can't say" rule applies). So, it's possible.

What scene

[Anonymous Coward]

What scene was cut?

Airline versions

[myth_of_sisyphus]

For the movie "Rainman" the airlines cut the scene out where Dustin Hoffman freaks out in the airport and cites airline crash statistics. The director objected saying it provides the whole reasoning behind the road trip.

My friend saw the movie "The Sweet Hereafter" on an airplane and they cut out the whole father/daughter incest storyline, understandable but kind of ruins a couple plot-points.

Who knows what other cuts are made on other films.

Re:Airline versions

[nsayer]

I saw The World Is Not Enough on a plane before I ever saw it "for real". I don't know the entire catalog of edits, but one that stuck out even at the time was in the very begining when the "Rupert Murdoch wannabe bond villian" guy was listening to his cronies rifle off the day's headlines.

"And there's been a big train crash in California."

Never mind the fact that the word "train" sounded like it had been dubbed in, you usually hear them described as "train wrecks" or "derailments" and the like. "train crash" just isn't quite what slips off the tongue.

Of course the line is "PLANE crash," but airlines never want bad news from the industry to invade the cabin, for reasonably obvious reasons. The selection of newspapers and magazines also suffers when an air travel incident is in the news. It's almost like being on a sequestered jury - your newspaper comes to you with big holes cut out of it. But I digress.

What really bothers me about content editing like that is that it's usually plainly obvious what was changed, and often it's pretty clear what used to be there. If anyone with half a brain can figure out what was there before the edit, why bother with the editing?

Re:Airline versions

[rockola]

For the movie "Rainman" the airlines cut the scene out where Dustin Hoffman freaks out in the airport and cites airline crash statistics.

Qantas didn't, and here's why:

Charlie: Ray, all airlines have crashed at one time or another, that doesn't mean that they are not safe.
Raymond: QANTAS. QANTAS never crashed.
Charlie: QANTAS?
Raymond: Never crashed.
Charlie: Oh that's gonna do me a lot of good because QANTAS doesn't fly to Los Angeles out of Cincinnati, you have to get to Melbourne! Melbourne, Australia in order to get the plane that flies to Los Angeles!

This is censorship!!

[commodoresloat]

If that's censorship then I guess my local whole foods market is guilty too, because they don't carry Cap'n Crunch Peanut Butter Crunch. All they carry is some crappy organic peanut butter puffs. The *bastards*.

That is unacceptable. Access to Cap'n Crunch Peanut Butter Crunch is the bedrock of our liberties. Those who would sacrifice access to Peanut Butter Crunch for security deserve neither.

one-liner

[Anonymous Coward]

filmList.setSafeForJesusLand( customer.isWalMartCustomer() );

Re:one-liner

[Anonymous Coward]

Oooh, bad programmer making assumptions. The other code only set filmList.setSafeForJesusLand(true). That doesn't mean they want the inverse set.

Given /.er hate of web nasties...

[suitepotato]

...why do so many get service from Netflix when their pop-up ads are all over the place lately?

Seriously, I personally am not given to shopping at, doing business with, or even entertaining the thought thereof when it comes to businesses with annoying obtrusive advertising. Especially pop-up users. Netflix can go whistle.

And Wal-Mart? Let them censor whatever they want. I buy my DVDs from mall chains, Best Buy, and a couple of local places with loopy mad owners who can find the oddest stuff and cannot be replaced by Wal-Mart of Netflix.

Am kind of surprised at this though.

Crap

[Anonymous Coward]

Now I have to look at a big Walmart banner when I go to Netflix.

"Unrated" Version

[Kadin2048]

Usually the 'unrated' or director's cut versions of movies are clearly marked as such, as selling points. You'd have to be fairly unobservant to rent the Director's Cut and not notice it, and then go back and buy the theatrical release.

Neither WalMart nor any other retailer has a responsibility to return a product just because the buyer was dumb and/or unobservant. Check the back of the box if you're not sure -- if you're buying something for the hardcore sex scenes or gratuitous nudity and the box says it's rated R, then you might not be buying what you think you're buying.

I'm not a big fan of WalMart, but what I like even less is the continual trend to push more and more consumer responsibility off onto the retailer, as if shoppers are so stupid, they have to be protected from every bad decision they might possibly make. An honest retailer doesn't have to let you return anything, the fact that they do is a service, not a right. Don't buy something unless you know what you're getting--if you're not sure, wait and do some research.

Widescreen and Availability

[ArkiMage]

I switched from NetFlix to Wal-Mart a year or more ago because of having difficulty getting new movies. When I heard NetFlix intentionally moved high volume renters lower and lower on priority scales it annoyed me and I switched. Wal-Mart appeared to never do that. The one thing that annoyed me with them occasionally was full-screen-only versions now and then. Rarely but occasionally that's all they would make available...

Re:Widescreen and Availability

[/dev/trash]

Define high volume? I get my movies in 1-2 days, depending on Postal Service speed.

Re:Widescreen and Availability

[ArkiMage]

Nothing to do with postal speed. Take for instance 3 out at a time, unlimited per month.. Unlimited being the key word. On the 18th of the month if you've watched and returned 2 total movies and you sign up for something you'll get it. If you've already gotten 9 or so at that point you're much more likely to see "long wait" on the movie when you add it to the queue.

2 day turnaround with Netflix

[ChrisCampbell47]

The post office is the main hold up in terms of 1 day turn arounds, if you happen to be in the same city as a distribution center you should get 1 day turnarounds pretty frequently, though...

Absolutely. I reliably get 2 day turnarounds with Netflix (e.g. send back DVD on Monday, get replacement Wednesday). I am in a large metro area with a Netflix warehouse in it (somewhere).

One thing to watch out for is when Netflix sends you an email asking you to tell them exactly what day you received a DVD from them, so they can verify that delivery is working well. That's not quite true -- they're calibrating their system in order to SLOW it down. If it only takes 1 day for a DVD to get to you, they'll actually DELAY shipping the DVD by a day, thus slowing the turnaround time for you significantly. That saves them money (how so is left as an exercise for the reader). The extra delay doesn't annoy you enough to quit (or even complain) ...

Re:2 day turnaround with Netflix

[Spunk]

a Netflix warehouse in it (somewhere)

I bet if you looked at the return address on your envelopes, you could narrow that down a bit :)

Define government

[tepples]

Is an authoritative body here (i.e. some executive branch of local/state/fed government) preventing you, by statute, from seeing or getting it here?

Define government. If Wal-Mart is the only store in town, it can deny you at least some essentials of human life (food and clothing) if you don't shop there. Therefore, Wal-Mart is a "state" by definition (an entity that exercises control over legitimate use of lethal force in a territory).

Re:Define government

[Big_Al_B]

Therefore, Wal-Mart is a "state" by definition

Wow...just...wow. [Exhale] Do you really believe that? Can you really rationalize that? Wow.

Define government.

Any standard definition will suffice.

If Wal-Mart is the only store in town, it can deny you at least some essentials of human life (food and clothing) if you don't shop there.

So you believe that there are places where people must either choose to shop at Walmart or they'll starve to death, naked to the elements? Wow.

Walmart corporation doesn't execute governing authority over any jurisdiction, therefore Walmart can't deny anyone access to human essentials.

Therefore, Wal-Mart is a "state" by definition (an entity that exercises control over legitimate use of lethal force in a territory).

Nevermind government, man. What definitions of "legitimate", "lethal force", and "territory" are you using here?! Wow.

Re:Define government

[tepples]

So you believe that there are places where people must either choose to shop at Walmart or they'll starve to death, naked to the elements?

Have you read The Grapes of Wrath? If Wal-Mart is the only store in town...

Walmart corporation doesn't execute governing authority over any jurisdiction

It does if it bribes local governments so much with promises of tax dollars and/or campaign contributions that it makes the local government into a figurehead.

What definitions of "legitimate", "lethal force", and "territory" are you using here?

"Legitimate": no formal sanctions taken against the entity for its actions. "Lethal force": includes the power to deny the essentials of life. "Territory": the area formerly serviced by mom-and-pop shops that Wal-Mart drove out.

Re:Define government

[Big_Al_B]

Have you read The Grapes of Wrath? If Wal-Mart is the only store in town...

"I'll be ever'where--wherever you look..." -- Tom Joad

"You and me both..."--Sam Walton

Re:Define government

[Big_Al_B]

Humor aside....

Have you read The Grapes of Wrath? If Wal-Mart is the only store in town...

Steinbeck's depression-era landscape was quite different than today's. With our maturing global telecomunications, media and transportation environments, even the rural towns on Route 66 aren't isolated or insulated anymore. There is no such thing as the "only store in town" anymore.

It does if it bribes local governments so much with promises of tax dollars and/or campaign contributions that it makes the local government into a figurehead.

Wal-Mart surely lobbies local governments to create conditions favorable to its success and to the failure of its competitors. There's no reason to be naive enough to believe Wal-Mart will act in the best interest of host communities--or its own employees, or customers, or suppliers--or in anyone's interest but its own. However, Wal-Mart's political influence *requires* government cooperation and ends there because it has no legal authority to direct uncooperative governments. Hence, Wal-Mart is neither a government nor a state. Period.

"Legitimate": no formal sanctions taken against the entity for its actions.

That, my friend, is not the definition of "legitimate". You can't define the positive, i.e. legitimate, as the absense of consequence for being the negative, i.e. illegitimate. That definition would result in crimes being "legitimate" activities so long as the associated criminals were never punished.

Here's the actual definition:
"Legitimate":according to law, established legal forms and requirements; or according to recognized principles, accepted rules and standards

"Lethal force": includes the power to deny the essentials of life.

Weak definition. Regardless, Wal-Mart has no such power.

"Territory": the area formerly serviced by mom-and-pop shops that Wal-Mart drove out.

Ah, but the shopper's "territory" is much larger than that--what with telephones, mail, the internet, and motor vehicles and all.

Re:Define government

[tepples]

I'm not ready to respond to all of your post, but I do wish to rebut one of your objections:

but the shopper's "territory" is much larger than that--what with telephones, mail, the internet

In many cases, shipping and insurance costs more than the good itself. And this doesn't help with face-to-face services such as Wal-Mart's vision center and hair salon putting local independent optometrists and barbers out of business.

and motor vehicles and all.

Not everybody is capable of driving a car. I'm 24 and I still live with my parents and don't know how to drive because I can't afford car insurance because all I get from employers is "Sorry, despite your qualifications, we went with another candidate", even when applying for a position as a cashier at a home improvement store chain. Even worse, what happens when Wal-Mart is the only employer left in town?

Re:Define government

[Big_Al_B]

I'm not ready to respond to all of your post

Whenever you're up to it...I'll reply to what we've got so far:

In many cases, shipping and insurance costs more than the good itself. And this doesn't help with face-to-face services such as Wal-Mart's vision center and hair salon putting local independent optometrists and barbers out of business.

No one said being a consumer is easy. I live in the upper midwest, within minutes of several of the largest malls in the country (hint,hint), and I still have to drive 50 miles roundtrip to find the hiking boots I like. That's life. It doesn't mean you're being censored, or that stores are governing authorities.

Not everybody is capable of driving a car.

Not everything is Wal-Mart's responsibility. Most people have access to some transportation.

I'm 24 and I still live with my parents and don't know how to drive because I can't afford car insurance because all I get from employers is "Sorry, despite your qualifications, we went with another candidate", even when applying for a position as a cashier at a home improvement store chain.

Ahah! The meandering, shiftless mid-twenties guy. I know that guy. I was that guy. My advice, gleaned from the decade between 25 and 35: YOU have GOT to get your s**t together, because noone else will group your poop for you.

You've had about ten years to learn to drive a car. And you don't need to buy and insure a car prior to learning how to drive. Just go get a permit, have a friend or relative take you out to a Wal-Mart parking lot and have at it man. That'll cost about $20 for the permit plus some gas money if your friend/family member is a bastard.

Regarding the job problem: I assure you that the problem is with you and is for you to solve. Assuming typical HS or college graduation times, you've had somewhere between one and six years to find work. There's a reason you're not attractive to employers. Fix it.

Re:Screw Whole Foods

[M4N14C]

I want my saturated fats too. In the form of high cholesterol organic granola.

Re:Wal-mart censorship... I wonder if in Japan...

[davidsyes]

wally censors their Japan-based WalMarts (which happen to be operating under a locally-pronouncable name, vs "wa-dadu-mata-du"...

I was in Japan Dec-Feb, and during what we 'merkuns would call afternoon programming, I saw in the local TV some wester b-movie full of church-cringing profanity, along the lines of...

"Give us the money and we'll let you live."

"FUCK YOU. How 'bout you give ME the money and I'll let YOU live?"

It was worse than that.

What was funny and macabre at once was one morning I watched a comedian/variety show which covered restaurants coping with and eradicating rats. One hired a pest eliminator who (after the cameras were mounted strategically) placed super-sticky tape ALL OVER the floor, the counters and against wall/floor edges. Eventually, one hapless mouse/rat got stuck and began gnawing itself to free the majority of its body from the tape, only to become more stuck. All the while, the soundtrack from "Deep Rising" (all dramatic, and gung-ho and such, from where the movie opens and the speedboat Treat Williams is helming cuts through the rough, rained-on waives: 'Duh-DUHH-Duhhhh, Duh-DUHH-Duhhhh, Duh-DUHH-Duhhhh, Duh-DUHH-Duhhhh, Duh-DUHH-Duhhhh, Duh-DUHH-Duhhhh, .....) I mean, the music was KEWL, cuz I'd liked it. It set my mind to figuring the track, and lo and behold I had it in my luggage, JUSt for occasions like this and showing friends in the hostel.

But, what was trippin' about the rat's fate was the way Japanese comedy/variety/news shows incessantly, didactically replay scenes... over, and over, and over, as if short-term memory effect reigns over Sake or Fundoshis... The poor rat/mouse, its red eyes (photo effect) flared and panned and zoomed...

But, such didactic replays are not limited to darkly comedic pest eliminations. Once, a man or a couple jumped in a suicide pact from a building and the camera footage that showed the jump point to the splat point was repled over and over as if to find out where JFK's bullet came from. Various angles, math, and trajectory-like analysis prevailed, lasting about 4 or 6 minutes, maybe even 8. After a while it made us in the lounge nearly numbed or cold to the sadness that led to the jumpers' fate.

Duh-DUHH-Duhhhh,.. Duh-DUHH-Duhhhh,.. Duh-DUHH-Duhhhh,..

So, maybe Walmart does censor... After all, loopers in the studios add lines to scenes that are otherwise dull when the principal characters have their backs to the screen and nothing is going on. With the sequence timing on-screen, it's easy to have voice talent come in and fix or adjust things during post production, particularly after a test screening has met with lower-than-expected reaction.

David Syes

Re:Wal-mart censorship... I wonder if in Japan...

[davidsyes]

BTW, the news jumper-report footage was not of the actual jump-- it was post-leap/splat analysis.

As for the rat and the Deep Rising hero music loop, I can't remember if those of us watching it shoulder-to-shoulder started doing the wave and snapping our necks.

Low prices - Tragedy of the Commons

[whitis]

The obsession with low prices in this country creates a Tragedy of the Commons situation. We save money buying at walmart but in doing so, jobs move overseas and the jobs which stay here become less lucrative. Each individual saves some money by buying at walmart and that individuals own choice to buy at walmart (or buy cheap products in general) or not ultimately doesn't make much difference in whether their job gets offshored or not but collectively the behavior cuts jobs. As long as your neighbors buy the cheap stuff, your job still goes overseas. This is quite different from Henry Fords original goal to pay his workers enough money that they could afford to buy his cars. Every man for himself leaves us all vulnerable, unless we own a multinational corporation.

And as more people are unemployed or less gainfully employed we have less money to buy things so we have to buy cheap creating a vicious circle.

While the US economy appears to be growing, all this free market out of control and globalization the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. The article In Praise of Prosperity points out that while GDP has gone up the real incomes of 90% of the population went down. It also points out that 7 out of 10 of the highest GDP per capita nations are social democracies. And that America's GDP went up only because we are working 25% more hours while other countries like France can sustain the same GDP growth while reducing the hours worked by 25%. So, if we both started at 40 hours a week, we are working 50 hours when the french are down to 30.

As the situation for Americans continues to deteriorate, we become ripe targets for palingenetic ultranationalist populism. And to distract people from the real problems they will redirect peoples discontent towards immigrants, sexual minorities, and other marginal groups. But there is nothing to worry about until you see campaigns to make it impossible for illegal aliens to get drivers licenses, vigilantes patrolling the border, or denying civil rights and jobs to homosexuals.
Oh... wait.

I'll have to check my rental history....

[/dev/trash]

But I've not seen a "Long Wait" movie in my queue since I've started.

Walmart is the winner here

[SethJohnson]

Walmart was getting into an area it didn't need to be in. Sure, they've got a gargantuan distribution network established, but when it comes to soliciting customers, they lose on the internet. They win in brick-and-mortar because they are everywhere, open 24/7, and stock a huge selection of crap. On the internet, everyone stocks an equally huge selection of crap, is open 24/7, and they lose their competitive advantage. Unlike their online music distribution service, the DVD rental-by-mail service carries massive overhead with it that is a financial liability.

People consider Netflix the 'little guy' because some stock analysts have predicted doom for them going against Blockbuster and Walmart. This news represents traction that Netflix has found against its competition. Ultimately, I would not be surprised if Blockbuster bought out Netflix. They did this in the early nineties when Sound Warehouse rented video tapes for fifty-cents.

Netflix dealing with the devil...?

[ChibiLZ]

I am actually surprised that Wal-Mart didn't crush the competition. Some people might be scared of Microsoft as a monopoly, but I find Wal-Mart much more frightening. And for all you Netflixers out there, give the newest version of my Netflix queue manager, FlixQueue, a spin. We're nearing the end of beta, and we have many new features! http://www.5hyphen.com/flixqueue/index.htm

No Magic Involved

[susano_otter]

I reasonably understood that Blockbuster would no longer charge me an incremental daily fee for keeping their movies past their return date.

I also reasonably understood that Blockbuster would still charge me something--a flat fee after a certain amount of time had passed, as it turns out--for keeping their movie forever.

I admit, I was a little surprised at the "restocking" fee, but on consideration I decided it made sense: I keep the movie so long that you give up on ever getting it back, and update your records accordingly. Then I return the movie, and you have to do work to re-add it to your inventory records (over and above the work of just logging it back in and putting it back on the shelf).

Did you seriously believe that "no more late fees" meant "buy this new release movie for $4.99"?

When people take Blockbuster's movies and don't return them, Blockbuster loses money. Why are you so shocked to discover that their new policy, while more generous than the old one, does not actually allow customers to bankrupt them?

Think of it this way: "no more late fees" means "we won't charge you for returning a movie late, but we will still charge you for not returning a movie at all". It seems to me like you are trying to scam Blockbuster by tricking them into thinking that "nonreturn" and "late return" are the same thing. It's clear from their clearly written policy that they aren't going to fall for it.

All that aside, I find Blockbuster profoundly annoying and useless, and haven't been doing business with them at all for many months.

I want to get a job. Please help me.

[tepples]

You've had about ten years to learn to drive a car.

I once had a permit. The first time my mom took me out to a parking lot to learn to drive, I had a headache after six minutes. By a half hour in, not only did the headache become unbearable, but I was also missing stop signs at parking lot speeds. What should I have done differently?

Assuming typical HS or college graduation times, you've had somewhere between one and six years to find work.

That would be two years. Four of those six years since I graduated from high school were spent earning a BS in computer science.

There's a reason you're not attractive to employers. Fix it.

I have Asperger syndrome, which despite my best effort makes me appear less-than-ideal in an interviewing situation. I also was born and raised in northeast Indiana, which appears to have a surplus of job seekers who have some paid work experience and are thus more attractive than I am. Even with my degree, I have still managed to get only "Sorry, we went with another candidate" for the last two years, whether I apply for the few IT jobs in my local paper (less than one a week on average) or even apply for minimum-wage jobs. What would you suggest that I do to overcome these hurdles?

Re:I want to get a job. Please help me.

[Big_Al_B]

I once had a permit. The first time my mom took me out to a parking lot to learn to drive, I had a headache after six minutes. By a half hour in, not only did the headache become unbearable, but I was also missing stop signs at parking lot speeds. What should I have done differently?

This is a different reason than not being able to afford auto insurance. Although you have absolutely no obligation to share personal information with a stranger, it would have been more honest to cite "health reasons".

However, I really appreciate the honesty of this last post. I am choosing to take your questions literally and not as sarcasm. If they were meant sarcasticly, I apologize in advance for any unwelcome advice.

If a health condition is making it difficult to learn to drive, then my only advice is to work closely with whatever support network (doctor/family/friends) you have, and to tackle it in the safest way possible. If driving a car is not going to work out, then perhaps other transportation methods may be better. You would know which ones might work better than I would, and I won't patronize you with lame suggestions.

That would be two years. Four of those six years since I graduated from high school were spent earning a BS in computer science

My sincere congratulations. Computer Science is a tough major to complete in four years. Took me five years to complete a BA in Journalism and 2.5 more to finish a BS in CSci. As I said, I was "meandering mid-twenties guy".

What would you suggest that I do to overcome these hurdles?

AS sounds like a real challenge.

What I would do is find a mentor and advocate, preferably in the industry you hope to enter, who also understands AS. They could help you find and communicate with prospective employers.

Employment agencies and headhunters could help get you in the door, but also prepare a potential employer with supportive information about your condition prior to your interview.

Finally, if you're really experiencing illegal discrimination, you could play the ADA card through the Equal Opportunity Employement agency.

BTW, don't settle for the opportunities your hometown paper may offer. If you must, look in nearby metros (Chicago, Indianapolis, Detroit, C* Ohio, etc.) and get your resume out. You may have to move away from home to find work. That's what many, many people do. Send hundreds of letters and resumes out each month. Hundreds.

This all depends on you accepting that you may have to get way outside your comfort zone to achieve forward progress, which obviously is easier said than done. But I assure you it's well worth the extreme effort you put into it.