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Redmond Yawning at Apple-Google Alliance?
Debra D'Agostino writes "Despite the media hype around Google CEO Eric Schmidt's appointment to Apple's board, CIO Insight Executive Editor Dan Briody says it's not that big a story. 'Apple and Google are already plenty tight,' he says. Arthur Levinson, CEO of Genentech, has been on both boards for years. And Al Gore and Intuit Chairman Bill Campbell are both Apple board members and advisors to Google. 'While it's fun to speculate about what an Apple-Google alliance could produce (GoogleMacs? MacGoogle? GoogleTunes?) this move is far from an alliance,' Briody writes. 'And even if it were, it wouldn't be first time that two upstart powerhouses have joined forces in an attempt to unseat Microsoft. Remember AOL-Netscape? Boy, they just steamrolled the team from Redmond, didn't they?'"
These are exciting times for Microsoft Haters. Google is growing in strength, serving up online ads by the bucket, even making headway in the corporate software market.
What adult writes like this?
Blogs are the new Op-Ed page, only with no journalistic standards.
The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
apple is an upstart now?
Arthur Levinson, CEO of Genentech
I wonder who's idea it was to name the company after a Nightsider?
I think a lot of people bought and listened to MS because they were the biggest and seemed to be leading the way, so you bought their stuff and did things their way because that was the easiest... Now with two giants providing a different path, MS will start to look far weaker and people will feel that they are now entitled to make non-MS decisions.
Engineering is the art of compromise.
If Apple and Google are so tight, where the hell is that Mac-compatible Google Talk voice chat client we were promised a year ago?
Not to mention... well... ALL the rest of Google's software.
I'm not blaming Google specifically, mind you.... Apple should hurry up and fix those Javascript bugs in Safari already so that stuff like Writely will finally work.
I agree that just because Schmidt is on the board that this is an all-out agreement. Don't dismiss this though. Given some time, something could come up--or maybe nothing at all. I can still be pretty sure that Redmond isn't yawning over this. I'd say a few chairs are being thrown around (It's like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic--er, I mean the board room)
Before you die, you see DoubleRing...
What he said about AOL-Netscape may be true, but AOL-Netscape was a lame-ass alliance.
Seriously, I've known Apple fanboys to be zealous to the point of failed logic, but I've never known a mac user to be outright stupid (lookin' at you, AOL).
Meanwhile, Google is ubiquitous and powerful, with a number of good web-apps that are challenging to MS's model. And the pair of them are at the (to date) height of their power with very little overlaping in the finger-to-pie categories.
If there's a plan, I hope it's a good one.
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If there was ever a trolling story, this is it. NPOV anyone?
If Apple and Google are so tight, where the hell is that Mac-compatible Google Talk voice chat client we were promised a year ago?
Likewise, how come Intuit has waffled back and forth over Mac support during Campbell's tenure on Apple's board? How come the presence of Ellison on Apple's board never resulted in any staggering Oracle+Apple ventures?
Boards of directors are supposed provide outside perspective and serve as a safeguard for shareholders. Whether they actually do this in the era of the massively overpaid chief executive is debatable, but it seems obvious that membership on a board doesn't lead to actual strategic connections between the two companies.
Read the EFF's Fair Use FAQ
I've never known a mac user to be outright stupid
As a mac user myself, who reads and posts on many mac-centric websites....
You obviously haven't looked very hard. I've seen apple fanbois who would brag about the opportunity to bend over and have steve jobs fuck them in the ass with a baseball bat with the letters "DRM" spelled out in razor blades.
:o
Remember AOL-Netscape? Boy, they just steamrolled the team from Redmond, didn't they?
Score -1 flamebait.
Well I guess this alliance will provide the best services for the world, since Aplle great designs and Google great technologies, a combination of both will lead to great technological stuff that we have not seen yet.GIPOD
This illustrates the need for a moderation class of +1: Vivid and Disturbing Image.
If we're lucky, we can all see the fiery explosion that will be the downfall of M$.
Where do you guys come from with all this venom and FUD? God, complete with a $. Your type really seem to think so much alike that I'd swear every one of you are the same person. It's so ironic, it's sad.
Anyway, getting to the point: Maybe I agree or disagree but you should provide some reasoning along with a statement.
Let me try: I don't think there is an alliance, and even Google and Apple together are not going to just "crush" Microsoft. MS' sheer size, marketshare along with its diverse involments in many more markets that Google nd Apple combined coupled with its admittedly dubious business practices are going to ensure they'll be around a *long* time.
why run from Vincenzo?
No one is going to be a threat to Microsoft until they challenge Windows as an operating system. Microsoft can always include any product they make into their operating system "for free" (actually subsidized by the cost of Windows), and push them out, like what they've done with all before them.
The key to "beating" Microsoft is the OS. Something that's easy to use, runs on cheap/common hardware, and compatible with current software.
The key to beating Microsoft is to unseat Windows. Having a new board member at Apple isn't going to do that.
If Apple was serious about unseating Windows then they would copy Microsoft's strategies. Microsoft can see threats coming. The Playstation was a trojan horse into the living room. MS pumped a lot of money into putting a machine into people's living rooms that would stop them from needing to buy a Playstation. This is a long term strategy.
What Apple should do is buy Sun and put those hardware engineers to work on making the worlds best game console. That console should be a server with thin clients around the house, it should serve up great games and movies to the tv, and also let you wirelessly connect a Monitor and keyboard thin client and use Googles internet office suite for working on all your work like needs. TV and music on demand would be served up through Apples iTunes store. With this strategy Apple/Google/Sun could take over the entire household computing needs. And you know it would be cool because it comes from Apple.
Of course in the meantime I'm going to end up buying Vista, Office 2007, a Nintendo Wii and think about an Xbox 360.
Australian running a company that does C# / C++ / Java / SQL / Python / Mathematica
Why would anyone compare AOL-Netscape to Google-Apple? Aol and Netscape were both failing before they joined. Google and Apple are both doing very well and aren't exactly the same type of merge/join the AOL and Netcape. If memory serves me right AOL bought Netscape. Neither Apple nor Google is buying the other. It's just the CEO of one company serving on the board of another. It happens all the time with businesses.
Funny createSig(Witty remark, Odd reference)
{
return (Funny)remark + (Funny)reference;
}
To be fair I posted that in a BDSM forum, not a Mac forum.
i really think Google should strengthen its ties with Linux and help to make it something sweet.. all these years they've had something in common, and that's free software.. i guess its not exactly the best capital venture they could take, but what made them so popular is the number of people that use their services.. what better way to keep on promoting yourself to massive amounts of people, than with the opensource/free software movement? who knows.. maybe it shouldn't be their main point of concentration at the moment.. its quite possible that with an Apple and Google partnership, more capital for Google, could mean more money to buy time to contribute the the *nix world..
*plays the Apogee theme song music*
Dayum.
Still, that's zealotism to the point of failed logic. Have you seen them do the kinda shit AOLers are famous for*?
* Script-kiddieism; excessive and post-useful typing in l33t; LOL@URMOM!!!!; the bad habit of ruining their computers with ad/spyware in the space of minutes**; being the worst forum trolls in the universe; and finally, installing AOL
** I swear, AOL'ers and post-AOL'ers are primarily responsible for windows users' reps as typhoid users
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I didn't need that image. But there are a lot of sad Mac fans. I've even had the displeasure of talking to one that said that Microsoft is a failed corporation. We aren't talking about just any biased person, but a full-on kool-aid-aholic. I think it's really sad to see the fans to be so rabid at times.
Partial disclosure: I happen to have a couple Macs that I regularly use. I like the OS though I wish there were some better choices made with respect to the hardware, especially the desktops.
...cause after all, he did invent the Internet.
Someone who loves M$, apparently. The summary about Microsoft's "seat" and the "Microsoft haters" and "upstarts" who would have taken their chair makes me think of the movie Tombstone or Steve Ballmer's famous chair throwing temper tantrum. Don't bother to read the article because there's nothing more there but the same kind of embarrassing nonsense. The author apparently thinks that it's OK to steal and lock down other people's innovative ideas, sue public schools and all the other villiany that comes from M$ and that no rational person should mind the abuse because M$ is eternal. So it is with WinTel fanboys everywhere and that is nothing new.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
actually, such silly behavior is no different from the linux and bsd zealotry that is just as prevalent on places like slashdot. But for whatever reason it's somehow cooler to be a linux zealot than a mac fanboi.
make world, not war
Comes with a mullet, a swiss army knife, some little toy magnets, a straw, a rubber band, a paperclip, and a couple wires.
You make the computer yourself, or the bad guys get away.
AOL-Netscape doesn't seem like the best comparison to me. It might be appropriate if we were talking about, say, Yugo-Google.
I've always respected google and appreciate what they've contributed to the OSS community. To me, they are apple, but only better and without the snobbish attitude of anything Apple..
"MS' sheer size, marketshare along with its diverse involments"
Microsoft has at least two achilles heels: Windows and Office. This is so since these are the only two money makers for Microsoft, the rest of their 'diverse involments' lose money hand over fist. If Microsoft were to be harmed in either of these two markets then it would be a severe blow.
I'd guess that the first of these weaknesses that will be exploited is in the Office market since it is easier to switch to another suite, i.e. OpenOffice, then it is to switch operating systems. Switching over to other non-Microsoft products paves the way towards helping people rid themselves of Windows as well.
Microsoft thinks that a mandatory start-up beep is a buzz worthy feature, yet any sort of alliance between a competitor and the world's most popular search engine isn't news?
With attitudes like that, I just want M$ to go the way of the Dell laptop a bit more.
Well I for one welcome our new Moogle (Aoogle?) overlords.
"Love is like a trampoline, first it's like "SWEET!!" then it's like *BLAMM!*"
Not likely. Alliance or not. In fact no-ones even ready to challenge them, Apple being the strongest contender, but to do *that* Apple would have to give something up I don't believe their willing to do.
Namely, their hardward platform. Let OS X/Tiger/Cheetah/whatever run on the same commodity hardware Windows has for ages and watch uses start to drift. Of course there's give and theirs take, Apple will have lost the ability to micromanage the hardware like they always have (mostly for the better I think) but then there are a lot of people like me who have invested heavily in PC hardware (built from commodity/specialized PC parts) who wouldn't dream of scrapping the whole system to change the operating system.
Then there's the question that *really* puzzles me. I always heard the story of how Apple makes most of its revenue off its hardware sales, and that sounded reasonable enough, then (for testing, my company does web-app development) we get an Apple and find out even point releases are sold seperately as upgrades. Is it just me or does that make it look like Micrsoft is really doing *me* a favor, namely by continuing to update and support their software platform until its end of life?
Thats a legitimate question by the way. I'm not an Apple basher (I'd pay $120 or whatever the going price is to see if I liked it on PC hardware), I do use Windows (XP Pro, on Workstations) and I manage more Linux servers (RHELu3) then any and all of that combined.
But in business Micrsoft is kind and not just because its the right OS (although that it and always has been Microsofts target market). Take any mid-sized business, inventory their hardware and tell me how much its going to cost to replace each system? Because you can't just do one, one there, thats where the compatibility issues come in. Say we've got 100 workstation no at EOL, nobody is going to sign off on a purchase order to replace all those functioning systems unless they have a lot of extra cash and a serious bias. Because in business sense it just doesn't add up. Then remember those EOL systems, you know, the ones the interns use, file stores, backup systems, whatever. Companies invest a lot of capitol into a solution like that and you're absolutely right, its going to be hard to topple.
I'm still not sure what Apples strategy is with the move to Intel, but so far it seem clear that moving into Micrsofts territory is not on the map. Things could change, I'd like that, or Redmond could be the 10,000 lb gorilla they aren't willing to challenge.
Quack, quack.
While Windows has it's devotees, you're much more likely to find die-hard Mac users than fanatical Windows users. Despite increased sales, Macintosh is still a cult / non-conforming sort of thing, so chances are better at finding 'stupid' fanatics who don't know anything besides it's not Win.
This just isn't the same as Windows fans, who *generally* either buy the cheapest (Dell) machine or need it for work. So don't say there are many / more Mac idiots, just more outspoken and obvious ones... partly -because- it is Mac and not Windows.
It's always confirmation bias!
Apple and Google coming together? I read that as Commodore and Compuserve. Or maybe Atari and Yahoo.
Microsoft has pimped the corpse of VMS for all its worth.
Ditto for Apple and NextStep, Linus and the Solaris manuals.
DragonflyBSD is only place any real innovation going on these days. Not that anyone is noticing. Yawn.
"actually, such silly behavior is no different from the linux and bsd zealotry that is just as prevalent on places like slashdot. But for whatever reason it's somehow cooler to be a linux zealot than a mac fanboi."
Well... "cooler" in the tiny world that is Slashdot, perhaps; but as far as the rest of humanity is concerned, there aren't many things that are less cool than a Linux zealot. (Or should that be a GNU/Linux zealot?)
#DeleteChrome
Great Intellect...
So, it's just a CEO that sits around a board meeting a couple of times per year giving advice. It's NOT a merger, it's NO co-operation in products, there IS NO alliance.
It's just that the media and a lot of lame bloggers make a big hype out of this. Everybody else just yawns along with Redmond.
Microsoft will be around until Windows and Office are unseated. With Linux and OpenOffice.org (not to mention many other non-MS alternatives) I can see where this *could* happen very soon.
Not to mention that Google also has many different business ventures, and Apple also has a couple of their own.
www.linuxpenguin.net
The majority of Office users use Windows. If we got rid of Windows then MS would be screwed because the only other Office version they have is for Mac, and I'm pretty sure there are absolutely NO Macs with Office preinstalled. And for most people, if they saw the pricetag of a new copy of Office, they would probably consider using an alternative rather than buying Office.
"Why buy vista? Perhaps so you can run office 2007? No other app has been announced for it that we must have yet. Just think about that."
Wow, you've gotta be the only person I know who wants to buy Vista to run Office 2007.
Let me ask you this. . . why do you care what version of Office you run if all you use it for is word processing and Excel? That's all most people use it for.
Most people won't buy Office 2007 or Vista until they absolutely have to.
www.linuxpenguin.net
A couple of months ago there were already rumours about google to choose ubuntu as their google desktop platform.
e s_desktop_linux/
e d-company anyway...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/01/31/google_go
(just search for google+desktop+ubuntu in your favorite search engine...)
I don't care what they choose, I don't trust google,apple,microsoft,any-us-government-controll
But I hope that they do not pollute/restrict the ubuntu desktop with their influence.
....but as far as the rest of humanity is concerned, there aren't many things that are less cool....
You're kidding right? Do you really think most of the world can tell what particular sub-genus of nerd you fit into?
Clue for you - we're all just computer guys to most people.
There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
I never liked iTunes, but GTunes I'm down with that homey.
"To be is to do." --Socrates
"To do is to be." -- Aristotle
"Do-Be-Do-Be-Do..." --Sinatra
the linux and bsd zealotry that is just as prevalent on places like slashdot
Aaaaah, but the Mac guys combine their zealotry with cluelessness. It's really annoying.
There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
Soon they will be as strong and flexible as gumby and hercules combined!
Non sequitur: Your facts are uncoordinated.
Remember AOL-Netscape? Boy, they just steamrolled the team from Redmond, didn't they?
AOL and Netscape were never in the same league as Apple and Google are now. I'm not saying that they would necissicarily succeed in upsetting the M$ balance, but they've got a much better shot than AOL and Netscape, together or alone, ever did.
Apple is the supreme maker of elegant design merged with tech. They understand users. Google is like the heavy tech that doesnt understand design one bit.
The big problem I think with such a huge system distributed throughout the entire house, serving up media, being your tool for all your needs... is that it will cost quite a bit... and it might be obsolete in a few years.
Imagine having an Atari 2600 / 8 Track / Beta video / 9600 baud modem machine integrated into your house...
Or even if its not part of your house, you still bought all this crap and invested in it... you're going to want to hold on to it for as long as possible, probably to the point it just feels ridiculous and overhyped.
Then some better solution comes along for cheaper. And you realize you could have bought dedicated machines that offered more features for less.
I think that it simply represents the interests (shares) google has in apple. Other directors of google are probably identified too much with google to sit on other boards.
eric schmidt is also an old novell hand and so is probably a senior member of the ABM (anyone but microsoft) club.
End
Pending? Its more like: pending, pending, hype, pending, shedding features.... pending, more hype, pending, shedding some more features...... but we know it's coming.... right???? pending, pending, even more hype, pending, shedding even more features.... any moment now!!!! pending, pending........
Only to idiots, are orders laws.
-- Henning von Tresckow
sarcasm [sahr-kaz-uhm]
-noun
1. harsh or bitter derision or irony.
2. a sharply ironical taunt; sneering or cutting remark: a review full of sarcasms.
[Origin: 1570-80; < LL sarcasmus < Gk sarkasmós, deriv. of sarkázein to rend (flesh), sneer; see sarco-]
--Synonyms 1. sardonicism, bitterness, ridicule. See irony1. 2. jeer.
Do you see it now?
Only to idiots, are orders laws.
-- Henning von Tresckow
Don't forget M$ share price which has been in steady decline for an extended period. When investors lose confidence with the company's ability to produce earnings commensurate with its share price, the bottom can fall out very quickly and investors are a fickled bunch.
Wall Street will take M$ out long before Apple, Google, Linux or OSS but all of those certainly do put pressure on Microsoft and erodes the company's earnings outlook moving forward.
M$ is pretty much up against the wall with their OS and Office products, having captured the vast majority of those markets, growth if any is notably restricted. While allot is riding on the successful Vista launch to generate another round of profit taking, new revenue streams are desperately needed to sustain the company in the longer term. It is not enough to participate, M$ must dominate online music/players, web search/advertising and games/platforms while achieving and maintaining brand specific integration and leverage.
The key component becomes a matter of time. M$ can compete and can be dominant given enough time as has been demonstrated historically. At this point however, M$ doesn't enjoy the greatest luxury of time and no markets they are presently venturing into promises to yield the greater reward quickly. M$ has to beat iTunes, Google and Sony just for starters and there are other competitors in these markets as well.
There is little doubt that Vista needs to produce a penetrating punch at launch akin to the initial success of Win95 upon its inaugural and many doubt that will happen. The greater expectation is that Vista will roll out mainly on the backs of newly purchased computer preloads and that revenue gain probably won't make up the losses of the other initiatives. The question in turn is a matter of how long M$ can bleed before new market explorations start producing rewards.
On the basis of M$'s war chest which is huge, one might expect the company could sustain losses for extended periods of time and indeed that is true all else being equal. But I'm reminded of the relatively recent case where M$ reported above projected earnings for a quarter and lost 10% of their valuation in less than 24 hours as a result of the good news. The reason for that was due to a M$ spokesman commenting that a significant portion of the gain was going to be reinvested in research and development thus reducing investor dividends on the windfall.
At the opening bell the following day, M$ stock was heading for the tank and has yet to fully recover all these months later, although it has recovered enough to intersect a normalized trendline that has been in decline for more than two years. If that one day negative spike was indicative of anything, it would be how fast and furious investors can sour on a stock and the deadly ramifications that can bring.
Microsoft has significant financial resources and can buy back large quantities of stock in defense of their share price but Microsoft is also a paper tiger well beyond the realization of most people. The day the company loses majority investor confidence in their ability to deliver profits will be the day that Microsoft ceases to exist as we know it.
AOL-Netscape? How about AOL-TimeWarner?
/. user, they'd have infectiously bad karma. They're posts would not only immediately drop off the radar, but would cause all parent posts, like parent companies, to tank as well.
Anyone that partners with AOL goes down the tubes. If AOL were a
An "iGapple" company would at least be the guy who always gets "first post", and sums up the entire following reaction in 1 line. The number of their +5 moderations would eventually get so boring, that the only thing newsworthy would be the 3's and 4's.
It's not even apples and oranges, it's Special Ed versus Superman.
I8-D
oh wait... I thought you meant "Startup". :)
---
Best Freeware - Intros & Reviews
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two upstart powerhouses
WTF ?
I am putting myself to the fullest possible use, which is all I can think that any conscious entity can ever hope to do.
two upstart powerhouses
Let us look at the definitions of upstart from Princeton Wordnet:
1. an arrogant or presumptuous person (Sounds more like Microsoft then Google, I cannot attest for Apple.)
2. a person who has suddenly risen to a higher economic status but has not gained social acceptance of others in that class (Apple is almost as old as Microsoft and unless my mind fails me, they had a graphical OS first. Google might be closer, but look at Google's core tech. They are considered the top, ahead of Microsoft, and have gained social acceptance.)
That handles the nouns. Now since they used it as an adjective:
1. characteristic of someone who has risen economically or socially but lacks the social skills appropriate for this new position.
Seriously, a horrible use of the word. If anyone lacks the social skills appropriate for their position it is Microsoft. We all know their tactics are less than admirable, and there are plenty of jokes about their social skills with regards to chairs. I just wish people would stop acting like Microsoft is some untouchable entity. I can only hope that I get to see the day they have a great fall.
"Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb."
'And even if it were, it wouldn't be first time that two upstart powerhouses have joined forces in an attempt to unseat Microsoft.'
Exactly -- but at that time it seems those alliances were to "beat Microsoft". Now this one appears to be something else, maybe to use Google to deliver video, maybe integrate desktop search, maybe put up a bunch of applications, and Microsoft is an afterthought. Interesting that Apple also has a relationship with Akamai. Hmmmm.
Steve throws a chair.
the more they over-think the plumbing the easier it is to stop up the pipe
Didn't check, because I refuse to read an article with a title " Redmond Yawning at Apple-Google Alliance?" when there is no fucking alliance, or even close. Read up on what the board of directors are, what they do, and how many members Apple has had from various companies, and why they aren't allied and sometimes even competitors. Then come again.
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
The point is not that Google and Apple will bring down Microsoft. The writing is on the wall (it's actually been there for years, but broadband and a combination of other factors now make things much more plausible). Services are moving to the web and by services I mean applications like those found in Office. It is no longer making as much of a difference what platform (Windows/Linux/Mac OS) that a person runs because the things that the average users (and a lot of business users) need are going to run in Firefox/IE/Safari/Opera/et. al.
Microsoft isn't going to go away, it's going to change. Did IBM go away? Microsoft is too big, they do too many things to go away and the goal of Google and Apple can't be to take over their market. Instead, the idea is to reinvent the market, to set a new paradigm for things the way that the iPod did for music and Google did for search.
I repeat, Microsoft isn't going anywhere. That's part of their problem, but it's also a fact that they won't disappear.
Yeah, I'm as old as my UID would suggest.
How about network services? Does Apple have a network? Google does, or is building one. Could iTunes integrate some Google "free" content? Could Google pass people to iTunes? Could
What about advertising? Allow self-publishers of music via iTunes to advertise through Google with integrated billing system? Both purchase LuLu.com?
I'm curious about how Slashdot readers think is the best way to think through this type of problem? Is it simply looking where services could combine? where services could "compliment" each other? where both companies could address an entirely new market? Slashdot readers: what is the basic principle of innovation here and how does one analyze it?
My conspiracy theory... I call it the silverback conspiracy (silver/gray haired typically-white old men). So many corporations are all in bed together. I noticed this while working in the defense industry, its frightening how many CEO's are on the Board of Directors of their "competiton." Seems less and less like a free market and more and more like cleverly disguised monopolies. I'm only half serious about the conspiracy theory.
Now let me adjust my tinfoil hat.
But Bush invented the iPod, so would Gore have to pay him royalties from the lockbox?
You can if he calls himself a sub-genius.
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Yah - well, it'd be nice if the Intuit 'alliance' with Apple would produce software and services that were on par with Windows based offerings (Quickbooks, Quickbooks On-Line - I'm looking at you).
Note: Quickbooks On-Line has to be run in IE.
Cake or Death? Cake Please!
Or perhaps "need it for work" means you have to run one of the thousands of applications that run on Windows but aren't available for the Mac. I don't agree that the average Mac user is dumb, but let's not pretend that there are valid reasons to prefer Windows in certain circumstances.
The guy calls someone a douche bag and it's moderated "redundant." That's gotta be a blow to the GP's self-esteem. It's so self-evident that he's a douche that it's redundant to actually say it.
In related news, Microsoft announced today that it has had a Google board member in development for several months and will be releasing it to the public next week.
Trust me. This is an inactive account. Regardless of what the
Google has also been buying up alot of dark fiber and deploying data centers. With Apple there are so many things that they could do. I'm sure both companies are going to suprise us in the near future.
http://www.fastpcnet.net
It's right here: http://malfy.org/
Gapple ?
Kickass Cheap Web Hosting
I think you mean -1 ... you didn't LIKE that image did you?
Cwm, fjord-bank glyphs vext quiz
that Netscape and AOL are even in the same league as Apple and Google is pretty much the definition of "disingenuous."
To the guy who rated me flamebait... (I'm really going for it this time.) Here's $20, buy yourself a sense of humor.
Cliff Claven
K.E.G. Party Chairman
Founding Leader of: Koncerned for Egalitarin Governance
"There are no significant bugs in our released software that any significant number of users want fixed."
- Bill Gates, 1995
"Microsoft has had clear competitors in the past. It's a good thing we have museums to document that."
- Bill Gates, 2001
"I believe OS/2 is destined to be the most important operation system, and possible program, of all time."
- Bill Gates, 1987
"There are people who don't like capitalism, and people who don't like PCs. But there's no one who likes the PC who doesn't like Microsoft."
- Bill Gates
you are so insensitive. what about the teenagers who read this thread? can they tell the difference between DRM and baseball?
2) .]
[. . . ]
You know that most OS X PC users have Windows anyways, therefore, does it make sense to make a special OS X PC version of your software? No. Instead, you drop _all_ OS X support, and tell the users to simply boot into Windows when they want to use your software.
[. .
You have just described the platform into which Apple's switch to Intel has transformed the Macintosh. The possibility that current OS X developers (and especially OSX/Windows developers) may stop targeting Intel-based OS X in favor of Intel-based Windows is real. Basically, Apple now makes Windows boxen that may be the most predictable in terms of hardware configuration. People pit Apple against Microsoft but in my opinion, the real war is now Apple vs. Dell.
blog
But lets leave off the 'Parroted' snipes. I made some what I believe legitimate statements along with some open questions. Your post, aside from being somewhat abrasive, clearly addressed some of my questions and others a tad more hastily (probably because you quickly scanned my original post).
As for the 80% of revenue, we have to play this game in terms of volume. I absolutely agree Apple would be taking a hit in hardware based revenue and then the dual hit with the loss of platform control, which is certainly nothing to snuff at. Which I do mention.
But on the flip-side there's the increase in revenue generated through software sales.
Here's the sticky part, you seem to have understood that I believed Apple, by following my off-the-cuff remarks, could dominate the OS market and de-throne Microsoft.
But both you and I know nothing is that simple. Microsoft is quite entrenched. But Apple could increase its market share and if the numbers provided by 'hitslink.com' are to be trusted it wouldn't take much to make a significant increase. Which translates into revenue, which might help off-set the loss of some of their hardware revenue (I'd assume they'd still be in the hardware market and still be the first choice for believers and high-end users).
And lets be fair, OS/2 is not a decent analogy. It did fail, but there are a lot of reasons for that and I don't see a strong connection.
Frankly, no-one with a strong platform has ever tried to challenge Microsoft. Thats just a fact. Apple does have a strong platform and could, thats just another fact. How it would work out is impossible to foretell.
But if you don't think there would be a note-worthy migration to Apple you're kidding yourself. Its trendy. Its different. It looks nice and it does everything 90% of the users need it to do.
All the while Vista languishes with rewrite after rewrite, components being scrapped. Seems like a fine time for making in-roads.
Which is why I believe Apple is simply not willing to go up against the 10,000 lb gorilla. Sure, drivers would be a drag, but Apple would simply point back to the manufactures. I mean if you really want Apple without the Windows headaches, buy Apple manufactured/Apple certified/Apple endorsed hardware (oh wait, another revenue stream).
Anyway, I'm not saying Apple will or should go after Redmond. I'm simply stating that if they were willing to make some hard decisions they are the only players that have something resembling a serious chance. That doesn't mean taking 90% of the market. That means displacing Windows systems in large enough numbers to get into the double digits. (IMHO) Doable.
Maybe you're not part of the iPod generation, but there is serious interest out there. And it just so happens that Apples ported the OS completely to Intel's architecture. Interesting, but your right, Steve might be perfectly happy with what they've got. I'm sure the board is happy and their customers seem happy.
Quack, quack.
But by plan or shear incompetence, Micrsofts releases are quite a bit more spread out, making the TCO of keeping an updated systems surprisingly: lower.
That said, I could be totally off the mark here, like I said I have limited experience with OS X as an inventory item. Was just a little of a surprise. I do understand that their 'point' releases also provide additional functionality or enhancements from time to time, which is clearly something Microsoft is not doing.
Quack, quack.
Just being able to use the term ROI says a lot about your background.
;)
This is business and terms like ROI, TCO and depreciation drive it. Managers make decisions, budgets and profit margins count. Its fine to be geeky and say you'd like to see something ideally, but industry is about compromise. Working IT is certainly about compromise.
I think a lot of the Slashdotters that take such hard lines are either clueless, young, inexperienced, idealistic, truly devout or all the above.
Behind every IT department there's an MBA and frankly I believe there should be. You may not always agree with everything they do but if you're half lucky they are able to take in the big picture and make decisions that keep you in paychecks and maybe even cover the costs of some of that 'extra' hardware you really need.
Before turning to IT I had the good fortune of working administration. Meaning budgeting, board meetings, human resources, the nitty-gritty. It definitely helps to have a broader point of view. We technical people tend to get too focused on our own areas of expertise. We see things one way and believe that this is the right way. And it looks that way. Until you move your view a little bit and see that your company is hemorrhaging money. Or that a large purchase will take you from black to red.
We don't have to explain to a board of directors why the company isn't able to meet its goals. But someone does.
The power of the mighty dollar.
Sorry for the rant, but its get so tiresome hearing all the idealism sans pragmatism and its nice to hear a little sanity in amongst the chatter.
Quack, quack.
And I wish someone would mod you up. I've still (as a purchaser) got to consider XP Pro has been out since 2001, with only unpaid upgrades (not that I don't see the advantage of the incremental feature enhancements, Internet Explorer being a fine example of a primary services thats seen no real improvement over the last 5 years, while Safari continues to develop (with of course the help of the KDE team)).
Anyway, I just wanted to chime in and thank you for taking the time to provide a serious response to an honest question.
Quack, quack.
I got it in an earlier post, but I appreciate your response. From a business point of view it sounds a little strange. Do we want those features? But then it sounds like Apple is happy not particularly targeting business so the milestones and the added features are probably pretty nice, particularly if they aren't part of a businesses budgetary concerns (designers, end users, fans and artists aside).
I image it works well for their target market. Just like keeping Windows more or less stable for predictable lengths of time works for the 'average' or business user, where enhancements aren't a primary consern.
Quack, quack.
I enjoy the accessibility to content . It seems your seeking admonishment for not having provided this ease sooner . I am sorry if I am unable to provide a stern lashing for your guilt or perhaps even further an apology if I am mistaken . If this seems circular rest assured that is a reflection of the presentation of your request which if less open to random input would indeed have sizzling snap in every point . Regrettably I find myself wandering again . Sorry Frederick
... as long as it is Apple Computer Google is teaming up with.
For Microsoft to deal with Apple, there is always the "MS Office for Mac" whip at hand. This whip does not even have to be shown to Apple, just mentioned in an occasional way.
What Microsoft has to worry about (and they do worry) is Free and Open Source Software (FOSS) - which has been funded also by Google.
Walter.
Because you keep hitting it. A few of the best experiences I've had working IT were system failures. Its funny/sad, but those can clearly convey messages you've been trying to get across for ages in seconds. Because of course your right. A functioning network is almost invisible outside the IT department, which makes it hard for a manager to see the technical reasons some things should be prioritized (granted, I've met a lot of IT people who don't know how to clearly convey the whats and whys in the first place which is a whole other issue).
Quack, quack.
oh why not have some more fun. to be honest though windows and office have let everybody become michelangelo where if it was all IBM it would be the guys in white coats
Pending? Its more like: pending, pending, hype, pending, shedding features.... pending, more hype, pending, shedding some more features...... but we know it's coming.... right???? pending, pending, even more hype, pending, shedding even more features.... any moment now!!!! pending, pending........
Ok that's a funny post I gotta admit (same as the "list of things that happened since Duke Nukem Forever started development").
But you also gotta admit Vista RC1 is looking amazingly fit as the successor of Windows into the 21-st century. Soon it'll be out publically and whoever couldn't check it out will have the chance.
My curious mind has got me theorizing... will Google come up with its own hardware device? They've already made much headway with their platform, and going forward, it might make sense if they'll develop their own branded hardware. Some say it could be a smartphone, or a PDA, or maybe an entertainment device (to go against Microsoft Zunes). But my guess is that this will be released not in the US, maybe initially in Japan. Thoughts?
I still think Jobs is looking to create the ultimate media device and take on Microsoft. He can't do it himself so he went to the enemy. Look for a Google\Ipod Media device integrating Apple iTunes\iMovies and Google ads\video\etc.
www.IBuyMacs.com