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Sony's Karakker On Turning Around PS3 Buzz

simoniker writes "Sony's new PR boss Dave Karakker has been talking about his challenges handling publicity for the PlayStation 3, explaining how Sony will be switching things up: 'We were allowing media to drive the message for us, and interpret it for us. So allowing someone like Peter Moore, who's a good friend of mine, to stand up there and say negative things about Sony, there wasn't anybody refuting that. People just took that for face value. Now we're very aggressively defending our turf.' He also defend the lack of universal achievements on PS3: 'Frankly, how I view it is I don't care if you're great at Madden if I'm playing you in Resistance. Because that doesn't tell me you're that much better in Resistance. An overall score doesn't really tell me much, it tells me you've spent a lot of time online, it tells me you spend a lot of time playing games, but it doesn't tell me how good you are at a particular game.'" Should be noted that Simoniker is a former Slashdot editor -- also, the AP write-up about reactions to the PS3 is quite positive.

209 comments

  1. Sounds like a scape goat! by LiquidCoooled · · Score: 1

    He has coasted around ruining companies and now sony think he is perfect to head up the PS3.

    In his own words:

    I don't know if I'm the smartest guy in the world, for jumping in two months before launch, or the dumbest guy in the world.

    --
    liqbase :: faster than paper
    1. Re:Sounds like a scape goat! by Zarniwoop_Editor · · Score: 1
      I don't know if I'm the smartest guy in the world, for jumping in two months before launch, or the dumbest guy in the world.

      I guess only time will tell how wise this decision was.
      --
      - F1 NEWS
    2. Re:Sounds like a scape goat! by dch24 · · Score: 1

      Still, it reminds me of Marketing and PR departments that I resent.

      When the Marketing/PR department starts making the crucial decisions, the consumer generally loses. (Examples include Intel's Gigahertz campaign, Microsoft for the last twenty years, Bush Jr., Sony's rootkit, DRM in general, etc.)

  2. Media and media by kahei · · Score: 1


    When he said "We were allowing media to drive the message..." I thought:

    You're right! You actually realized -- you realized that trying to constantly synergize with the media and IP divisions of sony is what's paralyzed the game division! Someone at Sony actually finally understands that you can't spend all your time interacting with other divisions of your company -- you have to interact with what customers want as well!

    Then it became clear that he meant 'media' in the 'news media' sense. So I gave up on Sony again.

    --
    Whence? Hence. Whither? Thither.
  3. Simoniker is a former Slashdot editor by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 0, Offtopic
    Should be noted that Simoniker is a former Slashdot editor
    He should be a natural fit with a solid history of "dups" behind him; half a PR flak's job is sending out the same information over and over again.
    1. Re:Simoniker is a former Slashdot editor by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Simoniker is the submitter, not the PR guy. Sony may be desperate but there's no way they're going to hire a Slashdot editor to a serious position.

  4. I've been positive about it for a while by 91degrees · · Score: 3, Insightful

    While it is expensive, and although Sony have been pretty evil in the past, the fact remains that the PS3 is a very powerful system, with a decent level of brand recognition.

    HD support may not be a requirement for many people, but those with HDTV will want some hardware to complement it. Blu-ray might have been a result of pressure from Sony's top level, but the extra capacity is not to be sneezed at.

    Early adopters have a lot of money. They can afford the thing. And how often has the most powerful console been a total market failure?

    1. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      /sneeze

    2. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by (A)*(B)!0_- · · Score: 1
      "And how often has the most powerful console been a total market failure?"
      There's such a limited history of console releases and so many other factors in the success or failure of a console that that "factoid" is practically meaningless.

      How often has a console meant for the home market with a MSRP greater than $500 been anything other than an amazing failure?

    3. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by HappySqurriel · · Score: 2, Insightful

      How often has the most powerful console been a total market failure?

      Define "Total Market Failure"?

      The XBox is certainly a contender after having lost $4 Billion to only sell 20 Million systems (or $200 per system sold); several of the Neo-Geo / Turbo Graphics 16 / 3DO / Jaguar / etc. systems were the most powerful systems of their time and still failed to be successful platforms; and the most obvious choice was the N64, which was much more powerful than the Saturn/Playstation yet sold half as many systems as the SNES did.

      HD support may not be a requirement for many people, but those with HDTV will want some hardware to complement it.

      This may be true, but how much of an impact on sales it will have is questionable. Currently only about 15% of households have HDTVs, and HDTVs currently make up 50% of new TVs sold; a good guestimate for market penetration would be 25% sometime in 2008, 50% around 2010 and 100% around 2020 (the bottom half of the market will likely stick with whatever TV they have until it breaks). Now, when you start talking about 1080p TVs they have a much smaller market share and will (likely) take 5 years to get the market penetration that 1080i/720p TVs currently have. The "Advantage" of 1080p HDTV will likely only be felt in 2010-2012 (after the XBox 720 has been released).

      While it is expensive, and although Sony have been pretty evil in the past, the fact remains that the PS3 is a very powerful system, with a decent level of brand recognition.

      Brand recognition is a strong thing, but it can erode quickly and it can not float the wrong product that is released at the wrong time.

      Now, I'm not going to make any Doom and Gloom predictions for the PS3 but everyone has to admit that because of the higher price point and low supply the PS3 is (likely) going to sell poorly in 2006 and through the first half of 2007; this (in theory) could discourage developers from producing exclusive games and prevent the stranglehold that the PS2 had on third parties (which would further reduce sales of the PS3). In other words it is likely that the PS3 will sell worse than either the PS2 or Playstation, and the Wii and XBox 360 will gain in marketshare; how dramatic these changes are is still open to debate.

      The final question is how well can someone who only has been in charge of PR for the company for 2 months manage the growing problems; if he makes a couple of foolish mistakes it could cost the PS3 even further market share and possibly destroy the brand.

    4. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by Hitto · · Score: 1

      The 5200? The Neo-geo? The saturn? Dreamcast, maybe?
      Remember, all of those were "the most powerful" for maybe a whole three months, sometimes.

      As long as videogames were in the "I'll buy one for my kid at christmas" range, those never failed.

      Also, the early adopters are those that have been BOMBARDED with the most negative news about Sony, most of which cannot really be excused as a mistake. Rootkit, killing lik-sang, not allowing your console to run used games (though I think that's still a rumor, but will it remain so?), the *embarrassing* "yay let's try to be internet-funny" ads, general ridicule ($599, Ridge Racer, Gran Turismo with paid downloadable content) and the like?

      Even the astroturfers have stopped using "Zonked". They now lie in shame, in the darkest recesses of the net. Hoping this will all "wash over".

      So no, most learned early adopters are kind of pissed and waiting for the Guillotine to... I mean, the *price* to drop.

    5. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by AndyboyH · · Score: 1

      I don't think there is that limited a history, stare at history, and you'll see a very clear picture:

      MegaDrive (Genesis): Successful but still a flop, lost to inferior SNES
      Dreamcast: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior PS1
      N64: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior PS1
      Xbox: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior PS2
      Gamecube: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior PS2
      N-Gage: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior GBA
      PSP: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior DS (although one might argue it's not dead yet, the stats seem to suggest they've got a long way to go to win)
      Gizmondo: Unsuccessful flop, lost to inferior DS

      Nevermind the Atari Jaguar or NeoGeos...

      On my own biased side, I'm looking forward to Sony having a real chance of losing. I'm sick of their gaming stranglehold, and will enjoy seeing a good Wii60 combo reign over this generation - 360 with the advanced tech games, Wii with the innovation.

      Plus I feel they deserve it for their bully-boy tactics and suicidal urges to use their own formats (not just recently but also in the past)

      --
      Baka Drew
    6. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by Planesdragon · · Score: 2, Insightful

      And how often has the most powerful console been a total market failure?

      Almost always. (see: NeoGeo, 3D0, N64, Game Gear, etc., etc.)

    7. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Genesis is valid. DC was killed by underhanded, fraudulent marketing techniques that should have gotten Sony Punished with a capital P. N64 was superior in some ways but majorly inferior (media capacity) in others. Xbox is a valid point but I think people avoided it mostly because it came from Microsoft - in the post-Halo world they don't have to worry about this any more. 'Cube is superior except that it doesn't play DVDs (except for some Japan-only versions) so you can't make a direct comparison there. N-Gage was HORRIBLE to hold - it was seriously inferior. The controls were garbage. PSP has more power, but crap battery life and poorer build quality than the DS, so that's not really a superior/inferior thing either. And no one ever heard of Gizmondo. I mean I've heard of it but I don't even know anything about it except that it has a stupid name.

      Jaguar and Neo Geo were both horrendously expensive, as was Turbo Grafx 16 (which I See you didn't even mention, you poser) which is what killed them. Ditto for the Saturn, which you also didn't mention. You're a double poser.

      The amount of horsepower in the console is irrelevant. It's all about market position, marketing, and brand recognition. Microsoft's new console is selling well because they're out early (position) and because they are marketing it by associating it with Halo (position, marketing, brand recognition) and since they've already had a console out (recognition) people don't automatically think it will be crap just because it says Microsoft on it.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    8. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by LeBoomer · · Score: 1

      You've got a couple things backwards. First, early adoption is not always about having the money so much as having the stomach to part with the money. Having a lot of money does not make someone an early adopter. Second, there are examples all over of products that fail despite better specifications (power). Famous ones are things like Betamax and the 3DO.

    9. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by bahwi · · Score: 1

      Gizmondo doesn't count, it was doomed to failure from the get go. I mean, come on, paying to develop a typing tutor for a handheld that lacks a keyboard?

    10. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by 91degrees · · Score: 1

      Define "Total Market Failure"?

      Well, anything that completely failed to achieve any of its potential. The XBox was never going to be profitable. It existed to promote Microsoft as a player in the console market. The Jaguar did well at the start, but lost popularity when the playstation was around the corner. The N64 was by no means a failure. It was a profitable console for Nintendo. The neo-geo did okay even though it never hit the top spot. The 3D0 was a bit of a failure.

      Currently only about 15% of households have HDTVs, and HDTVs currently make up 50% of new TVs sold;

      I have no reason to doubt your figures, but how many of the 50% who decided not to go HD are likely to buy a high end console? In the foirst 6 months, I'd bet 90% of sales will be to those 15% with HDTV. The PS3 is being sold to a technology loving demographic.

      Now, I'll agree that it would probably have made more sense to wait for the next generation to add HD support, but I think it will help both initial sales and longevity. The extra cost could hurt them in the mid term. Perhaps they expect the hardware costs to have fallen sufficiently after 2 years that this will not affect the unit cost too much.

      In other words it is likely that the PS3 will sell worse than either the PS2 or Playstation, and the Wii and XBox 360 will gain in marketshare; how dramatic these changes are is still open to debate.

      This is a possibility. It would not neccesarily be a disaster if the PS3 didn't make a profit though. As long as it does well enough for Sony to learn its lessons, and have a springboard for the PS4, they'll have been justified in their decisions.

    11. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by twistedsymphony · · Score: 1
      Dreamcast: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior PS1
      ARGH... I can't believe you made that comparison.
      Dreamcast:PS2::Saturn:PS1

      The Dreamcast was Sega's competitor to the PS2, Xbox and Gamecube... The Saturn was the competitor to the PS1 and N64. Just because the Dreamcast launched early and died early doesn't mean it was part of the preceding generation. sorry it's just a pet-peeve of mine.
    12. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by OSS_ilation · · Score: 1

      "Early adopters have a lot of money. They can afford the thing. And how often has the most powerful console been a total market failure?" Let me count the ways... 3DO, CD-i, Neo Geo....

    13. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by trdrstv · · Score: 1

      Don't forget Xbox. They sold 20 million units, but lost $4 billion to do it.

    14. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by nuzak · · Score: 2, Insightful

      > Dreamcast: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior PS1

      Arguably it lost out to the then-unreleased PS2. Mostly it lost due to Sega's vast ineptitude.

      > N64: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior PS1

      The N64 was an unqualified runaway success. If you consider "losing" to mean not getting 100% market share, I suppose you could call it a loss.

      > Xbox: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior PS2

      How is something "reasonably successful but still a flop" anyhow?

      > N-Gage: Reasonably successful but still a flop,

      It's becoming apparent you're copying and pasting. Nokia itself considers the N-Gage to have been an unmitigated bomb.

      > PSP: Reasonably successful but still a flop, lost to inferior DS

      UMD is certainly a flop (and the PS3 conspicuously lacks the UMD slot). The DS is a rather different device.

      I actually rather like the PS2, and I think Sony did better for the console gaming industry than Nintendo in the N64 days, but just as Nintendo got taken down a peg, Sony needs to be taken down a couple. I think it'll be good for them.

      --
      Done with slashdot, done with nerds, getting a life.
    15. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Can you define "Successful" and "Flop"? I can't really see how they can be applied to the same product.

    16. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by Haeleth · · Score: 1

      MegaDrive (Genesis): Successful but still a flop, lost to inferior SNES

      Um, no. In that particular struggle, neither console was clearly superior. The Mega Drive had a significantly faster processor, but the SNES had a better sound chip. Graphics marginally favoured the SNES, which could display 4096 simultaneous colours compared to the Mega Drive's measly 64, and could do more fancy scaling and transparency effects; the Mega Drive's standard resolution was marginally higher than the SNES', but not by enough that many people noticed.

      In other words, very hard to call.

    17. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by 91degrees · · Score: 1

      I'm only taling about consoles. Video recoprders have different user demands.

      And I'm not sure 3D0 was all it was cracked up to be. There wasn't that much of a gap between it and the Playstation in terms of release date, and the playstation did have better looking games.

    18. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by 91degrees · · Score: 0

      And established Microsoft as a player in the console market.

      Plus, the XBox has a few more years left in it, and an established userbase that's willing to keep paying for new games and xbox live subscription for a while to come.

    19. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by Chris+Burke · · Score: 1

      Well, anything that completely failed to achieve any of its potential. The XBox was never going to be profitable. It existed to promote Microsoft as a player in the console market. The Jaguar did well at the start, but lost popularity when the playstation was around the corner. The N64 was by no means a failure. It was a profitable console for Nintendo. The neo-geo did okay even though it never hit the top spot. The 3D0 was a bit of a failure.

      Just a bit?

      It's starting to sound like your first question could be rephrased: "How often has any console been a total market failure?" with the answer "never".

      Not terribly useful question then.

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    20. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by ZakuSage · · Score: 1

      I'll call it for you then: SNES created better graphics by a longshot. Calling Genesis the more powerful system simply because of it's slightly faster processor is absurd. It'd be like calling PS2 more powerful then Xbox because the "Emotion Engine" is much more powerful then the depleted P3 in Xbox.

    21. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not running used games is an outright lie. Sony totally denied this in a press release, albeit one I can't find..look it up in Slashdot, I'm sure it'll be there somewhere.

      Stopped using Zonked? Bullshit, go look at any given Zonk post.

      Ridge Racer is always a funny thing to make fun of. Since the most recent Ridge Racer game is on 360

    22. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by brkello · · Score: 1

      Now, I'm not going to make any Doom and Gloom predictions for the PS3 but everyone has to admit that because of the higher price point and low supply the PS3 is (likely) going to sell poorly in 2006 and through the first half of 2007

      I disagree. The PS3 will sell out everywhere (even if it is just because people want to ebay them). Big name developers are already on board. I do agree that Sony will lose market share this round...but I think they will have no problem selling out. It is just that their production will be worse that the Wii and the 360.

      --
      Support a great indie game: http://www.abaddon360.com
    23. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by drsquare · · Score: 1
      I have no reason to doubt your figures, but how many of the 50% who decided not to go HD are likely to buy a high end console?


      They'll buy a wii or 360, along with the 90% of people who wait until their TV breaks before getting a new one.

      I'd bet 90% of sales will be to those 15% with HDTV. The PS3 is being sold to a technology loving demographic.


      A very small demographic. Is this the generation that the PS becomes a niche?
    24. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by joshsisk · · Score: 1

      The neo-geo did okay even though it never hit the top spot. The 3D0 was a bit of a failure.

      I was a teen in the heyday of the Neo-Geo. I only knew one person who had one. Of course, it was a specialty prduct compare to the other consoles, but I don't think you can really say it "did okay".

      The 3D0 was a huge, huge failure that caused the 3DO company to sell off all it's assets and restructure as a content company.

    25. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by HappySqurriel · · Score: 1

      I disagree. The PS3 will sell out everywhere (even if it is just because people want to ebay them). Big name developers are already on board. I do agree that Sony will lose market share this round...but I think they will have no problem selling out. It is just that their production will be worse that the Wii and the 360.

      I think that many people have misunderstood what I meant by "selling poorly" ... I will try to clarify the statement.

      The PS3 will likely sell out from Q4 2006 until the end of Q2 2007 simply because they have a limited supply of units and they have to launch the system in three regions; I think they will fail to make sales projections durring this time frame because they will be unable to supply enough units. I expect that even if Sony gets control over their supply problems that they will continue to sell at an uninspired rate largely because the pricetag acts as a barrier to entry for the average consumer; $600 (for console, 1 game and tax) is a tough expense to justify regardless of income level.

      I can guess what is going to happen in Q3/Q4 2007 but without knowing certain pieces of information I can't guess all that accurately; for example, if the XBox 360 and Wii both drop in price and the PS3 maintains its price the outcome would be different then if Microsoft releases the XBox 360HD and matches the price of a PS3 base.

    26. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The N64 saw Nintendo go from market domination to a distant second. I'd call that a pretty big loss.

    27. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "The XBox is certainly a contender after having lost $4 Billion to only sell 20 Million systems (or $200 per system sold)"

      That's a really interesting statistic, and I'm going to enjoy baiting idiot Xbox fanboys with it.

      However, it's pretty unfair - that money wasn't just spent subsidising xboxes so people would buy them, it also paid for MS to buy development talent like Bungie, Molyneux and Rare (well, sort-of talent), and the Live infrastructure. So, that huge loss was partially to put them in a better position for the 360... not that they're going to hit their targets there either, but can you imagine how much worse they'd be doing if they were starting from scratch?

    28. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by thrillseeker · · Score: 1

      $600 (for console, 1 game and tax) is a tough expense to justify regardless of income level.

      It's a weekend at the beach after a two hour drive - i.e. nothing for a couple of parents looking to please Junior.

    29. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by thrillseeker · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Don't forget Xbox. They sold 20 million units, but lost $4 billion to do it.

      And established Microsoft as a player in the console market.


      $4 billion here ... $4 billion there ... pretty soon we're talking becomeing an established player in the bankruptcy court.

    30. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by Mark+Maughan · · Score: 1

      I completely agree that SNES graphics (and sound) were far superior to the Genesis, but the CPU advantage of the Genesis was also very noticeable in sports and strategy games.

      I had and loved both systems.

    31. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by 91degrees · · Score: 1

      Yeah, Microsoft are scraping for every penny. $4 billion is round about Microsofts quaterly profits. They can afford this sort of loss.

    32. Re:I've been positive about it for a while by MeanderingMind · · Score: 1

      While it may not be independant of income level, a $600 price tag is prohibitive for a large number of incomes and mindsets. There will be parents who have to buy everything for their kids, but on the flip side there will be as many or more parents who can't afford or are unwilling to pay that much.

      --
      Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
  5. Sony should burn. by treffy · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    One more failure, amongst many. Sony as a company should simply wiff out of existance. They do not have a single worthy product, nor service.

    1. Re:Sony should burn. by tomstdenis · · Score: 1

      Give it time... :-)

      It would help if people stopped blindly buying their products... but again we can't count on people being remotely smart about things... ... still need a cookie....

      Tom

      --
      Someday, I'll have a real sig.
    2. Re:Sony should burn. by Reapman · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Hmmm... outside of your world things might be different. The last Ryokan I stayed in Tokyo at, had no less then four Sony computers for guests to use. Including the very sweet L series Vaio, dont think it'll make it stateside tho, shame because that would work great for what my mom needs / wants (functional and good lookin) Plus last I counted they still make the PS2... a product that a few would consider "a worthy product" Plus even tho the software is no iTunes, I actually do enjoy my NWA-3000 Sony Walkman. Showed it to a friend of mine, and if he could buy one over here, he would. I don't run "only" sony... i don't own a Sony computer, I have a Kenwood surround sound setup etc etc... so I don't consider myself much of a fanboy. I'll probably buy a Wii first, then maybe a PS3 (360... if a game of interest for me comes out)

      With that said... I do agree with the one point where comparing myself vs someone that is on 20x more then me doesnt' tell me much... other then he may not have as much of a life as I do. But then again I never really got "into" XBox Live either so I guess i'm not the target audience.

      Ya Sony has done some dumb stupid things, but then again I don't think they're worthy of my hatred yet. I am curious why I haven't read on /. here about some PS3 articles i've read on other sites, talking about where they have seen a PS3 in action, seems to run cooler then a 360 etc etc. Still early maybe that article is below, since I know Slashdot doesn't just run negative Sony stories and all that.

    3. Re:Sony should burn. by treffy · · Score: 1

      Have you seen recent attacks by Sony, namely kiksang articles? How about price tags attached to PS3? In our age, technology should be MORE affordable, and not something of an elite product that try to create. Refer to Grey Goose vodka marketing stories. How about their great rootkits? How about Sony BMGs RIA involvement? How about exploding batteries? Fixing markets around flash ram? There are many more examples, and even if they may act different in Japan, do not forget the culture differences, etc. However, their European involvement, or even North America politics...Its dirty. Microsoft looks like a saint compared to Sony.

    4. Re:Sony should burn. by iainl · · Score: 1

      Lord knows I'm unimpressed with their game, music and movie divisions. I've gone and bought an XBox 360 instead, even though by the time I get the HD-DVD add-on device (and I plan to) it will have cost me as much as Sony's console, mainly because I don't like the look of Blu-Ray. The less said about the rootkit fiasco the better.

      But when I bought an LCD TV earlier in the year, I decided on their Bravia S-series, because nothing beats it for image quality in the price range. Their new W-series is even better, if you've got the extra cash. So the fact that other departments can't find a clue with both hands and a torch shouldn't dimish the good work done for this year's TV models.

      --
      "I Know You Are But What Am I?"
    5. Re:Sony should burn. by Reapman · · Score: 1

      Hence i said they did some dumb stuff lately. With that said, nothing you listed are cause enough for me to "hate with a passion" any company. Now, if you mentioned something like oh I dont know, slave labor, eating babies, that sorta thing... then yes... Sony Should Burn. So far the only tech company in the news about sweat shops was Apple, and although that was questionable as to their direct involvement I dont see nearly as much hatred for directly causing harm to members of the human race vs "the important stuff like music DRM"

    6. Re:Sony should burn. by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Vaios are poop and people who buy them are fucking suckers. They're the same people that buy Apple because it looks nice but they get burned because they buy Sony instead. Sony's driver support is infamous across the industry for being poor and being dropped early - I personally surmise that it is because Japanese electronics have a much shorter life cycle in Japan and they're trying to apply that model to the world. Their hardware quality is poor - or did you miss the fact that they're the ones causing laptops to burst into flame? We got a Vaio with a Core Duo in here, and I got an HP. The Vaio developed a problem in the first couple of weeks... I know it's an anecdote, but it's a tasty one. Do yourself a favor and stay away from Sony computers. Also, Sony has never been able to and probably never will figure out how to make an optical drive that stands up to abuse. We're talking about game consoles. You can beat a gamecube all day and have it still work. Kick your PS1 gently once and it'll never track again. Fuck Sony in their arrogant ear.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    7. Re:Sony should burn. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly. Sony has been getting a lot of bad press recently, but their current line-up of HDTV's may be the most highly regarded overall right now. In the recent past their TVs have been expensive and sub-par, but not right now. Anyone who doubts that merely needs to check the forums at AVScience.com. They are still expensive, but no longer sub-par.

    8. Re:Sony should burn. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So you've never watched a movie from Sony Pictures? You don't like Seinfeld or Jeopardy? I'm willing to take a bet that you have their products in your home. Try looking here http://www.sonypictures.com/ and then make sure you've never come into contact with any of that either. Also don't use Mac's or a large amount of laptops. I'm too lazy to look up more.
       
      And yes, failure, I wish I too could "fail" by your terms. You have the term failure and one of the largest electronics and entertainment companies in history mixed up.

    9. Re:Sony should burn. by (A)*(B)!0_- · · Score: 1
      "With that said, nothing you listed are cause enough for me to "hate with a passion" any company. Now, if you mentioned something like oh I dont know, slave labor, eating babies, that sorta thing... then yes... Sony Should Burn."
      Eating babies? Well, since you included that in the list it is obvious you're not taking this discussion seriously. On the other hand, I think that the way Sony has trampled consumer rights (as evidenced by both the rootkit fiasco and their attacks on lik-sang) gives me a justifiable reason never to give them another dollar. I guess they don't eat babies or whatever other silly, completely inappropriate example you want to give, but I still think their behavior has been completely unacceptable.
    10. Re:Sony should burn. by Reapman · · Score: 1

      No I don't plan on buying a Vaio anytime soon... I value price and features over looks... but I know some people that don't care if it's "as fast" as a beige box, they want one that looks good. And trust me the L looks hot. That's who Sony's computers are geared towards.

    11. Re:Sony should burn. by Reapman · · Score: 1

      You consider sweat shops a "silly, completely inappropriate example"? Thanks for taking one term you did'nt like and ignoring the rest of my response.

      Sorry if saying eating babies you found offensive or whatever it was you found it, but I figured that was the terminology used on slashdot (Lord knows i've read enough about Sony eating babies to figure using it as an anti example would have worked.)

    12. Re:Sony should burn. by treffy · · Score: 1

      People should learn to agree to disagree. If you think Sony is not guilty of aforementioned "digital crimes", it is your opinion. Personally their rootkit galore I had to suffer through, their fn battery leaking all over, AND screwing independant retailers is "digital baby eating" for people such as myself. Larger companies tend to get away with larger crimes, and I simply think consumers should be able to demonstrate the basic level of respect they deserve, instead of being treated as a herd of sheep.

    13. Re:Sony should burn. by (A)*(B)!0_- · · Score: 1
      "You consider sweat shops a "silly, completely inappropriate example"?"
      No, I find the idea that a multi-national corporation "eating babies" quite a glib and foolish comment to make. Your inclusion of it in a list of things that a corporation would have to do wrong in order to raise your ire makes the entire statement sound foolish. Let me explain: if I say that some of my favorite foods are pizza, ice cream and cow dung what conclusion can you draw? Obviously cow dung isn't a food and it's highly doubtful that I enjoy eating. So you're probably going to conclude that I am joking. Am I joking about pizza and ice cream? Who knows. The inclusion of the cow dung in that sentence invalidates any conclusion you can draw about the rest of the sentence. Or, you can also conclude that I may be a very strange person and actually being truthful in mentioning cow dung. In that case, I am not a person with similar taste or sensitibilities as anyone else and therefore any discussion is probably not worth pursuing. I think I have demonstrated that your baby-eating reference creates problems with reading your entire statement. If you do not believe that I have sufficiently demonstrated this please reply and explain where you find fault.
      "Thanks for taking one term you did'nt like and ignoring the rest of my response."
      Again, there are times when the use of one term raises questions about the entire statement. I believe this is one of those times. Furthermore, I made points beyond just the fact that your use of "baby-eating" was inappropriate which you did not address. Please review my comment and address those - specifically why Sony's approach to consumer rights (specifically, ignoring consumer rights, using their clout as a huge company to push lik-sang out of the market, which again infringes on the consumer's right to resell a product that they legally bought) is not bothersome to you.
    14. Re:Sony should burn. by Reapman · · Score: 1

      Read the other response to my post. I'll agree with him and we can agree to disagree. He is right. If it's bothersome to you then you fight your fight. If it's not bothersome to me, I won't join your fight. Each to their own. You obviously feel much stronger about this then I do. You win.

  6. The reactions are positive? by tarun713 · · Score: 2, Informative

    We're talking about the reactions from people who attended a Sony PR event - people who, for the most part, already love Sony. I'd say reactions from them would be slightly biased at the least.

    1. Re:The reactions are positive? by kinglink · · Score: 1

      You're forgetting, they are people who don't have to pay 600 dollars to bask in the glory of Sony.

      It's a great system honestly. If programmed correctly, it'll be slightly better then the 360. However it's harder to program for, it's more expensive, and it's playing catch up with both systems. When for the price of one system I can get a system almost as good in every way, and a system that will play games in new ways why am I buying the more expensive one? Yes it might have motion control, but the Wii will feel better there, yes it might have better graphics, but the Xbox 360 is easier to program for and already has more games.

      The Excite news piece is a fluff piece. You can always find gamers interested even in shitty games. How many people were hyped about Daikatana? How many were excited about the 32x? The answer was a lot and neither delivered.

      Sony still has a lot of life, but there's no amount of spin that can create an urge for me to buy a PS3. At least not until the price drops and some better games come out for it.

  7. I wish i could by joerdie · · Score: 1

    say that PS3 will be end of Sony but im sure it will not be. all you have to do is go onto a few of PS3 message boards to see that millions are lining up to own one. This guy may or may not help, but even with all of the bad press of late, the PS3 will still be a success.

    1. Re:I wish i could by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the PS3 will still be a success.

      I certainly hope so. It will hopefully shut the mouths of a few of slashdot's fabled armchair experts.

      I'm sick of hearing their whinning about DRM and such. Get over it.

    2. Re:I wish i could by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wish I could say 360|Vista|XP would be the end of M$, a company that through its illegal monopoly has single handedly held the PC industry back 10 years.

    3. Re:I wish i could by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Indeed. I am always amused that slashdotters seems to think Microsoft will somehow improve the games industry, even though it has caused every other market it has won so far (desktop OS, Office, web browser) to fall into stasis for years; or that it is somehow less evil than Sony, even though it has over two decades of experience with slimy underhandedness--everything from faking Mac-to-Win switcher blogs to abusing OS monopoly in order to force bundling agreements and extract patent indemnity from PC vendors, deliberate incompatibility with DR-DOS and lying about it, and just plain theft of Stacker and Quicktime codes. And these are just cases that have been exposed, proven and dealt with. (And more are coming: for example, recent testimonies in SCO's lawsuit against IBM indicate that Microsoft covertly bankrolled the lawsuit in order to spread FUD against Linux.)

  8. Wow! by LWATCDR · · Score: 2, Interesting

    This guy worked on the 3DO and the Dreamcast! This means that the PS/3 will be the best console of the generation and still die a marketing driven death!
    He also worked for Martha Stewart and KMart. So that means their is a good chance that this will end in bankruptcy or jail time.

    If Sony was smart they would give Steve Jobs half the stock in the company. He would create a Red PS/3 and give $5 to African Aids research for everyone sold. Bono would hawk it for him and people would get on a six month waiting list to get one.

    --
    See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    1. Re:Wow! by Xugumad · · Score: 1

      Just so you know, it's PS3 not PS/3. PS/2, is either a computer or connector depending on context ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PS/2 ), PS2 was the PlayStation 2.

    2. Re:Wow! by bilbravo · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Troll! Troll!

      Don't you have anything better to do? Good grief!

    3. Re:Wow! by jetxee · · Score: 3, Insightful
      GS: What made you leave games, and what made you come back?

      DK: Well, I left to go chase dot com millions. But that never came to fruition. My 100,000 shares turned into about $33 (laughs). So that wasn't brilliant. I left to go launch Kmart's e-commerce site, is what it was, which was a joint venture between Kmart, Softbank and Martha Stewart. And that obviously went belly-up, so I worked for Kmart for a bit, then left Kmart when the bankruptcy happened, and then Martha Stewart, but I was there during the Martha Stewart...problem.

      It seems I know that kind of managers... They come to take over the project in the end.

    4. Re:Wow! by Hawkxor · · Score: 1

      Don't You?

    5. Re:Wow! by lazyl · · Score: 1

      Troll! Troll!

      --
      Aw crap, ninjas!
    6. Re:Wow! by Cr33pybusguy · · Score: 1

      That is a track record I would not be proud of!
      LOL the Martha Stewart... Problem. Yep going to jail is a problem alright.

      --
      Hee Hee The drinking bird does all the work!
    7. Re:Wow! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If Sony was smart they would give Steve Jobs half the stock in the company. He would create a Red PS/3 and give $5 to African Aids research for everyone sold. Bono would hawk it for him and people would get on a six month waiting list to get one.

      It may not even be necessary for them to actually do any of that. For example, your mere suggestion that it's possible is enough to make me want to buy one. Where do I send my check?

    8. Re:Wow! by Firefly1 · · Score: 1
      ...create a Red PS/3 and give $5 to African Aids research for everyone sold. Bono would hawk it for him and people would get on a six month waiting list to get one.
      The moderation is spot-on here: the above is an interesting idea. Can anyone tell me how this is working out in terms of sales for Gap (I think that's the store running this deal on some clothing)?
      If I read this correctly, these Red PS3s would be part of the first wave - in that case, the per-unit donation (note to accounting weasels: don't even think of passing this cost on to the consumers) might need to be raised some, given the size of the early-adopter base. This also means that there will be less tolerance for defects.
      --
      - White Knight of the Order of Mihoshi Enthusiasts
  9. I gave up by tkrotchko · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I made it to page 4 of 5. But the interviewer clearly is more concerned with being a buddy than asking anything interesting or inciteful.

    Here's two of his question on the first page:

    GS: Sounds fun!

    GS: Woah!

    and on the second page, he says:

    GS: It did seem like there were a number of mis-statements, and this may be a media misperception, but did you have to work to rein people in and make sure they're on message?

    Even the Sony guy didn't claim that (and note the spelling error is the web site's not mine)

    And then he asks:
    GS: Don't take offense to this, but is the system going to be able to hold up to being always on?

    Why worry about if he's going to take offense? This is not journalism, this is a fan blog. Don't worry about offended a PR flac... that's his job. Ask questions that mean something... "The console looks impressive, but it's the most expensive. Why do you think gamers will buy it?". Don't pretend all negative buzz is just from people not being on message.

    The guy doesn't have to be combative, but he should ask some questions that are hard and that might be interesting to the readership.

    --
    You were mistaken. Which is odd, since memory shouldn't be a problem for you
    1. Re:I gave up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Even the Sony guy didn't claim that (and note the spelling error is the web site's not mine)

      I was going to say "Well, the author was a former Slashdot editor!", but the submitter and author don't seem to be the same person.

    2. Re:I gave up by drew · · Score: 1
      GS: It did seem like there were a number of mis-statements, and this may be a media misperception, but did you have to work to rein people in and make sure they're on message?

      Even the Sony guy didn't claim that (and note the spelling error is the web site's not mine)


      Which spelling error? Unless you think they are talking about turning all of the marketing people into royalty, I don't see anything out of place there.
      --
      If I don't put anything here, will anyone recognize me anymore?
  10. Paid well by Fozzyuw · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I hope their new PR guy is good. They do have a lot overcome. However, there has been a lot of doom and gloom viral marketing for the PS3 which is not entirely true. Even though I've speculated a lot on /. about Sony's poor choices on the PS3 and how it expect it to hurt their sales, I have also been (finally) seeing more information on their games and their hardware and I'm pretty interested in it. Some of their screen shots are breathtaking.

    Was the most controversial, Blu-Ray, the right thing to do? Hmm... I'm still going to say no. However, like I've said in the past, looking at the perspective of adding it or leaving it, I can only defend adding it, all things considered once I think about it...

    • Add a stand alone Blu-ray option? No, it's a game machine, it should have a standard media and not duel/split media. I'd hate to see a game developed 'exclusively' for the Blu-Ray player.
    • Price? I cannot comment directly, but for some reason, I just don't see the price dropping significantly. Sony is already taking a big chunk of the cost of new units. Without Blu-Ray, Sony will be just taking less of a hit, but still charging $500. And lets face it. When it comes to gamers who can spend $400 on the latest video card, $500 for a full system can be justified for them. Such, it does suck when the competition is at $250 and $400, but hey, those are the rules.
    • Blu-Ray as a medium? This is Sony's baby. If they don't start forcing this down people's throats, it might not make it in the next-format wars. Sony's set to reap tons of profits off Blu-Ray licenses, likely more so than anything the PS3 could do, given the fact that if Blu-Ray becomes the adopted standard, it could very well last for well over a decade, much longer than any game console has lasted.

    While I think Sony has been doing things ass-backwards as far as Public Relations and response to the 'shock' of the new system on gamers, they do have room to make amends if they just started being a little more respectful and talking up their system on a positive aspect instead of the "you're n00b!" approach.

    Cheers,
    Fozzy

    --
    "The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became truth." ~1984 George Orwell
    1. Re:Paid well by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Add a stand alone Blu-ray option? No, it's a game machine, it should have a standard media and not duel/split media.


      Me too... I hate it when some of my media starts wars with my other media... or worse, it attacks me when I'm least expected... particularly late and night and it wakes me up. I prefer my media to all get along.
    2. Re:Paid well by elrous0 · · Score: 1
      The main problem with Sony's PR to date is their (largely deserved) reputation of being heavy-handed, arrogant, control-freaks. It's going to take more than a PR blitz to shake THAT rep among us geeks, especially in light of the still-all-too-fresh rootkit fiasco, the various "The revolution doesn't start until WE say so" statements, their long-standing propensity for supporting only their own obscure proprietary formats, etc.

      -Eric

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
  11. Saturn games for download?!!? by testudorex · · Score: 1

    *drools* dragon force I'd buy a ps3 just so I could play the saturn again...

    --
    "NASA's Rollercoaster For Moon Rocket Escape"
    Xonk?
    1. Re:Saturn games for download?!!? by iainl · · Score: 1

      Don't jump at it too quickly - I expect to see the same stuff end up on both Wii's download service and the XBox Live Arcade in good time.

      --
      "I Know You Are But What Am I?"
    2. Re:Saturn games for download?!!? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      XBLA has a 50 megabyte size limit for games. The Wii only has 512 Mb of internal storage - which you can expand by buying SD cards, but the prices for SD cards are currently so high that you'll be spending more on storage than on the game.

      Basically, don't expect any 300 megabyte CD based games on either system.

      The premium 360 has the capacity, if MS decides to abandon their policy of making all downloadable games available to core system users, and the Wii could potentially use a USB hard drive, but no plans have been announced. The only other possibility is if they reengineer the games to use additional compression on their music and video, which might drive the sizes down to something reasonable.

    3. Re:Saturn games for download?!!? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      "The Revolution won't have a hard drive, though, raising questions about where owners will be able to store games obtained from the system's "Virtual Console" (a service that will allow them to download virtually every game for previous Nintendo home systems, as well as select titles from the Sega Genesis and TurboGrafx systems).

      Again, Iwata said this will be a topic addressed at E3, though he did offer some insight.

      The Revolution has 512 MB of flash memory, allowing for some initial storage space. The system also has a slot for SD memory cards, which are widely used in digital cameras and can hold a greater amount of data. Most importantly, Iwata mentioned, were the USB ports that are built into the Revolution "so practically any storage method can be used".

      http://money.cnn.com/2006/03/29/commentary/game_ov er/column_gaming/index.htm

      Your Welcome

    4. Re:Saturn games for download?!!? by IpalindromeI · · Score: 1

      but the prices for SD cards are currently so high that you'll be spending more on storage than on the game.

      A quick froogle/pricegrabber search finds 2Gb SD cards for $30. Doesn't seem to bad to me, although I don't know how big the average Saturn game was. Also, the Wii has two USB ports on the back, which may be able to connect to USB hard drives for another storage option.

      --

      --
      Promoting critical thinking since 1994.
    5. Re:Saturn games for download?!!? by IpalindromeI · · Score: 1

      Guess I should have read the rest of your post:P Bleh.

      Sorry for the redundancy.

      --

      --
      Promoting critical thinking since 1994.
  12. Nice straw man by Control+Group · · Score: 3, Insightful

    An overall score doesn't really tell me much, it tells me you've spent a lot of time online, it tells me you spend a lot of time playing games, but it doesn't tell me how good you are at a particular game

    But the gamerscore isn't supposed to fill the role of "how good an opponent is someone," it's to fill the role of providing an official metric for the eternal "my dick's bigger than yours" competition that goes on amongst "hardcore" gamers. And that's a competition that's been going on since arcade denizens started sending Polaroids of their high scores in to gaming magazines.

    That's all the gamerscore means, and it's not meant to mean anything else. It's bragging rights by the numbers, and I think it's a bit disingenuous to say that it doesn't matter because it's not a record of how good someone is at a given game.

    --

    Reality has a conservative bias: it conserves mass, energy, momentum...
    1. Re:Nice straw man by GrayCalx · · Score: 1

      And lets not forget the "Pokemon Syndrome" of gotta catch 'em all. I do agree with him that you can't compare your score to anothers and expect to find anything significant in what type of player you are. But still... I like collecting things, what can I say. I have and will, replayed a couple of levels/games just to try and get that Achievement that I missed.

    2. Re:Nice straw man by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      What's important about Live gamerscore is that you can see what games ppl you meet are playing and how seriously they've been playing them.
      You could decide to add someone in your friend list based on that information.

    3. Re:Nice straw man by freeweed · · Score: 1

      I think that was entirely his point.

      --
      Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
    4. Re:Nice straw man by Mongoose · · Score: 1

      I think gamerscore is just a lame way to make morons buy more games. Have you ever heard someone boasting about how they go out and import or buy crappy 360 games just to increase their gamer score? That's great for MS in terms of revenue, but I think it's a cheap gimmick. I would rather play multiplayer with more mature indivduals, and also like to 'opt-out' of sharing what games I play. Do you really need to know I play Shin Megami Tensei? What if your some ultra relgious zealot and see that? Think about it.

    5. Re:Nice straw man by elrous0 · · Score: 1
      I think gamerscore is just a lame way to make morons buy more games.

      Yes, God forbid Sony encourage that. All part of their new strategy:

      • Discourage gamers from buying more games.
      • ??
      • Profit!!

      -Eric

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    6. Re:Nice straw man by Control+Group · · Score: 1

      Then hide your details on Live. This isn't rocket surgery.

      Have you ever heard someone boasting about how they go out and import or buy crappy 360 games just to increase their gamer score?

      Then it's a winning business strategy then, isn't it? Makes it sort of self-evident that MS is providing something that people want, doesn't it? Makes it a little silly for a Sony flak to claim that it's something people don't actually want, don't you think?

      --

      Reality has a conservative bias: it conserves mass, energy, momentum...
  13. Sony's Marketing Model by pembo13 · · Score: 1

    1) Piss in the koolaid
    2) Relish the fact that no matter what you do your loyal fan base will still throw their salaries at you
    3) ????
    4) Laugh some more
    5) Profit

    --
    "Thanks for all the money you paid to us. We've used it to buy off ISO among other things" -Microsoft
  14. Too little too late? by pboyd2004 · · Score: 0

    "Now we're very aggressively defending our turf."
    Let's see the console launches in a couple of weeks and you're just now going to start defending it?
    Brilliant marketing strategy...

  15. Sony's finally woken up by gamer4Life · · Score: 1

    After neglecting the Internet space, they've finally realized that there's a lot of unfounded trash talk against the PS3. Microsoft's been very keen at catering to the blogosphere that there are many pro-360 sites which have helped influence the minds of many gamers.

    Overpriced? Nope, it's a better value than the XBox 360 when it comes to technology and cost of manufacturing.

    Overheating? Nope, it's cooler than the XBox 360.

    Shortage? Doesn't take away from the console, just my ability to buy one.

    The only thing I can think of that's a legitimate negative for the PS3 is the lack of rumble.

    The positives for the PS3 are worth the extra $100 you spend (Premium Xbox 360 vs base PS3):

    Free online service
    Better form factor
    Linux capability
    Blu-ray
    Motion control
    Superior hardware (may take at least a year for developers to take advantage of it though)

    It was Linux capability that tipped the scales for me though.

    As for rootkit, Lik-Sang and DRM... I think Microsoft's done just as bad w/ their monopoly and it's just as bad with DRM.

    The Wii is a great machine too, and I've been recommending it to most people who can't afford the PS3 (or can afford both), and to those who have kids.

    1. Re:Sony's finally woken up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Free online service --True
      Better form factor --Opinion
      Linux capability --Average user does not care
      Blu-ray --N/A as not a standard yet.
      Motion control --True
      Superior hardware (may take at least a year for developers to take advantage of it though) -- As with all consoles the old saying , it is the games, still aplies.

      So.....

      Is it still worth the extra $100 to anybody else besides you? Who knows, who cares.

      If you want one then buy one, I am happy with my GBA.

    2. Re:Sony's finally woken up by Xugumad · · Score: 3, Insightful

      > Overpriced? Nope, it's a better value than the XBox 360 when it comes to technology and cost of manufacturing.

      Yes, except, fundamentally, it's a games console. There's over a decade's evidence that the $300 price point works well for a console at release. Personally, I'm not willing to spend $599 on a games console. It could be hand crafted, and cost twice as much to make as they're selling it for, for all I care, there's still the fact that it's games console priced outside what I'm willing to spend on a games console.

      Heard a lot of similar arguments about the Mac Pro, while trying to argue that it would be great if Apple released an upgradable iMac equivalent. It's brilliant value for money, if you want a quad core Xeon workstation, but fundamentally if you don't need that much processing power it's just not worth it.

      > Overheating? Nope, it's cooler than the XBox 360.

      Source?

      > Shortage? Doesn't take away from the console, just my ability to buy one.

      Agree. The late launch may be an issue, but frankly a launch shortage is going to have minimal impact 6 months down the line.

      > Free online service
      Yup

      > Better form factor
      Err... no, I'd call both equally ugly. But hey, each to their own

      > Linux capability
      Good point for the /. crowd, but it's not exactly going to make or break the console.

      > Blu-ray
      Which is great, if you want HD movies. I'm unconvinced this is going to be a major selling point, especially as so far HD-DVD seems to be doing a lot better than Blu-Ray. It could be an issue for games, but personally I'm not seeing two-DVD releases being a major issue.

      > Motion control
      I thought general opinion is this wasn't very good, or was it just not quite as good as Nintendos?

      The PS3 is one hell of a powerful console, released at a decent price point for the cost to make... I just personally don't think people are going to be willing to pay the extra, and that the XBox 360 and Wii will both gain serious ground before Sony gets around to price cuts...

    3. Re:Sony's finally woken up by HappySqurriel · · Score: 1

      Overpriced? Nope, it's a better value than the XBox 360 when it comes to technology and cost of manufacturing.

      It may be a better "value" but that doesn't really matter too much to people when it comes to videogames. The reality is that people buy a videogame system when a game they want is released for it and (usually) not for the technology that is in the system; a high price acts as a barrier to entry because there are few people who are willing to spend $500/$600 to play 1 or 2 games.

      Overheating? Nope, it's cooler than the XBox 360.

      Overheating and durability will be seen as to whether it is better than the XBox 360 ...

      Free online service

      Depending on how good it is ... I would (personally) rather spend $4.50 per month for a good service than use an awful service for free.

      Better form factor

      Define "Better" ...

      Linux capability

      Unless it alows for homebrew development this is pretty pointless ...

      Blu-ray

      I don't own a 1080p TV and there is so little content for Blu-Ray that it is pointless at this time; over time the extra space may be useful for games but (beyond 1080p FMV) there is little content that will use this space.

      Motion control

      With how this Motion control is integrated I'm not sure how much of a benefit there will be ...
      The Wii offers a whole new playing experience with tons of ways to use the controller, the PS3 controller seems only really useful for flight games or monkey ball ...

      I'm not trying to say that the PS3 is doomed just the benefits you listed are all conditional benefits or are quite limited ...

    4. Re:Sony's finally woken up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Overpriced? Nope, it's a better value than the XBox 360 when it comes to technology and cost of manufacturing.

      You mean, once you realize that Sony are trying to sell an overarchitected chip that they can't efficiently make and that isn't a good fit for games anyway, it's good value. Yup, I'll agree there. Unfortunately most consumers won't spend $600 just to get a miracle of modern process engineering. They just want games and stuff.

      Overheating? Nope, it's cooler than the XBox 360.

      Plucked out of your ass. Let's wait and see, shall we? Like you say, no-one's using half the CPU yet.

      The positives for the PS3 are worth the extra $100 you spend (Premium Xbox 360 vs base PS3)

      Why would you compare the Premium XBox and the Base PS3? Other than to make the PS3 only look $100 more when in fact it is $200 more?

      Better form factor

      WTF?

      Linux capability

      Yes, real useful - no SPU access and an underpowered PPC unit with no speculative execution - that doesn't compete effectively with a $200 Dell PC. They're not going to let you write a movie player on this, you know.

      Blu-ray

      So you're paying $600 to help Sony corner the movie format market. Do you think that's going to make them cheaper to buy, should they succeed? After all we've all seen how reasonably priced UMD movies are, and you can buy a 1GB memory stick for under $100 these days. I'd go with XBox 360 just to make sure that the future movie format is not proprietory to one company.

      Motion control

      That doesn't mean what you think it means. I guess you're referring to the technology they ripped from Nintendo at the 11th hour. Yeah, that's going to work properly in time for launch.

      Superior hardware (may take at least a year for developers to take advantage of it though)

      It's not even superior. Not for games. You're buying a supercomputer but you don't need a supercomputer to play games. You need a machine that's designed for games. Sony didn't talk to any game developers about Cell before charging ahead and implementing it. Kutaragi knows best. Whereas MS consulted everyone and came up with a machine developers are happy about.

      At least we agree the Wii rules.

    5. Re:Sony's finally woken up by MSFanBoi2 · · Score: 1

      The "free" online service Sony provides is already showing not to be really good, with a LOT of developers complaining that it was easier to do there own online services than use the framework provided by Sony.

      Point Microsoft

      Developers are already saying the hardware platforms are close in performance, very close, with props going to Microsoft for more memory and much easier development.

      Point Microsoft

      The blue ray drive in the PS3 has been killing production of other blue ray players, and quite frankly it hasn't even been close to deciding yet the victor over DVD if there ever was one. Why shove it down someones throat and increase the cost?

      Point Microsoft

      LIMITED motion control that replaces force feedback/rumble, and then to not let developers know rumble was going away till months and months into the development cycle? Thats not a positive in any developers book.

      Better formfactor?
      How so? PS3: about 13.5" x 3.25" and 11 lbs, versus Xbox360 about 10.25" x 2.5" deep at 7.7 lbs. hell the PS3 is LARGER than the original XBox that everyone was complaining was too big!
      Point Microsoft

    6. Re:Sony's finally woken up by DeadMilkman · · Score: 1

      How about using 1/4 your "base" Harddrive to play one game, or spend quite of bit of loading time.

      That game is Ridge Racer, it requests 5gigs for a local install. And this info is from the japanese lead producer of the title.

    7. Re:Sony's finally woken up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Overpriced? Nope, it's a better value than the XBox 360 when it comes to technology and cost of manufacturing."

      Ummm... there's a difference between being a good value for the what you get and being overpriced for your market. Most people are claiming the latter.

      "Overheating? Nope, it's cooler than the XBox 360."

      Unproven. Wait till it's in the wild and thousands of people are sticking the system in enclosed entertainment centers. Plus, who knows what other problems will crop up? Unless you are a total noob you should be well aware of the issues with the PS1 and PS2. PS1 had issues like overheating and people having to turn the system upside down to play FMV smoothly. The PS2 had disc scratching issues and systems died in droves due to various reasons (the system has what... like 14 revisions?). Sony's record for hardware in the console market is very poor.

      "Shortage? Doesn't take away from the console, just my ability to buy one."

      True enough. It just hurts PR.

      "The only thing I can think of that's a legitimate negative for the PS3 is the lack of rumble."

      This is indeed pretty crappy.

      "The positives for the PS3 are worth the extra $100 you spend (Premium Xbox 360 vs base PS3):"

      "Free online service" (Might be great, might suck. I have my doubts that it will be able to match what Live offers.)
      "Better form factor" (What are you talking about here? I hope it's not the physical system... because it's damned ugly and HUGE. It's bigger than the original XBox which caught all kinds of flak for being that big. Somehow Sony has managed to dodge the same complaints... not sure how.)

      "Linux capability" (Great! Too bad it won't matter to 95%+ of the gaming audience.)

      "Blu-ray" (That's totally subjective. So far the 360 is getting along just fine. Devs on the PS3 are likely just going to fill it with tons of HD FMV. Sorry, but I'll take the in-game engine used for cut scenes over FMV any day. FMV can certainly look pretty, but when it looks nothing like the game you are playing it only serves to take from the immersion. Other than that the system may certainly appeal to some home theater buffs looking for a cheap Blu-Ray movie player. The question here is will the video quality be as good as a stand-alone player? That certainly wasn't truye for the PS2 and XBox. They were decent DVD movie players at best.)

      "Motion control" (Again, unproven. It's really just an attempt to copy Nintendo. Maybe it will work great? That has yet to be seen. But just FYI, MS has plans for motion technolgy via the camera. Will it work? Who knows? It' also is unproven. But it the technolgy works great then it has the potential to be as good or better than Nintendo's implementation since it will be able to read body movements and not just controller movement. If it does work though it still faces an uphill battle since it's not standard equipment, but there are plans and so far neither Sony nor MS have proven anything with their motion technology.)

      "Superior hardware (may take at least a year for developers to take advantage of it though)" (HAHA... even developers have disagreed on this. A fair number have come out and said they don't expect any major differences between the systems in terms of graphics for games. So, again, unproven.)

    8. Re:Sony's finally woken up by powerlord · · Score: 1
      > Blu-ray
      Which is great, if you want HD movies. I'm unconvinced this is going to be a major selling point, especially as so far HD-DVD seems to be doing a lot better than Blu-Ray. It could be an issue for games, but personally I'm not seeing two-DVD releases being a major issue.


      Most people keep talking about "Oh, I'll just wait till the dual format players are available".

      If that is true, and most people have dual format players, and a whole bunch more people have PS3s (over the number of standalone HD-DVD players), then Sony won and more movies will probably be produced in Blu-Ray.
      --
      This space for rent. All reasonable inquiries will be entertained at proprietors discretion.
    9. Re:Sony's finally woken up by Chris+Burke · · Score: 1

      Overpriced? Nope, it's a better value than the XBox 360 when it comes to technology and cost of manufacturing.

      Is a Ferrari overpriced? Depends on what you mean by "overpriced". Priced over what?

      If you mean priced over the cost of materials, research, manufacturing, and a reasonable percentage of profit margin, then no.

      If you mean priced over what most people buying a car -- even a sports car -- can afford, then hell yes it's overpriced.

      The Ferrari is not overpriced one way, but is in another, and that second way very much limits the sales of Ferraris. Is the Ferrari "worth" every penny? Sure, but that doesn't matter at all if you don't have sufficient pennies.

      I'm not sure what the logic is behind saying the price is not a legitimate negative for the console. A "legitimate negative" is any rational reason why I or anyone else would choose not to buy the console. You better believe price is such a reason. I sure hope Sony, behind closed doors, believes it.

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    10. Re:Sony's finally woken up by CronoCloud · · Score: 1
      Linux capability

      Unless it alows for homebrew development this is pretty pointless ...


      What part of the following do you not understand?


      Under basic agreement with SCEI, Terra Soft was granted a unique opportunity to develop and bring to market a complete Linux OS for PLAYSTATION 3. In development of Yellow Dog Linux v5.0, Terra Soft integrated and enhanced code from Barcelona Supercomputing Center, SCEI , and Fedora in order to offer the following:
      - kernel 2.6.16
      - gcc 4.1.1 and glibc 2.4
      - Cell SDK 1.1
      - OpenOffice.org 2.0.2
      - FireFox 1.5.0 and Thunderbird 1.5.0
      - Nautilus 2.14 ... and a suite of Personal Accessories, Development Tools; Sound & Video, Internet, and Networking applications.


    11. Re:Sony's finally woken up by CronoCloud · · Score: 1
      Good point for the /. crowd, but it's not exactly going to make or break the console.


      It's a big selling point for purchase justification:

      Hey mom, it isn't just a games machine, I can do my homework.

      There's a lot of "second PC's" being sold, the PS3 could make a dent in that:

      "Hey, we don't need another windows machine, when our PS3 can do double duty"

    12. Re:Sony's finally woken up by KDR_11k · · Score: 1

      Your username really lends you credibility.

      --
      Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
    13. Re:Sony's finally woken up by IpalindromeI · · Score: 1

      Shortage? Doesn't take away from the console, just my ability to buy one.

      The shortage could have a bigger effect than you think. The PS3 isn't coming out a year ahead of its competitors, leaving no real alternative but waiting. I'm guessing there will be more than a few people who will pass on the PS3 because the Wii and XBox360 are sitting right there on the shelf ready to take home. To add to that fun, it won't even be released in Europe and Australia until March. Meanwhile, Wiis and 360s will be selling everywhere.

      Okay, you got yours so big deal, right? Who cares if no one else has one. Well, the developers care. They want their games to sell to the most people. If the PS3 has a smaller install base because the machines aren't available, developers will be looking to the other consoles first. That means less exclusives for the PS3, and maybe more exclusives with the other two.

      I think a shortage will hurt the PS3 more than any of the other "reasons for failure" that people keep bringing up. It simply won't be able to grow the install base fast enough to generate the massive snowball effect the PS2 had.

      --

      --
      Promoting critical thinking since 1994.
    14. Re:Sony's finally woken up by zeroduck · · Score: 1
      Better formfactor? How so? PS3: about 13.5" x 3.25" and 11 lbs, versus Xbox360 about 10.25" x 2.5" deep at 7.7 lbs. hell the PS3 is LARGER than the original XBox that everyone was complaining was too big! Point Microsoft

      The 360 also has a massive power brick. The PS3 has a standard PC power plug on the back (for that, I give them props).

      Disclaimer: I have a 360, and I love it. Even though I really shouldn't have spent as much as I did on it (I realize this as my credit card statement is coming in).

    15. Re:Sony's finally woken up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Manufacturing cost? That has nothing to do with the acceptable price point of an item. If you can deliver for less and choose not to, how can I, as a consumer, be expected to reward you for that? Not to mention that, as far as I can tell, anyone who goes into mainstream business with the message, "We spent too much making our product and we need to cut our losses!" is either shady or running an outright scam.

    16. Re:Sony's finally woken up by MeanderingMind · · Score: 1

      I don't think we need the confusion.

      Mom: "Go do your homework Junior."

      Junior: "I'll go do my 'homework' on the PS3."

      Mom: "Okay Dear."

      3 hours later...

      Mom: "How's your homework coming dear?"

      Junior: "Great mom, I've almost cleared the third boss!"

      --
      Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
    17. Re:Sony's finally woken up by MeanderingMind · · Score: 1

      The part where that wasn't posted in the first place?

      You don't have to be abrasive about being more informed than the rest of us. Sony hasn't really gone out of its way to tell us that Linux on the PS3 isn't gimped like it was on the PS2. Your post is informative, but please assume that we're simply not informed as opposed to willfully ignorant in the future (regardless of which we may actually be).

      --
      Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
    18. Re:Sony's finally woken up by CronoCloud · · Score: 1

      I believed it was willful ignorance when the parent could have read the information I posted, on the YDL website.....two weeks ago.

      The YDL website has been linked to in the various PS3 Linux articles posted on Slashdot. In fact it was the Oct 17 article posted here that led me to the info I posted.

      This does not take into account that SCE has been saying for months that the Linux for PS3 release would have the full dev toolchain, i.e. gcc etc. As did the PS2 Linux kit.

      I do also wish some people would leave commenting on the usefulness of Linux on the PS2 to those who actually own kits. I wouldn't consider the thing gimped when one can actually compile recent GIMP code on it., or your own code. No you can't just make a disc to hand off to a regular PS2 owner but that's not a biggie. The PS2 Linux kit was probably best used for ones portfolio, or to do a prototype to show to a publisher

  16. Retail Channel by corby · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Hate to say it, Sony, but your biggest image problem right now isn't coming from the media. It's the retail channel.

    I walked into a Gamestop this week, and casually asked about the next-gen systems. The employees there pushed the Wii and the 360 hard, and slammed the PS3.

    Why? Because the retail outlets know they will be able to sell a bunch of hardware, software, and accessories for the Wii and the 360. They know that customers who hold out for a PS3 will simply spend the holidays on a waiting list, and not spend any cash at the store.

    Sony's shipping projections for the PS3 are shrinking every week, and the retailers don't see any reason to bend over for Sony at this time.

    1. Re:Retail Channel by _xeno_ · · Score: 1

      I noticed that when Best Buy recently sent me a catalog advertising all their "Holiday gift ideas."

      The Wii had a full two page picture as the lead-in to the video game section, plus it's own half-page within the game section next to the rest of the Nintendo games.

      The only mention of the PS3 was stuck on a quarter of the PlayStation page, split with the PSP and various games.

      And I'll bet you're right. Best Buy knows that each store will get something on the order of 5-10 PS3s total in time for Christmas. (OK, that number was pulled out of my ass. But it's something ridiculously low, since it's 400,000 units spread out amongst all retailers.)

      I don't know how many Wiis they expect to get, but I'll bet it's in the 50-100 unit range per store. Again, a made up number, but since Nintendo will be releasing 4 million units, it's at least the correct ratio compared to the PS3 numbers.

      --
      You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
    2. Re:Retail Channel by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wasn't the 4 million figure "by the end of 2006"?

      Sony is still adamant they'll have at leas 2 million by then, which isn't half bad. The 400,000 is only launchday numbers, and that's almost 100,000 more units than Microsoft shipped for the US launch of the 360.

      It makes sense not to advertise it now, but once the second shipments of PS3s arrive? I'm betting there'll be just as much advertisement as Wii, if not more.

  17. FUD Turns To Bitterness by RichardMarks · · Score: 1

    Having gone through many console launches, it is amazing to see how the vast majority of the PS3 FUD is almost word for word/cut n paste six year old PS2 FUD.

    And we all know how that worked out six years ago...

    Right about now is when all the pre-launch FUD starts to fade away as people get first hand experience with the console and the room for wild FUD claims goes away and the FUD turns to bitter, almost self pitying, posts and stories about how Sony is once again fooling gamers 'with teh Sony Hype and Lies' as Playstation console fly off the shelves.

    The only thing that is really different this time for Sony is the bitterness is ramped up a notch. There is a decent number of people that have been praying for Sony to fail for a decade now. Dreamcast fans. Xbox fans. And now Xbox 360 fans. All looking yet again at Sony dominating another console generation(execept in Japan where it will probably be pretty close between the Wii and PS3).

    1. Re:FUD Turns To Bitterness by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can call it FUD all you want, but nearly all of it is based in truth. It will catch up to them at some point. You can't continue to piss off your userbase and get away with it forever. Nintendo was on top with the NES and SNES and then got too arrogant and took a big fall to Sony. Now Sony is clearly heading down the same path. It may not be this generation, but they are definitely headed for a fall. My guess... Sony is going to lose a lot of market share this generation and their fall will be complete next generation.

    2. Re:FUD Turns To Bitterness by IpalindromeI · · Score: 1

      The only thing that is really different this time for Sony is the bitterness is ramped up a notch.

      I didn't follow the action during the PS2 / Gamecube / Xbox launch period, so tell me if any of these things were different:
      * Was the PS2 released an entire year after one of the others?
      * Was it last to release in Europe/Australia by 3+ months?
      * Did the PS2 face a manufacturing shortage, while the others did not during the same period?
      * Was the PS2 priced over twice as much as one of the others?

      I'm pretty sure all of those are different this time. I don't think the PS3 is going to be a miserable failure, but it clearly does not have many of the advantages the PS2 had when it launched. The PS2 had a long time to shake out its launch mistakes before the other two came along. The PS3 doesn't have that. In fact, if Sony follows history, the PS3 will have some pretty bad quality problems, in addition to the shortage that is already expected. Do you think that will help them? When the competition is out in full force without those problems or shortages?

      You're just as bad as the FUD flingers if you can't see those disadvantages.

      --

      --
      Promoting critical thinking since 1994.
    3. Re:FUD Turns To Bitterness by Saint_Waldo · · Score: 0

      I didn't follow the action during the PS2 / Gamecube / Xbox launch period, so tell me if any of these things were different:
      So you are unqualified to make an accurate assesment, yet you'll still fling poo in unknown drections, while asserting no bad intent. Fine.

      * Was the PS2 released an entire year after one of the others?
      Yes, it was supposedly the "too little, too late" response to the Sega Dreamcast. DC came out 15 months before PS2. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sega_Dreamcast

      * Was it last to release in Europe/Australia by 3+ months?
      Not quite, it trailed by about a month, but what is the point of this question? No one can buy a Vend in the EU for the forseeable future, so I guess Microsoft should just go die in a corner? We all know that XBox 360 had the first worldwide launch, but we also know that it wasn't the smoothest thing ever. So half-point to MS for doing that, but it doesn't mean everyone that follows has to do the same to be counted as a valid contender.

      * Did the PS2 face a manufacturing shortage, while the others did not during the same period?
      Yes. But it was the only system ramping up at the time, and both the GameCube and Dreamcast were subject to tight supplies when they were released. DC couldn't fill all the preorders, just as an example. And manf issues do not neccesarily hurt eventual sales. First release iPod, anyone?

      * Was the PS2 priced over twice as much as one of the others?
      Yes. Because DC issued a price cut right when the PS2 was launched, you could purchase a DC for exactly 1/2 the retail cost of the PS2.

      Any more questions?

    4. Re:FUD Turns To Bitterness by IpalindromeI · · Score: 1

      I had forgotten the DC, thanks for the link. That article makes it clear, however, that the Dreamcast was mostly irrelevant. Japan ignored it, waiting for the Playstation 2, and even though it did well in the beginning in the US, it couldn't keep enough attention there either. Sega announced it was discontuing the DC just 3 months after the PS2 was released in the US. I don't think the DC was enough of a competitor that it actually made a difference.

      * Was it last to release in Europe/Australia by 3+ months?
      Not quite, it trailed by about a month, but what is the point of this question?


      I'm not sure where your "about a month" figure comes from here. If you're still talking about the DC, Wikipedia gives more than a year after for the PS2 release. If not, the PS2 beat the other two to Europe by a year and a half. So it wasn't last to Europe either way. The point of the question was to note that, of this generation's three major consoles, the PS3 will be the last to launch in Europe by over three months. Reversing the situation of the PS2, where it beat the main competitors to all territories by over a year.

      * Did the PS2 face a manufacturing shortage, while the others did not during the same period?
      Yes. But it was the only system ramping up at the time


      Yeah, that's why I worded the question that way. By the time the Gamecube and XBox came out, the PS2's manufacturing problems were over. There wasn't a time when the PS2 was having a shortage and the GC and Xbox were not. That's the reverse of this launch, where the PS3 will be facing a pretty serious shortage while the other two won't be.

      Any more questions?

      Sure. Why not answer the real argument rather than throw shadows? The parent of my post was basically stating that although the PS3 launch has the same naysayers as the PS2 launch, that they will all be proven wrong for the same reasons. I was pointing out some of the differences. Like I said, I don't think the PS3 will be a miserable failure. If it is wildly successful, it will be for different reasons than the PS2 because almost none of the circumstances are the same. The only things that are really the same are: the words "Sony" and "Playstation", and probably the brand loyalty. I doubt those things are enough to disprove the naysayers, so if it happens, it will be due to other factors.

      --

      --
      Promoting critical thinking since 1994.
    5. Re:FUD Turns To Bitterness by Saint_Waldo · · Score: 0

      Dude, apparently 1up completely agrees with me. http://www.1up.com/do/feature?cId=3155102 It's on the front page now...

    6. Re:FUD Turns To Bitterness by IpalindromeI · · Score: 1

      Nice response. I can see you have a firm grasp of debate.

      Dude! A gaming journal having a slow news day posted a fluff piece listing a bunch of similarities to the current situation! I win!

      I bow to your superior pwnage. By the way, did you see the second page?

      --

      --
      Promoting critical thinking since 1994.
    7. Re:FUD Turns To Bitterness by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do you know what FUD is? FUD is when a company goes on stage in front of a thousand journalists and says "only our console has true HD". When a disgruntled individual expresses his opinion, that is not FUD. That is grassroots disenchantment. Lap it up.

      The only people who are bitter at Sony are those who have bought Sony products.

      PSP - total waste of space as a media player because Sony deliberately crippled it; and yet it was sold as a games machine and media player.

      Any Sony music player - even if they missed the ATRAC bullshit they still have to put up with SonicStage.

      Those CDs with rootkits on - nuff said.

      The price of Memory Sticks - anyone who's bought a Sony camera or audio player has had to face the 75% Sony Tax on every memory stick they have bought. It's simple greed.

      This petty war with Apple over FairPlay DRM licenses. Sony wants to charge a license on every facet of every product, but it won't pay a penny to license a standard from anyone else. It's pathetic.

      Richard, what we're seeing is a backlash against this stuff. It's not imaginary - it's real. Sony do not have a market lead in any industry at the moment, except games, and there are reasons for that. The reason is that, far from being a "premium electronics provider" they have become a manufacturer of goods which look nice but are completely shoddy from a utilitarian point of view.

      Every time Sony fucks an early adopter over there is another anti-Sony person born. The more marketing it does, the more customers will slip through its fingers.

      So you pretend it's all fanboyism if you like. Fiddle while Rome burns. It's your city.

  18. PS3 Commercials by Shadow+Wrought · · Score: 1

    The Rubik's Cube exploding is pretty cool, but the crying doll is just... whack.

    --
    If brevity is the soul of wit, then how does one explain Twitter?
  19. Cluetrain by xymog · · Score: 1

    It's apparent that Dave Karakker hasn't read The Cluetrain Manifesto. Or he's read it and doesn't care. I hate spin, marketese, the corporate arrogance and belief that I can't understand something without a marketroid to interpret for me. Sony doesn't have a clue, really.

    1. Re:Cluetrain by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sony doesn't have a clue, really.

      That's why Sony is sitting on mountains of gold and you're still camped out in your mom's basement.

      What flavor is the kool-aid you been drinking?

  20. Intentional Misdirection by Stonesand · · Score: 1
    Yes achievements are summed, giving the player a total score of all achievements from all games that is publically viewable. However, the achievements DIRECTLY tell you how well you are at a game compared to anyone else, and I doubt that this Sony guy was unaware of that. I can see exactly which levels I've beat and at what difficulty in GRAW, and I can compare that to the whole world. This Sony guy is saying that you can't. Ah falsehoods. This statement is true:
    "He also defend the lack of universal achievements on PS3: 'Frankly, how I view it is I don't care if you're great at Madden if I'm playing you in Resistance. Because that doesn't tell me you're that much better in Resistance. An overall score doesn't really tell me much, it tells me you've spent a lot of time online, it tells me you spend a lot of time playing games, but it doesn't tell me how good you are at a particular game.'".
    But, that "overall score" he mentions is infinitely divisible for examination between the various games. An activity you can even do (well) on Xbox.com. Thanks for the lie, Sony!
  21. Like selling the PS3 will be a effort by Rik+Sweeney · · Score: 1

    Sony could take a leaf out of Snakes on a Plane's book and let the hype engine sell it. Christ, I could sell the PS3 myself by getting 1 single full page advert in a newspaper and writing the following:

    PlayStation 3

    November 17 2006

    And that's it.

    1. Re:Like selling the PS3 will be a effort by Rayonic · · Score: 1
      November 17 2006

      Hell, they can't even do that part right. All the PS3 commercials I've seen have the date appear like this:

      ///7

      Where the ones and the slash look identical.
    2. Re:Like selling the PS3 will be a effort by phoenix.bam! · · Score: 1

      11/17 is the release date? What the hell? I saw the commercial and didn't even pick that up. Fuck sony.

    3. Re:Like selling the PS3 will be a effort by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Woah, is that when the next Chucky film is coming out? Are they distributed by Sony then?

  22. My God, It's Full of Games! by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 1

    All I know about Sony's ad campaign for the PS3 is that the ad featuring the naked baby doll is really freaky (especially the expressions on its face when it laughs), yet also has a strong 2001: A Space Odyssey homage feel.

    I love that ad.

    --
    Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
  23. Isn't it more about driving folks to pay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    and pay and pay for that on-line component? It's an added "incentive" for you to give them your money, because they track your "on-line time" and give you a score for it that you can "feel good about"--it's all marketing.

    1. Re:Isn't it more about driving folks to pay by Julian352 · · Score: 1

      The silver account has gamerscore and can get all of the achievement. Paying is only required for having online multiplayer.

  24. You know what's funny... by Dorkmaster+Flek · · Score: 1

    People are complaining that Sony is basically pissing in the Kool-Aid and no matter what they do, everybody will still throw money at them (not disagreeing, just observing). The same thing happened with Nintendo back in the days of the NES and early SNES. In fact, they turned Sony down when they were developing the CD addon for the SNES back in the early 1990s, a decision that directly lead to Sony reworking that project as the original PlayStation console. Quite the reversal we've got going on here! Does this mean Sony is also in for a shock of some kind in the near future?

    --
    I like to think of online DRM as something akin to a college -- you pay for lessons until you learn something.
  25. Selling poorly by SuperKendall · · Score: 1

    everyone has to admit that because of the higher price point and low supply the PS3 is (likely) going to sell poorly in 2006 and through the first half of 2007;

    By definition you cannot sell poorly if you are selling every unit you make.

    Now poor profits, that is another matter - lowered production rates will hurt them in terms of profitability until they can catch up with demand. But no-one I think expects that units will be languishing on the stores this Christmas.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:Selling poorly by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      what definition is that?

      if you only are able to sell 2 units b/c that's all you make, I'd call that selling poorly as well.

    2. Re:Selling poorly by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well anyone foolish enough to have written a launch title for the PS3 might disagree. Sony will release it in Japan with 80,000 units which is a few days sales of the Nintendo DS for example. Even if every japanese owner buys two copies of each game that would still not be enough for a AAA game to make a profit.

    3. Re:Selling poorly by Broken+scope · · Score: 1
      --
      You mad
    4. Re:Selling poorly by IpalindromeI · · Score: 1

      By definition you cannot sell poorly if you are selling every unit you make.

      Perhaps in the absolute sense, but how about relative to the other consoles? If the PS3 only sells a million by years end because that's all they can produce, but the Wii sells 4 million by years end, I think it would be accurate to say the PS3 sold poorly compared to the Wii. Certainly the game developers will think so, because there will be 4 times as many people wanting games for the Wii as for the PS3. That is the kind of thing that sets up a cycle of more games leading to more appeal leading to more games, etc. That cycle was a major advantage for the PS2, but because of potentially poor relative sales, it might work against the PS3.

      --

      --
      Promoting critical thinking since 1994.
  26. PHB DETECTED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You used the word "SYNERGISE" in your post, it is slashbots highly trained opinion that you are a PHB.

    Please dont visit again.

    Slashbot.

  27. When Did SONY Become the Evil Empire? by Alamoth · · Score: 1

    Have you people ever even heard of MICROSOFT? You know, the company that dupes all of its users into buying their software for extraordinary prices and then forces them to only use other software they produce with it?

    Windows XP Pro costs $200. You need that to run your PC. It's either Windows or Linux and most people opt for the former and shell out the $$$ for it.

    Microsoft is the company that forces all its software upon you when you purchase a Dell or an HP. They're the company that makes you agree to an EULA simply by opening the packaging to read the EULA you've just committed to. You never even read it? How can that work? You can't even view the EULAs on Microsoft's website without searching deep into the network. Microsoft is the company that makes all its software (Windows, IE, Office) work very well together but provides security holes for hackers to destroy your machine with.

    Microsoft is the company that fought an Antitrust lawsuit in America and in Europe. An Antitrust Lawsuit means they were accused of essentially being an Evil Empire but now everyone is so quick to forget about this and lash at the throat of SONY who did nothing but give you all the Playstation 2.

    Sony put some game importer out of business.
    Microsoft has put countless software companies out of business or bought them out.

    Sony is pricing the Playstation 3 at ~$600.
    Microsoft will be charging about half as much for Windows Vista which is just a piece of Software.

    Sony has made a lot of mistakes in the past year, but this is no reason to jump onto the Microsoft Bandwagon because if you look at the big picture Microsoft has always been an Evil Empire and Sony is just having some problems.

    1. Re:When Did SONY Become the Evil Empire? by Creepy+Crawler · · Score: 1

      Ok, you made your point. Microsoft Sucks.

      Sony shut down Lik-Sang.

      I smell many cell processors unused.

      --
    2. Re:When Did SONY Become the Evil Empire? by crabpeople · · Score: 1
      "Windows XP Pro costs $200"

      No it doesnt. It is either 1) Bundled by the OEM. or 2) Pirated. If people actually had to pay for windows it wouldnt be half as popular as it is.

      --
      I'll just use my special getting high powers one more time...
    3. Re:When Did SONY Become the Evil Empire? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No one except a bunch of crazy Japanese game obsessed, SNK lovin fanboys buys from lik-sang. You ask the average person who's gonna buy a PS3 about Lik-sang and they'll say:

      What's lik-sang?

    4. Re:When Did SONY Become the Evil Empire? by IpalindromeI · · Score: 1

      Calm down. I hate them both.

      --

      --
      Promoting critical thinking since 1994.
    5. Re:When Did SONY Become the Evil Empire? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      (enter Nintendo, stage left)

      Not SONY? Check.
      Not Microsoft? Check.
      Not an Evil Empire? Um, the nice Nintendo rep holding a gun to my head says "Check."

      There you have it folks, if you don't like the regimes of MS or SONY, the only vote is Nintendo.

      VIVA LA WII

    6. Re:When Did SONY Become the Evil Empire? by DeeDob · · Score: 1

      The thing is, Microsoft just hasn't really "pissed-off" it's customers in the XBOX division.

      Sony has annoyed it's customers more than once with their gaming division. Also a strong case of dissapointing them (over promising and under-delivering on just about everything).

      Exemples: Dual-HDMI ports that were promised for dual screen gaming, lack of feedback in controllers (rumble), lower graphics capabilities than expected from both the PS2 and PS3, higher price than anybody would've liked, hardly any units to speak of for the launch of the PS3, lack of HD cables in a console that is sold with the promise of HD content and so on and on...

      News sources about the fact that Microsoft has also been good towards it's developpers and provided them with more support than Sony and also provide them with better tools to create games don't help Sony's gaming division image either.

      What Microsoft does in the PC market is irrelevant (to a point) when it comes to consoles, just like Sony televisions and MP3 players are irrelevant to the console market. It's a different market.

      It seems that Sony falls to the same marketting problem it had in the past. It's simply over-promissing and under-delivering. It really doesn't matter that your hardware is the best and your game catalogue is the most recognized when you keep under-delivering. At one point, your customers get annoyed with you.

      Or it might simply be a case of "hating the leader to be more cool". In the OS market, Microsoft is the leader, let's hate them. In the games market, Sony is the leader, let's hate them. In the fast-food industry, McDonalds is the biggest, they are also the most hated. In the giant retailers, it's WalMart. In the gas market, it's Exxon/Esso (or whatever that company name is in your country).

  28. Problem with some PS3 commercials by Midnight+Thunder · · Score: 1

    The problem with some PS3 commercials is that you aren't sure whether they are trying to sell you a BlueRay player or gaming machine? I say this because a number of the adverts I have seen seem to have the whole gaming experience a distant second to its ability to use BluRay disks.

    The other thing I have noticed is when going into gaming stores and talking to the sales clerks: some of them are wanting to buy the PS3 to sell on eBay, but would rather have the Wii!? I want the Wii too, but it seriously needs some more high quality RPGs, such as those from Square-Enix.

    --
    Jumpstart the tartan drive.
    1. Re:Problem with some PS3 commercials by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's really confusing when you end a normal sentence with a question mark?

    2. Re:Problem with some PS3 commercials by darkuni · · Score: 1

      I'm in close quarters with several GameStop managers. They are ALL jonesing for the Wii, consider the PS3 nearly insignificant and cite that Wii has generated some of the most demand they've seen. Remember, these guys have been to the recent shows - they've played all the platforms (and not for 30 seconds at a Nintendo Fusion Tour). What does that say? I dunno - but my money is on Wii. Don't you worry A THING about RPGs on the Wii. Square-Enix is so far in the closet with Nintendo (some of the Top 10 Nintendo DS titles are the breathtaking games from Square-Enix). I have NO doubts that they are hard at work on Wii titles. That being said, if you don't have a DS yet and are into RPGs, you might want to consider picking one up. FFIII is unreal.

    3. Re:Problem with some PS3 commercials by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Squenix is saving the big guns for Sony as usual though. There are already two games planned for a 2007 release, both part of the MAIN Final Fantasy series (FFXIII and it's spinoff by the KH team).

      As for Gamestop managers...so what? Gaming advice from a minimum wage retail store employee isn't exactly going to determine the console wars.

  29. Sony's new PR boss Dave Karakker? by mauledbydogs · · Score: 1

    Wasn't he in Street Fighter II :)?

  30. How to market the PS3 by Jhan · · Score: 1

    With all the bad press and near disasters surronding the PS3 development, I was becoming more and more sceptical as to wether I shouldn't just get a Wii instead.

    Until, that is I went into my favorite game store today to pick up Liberty City Stories. The store had started their PS3 promo, with big signs saying "Coming Spring 2007: PS3" and lots of pretty posters and whatnot. None of that impressed me, but:

    In the center was a very good 50" HDTV rolling demo footage. The game in question was MetalGear 4. Nice! So I got closer... and closer... and closer...

    In the end, the screen filled my entire field of vision. I still couldn't see any pixels, edges or blurring. The detail was jaw-dropping. That's when I suddenly noticed a caption at the top right.

    Demo only, not full PS3 resolution.

    In other words, once you see what the PS3 can do on a good display, you'd never buy a Wii. Perhaps a XBox360, but lets face it, to make things look good at that resolution you need a metric shitload of textures, and the PS3 can fit 50 GB of data onto a single disc.

    Conclusion: seeing is believing. I'll get three, please.

    Ps: You will also need extremely deep pockets. PS3 + TV to make it shine will cost you at least $4000.

    --

    I choose to remain celibate, like my father and his father before him.

    1. Re:How to market the PS3 by heinousjay · · Score: 1

      I agree. I get games to look at them. Sony, moreso than any other company, excels at producing pretty looking schlock that I don't need to play, and wouldn't want to if I did.

      It's graphics or nothing for me!

      --
      Slashdot - where whining about luck is the new way to make the world you want.
    2. Re:How to market the PS3 by Rayonic · · Score: 1
      to make things look good at that resolution you need a metric shitload of textures, and the PS3 can fit 50 GB of data onto a single disc.

      But it can only have 256MB of textures per scene.

      And it's not like the disc read times have increased as drastically as the storage capacity. But I guess Sony and long load times go hand-in-hand. (See: PS1, PS2, PSP)
    3. Re:How to market the PS3 by AikonMGB · · Score: 1

      Forgive me, but I call shenanigans. At a resolution of 1920x1080, an HDTV (in full 1080i/p) has only slightly more pixels than my desktop computer at 1600x1200. I can very clearly see individual pixels on my 19" monitor. Watching HDTV from cable or hooking up my computer through DVI-HDMI, I can clearly see pixelation on my 42" plasma HDTV, as well as on my sister's 42" LCD HDTV, as well as my house-mates 50" rear-projection HDTV (no, they're not all in the same house, they're in three different cities).

      No matter how good the composited graphics look, there is no making up for a lack of resolution at the specification/hardware level. I don't doubt the view was gorgeous, and the colours intense and vibrant, but HDTV is still a grid of pixels and you just can't get any better than that.

      Aikon-

    4. Re:How to market the PS3 by rjung2k · · Score: 1

      "In other words, once you see what the PS3 can do on a good display, you'd never buy a Wii."
      Since I don't have a high-end HDTV, and Sony isn't bundling one with the PS3, all that eye candy won't do me any good.

      "Conclusion: seeing is believing. I'll get three, please."
      Sure, but that's only because you're a Sony marketeer in disguise. ;-)

    5. Re:How to market the PS3 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dave Karakker, is that you?

    6. Re:How to market the PS3 by Garse+Janacek · · Score: 1

      In other words, once you see what the PS3 can do on a good display, you'd never buy a Wii.

      By this reasoning, once I see what my PC can do on a 36" LCD screen, I'd never buy a 19" CRT. Hang on, lemme check. Nope, I still have a 19" CRT. And a 24" TV, or is it 22"? To be honest, I'm not sure, I'd have to check the manual, because that's not why I watch TV shows/movies or play games. I'm more interested in, you know, the content.

      Of course that's besides the issue that I can't afford a PS3. Even if I really wanted one, I couldn't get it. You're telling people that once they drive a BMW they'll never buy anything else, when last time I checked, most people with cars can't afford BMWs, and BMW doesn't have anywhere near dominant market share. And before you say it, yes, $600 is arguably a good deal for the hardware you get, so maybe people could afford it. BMWs are still cheaper than most houses, after all, so everyone who can afford a house could have afforded a BMW... except that most people think that's an unreasonable trade, and similarly, for most people, having the best console hardware just isn't one of their top financial priorities...

      --

      I am the man with no sig!

    7. Re:How to market the PS3 by Mongoose · · Score: 1

      I think he means aliasing when he says 'pixels', since the guy likely isn't a graphics programmer. =)

    8. Re:How to market the PS3 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because of hardware limitations, PS3 games will likely be visually less rich than 360 counterparts (and we already see that- compare the Resistance to Gears of War).
      The PS3 only has 256 of VRAM. All textures must fit into that to be rendered. The 360 can use all of its memory as VRAM. If you want more than 224MB of textures (Sony steals 32MB of VRAM for its own use), you have to swap mid-frame which 1) Is slow because you have to flush the pipeline and copy from system memory to VRAM and sync and wait 2) Wastes even more memory since you have to have some textures duplicated in main memory and in VRAM. Also, Sony steals another 64MB of the 256 MB of main memory for its silly background apps. That 96MB total of the 512MB of memory not available to developers. The 360 can use all its 512MB as texture memory if it wants to so you could have games that take up 400MB of textures if they need to. To use Sony's Blu-ray logic 400>256 so the 360 must better. Also, of the 512MB, Microsoft only reserves 32MB for its background use. Also, since the 360 doesn't have to waste time copying data from main memory to VRAM and syncing, developers have more cycles to render richer visuals.
      Now Sony is trying to hide the graphic weakness of the PS3 by pushing the "1080P" bullet point but the reality is
      1) The 360 GPU is much more capable of pushing 1080P than the PS3.
      2) Sony is sacrificing visual quality to get a higher resolution. Microsoft requires that all games use anti-aliasing. Sony does not so that is why in those 1080P games you tend to see bland lighting and jaggy edges because it has to lower the visual quality to handle the extra resolution. Even a game with mediocre ligthing effects like Resistance can't push 1080P. That game has a hard enough time handling 720P at 30FPS and that is from an A-list developer. If you want 1080P you have to dumb-down the graphics and then you get dreck like Riiiidge Raaaacer and Sodoku.

    9. Re:How to market the PS3 by KDR_11k · · Score: 1

      In other words, once you see what the PS3 can do on a good display, you'd never buy a Wii.

      That's nice if graphics are all you demand from a game. I'm getting pretty damn high-res and next gen graphics on my PC already and I don't have a problem playing some 2d game at 256x192 and 8 bit color on my DS.

      --
      Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
    10. Re:How to market the PS3 by drsquare · · Score: 1

      You can make the same argument about expensive cars, but what do you see more of on the roads, Diablos or Corsas?

    11. Re:How to market the PS3 by Guppy06 · · Score: 1

      "In the center was a very good 50" HDTV rolling demo footage."

      I don't think my living room is that big.

      "Demo only, not full PS3 resolution."

      That statement could go either way. You're assuming what you're seeing is less than the PS3's capabilities, not greater than.

      That, and "demo only" sounds a lot like "cutscene, not gameplay" to me.

      "Conclusion: seeing is believing."

      You mean like Dragon's Lair?

      Welcome to video games. Playing is believing.

  31. Sony misses the mark again! by Aladrin · · Score: 1

    "An overall score doesn't really tell me much, it tells me you've spent a lot of time online, it tells me you spend a lot of time playing games, but it doesn't tell me how good you are at a particular game."

    You know what? I -prefer- to play 360 games over PS2 and PC games BECAUSE of that score. It's the ONLY lasting recognition that I played a game. Besides that, when I look at the 1000-point gamescores, I generally remember the pain I had to go through to get to the top like that... And I remember it fondly. When I complete a PS2 game, the pain is usually the same, but there's nothing afterwards.

    This is completely aside from the fact that I'm what I call a 'collector.' I always feel the need to collect things, but rarely strong enough to make an actual collection of something physical. These points fill a need for me, as sad as it may seem.

    It's gotten to the point that I refuse to cheat on 360 games because it'll mess up my gamer score. Those points would not have been 'me'.

    Sony misses all of this. They refuse to admit that gamers may have a different view of things than journalists and corporate executives. I can't believe they can be so blind.

    --
    "If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
    1. Re:Sony misses the mark again! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe you should find some games that are fun to play, rather than painful. Then the fun you have playing will be its own reward, and you don't need to worry about how you rank with other players.

    2. Re:Sony misses the mark again! by ivan256 · · Score: 1

      I think you're in the minority. I think that you don't think you are in the minority because people like you are also thousands of times more likely to post about their gaming habits on the internet. Perhaps I'm biased though, because the ranking crap is exactly the thing that turns me off the most about Live and games like WoW.

      You do make me wish it was easy to figure out what somebody's xbox gamer tag was though. It would be valuable information to have about somebody when deciding who to hire.

    3. Re:Sony misses the mark again! by Aladrin · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure you can tell how good a worker someone will be by their gaming habits, really. I'm over 6000 points on XBL in just a couple months, surpassing all my friends with ease. It's what I do in my free time to relax. I'm positive my jobs thinks I'm an asset because they've told me in 2 ways: Verbally, and with a huge raise at 3 months. I'm talking a bigger raise ($ and %-wise) than my father ever got in his entire career as an industrial engineer. Nothing says 'we love you' like a huge raise.

      I will admit it might be used as another tool for hiring, but I'm not sure exactly how. Maybe if they favor games that require thought over mindless hack and slash? Low points doesn't mean they don't game, just that they don't X360.

      I have to disagree with being in the minority, though. Think about all the bragging gamers do about their scores in various games, or their accomplishments. It's a HUGE part of gaming, and an even bigger part of online gaming. The new PSU has trophies you can win by beating the hardest bosses online. (It's more complicated than that, but still.)

      I realize that everyone thinks they are not in the minority on these types of things. My theory is that everyone thinks everyone else is just like them, until proven otherwise. Some people need trauma to prove it.

      But I really don't think I'm in the minority on this one.

      --
      "If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
    4. Re:Sony misses the mark again! by ivan256 · · Score: 1

      I have to disagree with being in the minority, though. Think about all the bragging gamers do about their scores in various games, or their accomplishments. It's a HUGE part of gaming, and an even bigger part of online gaming. The new PSU has trophies you can win by beating the hardest bosses online. (It's more complicated than that, but still.)

      I'm thinking about all the gamers I know, and the only people I know who think like that (with the exception of one guy) are in the highschool to college age... And I'm not talking about all the people I know in that age range. A good 75% of them would rather play either PC games that don't have a central score system (mostly first person shooters), casual games, or just plain single-player games (Oblivion and HoMMV were big this year, as is NWN2 right now). You've also got to remember that console online gaming is still only used by a very small minority of console owners... Xboxes of either variety are still only owned by small minority of console owners...

  32. Wait by OSS_ilation · · Score: 1

    So when Sony execs were running around for the past year making bone-headed statements that were so easily disproven it made President Bush look like an idiot savant, they weren't trying to craft the message about the PS3??? I fear for this guy, and the pile of crap he has stepped into. I fear what the PS3 marketing will look like now that they are *really* trying.

    1. Re:Wait by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Actually, the most telling part about this interview is this phrase:
      ...there wasn't anyone in this position that I'm in right now [senior director of corporate communications]...
      It was obvious for a long time that Sony's PR was not being driven by anyone competent in PR; now we know that it was being driven by no one. That means there was no coherent "party line" view for the PS3--when Sony execs got pressed for a view on the PS3, they had to make one up for themselves. End result: Sony looks like it's equivocating (and sometimes really does end up equivocating)--PR disaster ensues. What Sony can finally do with this guy in place is to make sure all the PR droids and execs have the same level of information on where the PS3 is, where it wants to go, and how much of it they are allowed to talk about. That can only be a good thing--unless you are a rumor monger or a competitor, of course.
  33. Re:Saddam Hussein : Scapegoat +1, Helpful by Afrosheen · · Score: 1

    Thanks Trout, I needed a complete and total diversion from anything relevant, and you heeded the call.

  34. Getting sick of hearing this by steveo777 · · Score: 1
    GS: Are you worried at all about Nintendo taking any marketshare from the PS3, or do you really feel like people will buy one HD console and the Wii?

    DK: Yeah, for us it's apples and oranges when you compare the PS3 with Wii. They've done a great job of saying exactly who they're going after, the casual gamer, the hardcore gamer, and we've said exactly who we're going after. And you can't, when you put the systems side by side technologically, and even price-wise, they just don't compare to each other.


    Okay, in reality, PS3 is going after every gamer. Just like the Wii (and 360). Sure, Nintendo is trying to reach out to people who wouldn't normally game, and making it much easier for them to start. That's nice and all, but what all three companies are targeting is your time, on your TV. HD or not. Every time I see this BS about not being able to compare one system with another it gets me kind of steamed. They're all entertainment devices over the same medium. That's the bottom line. They are apples and apples every time.

    --
    This sig isn't original enough, it's time to come up with something witty...
    1. Re:Getting sick of hearing this by DragonWriter · · Score: 1
      Sure, Nintendo is trying to reach out to people who wouldn't normally game, and making it much easier for them to start. That's nice and all, but what all three companies are targeting is your time, on your TV.
      No, see, at the beginning there you start to get the point, but then you jump right by it. The "you" to which Nintendo, Microsoft, and Sony's efforts are primarily directed are not the same. Sure, each of them would take anyone who wants to buy their machine, but their focus is not the same slice of the market (though they all overlap to an extent.)
    2. Re:Getting sick of hearing this by steveo777 · · Score: 1
      Hmm... let me clarify. My arguement is for anyone who touts the philosophy Get a 360 + Wii, or a PS3 + Wii. Which is both MS and Sony. If I were MS or Sony, I would certainly want to endorse what looks like my least powerful competitor, but I really wouldn't mean it. If someone owns two systems, that means that both systems are going to fight for TV time for that consumer. And both Sony and MS know this.


      But with the console market saying you think your customers ought to purchase a different gaming system is like BMW issuing a statement that in stead of its customers purchasing a Mercedes for their other driving needs, they should buy a Chevrolet (it's cheaper). You could still say, "Well, cars vs trucks." But in the end, there is still one driver, two vehicles. The driver is going to pick the one that best meets his/her needs at the time, or whichever is more fun. Same with the consoles. Gamers may have two, but they'll only use the one that's most entertaining.

      Dangerous ground for Sony and MS to tread on. They are recommending a company with a track record consisting of well over 50% platinum hits (can't say for sure, but I'll still venture the guess, unless all the Mario Party's are killing that stat). It may help keep people away from the other expensive console, but it still puts another one the living room.

      --
      This sig isn't original enough, it's time to come up with something witty...
    3. Re:Getting sick of hearing this by DragonWriter · · Score: 1
      If someone owns two systems, that means that both systems are going to fight for TV time for that consumer.


      No, it doesn't. That assumes that TV time is fixed. Having systems (and presumably games: the only reason for one person to have two systems is because each is better for different kinds of games) that suit different moods means that you are more likely to want to sit in front of the TV and play games more of the time.

      The Xbox360 and the PS3 are more closely targetted to the same type of user and use, the Wii is more differently targetted than either of the other two. For reasons beyond price, Wii+Xbox360 or Wii+PS3 seems more natural than PS3+Xbox360 (though I can see getting a PS3 for backward compatibility -- if you're a PS2 user now -- and technical advantages, and an Xbox360 because of XNA GSE if you are into homebrew content.)

      But with the console market saying you think your customers ought to purchase a different gaming system is like BMW issuing a statement that in stead of its customers purchasing a Mercedes for their other driving needs, they should buy a Chevrolet (it's cheaper). You could still say, "Well, cars vs trucks." But in the end, there is still one driver, two vehicles. The driver is going to pick the one that best meets his/her needs at the time, or whichever is more fun. Same with the consoles. Gamers may have two, but they'll only use the one that's most entertaining.


      And, just as with a BMW and a Chevy pickup, which is more entertaining or meets needs better at the time won't be constant from time to time for many users. Sure, some gamers are only interested in the kind of things the more expensive consoles will do better than the Wii, and some
      are only interested in the kinds of things the Wii does better. But some will be interested in both.
    4. Re:Getting sick of hearing this by steveo777 · · Score: 1
      You still haven't addressed the issue. On gamer. Two systems. They WILL compete for TV time. You DO assume fixed time for gaming. 24hrs a day minus work, sleep, eating, etc. Sure, people with two systems likely play games more often, but that is still fixed time. Perhaps it will be more time with two systems, but you can't say that some guy goes home and games 2 hours a night will always play 4 hours with two systems (or 6 with three). Then again, you can't assume they won't.

      The software will utlimately drive the playtime, but it becomes recursive. And license fees are the next profit-maker (or only for MS and SONY). The gamer will play games and buy games based on what the gamer experiences and expects to experience. MS, Sony, and Nintendo want to be the main source for every gamer, though they have different targets.

      --
      This sig isn't original enough, it's time to come up with something witty...
    5. Re:Getting sick of hearing this by DragonWriter · · Score: 1
      You still haven't addressed the issue. On gamer. Two systems. They WILL compete for TV time. You DO assume fixed time for gaming. 24hrs a day minus work, sleep, eating, etc.


      Er, "work", "sleeping", "eating" etc. are not constants. They can be varied, one factor in which is the relative importance of other activities (like, say, gaming.) And that relative importance is influenced by the options available for that activity. So, again, your presumption is wrong.

      Sure, people with two systems likely play games more often, but that is still fixed time.


      No, if having two systems means they play more often than they would if they had one system, that means it is exactly not fixed time. Do you even know what "fixed" means?

      Perhaps it will be more time with two systems, but you can't say that some guy goes home and games 2 hours a night will always play 4 hours with two systems (or 6 with three). Then again, you can't assume they won't.


      Er, right. And if you can't say that it will be the same, it is, by definition, not "fixed".

      MS, Sony, and Nintendo want to be the main source for every gamer, though they have different targets.


      If they have "different targets", they are clearly not all targetting "every gamer", since that would be the same target. Are you deliberately contradicting yourself in every sentence?

    6. Re:Getting sick of hearing this by steveo777 · · Score: 1

      Sounds like you're arguing for the sake of arguing. You still haven't told me how to fit more than 24 hours in a day. Good day!

      --
      This sig isn't original enough, it's time to come up with something witty...
  35. The most spin on a review I have ever seen by SuperKendall · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Sure the interviewer was not asking "deep questions", at least at the start - but you have to at least admit the context of one of those questions made the remark reasonable:

    So from Access I went to work at Allied Domecq, which used to be the world's biggest liquor company. So they own brands like Stoli, Beefeater, Maker's Mark, Kahlua, and also Dunkin Donuts, Baskin-Robbins, and Togo's, but I just worked on Spirits of North America. But then that company got bought out by a French company, and they laid off everybody here in the United States.

    GS: Woah!


    See? All of the sudden the reaction seems pretty natural. Bought out by a french company and laid off everyone - whoa!

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:The most spin on a review I have ever seen by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      see their home page to get a feeling of what's left of that company...

  36. Great PS3 Review. by MrCopilot · · Score: 1
    On Slate. Is the PlayStation 3 Any Good?A few things I hate--and one thing I love--about Sony's next-gen console.

    http://www.slate.com/id/2152794/fr/rss/

    His conclusion. Can't wait for a Wii.

    --
    OSGGFG - Open Source Gamers Guide to Free Games
  37. pfft by minus_273 · · Score: 1

    let me know when krakken has something to say.

    --
    The war with islam is a war on the beast
    The war on terror is a war for peace
  38. Sony's customers already got the message by Hap76 · · Score: 1

    When Sony infected already nonstandard, DRM-laden CDs with rootkits, neutered potentially useful formats with DRM, and saddled the PS3 with BluRay in order to attempt to use its leverage in the games console market to gain marketshare in the HD DVD (note space) market, its customers got the message loud and clear - they don't really matter. The people that make the content at Sony are the ones who mater, even at the risk of neutering Sony's hardware business.

    The PS3 could be successful and have better buzz despite Sony's business practices and their arrogance and near-contempt for their consumers if the PS3 had been either cheap enough (no BluRay) or available enough (so retailers could be assured of selling systems and games for the holidays) - instead they managed to hose both their retailers and customers. And, of course, instead of making things better for their customers and retailers, they instead try to explain why it's all in their heads. Mmmkay.

  39. Just call it explosive results when by WillAffleckUW · · Score: 1

    the PS3 lights itself on fire and the DRM-enhanced Blu-Ray laser goes on a rampage to kill all humans in the vicinity.

    I'm sure it will work.

    Or you could realize the well is poisoned quite deeply, and that trying to spin things will make the fire grow that much higher ...

    --
    -- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
  40. DIE PS3 DIE!!!!!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Once Sony's gaming division goes bankrupt, Nintendo will most likely be bought out by Microsoft, and we will all finally be able to bask in the glory of the greatest software company that ever existing having a monopoly in yet another market! All hail Microsoft!

  41. Re:Wow! or Karakker resume by WillAffleckUW · · Score: 1

    This guy worked on the 3DO and the Dreamcast! This means that the PS/3 will be the best console of the generation and still die a marketing driven death!
    He also worked for Martha Stewart and KMart. So that means their is a good chance that this will end in bankruptcy or jail time.


    Don't forget, he also spun the Heidi Fleiss defense in the media. I guess that means they'll be hanging out in Vegas jails after the PS3 fails.

    --
    -- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
  42. Apart from the price, PS3 is a Videogame Dream by keyrat+rafa · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It seems to me that all the negative press surrounding the PS3 is largely due to it's price, and due to the fact that the average fanboy teenager can't afford it. While I too believe it's a pricey console, the box itself offers a lot of features that I've been waiting for as a gamer for a long time:

    Hard drive standard - every PS3 comes with an hard disk, which means every developer can develop for it without excluding anyone.

    No region encoding for games - THIS IS HUGE! Have we as gamers not been waiting for this since the beginning? It's finally here! We don't have to wait for marketing departments to choose what we may or may not like in a foreign game; it's all ours.

    Card reader - hellooooo homebrew. While homebrew isn't officially supported, this makes it much easier.

    Blu-Ray - 50GB discs allow for an obscene amount of storage.

    But does it run Linux? Yea, supposedly it will, which means even more homebrew goodness.

    While everything I've stated doesn't guarantee great games, it seems to me like they've made it so that this system has a bunch of potential.

    1. Re:Apart from the price, PS3 is a Videogame Dream by MMaestro · · Score: 1
      Hard drive standard - every PS3 comes with an hard disk, which means every developer can develop for it without excluding anyone.

      That is, assuming the developer has the cash to pay off Sony.

      No region encoding for games - THIS IS HUGE! Have we as gamers not been waiting for this since the beginning? It's finally here! We don't have to wait for marketing departments to choose what we may or may not like in a foreign game; it's all ours.

      Um, the Nintendo Gameboy/Gameboy Advance/Nintendo DS has never had region encoding and neither has Microsoft's Xbox/Xbox360.

      Card reader - hellooooo homebrew. While homebrew isn't officially supported, this makes it much easier.

      Yeah, and the PSP is such a great homebrewing system. /sarcasm

      Blu-Ray - 50GB discs allow for an obscene amount of storage.

      Who here owns a Blu-Ray disc burner? Who here has a video game over 10GB, compressed?

      But does it run Linux? Yea, supposedly it will, which means even more homebrew goodness.

      Yeah, I'm sure Sony won't put any software restrictions into the system to keep people out. /sarcasm

    2. Re:Apart from the price, PS3 is a Videogame Dream by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Who here owns a Blu-Ray disc burner? Who here has a video game over 10GB, compressed?

      Um.. Who here thinks console game data is compressed particularly well (if at all)?

  43. Sony needs to prioritize better by heroine · · Score: 1

    Sony needs to capitalize more on their music and movie assets and less on their high profile failures. Most of the attention is on a small number of high profile failures, despite the fact that Sony has had the most successful movie and music releases of our time.

  44. Just what I said by SuperKendall · · Score: 1

    Yes, I've seen the comic before (VGCats and Penny arcade are really the only online comics I read regularily)- it's saying exactly what I said. Sales will be good, but profits will be poor until they can ramp up production.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:Just what I said by Chris+Burke · · Score: 1

      Sales will be good, but profits will be poor until they can ramp up production.

      I've known sales teams that didn't care one woof about profit, but I've never heard of one that thought in terms of percentage of units sold, rather than total number. Only the most retarded of salesman would think selling 100% of one unit was good sales, unless it was a nuclear reactor or an island or something. When your sales numbers are low because production levels are low, that's still poor sales.

      I think you misinterpret the comic if you think it's saying that Mr. Kutarchini is correct when says he has the fastest selling toy ever.

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
  45. Parents couldn't afford clothes by KalvinB · · Score: 1

    I'm guessing that the baby is crying because the parents can no longer afford clothes or an education for the child after purchasing the PS3.

  46. Re:Saddam Hussein : Scapegoat +1, Helpful by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Kilgore Trout is a known spammer. Do NOT click any of his links unless you want more mindless tripe like that to be posted on slashdot.

  47. MKT 101 by Cartack · · Score: 0

    Todays lesson: Turning a negative into a positive


    PS3: 'Frankly, how I view it is I don't care if you're great at Madden if I'm playing you in Resistance. Because that doesn't tell me you're that much better in Resistance. An overall score doesn't really tell me much, it tells me you've spent a lot of time online, it tells me you spend a lot of time playing games, but it doesn't tell me how good you are at a particular game.'" A+

  48. Xbox fan talking points re: Cell architecture by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Could you guys like maybe get together on xboxlive.com (or wherever y'all hang out when there's not a console story on slashdot) and decide as a group whether you want to use the "PS3 will suck because it's harder to program than the 360" argument or the "PS3 will suck because it's the exact same processor as the 360 but more expensive" argument? The current situation where you have people making both contradictory arguments in every debate just makes all 360 fans look dumb.

    1. Re:Xbox fan talking points re: Cell architecture by kinglink · · Score: 1

      That's a good idea because you know Sony's fans don't make these mistakes? You know talking about Sony is all unique, or The motion controller is just Sony taking nintendo's idea and making it for themself. Or is it that the rumble isn't needed because it's just "lame".

      The sad thing is at least with Sony fan's it's not their fault. Sony's leadership has been so screwed up over the last year who knows what the current line that the fans are expected to tow is.

      God I love ACs.

  49. vs. PS3 by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 1

    I'm guessing that the baby is crying because the parents can no longer afford clothes or an education for the child after purchasing the PS3.

    That is a funny cynical take on it. I like the way you think.

    But I didn't think of it that way; I went more darkly cynical: if you look at what is reflected in its eyes--pretty much entirely explosions from violent games--and how the tears get sucked back up into its eyes, it's almost a commentary on how kids are getting desensitized to violence and that video games are replacing family, beyond babysitter to surrogate parent. (And it gives kids telekinetic abilities.)

    Which is clearly not the message they intend to convey, much like the quickly pulled TiVo ad which narcs on its owner's nudism to his date who flees when she sees what's in his Now Playing list before he can emerge from the kitchen naked with a cake.

    But from another ad featuring a Rubik's Cube, it seems it is more depicting a lab experiment pitting the toys of old against the PS3 to show how the new product is superior: the baby doll wants it (calls it "mama"), the Rubik's Cube explodes to cover the room in color. That's probably the concept they wanted to get across, but the baby doll one is so insane I expect it to go viral by itself outside of the context of the ad campaign; its successful for all the wrong reasons.

    Compare the new Head On ads of the form, "I hate your ad, but I love your product." They're trying too hard to ride their infame.

    --
    Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
  50. For the average consumer they are overpriced by Gnostic+Ronin · · Score: 1
    Comparing the ps3 to a farrari doesn't make sense.

    in the console market, there are only 4 options (one being the pc). You simply can't take the farari approach to marketing, because the biggest sell point is the games available. To get a large library of games, you simply must have a huge install base. The problem being that the average consumer isn't going to buy the most expensive console out there. And where the average consumer goes with console money is where the games will be. ps3 will essentially be a paperweight. a $600 paperweight.

    In fact, this is a major reason why I'm no longer excited about the ps3. Yes it looks great. The games announced for it sound good. But when the dust settles on the next console wars, most of the games will have either switched consoles or have gone multi-console because the ps3 is essentially priced out of the reach of most people buying a console. The average consumer walking into best buy or gamestop will see a used Xbox360 for $300, and if they can find any at all, the ps3 is twice that. Wii at $250 is even less. So 90% of the people walking in wanting a ps3 (assuming that in a parralel universe it was reasonable to assume you could find one), will walk out with the competitions console.

    So Long, Sony.

    1. Re:For the average consumer they are overpriced by Chris+Burke · · Score: 1

      Comparing the ps3 to a farrari doesn't make sense.

      It does for illustrating the difference in "overpriced" as in "costs more than what you get (ignoring whether you need what you get)", and "costs more than what you can afford". Which is all I was doing.

      in the console market, there are only 4 options (one being the pc). You simply can't take the farari approach to marketing, because the biggest sell point is the games available. To get a large library of games, you simply must have a huge install base.

      Yep. You're dang right that Ferrari marketing/sales tactics won't work. With Sony's rather limited launch the install base issue would be there regardless of price (though obviously factors limiting launch supplies and price are related in this case). The high price will continue to limit demand after the supply issues are solved and make it into a long-term issue.

      I doubt it will be so bad that the PS3 will be a paperweight. However there is really no way that a $600 console is going to enjoy the same dominance as the PS2 which debuted at half the price. My bet for this generation is a much more balanced market without a clear "winner" (except IBM) and two also-rans duking it out for second place. Whether this results in a healthy, vibrant market where each competitor seeks to define their own identity, or just every game being ported to three different consoles, I don't know.

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    2. Re:For the average consumer they are overpriced by Gnostic+Ronin · · Score: 1
      Maybe I'm exaggerating slightly with the paperweight thing. But really, Sony should pray that the competition is tight, rather than that they are a distant third. That's where I'd predict them. For all intents and purposes, their debut (as in joe blow has a reasonable chance of walking out of the store with a ps3, not a name on the waiting list) is probably spring '07. So they're coming out 4 months after the Wii, and 18 months after the 360. By the time the ps3 is available, the war could easily be over, which wouldn't make them necessarily out of the race completely, just have a hard uphill battle. Add in the cost, and there's no way the race is ps3/360, it's 360/Wii.

      Maybe Square will throw a minor FF spinnoff to the ps3, and maybe there will be a few minor games, but likely the ps3 will end up with a selection much like the GameCube has now -- 80% first party, 10% ports, and a few minor 3rd party games. That isn't worth $600. wait until next spring. I think by then, very few games promised for ps3 will still be exclusive. FFXIII and Metal Gear 4 will probably be ported and most of the other big ps franchises will follow.

    3. Re:For the average consumer they are overpriced by MeanderingMind · · Score: 1

      A major point to be made is that Sony can not afford to try pulling a Nintendo.

      When Nintendo lost its dominant place in the market (as well as most of its third party support) it had 2 major factors in its favor.

      1. They didn't sell consoles at a loss.
      2. They make craploads of first party games.

      Despite the often non-existant support from other companies, Nintendo's first and second party titles made them extremely profitable even resting on the least market share of the three big players.

      Sony has been building up capability for first party titles and we've seen some neat games because of it. However, Sony does not have the software muscle that Nintendo has. That muscle is what has kept Nintendo going strong despite its meager share in the market. Were their positions reverse Sony would be in trouble. They sell systems at a loss, and they depend largely on third party support.

      Third party support isn't bad, but if you are completely dependant on it you can't afford to alienate it. Sony may well do this.

      1. Sony's system will be the hardest to program for (the Cell is tough to crack).
      2. Sony's system looks to be set up a slow start (who wants to have a launch title on a system with only 500k units worldwide).

      There is a threshhold this generation which Sony can not afford to fall below. If they can not garner a significant amount of marketshare relative to their competitors they will hemmorage third party titles left and right.

      --
      Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
  51. Spot on! by drc003 · · Score: 1

    Finally someone making sense. The fact is all of these posters claiming Sony only prospers due to blind fanboys are for the most part die hard Xbox fanboys/Sony haters. Please give it a rest. I own all 3 consoles from the last gen and for the most part I am happy with all of them. However there is no denying that Sony and their PS2 have given me the most amount of overall entertainment and will also support said generation for the longest period of time. Not only that but if you want a high end next gen rig what other options do you have? IMO, PC is about it. The 360 is just not a true next gen console imho. Nintendo will give you next gen gameplay innovation with the Wii and Sony has you covered with next gen hardware and media. Microsoft has given us Xbox 1.5 at a pretty hefty price in it's own right. I for one will pick up a Wii this Xmas for the family while also continuing to play plenty of great titles at budget prices on PS2/Xbox. When I have the money to burn I will probably pick up a PS3. The 360 is just a huge letdown if you ask me. I was at E3 2005 and was incredibly hyped for the release. However at this point things have been incredibly disappointing and I don't think there will be any drastic change. Gears of War will come out and be great but it won't be enough. Come this time next year the PS3 will be blowing the Xbox out of the water.

  52. Re:Saddam Hussein : Scapegoat +1, Helpful by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What should we sentence the White House to? Termite infestation? Maybe we could get the British to burn it again and start over. What did a building ever do to you, though?

  53. Bzzt Wrong but thanks for playing, by mjwx · · Score: 0

    Demo only, not full PS3 resolution

    you're obviously a rather naive fellow, so allow me to explain that that is marketdroid doublespeak for this is not how the game will really look.

    --
    Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
  54. Dave Karakker is a complete moron by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Well I *did* make it to page 5/5, but it sure was hard going. Unfortunately it was as bad or worse than any previous Sony "PR" on PS3.

    Dave Karakker is a complete moron, that much is clear. He can't understand the topic being discussed but drifts around in a world of his own, he answers "Yeah" when he means "No", and he talks like a 13-year old. The only thing he is wonderfully competent at is saying absolutely nothing. The zero-content man.

    I can't imagine why a company in deep PR trouble would hire this person. Very very odd. They sure have a death wish.

    I have every model of Playstation ever produced at home, yet Sony has been unable to interest me in a PS3 so far. They must be doing something very very very very wrong.

  55. MS will wreck console business by acomj · · Score: 1

    MS has lost Billions trying to get a foothold in the console business. The economics of "slight" loss leader console make money on games has been turned into "loose money for 5+ years" by a company(MS) that can afford to loose as much money as it wants to drive Nintendo and Sony out of the market.

    This assault of the Market is paid for by windows and office.

    Ultimately this is bad for the whole business as a whole. I suspect Nintendo will be the first out, (unless they can inovate there way to some profits like apple computer).

  56. Gee, the media! by jotaeleemeese · · Score: 1

    The bastards, doing their job.

    How dare they.

    That tells me all what I need to know about the new "PR" person...

    --
    IANAL but write like a drunk one.