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Shaolin Monks May Sue Over Tale of Defeat by Ninja
Socguy writes "A unique story on the CBC website details an even more unusual conflict. A Chinese Shaolin temple has demanded an apology from 'an Internet user who claimed a Japanese ninja beat its kung fu-practicing monks in a showdown.' A letter from the members of the temple, posted on the Internet on Thursday, denied the fight ever took place and called on the person who posted the claim under the name "Five minutes every day" to apologize to the temple's martial arts masters. Monks from the temple, which is located in the Songshan Mountain region of the Henan province, said they will consider legal action if he or she doesn't make a public apology."
Someone just won at Internet trolling.
Hear that, Slashdot trolls? When you get written up by Reuters, that's when you've arrived.
The monks also stated that this alleged ninja must be produced for execution by means of the five-point palm exploding heart technique.
just turn up at his door and demand the apology be typed in... why mess about with lawyers... come on, you're Shaolin Monks... you don't need lawyers..
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.
If they're this upset over a potential loss of honor and respect they would get from the ninja story, I'd hate to see what they do in response to what they get for pulling this stunt.
The idea of a Shaolin Monk 'considering' legal action, in order to defend himself against a single bulletin board poster, just doesn't have the same impact, when we live in a day and age where another group of religious fighters abduct real reporters, cut of their heads, and post the video with all gurgling noises included, to the internet.
Ninjas couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper sack.
This is just a cover story to draw attention away from the fact that several Shaolin Temples, were in fact, recently plundered by pirates.
Pirates rule.
What the hell do the Pirates have to say about all of this?
The eternal struggle of good vs. evil begins within one's self.
They're just threatening early to discourage people from getting the truth out about the Chuck Norris showdown.
1. Record the event
2. Post on YouTube
3. Have Large TV network steal it
4. Post that on YouTube
5. Get sued by TV network
6. Now you are a Pirate and can surely kick Ninja ass...
7. Profit (if you win the lawsuit).
TC - My Photos..
"I'm sorry but theres only one possible answer to all this"
Ninjas descend from ceiling and take a stance.
"Round one! FIGHT!"
[Much later]
And then, just as it seemed the fighting would come to a conclusion, a ship flying a skull and cross bones moored at the local pier...
"I may be full of crap about this game, and I may be wrong, and that's fine." -Jack Thompson
... that this story could be true. Everyone knows that if a ninja kicks your arse, no-one would ever live to see it, let alone write about it on the internet. Of course, the writer could be the ninja himself, in which case, DON'T PISS HIM OFF!
'If Christ had tweeted the sermon on the mount, it might have lasted until nightfall.' - John Perry Barlow
Ballmer, in the temple, with the chair.
Get thee glass eyes, and, like a scurvy politician, seem to see things thou dost not.--King Lear
One of the things that frustrates me is that, although the Chinese and Japanese have known how to write for a very long time, the martial arts are very poorly documented. The result is that most of the transmission has been oral. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oral_tradition Any given martial art (the monks are different) is probably passed down from father to son. Some families are willing to teach others. Some aren't. The Japanese tend to keep secerets, even from their senior students. Given the situation, it's no surprise that different martial artists have wildly different versions of the truth. The other complication is that most martial artists never fight real fights. (Point sparring doesn't count.) It is possible to spend years working on a given martial art and then discover that it is absolutely ineffective against the average street punk.
So, the question of the moment; could a single ninja beat a group of monks. It could happen. It depends on the ninja and the monks. Bear in mind though that the ninja are Japanese and the monks are Chinese so there's not a lot of opportunity for the match to happen.
1. Someone claiming that a Ninja defeated one of them
2. Suing someone for posting on the internet
Nuff said!
These guys are cool; and by cool, I mean totally sweet.
Facts:
1. Ninjas are mammals.
2. Ninjas fight ALL the time.
3. The purpose of the ninja is to flip out and kill people.
Especially note 3 above. The Ninjas probably just went to the Shaolin Temple to talk about tea n shit, and then they just totally flipped out and killed all the monks.
Anyway, here is some more things about Ninjas.
Q: Why is everyone so obsessed about ninjas?
A: Ninjas are the ultimate paradox. On the one hand they don't give a crap, but on the other hand, ninjas are very careful and precise.
Q: I heard that ninjas are always cruel or mean. What's their problem?
A: Whoever told you that is a total liar. Just like other mammals, ninjas can be mean OR totally awesome.
Q: What do ninjas do when they're not cutting off heads or flipping out?
A: Most of their free time is spent flying, but sometime they stab. (Ask Mark if you don't believe me.)
- Nothing to see hear.
If he retracts his statement, he'll have a bunch of angry ninjas after him. If he doesn't retract, he's got a whole temple of kung-fu masters on his ass. I can't imagine a more troubling situation.
boycott slashdot February 10th - 17th check out: altSlashdot.org
"The parties are advised to chill."
On the other hand, Buddhist monks spend a decent amount of their studies on the subject of humor, so maybe this is simply the single greatest cultural practical joke ever perpetrated...a Zen masterpiece.
All the techniques ever used to make men moral have been themselves thoroughly immoral... (Nietzsche)
why not ask a ninja?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehQo7s_02sc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEmss2lg-ug
1. Human Weapon on the History Channel does a Ninjutsu episode.
2. Bill or Jason beats a Ninjutsu master
3. Human Weapon then does the Kung Fu episode.
4. Jason beats the Kung Fu master.
5. ?
6. Profiteering by the Pirates
7. Full cycle of Ninja/Shaolin Monk/Pirate debate is complete.
Selex
That the Shaolin monks don't try something more ... physical towards the troll. ;-)
It's better to be the foot on the boot than the face on the pavement. ~~ tkx Kadin2048
Shaolin monks are pretty cool, and their kung-fu is very awesome. However, there seems to be this aura of invincibility around their martial arts masters. People are so amazed at their abilities that they think beating them in a fight is such a huge deal. If this is the case, how come shaolin kung-fu masters aren't winning UFC championships and such? The reason is simple. Shaolin kung-fu is easily beaten by powerful grappling just as easily as scissor beats paper. When a huge Zangeif type person grabs all their limbs and holds them to the ground, their fancy kung-fu runs out pretty quickly. There's no reason a clever ninja couldn't have also come up with clever techniques to beat monks as well.
The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
Shaolin Lawyer... coming to a cinema near you.
Ninja's do not do competitions. This is something that Maasaki Hatsumi has said - there will never be an official Bujinkan representative at any competition.
As for the past - why would a ninja be so stupid as to fight in a tournament? The way a ninja fights is not in the open - they sneak and kill in secret, and only fight hand-to-hand when there is no alternative.
Would a ninja beat an entire group of shaolin monks? You bet. Wait for them to go to sleep, then pick them off one by one. Easy as pie.
Ninjas were assassins used in feudal Japan and as such, if they were seen, they'd already failed.
What happened with a Ninja, you would simply be found dead the next morning. Or perhaps never found. That was a successful Ninja. I train in a Japanese system based on fighting styles used in the 15th and 16th century and just for fun, we'll try a few simple techniques that are/were attributed to Ninjas. Now I suspect there really were never Ninjas, but I'll play along for 2 hours to have some fun.
Typical is that as you walk by somebody (opposite way), if you grab their arm and yank straight down, they will fall. It seems like it shouldn't work, but it does. And it only works if the person doesn't expect it. If you fall backwards quickly like that, you'll be stunned for a second or two. If the attacker has a knife, you could be dead within seconds. That's (to me) the essence of Ninja stuff. Quiet, and striking when your guard is down, and then they're gone.
Again, I think it's a lot of B.S. but I think the Ninja myth is to Japan what the Cowboy myth is to the U.S. or what the King Arthur myth is to England.
There's only one Shaolin temple, even though the Songshan region is home to numerous martial arts training schools which use the name of "Shaolin." The Shaolin temple has recently taken legal action against such schools in order to preserve the integrity of its name and heritage. See: http://www.usatoday.com/money/2002-09-25-kung-fu-t rademark_x.htm
Okay, this is a totally contentless reply. However, the monks referenced in the article title is more or less what inspired my nickname network-time eons ago. Thus, in many ways, this is the most personal Slashdot article I have ever seen. Thanks Zonk. -- The one true Shallow Monkey
Ninjas beat The Tick in a fight. Arthur unavailable for comment. Wikipedia Entry alleged tainted by Ninja employees. 'SPOOOOON' catch phrase reportedly up for sale on Ebay.
This is Barry (the Tick) reporting.
Sorry about the writing. Robot fingers, you know? Cliff Steele in DOOM PATROL #23
"Five Minutes a Day" can at least be assured that the Shaolin Temple won't be sending Ninjas after them...
:P
You might not be able to beat a Shaolin Master, but at least you will be likely to see them first
"The first time I got drunk, I got married. The second time I bought a chimpanzee, after that I stayed sober" Arian Seid
Even if there is some truth to this, there's something else going on in the background, I seriously doubt any self-respecting monk would bother suing over some online comment. It doesn't make sense to me.
"we've got trenchcoats and bad attitudes" - John Constantine, HellBlazer
I hope Stephen Chow reads Slashdot.
And after all the attention Shaolin monks are now receiving, the host of world wide pirates and ninjas have now ended their long time animosity and joined forces to defeat all Shaolin monks. It was a great fight, quite funny actually. I guess you had to be there.
... until you can snatch the pebble from my palm, you will be pursued by lawyers and other creatures of the night.
I wonder what kind of process server Shaolin monks would use to serve notice to a ninja? I seems this might be the basis for a TV sitcom, with each episode having the hapless process server falling back to devise a new approach to sneak up on the ninja and serve the papers.
Well, it wasn't a Ninja at all. It was one of their own Shaolin Monks DISGUISED as a ninja who had returned to avenge the death of his sister which he blamed on the temples King Fu Master from years ago.....
I would go further and suggest that the techniques are *shown* and not even verbally transmitted. This would fall into harmony with the common eastern theme that certain levels of awareness must be transmitted outside the intellect and the word.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
WTF do you think all the fancy bullshit "blocks" really are?
Real kung fu isn't what you see on TV or on the movies. That is ballet or gymnastics. Real kung fu is up close, personal and brutal.
The reason they aren't on UFC, it's American, and most of the American kung-fu practitioners have no clue what the movements they're practising really mean.
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The world needs more humour, especially certain parts of the world. The presence of humour in a society should be used to gauge its civility, tolerance and sophistication.
England used to be pretty good (Monty Python) but I think America has taken the lead unintentionally via Bushisms.
Now please slap me with a fish.
I have to say, being one myself, I don't think any ninja would have the time or energy to waste on little things such as pride. I would more so believe that some bystander saw something relating to a duel where there was a need for defense on some level and it is quite possible that a ninja could beat a monk or a monk could beat a ninja...depends on the level they are at.
A Koga region ninja could very easily beat a shaolin monk , but might have problems with a white crane kung-fu master....why, diff. styles, and diff. combinations, certain regions are closer, therefor have seen the other styles or have had influence on them.
I could even let you know that the present day GrandMaster Ninja Hatsumi sensei, not only is a ninja, but comes from a long line of samurai masters...his family were samurai, and he learned the ways of the ninja. SO anything is possible in this world, I have heard stories of how demeaning a monk could be to fellow peasants, and I have seen myself how family oriented and
how much value for life certain ninjutsu masters have,
I would hate to generalize as so many people do in their ignorance (and as in this article).
If it were a real shaolin monk , there would be no lawyers, as the duel would take place immediately afterwards, with the monk seeking out the indivdual (as it would be his duty)
and "finishing" the duel.
Both sides take no sh*t and I think it sad that someone could start this whole thing as a media frenzy, where if asked I bet neither side would really care about such clames.
The martial arts... Karate, Kung-fu, ju-jitsu and the rest were never designed as competitive sports. They were self defence systems. And they were and are brutally effective if trained and practised that way. The very idea that one is better than another is complete bullshit, they were never meant to be used against other martial artists, they were meant to be used against aggressive but largely untrained attackers.
However, the last hundred years many of them have turned into sports. You are no longer allowed to gouge out your opponent's eyes, fishhook their mouths or attack other dangerous points like the neck, throat, groin, back or stamp on them on the ground. Instead you score points, playing tag in the ring. This pretty much leaves you with punches and kicks. The original techniques that are encoded into the forms or kata are either hidden, forgotten or simply not trained.
Now, the concept that karate and Kung-fu are purely striking systems is utter, utter bollocks. The forms and kata of both systems have joint locks, chokes, strangles, throws, gouges built in for all to see, if you know what you're looking at. Yes, much of which can be used on the ground. You just have to recognise them and practise. Ju-jitsu originally had a fair level of striking in it as well.
If you're practising karate, kung-fu purely as a striking system then what you are practising is kickboxing, not karate, not kung-fu. Practising ju-jitsu without kicks and punches it's not ju-jitsu.
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Probably, yeah. "Navy seals" and their ilk have the same aura of mysticism surrounding them, as do "monks." I think, on the whole, though, they are better trained, and more prepared for hand to hand combat.
I would certainly rather face a "Shaolin Monk" than Tito Ortiz.
I for one welcome our new suing Chinese Shaolin overlords.
Sorry
I spent five minutes stealing cool sigs and all I got was this.
However. There's a definite realisation of the problem and move back to reality training, which the traditional methods were based on.
See books by Lawrence Kane, Peter Consterdine, Ian Abernethy, Geoff Thompson. Particularly Abernethy's "Bunkai Jutsu".
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If UFC has shown us anything, it's that dependence on one single fight style is a death sentence. Kung Fu is a good workout, but is reduced to a fancy "dance" when your opponent actually steps in close enough to "grapple" with you. Israels Mossad has a pretty neat Mixed Martial Arts technique. But I'm not here to endorse a particular style. Mixed Martial Arts is exactly that, mixed. I'm sorry if the Shaolin Monks are worried that their style is losing it's generally accepted status as "most superior".
I'd sue too if I was beat by these guys.
"A unique story on the CBC website details an even more unusual conflict."
How can something happen and be more unusual than unique? There aren't that many integers between 0 and 1.
Your mom needs you to take the trash out.
If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
Just handing me legal documents have caused my eyes to erupt into fountains of blood. The power of these Shaolin Lawyers have no peer, and there is no known counter attack to their secret techniques.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
That point of view is theirs.
I prefer to think that most concepts are served well by medium level documentation to consisting of a presentation and a FAQ. When a student does this basic homework beforehand, it means his questions to the Master become more intelligent.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
I'd be glad they're only threatening legal action. You wouldn't want them to come do the Shaolin version of a blanket party on you for posting a story about them, would you?
Just think about it -- Shaolin monks gone Mafia -- "I hear you said bad things about us, (beatings) that's not going to happen again, (more beatings) is it?"
- Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)
What's next? "Knights Templar call for far-reaching tort reform"? "Jedi Knights file civil suit against Empire for breach of verbal contract in Dantooine destruction"?* Sheesh. Just go kick the guy's ass -- isn't that more in keeping with this particular conflict?
* I'm embarrassed to have been able to cast this particular sentence as fast as I could type. Pardon me, I must now go freshen the tape on my glasses.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.
/*ancient chinese voice/ Shaolin shadow boxing, and the Wu-Tang swordstyle...
/*second ancient chinese voice/ If what you say is true, the Shaolin and the Wu-Tang could be dangerous...
/*sound of swords being unsheathed.../ shhhiiiiinnngggggggg.....
/*first ancient chinese voice/ I'll let you try my Wu-Tang sword style
/*Sounds of intense sword-fighting and exclamations from combatants/
/*fade to black.../
Move along now, nothing to see here! Go on!
Even if it didn't happen, I'm sure it could happen. I mean, just look at this website. How can you deny those facts? http://http//www.realultimatepower.net/
Yet more proof, as if any was needed, that pirates rule. Shaolin Monks use lawyers to intimidate; Ninjas are intimidated by lawyers. Pirates, by definition, are not afraid of lawyers, and have no use for them except as ballast. QED.
"Cowboy myth"
I'm not sure what you mean about the cowboy myth. There is very real documentation of the bandits that roamed the Western U.S. in the 19th century: witness accounts, wanted posters, photographs, legal documents, you name it. Locals really would put together a possy and hunt them down when they became too much of a problem. So I don't know what you're referring to as a myth. There are fictions stories and movies, but no one is ascribing any kind of historical accuracy to them.
Ahhh, grasshopper only in secret, ancient and deadly but enlightened art of "FUNG-GOOL" can we ever hope to de-feet da Shaolin munks in dey own crib yo!
I killed da wabbit -Elmer Fudd
Ninja: I will kick your ass
Shaolin Monk: I will sue your ass
Pirate: all your base are belong to us
"Steve Jobs invented the world" -- Bill W. GATES
This is the most redicules thing I've ever heard of from supposedly Buddhist monks! What the Hell? I'm pretty sure that the whole freaking idea behind Buddhism is to let go of your ego. This is the most ego related thing I've ever heard of.
Word has just come in that the monks are filing a lawsuit against you now as well, and demanding a retraction and apology.
And you'd be wrong about techniques. Sure, describing what something is supposed to feel like is a good start, but it takes someone who knows to tell you why your technique is failing on one guy and working on another.
"We returned the General to El Salvador, or maybe Guatemala, it's difficult to tell from 10,000 feet"
Simple: Navy Seals have less training in hand to hand stuff. Also, note that it's very rare for someone to overpower a Navy Seal, so sacrificing some finer points of the style may be justified to reduce the training time. Of course, nothing prevents them from getting trained independently.
"We returned the General to El Salvador, or maybe Guatemala, it's difficult to tell from 10,000 feet"
What happened to the times when such a dispute was settled with a good thrashing?
I hadn't the slightest objection to his spending his time planning massacres for the bourgeoisie... (P.G. Wodehouse)
http://imdb.com/title/tt0080172/
I own the actual fight footage and can attest that Chinese Gung Fu bested every style the Japanese could throw at it, and without Bruce Lee's help.
No legal defense technique was needed then, and still not now.
Confucius says:
If have sidekick in comedy act, funny har har
If receive side kick in kung fu, Yie Ar! Not funny, but still can be side-splitting
MMm. The old martial arts masters typically knew fewer forms/kata, fewer techniques than those of today but spent more time on them. Plus, both attacker and defender are humans with human bodies. They only move in so many different ways. A punch is a punch, a throw is a throw, a kick is a kick. etc.
In reality most martial arts are almost identical when it comes down to using them on the street. The perceived differences between styles are largely ego or misunderstanding about what's actually happening. The bigger difference is between reality based training and sport based training.
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You know, the great thing is... This story comes from while he was on shore leave in the Navy ;) I don't think he was a SEAL, but still found it funny.