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Interview With an EVE Pirate
Within any game, especially massive games, there is usually a well established culture. This of course ultimately leads to some sort of counterculture (usually a la griefer). CCP's EVE has been able to give life to a counterculture that isn't completely destructive and makes for a very rich gameplay experience. Massively recently had a chance to sit down with one of EVE's leading criminals to discuss life as an outlaw. "One notable criminal organization devoted to piracy is Veto Corp, headed by their CEO Ethan Verone, who is without a doubt one of New Eden's more notorious pirates. Under his guidance, Veto Corp has been linked to numerous incidents of ransoming, hijacking, and illegal arms sales, among their many other crimes. Their modus operandi of shunning territorial control in favor of remaining fast and free ensures that Veto can conduct 'business' and hit targets anytime, and practically anywhere."
I don't speak for all of Eve players, but I've certainly never heard of them.
Just doin his part to keep EVE Online free of Global Warming.
If you can read this, I forgot to post anonymously.
And who will win the eternal battle between clowns and pirates?
this is why I love eve
the developers don't try to shelter their users
they openly designed it so there could be things like this.
eve is a real mmo the way it should be done
Eve is very unique in that there is only one universe. In Warcraft, if you develop a bad name, you can change servers, even change your name. If Eve, you have to make the best (or worst) of whatever lifestyle you choose to follow. As a Lawful Good resident, Eve quickly became a little terrifying since the only way I could expand my experience of the game was to move into less-friendly territory, something I was slightly reluctant to do with a Navy Raven with the best equipment. I suppose I (and others like me) could hop into a clone and take a cheap ship anywhere we wanted and experience that universe, but it just seemed too much like starting over. As more and more people grow into the position I was, we'll probably see an ever growing ratio of pirates to lawful citizens. At that point it will be very interesting to see what direction the game takes. It will probably be a Mad Max world at that point.
I think a lot of this has to do with the price of death.
When you die, you loose your ship and that can hurt a lot. This causes players to think more before they act. It offeres a bit of suspense when one gets into a battle. No other game has this, and if the death system was not the way it was then EVE would crumble.
If you die and get your ship back for free, what's the point?
The greatest revenge in life is massive success.
Stuff like this happens in any and all games. The difference is EVEs focus on PvP and the ensuing legalization of practically anything. There are very large portions of the universe where you can quite literally get away with what would be consider a crime, your only real protection will come from being in a large player gang, as there is simply no protection from NPCs. Even in so called "high sec", theres still a risk of getting blown up by an overpowering strike force before CONCORD (the space cops) can show up and defend you. Further more, any in game "corporation" (eve's guilds), can declare war upon another corporation, or groups of corporations that have banded together in an alliance, allowing them to be attacked anywhere, including the safest systems, as you've basically paid the cops to look the other way for a week. Several other mercenary corporations besides VETO exist as well. In fact I've hired a few of them to take out worthless targets simply because I can afford it and I got a good laugh from pissing the victims off.
I've heard of Ethan Verone. I used to read his posts on Eve-Pirate.
"Nerd makes nerd frat online where he has some virtual power and virtual friends" seems like something that a lot of slashdotters would be interested in.
He's infringing copyri... oh, I see.
Very well, carry on.
If all you have is a grenade, pretty soon every problem looks like a foxhole -- MightyYar
Buy cheap ship, gather in groups.
Wait/look for ship you can take down fast to wander by.
Destroy ship, maybe pod the pilot.
Repeat.
Encounter force larger/better then your own.
Return to Station, go afk and watch a movie while they spend hours 'camping' you. You have a good time, and make people spend tedious hours watching your avatar in station.
"...whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive...it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it..."
http://www.eve-pirate.com/uploads/LearningCurve.jpg
Yah? Does he pay CCP each month? If so, he's a soddin' carebear. Real pirates steal their accounts as well as their l00t.
Kwisatz Haderach
Sell the spice to CHOAM
This Mahdi took Shaddam's Throne
Most pirates in EVE, including VETO, are not generally regarded as very good players. They spend most of their time in systems with "low" security status rather than systems with "zero" security status. This amounts to the same as PVPing in the beginner zones of other MMOs, as the game prohibits fighting in "high" security systems. Low security systems still provides some automated defenses for a player that does not initiate combat, tends to have NPC stations (a place in which a player can dock up to hide or repair) and does not allow some of the more advanced ships to operate. These guys are roughly equal to mid-to-high-level horde players that hang out in Redridge.
Criminal? Outlaw??
While most citizens in New Eden follow the rules society dictates, there are some free spirits who shun the status quo -- and the law -- and live on their own terms.
What law, exactly, are they shunning? It was my understanding that in EVE there really was no law. That the PvP was full-on and unrestricted.
Now, if I'm incorrect, and EVE has an FBI, Interpol, or the like, then this may be more worthwhile.
Otherwise, this may as well be a story about playing Horde in Alliance territory - just another player playing a game as it was intended.
BFD
Every time Eve comes up in discussion I think about checking it out. I get the sense that it is really geared toward people who have lots of time to play it and it isn't very friendly toward casual players. What do you guys think? Is there any point in playing it if I only have 5-10 hours a week to devote to it?
If anyone is interested about the psychological aspects of competion-based games, I suggest to grab a copy of No Contest By Alfie Kohn:
Google Preview
Makes a interesting case about the underlying stimulus for competition-type personalities. I often found interesting that PvP servers and games attract a specific type of personality, that book makes me feel better about myself in comparison to them (for the humor-impaired that was a joke related to the book).
All EvE does is make me sad that EA got its claws into Origins. :(
Be warned. Eve is like being Rick Rolled. At first it seems great. MMO. Space. But then when you get there you find out it is horrible and people just played a horrible trick on you.
Do you really want to be Rick Rolled? I don't think so. Friends don't let friends play Eve.
If you find you don't have a lot of time to play during a typical week, why not consider a more casual friendly MMO? City of Heroes/City of Villains is very casual friendly in the sense that you can login, play for an hour or so and know you accomplished something towards leveling your character. You can easily find a PUG on most servers, although the quality of players varies considerably and finding a good guild - Supergroup in COH parlance - is a good idea if you find you like the game.
The combat system is first rate, the grouped combat is awesome, almost any character type (Archetype or AT in COH parlance) is capable of soloing - although more support oriented classes are slower at it of course, and the game can be quite addicting once you get used to it. There are still tons of low level characters being leveled up that you can group with (the game is very prone to Altitis and many people are constantly making new characters). You can have a lot of characters per server so you can try out many of the ATs to see what suits you etc.
Its not a big PvP game, although PvP is available in special zones, but you are also never forced to PvP. Gameplay consists mainly of getting and completing missions (usually takes about 10-20 mins to complete a typical mission) and Task Forces (takes much longer as they are a series of missions for a group and you can't take regular missions until you complete the TF or quit it).
It has collision detection - unlike the majority of MMOs - and this is a major attraction for me an my friends. You can actually physically block a door with your character and contain the mobs etc, they can't just run through you, and you can't run through your teammates. The combat system is well designed, and each character has a definite role in most groups, although it can vary depending on your spec).
Its not for everyone, but its a great game, one of the best designed MMOs out there IMHO, and after years its still going strong and they are still adding (free) content to the game on a regular basis. It takes very little time to figure out how things work but there is enough depth that it takes a while to master a particular set of powers.
http://www.cityofheroes.com/ if you want more information.
"The first time I got drunk, I got married. The second time I bought a chimpanzee, after that I stayed sober" Arian Seid
Pirates never fight on even terms (they always hide when out gunned)
Not at all true. We get in all kinds of fights that are even, lopsided, traps, whatever. You get a couple fleets slugging it out, and them you get stomped. No problem, you know now you can bait their big stuff out, so you plan ahead and then get your payback (and not necessarily with a larger fleet; more often than not, good planning and little quick thinking is more important than sheer numbers.
Another example would be faction warfare PvP. There's gangs of all sizes flying around. You have 12, they have 21? Well, what sizes are we talking about? Hmmm, we have two more cruisers than them, yeah, might work, if we can take that ship first, then that one, then either of those two. Good tactics and a good fleet commander making good decisions easily doubles the size of your fleet.
I think you were fell victim to one too many can flips and finally got pissed enough about all that veld you were losing that you quit -- without a full picture of what the entire game has to offer. You use the phrase "mind numbingly boring". What is mining if not that? Where's the excitement in watching a mining laser fire off again and again and again...
-B
Ash and Hickory, straight-grained and true, make excellent bludgeons, dandy for the cudgeling of vegetarians.
I'm an ex EVE player, and have to admit, I loved the universe, the trading and a little bit of risk of building things up.
In year or so that I played (pretty casually), I came across the odd pirate or two. Interestingly, in the earlier days, the pirates were a challenge. When geared up, it was a tossup who would win (with odds in favour of the pirates usually, but some chance to escape). That's what got the adrenaline pumping, the chance to slug it out with an actual opponent, and have a battle of wits to try and fight through. When the pirates won, they'd loot up (and from the hard fought battles, you knew they'd make use of the cash/gear). There's a few times when I've even sent a tell to the ambusher to congratulate them on winning a hard fought fight!
It can be as fun to lose to a sportsman as it is to win. You learn something.
In the latter days there, I found the majority had shifted to extremely well armed ships popping up in pretty secure space, and simply toasting anyone they could find. No pirating of the ships. No real money to be made. Not enough profit to really interest them (the equivalent to using a military navy prototype battlecruiser to hold a pensioner's outing riverboat to ransom).
They simply turned up, blew people away with vastly superior firepower, and after a few hours, moved to the next system to do just the same.
End result: Most of the newbies had their days ruined. No chance of escape (and none offered), just simple griefing. They frequently ended up podding people too (extra cost, extra inconvenience, and honestly, just plain nasty). Nothing to be learned, except that there are people out there who just want to piss you off.
When it got to that point, I simply cancelled my account and walked away. I don't mind a hard fight. I don't mind a challenge. It's just no fun to have people just come along to cause grief.
None of the posts on here that say "The players ARE the game" make me feel better about that, as honestly, those kind of people I can do without. They don't create fun. They don't give you a challenge. All you get to do when you encounter those groups is sit and watch for a few seconds as your ship is systematically shut down to a a crawl, and then your shields and hull tick down to nothing. You can't dent them. Can't scratch the paintwork even. Your only option (once you respawn at your clone location) is to head elsewhere in your backup ship and hope that they don't follow (which, inevitably, someone just like them will do soon enough).
In short, challenge is good and fun. If I want to keep getting assholes trying to ruin my day, I can get that for free just by going into a rough pub on a Saturday night.
Who is this clown? And how long till this EVE hits him with DMCA?
Having said that, the GP definitely summed it up when he said you have to have a different mind frame. This isn't a solo game, and those other players are REAL competition with REAL consequences. That's more than half the fun, not being a "mini-God".
I've done both low sec and 0.0 pvp and low sec is by far much harder, if your a pirate. What gate guns mean to a pirate is an extra 400 DPS helping the other non-pirate guy, plus a lot of other headaches I won't go into here. I happen to be in VETO corp and it's one of the best corps I've even been in. Not only are the members awesome but Verone runs a tight ship making VETO one of the most organized corps out there. I've been having some of the most fun I ever had playing a MMO since I joined these guys. P.S. He isn't a fry cook hes a fluffer.
How is what Veto Corp does different from what other corps do? Okay, so they don't claim large tracts of space for themselves (which might be the biggest form of piracy there is in EVE), but any corp will gladly kill you if you look at them the wrong way.
And what's illegal about arms trade in Eve? Is there anything at all that's illegal there? Okay, attacking people in 1.0 space gets you in trouble with the cops, but other than that, anything goes, right?
I guess the two distinguishing features of Veto Corps as far as I can tell are:
1: Mobility.
2: I suppose they're less diplomatic about what they're doing.