Xbox Live For Original Xbox Games Shutting Down

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Xbox Live For Original Xbox Games Shutting Down

Posted by Soulskill on Friday February 5, 2010 @07:43AM from the this-is-where-the-sidewalk-ends dept.

itwbennett writes "Giving no explanation beyond that it 'will provide the greatest benefit to the Xbox LIVE community,' Microsoft's General Manager for Xbox Live, Mark Whitten, announced that as of April 15th, Microsoft will be shutting down its Xbox Live service for the original Xbox and its games. 'Cold comfort for those of you who still enjoy playing Xbox titles like Halo 2 with your friends,' writes blogger Peter Smith. But Smith notes that Whitten's announcement does hint at some form of restitution for those affected, encouraging users to check their LIVE messages for more details and opportunities."

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So I guess you would call it by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 07:45 · Score: 5, Funny

Xbox Dead... goodnight everybody, I'll be here all week. Remember to tip your waitress.
Well... by Jorl17 · 2010-02-05 07:46 · Score: 5, Insightful

We can't sit around and hope that everything will be maintained for ever...
Sometimes it has to go down as deprecated, no matter when, no matter how, no matter why. Microsoft can and Microsoft shall, that's the price for being at their hands. The reward? To get to use their products.

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1. Re:Well... by jgagnon · 2010-02-05 07:49 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  It would make far more sense if they had stopped selling XBox games first.
  
  --
  Remember to maintain your supply of /facepalm oil to prevent chafing.
2. Re:Well... by blahplusplus · 2010-02-05 07:50 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  "We can't sit around and hope that everything will be maintained for ever..."
  You wouldn't have this problem on PC, anyone with a server or internet connection can host their own.
3. Re:Well... by Jorl17 · 2010-02-05 07:51 · Score: 1
  
  True, and that's why I explicitly state that "Microsoft can and Microsoft shall, that's the price for being at their hands". Next time, don't be at their hands.
  
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  Have you heard about SoylentNews?
4. Re:Well... by sopssa · 2010-02-05 07:54 · Score: 1
  
  Not when the server list or auth servers go down. You might be able to still connect to ip address directly, but that means you need to find lots of friends to come play with you (especially in team based games where you need something like 16+ players for it to be fun).
  It's time to fun to newer better games. Or just stay on single player games. Everyone playing multiplayer games has to know that at some point the player base will die because people move to new games.
5. Re:Well... by sopssa · 2010-02-05 07:56 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  It's time to move to newer better games, I mean. Wonder where that fun came from.
6. Re:Well... by blackraven14250 · 2010-02-05 07:57 · Score: 2, Funny
  
  The 800-pound clown in the room, maybe?
7. Re:Well... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · 2010-02-05 07:58 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  The issue, of course, is less with exactly when a given product is deprecated, and more with how many products are designed such that deprecation is effectively terminal.
  
  It is hard to make a case for forcing a company to continue to offer a particular good or service(unless they contractually obligated themselves and are violating that contract); but the fact that product design is moving in the direction of deprecation = death is extremely disturbing.
  
  Historically, with PC games, the creator may or may not have offered a matchmaking service or servers at all, but there was nothing stopping 3rd parties from doing so. Increasingly, through a combination of DRM activation and closer tying of matchmaking services and multiplayer servers to the core game, it is becoming difficult for 3rd parties to step up(and, if they do, they often place themselves in the line of fire with respect to some DMCA or equivalent legal hassle). On the hardware side, it is a matter of driver specs and parts. If driver specs aren't available, deprecation is death more or less as soon as the next major OS comes out. If service guides/tools/parts are tightly restricted, deprecation is death as soon as the parts dry up.
  
  The fact that products get deprecated is fine. The fact that the severity of deprecation is markedly increasing, and promises only to increase further, is very, very troubling.
8. Re:Well... by Blakey+Rat · 2010-02-05 08:00 · Score: 1
  
  You wouldn't have this problem on PC,
  Sure you would. Try playing Tabula Rasa online right now, that's a PC game.
  
  --
  Comment of the year
9. Re:Well... by blahplusplus · 2010-02-05 08:02 · Score: 1
  
  That is an MMO big difference. You're comparing apples to oranges.
10. Re:Well... by Chyeld · 2010-02-05 08:04 · Score: 1
  
  However as the long and varied life of Half-Life (the original game) proved, it's not impossible to update an old game with new matching software as time goes on.
  Additionally, and ironically in some respects, as Allegiance, a game initially developed by Microsoft, shows it's possible for a PC game to survive well beyond when the company that supported it turns everything off.
11. Re:Well... by Dan667 · 2010-02-05 08:05 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  They could have released a server so people could set up their own if they wanted to continue to use it. This is why vendor lock-in on consoles sucks in the first place.
12. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:08 · Score: 1, Insightful
  
  If hardly anyone's using it, how much does it cost them to keep the system on?
  If a substantial number of people are using it.... why should they discontinue support for it?
13. Re:Well... by poetmatt · 2010-02-05 08:08 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  really?
  You think this would happen if it was on a PC and for things that allowed dedicated servers?
  I'll give you a clue: it wouldn't.
  Welcome to what happens when non-technical console users get shoved into the world of pc gaming/become more techie as a result of MS's poor business choices. I hope people realize this applies to apple and any company/services that uses DRM (such as windows live gaming or whatever it's called) as well.
14. Re:Well... by d34dluk3 · 2010-02-05 08:09 · Score: 0, Redundant
  
  GP:
  
  Sometimes it has to go down as deprecated
  Parent:
  
  The issue, of course, is less with exactly when a given product is deprecated
  Seriously, guys? The product was belittled by Microsoft? I think we're missing an i somewhere here.
15. Re:Well... by AndrewNeo · 2010-02-05 08:09 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Nothing's stopping you from playing single player Xbox 1 games. If anything now nobody has an excuse not to mod their original Xbox!
16. Re:Well... by poetmatt · 2010-02-05 08:10 · Score: 1
  
  I think you're right for most games, but not for all. Some games actually think long term such as Eve online.
17. Re:Well... by LWATCDR · 2010-02-05 08:10 · Score: 1
  
  Well this is just fine.
  Microsoft should now open the SDK and open the XBox protocols so somebody else can take over support for their games.
  
  --
  See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
18. Re:Well... by sopssa · 2010-02-05 08:11 · Score: 1
  
  No he isn't really. MMO's and multiplayer games are a lot alike. Only thing separating is that servers are usually ran by the company, and that the world generally has a lot more players in single environment. Hence the name massively multiplayer online game.
19. Re:Well... by Blakey+Rat · 2010-02-05 08:11 · Score: 1
  
  Original Xbox had MMOs on it.
  But ok: try playing Starsiege: Tribes then. The master server is down, and without it it can't connect to any game servers that may still be up. (If any are.) I believe Tribes 2's master server is down as well.
  
  --
  Comment of the year
20. Re:Well... by Jorl17 · 2010-02-05 08:11 · Score: 1
  
  Did I ever say that? All I said was that they can control it. I never said that they could also control PC games that well. Unfortunately, you decided to commit a fallacy on that one...
  On the other hand, I *DO* know that. I *DO* want people to realize it. and I *DO* hope that you only accidentally didn't realize that I never stated that this wouldn't happen if it were a PC. Even without being a PC, it is possible to go around it; even if it ran in a PC with no dedicated servers possible, it'd be hackable.
  
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  Have you heard about SoylentNews?
21. Re:Well... by rrohbeck · 2010-02-05 08:12 · Score: 1
  
  Microsoft can and Microsoft shall, that's the price for being at their hands. The reward? To get to use their products.
  High tech masochism?
  
  --
  thegodmovie.com - watch it
22. Re:Well... by talz13 · 2010-02-05 08:14 · Score: 1
  
  Deprecated is a commonly used term in computer science / programming.
23. Re:Well... by The+End+Of+Days · 2010-02-05 08:15 · Score: 1
  
  no
24. Re:Well... by wjousts · 2010-02-05 08:26 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  Not any more, see MW2 for example. Also, watch what happens when Steam shuts down.
25. Re:Well... by poetmatt · 2010-02-05 08:27 · Score: 1
  
  Sorry to seem ad hominem. I never meant you said that, I'm just providing a reply here so that hopefully people will read it. Hopefully people will realize what went on is a direct example of the issues people don't realize exist.
  Really, you can only hack a game so much without dedicated servers - the reason is that you don't know what the server side data is. Even if you know what the client is requesting it isn't telling you what the server does with it.
26. Re:Well... by Snarkalicious · 2010-02-05 08:28 · Score: 1
  
  Answer one is: Proportinately more per user. The base costs are the same and , while the incremental costs are down, the revenue stream has tanked, giving it a net negative effect. The business model wasn't designed to support a steadily declining customer base over a long period of time. Answer two: New content is not forthcoming at a fast enough rate to make the thing profitable. With the 360, hot new games lead to hot new DLC that MS gets a cut of in a distro deal. On the old system, not so much. That, and I would guess getting assigned to maintain old X-Box titles has a certain Siberia-esque feel to it around the office. Dollars and politics, essentially. And, btw, I typed this thing using paragraphs, but it won't display that way. Sry bout that.
27. Re:Well... by Rathum · 2010-02-05 08:35 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  There are community run Tribes 1 and 2 master servers and there have been for years.
28. Re:Well... by spleentor · 2010-02-05 08:45 · Score: 5, Informative
  
  Tribes is still very much alive. Unlike with an xbox live game, all you need to do is change the master server the game looks for. http://www.maxogc.net/tribes/master/
29. Re:Well... by Ephemeriis · 2010-02-05 08:45 · Score: 1
  
  We can't sit around and hope that everything will be maintained for ever...
  Well, if the games had been designed differently, it wouldn't be necessary for them to be maintained forever.
  What ever happened to a good ol' dedicated server running on your LAN?
  
  --
  "Work is the curse of the drinking classes." -Oscar Wilde
30. Re:Well... by blahplusplus · 2010-02-05 08:49 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Yes he is really, when an MMO shuts down it takes down ONLY the mmo and anyone who gets into MMO's knows this before hand since a game can only maintain the servers for as long as there is paying customers, stand alone games are nothing like this. Hence his fallacious comparison.
31. Re:Well... by jgagnon · 2010-02-05 09:01 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Except that the XBox games being sold still tout their multi-player capabilities. Now if they reduce the XBox game prices to reflect the loss of capabilities and relabel them to suit, this would be less of an issue (but still wholly relevant to those who purchased XBox games recently for their multi-player capabilities).
  And, for the record, I don't own or use the XBox or XBox 360.
  
  --
  Remember to maintain your supply of /facepalm oil to prevent chafing.
32. Re:Well... by Captain+Spam · 2010-02-05 09:01 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Well, yeah, if by that you mean once Eve Online's central servers go away, the entire game completely and absolutely stops, since the game can't exist in that case. After, say, Descent 3's central server lists went away, the game could still be played via informal means and direct IP address connections.
  I used to be part of a community for a relatively obscure online game whose central server lists were long-abandoned by the parent company, but thanks to a registry hack and someone getting hold of the original metaserver code, not only is the game still playable via IP address connections, they now have a community-run central server list and the means to make more if need be.
  Or, for instance, take FreeCiv (the standalone one, not the HTML5 experiment). That uses a central metaserver. All vanilla copies of the game come with that server as the default, but since the metaserver itself is open-source, anyone else could make their own and use it if the official ones suddenly went away, and the game makes it easy to input a new metaserver if you know where it is.
  Outside of modding the XBox or hacking the games themselves, console owners generally don't have this option. And (most) MMOGs, like Eve Online, completely lose this functionality if their central servers (and thus where the persistent gameworld and content is stored) vanish.
  
  --
  Demanding constant attention will only lead to attention.
33. Re:Well... by VGPowerlord · 2010-02-05 09:02 · Score: 1
  
  And yet there are still servers for the 10+-year old Counter-Strike.
  In fact, Counter-Strike (classic, not Source) is still one of the top played games on Steam. In the top two, no less. The other game in the top two? Conter-Strike: Source. And Team Fortress 2 places a distant third.
  
  --
  GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
34. Re:Well... by VGPowerlord · 2010-02-05 09:04 · Score: 1
  
  Whoops, my bad. Modern Warfare 2 bumped CSS and CS (and TF2) down 1 slot each on Steam's stats (I also thought I hit preview while I went to check on those numbers...)
  
  --
  GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
35. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 09:06 · Score: 1, Funny
  
  The PS3?
36. Re:Well... by Jorl17 · 2010-02-05 09:09 · Score: 1
  
  Well, we can hack a game without dedicated servers, if we manage to successfully reverse engineer it. On a possibly not-good-enough example, look at OpenTTD, based on the disassembly of TTD. Sure, figuring out a protocol between server and client isn't the same thing, but there will always be a way to do it -- we just lack the right people.
  
  --
  Have you heard about SoylentNews?
37. Re:Well... by brkello · 2010-02-05 09:11 · Score: 1
  
  Exactly. And this also why I look at people who hate Blizzard a little funny. How long have they been running their servers for their customers? I guess a counter point to myself, though, is if they did shut down, it would sure be nice to have private servers so people could still play. But as long as they still support it, I will stay impressed. If/when they finally do shut down, I am sure someone won't have too much trouble writing bnetd 2.0.
  
  --
  Support a great indie game: http://www.abaddon360.com
38. Re:Well... by jgtg32a · 2010-02-05 09:15 · Score: 1
  
  Give that another 6 months or so
39. Re:Well... by RobDude · 2010-02-05 09:24 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Game companies can't have it both ways (they can try, but eventually customers will wise up).
  With 'private' servers they host (and only they can host) and even various DRM techniques; they've produced games that require the servers to be up and running for games to continue to work.
  That game you legal purchased and own....you can only expect it to work as advertised, so long as the company continues to keep their end up and running.
  It's easy for people to dismiss concerns of 'Ummm - what if the shut down the servers' and simply say, 'Come'on Microsoft isn't going anywhere!'. But, even in the short time that online gameplay can be expected - we've seen TONS of games lose functionality.
  Apparently, every Xbox game that was playable on Xbox Live is now crippleware.
  Maybe you only play games for 6 months and move on...but some people don't. They enjoy replaying their games. I'll play through FF1 every 2-4 years and that came out in 1987. It's still fun, at least for me. Sure, only a select few games get that level of replay value; but it's *your* game. Or, it should be.
  This is all just another step towards having to 'rent' your games in order to play them. And sitting back and idling dismissing it as 'no big deal' just invites the problem to continue.
40. Re:Well... by dissy · 2010-02-05 09:31 · Score: 1
  
  We can't sit around and hope that everything will be maintained for ever...
  
  Sure we can. And do. And at least for PC games, one is far more likely to get their wish.
  
  Sometimes it has to go down as deprecated, no matter when, no matter how, no matter why.
  
  Totally not true.
  It never HAS to do deprecated. A 10 year old server for a 10 year old game will run just fine as long as you aren't stingy and try to do everything yourself poorly.
  As long as I can have my own computer on the internet, I have all the abilities I need to run a game server, except for the game server software itself.
  With PC games, you almost always can get this too. Only with console games do you not.
  
  Microsoft can and Microsoft shall, that's the price for being at their hands. The reward? To get to use their products.
  The article disagrees. Clearly the reward is NOT being able to use their products (or at least not after April 15th)
41. Re:Well... by Sechr+Nibw · 2010-02-05 09:54 · Score: 1
  
  See that drop down menu next to Preview and Submit?
  Yeah that one. Set it to "Plain Old Text" if you're having trouble, or learn how to use the html line break.
42. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 09:55 · Score: 0
  
  Not when the server list or auth servers go down
  Yes, even when "the server list or auth servers go down"
  Jesus, the console fanboys are dense.
43. Re:Well... by Mista2 · 2010-02-05 10:01 · Score: 1
  
  Not a surprise coming form the company that also brough you failr-play - then stopped that support so all the pruchased content was instantly worthless. Thsi is the main reason I have nto even bothered wasting my Money on XB-Live - in a few years it will be gone, and so will my money. But then as MS cant seem to make XB360 console that last more than a few years, maybe this isnt really a problem afterall.
44. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 10:04 · Score: 0
  
  Ahh, the original Xbox - what a thing of beauty! The system that you could mod yet still play games online while not worrying about being caught. The joy of dual BIOSes.
45. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 10:10 · Score: 0
  
  Valve has promised that they'll remove the protection from games when this day comes. Of course, there's no contract for them to do this, but there'll always be piracy as backup.
46. Re:Well... by drinkypoo · 2010-02-05 10:15 · Score: 1
  
  We can't sit around and hope that everything will be maintained for ever...
  The users are paying for a service that is working fine. Or at least, fine enough to keep them paying. Microsoft is doing this solely to force them to stop playing gamest that they enjoy, and spend more money on alternatives. The implication with paying for the service is that it makes a profit, and that it should continue as long as this is so. Therefore, if Microsoft is doing this for any reason other than that they are now losing money on it, they are right bastards. It might not be legally actionable, but it is going to drive some people away.
  For those of us who have never paid for Xbox Live (the trial was underwhelming at best; the best reason for me to have Live Gold was to have Netflix, but it doesn't buffer like paid movie and music downloads do, and my connection isn't fast enough for streaming netflix though I have enough monthly transfer for it, so that's useless to me) and never bought a game based on the Xbox Live functionality, this is ample reason to never do so. In theory, my WISP was going to be upgrading their equipment to the point where I could get low enough latency to play games on Live, and I would have subscribed at that time. Now, I certainly will not, because I know that Microsoft will eventually yank the rug out from under those games. I always suspected it because I am not a moron, but now I am sure. Since I won't have Live Gold, I won't be buying any games with a limp single player, which is most of them, so that translates into lost license fees for Microsoft.
  Hopefully, when PS3 starts charging and Microsoft cuts off Xbox Live users on Xbox (perhaps it should be renamed to Xbox 360 Live) this will spark a resurgence in interest in PC gaming. Now that many developers have shifted to making Xbox 360 games and doing a PC port, hopefully more of them will support gamepads properly. Some games demand a joystick, some mouse and keyboard; some games, however, are most playable with a gamepad. Often, support for gamepads has been soft on the PC...
  
  --
  "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
47. Re:Well... by thetoadwarrior · 2010-02-05 10:17 · Score: 1
  
  Which would be fine if games included the option to play online outside of XBL too as they should.
  
  It's not like Xbox live is being shut down or that people don't pay to use it. It's because as far as publishers are concerned playing old games is just as bad as buying used games because it means you're not buying new games and MS is not going to encourage that.
  
  Just like EA killing off online play for sports games more or less as soon as the next version is out, it's pure greed and nothing else.
48. Re:Well... by drinkypoo · 2010-02-05 10:17 · Score: 1
  
  Additionally, and ironically in some respects, as Allegiance, a game initially developed by Microsoft, shows it's possible for a PC game to survive well beyond when the company that supported it turns everything off.
  Microsoft released the source to Allegiance under their shared source license. This is not going to happen for the majority of Xbox titles, if any. Even if the source to the game servers was released, you'd still need a fake Xbox Live server to handle matching. Of course, in some Xbox games, one user hosts the server... but they still match through Live. Some games have LAN play; this will be largely unaffected, and the games can be played over a sufficiently powerful internet connection using Kai. Games for which all these things are true are deeply in the minority, however.
  
  --
  "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
49. Re:Well... by Jorl17 · 2010-02-05 10:26 · Score: 1
  
  Right. If you read only the last part of my comment, you'd see that I completely agree with you. They are greedy and they are, excuse me, the biggest fucking retarded pricks on earth. Go on funding them by using Windows, Office, XBox, Zune and whatever else you use. Your problem now, I don't use any of that.
  
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  Have you heard about SoylentNews?
50. Re:Well... by Chyeld · 2010-02-05 10:36 · Score: 1
  
  That was sort of my point. Even Microsoft, in the PC realm, was able to come up with a solution that allowed the games to go on 'forever'.
  The OP was making the case that the problem the consoles is shared with the PCs.
  But the manner in which consoles were setup though (and it's not just the Xbox that this is a problem with) means that you have to recreate an entire infrastructure rather than mimic a server.
  Even if you have an "Xbox Live" emulator, you still have to either play games with your network routing in order to make the game see the emulator or go in and change the game itself to look for the emulator rather than the 'real thing'.
51. Re:Well... by iamhassi · 2010-02-05 10:38 · Score: 1
  
  "We can't sit around and hope that everything will be maintained for ever..."
  
  Forever? Is four years "forever"? The Xbox360 was released late 2005, and the original Xbox was discontinued late 2006 and the last game was released August 2008, so that means there's easily people with 4 year old Xbox consoles and 2 year old games looking at Microsoft saying "WTF?! I just bought this thing!" . If you bought your computer brand new in 2006 and Microsoft said "hey you can't have internet anymore after April, go buy a new system!" I'd imagine you'd be pretty upset.
  
  --
  my karma will be here long after I'm gone
52. Re:Well... by iamhassi · 2010-02-05 10:45 · Score: 1
  
  I hope all Xbox 360 owners remember this announcement, because approximately 5 years after whatever the new Xbox is called is released, Microsoft might be shutting you guys down too.
  
  First they came for the original Xbox owners, and I did not speak out....
  
  --
  my karma will be here long after I'm gone
53. Re:Well... by flyneye · 2010-02-05 10:47 · Score: 1
  
  Well, you can still use the old Xbox to run Dynebolic www.dyne.org .
  
  --
  *Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
54. Re:Well... by Schadrach · 2010-02-05 11:14 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  Thank you sweet merciful lady of chaos. I used to play Tribes all the time, and wasn't aware you could do this. Wonder if there are still any Shifter servers running...
55. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 11:19 · Score: 0
  
  You have to pay for the online service. I wonder if there will be another player who will take over.
56. Re:Well... by dunezone · 2010-02-05 11:34 · Score: 1
  
  "We can't sit around and hope that everything will be maintained for ever..."
  You wouldn't have this problem on PC, anyone with a server or internet connection can host their own.
  You would still have problems with PC. DOS games can be played on DOSbox, but working DOSbox with network support is nightmare. And emulation is never 100% so you can always run into problems. Privateer was nearly impossible to run on a modern system until emulation came around.
  
  Running 3D Accelerated games is hit or miss since modern drivers tend to break backward compatibility. So many of those early classics will run with graphic glitches or not at all. My Nvidia driver from six months ago broke my Jedi Knight: Dark Forces and that no longer runs.
  
  Some games were made to use M-Player and HEAT.NET and now would require a third-party plugin to work. This requires someone with knowledge and the time to fix. Command and Conquer Gold requires third-party hacked files to run properly on a modern OS. Of course than Westwood Online is no longer available so you need to find an alternative.
  
  If you're real lucky the company released the source code to the game like ID Software and its been rewritten or ported but that's very rare.
  
  Emulation is an option but that opens a whole can of worms, especially with 3D Acceleration emulation.
  
  PC is better but it has a lot of gotchas. The reason its better is because its easier to fix a PC game than a closed-console. The funny thing is, there are ways to get multiplayer to work for Halo and Halo 2 on the xbox without going through LIVE.
57. Re:Well... by HAKdragon · 2010-02-05 11:50 · Score: 1
  
  If you're thinking "fairplay", that's from Apple for encrypting media bought from iTunes..
  
  --
  "Our opponent is an alien starship packed with atomic bombs. We have a protractor."
58. Re:Well... by theArtificial · 2010-02-05 12:12 · Score: 1
  
  With the success of Modern Warfare 2 and the model it has put foward the solution you're providing is not absolute.
  
  --
  Man blir trött av att gå och göra ingenting.
59. Re:Well... by Belial6 · 2010-02-05 12:15 · Score: 1
  
  That or they could open source their server so that third parties can run their own servers for those games. Actually, if isn't there already a third party server for the XBox?
60. Re:Well... by theArtificial · 2010-02-05 12:15 · Score: 1
  
  Perhaps you should look into XBConnect.
  
  --
  Man blir trött av att gå och göra ingenting.
61. Re:Well... by theArtificial · 2010-02-05 12:22 · Score: 1
  
  There is no need to hack the console when you can use software on your PC to handle locating and connecting to other players. While this isn't a magic bullet it does support popular titles and I'm sure with more involvment attitional titles maybe supported (depending on how they're designed). For more information look at the games XBConnect.com supports.
  
  --
  Man blir trött av att gå och göra ingenting.
62. Re:Well... by theArtificial · 2010-02-05 12:25 · Score: 1
  
  I wouldn't hold your breath for the price to drop either.
  
  --
  Man blir trött av att gå och göra ingenting.
63. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 12:40 · Score: 1, Insightful
  
  We can't sit around and hope that everything will be maintained for ever [...] Microsoft can and Microsoft shall, that's the price for being at their hands. The reward? To get to use their products.
  This is just a reaction test to gauge the audience for a much larger community. I'm talking about Windows XP users who must ACTIVATE their install legally when going through yearly spring cleaning or disaster recovery reinstalls. We all complained when Vista came out, and still cling to it, but unlike with those Windows NT, Windows 98 and Windows 2000 boxes that we still see out there in countless small businesses and homes, MS can finally refuse activation and force the client to purchase a new version. My problem is not the fact that old OS's become insecure and a liability to their owners and businesses, but the fact that you'll leave lots of computers in reduced / unusable mode even if they were meant to sit around as a dedicated internal file server or whatever
  Those users *purchased* XP at $200+ dollars --didn't hacked it. That allone will give them a feeling of entitlement to perpetual service, because the home user or small business user does not understand licensing and activation / deactivation, especially when a "no reactivation" date was never published so they could account for it. OEM laptops and PC's, and legal business use volume keys and their PC's don't actually need a web connection or phonecall to reactivate based solely on their serial number. Their IT departments will take care of reinstalls and upgrades to Vista / Windows 7 / Windows 8 for them.
  I can imagine the XP users phoning the MS # as usual to get the reactivation key, only to be told that they need to go out and pay for a new version. I can see angry forum posts and blogs saying how their online activation brings them to an upgrade page, and that even if they wanted to pay for a new windows version, the upgrade advisor finds their hardware too old, since it was designed without even Vista specs in mind. MS just wants to see how 25 million users react to having the plug pulled, and do some math to see how they adjust their plans for a the silent Windows XP death and beginning of a control model they've been craving for a whole decade.
64. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 13:00 · Score: 0
  
  We can't sit around and hope that everything will be maintained for ever... Sometimes it has to go down as deprecated, no matter when, no matter how, no matter why. Microsoft can and Microsoft shall, that's the price for being at their hands. The reward? To get to use their products.
  Yeah, I'd be more sympathetic to that argument if we weren't paying them money to use their service. If I pay for an XBox Live account, I damn well expect my Xbox Live games to continue working with it!
65. Re:Well... by Grieviant · 2010-02-05 13:16 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Actually, if isn't there already a third party server for the XBox?
  xbox connect
66. Re:Well... by Ihmhi · 2010-02-05 13:31 · Score: 1
  
  I still play TRIBES, and the official master server has been shut down for years now.
  
  --
  Random Thoughts From A Diseased Mind (Not For Dummies)
67. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 14:12 · Score: 0
  
  Modern Warfare 2 will not be missed much by the PC community. It was one of the most overhyped, unbalanced and glitchiest AAA games released.
  Valve have repeatedly said that they'll patch Steam if it ever gets shut down, and even if they don't the DRM on Steam has been broken for ages already. Whenever the Valve License Check servers go down, anybody can play Source games multiplayer (hence the DDoS attacks on them by pirates a while ago).
68. Re:Well... by WCLPeter · 2010-02-05 14:48 · Score: 1
  
  If a substantial number of people are using it.... why should they discontinue support for it?
  Because Microsoft doesn't want you to play multi-player games on your fully functional eight year old original X-Box. Instead they want you to go out and buy your fourth X-Box 360 and attempt to play multi-player games, assuming the thing doesn't get so hot it red rings again, or that the DVD drive will actually reads your disks.
69. Re:Well... by Denjiro · 2010-02-05 15:22 · Score: 1
  
  Looks like it. The bottom of the list at the parent link there were nine servers listing Shifter V1G.
70. Re:Well... by Doctor_Jest · 2010-02-05 17:10 · Score: 1
  
  That's why I am amazed more games don't have a better single player component. Take Fallout 3 (or Oblivion for that matter) AMAZINGLY vast game-world... single player. These two games alone have racked up YEARS of play on my PS3 and 360 respectively. (and I'm STILL not done with Fallout 3, but I'm a completist with these sorts of games) Games with no single player component? (Warhawk, or any game that is meant to be a "connected multiplayer") I tend to avoid them... It's not that there's anything inherently wrong with the concept, but like EA and their server pruning (and now XBox "1" Live), I tend to avoid games with such a short shelf-life. It's not terribly short, mind you, if you are willing to spend the full price for the game at launch (and it's not a dog of a game)... but if you wait for a "Greatest Hits" or a used version, you are playing Russian Roulette with the game's usefulness (not every game's online component can be a Halo 2...)
  
  I like Demon's Souls concept of online. It doesn't really require there to be anyone else there, but when there are, you can see nasty deaths ahead, and read some (sometimes) handy hints. :)
  
  --
  It's the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man.
71. Re:Well... by drkim · 2010-02-05 20:32 · Score: 1
  
  It's too bad they don't have a system like UT2004 and UT3 have - where users can run their own server off their system.
72. Re:Well... by Mista2 · 2010-02-05 20:46 · Score: 1
  
  Sorry, meant Plays-For-Sure, the MS one.
73. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 20:54 · Score: 2, Funny
  
  You don't have to. I can hold it myself.
74. Re:Well... by KDR_11k · 2010-02-05 21:20 · Score: 1
  
  Newer games aren't always better, some just don't have more modern replacements. Sometimes the replacements are of lower quality (ask any Deus Ex fan...).
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
75. Re:Well... by KDR_11k · 2010-02-05 21:23 · Score: 1
  
  Didn't the BNetD ruling mean that these servers are vulnerable to lawsuits? Sure, most companies aren't jackasses on a level that they'd sue you over serving obsolete games but some just might be.
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
76. Re:Well... by b4k3d+b34nz · 2010-02-05 21:24 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  I would actually rather rent games, but that's because I consider them disposable except for maybe the super classics. I don't have any need to "own" licenses for music, games, television shows, or software. I pay for some in each category because there's no way to always rent.
  I think a lot of the reason we pay for games, movies, and music is because we want them to run on a variety of devices, and the only way to do that is with a physical copy or DRM. But, for me, I think it makes more financial sense to rent instead of own. I can listen to the old songs that I enjoy, along with approximately 750 new songs every month (~8 songs/hour, 6 hours per workday, 4 days a week, 4 weeks a month). If I want to watch a movie, I can rent it and it will be at my house in 2 days, or I can probably rent it online included in my Netflix, find it on Amazon, or worst case just go down to redbox.
  
  --
  Grammar Lesson: you're is a contraction of "you are"; your means you possess something; yore means days gone by.
77. Re:Well... by KDR_11k · 2010-02-05 21:27 · Score: 1
  
  If you bought it at the right store you got a pricedrop in the first few weeks it was out. I hear the UK had a serious price war over MW2.
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
78. Re:Well... by Pofy · 2010-02-05 22:24 · Score: 1
  
  "Didn't the BNetD ruling mean that these servers are vulnerable to lawsuits?"
  Are they all in the US? At least the list seems to be in Germany.
79. Re:Well... by KDR_11k · 2010-02-05 22:33 · Score: 1
  
  I agree with most overhyped but I've been a PC gamer for a long time, if you think MW2 was anywhere near the most unbalanced or glitchiest AAA PC title you're coddled by modern games. I remember when we had to get patches just to make the installer work.
  
  --
  Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
80. Re:Well... by Idiomatick · 2010-02-06 00:46 · Score: 1
  
  MMO servers are COMPLETELY fucking different from most game servers. To say otherwise is just being ignorant.
81. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-06 00:51 · Score: 0
  
  ... The reward? To get to use their products.
  That's not a reward. That is punishment!
82. Re:Well... by fyrewulff · 2010-02-06 01:42 · Score: 1
  
  You think this would happen if it was on a PC and for things that allowed dedicated servers? I'll give you a clue: it wouldn't.
  Actually, I can think of quite a few PC games who's online modes stopped working. C&C95, Tiberian Sun, Renegade, many others. Dedicated servers don't mean the game can stay up if the company pulls the plug on the master server. Seeing as how all these games are peer-to-peer, they're actually less vulnerable to shutdowns, since nobody has to buy and run separate server hardware. It doesn't matter who ultimately hosts a game.
  
  However, both dedicated and P2P gaming both have the same weakness - if the central master server goes down, you won't be able to find games anymore. There is no difference between me sitting in a lobby waiting for connections in P2P or me sitting in a dedicated server lobby waiting for connections. If people aren't given a way to get to that server, they're both essentially dead. Only games that anyone really cares about get their master servers reverse engineered, or if the developer releases the master server software
  
  I've also seen bad examples of a 'community' taking over a game after it goes down. If anyone remembers Subspace, a top-down shooter for PC? The original company (Sierra, if I remember correctly) shut it off. People found out how to get it to run on their own servers. A couple of years later, these people used their power and consolidated the master server software into their own little group, essentially taking the game -back away- from the community and pushed out the replacement software (called "Continuum"), in short they hijacked the game. After they then proceeded to do crap like delete six year old active accounts because "they wanted the screenname for a friend", I stopped playing.
  
  So in short, quit putting dedicated servers on a magical pedestal. They aren't the end all be all. For a game to continue after it's plug is pulled either requires a community with people in it good enough to reverse engineer the master servers, hope to hell the developer releases the master server, and then hope you don't have jerks go for a power play and 'take over' and turn out to be bigger assholes than the company could ever be. Dedicated servers are just a relic of the old days when it would have not been feasible (especially when graphics were CPU-bound) to run both the server daemon and the game off the same machine, so it was just easier to split them up. Now we have multi-core machines and seperate GPUs. There is no real reason for dedicated servers to exist anymore, because you can replicate all their functionality in a P2P game anyway.
  
  Ultimately though, I suspect the real reason behind the shutdown is that they're probably starting to lose money on supporting original Xboxes. When you call 1-800-4MYXBOX, you still get menu options for OXbox support. Training people to support it is going to cost money and time. If you only have 90 people playing from an OXbox, their subscriptions are not going to support your operations. It really is the last cord they have to cut to completely drop the OXbox. There's also the fact that you cannot actually sign up for new accounts through the original Xbox - you need to use a prepaid code to start your account, you just can't put in a credit card by itself.
  
  It should also be stated that this is not the end of Halo 2 online! There's still Halo 2 Vista, which runs on both Vista and 7. It has both peer-to-peer and dedicated servers (guess which one is the bigger method of playing (hint: peer to peer, due to the dedicated servers usually only running one gametype)). It runs on GFWL so it will work as long as MS wants it to. And if they kill GFWL live, even though H2V has dedicated servers, it'd still become unplayable.
  
  Developers should never be forced to support a game into eternity - in the real world, servers cost money for bandwidth and maintenance.
  
  Bonus content: All of the games affected by this can still be played over the internet with Xbox Connect through their LAN modes.
  
  --
  "We need to get over this notion, that, for Apple to win... Microsoft must lose." - Steve Jobs, 1997
83. Re:Well... by Bert64 · 2010-02-06 01:44 · Score: 1
  
  But by having a console which depends on a single service, you effectively have an expiry date on the usefulness of the console.
  Lots of people like to play old games, and many poorer people will buy old consoles very cheaply with a stack of games for their kids.
  I still play quake online sometimes, it runs very fast on almost any modern system and is still great fun to play against other people.
  
  --
  http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
84. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-06 04:15 · Score: 0
  
  I'd like to see online game providers subject to regulations that require them to produce a patch to any game they produce with online dependencies.
  This patch would enable the game to play on 3rd-party servers, and would be held in escrow for the lifetime of the online service.
  The patch would be required to be released in the event that the company terminates its services for any reason.
  That way we don't have to trust the company to maintain its services indefinitely - we have a suitable fallback option, which does not threaten the company's ability to profit from its services for as long as it offers them.
  In the interest of full disclosure, I work in a game studio, and would be happy to have my company comply with such a regulation. It lets me deliver the intended experience to my players long-term, without impacting my profits, or those of my investors.
85. Re:Well... by theArtificial · 2010-02-06 09:02 · Score: 1
  
  Well thats a step in the right direction. EA is notorious for their Steam prices which generally hold strong during the life of the product (until the next great thing comes out) look at COD4 and COD5 WaW.
  
  --
  Man blir trött av att gå och göra ingenting.
86. Re:Well... by Snarkalicious · 2010-02-07 08:38 · Score: 1
  
  Pedantic, condescending...yup. Learn to teach without insulting, you pusillanimous twit.
87. Re:Well... by Tukz · 2010-02-07 19:16 · Score: 1
  
  PvPGN is said to be on standby to make the appropiate changes for Battle.net 2 when it goes live.
  Only a matter of time before PvPGN will support it.
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PvPGN
  
  --
  - Don't do what I do, it's probably not healthy nor safe. -
88. Re:Well... by twistedsymphony · 2010-02-10 04:57 · Score: 1
  
  Actually, if isn't there already a third party server for the XBox?
  XLink Kai
  
  --
  Collector's Edition
89. Re:Well... by twistedsymphony · 2010-02-10 06:17 · Score: 1
  
  It's still better than some of the alternatives. EA recently shut off the Madden 2009 servers, how's that for replay value?
  
  I was actually really happy when I read this announcement because as an Xbox 360 owner there are a number of features that I and others have wanted to see for a while but had been told "sorry due to the limitations of Xbox 1 games the live service can't be upgraded to incorporate that feature."
  
  In all honesty though, unless you're a AAA title like Halo 2, the multiplayer servers are a ghost-town inside of 2 months. I can't tell you how often I've tried to get online and end up spending 35 minutes searching for a match and not finding anyone.
  
  Honestly I'd be shocked if more than 2 or 3 Xbox 1 games actually got regular play on the network. And of those most have private networks that they can be played on such as XBConnect and XLink Kai.
  
  --
  Collector's Edition
90. Re:Well... by Belial6 · 2010-02-10 15:54 · Score: 1
  
  That's the one I was thinking of.
91. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-14 18:22 · Score: 0
  
  And yet Battle.net, a free service from Blizzard is still running after 10+ years...
Date by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 07:46 · Score: 0

Are you sure they did't mean April 1st?
Punish Them by Concern · 2010-02-05 07:48 · Score: 5, Informative

If you want to know what the cost is for buying games from companies that control their platform this tightly, now you get to see it.
If it bothers you, you have one option. Cancel your xbox live subs. Ebay your xbox. Buy your games on a different platform.
They didn't even set out to screw you over and make the games you (thought you) paid for (largely) worthless. You just gave them so much power that they practically did it by accident.
The answer is the PC games model we already had, where the platform is open and the infrastructure isn't something you are forced to buy from a single seller you are locked to for life (xbox live).
Yeah, I know - what is one slashdot post going to do to stop the console juggernaut? Answer: nothing. But don't say I didn't warn you. Give a thought at least to patronizing developers who make and sell their games the old-fashioned way. Especially the ones who support open standards and open platforms like opengl and linux - there are a few.

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1. Re:Punish Them by Jorl17 · 2010-02-05 07:50 · Score: 0
  
  Exactly! The old model was great. We need to make these companies be punished and we must raise awareness! We must aware people about the danger of letting our lives get into other company's hands! What if this continues like this in the future? What if they'll be able to track our every move? What if they RULE THE WORLD? A bit too cataclysmic, but we really need to put them in their place.
  
  --
  Have you heard about SoylentNews?
2. Re:Punish Them by santax · 2010-02-05 07:53 · Score: 1
  
  There are more options. A mod-chip and xboxconnect will do just fine. What's the use of buying games when you can't be certain you can play the (full) game a year from now? I have other things I could use that hard earned cash for. I never had Fender call me to say that I could only use the G-string from that point on.
3. Re:Punish Them by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 07:55 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  I, for one, will gladly accept those consequences since for me they are more than outweighed by the benefits of having things as easy as possible while the game is supported. No drivers, no installation woes, no licensing issues - it all just works out of the box. If that means that after a couple of years the product is no longer supported, so be it. Disposable income I have, but free time to do things I enjoy I don't have enough of.
4. Re:Punish Them by grapeape · 2010-02-05 07:56 · Score: 1
  
  Well your options are kind of limited, Sony threw out backwards compatabilty completely with the slim, none of the current models of PS3 sold have backwards compatability or even the "other OS" option.
  Nintendo dropped online support for the few gamecube games that supported online back in 07.
  That leaves...PC gaming I guess? Well unless you have certain EA titles or Capcom tiles or certain MMO's, etc.
5. Re:Punish Them by sopssa · 2010-02-05 07:57 · Score: 1
  
  Exactly! The old model was great. We need to make these companies be punished and we must raise awareness! We must aware people about the danger of letting our lives get into other company's hands! What if this continues like this in the future? What if they'll be able to track our every move? What if they RULE THE WORLD? A bit too cataclysmic, but we really need to put them in their place.
  Or you know, you just stop buying their games.
6. Re:Punish Them by Jorl17 · 2010-02-05 07:59 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, I'm sure one man can make the difference....
  We need to spread the word so that *other* people so buying their games, as well as ourselves.
  
  --
  Have you heard about SoylentNews?
7. Re:Punish Them by qoncept · 2010-02-05 08:00 · Score: 1
  
  If it bothers you, your best option is to get the most out of your games in the first EIGHT years.
  
  --
  Whale
8. Re:Punish Them by Red+Flayer · 2010-02-05 08:00 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  I never had Fender call me to say that I could only use the G-string from that point on.
  That line had me all sorts of confused until I realized that Fender is a guitar company, not a supplier of stripper apparel.
  
  --
  "Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
9. Re:Punish Them by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:01 · Score: 0
  
  I've never had Fender call to tell me that, but the strip club has.
10. Re:Punish Them by santax · 2010-02-05 08:03 · Score: 2, Funny
  
  Hmmz, maybe I should have taken a different example ;)
11. Re:Punish Them by Blakey+Rat · 2010-02-05 08:06 · Score: 1
  
  Devil's Advocate:
  Let's assuming Microsoft's reason for doing this (friends list limited to 100 friends) is correct. Let's say that instead of cutting off Xbox games, they instead offered this ballot to all Xbox Live members:
  Choose one:
  1) Raise friend list limit to 1,000 friends
  2) Continue playing original Xbox games online
  Which do you think the game-playing audience would have chosen?
  This seems to me to be a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" kind of decision. There's nothing you can do to make every happy all the time. However, I'd guess that most Xbox gamers would choose option 1.
  
  --
  Comment of the year
12. Re:Punish Them by d34dluk3 · 2010-02-05 08:11 · Score: 1
  
  This. We're supposed to believe in this hypothetical gamer who is serious enough to play online, but not enough to buy a new console. Buy Halo 3 already.
13. Re:Punish Them by ravyne · 2010-02-05 08:11 · Score: 1
  
  Oh please. Its not like PC games are never shut down -- granted some of them have dedicated servers that individuals run for as long as they like, but how many MMOs have been shut down? You know, those MMOs that cost 50 bucks to start + 10-15 bucks (just for that one game) every month up until it was cancelled? Not all PC games are impervious to this sort of thing.
  
  That said, I believe that any original XBox game that works on the 360 hardware ought to be supported for as long as the 360 games are. But, it's also not some huge loss either -- its not as if gobs of people are still playing even Halo 2, which was by far the most popular online game for the original XBox -- when my 360 red-ringed, I tried to hop on some halo 2 to get my fix. The number of online players was in the very-low 4 digits, maybe 1200 or so. It took me 20 minutes to get into a 6-man game, and everyone in it, aside from myself, were either glitching or using hacks. It really is sad, because there were some really great multiplayer maps in Halo 2 that weren't made over for 3.
  
  Also, from what I recall, one of the reasons that your friends list is limited to 100 or so is because all the original xbox games hard-coded this number -- so they either limit the query to 100 results, cutting off your would-be friends, or they try to read all that data and likely crash. On the 360, I don't believe devs were allowed to assume this number and had to query for it. Its very likely that cutting off the old games will allow the live platform to move beyond some of the early mistakes like this.
14. Re:Punish Them by sopssa · 2010-02-05 08:13 · Score: 1
  
  Spread what word? You mean like "No, you cannot buy this fun Modern Warfare 2 game because its multiplayer could stop working in the future! No, no matter how much you would like it now and say its fun and exciting and rocking! No! Nooooo!"
15. Re:Punish Them by Jorl17 · 2010-02-05 08:19 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  No, I mean: "You shouldn't buy this game or this service, because it does not give you control of it. You are dependent on the decisions made by the company who made the game/service. Is it fun or useful? Yes it is! However, you'll be funding them so that they can control more and in tougher ways. It's your choice. After all, I don't use their products, YOU do."
  
  Notice that I am not a "fascist pig" stating that they CANNOT.
  
  --
  Have you heard about SoylentNews?
16. Re:Punish Them by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:24 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Or the non-hypothetical gamer who owns Halo 3 and an Xbox 360, but also enjoys playing Xbox 1 games online from time to time.
17. Re:Punish Them by Monkeedude1212 · 2010-02-05 08:35 · Score: 1
  
  The answer is the PC games model we already had, where the platform is open
  If only that were the case with -ALL- PC Games. Sadly, it is not. If Blizzard were to drop off the grid, not only would WoW become unplayable (obviously) but also their other titles, such as Starcraft and Diablo 2. And it happens to everyone. Sierra got bought out and now half their game hosting servers are shut down. A handful of games from the 90's no longer have any server support. Some Ubisoft titles come to mind as well.
  It's easy to bash a console - especially one operated by Microsoft, but you aren't really looking at the big picture. The thing was launched in 2002, so thats 7 to 8 years of solid support. Thats automatic matchmaking, ranking systems, communications with friends, shopping, etc etc. The only system to have even come close to that is Steam, which in of itself is no more open than XboxLive. If Valve decided to shutdown their steam servers, you are just as tied into their locked in model as Microsofts.
  So yes - if you want to escape from this model, you need to find open standards and open platforms, (though I don't think Linux and opengl particularily effect a games lifelength). Its about finding games that aren't dependant on the publisher's/developer's servers, which is tough now-a-days. And you probably don't know if there is the option to host a server dedicated or not until you buy and play the game, so you're pretty much screwed either way.
18. Re:Punish Them by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:36 · Score: 0
  
  Thank you for telling me about xboxconnect. The last time I looked into this type of system, the only thing available was xlink kai (which I couldn't get to work for whatever reason).
19. Re:Punish Them by Xeno+man · 2010-02-05 08:43 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Why does potential enjoyment of a product have to start decreasing from the release date? I certainly wasn't in line the day XBoX was released for sale. I'm sure there are a lot of poorer kids that waited a few years for prices to come down and to save up enough to buy the system, and those that waited for something to appear in the used game bin before they bought that. I'm sure there are plenty of games people haven't had even a year and now they are loosing support? How is that fair?
20. Re:Punish Them by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:44 · Score: 0
  
  Well, how long do you honestly expect them to support it? 20 years? The Xbox was released 8.5 years ago; in terms of consoles that's a long time. As for PC games, sadly those are on the decline; more and more PC games are direct ports of console titles, including the locked-down server systems (MW2, anyone?). I used to be a die-hard PC gamer, but the constant bullshit was just too much for me; I have since switched over to the dark side and have accepted the shortcomings of consoles in favor of their simplicity. While I do miss the mouse and keyboard, I no longer have to deal with video drivers, SecuROM/SafeDisc, general stability problems, etc.
21. Re:Punish Them by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:47 · Score: 0
  
  When is the last time you installed a PC game, 1997? Besides licensing issues, which I admit are real, there are no real issues today for a major game. Now, if DRM will just die a quick death, the PC will be again the best way to enjoy online games.
22. Re:Punish Them by Darinbob · 2010-02-05 09:00 · Score: 1
  
  What is this "Live" stuff anyway? What benefit does it give the user? Similarly for Windows Live which just seems a waste of space to have it installed. Do players really care what someone else's achievements are?
23. Re:Punish Them by BenoitRen · 2010-02-05 09:13 · Score: 1
  
  The answer is the PC games model we already had, where the platform is open and the infrastructure isn't something you are forced to buy from a single seller you are locked to for life (xbox live).
  
  Wrong. The hardware configuration is open, but that's it. The specs of most hardware isn't open. Windows is not open. Most PC games aren't open either.
24. Re:Punish Them by Roberticus · 2010-02-05 09:15 · Score: 1
  
  Or at least chosen a different string.
25. Re:Punish Them by brkello · 2010-02-05 09:16 · Score: 1
  
  Horrible analogy. Fender couldn't do that even if they wanted to. Consoles are a closed platform. It makes PC gamers smile to see this so they can say "I told you so." (I am both, so personally not saying it, just not surprised) It's great that there are other options. But not everyone is technically savvy enough to know how to do it...or even that they exist.
  
  --
  Support a great indie game: http://www.abaddon360.com
26. Re:Punish Them by MogNuts · 2010-02-05 09:17 · Score: 1
  
  Good post. It's nice you posted a solution. I just want to spell it out though, because I don't think fellow /.'ers realize the gravity of this. What happens to PC games using LIVE? When they hit the switch, games like RE5 and Gears of War, that utilize LIVE for saving/accessing games and patches, won't even be able to save or access your old saved game! And what happens with the 360? People still play Oblivion. What happens if you need a patch from XBL (which is absolutely necessary)? You're screwed. So basically the precedent has been set. Once a new XBox is out, it's 5 years until all the games you bought for your 360 and/or PC are *worthless*.
  I can't believe no one realized this when they read the article. I saw it and thought this is the biggest (and SCARIEST) thing to happen to the video game industry since Pong!
27. Re:Punish Them by sopssa · 2010-02-05 09:29 · Score: 1
  
  Windows Live is completely different thing than Live on xbox and 360. It does all the multiplayer aspect of games, provides matchmaking, demo downloads, updates and so on..
28. Re:Punish Them by MogNuts · 2010-02-05 09:30 · Score: 1
  
  I disagree. A couple months ago I busted out Final Fantasy IX for the Playstation 1. When I first bought it, I just didn't have the time. Now I do, and got around to it. Fired it up, had a blast. It's an incredible game. But it was released 10 years ago. So I'm not allowed to play it?
29. Re:Punish Them by RyuuzakiTetsuya · 2010-02-05 10:09 · Score: 1
  
  The answer is the PC games model we already had, where the platform is open and the infrastructure isn't something you are forced to buy from a single seller you are locked to for life (xbox live).
  The problem is, the games on PC *suck*.
  Online support shouldn't be provisional, but it's de-facto provisional. Armored Core 4: For Answer still has online servers running but... No one's playing. They might as well shut the servers down. For many games that has online support, LAN still works, and LAN VPN is always an option.
  
  --
  Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
30. Re:Punish Them by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 10:09 · Score: 0
  
  WoW would still be playable, but not legally, I believe.
31. Re:Punish Them by snowraver1 · 2010-02-05 10:14 · Score: 1
  
  Xbox LIVE! is the online part of the XBOX. Speaking specifically for the xbox 360, it provides content of all sorts. The first thing that you notice when you connect to XBox Live (referred to as XBL here on out) will be the advertisements. Generally they are for new and upcoming games, peripherals, and new xbox features, but may also include advertisements for cellular carriers, food chains, or anything else.
  
  Game demos, downloadable content, game updates, console updates, movie streaming and downloads are all handled by XBL. XBL tracks your game progress through achievements, but does not store save game data (at this time, hopefully one day...) XBL has social features such as a friends list and a list of recently played players. Voice chat is handled by XBL rather than through individual games, which allows for seamless cross game chat. XBL's matchmaking has something called Trueskill or Truskill that will assess a gamer's skill and match that gamer with others of a similar skill level. Leaderboards are also hosted by XBL and allow for competetion on offline games.
  
  On the back end, I'm sure that there are detailed statistics on their users including number of games played, amount of time playing, skill level, etc.
  
  As for your other question, I frequently look at other players' achievments, especially my friends'. For some reason, the sound that plays when you unlock an achievement is very addictive, and strangely satisfying. Looking at other players gives you an idea of which achievments are actually attainable (some are way too hard to get).
  
  --
  Copyright 2010. All rights reserved. This comment may not be copied in any way including, but not limited to caching.
32. Re:Punish Them by Pharmboy · 2010-02-05 13:17 · Score: 1
  
  Steam on the PC works pretty much like that, and the servers are owned by individuals. Once you buy, it autoinstalls. No clicks needed. There are still TFC servers out there, over 100, and that game came out over 10 years ago. And with Steam, I can't lose the disk since there is none, and I can play at home, at work, on the laptop, etc. because I can install the software on all those systems, even tho I can only play on one at a time. If you have to have control, it is the least problematic way.
  
  --
  Tequila: It's not just for breakfast anymore!
33. Re:Punish Them by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 13:55 · Score: 0
  
  Your Fender doesn't rely on continued support from it's maker either. Once you buy it, it becomes yours in a completely self sustained way. If you needed to send it into Fender every week to have work done on it so that you may keep using it, and each different model creates additional support costs for Fender, then I'm sure your old guitar would lose support too.
34. Re:Punish Them by santax · 2010-02-05 14:14 · Score: 1
  
  I'm pretty sure Fender will never bring out a product they won't support. That behavior is only a business model in software. And that model is wrong. This isn't about the costs. This is all about selling more live-gold subscriptions and xbox360's.
35. Re:Punish Them by Richard+Steiner · 2010-02-05 15:45 · Score: 1
  
  The problem is, the games on PC *suck*.
  Really? Maybe for you. :-) I think Spring is a wonderful RTS, for example, and UT2004 was/is still a blast.
  Maybe they aren't super cutting edge, but I play games because I like playing them, not because I need to keep climbing up the ladder with each and every title release.
  
  --
  Mainframe/UNIX Bit Twiddler and long time Windows/Linux Hobbyist.
  The Theorem Theorem: If If, Then Then.
36. Re:Punish Them by grumbel · 2010-02-05 20:48 · Score: 1
  
  Well, how long do you honestly expect them to support it? 20 years?
  Till they go bankrupt and after that I expect the server binaries to be released.
  I mean we are speaking about Microsoft here, not some small Indie developer where every penny counts. It shouldn't be to hard for them to just let their server stuff run in a VM on some spare hardware.
  And by the way, 8.5 years was the time when the Xbox was released, but they are selling multiplayer Xbox1 games, via XboxLive on the Xbox360 *right now*. Its not like the service has been completly forgotten and is only used by three people in the whole world.
37. Re:Punish Them by AniVisual · 2010-02-05 21:04 · Score: 1
  
  One man can make the difference. Thy decision makes all the difference to thyself. Why be cynical, when you aren't affected yourself?
38. Re:Punish Them by Jorl17 · 2010-02-06 03:32 · Score: 1
  
  Three words: Because I care. Unlike selfish people, I care that other people can benefit; I care that other people never get to suffer. I am tired of looking at them and seeing how manipulated they can be.
  It's not about me, it's about them. It's their problem, not mine -- and yet I feel like I should help them.
  
  --
  Have you heard about SoylentNews?
battle.net still lives by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 07:49 · Score: 0

I can still play Diablo 2, Warcraft 3, and Warcraft 2 battle.net edition on battle.net for free.
1. Re:battle.net still lives by Nadaka · 2010-02-05 08:35 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  not only that, but you can play those games over a direct IP connection for free without involving battle.net. So when battle.net eventually does shut down or upgrades beyond compatability. You can still play those games with your friends. However this will not be true for starcraft 2.
Planned Obsolesence by Adrian+Lopez · 2010-02-05 07:49 · Score: 1

I'll be sure to keep this in mind before purchasing any games through Xbox Live Marketplace.

--
"In prison you just have to shut your eyes and take it. Here you have to shut your eyes and give it."
1. Re:Planned Obsolesence by AndrewNeo · 2010-02-05 08:12 · Score: 1
  
  Since when do you have to connect to Live to play your games offline?
2. Re:Planned Obsolesence by Adrian+Lopez · 2010-02-05 08:23 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Since when do you have to connect to Live to play your games offline?
  Ever since Microsoft decided Xbox Live Marketplace content should only work offline when played on the particular console to which it was originally downloaded?
  
  --
  "In prison you just have to shut your eyes and take it. Here you have to shut your eyes and give it."
3. Re:Planned Obsolesence by assassinator42 · 2010-02-05 08:43 · Score: 1
  
  Which wouldn't be so bad if it weren't for almost all of them failing within a few years. And instead of sending back a new model that doesn't fail as much, they send back a repaired model with the same flawed design. (At least that's what happened to my friend with a first generation Elite. I got a Falcon back for my Falcon as well.)
4. Re:Planned Obsolesence by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 18:30 · Score: 0
  
  you do realize you can reauthorize your downloaded software on a new Xbox? You can set your Xbox to redownload your software from Xbox.com and then use it on your new console like you purchased it there. The uproar over the issue you mention forced MS to do this, but all the same, your concern is no longer valid.
  Yes, I'm drunk, but you can, from Xbox.com, reauthorize previously downloaded software to a new box. I believe it's only once a year, though. Which is gay.
Life expectancy by chilvence · 2010-02-05 07:50 · Score: 5, Insightful

From the article, Halo 2 has a 5 year run on the internet. Wow, thats a LONG time!
Doom is still being played online.. that's about 17 years and still going?
So from this we can see, if you happen to be attached to a particular game, then in future you get to be dispersed by the company for loitering.
How many people here play chess?
1. Re:Life expectancy by atrus · 2010-02-05 08:04 · Score: 1
  
  I recently upgraded to Chess 2010. How about you?
2. Re:Life expectancy by sopssa · 2010-02-05 08:07 · Score: 1
  
  I loved the original Day of Defeat mod, I had many great moments with it and fun favorite servers. Then at some point the patches balanced things I didn't like and new features that I didn't like were added. Then came DoD:Source and players moved. Does it really bother me that much? No, I just moved to new games. I had my fun times already.
  I loved my old girlfriend, I had many great moments with her and good favorite restaurants. Then at some point things changed and new features that I didn't like were added. Then came new persons and we moved on. Does it really bother me that much? No, I just moved to new girls. I had my fun times already.
  I loved the pizza I ate on Wednesday, I had many delicious moments with it and great tastes. Then at some point the pizza was eaten and new features (stomach being damn full) that I didn't like were added. Then came even better pizza and it replaced the old one. Does it really bother me that much? No, I just moved to new tastes. I had my fun times already.
3. Re:Life expectancy by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:13 · Score: 0
  
  Subspace still peaks near 1000 players. It's been going 13 years, and was long ago completely abandoned by the company that created it.
4. Re:Life expectancy by Chris+Mattern · 2010-02-05 08:13 · Score: 2
  
  I still haven't gotten the hang of the Laser Rooks and Transforming Bishops yet.
5. Re:Life expectancy by windex82 · 2010-02-05 08:26 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Damn, I was all set to prove you wrong. It seemed like Doom came out well before 93....
  From wiki:
  
  In gaming:
  * Doom (series), a series of first-person shooter video games developed by id Software
  o Doom (video game), the first installment, released in 1993
6. Re:Life expectancy by FoolishOwl · 2010-02-05 08:40 · Score: 1
  
  I'm sick of the dumbasses still playing Chess 2009. When will they upgrade their crappy hardware? HDTV has been available for years now. There's no excuse for playing old games on SDTV.
7. Re:Life expectancy by Nimey · 2010-02-05 08:45 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Mid-December '93, to be precise, and ISTR that the full version started shipping in Jan '94.
  
  --
  Hail Eris, full of mischief...
  
  E pluribus sanguinem
8. Re:Life expectancy by VGPowerlord · 2010-02-05 09:09 · Score: 0, Flamebait
  
  Doom is still being played online.. that's about 17 years and still going?
  No, because Doom couldn't be played online when it first came out. By modem yes, on a IPX/SPX LAN yes, on the Internet no.
  Actually, I'm not really sure how you'd play it online now, seeing as how it doesn't use a client/server protocol.
  
  --
  GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
9. Re:Life expectancy by pisces22 · 2010-02-05 09:35 · Score: 1
  
  How many people here play chess?
  Is that you, Joshua?
10. Re:Life expectancy by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 09:39 · Score: 1, Insightful
  
  Spending more money at each step of the way, just like a good little consumer!
  There's no reason that I shouldn't be able to play a game that I paid for into infinity. I had a lot of fun on my bicycle last night. I'm going to ride it again tomorrow, regardless of whether Continental decides to stop making tires for it.
11. Re:Life expectancy by DaFallus · 2010-02-05 09:39 · Score: 1
  
  I'm not trying to disagree with you, but usually any Xbox game that has a LAN multiplayer option can be fooled using XBconnect or some other tunneling software. This is how we were able to play the original Halo online before Halo 2 was released. So, perhaps not all hope is completely lost.
  
  --
  No one cares what your captcha was
  
  Houston TX, USA
12. Re:Life expectancy by snuf23 · 2010-02-05 10:21 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  You could play Doom over the Internet by 1995 via Kali which allows IPX network games to work over TCP/IP. Apparently there were earlier precursors to Kali that also enabled Doom over the Internet. Nowadays you would probably just use a port like ZDoom which has Internet play built in.
  
  --
  Sometimes my arms bend back.
13. Re:Life expectancy by Whatsmynickname · 2010-02-05 10:38 · Score: 1
  
  It is not the issue of if a game has reached some "end of a run" or not. The issue is if someone else comes along and says "this network game is over for you".
14. Re:Life expectancy by MRe_nl · 2010-02-05 10:48 · Score: 1
  
  Would you like to play a game?
  
  --
  "Kill 'em all and let Root sort 'em out"
15. Re:Life expectancy by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 11:00 · Score: 0
  
  Hello Professor, Would you like to play a game?
16. Re:Life expectancy by floatednerd · 2010-02-05 11:09 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  I usually play Doom online via ZDaemon.
17. Re:Life expectancy by chilvence · 2010-02-05 13:17 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  You are just being unreasonably pedantic. What I was illustrating was the difference between something decentralised and largely independant, and another thing that is completely in thrall of a large corporate entity and its whims.
  And to answer your second point, google odamex, skulltag, zdaemon - all client server upgrades to the venerable Doom. I'm sure there are more since it is open source, but those are the ones I know. I grant you these open source upgrades were not available in 1993, but the internet didn't even exist in most peoples heads back then either, and in fact their very existance proves how allowing independant modification can preserve something indefinitely.
18. Re:Life expectancy by Bungie · 2010-02-05 13:42 · Score: 1
  
  DooM Legacy is a build of the Doom engine for Windows which adds updated features like TCP/IP network play.
  
  --
  The clash of honour calls, to stand when others fall.
Is anyone surprised? by randomencounter · 2010-02-05 07:52 · Score: 1

No service lasts forever, and this is why buying a product with a required on-line component is a bad idea.
How many times do people need to be taught this lesson before it sticks?

--
Forget diamonds, copyright is forever.
1. Re:Is anyone surprised? by Jorl17 · 2010-02-05 07:53 · Score: 1
  
  http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1539026&cid=31038362
  http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1539026&cid=31038302
  Boy, do we think alike. We need to change their mentality. The problem is that they don't want it to be changed. Thus, trying to change it is considered, by modern society, to be....fascism.
  
  --
  Have you heard about SoylentNews?
2. Re:Is anyone surprised? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 07:57 · Score: 0
  
  Yeah.. prostitution may be the world's oldest profession, but that doesn't mean you didn't have to upgrade to the new brothel once in awhile.
3. Re:Is anyone surprised? by zach_the_lizard · 2010-02-05 08:41 · Score: 1
  
  What? I still go to the original brothel and see the original prostitutes. Sure, they may not be as lively (or even alive) as before, but I refuse to upgrade! I have used them since mammoths roamed the earth, and I am one loyal customer.
  
  --
  SSC
4. Re:Is anyone surprised? by apoc.famine · 2010-02-05 18:53 · Score: 1
  
  Once per game, it would seem.
  
  --
  Velociraptor = Distiraptor / Timeraptor
Larger friends lists incoming... by zorkwiz · 2010-02-05 07:53 · Score: 1

It's about time. It's been known for quite some time now that the reason Xbox live friend lists are capped at 100 is due to legacy code from the Xbox 1 live days. This should free us to have more friends at the least. Now we'll just have to go make some..
1. Re:Larger friends lists incoming... by guruevi · 2010-02-05 09:01 · Score: 1
  
  Legacy code from the MSN network somewhere late 90's.
  On another note - I was on the MSN network before that and I have 120+ friends in XBox Live now.
  
  --
  Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
Hahahaha by FunkyELF · 2010-02-05 07:55 · Score: 1

Shutting down for no good reason at all. Its like flickr, or Facebook, or GMail just disappearing.
Don't trust the cloud.
That stuff should never happen. I bet you can still find people playing Duke Nukem 3d on the internet.
I played some Battlefield 1942 a couple months ago. Its nice to feel nostalgic.
Let some non-profit group take it over, or release it to the public so people can run their own servers.
What a bad design. Those who make the games should be able to have their own servers and release Linux servers for anyone who wants to run one on their microwave.
Side note... I remember there were some things you could run on a modded xbox that would make people on the internet appear to be on your own local network so that you could play games online without xbox live.
1. Re:Hahahaha by ubercam · 2010-02-05 09:02 · Score: 1
  
  I believe you're thinking of Xlink Kai. It was tunnelling software with some kind of centralized server that had a friends list and stuff that fooled the Xbox into thinking remotely tunnelled LAN players were local. I remember setting it up, but I don't recall using it to play a game with anybody since I didn't know many people with an Xbox.
2. Re:Hahahaha by ajlisows · 2010-02-05 14:31 · Score: 1
  
  I had an Xbox before they released Live. It was unmodded. I remember downloading some software onto my desktop that allowed you to connect to some server that was hosting multi-player Halo. I only did it once just to see how it worked out so I really don't remember details. I do know it was possible though.
Take it a step further by Opportunist · 2010-02-05 07:56 · Score: 1

Refuse to buy games that hand over the control of whether you may play them to its maker. That affects far more than just XBox Live. There's games that have mandatory online registration that wave the same sword of damocles above your head. They turn off the server, your game DVD becomes little more than a costy coaster. Same applies to games that only allow connections to the game servers of the makers (and I'm not talking MMOs here exclusively). And of course it affects all console gaming platforms IIRC.
If you support the system until they switch off support, you're not hurting them. Do you think they switch it off because they think "Hey, it's Friday, let's piss off our users"? They do it because it already is unprofitable to run the system. So whether you cancel or not doesn't mean jack. They have an expense of X to keep your platform supported, they have income of Y from users running these platforms, X is already bigger than Y, so they cut the cord. Yes, they will lose Y, but they gain X in turn. Does it take a MBA to figure it out that they win by turning it off?
If so, hand me my diploma :)
If you want to change that system, do not accept games and platforms that tie you for good or ill to the maker. Anything else won't send any message at all. That you'll cancel when your system is no longer supported is no message. That's a given.

--
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
1. Re:Take it a step further by Kell+Bengal · 2010-02-05 08:33 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  This is exactly why I refuse to buy games that require online activation. The presumption that I might be online and must connect to their server to install/play my game is anathema to the philosophy of controlling the things that I own. This extends to Steam, as well. I simply refuse to cede any control of the things I own merely so that I can use the latest shiney.
  
  Does it mean I miss out on some of the latest and greatest games? Sure! But there are also a surprising number of games companies that do treat me like a valued customer and do produce software the just installs itself quietly in a single directory and lets you get on with things. I buy their products, sometimes because I just -have- to have the thing they've sold, and sometimes just to check out their latest work and to support a company that makes things I like.
  
  --
  Scientists point out problems, engineers fix them
  altslashdot.org: The future of slashdot.
2. Re:Take it a step further by lgw · 2010-02-05 08:50 · Score: 1
  
  Do you grow your own food, or cede control of that to others? Steam does a better job of being my games librarian than I do. Sure, it may one day shut down my ability to play all these games I paid for, but that's balanced by the fact that I sometimes lose game media (or other storage). So far I've lost or discarded a few games, and Steam hasn't lost any.
  Being such a control freak that you won't use a service you don't control, for fear they might choose not to provide it in the future, means leaving society entirely.
  
  --
  Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
3. Re:Take it a step further by ajlisows · 2010-02-05 14:19 · Score: 1
  
  I guess I am not clear on their motive here. I can't see allowing users to play older games on Live being much of a cost at all. They aren't constantly releasing updates or anything for older games. I'm guessing that there aren't THAT many people playing the older games so it shouldn't be a capacity problem. Perhaps they are counting on selling more new games by cutting off the old ones?
  I'm thinking the only people that it is really a big deal are those who like Halo 1 or Halo 2 and hate Halo 3 and other shooters. Those people are probably few in number but if you take away the reason they have a Live Account, they would probably cancel it.
  Overall, I simply don't understand how this could matter enough to be a money saver for them. Then again, I don't really know what the gaming landscape on Live looks like.
4. Re:Take it a step further by mordenkhai · 2010-02-05 14:24 · Score: 1
  
  I feel that when it comes to Steam you trade for things. Yes I have to online activate but in exchange, I can uninstall and reinstall without worrying about a lost or damaged disk. In addition, I can download and install at my parents house when I'm there for vacation and play without carrying disks at the risk of losing or damaging them(assuming no one is at home playing on my computer). This gives me one very useful feature, as I got tired of losing disk 1 of 5 or having it scratched), and one feature which seems nice but I've only used it once or twice ever.
5. Re:Take it a step further by MogNuts · 2010-02-06 03:27 · Score: 1
  
  Normally I agree with you. Theory, in reality (LOL), never occurs. However, this is one instance where theory trumps reality. I painfully experienced it with RE5 recently. It requires you to be online just to access (read/write) your saved game (via Windows LIVE). Well, I was playing single player, so it shouldn't need an online connection. Well I was out an internet connection multiple times this week, and what do you know, can't even play simple *single* player in a game that should not need an online component.
  I realize you were talking about Steam, but I'm referring to online activation in the general sense.
6. Re:Take it a step further by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-06 09:15 · Score: 0
  
  You're silly, you've surely already ceded control. How many of the games you've purchased have source code available? ;)
  They're bit-rotting as we speak...
7. Re:Take it a step further by Opportunist · 2010-02-06 09:41 · Score: 1
  
  Well, you have to keep the matchmaking code in place, they eat up bandwidth and most of all, people that still play old games now after new versions of the same game came out on the new platform probably refused to upgrade. So when you cut their ability to play, maybe they finally bite the bullet and buy your new crap.
  
  --
  We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
In order to serve you better... by Inf0phreak · 2010-02-05 08:00 · Score: 3, Insightful

... we have decided not to serve you at all.
What do you say? That doesn't make any sense? Look! Shiny! New stuff for you to buy, Mr. Consumer!

--
________
Entranced by anime since late summer 2001 and loving it ^_^
1. Re:In order to serve you better... by rrohbeck · 2010-02-05 08:14 · Score: 1
  
  That makes perfect sense to me.
  "See, you're served much better with open PC-based gaming. Now get rid of your console."
  
  --
  thegodmovie.com - watch it
2. Re:In order to serve you better... by zero_out · 2010-02-05 08:21 · Score: 1
  
  The statement was that it is better for the community, not for an individual member of the community. This could mean a lot of things. It could mean that the servers that were running these older games will get replaced, and their racks used for new games. This might hurt 1,000 players, but benefit 10,000 at the same time. The community as a whole would benefit from this. It could also mean that MS believes these people who continue to play older games will spend more time playing newer games, and thus strengthen a weaker community, much like MMO's sometimes merge servers.
3. Re:In order to serve you better... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 19:50 · Score: 0
  
  acutally, coming from microsoft that sentence is perfectly rational.
4. Re:In order to serve you better... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-06 03:44 · Score: 0
  
  There is actually a good reason to do this. Many features of XBox Live, which is a shared service between the XBox and XBox 360, are held back by legacy support for the XBox. The 100 friend limit is the most well known example of this, but there are others. Removing the legacy support will allow Microsoft to make positive changes to the Live service.
  And lets be clear, not many people use XBox Live for XBox games any more. As a quick estimate, compare the number of players between Halo 2 (by far the most popular XBox Live XBox game) and Halo 3 (not even currently the most popular XBbox 360 game) in the last 24 hours. Halo 2: 4,505 unique players. Halo 3: 629,211 unique players.
  They are choosing to stop servicing less than 1% of the Live subscriber base in order to serve the other 99% better. I'll take that.
Dedicated servers by TyFoN · 2010-02-05 08:02 · Score: 4, Insightful

And this is why you want player controlled dedicated servers for your
favorite FPS or RTS game. A game studio will eventually shut down the central
one because of the lack of $$. Oh and I am still waiting for a game studio to
try the monthly fee route for their central server :p
1. Re:Dedicated servers by jittles · 2010-02-05 08:10 · Score: 1
  
  Oh and I am still waiting for a game studio to try the monthly fee route for their central server :p
  Kind of like.... World of Warcraft?
2. Re:Dedicated servers by TyFoN · 2010-02-05 08:18 · Score: 1
  
  No, for a game that does not require constant development and support from GM's
  and need a big server with several thousand online at the same time, but a game like
  MW2 (even if they went the non-dedi route)..
3. Re:Dedicated servers by Datamonstar · 2010-02-05 08:25 · Score: 1
  
  Try again, friend. I don't pay WoW, so I'm not a rabid fan boy defending it to the the death. Still I realize that a game that has to track, store and host massive amounts of player data is a far cry from a simple login server + lobby with cient-side hosting and would require a considerably larger amount of money. You're trying to compare apples to oranges in order to make some statement against WoW that isn't even an issue.
  
  --
  The eternal struggle of good vs. evil begins within one's self.
4. Re:Dedicated servers by zach_the_lizard · 2010-02-05 08:42 · Score: 1
  
  I have heard that Blizzard may do this for Diablo 3. If that is the case, I will not buy the game.
  
  --
  SSC
5. Re:Dedicated servers by brkello · 2010-02-05 11:23 · Score: 1
  
  Uh, source? I have not heard Blizzard say anything like that...and it doesn't even make sense considering how long they have supported battle.net without charging.
  
  --
  Support a great indie game: http://www.abaddon360.com
PC Gaming is coming back in style by Dan667 · 2010-02-05 08:07 · Score: 2, Interesting

largely as a result of continued incidents like this. People use to say they could just set up a console and use it are now having to deal with real quality issues and vendor lock-in problems are realizing it is not actually such a great deal.
1. Re:PC Gaming is coming back in style by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:21 · Score: 0
  
  I hope so. I tried the Xbox 360 to avoid the PC upgrade issues. The lock-in, constant nickel and dime'ing for DLC that's free on PC, subscription fee to play online (WTF), advertisements, etc have made the decision for me. I'm just not going to replace the Xbox - when it dies, M$ gets no more of my money.
2. Re:PC Gaming is coming back in style by decipher_saint · 2010-02-05 08:34 · Score: 1
  
  ...until Steam goes down or your EA key doesn't validate (etc, etc, etc). This is becoming endemic to electronic gaming as a whole not just console gaming.
  
  --
  crazy dynamite monkey
3. Re:PC Gaming is coming back in style by Dan667 · 2010-02-05 09:20 · Score: 1
  
  someone would just hack the steam client if they turned off the authentication. Not as easy to do on a console as xbox owners are getting ready to find out.
ExBox? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:11 · Score: 0

Fascism is collusion between government and wealth. Before the name fascism was invoked in Italy, Socrates called it oligarchy and convinced the powerful to overthrow a democracy. Recently the supreme court ruled that any corporate propaganda is rightfully the tool of the wealthy, no matter who they represent.
Microsoft doesn't care about your politics, only they're profit. What part of this was hidden when you bought your little ex-box?
Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by rwade · 2010-02-05 08:13 · Score: 1, Interesting

From the announcement, XBox's live director takes hyperbole of one's achievements to a new level:

Seven years ago we laid out our vision for the connected console when we launched Xbox LIVE. We believed then that the power of the Internet to connect people would revolutionize living room entertainment. It started with amazing multiplayer games, and we’ve since seen that bet pay off again and again with the launches of Xbox 360, Marketplace, Netflix and powerful social features like Facebook, Twitter and Last.fm. None of this would have been possible without the success of LIVE as a multiplayer gaming network.

Netflix, Facebook, and Twitter would never have happened without XBox live? Really?
1. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by ashridah · 2010-02-05 08:34 · Score: 1
  
  I'm going to stay within context, and assume he means 'the launch of features to access these services from xbox live, which have been popular for the services themselves', not that he means that the services couldn't have happened without xbox live.
  I know i didn't bother with netflix until it was easy to use via my xbox. facebook and twitter are less useful (my phone works better there, although the xbox makes a decent facebook-photo-browsing tool)
2. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:46 · Score: 0
  
  I think you read that wrong...
  XBox features, including the feature of using Netflix, Facebook, Twitter, and Last.fm would not exist without the success of LIVE as a multiplayer gaming network.
  If LIVE wasn't successful, they never would've added Netflix, Facebook, Twitter, and Last.fm integration.
3. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by RavenofNi · 2010-02-05 08:49 · Score: 1
  
  This is modded interesting? Wow.
  
  The statement when properly read is saying the the Xbox 360, and several of its components such as the Live Marketplace, Netflix streaming content through the Xbox Dashboard, Facebook/Twitter Dashboard apps, and Live.FM streaming audio wouldn't have come to pass.
  
  All of which is perfectly true, had the XBox 1 not done well, it's like that the 360 would have been canned in R&D, and thus these elements of the 360 experience wouldn't have come into existence either.
4. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by rwade · 2010-02-05 08:55 · Score: 1
  
  Seven years ago we laid out our vision for the connected console when we launched Xbox LIVE. We believed then that the power of the Internet to connect people would revolutionize living room entertainment. It started with amazing multiplayer games, and we’ve since seen that bet pay off again and again with the launches of Xbox 360, Marketplace, Netflix...None of this would have been possible without the success of LIVE as a multiplayer gaming network.
  If you read it literally, they're claiming success for Netflix in general and facebook, twitter, and last.fm as features in Xbox 360.
  I'm just saying I'm not as dumb as your comment suggests. This statement does literally claim that Xbox live resulted in launch of Netflix, if you read it literally.
5. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:58 · Score: 0
  
  Netflix, Facebook, and Twitter would never have happened without XBox live? Really?
  It's pretty obvious that what he's referring to is the integration of those things into Live. So obvious, in fact, that you're either an idiot for not seeing that or a liar for pretending that he said something else. No other possibilities exist.
6. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 09:05 · Score: 0
  
  He may be an idiot, but you have nothing better to do than comment on his idocy, so what does that make you?
7. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by DesertFly · 2010-02-05 09:28 · Score: 1
  
  On the XBox maybe?
8. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 09:36 · Score: 0
  
  They're clearly referring to the Netflix, Facebook, and Twitter features on Xbox 360. But whatever, any excuse to bash, right?
9. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 09:46 · Score: 0
  
  He means that those services could never have been brought to a gaming console in the living room without an established online service model.
10. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 09:59 · Score: 0
  
  On the Xbox? No, probably not.
  It's in the context of the statement that implies that no, netflix on the 360 probably wouldn't have been reasonably possible without Xbox live blazing a trail.
  And they're probably right. It probably wouldn't have been worth it to netflix to create their own xbox application to use an internet connection if Xbox live hadn't happened first.
11. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 10:10 · Score: 0
  
  No, what is being said is that the 360, Marketplace, Netflix, Facebook, Twitter, and Last.fm on the XBox would never have happend without LIVE paving the way. The success of the various services over LIVE would not have been possible without the LIVE platform.
12. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by guspasho · 2010-02-05 10:15 · Score: 1
  
  He means that without the multiplayer network Microsoft would not have been able to leech money off of these products.
13. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 10:20 · Score: 0
  
  Which could just have easily been implemented on the Xbox 360, LIVE or no. Hell, just add a browser with flash and there you go.
14. Re:Xbox Live is cornerstone of Social Networking? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 10:21 · Score: 0
  
  You misunderstood - he is attributing the success of the XBox 360 Live environment and features such as netflix, etc... to the foundation and learning experience they had with Xbox 180 Live.
Translation by Gudeldar · 2010-02-05 08:16 · Score: 4, Informative

Quit playing your Xbox and buy a Xbox 360 already dammit.

- Love Steve Ballmer
1. Re:Translation by ajlisows · 2010-02-05 14:36 · Score: 1
  
  I call bullshit on your post.....
  Everybody knows that there are no original Xbox consoles that has evaded the "Red Rings" for this long. ;)
Better PR by MobyDisk · 2010-02-05 08:17 · Score: 1

I think they would be better off if they were honest, instead of hiding behind public-relations speak. How about:
"We are shutting down XBOX live for old games because the economy sucks, and we either provide service for old games, or service for new games. We can't afford infinite amounts of computer power. It would be awesome to provide service for older games forever, sorry. We hope we have provided service for long enough to warrant continued purchase of future XBOX titles. Have a nice day."
1. Re:Better PR by StuartHankins · 2010-02-05 08:55 · Score: 1
  
  Mod parent up. A brief moment of truth would be refreshing. I think most people would understand and sympathize.
2. Re:Better PR by rwade · 2010-02-05 09:13 · Score: 1
  
  How about: We can't afford infinite amounts of computer power.
  Well, that would not be true. Microsoft can afford to pay for the original Xbox live to continue working, they're just choosing not to prod people to buy Xbox 360s.
  After all, I find it hard to believe that the cost of keeping the services for the original Xbox live games is a material item in the Xbox division's balance sheet. Do you? Do you really?
3. Re:Better PR by MogNuts · 2010-02-05 09:24 · Score: 1
  
  Your argument is sound. However, there is a problem nowadays, but my earlier post sums it up perfectly, so I'll place it here:
  "I just want to spell it out though, because I don't think fellow /.'ers realize the gravity of this. What happens to PC games using LIVE? When they hit the switch, games like RE5 and Gears of War, that utilize LIVE for saving/accessing games and patches, won't even be able to save or access your old saved game! And what happens with the 360? People still play Oblivion. What happens if you need a patch from XBL (which is absolutely necessary)? You're screwed. So basically the precedent has been set. Once a new XBox is out, it's 5 years until all the games you bought for your 360 and/or PC are *worthless*.
  I can't believe no one realized this when they read the article. I saw it and thought this is the biggest (and SCARIEST) thing to happen to the video game industry since Pong!"
4. Re:Better PR by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 10:22 · Score: 0
  
  Only Microsoft can more than afford to continue supporting Xbox Live on legacy titles, and remain profitable even. Or at least release some server tools so that people can host their own games.
Replayability and licensing by zero_out · 2010-02-05 08:17 · Score: 4, Interesting

As an avid gamer, I hate the way modern games are moving away from the old model of pay once, play forever, and moving toward licensing. It may not be called licensing by the producers, but that's exactly what it is. How many of us still enjoy a nostalgic game of Donkey Kong, or Super Mario Bros.? I'm sure there is still a group of gamers out there who enjoy a multiplayer game of Quake or Command and Conquer.
Ten years from now, a few friends would like to play a game of Halo 2, but they won't be able to. Just last year, I sank a good 30 hours into the original Sid Mier's(sp?) Colonization, like I have been doing since 1996. I don't know the details about Xbox Live, or Halo 2, but if the game requires a centralized Live server for multiplayer functionality, then it simply won't work. In effect, you are only licensing a portion of the game for a certain period of time. Sure, you can code your own server from scratch, like the Star Wars Galaxies fans have done, but that still eliminates 90% of the fans who will one day want to replay the game that they loved.
1. Re:Replayability and licensing by windex82 · 2010-02-05 08:31 · Score: 1
  
  If you remember, way back games like donkey kong and pac man were pay to play at a nickle, dime, or quarter per play. When they moved to consoles they turned to buy once play forever. Now they are just reverting back to the old original model. ;)
2. Re:Replayability and licensing by zero_out · 2010-02-05 09:54 · Score: 1
  
  You're right, but at least today you can buy a DK game, cabinet and all, and play exactly the same game as you could 30+ years ago. You can't do that with games that require access to a server that is owned and controlled by a company who chooses to shut them down.
3. Re:Replayability and licensing by jonesy16 · 2010-02-05 10:00 · Score: 1
  
  There are plenty of DOS games that I enjoyed playing, good luck getting them to run now. Got a dos driver for your embedded RealTek audio card? How about a dos driver for your wireless mouse? Fretting about not being able to play a 15-year-old game just seems silly to me. That's what technology does to things, we constantly move forward and at some point it doesn't make sense to carry along support for old things. I have a library of Beta tapes, where can i buy a new Beta player? Hell, I can't remember the last time i saw a new movie on VHS at the store. OS X 10.6 doesn't run on PPC macs, Windows 7 doesn't support some XP programs, etc. It's convenient to blame the manufacturer and claim they're purposefully screwing the consumers but at some point you have to let go. What about all of those Windows XP users that want to play the latest DirectX 11 games ... too bad.
  My point is, as a consumer you have to ready yourself for the 6 year life that most software carries nowadays. And if that frustrates you then you best find another source of entertainment.
4. Re:Replayability and licensing by BigDogCH · 2010-02-05 10:23 · Score: 1
  
  I agree, except one can still go to Walmart and buy Ps2 and xbox games that advertise online support right on the package. I try to buy PS2 games with LAN support, but it is hard to tell which ones actually support LAN without the online server.
  
  It should be more like 10-15 years, but your 6 year lifespan is probably correct for many games.
  
  My little brothers favorite game is Sam-n-Max Hit the road. The game is now 15+ years old, 4 years older than he is. It ran on a 386. I use DosBox to run it although some versions work okay in Windows if you can switch to 256 colors.
  
  Age of Empires II is my favorite game (something like 12 years old). It plays fine under Windows 7 which means it will survive past the 15-year mark.
  
  On the contrary, my copy of RISK has worked on every coffee table I have owned!
5. Re:Replayability and licensing by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 10:26 · Score: 1, Interesting
  
  DOSbox is pretty cool.
  Games aren't just technology, they are art. Technology becomes obsolete, art does not.
6. Re:Replayability and licensing by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 10:39 · Score: 0
  
  two words: DOSBox, Bitch.
7. Re:Replayability and licensing by jonesy16 · 2010-02-05 10:44 · Score: 1
  
  That's a very good point, they should pull those games from the market if they're going to go forward with this. They have an obligation to inform people that these games may not work as advertised.
8. Re:Replayability and licensing by zero_out · 2010-02-05 10:54 · Score: 1
  
  There are plenty of DOS games that I enjoyed playing, good luck getting them to run now.
  Try DOSBox. It emulates DOS just fine for gaming.
9. Re:Replayability and licensing by jonesy16 · 2010-02-05 10:57 · Score: 1
  
  Thanks for the link!
10. Re:Replayability and licensing by brkello · 2010-02-05 11:27 · Score: 1
  
  Having a network connection is new territory for consoles. Traditionally multiplayer meant you would gather a few mates and play together at your house. That really still is the same in this sense...you can still go back and play the games you enjoyed. The multiplayer component will be missing, and if that is what you wanted, then it really sucks.
  
  I wouldn't be surprised if the community of gamers don't figure out a way around this and make their own private servers. I would hope MS would be smart enough not to shut this down.
  
  --
  Support a great indie game: http://www.abaddon360.com
11. Re:Replayability and licensing by Hatta · 2010-02-05 11:51 · Score: 1
  
  My little brothers favorite game is Sam-n-Max Hit the road. The game is now 15+ years old, 4 years older than he is. It ran on a 386. I use DosBox to run it although some versions work okay in Windows if you can switch to 256 colors.
  You should really be running it on ScummVM. There's a port for just about every platform you could possibly want.
  
  --
  Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
12. Re:Replayability and licensing by CronoCloud · 2010-02-05 13:40 · Score: 1
  
  Most PS2 games with online play still have the servers up, except for the yearly updated sports games.
13. Re:Replayability and licensing by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 14:01 · Score: 0
  
  "There are plenty of DOS games that I enjoyed playing, good luck getting them to run now."
  It's much easier today than back in the day. Editing dosbox.conf to make dosbox emulate the game's preferred hardware is much easier than physically moving ISA cards to different slots, toggling jumpers, restarting DOS with different configurations in order to make the game run.
14. Re:Replayability and licensing by grumbel · 2010-02-05 21:11 · Score: 1
  
  Nothing stops you from just using old hardware, there are tons of old PCs still floating around, so it shouldn't be to hard to find one. If you want to use your modern hardware, use DOSBox. Sure, getting the proper original game play experience back can be a little troublesome at times, but there is a big difference between something requiring a little bit of work and something being flat out impossible thanks to DRM or centralized servers.
  The biggest practical issue I had with getting 15 year old PC stuff to run was that many games of that time no longer used DOS, but Windows with its early incarnations of DirectX, which meant that they won't run in DOSbox and neither on a modern Windows. Getting Windows98 along with the drivers installed was a little troublesome, but still doable, getting the drivers was actually the biggest problem, as many vendors (especially Creative) just don't offer them anymore, so you better have a backup.
  
  Fretting about not being able to play a 15-year-old game just seems silly to me.
  We aren't taking about 15 year old games, we are talking about 5 year old games, some of which you might have bought yesterday as Xbox Classic on your Xbox360.
Not again! by tgd · 2010-02-05 08:17 · Score: 1

Its like when GEnie shut down the Air Warrior servers!
(did I just date myself?)
Seriously, though. Halo2 is fun, but its 2010. Play Halo3. All of the rest of us know its identical to Halo2 only with better graphics. You'll barely even notice the change if you're on an equally old TV.
And it sure sounded to me like they aren't happy they're making the move and, unlike most companies that do it, are planning on interacting with the affected people *somehow*.
I know people on Slashdot hate Microsoft for just about everything, but once you pull your head out of that hole, I don't see how this is worth grabbing the pitchforks for. If you aren't one of the people impacted, why do you care so much, and if you are *they said they're going to work with you about it*. So why are you bent out of shape *before they have*?
1. Re:Not again! by Undead+Waffle · 2010-02-05 09:14 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Its like when GEnie shut down the Air Warrior servers!
  (did I just date myself?)
  Seriously, though. Halo2 is fun, but its 2010. Play Halo3. All of the rest of us know its identical to Halo2 only with better graphics. You'll barely even notice the change if you're on an equally old TV.
  And it sure sounded to me like they aren't happy they're making the move and, unlike most companies that do it, are planning on interacting with the affected people *somehow*.
  I know people on Slashdot hate Microsoft for just about everything, but once you pull your head out of that hole, I don't see how this is worth grabbing the pitchforks for. If you aren't one of the people impacted, why do you care so much, and if you are *they said they're going to work with you about it*. So why are you bent out of shape *before they have*?
  So you're saying Halo 3 is exactly like Halo 2, but because Halo 2 was released so long ago they should just buy a new console and Halo 3 to continue playing the same game?
  And then you're saying people need to pull their head out of the hole and get over their hatred for Microsoft?
  ...
XLink Kai by Aphex+Junkie · 2010-02-05 08:17 · Score: 2, Informative

Get XLink Kai, problem solved!
Supports original Xbox, Xbox 360, PS2, PS3, PSP, and Gamecube.

It's free to use, and the source code is freely available:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XLink_Kai
1. Re:XLink Kai by CSMatt · 2010-02-05 17:15 · Score: 1
  
  Fine. except that the Xbox 360's system link drops connections with ping times longer than 33 ms (Warning, uncited Wikipedia reference). Sure, you can just get an old Xbox secondhand for actual Xbox games, but this doesn't help for anyone who downloaded them from the Xbox Live Marketplace.
  If Microsoft is interested in mitigating the damage caused by terminating the service for Xbox games and consoles, the least they could do is lift this restriction on system link connections, at the very least for these soon-to-be-unsupported titles.
  PS: the downloads page does not seem to have the source code for the engine, only the UI. Where is the source code for the rest of the software?
What did you expect? by macintard · 2010-02-05 08:18 · Score: 0

For them to support the original console for another decade? The console was released in '01!
1. Re:What did you expect? by VGPowerlord · 2010-02-05 09:15 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  For them to support the original console for another decade? The console was released in '01!
  And more importantly, its replacement was released in '05!
  
  --
  GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
2. Re:What did you expect? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 11:49 · Score: 0
  
  too bad none of the backwards compatibility worked on any of the 20ish games I own.
HA HA HA Serves you suckers right! by DarthVain · 2010-02-05 08:19 · Score: 3, Interesting

Just another reason to buy a computer.
I will admit I too had an Xbox. I long ago let the subscription expire. At one point I had to make the decision: Buy a new console (likely the 360) or spend more and get a new computer. I am 100% glad I sent it on a new computer.
It was just last week that Sony announced that "hey guess what? Even though you bought the PS3 thinking online networking would be free, well not anymore suckas!".
Now MS is saying they are shutting down service for old hardware, making many games pretty useless (as they were sold as online games with limited single player options).
That's the problem with consoles, they (MS and Sony, and Nintendo) own everything. They can do whatever they please. Don't like it? Too bad. Your option is to buy the other guys console, who is going to screw you just as much.
So buy or upgrade your computer where you can actually own your own stuff, and join in the big boy games.
Also there are less 12 year old shouting profanities at you (notice I only said less, you can only do so much!) and generally being asshats.
1. Re:HA HA HA Serves you suckers right! by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:27 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  Also there are less 12 year old shouting profanities at you (notice I only said less, you can only do so much!) and generally being asshats.
  'fewer'
2. Re:HA HA HA Serves you suckers right! by xthor · 2010-02-05 08:51 · Score: 1
  
  Also there are less 12 year old shouting profanities at you (notice I only said less, you can only do so much!) and generally being asshats.
  I agreed with you, right up until that last comment.
3. Re:HA HA HA Serves you suckers right! by MSG · 2010-02-05 08:54 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  It was just last week that Sony announced that "hey guess what? Even though you bought the PS3 thinking online networking would be free, well not anymore suckas!".
  I must have missed that. Sony is still advertising the Playstation Network as "100% Free". Where did they announce the change last week?
4. Re:HA HA HA Serves you suckers right! by barberousse · 2010-02-05 08:57 · Score: 1
  
  Check this story. It's a rumor, for now...
5. Re:HA HA HA Serves you suckers right! by Admiralbumblebee · 2010-02-05 09:06 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  Sony has not announced that PSN will be pay-only.
6. Re:HA HA HA Serves you suckers right! by DarthVain · 2010-02-05 09:17 · Score: 1
  
  http://games.slashdot.org/story/10/02/04/0727249/Sony-May-Charge-For-PlayStation-Network
  As per yesterday.
  They have NOT announced that it WILL be pay-only.
  They DID announce that they are looking into it (and likely they have been for some time, key here is now they are willing to admit it).
  I think in the not so distant future they will be adopting the MS payment model. With a gold and silver accounts. The silver will be free but crippled.
Makes sense to me. by ironicsky · 2010-02-05 08:22 · Score: 3, Insightful

Listen... xBox v1 has been around for almost 10 years. They stopped selling the thing 4 years ago. Look at any Microsoft support life cycle.
Windows 98
- Released June 1998
- Discontinued 2002
- Extended support ended 2006
---Total shelf life - 8 years
Windows ME
- Released December 2000
- Discontinued December 2003
- Extended support ended 2006
---Total shelf life - 6 years
Windows 2000
- Released March 2000
- Discontinued June 2005
- Extended support ends this summer
---Total shelf life - 10 years
Microsoft is right in line with their typical support life cycle for the xBox. Even though its a different product line, Microsoft is still Microsoft. They cannot support an aging product forever (even if by support I mean maintain a server for it)
1. Re:Makes sense to me. by Crystalmonkey · 2010-02-05 08:35 · Score: 1
  
  The point isn't about consistency - If you want to play a computer game like DOOM, that's still a valid option. (Heck, Half Life came out in 1998 and it's STILL a sizable game community because of the mods.) Even when they shut down the WON servers, you could still find ways to play (not including Steam) by patching the game, and some people set up alternative authentication servers.
  
  A lot harder to do for the XBox...
2. Re:Makes sense to me. by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 08:50 · Score: 0
  
  Exactly.
  When I buy a game I understand the risks. I pay 60 bucks and hopefully I get at least 10-20 hours of enjoyable game time out of it.
  That equates to 3-6 dollars per hour for the entertainment.
  Compare that to the Movies. 10 bucks for a ticket to a 2-3 hour movie.
  I have over 150 Hours played in MW2 on the 360, so far that equates to 40 cents an hour.
  Add in the price of the 360, and that is around 3 bucks per hour.
  Toss in all the extra hours I use the 360 for watching movies, playing other games etc, and it is probably back to the 40-60cent per hour range.
3. Re:Makes sense to me. by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 09:13 · Score: 0
  
  You miss the point entirely. The issue is not support, nor how long the xbox exists.
  It is about vendor lock-in, DRM and control.
  This is in no way different than DRM'ed music not working anymore because someone pulls the plug on the servers.
4. Re:Makes sense to me. by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 09:16 · Score: 0
  
  Support requirements for a gaming community do not compare to support cycles of an OS. If MS want to stop hosting Xbox v1 game-servers, then offer an alternative so that I can host myown v1 game-servers. I'd rent a hosted server to play older games with my friends. Hell, the games are only 8-5years old, thats nothing!
5. Re:Makes sense to me. by VGPowerlord · 2010-02-05 09:26 · Score: 1
  
  I suppose I shouldn't mention that I've clocked almost 600 hours in Team Fortress 2. I got TF2 as part of Valve's Source pack, a (now discontinued) (I think) $80 collection of all their Source games prior to Left 4 Dead.
  That's for a set of 11 games: Half-Life 2, Counter-Strike: Source, Half-Life: Source, Day of Defeat: Source, Half-Life 2: Deathmatch, Half-Life 2: Lost Coast, Half-Life Deathmatch: Source, Half-Life 2: Episode One, Portal, Half-Life 2: Episode Two, Team Fortress 2.
  So... 600 hours in a game that cost me something like $6-7. That's approximately $0.01 per hour.
  I could factor in the cost of my computer, but I use my computer for more than just games: Classes, web browsing, watching movies, software development for personal projects, etc...
  
  --
  GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
6. Re:Makes sense to me. by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 09:36 · Score: 0
  
  But with XBox Live they are getting paid to keep the servers running. it's subscription driven it doesn't make sense to kill it, unless there the subscription numbers are so low that it really is a non issue anyway.
7. Re:Makes sense to me. by GreatDrok · 2010-02-05 11:41 · Score: 1
  
  The PS2 came out before the Xbox and is still being made and new games are still being produced albeit in lower numbers. With the 360 came out, the original Xbox disappeared almost over night and games for it stopped immediately too. When the 360 replacement comes out I fully expect the same thing to happen so despite the fact that I have a 360 and enjoy the system (albeit after 2 RROD repairs) I will seriously consider my options when the time comes.
  The PS3 has likely got another 7 years in it at least based on the lifespans of the PS1 and PS2 so even though I don't currently have a PS3 I may buy one in the next year or two knowing that I'll get a good run with it. I wonder how much life today's 360 purchasers can expect given that the original Xbox only had a 5 year run?
  
  --
  "I have the attention span of a strobe lit goldfish, please get to the point quickly!"
8. Re:Makes sense to me. by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 15:35 · Score: 0
  
  Wrong. You can still use win 95 today with all its features as advertised in 1995. You can not with xbox1 multiplayer games. This is a case of defective by design.
9. Re:Makes sense to me. by rastoboy29 · 2010-02-05 19:39 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, it would be a herculean task for them to support people setting up their own master servers. You're right--MS would probably fuck it up.
  
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  expandfairuse.org
10. Re:Makes sense to me. by nikanj · 2010-02-05 23:02 · Score: 1
  
  The xbox came to market in 2001 and is shutting down in 2010. I wonder how you came up with the 5 year run.
11. Re:Makes sense to me. by GreatDrok · 2010-02-06 16:46 · Score: 1
  
  "The xbox came to market in 2001 and is shutting down in 2010. I wonder how you came up with the 5 year run."
  The PS2 came out in 2000 and is still getting new games. The Xbox came out in 2001 and was replaced by the 360 in 2006 at which point new games for the Xbox dried up almost immediately. Looks like 5 years to me. If you can't buy new games for the system it is dead.
  
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  "I have the attention span of a strobe lit goldfish, please get to the point quickly!"
To move forward what choice did they have? by grapeape · 2010-02-05 08:23 · Score: 3, Insightful

People have complained for years about the 100 tag limit on friends list and other seemingly stupid limitations put into place. The reasoning offered by MS then was that in order to maintain compatabilty with original xbox games the limitations in the original live service had to follow over to the 360.
MS has decided after 5 years of the 360 to remove the legacy caps by removing support for a platform that hasnt been sold in 5 years. You cant really have it both ways...
1. Re:To move forward what choice did they have? by tlhIngan · 2010-02-05 09:07 · Score: 1
  
  People have complained for years about the 100 tag limit on friends list and other seemingly stupid limitations put into place. The reasoning offered by MS then was that in order to maintain compatabilty with original xbox games the limitations in the original live service had to follow over to the 360.
  MS has decided after 5 years of the 360 to remove the legacy caps by removing support for a platform that hasnt been sold in 5 years. You cant really have it both ways...
  Not only that, but the main reason we've stuck with it for 5 years is because of ONE game. Halo 2.
  That's practically the only Live game played with a significant audience, and it's been #1 on the original Xbox live games chart for years now.
  Now, will Microsoft actually withdraw Halo 2 support? Unlikely - they'll probably have a patch on the 360 so you can play Halo 2 with the "new" Live, probably by sending out a new Halo 2 binary combined with emulator changes. Probably something difficult to do with the original Xbox...
  http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/59918
2. Re:To move forward what choice did they have? by patlabor · 2010-02-05 10:34 · Score: 1
  
  Sure you can. Microsoft could detect the client and serve compatible content (like only the top 100 friend tags) to the Xbox, and serve full content to the 360. Seems like it would be a fairly simple programming change.
3. Re:To move forward what choice did they have? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 19:50 · Score: 0
  
  I fail to see how they couldn't simply program around that... I mean, all the data's in the cloud right? Wasn't the the whole point of "Live!" such that they could update code online?
  Couldn't they simply separate Xbox Live! and 360 Live! ? I would imagine it's as easy as cloning a few servers and databases, and then pointing the master server to a different IP. Sure, you'd have no communication between 1 and 360s ... but then look what you're getting now?
  There's a lot of different ways to get around this. M$ picked NONE.
There's no reason not to mod it now. by pacbowl · 2010-02-05 08:29 · Score: 1

I haven't played a game on mine in over 5 years, but instead just use xbmc and mce to stream movies from a PC to a non-HD TV.
1. Re:There's no reason not to mod it now. by bmsleight · 2010-02-05 20:26 · Score: 1
  
  And now they maybe a chance to pick up more cheaper boxes fro the rest of the house.
Already a trend by revengebomber · 2010-02-05 08:33 · Score: 4, Insightful

Let's talk about some old games. Take, for one, Halo 2. It's now going to be permanently offline, as a result of it being connected to Microsoft's services. Let's go back though. Take a look at Jedi Knight. Can you play that online anymore? Nope. Microsoft service. Dead. Any of those other MSN/"Zone" games? Dead. At least DirectPlay supported LAN in the same manner as online, so the games all still support that.

But - Quake 2? Still kicking. Released the same year as JK, too, IIRC. Microsoft continues to do this; they entice game developers with easy online/multiplayer libraries and then kill the service to force people to upgrade. I fear for all the Games for Windows games; that's why I'll never buy a title that uses Games for Windows Live. 10 years down the road, all those games will be permanently offline too, as will (likely) all this trash like CoD42 which uses an even smaller and even more restricted network. Meanwhile, I'll still be playing Quake 3 (and hopefully RAGE, now that it's not being published by EA).

DirectPlay. Live. When will developers learn?

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1. Re:Already a trend by Beelzebud · 2010-02-05 10:02 · Score: 1
  
  Rage is being published by Bethesda though, and even Fallout 3 uses GfW. Out of the frying pan and in to the fire. I'm hoping id can maintain their integrity and keep GfW completely off the PC version.
2. Re:Already a trend by Scott+Kevill · 2010-02-05 15:25 · Score: 1
  
  Let's talk about some old games. Take, for one, Halo 2. It's now going to be permanently offline, as a result of it being connected to Microsoft's services. Let's go back though. Take a look at Jedi Knight. Can you play that online anymore? Nope. Microsoft service. Dead. Any of those other MSN/"Zone" games? Dead. At least DirectPlay supported LAN in the same manner as online, so the games all still support that.
  You raise a valid point, though Jedi Knight: Dark Forces II and nearly all of the MSN Zone games can still be played online through GameRanger (see the list). You'd be amazed at how many games of Age of Empires II are being played each day -- it puts many recent games to shame.
  
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  GameRanger - multiplayer gaming service for PC and Mac games
3. Re:Already a trend by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 19:58 · Score: 0
  
  Developers don't need to learn. People buy their games, they get paid.
  You argument is actually contrary to what the developers want: You're playing old games = You're not buying new ones.
Reading it again, you're probably right... by rwade · 2010-02-05 08:43 · Score: 1

...assume he means 'the launch of features to access these services from xbox live, which have been popular for the services themselves', not that he means that the services couldn't have happened without xbox live.
Good point -- that's probably what he's talking about. Given that, I'd be curious to know why anyone would twitter from an Xbox...
I'm trying to think of a scenario and -- like you're playing Madden 10 or something and you pop out of it and say "Shit yeah, TD Eagles." Wouldn't it just be easier to use your cell?
1. Re:Reading it again, you're probably right... by il_diablo · 2010-02-05 08:59 · Score: 1
  
  I'm trying to think of a scenario and -- like you're playing Madden 10 or something and you pop out of it and say "Shit yeah, TD Eagles." Wouldn't it just be easier to use your cell?
  I don't Twitter, so I can't be sure, but it may very well be that games will come with the ability to tweet for you when things happen in them (the TD situation you mentioned, gaining a level in an RPG, even getting an achievement).
  
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  Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.
Limitations of the old live service by jpmorgan · 2010-02-05 08:43 · Score: 1

My understanding is there are certain limitations to the old Live service, specifically the number of friends. By deprecating the old service they can remove those limitations and let people have more than 100 people on their live friends lists.
1. Re:Limitations of the old live service by FrozenFOXX · 2010-02-06 03:16 · Score: 1
  
  Please mod this person up. Bash the move all you like but this is cruft-trimming. Should they open the standards used to communicate so the community could make their own XBox Live Legacy? Yeah, that'd be nice, but as far as "oh ones they're terrible people" I think that's massively overblown. This is a simple case of old infrastructure holding back new features and it's been deprecated ever since they stopped selling the original XBox.
  
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  "Just a fox, a whisper."
Thisis a GREAT thing.. by Lumpy · 2010-02-05 08:44 · Score: 2, Insightful

Because the demand for a "fake" Xboxlive server just became reality.
Someone will hack one together in short order and post the code out there.
I love it when Microsoft creates a need for someone to completely hack a service they were providing and decided to end.

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Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
1. Re:Thisis a GREAT thing.. by Kjella · 2010-02-05 12:00 · Score: 1
  
  Because the demand for a "fake" Xboxlive server just became reality.
  Someone will hack one together in short order and post the code out there.
  I assume the master server used some kind of secure connection, if so good luck faking its security certificate. Only modded boxes will ever think the fake server is real.
  
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  Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
2. Re:Thisis a GREAT thing.. by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 15:30 · Score: 0
  
  Google "XBC" or "XBoxConnect". You're several years behind the curve. It's not "Live" and instead tunnels the System Link over the Internet, but you can certainly play Halo online. As well as many other games.
3. Re:Thisis a GREAT thing.. by Drewcool · 2010-02-05 21:43 · Score: 1
  
  At least for games that support LAN play, there is http://www.teamxlink.co.uk/ .
4. Re:Thisis a GREAT thing.. by Lumpy · 2010-02-08 04:12 · Score: 1
  
  Not the same thing, that does not support games that don't have a "lan gaming" function.
  
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  Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
5. Re:Thisis a GREAT thing.. by bobbomo · 2010-02-08 12:15 · Score: 0
  
  not a full Xbox LIVE server, but works for most games
  www.xbconnect.com/
  http://www.techlore.com/article/14302/XBConnect--A-Free-Alternative-to-XBox-Live/
Ha ha. by Stumbles · 2010-02-05 08:47 · Score: 1, Informative

Microsoft needs you morons to buy new hardware and games... dey nedz da muny.

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My karma is not a Chameleon.
XBOXGW FTW! by Dark_Gravity · 2010-02-05 08:52 · Score: 1

http://xboxgw.com/index.html

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Bring back Sirius Punk!
It's not the end of the world by westlake · 2010-02-05 09:25 · Score: 1

It would make far more sense if they had stopped selling XBox games first.
You may not have XBox Live - but the best in single-player will run the XBox 360. Original Xbox Games Playable on Xbox 360
The missing link by westlake · 2010-02-05 09:28 · Score: 1

Original Xbox Games Playable on Xbox 360
Re:Take it a step further, now back a step by BigDogCH · 2010-02-05 09:55 · Score: 2, Insightful

"Do you grow your own food, or cede control of that to others?"

Makes sense. It is annoying when I can't eat my food because they took down the server and now I can't activate it. It is even worse that I can't give my food to someone else or resell it; I should have purchased it on DVD or downloaded the installer. Perfect analogy.

You can't keep track of your stuff, thus those who prefer having a local installer that doesn't need activation or an internet connection must leave society. Makes sense.

I agree with Bengal. I buy a game and play it for years. I still have a PS2 which works great for LAN parties.......sadly only a few dozen games support LAN without going through an online server.

Bengal and I are in the minority I believe, which means my days of buying video games are over. Almost everything I play is now FOSS.

There are too many great open source projects out there to be willing to buy games.
...Off to the pawn shop by kent_eh · 2010-02-05 10:02 · Score: 1

It sounds like there will be a lot of X-Boxes coming onto the used market soon, for cheap.
Now, what to do with them ...

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"I can't complain, but sometimes still do..." Joe Walsh
My own personal crusade :) by drinkypoo · 2010-02-05 10:06 · Score: 1

Refuse to buy games that hand over the control of whether you may play them to its maker.
This applies to all games on the Steam platform. You can't even play a steam "backup" without illegally (due to the DMCA) bypassing the system which prevents you from playing a game without Steam doing its initial call-home-and-update dance.
This only applies to multiplayer-only games with only Xbox Live support and no LAN play, are there any? And of course, the online functionality of any Xbox Live-only (no LAN support) games. Now THAT category is very large. If what you cared about was playing those games into infinity, though, you should never have bought them on the Xbox.
Perhaps this will lead to some new Xbox Live replacement hacks, although without the server code, it won't do much good except in the case of games where the player machine is the server, and Xbox Live only provides matching. If you love your games, you need to sniff and log some sample traffic now so that you can provide the data to someone who is interested in taking on this challenge.

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"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Nothing to do with game age by DesScorp · 2010-02-05 10:58 · Score: 1

Enemy Territory is over 7 years old now, and still has a strong following. On forums I constantly see comments about people coming back to ET because "newer games just aren't as fun". New maps are still being created, and older favorites are still being modded. ID seems to be on the ball with this idea. Look at what they did putting Quake 3 online. If a game has a following, don't kill it.
After EA's decision to terminate servers for a whole bunch of games... some of them fairly recent... and now Live pulling this stunt... I'm really wary about getting my son that Xbox 360 he's been wanting.

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Life is hard, and the world is cruel
My thoughts,,, by HazMat+79 · 2010-02-05 11:10 · Score: 1

5 years ago a v1 xbox cost about $125 out the door. A game such as Halo 2 cost $30. The next 4 years of xbox live cost me $200. Total investment is $355. I will guesstimate 5000 hours of entertainment from said investment. Investment per hour is $0.071 an hour. Pretty sure I got my money outta that. Not counting the other games I have. If most pc gamers keep a rig for 4 years, realisticly they aren't expected to play every game they can buy or have bought in the past. Honestly I am more surprised more of you are not commenting on the fact that a dead console was supported for so long.
1. Re:My thoughts,,, by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 21:41 · Score: 0
  
  The issue with shutting down servers isn't a money issue, it is not about "getting your money's worth", it is about the games and the gaming experience being preserved for future generations.
  When I want to have a look at the games of my childhood, I just take my NES and play a bit or if that fails take an emulator. What will the kids of today do in 20 years? Even worse, what will the kids of tomorrow do when services like OnLive get some mass market traction where everything is server based?
  At the moment this seems like history is repeating itself. A lot of early movies got lost since nobody considered them important enough to preserve them. Today on the other side people spend great effort in piecing together the lost bits of classics like Metropolis. With video games it seems to go much the same route. Luckily we have hackers and crackers doing their best to counter the industry, but it seems like an uphill battle, that isn't getting any easier when things are moved to the server side or wrapped in DRM.
XLink Kai by doronbc · 2010-02-05 11:29 · Score: 1

I guess it's too bad for them I've used XLink Kai for the last 4 years.
What does "stopping support" mean? by argent · 2010-02-05 11:42 · Score: 1

Does "stopping support" mean that your Windows 98, 2000, or XP box stops working? That any functionality stops working? All it means is... you have to go to someone like WindizUpdate for your driver updates and patches instead of Microsoft.
That's the problem with software that depends on a service. When they pull the plug, it stops working right then and there. Poof. It's gone.
At least you can still use your XBox offline.
Now... keep THAT in mind when you get ready to plonk down thirty bucks on one of the new games that are coming along that require you to connect to the server just to play locally.
I would make by Mehall · 2010-02-05 11:55 · Score: 1

I would make some kind of reference to Steam, or the pspGO and the 360 Live service, but if I say anything about Sony discontinuing the GO, then I'd need to admit something:
If Sony were to discontinue the pspGO service, it would probably be a week before it was well known.
But on topic:
This is something that was predictable, and part of the reason why I was avoiding getting a 360, and why I only got an XBox when it was down to £10
Then again, both the Microsoft consoles now sit next to every other console I own, and fit in rather well with the crowd, but I don't use them online.
Remind me what the point of this was?
Sound of a Million Classic Gamers cry out at once by Jackie_Chan_Fan · 2010-02-05 12:06 · Score: 1

And this is why classic gaming will die.
Hopefully someone will write their own xbox live open source server system for gamers to keep going.
Thats it if anyone is actually interested.
who the sucker! by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 12:10 · Score: 0

by "a computer" we assume you mean a computer running MS-Windows of some flavor or another?
If so, then you just signed a worse agreement to forgo another. The EULA for Windows is one of the worst in the industry. That's why Microsoft won't even give you the one you agree to when you purchase a name brand computer. I bet most Dell users don't even realize that the Windows Agreement they signed in order to use their PC was between them and Dell... not Microsoft! Why? It's a legal mess full of limiting your rights as a consumer down to the level of probably being illegal and class-actionable (think anti-trust law). ie: too much legal liability exposure for MS.
FTR: I have an XBOX. I have read both XBOX live and Windows EULA agreement. The Windows agreement puts all of my computing data and services in jeopardy. Whereas, the XBOX agreement only endangers the gaming portion of my life (smaller subset).
Anyhow... I don't like the idea of signing outrageous agreements that applies to the same computer I use for email, porn, taxes and other personal stuff.
Conclusion : better to sign an EULA on a dedicated device if you have to. ie: buy a game console.
Conclusion2 : don't be a sucker. Run linux or other O/S not requiring a ridiculous EULA to do your private computing.
Conclusion3 : "and never the Twain shall meet"
Also of note: a console is cheaper than having a dedicated PC for gaming. I know most don't do this. But it is the only other "safe" option.
In every discussion where Steam is mentioned... by YojimboJango · 2010-02-05 12:22 · Score: 1

In every discussion where Steam is mentioned there's always that one guy that gets modded up really high talking about how you're just renting your games from Steam. Then this person goes on a tirade about how you shouldn't use steam and should just buy console games or PC games on discs, because those magically work forever and the disc never gets scratched and this crap can never happen. Also if Valve goes out of business then we have the legal right to open up their DRM (like they've publicly stated). So not only do we get to keep playing single player like we already can offline, but I'm betting that all the games that aren't Modern Warfare 2 would just keep right on chugging along.
I'd just like to say that I'm bookmarking this article to post in reply to that guy.
Then again Steam has been around since Sept 2003; the xbox has been around since November 2001. I guess that guy has till December 2011 for Valve to die a sudden and horrible death.
This doesn't make any sense by LeRaldo · 2010-02-05 12:44 · Score: 1

I don't understand why they would do this. It's not like Xbox LIVE was free for those original Xbox games; you still have to pay for it. Not only that, but they've been selling downloadable original Xbox games on the XBL Market Place... and now you wont be able to play them online? How is this logical in any way? I have an Xbox 360 and still play a few original Xbox titles on it, but only multiplayer on LIVE. I guess that will no longer be possible, and that secures me never buying an original Xbox title on their LIVE marketplace.
Why? There are still servers for PS2 games up by CronoCloud · 2010-02-05 13:52 · Score: 1

One of the oldest PS2 online games, the original 2002 vintage SOCOM, still has it's servers up. As do the other PS2 SOCOM games. Everquest Online Adventures, the PS2 MMORPG released in 2003, is also still up. As of last year, the Champions of Norrath (both games) servers were still up. Final Fantasy XI is still going.
1. Re:Why? There are still servers for PS2 games up by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-05 21:31 · Score: 0
  
  There is also lots of PS2 stuff that has been shutdown, Resident Evil: Outbreak for example.
Nice quote from the company by Kalewa · 2010-02-05 15:44 · Score: 1

I'm amused by how little companies even try to not make it sound like they're lying. Shutting down XBL is good for XBL customers. Oh, of course, why didn't I think of that. Here I just assumed it was because subscription levels had reached a low enough point that it was no in Microsoft's financial interest to continue to support it. Too bad I and the gaming public are too dumb to understand things like that.
Be sure to drink your Ovaltine by ndege · 2010-02-05 19:40 · Score: 1

Well, maybe they just decided that it is time for you to drink more Ovaltine. (ie: MS closes the old service out, planning that you will buy a new xbox)
For those of you that might not get the reference, here is a video clip that just came to mind: Secret circle - decoder ring scene from "A Christmas Story"

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Sig Return: 204 No Content
It's worse than that by Lemming+Mark · 2010-02-06 01:40 · Score: 1

And, in fact, it wouldn't even be so depressing if that was all they were proposing. But the 360 supports original Xbox games and that influenced people who had a back catalogue of existing games. Now those people will have a load of games they can't play online, accompanied by a console that is harder to mod to use alternate services.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if we start seeing ports of original XBox games, updated to use the new Live multiplayer systems, being sold as DLC so you can't resell it. That way they can sell you your old games again so you can buy back functionality. Maybe I'm being over cynical ... nah.
My Wife Is Celebrating!!! by indytx · 2010-02-06 01:52 · Score: 1

This is GREAT news in our house! Finally, the Halo Green Xbox will be out of our lives. Micro$oft has done what I didn't have the strength to do myself. First, there was the move from the big TV in the living room to a guest bedroom. Then, the Xbox made its way to the Garage, BUT IT WOULDN"T DIE!!! No, our unlikely hero was able to play Halo 2 with his brothers in the garage!!! WDS? W Who?
Sure, I dutifully bought my Xbox Gold card every year so I could play Xbox with brothers, but IT WAS WRONG!!! Don't you see? My constant, yearly Xbox subscription was just feeding my addiction. I mean, isn't it time I pick a decent midlife crisis? Video games? Time to grow up and get a convertible.

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Make love, not reality television.
1. Re:My Wife Is Celebrating!!! by Jedi+Alec · 2010-02-09 23:08 · Score: 1
  
  Time to grow up and get a convertible.
  As well as a girlfriend in her early twenties. Although that might dampen your wife's spirits a bit... ;-)
  
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  People replying to my sig annoy me. That's why I change it all the time.
Finally, we can move forward by FrozenFOXX · 2010-02-06 03:12 · Score: 1

Look, I know it's popular to bash MS for this and all but from what we've seen from them in the past the old XBox Live service model was actually the last thing holding back the 360 Live service. Ever wonder why you can only have 100 friends on your 360 XBL Friends list? No clans? No other "modern" features? Halo 2 was the reason.

From what they said in the past SPECIFICALLY Halo 2 was holding it back because it wouldn't recognize a friends list longer than 100 people or additional features. Yes, this is poor planning for the original infrastructure but the only way to fix it is to kill support for the XBox Live infrastructure.

I thought we were supposed to welcome trimming cruft (OpenGL anyone?). Even if it hurts a little in the short term compare how many people were using the original XBox Live infrastructure to the number of people using the new XBox 360 Live infrastructure.

Personally I think they should've had a legacy server infrastructure set up but that would've meant that you'd have two separate friends lists, two separate sets of features, and again you're not really trimming cruft, just making it such that you have to duplicate a lot of your work when you want to upgrade it. However much as it hurts to drop the original XBox Live I'm looking forward to much higher limits on my friends list, more expansive features of the Live service since the 360 (and its games) was designed with a constantly upgraded infrastructure in mind, and so forth.

Bash 'em all you like but that 100 player limit ALONE in your friends list was a major sticking point for many communities (hello all us Penny-Arcade and Ctrl-Alt-Del fans who want to play with the creators of the strip). At least now we can get that shit out of the way.

Disclaimer: I have all Linux machines in my house, all major consoles, have played games since the Atari 2600 on right about everything from Windows 95 to OpenSolaris, NES to 360. No gaming is around forever, even my beloved System Shock requires some interesting emulation to get it to work, I view this as no different other than the fact MS told you up front it wouldn't be around forever.

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"Just a fox, a whisper."
Goodbye Live - Welcome Modz by bjoeg · 2010-02-06 03:35 · Score: 1

Goodbye to Xbox live.
And for those still loyal to Microsoft's services, we welcome you to the world of modding a Xbox and joining players on Xlink KAI.
about time! by Scarumanga · 2010-02-06 05:21 · Score: 2, Interesting

This is a good thing, that means more bandwidth and lower ping times for people who play 360 games, who wants to play halo 2 instead of halo 3 though? IMO halo 3 kicks the crap out of 2 any day of the week, looks better, plays better, is better. There is no excuse to NOT own a 360 by now, they have been out for 5 years and are dirt cheap.
Talk about killing nostalgia.. by Rexdude · 2010-02-06 07:32 · Score: 1

I was 15 when Doom was launched. In fact, I fondly remember the times all the classic FPSes (Quake 1/2, Duke 3D, Halflife, Heretic, Hexen) were released, and playing the demos bundled with magazine CDs. The first time I tried multiplayer was in college, around 1998. Friend of mine had 2 PCs at home, and we would play Halflife 1 and Quake 2/3 multiplayer. On weekends, 3 other guys would converge at his place for LAN parties. I ran into him recently, turns out he STILL plays Halflife 1, finding all the new games with activation etc too complicated.
We had another game together for old times' sake and it was just as much fun as before.
When it comes to single player, I use DosBOX to play . Currently I'm playing Fallout 1. There are still tons of perfectly playable and fun games from a generation ago, if you're not picky about graphics.
Imagine the kids playing today..with all the bullshit activation and servers going down, do you think they'll be able to revisit the games of today 10 or 20 years hence?

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"..One hosts to look them up, one DNS to find them, and in the darkness BIND them."
Tunneling programs by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-06 15:32 · Score: 0

Who cares if xbox live for the orginal xbox will be over? Never needed it before to play with people online. Just grab Xlink Kai or XBConnect and install it on your computer. They basically tunnel the system link multiplayer option over the internet. Any game with system link like halo or farcry will work just fine playing online.
Xbox Live won't be missed, it will be replaced.
Some Alternatives by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-07 13:23 · Score: 0

I know it's not the same but there are some alternatives to be aware of: XBConnect and Xlink Kai.
That is at least unless they decide to stop support for the original xbox too.
I guess this is why I prefer playing multiplayer games on PC rather than my consoles. This is also why I prefer to buy media for a game (e.g CD or DVD) rather than a download (e.g steam). Even though I also use steam.
End of an Era by catd77 · 2010-02-11 09:59 · Score: 1

It's the end of an era I guess. The Xbox ushered in the era of online gaming. Now every major game touts "online capabilities".