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Stars Remain In Their Usual Places; People Panic
asheller writes "The Star Tribune tells us the zodiac signs have shifted. Earth's wobble has shifted the signs, a new one's been added and many of us have changed signs. Formerly a Cancer, I've apparently been upgraded to Gemini and am now married to an Ophiuchus, a new sign. What's yor sign? The new Zodiac Chart is pretty interesting." Here are some priceless reactions to this celestial development. As long as the Chinese Zodiac is unaffected, I'll still be able to accurately judge people based on when they were born, so please indicate in comments your (new) sign and birth year animal, so we'll be able to know where you're coming from.
Give me Libra, or give me death!
I'm not a zodiac follower and I could care less about my horoscope. (Though today it says my karma may change). However, the tropical zodiac does not change which is typically what we use.
Since this is a topic I care very little for, but just enough to post another article I will provide a citation.
http://newsfeed.time.com/2011/01/14/astrologers-get-their-say-in-the-horoscope-hubbub/
It is very short so it's fairly safe to RTFA, but be warned I won't debate any of this. I really don't care enough to apologize if some zen buddhist tao roman catholic devout follower of zod says I am specifically wrong and a celestial being of my choosing will strike me down. (Stay Puff Marshmallow Man)
"You should always go to other people's funerals; otherwise, they won't come to yours." -- Yogi Berra
Formally? Do you perhaps mean FORMERLY? What kind of gabootz can't tell the difference???
I mean, yeah this was funny and all, but if I wanted to read an aggregation site covering spoof sites like The Onion, I'd do so.
goin' to bed Capricorn. Boy are my arms tired.
Cool. I get a new personality. Just what my wife wanted for Christmas.
Prepare to be sued.
It will be funny to see people changing their behaviour towards the suggested behaviour of their new sign. Or sad, if you really think about it.
Lets be honest: nothing will change. Nothing. You have a new sign, yay. It just means guys will have to change their pickup lines and girls will have to look at a different part of the horoscope page.
When you were born and how the stars were aligned will have no impact on your personality. The influence of what those nutjobs told you about your sign might have some impact, but you have all the control over who you are. In fact, many of the descriptions will fit you anyway because of how god damn vague they are. It's just a matter of interpreting the text.
BTW, I've gone from Libra to Virgo. I was born year of the monkey.
even if you follow astrology a little (I do, for amusement), this is f-ing retarded.
-- Who is the bigger fool? The fool or the fool who follows him? --
The new Zodiac Chart is pretty interesting.
Yeah, pretty interesting choice of Adobe Flash for a static piece of text and illustration.
Is that supposed to act as a poor man's DRM ?
I have discovered a truly marvelous proof of killer sig, which this margin is too narrow to contain.
Watch you local nutcases stumble over this. The greater derail the more irrational they are.
Some girl with psychic powers, she said "T-bone, what's your
sign"
I blink and answer "Neon," I thought I'd blow her mind.
-- Tom "T-Bone" Stankus, 1979
I just got demoted from a caprican to a sagitaron. I'm sure all the battlestar galactica buffs out there feel my pain.
baah baah baah ...
Hmm, my birthday is June 1st, im now a Taurus instead of Gemmini?
Not that i believe in Horrorscopes.
Insert sufficiently witty sig here.
rather than the Excalibur-wielding badass? crap.
Well, at least I'm not a chick, so there's that. Sucks to be you, Ophiuchus!
No problem is insoluble in all conceivable circumstances.
The ecliptic from the Earth's perspective is constant (by definition), and the Sun's travel across the ecliptic is about as constant. Astrologers don't REALLY believe that constellations occupy precisely 30 degree chunks of the ecliptic, with Aries starting precisely at the vernal equinox. The constellations were just a conventional way to label those segments.
What's slightly more disconcerting about this article is that Astrology knew about this long long ago. They have a name for when a new constellation reaches the vernal equinox, it's the beginning of an "Age". You know, like the "Age of Aquarius"?
Astrology is a superstitious hobby of zero scientific merit, but even within its own formulation this article should have no impact on it.
I think Astrology is an interesting thing. The idea is pretty simple. The states and positions of the stars when you were born, and where they are today, affect you. That's fine. If people want to believe in burning bushes, dudes that can turn water into wine, etc., etc., etc. I hardly find it any more or less valid than anything else involved in religion and faith.
What I find particularly curious here is that an Astrologer should be an Astronomer first, and there is a backlash. Everything they do is fundamentally based upon the ability to accurately determine the states and positions of stars at a given time right? That's Astronomy.
Soooo.... Astronomy is now saying, "Hey dudes. We've been reading the "map" wrong all this time. Didn't account for this, that, and all the what have yous and stuff." Well, then wouldn't the most genuine and sincere there for an Astrologist to do is be thankful? Possibly peer review it, take it into consideration, and then use the knowledge to more accurately practice their craft?
Seriously..... we've known about the precession of the equinoxes since 130 BC.... how the hell does this make the headlines????????
And what kind of name is Parke Kunkle?!!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precession_of_the_equinoxes
I think that Bad Astronomy summed it up perfectly.
Sigs are too short to say anything truly profound so read the above post instead.
No ones sign actually changed it only applies to people born this year.
Hmm, my sign appears to have shifted from Leo the Lion to the Michelin Man. My birth animal remains the Mexican Jumping Bean.
Is Feces.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
It said "Maternity Ward"...
Only the sidereal zodiac is affected by this. Western culture adheres to the tropical zodiac, which hasn't changed.
I have a Scorpio tattoo, you insensitive clod!
Uh, yeah. You obviously have no idea how the zodiac symbols were really decided. On the day you were born the Sun is sitting in the middle of a constellation. That was how it was determined. You are also ignoring the fact that not only do the zodiac symbols rotate slowly through the calender, because of the exact same second rotational axis, so do the seasons. In 11,500 years, Dec. 21 will be midsummer in the northern hemisphere. I don't know how you'd think it has anything to do with seasons, anyway. Leave it to the superstitious to ignore any actual facts or history.
The real fraud here is the way the science media sets up this same straw man every year so their believers can break their arms patting themselves on the back feeling superior to "those stupid pseudoscientific wannabees who believe in astrology".
The reality is that, as TFA hints at, western astrology hasn't been based on stars for thousands of years. ...approximately since the constellations were when they were assigned. It's based on equinoxes. Open any book on astrology that goes deeper than sun-sign horoscopes and you'll find a thorough treatment of this topic in one of the first few chapters. But most of you enjoy dumping on stuff you haven't read much about.
I regret that I have to say this but note that I have not expressed an opinion on the merits of astrology in this post. If you reply as if I had, you're only proving your inability to participate in neutral discussion.
SUPER old news. Like 1000+ years old. Here's Carl Sagan mentioning it back in the 70's: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iunr4B4wfDA and even then he mentions they've been wrong for 1000 years.
does adding a sign to get 13 somehow divide the celestial sphere into a neater so many degrees/minutes of arc?
(probably there's a RTFM someplace to discover this, but, y'know... it's lazier to ask here)
Maybe the article explains this, but I'm at work and can't read it. Wouldn't the stars changing only affect people born after the change(s) occurred? After all, if you were born under the sign of the Cancer, then the Earth wobbles differently, you were still born under the sign of the Cancer, but people born after the new wobble might not be. And since this is a matter of the Earth changing, they can't claim some obnoxious relativistic hocus pocus.
If you can't convince them, convict them.
Is it April already?
Religion pisses me off more than you can imagine. But Astrology ... oh, Astrology is even worse. How can stupidity reach such amazing levels as to allow religion, astrology and such other crap to exist in the year 2011?
WTF am I doing replying to an AC at 5 A.M on a Friday night?
I was a Cancer before and now I'm an AIDS. WTF?
For sale: Signature. One owner. Low miles. Always garaged. New punctuation, just installed!
Why don't you try "popping your cherry" and get a Slashdot ID.
good times, good times ...
Read radical news here
There has been a lot of talk about Astrology, lately. Some people seem to have become distraught over their "sign changing" (even though it really hasn't).
There is a difference between Tropical Astrology and Sidereal Astrology. Tropical Astrology ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tropical_astrology ) has the 12 Zodiac signs we are all used to.
Sidereal Astrology ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidereal_astrology ) does things differently. It has 13 Zodiac Signs and different dates for each sign. It's not really new, and it's certainly not any more real than the Tropical Astrology. Simply ignore it and nothing really changes.
and jupiter aligns with mars ?
so that kind of shit was real after all ?
Read radical news here
I happen to have paid for astrological readings many times. I don't really think astrology has anything to do with reality or astronomy, not even for a second; but I do enjoy it. It's rather like how I enjoy The Matrix even though it doesn't make any sense at all.
I happened to ask my astrologer about this many years ago (it's not like they just switched a couple days ago) and the astrologer was actually aware that the astrological symbols had changed, but assured me the Zodiac signs did not. It's been totally decoupled for decades and astrologers seem to be aware of it.
It's not like if you learned to precisely measure something (I don't know what it would be); you'd suddenly change all the symbols on your Tarot deck either. Heh. They're all complicated systems of nonsense. They don't really require further adjustments.
I'm sure there'll be TONS of new astrology books coming out because this is suddenly big news for some reason. It may even cause a schism, but it doesn't really matter which system you pick. A really good astrologer reads the man, not the stars.
Imagine if you weren't allowed to use roads because a bus company complained about your driving 3 times. --skunkpussy
Even if the new zodiac calendar did affect me, my sign wouldn't change. I was born August 15th, which puts me in Leo on both calendars. The closer you were born towards the end of your sign, the more likely you'll retain the same sign on the new calendar, as most of them have a brief overlap if you compare the dates on both calendars. I guess I could be considered one of the lucky few that falls in Leo's overlap.
True story:
As an undergrad I had a job at a big chain steak and potato restaurant. The manger asked what I was taking for classes that semester. I mentioned that one of the classes I was taking was Astronomy. She then replied, "Great! When you're done, maybe you can do my chart."
I didn't correct her because I needed the job.
We have a society that's so scientifically illiterate, we don't know science from myth and folklore. And then, we have a moronic media that in its attempts to make things "fair and balanced" gives screen time to the crackpots; thereby, confusing an already ignorant public further. And it doesn't help when we have media people with a science background (Gupta, M.D.) entertaining some of these ideas - I'm thinking of life after death, Michael Shermer in Scientific American did a Skeptic article on reincarnation and a television appearance on CNN IIRC.
I realize this is very likely the least friendly place to express these ideas, but I'll put myself on the firing line for those who may be genuinely interested in what the art and practice of astrology is about.
All the panic and hub-bub about this finding is coming from a great deal of ignorance about astrology. It's like the criticisms that came from Carl Sagan, where someone with a perspective on science is using demonstrably unscientific methods to put down or even berate (in the case of Sagan) the practice of astrology. It's no different than someone without a background in science claiming that all science is fraudulent due to a few fraudulent scientists.
Astrology makes its observations from a purely relative perspective from Earth. The sun *appears* to be in the sign of Aries on the Spring Equinox, so we say the sun is in Aries. Whether it is actually in absolute alignment with that constellation is not the claim, nor is it even relevant. Indeed, tropical astrology (what is predominantly used in the West) doesn't use the constellations at all but puts the zodiac as a fixed wheel around the Earth, so that the Spring equinox is always the first day of Aries, even though over the thousands of years since the Babylonians the constellation that aligns with the sun (from Earth's perspective) has moved to Pisces, and is now moving towards Aquarius, hence the coming "Age of Aquarius". That is of course the result of the so called precession of the equinoxes.
As for the 13th sign, that's old news. Astrologers have been debating the usefulness of Ophiuchus for decades at least.
Astrology is about understanding natural cycles, in particular the ways in which the cycles of planets and stars synchronize with the cycles of individual and collective human events. It is not about absolute claims of prediction based on absolute alignments. Newspaper horoscopes are, on the whole, a fraud, and not consistent with the true intention and purpose of astrology.
Hope that clears things up. There's no crisis in astrology, you're still who you thought you were....or not.
"Molest me not with this pocket calculator stuff."
- Deep Thought
As long as the Chinese Zodiac is unaffected, I'll still be able to accurately judge people based on when they were born, so please indicate in comments your (new) sign and birth year animal, so we'll be able to know where you're coming from.
Serpentarius and Cat, of course.
The most ridiculous thing I've seen in a paper article was, "So this means that we're not really in the age of Aquarius, but in the age of Capricorn". UUUUUUGH!!! The whole idea of Astrological Ages is based on the fact of the precession of the equinoxes. The astrological age is the constellation the sun is actually in at the spring equinox. Tropical astrology, which is the system that's told you what your sign is all your life if you live in Western civilization, is based on pretending that we are eternally and forever in the Age of Aries. That is, it is based on pretending that the sun always moves into Aries on March 20th. In reality, it has since left Aries, and moved through most of Pisces, and will move into Aquarius sometime around the year 2600 because of precisely the same "wobble" that makes tropical astrology wrong.
And don't try to tell me that tropical astrology isn't necessarily "wrong", because it is based on seasons and not stars. That should be an intellectually embarrassing argument even for an astrologer.
I used to be able to say "Us Tauri don't believe in astrology", but now, apparently, I'm an Ares.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
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I might just stick to the Adam Sandler Horoscope instead; it seems to be pretty good most of the time.
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
Clearly this wobble is of a global nature and is having negative affects (it's probably anthropogenic as well). I think we should spend trillions of dollars to find a way stop global wobbling and return the earth to the way it was in the past.
Support Right To Repair Legislation.
Ophiuchus has stuck a wedge into the zodiac at least since the modern perimeters of the constellations were defined. It has just been ignored to make the number of signs work out to the magical 12.
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Especially ancient ones. I learned about the Earth's precession back in middle school. I remember this because for all of about 2 hours I was teased for being called a "Virgo the Virgin". Yes, I know a horrible thing to call a 12 year-old. But, I also remember salvation came when the astronomer told us about the change in the Earth's orientation that would allow me a technical out.
I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
Headline: "What You Need to Know About The New Zodiac Sign"
The Huffington Post is staffed by and written for idiots. No further proof is needed.
Advice: on VPS providers
Not many years ago they pulled the same manure: Your Zodiac sign is probably wrong because there's a 13th sign --Ophiucus. This happened in the late 90s - early 2000s and it happened before. And it will happen again. Sadly.
2019 is going to be the year of Linux on the desktop.
People have been using the wrong horoscopes! That means that many of the predictions that horoscopes have made and that world leaders have based their policies on have been WRONG! It's no wonder that our world has been in so much trouble!
This should have been filled under Idle.
Awwww yeah.
the logic behind the astrological sign is, the cosmic radiation/influx flavor that is active at that particular point (or if you want to go spiritual, the influence from the particular star set) affects your character. so, once you are born, you are born under that particular influx, and its set. it does not change if the constellations change later, because the particular flavor of influx there at the time of your birth, was the one affected you.
...
tho, i dont give any credence to fortune telling part of this, i have seen a brain boggling measure of accuracy of astrology in regard to determining the general (broad) behavior set/characteristics of people in my life and in general. from the excessively homely trait of taurus, to its long winded patience and eventual mega explosion when s/he feds up (thats why its called taurus) to insincerity, infidelity, undecidedness of scorpio in regard to love affairs
Read radical news here
your zodiac is what your "born" under!!
What I find amusing is that (now mostly forgotten) SF writer John Sladek figured out that there ought to be 13 constellations in the zodiac, rather than 12 (on the argument that there are not 12, but 12 1/2 lunar months in a year-- need an extra constellation to account for one per month)-- and wrote a satirical "nonfiction" book "Arachne Rising" explaining the conspiracy that "suppressed" the missing 13th constellation. (under the pseudonyn "John Vogh").
That's why astrology is usually wrong, everybody! The secret 13th sign of the zodiac (now called "Ophiuchus," but formerly* Arachne) isn't used!
*--according to Sladek.
http://www.geoffreylandis.com
I know that astrology is bunk anyways... but I'd seriously like to know if this is for real... at least insomuch as it is part of actual astrology?
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
The whole damned thing is based on the fact that a fool and his money are soon parted. Damn, it's depressing to see people still believing in BS like astrology, and proudly demonstrating their gullibility on a 21st Century technically oriented web forum!
No, I'm not new here; just still sick of seeing it go on and on and on. If I vetted technical hires, stuff like this would instantly disqualify applicants. If they believed in claptrap like this, $DEITY knows what other gibberish they'd use to explain their incompetence in the future.
Grr ...
"Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit
Your new horoscope is ready. Instead of being an obscenely wealthy businessman, you are supposed to be a destitute bum. Please relinquish your financial holdings and report to the Belltown Millionaire's Club immediately.
Have gnu, will travel.
Yeah, right! Next you'll be telling me Pluto isn't a planet!
"Slow down, Cowboy! It has been 3 years, 7 months and 26 days since you last successfully posted a comment."
This is the difference between http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_astrology and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidereal_astrology. It's nothing new.
Folks looking at the new Sidereal calendar and thinking their sign changed are probably wrong. In theory (since its BS anyway), what matters is what the sign was when you were born. Not the chart that applies if you were born today (or every minute like most suckers).
If I vetted technical hires, stuff like this would instantly disqualify applicants. If they believed in claptrap like this, $DEITY knows what other gibberish they'd use to explain their incompetence in the future.
And if I vetted hiring decision-makers, you would be instantly disqualified for this, because you fail to understand that a person can be a complete moron in one area, while still know what they're doing in a separate area. You still have to test them on their actual merits, you can't just throw them out because of your preconceived notions.
"16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
This explains why my horoscope is always wrong.
ps--If you want to know my sign, just read the medallion.
Happy now?
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
"This is the excellent foppery of the world, that, when we are sick in fortune,--often the surfeit of our own behavior,--we make guilty of our disasters the sun, the moon, and the stars: as if we were villains by necessity; fools by heavenly compulsion; knaves, thieves, and treachers, by spherical predominance; drunkards, liars, and adulterers, by an enforced obedience of planetary influence; and all that we are evil in, by a divine thrusting on: an admirable evasion of whoremaster man, to lay his goatish disposition to the charge of a star!" --Wm Shakespeare, 'King Lear', I, ii
"Love is a familiar; Love is a devil: there is no evil angel but Love." --William Shakespeare ('Love's Labors Lost')
Sorry bud, but belief in astrology is a pretty damning indictment. Tooth Fairy, Santa Clause, pass. Astrology, "Thanks for your time. Next!"
"Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit
The ecliptic from the Earth's perspective is constant (by definition)
Its true that the definition is constant but, against the backdrop of stars, the ecliptic is anything but constant. The sun is in orbit around the galactic core so given enough time (100k years or so) you can certainly have a change where the ecliptic is compared to the background stars. Of course since those stars themselves are all in orbits too they will have also shifted relative to each other.
Astrology is a superstitious hobby of zero scientific merit, but even within its own formulation this article should have no impact on it.
irregardless, he could care less
I'm curious why. The scientific studies in support of astrology are stronger than those for Santa Clause.
"Who is the Journal of Quantum Physics going to believe?" --Stephen Hawking
I can still judge people pretty accuratly on how much people know and care about their zodiac.
If they know anything more than what their sign is and if they care more than nothing about it then it's best to give them a wide berth for when they inevitably explode from drinking rocket fuel and colloidal silver.
- "There is nothing quite like an ineffective solution to an nonexistant problem"
I usually don't post much in the Internet nowadays. I have been in the IT industry as a Network and Systems Administrator (and helpdesk) for about 8 years now. I went to school and got my BS in CIS. I use to be a big Astronomy geek when I was in Junior High, and still have been interested in the planets and the stars. I've always been drawn to the night sky, there was so much mystique in it. A couple of things happened in my life that made me see the world in a different light, and I began to study astrology. I was very skeptical at first, and then as I learned more I began to open my eyes to the possibility that there might be something to it. The more I practiced it, the more I understood it. However, how and why it really works, I have no idea, and I think it would take science a very long time to really find how it works. What I mean is, most people will say that it doesn't work, even Scientists have done their own experimentation to try and debunk it. Some have declared that it doesn't work and that the science behind it is absurd, some became more interested in the subject. The reason why most people think it doesn't work it's because it is highly misunderstood. This misinformation comes from both astrologers and non-astrologers. However, in that sea of misinformation there are some things that can be applied and see astonishing results. Coincidences? Perhaps, but those are far too many coincidences. In my way of researching, I have been trying to see Astrology in the most logical manner possible. I came up to a posibbilty of why I think Astrology works. I believe that Astrology has more to do with cycles than with influence from the stars and planets. For me as someone who takes a deep interest in Astrology, I see the Zodiac signs in terms of location of the earth in it's orbit around the sun. Like a clock, I see the Planets as the hands of the clock and the signs as the labels of the hours. For example, all of us follow cycles in our lives. Most people react a certain way depending on what time of the year it is. Most might want to
Hello from your fellow Ophiuchus! I was a little depressed about losing the macho points associated with having the only zodiacal symbol that was armed with a weapon until I looked up what "Ophiuchus" is. The serpent bearer, represented by a guy clutching his snake. (No, that's not a euphamism; but even if it were, it'd still be a hell of a cool sign.)
According to the definitive authority on the matter (Wikipedia):
According to Roman era mythography, the figure represents the healer Asclepius, who learned the secrets of keeping death at bay after observing one serpent bringing another healing herbs. To prevent the entire human race from becoming immortal under Asclepius' care, Zeus killed him with a bolt of lightning, but later placed his image in the heavens to honor his good works.
That's the same Asclepius whose staff (with the serpents) is the modern symbol of medicine.
I'll let others argue over whether the new Zodiac is valid (well, as "valid" as the zodiac can be...). As for me, I don't mind being an Ophiuchus. Maybe we should insist that we be referred to by its old name, Serpentarius.
Why make fun out of the stupid and ignorant who believe in this nonsense? It doesn't seem like much fun to me.
By now we all know that people on the whole are easily fooled and easily lead. Making fun of them for it is redundant.
Ha! Good one. Cite?
I can't believe we're wasting our time even discussing this.
"Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit
Since my birthday is 20-JAN, does that make me Capricorn, Sagittarius, or Caprittarious?
And if you are reading this, your forecast is as follows:
Sitting will be rather uncomfortable tonight when the moon passes through Uranus.
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This gripe in the article really stood out...
Some people seemed angry. “I believe it’s a zodiac scam,” said Jose Arce, 38, from Fort Lee, N.J., who runs a body shop.
Uh, dude. This is horoscopes we are talking about here. It has always been a scam.
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I remember when astronomers spent their time unravelling the mystery of the universe instead of things like downgrading the status of planets and dabbling with astrology and stuff. Sure, there is a lighter side to science, but with tight budgets (most astronomers are publicly funded), I think I would spend more time on real research.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/1097-4679(197410)30:4%3C577::AID-JCLP2270300434%3E3.0.CO;2-8/abstract
"Who is the Journal of Quantum Physics going to believe?" --Stephen Hawking
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/1097-4679(197410)30:4%3C577::AID-JCLP2270300434%3E3.0.CO;2-8/abstract
Part of the accuracy of natal astrological statements probably stems from the fact that these interpretations are general in nature. Gauquilin has reported that 30% to 60% of the population admit to the belief that there is some truth in general astrology statements
yea that is damning evidence in favor of astrology right there.
http://www.accountkiller.com/removal-requested
Did you even read that? It mentions Coudere sending out identical readings to complete strangers, 200 of which thanked him for the accurate reading. James Randi did much the same thing, handing out identical readings to full classes. "Now, pass your reading to the person in front of you."
It's a con job! You should be shagrined (at least) for having fallen for it. It's not even a very good con.
"Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit
Aries
birth year animal: Goat
Mendacem Memorem Esse Oportet
So, I'm a Libran now? I suppose that's OK, on the balance.
the lot of ya.
If they're based on the seasons, then shouldn't the precession of the seasons affect them?
I only claimed the evidence was better than for Santa Clause.
"Who is the Journal of Quantum Physics going to believe?" --Stephen Hawking
known to the state of California to cause cancer
The problem is when you face it in your everyday life.
Conversation goes as follows:
Believer: What's your sign?
me: X
Believer: (no matter what sign I pick) Ohhhh! that makes total sense!
"Science can amuse and fascinate us all, but it is engineering that changes the world. " - Asimov.
also, santa is your parents. You're welcome.
If santa is our parents is that through immaculate conception or self pollination? Also, where can one become a formal initiate of this interesting new religion? Does it involve hot chocolate baptisms? If it does I'm seriously considering converting from Pastafarianism
The surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us.
You're right. I'll wear a "Whoosh!" for that one. I saw the "scientific studies in support" bit, and went ballistic.
[Apologies to Santa Claus for the misspell; my fault.]
"Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit
This is a great work that goes into some scientific detail
and how Astrology fails many key tests.
Kudos to the author.
It even brings up something that most people don't even
consider when the subject of 'planets ruling' comes up,
Exoplanets!
"And it gets worse for astrology. Astronomers have now found about 150 planets orbiting other stars. These are very distant, certainly, but hey! Distance is no issue. So therefore these planets must affect us too. Now, these are only the planets we've discovered so far. Given how many we've found, and what kind of stars they tend to orbit, it's reasonable to assume that there are billions (billions!) of such planets in our galaxy alone. They're everywhere! Why don't astrologers include them in their horoscopes?"
Here's another way to think of it. Astronomers (the real scientists) can determine that the planets are out there due to their real effects on their parent stars. If these planets affect us, as they must according to the astrologers' own set of rules, then why don't astrologers predict them? Why didn't any single astrologer 50 years ago say "There must be planets around other stars, because we can see it in our data!"? They didn't because they can't. Their "data" are meaningless. Again, by the rules used by astrologers, all those planets would simply overpower our own solar system planets
-AI
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion
This is a great work that goes into some scientific detail
about how Astrology fails many key tests.
Lol, forgotten URL to said article, wow... n00b. =)
http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/astrology.html
-AI
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion
if you read the astrology section, and it will pertain to you anyway.
The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than the question of whether a submarine can swim.
This is just a more specific interpretation of sidereal astrology. This debate has been going on for awhile, and demonstrates what happened to most "sciences" as civilization fell in europe as we entered the common era. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidereal_astrology
I agree, if you were hiring just another office drone. Anyone expected to use reasoning in their work...
Yet Another Tech Blog
(but so much more, including game and movie reviews)
http://yanteb.peasantoid.org
People born on March 11 are Pisces either way.
Not true. A person can display sound reasoning ability in one area, while being blind in another. People aren't uniform, they don't approach everything the same. I would be a bit concerned, and test that person to make sure they approach their job duties with some sense, but I wouldn't reject them out of hand. That's idiotic.
"16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
The sign when I was born seems to be more relevant. I'll use Cartes du Ciel to figure that out.
I don't get it. Why would exoplanets be predictive for people living in this solar system. For stellar objects give us signs, I think the point is that we have to be able to see them in the sky.
This explains everything. It's the 13th colony.
In your rush to arrogance, did you stop to consider that Astrologers have known about precession for as long as there has been a word for it?
It's just a labeling problem, and an easy one to solve. Astrologers who know their stuff work from current activity in the night time sky. This is only an issue among the ignorant, of which you are a member. Sorry.
There is as much disinformation among the New Age types as there is among the Science types. The god of Dogma wears all hats.
-FL
"The popular astrologer Susan Miller called the news "ridiculous." In an interview with ABC News, she said, "We've known about this for ages. The constellations don't suggest what's coming up, it's the planets! The constellations are a measuring device."
"In ancient days there were, like, 50 constellations. Then they finally got together and agreed on 18. Then they narrowed it down," says Miller. "I'm getting so many tweets. Trying to explain something technical in 140 characters is hard!"
That's it. Two lines.
There is a LOT of media energy being spent focusing on spinning up a ton of confusion based on old, (OLD) news and very little spent asking people who know what they are talking about to clear things up. It's almost as though there is some sort of vested interest in muddying the waters.
I wonder if this has anything to do with the fact that Greenland saw the Sun rise two days too early this year. . ?
-A story which actually happens to be HUGELY important because it means our planet is changing significantly, (probably spinning more slowly.)
Though, I notice in the rush to forget about it as quickly as possible, they're actually trying to pin it to Global Warming. (As if they measure the annual sunrise dates against the tops of mutable ice and snow rather than a fixed horizon feature, like the ocean, for instance.)
Whatever the case. . , I smell distraction.
The world is changing in BIG ways, folks. But yes, let's confuse the issue by creating emotional links to nonsense stories that scientifically inclined people will then have to contend with should they ever wake up for long enough to notice the real issues happening around them.
-FL
How can anyone claiming to be 'intellectual' in any fashion treat astrological bullshit with anything more serious than disdain? You might as well hold Magic: The Gathering as your religion...
~/ssh slashdot.org ssh: connect to host slashdot.org port 22: too many beers
You mention the preference for when to have sex as an influence on your personality. But people ALWAYS want sex which can be proven that a power cut at ANY time of the year will ALWAYS result in a baby boom 9 months later.
Seasonal differences could make a chance except that modern man has managed to make seasonal differences go away. A mother carrying a child in winter no longer needs to fight bitter cold. And anyway, what about climates were the seasonal differences are minor? If being born in the winter makes you grumpy then wouldn't all northern people be really really grumpy full stop? Wouldn't all Africans have the same year round personality because of the year round sunshine?
And how do you account for different personalities in twins? For that matter, study animals and explain why a litter of half a dozen kittens can have half a dozen furry personalities?
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
The scientific haters of astrology say that 'the planets/stars are too far, their influence is very weak..' I think those people are just arrogant. The planets/stars are huge objects that bend space-time, emit EM radiation and particles.. We are just a mycosis on one small rock and as such, we are affected by changes in the environment of the rock. Astrology studies the relation between us (the individual) and the clockwork of outer space. It is an old science that combines math, astronomy, history, medicine, sociology, psychology. It requires the apprentice to be open-minded and to have some level of empathy. And of course, one has to study. The basics can be covered in a year, but the devil is in the detail, so one can study astrology his whole life and still be surprised. Besides, a good astrology book starts by saying that it can help you to understand, not to predict. However, there are also bad books on astrology. There are also lazy/greedy people with no talent or integrity and these charlatans degrade the whole idea. Combine that with the arrogance of modern science and the stupidity of modern journalism and as a result, members of human society are deprived of a tool that can help them to understand life.
Actually, the various personality traits that are sometimes associated with zodiac signs may carry a grain of truth after all: Psychologists have discussed and studied for ages that there are correlations between the season at the time of birth and the resulting personality traits. The early devopment of a baby follows a precise schedule, where certain phases happen days, weeks and months after the time of birth. It is not surprising at all that the amount of daylight, the temperature and the mood of the parents during a childs first weeks has a significant effect on its development and shows up in various ways throughout life. Obviously, a children born in midwinter would statistically show different traits than children born in late spring, early autumn or high summer. So, the knowledge of the zodiac may simply be the result of careful observation of typical traits of people born in certain months. Viewed like this, it is clear that astrologers should not adjust to the "revised" zodiac dates. However - when trying to judge a person, it may be helpful to take many more aspects into account than just the month of birth. After all, this is just one of many factors that may allow one to apply statistical correlations to extract information.
All my life when asked what my sign was, I've always answered Neon.
Now I'm lost.... what the hell am I now? An Argon?
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- - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
My default answer to the sign question is that I don't have one.
Reactions to that are priceless too, but it may of course have cost me some one night stands.
"Recent study showed that most studies aren't reproducible"
Warning: recursion error... stack overflow.
"a great deal of ignorance about astrology"
No, we are coming from a perspective that there is not a single astrology. Yes even the western astrology vary between practioneer. Even astrlogue are unable to predict better than chance who's sign is which. Astrlogist predict contrary stuff between each other. Tehre is a great deal of ingorance in astrology too. Some astrlogist pretend you need to know the seconds or minutes of your birth date (you know, to try to explain away twins with different presonalities). Some astrologist pretend the PLANET themselves set the influence (hehe, too abd they only added planet when astronomer discovered them) some pretend it is the season the important, some the sun and moon, all have thier kind of lala-land justification. Bottom line is : don't ty to tell us we are ignorant: there are as many astrology as there are astrologer (or nearly).
Astrology makes its observations from a purely relative perspective from Earth.
AstrologyDO NOT make any observation whatsoever. it asserts stuff without any evidence.
As for the 13th sign, that's old news. Astrologers have been debating the usefulness of Ophiuchus for decades at least.
Which is an interresting contradiction with the sideral and twelve sign thingy (Whether it is actually in absolute alignment with that constellation is not the claim, nor is it even relevant. Indeed, tropical astrology (what is predominantly used in the West) doesn't use the constellations at all but puts the zodiac as a fixed wheel around the Earth, so that the Spring equinox is always the first day of Aries) but I guess once you start making stuff up on the spot, why not go a 13th step further.
Astrology is about understanding natural cycles, Care to give a citation on that ? Astrology has ALWAYS been about getting money from gullible (or moving responsibility of a decision on what is basically a throw of dice) and never about any natural cycle whatsoever. Astrology has no basis with reality whatsoever.
It is not about absolute claims of prediction based on absolute alignments. Newspaper horoscopes are, on the whole, a fraud, and not consistent with the true intention and purpose of astrology.
LOL the usual defense , nobody care about newspaper astrology, even nitwit knows something printed a million time can't be right, we all speak of the pretend astrloger which say they are acurate. Study have been made , and TAdam, basically they are able to predict birthdtate based on personality quizz no better than chance, and given NO hot and cold reading, they are no better at making prediction of personality based on biorth date than this : Forer effect wiki.
Astrlogy has always been JUNK. For fuck sake, there is nothing to astrology, absolutely nothing than banality , generality , self dellusion and scamming money.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
this guy will say it better than me you are simply spouting non sense, you haven't any evidence at ALL that astrology works beyond cold/hot reading and forer effect.
"For astrology to really work, it does require a surrender of one's bias against phenomenon that cannot be directly sensed by physical senses. "
I will let any rational person read that twice, and try to reconciliate thazt with the fact astrology pretend to make prediction on people's personality, personality *which* indubitably can directly be sensed by common sense. But hey, since astrology utter FAIL at its own prediction, that's OK i guess.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
The most influential celestial body around here is the Sun, and the second one is the Moon. Coincidently your main sign is called your Solar Sign, and your secondary one is your Lunar Sign. That should cue you that astrology is trying to correlate hundreds of years of empirical observations to the orbit of the Earth around the Sun and the position of the Moon. Astrology says they have found a tipology that can be attributed to whatever fields the Sun and the Moon are directing toward Earth. As for the influence of something as faraway as planets and other stars, astrology says those influences exist, affecting mainly superior qualities of the human personality, but subordinated to stronger influences caused by your genetics and your Karma. How can you start a personal investigation of the validity of real Astrology? Check in the groups you belong to the "Element" you all belong to and classify them in two groups, one for Air and Water the other for Fire and Earth. Also, check with all the married couples you're acquainted with and check their "Element". The results might surprise you.
Born an Aries under the Ram. (Double sheep!) Now, I'm a Pieces, apparently. (Fishy sheep!)
If you accept this change, then either astrology has been useless bunk for much of the last millennium or so ... or it is now.
and that's not necessarily an exclusive 'or'.
Sometimes boldness is in fashion. Sometimes only the brave will be bold.
Don't really believe in Astrology, but it does appear to be an amazing predictor of human personality.
So, I suddenly have to change my behavior?
As one born on the cusp (15 minutes as the clock flies, not degree-wise), guess I can now claim three signs. Things were confusing enough with just the two.
I always thought that the signs were applicable to your birth date. Has everyone changed their original birth date? I doubt it. So, if you were born an Aries, you are still an Aries and always will be an Aries. The new charts only apply to new births IMHO.
I think this whole thing is a scam cooked up by the tattoo removal industry.
BTW: I used to be Scorpio with ruling planet Pluto, so I'm in double trouble!