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Homeland Security Stole Michael Arrington's Boat
An anonymous reader writes "Michael Arrington, founder of TechCrunch, lives near Seattle and bought a boat there. He ordered it from a company based near him, but across the border in Canada. Yesterday, the company tried to deliver it to him, and it had to clear customs. An agent for the Department of Homeland Security asked him to sign a form. The form contained information about the boat, including its cost. The price was correct, but it was in U.S. dollars rather than Canadian dollars. Since the form contained legal warnings about making sure everything on it is true and accurate, Arrington suggested to the agent that they correct the error. She responded by seizing the boat. 'As in, demanded that we get off the boat, demanded the keys and took physical control of it. What struck me the most about the situation is how excited she got about seizing the boat. Like she was just itching for something like this to happen. This was a very happy day for her. ... A person with a gun and a government badge asked me to swear in writing that a lie was true today. And when I didn't do what she wanted she simply took my boat and asked me to leave.'"
in the years that I imported horse manure.
Rich people problems.
A person in a position of power abused that power? Well color me surprised! I'm sure this has everything to do with DHS and nothing at all to do with the fact that every imaginable authority organization has had people who abuse their power since the dawn of time. Why is this news? Pursue your problem, get it resolved... But this is not "news for nerds" by any reasonable stretch of the imagination.
I do not respond to cowards. Especially anonymous ones.
FTFA, "My point in writing this isn’t to whine."
No, clearly your point was to whine. Otherwise you wouldn't have been an asshole about the whole thing. Make the correction, initial it, and sign the bottom. Ask to have the paperwork re-done and make an appointment to come back when it's ready. Better yet, hire a real importer and have them process the paperwork for you. Don't go bitch and complain about it.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
Vote from the rooftops
The government is creating a giant force of people with ill-defined powers who are itching to push people around for the sake of the fatherland. The current gun control push is to make the nation safer for these guys. We either get this government back into its Constitutional box or we will be the ones in the box.
I dont remember the last time we had a dept that was so pathetic, inefficient, useless, corrupt and annoying as the Dept. of Homeland Security. Why do these people even exist? I dont feel any safer with them being around at all. Just yesterday there was an article in Slate about how insecure airport perimeter security is. http://www.slate.com/blogs/crime/2013/02/20/airport_diamond_heist_it_is_shockingly_easy_to_breach_perimeter_security.html
Sorry, but that is a badly written blog. Convoluted and poorly put together. Who cares about your boat. Also, the currency didn't matter so as long as the value of the boat was correct (either in US or canadian dollars).
"electronic devices" onboard. I new that new border law was going to give them a "bone".
Tell them to fuck off.
That was one agent, not the entire DHS.
"It's just paperwork, it doesn't matter"
So, a government functionary with a minor Napoleon complex who just wants to get on with the fun parts of the job then?
This is what happens when you give stupid people that much power.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Cross out what you did not want, replace it with the corrrect currency, and inital, then sign the darn document....
Little rich boy Mikey couldn't get his boat right away and was made to feel bad.
Fuck him.
---Technology will liberate us if it doesn't enslave us first.
As TFA notes, he will hire a lawyer and get it back. The only variable is when; my guess is that within two weeks, he'll be sailing around. However, if the government accuses the boat of being the proceeds of a drug transaction (very unlikely, since there was no cash or drugs anywhere around) it will take longer. But "stole" makes for a much better headline than the truth, "confiscated", doesn't it?
Was the exchange rate wrong? What am I missing? If the document stated the price in US dollars and was clearly marked as being US dollars why would one care that they paid Canadian Dollars if the paper had the correct exchange rate and listed it in US dollars. Or is it that it did but didn't list the exchange rate at the time? Or is it that the document said the price was (example) $4,000,000 when it should have been C$4,000,000?
Paul: Father... father, the sleeper has awakened! - Dune
It sounds like he was being pedantic. 1 USD =~ 1 CAD these days. It's been trading in such a narrow band (0.96 - 1.04) for over a year now. Just fill out the paperwork, and get on with life. Don't upset the pencil pushers. They're goons with badges and guns.
I can't belive anybody is foolish enough to try to import a BOAT without hiring a customs broker to ensure this sort of thing doesn't happen.
Guess what happens when the victim isn't rich?
We never hear about it, and the agent seizes his boat and profits.
Corruption is a very real threat!
So what if this guy is rich? The point is that if they'll do it to rich people, they'll do it to anyone, except little people have no ability to retaliate.
Futurist Traditionalism
He writes:
itâ(TM)s to highlight how screwed up our government bureaucracy has become.
If true (we should hear the other side), it's nothing new in the history of governments or the United States. Not that it shouldn't improve, but the good old days never were.
That's the essential point to understand that if you want to improve things: The problem isn't current bad apples or lack of morality or a temporary increase in corruption; it's the universal, eternal nature of humanity and their institutions. Ignoring that fact is like designing a bridge and ignoring gravity. There are solutions, such as transparency, but it's not a matter of replacing the current 'bad' apples with a new batch -- they will be human too.
The customs paperwork on a shipment was screwed up.
The Customs department impounded the shipment until the paperwork gets straightened out.
WTF did you expect to happen?
Sounds to me like a whiny rich asshole didn't get his way when importing an expensive toy. Cry me a fscking river. (And maybe buy American next time, dude, then you won't have to worry about Customs.)
Tom Swiss | the infamous tms | my blog
You cannot wash away blood with blood
Post the name of the agent that did this.
Tar, feathers.
Maybe torch as well, but tar and feathers at a minimum.
I'm sure Arrington, with his long history of reporting the facts, is telling us the entire story. And if he is? It couldn't have happened to a nicer guy . . .
I always thought the fanatical left was completely hypocritical that they bashed the Bush administration for liberty violations by federal agents but now they are Obama constituents and are completely silent.
*sigh*
Oh well; who needs those stupid ethics and morals anyway?
And they deserve the same sort of respect.
If you give people power, they will abuse it. Government is usually a parasite. Best to keep it in its smaller symbiotic stages.
If you don't pay them their bribes you don't get your shit across. Everyone knows that...
I wonder if the agent is part of the cabal? Was she involved in the theft of the CrunchPad?
There's all sorts of reasons to hate the DHS and their agents. Years of reading techcrunch has left me with the impression that there's all sorts of reasons to take what Arrington writes with a block of salt.
Its too late to turn back now. They actually have assumed control.
No tin hat needed.
exactly, this has newsworthiness for a few reasons, two of which i will expand upon.... IF a rich guy can be treated like this, guess what? if youre not rich, YOU ARE GONNA GET IT WORSE.... secondly, it is cause the guy is also a celeb in the geek world, so geeks care about him in the same brainspace that they will occasionally pick up something about steve job's illeg. child.
They told me if I voted for Romney, we'd see DHS continue with abuse power... and they were right.
Guess what happens when the victim isn't rich?
They don't have a boat for DHS to steal?
The American people have a right to know who did this. I'm sure the guy will eventually get his boat, but he'll have no recourse for any damage they do to it. We're paying those bastards big salaries to fuck us over. And they wonder why citizens are seeing red.
If he was being an incredible dick toward the agent, I'm sure she was excited to seize property from an asshole who thinks his money makes him the coolest thing since the last ice age.
I'm just sayin'... There are always two sides to a story. Unfortunately, since this agent is an official government employee, her TRUE side can't be heard; only the legal facts (the numbers did not match, etc).
If I were being a real prick toward someone and they relieved their vengeance toward me, I would sensationalize the story about it to try and one-up them, just like this story sounds. If I would, millions of others would, too.
Again, just sayin'.
Since the Canadian and US Dollars are almost the same, the diff was what 10 pence?
Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
the US is a totalitarian state now run by the corporations and paranoia merchants who exist to fuel wars. I would not travel there with any electronic device as I would be more concerned about them messing about it or taking it at the border than if I was going to China. Seriously it has to have killed of a bit of tourism if nothing else with the mental border policies. Sure Israel blows up laptops it does not like but at least they have provable reason. I've picked flights to avoid the US as a stop over simply because I don't feel safe traveling there with electronics, not that I have anything to hide but I don't think that matters anymore.
Call me old fashioned but I just don't want to be irradiated and have all my electronic devices seized and violated at the whim of some random overpaid security guard with a bad attitude.
Dealing successfully with the ironically-named 'justice system' (where 'successfully' is defined as 'minimal loss of wealth/immediate freedom/future earning potential/continence' is based on two key factors:
1) Do not appear to have anything confiscatable
2) Flatter their ego
Stupid people care about the law. They think that if they obey the law, they will be ok. The fact is, the law really doesn't matter. Cops don't know the law, they just enforce it. The most important thing is to not get involved with the police, and if you do, to not get arrested. If you get arrested, you have already lost.
The law only matters after you are arrested. But even then, you will end up plea-bargaining to an unrelated charge anyway. The idea that you will stand up before a judge and he will see that you were in compliance with the law and you will achieve some kind of 'justice' is pure naivete. Even if the case is dismissed, you lost.
He'll get his boat back. More worryingly this was the third attempt at delivery. It broke down *twice* before and had to return to the manufacturer when attempts were made to deliver. A bigger entity really does not want him to have his boat! Boats breaking down is serious. You evade storms in a working boat.
In post Patriot Act America, the library books scan you.
Is it that we're NOT supposed to care because this is a rich guy who got fucked?
I don't know about you, but I figure that this isn't good, even though I, personally, have never lost anything to border security.
Guess what happens when the victim isn't rich?
They buy a domestic boat instead of outsourcing?
I know it's a little off topic and few are likely to read an AC's post anyway :), but I have a story of government bureaucracy bullshit related to the U.S./Canadian border.
Years ago, I tried to cross the border to get into Canada from the U.S. I had been arrested about a year before or so on a minor charge--interference with government operations. Basically some asshole cops were abusing their power, arresting kids outside a music venue, throwing them into the ground, and one of them threw his elbow into me on his way over, knocking me back. So I stood my ground. When he told me to move back, I told him that I wouldn't because a) he hit me on the way over , b) I hadn't moved since this whole thing started, and c) what they were doing wasn't police work, it was plain and simple bullshit. (Btw, one of these cops was later thrown in jail for murdering his young boy lover, and the other gets in trouble periodically for beating up high school students.) So I got arrested. After they let me go, amidst much snickering as they filled out my charge sheet or whatever on their rinky-dinky circa 80s mainframe system (it seemed), I went to court (not the real court, mind you, the misdemeanor court) and pled guilty so I could just get out of there. I paid $150 to someone behind a window and left.
So flash forward to when I'm trying to cross the border, and the Canadian border/police officer tells me that I have a felony terrorist offense on my record and they won't allow me in. And I'm like, "What?!?!" Well, there's a felony in Canada with the same name as the misdemeanor that I stupidly pled guilty to. I tried explaining this, and my explanation was along the lines of "So these asshole cops were abusing their power, and I was resisting it," all while the cop I'm talking to is obviously taking these (future murderer and disgraced) cops' sides. So I had to sneak into Canada. I'm not sure, but I suspect that to this day, I am still not allowed into Canada. It's something I could maybe fix with a lawyer, but I'm not rich and I'm stubborn about this bullshit.
So yeah, I'm pretty sure this all happened because of the 9/11 mess, Patriot Act and such. Screw bureaucracy. Screw all of these new government institutions and laws put in place since 9/11 that are just obviously fucked up (TSA, I'm talking about you). And of course, confiscating this guy's boat is bullshit, but as he said, he is rich and he will get it back. How many people have shit like this happen who aren't rich and don't have a popular blog and slashdot to publicize it? I'm guessing far too many.
You know, there exist boats that aren't yachts and are inside the purchasing power of many people.
upon the advice of my lawyer, i have no sig at this time
More evidence for thr 10,000 year old theory that people want government power to enrich themselves.
Stop following words and lok at actions. Someone came up to someone else, waved their hands, and took something. Exit the world of seductive, disabling memes.
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
..where "people" with sub-100 IQs who should be unemployed or on welfare now work for federal agencies (especially DHS and TSA) and are given a gun, a badge, and the power to ruin your life. This is just the beginning. It's about to get a LOT worse.
Guess what happens when the victim isn't rich?
We never hear about it, and the agent seizes his boat and profits.
Corruption is a very real threat.
So only rich people are allowed to make slashdot submissions? No wonder so many of my submissions are voted down so quickly.
So the president is ramming gun control down the throat of the minority who do not wish it.
Unless and until you can make a gun that won't fire at someone who is unarmed, your ownership of a gun has to be regulated by the wishes of the entire society, not just the ones with a gun.
No, he was a dick about it. Instead of simply making a notation and signing, he made a big deal about how the agency made an error. It was a dick thing to do, since $1 Canadian is nearly equal to $1 US.
Technical types get wrapped around the axle over stupid shit like this all the time. I used to, too, before I realized how much more you can get accomplished when you stop being a dick and work with people.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
Where's your messiah now!?
I didn't know there was a minimum income requirement for writing a blog. But thanks for your contribution to class warfare.
Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
honestly, if Coastal Craft's construction is as bad as the grammar on their website... DHS may have saved his life...
-- it's ridiculous how many people misspell ridiculous... (damn, damn, damn...)
Finally! The slashdot libertarian crowd shows their true belief. It's ok for the DHS to steal petty objects from poor people. It's only wrong for the government to take your stuff if it's important rich guy things. Take your iPad? So what you deserve moocher. Impound your car? So what, it's a POS anyway get an education and a job! Take a rich guy's boat? The HORROR! How dare the government we must attack! You guys remind me of Mr. Howell on Gilligan's Island.
Dealing successfully with the ironically-named 'justice system' (where 'successfully' is defined as 'minimal loss of wealth/immediate freedom/future earning potential/continence' is based on two key factors: 1) Do not appear to have anything confiscatable 2) Flatter their ego Stupid people care about the law. They think that if they obey the law, they will be ok. The fact is, the law really doesn't matter. Cops don't know the law, they just enforce it. The most important thing is to not get involved with the police, and if you do, to not get arrested. If you get arrested, you have already lost. The law only matters after you are arrested. But even then, you will end up plea-bargaining to an unrelated charge anyway. The idea that you will stand up before a judge and he will see that you were in compliance with the law and you will achieve some kind of 'justice' is pure naivete. Even if the case is dismissed, you lost.
This is brilliant.
Welcome to another example of the "New Normal" in US Government-Citizenry Relations. Yes. YOUR Government is no longer there for you, YOU are there for the Government: to sustain itself (le gouvernement pour le gouvernement) and to be its loyal subject (so it asserts its own legitimacy and reason-for-being). Pay your taxes, and do what we tell you to... or else!
In the old days, the government worker would have assessed the situation, used their brain to think about it, determined that indeed there was an error, and helped the civilian to correct the situation. That required two things:
1. the ability to think independently;
2. a customer-service (instead of authoritarian) attitude.
Part of the Government Bullying problem is also the "metrics-ization" of people's work; it doesn't matter anymore if you do a good job, just if you "met your targets". This means any kind of issue that takes a bit longer puts a blemish on your work performance. Workers are being rewarded to just get rid of you, one way or the other, as quickly as possible. Next in line step forward!
When the copyright term is "forever minus a day", live every day like it's the last.
How exactly did DHS "steal" it? He has no right to have a boat from Canada without following proper regulation. The builder sent the price in the wrong currency, and he caught the error. The builder needs to resubmit the correct price, in a currency used by the United States, and then he can sign the form correctly, and accept delivery of his boat.
Steal implies doing something unlawfully. This was very lawful. There was no theft what-so-ever. It's not the US government's job to be a currency converter for every one importing an asset or object. Declare the value in USD next time and you won't have a problem.
Simply, I am against misuse of regulation for BIG REASONS.
Writers of the Declaration of Indepence & Constitution knew exactly what happens when a government turns tyrannical.
They had the entire history of the European arena to view tyrannical acts that reduced citizens to mere slave subjects or worse.
Your blasé attitude toward this dystopian paradise is inspiring.
"The two best days of a boat owners life are the day they buy the boat and the day they sell it".
Not sure if that works anymore.
It's only news because it's a rich person and his boat. When they utilize the new Homeland Security policy allowing them to seize any electronic device at the border without suspicion, and decide to hold on to your IPad or cellphone it will most certainly be your problem. And you will have enabled it to be so because you are so cavalier about a person's rights, so long as they have a different amount of wealth as you.
Isnt it fascinating that it's abhorent to violate a poor person's rights, but its chiche to promote violating the rights of the wealthy?
http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2008/10/aclu-assails-10/
As much as you might complain about it, the fact that it works its way up to affect the rich people, who can afford to be outraged and can afford the publicity means that it becomes a lot bigger news than a victim from a less wealthy background. Stories like this slip through the cracks all the time, and they're publicized only on a local level, possibly to friends or family. When it affects someone of this kind of standing, he raises his buddies, lawyers up, and gathers a legal defense and a public outcry, and the government has to step down, hopefully for everybody. The government often has to take the response of the people into consideration, and the more publicity a story about a high-profile person receives, the higher the chance that it becomes a persistent or issue that requires addressing. So yes, it happens to everybody, and not much gets done about it. But the more people it affects and the more people complain, loudly, the more likely it is that powers could be rolled back, instead of quietly advanced.
I think regardless of how in the right the DHS rep is they handled it poorly. If they don't have the authority to change the form fine. If they must seized the boat fine. Explain the the gentleman why you are unable to make the changes and why you must seized the boat. Then let them know what the next step is to get things sorted out. Most people are fairly forgiving of inconveniences if they know why they are happening.
This just smacks of a functionary that enjoys being a pain. As for the DHS agent this is probably not going to go well for them. Even if it doesn't cost them there job it will probably result in a demotion.
He should have waited a week for the sequestration. There wouldn't be anyone at the border to check him.
Well, that bitch is fired
Don't steal, the government hates competition.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
> I used to, too, before I realized how much more you can get accomplished when you stop being a dick and work with people.
That is a nice euphemism for perjury. But I admit that you are right - you get on with people much better if you do not insist on jumping through some pointless hoops just because they are the law. The respect for the law is low, but then again the law deserves no better.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._$124,700_in_U.S._Currency
The difference is, this guy will probably get his boat back (but won't be re-imbursed for fuel used joy-riding it around, or any damage done by the morons who confiscated it).
I mean you have the right to defend your life, liberty, and Property... sounds like that boat was pretty critical to all that.
I'm sorry, but that's bullshit.
By your reasoning the only way for the government to be OK is to not have any law enforcement or courts at all. Because there'd be no point in having them if they can't arrest or prosecute anybody.
Yes, plea-bargaining is a problem, but you make it sound like everybody is equally likely to be in that position, when the reality is that if you're not around criminals, it's unlikely that this will even come into play. Stay away from organized crime and the likelihood of ending up like that goes down drastically.
Canadian boats are unlikely to be any less expensive than American ones are. The Canadian Dollar and US Dollar have been at parity for several years now to within a cent or two. Any cost savings like that would likely be eaten up by the additional transportation costs.
Wow, so the incorruptible are corruptible, lower their wages, and they behave just like authorities across the border, just with higher bribes. Skirt past them with awesome toys, and they become envious in their dead end DHS job. I know border agents definitely hate seeing happy families crossing the borders, so they make it hell to cross back.
This is clearly a conspiracy by the socialist obama administration to punish the John Galt's of our society for not giving up their hard won posessions fast enough.
We must all GO GALT!
It's time to just admit that the terrorists won.
Time to call this game over.
Have gnu, will travel.
Im sure it has nothing to do with Arrington being an asshole most of the time !!!
This is why I think we should have Gun Control only for Govt and Govt employees and not for the rest of the population.
The really stupid part of this system is that the agent *doesn't* profit. Nor does the agency; they lose money on most of these siezures. A brand new boat, perhaps. However, the odds are non-trivial that the modern country where it was manufactured has a court system in which a lien could be placed on the boat, rendering it useless in the area. Yes, it's a dirty trick, and yes, it should be pulled..
Do you think it is not newsworthy if it happens to some ordinary Joe or Jane?
I do.
And even if that Joe or Jane is filthy rich, it's still as newsworthy, isn't it? Even if "not at all newsworthy" is your assessment. In which case, why bring up the wealth?
Name names. This thug needs to be held accountable for her abuse of public trust and power.
"On a scale from 1 to 10, people are stupid"
Is anyone surprised by this? America has accepted a dictator as president. It has also accepted an immense unelected government that operates with impunity and without accountability. Abuse of power is normal and expected.
Since the CAD is currently weaker than the dollar, having declared it in USD instead of CAD would be adverse to the government, which actually makes it easier. (It depends on the exchange rate at the date of export, but based on today.)
(Rulings adverse to the importer entered after Dec 2004 actually HAVE to come from a formal protest.)
http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?c=ecfr&SID=e7f7df984a01d3c9478867fa0f872497&rgn=div5&view=text&node=19:2.0.1.1.19&idno=19
19CFR 173:
 173.1 Authority to review for error.
Port directors have broad responsibility and authority to review transactions to ensure that the rate and amount of duty assessed on imported merchandise is correct and that the transaction is otherwise in accordance with the law. This authority extends to errors in the construction of a law and to errors adverse to the Government as well as the importer.
[T.D. 70-181, 35 FR 13429, Aug. 22, 1970, as amended by T.D. 79-221, 44 FR 46830, Aug. 9, 1979]
 173.2 Transactions which may be reviewed and corrected.
The port director may review transactions for correctness, and take appropriate action under his general authority to correct errors, including those in appraisement where appropriate, at the time of:
(a) Liquidation of an entry;
(b) Voluntary reliquidation completed within 90 days after liquidation;
(c) Voluntary correction of an exaction within 90 days after the exaction was made;
(d) Reliquidation made pursuant to a valid protest covering the particular merchandise as to which a change is in order; or
(e) Modification, pursuant to a valid protest, of a transaction or decision which is neither a liquidation or reliquidation.
 173.4a Correction of clerical error prior to liquidation.
Pursuant to section 520(a)(4), Tariff Act of 1930, as amended (19 U.S.C. 1520(a)(4)), the port director may, prior to liquidation of an entry, take appropriate action to correct a clerical error that resulted in the deposit or payment of excess duties, fees, charges, or exactions.
[T.D. 85-123, 50 FR 29957, July 23, 1985]
 162.23 Seizure under section 596(c), Tariff Act of 1930, as amended (19 U.S.C. 1595a(c)).
(...)
(d) Seizure under 19 U.S.C. 1592. If merchandise is imported, introduced or attempted to be introduced contrary to a provision of law governing its classification or value, and there is no issue of admissibility, such merchandise shall not be seized pursuant to 19 U.S.C. 1595a(c). Any seizure of such merchandise shall be in accordance with section 1592 (see  162.75 of this chapter).
As I understand the circumstances, on importation he performed what's called 'prior disclosure' - (Â 162.74 Prior disclosure.) identifying orally or in writing to the customs officer of the violation, before an actual investigation was begun. In this case the importer is supposed to tender any potential penalties/duties (in this case, none, since the import value was actually LOWER than declared) .
And finally:
 162.75 Seizures limited under section 592, Tariff Act of 1930, as amended.
(a) When authorized. Merchandise may be seized for violation of section 592, Tariff Act of 1930, as amended (19 U.S.C. 1592) only if the port director has reasonable cause to believe that a person has violated the statute and that
(1) The person is insolvent,
(2) The person is beyond the jurisdiction of the United States,
(3) Seizure otherwise is essential to protect the revenue, or
(4) Seizure is essential to prevent the introduction of prohibited or restricted merchandise into the Customs territory of the United States.
(b) No seizure if prior disclosure. Under no circumstances shall merchandise be seized under the authority of 19 U.S.C. 1592 if there has been a prior disclosure of the violatio
-Styopa
to name the agent publicly?
Why can't we go back to using jumpers to configure slot adapter cards? Why? I say!
At least the rich can do their job here and set precedence for the rest of us. The DHS isn't going to get regulated until some rich people are inconvenienced.
many years ago I imported a broken car from the USA to Canada. I had tonnes of documentation, text messages between me and the seller, private messages from a forum printed out along with the forum posts about the sale, 2 copies of the Bill Of Sale and probably other documents that I'm forgetting about. The officer pretty much tossed all the paperwork aside and said "I don't think you paid what you're saying.. He made up a number which was about $3000 more than the $1500 car I bought. And pretty much told me that if I don't agree with it and pay the extra taxes on importing it, they will just take it. It wasn't until I mentioned the name of a friend that works there they got me off the hook. If I didn't do that, then I probably would have refused the pay, they would have taken the car and I would probably have issues crossing the border after that.
Pretty sure most of the states are going to beat him to it. Hmm, it's almost like a majority of the population is ok with it. Damn politicians, bending to their whims.
OK, with what, banning fully automatic machine guns? That's what many of the people you reference think is going on. That's what some politicians actually claim is going on. That what popular media like the Colbert Report have claimed is going on.
However the truth is quite different. They are proposing to ban rifles that are functionally identical to popular hunting and sporting rifles when a 5 round magazine is inserted into them (note many ship from their respective factories with low capacity 5 or 10 round magazines), rifles that differ only in cosmetics. Hold no more rounds than normal rifles, shoot no faster, shoot the same ammunition, etc.
Do you really think an ignorant public supporting legislation that is intentionally being misrepresented is contradicting the GP's suggestion of gun control being forced, it actually seems to be supporting the GP. The misrepresentation being the mechanism by which the government subverts the system.
boats'n'hoes, boats'n'hoes, gotta get more of them boats'n'hoes..
I was stopped for a tail-light out on my truck last night. Two officers in the vehicle and one stayed right at my side with his hand on his firearm at all times. Scary what they are teaching these LEOs these days!
Karma: Bad
Uh, no.
Colorado's proposed legislation is limiting magazines to 15 for rifles, 8 for shotguns.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/17/us/gun-control-laws-clear-initial-hurdle-in-colorado.html?_r=0
Maybe it's you who needs to stop misrepresenting?
There are two types of people in the world: Those who crave closure
Next time buy American you cheap prick!
http://wh.gov/vyC1
The form almost certainly cares about the value at the time of import (since customs duty is based on value of the import, not the USD-value-of-the-foreign-purchase-price-of-the-import-based-on-exchange-rate-at-the-time-payments-were-made), and requires the value to be declared in US dollars, not foreign currency, and Canadian dollars currently trade at very close to 1:1 with US dollars (which Arrington acknowledges, though he states that wasn't true when he made most of the payments on the boat, but doesn't explain why he thinks that is relevant.) Given that the currency exchange rates are fluctuating and, at any given point in time, there is a range of plausible valuations though the current price on any particular exchange will be fixed, the exact CAD purchase price is as accurate as any other valuation in USD.
If Arrington refuses to sign the form because he disputes the CBP's valuation (and, therefore, the amount of import duty that must be paid prior to releasing the boat) then, whatever the basis for the dispute of the valuation, it needs to be resolved before the boat can be released.
Now, maybe if more details are available there is information which supports this being something done wrong bu Customs and Border Protection, but right now it looks like Arrington was presented an accurate form.
going the opposite direction. I just notated on the form which information was false but that the agent insisted I needed to sign it regardless of whether it was true. They didn't seem too happy about that but let me through anyways.
Don't complain about syntax, grammar, or spelling. There is no.hell like input on android.
The LENR article where NASA say it's real and they're investigating it gets under 100 comments.
This one-sided story about some guy's experience with border control after he refused to sign official documentation *on principle* when he could have just signed it and took his boat gets over 400?
Boy, you guys get excited by some weird shit.
Why is an administration who has been militarizing police forces so interested in disarming civilians?
Wait, no I'm not anymore. Shit.
Way to go giving all those Canadian boat-builders work to do. Buy American next time and no complaints.
1) doesn't always work. I've only had one thing confiscated by US customs: A shilling. It's an obsolete coin, no longer legal tender anywhere in the world. Just a little disc of cheap metal. I posted one to a collector in the US. The envelope arrived, but the coin was gone: They actually forwarded on an empty envelope! I'm guessing because of the rule against importing currency. A shilling isn't currency, and hasn't been for decades, but the American inspector presumably wasn't familiar with disused British coinage.
Scr*w you, Mike Arrington.
Poor rich man. Maybe next time you should buy American.
Sure they do, but it usually involves guns and homemade explosives.
from outside the country and lie about their value but you can bring in H1-B visa people and lie about their salaries? Nice.
Yet another example of government corruption
They take care of the customs and other international trade-preventing economy-suppression measures.
I've often thought that the problems inherent in democratically elected governments (yes, I know the U.S. is a Republic wherein sovereignty lies in the person, and not the population at large, but the electoral process is democratic) is that they allow individuals to collectively exercise political power without any individual responsibility. Thus, there is no incentive to seek checks on abuse of such power, when such abuse affects "others".
If there was commensurate risk to each individual in proportion to government abuse of power, things might be different.
Enter the "crazies", you know those that get ticked off, for some state injustice, perceived, or real, and take it out on "society": you know, "you", "your kids", if you happen to be in the "wrong place at the wrong time". Think rogue LA cop Chris Dorner. Doesn't matter if they "get him" in the end: if, in his rage, he kills your wife and kid, they are still dead.
So, the premise is this: increased government abuse of power correlates positively with greater number of "crazies" thinking their constitutional rights are violated (some times they are, some times they're delusional), who will take their rage out on you.
The more abusive government gets, the more likely "crazies" will harm you, or your family.
Perhaps we just need more Dorners, to show the utter incompetence of government to stop them before they cause harm: "Steal my boat, will ya? I'll kill the next 20 people I see!" After all, "the people" are ultimately responsible for government abuse, and should suffer if "they" allow it to persist. Yes, I know that is a falacious argument and completely disregards the rule of law. However, statistically it holds in the sense that the more abusive government becomes, the greater the chance that someone will "snap", and therefore you will suffer collateral damage
So, every time you turn a blind eye to this kind of abuse, you place your kids at greater risk of some "crazies" killing them.
We accept government because order strikes us as safer than anarchy, but at some point of government corruption, that stops being true. Given the propensitiy for public fear to be greatly out of proportion to real risks, perhaps that can be used to an advantage in encouraging a curtailment of state abuse before it truely reaches the point that anarchy (and thus chaotic revolition) actually are to be preferred.
Won't you think of the children?
Recall the mantra: The more abusive government gets, the more likely "crazies" will harm you, or your family.
In Liberty, Rene
Since the beguinning of this US economy slowdown (world recesion) us and canada $ are in parity, so $1 US equal 1$ can. +/- 2cents big deal. !
Ceci n'est pas une Signature !
And that's what really sucks.
The Comprehensive Forfeiture Law of 1984 gives them broad seizure powers. Boats, houses, money, anything if they think it's been used in the drug trade. Microscopic amounts of coke in your twenty dollar bills? Lose the bills and your car that's transporting those bills.
This happens on the Interstate daily. Dan Lundgren was very proud of this bill.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/19/dan-lungren-drug-warrior-reelection_n_2159755.html
http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Asset+forfeiture
That heist has state-sponsored written all over it. Probably pulled off by one of those Euro countries that's bankrupt or almost bankrupt like Greece, Italy, Spain or Portugal. Might have even been pulled by the French too.
You could always advocate getting away from a adversarial justice system that rewards prosecutors for conviction percentages as opposed to actually making sure that the people they jail are guilty. You could put higher penalties on corruption by public servants, and you could put someone in place to arrest and charge those servants who are otherwise immune. There are a lot of situations where checks and balances are broken, or the check is managed by an individual who is overwhelmed by other issues.
We could try to identify where process and fairness break down and correct them as a society.
Point is, there's plenty you could do other than throw up your hands and say, "It's either this or SATANIC ANARCHY!"
Costal Craft builds high tech - high performance - luxury yachts designed for the Pacific Northwest. 48' Coastal Craft 420 IPS
The 48' Coastal Craft 450 IPS lists for $1.2 million.
From U.S. Customs and Border Protection: Importing a boat for personal use into the U.S.Importing a boat for personal use into the U.S.
Rates of Duty: Pleasure boats are generally dutiable when imported into the United States. The following duty rates apply to boats imported for recreational purposes:
-Sailboats and motorboats other than outboard motorboats: 1.5 percent
TechCrunch Guy could easily owe the government $10-$20K in import duties and on up from there.
He needs to show proof of ownership, such as a bill of sale.
Proof that the boat conforms with EPA regulations (Engine Declaration Form).
The documentation on a boat in this class has to be tight.
Welcome to the real world, where border guards carry guns and water is wet.
FWIW, Canada does not allow persons with DUI's to enter their country
https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/402/~/entering-the-u.s.-and-canada-with-dui-offenses
Millions of people can invite themselves into the United States and the government does very little.
Try to bring in your own boat and that's a serious offence.
That's ABSURD!!! He was less than 1% off the actual price.
..to the new normal. Rapidly approaching the state where regulation complexity exceeds economic effort.
Organization? You must be joking..
Say no, nd tell her to take it to court. Posession is 9/10 of the law.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meritocracy
Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
So suck up to power? That's your solution? I can see no possible way that would ever turn out wrong a few years down the line.
http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article38581.html
http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article39053.html
Captcha: uneven
You're digging yourself deeper.
You think it's newsworthy if applied to some ordinary Joe or Jane? Really? So why aren't you ringing up the papers demanding more coverage? There's an article every year or two about some TSA agent being arrested after laptops etc mysteriously disappeared after being confiscated, but for some reason the stories associated with each theft never get reported at the time.
Wonder why? Oh, I know, because this stuff doesn't matter if it's happening to you or me. Even if it's our livelihoods.
Why bring up the wealth? Because that's why we're getting the story. And we're not getting a newsworthy story about widespread corruption or abuse of power or anything like that, but "Zillionaire upset after pissed off govt official holds imported luxury goods awaiting paperwork. Hear his spin on it at 11"
You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
If you don't think the definition of people has changed in the last 220+ years of the Constitution, you should go back to history class. Just because we've used the amendment process most times to expand individual rights (and the definition of which people gets those rights) doesn't mean that's the only way it can be used.
Arrington suggested to the agent that they correct the error. She responded by seizing the boat.
sounds like one side of the story to me. as with most things, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.
you didn't sign the paperwork. I bet she would have done an about-face and detained you instead of the boat.
Howdy howdy howdy
Even if the case is dismissed, you lost.
Oh so woefully true.
Howdy howdy howdy
Rich != member_of_power_elite;
Ie., just another version of "if you aren't doing anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about."
This is false. As an example (sorry I can't cite), the ATF sent a package containing a firearm component which can be used to manufacture a machine gun to someone they didn't like. When he signed for the package before learning what was inside, they arrested and charged him with some felony firearm law violation.
The fact of the matter is, if you aren't doing anything wrong, you have a great deal to worry about. If you are law abiding, you are much more likely to victimized by the government today than by criminals.
We have got to hunt these people down and kill them all leaving no room unturned and none of them alive or you are as under hitlerism if they can take your property without a judges order. It is not an America I want to live in. Fight now or die later.
I can't find that "reasoning" anywhere in the post above, just a message delivered about current problems in a system. You appear to be building a strawman from something in your own head and arguing with that. While it's OK for a cocaine addled ex-DJ to do such shit on Fox the objective there is to get paid for entertainment and not a serious attempt at communication.
You make a decent point, but for some reason I don't think many poor people get their boats seized by customs.
Uh, no.
Colorado's proposed legislation is limiting magazines to 15 for rifles, 8 for shotguns. http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/17/us/gun-control-laws-clear-initial-hurdle-in-colorado.html?_r=0 Maybe it's you who needs to stop misrepresenting?
I'm referring to the proposed federal legislation. The various references to the President in this thread should have given you a clue.
It would have been so simple to strike out $US and replace it with $Cdn...and initial it...
I'm thinking we might have two attitude problems going on here...
Thanks to plea bargaining, the Los Angeles County prosecutor's office has (as of about 2 years ago) a 96% conviction rate.
Do you really believe 96% of all cases were from good arrests??
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
I fucked a rabbit.
For one, you are a rich one percenter. For another, you and your friends all love President Obama, so must love his policies. What are you whining about? You got exactly what you voted for: Bush 3.0.
Isn't it just a little bit strange that we have an agency dedicated to fighting terror which does little more than offer it up to visitors?
Hold on while I work up some tears.
close your parenthesis next time
-Clio
Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
Okay all, the rest of the story(I was there). 1. The amount on both invoice and CBP form were in U.S dollars correctly completed on the form. 2. Just because someone has $$$ and posts something first on the web, doesn't make them true. 3. The officer in question did not act gleefully, in fact SHE called back to the office and vessel manufacturer several times to verify the stated value. 4. The officer in question vilified by this rich individual now has to endure all the grief posted here and elsewhere by Mr rich guy and explain why she followed the LEGAL document value and wouldn't cow to his brow beating. 5. Coastal Craft ended up paying for a broker to perform what should have been a personal importation and guess what The value on that entry was EXACTLY the same as on the CBP presented form. 6. Mr. Rich guy will probably post everywhere now that HE was right due to the fact that he has his boat and did not sign anything, but the fact is that the company took the high moral ground and due to ALL the false posting by Arrington, they paid for the paperwork to be processed. 7. We are all at the mercy of individuals who feel (right or wrong) that they can put out whatever they feel and get hundreds of all of you all worked up about the big bad government, fact is the is/was correct and all of us had to jump thru hoops due to arrington's posts and written falsehoods. 8. I am proud to work with this office/officer and all of you should be ashamed for vilifying her/DHS without knowing the facts. 9. Most working folds have bosses and we are no exception sadly we had to answer many questions for correctly performing our sworn duties due to all the bad press put out by someone who feels entitled or above the public servant. Shame on you.
You are absolutely right. But take a look at the comments on Gawker. Lots of giddy comments about "the rich asshole" losing his boat. All these people so blinded by their pathetic wealth envy that they can't see they could easily be in an analogous situation regarding their own property, be it a boat or their double wide.
For the Stalin-ist USSR it was Motherland, for Nazi Germany it was Fatherland, now for modern US it s Homeland... I've always found that trend a little disturbing.
WOW .. is this the democracy that the USA is dying to spread world wide ?!?!?!?.... where I live, I'd kill her if she do it ... and yeah I am terrorist ... sheesh what a shame !!
People are shocked that government is full of unaccountable, untouchable, corrupt, even criminal elements? Schools not teaching history anymore (I gather they are teaching something that they say "passes" as history).
And anyone point out yet that the DHS in the past year or so has bought more than 1.4 billion rounds of anti-civilian ammunition (not geneva convention legal). With that much ammo the US military could have run wars in afghanistan and iraq for decades.
You got yourself a corrupt, even criminal organization with government backing to do whatever they want with enough ammunition to kill you, your family and your associates many many times over. Anyone see a problem with this?
so our wonderful overlords at the Justice Department could threaten his ass with 5 years in PMITA prison for violating 18 USC 1001 (false statements to the government). Oh, yeah, he'd also be a felon, lose his right to vote and his right to own or bear arms and his right to serve on a jury (ok, he might not mind losing that one) and have his future career prospects drastically diminished because of his status as a convicted felon. However, he may still have a bright future as a politician.
in charge of healthcare.