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TSA's Precheck Registration Program Causing Longer Security Lines (usatoday.com)
McGruber writes: The Associated Press is reporting that TSA's PreCheck program is causing maddening long security lines at U.S. airports. TSA's PreCheck security lanes can screen 300 passengers an hour, twice that of its standard security lanes. Based on that and other increased efficiencies, the TSA's front-line screeners were cut from 47,147 three years ago to 42,525 currently. At the same time, the number of annual fliers passing through checkpoints has grown from 643 million to more than 700 million. The TSA told Congress its goal was to have 25 million fliers enrolled in the PreCheck registration program, but as of March 1, only 9.3 million people had registered for PreCheck. TSA first tried to make up for that shortfall by randomly placing passengers into the express Precheck lanes, but scaled back that effort for fear dangerous passengers were being let through. That's when the regular security lines started growing -- up to 90 minutes in some cases. The TSA is now shifting some resources to tackle lines at the nation's biggest airports, but it claims there is no easy solution to the problem with a record number of fliers expected this summer. To enroll in TSA's Precheck registration program, travelers must pay $85 to $100 every five years, then submit to a background check, in-person interview at an airport, and to being fingerprinted. Unsurprisingly, getting once-a-year fliers to spend the time or the money to register has been a challenge. While 250,000 to 300,000 people are registering for Precheck every month, it will take more than four years at that pace to reach the TSA's target enrollment.
Just a small correction: the interviews don't have to happen at the airport. I was able to go through the interview process about a half our away from the airport, about 5 minutes away from my house. The interview process was painless. The entire thing is handled online, and then in person you just say "yes"/"confirm" to all the information on the form, that's it. The fingerprints are also taken electronically, so nothing messy there. They do the whole hand at once. I was in and out of the place in maybe 10 minutes? I can understand why infrequent travelers wouldn't want to pay the fee, but if you travel regularly it is more than worth it! (especially in airports with super wonky security, like San Diego where you have to leave and re-enter security to switch between gates sometimes)
Airport security does suck everywhere. Australia's is pretty bad. Germany's is pretty terrible too, but the worst, by far, out of any country I have every flow through, is Americas. I have never had more confrontations with security than in the US. Most other countries don't require ID for flying domestically (and fun fact: America doesn't either. Next time, refuse. It takes a little longer, but it's worth it. The US government has no right to restrict transit if you don't have papers. In most EU countries you are required to have ID on you at all time. Not in the US).
Airport security is a joke. It's not security, it's security theatre. They've never stopped a single damn person intending harm ever in the history of their existence. Fuck them, fuck airports and fuck the TSA.
Not to mention, the TSA searches are totally and completely illegal and unconstitutional. Back when airport security was private, it was the airlines getting together to set the standards and searches were part of their terms of service. When the federal government starts doing it, it now becomes a 4th amendment violation. Texas tried to return airports to private security and was bullied by the federal government and gave up the fight. The new mm-wave body scanners have a massive false positive rate and are effectively useless.
This is a misleading report. Attributing long lines to TSA pre-check is false; attributing long lines to mismanagement would be more accurate. Problem with TSA precheck enrollment? Drop the price. Recently; in 75% of the airports I've traveled - the TSA Precheck line was closed. This article is completely bogus; and everyone should do their own due diligence than blindly believing these reports and redistributing these articles. Please - due your own diligence; mainstream media has a long track record of misleading people.
From 2 flights a month or so to near zero death bed visits are the only reason now.
I was told the only interview location was at the airport. How dod you get interviewed away from it?
The interview process was painless but be away they are looking at the entirely of your government accessible records when doing so.
If you travel even once internationally Global Entry (which includes PreCheck registration) is utterly worth getting, just to skip customs lines coming back into the U.S.. And like the article says, the $100 Global Entry registration lasts five years.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
If you travel overseas, go for Global Entry. It costs the same ($100), and it includes PreCheck as a perk. As an added bonus, you get to use kiosks for passport control (never a wait) and the crew line for customs.
I routinely take 8-10 minutes total from deplaning at LAX (Bradley Terminal) to the terminal exit. A bit longer if I have to wait for checked luggage. Worth every cent.
I tried every decent and legal way I could think of to resolve the issue w/the business before I rented the chicken suit
So, what's the problem, exactly?
I mean, do we want faster lines, more people in the pre-check program, a cheaper program, safer flights, less complaints, what?
Maybe we want convenience without the need to define what that is.
On a side note, sufficiently frustrated travelers may mean fewer flights which could lead to a decrease in global warming.
our flight at SEATAC because of long security lines. The TSA is really hurting airlines. They had to book us on later flights, and in some cases on a different airline which I assumed cost them money.
I'll never get fingerprinted like a criminal for anything. The fact that people willingly so do is a testament to the fact that the typical American is a fool.
It's bad enough that we are forced to endure 4th Amendment violations to travel freely so I will not add insult to injury by submitting to this egregious precheck program.
Active duty military are automatically enrolled in TSA pre-check without any additional effort or payment on the member's part. That is probably a good percentage of the claimed 9.3 million registered persons.
The Associated Press is reporting that TSA's PreCheck program is causing maddening long security lines at U.S. airports.
That doesn't make any sense at all... Please refrain in the future from including the TSA & long lines in the same phrase, you crazy bastard.
Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.
Ernest Hemingway
While we are at numbers: how many ready-to-strike terrorists the TSA caught?
I fly a lot, and routinely notice that the body scanners take about 5x as long as the metal detectors (and probably cause cancer). I regularly watch the TSA agents clear their backed-up lines by opening the metal detector for 30 seconds, sending 10 people through, and then closing it again (making the value of the scanner clearly questionable).
Have they actually found any of those by now?
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
The airlines have the money, so TSA can KILL ALL who enter.
Simple. Efficient. Clean.
And TSA Zombies can rob the dead and eat the brains! That saves DHS from raising the minimum wage and requiring Obama Care on TSA Zombie employees!
It's a WIN-WIN People!
Ha ha
whole idea that every passenger can be checked enough to detect any item that can be used in terrorist attack is stupid, impracticable, and as this story shows unmanageable.
if the aim is to deter terrorists from going through a check point, best solution is to subject random passengers ( and this has to be completely random, with all passengers having equal chance of being checked, with no possibility of knowing who will be checked) to fullest possible checks available. that way checks can be reduced in number to be manageable, checkers will be alert and multiple, and all the while there would continue to be doubt in terrorist's mind about his chances of passing through.
No point in bombing the airplanes anymore, just bomb the TSA checkpoint.
No, their policy of making people take off their shoes is causing long lines.
You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it dissolve.
I arrived at the airport over an hour and a half early, and you still blame me?
Yes, whatever. I fly 6 times a konth from end to end. I have "pre-check", and scoot right through. Normal lines seem normal. I walk to the front, keep my belt and shoes on, and head directly for the the food court where I have sushi and beer, and then pre-board. If you hoi polloi want to ignore simple rules of flying without issues, more power to you. Me? I like to be educated on how to fly, and end up with no issues.
If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
Probably because they let all these "PreCheck" assholes skip you in line. The entire thing is a farse.
It is nothing but theater - i.e. something to give people a (false) sense of security. And also to fill the pockets of whoever is supplying the equipment and training. But, the worst thing of all is that it is a complete victory for the terrorists - they indeed got us to be permanently afraid.
Although I travel often I am against the pre-check because it seems like a scam to have to pay $85 to be treated like a citizen again.
Things will go a lot faster. I'd rather take my chances than rely on the unreliables.
This is very wrong on so many levels. I met a former TSA and she explained how working there is hell made by those at the helm. They are all former Military with military training and mentality, enforcing military discipline onto the TSA workers and onto us, the citizen. She also mentioned that TSA workers send a lot of feedback to their superior but are met with either disciplinary measure or contempt.
tbh, it couldn't be worse than what we have now (and by 'now' I mean both pre and post Obamacare)
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
I've traveled internationally multiple and the customs lines were never more than a few minutes coming back. Did you have a different experience?
An hour and a half coming back through Minneapolis, an hour or two mostly coming back through Chicago, LA and Denver in prior years. Every now and then is was perhaps 15 minutes but I think only once was it ever less than that - and part of that is determined by how fast you are able to sprint past everyone else getting off the plane ahead of you.
Since getting global entry I've usually skipped over lines that looked like at least a half hour, probably more...
A friend of mine just recently came in through Chicago, and it took her over two hours to get through customs - nearly missing her connecting flight.
Even if the customs lines were NOT bad, Global Entry is still worthwhile because you don't have to do the short but pointless interview - you just answer a few entry questions on-screen (like are you bringing in lots of goods or have you been around livestock), scan your passport and then you just collect luggage and leave. It's guaranteed to at least save you some time, but it's just as valuable for not having to deal with a conversation when groggy off a plane.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
The maddening long lines have existed since the TSA began. What sort of PR is this that Pre-Check is the problem?
However, someone told me there was often no waiting at the office. I went down with a book to read, expecting to wait and, sure enough, there was no waiting.
I don't think that always works, but I also went down without an interview - I think I had to wait 20 minutes, but it was still better because I went at a time that was really convenient for me rather than worrying about making a specific appointment. The interviews are very short too so there are often gaps between them doing an interview and the next person showing up it seems.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Having recently gotten Global Entry (and TSA Pre) I was surprised that the only one airport can do the interviews - Logan. I started the paperwork in October and the first available interview slot was in late February. So for 6+ million people or so where Logan is the nearest airport that performs the interviews, guess how many people the TSA actually had working when I went in? Two...(I will say given their crushing workload and probably mostly irate customers over the long delays they were actually very nice people and pretty efficient).
For me it was only a 45 minute drive, but for a lot of people Logan would be over a 4 hour drive (one way, and 2x that if they lived way up). Seems to me if they want people to sign up then every airport should be able to do this? Though probably the number of people that would want Global Entry is small relative to TSAPre, but it's another reason to think twice about bothering to go through with it.
I think pre-check is only available to US citizens. I have APEC that gets me through immigration and customs quicker but not the TSA checks. USA is by far the worst country I have to travel thru and LAX is the worst in the world, no contest. I hate the TSA checks there, so damn slow!
I did have a really pleasant TSA experience leaving North Carolina recently. They allowed travelers to leave shoes and belts on, laptop and toiletries in bags. The end result was an experience on par or better than what I normally have outside the USA. Not sure if it was a one off thing but there was short queues and happy travelers.
As is usually un-needed on Slashdot, I read the article. This summary and article are both misleading. It's not Pre-Check that's the problem. It's that TSA cut staff in expectation of lightening workload (thanks to Pre-Check) that's the problem.
If TSA had done The Right Thing (tm) and waiting until the numbers actually bore themselves out before letting go of all of that staff then they wouldn't be in this mess.
seems like a scam to have to pay $85 to be treated like a citizen again.
Citizens don't get fingerprinted, interviewed and have to have a background check to fly.
It doesn't help that the TSA check points aren't always sufficiently staffed to run the Precheck lane(s). My home town airport often has the precheck lane closed. As a booby prize I get a car which lets me keep my shoes on, but I still have to take out my laptop and liquids. If they are serious about getting people to enroll in the program (which I did) than they damn well need to make sure that we can make use of it. How can they hope to convince people to pay the fees to enroll in precheck if they might not even get to make use of the program.
Even worse when you think about it this way:
You pay $85 and go through a bunch of rigamarole so the TSA can save money by cutting back on screeners?
My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
when the guidelines globally are 2 hours then yeah...
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
I agree, so I got US Global Entry, which is $100, but is through customs, and it gives you pre-check with it. I rationalized myself that it was OK giving $100 to customs because at least they serve a legitimate and important purpose.
Even a misdemeanor "Disturbing the Peace", the lowest you can get, will block you from being approved for the TSA's PreCheck program.
This, even though you might still hold valid a US SECRET or TOP SECRET security clearance.
So we started a special lane, where people would be thoroughly examined, so they could go through screening faster.
Anticipating efficiencies, fire 10% of the screeners.
Resulting in extra congestion.
To relieve the congestion, put random *UNSCREENED* people in the pre-check lane.
Seriously, Joseph Heller couldn't have written it better.
-Styopa
There's no evidence that the backscatter X-Ray machines are a cancer risk to passengers (they are probably more of a risk to TSA employees that are exposed long term).
And that is because the X-ray scanners did not go through FDA testing for safety, and also because we are relying on the manufacturer's measurements of the delivered dosage.
And relying on the manufacturer's estimate that the screeners will engage the system once, and not several times (as for example, when a really hot looking redhead goes through).
If you extrapolate the X-ray-to-cancer curve dosage to the amount the scanners are reported to deliver, and multiply that by the number of passengers per year (about 3/4 of a billion, more or less), it comes out to about 10 extra cases of cancer per year *caused* by the airport scanning.
(And this doesn't account for the number of people who die because they drive long distances rather than have their teenage daughter scanned or groped in public.)
You are confusing absence of evidence with evidence of absence.
Actually there's another location in an office park in Warwick, Rhode Island (RI DHS office). I only had a 4.5 month wait for my GE interview (a year ago, its not getting any better). They clearly haven't done the math -- if the wait was shorter, I'd suggest my wife and friends do it. As it is, I'd only suggest it for true road warriors.
If they want people to do it, make it so you can arrive an hour early for your next flight and sign up at the airport -- not wait 5 months.
If you're going to do it, might as well do GE. I don't know that many road warriors who don't do at least an occasional international flight. And you can easily wait 75 minutes at Logan for customs/immigration if you're sitting in the back of the 2nd 747 to land in a row.
Last thing I want is for the government to have additional data on me, such as my fingerprints. The more data the government has about me, the more likely they'll get a false positive because of an error on their part.
Background
I grew up in New Jersey but left in 1998 to take a job in Utah. About a year after I left New Jersey, a college campus security guard wrote the wrong license plate number on a parking ticket, listing the license plate number for my old vehicle. By that time mail was no longer being forwarded to my new address so I received no notification that there was any issue. Almost 10 years later I moved from Utah to Colorado only to find out that my license had be previously suspended in New Jersey due to this bogus parking ticket. I spent months trying to resolve the issue.
Don't you dare touch it!
you misspelled 'poor provisioning and inappropriate staff & cost cutting measures causing longer security lines'.
Business heads seem to have never learned this generation that in order to perform tasks you need a certain number of hands, or at least an appropriate analog specialized for the task at hand. You can fire everyone and wonder why no work gets done, but your customers will probably be able to tell you (except by that point, who listens to *customers*? that's what focus groups are for...)
Although I travel often I am against the pre-check because it seems like a scam to have to pay $85 to be treated like a citizen again.
Sure it is. But take an estimate of the value of your time and multiply it by the amount of time you spend waiting in line. If you travel very much, it's a scam that's well worth what it costs. Though I agree with the many who've recommended doing Global Entry instead. It's what I did.
10+ years ago, when I made about what I do now and had 1.5x the vacation, plus a 4-day work week, and ticket prices were 1/4-1/2 the current prices, I flew very regularly. It might have been worth it back then, but with the 1-2 flights I make a year now, it's just not worth it.
Then again, I'd happily pay for Global Entry if it meant I could avoid all security theater and customs PLUS ended my paying any more outrageous TSA fees.
I guess my point is that it's way too expensive. At $40, I'd do Pre Check without hesitation. At $80 as an addition to my passport renewal (with the same period of validity), Global Entry would be an obvious choice. At no more than one international flight every couple years, with most to adjacent countries with really smooth customs processes, it just isn't worth $200 for 10 years for GE or $170 for 10 years with PC. They're simply not cheap enough and don't have enough benefits for a very casual irregular traveler.
They could add a few million more people to TSA PreCheck by adding people that hold U.S. security clearances. It baffles the mind that they haven't already done this, as the background checks for DoD Top Secret and DOE Q clearances are much more thorough than the TSA background check.
These systems that require payment for favorable treatment and faster pass-through security checkpoints are akin to soft-corruption since they cost money to attain such elevated status. Their value is questionable and the procedure and process to pass-through is a bureaucratic joke without elevating security in any way. My in-person interview was getting a glace by a TSA employee and being asked my name. (Speaking as a Global Entry and TSA PreCheck holder.)
I remember a while back that they had a pilot program that I encountered a few times where experienced travelers with some specific rules could go into a special lane. I met whatever the requirements were and that was always like 2 minutes, tops, because I had everything prepared and everyone else in that lane was completely prepared, so there was never a delay in that line.
I really miss that... It was nothing like standing in an hour-long lines with a bunch of mouth-breathers that rarely fly and can't follow simple directions.
tbh, it couldn't be worse than what we have now (and by 'now' I mean both pre and post Obamacare)
Oh yes it can! You see, I have traveled, and I have seen much worse!
This is the very clever beginning of a grand scheme.
In time they can make the prescreening passes essentially mandatory for anyone that flies. They could charge $500 per year. If you don't have one then you are suspect and need to go through a mandatory two hour procedure involving search of body cavities. The whole TSA could become a profit centre for the government.
Health insurance was not a problem until the Government got involved (a reoccurring theme). I grew up in the 70s and got to see the collapse and corruption of just about everything thanks to Government "help". Pre Obamacare is 25 years of regulated monopolization and wealth redistribution which resulted in the collapse of thousands and thousands of free hospitals and clinics. Attorneys, Bureaucrats, and their executive buddies got rich and everyone else got screwed.
Too long of a discussion here, but go read some Milton Friedman for starters.
-The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.
So the membership fee I pay to get TSA PreCheck is just there so TSA can save money and reduce staff? The more money they make from PreCheck the more cutbacks they perform? Where does the money go???
Local media has been covering the two+ hour TSA delays for months. How could you possibly not know about it?
Many of the people flying in and out of the US aren't citizens... I'm not, and they already have my fingerprints (taken every time I enter)...Open it to schengen member nations, lower fees and drop in-person interview. That would make sense...
...Osama is laughing his ass off.
I've calculated my velocity with such exquisite precision that I have no idea where I am.
mandatory two hour procedure involving search of body cavities
Excellent. My taxes are paying for me to be molested, and they damned well better do a thorough job of it. None of this slapdash scanny nonsense followed by a quick grope.
I fly a lot. Not as much as the tech sales guys I work with, but enough to get Alaska's MVP75K top-level status in just the last half of last year. A few years back I had top-tier status on United and Alaska in the same year. So I have one of those nice little cards that lets me go thru the "premier/first class" lines at every airport. AND STILL the process sucks, and remains a constant source of despair for the state of business, security, and the country.
To wit:
1. Orwellian PRE bureaucracy: I cannot get a PRE approval, because my state ID (DL) doesn't list my middle initial, while my passport does. I would have to produce a certified copy of my birth certificate to correct the state ID, and my original birth certificate has a one-letter misspelling of one of my parents' names. It is a clusterfuck. And why the hell should I have to pay a private company for what amounts to a national ID card anyway?
2. The nakey microwave: The goddamn "millimeter wave" (high frequency microwave) xray machines are STILL NOT TESTED OR CERTIFIED as medically safe for xray exposure, only that they're safe from a heat damage perspective. It would be a federal crime to use one in a hospital, because there have been "no human tests or studies to prove scanner safety." And yet the TSA video playing at top volume above the line makes baseless claims that it's perfectly safe...
3. False positives: Even when I resign myself to go through the untested scanner, for me it gives a false positive about 75% of the time. Apparently I have oddly shaped legs. So I have to wait or step to the aide and get a patdown, which often takes as long as the opt-out groping (without the RF exposure).
4. The intentional delays: When I opt-out, the procedure is to let me stand there for at at least 5 minutes before calling a screener to come grope me. Not joking about this -- I had about 60 TSA pat-downs last year all across the US, and often the gate agent would just call "MALE ASSIST" off into the void to no one (literally calling out to an empty area). A few minutes later, they would say it again to the agent on the other side of the microwave box, and then someone would come up and walk me back. It was consistent enough to wonder if there's a policy to make sure that opt-out takes long enough to discourage others.
5. Nonexistent training for TSA: The opt-out manual screening procedure is passed on through oral tradition. I'm supposed to be read a statement about the procedure, asked if I want a screening in private, asked if I have medical devices (I do, so it matters), or if I have any sensitive or painful areas. Only 1 in 4 TSA agents remember to ask all of these, and I've frequently had to remind agents of what they're supposed to ask me. On 4 different occasions in the last quarter, I've had a newly hired TSA agaent being instructed on how to do the procedure by a slightly less inexperienced agent -- with no written instructions, no consistency to the procedure, and the instructor omitted one of the key points EVERY TIME. It's clown school.
6. Total failure to detect: They have no idea what to look for -- through some unintentional testing. I found an unsubtle pocketknife (a kershaw switchblade my teenager had bought) stuck between the frame and outer covering of one of the rolly bags I use -- after I'd used it half a dozen times as a carry-on, and TSA had missed it EVERY time. I can carry on a bag full of a dozen lithium-ion battery packs, and they don't even blink. A ziplock baggie full of random powder? No problem, as long as it's not a liquid or gel... But god forbid my girlfriend use a Lush product with too much glycerine in the lotion, and they're calling the explosives expert.
I could go on. A lot. But there's no point; there's already way way too much money invested into this security theater, enough that it has become its own ecosystem. Stopping now would mean publicly acknowledging the total lack of success or value. Not gonna happen... And
I think not...(*poof*)
Is opting out even still an option?
I remember reading here some months ago that the TSA had tried to institute a new rule that everyone had to go through their scanners.
One failed shoe bomb...
Microsoft gets 6 free articles on the main page. Is this what slashdot is reduced to, shilling for the MICROS~1 organization?
I remember a while back that they had a pilot program that I encountered a few times where experienced travelers with some specific rules could go into a special lane. I met whatever the requirements were and that was always like 2 minutes, tops, because I had everything prepared and everyone else in that lane was completely prepared, so there was never a delay in that line.
I really miss that... It was nothing like standing in an hour-long lines with a bunch of mouth-breathers that rarely fly and can't follow simple directions.
They were the black diamond lanes. Gone ever since TSA PRE came along
I fly to the US 2-3 times a year. The last two times I flew in, GE was offline at my airport of entry. The last time, as a matter of fact, GE was offline as three Triple-7s disgorged their passengers in to the Immigration hall, or more properly speaking, the lines snaking through the hallways leading to the immigration hall. There were GE people with us, and they were very pleased about having invested their hundred bucks.
So why should I shell out the $100 and go through the trouble? Besides, I often travel in the company of people who cannot even get GE, so it's useless then?
Here's the other thing about TSA Pre that nobody's commented on: Where the hell do they think they're going to find 25 million people to sign up for it? There are 240 million adults in the US. Of those, one third, or 80 million, flew on an airplane in the last twelve months. Of the rest, It's evidently clear from my recent flights that a sizable chunk, say half, only flew one trip in the year. Those people aren't going to sign up for TSA Pre. So, say 40 million adults fly more than one round-trip in a year. Now, TSA Pre offers two benefits: 1. You don't have to pull crap out of your bags and scan your shoes, and 2. You don't have to wait in line. Now, I don't like 1, but 2 is the killer, and 2 is what sells TSA Pre.
So let's look at those 40 million. Many of them will be flying in and out of a smaller airport, and there's not much benefit in a security bypass there. So only the ones who fly through mid-size and large airports will be interested. Now you've got to eliminate the elite status frequent flyers, who get the bypass lane to the sock hop. True, many of them get TSA Pre paid for by the airline (who also pays for the bypass) or by their credit card company.
In short, there's no way they can get to 25 million signups. There's just not the market there for that. That's doubly so when their own system breaks down (as well as when they sabotage it themselves).
Depends on the model of plane.
For the price of 45,000 FTE's and 30-90 minute lines to board every airport in the country, you could move the damn axe and install a steel door with a manual release from the cockpit. Now all a terrorist can do is blow the plane up, and he can blow up a bus--so the rest is just stupid theater.
Unfortunately, people care more about stupid theater than they do about having a pleasant flight or making their travel efficient or encouraging tourism.
Yep, but it's a bargain if you have kids. My wife and I signed up for Global Entry and it covers our little ones when they travel with us. Totally worth it.
Exactly. The main problem with the TSA is that they simply need more people. If we are going to impose these security regulations, we have to make sure we have the money to buy the manpower and infrastructure necessary to implement them. They need to triple the number of people working in some airports to shorten those lines and treat people like humans, not make privileged people pay extra. The lines at TSA at some airports have gotten so bad that I see it as a human dignity issue. And don't even get me started on passport control. The way international visitors are greeted (often with 2 or 3+ hour waits) is an utter disgrace that makes the TSA checks look like Disneyland.
>"To enroll in TSA's Precheck registration program, travelers must pay $85 to $100 every five years, then submit to a background check, in-person interview at an airport, and to being fingerprinted. "
Yeah, because I am really going to submit to being FINGERPRINTED so I can be searched without probable cause EVERY single time they run anybody's prints for ANY reason from ANY agency. I think not. Totally unacceptable.
Fingerprints should not be used for biometrics. Period. Once you give this data to the government (or big business), it will NEVER be erased or restricted, regardless of claims or laws- it will go into huge databases and shared between all agencies and used however they want for as long as they want.
If they really need a biometric for this "feature" of security, there is only one safer and practical biometric I know of- that is deep vein palm scan. That registration data cannot be readily abused. It can't be latently collected like DNA, fingerprints, and face recognition can. You have to know you are registering/enrolling when it happens. You don't leave evidence of it all over the place. When you go to use it, you know you are using it every time. And on top of all that, it is accurate, fast, reliable, unchanging, live-sensing, and cheap. If you must participate in a biometric, this is the one you should insist on using.
Example: http://www.m2sys.com/palm-vein...
But we also need to realize that IT IS NOT EVERYONE'S BUSINESS WHAT WE ALL DO. The first step in securing freedom is privacy. When you are tracked, you are losing your freedom, whether you realize it or not. And the whole TSA security theater is a scam on everyone.
You've never flown with EasyJet or Ryan Air.
Maybe they don't live in Seattle and were trying to leave after a business trip there? They could have been in the city for less than a day. Why should they be expected to have read the local press for several months in advance of their trip?
And by their own audits, THEY DON'T CATCH 95% OF THE WEAPONS PLANTED ANYWAYS!!!!!!
Get rid of them, the whole lot, starting in Washington, and moving outside the beltway once that entire area is cleared.
This system is a joke, a horrible, disgusting joke, being played on every American out there. Welcome to the Banana Repulik formerly known as the USSA!
it will take more than four years at that pace to reach the TSA's target enrollment.
No, it won't, because when the queues reach 3 hours of waiting, everybody will jump to enroll. It's a flawless strategy.
Once again, measurable savings (reduce the personnel) trump much bigger, but unmeasurable loses (the zillion hours lost by travellers).
Rome taught me patience and assiduous application to detail. Virtues which temper the boldness of great, general views.
The in-person interview is only for Global Entry. For TSA Precheck all you do is pay a $85 fee and get fingerprinted. Less than a week later you have a known traveler number. Many airports not only make it quicker and easier for you, but anyone you booked at the same time. Also, if you have a higher-end AmEx card, they pay it for you. I am so glad I enrolled in PreCheck. My normal time through security is about 10-15 minutes from getting on the line to being all the way through, with it sometimes being significantly less.
But it was the best 85 bucks I ever spent. Very little standing in line, keep my shoes on, keep my laptop in my bag....yeah, it's worth it. I fly about once a month. It just makes the whole trip easier, less worrying about time, less hassle, I love it.
We got to stop this turning back to the dark ages thing we're doing. Control this control that, nothing really ensures anything - the only thing that comes out of all of this is massive citizen surveillance and doesn't stop terrorism at all. In fact - I'd go as far as to say it's the ROOT of future terrorism on the population. We seem to have completely forgotten what the constitution is all about, every man (and woman) has the right to pursue their dreams where ever they want to, whether in America or not, be it Europe, be it Asia...doesn't matter - as long as YOU are happy! I'm a Norwegian (so don't even think that I'm a desperate refugee as I'm 100% native to Norway and we're doing just fine, and we can afford to open our borders as well. I'm actually kind of sick and tired of this ridiculous madness where borders are closed for certain people. People are PEOPLE and you can live where you want.
What this world is coming to - is for you and me to decide.
just goes to show that that the multi-year hot ticket show is Security Theatre.
Just about any elective surgery is far cheaper than it used to be. Of course, people pay for elective surgeries out of their own pockets.
one state, Arkansas, IIRC, having 90% of the population being served by only one (ONE!) health insurance company. Clearly that company was capable of ruining people by jacking up their rates, because they owned the market. Obamacare was going to bring diversity to the market with dozens of non-profit coops to save the people!!
At the time, I looked it up and that 90% insurer was a non-profit BCBS.
It's just that most of them are located on airport properties.
I signed up for this just because my wife is a million-miler and got two free signups as a promotional deal. Includes TSA Precheck and lets you swipe a card at a kiosk at most big Customs areas (like ATL's nice new intl terminal, where we fly from).
I also have a passport card, which was like $10 extra when I last renewed. It's only good for travel to Canada, Mexico and some Caribbean islands, but sure makes me feel better having it in addition to a full passport when overseas.
For a long time TSA was using the precheck lanes for overflow, which seemed to utterly defeat the purpose, even knowing that it's 99% theater.
I felt this way too, and for years I "fought the system" by going thru the regular line and forcing them to pat me down in front of everyone. In the end, no one cared but me -- not the TSA and not my fellow travelers. I realized that my time is worth a lot more than having to cough up $85 every five years. Getting PreCheck is indeed like a time machine back to pre-9/11 airport security, and anyone who travels more than a few times a year should have it IMHO.
Is anybody really surprised how incompetent a central government is?
Programs designed to shorten security lines make then longer.
Affordable Care Acts make health care more expensive.
Patriot Acts take away liberties and are unconstitutional.
Minimum wage increases that seek to help poverty costs millions their jobs.
"A plan fiendishly clever in its intricacies"- Homer Simpson
No, their policy of making people take off their shoes is causing long lines.
It's up to the individual airport, but some US airports actually tell you not to take off your shoes for security but others still want you to do it. I've been in both in the past couple of years.
I fly a lot. The amount of time I wait in security is highly dependent on when I arrive.
Airline schedules are more compressed than they were in years past. There are fewer flights than there was in days of past; the flights are all 95-100% full, however. This is why canceled flights are such a disaster: there simply isn't room for everyone on the non-canceled flights. It's hard enough if a single flight is canceled; a whole day of cancellations requires creative booking and cooperation with other airlines, often with people forced to choose alternate airports.
Certain times of the day are obvious desirable for travelers: 7AM-9AM and 6-8PM. Midday flights are less common and even in hubs on common routes, you'll see a schedule like 7AM, 8:30AM, 11:30 AM, 5PM, 8PM. Every airline does this, so if you're arriving in the morning, it's jammed. At night, there's far fewer flights as well and the lines are short. Take that 3PM flight and arrive at security at 1PM? Place will be a ghost town.
In years past, airlines would run schedules like 7AM, 8AM, 11AM, 1PM, 2:30PM, 5PM, 7PM with each flight 75-80% full. Then another route would run those times +/- 30 minutes. This spaced the travelers out a lot more and made security a bit better. Now with a reduced number of flights, all of which are happening at the same time, people are there are certain times only. That makes the lines worse then. Travel at an off-hour or arrive earlier than you need to and you'll usually blaze right through the lines.
It's not the taking off of shoes and belts. These things come off quickly. It's the putting them back on that takes all the time. Many people are smart and considerate enough to grab their stuff and move past the conveyer belts (others of course are not).
Easier answer, stay out of the USA.
Since I'm a US Citizen that might be a tad problematic.
Kiosks for passport control? Never wait? This has never been a problem for me...
That is not the standard experience. I've traveled out of the US a fair bit. About 20-30% of the time the wait has been minimal. The rest of the time the wait has been at least 30 minutes and I've had waits as long as 90 minutes. Curiously the US is generally the more hostile (for lack of a better word) to people entering the country than most of the countries I've been to and I've been to places like Vietnam and China which are not exactly bastions of democracy.
Never heard of Global Entry or PreCheck.
If you haven't heard of TSA Pre then you haven't traveled in a US airport in the last several years. It's pretty hard to miss the signs. Global Entry is a bit less well known but is available to US Citizens plus a few other countries.
I noticed a few things from my travels that create the delays.
One.. laptops, taking them out and putting them a 2nd tray.
Two.. taking your shoes off. This is rediculous.
Three.. people that don't take off jewelry and beep at the metal detector causing a wand screening before the next person can go through.
And lastly, idiots that wait until their at the front of the line before they start preparing for screening.
Come on people.. take your jacket off, check your pockets, and get your laptop out before you get to the front of the line.
Wtf, is this still a thing?
Yes it is. Shoes, belts, jackets have to be removed. Laptops have to come out of their bags. They have rules about liquids and bottle sizes.
None of it makes any sense or serves any useful security purpose. It's all security theater. Basically I think they are being intentionally annoying to try to get people to enroll in their pre-check programs like TSA-Pre or Global Entry.
I thought it was a hoax or a temporary measure in response to a terrorist attack.
Nope. Not a hoax and not temporary either. The TSA refuses to clarify exactly what threat this is supposedly protecting us from and there is no evidence that it has resulted in a single criminal apprehended or deterred.
Because my addlepated and ill informed friend, government run healthcare -- which comes in a lot of flavors -- has a solid track record of good coverage, adequate results and much lower costs than the US (about half in most countries, two thirds in Canada). You and your obnoxious friends have managed to create a mediocre and incredibly costly healthcare system in the US and then whine endlessly and blame everyone but yourselves for the result. Why, in the face of overwhelming evidence, do you think that the government is the problem when it is abundantly clear that the problem is you?
You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
I have an issue with the "first class lines" to go through the TSA that lead to the same section that other passengers are to go through. Airline employees block a perfectly use able entrance to the line and guide you to a much longer line unless you have first class tickets this is the equivalent to Lexus lanes on public highways i think the practice it deplorable because it creates confusion and annoyance as sometimes the TSA agent at the end of the "special" lane is just sitting there with nothing to do while the normal lane is backed up. this is all created by the airlines to pad their first class feel but it harms the rest of us and at tax payer expense. if you try to go through that line the airline employees block you and threaten you with "calling the tsa" but they are the ones doing something wrong blocking access to a usable gate.
SFO and a few other airports already have private companies, not the incompetent TSA, doing security.
http://www.covenantsecurity.com/subcontents/cascustomerservices/sfo/
More airports need to go this way, and just shut down the TSA.
You hit it on the head - the real reason for TSA is to increase airline profits.
The existence of the TSA has nothing to do with airline profit. TSA is a part of the federal government. As a general proposition they are indifferent to the amount of profit the airlines make. Speaking as an accountant I can tell you that you would have a very hard time showing that TSA has any sort of tangible positive effect on the bottom line of any airline company.
The reason for the TSA is so that politicians don't have the answer the question of why the federal government allowed airline security to be (literally) managed by a bunch of rent-a-cops. TSA was created after 9/11 because there was the perception (true or not) that the companies in charge of airline security previously were doing an inadequate job - which was almost certainly true. The problem is that TSA hasn't done any better as far as anyone can tell and is certainly more obnoxious than ever before. But the politicians get to claim that they did something about the problem, conveniently ignoring the fact that their "solution" didn't solve anything.
TSA confiscates your drinks, while the airline sells you drinks at insane margins.
The only drinks the airlines sell you are the ones in their lounges and on their planes. The stores at the airport have nothing to do with the airlines directly. Typically they lease space from some form of airport authority and are independent businesses in no way associated with the airlines. The notion that the TSA somehow exists to pad airline profits is complete nonsense that doesn't withstand even casual scrutiny.
Eliminate payroll direct deposits for all TSA and DOT employees, including the Sec. of Transportation. Hand the checks to the security screeners at one of the Reagan Airport security lines. If an employee want to be paid he or she just has to get in line every two weeks, wait the usual 45 minutes and show an ID to get the paycheck.
Then extend the system to Congressmen, Senators and Supreme Court Justices, all of whom get to use a special parking lot for free at Reagan and to use a "courtesy" checkin system- quite private with no lines, no xrays, no shoe removal and best of all, no waiting. If this sounds vaguely like the old Soviet system... can't help that.
It is always a temptation to an armed and agile nation
To call upon a neighbour and to say: --
"We invaded you last night--we are quite prepared to fight,
Unless you pay us cash to go away."
And that is called asking for Dane-geld,
And the people who ask it explain
That you've only to pay 'em the Dane-geld
And then you'll get rid of the Dane!
It is always a temptation for a rich and lazy nation,
To puff and look important and to say: --
"Though we know we should defeat you, we have not the time to meet you.
We will therefore pay you cash to go away."
And that is called paying the Dane-geld;
But we've proved it again and again,
That if once you have paid him the Dane-geld
You never get rid of the Dane.
It is wrong to put temptation in the path of any nation,
For fear they should succumb and go astray;
So when you are requested to pay up or be molested,
You will find it better policy to say: --
"We never pay any-one Dane-geld,
No matter how trifling the cost;
For the end of that game is oppression and shame,
And the nation that pays it is lost!"
This Space Intentionally Left Blank
What are you nuts? This made slashdot some time ago. Somebody or other got a hold of an X-ray machine and tested it out. Turns out the odds of causing cancer are about 1 in 10 million. 600 to 800+ million people getting scanned a year. You do the math. Of course with half a million people dying of cancer every year, who's going to notice a few extra bodies...
And that's before all the problems with lack of maintenance, machines putting out 10x the radiation there were supposed to, attractive passengers being repeatedly rescreened, etc. Remember how they used to tell us it wouldn't penetrate the skin? And how the images were private and not stored? Then rate-my-backscatter showed up and you could see folk's bones?
I can't help but notice how, at the dentists or hospital, we get covered in a lead apron, and everyone leaves the room while X-rays are taken. Whereas TSA runs their X-ray equipment in the middle of a very large densely crowded room with no outside verification of safety. Employees weren't even allowed to wear a dosimeter.
As for the new systems, Terrahertz has been shown to break apart DNA in the lab. The body has repair systems. They don't always work right. No testing data on these new machines yet. The TSA and their suppliers are trying hard not to let anyone test them. Not exactly an encouraging sign.
How about the moving parts? What happens when they break down? That's a lot of energy being beamed at you. If it doesn't keep moving... Ouch. Do you supposed they improved the maintenance procedures yet? I mean, we are talking about an organization that made mothers drink their own breast milk, doused sick people with their own urine, and destroyed expensive life-essential medical equipment.
The most dangerous place in any airport is the massive, serpentine line of people waiting for the bullshit security theater obedience ritual. We've known ever since the invention of hand grenades that bunching up is fucking dangerous.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
What I dont get is why they are not giving them away for free. Have some threshold for freq flyers. Say the '10th time' you fly you get voucher to do the pre-screen for free. Instead of waiting around for your flight you swing by and get pre-screened and they give you one. Then you find out in a week or two by mail if you are pre-screened from then on.
It seems it would be in their best interests to filter out people. It would cut down on staff and let them focus on those who need attention.
"We're The TSA- Slowing You Down Just For The Hell Of It"
"We're The TSA- Using Yesterday's Technology Tomorrow!"
"We're The TSA- We All Gots High School Degrees, Well Sum Of Us Do!"
"We're The TSA- Fat, Lazy, and Uninformed!"
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
While standing in line at an airport about 2 years ago, I overheard two security personnel have this exchange:
Security Person 1: Your turn to use this wand, I want to switch.
SP2: But I don't know how to use it.
SP1: Me either. I just wave it around in the air a bit. It's easy.
I have heard stories of incompetence, and I am not saying they are ALL like this, but the magnitude of this incompetence shocked me.
Most US Government employees have to go through a series of background checks to have an HSPD-12 badge (aka 'CAC card', as it's required for computer access at many agencies)
The badges allow people access to multiple installations, rather than just the one they work at (and thus, aren't necessary for 90%+ of the people who have them, and mostly fix problems that high level administrators ran into, thus forcing this crap on all of the rest of us).
As we have to go through all of these checks already*, why not just let us into the PreCheck lines? Active duty military are allowed to use the lines. (and as I understand it, the HSPD12 badges allow access to military bases ... at least, the time I went to one for my mom's retirement party, when they asked for ID for the guest badge, and I showed them mine, they asked me why the hell I needed a guest badge)
* Of course, this assumes that we've actually gone through the checks. There was evidence after the Navy Yard incident that the contractor that was doing the background checks never actually did them. I know that none of the people that I had listed as part of the background check told me that they had been contacted ... but I don't know if there were special rules in play because my mom & step-dad had active military security clearances)
Build it, and they will come^Hplain.
Done and done.
Anyone who is still willing to fly within the context of the mainland US after the instantiation of the TSA deserves every inconvenience forced on them.
If you don't like the abuse being heaped on you, either do something about it -- like DRIVE -- or STFU. Because all you're doing is whining. It serves no purpose other than to try to spread your own fuckup into other's ears.
If no significant pressure is put on the airlines, this will never change. It'll just get worse.
Do. Not. Fly. Domestically.
Exert some pressure of your own, spend some effort and time. Otherwise, as above, STFU. Whiners.
The whole TSA theater is BS but if they want a quick partial fix to this problem simply let everyone with a concealed weapon permit through the precheck line. The requirements are the same as Precheck with the exception of the "airport interview" which doesn't seem to be a real interview anyway. That would make another 13 million background checked and fingerprinted people eligible to use the Pre lane. Of course that isn't 13 million flyers but it would be an instant and free way to move millions of people out of the traditional screening line.
When I flew back to my uncle's funeral a month ago, the Precheck signup folks were offering a 4-month free trial.
I looked at the monster line to get through the grossly inadequate number of screeners, and signed up for the free trial. Iris scan, fingerprints, all that stuff.
I will not be keeping it past the free trial. As a "once a year, or every other year" flyer, it makes no sense.
A couple of years from now, when I next get on an airplane, I might try signing up for another free trial, assuming this nonsense is still going on. (And assuming they don't keep track of who took advantage of the free trial two years ago.)
I am waiting for sudden realization that the 2nd generation machines can give people cancer as well so that they can be phased out and replaced by 3rd generation machines at a great profit.
Notably, 1st generation are "officially" recognized as unsafe (you can get a lecture from a friendly TSA officer, when opting out from a scan, on how the "new" machines are the "safe" kind of radiation), but no one went to jail for imposing the "bad" radiation on so many people./p>
Because of the legal doctrine of sovereign immunity... if the Airlines were put back in charge of security for their own airplanes then they would be liable for harming people. But if agents of the Federal government do something that hurts people, then it takes an Act of Congress to compensate them.
It really doesn't help that some airports, even major ones, sometimes close or merge their pre-check lines, so there is a line of about 100 people waiting for 2 screening stations when 6 are available. Enough stations, not enough workers, incompetent or not.
Took a flight out of SFO pre check and had to remove my shoes, they examined my bags in front of everyone, then put me in a room for further inspection.
They told me it was random but the lady behind me was in queue for the same bag check followed by the gloved ride in a small room.
To see how government managed health care would look just take a look a the government managed health care system we already have - the VA. People literally dying in line to see a doctor.