Slashdot Mirror
France Says 'Au Revoir' to the Word 'Smartphone' (smithsonianmag.com)
Hoping to prevent English tech vocabulary from entering the French language, officials have suggested 'mobile multifunction' as an alternative. An anonymous reader shares a report: The official journal of the French Republic, the Journal officiel, has suggested "internet clandestin" instead of dark net. It's dubbed a casual gamer "joueur occasionnel" for messieurs and "joueuse occasionnelle" for mesdames. To replace hashtag, it's selected "mot-diese." Now, as the Local reports, the latest word to get the official boot in France is smartphone. It's time to say bonjour to the "le mobile multifonction." The recommendation was put forth by the Commission d'enrichissement de la langue francaise, which works in conjunction with the Academie Francaise to preserve the French language. This isn't the first time that the commission has tried to encourage French citizens to switch over to a Franco-friendly word for "smartphone." Previous suggestions included "ordiphone" (from "ordinateur," the French word for computer) and "terminal de poche" (or pocket terminal). These, it seems, did not quite stick.
which works in conjunction with the Academie FranÃaise to preserve the need of UTF8
ftfy
`echo $[0x853204FA81]|tr 0-9 ionbsdeaml`@gmail.com
I remember when they tried to push back against "cheeseburger", McDonalds in Québec had to write "hambourgeois au fromage". It didn't stick for long. It's called "hamburger au fromage" in the correct form now, but we still call it a freakin' cheeseburger.
C'est le meilleur choix
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
I used to think, being a Canadian, that it was just the Quebec francophones with the hyperactive inferiority complex which manifested like that. In Quebec they are anal about signage to the point of there being ordinances outlining the maximum size of English print on your store front in order to preserve their language (which I won't actually insult France enough to call French and will just call "Quebecois"). They were so adamant about it they had to use a special constitutional opt-out Canadian provinces have called the notwithstanding clause to make it legal notwithstanding a person's right to freedom of expression.
Now I realize this is just endemic to all French everywhere.
...they don't even have a word for "entrepreneur"
i don't speak French but even I can figure out that's a big mealy mouthful... hard for six or seven syllables to come up with two... couldn't they even compromise with a more streamlined "multifonc" ?
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Don't underestimate the link between language and culture.
The French are probably doing the right thing here. (granted removing the invaders is probably a bigger concern; but one that takes a bit more political capital to make happen.)
I believe it's the only language which has a government-supported commission to decide what new words are needed. The result, as with any other bureaucratic organization is that the language is a lot less flexible than English, and adapts much more slowly to changes.
IMO, that lack of flexibility is the reason that English has become humanity's lingua franca.
French IT specialist complained about not being able to find jobs abroad. International companies we asked cited "a lack of knowledge of fundamental IT terms they even know in third world countries" as a reason.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Can you imagine the blacklash if Trump told people what words to use?
No need to imagine; I just don't observe any.
Ezekiel 23:20
After all they are the new norm, and despite various attempts not yet that "smart" after all,
If I were French, I would call it Le Distracteur.
These devices haven't been "phones" for a long time. The "Phone" is but one app on my mobile computer. I like how in The Expanse they just call them "hand terminals." Mobile device or mobile computer works just as well. Let's just remove "phone" from the vocabulary, please?
Aren't they cute tho? I think French people are adorable with their sweet language and yummy foods and fetching fashions too! Everyone should own a French person. Or two in Utah.
But really, there is an aura around France and French things that doesn't exist elsewhere (Brasil is close). It makes economic sense to protect, preserve, promote that aura just as it makes sense for Germany and the US to put some things behind them. If they want a 'pure' language, they're welcome to try and many people do appreciate the effort.
...omphaloskepsis often...
They can get back at us for "French Fries".
This sort of French language and cultural identity protection has been going on for years. I remember once talking to a colleague from Quebec about this. He told me that he had initially been reticent about the idea of moving to the US because there is a sense among the Quebecers that the rest of us English-speaking Americans are out to destroy their cultural heritage. At the time of the conversation he had already been in the US for several years and so I asked him, "well, what is your assessment of American culture trying to destroy French culture?" His response boiled down to, "most of you don't even know who we are. We've been paranoid about nothing."
If France is looking to protect their culture, this might be a better place to begin.
My wife spent a summer living in Germany with her family. They took the Eurorail to Paris for a couple of days. On the way, all announcements were made in English, Spanish, French and German. Until they got to France, where it switched to ONLY French, even though the train was continuing on to Spain.
At some point it gets petty.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
... a Tracking and Data Harvesting Device.
I thought that was just supposed to emerge naturally by what people agreed upon. Colloquialisms become official language.
Twinstiq, game news
You mean like when we say things like despite the constant negative press covfefe, Trump is still popular?
#DeleteFacebook
Remove the soul and you'll sell millions of those boxes.
#DeleteFacebook
https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
#DeleteFacebook
I wonder how successful it will be this time. At least courriel had the benefit of not increasing the syllable count.
https://www.wired.com/2003/07/...
Make sure everyone's vote counts: Verified Voting
Just call it a "mobile" or "handy" like everyone else in the world.
Certainly that would be translated as "crasseux occasionnel".
I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
I've been on /. for many years and I've never heard of such an acronym as "UTF8", and neither have the site maintainers for /.
Now, as the Local reports, the latest word to get the official boot in France is smartphone. It's time to say bonjour to the "le mobile multifonction."
Oh phew, that'll keep those pesky English words out...HEY WAIT A MINUTE
"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
It is funny to see the French complaining about a few English words entering their language when up to 45% of English words are of French origin.
The "dark net", in its original definition, was a part of the internet that was unobservable, because it existed behind passwords, or because it was simply not indexed in search engines. The phrase "internet clandestin" immediately tags a big "illegal!" tag on the whole thing.
Also, "internet" is kind of a funny choice. How about "réseau reliant les ordinateurs à l'échelle mondiale"?
When I was in college, my English professor insisted that the official bodies which have vise-like control over the French language will inadvertently make it a dead language by the end of this century.
Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
How about "Dalle de poche qui fait des choses intelligentes"?
Google translate gave me back "pocket slab making smart things".
That's good. Maximally accurate and maximally prolix.
Do you think they can be any more rude?
All the suggested words & phrases need to have at least 65% more letters that aren't pronounced.
The French already have a word for this device, dating back to novelist Jules Verne -- see https://entertainment.theonion...
Ordiphone, noun: Just a regular, ordinary phone.
Anyway Frederick Pohl called them "joymakers" in his 1966 book, Age of the Pussyfoot. So that is what all truly cool people already call them. Though I guess you could argue whether they do in fact "make joy," so...
NO ONE cares about the "Académie Française".
I can't remember a suggestion they did that did stick, whereas all the stupid "Cédérom", "Dévédérom", "mél" are NEVER used by the people actually using the language every day (It is possible some TV shows/commercials try to stick on that, but no one cares). There's no reason "internet clandestin", "joueur occasionnel", "mot-diese", or "mobile multifonction" will fare better than the previous failures.
The Académie Française is a group of old men babbling together about how the language is so awesome despite needing a heavy refactoring. They are just unable to keep up with the 20th century, nevermind the 21th. Just remember to shut down the TV before putting them to bed for the night (and don't forget the medicine, and the diapers).
Seriously, there are more important things in the universe.
The day we fire them, and replace them by actual language experts and engineers, we'll all celebrate together. Until them, let them talk. Don't give them your attention (they crave that). Just close the door so the noise doesn't bother you.
I have decades of experience speaking with the French on a daily basis and in that time I've never heard anyone use a single one of the AF's prescribed words. But hey, let 'em keep on prescribing if it makes them feel useful. Thank you to the French people for demonstrating in the best possible way that language exists to be descriptive, not prescriptive.
No, your children are not the special ones. Nor are your pets.
The Académie française ridiculed themselves big time with "mot diese". Not only is it a double "abus de langage" (the # symbol is not a musical sharp and a tag is not a word), but the word hash is already basically French, from "hachure", which means .., um ... a crosshatch pattern.
No, your children are not the special ones. Nor are your pets.
As for casual gamer, "joueur ponctuel" conveys the precise meaning without taking a whole line up.
No, your children are not the special ones. Nor are your pets.
French: ... Sixty-seven, sixty-eight, sixty-nine, sixty-ten... ...sixty-eleven, sixty-twelve, sixty-thirteen... ...sixty-sixteen, sixty-ten-seven... ..sixty-ten-eight, sixty-ten-nine... ...four twenties! :) Four twenties one...
Other languages: **stares**
French: **stares back**
French:
French:
Other languages: *shutting eyes*
French:
Other languages: *hands over face*
French:
I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar.
I'm pretty sure the Apollo mission computers did a lot more computing than ordinating in the days when computers were computers.
Calculateur is French for a computer that computes.
No, your children are not the special ones. Nor are your pets.
I love learning something new every day. My favorite is with slightly old sourdough bread. We call that French bread here. I especially like cutting out a circle and frying an egg in the hole.
errr....umm...*whooosh* *whoosh* Is this thing on ?
The Académie française ridiculed themselves big time with "mot diese". Not only is it a double "abus de langage" (the # symbol is not a musical sharp and a tag is not a word), but the word hash is already basically French, from "hachure", which means .., um ... a crosshatch pattern.
I beg to differ. "mot dièse" (literally "word sharp") has an elegance that is lacking in "hashtag" or "hachure".
And # (as sharp) is kind of useful when you want to talk about Chopin's legendary Prelude no. 8 in F# minor.
If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
The French are like that. In case you haven't noticed, they have a few other unusual habits. To many cultures, so do we (speaking as a native English North American). They also don't give a damn who they offend, or why.
They are sensitive to English (mostly) words, that they would probably say are "polluting" their language.
It's not something anyone who isn't a native French speaker needs to concern themselves with; so any comment in an English speaking forum, really, is irrelevant.
They have this history with the English. It matters to them sometimes. Maybe it's silly, but it's real. It's also their culture to shepherd, not mine.
I say let 'em, it's not anything that affects me. It's interesting in an "factoid" kind of way but that's the end of it as far as I'm concerned. Whatever floats their boat.
The idea is not that bad, but as usual it comes too late, years after everyone got used to "smartphone". It will probably not go further than "jeune pousse" for startup.
The Academie is one of the reasons that written French is diverging from spoken French.
I'm not sure that is a good thing either..
Schools also largely have to stick to a fairly conservative language curriculum.
Learning French is a many step process, with written forms that are essentially never spoken, and spoken forms that may be written, but largely aren't.
Yet for all this, I'm not sure what they hold on to by doing it? The French are French. They should have no fear of ever not being.
How unreasonable of francophones for wanting to have a word for these digital communication devices in their own language. It's not as if they pioneered digital communication: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
smartphones were translated to the translation of smartphone from the day 1.
pda's never got popular so they were just pda's though.
now smartphones are just phones anyways in common language use, so it's kind of moot point. there's a slang word for mobile phones that got accepted to pretty much official use though, since "travel phone" translation is a long word(matkapuhelin), so nobody wanted to really use that one in everyday talk - instead a wired phone has been dubbed as the wirephone(lankapuhelin) to not confuse people. somebody speaks of a phone they mean a mobile phone unless they specify that it's wired.
it's not that they haven't tried other stupid stuff over the years though, like television being visual radio(in translated form). never took off because tv or television rolls off the tongue better.
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
I never used the word logical. Is it logical to refer to inanimate objects as he or she?
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Maybe you don't know many french people?
"Trump!!", the new Godwin.
French had nothing to do with these Anglo-American attempts to crush Germany and Russia.
They are scared as hell that both will ever work together and push the old empires out of existence.
Once the capital and technology of the Germans merge with the resources of Russia it's game over for them.
Try to catch up on your geopolitics please.
"Trump!!", the new Godwin.
Sous-reseau?
"Trump!!", the new Godwin.
Most people rarely use the word smartphone already, unless they want to make it clear they are talking about the general kind of phone. A lot of people would actually even only call it "iphone", whichever it is. But in common talk, people just say "telephone", "tel" or "portable", or even "mobile", depending on regions I guess But some people like to lose time over tiny details that no one cares about and publish notes than nobody heeds, except themselves.
We fart in our own general direction.
France, aka Napoleon tried to crush Germany several times. ...
Your look on history is short sighted at best
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
I never hear the term "mobile" in day to day speech. It must be a regional thing for you. I heard "cell", "cellphone", "smartphone", "iOS", "iPhone" and "android phone". With the last being a real mouthful and the last three being not that generic but used generically by some.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
gah, moderators are stupid fools.:D
L'Idiot
Isn't "NETwork" an English word? Waw, this comission for enriching French language is made of traitors!
Because its not that easy. In principle, BBC could follow a main body, and a few bigger newspapers could be forced to follow a official doctrine. But because its not done, there is no standard in England.
The US situation is even more complex, simply from having little to no expansive state media, so even if they did a bookwork on their part of the language, there is no way to force communication to follow suit. At most, you will get papers pushers related to the government, to have a cheat sheet for common words that needs to be replaced.
In both, the school system is used, but it doesn't have the same kind o reach, because you are waiting for those kids to reach the age where they become adults.
The situation in France is a bit different, i mean, we can quote Wikipedia on the matter:
>France Télévisions (French pronunciation: [fs televizj]) is the French public national television broadcaster. It is a state-owned company formed from the integration of the public television channels France 2 (formerly Antenne 2) and France 3 (formerly France Régions 3), later joined by the legally independent channels France 5 (formerly La Cinquième), France Ô (formerly RFO Sat), and France 4 (formerly Festival).
And the same is true of the various branches of Radio France.
So when Academie Francaise decides on something, common media known to the public will have to accommodate this. In subtitles, translations, new shows, the news, etc.
So its either a phone, or a phone multifunction now. So in a few years, people will ask for the latter in shops, instead of a smart phone~.
so it seems its more of a case of the professor of mentil, showing a bit of edge, is hurt a little that his circle of academia can't try to unfuck the language in the long term.
It seems quaint, doesn't it? A central authority trying prohibit a language from evolving by pronouncing the occasional fatwa against a loan word, a foreign coinage, etc. However, there's a good argument that such a preservation effort will be needed far more over the next 100 years than it was over the last ~400.
Alors, au cours du présent siècle où le monde se rétrécit chaque jour, je souhaite la meilleure des chances à l'Académie Francaise.
They're gonna need it.
"We reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals." --The American President (20.1.2009)
What I find interesting is, people complain about English having odd spelling/pronunciation, but some of our strangest words are from the French.
Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
Sorry but french fell out of favour as a language of international business a long time ago. English is now the lingua franca.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
No, it's just more contemporary.
"Trump!!", the new Godwin.
I studied French in school in Ontario where they taught us the "right" words. My Quebec cousins used to laugh at us when we'd say things like "pomme de terre" (literally apple of the ground). They'd correct us and say it's called "patate" (Frenchification of potato) and where did we get a crazy idea about calling them earth apples?
There's the French spoken today, then there is old French. A guy that knew Old French, say from the 1600s wouldn't be able to carry on much of a conversation with a French Chick today. He'd probably get slapped.
So much ado over nothing.
News for nerds, news that matters? I don't think so.
in america, a handy is something entirely different lol
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same