Slashdot Mirror

I know it was demonstrated awhile back that a rabbit kidney could be cryopreserved and then restored to function.

Seriously, the longer I live, the more it seems plausible that one day it will be possible to cryopreserve a human brain and restore it to function later. One day human lifespan may be greatly extended in a way that looks like this:

McCoy: "He's dead, Jim."

Kirk: "Bones, do something!"

McCoy: "Sorry, Jim, there isn't anything I can do."

KirK: "Why?"

McCoy: "Because he's dead."

Kirk: "How do you know he's dead?"

McCoy: "Because there's nothing I can do."

Kirk: "Because he's dead?"

McCoy: "That's right."

Kirk: "But I was talking to him just one minute ago!"

McCoy: "Dammit Jim, I'm a doctor not a spiritual medium! I can't bring back the dead anymore than I can cure a common cold."

Spock: "Doctor, we could take him back to the ship, dissolve any blood clots, restore circulation, and restore homeostasis by molecular repair. He could fully resume duty within days."

McCoy: "Spock, leave doctoring to doctors! What this man needs is a decent burial."

How much does this cost?

$100,000 for whole body, $35,000 for head-only.

Cost of Cryonics

I could think of plenty of better things to spend that money on.

You could say the same thing about money spent on sports cars, nice houses, or gourmet coffee. It is their money, they can do what they want with it.

Actually, I suspect she's counting on workable nanotech and cell repair machines. Of course, that assumes that the gestalt that is the human consciousness is (1) written to brain tissue, and (2) sufficiently distinctive that it can be recovered.

If, on the other hand, the human mind is the equivalent of a bootable runtime, the best that's recoverable is a human, but the memories and personality would be gone. And until the tech is available, it's a crapshoot. On the other hand, she was dead already. . .

Take a look at Alcor.org. Hal Finney just went there recently. Marvin Minsky, Ralph Merkle and others are on the Scientific Advisory Board and members. Smart people.

See e.g.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A...
or
http://www.alcor.org/

It could just as well be proof of their stupidity.

Hold on there, now you're saying they're stupid, instead of saying they're scammers. Is it possible that you simply don't like the concept and are making up reasons that support your feeling?

To directly address your concerns, I'm reading through the extended FAQs.[1]
First off, I have to admit that what I thought I read was Cryonics Institute being based where they are due to low geological risk. However, it seems I read that about Alcor Life Extension Foundation, which is the other non-profit Cryonics preservation service in the US. They detailed their location decision here: [2] Summarizing, it's because of very low risk of natural disaster, availability of major airport facilities, favorable weather (no winter blockages), and low crime. See the link for extended information.

Doing some quick research, it seems that in terms of seismic activity, Michigan is even safer than Arizona.[3,4] You mention geological stability is your territory, so I'll defer to your opinion on that.

Why not the North of Canada or the center of Australia?

I would think the main reasons are: The North of Canada is hard to get to, and frequently inaccessible, which is a problem when time is of the essence. Australia is not populated enough: People from the USA would find it hard to get to, and there may not be enough people in Australia to warrant a Cryonics center there. Australia's laws might also create a hurdle, although I'm not too familiar with that.

As a final note, I'd suggest interested people have a look around through the public information. All financials are public,[5] the cryopreservation methods used are well detailed,[6] and for every person cryopreserved there is a case report available, detailing both the things that went well and the things that need improvement.[7]

Cryonics is a thing. The people involved are intelligent, and are working to give the preserved patients the best chance they can at a future. Cryopreservation seems odd at first glance, raising a lot of concerns that need to be addressed. Luckily, these have indeed been addressed. Have a google through the information available, and perhaps you'll find your view shifting!


[1]
Cryonics: A basic introduction
Cryonics: A basic introduction (Continued)
Cryonics: A basic introduction (Continued 2)
Cryonics: Why don't we?
Cryonics Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)

[2] Why Scottsdale?
[3] Arizona Seismic Hazard Map
[4] Michigan Seismic Hazard Map
[5] Cryonics Institute Financial Statements
[6] Outline of CI Cryopreservation procedures
[7] The Cryonic Institute's 110th Patient

It could just as well be proof of their stupidity.

Hold on there, now you're saying they're stupid, instead of saying they're scammers. Is it possible that you simply don't like the concept and are making up reasons that support your feeling?

To directly address your concerns, I'm reading through the extended FAQs.[1]
First off, I have to admit that what I thought I read was Cryonics Institute being based where they are due to low geological risk. However, it seems I read that about Alcor Life Extension Foundation, which is the other non-profit Cryonics preservation service in the US. They detailed their location decision here: [2]
Summarizing, it's because of very low risk of natural disaster, availability of major airport facilities, favorable weather (no winter blockages), and low crime. See the link for extended information.

Doing some quick research, it seems that in terms of seismic activity, Michigan is even safer than Arizona.[3,4] You mention geological stability is your territory, so I'll defer to your opinion on that.

Why not the North of Canada or the center of Australia?

I would think the main reasons are: The North of Canada is hard to get to, and frequently inaccessible, which is a problem when time is of the essence. Australia is not populated enough: People from the USA would find it hard to get to, and there may not be enough people in Australia to warrant a Cryonics center there. Australia's laws might also create a hurdle, although I'm not too familiar with that.

As a final note, I'd suggest interested people have a look around through the public information. All financials are public,[5] the cryopreservation methods used are well detailed,[6] and for every person cryopreserved there is a case report available, detailing both the things that went well and the things that need improvement.[7]

Cryonics is a thing. The people involved are intelligent, and are working to give the preserved patients the best chance they can at a future. Cryopreservation seems odd at first glance, raising a lot of concerns that need to be addressed. Luckily, these have indeed been addressed. Have a google through the information available, and perhaps you'll find your view shifting!

[1]
Cryonics: A basic introduction
Cryonics: A basic introduction (Continued)
Cryonics: A basic introduction (Continued 2)
Cryonics: Why don't we?
Cryonics Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)

[2] Why Scottsdale?
[3] Arizona Seismic Hazard Map
[4] Michigan Seismic Hazard Map
[5] Cryonics Institute Financial Statements
[6] Outline of CI Cryopreservation procedures
[7] The Cryonic Institute's 110th Patient

These guys can help you see the release in the year 3011.

Sure, but preserving Osama Bin Laden's body will cost $200,000 and then we have to wait until a gunshot wound to the head is no longer a fatal injury to medical science.

After you restore him from cyro, fix his injuries, and see if he still retains any memories or personality at all .. feel free to beat the crap out of him with a $5 wrench.

Until then, if the key dies with the holder, the encrypted drive is secure as secure gets.

But some of us plan on coming back: http://www.alcor.org/

You don't suck the water out, you remove most of the blood and pump in the cryoprotectants while providing cardiopulmonary support to ensure that the compounds actually get to most of the body. See other reply in this subthread where I discuss how they've actually used this technique successfully on rabbit kidneys and then brought them back and transplanted them. The anti-freeze compounds don't penetrate perfectly so there's still some ice formation, but it occurs at a pretty minimal level. Essentially, you keep pumping in cryoprotectants as you gradually reduce the temperature. See http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/CardiopulmonarySupport.html which outlines much of the process.

That give me an idea for one of those companies that peddle stuff to people who don't know any better, like Star Registry or cryogenics - get people to pay you big bucks to save some DNA samples of yourself on the premise that someday when human cloning is perfected, they can bring you back to life!!! (results may vary).

I can see the commercials, some sad old guy hobbles off to his grave, cut to futuristic world and the same guy is wearing a jumpsuit and a big smile. Voiceover, "It's never too late, so come see what the future has in store for you".

It says here that there is no longer any freezing damage.

http://www.alcor.org/ . My wife and I are both signed up for cryonic suspension. Even if the chances of success are low, they beat the pants off of the alternative!

Also, if I may tout my own unofficial FAQ: http://datan0de.livejournal.com/144534.html

For some random reason I was reading up on cryonics today and ran across a supportive quote from Clarke

"Although no one can quantify the probability of cryonics working, I estimate it is at least 90% -- and certainly nobody can say it is zero."

I didn't see any mention of cryonics in any coverage of his death so I assume he never followed through with it, but if he actually did maybe there's the hope that he's not gone forever and may be back again someday.

While I don't dispute the "kills you dead" part, modern cryonics doesn't freeze you. It vitrifies the brain, avoiding the ice crystals. Read Myth #2.

http://www.alcor.org/cryomyths.html

I find cryonics to be attractive in a "hedging the bets" kind of way. It's not so much that I think that it'll work as that the downside is relatively small if it doesn't (you're out a life insurance policy you arguably wouldn't have purchased anyway).

However, Penn Gillette said something on BS that has made me question the entire concept; paraphrased: "Even if it does work, you're just paying for your perpetual storage. Who do you think is going to be charitable enough to pay for thawing, reconstructing, and rehabbing you? Evil geniuses needing goons, that's who!"

Absurdity aside, he's kind of got a point. Seems like a gamble to count on altruism. There are things worse than death.

...and the most famous company in the field is Alcor.

I read their FAQ on ischema and reperfusion injury some time ago.

A distinction can be made between protoscience and pseudoscience. Cryonics: http://www.alcor.org/AboutCryonics/index.html
Extropianism: http://www.transhumanism.org/resources/faq.html
MNT: http://www.crnano.org/whatis.htm

Make up your own minds.

You may consider yourself fodder for the nematodes, but I have no intention of ever shuffling off this mortal coil.

Well, it seems there has been some progress on that lately: http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/vitrification.ht ml

I'd like to introduce some facts to this thread, being that people are claiming that tissue "freezing" is impossible.

This page has a list of journal articles supporting the scientific basis for cryonics. Yes, it is hosted at Alcor, spare me the ad-hominems if you please, the work is valid.

Selected Journal Articles Supporting the Scientific Basis of Cryonics
Science FAQ, including pre/post vitrification high magnification images of neural tissue.
Scientist's Open Letter on Cryonics - Letter of support from the science community.

Hope this helps clear things up for some.

kulakovich, transhumnanist nutjob.
Member Extropy Institute - extropy.org
Member World Transhumanist Association - transhumanism.org
Member Alcor Life Extension Foundation - alcor.org
Member Independent Game Developers Association - igda.org
etc.
etc.

I'd like to introduce some facts to this thread, being that people are claiming that tissue "freezing" is impossible.

This page has a list of journal articles supporting the scientific basis for cryonics. Yes, it is hosted at Alcor, spare me the ad-hominems if you please, the work is valid.

Selected Journal Articles Supporting the Scientific Basis of Cryonics
Science FAQ, including pre/post vitrification high magnification images of neural tissue.
Scientist's Open Letter on Cryonics - Letter of support from the science community.

Hope this helps clear things up for some.

kulakovich, transhumnanist nutjob.
Member Extropy Institute - extropy.org
Member World Transhumanist Association - transhumanism.org
Member Alcor Life Extension Foundation - alcor.org
Member Independent Game Developers Association - igda.org
etc.
etc.

Hi, I've never said this here before, Decaff, and I mean no offense.

Your quote about human tissue survival is completely incorrect. If you had left of the paren-section " (at least not with current freezing techniques)." You'd have been ok. However the statement " Human tissues simply don't survive freezing (at least not with current freezing techniques)." is false.

And I am not just talking about sperm and egg storage in liquid nitrogen. The vitrification process tests using high-molar concentration glucos based solutions on large mammal brains has yielded terrific results. Sure, we don't have a return process, and there are still hurdles to overcome...

Here is a link. Sure you can claim bias since it is at Alcor, but if you look around there are better pubs.

Science FAQ.

kulakovich

Your information is out of date. The current process is called vitrification a process that avoids most of this type of damage and has been in use for some time now. This technology comes from the organ preservation world.

Cryonics, like any other experimental technology, tries to make continuous, incremental advances.

Your information is out of date. The current process is called vitrification a process that avoids most of this type of damage and has been in use for some time now. This technology comes from the organ preservation world.

Cryonics, like any other experimental technology, tries to make continuous, incremental advances.

The thinking for cryonic suspension goes like this. 50 Years ago when your heart stopped you were dead, nothing anyone could do would get you back from your heart stopping. Today we can revive someone with a good rate of success after a few minutes after the heart stopping, the biggest problem being lack of oxygen to the brain. In 50 years from now how long will we have after a heart stops untill we cant revive someone.

This has non-trauma related applications too. Take for example cancer or lukemia. You can imagine any progressive and fatal disease as a possible application here. Many people today are frozen at the moment of death either of natural causes or slow non trauma related diseases. The company Alcor freezes people all the time with the hopes that in the future their disease will be curable AND they will be able to be revived at a few minutes of their heart stopping.

Some people opt to have only their head frozen. The idea with that is in the future a new body will be able to be grown from a DNa sample from yourself.

Rather than get into a point-by-point debate, I'll simply refer you here to address the specific technical questions:
http://www.alcor.org/sciencefaq.htm

-Cybrex

I take objection to so much of what you're ranting about here that it's a challenge to keep this from becoming a counter-rant, but I'm going try by focussing only on your basic question.

The Alcor Patient Care Trust is legally obligated to care for those in suspension until they are repaired/revived. The maintenance costs for the patients in suspension is low, but at some point it becomes cheaper to revive them than to keep them perpetually suspended.

Additionally, in order to be on the board of the Trust it's a requirement that you be a signed Alcor member. Additionally, of the 5 people on the board, at least 3 of them must have a relative or significant other in suspension.

Check here for more information:
http://www.alcor.org/AboutAlcor/patientcaretrustfu nd.html

-Cybrex

Actually, the body is "ruined" when the original relevant cell structures can no longer be inferred from the current structure. Given that even with current technology tissue samples, fetuses, and some entire organs can be preserved for an arbitrary period of time, thawed, and successfully used it's clear that the issue isn't so simple.

A lot depends on the quality of the suspension, and that can vary significantly depending on the circumstances surrounding the patient's "death". If a body is found after several days then yes, the outlook is grim. Generally a patient isn't just "frozen", but instead goes through a rather involved process to minimize cellular damage using either "standard" cryoprotectants or, more recently, a vitrification solution. There is abundant information available on these processes and their outcomes.

Please get your facts straight. I suggest starting here: http://www.alcor.org/sciencefaq.htm but by all means, go elsewhere and do research from other sources! Just please educate yourself on the topic before spouting off about it here.

If, after you're done with your Futurama jokes and "moral" indignation you secretly want to look into this further, read the cryonics funding information page. If you're uncomfortable explaining the whole thing cold to an insurance agent (they're not the most inaginative and open minded people in the world, after all) Alcor also maintains a list of insurance agents who have worked with Alcor members in the past. A phone conversation with one of these folks, a physical checkup a week later, pay your premiums and Alcor fees, and *poof* you too have a cryo contract.

If, after you're done with your Futurama jokes and "moral" indignation you secretly want to look into this further, read the cryonics funding information page. If you're uncomfortable explaining the whole thing cold to an insurance agent (they're not the most inaginative and open minded people in the world, after all) Alcor also maintains a list of insurance agents who have worked with Alcor members in the past. A phone conversation with one of these folks, a physical checkup a week later, pay your premiums and Alcor fees, and *poof* you too have a cryo contract.

The state-of-the-art in cryonics today is *vitrification*, not freezing. Very high quality brain preservation is possible when freezing is prevented with cryoprotectants

http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/braincryopreserv ation1.html

Changes in dendritic spines cited by one poster as evidence that 5 minutes of clinical death is irreversible are in fact known to be *spontaneously reversible*!

http://www.jneurosci.org/cgi/content/abstract/25/2 2/5333

The world record for recovery of large animals without brain damage after intervals of clinical death at normal temperature using advanced resuscitation technology is now 16 minutes, not 5 minutes.

http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/annals.html

Even just post-resuscitation hypothermia, hemodilution, and hypertension will get you to 13 minutes

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd= Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=2298837

The brain doesn't go "kaboom" after a few minutes of circulatory arrest. Foreseeable technologies will likely eventually extend the reach of resuscitation medicine to one hour or more of clinical death at normal temperatures. A person with a stopped heart is fundamentally A SICK PERSON that doesn't really die until much later.

On top of it all, all this is moot for cryonics patients who suffer attended cardiac arrest, for whom the preservation process is started immediately, the first step being restoration of blood circulation and oxygenation.

http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/CardiopulmonaryS upport.html

People should do at least some minimum checking before making confident pronouncements about the stupidity of others. There are some very sharp people behind this field

http://www.cryoletter.org/

The state-of-the-art in cryonics today is *vitrification*, not freezing. Very high quality brain preservation is possible when freezing is prevented with cryoprotectants

http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/braincryopreserv ation1.html

Changes in dendritic spines cited by one poster as evidence that 5 minutes of clinical death is irreversible are in fact known to be *spontaneously reversible*!

http://www.jneurosci.org/cgi/content/abstract/25/2 2/5333

The world record for recovery of large animals without brain damage after intervals of clinical death at normal temperature using advanced resuscitation technology is now 16 minutes, not 5 minutes.

http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/annals.html

Even just post-resuscitation hypothermia, hemodilution, and hypertension will get you to 13 minutes

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd= Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=2298837

The brain doesn't go "kaboom" after a few minutes of circulatory arrest. Foreseeable technologies will likely eventually extend the reach of resuscitation medicine to one hour or more of clinical death at normal temperatures. A person with a stopped heart is fundamentally A SICK PERSON that doesn't really die until much later.

On top of it all, all this is moot for cryonics patients who suffer attended cardiac arrest, for whom the preservation process is started immediately, the first step being restoration of blood circulation and oxygenation.

http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/CardiopulmonaryS upport.html

People should do at least some minimum checking before making confident pronouncements about the stupidity of others. There are some very sharp people behind this field

http://www.cryoletter.org/

The state-of-the-art in cryonics today is *vitrification*, not freezing. Very high quality brain preservation is possible when freezing is prevented with cryoprotectants

http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/braincryopreserv ation1.html

Changes in dendritic spines cited by one poster as evidence that 5 minutes of clinical death is irreversible are in fact known to be *spontaneously reversible*!

http://www.jneurosci.org/cgi/content/abstract/25/2 2/5333

The world record for recovery of large animals without brain damage after intervals of clinical death at normal temperature using advanced resuscitation technology is now 16 minutes, not 5 minutes.

http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/annals.html

Even just post-resuscitation hypothermia, hemodilution, and hypertension will get you to 13 minutes

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd= Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=2298837

The brain doesn't go "kaboom" after a few minutes of circulatory arrest. Foreseeable technologies will likely eventually extend the reach of resuscitation medicine to one hour or more of clinical death at normal temperatures. A person with a stopped heart is fundamentally A SICK PERSON that doesn't really die until much later.

On top of it all, all this is moot for cryonics patients who suffer attended cardiac arrest, for whom the preservation process is started immediately, the first step being restoration of blood circulation and oxygenation.

http://www.alcor.org/Library/html/CardiopulmonaryS upport.html

People should do at least some minimum checking before making confident pronouncements about the stupidity of others. There are some very sharp people behind this field

http://www.cryoletter.org/

It's okay to not know key facts about modern cryonics, as you clearly don't. You don't start looking like an idiot until you call people who don't share your ignorance of these facts "stupid".

What's the most advanced bio or chem class you've taken?

So everything you people know about cryo comes from science fiction novels?

Actually, what really happens to cells is that the intracellular spaces suck the water out of them and damage them through dehydration. The point of vitrification is to prevent that.

Anyway, at worst I'll be dead and maybe in some metaphysical realm, and no longer caring about how stupid people will think my gamble was. But I won't be any less dead if I don't try it, so I have nothing (except money that I can't take with me) to lose.

Perhaps rich people are the ones worrying about preserving their assets for the future, but I don't want people to get the impression that you have to be rich to be a cryonicist.

That mistaken assumption is what caused me to take so long to take the plunge.

I'm a grad student, I make 20k/year, and I have a cryo contract. As a full-time student I pay $199 annually and my life insurance policy ($90k coverage) premiums cost about $1k per annually. If I wanted to, I could have taken out a term life insurance policy and I'd be paying in the low hundreds, but since by definition this is an arrangement you'd want to make for the duration of your life, I thought it would be better to lock in a good whole life insurance rate while I'm still young and healthy. Plus my policy has a safety margin of $10k over the $80k neurosuspension fee.

And that's me, a starving PhD student. Some of you people with real jobs can fund your cryo policy, and toss some money into a trust fund for yourself, and have some left over for charity and heirs.

Cryonics is a long-shot, but unlike many other beliefs about life after death, it doesn't contradict the observed laws of physics. I don't ridicule those beliefs or take any action to restrict them, no matter how alien to my way of thinking they may seem. I therefore expect a free and pluralistic society to reciprocate this courtesy toward my own beliefs.

Perhaps rich people are the ones worrying about preserving their assets for the future, but I don't want people to get the impression that you have to be rich to be a cryonicist.

That mistaken assumption is what caused me to take so long to take the plunge.

I'm a grad student, I make 20k/year, and I have a cryo contract. As a full-time student I pay $199 annually and my life insurance policy ($90k coverage) premiums cost about $1k per annually. If I wanted to, I could have taken out a term life insurance policy and I'd be paying in the low hundreds, but since by definition this is an arrangement you'd want to make for the duration of your life, I thought it would be better to lock in a good whole life insurance rate while I'm still young and healthy. Plus my policy has a safety margin of $10k over the $80k neurosuspension fee.

And that's me, a starving PhD student. Some of you people with real jobs can fund your cryo policy, and toss some money into a trust fund for yourself, and have some left over for charity and heirs.

Cryonics is a long-shot, but unlike many other beliefs about life after death, it doesn't contradict the observed laws of physics. I don't ridicule those beliefs or take any action to restrict them, no matter how alien to my way of thinking they may seem. I therefore expect a free and pluralistic society to reciprocate this courtesy toward my own beliefs.

the 10-minute brain damage happens when the patient is REVIVED, NOT when they are ischemic (without oxygen). The reoxygenation of the blood causes a cascade inflammatory reaction that causes the brain damage. Note that this particular brain damage is not structural in nature, but instead is functional. IOW, the memories are still there, but the cell functions no longer work.

There is another type of brain damage that IS structural--autolysis, where the cells eat themselves when they are starved for oxygen. But that takes many hours without oxygen for serious damage to occur.

Now, both the cascade inflammatory reaction AND autolysis processes can be greatly slowed by lowering the body temperature. That is why people can sometimes be revived from drowning in cold lakes after being underwater for an hour or more.

And....AND...this set of ideas I explained above is why cryonics MIGHT work.

The Outer Limits did a good story once about the more likely form of teleportation.

why is it worth mentioning that some cheesy tv series explored this topic?

This topic of self-copying should certainly be worth considering for every person, seeing as how we are all marching toward certain personal oblivion. But trust me, whatever the Outer Limits scripts have to say about this is hugely irrelevant.

However, on a much more relevant note, it appears that I, Cryofan, am the only poster on this thread who actually has a chance of ever uploading my brain. You see, I have a contract with Alcor to have my brain vitrified in liquid nitrogen until I am able to be revived. I hope to awaken in a future where uploading is available as an option for superlong life and space travel....

I'm pretty sure the majority of people given a choice between having babies and living a health vigorous life for +1000 years will choose the latter. Not all of course, see paragraph one. We don't even have to give up having babies entirely, but engage in a huge slow down. Say one baby per couple, per average lifespan to date. The rate of growth would slow and slow. Assuming accidental or eventual death it would even start to reverse at some point. In several centuries a couple of more population doubling may have occurred (I haven't done the math), but science will no doubt have progressed so far as to keep us all well fed.

Abrey De Grey may be onto something or not. I applaud his work not because I expect to live to One Thousand Years Plus, but because I believe in the Singularity with respect to progress. I think its most likely arrival is 50 to 100 years. An extra 50 human years nets me an immortality of transcendent survival in the machine. Maybe it comes in 30 years and I don't need De Grey's help. Maybe it comes in 300 years (I would mark this the outer bound for the Singularity), in which case I hope De Grey has gotten all the funding he wants.

I the meantime to hedge my bets even more, I'm getting brochures from Alcor

this is my indian friends argument against heaven :)

alternatively, you could check out
Alcor

For about $100/month in dues and insurance payments, you can sign up for cryonics. It's a longterm experiment to determine whether a person vitrified today using state-of-the-art cryopreservative/vitrifications techniques (which eliminate or greatly reduce ice crystal formation) will be able to be revived at some indeterminate date in the future.

Although such revival is impossible today, at some day N days in the future, it may be possible to revive the experimental subjects. A happy consequence of such revival would likely be awakening into a society where humans are virtually immortal (or extremely lomglived) and machines and other technologies make it possible for humans to not have to work.

Nice payoff for that experiment!

As for the odds of success, there are too many confounding variables to make an estimation. However, the probability of success would be the product of several independent variables, such as (odds of a future society coming up with revival technology) times (odds of remaining safe in the dewar until such a time arrives) times..... etc etc.

Link? Yeah, what the heck....

....I have a contract for cryostasis upon legal death with Alcor, and I plan to post on Slashdot soon after I am revived.

I wonder if my gmail account will be full?

it seems to be that this guy is just talking out of his ass. he basically threw in a bunch of buzzwords and did no research at all in giving his (clearly uninformed, imho) opinions. while undoubtedly some of these predictions will occur to some degree, to assume, for example, that the (basically nonexistent at present) nanomedicine field will be so ripe as to allow "clearing plaque out of your arteries, and getting rid of dangerous chemicals" is laughable The contact lenses feeding you Terminator-esque telemetry also strikes me as a bit silly. Now don't color me luddite just yet - i agree that many of his predictions will come eventually true, and wish for them as much as the next guy (nanotechnology could very well hold the key to "curing" aging, for example) - had this article been labeled "2054", i might have been a bit more on board. basically, you could pick any joe on slashdot and he would give you an equally accurate, or more so, prediction of near-future society in line with current technological trends (ew i sound like roland piquepaille). so if predicting the future is your day job, its a good thing you have that whole sci-fi writer thing to back you up :)

My point (which I didn't communicate well) was that it's quite ironic that Pascal's wager, which was used to argue that you should "fear God lest he might exist and ye might be punished if you don't" is now trotted out seriously in favor of cryonics. The bit about taking Pascal's original wager into account when considering cryonics was intended to illustrate, and show that they both fail because of the inherent flaws in the form of argument they employ.

Maybe it is smart to believe in God or to take out a policy from Alcor, but thinking either because of 2x2 matrices is indeed dumb.

The problem is the ant-aging tech will not help those of us today, most likely. So how do we oldsters get our memories and our consciousness to the future that does have such tech? Try cryonics....

That is the REALLY important data--like how it felt to get your first kiss, to drive your first car, to re-read your favorite book, etc etc.

What about maintaining THAT data after you die?

It may be feasible! Check out cryonics, the experimental science of cryopreservation, where as soon as possible after legal death, your brain is perfused with a cryopreservative (to minimize ice crystal formation), and then placed in liquid nitrogen, where all chemical reactions essentially cease.

Hundreds or even thousands of years from now, sophisticated neuroarchaeological techniques may be used to restore that data. And when that data is restored, you will be alive again. Nice work if you can get it, huh? And if revived in a society that is capable of such science, well, you are talking "virtual immortality", my friends.

see Alcor for details....

Why not just cryogenically freeze yourself? Who knows, perhaps some day you will be resurrected and have your brain plopped into a nice robotic body. Bleh... I will leave it at that, I already sound enough like a crackpot for one day.

My medical neck tag from Alcor says:

Front:
Call 24 hours ###-###-####
In case of death see reverse for Biostasis Protocol
Reward #####

Back:
Call now for instructions
Push 50,000 U Heparin by IV and do CPR while cooling with ice to 10C -Keep PH 7.5
NO Embalming
NO Autopsy

So what technologies are pursued today and almost certainly doable, and are widely derided or ignored by people who should know better?

Machine phase chemistry (The real stuff - Drexler)
Cryonics
Space Elevator