Domain: boeing.com
Stories and comments across the archive that link to boeing.com.
Comments · 502
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Re:Boeing release, photos, and movies
I say goddam! Anyone notice how freakin eighties that movie soundtrack is?? I wanted Louis Gossett Jr to pop up on the com telling the kid to turn that racket off.
"But Chappy, I need it to help me concentrate!"
*shudder* -
link for boeing press releasehere.
--paul
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Tacit Blue, UCAV and the manned fighterAnother descendent of Tacit Blue (the Whale
:-)
This is just a radar/areodynamic test prototype and is quite a few years from production. And as the "skip a generation" approach the current administration has the UAV version is probably the future.
The location of the air intake also implies that this is going to be a subsonic aircraft design. Perhaps the future replacement for the F117A rather than a fighter.
Even the Boeing PR points this out:
Boeing's current development of the X-45A Unmanned Combat Air Vehicle, or UCAV, technology demonstrator draws directly on its Bird of Prey experience. Some aspects of the UCAV's innovative radar-evading design, such as its shape and inlet, were developed from this project.
So it seems unlikley we'll see a manned version of one of these in the future. They may have been thinking that way in the early 1990s when they started to build it but not today.
The video is interesting -- the plane looks so different from different angles and there is one angle where the wings look more like a flying squirrel rather than a bird of prey(tm). -
It's not a fighter. Look at the specs
It's easy to look at the matte grey and assume it's a fighter, but a trip to Boeing's press release tells a different story.
The aircraft has an operational ceiling of 20,000 feet, and a cruising speed of 260 knots (mach 0.4). It's weight is 7,400 lbs. that's less than half the weight of an empty F-16 and a sixth that of an F-14. The weight alone doesn't mean it can't be a fighter, but it's no good for any sort of mixed-use, because of its minimal load capacity.
It's also an unlikely choice for surveillance because of its low ceiling. the U-2 was good because anti-aircraft munitions couldn't reach it. The SR-71 was good because they could outrun missiles. This thing, as stealthy as it may be, is a sitting duck as it patrols below its 20,000 foot ceiling, putting along at 280 knots.
No, the point of this aircraft is that it proves new design and fabrication techniques. the prototype was built for $64 million, soup to nuts, and that's a huge deal. Boeing financed the design and production out-of-pocket, and my best guess is that they did it to rpove to the DoD that they could come up with innovative designs, fabricate and test them cheaply and quickly, and maintain a veil of secrecy while they do it.
After losing the F-22/23 battle to Lockheed Martin, Boeing has to rebuild cred with the DoD as more than a missile and satellite maker. My guess is that this is their 'see what we can do' project for the military, since the Skunkworks facilities were't working on much else nowadays. -
Re:Boeing is desparate...
they couldn't do better than produce a plane that looks so damn cool.
They must have changed designers when they sketched out their JSF proposal. Did you ever see the Sailor Inhaler?
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QT movie points this out.
In the quicktime movie they pretty much make this explicit. There is a graphic of the word "Transformation" then a series of cross-fades between the Bird of Prey and the UCAV showing the similarities.
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Re:Shares some interesting similarities with past
Not being an aerospace engineer, I would guess that they made use of the fuselage of the aircraft for some lift as well. In this picture it looks like the body is aerofoil shaped (from nose to stern). I doubt the performance envelope is anywhere close to that of a fighter aircraft, though.
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Re:It's part of UCAV development.article plus photo of UCAV
they almost look identical, but bird of prey has added cockpit and little wing thingies at the ends.
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Re:not exactly tailless!
Click here for the correct URL (there's a space in the one above).
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Boeing release, photos, and movies
Boeing has a news release with other photos, details, and a movie. The movie is downloading real slow right now though. They've got an image of the plane on their home page, so it's being hyped up quite a bit.
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Boeing release, photos, and movies
Boeing has a news release with other photos, details, and a movie. The movie is downloading real slow right now though. They've got an image of the plane on their home page, so it's being hyped up quite a bit.
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You don't want a server...
You want a laptop!- Get something a couple years old
- Load the OS and software
- Pull the optical drive and replace it with your mirror HD
- set up software RAID
I'm a big fan of IBM ThinkPads. A nice, small (5 pounds or so) ThinkPad 600X (P-III/500, 256 MB, 20 GB, 1024x768 (XGA?), DVD reader) should sell on Ebay for about $600. Also, it's quiet! (That's important if this thing is going to live in an apartment.)
If that price is a bit high, step a little further back. The P-IIs get REALLY cheap ($200 range, though you give up memory and HD size too), and if you find something with an 800x600 screen it will be a lot less. (Unless it's a 'palmtop'.)
If you're in New England, check out Kaplan Computers in Manchester, CT. If you're in the Pacific Northwest, check out Boeing Surplus or RePC -- both have stores (in | near) Kent. If you aren't near any of these, sorry, I can't suggest anything other than (shudder) eBay.
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Re:Doesnt make sense?
Just done some research, and the bird is equipped with 10 kilowatts of solar panels. Astra 1H
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Unofficial Slashdot FAQ
Unofficial Slashdot FAQ
By ReluctantBadger- "Hi. Yeah. Erm, what the hell are 'boxen', 'VAXen', 'OSen' and 'Virii'?"
"These are mystical non-words, which have been conjured up by stupid wankers wanting to appear hip, cool and intellectual. Nothing to see here. Please move along." - "Why is everyone so against Microsoft? And what is up with that dollar sign?"
"Welcome to Slashdot. Much in the same way that one dog sniffs another's ass to evaluate that individual, so is this practice of marking your grounds of viewpoint. Think of it as a Linux user bending over and farting - It is all about making their views heard. - "Who is Junis?"
"The most legendary troll ever to grace the pages of Slashdot. Not only was a Slashdot editor duped into posting a complete article on the opression of Kabul's geeks, but it also spawned a veritable banquet of new trolling material (such as optimum temperatures for storing Commodore hardware buried under chicken huts and the abundance of DivX Baywatch episodes)" - "What is 'YHBT. YHL. HAND.'? I see it everywhere!"
"This is commonly seen in comments sections after a pathetic Slashboteer or paranoid YRO fanatic has been suckered into replying to a finely crafted piece of literary genius." - "Why the hell would someone want to re-program some obscure electronic device that is no longer produced?"
"Many cock-smoking Slashdot users like to claim that it is 'because they can'. In fact, it boils down to 'because I've got nothing else better to do'. These are normally the same people who think that their university attendance made them technical gods and everyone else is worthless." - "I recently saw an article on programming, and lots of people posted code snippets. Problem is, most of it was wrong. Why is that?"
"A high percentage of Slashdot users are still in university, and think that after day 1 of 'Introduction to C' that they are ready to code embedded systems for Boeing or Raytheon. They spend endless hours posting about how they've hacked device x, when in fact all they've done is downloaded the SDK, bragged about 16-bit bus register cron-job front side bus accumulators and watched 'Anti-Trust' for the 797th time."
This troll is dedicated to Nicola Wheeler on ITV's Emmerdale. mmmmm.... top heavy....
- "Hi. Yeah. Erm, what the hell are 'boxen', 'VAXen', 'OSen' and 'Virii'?"
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Unofficial Slashdot FAQ
Unofficial Slashdot FAQ
By ReluctantBadger- "Hi. Yeah. Erm, what the hell are 'boxen', 'VAXen', 'OSen' and 'Virii'?"
"These are mystical non-words, which have been conjured up by stupid wankers wanting to appear hip, cool and intellectual. Nothing to see here. Please move along." - "Why is everyone so against Microsoft? And what is up with that dollar sign?"
"Welcome to Slashdot. Much in the same way that one dog sniffs another's ass to evaluate that individual, so is this practice of marking your grounds of viewpoint. Think of it as a Linux user bending over and farting - It is all about making their views heard. - "Who is Junis?"
"The most legendary troll ever to grace the pages of Slashdot. Not only was a Slashdot editor duped into posting a complete article on the opression of Kabul's geeks, but it also spawned a veritable banquet of new trolling material (such as optimum temperatures for storing Commodore hardware buried under chicken huts and the abundance of DivX Baywatch episodes)" - "What is 'YHBT. YHL. HAND.'? I see it everywhere!"
"This is commonly seen in comments sections after a pathetic Slashboteer or paranoid YRO fanatic has been suckered into replying to a finely crafted piece of literary genius." - "Why the hell would someone want to re-program some obscure electronic device that is no longer produced?"
"Many cock-smoking Slashdot users like to claim that it is 'because they can'. In fact, it boils down to 'because I've got nothing else better to do'. These are normally the same people who think that their university attendance made them technical gods and everyone else is worthless." - "I recently saw an article on programming, and lots of people posted code snippets. Problem is, most of it was wrong. Why is that?"
"A high percentage of Slashdot users are still in university, and think that after day 1 of 'Introduction to C' that they are ready to code embedded systems for Boeing or Raytheon. They spend endless hours posting about how they've hacked device x, when in fact all they've done is downloaded the SDK, bragged about 16-bit bus register cron-job front side bus accumulators and watched 'Anti-Trust' for the 797th time."
This troll is dedicated to Nicola Wheeler on ITV's Emmerdale. mmmmm.... top heavy....
- "Hi. Yeah. Erm, what the hell are 'boxen', 'VAXen', 'OSen' and 'Virii'?"
-
Unofficial Slashdot FAQ
Unofficial Slashdot FAQ
By ReluctantBadger- "Hi. Yeah. Erm, what the hell are 'boxen', 'VAXen', 'OSen' and 'Virii'?"
"These are mystical non-words, which have been conjured up by stupid wankers wanting to appear hip, cool and intellectual. Nothing to see here. Please move along." - "Why is everyone so against Microsoft? And what is up with that dollar sign?"
"Welcome to Slashdot. Much in the same way that one dog sniffs another's ass to evaluate that individual, so is this practice of marking your grounds of viewpoint. Think of it as a Linux user bending over and farting - It is all about making their views heard. - "Who is Junis?"
"The most legendary troll ever to grace the pages of Slashdot. Not only was a Slashdot editor duped into posting a complete article on the opression of Kabul's geeks, but it also spawned a veritable banquet of new trolling material (such as optimum temperatures for storing Commodore hardware buried under chicken huts and the abundance of DivX Baywatch episodes)" - "What is 'YHBT. YHL. HAND.'? I see it everywhere!"
"This is commonly seen in comments sections after a pathetic Slashboteer or paranoid YRO fanatic has been suckered into replying to a finely crafted piece of literary genius." - "Why the hell would someone want to re-program some obscure electronic device that is no longer produced?"
"Many cock-smoking Slashdot users like to claim that it is 'because they can'. In fact, it boils down to 'because I've got nothing else better to do'. These are normally the same people who think that their university attendance made them technical gods and everyone else is worthless." - "I recently saw an article on programming, and lots of people posted code snippets. Problem is, most of it was wrong. Why is that?"
"A high percentage of Slashdot users are still in university, and think that after day 1 of 'Introduction to C' that they are ready to code embedded systems for Boeing or Raytheon. They spend endless hours posting about how they've hacked device x, when in fact all they've done is downloaded the SDK, bragged about 16-bit bus register cron-job front side bus accumulators and watched 'Anti-Trust' for the 797th time."
This troll is dedicated to Nicola Wheeler on ITV's Emmerdale. mmmmm.... top heavy....
- "Hi. Yeah. Erm, what the hell are 'boxen', 'VAXen', 'OSen' and 'Virii'?"
-
Unofficial Slashdot FAQ
Unofficial Slashdot FAQ
By ReluctantBadger- "Hi. Yeah. Erm, what the hell are 'boxen', 'VAXen', 'OSen' and 'Virii'?"
"These are mystical non-words, which have been conjured up by stupid wankers wanting to appear hip, cool and intellectual. Nothing to see here. Please move along." - "Why is everyone so against Microsoft? And what is up with that dollar sign?"
"Welcome to Slashdot. Much in the same way that one dog sniffs another's ass to evaluate that individual, so is this practice of marking your grounds of viewpoint. Think of it as a Linux user bending over and farting - It is all about making their views heard. - "Who is Junis?"
"The most legendary troll ever to grace the pages of Slashdot. Not only was a Slashdot editor duped into posting a complete article on the opression of Kabul's geeks, but it also spawned a veritable banquet of new trolling material (such as optimum temperatures for storing Commodore hardware buried under chicken huts and the abundance of DivX Baywatch episodes)" - "What is 'YHBT. YHL. HAND.'? I see it everywhere!"
"This is commonly seen in comments sections after a pathetic Slashboteer or paranoid YRO fanatic has been suckered into replying to a finely crafted piece of literary genius." - "Why the hell would someone want to re-program some obscure electronic device that is no longer produced?"
"Many cock-smoking Slashdot users like to claim that it is 'because they can'. In fact, it boils down to 'because I've got nothing else better to do'. These are normally the same people who think that their university attendance made them technical gods and everyone else is worthless." - "I recently saw an article on programming, and lots of people posted code snippets. Problem is, most of it was wrong. Why is
that?"
"A high percentage of Slashdot users are still in university, and think that after day 1 of 'Introduction to C' that they are ready to code embedded systems for Boeing or Raytheon. They spend endless hours posting about how they've hacked device x, when in fact all they've done is downloaded the SDK, bragged about 16-bit bus register cron-job front side bus accumulators and watched 'Anti-Trust' for the 797th time."
This troll is dedicated to Nicola Wheeler on ITV's Emmerdale. mmmmm.... top heavy....
- "Hi. Yeah. Erm, what the hell are 'boxen', 'VAXen', 'OSen' and 'Virii'?"
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Re:The Russians must have built more powerful rock
As far as currently operational systems go, maybe yes
...
They are talking about the Atlas V Heavy, not the Atlas V 4xx and 5xx configuration. The first stage is three Common Core boosters strapped together (ie three Atlas 501's strapped together, a two engine centuar upper stage and a 5 meter dia. payload shroud). The Heavy has not yet flown, but should have the same abilities as the Delta IV heavy which can do 23,000 Kg To LEO and 13,000 Kg to GTO.
This is more than the Proton, ~3000 Kg to GTO
This is more than the Ariane V, 6800 Kg to GTO
Similar to the shuttle, 24400 Kg to LEO
btw. The Delta IV heavy is scedualed to fly before the Atlas V heavy.
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Re:Bullshit. I saw one.Perhaps it looked like this. I have been told that at a distance the B2 - because of its wide wing span, appears to be moving very slow. Slow enough that the person actually said "Slow, Real slow, Fall out of the sky slow". (I was just struck by the fact that I have never seen one at a distance, I have only seen a LOW fly-by near the local DoD contractor.)
I'm not trying to say what you say, but could it have been one of these. You did say 1992, and thats about right for the B2
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Re:A little more infoGood rocket engines weigh about 1/15 as much as jet engines with similar sea-level thrust & scramjets weigh even more than jets.
Regarding jet engines: got a link? Regarding scramjets: so you mean this technology they've spent billions of dollars on is further along than the one that got virtually no funding at all? What a surprise.
Terrier-Orion sounding rockets (from surplus military stocks) can be obtained on a university budget
Can you get to orbit in them?
The dev costs on scramjets are easily in the billions
And, what, orbital rockets were developed in someone's backyard on a shoestring budget? They spent billions on them, too.
Finally, who cares how much is tanking. Fuel costs are negligable compared to the rest.
What we're interested in here is mass. To get to orbit, a rocket has to take thousands of tons of oxidizer along with it. A scramjet could leave most of it behind.
(hint: they weren't. Scramjets will be subject to the same guidance problems).
What, you mean the guidance problem of having all your thrust at the very bottom of the vehicle, which is basically a requirement for rockets?
As was pointed out != as has been proven. Please point me to your real-world proofs or stop presenting "I hope" as "It has been proven".
Oh, I do apologize. Shuttle engines specific impulse in a vacuum of 452. And let's see, here's an experimental air-breathing jet engine with a specific impulse in the atmosphere of around 2000. Or this one, from NASA themselves. In particular note the specific impulse of ion engines at 20000 which, if I'm not mistaken is higher than 400. Also it specifically states, "The chemical rocket engine is a fairly lightweight device. However, the specific impulse is not high. Solid and liquid propellants in present use deliver an impulse of around 250 seconds. The best liquid propellants so far conceived and evaluated yield an impulse of about 350 seconds." And of, course, there's this one, also at NASA, stating that Scramjets' specific impulse varies over the Mach range from 1000 to 1500. Want more?
Before stating that scramjets can accelerate to mach25 in the atmosphere you are going to have to solve the materiels problem
Gee, I seem to recall saying that very same thing. How kind of you to tell me what I already knew and act like you are all-knowing in the process.
scramjets by definition cannot [throttle back]
Eh? They have to accelerate constantly the whole time? Can't slow down, can't cruise, can't do anything except go faster? Do explain to me where you learned this.
Until then, kindly refrain from proposing theoretical yet unachievable limits.
You're the one proposing limits pal, not me.
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boeing?
didn't boeing also buy into that AMAZING new kind of cooling technology, it was slashdotted a while ago. here
i think that boeing just tends to jump on unsound technology. i wonder if they own any bitboys oi! stock? -
I take it you didn't study economics....
A company MUST PAY their employees enough to afford to buy their product or THEY WILL GO OUT OF BUSINESS. PERIOD. It's like gravity, fellas. Can't get around it no matter how many accountants and lawyers you hire.
This would appear to spell doom for Ferrari, Lamborghini, DeBeers, Moet et Chandon--and Freightliner, Terex, and Boeing. In fact, it would appear to spell doom for any company making a "luxury" good or any kind of capital equipment. It is simply not the case--an enormous number of companies produce goods that their employees can never hope to be able to afford. This does not mean that Pratt & Whitney is running a sweatshop--just that they make big-ticket capital items that are not sold at the mall.
Simple historical fact:
What is an historical fact is that over time any job with specialized technical knowledge will be automated to the point that less-expensive workers can do it. The classic economic case study is typesetting: from the time of Gutenberg until the early 1880s type was set by hand. It was a time-consuming process that required real skill--a capable, quick typesetter could make good money. When Ottmar Mergenthaler introduced his Linotype machine (which made it possible for anybody who could use a keyboard to set better type in a fraction of the time) approximately 90% of typesetters lost their jobs. More or less overnight.Programming computers is a specialized task that requires expert knowledge. Guess what? The natural response of any businessman will be to try to find a cheaper solution. Some are looking overseas (such as Bangalore), others are importing workers on temp visas. The long-term trend will be to simpler and simpler computer systems that require less skilled talent--and talent with less skill. A good case in point is in small accounting systems: ten years ago there were a lot of people writing accounting systems for small companies. Nowadays those companies buy QuickBooks, or go upscale to buy Solomon or Best. The marketplace for single-user PC accounting software development is essentially gone.
Some people recognize this...
...and learn new skills. Nobody is looking for a programmer to write a G/L package in FoxPro anymore. But there are people looking for programmers to write GIS software; and people looking for programmers to write Palm OS or WinCE software; and people looking for programmers to write Web software; and so on. And the programmers who continue to focus on learning those skills, and learning to work in new markets, and learning to adapt to a changing marketplace will thrive.Those who do not--who just expect the same skills in the same industry to last them a lifetime--will ultimately be left with nothing to do but whine to Congress about H1Bs taking their jobs.
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Boeing did this 30 years ago
Boeing already built a vehicle with electric power and motors for each wheel, 30 years ago. It is, of course, the Apollo Lunar Rover--three were used on the Apollo 15, 16, and 17 missions.
(To my surprise, the LRV didn't use a fuel cell, though fuel cells were used for other applications on Apollo.)
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Re:Sonic boom: how were they going to eliminate it
Boeing has two ideas for new airliners. The first announced is the sonic cruiser, which will cruise between mach 0.95 & 0.98 and carry 250 people max. The other is the blended wing body, originally developed by Douglas Aircraft to compete with Boeing planes. The BWB will cruise at mach 0.90, carry 480 people, and burn 32 percent less fuel than a competing Airbus.
And yes, that Concorde is damn loud. I was in London once at Kew Gardens (right under the "whirlpool" for Heathrow) and the Concorde at 10,000 feet was as loud as the 747s going over at 2500. And when it was the Concorde's turn at 2500, you had to shout to hear each other. -
Re:Sonic boom: how were they going to eliminate it
You mean this ? I believe it's supposed to be a high subsonic jet -- not supersonic, just faster than everything else subsonic. And of course cooler looking.
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It's a Blended Wind Body!!!!!!
Another example that graphic designers are off in their own technologically-naive world. Hope they're not actually Boeing employees
;(
The masthead: http://www.boeing.com/phantom/bwb.html -
Boing BWB site
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More Technical InsightFrom the site "As the air transport industry changes to a world of alliances and rapidly shifting markets, Boeing Commercial Airplanes maintains its leadership by:
- Focusing intensely on customers and the dynamic, complex air travel marketplace they face, and
Developing a family of products and services that deliver comprehensive customer solutions to these evolving challenges.
One of six operating groups within The Boeing Company, Commercial Airplanes is headquartered in Renton, Wash., under the leadership of President and Chief Executive Officer Alan Mulally.
- Focusing intensely on customers and the dynamic, complex air travel marketplace they face, and
Developing a family of products and services that deliver comprehensive customer solutions to these evolving challenges.
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Cool renderings, background info.
Here.
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Re:Future of Unmanned Aircraft?Umm... what about not putting lives at risk by future use of UCAV technologies?
The direction of these technologies has never been to _replace_ manned platforms, but to supplement the manned fighter and bomber force, particularly in the context of dangerous missions.
Gmanske.
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Re:Ion Emissions
??? Ion engines work fine thank you very much
Boeing even sold one of them for comerical use, so it might even be considered out of R&D and into present tech stage. -
Interesting, and I found some videos:A quick google search brought up this site from Boeing, and they even have a little videos that explain the technology behind the solar power towers.
They're all real video and come in 3 diff. sizes: 28.8Kbps, 56Kbps, and 200Kbps.
This technology seems pretty promising in comparison to straight up solar panels, thanks for informing me.
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Interesting, and I found some videos:A quick google search brought up this site from Boeing, and they even have a little videos that explain the technology behind the solar power towers.
They're all real video and come in 3 diff. sizes: 28.8Kbps, 56Kbps, and 200Kbps.
This technology seems pretty promising in comparison to straight up solar panels, thanks for informing me.
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Interesting, and I found some videos:A quick google search brought up this site from Boeing, and they even have a little videos that explain the technology behind the solar power towers.
They're all real video and come in 3 diff. sizes: 28.8Kbps, 56Kbps, and 200Kbps.
This technology seems pretty promising in comparison to straight up solar panels, thanks for informing me.
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Interesting, and I found some videos:A quick google search brought up this site from Boeing, and they even have a little videos that explain the technology behind the solar power towers.
They're all real video and come in 3 diff. sizes: 28.8Kbps, 56Kbps, and 200Kbps.
This technology seems pretty promising in comparison to straight up solar panels, thanks for informing me.
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Re:Popular does not mean Right
The only thing standing between my freedom and some Chinese soldier with Ak47 is not a good will on Chinesse people or an international treaty but good old US military.
Possible.
Another possibility: You've bought into a great big myth that the right-wing media has deemed necessary for you to believe so that it can facilitate more money going to Boeing.
Nah, you're probably right. After all, everywhere I look I see jingoistic nationalistic Chinese propaganda, reality television shows about the military, all sorts of questionable world alliances to facilitate oil imports, calls for countries around the world to join together under its leadership to rid the world of specific threats, backing coups against democratically-elected governments, supporting opressive and sexist regimes throughout the world...
Oh, wait a sec. -
LinksHere are some links to related info:
lots of good pix here
http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/program/sbl.htm
a paper on SBL for missile defense
http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/program/docs/98-16 5.htm
SBL fact sheet (PDF)
http://www.acq.osd.mil/bmdo/bmdolink/pdf/sbl.pdf
Missile Defense Agency homepage
http://www.acq.osd.mil/bmdo/bmdolink/html/bmdolink . tml
other links
http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/space/md/sbl/
http://www.sbl.losangeles.af.mil/Divisions/FrontOf fice/body.htm
http://www.trw.com/presskits/detailinfo/0,1067,2_1 2^2^12^40,FF.html -
Re:Delivery feeser.... How to put it politely... er...
Buran has a dry weight of 82 tons. The Boeing 747 can handle cargo loads in excess of 110 tons, and can take this weight from Moscow to New York without refueling. You might have to disassemble the Buran to get it inside the 747's hold, but you are wrong to say it is too heavy for a US cargo jet.
You could also handle this with an AN-124 (you wouldn't need a 224 or 225). The AN-124 is probably better suited for the project because it has an integrated cargo ramp and cargo handling equipment, so you would require less logistics support, and you might be able to get away with less disassembly. But if you had a cargo-trim 747 available, you could definitely get the job done.
-Graham -
Flight Of The Bumble TacoesFlight Of The Bumble Planes by Snake Plissken
as told to Carol A. Valentine
Curator, Waco Holocaust Electronic Museum http://www.Public-Action.com
Copyright, March, 2002
May be reproduced for non-commercial purposes
March 10, 2002 -- Eureka! One of my readers, who calls himself "Snake Plissken," has put it together. He tells us why the passenger lists of the four September 11 "suicide" jets were so small, how remote control was used, why the transponders were turned off, why the radar tracks of the four planes were confused, why there was no Boeing 757 debris at the Pentagon
By George, I think he's got it!My e-mail exchanges with Snake took place over a series of days. With Snake's agreement, I have consolidated the exchanges, inserted some reference URLs, and made minor edits. My comments and additions will be bracketed thus [ ]. As you read what Snake has to say, keep the following in mind:
Magic is the pretended performance of those things which cannot be done. The success of a magician's simulation of doing the impossible depends upon misleading the minds of his audiences. This, in the main, is done by adding, to a performance, details of which the spectators are unaware, and leaving out others which they believe you have not left out. In short a performance of magic is largely a demonstration of the universal reliability of certain facts of psychology.
In what follows, Snake unravels the illusions of the 9-11 magicians.
(John Mulholland, The Art of Illusion, Charles Scribner & Sons, 1944.)Carol,
You did some fine research on 9-11. You came within inches of solving the puzzle of the "suicide" jets, and now you need the rest of the story. Let me explain by making a suggestion.
Go visit a bumblebee hive some time, and try to keep your eye on just one bee. You can't do it. You get confused. Think of the 9-11 jets as bumblebees. Matter of fact, you could even call Operation 911 Flight of the Bumble Planes.
I've worked in cryptology and there are many ways of hiding the truth. Substitute information, omit information, scramble the information out of sequence, and add nonsense (random garbage). All four methods were used on the 9-11 incident. Let me lay out the clues and show you where they lead.
THE CLUE First Clue -- Few Passengers On The Four Flights: Many have remarked about the short passenger lists on the four 911 jets. You might get a low turnout for a 767 or 757 now and then, but four coast to-coast flights taking off from the East inside of a few minutes of each other, all with short passenger lists? Nuts. That's your first clue.Second Clue -- First Report of First WTC Crash: The second clue comes from the first New York eyewitness on NBC. She had no question about what she saw. You could hear it in her voice. If she was the state's witness, the defense team would have their heads between their knees before she stopped talking.
What did she say? She heard an airplane coming in low and looked up. She saw a small private jet, and watched it fly into the first WTC tower, the North tower. She was certain in her description -- most people know the difference between a big round-nose commercial jet and a smaller plane.
[ CV cmments:
Later, some dodgy report came in from an anonymous source in the "United Airlines Command Center" that American Airlines had a hijacking, and they gradually padded the story out until the viewer felt like he was part of an unfolding revelation on the size and make of the plane. So the first eyewitness's story got shellacked.
In his testimony before the Senate Armed Services Committee on October 25, 2001, NORAD commander Ralph Eberhart said of the first September 11 report: "We were told it was a light commuter airplane. It didn't look like that was caused by a light commuter airplane."
http://www.ngaus.org/newsroom/HomelandDefenseTrans cript.doc
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/eberhart-testimon y.html ]Third clue -- Pentagon Crash: The first report on NBC said there had been an explosion near the Pentagon heliport. No mention of a plane.
If you were watching ABC, the first reports cited eyewitnesses who said a business jet had crashed into the Pentagon. Notice that this description is similar to the first report about the WTC. A small plane, not a big, round-nosed passenger jet.
Then ABC interviewed some media executive who said he "saw the whole thing" from his car on the freeway. It was an American Airlines passenger jet. Good luck the road didn't need his attention while he was gawking. And of course it was a big passenger jet scraping the light poles with it's belly as it came in low. And that story paved the way for the official truth.
Fourth Clue -- No Boeing 757 Debris at Pentagon Crash Site : By now lots of people have realized there is something very wrong with the story of Flight 77's crash into the Pentagon. What's the problem? The wingspan of a 757 is about 125 feet, with about 35 feet between the two jet engines.
[CV comments: http://www.boeing.com/commercial/757-200/ext.html
After the smoke died down, everyone could see the Pentagon but no one could see the plane. The Pentagon is made of masonry -- limestone -- not steel and glass. The aluminum wings of the plane should have been ripped off and left outside the building. We should have seen wing wreckage. But there was none.
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/boeing757-200The hole left by whatever hit the building was 70 feet across.
US News & World Report, December 10, 2001, pg. 31
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/usn011210-1.jpg ][CV comments:
Fifth Clue -- Quality of Pilots in Pentagon crash: As you point out in Operation 911: NO SUICIDE PILOTS
I have studied TV footage taken contemporaneously by various networks and reviewed photos from news magazines published just after 9-11. After the smoke died down, no Boeing 757 debris was visible.See the following URLs at the website of the U.S. Army Military District of Washington, D.C., sent to me by researcher John DiNardo, <jadinardo@hotmail.com>. By the way, Mr. DiNardo suspects that inside explosives were used at the Pentagon on 9-11. Certainly the damaged section of the building had just been renovated; explosives would have been easy to install.
http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / iretruck.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon6http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / apitolview.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon5http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / ars-damaged.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon2The scenes depicted by the US Army photos are consistent with contemporaneously published photos in the popular press. See, for example, US News and World Report, September 14, 2001, pg. 40.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/usn010914-1.jpg
and the photo that appeared in Newsweek's 2001 "Extra" edition, pgs. 26, 27.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/nwkxtr-1.jpgThis photograph below, with caption, appeared on the US Army Military District of Washington site. It unwittingly demonstrates that there was no Boeing 757 wreckage. Think now: a hundred thousand pounds of seats, framework, skin plates, engine parts, flaps, wheels, luggage, interior panels, electronics, and this little out-of-context scrap of God-knows-what was shown by the Pentagon.
http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / lanepiece.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon0In the last several months, largely as a result of Mr. DiNardo's work, there has been growing Internet discussion of the lack of Boeing 757 debris outside the Pentagon. Now, magically, new photos of "Boeing 757" Pentagon wreckage are beginning to appear. Check out the websites of Mike Rivero <whatreallyhappened.com> and Joe Vialls for copies of these fakes. Rivero and Vialls, by endorsing them as real, have surely identified themselves as members of the fake opposition.
OK. Now back to Snake Plissken]
[http://www.Public-action.com/911/robotplane.html ]
the flying instructors who trained the "suicide" pilots of Flight 77 said they were hopeless. "It was like they had hardly even ever driven a car ..." The flight instructors called the two, "dumb and dumber," and told them to quit taking lessons.Yet the Washington Post described the maneuvers of Flight 77 before it hit the Pentagon. The huge jet took a 270 degree hairpin turn to make its target. The Post said Flight 77 had to be flown by expert pilots.
Something is wrong here. Now "dumb and dumber" are expert pilots. That is your fifth clue.
Sixth Clue -- Transponders Turned Off: As you point out, the "hijackers" turned off the transponders which transmit information showing the airline names, flight numbers, and altitude. But the FAA also uses conventional radar, so the "hijackers" must have known the planes were still visible. Why would the "hijackers" shut the transponders off, you asked? You are looking at your sixth clue.
[ Did NORAD Send The 'Suicide' Jets? Part 1
Seventh Clue -- Confusion On Radar Tracks: As you point out, some of these flights disappeared from the conventional radar scopes. [See above-cited URL.] That's your seventh clue.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/noradsend.html ]Eighth Clue -- Second WTC Tower Barely Hit : Have a look at the footage of the second WTC tower being hit. The plane almost missed the tower and just managed to hit the corner. Yet the first plane struck its target dead center. That's your eighth clue.
[See diagrams from Wag the WTC website at:
* A Boeing 767 was secured and painted up to look like a United Airlines jet. It had remote controls installed in it, courtesy of some NORAD types. Call that plane "Pseudo Flight 175" and leave it parked at a military airfield for the moment.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/psyopnews/Extra/1 / outhtowerpath.jpg ] HERE'S WHAT HAPPENED* The number of the passengers on each flight was kept artificially low that day. Easy to do. Just monkey with the airline computers and show the fights full so no more tickets are sold. Include some of your own operatives in each flight, maybe.
* After the planes are in the air, the transponders must be shut down. There are a few ways to do this, maybe, but the simplest is this: Have one of the NORAD insiders call the pilots and say: "This is the North American Aerospace Defense Command. There is a national emergency. We are under terrorist attack. Turn off your transponders. Maintain radio silence. Here is your new flight plan. You will land at [name] military air base."
* The pilots turn off the transponders. The FAA weenies lose the information which identifies the airline, the flight number, and the altitude of the planes. Of course the planes can still be seen on conventional radar, but the planes are just nameless blips now.
* What did the radar show of the planes' flight paths? We'll never see the real records, for sure. But in the spy movies, when the spy wants to lose a tail, he gets a double to lead the tail one way while the spy goes the other. If I were designing Operation 911, I'd do that: As each of the original jets is flying, another jet is sent to fly just above or below it, at the same latitude and longitude. The blips of the two planes merge on the radar scopes. Alternately, a plane is sent to cross the flight path of the original plane. Again, the blips merge, just like the little bees you're watching outside the hive. The original planes proceed to the military airfield and air traffic control is thoroughly confused, watching the wrong blips
...That's probably close to the way it was managed. Like I say, we'll never see the radar records so we won't know exactly.
[For the alleged flight paths of the four jets, see
* A small remote controlled commuter jet filled with incendiaries/explosives -- a cruise missile, if you like -- is flown into the first WTC tower. That's the plane the first NBC eyewitness saw.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/4flights.html
For names and locations of military airfields in the US, try
http://www.globemaster.de/bases.html
You can search for a listing of bases in 9-11 related states by using the search engine.]* The remote controlled "Pseudo Flight 175," decked out to look like a United airlines passenger jet, is sent aloft and flown by remote control -- without passengers -- and crashed into the second tower.
Beautiful! Everyone has pictures of that.
Why did Pseudo Flight 175 almost miss the second tower? Because the remote operators were used to smaller, more maneuverable craft, not a big stubborn passenger jet. The operators brought the jet in on a tight circle and almost blew it because those jets do hairpin turns like the Queen Mary. They brought it in too fast and too close to do the job right and just hit the corner of the tower.
* Then another remote controlled commuter jet filled with incendiaries/explosives -- a cruise missile if you like -- hits the Pentagon, in the name of Flight 77.
* Eyewitnesses are a dime a dozen. Trusted media whores "witness" the Pentagon hit and claim it was an American Airlines Boeing 757, Flight 77. Reporters lie better than lawyers.
* Meanwhile, the passengers from Flights 11, 175, and 77, now at the military airfield, are loaded onto Flight 93. If you've put some of your own agents aboard, they stay on the ground, of course.
* Flight 93 is taken aloft.
* Flight 93 is shot down or bombed -- makes no difference which. Main deal is to destroy that human meat without questions. Easiest way to dispose of 15,000 lbs. of human flesh, and nobody gets a headline if they find a foot in their front garden. No mass graves will ever be discovered, either.
* The trail is further confused by issuing reports that Flight 77 was actually headed towards the White House but changed course.
* The trail is further confused by having the Washington Post wax lyrical about the flying skills of non-existent pilots on a non-existence plane (Flight 77).
* The trail is further confused with conflicting reports and artificial catfight issues, such as -- did The Presidential Shrub really see the first tower hit on TV while he was waiting to read the story about the pet goat
...So we know the Boeing that used to be Flight 93 was blown up. The other three original Boeings (Flights 11, 175, 77) still exist somewhere, unless they were cut up for scrap.
The passengers and crews of Flights 11, 175, 77, and 93 died in an airplane crash, just like the newspapers said. Only for most of them, it was the wrong crash. But that's as close to the truth as the news media likes to get anyway, so it works.
WHY DO IT THAT WAY? So there you have it. Not four planes. More than four planes. There were the four original Boeing passenger jets that took off from the East Coast airports, the remote controlled Pseudo Flight 175 Boeing, and two small remote controlled jets or cruise missiles. Figure in a couple of extra planes to confuse the flight paths of the original passenger jets.The four original Boeings had conventional controls. The look-alike Boeing and the two small jets were drones, rigged with remote control. You called it Global Hawk, and that's good enough. The mimic planes could have been piloted or remote controlled.
Why not just install remote control in four passenger jets like you described in NO SUICIDE PILOTS? Here's why: You might get remote control gear installed on a passenger jet so pretty the pilot would not notice, but that would be more work, more time, and more people. Then you would have to control your special plane through maintenance dispatch and try to get it lined up for that day, that time, that flight. Then you would have to multiply those efforts by four. There would be too many chances of things going wrong. Plane substitution would be much simpler. You'd just need the NORAD insiders, the personnel at the military airfield, and maybe an agent or two inside the FAA air traffic control system to make sure things go smooth. That should not be too difficult because NORAD has sent lots of its people over to the FAA to work on the FAA radars.
[CV commens:
Some people have suggested the original passenger planes were used with the flight computers hacked and loaded with the collision coordinates for the targets. Maybe the job could have been done that way, but it was not. You know for sure it was not because flight computers do not fly planes the way those were flown. A flight computer is given a set of GPS points (geographic coordinates) to follow, and the computer charts the path between them, correcting for cross-winds and other errors. The flight computer flies smooth and gentle, the way passengers like it, without jerky corrections.
Gen. Eberhart, NORAD commander, told the Senate Armed Services Committee on October 25, 2001 that " . . . we've actually moved manpower on the order of about 200 people over the years to the FAA to operate these radars." Cited in Did NORAD Send The 'Suicide' Jets? Part 2. See Eberhart testimony at:
http://www.ngaus.org/newsroom/HomelandDefenseTrans cript.doc
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/eberhart-testimon y.html ]You know Flight 175 was not on that system when it hit the south tower because it came in fast (they say) in a tight hooking circle that almost missed the tower. An autopilot wouldn't make that mistake. The crash of flight 175 was not a preprgrammed flight computer finding the optimum path. What you see there in the path of 175 is a real-time controller fighting the physics of flight - and almost losing it.
You've already dealt with the Joe Vialls Home Run explanation, so I don't have to analyze that again.
[ http://www.Public-Action.com/911/noradsend.htm
I've seen another lame attempt to explain away what happened: Supposedly AWACS hit the planes with EMF and knocked out their manual electronics, then took over the 9-11 planes by remote and made them crash. That's a pipe dream. Anything that knocked out the electronics from a distance would turn a plane into a flying scrap heap. Those plane are completely dependent on electronics, and no remote beam could pick and choose which circuits to destroy and which to leave intact. OTHER DETAILS * Pentagon Security Photos : On March 7 CNN released four photographs taken by Pentagon security camera on September 11, 2001. Look at the photos:l ]http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/03/07/gen.pentagon.pic
t ures/index.htmlThe Washington Post says: "The first photo shows a small, blurry, white object near the upper right corner -- possibly the plane just a few feet about the ground," but admits "the hijacked American Airlines plane is not clearly visible." ("New Photos Show Attack on Pentagon," March 7, 2002. )
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A56
6 70-2002Mar7.htmlYeah, right, you can believe that the American Airlines plane is not visible.
* Fireman's Video of First Crash. The NBC eyewitness said the plane that few into the North tower was small. This is corroborated by the fireman's video taken on September 11:
http://www.xemox.net/wtc/movies/first.plane.hits.
g p.med.asf[Note to reader: There are other versions of this clip on the Internet, but I have been unable to find one I can verify as the original clip. If you can find a verifiable copy, let me know. CV <SkyWriter@Public.Action.com>]
In that clip, the camera shows a fireman with other workers casually discussing some street work. The fireman looks up over his left shoulder, then behind him, as though he is following a sound. The camera follows his gaze, finds nothing at the original location, then quickly moves to a shot of the WTC, visible through another corridor in the surrounding buildings.
Why does the cameraman focus on the WTC? I can only guess he heard the impact of the plane. The camera does not show the plane in the air prior to impact, so I assume it has already crashed.
In the first frames we see a puff of smoke from the impact site that grows into a cloud and erupts into flame. After a few seconds, the flame dies down and the smoke dissipates. At that moment, the camera shows the huge S-shaped gash in the side of WTC North.
If the wings of a large jet made that gash, the gash should not be S-shaped. The gash should be a straight line like the wings of the jet. But more important: if the impact of the jet made
the gash, the gash should appear at the moment of impact when the camera is first drawn to the building. Instead, it appears AFTER the smoke and flame.[ http://public-action.com/911/gamma.jpg
The Hijackers: I have read reports that some of the alleged hijackers are actually still alive. This suggests the hijacker scenario and the resultant mid-air telephone calls to the relatives is pure bull. But I can't verify the alleged hijackers are still alive, so let's move on.
and
http://public-action.com/911/gamma2.jpg ]
It would be easy for the 9-11 planners to collect the names of people with Muslim-sounding names who were taking flying lessons around the country. Just before 9-11 happens, they are disappeared. Then mid-air phone calls are created, reporting hijackers who were never aboard the planes. That would work.
As you and many people have noticed, the Muslim names don't appear on the passenger lists of the four flights. The hijackers names don't even appear on the list of passengers released by United on September 12 -- the list of passengers on Flights 175 and 93.
[ http://www.Public-Action.com/911/uapassngerlis
Sure it was careless not to put the Arab names on the passenger lists, but nobody's perfect.t ]Just to show you how scripted the Flight 93 hijacking thing was, think about the alleged phone calls from the passengers on Flight 93 to their next of kin in the moments before the crash. Supposedly, they learned of the attacks on the Pentagon and the WTC with their handy cell phones, and they figured out their own plane was hijacked for a similar purpose. So they decided to be heroes and take the plane away from the hijackers.
According to the Dallas Morning News : "The fourth time Thomas Burnett Jr. phoned his wife, Deena, he acknowledged up front: 'I know we're going to die. There's three of us who are going to do something about it.'"
[ Dallas Morning News, "Trapped in the skies, captives fought back," September 17, 2001.
Heroic, wasn't it? And not a dry hanky in the house. The heroes of modern America. A high school basketball star, a college rugby player, a forest ranger, a woman police officer
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/dmnheroes ] ...But why did it have to be suicide heroism? "They knew their deaths were inevitable, according to some family members with whom they spoke on the phone, and they didn't want thousands more to die with them." It makes a better story, of course. "Suicide Heroes Defeat Suicide Hijackers."
Why did they have to die? The crew was still alive and "herded at knife point to the back of the plane, where the passengers were being held," according to the same report. They weren't dead. If the passengers got control from the hijackers, couldn't the crew fly the plane? Why didn't those brave heroes say things like, "There's a chance we might save this boat"? But they said, "I know we're going to die."
Obviously, this script was concocted in midnight a bull sessions like they had in Dustin Hoffman's mansion in "Wag the Dog". And the American public has been trained on weak plots for decades on prime time TV, so they don't WANT to think their way out of a wet paper bag. It spoils the show.
Only the writers and producers of Operation 911 knew that the passengers of Flight 93 had to die. But the temptation was too much, so they put it in the passenger dialog, too. And that's how you know the cell phone calls are just theater, not fact.
By the way, if I was planning this operation, I'd put some fictitious names on the passenger list, so when the flight went down, the media could interview fake relatives. Like that Operation Northwoods plan in which a fake Cuban jet would shoot down a fake American passenger jet. Whoever planned that must have planned to use fake grieving relatives, too.
[ http://www.Public-Action.com//911/northwds.htm
And then of course I've heard they can do marvelous things with voice simulation. How about that fellow who called his mother from Flight 93 and said "Mom, this is Mark Bingham." That has all the truth of a plaster fish trophy. That one guy, Todd Beamer, with the pregnant wife -- she didn't talk to him directly, she just got a message from the answering service.l ]["The Final Moments of Flight 93," September 22, 2001, by Karen Breslau (NEWSWEEK WEB EXCLUSIVE)
Is this all too much for your to swallow? Don't you believe people would conspire to pull all this off? Well, look at the stakes. This current war will go on for years and blot out one of the world's great religions, legitimize military rule in the United States, redistribute the world's oil resources, and change the entire power structure of planet Earth. All that's needed to make it happen is ambition, chutzpah, "a few good men," and a nation that is willing to be deceived.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/632626.asp
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/finalmoments93 ]The problem with people like you when you try to understand events like this, you are not a trained killer. When you come to wiping out the whoever, you shrink back. That's normal. That is one of the things you have to train out of a soldier.
But when a soldier plans something like this, he doesn't flinch at the killing. He just takes that into the plans like one more or one less egg in the omelet. If he has to kill the enemy or Americans or even
himself, it doesn't matter because sometimes he has to do that to win. He's trained that way.The only thing that matters is the Objective. Whatever a soldier has to do to win the Objective, that is what he has to do. All of this false piety about suicide bombers is nuts. Well trained Americans would do that if you ordered them to. If they didn't, they weren't well trained.
So you have to kill a hundred, a thousand, or five thousand civilians, you just do it in the best way that will help the Objective.
-
Flight Of The Bumble PlanesFlight Of The Bumble Planes by Snake Plissken
as told to Carol A. Valentine
Curator, Waco Holocaust Electronic Museum http://www.Public-Action.com
Copyright, March, 2002
May be reproduced for non-commercial purposes
March 10, 2002 -- Eureka! One of my readers, who calls himself "Snake Plissken," has put it together. He tells us why the passenger lists of the four September 11 "suicide" jets were so small, how remote control was used, why the transponders were turned off, why the radar tracks of the four planes were confused, why there was no Boeing 757 debris at the Pentagon
By George, I think he's got it!My e-mail exchanges with Snake took place over a series of days. With Snake's agreement, I have consolidated the exchanges, inserted some reference URLs, and made minor edits. My comments and additions will be bracketed thus [ ]. As you read what Snake has to say, keep the following in mind:
Magic is the pretended performance of those things which cannot be done. The success of a magician's simulation of doing the impossible depends upon misleading the minds of his audiences. This, in the main, is done by adding, to a performance, details of which the spectators are unaware, and leaving out others which they believe you have not left out. In short a performance of magic is largely a demonstration of the universal reliability of certain facts of psychology.
In what follows, Snake unravels the illusions of the 9-11 magicians.
(John Mulholland, The Art of Illusion, Charles Scribner & Sons, 1944.)Carol,
You did some fine research on 9-11. You came within inches of solving the puzzle of the "suicide" jets, and now you need the rest of the story. Let me explain by making a suggestion.
Go visit a bumblebee hive some time, and try to keep your eye on just one bee. You can't do it. You get confused. Think of the 9-11 jets as bumblebees. Matter of fact, you could even call Operation 911 Flight of the Bumble Planes.
I've worked in cryptology and there are many ways of hiding the truth. Substitute information, omit information, scramble the information out of sequence, and add nonsense (random garbage). All four methods were used on the 9-11 incident. Let me lay out the clues and show you where they lead.
THE CLUE First Clue -- Few Passengers On The Four Flights: Many have remarked about the short passenger lists on the four 911 jets. You might get a low turnout for a 767 or 757 now and then, but four coast to-coast flights taking off from the East inside of a few minutes of each other, all with short passenger lists? Nuts. That's your first clue.Second Clue -- First Report of First WTC Crash: The second clue comes from the first New York eyewitness on NBC. She had no question about what she saw. You could hear it in her voice. If she was the state's witness, the defense team would have their heads between their knees before she stopped talking.
What did she say? She heard an airplane coming in low and looked up. She saw a small private jet, and watched it fly into the first WTC tower, the North tower. She was certain in her description -- most people know the difference between a big round-nose commercial jet and a smaller plane.
[ CV cmments:
Later, some dodgy report came in from an anonymous source in the "United Airlines Command Center" that American Airlines had a hijacking, and they gradually padded the story out until the viewer felt like he was part of an unfolding revelation on the size and make of the plane. So the first eyewitness's story got shellacked.
In his testimony before the Senate Armed Services Committee on October 25, 2001, NORAD commander Ralph Eberhart said of the first September 11 report: "We were told it was a light commuter airplane. It didn't look like that was caused by a light commuter airplane."
http://www.ngaus.org/newsroom/HomelandDefenseTrans cript.doc
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/eberhart-testimon y.html ]Third clue -- Pentagon Crash: The first report on NBC said there had been an explosion near the Pentagon heliport. No mention of a plane.
If you were watching ABC, the first reports cited eyewitnesses who said a business jet had crashed into the Pentagon. Notice that this description is similar to the first report about the WTC. A small plane, not a big, round-nosed passenger jet.
Then ABC interviewed some media executive who said he "saw the whole thing" from his car on the freeway. It was an American Airlines passenger jet. Good luck the road didn't need his attention while he was gawking. And of course it was a big passenger jet scraping the light poles with it's belly as it came in low. And that story paved the way for the official truth.
Fourth Clue -- No Boeing 757 Debris at Pentagon Crash Site : By now lots of people have realized there is something very wrong with the story of Flight 77's crash into the Pentagon. What's the problem? The wingspan of a 757 is about 125 feet, with about 35 feet between the two jet engines.
[CV comments: http://www.boeing.com/commercial/757-200/ext.html
After the smoke died down, everyone could see the Pentagon but no one could see the plane. The Pentagon is made of masonry -- limestone -- not steel and glass. The aluminum wings of the plane should have been ripped off and left outside the building. We should have seen wing wreckage. But there was none.
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/boeing757-200The hole left by whatever hit the building was 70 feet across.
US News & World Report, December 10, 2001, pg. 31
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/usn011210-1.jpg ][CV comments:
Fifth Clue -- Quality of Pilots in Pentagon crash: As you point out in Operation 911: NO SUICIDE PILOTS
I have studied TV footage taken contemporaneously by various networks and reviewed photos from news magazines published just after 9-11. After the smoke died down, no Boeing 757 debris was visible.See the following URLs at the website of the U.S. Army Military District of Washington, D.C., sent to me by researcher John DiNardo, <jadinardo@hotmail.com>. By the way, Mr. DiNardo suspects that inside explosives were used at the Pentagon on 9-11. Certainly the damaged section of the building had just been renovated; explosives would have been easy to install.
http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / iretruck.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon6http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / apitolview.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon5http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / ars-damaged.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon2The scenes depicted by the US Army photos are consistent with contemporaneously published photos in the popular press. See, for example, US News and World Report, September 14, 2001, pg. 40.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/usn010914-1.jpg
and the photo that appeared in Newsweek's 2001 "Extra" edition, pgs. 26, 27.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/nwkxtr-1.jpgThis photograph below, with caption, appeared on the US Army Military District of Washington site. It unwittingly demonstrates that there was no Boeing 757 wreckage. Think now: a hundred thousand pounds of seats, framework, skin plates, engine parts, flaps, wheels, luggage, interior panels, electronics, and this little out-of-context scrap of God-knows-what was shown by the Pentagon.
http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / lanepiece.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon0In the last several months, largely as a result of Mr. DiNardo's work, there has been growing Internet discussion of the lack of Boeing 757 debris outside the Pentagon. Now, magically, new photos of "Boeing 757" Pentagon wreckage are beginning to appear. Check out the websites of Mike Rivero <whatreallyhappened.com> and Joe Vialls for copies of these fakes. Rivero and Vialls, by endorsing them as real, have surely identified themselves as members of the fake opposition.
OK. Now back to Snake Plissken]
[http://www.Public-action.com/911/robotplane.html ]
the flying instructors who trained the "suicide" pilots of Flight 77 said they were hopeless. "It was like they had hardly even ever driven a car ..." The flight instructors called the two, "dumb and dumber," and told them to quit taking lessons.Yet the Washington Post described the maneuvers of Flight 77 before it hit the Pentagon. The huge jet took a 270 degree hairpin turn to make its target. The Post said Flight 77 had to be flown by expert pilots.
Something is wrong here. Now "dumb and dumber" are expert pilots. That is your fifth clue.
Sixth Clue -- Transponders Turned Off: As you point out, the "hijackers" turned off the transponders which transmit information showing the airline names, flight numbers, and altitude. But the FAA also uses conventional radar, so the "hijackers" must have known the planes were still visible. Why would the "hijackers" shut the transponders off, you asked? You are looking at your sixth clue.
[ Did NORAD Send The 'Suicide' Jets? Part 1
Seventh Clue -- Confusion On Radar Tracks: As you point out, some of these flights disappeared from the conventional radar scopes. [See above-cited URL.] That's your seventh clue.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/noradsend.html ]Eighth Clue -- Second WTC Tower Barely Hit : Have a look at the footage of the second WTC tower being hit. The plane almost missed the tower and just managed to hit the corner. Yet the first plane struck its target dead center. That's your eighth clue.
[See diagrams from Wag the WTC website at:
* A Boeing 767 was secured and painted up to look like a United Airlines jet. It had remote controls installed in it, courtesy of some NORAD types. Call that plane "Pseudo Flight 175" and leave it parked at a military airfield for the moment.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/psyopnews/Extra/1 / outhtowerpath.jpg ] HERE'S WHAT HAPPENED* The number of the passengers on each flight was kept artificially low that day. Easy to do. Just monkey with the airline computers and show the fights full so no more tickets are sold. Include some of your own operatives in each flight, maybe.
* After the planes are in the air, the transponders must be shut down. There are a few ways to do this, maybe, but the simplest is this: Have one of the NORAD insiders call the pilots and say: "This is the North American Aerospace Defense Command. There is a national emergency. We are under terrorist attack. Turn off your transponders. Maintain radio silence. Here is your new flight plan. You will land at [name] military air base."
* The pilots turn off the transponders. The FAA weenies lose the information which identifies the airline, the flight number, and the altitude of the planes. Of course the planes can still be seen on conventional radar, but the planes are just nameless blips now.
* What did the radar show of the planes' flight paths? We'll never see the real records, for sure. But in the spy movies, when the spy wants to lose a tail, he gets a double to lead the tail one way while the spy goes the other. If I were designing Operation 911, I'd do that: As each of the original jets is flying, another jet is sent to fly just above or below it, at the same latitude and longitude. The blips of the two planes merge on the radar scopes. Alternately, a plane is sent to cross the flight path of the original plane. Again, the blips merge, just like the little bees you're watching outside the hive. The original planes proceed to the military airfield and air traffic control is thoroughly confused, watching the wrong blips
...That's probably close to the way it was managed. Like I say, we'll never see the radar records so we won't know exactly.
[For the alleged flight paths of the four jets, see
* A small remote controlled commuter jet filled with incendiaries/explosives -- a cruise missile, if you like -- is flown into the first WTC tower. That's the plane the first NBC eyewitness saw.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/4flights.html
For names and locations of military airfields in the US, try
http://www.globemaster.de/bases.html
You can search for a listing of bases in 9-11 related states by using the search engine.]* The remote controlled "Pseudo Flight 175," decked out to look like a United airlines passenger jet, is sent aloft and flown by remote control -- without passengers -- and crashed into the second tower.
Beautiful! Everyone has pictures of that.
Why did Pseudo Flight 175 almost miss the second tower? Because the remote operators were used to smaller, more maneuverable craft, not a big stubborn passenger jet. The operators brought the jet in on a tight circle and almost blew it because those jets do hairpin turns like the Queen Mary. They brought it in too fast and too close to do the job right and just hit the corner of the tower.
* Then another remote controlled commuter jet filled with incendiaries/explosives -- a cruise missile if you like -- hits the Pentagon, in the name of Flight 77.
* Eyewitnesses are a dime a dozen. Trusted media whores "witness" the Pentagon hit and claim it was an American Airlines Boeing 757, Flight 77. Reporters lie better than lawyers.
* Meanwhile, the passengers from Flights 11, 175, and 77, now at the military airfield, are loaded onto Flight 93. If you've put some of your own agents aboard, they stay on the ground, of course.
* Flight 93 is taken aloft.
* Flight 93 is shot down or bombed -- makes no difference which. Main deal is to destroy that human meat without questions. Easiest way to dispose of 15,000 lbs. of human flesh, and nobody gets a headline if they find a foot in their front garden. No mass graves will ever be discovered, either.
* The trail is further confused by issuing reports that Flight 77 was actually headed towards the White House but changed course.
* The trail is further confused by having the Washington Post wax lyrical about the flying skills of non-existent pilots on a non-existence plane (Flight 77).
* The trail is further confused with conflicting reports and artificial catfight issues, such as -- did The Presidential Shrub really see the first tower hit on TV while he was waiting to read the story about the pet goat
...So we know the Boeing that used to be Flight 93 was blown up. The other three original Boeings (Flights 11, 175, 77) still exist somewhere, unless they were cut up for scrap.
The passengers and crews of Flights 11, 175, 77, and 93 died in an airplane crash, just like the newspapers said. Only for most of them, it was the wrong crash. But that's as close to the truth as the news media likes to get anyway, so it works.
WHY DO IT THAT WAY? So there you have it. Not four planes. More than four planes. There were the four original Boeing passenger jets that took off from the East Coast airports, the remote controlled Pseudo Flight 175 Boeing, and two small remote controlled jets or cruise missiles. Figure in a couple of extra planes to confuse the flight paths of the original passenger jets.The four original Boeings had conventional controls. The look-alike Boeing and the two small jets were drones, rigged with remote control. You called it Global Hawk, and that's good enough. The mimic planes could have been piloted or remote controlled.
Why not just install remote control in four passenger jets like you described in NO SUICIDE PILOTS? Here's why: You might get remote control gear installed on a passenger jet so pretty the pilot would not notice, but that would be more work, more time, and more people. Then you would have to control your special plane through maintenance dispatch and try to get it lined up for that day, that time, that flight. Then you would have to multiply those efforts by four. There would be too many chances of things going wrong. Plane substitution would be much simpler. You'd just need the NORAD insiders, the personnel at the military airfield, and maybe an agent or two inside the FAA air traffic control system to make sure things go smooth. That should not be too difficult because NORAD has sent lots of its people over to the FAA to work on the FAA radars.
[CV commens:
Some people have suggested the original passenger planes were used with the flight computers hacked and loaded with the collision coordinates for the targets. Maybe the job could have been done that way, but it was not. You know for sure it was not because flight computers do not fly planes the way those were flown. A flight computer is given a set of GPS points (geographic coordinates) to follow, and the computer charts the path between them, correcting for cross-winds and other errors. The flight computer flies smooth and gentle, the way passengers like it, without jerky corrections.
Gen. Eberhart, NORAD commander, told the Senate Armed Services Committee on October 25, 2001 that " . . . we've actually moved manpower on the order of about 200 people over the years to the FAA to operate these radars." Cited in Did NORAD Send The 'Suicide' Jets? Part 2. See Eberhart testimony at:
http://www.ngaus.org/newsroom/HomelandDefenseTrans cript.doc
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/eberhart-testimon y.html ]You know Flight 175 was not on that system when it hit the south tower because it came in fast (they say) in a tight hooking circle that almost missed the tower. An autopilot wouldn't make that mistake. The crash of flight 175 was not a preprgrammed flight computer finding the optimum path. What you see there in the path of 175 is a real-time controller fighting the physics of flight - and almost losing it.
You've already dealt with the Joe Vialls Home Run explanation, so I don't have to analyze that again.
[ http://www.Public-Action.com/911/noradsend.htm
I've seen another lame attempt to explain away what happened: Supposedly AWACS hit the planes with EMF and knocked out their manual electronics, then took over the 9-11 planes by remote and made them crash. That's a pipe dream. Anything that knocked out the electronics from a distance would turn a plane into a flying scrap heap. Those plane are completely dependent on electronics, and no remote beam could pick and choose which circuits to destroy and which to leave intact. OTHER DETAILS * Pentagon Security Photos : On March 7 CNN released four photographs taken by Pentagon security camera on September 11, 2001. Look at the photos:l ]http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/03/07/gen.pentagon.pic
t ures/index.htmlThe Washington Post says: "The first photo shows a small, blurry, white object near the upper right corner -- possibly the plane just a few feet about the ground," but admits "the hijacked American Airlines plane is not clearly visible." ("New Photos Show Attack on Pentagon," March 7, 2002. )
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A56
6 70-2002Mar7.htmlYeah, right, you can believe that the American Airlines plane is not visible.
* Fireman's Video of First Crash. The NBC eyewitness said the plane that few into the North tower was small. This is corroborated by the fireman's video taken on September 11:
http://www.xemox.net/wtc/movies/first.plane.hits.
g p.med.asf[Note to reader: There are other versions of this clip on the Internet, but I have been unable to find one I can verify as the original clip. If you can find a verifiable copy, let me know. CV <SkyWriter@Public.Action.com>]
In that clip, the camera shows a fireman with other workers casually discussing some street work. The fireman looks up over his left shoulder, then behind him, as though he is following a sound. The camera follows his gaze, finds nothing at the original location, then quickly moves to a shot of the WTC, visible through another corridor in the surrounding buildings.
Why does the cameraman focus on the WTC? I can only guess he heard the impact of the plane. The camera does not show the plane in the air prior to impact, so I assume it has already crashed.
In the first frames we see a puff of smoke from the impact site that grows into a cloud and erupts into flame. After a few seconds, the flame dies down and the smoke dissipates. At that moment, the camera shows the huge S-shaped gash in the side of WTC North.
If the wings of a large jet made that gash, the gash should not be S-shaped. The gash should be a straight line like the wings of the jet. But more important: if the impact of the jet made
the gash, the gash should appear at the moment of impact when the camera is first drawn to the building. Instead, it appears AFTER the smoke and flame.[ http://public-action.com/911/gamma.jpg
The Hijackers: I have read reports that some of the alleged hijackers are actually still alive. This suggests the hijacker scenario and the resultant mid-air telephone calls to the relatives is pure bull. But I can't verify the alleged hijackers are still alive, so let's move on.
and
http://public-action.com/911/gamma2.jpg ]
It would be easy for the 9-11 planners to collect the names of people with Muslim-sounding names who were taking flying lessons around the country. Just before 9-11 happens, they are disappeared. Then mid-air phone calls are created, reporting hijackers who were never aboard the planes. That would work.
As you and many people have noticed, the Muslim names don't appear on the passenger lists of the four flights. The hijackers names don't even appear on the list of passengers released by United on September 12 -- the list of passengers on Flights 175 and 93.
[ http://www.Public-Action.com/911/uapassngerlis
Sure it was careless not to put the Arab names on the passenger lists, but nobody's perfect.t ]Just to show you how scripted the Flight 93 hijacking thing was, think about the alleged phone calls from the passengers on Flight 93 to their next of kin in the moments before the crash. Supposedly, they learned of the attacks on the Pentagon and the WTC with their handy cell phones, and they figured out their own plane was hijacked for a similar purpose. So they decided to be heroes and take the plane away from the hijackers.
According to the Dallas Morning News : "The fourth time Thomas Burnett Jr. phoned his wife, Deena, he acknowledged up front: 'I know we're going to die. There's three of us who are going to do something about it.'"
[ Dallas Morning News, "Trapped in the skies, captives fought back," September 17, 2001.
Heroic, wasn't it? And not a dry hanky in the house. The heroes of modern America. A high school basketball star, a college rugby player, a forest ranger, a woman police officer
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/dmnheroes ] ...But why did it have to be suicide heroism? "They knew their deaths were inevitable, according to some family members with whom they spoke on the phone, and they didn't want thousands more to die with them." It makes a better story, of course. "Suicide Heroes Defeat Suicide Hijackers."
Why did they have to die? The crew was still alive and "herded at knife point to the back of the plane, where the passengers were being held," according to the same report. They weren't dead. If the passengers got control from the hijackers, couldn't the crew fly the plane? Why didn't those brave heroes say things like, "There's a chance we might save this boat"? But they said, "I know we're going to die."
Obviously, this script was concocted in midnight a bull sessions like they had in Dustin Hoffman's mansion in "Wag the Dog". And the American public has been trained on weak plots for decades on prime time TV, so they don't WANT to think their way out of a wet paper bag. It spoils the show.
Only the writers and producers of Operation 911 knew that the passengers of Flight 93 had to die. But the temptation was too much, so they put it in the passenger dialog, too. And that's how you know the cell phone calls are just theater, not fact.
By the way, if I was planning this operation, I'd put some fictitious names on the passenger list, so when the flight went down, the media could interview fake relatives. Like that Operation Northwoods plan in which a fake Cuban jet would shoot down a fake American passenger jet. Whoever planned that must have planned to use fake grieving relatives, too.
[ http://www.Public-Action.com//911/northwds.htm
And then of course I've heard they can do marvelous things with voice simulation. How about that fellow who called his mother from Flight 93 and said "Mom, this is Mark Bingham." That has all the truth of a plaster fish trophy. That one guy, Todd Beamer, with the pregnant wife -- she didn't talk to him directly, she just got a message from the answering service.l ]["The Final Moments of Flight 93," September 22, 2001, by Karen Breslau (NEWSWEEK WEB EXCLUSIVE)
Is this all too much for your to swallow? Don't you believe people would conspire to pull all this off? Well, look at the stakes. This current war will go on for years and blot out one of the world's great religions, legitimize military rule in the United States, redistribute the world's oil resources, and change the entire power structure of planet Earth. All that's needed to make it happen is ambition, chutzpah, "a few good men," and a nation that is willing to be deceived.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/632626.asp
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/finalmoments93 ]The problem with people like you when you try to understand events like this, you are not a trained killer. When you come to wiping out the whoever, you shrink back. That's normal. That is one of the things you have to train out of a soldier.
But when a soldier plans something like this, he doesn't flinch at the killing. He just takes that into the plans like one more or one less egg in the omelet. If he has to kill the enemy or Americans or even
himself, it doesn't matter because sometimes he has to do that to win. He's trained that way.The only thing that matters is the Objective. Whatever a soldier has to do to win the Objective, that is what he has to do. All of this false piety about suicide bombers is nuts. Well trained Americans would do that if you ordered them to. If they didn't, they weren't well trained.
So you have to kill a hundred, a thousand, or five thousand civilians, you just do it in the best way that will help the Objective.
-
(Sigh) Heil !Flight Of The Bumble Planes by Snake Plissken
as told to Carol A. Valentine
Curator, Waco Holocaust Electronic Museum http://www.Public-Action.com
Copyright, March, 2002
May be reproduced for non-commercial purposes
March 10, 2002 -- Eureka! One of my readers, who calls himself "Snake Plissken," has put it together. He tells us why the passenger lists of the four September 11 "suicide" jets were so small, how remote control was used, why the transponders were turned off, why the radar tracks of the four planes were confused, why there was no Boeing 757 debris at the Pentagon
By George, I think he's got it!My e-mail exchanges with Snake took place over a series of days. With Snake's agreement, I have consolidated the exchanges, inserted some reference URLs, and made minor edits. My comments and additions will be bracketed thus [ ]. As you read what Snake has to say, keep the following in mind:
Magic is the pretended performance of those things which cannot be done. The success of a magician's simulation of doing the impossible depends upon misleading the minds of his audiences. This, in the main, is done by adding, to a performance, details of which the spectators are unaware, and leaving out others which they believe you have not left out. In short a performance of magic is largely a demonstration of the universal reliability of certain facts of psychology.
In what follows, Snake unravels the illusions of the 9-11 magicians.
(John Mulholland, The Art of Illusion, Charles Scribner & Sons, 1944.)Carol,
You did some fine research on 9-11. You came within inches of solving the puzzle of the "suicide" jets, and now you need the rest of the story. Let me explain by making a suggestion.
Go visit a bumblebee hive some time, and try to keep your eye on just one bee. You can't do it. You get confused. Think of the 9-11 jets as bumblebees. Matter of fact, you could even call Operation 911 Flight of the Bumble Planes.
I've worked in cryptology and there are many ways of hiding the truth. Substitute information, omit information, scramble the information out of sequence, and add nonsense (random garbage). All four methods were used on the 9-11 incident. Let me lay out the clues and show you where they lead.
THE CLUE First Clue -- Few Passengers On The Four Flights: Many have remarked about the short passenger lists on the four 911 jets. You might get a low turnout for a 767 or 757 now and then, but four coast to-coast flights taking off from the East inside of a few minutes of each other, all with short passenger lists? Nuts. That's your first clue.Second Clue -- First Report of First WTC Crash: The second clue comes from the first New York eyewitness on NBC. She had no question about what she saw. You could hear it in her voice. If she was the state's witness, the defense team would have their heads between their knees before she stopped talking.
What did she say? She heard an airplane coming in low and looked up. She saw a small private jet, and watched it fly into the first WTC tower, the North tower. She was certain in her description -- most people know the difference between a big round-nose commercial jet and a smaller plane.
[ CV cmments:
Later, some dodgy report came in from an anonymous source in the "United Airlines Command Center" that American Airlines had a hijacking, and they gradually padded the story out until the viewer felt like he was part of an unfolding revelation on the size and make of the plane. So the first eyewitness's story got shellacked.
In his testimony before the Senate Armed Services Committee on October 25, 2001, NORAD commander Ralph Eberhart said of the first September 11 report: "We were told it was a light commuter airplane. It didn't look like that was caused by a light commuter airplane."
http://www.ngaus.org/newsroom/HomelandDefenseTrans cript.doc
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/eberhart-testimon y.html ]Third clue -- Pentagon Crash: The first report on NBC said there had been an explosion near the Pentagon heliport. No mention of a plane.
If you were watching ABC, the first reports cited eyewitnesses who said a business jet had crashed into the Pentagon. Notice that this description is similar to the first report about the WTC. A small plane, not a big, round-nosed passenger jet.
Then ABC interviewed some media executive who said he "saw the whole thing" from his car on the freeway. It was an American Airlines passenger jet. Good luck the road didn't need his attention while he was gawking. And of course it was a big passenger jet scraping the light poles with it's belly as it came in low. And that story paved the way for the official truth.
Fourth Clue -- No Boeing 757 Debris at Pentagon Crash Site : By now lots of people have realized there is something very wrong with the story of Flight 77's crash into the Pentagon. What's the problem? The wingspan of a 757 is about 125 feet, with about 35 feet between the two jet engines.
[CV comments: http://www.boeing.com/commercial/757-200/ext.html
After the smoke died down, everyone could see the Pentagon but no one could see the plane. The Pentagon is made of masonry -- limestone -- not steel and glass. The aluminum wings of the plane should have been ripped off and left outside the building. We should have seen wing wreckage. But there was none.
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/boeing757-200The hole left by whatever hit the building was 70 feet across.
US News & World Report, December 10, 2001, pg. 31
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/usn011210-1.jpg ][CV comments:
Fifth Clue -- Quality of Pilots in Pentagon crash: As you point out in Operation 911: NO SUICIDE PILOTS
I have studied TV footage taken contemporaneously by various networks and reviewed photos from news magazines published just after 9-11. After the smoke died down, no Boeing 757 debris was visible.See the following URLs at the website of the U.S. Army Military District of Washington, D.C., sent to me by researcher John DiNardo, <jadinardo@hotmail.com>. By the way, Mr. DiNardo suspects that inside explosives were used at the Pentagon on 9-11. Certainly the damaged section of the building had just been renovated; explosives would have been easy to install.
http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / iretruck.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon6http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / apitolview.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon5http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / ars-damaged.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon2The scenes depicted by the US Army photos are consistent with contemporaneously published photos in the popular press. See, for example, US News and World Report, September 14, 2001, pg. 40.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/usn010914-1.jpg
and the photo that appeared in Newsweek's 2001 "Extra" edition, pgs. 26, 27.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/nwkxtr-1.jpgThis photograph below, with caption, appeared on the US Army Military District of Washington site. It unwittingly demonstrates that there was no Boeing 757 wreckage. Think now: a hundred thousand pounds of seats, framework, skin plates, engine parts, flaps, wheels, luggage, interior panels, electronics, and this little out-of-context scrap of God-knows-what was shown by the Pentagon.
http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/page
s / lanepiece.html
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/pentagon0In the last several months, largely as a result of Mr. DiNardo's work, there has been growing Internet discussion of the lack of Boeing 757 debris outside the Pentagon. Now, magically, new photos of "Boeing 757" Pentagon wreckage are beginning to appear. Check out the websites of Mike Rivero <whatreallyhappened.com> and Joe Vialls for copies of these fakes. Rivero and Vialls, by endorsing them as real, have surely identified themselves as members of the fake opposition.
OK. Now back to Snake Plissken]
[http://www.Public-action.com/911/robotplane.html ]
the flying instructors who trained the "suicide" pilots of Flight 77 said they were hopeless. "It was like they had hardly even ever driven a car ..." The flight instructors called the two, "dumb and dumber," and told them to quit taking lessons.Yet the Washington Post described the maneuvers of Flight 77 before it hit the Pentagon. The huge jet took a 270 degree hairpin turn to make its target. The Post said Flight 77 had to be flown by expert pilots.
Something is wrong here. Now "dumb and dumber" are expert pilots. That is your fifth clue.
Sixth Clue -- Transponders Turned Off: As you point out, the "hijackers" turned off the transponders which transmit information showing the airline names, flight numbers, and altitude. But the FAA also uses conventional radar, so the "hijackers" must have known the planes were still visible. Why would the "hijackers" shut the transponders off, you asked? You are looking at your sixth clue.
[ Did NORAD Send The 'Suicide' Jets? Part 1
Seventh Clue -- Confusion On Radar Tracks: As you point out, some of these flights disappeared from the conventional radar scopes. [See above-cited URL.] That's your seventh clue.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/noradsend.html ]Eighth Clue -- Second WTC Tower Barely Hit : Have a look at the footage of the second WTC tower being hit. The plane almost missed the tower and just managed to hit the corner. Yet the first plane struck its target dead center. That's your eighth clue.
[See diagrams from Wag the WTC website at:
* A Boeing 767 was secured and painted up to look like a United Airlines jet. It had remote controls installed in it, courtesy of some NORAD types. Call that plane "Pseudo Flight 175" and leave it parked at a military airfield for the moment.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/psyopnews/Extra/1 / outhtowerpath.jpg ] HERE'S WHAT HAPPENED* The number of the passengers on each flight was kept artificially low that day. Easy to do. Just monkey with the airline computers and show the fights full so no more tickets are sold. Include some of your own operatives in each flight, maybe.
* After the planes are in the air, the transponders must be shut down. There are a few ways to do this, maybe, but the simplest is this: Have one of the NORAD insiders call the pilots and say: "This is the North American Aerospace Defense Command. There is a national emergency. We are under terrorist attack. Turn off your transponders. Maintain radio silence. Here is your new flight plan. You will land at [name] military air base."
* The pilots turn off the transponders. The FAA weenies lose the information which identifies the airline, the flight number, and the altitude of the planes. Of course the planes can still be seen on conventional radar, but the planes are just nameless blips now.
* What did the radar show of the planes' flight paths? We'll never see the real records, for sure. But in the spy movies, when the spy wants to lose a tail, he gets a double to lead the tail one way while the spy goes the other. If I were designing Operation 911, I'd do that: As each of the original jets is flying, another jet is sent to fly just above or below it, at the same latitude and longitude. The blips of the two planes merge on the radar scopes. Alternately, a plane is sent to cross the flight path of the original plane. Again, the blips merge, just like the little bees you're watching outside the hive. The original planes proceed to the military airfield and air traffic control is thoroughly confused, watching the wrong blips
...That's probably close to the way it was managed. Like I say, we'll never see the radar records so we won't know exactly.
[For the alleged flight paths of the four jets, see
* A small remote controlled commuter jet filled with incendiaries/explosives -- a cruise missile, if you like -- is flown into the first WTC tower. That's the plane the first NBC eyewitness saw.
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/4flights.html
For names and locations of military airfields in the US, try
http://www.globemaster.de/bases.html
You can search for a listing of bases in 9-11 related states by using the search engine.]* The remote controlled "Pseudo Flight 175," decked out to look like a United airlines passenger jet, is sent aloft and flown by remote control -- without passengers -- and crashed into the second tower.
Beautiful! Everyone has pictures of that.
Why did Pseudo Flight 175 almost miss the second tower? Because the remote operators were used to smaller, more maneuverable craft, not a big stubborn passenger jet. The operators brought the jet in on a tight circle and almost blew it because those jets do hairpin turns like the Queen Mary. They brought it in too fast and too close to do the job right and just hit the corner of the tower.
* Then another remote controlled commuter jet filled with incendiaries/explosives -- a cruise missile if you like -- hits the Pentagon, in the name of Flight 77.
* Eyewitnesses are a dime a dozen. Trusted media whores "witness" the Pentagon hit and claim it was an American Airlines Boeing 757, Flight 77. Reporters lie better than lawyers.
* Meanwhile, the passengers from Flights 11, 175, and 77, now at the military airfield, are loaded onto Flight 93. If you've put some of your own agents aboard, they stay on the ground, of course.
* Flight 93 is taken aloft.
* Flight 93 is shot down or bombed -- makes no difference which. Main deal is to destroy that human meat without questions. Easiest way to dispose of 15,000 lbs. of human flesh, and nobody gets a headline if they find a foot in their front garden. No mass graves will ever be discovered, either.
* The trail is further confused by issuing reports that Flight 77 was actually headed towards the White House but changed course.
* The trail is further confused by having the Washington Post wax lyrical about the flying skills of non-existent pilots on a non-existence plane (Flight 77).
* The trail is further confused with conflicting reports and artificial catfight issues, such as -- did The Presidential Shrub really see the first tower hit on TV while he was waiting to read the story about the pet goat
...So we know the Boeing that used to be Flight 93 was blown up. The other three original Boeings (Flights 11, 175, 77) still exist somewhere, unless they were cut up for scrap.
The passengers and crews of Flights 11, 175, 77, and 93 died in an airplane crash, just like the newspapers said. Only for most of them, it was the wrong crash. But that's as close to the truth as the news media likes to get anyway, so it works.
WHY DO IT THAT WAY? So there you have it. Not four planes. More than four planes. There were the four original Boeing passenger jets that took off from the East Coast airports, the remote controlled Pseudo Flight 175 Boeing, and two small remote controlled jets or cruise missiles. Figure in a couple of extra planes to confuse the flight paths of the original passenger jets.The four original Boeings had conventional controls. The look-alike Boeing and the two small jets were drones, rigged with remote control. You called it Global Hawk, and that's good enough. The mimic planes could have been piloted or remote controlled.
Why not just install remote control in four passenger jets like you described in NO SUICIDE PILOTS? Here's why: You might get remote control gear installed on a passenger jet so pretty the pilot would not notice, but that would be more work, more time, and more people. Then you would have to control your special plane through maintenance dispatch and try to get it lined up for that day, that time, that flight. Then you would have to multiply those efforts by four. There would be too many chances of things going wrong. Plane substitution would be much simpler. You'd just need the NORAD insiders, the personnel at the military airfield, and maybe an agent or two inside the FAA air traffic control system to make sure things go smooth. That should not be too difficult because NORAD has sent lots of its people over to the FAA to work on the FAA radars.
[CV commens:
Some people have suggested the original passenger planes were used with the flight computers hacked and loaded with the collision coordinates for the targets. Maybe the job could have been done that way, but it was not. You know for sure it was not because flight computers do not fly planes the way those were flown. A flight computer is given a set of GPS points (geographic coordinates) to follow, and the computer charts the path between them, correcting for cross-winds and other errors. The flight computer flies smooth and gentle, the way passengers like it, without jerky corrections.
Gen. Eberhart, NORAD commander, told the Senate Armed Services Committee on October 25, 2001 that " . . . we've actually moved manpower on the order of about 200 people over the years to the FAA to operate these radars." Cited in Did NORAD Send The 'Suicide' Jets? Part 2. See Eberhart testimony at:
http://www.ngaus.org/newsroom/HomelandDefenseTrans cript.doc
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/eberhart-testimon y.html ]You know Flight 175 was not on that system when it hit the south tower because it came in fast (they say) in a tight hooking circle that almost missed the tower. An autopilot wouldn't make that mistake. The crash of flight 175 was not a preprgrammed flight computer finding the optimum path. What you see there in the path of 175 is a real-time controller fighting the physics of flight - and almost losing it.
You've already dealt with the Joe Vialls Home Run explanation, so I don't have to analyze that again.
[ http://www.Public-Action.com/911/noradsend.htm
I've seen another lame attempt to explain away what happened: Supposedly AWACS hit the planes with EMF and knocked out their manual electronics, then took over the 9-11 planes by remote and made them crash. That's a pipe dream. Anything that knocked out the electronics from a distance would turn a plane into a flying scrap heap. Those plane are completely dependent on electronics, and no remote beam could pick and choose which circuits to destroy and which to leave intact. OTHER DETAILS * Pentagon Security Photos : On March 7 CNN released four photographs taken by Pentagon security camera on September 11, 2001. Look at the photos:l ]http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/03/07/gen.pentagon.pic
t ures/index.htmlThe Washington Post says: "The first photo shows a small, blurry, white object near the upper right corner -- possibly the plane just a few feet about the ground," but admits "the hijacked American Airlines plane is not clearly visible." ("New Photos Show Attack on Pentagon," March 7, 2002. )
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A56
6 70-2002Mar7.htmlYeah, right, you can believe that the American Airlines plane is not visible.
* Fireman's Video of First Crash. The NBC eyewitness said the plane that few into the North tower was small. This is corroborated by the fireman's video taken on September 11:
http://www.xemox.net/wtc/movies/first.plane.hits.
g p.med.asf[Note to reader: There are other versions of this clip on the Internet, but I have been unable to find one I can verify as the original clip. If you can find a verifiable copy, let me know. CV <SkyWriter@Public.Action.com>]
In that clip, the camera shows a fireman with other workers casually discussing some street work. The fireman looks up over his left shoulder, then behind him, as though he is following a sound. The camera follows his gaze, finds nothing at the original location, then quickly moves to a shot of the WTC, visible through another corridor in the surrounding buildings.
Why does the cameraman focus on the WTC? I can only guess he heard the impact of the plane. The camera does not show the plane in the air prior to impact, so I assume it has already crashed.
In the first frames we see a puff of smoke from the impact site that grows into a cloud and erupts into flame. After a few seconds, the flame dies down and the smoke dissipates. At that moment, the camera shows the huge S-shaped gash in the side of WTC North.
If the wings of a large jet made that gash, the gash should not be S-shaped. The gash should be a straight line like the wings of the jet. But more important: if the impact of the jet made
the gash, the gash should appear at the moment of impact when the camera is first drawn to the building. Instead, it appears AFTER the smoke and flame.[ http://public-action.com/911/gamma.jpg
The Hijackers: I have read reports that some of the alleged hijackers are actually still alive. This suggests the hijacker scenario and the resultant mid-air telephone calls to the relatives is pure bull. But I can't verify the alleged hijackers are still alive, so let's move on.
and
http://public-action.com/911/gamma2.jpg ]
It would be easy for the 9-11 planners to collect the names of people with Muslim-sounding names who were taking flying lessons around the country. Just before 9-11 happens, they are disappeared. Then mid-air phone calls are created, reporting hijackers who were never aboard the planes. That would work.
As you and many people have noticed, the Muslim names don't appear on the passenger lists of the four flights. The hijackers names don't even appear on the list of passengers released by United on September 12 -- the list of passengers on Flights 175 and 93.
[ http://www.Public-Action.com/911/uapassngerlis
Sure it was careless not to put the Arab names on the passenger lists, but nobody's perfect.t ]Just to show you how scripted the Flight 93 hijacking thing was, think about the alleged phone calls from the passengers on Flight 93 to their next of kin in the moments before the crash. Supposedly, they learned of the attacks on the Pentagon and the WTC with their handy cell phones, and they figured out their own plane was hijacked for a similar purpose. So they decided to be heroes and take the plane away from the hijackers.
According to the Dallas Morning News : "The fourth time Thomas Burnett Jr. phoned his wife, Deena, he acknowledged up front: 'I know we're going to die. There's three of us who are going to do something about it.'"
[ Dallas Morning News, "Trapped in the skies, captives fought back," September 17, 2001.
Heroic, wasn't it? And not a dry hanky in the house. The heroes of modern America. A high school basketball star, a college rugby player, a forest ranger, a woman police officer
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/dmnheroes ] ...But why did it have to be suicide heroism? "They knew their deaths were inevitable, according to some family members with whom they spoke on the phone, and they didn't want thousands more to die with them." It makes a better story, of course. "Suicide Heroes Defeat Suicide Hijackers."
Why did they have to die? The crew was still alive and "herded at knife point to the back of the plane, where the passengers were being held," according to the same report. They weren't dead. If the passengers got control from the hijackers, couldn't the crew fly the plane? Why didn't those brave heroes say things like, "There's a chance we might save this boat"? But they said, "I know we're going to die."
Obviously, this script was concocted in midnight a bull sessions like they had in Dustin Hoffman's mansion in "Wag the Dog". And the American public has been trained on weak plots for decades on prime time TV, so they don't WANT to think their way out of a wet paper bag. It spoils the show.
Only the writers and producers of Operation 911 knew that the passengers of Flight 93 had to die. But the temptation was too much, so they put it in the passenger dialog, too. And that's how you know the cell phone calls are just theater, not fact.
By the way, if I was planning this operation, I'd put some fictitious names on the passenger list, so when the flight went down, the media could interview fake relatives. Like that Operation Northwoods plan in which a fake Cuban jet would shoot down a fake American passenger jet. Whoever planned that must have planned to use fake grieving relatives, too.
[ http://www.Public-Action.com//911/northwds.htm
And then of course I've heard they can do marvelous things with voice simulation. How about that fellow who called his mother from Flight 93 and said "Mom, this is Mark Bingham." That has all the truth of a plaster fish trophy. That one guy, Todd Beamer, with the pregnant wife -- she didn't talk to him directly, she just got a message from the answering service.l ]["The Final Moments of Flight 93," September 22, 2001, by Karen Breslau (NEWSWEEK WEB EXCLUSIVE)
Is this all too much for your to swallow? Don't you believe people would conspire to pull all this off? Well, look at the stakes. This current war will go on for years and blot out one of the world's great religions, legitimize military rule in the United States, redistribute the world's oil resources, and change the entire power structure of planet Earth. All that's needed to make it happen is ambition, chutzpah, "a few good men," and a nation that is willing to be deceived.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/632626.asp
or
http://www.Public-Action.com/911/finalmoments93 ]The problem with people like you when you try to understand events like this, you are not a trained killer. When you come to wiping out the whoever, you shrink back. That's normal. That is one of the things you have to train out of a soldier.
But when a soldier plans something like this, he doesn't flinch at the killing. He just takes that into the plans like one more or one less egg in the omelet. If he has to kill the enemy or Americans or even
himself, it doesn't matter because sometimes he has to do that to win. He's trained that way.The only thing that matters is the Objective. Whatever a soldier has to do to win the Objective, that is what he has to do. All of this false piety about suicide bombers is nuts. Well trained Americans would do that if you ordered them to. If they didn't, they weren't well trained.
So you have to kill a hundred, a thousand, or five thousand civilians, you just do it in the best way that will help the Objective.
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Re: Compaq hot-plug drives
Let me get this right... you buy a used computer, and then go straight to the manufacturer for replacement parts??? (Surely you know 'accessories' are one of their higher-margin profit centers!)Still... if you're in the Seattle, WA area, stop in the Boeing Surplus Retail Store. I was there last week, and they had a bucket of what looked like 80-pin 2.1GB Compaq hot-plug drives. They were just sitting there next to a cash register like candy would be at a supermarket. I don't remember the price, but I want to say they wanted ~$5 each for 'em.
They were also selling an Indigo ($50), lots of PCs (mostly old Dell OptiPlex models, $20 - $300, Pentium MMXs to P-IIs), and even a Barco data-grade projector ($2500). Fun place to go and blow half a day poking around.
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Re:CA unemployment myths vs realities: my own storWell, if you are computer savy (which I assume most of
/. is), you can do what I am doing while going to school ...
I work at a place that is open 24 hours a day, I get full benefits (medical, dental, life insurance, and more), and make about $12 an hour plus profit sharing. And, the more profitible locations are ALWAYS looking for computer savy people.
My job duties include working with multiple platforms (Win, Mac, Solaris), doing all kinds of geeky stuff as a computer service specialist.
Plus, most importantly, you meet anyone who is anyone in the local companies ... I am on a first name basis with most of the top brass at a huge biotech company, several aerospace companies, a really cool, really geeky engineering department in the music industry, and just about anywhere else worth working in my area.
I get job offers all of the time, but am holding off until I finish school.
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Re:Evil AntennaeDude...it's not a "vague safety rule" that the attendants arbitrarily enforce. All electronic devices emit some electromagnetic interference. By law they must not contain circuitry/casing to completely remove this interference. I'm not sure why this is, but there is always a disclaimer to this in the manual or back of any device.
The aggregate amount of interference generated by passengers' spinning CD player motors, laptop LCD displays, CPU clocks, etc. has caused some concern by the FAA. Even low levels of interference can mess with sensitive avionics and communications systems. Most planes weren't built with much shielding in the passenger area because personal electronic devices weren't prevalent when they were manufactured...not to mention the fact that saving weight is paramount in aircraft manufacturing. The only protection is provided by shielding the wires themselves, which is OK but far from ideal. Stray signals can also be picked up by antennae located on the outside of the craft thanks to the multitude of windows that easily leak radio frequencies.
Here's a brief synopsis: http://www.physics.nwu.edu/classes/2001Fall/Phyx1
3 5-2/22/more.htm. Another good article is here. -
Boeing Phantom Works ProjectFor those of you who want to a know a little about the next-gen unmanned aerial combat vehicles try Boeing's X-45.
X-45 Stats:
Primary Mission: Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses (SEAD)
Length: 27ft
Wingspan: 34ft
Weight: 8,000lbs (empty)
Payload: 3,000lbs
Acquisition Cost: 65% Less than Manned Fighter Aircraft
Maintenance Cost: 75% Less than Current Systems
Timeframe to Deployment: 2007-2010
Unique Qualities: stealth aircraft; wings can be removed; vehicle can be containerized for shipment or storage.
Typical Mission: a typical mission scenario, multiple UCAVs will be equipped with preprogrammed objectives and preliminary targeting information from ground-based mission planners. Operations can then be carried out autonomously, but can also be managed interactively or revised en route by UCAV controllers should new objectives or targeting information dictate. -
Re:Only thing a better monitoring system would do.
We only get about a months notice of such close passes anyway and there is no way we're going to be able to get a 'Bruce Willis and mates' crew up into orbit in 30 days.
We wouldn't be sending any people out there. We'd be sending nukes. Lots of them, hopefully.
Could we lob enough thermonuclear devices at it in thirty days to nudge its orbit? We've still got plenty of warheads
,the problem is launch vehicles. How many powerful rockets (something along the power of the Delta II that launched NEAR would be about right, I suppose, though probably built more to the big dumb booster model) could we build in a month if nearly the entire planet's industrial output was devoted to that end?I don't know. But I think we'd be trying really really hard.
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Re:Of RPMs and Throughput
Quantum used to make a multi-headed drive like that, known as the 'Chinook', after the helicopter with a pair of rotors. It was reputed to be very fast at the time (1990 or so, IIRC).
[it was Conner, not Quantum - here's a page about it] -
Re:Re-engined B-52s
Boeing submited an unsolicited proposal to the USAF to re-engine the remaining B52s. The proposal was to replace the eight TF-33 turbofans with four RB211-535 turbofans, the same engines that are used in most 757s. They produce 37,000lb - 43,000lb thrust which is an improvement over the 34,000lb produced by two TF-33s but nowhere near the output of the Trent 800s used in the 777. Details are on the Boeing site.
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Re:Too bad they didn't do this for the SR71..
Titanium body, sustained speed and altitude specs that still (so far as I know) can't be beat.
Or what about the XB-70a ("Valkyrie")???(More links here.)
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Re:The end of air combat
You mean, say, something like this?