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What joystick device does WineX use? How do I get joystick support for X-Plane, and I asked for the name of a WineX game/demo that joysticks are known to work for. I get a half assed instructions on how to install a joystick under kernel 2.4.x and ticket closed.

Well my joystick has always worked under Linux, I complained about the response, they said they answered my question, I asked them to reread the question, they then gave me the name of a demo, my joystick worked with that demo. They also said it was a their practice to close tickets without customer feedback. In general they were plain rude.

My joystick still does not work with X-plane, I would also like to have a descent combat flight simulator like Aces High both games load and run well except the joystick does not work!

MSFS is a lousy sim to train for anything. The flight modeling is lousy compared with serious simulators, and it's not FAA approved for any sort of training at all. By comparison, Virtual Wings and Elite can be used for IFR training and X-Plane can be used for Instrument Rating, Commercial and Airline Transport Certificate. WHEN used with a $150,000 Motus full-motion platform. But the software is available separately- and competes with MSFS. At, I believe, a markedly lower price- and it's available for MacOSX, not just Windows.

So let's have no more of this 'MSFS is so good for IFR training' silliness ;)

If you want a cheaper way to play shuttle-pilot, X-Plane offers a space shuttle landing scenario. The demo version limits you to about 6 minutes of flight time, but that's enough to land the shuttle from final approach. Of course the payed version doesn't have a time limit, and you can start from space and land from there.

The mechanics of flying the plane are also pretty simple. As I stated in the root post, almost anyone can learn to fly any plane in about 3 days training. At least well enough to take command while already in the air, and to complete a suicide mission like this. Navigation is minimally important. Takeoff and landing are not needed. Proper proceedures for traffic space traversal, weather evaluation, flight planning, fuel management, collision avoidance, weight and balance, cockpit resource management and all that other pilot training stuff are unneccesary.

Most everything you need to know, the plane already knows if it has current instrumentation. All you need is someone to have given you notes on what buttons to press, and when. That information is simply gleaned from the plane's flight operation manual which is freely available, or from the flight data system's manual.
Once the auto-pilot is disengaged, you don't need to necessarily mess with the hardware on the plane. You can simply usea a handheld GPS reciever and a laptop with a moving map. You can get such a setup from many electronics retailers.

Tell ya what: Try this very thing onX-Plane. I only suggest X-PLane because it's on Mac and PC, and is very realistic. Have it start you off in a random spot around New York City and try flying in to any particular building. Use a dry erase marker to make the circle on your windscreen.

I don't know if we are talking about the same company, but Microsoft has produced many amazing games.

Flight Sim 98, 2000, 2002, Combat Flight Sim 1, Combat Flight Sim 2, Links, MechWarrior, MotoCross Madness... not to mention all there Xbox games that kick ass.

I'm sorry, but Windows 2000 runs just fine, Windows XP runs just fine, Office 2000 is a great suite, Microsoft Money is a life saver, and i can go on and on.

Flight Sim 2002 alone is worth every damn penny, and without microsoft a game that advanced wouldn't be available for the 39.00 you can purchase it at. Good simulation programs can run upwards of 200 bucks, and have alot less features!

Quite an interesting read. Some excerpts:

I DID POSSIBLY THE MOST EXCITING THING I HAVE EVER DONE TONIGHT. (OK, technically I finished it THIS MORNING). As some of you may know, I have been gathering data on Martian atmosphere, gravity, surface "texture", and topography for X-Plane from various NASA sites (http://ltpwww.gsfc.nasa.gov/tharsis/mola.html, for example).

...

(Could I be the first human to fly a real-time flight simulaton of Mars? I have seen many "movies" of "flying" over Mars terrain, but NONE have been hooked to an actual realistic FLIGHT MODEL... has NASA done a REAL-TIME simulation of Mars flight in a PILOTED aircraft? Has ANYONE?) Well, I have for the last 6 hours, AND IT IS FRIGGIN FASCINATING.

...

So what sort of planes can fly on Mars? Not anything from Earth, that's for sure. Not enough lift or thrust. A Cessna or Boeing will just sit there on the ground without even moving. Put them in the air and they drop like beveled bricks with no wings. Both of my Mars-plane concepts are much like the U-2 Spyplane (designed to operate at around 100,000 ft, in simlar density air) one with a HUGE high-bypass jet engine built AROUND THE FUSELAGE, and another with a smaller rocket engine in the tail, like the X-15. The rocket plane has a lower-thrust engine, with plenty of fuel, for about 30 minutes of flight or so... the JET plane can fly for hours!

Quite an interesting read. Some excerpts:

I DID POSSIBLY THE MOST EXCITING THING I HAVE EVER DONE TONIGHT. (OK, technically I finished it THIS MORNING). As some of you may know, I have been gathering data on Martian atmosphere, gravity, surface "texture", and topography for X-Plane from various NASA sites (http://ltpwww.gsfc.nasa.gov/tharsis/mola.html, for example).

...

(Could I be the first human to fly a real-time flight simulaton of Mars? I have seen many "movies" of "flying" over Mars terrain, but NONE have been hooked to an actual realistic FLIGHT MODEL... has NASA done a REAL-TIME simulation of Mars flight in a PILOTED aircraft? Has ANYONE?) Well, I have for the last 6 hours, AND IT IS FRIGGIN FASCINATING.

...

So what sort of planes can fly on Mars? Not anything from Earth, that's for sure. Not enough lift or thrust. A Cessna or Boeing will just sit there on the ground without even moving. Put them in the air and they drop like beveled bricks with no wings. Both of my Mars-plane concepts are much like the U-2 Spyplane (designed to operate at around 100,000 ft, in simlar density air) one with a HUGE high-bypass jet engine built AROUND THE FUSELAGE, and another with a smaller rocket engine in the tail, like the X-15. The rocket plane has a lower-thrust engine, with plenty of fuel, for about 30 minutes of flight or so... the JET plane can fly for hours!

It seems the Aerowinx software he's planning to use is based on empirical data from thousands of 747 flights.
Perhaps he should consider X-Plane instead. It derives it's aerodynamics from first principles, and is quite accurate in simulating things that haven't been actually done. You can even get FAA certification from using X-Plane. It's already got the software hooks to drive a motion platform.
Plus you can hack the hell out of it. There's a large community of users with interesting mods.

It seems the Aerowinx software he's planning to use is based on empirical data from thousands of 747 flights.
Perhaps he should consider X-Plane instead. It derives it's aerodynamics from first principles, and is quite accurate in simulating things that haven't been actually done. You can even get FAA certification from using X-Plane. It's already got the software hooks to drive a motion platform.
Plus you can hack the hell out of it. There's a large community of users with interesting mods.

X-Plane I believe it works by hooking up other comps running X-Plane, via ethernet, for the other views you want. Also has an instructor station. And apparently is certified by the FAA for getting your commercial instrument rating!

Point well taken.

But there are a lot of one-man projects that look pretty cool. For example, I thought X-Plane was pretty amazing: looks and sounds pretty nice (at least my old version, the new version looks and sounds even more impressive) and is very realistic.

Then, there are projects like Nethack: Developed by a group, with not too many visual arts or music talents... but the game itself is what counts, and even when it's ASCII or has ugly graphics, the game itself is excellent.

But this, of course, doesn't mean that everyone is instantaneously able to make games like these =)

Point well taken.

But there are a lot of one-man projects that look pretty cool. For example, I thought X-Plane was pretty amazing: looks and sounds pretty nice (at least my old version, the new version looks and sounds even more impressive) and is very realistic.

Then, there are projects like Nethack: Developed by a group, with not too many visual arts or music talents... but the game itself is what counts, and even when it's ASCII or has ugly graphics, the game itself is excellent.

But this, of course, doesn't mean that everyone is instantaneously able to make games like these =)

Man, it already exists.
Grab the latest demo from x-plane. The worldwide environment to be soon released (version 6.10) is composed from the USGS GTOPO30, USGS landuse map and NIMA world vector map (roads, rivers, electric lines et al).

For anyone who's really interested, X-Plane have a Mars scenario and planes that will fly on Mars (this is a sim, in case anyone hasn't got it yet), and a report on how it's done.

For anyone who's really interested, X-Plane have a Mars scenario and planes that will fly on Mars (this is a sim, in case anyone hasn't got it yet), and a report on how it's done.

Well, if there is a game with accurate physics, it would be X-plane. Heck, with this game, you can even land the space shuttle.

The only problem is that right now, we don't have anywhere close to enough data for the other planets. On mars, we got lucky because NASA released all of their data from the explorer.

I have downloaded the Demo for uplink and that is the sweetest game I have played in years. Makes me feel like a little script kiddy all over time.

X Plane will be my lover when it gets ported to linux. The game looks sweet. Simulation of flying on mars is just too cool. //BAD JOKE// I just cant wait to fly my airPlane into build..... I mean airports.//BAD JOKE//

The X-Plane web site has a description of some of the problems of conventional (non-flapping) flight on Mars. They also have flight models to allow simulation of flight. (However, the propulsion is a little unrealistic; maybe "muscles" would work better.)

Since I didn't see any posts for flight simulators, why not try X-Plane.

It uses OpenGL and runs on Windows, Mac, (OSX by Christmas) -- Linux port upcoming, and although I haven't tried, it supposedly can run with WINE.

There is also a great online community where one can get new planes, scenery, and utilities.

Oh and once you get it, feel free to land at my grandparent's airstrip - ID NA61. ;-)

The military has been using virtual reality for years now, just not exactly in this form...

I'm talking about flight simulators. They perfectly model the inside of a cockpit, hook the thing up to hydraulics and have an entire room full of minicomputers to drive the simulation with SGI Onyx machines for modeling the landscape and entities. The scenery is provided by 8 projectors which display the surroundings on a curved reflective screen just outside cockpit windows.

These multi-million dollar machines are quite impressive definitely a lot more fun than X-Plane. Machines at separate military bases can even be linked up together for the ultimate multiplayer flight sim.

Getting to check one of these out has definitely been one of the highlights of my life as a geek. I decided that being a systems programmer / maintainer or developer for flight simulator could be a very entertaining use of my future career. I already have the avionics background, I would just need the CS degree and maybe a class or two at Embry-Riddle...

From the page on Mars sims:

... The result? If you take off with 60 knots on the airspeed indicator, your REAL speed is SIX HUNDRED KNOTS! (about Mach 1) Take it from me, Mach-1 takeoffs are quite a thing to behold, when the plane will barely leave the runway at that speed.

To me, this is the best reason I've seen yet for creating sim software that uses real-world physics and modeling. I don't know of any other sims in existence that offer this level of "playability"; am I wrong here?

These guys have gone to great lengths to make this thing "the real deal", and I applaud their decision to make it usable under Linux. I stopped messing around with Windows-on-Linux type stuff months ago (well, partially due to the fact that almost everything I use runs under Linux ;-] ). The biggest thing I've been missing is stuff * I * find fun, which generally isn't the usual FPS games.

I can tell already I'm gonna be spending entirely too much time modeling new plane designs (and consequently flying them into the ground, d'oh! ).

Are there any other projects out there that focus this heavily on the physics modeling side of things for sims? Please tell me some of them run on Linux :-).

The very coolest thing about X-Plane is the extensive set of flight physics. Land the Space Shuttle, Fly on Mars. They sound cool, but are rightfully difficult! (but fun)

Any word on the price of X-Plane? Is there a chance it may be GPLed? Or at least priced lower than the Win/Mac versions?

The very coolest thing about X-Plane is the extensive set of flight physics. Land the Space Shuttle, Fly on Mars. They sound cool, but are rightfully difficult! (but fun)

Any word on the price of X-Plane? Is there a chance it may be GPLed? Or at least priced lower than the Win/Mac versions?

There will be no death of Linux. (and this is from someone who expects to be running OSX, thank you...) In fact, Linux will siphon off all the people who are truly gifted in the computer domain. (OSX will siphon off Grandma- and many people who are truly gifted in other domains. Artists, writers, inventors- hell, there's a guy designing a new type of autogyro, a real airplane, using a brilliant flight sim (http://www.x-plane.com/)... on a G4 Powermac. (fullsize pic: http://www.x-plane.com/images/misc/fullsize/cc2.jp g))

Linux is going to get many of the people who program the programs that make computers go. There will be no death of Linux, just because OSX is all that and an autogyro design tool ;)

There will be no death of Linux. (and this is from someone who expects to be running OSX, thank you...) In fact, Linux will siphon off all the people who are truly gifted in the computer domain. (OSX will siphon off Grandma- and many people who are truly gifted in other domains. Artists, writers, inventors- hell, there's a guy designing a new type of autogyro, a real airplane, using a brilliant flight sim (http://www.x-plane.com/)... on a G4 Powermac. (fullsize pic: http://www.x-plane.com/images/misc/fullsize/cc2.jp g))

Linux is going to get many of the people who program the programs that make computers go. There will be no death of Linux, just because OSX is all that and an autogyro design tool ;)

I'll be waiting for an X-Plane junkie to get their hands on the data and make a terrain set out of it.

The CarterCopter is being modeled and flight tested with X-Plane by Laminar Research. It is the most advanced consumer flight simulator that uses blade element analysis too calculate ALL of the real physical forces acting on the aircraft! Check out the X-Plane Front Page for pics of the CarterCoptor test pilot taking a test flight on a new Apple G4 (in the hanger with the actual plane in the background).

The CarterCopter is being modeled and flight tested with X-Plane by Laminar Research. It is the most advanced consumer flight simulator that uses blade element analysis too calculate ALL of the real physical forces acting on the aircraft! Check out the X-Plane Front Page for pics of the CarterCoptor test pilot taking a test flight on a new Apple G4 (in the hanger with the actual plane in the background).

The CarterCopter is being modeled and flight tested with X-Plane by Laminar Research. It is the most advanced consumer flight simulator that uses blade element analysis too calculate ALL of the real physical forces acting on the aircraft! Check out the X-Plane Front Page for pics of the CarterCoptor test pilot taking a test flight on a new Apple G4 (in the hanger with the actual plane in the background).

A combat flight sim for Linux would be cool, although, you might be able to use an existing sim from the windows world if you use wine. X-Plane works great under Linux using wine. IMHO, it's one of the best flight sims out there, but it does lack the ability to shoot/kill other entities besides yourself. I wonder how tough it would be to get flightgear working?

You want geeky? Try blade element modelling on all flight surfaces at least six times a second and _emergent_ flight model. Try modelling one of those wack planes from that upcoming MS game and seeing just how *CRASH!* unrealistic *WHAM!* it *CRASH!* really is *SPLAT!* ;) Then, work like a crazed weasel at trying different airfoils, giving the canard a steeper upward cant, messing with the center of gravity, and eventually get something that flies, even something that flies well- and know that if you could build the actual plane, IT WOULD fly like that, for the most part. Now that's geeky! It's freaking delightful. There's no complex system half as much fun as designing aircraft and modelling them with blade element modelling. And half the fun is knowing that the majority of even X-Planers aren't up to the challenge and will only fly the Cessna 172 Skyhawk (aka 'spam can') and bitch about its modelling ;) (which considering that no actual 172 flight model data was put in, just the dimensions of the plane and vital statistics, is not so bad at all)

I haven't updated the planes to the latest version of X-Plane yet, but I have some planes (with pictures) up at http://www.airwindows.com/gam es/flightsims/index.html. The planes there were a lot of fun to make, and there are infinite other possibilities..

Microsoft didn't create Flight Simulator; they bought it from SubLogic, then killed the Mac version. They've made a few tweaks to it, but these days other companies like Laminar Research are way ahead of MS in flight sim technology.

I'm going to go play with 'X-Plane' (which is at least half a hardcore aerodynamic engineering sim) and design myself a ground-effect car. And see what sorts of terrain I can fly it over :) vroom, whoosh! I think it's sort of pointless to design in a non-ground-effect tail seeing as the thing is supposed to _not_ actually take off fully. I'm thinking in terms of three wings and flat plates for the sides, perhaps some form of drag rudder.

I wonder if you could make the 'slots' for the Japanese train version in x-plane? It is sort of technically possible but would be absurdly hard to get the tolerances close enough...

By "simple", I mean the computational power required, not the mathematics involved.

X-Plane claims to have engineering-accurate flight simulation for most of the aircraft it models. I tend to believe that this claim is exaggerated, but it still does a good job with very little power. Most of X-Plane's computational requirements are wasted on pretty graphics rather than calculatin aerodynamics.

You really, really don't need a supercomputer to do this stuff. As proof, I point to the Apollo missions, which were planned and executed using mostly slide rules and the occasional "supercomputer" that is probably a hundredth of the speed of a cheap desktop now.