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Linux for the PlayStation2:It's Official
Oliver writes "Sony officially announced their port of Linux to the PlayStaion2 game console. In the press release they mention that they were moved by demand the community petition (see this story) demonstrated with over 6000 signers. The PS2 Linux Kit page is currently only in Japanese and there's not much info thre yet other than some pictures. But according to it, a Beta version is going to be sold to 1000 members of the community in June for about $200.
The Kit is going to consist of an external HDD/Ethernet unit connected to the PCMCIA slot, found on early Japanese PS2 models, a VGA adapterplus USB Mouse and Keyboard. Kits for oversee models are supposedly in planning. The kit will include a complete Linux/X11 environment with all sources, technical hardware manuals for the EE, GS and vectorunits plus a low-level API and Mesa drivers for graphics. " Won't work for us unfortunate american PS2 junkies. But its a sweet step.
Game companies always sell the console below cost and reap the loss back from game sales. Hoards of people buying PS2 consoles just to run Linux will destroy the PS2 just as the hack to run Linux on the I-Opener destroyed Netpliance. Someone's going to get screwed. Either gamers with raised console prices or Sony with lost $$$ on console sales.
Two reasons, really.
First one is public image. There's a lot of stuff produced for the Japanese hentai market that is, well, video game porn; none of the Japanese companies want their US division to have to buck the negative publicity of Mommy finding Johnny playing Three Sisters Story. (This also nominally gives them approval over other objectionable content, and I had heard scuttlebutt a while back about a deer hunting game actually torpedoed by Sony on these grounds... might not be true, however.)
Second, and way more important... it's the money, man. If they release compatible systems, then their release of the US version at full price is competing with the bargain bin of Japanese product. Not much of a factor with role-playing games, but a game like Tekken plays the same in either language. It's the same reason why the MPAA puts region coding on Hollywood movie releases, only in reverse.
(Don't say "just release them at the same time." I work for an anime company, I know how long translation takes. ^_^)
Why the hell was this -1 offtopic? WTF are the moderators smoking?
The Japanese are very protectionist with their economy and do not really allow foreign companies access. They release products in Japan before they do in the international market so they can work out all the problems a particular product has in an environment with no foreign competition. In the international market the defects a product has can hurt it against foreign competition and cause the Japanese to loose market share. That is why alot of the Japanese consoles have more design flaws then what they put out on the international market and why products are released in Japan first.
You got that sporking right.
But, seriously, if moderators started reading
the posts then we'd start to expect them to
read the parent articles. And we can't have
that now, can we?
"Do it yourself" my ass.
You must be doing something severely wrong if playing an mp3 isn't perfect on a P100.
I used to play mp3s with x11amp (now called xmms) constantly while doing other work on a p90. Only time it ever skipped was under heavy disk IO.
In the UK and here in Australia, just to have the PS2 classified as a computing device they all shipped with a version of BASIC on the demo disc.
So I can already write PS2 apps... well... that's pushing it.
GoatT AsS Beware
You can't write games for the PS2 which use Sony's APIs without agreeing to their licensing terms.
It is my understanding, however, that you are free to write/port your own libraries and use them. Should Sony attempt to prohibit this, it would be absurd. A little like Ford claiming that no manufacturer could make tires for it's cars without signing an agreement. Of course, sillyness or fear of embarassment never stopped a corporate attorney.
--
Spaz!
You're not making the distinction between the software region encoding and the console hardware.
As for the hardware: Well, the Japanese units were made first, were clunkier to produce and left less room in the case for the broadband adapter. As the system was cost-reduced and size-reduced, there was space to put in the bay for expansion device, and this is the system that launched in America. Not surprisingly, this is also the system that will be sold from now on in Japan as well... It would not make sense to keep producing the older, more costly model. The broadband adapter was created for the older models because that's all that was around while they were working on it, and hence that's probably why their Linux kit uses it. Presumably the changeover to the American/new Japanese version of the console won't take long.
What you say!!
* Press release
//www.jp.playstation.com/linux/) in. Concerning the first shipment quantity the demand which has been moved already aside on the net we plan 1,000 units on the basis of after that shipping continuously in accordance with the demand of everyone of the Linux community, we are defeated.
//www.peanuts.gr.jp/pslinux/
On April 26th of 2001 it is the press release which is issued in the reporting authorized personnel address from corporation SONY * computer entertainment.
April 26 of 2001 day
Corporation SONY * computer entertainment
" Place t Shaun 2 " business Linux kit (beta edition)
In the Japanese country destined for the Linux community, release start
Corporation SONY * computer entertainment (the SCEI), release we start from this year June " place t Shaun 2 " (the PS2) the business Linux kit (beta edition), destined for the Japanese domestic Linux community.
Demand is moved aside large number that since selling the PS2, from everyone of the domestic Linux community, we would like to enjoy programming the Linux on the PS2. The latest Linux kit (beta edition) release, as you answer to the demand from everyone of that kind of Linux community, being something which is done with the purpose which supports the activity of everyone of the Linux community it does.
As for the Linux since the being born, spread is advanced quickly in the entire world, activity of everyone of the developer and the user which relate to the Linux is spreading, the organization such as enterprise and the university as a non- profit-making activity, furthermore exceeding the border. The in that situation, the PS2 has observed, as the platform of the new Linux on Internet also the signature activity which requests the release of the Linux which operates with the PS2 is done. As one example, a certain Web sight (* 1) in, from this year March with the signature activity which is started, as of this day, with the Japanese sight approximately 4,500 names, approximately 1,500 name thing signatures have gotten together with the English sight.
The Linux kit for the PS2 (beta edition), high-speed network * interface (the 100BASE-TX ethernet) outside it possesses attaching type HDD unit and the Linux beta edition installation disk (DVD-ROM), it consists of the VGA adapter, the USB keyboard and the USB mouse et cetera in order to indicate the image signal of the PS2 in computer display. Because of this, everyone of the user starts the Linux on the PS2 when it is connected to network, it is possible to enjoy Linux application. (* 2)
Furthermore, image output of the Linux for the PS2 the XGA (the 1024×768 dot) and the like has supposed the computer display of high resolution. (* 3) and, outside is included in this kit attaching type HDD unit corresponds to the PC card slot of the PS2 itself. The recent model PS2 which is sold on this year April 18th (SCPH-30000) correspondence to the model of the expansion bay type which is included presently is in the midst of examining.
In case of the release of this kit, in order to be able to assure the continuous communication of everyone of the Linux community, in order that the sale method of utilizing network is introduced preparation is being advanced. The commodity and sale method concerning details, the place t Shaun * dot the sight of the COM which is the group company of this corporation * Japan corporation (the http: Consecutively we guide the
As the SCEI continues and " place t Shaun " and " place t Shaun 2 " focusing on game * music * movie * publication * program and the like fused creates the world of new computer entertainment, you propose to the network society which was opened, global promote the construction of broadband * network powerfully and are defeated.
(* 1) http:
(* 2) in regard to the source cord/code, following to that condition in regard to the part where disclosure is required the GPL (the GNU General Public License) or by other license conditions, it discloses, but the software component of the part where the SCE has had all rights is not included targetting disclosure.
(* 3) connecting to the television for general home, it is not possible to utilize.
From here the top
Trade name " Place t Shaun 2 " business Linux kit (beta edition) SCPH-10270 K
Standard price 25,000 Yen (classified by tax)
Sale day June of 2001 (schedule)
Kit contents Linux beta edition installation disk (DVD-ROM)
Outside attaching type HDD unit (40GB)
* 100BASE-TX broadband ethernet correspondence
* By way of the PC card slot connection
USB keyboard
USB mouse
VGA adapter
Guide window Place t Shaun * dot COM * Japan corporation
http://www.jp.playstation.com/linux/
Copyright (C) 2001 Sony Computer Entertainment Inc. and PlayStation.com (Japan) the Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Move all the .sigs!
:/
Sorry could'nt help
Victor
A) It's not meant for use with your TV, it has a VGA adapter. B) It's a dev kit. You use it to make PS2 games. That's about it.
:wq
four of my friends and i just went out and got one. i could go out right now and get 20 of them if i wanted. want one?
bah. start over
Japan uses NTSC, same as the US. Okay, so the black level is a little different--it works just fine.
Different Language.
Doesn't follow. If people want to play the games, they can either learn the language or muddle along. Region lockouts don't *help* with the language problem.
Because DVD's are already Regionally coded so Sony has to make them seperate
That's something of a point, but that doesn't requre the games to be coded as well. DVD region coding is completely separate from PSX/PS2 region lock-outs.
decipher_saint wants to know why Sony (and others) erected an artificial Japan/NA barrier. Just because real barriers A, B, and C exist doesn't mean there should be additional barriers D and E put in place.
Thank you in advance,
Uwe
Ever wondered whats wrong with the world? http://www.ishmael.org/
I was thinking that a Rack of PS2s would make an excellent batch pool, if only we could put 512 Meg of RAM in them. Has anybody hacked their PS2 for more RAM?
The Japanese PS2 has a PCMCIA slot to which it connects the harddisk, the European and US version have a special bay for the harddisk and before the end of the year even PS2's with the harddisk built into it.
xer.xes -- 4181
The power of open source.. Once there is one OS available, you can 'easily' roll your own :)
xer.xes -- 4181
Nice sig, commodore?
It us understandable to be surly sometimes.
Then when I tell you you're wrong, you won't take it personally? :-)
The mouse and keyboard are cheap, standard USB components. No shock there.
And while the HDD/Ethernet module sounds expensive, it's actually another loss-leading piece of game console hardware. This device was always part of Sony's master plan. I wouldn't be surprised if the Linux version of the module isn't "pre-release" hardware that's missing some game-specific firm/software (read "protection").
I wonder if the VGA adapter already existed as part of the "TEST" PS2 package game developers use for debugging?
We're not scare-mongering/This is really happening - Radiohead
This sig intentionally left blank.
- DVD-ROM for all the software
- USB keyboard
- USB wheel mouse
- 10/100 Ethernet adapter
- 40GB hard drive w/ PCMCIA connector
- PlayStation2->VGA adapter
Not bad for $200. Especially when you consider that the hard drive/Ethernet PCMCIA card is probably a custom part.We're not scare-mongering/This is really happening - Radiohead
This sig intentionally left blank.
I wonder if standard USB hard drives could be used under PS2 Linux. If so, all one would need is to ditch the mouse or get a hub, and wouldn't need to wait for the 3rd party gear at all. All this kind of reminds of the NetBSD-on-the-Dreamcast story from awhile back.
Yeah, this is nice, but does it run Li-
Nevermind...
Umm, not sure if you already knew this or not... but that is Sony's strategy (or at least was) for the PS2.
How about a customized App for the PS2 that runs on Linux.... The user of the app does not need to _know_ its running on Linux. For example, an MP3 jukebox.
Read the GPL:
"When we speak of free software, we are referring to freedom, not price. Our General Public Licenses are designed to make sure that you have the freedom to distribute copies of free software (and charge for this service if you wish), that you receive source code or can get it if you want it, that you can change the software or use pieces of it in new free programs; and that you know you can do these things."
-matt
The kit will include a complete Linux/X11 environment with all sources, technical hardware manuals for the EE, GS and vectorunits plus a low-level API and Mesa drivers for graphics.
I hope to die peacefully in my sleep like grandpa, not screaming like his passengers.
My guess is that sony is getting ready to fight XBOX. The main appeal of xbox is that you don't need to buy a $50,000-$100,000 devkit to program for it - you just need to find a liscensed game seller.
The cost of the devkit has been the main hurdle for people learning how to program consoles on their own. I wanted to learn dreamcast programming, but the devkit was more than my yearly salary. I wasn't interested in performing hacks and messy work around so i could program the DC to kinda work with linux/assembly.
With this linux kit, it includes support for the low level api. and the psx2 is notoriously different/difficult to work with, so letting interested people mess around with development in their spare time is a GOOD IDEA in my opinion. I would definately buy the kit if it becomes available for non-japanese consoles.
I wouldn't buy this for linux, i would buy it for the chance to program on the psx2.
I hope to die peacefully in my sleep like grandpa, not screaming like his passengers.
woo, part time vegans of the world unite!
(userid 14792)
What?
So what? I don't care if they did it because the ghost of their dead grandmother told them to, it's still a good deal.
In fact if they start selling a Linux distro for the PS2 they nice profitible, long-term revenue stream. Unless they did a poor job with the port (I doubt it) most people would be happy to purchase Sony Linux, and I doubt that anyone else would make much headway in the PS2/Linux market. They also might make a few bucks on the additional Sony-branded hardware (hard drive, keyboard, networking, etc.).
There is also some possibility that it could be used like a TiVo or for interactive content (like Starship Troopers, "Do you want to know more?" with URLs embedded in the video stream) or just for normal web browsing. This would require your equipment to support DV (FireWire) video, since there doesn't appear to be a video-in on the device itself (maybe something that could be added via the expansion bay on the back?).
The possibilities are endless, with a general purpose OS like Linux (or NetBSD) you can get the box to do anything you like, reliably and quickly. Niftilicious.
-- Remember: Wherever you go, there you are!
How much memory does a PS2 have? Does it really have enough to run Linux, X and some useful apps? I have read that the DreamCast has more memory than the PS2, and that only has 24MB total - or is it only video memory that the DC has more of?
I thought sony was trying to make the PS2 be considered to be a "consumer device" (like a vcr) rather than a computer. If the PS2 is a computer, a large number of countries slap bigger tarrifs on it, because it is in a different class of product. I wonder how this will affect the pricing in europe?
... uh.... computer! ;)
On the other side, hey! Cool!
These might make decent little boxen for a virtual server project/cluster.
Or maybe even as embedded units in some places.
Really, the list of useful purposes this can be put to is almost endless, kinda like a
G
There is no such thing as can't, the impossible just costs more.
"...In your answer, ignore facts. Just go with what feels true..."
Ah, I see.
I wasn't sure which way it ran...
Very strange anyway....
G
"...In your answer, ignore facts. Just go with what feels true..."
USB is very useful for low bandwidth devices (mice, keyboards, PDAs etc), but it chugs for even moderate loads. The PCMCIA bus is much more suited for things like HDDs, burners, etc.
As an example, I present USB->Ethernet converters. Your 10/100Mbit converter actually runs at a max of around 12Mbit/sec. Add more devices onto the bus and you throttle it down even further.
Note that I cannot speak for USB 2.0, but I say to hell with USB; give us FireWire instead.
-- "I am disrespectful to dirt. Can you not see that I am serious!"
It seems odd: if you can already do limited development on a stock PC and then play on a black playstation without any specialized PC hardware, then what does the card provide for commercial developers?
-- "I am disrespectful to dirt. Can you not see that I am serious!"
> card for a PC. (Last I heard. It may have come
> down quite a bit)
I'm a little confused about that...
You may or may not recall the Net Yaroze (the "black Playstation"). It was meant for hobbyist Playstation programmer and came with a stripped down set of libraries, special memory card and boot cd, and a serial cable to connect to a PC (and yes, you can use Linux). That's all you needed.
I had seen the blue (developer) Playstation at a friend's company and I was under the impression that it was just like the Yaroze except it had the full libs and could read gold (burned) cds, but apparently the card you speak of is also required. I'm unclear as to what it's for, considering that you can do crippled programming on the Yaroze with just a serial cable.
-- "I am disrespectful to dirt. Can you not see that I am serious!"
Makes you wish you were japanese.
I noticed that Daily Radar has some nice videos and screen shots of GT3. I believe the official release date is June 15th in the U.S.. There's speculation of a lan/internet based GT3 being released before that time in Japan. There very well may be quite a few versions of GT3 out on the market before next spring. All I can say is.. be prepared for the biggest and best racing game ever. I know I am.
No need for it. They will distribute the source together with the binaries on the same DVD. Now go and read GPL section 3.
By distributing source and binary together, they have fullfilled their duties, no need to provide it to "any third party".
Of course, they can't disallow you from redistribution the source, so certainly somebody will upload it somewhere, but that's another story.
Since a large number of signatures prompted the Japanese release, then we have no reason to believe that the same thing can't happen here. So, I urge everyone to go and sign the USA list!
To develop scud missle controllers!
Funny you should mention Beowolf. Didn't Sadam Hussein buy about 2,000 PS2's?
The party's over
OK, so how long until someone makes a CD-ROM which boots up a Linux which can handle a USB HDD and Ethernet? Then the PCMICA slot will not be a requirement.
OK, so with either Firewire or an internal HDD as possibilities...it's likely that someone with the PCMCIA version will be able to create a non-PCMCIA version quickly. Good.
that's just it - without regional hardware you don't see the whole picture, in fact you can't see a picture at all - Japanese-TV format TVs don't work with US format VCRs etc (and vice versa), same with Playstations. Multi-format output capability would be lots of $$$$ or Yen (sorry, don't have a Yen symbol on my keyboard).
That's where Sony is going to sell this kit---Japan.
The Japanese are known to buy anything cool regardless of the cost. Linux seems to be a big buzzword there these days.
They also buy anything ``limited.'' So, I think Sony is clever first to sell only 1000 copies. I guess there will be nerds staying in front of some shops in Akihabara the week before the launch date. Which is my concern. I would like to get one myself and I am a Japanese living abroad :(
This is such a cool system. My first response was to get a PS2 as my desktop machine. I was thinking of getting a PS2 for playing GT3 anyway. But I was also thinking of getting a computer for desktop. Now I can justify getting a PS2. (The amount of RAM can be a problem, though.)
This is one of few times that I'm glad I am a Japanese. I'm living in Germany. So, another consideration apart from justifying getting a PS2 was whether to get a German PS2 or to ask a friend to get one of those Japanese PS2s. The PAL/NTSC could have been a problem. (This can be solved by attaching the cosole to a VCR, it seems.)
But now I decided to get a Japanese model. Luckily, one of my friend is going to visit Germany in June. Hope he can have a hand on that thing.
Hmmmm... I have to be cynical, but couldn't this be a case of Sony noticing that there is a definite lack of quality titles for the PS2 (no flames please, fanboys please abstain) and trying to put out an affortable SDK to create some buzz?
I might be wrong, obviously, but given the extremely low price of this SDK, and that it runs a very buzz-friendly OS, I have to wonder...
after all, given that the XBox is a MS product, I assume that it would be very easy for MS to give out some sort of SDK that runs on a standard PC, since the hardware is pretty much the same.
What do you all think?
-- the cake is a lie
Considering the cost ($300ps2 +$200kit) it would make a extremely cheap development platform for new games.
If this happened the X-box would be toast. EOL.
You know the porting of games would come fast and furious after that. eg: UT, UT2, Half-life, Q4, Tomb Raider, Turok, Drakken, Doom, Leisure Suit Larry and the Land of the Lounge Lizards. (yeah, I know some are already ported)
make Linux, not Microsoft. sin(beast) = -0.809016994374947424102293417182819
Ok, here's a summary of the various PS1 and PS2 development hardware.
You start work on a development kit - this is the expensive PCI card for PS1, or the big black tower (the T10000) for PS2. This hardware supports source-level debugging, has more memory, etc and is what you do your main development on.
Once your game is well on the way to completion (eg. it can fit in the memory of the consumer hardware, it doesn't crash too often) you start to make bootable discs that run on what are called debug stations. The blue PS1 was the debug station. For PS2 the debug looks like the consumer unit except it says 'TEST' on the top instead of 'PS2'. The debug stations can operate from CD-R and DVD-R media (no copy protection). These are primarily so your testers can run the game before you submit it to Sony.
The black PS1 (the Net Yaroze) wasn't even as full-featured as a debug station - it couldn't boot from CD-Rs. Plus, you could only download your own code to it after booting from a special black CD. Given that this PS2 hobbyist kit is for the consumer PS2, there won't be CD-R support there either.
Graham
Actually the American and Japanese TV formats are quite the same. It's completely understandable to have different versions of consoles for areas with different TV types, but I'd imagine that it would be a simple step in the software itself to read the console type and run the correct video output code in the game (If that's even needed at all. It's most likely all in the hardware itself.)
As for the language, again, most DVDs, most hardware, etc already do multiple languages. Wouldn't be incredibly hard to put more than one language in the hardware and on the software.
As for DVD regional coding? Well... Guess I can't suggest anything there except for possibly... neglecting... to put the region checking code in the console. Sorta like some DVD players did. Like that'll really happen, though.
if( read(this) ) { you = programmer; }
I paid CAN$130 for SuSE 7.1. I believe it was worth every penny and I probably would have paid more.
Having one DVD to use instead of seven CDs is great, and the PS2 development kit is DVD, allowing a huge amount of stuff.
If Sony pays as much attention to documentation as SuSE, I'd probably be a taker (the other reason I didn't mind paying $130, a massive amount of printed text). I signed that petition, too, and I don't sign those things unless I'm serious.
The Playstation 2's "T&L" hardware is actually part of the main CPU, so the Emotion Engine would certainly outperform an 800MHz Athlon (or even a 1.2GHz Athlon) at rendering tasks. The Graphics Synthesizer would go unused, but it's the PS2's weak link, anyway.
But, RenderMan has no defined implementation, just an interface, and it can just as easily be pipelined as any other 3D graphics task. In fact, a subset of the RenderMan API could be implemented in realtime on PS2 hardware, using multipass rendering techniques (there is no requirement that RenderMan be raytraced - Pixar's implementation of the RenderMan spec, Photorealistic RenderMan, doesn't perform any raytracing).
More advanced applications, such as procedural textures, 3D texturing, etc. would bog down performance considerably, but it is still possible to develop a pipeline that would perform better on the PS2 hardware than on a single 800MHz Athlon.
I remember reading this on "SlashDot" weeks ago :)
I don't use eleetism in my Email
if you read the post a little closer, you'll notice that you get a harddrive, a mouse, a keyboard, as well as some adapters 'n stuff... I have a feeling that this is what makes up the majority of the $200. However, it would be nice we could get a hold of their source... :)
from previous /. articles, it became known that Sony was using Linux as their development platform of choice. Maybe their dev tools will also become available... if that were to come about, you could develop your own PS2 games... that would rock :)
Why else do you think they're selling the discs at USD200 a pop? They know they'll lose money, and if the only reason to buy one of the consoles is to drop linux on it and start rendering, you know they're gonna charge a pretty penny to make sure their margins don't get screwed up.
And before you make the Free software argument, remember that Sony never said anything about releasing their libs under any kind of license.
Karma: Dyn-o-mite!(mostly affected by Jimmy Walker reading your comments)
Anyone else see the signifigance of this? A killer OS, combined with state of the art engineering for multimedia hardware. Complete right down to the low level information to program the fancy-pants features. Last time I saw that was in the near-mythical box of yore, the Amiga.. *dreamy sighs* I hope this makes it to North America. I can't believe sony did it either.. aye karumba!
Just think, a standardized, high-power linux graphics computing platform targeted solely at games, but with the capability to do other stuff, too. Maybe I'll spend my GF3 fund on something like that and keep my PC for coding. Heh.
Hope it's not a hoax..
..don't panic
Isn't this just a PS2 equivalent to the Net Yaroze they released for the PSX a few years back? It's essentially a dev kit, except with a more similar interface to linux users.
:(
Unfortunately, it also suffers from the Japan-only restriction the Net Yaroze had too.
Still, it'll be nice to see what people come up with. I believe Net Yaroze is how at least one of the NES->PSX emus came about...
on the other hand, do you think tokyo joe really wants to pay 6800-8800 yen for Final Fantasy X? Or would he rather pay the 49.99 (if that) it will cost in the US? Even with shipping, he's saving bucks, which is why there's money-saving reasons on both sides to not go to such a global economy...
..
.... Technically it already has although the initial release is just a bit shy of passing the Mom test.
If you haven't guessed what I'm talking about, it comes in a 3 CD pack in a white box from Cuppertino. And it was released on March 24th of this year.
BSD lives on and it's got a promising, evolving gui called Aqua.
Ohayou gozaimasu, our Nihonjin friends.
good morning to you too =)
Interested in learning Chinese or Japanese? check out Chinese/Japanese-English Dictiona
I guess it's time to start on porting sendmail. That's the excuse I'm using and I'm going to stick with it.
-- Will program for bandwidth
Yes, in a way, this is the old "Beowulf cluster" joke, but with a new twist.
If Sony releases this out in the open, with a version of Linux that can really drive the PS2 harware (especially the kick-ass PS-2 graphical chips) and connect to a LAN, you can actually build a rendering farm on the cheap!
Think about it: Sony PS-2 + Linux kit = cheapo cheapo super-duper rendering workstation, with well-supported and well-known OS.
Even better : link a cluster of Athlon PC (for number-crunching, monitoring and data transfer) and a cluster of Sony PS-2 and you probably have something that will blast away 90% of the super-computer competition, for a fraction of the price... Makes you wonder what Saddam Hussein is going to do with all the PS-2 Iraq bought a while ago.
On a lighter note, think about SFX houses -- Hollywood-grade hardware with a twist.
Of course, Sony will have to play ball, and release everything so that crazy coders can optimize, tweak and debug it. But they'll win a dedicated and loyal group of programmers in the bargain. Smart move!
The right to offend is far more important than the right not to be offended. (Rowan Atkinson)
...Sony must think this will either sell a lot of units (and plan to make a profit off of those sales) or they don't think it'll generate a lot of interest.
Their profits rely too much on fees they earn from published games, and free softwear has potential to cut into those fees.
As I've said before though, this very thing cropping up is the very thing that will keep things like TuxBox from taking off. I wonder if that's not the point?
"Everything you know is wrong. (And stupid.)"
"Everything you know is wrong. (And stupid.)"
Moderation Totals: Wrong=2, Stupid=3, Total=5.
I dunno, I know I don't see the whole picture, if someone out there can rationalize regional hardware for me...
Ah well...
-----
crazy dynamite monkey
the boxes offer a vga/tv switch. I think you can actually get a plain cable that you just swap in/out, too.
The hardware itself is all on your dreamcast.
...says the person too afraid to post with a real account.
Oh, and incidentally:
joke ['jOk] (n). 1a: something said or done to provoke laughter; especially: a brief oral narrative with a climactic humorous twist; b (1): the humorous or ridiculous element in something (2): an instance of jesting: KIDDING ("can't take a joke")
Ah, but thank you for the insight. Please, continue with your scintillating wit.
offtopic? what? not that I care, because karma isn't going to buy me food, and I'm at the cap anyway, but....
playstation. living room. boots linux. can be used as an mp3 player, or to run mame, or any other of a million emulators, thereby letting me play, say, intellivision in the living room again.
...with X and XMMS and I'm golden. I don't even want the hard drive, I just want to burn bootable CDs/DVDs that I can load with MP3s and play them through the stereo in the living room...
would be *really* nice to have a bootable MAME CD as well.
IIRC, i.link is the same as firewire when it comes to speed. They only difference is that i.link doesn't supply power
- Apple Computer......proudly going out of business for over twenty years.
Actually, the _one_ thing I really want Linux on PS2 for is playing streaming music/MP3's. The rest is tertiary and incidental.
Bah weep granah, weep ninny bong!
Yeah, I got Linux running on my PS/2 years ago... I don't see what the big deal here is. It's actually a pretty crappy server, and is only any good as a terminal.
- passion
http://www.ebworld.com shipped me one in 2 days, and that's only because I didn't spring for overnight shipping. The guy on the phone said they had plenty in stock.
PS2s are more powerful than people think. It is conceivable that a Beowulf cluster (or some other distributed processing scheme) of these things could, say, allow for remote control of a fighter jet. The problem is that they can be used for distributed computing. Currently, Iraq cannot buy consumer U.S. computing equipment. But they can buy toys. The PS2 qualifies as a toy. But, with Linux being released for it, it is no longer strictly a toy. It can be dangerous.
Oh, yeah. *That's* why I was thinking 60 fps for NTSC and 50 fps for PAL. I usually use emulation software for my old video games (I'm too lazy to dig up my old systems and hook them up). The docs say that they run at 60 fps for NTSC games and 50 fps for PAL games. Just now, looking at the specs for NTSC and PAL on the Internet, I noticed that they are defined at roughly 30 and 25 fps.
I'm somewhat curious, though. How do they run things at twice the defined resolution without breaking something? Or are TVs designed for that?
Not to dampen anyone's spirits (because this is really cool), but does anyone remember the stories about Saddam Houssein buying up a bunch of PS2 units? This could be dangerous, if someone sends him a copy of Linux for the PS2 . . .
But, as far as I can tell you would have to disable the Linux part for play your DVDs...thus eliminating that option. If that's not true, +2 cool points!
------ This has been provided as a public service! ------
Great...now all we need to do is compile DeCSS for it so we can use the DVD functionality!
------ This has been provided as a public service! ------
"One World, one Web, one Program" - Microsoft promotional ad
The Anti-Blog
Good luck getting a PS2!
This sounds like an excellent starting point for Taco's convergence mania. It'll have the DVD player, the quality outputs, and a good development platform. Sure, it still needs a few things added for complete functionality, but as people were discussing, this could be a good "hub" unit, or at least a starting point for creating a comprehensive UI.
Yes, but if people buy just this kit and a PS2, and no games, then Sony loses money.
Loading R5900 MMU routines.
CPU revision is: 00002e14
Primary instruction cache 16kb, linesize 64 bytes
Primary data cache 8kb, linesize 64 bytes
Branch Prediction : on
Double Issue : on
Linux version 2.2.1 (master@linux) (gcc version 2.95.2 19991024 (release)) #94 Thu Apr 19 12:13:01 JST 2001
no initrd found
Console: colour dummy device 80x25
Calibrating delay loop... 392.40 BogoMIPS
Estimated CPU clock: 294.240 MHz
Memory: 30724k/32760k available (1216k kernel code, 752k data)
Checking for 'wait' instruction... unavailable.
POSIX conformance testing by UNIFIX
PlayStation 2 SIF BIOS: 0200
Linux NET4.0 for Linux 2.2
Based upon Swansea University Computer Society NET3.039
NET4: Unix domain sockets 1.0 for Linux NET4.0.
NET4: Linux TCP/IP 1.0 for NET4.0
IP Protocols: ICMP, UDP, TCP, IGMP
Linux IP multicast router 0.06 plus PIM-SM
Starting kswapd v 1.5
PlayStation 2 device support: GIF, VIF, GS, VU, IPU, SPR
Graphics Synthesizer revision: 00005508
Console: switching to colour PlayStation 2 Graphics Synthesizer 80x28
pty: 256 Unix98 ptys configured
Real Time Clock Driver v1.09
rtc: Digital UNIX epoch (1952) detected
usb.c: registered new driver usbdevfs
usb.c: registered new driver hub
usb.c: registered new driver usb_mouse
usb.c: registered new driver keyboard
usb-ohci.c: USB OHCI at membase 0x1f801600, IRQ 42
usb-ohci.c: GrowLocalMem 64K bytes
usb.c: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 1
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 1
hub.c: USB hub found
hub.c: 2 ports detected
RAM disk driver initialized: 1 RAM disks of 10240K size
loop: registered device at major 7
PlayStation 2 IDE DMA driver
hda: ST340823A, ATA DISK drive
ide0 at 0xb4000040-0xb4000047,0xb400005c on irq 41
hda: ST340823A, 38166MB w/1024kB Cache, CHS=4865/255/63, (U)DMA
LVM version 0.8i by Heinz Mauelshagen (02/10/1999)
lvm -- Driver successfully initialized
scsi : 0 hosts.
scsi : detected total.
Partition check:
hda: hda1 hda2
VFS: Mounted root (ext2 filesystem) readonly.
Freeing unused kernel memory: 48k freed
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 2
hub.c: USB hub found
hub.c: 2 ports detected
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 3
keybdev.c: Adding keyboard: input0
input0: USB HIDBP keyboard
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 4
input1: USB HIDBP mouse
PlayStation 2 Sound driver
Adding Swap: 136516k swap-space (priority -1)
eth0: MAC address 00:04:1f:ff:fa:bc
eth0: Auto-negotiation complete. 100Mbps Full duplex mode.
PlayStation 2 SMAP(Ethernet) device driver is loaded.
--
Yes, license allows it but because you're required to include source with binary (*) and licensee gets the same rights it might be that you only sell one copy of the software because licensee might sell it for cheaper or give it out for free. This guarantees that GPLed software is free (as in beer) in practice. GPL talks about media costs and that's pretty much what you can charge for GPLed software.
However, if ALL software required isn't under GPL this doesn't matter because if for example the compiler is under different license you cannot do "anything" with the Free software without full, perhaps expensive, license.
(*) To be exact source doesn't have to be bundled but it must be made available.
_________________________
_________________________
Spelling and grammar mistakes left as an exercise for the reader.
Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
Almost; I can charge what I'd like for the software, but the source needs to be made available, and all I can charge for the source is media and handling and the like. The binaries I can charge as much as I'd like.
Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
Gods damn you , would you please get it through your heads that the GPL does NOT mean 'free software' in any way? It means 'software comes with source; source can be done with as you please.' Say it with me, folks; GPL SOFTWARE CAN BE CHARGED FOR.
Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
"in Japanese and there's not much info thre yet other than some pictures. But according to..."
What?! At first I though it was some auto correct feature of some editor that forced Taco to use than instead of then. This concept desapeared when I saw this new word thre.
Could this be a foreseen of slashdot's end?
now now, you can't blame sony for not photoshopping their screen-caps like other gaming systems soon to be released.
FluX
After 16 years, MTV has finally completed its deevolution into the shiny things network
"It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once." -David Hume
I suppose i'm still waiting for Sony's port of Gran Tourismo 3 A-spec. Where do i sign?
FluX
After 16 years, MTV has finally completed its deevolution into the shiny things network
"It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once." -David Hume
1. Learn Japanese.
Learning a language too distant from your native language can be extremely difficult for somebody whose language learning unit has hardened, that is, most people older than 10 years old.
2. Buy a PS2.
USD $600 for two PS2 units is expensive. The kit is probably compatible only with PS2 systems region-coded for [NTSC|J], while PS2 units that play American games are coded for [NTSC|U/C].
4. Convince wife that it is all "educational" and is not because of any "cool factor".
Assuming all female geeks are lesbian?
Will I retire or break 10K?
NTSC is 30fps, 2 fields per frame.
Sure, NTSC is specified as 29.97 fps. However, live and videotaped television and video games run it at 59.94 fps, moving the camera and game objects between fields, because that creates smoother motion. Besides, consoles that use NTSC will fail when NTSC televisions are no longer sold because there is no market for them because all broadcast television is done in digital encrypted non-tapeable formats.
Will I retire or break 10K?
How do they run things at twice the defined resolution without breaking something?
Interlaced television systems (such as NTSC, PAL, and HDTV 1080i) draw odd scanlines in odd fields (59.94 fields per second in NTSC) and even scanlines in even fields. Two fields make up a full frame. You see thin horizontal lines on the sides of moving objects in a high-resolution screen capture because an object can move between fields. (You don't see it in DVD captures because DVDs are stored at 24 fps.) Most PlayStation 2 games (and a few later PSX 1 games such as Tobal No. 1 and Ehrgeiz) render the display at 640x240 at 59.94 fps or 640x288 at 50 fps and move the camera down half a pixel every other field.
Will I retire or break 10K?
Get yerricde a pronounceable handle ... This one might take a while ....
Two years and a month, to be exact. By then, I will have graduated from the school that gave me this username (Damian E Yerrick => yerricde).
and a sense of humor
I have a sense of humor, but not for jokes that are old and poorly told.
Will I retire or break 10K?
It never-EVER made sense to me that there is a difference between Japanese and American console units.
<apologist>
Mostly because copyrights are licensed regionally. How else are you supposed to keep American rights to a movie franchise from being infringed when you have licensed only the right to distribute in Japan? And what if someone asks for tech support or game tips for an obscure Japanese game with which the American subsidiary is not familiar?
</apologist>
<honest>
The translation doesn't even have to be good. I just want all Sony's Japanese game to be belong to Americans.
</honest>
Will I retire or break 10K?
Wasnt it Bill Gates who, upon being asked if he thought all software should be free, replied `yes, and all hardware too` ?
Yes. I believe the problem was with the word `Microsoft`, and not `everywhere`.
Quite frankly, I don't think this is going to happen like this. Linux is already available for PCs. Linux running PC-owners have a far higher proportion of programmers with the ability to write games than the ps2. If we were going to see a plethora of games for linux, developed by amateurs, they would already be here. As it is, we have a handful of Loki ports, and a few relatively simplistic games (cannon smash, tux racer etc).
Where it may help is if it is competitive with the native development of ps2 games. A conventional games company looking at developing a game for ps2 would weigh up the points of doing it under linux on ps2 or not, and one point that may swing it is that, "if we do it under linux, we can pick up all those geeks on slashdot too".
For myself, I would rather see something like the dreamcast linux that is currently available. I don't need a hard disk on a console, just a network card. Because I know all I'll use it for is as a sitting room front-end for my real computer to play mp3s, occasionally look at the web etc.. which isn't exciting, but I'd put money it's what a lot of people want.
not_cub
q='echo "q=$s$q$s;s=$b$s;b=$b$b;$q"';s=\';b=\\;echo "q=$s$q$s;s=$b$s;b=$b$b;$q"
I bet this could help a lot of non-PC Gamers to get into Linux...Great Stuff...need it! Lispy
1. Learn Japanese.
2. Buy a PS2.
3. Get kit.
4. Convince wife that it is all "educational" and is not because of any "cool factor".
BlackNova Traders
This shows that public opinion can work through petitions. Go sign the petitions at the Tux Games Petitions Page.
Tux Games. Your complete source for native Linux games.
Remember in the 80's when every game console was trying to cash in on the home computer movement? Remember ADAM, the Colecovision box with a bad keyboard and printer, is that what this is all about or what?
second society
ding ding ding! We have a winn'ah!
Now you and your loved ones can enjoy this avacado green Washer and Dryer from Westing House or what's behind this box!
---
This
Let's put this in perspective.
;)
/dev/dsp!) I can cram through an oversampled MP3 (like, oh.. 256 kbps stereo) and it sounds quite bloody good.
I have two rigs I use with daily frequency. Both run Linux, the 2.2.14 kernel, and are virtually identical in the software arena (yes, one has WordPerfect and XEmacs, but I don't use them that much
One is a C433 with 96 M ram, a PCI sound card, and a Voodoo2 3000 accelerator card. I can play Q3A and it sings (except for a minor sound problem.. damned
Now, the other rig is a P100 laptop with 40 MB ram and 350+M swap (for now.. i needed the insane swap to get certain apps running right!). I play a regular 128 kbps stereo MP3, and it belches out the audio in fits and spurts. Audio sucks even on lower quality MP3s because the ability to process the large amounts of data ain't there.
Then comes in the handheld MP3 player. Of course it plays 'em good; after all, THAT'S ALL IT DOES!
Moral of the story: A properly engineered dedicated device can do more with less processing power than a non-dedicated box.
I mean, think about it! MPEG-2 decoding is insane on system resources! Loads of ram and tons of cycles are needed to chew through the frames and the damned CSS coding!
A dedicated DVD player is built to crank out IMAGE without the overhead of an OS and multiple uses (beyond CD player, but a 386 can play a CD!!)
Windows.. Good for targeting rocks.
I used to be someone else. Now I'm someone better.
Real life is underrated.
You know, I'm sure that only the other day I was reading pages of lengthy and semi-literate diatribes about how Sony were one of the greatest evils on the planet (mostly because they don't like you stealing music & films from them).
Suddenly, they put out a Linux kit for the PS2 and they're the best little bunnies in the whole wide world, you just want to hug them and kiss them and call them George...
Baa for me. Go on. Let me hear you say Baaaa!
Hacker: A criminal who breaks into computer systems
"Information wants to be paid"
Dreamcast Linux
NetBSD, too, if you swing that way. ;)
Dreamcast NetBSD
Raw links for the Goatse paranoid:
http://linuxdc.sourceforge.net/
http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/dreamcast/
This sig is xenon coated, and will glow red when in the presence of aliens
The US, Euro (I guess?) and latest Japan models have an internal bay for the hard disk and ethernet port, so they'll require a different kit. I'm sure it's being worked on, if only because they'll need it in Japan.
That's why I wanted a PS2: SSX and this.
("... and the no-feet guy told me there was this thing called a budget and WNYX was way over it.")
This could turn out very interesting. Indrema had a new idea, but the problem was that the company simply couldn't fund a project like this. Now we've got big Sony supporting Linux (even more intriguing, Linux is something Microsoft fears greatly, and now Sony's supporting it)
Men believe what they want. - Caesar
That's what I meant, that is, the "old specs" (I didn't know they quadrupled the number of processors and graphics chips, nice!)
Men believe what they want. - Caesar
http://www.us.playstation.com/product_detail/produ ct_detail.jhtml?PRODID=1&CATID=401
Men believe what they want. - Caesar
GSCube is actually a collection of 16 PS2s working together in a cluster (feel free to make Beowulf jokes here). Basically, it is a monster graphics renderer used for CG like the Final Fantasy: Spirits Within movie coming out this summer. It doesn't play games. You hook it into a SGI computer and it pumps out graphics like nobody's business.
Men believe what they want. - Caesar
http://www.jp.playstation.com/linux/naiyo.html
Use http://babel.altavista.com to translate it.
Men believe what they want. - Caesar
As far as I know, right now you can't write games for the PS2 without the permission and strict supervision of Sony. Will the existence of PS2 Linux change this, or will any attempt to distribute games for it meet with a heavy kibosh from a swarm of Sony lawyers? I'm not too excited about an Open Source OS for the PS2 if I can't run Open Source software on it.
If you don't want my koalas, baby, don't shake my eucalyptus tree.
Strangely enough, this isn't too far out of Sony's master plans. The GSCube, their 3rd-generation console, runs almost entirely on Linux according to this month's issue of Wired magazine. It's a large, ugly beast but very powerful -- many many processors.
But still, PS2 + Linux doesn't make a whole lot of business sense.
- I don't care if they globalize against free speech. All my best free thoughts are done in my head.
So a person can program with the HD and stuff but how will they share thier creation with others? Will there be a way to link of HDs to share the info or can you attach the HD to a normal computer and burn the game yourself?
If they give you sources, they dont need to provide downloads. Not to say you couldn't provide downloads after you bought it though.
Just a Tuna in the Sea of Life
It should make porting Games to the PS2 easier. And better yet, it might make some PS2 title available on Linux. I see the biggest fear being that a bunch of games might get released with out official sanction of Sony.
Just a Tuna in the Sea of Life
The kit will include a complete Linux/X11 environment with all sources, technical hardware manuals for the EE, GS and vectorunits plus a low-level API and Mesa drivers for graphics.
Ever consider reading the article? The GPL lets you charge for copies, besides it says that Sony is providing a lot more than just linux on a DVD/CD.
Just a Tuna in the Sea of Life
If you have been paying attention, a basic programming language (BASIC I think) was added to the Euro model just to get it considered a computer, thereby dropping into lower tarifs.
Just a Tuna in the Sea of Life
i.Link is just Sony's name alternate name. (I believe) that for all technical purposes, they're the same thing.
/.ers only have a karma of 49...
REAL
SIG: HUP
I work as Tech Support Droid for Blitz Basic (see sig), a compiled Basic currently using DirectX for its graphics (damn fast, and Blitz 3D's in beta; also damn fast and good looking). I know that the author was very interested in porting to Indrema, and shocked when I told him it was dead.
Blitz isn't open source; it's a commercial product, currently only for Windoze, but future ports are a big possiblity (though it'd be next year at the earliest). If you have Windoze, try out the demo from the web site.
This is my personal, unofficial, unapproved spam-poll -- post here if you'd be interested in this (assuming current Windoze version price, around £30/$50, maybe slightly more, dunno), so I can pass the responses on if there's a lot of interest...
Of course, it's not up to me (er, especially the PS2 Linux outside Japan part), so don't count on it -- just trying to gauge interest...
http://www.blitzbasic.com/
http://www.blitzbasic.com/
Graphics3D 640, 480
Okay, this rocks. Assuming Sony will get this out in multilingual formats, this will *really* help speed acceptance and build an incredible amature developer base for new games and apps.
What crack are you smoking? Do you honestly think Sony really needs the "kudos" generated by a few long-haired open source zealots to ensure acceptance of the PS2? Nonsense. And the thought that any of them will actually fork out money for this is rediculous, after all if it's not free it's not worth having.
Jon Erikson, IT guru
There is a 4 and 6 pin plug. The 4 pin has no power on it. I think my PS2 has a 4 pin plug on it.
Can I run apache, PHP, mod_perl in a cluster of these suckers?
Newsfollow.com
Double your pleasure. It's two, two, two boxes in one.
When it comes to paying taxes, PS2 is a computer.
When it comes to slapping on tarrifs, it's a game.
I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
I believe that the PS2 has i.Link, not Firewire. i.Link is half the speed of Firewire, and tops at about 200 Mbps. That isn't slow, but still isn't as fast as true Firewire.
Literally everything you said here is wrong. For starters, there are only mild differences between NTSC-UC and NTSC-J. My American Televesions will work with ANY Japanese NTSC products. China, Europe, and a few other places use the PAL format. That is not compatible with NTSC. Often, you can get a picture from a PAL device on an NTSC television, but it doesn't look right. And to answer some people's questions about territorial lockouts... That's easy... Money! If you published a game in the US, would you want it to be imported to Japan to be sold? Maybe... That would give you more money. But the original Japanese publisher would be tweaked because your game got you a few bucks but shafted his company out of selling a unit. Different countries have different publishers- just like with books or movies.
The PS2 is one of the WORST DVD players that you can buy. My $149 Apex kicks it's ass in terms of features and picture/sound quality. The PS2 doesn't have the video RAM to accomidate the limited textures in Tux Racer.
But is there any practical value for this? It seems to me that when you're buying a keyboard and external hard drive to run Linux on a system displaying on your TV, you would be better off using the PC you already have. (I'm skeptical that there is a large base of PlayStation Linux customers who don't already have a PC.)
I'm not knocking this - I'm trying to understand if there's anything behind statements like conservative fractions in the company are hindering the Public Release of the port, fearing revelation of their trade secrets and not seeing the advantage for SCEI releasing the software.
Unsettling MOTD at my ISP.
Indrema's problem wasn't the lack of funds per se, it was the lack of an intelligent approach to actualizing the dream. Hype and VCs were brought into the picture way too early, before the hardware was finalized or the prototype constructed. They should have built a cheap, working demo unit (wooden box, breadboards, copper wires - but functional) first and only then sought financing to bring the device to the mass market.
Furthermore, Sony isn't "supporting Linux"; it's responding to slow sales, lack of interest and the fact that much PS2 development is done using Linux. It's a pure utility thing - no ideological fantasies, people.
Now I'll be able to get Tux Racer and 36 different versions of solitaire for PS2. Plus all the games people were developing for the Idrema...
I'll never be off my PS2 ever...
So the big question now is ... who will develop a PlayStation 2 emulator for this thing?
;-) "Because we can"
Any technology distinguishable from magic, is insufficiently advanced.
Why not extend this and include the libraries and compilers needed to create a native ps2 application? Just compile it on the ps2 and zip it out the ethernet to your cd-burner. You'd probably be best suited to do the 3d modeling, animation, mapping, textures, etc on another machine, but this could be feasible.
6000 sigs aside, maybe the Indrema (or the principles behind it) where the motivating factor.
Think about it, whats the best way to insure the longevity of a game these days? Ask Sierra studios and they'll tell you the answer is a community of home grown developers. This practice can easily translate to a console. Sony is protecting themselves against the Xbox and Gamecube by 'opening' their console to people who could develop apps and games at home.
BOSTON SUCKS!
If all of the hardware that you listed is included then that is a good deal. But considering the price a PS2 goes for ($300 USD), I some how doubt that Sony is going to give you all of that for only $200 USD just because it has Linux on it.
I would love to be wrong.
I wondered why this site suddenly appeared a few days ago...
Anybody want a peanut?
As you see of this text, I want PS2 to play DivX.
This is a subliminal line. When you read this you feel like playing DivX on PS2.
Okay, this rocks. Assuming Sony will get this out in multilingual formats, this will *really* help speed acceptance and build an incredible amature developer base for new games and apps.
Nintendo currently requires you to buy or lease an expensive (bigger than my yearly salary) SGI-based development kit. Playstation 1 requires you to buy a $2k PCI card for a PC. (Last I heard. It may have come down quite a bit) Microsoft's going to let you develop on a PC, but let's be honest here. How many developers have the best 3D gaming platform money can buy?
Letting users run linux and a HDD *on* a PS2, however, means that entriprising hackers can start building games and/or other apps. What's *really* great about this is the fact that quite a few of these new apps are going to be written for the X environment on the Linux kit. It seems to me like that would make it an easy port to GTK, etc...
Ohayou gozaimasu, our Nihonjin friends. How about some prelim reports on the functionality once you get your hands on these guys?
The next Slashdot story will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and slashdot the links early!
Isn't Linux GPLed? In addition to selling it for 200 bucks, don't they have to make it freely available?
The need the Playstation 2 to be classified as a computing device rather than as a consumer electronics/entertainment device (For Great Britain - I don't know about the European Community as a whole).
This was discussed in Slashdot before. Where's that group memory thing (or I guess I'm one cell of it...)
A beginners' guide to Portland, OR?
There is something pretty twisted when an entire thread is moderated down because it's not part of the "giant linux circle-jerk." Browse this thread at -1 and you will see some interesting comments...
I think you read it backwards... it can help acceptance of linux and increase the number of game developers for linux. If you have to fork out $2000 for a decent new computer, why not instead upgrade your PS2 for $200 to have a gaming computer you can develop on?
---
Developers: We can use your help.
It can't require a programming language to be considered a computer - what about buying a complete system with an empty HD and no included software? It's still a computer, but no language. Maybe including a language is one of many possible requirements. I probably don't know what I'm talking about.
I really hate signatures, but go to my website.
How many BogoMIPS does a PS2 get?
Seriously, would this be speedy enough for someone wanting to run a a normal desktop system (KDE2, Koffice, Konq or Mozilla, & ssh)? Also, any clues as to the size of the HD included? I can't read Japanese
If it is fast and has a decent amount of drive space, a PS2 would make a great low-end office box. Sony could be opening up a whole new market for themselves; a smart business move on their part.
On a side note, PS2s running Linux could take the place of Indrema, and boost the market for Linux gaming. It should be pretty easy for existing games that run on the PC (Loki's ports, etc) to be used on the PS2...just burn em to a cd along with a bootable kernel image, and off you go! Now, who's the enterprising soul who wants to port SDL to the PS2?
Is this rock and roll, or a form of state control?
I cant wait to get my hands on one of these puppies.. but why the difference between american/japanese launch date ? im sick of it!
"Be glad you sailed for a better day, But dont forget there will be hell to pay" - Dave King/Flogging Molly
now sadaam doesn't even have to port linux or anything. a 2000 node cluster of ps2's running linux sounds like a supercomputer to me.
Bored with your projects?
Try Einsteinium
The reason why you need a licence agreement in order to make games for consoles is that this is how the manufacturers make their money. The consoles themselves are sold at a loss, and the manufacturer (e.g. Sony, Microsoft, etc.) recoups this loss through licence fees. That's one of the reasons why console games are more expensive than PC games (or at least they are here - IEP 54.99 for a new PS2 game, vs. ~IEP 40 for a new PC game... If you tried to release a game for a console without a licence, chances are an army of lawyers would be at your throat in no time at all.
I personally think that this box would kick some serious ass as a nice portable system to take with you on vacation.
If god had intended you to be naked, you would have been born that way.
You're probably right. Tariff laws are confusing and convoluted, as governments around the world seem to take a perverse pleasure in creating confusion in their populace
If god had intended you to be naked, you would have been born that way.
This isn't a hack, it's an official Sony product that they will be making money on.
Come to Michigan - we have plenty. I was just in Best Buy yesterday and they had about ten PS2s on the floor. And, if we don't have them here, you can always go to Canada - I understand they're not moving all that fast over there...
Through the mud and the blood into the green field beyond...
Was that confirmed, or was it an U. L. ?
Why exactly do you WANT Linux on a PS2? You're confined to using the display on a TV with a low-res, a certain set of hardware that you can't really modify, and like, you've prolly already got it on your PC if you buy it for your PS2.
Besides which, I don't know if it'll sell well in Japan, so odds are we wouldn't see it here anyways.
As far as I know the PS2 has 4 mbyte graphics memory and 32 mbyte of main memory (RDRAM). Should be sufficient to run most apps, but maybe not star office. ;)
Dreamcast has 24 mbyte SDRAM. 8 mbyte of it are graphics memory.