Slashdot Mirror
To the Moon, Alice
Wa7ly writes: "An amateur rocket scientist in the US hopes to blast off into space this autumn in a $250,000 rocket he built in his back yard. This seems to be a really great idea if he can successfully pull it off and come back to earth safely!" *cough*Darwin Award*cough*
FAA: "So, what are your flight plans?"
The guy: "See that big blue thing over your head?"
FAA: "Yes."
The guy: "That's where i'll be flying."
Thats it. I've seen people tell you before that your sig is incorrect. However you refuse to fix it. Therefore from this day on I am declaring war against you until you fix your sig. I get mod points constantly. and I like to waste them.
-tm
The guys got a website http://www.rocketguy.com
I'd like to know specifics too, but presumable they don't want it to hit a plane. Unlikely but that kind of thing requires planning. The airspace is extremely crowded these days.
And the same superiority-complex pussies are sneering.
Good luck, Mr. Walker.
No they weren't; not even close. But they were the first to have a controlled, powered, heavier than air flight--but gliders (unpowered), balloons (lighter than air), and I think a couple of failed attempts by others (not controlled
While I"m at it, the Wright brothers claimed that building an autogyro (helicopter) would have been easier, but the problem was making it move forward once it was up . . .
hawk
hawk
It looked like he had a whole bunch of experiments going on in a whole bunch of things but couldn't stay focused long enough to finish any of them. Now 3 months later it looks like his web site is one of them, with the last photos from February before taking another diversion and traveling to Russia. Even if he could finish just one of the things in his back yard, it would definitely take more concentration than he's shown to test it and learn to fly it.
if you're the webmaster, a URL would be nice
http://rareformnewmedia.com/
The soviets were also smart enough to kick the pants off the US during the first decade of space missions.
http://rareformnewmedia.com/
Maybe so, but not in my case. I've always been very aware of quite how socially incompetent I am, and so are most of the other Slashdot-types I know. The problem I have is that I see social etiquette as a game that someone invented with arbitrary rules, and I just don't see the point of playing the game. Consequently, I don't bother.
"The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike." -- Delos B. McKown
For more information on this phenomenon, see the scary article at http://www.apa.org/journals/psp/psp7761121.html.
"The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike." -- Delos B. McKown
The Wright brothers' bicycle shop was in Dayton, Ohio. They just made their first test flight in Kitty Hawk, NC.
--ThoraX695
I'm really hoping he doesn't actually try to store the distilled 90% pure hydrogen peroxide anywhere on his property. He will move from the status of "Local Character" to "Community Menace" very quickly.
I think amateur rocketry is a helluva lot of fun, and properly engineered rockets can even deliver satellite payloads. This guy's efforts are more of the "tinfoil helmet" variety, and shouldn't be confused with what some folks are actually doing to improve actual steam propelled rockets. Check out http://www.erps.org for a few interesting sidenotes on this engine type.
-- lk t lv ll th vwls t f wrds. T svs lts f tm t wrt bt ts pn n th ss t rd nd mks m lk lk cmplt dpsht.
Think about it. You're the people that future generations will look back at and say "Boy, it's a good thing Mr.SoAndSo didn't listen to all those idiots who said it was impossible. We'd still be back at the turn of the century if he did!"
If you have a technical argument, bring it. If you have a bunch of "I don't think he can do it, because I know I can't do it." type of whining then, don't bother posting it.
Personally, I think the whole thing is a hoax, of the 'move it all to Mexico' statement. However, that doesn't mean a non-NASA person couldn't make something like this happen.
As a close friend of Rocket Guy ...
You might be the right person to ask this to then. How does he intend to prevent the rocket from going up and over and straight back down into the ground, or else up and around and around like a catherine wheel?
The mere fact that the rocket outlet is in front of the centre of mass of the vehicle does not guarantee anything at all about the direction of travel. If the thrust is sufficient but not perfectly balanced on the line between the centre of mass of the rocket and the gravitational centre of the Earth, the leading rocket can easily pull the whole vehicle up and around and down or into a rapid catherine wheel spin.
There could be absolutely nothing the pilot can do about this manually because the potentially huge inertial forces could pin him (or any mechanical devices) into immobility. And it could all happen so fast that he wouldn't have time to balance the upward thrust nicely.
The time to think about this is now.
"The question of whether machines can think is no more interesting than [] whether submarines can swim" - Dijkstra
It wasn't a failure. I already knew he killed himself, which is why I'm doing justice to his memory. They guy felt like flying. He flew. End of story.
--
I think there is a world market for maybe five personal web logs.
Ahem... the guy (AKA Larry Walters, e.g. "Lawn Chair Larry") who put baloons on his lawn chair and flew up into the sky had it go off like a charm, if I remember correctly. He got up to about 16000 feet, drifted for 14 hours, drank beer, and ate sandwiches, before finally drifting into an LAX approach lane, at which point he descended, got caught in some power lines, and climbed down. He survived, and got probably the coolest, quietest, and most serene bird's eye view of Los Angeles (parts of it at night, no less) that anyone in history has ever gotten. How do you call that a failure?
--
I think there is a world market for maybe five personal web logs.
A good summary of Larry Walter's lawn chair flight is available at Snopes.
Search 2010 Gen Con events
For those who aren't familar with it, it is worth stating that the New York Post, although once a respectable paper in the 19th and earrly 20th centuries, is currently little better than the National Enquirer or Weekly World Sun, and generally prints stories like "Aliens kidnap hamster". Unless somebody can find a version of the story in a more serious source, I can only assume it is fictional.
Oh, come on! This has nothing to do with politics. The Wall Street Journal is a reputable right-wing paper -- The Post is a tabloid.
> On RocketGuy's website, he writes (in third person, no less) that his goal is "to set the altitude record for a private citizen". I don't want to shatter his dream, but Dennis Tito became the first space tourist this past week.
You don't think setting a record for "private citizen in his own privately built rocket" and for "private citizen going along as a passemger on a government funded mission" might be different dreams?
--
rant
Never be afraid to try something new. Remeber, Amateurs build the Ark, professionals built the Titanic.
JET Program: see Japan, meet intere
While this story may be fictional, there is a group from Portland, OR that are working on rockets to be fired from Bend, OR. Their website is at www.psas.pdx.edu. They're working on inertial navigation, and recently put out a call for volunteers to work on a port of [uC]Linux to the mpc555 chip, which is a PPC variant.
They are launching from Bend because they can get clearance there for the altitudes they expect to hit. When they want to go higher (say, the 100km mark), they'll have to go to Alaska, from what I hear. Alaska's got the only true spaceport that's not NASA controlled, and with (easier) FAA approval you can actually launch from there. Or try for a sea-launch and hope you don't flub the schedule <g>
GStreamer - The only way to stream!
I hope he has plenty of glo-plugs, as I know it always took me a few to start my model rockets.
Also, i hope he remember to wrap the parachue right, otherwise it'll just tumble end over end until it gets caught in a tree.
Why didn't the Hooters girls ever help me celebrate my rocket launches?
Know what I like about atheists? I've yet to meet one that believes God is on their side.
A couple of points to note. 1) It is powered by H2O2 ( hydrogen peroxide ) not steam. Steam is a by product from the reaction with the silver catalist screen. 2) While H2O2 can be purchased in stores, it in not of sufficient purity (~5% H2O2 mixed with 95% H2O) to be used in this context. H2O2 in its pure form is highly corrosive, as well as being spontaneously explosive under the right conditions. I think that nixes out EASY transportation across the border.
SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0
0 rows returned
The shuttle has a max altitude of about 400 kilometres, which is a lot less than 400 miles.
. htm
http://www.friends-partners.org/mwade/lvs/shuttle
--
One of the issues that the FAA is going to be concerned about is range safety. This means that the people who are launching the rocket will have to convince the FAA that the rocket is not going to nose over and crash into an elementary school. For NASA, commercial and military launches, there is a Range Safety Officer (RSO) who is responsible for sending a destruct command to the launch vehicle if it deviates from the planned trajectory.
Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
While i'm not doubting the guy's abilities, it says that he's a multimillionaire. Now, if I had multimillions, i'd follow Tito. I mean, why not leave it up to people who know what they are doing, and have done it sucessfully. I mean, look at all the failures that have happened in both the American and Russian space programs. Getting into space is a little more complex than strapping a whole lot of explosives to something, and praying :)
---
--
Insert Witty Sig Here
Interesting problem. Do you think, that if he solves the balancing problem that he'll have angular momentum problems once he gets high enough? Is 30 miles high enough? Will he accidentally hit the ocean or some city because the earth turned underneath him while his rocket was in the air?
Need a Python, C++, Unix, Linux develop
I still think you're going to see interesting angular momentum problems. You have to be going around lots faster to go around once every 24 hours if you're 30 miles farther away from the center of the earth.
I was impressed in the article noting that the propulsion system was actually thought out and not something totally half baked. :-)
Good luck to your friend. I hope he makes it. :-)
Need a Python, C++, Unix, Linux develop
Nobody's forcing YOU to build one of these things and kill yourself on it. If somebody else wants to, let him by. Don't try to run other people's lives just to keep them out of harm's way.
Mod down posts with a "Free Mac Mini/iPod" sig, they're spam!
-Jeremy (playing the karma whore today)
I don't care if it's 90,000 hectares. That lake was not my doing.
>Incidentall, did Nasa have to file flight plans during the shuttle launches? They'd be interesting to see.
Probably...but it'd be a simple one: powered acceleration curve to insert into orbit, until such time as they go over the FAA's head.
It might be very appropriate. This could be something which would make him rather famous, and that has noted benefits, as well as penalties.
Caution: Now approaching the (technological) singularity.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
Hooters must be different in Oregon. Here in Indy, Hooters doesn't seem to employ attractive women, or women with breasts, hooters if you will.
--
--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
I went to the guys site, and the tech is at the very least plausable. The Silver/H2O2 tech has proven itself (rocket powered dragster Sprit Of Australia - 300+ MPH/4.11 second 1/4 mile), and the rest seems not without merit. I think he'll land using the chute on his back - but he'll land.
Yes, he has a good shot at the Darwin Award to be sure, but he might actally be the first to collect the X Prize. What he proposes isn't any sillier than what these inventive people from my country intend to use to collect the $10M US (about $20CDN).
I myself salute his moxy and entrepreneurial spirit. No way I'd hit the button to light that candle.
"Depression is merely anger without enthusiasm." - Anonymous
I find it to be a solid NY-centric news source without the PC and liberal bullcrap that makes the NY Daily News (its main rival) not worthy to line a bird cage. Check it out and make your own judgement:
http://www.nypost.com
AD ASTRA, EVERYMAN!
The Rocket Guy
When Rocket Guy dreams
I wish this guy would put up a website to record his progress and report on the project... but I couldn't find anything like that.
"Perhaps most amazingly, votaries of 'diversity' insist on absolute conformity." -- Tony Snow
The truth is this guy was upset that Mir and ... if he
... for free (minus the costs
that X-10 plane or whatever it was didn't
hit the Taco Bell sign, so he's taking
the matter into his own hands
hits the sign, he gets to look like
a chalupa
of building the rocket of course)...
Maybe Slashdot should set up an interview so we can submit questions to him. It would be interesting to see what he has to say.
Need Free Juniper/NetScreen Support? JuniperForum
Since he's not going into orbit, he doesn't need orbital calculations. It's a sub-orbital ballistic shot, like Alan Shepard flew in 1962 (before John Glenn's orbital flight).
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
Slashdot Poll
The outcome I'd most like to see with Rocket Man is:
Cheers,
-- jon
>He doesn't want to advance science, he just wants to have champagne poured on him by Hooters girls.
And there is something *wrong* with this?
Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball
...or more money than a small country...
$250,000 is still a large chunk of cash. I imagine not many people have that in their couch cushions.
Need I remind you that the ship that brought us into first contact with the Vulcans was made by one hick (not counting interferance by future generations). Oh wait, I'm confusing imagination with reality again. Just like everybody who thinks this story is genuine.
It's turtles all the way down.
I've met him, and one of the people who works with him is one of my best friends from high school, who majored in physics and worked with a company at Edwards AFB in California developing experimental aircraft.
I think he'll succeed.
http://rocketguy.com/ is his website.
[RANT MODE ON]: I submitted this story a week ago, how is it that me, who has inside information on the subject, gets rejected, and this guy, who merely saw it on the NYT gets it posted?
2001-04-30 18:01:06 Manned Amateur Rocketry (articles,space) (rejected)
[RANT MODE OFF]
"Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives" should be a convenience store, not a government agency.
I've met him, and been to his backyard, and seen the equipment
It wouldn't be hard for me to get in touch with him again
"Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives" should be a convenience store, not a government agency.
As someone said above - what's in stores is 97% WATER. Go back and visit John Carmack's site concerning his efforts. One of the more interesting tests are those that they did on clothes in order to determine that which was mos safe. John himself said that some of those tests were "interesting" to say the least. This is the sort of chemical that EATS aluminum, stainless steel, and will eat YOU if you're not careful. Not cheap either.
Honestly, I'm wondering how this guy figures he'll go straight up and straight back down. How the heck is he going to steer his descent let alone his ascent? Same with the fuel pod that he plans to jettison - what prevents that from landing on a home? Is this the dry lakes he's launching from? They're big but THAT big?
I wish him luck though. I too am VERY frustrated with NASA and Congressional funding of same. If we had a gun to our heads today to goto the Moon we'd be pulling crap out of mothballs to do it. That's pathetic! Why have we moved so slowly forward and why are we relying on such an expensive maintenance intensive craft to do it? there has got to be a better way but I'm starting to doubt I'll see any of it in my lifetime if folks like this guy and John Carmack among others don't get things kickstarted. NASA is mired down, we need some help fomr the more creative people out there...
Build it, Drive it, Improve it! Hybridz.org
Rocketguy has a website. Complete with simulation vidoes, and pictures of where he is building his rocket and centrifuge.
...and I'm not sure we should trust this Kyle Sagan either.
"Louise Brooks naked and petrified! "
Minor quibble -- Brooks was from the 20's and early 30's.
I'd have picked one of the hotties of that era, such as Evelyn Nesbitt (the "Gibson Girl", involved in a murder scandal about 3 to 5 years after the Wright Brothers' original flight), or Lillian Russell (more from the 1890's, but still prominent in the decade of 1900).
This page accidentally left blank
Exactly what the Darwin Award is all about.
;)
If you just sit on your couch like a lump you can never achieve the acclaim of your peers or do something blindingly stupid enough to win the Darwin Award. The line between the two is success.
If this guy does what he says he will do, he will be famous. If he screws up... well, let's just say that he'll not be worrying the rest of us with the proliferation of his DNA
I wish him the best, and hope he does it. Amature spaceflight might just be the only way to wake up corporations to the value of private space exploitation.
damn that impressive. everyone read that. BTW, the same type of brake arrangement is used on trains.
Rocket Guy has a Web page. This has got to be one of the strangest looking rockets ever.
Maybe he should consider sending his dog instead.
Man I hope they televise this.
:)
Be as good to watch as Challenger was
_______________________ I am the eggman, wooo! _______________________
You're afraid an engineering degree would make you dumber?
--
Patrick Doyle
I mod down every jackass who puts his moderation policy in his sig. Oh, wait a sec....
I know it was mentioned on the older article:
This guy would do well to look over this web page, and understand why rockets are inverted, rather than hanging, pendulums.
If he continues with his current plan, about all he'll end up doing is making a nice crater in the lake bed...
Worldcom - Generation Duh!
Reason is the Path to God - Anon
"According to his plans, a pickup truck will be waiting to drive him to a group of bleachers where fans and 12 Hooters bar girls will pour champagne all over him. "
Now all he's got to do is git liquered up and shoot himself to the moon...
-Ex
nt
Best Slashdot Co
"I think he is carrying on a fine tradition where one person with guts can make a big impact on the world"...quite literally, if he screws up. Yup, he'll leave his mark alright :-)
Seriously, I hope he makes it, but I'll be staying a (hopefully) safe distance away.
Anyone who isn't seriously impaired can get a class 3. Costs $70-$90 and a doctor's visit.
I think it would be courteous to file a flight plan, since he is going to "flying" into class Alpha airspace. I'm not sure what the sectional looks like, but it's prolly Class Echo, followed by Class Alpha. However, I think the FAA could cut the poor guy a little slack - as long as he isn't going to be interfering with any airline traffic, let him have his fun. If I was him, I'd just go to Mexico, the FAA can be a real bitch to deal with.
The FAA is to the aviation world, as the IRS is to the business world. Some people bring joy when they arrive, others when they leave, and the FAA definitely brings joy when they're leaving.
Actually, that would be Godacceleration. Godspeed would be the speed at which he plummets to earth in a flaming pile of wreckage because his hydrogen peroxide motor explodes.
I can imagine Orville Wright saying the same thing...
Ok, maybe if Orville Wright was saying that before he tested his plane at the Grand Canyon (instead Kitty Hawk, NC which is flat and not dangerous), while the Air Force flies around in jets above him...
The Wright brothers were the first people to fly. This guy isn't. He doesn't want to advance science, he just wants to have champagne poured on him by Hooters girls.
I think he is carrying on a fine tradition where one person with guts can make a big impact on the world.
Yeah, he's going to make a very big impact on a dry Oregon lake bed.
some fucking bike shop owners from north carolina trying to FLY, for god's sake, FLY!
This would be very like /. considering the brothers weren't from North Carolina. :-)
You cannot apply a technological solution to a sociological problem. (Edwards' Law)
This story was reported on Slashdot over 6 months ago with a link to a seattletimes.com story having slightly more information.
If you can't tell the guy is a freak who is going to blow himself up, you're a fucking idiot. His life's work so far has been to drop out of school, do some worthless shit, and then blow himself up. He and his life's work deserve mockery of the highest degree.
- Have a picture
---snip
the combined PhD's that GRADUATED COLLEGE at NASA
---snip
Graduated college at NASA? Oh dear.
Putting a man into an amateur space vehicle is, IMHO, probably a bad idea. I think it's highly do-able for amateurs to put vehicles into orbit. I'm a "high power model rocketry" fanatic, and I have a lot of respect and appreciation for what can be accomplished with simple solid-fuel boosters. There are orders of magnitude difference, however, between the complexity of a small solid or liquid fueled booster that can achieve tens of thousands of feet of altitude, and a booster capable of throwing a payload into a stable orbit.
I believe the technology necessary to put men into space is not beyond the grasp of private individuals or small corporations. Look at the advances in technology since the 1960's and the "golden age" of the U.S. space program-- it should be possible to do the same things the Mercury or Gemini programs did for a fraction of the research and development cost.
Having civilians participate in the space program is the best way to build enthusiasm for the space program-- but I don't think it wise for private individuals or corporations to go trying to loft men into space just yet... There has not been enough unmanned testing of vehicles yet to assure that launching these things will be safe for the men onboard, or those of us on the ground!
The Attitude Adjuster, I hate me, you can too.
I don't know how easy it is to teach yourself the engineering involved in this kind of adventure.
Oh come on!! It's not like this is rocket sci----
Oh shit, never mind!
--------
Yeah, I'm a Mac programmer. You got a problem with that?
-- thinkyhead software and media
Give him a break. It's his choice if he wants to risk his life doing this, not yours. I, for one, don't think he's a freak at all. Of course, I grew up during the rocket crazed 60's, so I really don't see anything that insane about what he's doing. The guy is only 4 years older than I am and I can empathise with what he's doing very, very much. I also dropped out of college. Wanna compare tax returns? He deserves kudos for having the balls to try what NASA has been saying is impossible. What if he succeeds? Mass produced space-rockets? WOOHOO!! Sign me up!
Dive Gear
--- Think of it as evolution in action ---
>>>Mr. Walker should be commended for his ambition, its people like this that change the world.
I wish him luck but I fear the only change he will make to the world will be the crater he leaves behind!
I don't think it's a question of stereotypes; I haven't seen any posts that say it'll never work because he doesn't have a college degree. I would say he's a madman even if he had a Ph.D. in Backyard Rocket Design from MIT. I would say he's mad were he Goddard himself.
Of course, I'd still ask him to go ahead and do it anyway; there's no risk he'd crash into my house or that of a loved one. Madmen do occasionally pull something off. Just because a couple of bicycle mechanics manage to survive, however, doesn't mean that a great many others don't go splat, their experiments providing footage for countless commercials which state "there's a better way to do things." But, better he go splat than me, and I want his cool toys.
~~~~~~
under-paid karma whore
Well, I'd hate to be the guy below him who got the receiving end of 14 hours of beer-piss...
This post expresses my opinion, not that of my employer. And yes, IAAL.
Too bad most people don't remember Robert Truax. He gained fame in the '70s by building a single-man rocket and selling rides in it (I don't know that it ever launched, but it was intended to). You can find Mr. Truax's website at http://www.rctruax.com/, where he and his company will be able to sell you one of his "Excalibur" low cost space launch vehicles. According to the website, these vehicals have the capability to place payloads ranging from 200 to 1,000,000 lbs to LEO and other space orbits.
"values of beta will give rise to dom!"
According to his plans, a pickup truck will be waiting to drive him to a group of bleachers where fans and 12 Hooters bar girls will pour champagne all over him.
Well, he doesn't even know if the FAA will let him do it, but he certainly knows what he wants after he succeeds. Sheesh. Some people will do anything for a little female attention. I guess if he can't do it, he could always just rent the Hooters girls and show them his rocket. Hooters, sheesh.
AFAIK, developing a non commercial clone of a powerful OS for a computer that is little more than a toy isn't likely to get you blown to smithereens. The chances of some critical failure to happen for this guy are huge -- the guys at NASA fucked up a minor detail and whoops, there goes Challenger and everyone on it. You think a lone man can create a failure-proof rocket? If he manages to attempt his launch, more than likely he'll end up dead. Sure, follow your dreams and all that, but one should realize when one's dreams are more than likely fatal.
Once the fuel tank separates there will be different amounts of atmospheric drag on the fuel tank and the capsule. This will result in the fuel tank slowing down faster than the capsule. As a result the fuel tank will remain below the capsule. Thats why Allen Shepherd's redstone didn't hit him in the ass on re-entry. (It crashed into the ocean before the capsule landed, almost hitting a freighter!) Also, the article said that the fuel tank would parachute down, I assume it's chute's would deploy first.
Sounds a bit like Bob Trueax (not sure how to spell that) who designed Evil Knivel's sky cycle. Bob was an Ex-Nasa engineer who was designing his own space shuttle out of disgarded rocket parts. The TV show "Salvage One" (about a junkyard owner and an ex astronaut who went to the moon to collect old apollo 'junk') was based on him.
skilful (sic) and intelligent people who kill themselves may or may not have reproduced beforehand:)
Ah yes. Whoever moderated me down, I thank you. You have proved that moderation does *not* work.
I think I will keep posting insightful, or witty commentary using my IAmNotA_Spork user account to show exactly how broken this moderation system is.....
Give power to an idiot, and they will only abuse it.....
Feed the need: Digitaladdiction.net
The space capsule doesn't have room for his balls which clearly are the biggest on Earth.
Someone you trust is one of us.
The fact that this guy didn't go to college is irrellevant. What makes him certifiable, is that he is going to launch himselve 36 miles into the outer atmosphere. Of course his celebration plan is to get drunk at Hooters, which makes him some kind of crazy-idiot-genius all at the same time.
Someone you trust is one of us.
This does bring up the always intriguing argument about what actually defines intelligence. Currently, one of my favorite definitions is "The ability to relate two unrelated thoughts/items/etc.".
I can pick two words at random from the dictionary and form a sentence using those words might. Does that count? (How about "the ability to relate two seemingly unrelated thoughts/items/etc. in a useful way"?)
By the way, I think this definition is better suited for "creativity" than for "intelligence".
The shareholder is always right.
- mipe -
The guy reminds me of a once adventurous Chinese official named Wan-Hu who assembled a rocket powered flying chair. He attached to a chair two large kites along with a multitude of rockets (remember the chinese were the first to discover gun powder).
He commanded his servants, armed with torches, to light the rockets at the same time. When the smoke and fire cleared Wan-Hu was never found (at least not in any recognizable pieces)!
Depending on your point-of-view Wan-Hu was either an epitome of the human pioneering spirit or a potential canidate for a darwin award.
My guess is he *DOES* understand the risks, but is going to try it anyway because it's the chance of a lifetime.
But even if that is the case, it's most definately still a trait that evolution would weed out. So, your conclusion is still correct, that he would be a perfect candidate for a darwin award.
But, who knows, maybe he really knows what he's doing and will come out of this alright.
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
btw, we don't call him the "rocket guy" around here. at best he's the "rocket cook".
'Ey, pizano, you-a tasta da nice-a rocket, eh si? Izza good for you! You like, eh? Luigi cooka da rocket a-good, no?
Moreover, what incentive would the FAA have to permit such a launch? ;), then they get criticized for allowing such an obviously reckless and foolhardy stunt to be carried out.
If it goes well, NASA, the government etc. end up looking foolish for spending so much money when some clown with a quarter-mil got himself into space.
If it goes badly (a far more likely scenario IMHO
I know it! I did actually buy the magazine months ago, and it's not a bad article, maybe not worth buying a whole magizine for, but what the heck. All the guy wanted was a source other than the NY Post, so that's what I provided. Seems there are other sources available on the net, as provided by others: www.rocketguy.com and even a /. story on this last summer, which pre-dates the space.com magazine by a lot...
I'm going to disagree with your statement that there is no correlation between degrees and intelligence. The probability of someone having one or more college degrees and being intelligent is far far far higher than someone with no degrees or no high school education.
I grew up near a small town in a very rural area. I've met a lot of "blue collar" guys who were reasonably intelligent. But the majority of them (both men and women) were the type of person that wondered "why in the world" I'd want to go off to college and learn "stuff that ain't good fer nuthin'". Well... most of those people are still earning about $14 an hour in a factory (if they are lucky). Don't get me wrong though... I've also met some idiots that made it through college.. but I've met a LOT more idiots that never went to college.
Given a choice between someone with a degree and someone without a degree, I'd probably choose the person with the degree for a job.. unless the undegreed person demonstrated exceptional skills and also demonstrated that the ability to learn new skills and to adapt quickly to a changing schedule and work requirements. College teaches you a lot more than how to solve statics problems.
That's exactly what I thought of! I couldn't think of the name of it for anything; thank goodness for Slashdot and IMDB. Salvage I was a short-lived mutant of the original 1978 TV movie, Salvage, which really was about someone building a cheap rocket in their backyard - to go to the Moon, no less. They built it out of salvaged junk. And ironically, I think (man it's been a long time since I saw it) that the rocket cost about a quarter-million dollars to build. I wonder if that's where the guy got the idea - he would've been about 20 when it was released.
(Incidentally - "Off Topic"?? Since when did the concept of life-imitating-art-imitating-life become too highbrow for Slashdot? Geez, is it metamod time again already?)
It takes to get into space is enough money, and a flight plan? Surely there's gotta be more to it than that, in regards to gov't licences or some such thing, wouldn't there be?!
Follow the link at the bottom of the article and read a couple of other articles if you've never heard of the NY Post
A guy building a rocket by himself and not within the confines of a huge rocket company?
Sound crazy? Just replace "rocket" with "Operating System" and you have the story of Linux. Sure it is oversimplified, but damn, for $250,000 I'm sure he's done something right.
Chaos, Mayhem, and Destruction: Not
Now if NASA had Hooters girls in the 60s, do ya think maybe we would have landed on the moon earlier? I think yes!
I can see it now "Teams you have 10 hours to build a rocket to bring you to the moon and back using only parts in the junkyard!!!!"
iRepairIT - iPhone, Mac, & PC Repair
Darwin Award?
Didn't slashdot have a story on Carmack and his rocket experiments just last week? I believe he wanted to achieve low altitude orbit or something. Sounds very similar to this guy's attempt.
Should Carmack get a Darwin award too?
"4/25/01 Due to increased demands on Rocket Guy's time by the media the launch will be delayed until May 2002."
Is it just me or does this sentence sound a little absurd? Demands on one's time by the media? More likely there's a simpler explanation...
We're on the road to Tycho.
I wish him well, but this sounds crazy. I mean, I don't know how easy it is to teach yourself the engineering involved in this kind of adventure. Also, how well did he compensate for the non-ideal reality compared to the ideal world of a physics text?
I mean, I'll grant that most of NASA's expense is our desire of safety beyond the point of diminishing return. I mean, the 80-20 rule probably applies, 80% of the cost is the last 20%... I mean, NASA can't risk a casualty, he may be willing to risk a 80% survival rate.
However, this still seems insane, I can't imagine that he has figured EVERYTHING out... Well, good luck and God-speed.
Alex
The X-Prize goes to someone who can create a vehicle that can send three people into space. This one seats only one.
However, I really salute this person and I hope he makes it. Good luck!
Last night I shot an elephant in my pajamas. How he got in my pajamas I'll never know.
Godspeed and good luck, Mr. Walker.. I think I've heard of that before... I think I remember "Godspeed" being defined in physics as 9.8 meters per second squared on earth.
We need to get a couple more of these amature rocket scientists together, paint a big circle in the middle of the desert and turn this into a big game of lawn darts.
This gentleman has successfully completed Russian cosmonaut training. Rocketguy is the shitski.
Does this guy not have enough sense to at least blast a manless test flight into space first and see if it works? Or can he not afford to do it twice?
I don't know about the Darwin Award - it takes quite a lot of skill and intelligence to kill yourself like this.
Quattuor res in hoc mundo sanctae sunt: libri, liberi, libertas et liberalitas.
Considering the odds, he should be asking for more Hooters girls, and he should be getting more than beer and champagne from them! No offense to the girls too - they should feel safe making this bet with him. ;-)
And the legacy of his exploits documented in email forwards for years to come...
--
luckily the smashing pumpkins were on hand to tape a moon launch of a rocket contstructed by young kids in a backyard. they put it in a video.
-=tonyt=-
Flying on the thing after a successful test flight is risky. Flying on it before one is just plain stupid.
If he blows himself up, he deserves a Darwin Award not for trying it but for not testing it first.
Go Badgers! -- #include "std/disclaimer.h"
I think there is an award for the first person to manage a flight like this and if he succeeds, he'll get it. I, as an engineer, just can't envision trusting my life to something that hasn't been tested because about 90% of the time, that is a disaster.
Go Badgers! -- #include "std/disclaimer.h"
Hey.. maybe Taco Bell can sponsor this one too like they did with Mir. If a piece of his craft lands on a target, everyone in America will get a free Chihauha. Good marketing ploy. Yo Quiero
That's a really frustrating link. It gives the contents of the issue, and the items look clickable, but there's no content there. You have to buy the print magazine.
This thing has neither big fins nor active guidance. It's going to be all over the sky. As someone else pointed out, putting the exhaust near the top doesn't help stability.
I like how he says he's just going to shoot 32 miles up in the air, then drift back down and land in roughly the same place he took off from. Think he's heard of "wind"?
i'm flattered that you went to the trouble of doing that.
mas cerveza, por favor politically incorrect stu
That would be just spectacular. Home-made rocket survivor. Design, construct, launch, and return safely to Earth and you may be a millionaire.
But, this seems interesting. The mathematics regarding gravity, forces, mass and accelleration are fairly straight-forward, even considering that accelleration isn't constant.
I am highly impressed with the hydrogen peroxide and silver mesh engine. Why isn't NASA using that? And why isn't he working for NASA?
The List of Grievances with Slashdot.
What about support staff? Capcoms and the like? Orbit calculations?
Sounds a lot like the guy who put baloons on his lawn chair and flew up into the sky... in other words, I don't expect it to end up working too well.
It would be cool to land 100% civilian people on the moon, though... but that will cost more than $250k.
Momentum will carry Walker and his capsule up to 32 miles, where he will experience several moments of weightlessness and then begin to fall back toward Earth.
What the hell does "several moments" mean? Maybe 5-10 microfortnights?
Many people called the Wright brothers nuts, and they made their stuff out of bicycle parts.
Both dropped out of High School.
They acheived flight w/o government/public money -- only what they earned via a printing business, then a bicycle shop.
I think he is carrying on a fine tradition where one person with guts can make a big impact on the world.
Treatment, not tyranny. End the drug war and free our American POWs.
See my user info for links.
I am simply in awe of this. I cannot think of anything to say. I have only a tiny fraction of the motivation that this guy must have... I would like to keep my life comfortable, nothing more! I applaud this "Rocket Boy."
The Honeymooners, a TV series from the 50's/60's. The character played by Jackie Gleason, when riled up by his character wife Alice, would threaten to beat his wife with a punch that sent her "to the moon". Of course, this being over 40 years ago, he never actually did it...
I/O Error G-17: Aborting Installation
The best one I've seen is JP Aerospace. Their progress may be slow, but it's steady .. and they're certainly targeting some pretty high altitudes! Hopefully we'll see some information on their May 5/6th launch soon.
I/O Error G-17: Aborting Installation
Check his website at www.rocketguy.com.
Tom the Sigless
I agree, it seems that today, corporations have lost any will to innovate, meanwhile it's the private citizens that make the breakthroughs. Re-useable rockets being one example, but I think solar powered cars are the best way to visualize corporate complacency. I could go out right now and build a working solar powered car... That is, if I had the money to invest, and some company behind me to sell it can defend the patent. But that's a different story.
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
"Then again, he makes toys for a living, he's not your average businessman (his loss)."
I don't see how you can equate him not being a businessman to being 'his loss'. Would you rather be a shrewd businessman, or an extremely talented inventor capable of designing, constructing, and launching your own manned space craft?
I know what I'd prefer.
According to his plans, a pickup truck will be waiting to drive him to a group of bleachers where fans and 12 Hooters bar girls will pour champagne all over him.
Hahaha, sounds to me like buddy has it all worked out.
:-D
The Wright Brothers were from Dayton, OH. I've seen the bike shop there. 'Nuff said.
... but I'm too lazy to read through the three thousand lamers and phreaks to care.
Anyway, I'd like to remind you that when Heinlein's kids went to the moon with a rocket built in their backyard (with an atomic pile in the rocket, I remind you), there were space Nazis up there already. Unless he can sing Deustchlund Uber Alles, he'd best watch out.
(I'm not a Nazi, I'm just warning, that's all. Read some Heinlein and figure it out for yourself.)
Geek Culture killed my dog/
and I don't think it's fair...
io hymen hymnaee io
io hymen hymnaee
hey, you never know, he might be ok.. this isn't rocket science or anythi... oh, hehe...
I might be missing something here (my physics is total crap), but don't all objects accelerate downwards due to gravity at the same rate, regardless of mass?
Not unless they are in a vaccume.
Rate me on picture-rate.com
"and dear god does this website suck now." -- CmdrTaco
Acceleration is the derivative of velocity which is the change in position over time. Acceleration is the change in velocity over time. Every object is pulled on with a force of ~9.8 Newtons, and would accelerate at that rate if there were no other forces But there are (wind resistance). Objects are not 'accelerated' equally by gravity they are pulled equally by gravity. Acceleration is the result of the pulling, not the cause.
Rate me on picture-rate.com
"and dear god does this website suck now." -- CmdrTaco
If he makes it back alive, he'll be starting a Travel service and a Timeshare on the Moon. He could have the remaining cast from Gilligan's Island for spokes-people.
Fight Spammers!
In my freshman year in high school, I did a little research on rocket science, and drew up some plans for a rocket that I figured could do just about what he was planning. Go 30 miles up and then fall back down. But I couldn't realistically go up in the rocket, so I planned on putting in 50 kilos of fireworks and a remote control detonator or something (it ended up being timed because that was easier). Also that way I didn't need parachutes or anything.
So anyway, a few more calculations said that this whole thing would cost me $120000, so I went to a local bank to take out the loan, and we finally made the agreement that I would put their name and phone number on the side of the rocket, and there would be a fairly high interest rate on the thing too. [Lucky for me, this was only a one-branch bank].
Now that I had my money, I set out to build the rocket. It only took me a few months, and I had the whole thing ready to go and everything. I was going to do it after school on a Friday, and the night before, I rented out an entire park with the money I had left, and set the launch up and hid the rocket under some branches.
Unfortunately, one of my friends found out where the rocket was set up to launch, and he skipped school that day and went to the launch site, with the intent to launch the thing without my permission, and to be the guy when the media showed up. Now, as I'm told, when he pulled the camoflage off the rocket, he misaligned the launch platform, and the rocket would now have to resetup for launch. But, being an idiot, he did not know that. So he pressed the launch button on my computer on the other side of the field, and launch it did. Apparently (I was not there to see it lift off, though I did see it in flight from class), the launch was spectacular, and looked much better than the NASA launches. Well, the small launch pad problem escalated to a huge problem during the flight. Instead of flying straight up and exploding, the rocket turned over on its side about 75 feet above the ground and whizzed past all the buildings in the city at speeds that should have been over 1000 mph, and judging by the blast created by breaking the sound barrier, it may have been nearly there.
The rocket barely cleared my school, and knocked most of us on out collective arses, so to speak, blast. Knowing that my friend wasn't in school, and fearing the worst, hoping it wasn't true, but knowing beyond a shadow of a doubt that it was, I ran to the roof just in time to see the rocket's final seconds. I knew the explosives should be going off any second, and the fuel should expire just a moment before the detonation. The fire behind the rocket extinguished, and I instinctively covered my ears, waiting for the (hopefully) tremendous explosion. It was several seconds longer than I had expected, which disappointed me to no end. Until the end of my disappointment, just a few seconds later when the explosives lit off, and basically vaporized 6 city blocks. At the center of those 6 city blocks was the bank that I had gotten the loan from. Everything they had had been destroyed by the explosion. Along with a prison, a police station, and a few office buildings (most of which wasn't my fault, I swear! There was a gas station nearby that also exploded, and that was probably a completely unrelated coincidence).
The only person related to the bank was the owner/manager, who was on his way back from vacation in Montana. What a freakin' loony, on vacation in Montana?? Anyway, someone had managed to take a picture of the rocket in flight, and dead-center in the middle of it sat the name of the bank that blew up, and the phone number. The city blamed the owner of the bank, and sued him for something to do with the millions of dollars of damage that were caused (by him). Since all his records had been destroyed in the blast, he could not prove to them that he had granted a loan to someone else to build a rocket and put his number on it. Of course, nobody believed him, and he was persecuted to the full extent of the law. Either that, or they just gave him a friendly slap on the wrist and told him to run along now.
And that is the story of how I built a rocket destined for space, but instead of going to space, it blew up the financing bank. And the guy who owned the crater which used to be a bank got blamed, while I got off scot-free and laughed all the way to the bank. So to speak.
And then I found fifty bucks.
Lack of eloquence does not denote lack of intelligence, though they often coincide.
Some people don't think attacking someones life's work is a joke.
It's his life to use as he wishes to acheive his dream. Linus only needed to spend a lot of time coding. He was doing that anyway. No big sacrifice needed. This guy is risking his life, because someone needs to go up in this thing and he wants to do it. His dream happens to require that kind of risk. That doesn't make it a stupid idea.
"If I die, I die," he scoffs. "I'd rather die trying this than spend the next 40 years bitter than I never made the attempt."
"Funny, I'd rather live for those 40 years."
He'd rather do somthing significant with his life. You apparantly don't. What's the problem? The only glitch could be the Federal Aviation Administration, which has demanded that Walker produce a flight plan and details of his rocket design before it issues a permit for his launch. "If they are not going to grant me permission to launch, I'll just take the whole thing across the border to Mexico," Walker says.
"Great, and then Tostitos can sponsor the flight. That's all we need: corn chips and salsa raining down in the Pacific instead of Mir..."
How the hell did you come to that conclusion? The article doesn't say anyone is sponsering him at all. And just because he's launching from Mexico doesn't mean a producer of Pseudo-Mexican food would be sponsering the thing and insisting he load his rocket with their products instead of things like fuel. Besides, corn chips and salsa won't damage the Pacific ocean nearly as much as the space slime growing inside Mir.
--Someone somewhere told me (maybe I read it):
Intelligence is knowing what you don't know.
(and by extension learning those things.)
--I wish the guy luck, and the ability to not turn into Tomatoe Surprise.
---
This
well I got a "c" this spring so get out the salt when you read this. At 20 miles there is still be some amount of air, lets us asumme that the gas contaner is empty and it's mass it a lot less than the capsle. The large light gas can will slow down much faster. Think of playing catch with a baseball and an empty coke can. you can throw the can as hard as you want but it will still slow down much faster than the ball. The formula for kenetic energy is KE=(1/2)mv^2 as the two split you can see how most of the mass will stay with the capsle, So it will have a large m value. both have the same speed so v is the same for both. just plug in the numbers and you will see that to start with ( before air is taken in to acount) the capsle will have more energy to keep it going. then gravity and air will slow the tank much faster than the capsle. Any one else want to chime in here
________
Does anyone actually have a Java program designed to control air traffic, or for the operation of a nuclear facility?
Probably why he's using the desert in eastern Oregon. That covers more than half the state... if he crashes he'll create a big dust cloud. that's it.
Ralph Kramden had a LOT more on the ball than this guy. I would sacrifice all my karma whoring points to make this clear. I already un-slashed Jon Katz from my front /. page. Please don't dis the Honeymooners! It was and is the BEST show on television. Thank you.
Any relation to Trolls or their heirs is totally unintentional!
Because hydrogen peroxide is extremely inefficiant and extremely dangerous to handle.
One flake of the wrong kind of substance in the fuel tank and the whole thing blows up. I would rather store my oxidizer seperately from the fuel.
--
Soma: because a gramme is better than a damn.
....Wouldn't it be cheaper to just fake a trip to the moon? Graphic artists are a relative bargain now-a-days with photoshop technology.
Wouldn't Dennis Titto have the altitude record for a private citizen now though?
Check this out!
rocketguy.com
My other sig is also a
"he just wants to have champagne poured on him by Hooters girls."
You say that like it's a bad thing...
A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kick boxing -- Emo Phillips
Maybe "they" should invent a new award called the creationist award which celebrates skilful and intelligent people who kill themselves - Proof that evolution doesn't provide the best of breed necessary to have created the race we are now.
pah!
slyrp
Yes, I did read that paper a few weeks before posting that.
Either that, or the violent reaction will spread his ashes from here to the Gobi Desert.
Waypoint 1: Up
Final destination: Back down
"Due to increased demands on Rocket Guy's time by the media the launch will be delayed until May 2002".
I guess the New York Post is just taking up soo much of his time.
"The universe seems neither benign nor hostile, merely indifferent." --Carl Sagan
First - I share the belief with some others that this story is fake, considering the source. However, if it is true, then I think his chances of survival are tiny.
That said, I think it'd be incredibly interesting to browse through a detailed website showing how he came up with his ideas, what he used to make it, and how and with whom he built it. I want to see pictures of this thing. I'd love to see pictures/video of it blast off (assuming this is all real, of course).
Also, if he had that $250k back in 1990, he coulda easily made $20 million by 1999 with it (with stocks like Cisco and Dell). Then he'd have had a nice cozy ride with cosmonauts for 6 days like our buddy Tito. Then again, he makes toys for a living, he's not your average businessman (his loss).
"The universe seems neither benign nor hostile, merely indifferent." --Carl Sagan
I don't think they /care/ if he's going to blow himself up, as long as he's filed a flight plan so they know /where/ he's going to do it. If it's just him it's not really their biz if it's untested, he has to test it somehow, after all.
Ever get the impression that your life would make a good sitcom?
Ever follow this to its logical conclusion: that your life is a sitcom?
"I don't care about the Constitution!" --Bill O'Reilly, November 17, 2009
Brian Walker's webpage (www.rocketguy.com) gives info about his rocket shows photographs. You can also see some of his other wacky inventions.
Actually, Mr. Walker is likely a brilliant man. He is a self made millionare as an inventor. Although only his toys have been marketable, he's produced some other really cool projects (a recreational hovercraft and submarine) and is taking his project seriously (he has trained as a cosmonaut, flown a MIG fighter, and has been training on a human centrifuge).
In the end, he is going about the project in the correct manor. He's aiming at only 30 seconds outside of the atmosphere and he's using an extremely simple propulsion system. His plan is so simple, it just might work.
I have a shotgun, a shovel and 30 acres behind the barn.
1q2w3e4r5t6y7u8i9o0pqawsedrftgthyjukilo;p'azsxdcf
I have a shotgun, a shovel and 30 acres behind the barn.
1q2w3e4r5t6y7u8i9o0pqawsedrftgthyjukilo;p'azsxdcf
But I'll believe it when I see it.
I'd say the cost of the materials alone would easily exceed $250k.
It'd be cool if the guy poseted to
And as for "moving across the border", I severley doubt that you can pack this up into a truck and move it over the border.
What the hell happened to all these private space projects? The stratospheric skydiving seemed to die out, as did the manned launch to space a while back, they were going out to launch out of the ocean or something.
Perhaps a comprehensive slashback would be cool.
I have a shotgun, a shovel and 30 acres behind the barn.
1q2w3e4r5t6y7u8i9o0pqawsedrftgthyjukilo;p'azsxdcf
I fell out of the chair laughing.
Incidentall, did Nasa have to file flight plans during the shuttle launches? They'd be interesting to see.
I have a shotgun, a shovel and 30 acres behind the barn.
1q2w3e4r5t6y7u8i9o0pqawsedrftgthyjukilo;p'azsxdcf
FAA doesn't approve it. So what? They give him a fine if he makes it down alive. If he doesn't survive they fine his estate?
Waltz, nymph, for quick jigs vex Bud.
The G is for Goddard.
Sounds like a lot of fun. Of course, travelling at "four times the speed of sound" might be a bit more intense than cheering fans and a dozen Hooters girls, but not by much.
Also from the article:
I'm thinking an airbag won't help much no matter how giant it is. Maybe if it just deploys on impact.
.
Anyone can experience weightlessness. Go to your local airport and plop down ~$100 for a plane and pilot for an hour and tell them what you want. I have experienced both zero Gs and 4+ Gs for several seconds in a single engine plane less that 3000 feet off the ground.
I have great faith in fools - self confidence my friends call it. - Edgar Allan Poe
This guy is so my hero if this is not a hoax and he makes it.
Those who can, learn. Those who can't, sit in a classroom.
Funny, I'd rather live for those 40 years.
The only glitch could be the Federal Aviation Administration, which has demanded that Walker produce a flight plan and details of his rocket design before it issues a permit for his launch.
"If they are not going to grant me permission to launch, I'll just take the whole thing across the border to Mexico," Walker says.
Great, and then Tostitos can sponsor the flight. That's all we need: corn chips and salsa raining down in the Pacific instead of Mir...
- I don't care if they globalize against free speech. All my best free thoughts are done in my head.
One thing I keep learning as I get older, there are a lot of idiots with degrees out there,
... the theoretical realm and the practical realm. Historically, the owners of the most brilliant theoretical minds have had quite some difficulty applying these wonderful ideas.
[snip]
My step-father on the other hand can do about anything he wants.
True, although you're comparing two different aptitudes
This does bring up the always intriguing argument about what actually defines intelligence. Currently, one of my favorite definitions is "The ability to relate two unrelated thoughts/items/etc.".
Of all the famous people that we get an Ask _____ about, why not this guy? Seriously, someone from /. should contact this guy and set him up with an interview. By the sound of his intent, I bet he'd be happy to do it. And we could get some great info from him about his attempt (since we realistically might not be able to talk with him AFTER the attempt, God forbid)
------
Let me give you the lowdown
After all, this is rocket science, not brain surgery.
--
Freeper Logic
But if he's unsuccessful think of all the "this is why we don't let the masses do this" fud we're gonna hear from those in charge. Worse yet is if he hurts someone else. The article doesn't go in to what safeguards he may or may not have taken or who has looked over his designs.
I might be missing something here (my physics is total crap), but don't all objects accelerate downwards due to gravity at the same rate, regardless of mass? In which case, if this nutter does get up to 32 miles in his capsule, won't his fuel tank follow him (since both objects are moving at roughly the same velocity, ignoring the minor delta-v imparted during detachment)? Unless, of course, his capsule has boosters (or his tank has retros) we aren't being told about.
Needless to say, this may cause problems of the collision kind when both start falling to earth together...
From a friend who actually knows something:
"if he thinks he can get permission from AST he's out of his mind. And if he thinks Mexico will let him if the FAA says no, he's living in a fantasy world because the first thing the Mexicans will do is call the FAA and ask if they've given him permission to fly and if not, why not."
Aparrantly:
"_Everyone_ has tried to talk to this guy and he won't listen. Yes, he's nuts and he's probably just smart enough to get himself killed."
Mike Massee
The problem currently with manned access to space is simply that in the United States NASA is a monopoly. They have no interest in allowing anyone but NASA to provide access to space. If they did then this would risk NASA's congressional funding. Lets hope if successful this would lead to the break up of NASA's monopoly and by doing so open space to the masses!
:P
--
When I'm good I'm very good, when I'm bad I'm better, But when I'm evil you better run
"GET / HTTP/1.0" 200 51230 "-" "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; Setec Astronomy)"
I severley doubt that you can pack this up into a truck and move it over the border
Why? It's powered by steam and hydrogen peroxide (common for first aid or bleaching hair, and easily aquired at the drug store), and made of steel. I'm simplifying, but the materials sound quite legal, and it doesn't sound to me like it would be classified as drugs, dangerous chemicals, weaponry, or explosives.
Albeit his invention is pretty unconventional, but does someone with experience or from Mexico know if there's actually a Mexican law that this contraption would break? Or once down there, is there a Mexican "FAA" to worry about?
-- New York Times Editorial, 1920
In short, doubt not without a reason. If he splats, at least he tried. Me, I am developing callouses in rather uncomfortable places from sitting in front of a screen all day. Which is a better way to go is open for discussion.
This article previously on slashdot provides a useful prospective. It's interesting to look at where he was then, and how close he is now. I honestly hope it works.... would be nice to see that you can get into space without being an astronaut, or more money than a small country. Just my two cents.
A college dropout who attended just two semesters of engineering school, Walker will be staking his life on how well he has been able to teach himself rocket science.
I'm staying indoors
Well, I may be wrong, but as far as I remember she was a teacher chosen amongst thousands to give some lessons from orbit to eath over video. This is not in the same leage as Tito and this wacko, because she woudn't have funded it herself. She was lucky to be chosen, unlucky to pick the only space shuttle that blew up in history.
Ahhh...the great dumpster continuum. Many a free computer will be found there. -- sowth (748135)
Now all we need is for Sarek of Vulcan to be flying nearby and detect his warp trace. Then the Vulcans will know that we are not primitive for them. (For the Treck illiterate: Xephran Cochran was an amature rocketeer who invented the warp drive. On his first flight Sarek of Vulcan detected his warp train and the rest is history...well maybe not history exactly...)
"Just because I don't care doesn't mean I won't listen"
... a higher opinion of this man's engineering skills and intelligence if he'd planned an unmanned test first.
Bad enough you should ride in a vehicle with untested fabrication. Sheer lunacy to ride in one with untested design as well...
-- AndrewD
A Maze of Twisty Little Laws, All Different.
He was fined by the FAA. A decade later, he killed himself.
From The Los Angeles Times, 24 November 1993 (by Myrna Oliver, Times Staff Writer)
If something can go wrong, it will. That is why I think RocketGuy won't have a smooth ride, either. I wonder what safety factor he's building into his system?
I don't want to shatter his dream, but Dennis Tito became the first space tourist this past week. He paid $20 million to Russia to loft him into orbit.
Another civilian who attempted to go into space, Christa McAuliffe, died aboard the Space Shuttle Challenger in 1986.
Finally, death didn't stop Timothy Leary, Gene Roddenberry, and 22 other space enthuasists. Their ashes were launched into space on April 1997 aboard a Pegaus missile.
Alive or dead, for free or for a fee, civilians have already gone into space.
Just not from their own backyard. Gotta give him credit for that.
Yes, the original poster may not be aware that Autogyros go up because of their forward movement. But that doesn't make the Wright quote any less valid.
It's surprising how many people don't realize that. On the final episode of Junkyard Wars, season 4 (on the cable channel TLC) the two teams built rockets to see who could launch an ostrich egg higher. They both used an accelerometer to trigger their parachute deployment, and both teams, aided by model rocketry experts concluded that when the acceleration drops to zero that the charge should go off because that would happen at the apogee of the flight.
Wrong! The parachutes were deployed as soon as the rocket motors burned out, preventing the rockets from attaining their highest potential altitude given their upward momentum.
That demonstrates nicely that (absent significant aerodynamic drag) a rocket is "weightless" from the moment the engines quit until it either hits the ground or is retarded by a parachute.
Crazy as it may seem, though, I wish this guy the best of luck. NASA and its international equivalents have held the monopoly on space flight for too long. I'll never be a NASA astronaut, but I'd love to be in space at least once in my life. If this fellow makes it back, and others are heartened by his attempt... it might mean the beginning of a whole new era, where not only military men, scientists, and rich people can experience the majesty of space.
"Cut word lines. Cut music lines. Smash the control images. Smash the control machine." - William S. Burroughs
He had a masters in engineering...i don't know the area off hand. But, uh, he couldn't light a pilot light. All one has to do, is like, take off a panel and light the flame. Very small learning curve puck
I mean, come on, just because the guy did not complete a college degree doesn't make him an idiot. It seems too many people are down on this guy just because he doesn't have a degree behind his name. Don't get me wrong, I do find the magnitude and risks of this undertaking quite high. That's a no brainer. But who here is to say he won't pull this off. If its because he has no degree, I say think again.
One thing I keep learning as I get older, there are a lot of idiots with degrees out there, engineers and computer scientists included. I have a neighbor who works for Boeing, has a masters engineering. He supposedly designs the consoles in F15's. This same guy has his pilot light go out a few years ago in his water heater, and had no idea how to relight it! So he came over and ask my step-father, who has no degree, to come over and fix it for him.
My step-father on the other hand can do about anything he wants. I've seen him build computers, write his own programs, fix cars, build cars from scrap, build an in ground pool of his own design, add on to our garage, repair air conditioners and heaters, wire commercial building, and build a network at his work...he's supposed to be the maintenance guy. Did I mention he only had a high school graduation?
Of course there are idiots w/o degrees and geniuses with several, but there is no good correlation (ie. degree=intelligent) that I have noticed in my admittedly short time on earth. Just a lot of idiots that think they know something because they have a degree.
Mr. Walker should be commended for his ambition, its people like this that change the world.
puck
So, whatever government permits a launch from their territory is responsible for any consequences.
Zero Sum (don't amount to much). [root@localhost]
I know Earthstar I isn't the Phoenix, but doesn't this sound like the plot of Star Trek: First Contact ? Amateur guy builds a rocket part. I mean, I assume he's not telling anybody about the warp drive part.
And have you seen it? Half the stuff looks as well-engineered as a carnival ride. And that pod is awfully small-looking. He better bring a sweater.
I can imagine Orville Wright saying the same thing...
"If I die, I die", he scoffed. "I'd rather die trying this than spend the next 40 years making bicycles, bitter that I never made the attempt."
-------
-- russ
"You want people to think logically? ACK! Turn in your UID, you traitor!"
Natural != (nontoxic || beneficial)
Useing an H2O2 as the monofuel and a Silver screen as the catalyst is a bad idea for such a project. I doubt he can get the projected thrust from it for 1 and because it generates massive ammounts of heat if you dont keep the rate down it will actualy melt the silver screen. Useing H2O2 and an alcohol like Ethanol or just about any highly combustable alcohol is best since you then have no limit on thrust, the only limiting factor is how much you can force through the nozzles into the combustion chamber. Im not only a crazy college studen im also the same kinda rocket scientist he is!
Darwin Award, Schmarwin Award. At least he's out there trying instead of sitting around mocking people for expending effort.
"'If I die, I die,' he scoffs. 'I'd rather die trying this than spend the next 40 years bitter that I never made the attempt.'"
Godspeed and good luck, Mr. Walker..
end communication
But if that is not possible, a coffee can spreading his ashes over Yellowstone will do.
If this home-made craft costs only $0.25M then it is in comparison economical. Is this the beginning of some sort of open-source (i.e. 'compile' your own spacecraft) space tourism movement?
What about guidance systems? The thrust will come out at the top of the rocket. An early American pioneer Robert Goddard did the same thing with his early test rockets. The rocket should "hang down" from the thrust like a pendulum. Since he is going straight up in the middle of a large desert there is no need for precise guidance. All he needs is a throttle.
Wasn't there an article on Slashdot (or a link) on Goddard's birthday showing that pendulum guidance just doesn't work?
I have a bad feeling about this...
One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
There's unlikely to be a ball of flame with hydrogen peroxide fuel -- although 90% peroxide can be touchy stuff. (All those oxygen molecules held in bondage, yearning to be free.) He could be savagely bleached!
And a fall from 32 miles won't generate much reentry heat.
Flipping over is quite possible since his pendulum guidance isn't stable.
One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
If your refering to the rocket car Darwin award, here's the true story.
The odds can't be good that the FAA will OK a manned flight of an untested amateur rocket.
The sane thing to do would be to spend another half million to build and launch a couple of test shots. He would have a hell of a lot better chance of convincing the FAA that all was golden after a couple succesful unmanned test flights, and a chance to discover the inevitable design flaws in his complex machine in a less permanant way!
Still, all and all, I have to think it is a good thing that there seems to be a growing civilian intrest in/push for space flight.
If Godzilla did not exist, man would have had to create him.
The tank is large, the drag is great... The Capsule looks rather sleek. (from photots) I assume the two would seperate rather quickly.
Momentum will carry Walker and his capsule up to 32 miles, where he will experience several moments of weightlessness and then begin to fall back toward Earth.
Reporter: Since you've miraculously survived your voyage in Earthstar 1, we'd like to ask a few questions. Looking back on your project, what would you have done differently and what will you do differently when and if you try again.
Walker: (In a body cast) I think I'm going to spend a less time concentrating on those few moments of weightlessness and a little more time packing some reentry parachutes.
The next Slashdot story will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and slashdot the links early!
Seriously, I think this is a testament to how far rich yuppie egos will go. Yes, the guy is 42, not the normal twentysomethings that the dot-comers in that repo article a few days ago are, but his thought process level is just the same, IMO. This is a guy who, just because he "made his own fortune", or is a "self-made man", he suddenly thinks he knows more than all the combined PhD's that GRADUATED COLLEGE at NASA, arguably one of the largest collection of scientific minds ever put together. Screw them, I suppose, all this guy has to do is pick up Rocketry for Dummies and blow a few million the he just has lying around and fly up into space. I say give him the Darwin Award now, an make him fork over his fortune to NASA, God knows the US government isn't. Maybe he can have his name on the module of the ISS where they keep the bathrooms :)
Since I originally wrote what was cut and pasted makes it a little different. It was late on Sunday night and I wanted people to have some facts so why re-invent the wheel?
I didn't put the link in because it was mentioned several times before.
I do have a link for el_guapo to help him believe about who is webmaster for the site.
http://www.rocketguy.com/el_guapo.html
Tito didn't build his own rocket. As Rocket Guy says "Everyone else has gone up in a rocket made by the US or Russia".
The link was mentioned several times before I posted. I was putting a snippet from the site out to get people interested.
Before you judge get a few of the facts straight.
He is NOT going into space. Space starts at 58 miles up. The goal is to go straight up 30 miles. There are no plans for orbit just to set the altitude record for a private citizen. Orbit requires going at least 170 miles up and going 17,000 MPH around the earth. Lots of up and lots of sideways. Going up to a straight up to a stop and dropping back down is different.
The rocket will be fueled by 90 percent pure hydrogen peroxide. It reacts with a silver catalyst screen to produce thrust. This is the same thing the Bell jet belt used. Footage of the Bell jet belt was used in the TV series "Lost in Space" the TV series. This fuel only has about 1/3 the energy of liquid hydrogen and liquid oxygen. That's why it usually isn't used for a rocket. Liquid hydrogen and liquid oxygen are also very dangerous to deal with.
What about re-entry? Since he is going up and not sideways re-entry isn't as much of a problem as going 17,000 MPH and hitting the atmosphere at an angle. It's up, up, up to basically a stall and falling back down with parachutes to slow you down. He is going to have an option to eject and use a conventional backpack parachute.
"I mean, look at all the failures that have happened in both the American and Russian space programs."
:)" This is exactly the meme hypothetical sinister government agencies would want to perpetuate, and one that would be locked in if this little operation is destroyed by sabotage.
If there is such a thing as a sinister government agency that doesn't want to be shown up by single civilian, couldn't they easily trash this operation? There must be quite a few ways to make a rocket blow up that looks accidental. (Lasers were the first long range, hard-to-detect idea that came to mind.)
If anything goes wrong, the common public is going to assume that it's because it was a dumbass idea for civilians to go into space. They'll leave it to massively funded government projects. No one is going to look for tiny laser burns on the peroxide tanks.
"Getting into space is a little more complex than strapping a whole lot of explosives to something, and praying
There's a chance it could fail on its own, but if it were sabotage how would anyone tell the difference? A comprehensive, accurate wreckage investigation would have to be conducted by neutral sources.
We'll see. I hope it works perfectly.
He must not be that big an idiot, he's a millionaire and i'm not. Lots of people do really risky things (like climbing Everest or K-2) but I can't figure out why. I hope this guy did his math right...pure hydrogen peroxide and silver produces quite a punch, if it works it will be a wild ride. -ted
Or is this one going to be the maiden flight?
i have reciently seen an ad that the first person to go into space with a home made rocket will win a 1,000,000 dollar prize and a really neat looking trophy plus a lot of bragging rights. NASA has put up this contest for all of you wanna be rocketteers out there. Hell i'd be there if i had the engineering know how to design something like that.
You moron.
Lets see.
Bill Gates are Larry Ellison perhaps the two most famous uni drop outs. Obviously their life works deserve to be mocked.
He's a multi-millionare due to the numerous childrens toy's he's invented through his own creativity and entrepreneurship. Naturally, that is an "achievement" worthy of mockery.
He's now spent two years of his life attempting to do something only government agencies have previously suceeded at.
If he fails, so what? At least he's acted on his dreams, and not spent his life cutting down tall poppies.
F**k the armchair generals.
Doubtme
There's no $$$ in 'team'...
www..--..net - for incisive, w
Russia was similarly successful in avoiding fungal monikers. Sputnik, however, might be considered only a minor success, mind you, as it makes the mistake of being most easily likened to a sound you make when you sneeze.
What the heck is "To the moon, Alice" from? I've heard that phrase a million times, but I'll be damned if I know its origin. Someone like to fill me in? (I went through this once before with "All your base...")
The coolest voice ever.
-Mark
Dovie'andi se tovya sagain.
http://www.rocketguy.com/rocket/testcap1.html
here's the dude's capsule. *chuckle* *snort* *laugh*
... as the guy from Oldham, who has managed to get two other indivduals to stump up 250,000 GBP each (a married couple IIRC), and who is planning on taking them out up past the 58 mile boundary within a few months?
In the North Manchester (UK) area, there seem to be quite a few of these little projects knocking around.
This line intentionally left here to annoy you.
Flying 32 miles high is not quite getting into space. That's about the altitude of the ozone layer IIRC.
Too bad for the guy, he's going to kill himself trying to not reach space. Why not just go for the extra 150 miles or so, and pass some satelites? Or crash into them, that would be a cool way to die.
-------------------------------------
Be wary of any facts that confirm your opinion.
Darwin awards are for those people who kill themselves for no good reason (other than raising the IQ of the gene pool). Like people who rock a Coke machine to get a free soda and get crushed to death, or people who sit in front of microwave power transmitters to get warm. I could see how getting into space is a fair trade for one's life.
They certainly do file flight plans for the period the shuttle is in the lower atmosphere. They get very big no-fly zones for it, too; I forget the exact number, but they really clear all planes from the area.
and that's all the degree is...3 letters. good to see someone working outside the system.
--how long till the operators are jailed for anime-induced pedophelia and
Without understanding the technical issues, I am giving this guy the benefit of the doubt. He is only going up to 30 miles (the Shuttle can reach 400 miles) and will be weightless for a fairly short time. Reentry is probably a relatively small deal. The price tag seems quite low (a small Cessna costs that much) but then again this isn't exactly space exploration, it's more like manned amateur rocketry.
The Germans also used hydrogen peroxide(H202) as part of the propulsion for the Me163 rocket plane. The fuel was H202 and Hydrazine, pretty toxic all round, but the performance was very good. Unfortunately one of the side affects of the H202 was that when it leaked into the cockpit it dissolved the pilot! Probably handling 90% h202 is as risky as the flight itself.
Personally, I hope the guy succeeds.
Mr Churchill, If I was your wife I would put poison in your tea! Madam, If I was your Husband I would drink it!
I don't know what is worse......if he dies while trying this, or the hoards of "backyard rocket scientist" that will blindly attempt to duplicate this if he is successful.
Given the level of detail in the article, it's actually difficult to make a prediction one way or the other about this particular suggestion -- that the tank and the capsule will hit each other.
The explosives (?) that would be used to detach the tank from the capsule would introduce a difference of both velocity and trajectory between the two objects, which will grow exponentially as the flight proceeds. For example, if you can fashion a charge that will project the tank away from the capsule, you might have a shot at surviving.
That is, of course, assuming you're not consumed in fire prior to liftoff, that your rocket stays stable in its trajectory once you've launched (and doesn't flip over and start heading downward with 12,000 pounds of thrust or explode Challenger-like in a cool ball of flame with little streaming bits of hot metal falling back to the ground), that you aren't crushed by the g-force going up, that you don't suffocate as your capsule decompresses and/or you run out of oxygen in your tank, that your vehicle isn't burned to a Mir crisp on re-entry, that your deceleration chute deploys properly, and that it's big enough to slow you enough so that you're not simply 5,000 pouds of falling steel heading for a rather rude and sudden stop down near the ground.
Interesting story. I ain't climbing on.
Remove the caps and hold to a mirror.
You doubters are all a shame to the title NERDS.. Brian Walker is undertaking one of the most incredible and amazing flights since the Wright brothers. Its shame that you have all been fooled by the corrupt dealings of Governments with endless budgets to spend, pouring there money into massive corporations too glad to spend it. That is why rockets cost so much, if you where at all educated about the history of the modern rockets you would all know that they where developed from ICBMs. They where first designed in the 50s-60s using what was then state of the art materials and technologies, with no concern placed on cost. These technologies are now beyond redundant but still in use because the companies who produce them have there own senators in congress who make sure they always secure the next Government contract. It is for this reason no new companies can enter the market with simpler and more cost effective technologies, ( see the demise of Beal Aerospace the American Rocket Company etc ). Rockets are not some mystical high technology device, they are in fact simpler than an internal combustion engine. And have been designed, tested & refined for the last 50+ years, the problem is that we are still using 30 + year old technology because of the above stated political and financial pressures. Imagine if computers followed this suit we would still be using the 286?? I have been involved in several entrepreneurial rocket ventures, and the design of several rocket systems of various sizes. As well as having over 16 years first hand experience in experimental rocketry, and I can see that Brian's plan is quite solid. And the main reason is because it is simple, a ballistic flight to 30 kilometres in an unguided rocket vehicle. He is using the same type of propulsion that has been proven for many years to power drag cars, as well as established methods of composite airframe manufacturing for the vehicle. I draw your attention to the case of the Voyager aircraft that made history by flying the globe, it was built not by a large corporation but by one man Burt Rutan. He designed, tested and built it for under $7million. GE Aerospace cost model for the same project $700 million, did the voyager fall out of the sky because GE didn't build it for $700 million??? The lack of education in many of the replies here is obvious example " what about support infrastructure, and orbital calculations". First of all his not going into orbit it is a ballistic sub-orbital flight, effectively the same as flying a plane near vertical for a few minutes, in terms of infrastructure his design requires little as it is transported to launch site on a mobile launcher. Once again well proven and sound technology, also with today's computer power a couple of Pentium class computers would be all that is need to test and monitor vehicles systems. As he his vehicle is unguided it removes the need for expensive internal guidance navigation and control systems, which are behind most new launch vehicle failures ( see Ariane 5 first launch ). In fact when we strip it down to basic Brian Walker is launching himself in BIG MODEL ROCKET, and that is why he has as good a chance as anybody launching home made rocket at success. Some real imaginative guy quotes " I hear his got millions, why dosent he just pay the Russians", thats not his goal his goal is to do it by his own hands. Sure and why dont we just let Microsoft write all the worlds software, lets not be pioneers & find better or cheaper ways to things. Meanwhile the rich can go to space for the next 100years becasue nobody else is trying to make affordable space technology. It will be by the efforts of people such as Brian that you and I will get the opportunity to make this voyage, not by government or big business as they have already had 50 years to get us there and they are still no closer. Think about that next time before you so openly bag a pioneer.
Your info is wrong check out www.xprize.org It has nothing to do with NASA first of all. Its 10 million dollars second of all. And thirdly it requires a rocket launch of 3 adults to 100km, with the ability to refurbish and relaunch the rocket within 3 days.
Dude do you even know what you are talking about? He is not going into space, he is not trying to reach orbit. It is a ballistic sub-orbital flight, straight up & down...Just like pointing a gun & firing it into the sky, do you think that bullet goes into orbit? Not likley as an object requires over 7500 KM/hr to stay in orbit around the earth. He is not even leaving the atmosphere, take a look at an Encyclopedia and understand the various regions of earths atmosphere. He is not even leaving the stratosphere. Every day some where on this clobe someone is flying a home made rocket on such a flight, also people are building fiberglass kit aircraft in there back yard. Also people have been driving drag cars, bikes and even rocket packs using Peroxide. Also parachutes are used safely everyday to drop everything from people to millitary tanks.. SO there for we have a man building a fiberglass rocket airshell ( proven tech )powered by Hydrogen Peroxide ( Proven Tech ) & recovered by parachute ( Proven Tech ), why is this such a problem for you to grasp? Also it might help you to learn the difference between sub-orbital and orbital flight, maybe then the idea of what this guy is doing wont seem so impossible to you any more. It obviously challanges your small frame of realities so much, that you are wasting all this time & effort trying to prove why it cant be done. The excellent theory you put together out of snippets of info you found in a Encyclopedia or on the web re: space launching is great except for one thing.. How do you explain space launches from Vandenberg AFB..Isnt that in in California?? No wonder your anonymous