Cell Phones Changing Social Group Communication

Mortimer.CA writes "An interesting article on how cell phones are changing the way people interact and get together in Japan. Some interesting quotations: 'To not have a keitai (cell phone) is to be walking blind, disconnected from just-in-time information on where and when you are in the social networks of time and place.' And the new social faux pas: 'One college student I spoke to described leaving one's phone at home or letting the battery die as "the new taboo."' The article mentions the book Smart Mobs which was mentioned on Slashdot before. I keep thinking how Marshal McLuhan said that our new inventions change the way we view the world. This is 'obvious' now, but was quite a new idea when he thought of it. In the 40s and 50s you "needed" to get a (land line) phone, then it was cars, email, and now cell phones. What's next? Is it simply a matter of keeping up with the Joneses?"

Comments

Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

I mean, not just being around people who use them, but using them myself. The whole idea of having to carry a phone with you is just... wrong. I don't want to be part of one of these groups.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[tigertigr]

I don't know about anybody else, but I like my time alone. I like to know that if I am out for a walk or doing something outside my home, no one (unless they are in my immediate vicinity) is going to interfere with that. I like to multi-task my work, but I don't like to multi-task my play.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[sydres]

I agree totaly but in the field that I hope to end up in (network/security)after college. will probably mean I will need one just to keep in touch with realitysince I probably will be gone all the time

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Evil Adrian]

I think the idea of driving a vehicle around without a phone is just wrong. What if it breaks down or you get in an accident?

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

You do what you have done for about 60 years between common use of automobiles and common use of cell phones - you walk/limp/drag yourself to the nearest house and summon help.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Balthisar]

Why I don't hate 'em, I thought *I* was the strange one for having just disconnected mine. I never used it but for emergencies. It still works for 911 (free, even), and if I need to call someone, it gets on the America's Roaming Network with a credit card. That $6.00/minute once a year will easily make up for the $220/year I was paying.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Sporkinum]

No, you are not the only one. I like being out of touch, though I am not above leaching someone elses phone when I do something stupid like lock myself out of my car. I finally broke down and bought an answering machine though.. cost me all of $3 at goodwill for a nice digital one.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Evil Adrian]

That doesn't work if it is 10 below zero outside, or you are old, or you are in a bad neighborhood (case in point: Bill Cosby's son), or you are on the New Jersey Turnpike...

It's stupid to not have a cell phone in your car.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Alex Thorpe]

I have no desire to carry either a cell phone or pager, even if they were completely free. Anyone needing to reach me can call me at home, and if I'm not there, CallNotes can take a message. I've long considered pagers to be a form of those radio transmitters they tag wild animals with to track them, and I don't want to be tracked. Making a call? I hardly dial out on my phone at home that often, and it's not like there won't be a phone anywhere I go if an emergency comes up!

I use email, sometimes AIM/iChat, and a corded phone with Caller ID. That's all I need.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[TheRaven64]

I personally hate the entire idea of telephones. The idea that when they ring you should interrupt whatever you are doing and answer them just seems impolite. I also don't like talking to people on the telephone due to the amount of information you lose. When you talk to someone face-to-face you get all sorts of clues about what they're thinking from their expression, posture and even their smell. Without these you can miss a lot of communication.

I own a mobile, and often carry it around with me, but it's turned off unless I either need to make a call, or know someone actually needs to talk to me. I try to check my messages fairly regularly, and usually get back to people, if they leave one. I do not regard a telephone as a means of communication, but as a way of arranging when to meet people with whom I wish to communicate.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[TV-SET]

I have no desire to carry either a cell phone or pager, even if they were completely free.

Actually, nowadays, they pay you to carry a cell phone with you. I am one of those paid. And - yes, I am a sysadmin with a 24x7 contract. :)

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[mce]

No you are not the only one.

I work for a micro-electonics research institute. One of our many activities actually is making the implementation of ever smarter and feature-rich cellphones and similar devices ever more easy. Even worse, my very own project is about designing for low power from the system level downwards. One could say we're part of the cell phone companies pipe dreams. (Actually, my project worked closely with one of the major cell phone companies in the past, and now another one is very intersted.) All that just to make very clear that I'm not oposed to the technology for the technology's sake. But neither am I in favour of it "just because".

I will personally *never* be caught having my own cell phone. I will carry/use one if the job that I'm doing at that very moment requires that I be reachable while away from any fixed phone system (which happens maybe once per year), but I flat out *refuse* to give in to the "But sir, you have to be reachable, don't you?" pressure. *I* am the one who decides when and where I want to be reachable. And when I've decided that I'm not to be reached, I will implement that very strictly. Now, I know that one can switch off those buggers when one doesn't want to be disturbed, but that is not the same thing: simply by always carrying that thing around, one creates that expection that one be reachable. Maybe not immediately, but definitely within the hour. People then just assume that they can interrupt your life at any moment, because "Hey, what else (s)he's got that cellphone for, afterall?". Then when you diseble it for more than one or two hours on end, they look at you like you're the bad guy/gall who prevented them from doing something "important" such as telling you they ran into Joe or Mary on the way to the bakery. As if that kind of chit-chat can't wait till next time you really see each other. If by then it's still worthy of being told at all, that is.

Also concerning the "but you have to be reachable" craze: Once upon a time my phone company "discovered" that I use the internet a lot when at home. This is over a plain old dial-up modem, so they figured that "he's got to be reachable, so lets enable our nice (and paying!) mailbox service for him". Now there is some poor helpdesk guy over there who probably still has not recovered from what befell him after I found out what they had done and got in touch to get it disabled again. They charge the person who calls you for leaving the message, they charge you *again* for listening to the recording, and then they charge one of you *yet again* when you finnally do get to speak to one another on the phone? Not with me. Not in a million years.

If all that makes me a social outcast, than so be it.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm with you on this. I have a feeling that we're the future's crotchety old guys who "don't take stock in all this 'mobile communication' hooey".

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[mce]

PS: Sorry about all the typos. I accidently hit the submit button iso the preview one..

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[ornil]

You are not married, are you?

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonvmous Coward]

"I mean, not just being around people who use them, but using them myself. The whole idea of having to carry a phone with you is just... wrong. I don't want to be part of one of these groups."

I don't see what's so 'wrong' about it. A cell phone can be a life saver. Here in Oregon there's been an on-going story about a snow-shoer that got lost on Mount Hood. I bet his family wishes he was carrying a cell phone.

In any case, I can understand the social evolutions of carrying cell phones. When you got a group of people who wants to go do stuff, it's a lot easier to mobilize when the prerequisite is that everybody's home.

Is that wrong? I don't see how. It may be bothersome to you if you've got a large group of friends that insist on calling all the time. But that's the neat thing you can do with a cell phone you can't do with a regular phone, put it on silent. Let the voice mail get it. You really can't do that with a landline for fear of blocking calls to other people who use it.

So no, I don't have the instant "oo dat's bad" reaction to it.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Alex Thorpe]

Heh, not even close.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

Plenty of people have trouble getting service in populated areas, let alone in the mountains. People survived just fine for thousands of years without being reachable 24/7.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[cpt kangarooski]

I agree; I also don't like phones generally.

Personally I make only two types of phone calls -- calling my parents every weekend at a roughly prearranged time, and sometimes calling to arrange an order of take out food.

I don't have a cel, and with the computer online 24/7, it's extremely unusual for anyone to be able to call me at home. I prefer email instead. (in fact, I so loathe real time, non-face to face communication I don't have any sort of IM or chat either)

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[mmckinstUM]

This is a reason I hear a lot for people having cell phones.

Well, what did you and everyone else before you do before they had cell phones? If you car breaks down you can use someone's phone in their house or a phone in a business to call a wrecker. Most people drive in the city or suburbs so it's not like you are miles away from civilization.

If you get in an accident you can use the same strategy. You can also use someone else's cell phone (maybe even the person you hit) to call whoever.

I've found that a lot of the people that have cell phones also have decent cars that aren't going to break down. Usually when you car 'breaks down' it won't start. Usually when you stop you car it is at a place of business or a friends house. For the times when you car is slowly breaking down you can limp it into town or to someones house. There aren't many times when you are driving in the middle of the night, miles from civilization, when you car breaks down (unless it is a horror movie :)).

If your car does break down in the middle of nowhere the it will usually be at least an hour or two before a wrecker will get there.

I drove to from Michigan to Alaska then down to California and back (12,000 miles) without a cell phone. No one had a cell phone, the car did not break down. We were not worried if it did. BTW, the car was about 5-7 years old, were were considering taking my 89 VW Fox before we got the other car.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

what about the people who feel the need to talk while driving. that is stupid. in the past year i have been rear-edned TWICE by people who were too busy talking on the phone to pay attention to minor inconveniences like red lights and stopped traffic.

i've got no problem with carring a phone in case of emergency, but phones and cars, for the most part, don't mix.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[IWannaBeAnAC]

It doesn't work because Americans simply don't trust each other as much as they used to. The very act of flagging someone down on the highway for help is viewed as suspicous, - perhaps you are a car-jacker, or an escaped felon, or even a terrorist!

Unfortunately I can't see any way for this to be reversed, at least not in the short to medium term. The current government is in fact encouraging the attitude of "keep a lookout on your neighbor, regard everything as suspicous".

It is really a shame, I can only hope that other countries don't end up falling down the same path.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[TheGrayArea]

I don't carry one because I want to have time to myself. I don't always want to be found in an instant. I want time to get away. It's nice to know that when I'm in my truck traveling down the highway that no one can interrupt my thoughts or my trip. There's also the issue of keeping your cell number private. Most employers (PHBs) tend to consider your cell number a part of public record just like your home number and demand to have it available. Hey! I don't want work calling while I'm supposed to be off or worse, when I'm sitting on the can.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Lemmy Caution]

It's because I like my time alone that I like my cell phone. My cell phone means that I can largely go about my business in the world and still maintain a lot of my commitments by using the phone. It gives me far more freedom of movement than it takes away freedom from interaction, since my level of interactin is generally a constant, or at least something that I can control more actively.

But my work habits have long been nomadic: I always look for positions and projects that give me maximum mobility.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[NDPTAL85]

So basically you're autistic?

No wonder you don't like OS X's GUI

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

Most people drive in the city or suburbs so it's not like you are miles away from civilization.

It isn't that you _can't_ find a phone, it is just much more convenient to have one with you.

You can also use someone else's cell phone (maybe even the person you hit) to call whoever.

If you hit my car do you really think I'm going to let you use my cell phone?

I drove to from Michigan to Alaska then down to California and back (12,000 miles) without a cell phone.

Good thing, too. The roaming charges might have been an unpleasant surprise.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, a cell phone in the car is never a bad idea. Even if you don't ever turn it on.

That's the #1 benefit I've found. You never have to be stranded if you have your phone.

Even if you own a new car, you never know what can happen.

It's not just about social interaction.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[jgerman]

Ok let's keep going back, before most people had cars everyone walked. So there's no need for cars. God forbid technology comes along to make life easier.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

Or have children?

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[esonik]

This worked as long as it was the only means to get help. The times will come where you will be _expected_ to carry a mobile phone and get your help yourself. When you knock on a door asking for help, people will probably suspect that you are a beggar; "What? You don't have a mobile phone to call help? You are either very strange or a beggar or just lying."
Two years ago, when I called the police to report some obstacle on the freeway, the operator asked for my mobile phone number. When I told him that I was calling from home, he said: "Oh, I was _assuming_ you were calling from your mobile phone. In that case, I need your name and address...". And this was not in Japan. It was in a European country and it was two years ago.

Don't we all realize how - with the increasing ability to always get in contact with our friends - the people directly around us get less and less important? They _have_ to get less important, because we can and do now spend more time to communicate with our friends (the people we already know). Consequently, we cannot spend that time with people around us that we do not know yet. For example, if you get bored on subway you call a friend or send him/her messages, while in previous times the only option was to talk to the the stranger on the next seat (thus possibly making a new acquaintance). Not that talking to strangers in a subway was something we did regularly. In that context, isn't it remarkable that the more people are around us (city vs. small village), the less common is it to talk to people you don't know ?
I find it more and more difficult to make new acquaintances because the reasons to talk to people I don't already know are vanishing...You are not expected to do it - next step is: you are expected to not do it.

Of course, all this has consequences: If your friends are spread out throughout the country (and this is only a matter of time), transport will become more important...not _less_ important as some have predicted for the age of connected world. But this a different story...

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Azure_Reis]

The thing is, you don't understand the nature of the Japanese. Where confucian values reign supreme and the youth are brought up to revere group structure, being out of touch can be a BAD THING (TM). The reason for the social change among the Japanese is because the language is heirarchical; the honorific form, which is used to separate people of different ages and different levels of power, is not used on the phone. Things are more casual and you don't have to defer to those about you. It's part of a process of social evolution that is going on in Japan because of the youth.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

You are looking at it the wrong way: the *force* you to carry it.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[esonik]

The idea that when they ring you should interrupt whatever you are doing and answer them just seems impolite.

It _is_ considered impolite _especially_ with mobile phones. The article also mentions that before people make an actual call, they send messages to find out whether the partner can be interrupted. The fact that calling somebody on a mobile phone is such an intrusion makes it necessary to "warn" the partner. Thus, phoning somebody get's more complex...Weird, isn't it?

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[cpt kangarooski]

No, I just don't like talking on phones. It's not that I can't or that I don't; it's just distasteful and something I try to avoid because I don't like it. Sort of how I don't like raw tomatoes either, so I don't eat foods containing them. It's entirely a personal preference.

Chat (be it talk, or IRC, or IM, or whatever the hell it is that people use these days) I avoid more because I fear that I'd waste a huge amount of time there. Slashdot is bad enough for me. Chat would just be a problem I don't need.

And at any rate, I prefer communicating with people at my own pace, when I feel like it. As the previous poster mentioned, it's annoying to feel like you have to pick up a phone because it's ringing, etc.

OTOH in real life, I'm fairly chatty at least with people that I know well enough to strike up a conversation with.

Now: what the hell does all of this have to do with OS X? Because I haven't got the slightest clue unless it was some utterly stupid, miserable failure of an insult.

Don't they teach kids good insults anymore? E.g. you like to lick the ass of a leper; that's a decent insult. This autism crap, that's just no good.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, about two years ago, I needed to call my son to get some info on something I was buying him. It took me an hour to find a working payphone, and this in a busy shopping area.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Rip!ey]

I will personally *never* be caught having my own cell phone ... *I* am the one who decides when and where I want to be reachable.

Personally, when I don't want to be reached, I turn mine off.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Psiren]

I like to know that if I am out for a walk or doing something outside my home, no one (unless they are in my immediate vicinity) is going to interfere with that.

So, turn the phone off. I'll bet you'll wish you had one when you fall and break a leg out walking, miles from any form of contact. It has happened numerous times, and mobile phones have often been the only way to get help. Don't dismiss it just because you can't figure out how to turn one on and off.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[cyb97]

Bringing a mobilephone when you go skiing/hiking/some-non-nerdy-activity creates a sense of false security.
Lots of people plan in advance to call somebody when they get to their destination to discover they've run out of battery or the signal is too weak to place a call all this of course leading to relatives etc. jumping the gun and calling emergency services just becase somebody didn't call as planned...
It's dangerous placing too much trust upon your mobilephone...

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[jproudfo]

This may be the western view of cell phones, but isn't true in many parts of Asia. When I was working in Hong Kong it was considered rude if you weren't always available on your mobile phone. In fact, it was a regular occurance to get interuppted in a business meeting with multiple mobile phones ringing and conversations going on.

Just because this may be the acceptable norm in your part of the world, doesn't mean it's like that everywhere else.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[goofballs]

*I* am the one who decides when and where I want to be reachable.

you can only do that if you have a cell phone! with one, you can turn it on or off, screen calls via caller id, voice mail, etc. without a cell phone, how do you decide to be reachable when you're not home?

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[jproudfo]

This may be rue in your part of the world (the U.S.?), but it isn't true in many parts of Asia. When I was working in Hong Kong it was considered rude if you weren't always available on your mobile phone. In fact, it was a regular occurance to get interuppted in a business meeting with multiple mobile phones ringing and conversations going on.

Being from Canada, I found it rather annoying. But, when in Rome...

I guess my point is that just because this may be the acceptable norm in your part of the world, doesn't mean it's like that everywhere else.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Jim Morash]

In the White Mountains in NH, hikers are discouraged from bringing cell phones because they make you feel safer than you are. The NH state legislature recently passed a law that says you have to pay all expenses if you get lost in the mountains and need a rescue - and that's assuming the weather clears up enough for them to come get you! Otherwise, a cell phone is just a way for them to listen to you freeze to death.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[jproudfo]

Oops... I hit the 'Submit' button instead of 'Preview'. Sorry.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[MerlTurkin]

You're not the only one. I don't have one and I have no intention of ever getting one unless they do away with standard telephones. It amazes me how many people now have cellphones. Every person I talk to about them say they got it for "emergency use". Riiiiight. I see moron students in college leave a class to go into the hall to answer their phone and shoot the crap with their buddy or girlfriend. If I'm a teacher I break their phone on them if it isn't an emergency call. It's total nonsense. I see these morons talking in grocery stores, malls, you name it their talking on them. I heard Larry Fishburn in the middle of his play heard a cellphone go off and told the person to "Shut the F&*king cellphone off". Several broadway actors have had to do the same thing. I think these people need to be beaten senseless. Wait, they're already senseless..... Just once I'd like to see someone grab another's cellphone and smash it to smithereens. I'd applaud.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[JesusPGT]

I personally love my cell phone. I pay a reasonable rate, and with that I get nationwide calling and wireless internet. This is so much better than having a land line that I actually don't bother wasting money on one. As it is, I don't have to worry about any stupid long distance charges or anything.
And if I don't want to be reached? Simple, mine has this awesome feature called a power button, it actually lets me turn the power on and off. Amazing! But then again, I don't have friends that try to call me for inane reasons, so a simple solution could actually be to stop being friends with phone-happy idiots.

In conclusion, my cell phone is like having a more useful and versatile home phone, and I love that fact.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[NDPTAL85]

lol I'm just messing with you.

Aren't you one of the guys who hates the OS X Aqua GUI compared to the old Platinum Classic Mac OS GUI? If not then I've mistaken you for someone else.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[xigxag]

That doesn't work if it is 10 below zero outside, or you are old, or you are in a bad neighborhood, or you are on the New Jersey Turnpike...


So for those few Americans who are driving from their jobs at a Newark crack den on their way home to their Buffalo retirement communities in the dead of winter, then yes, I'd absolutely recommend they carry a cell phone at all times.

For everyone else, having a phone seems rather optional, and perhaps even a liability. I'd wager that far more people have been killed by bringing their car phones than by leaving them home.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[jazman_777]

Well, what did you and everyone else before you do before they had cell phones?

They died of exposure or loneliness or worse. Same argument about not wearing seat belts. The ones who got killed aren't around to talk about how "we drove around with 5 kids in the back just bouncing around, and nothing happened to us!"

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[DennyK]

I do have a cellphone for emergency use. It stays off unless I am making a call, and I never check my voicemail on it, because no one who knows the number calls me, because they know I don't keep it on.

Actually, I probably won't have it much longer; I haven't made a call on it in about six months now, and I'm probably gonna pick up a prepaid cell phone somewhere and lose the monthly fee.

DennyK

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Bad_Feeling]

Imagine looking for a job and applying at a dozen places. I wouldn't want to be trapped at home waiting for the landline phone to ring, when i can just publish my cell number, and free my self to do whatever i want while waiting for that important call.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Bad_Feeling]

Ever heard of a vibrate feature? They can contact you, and if you don't want to pick it up well nobody the wiser. Someone earlier mentioned something about this new fangled power button thing as well, which could be useful during, say, a funeral.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[jazman_777]

I personally hate the entire idea of telephones. The idea that when they ring you should interrupt whatever you are doing and answer them just seems impolite.

You don't have to be a slave to the phone. I just ignore it when I'm not inclined to answer. It's quite easy.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Lebrun]

I totally agree with you. I live in a country with many cell phones (close to 46% of the population has one or more), and I have felt some pressure to get one. Since I find the telephone in general annoying, I found this concept of portable annoyance much more irritating. Thus so far I've resisted to buy one.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[pyrote]

A Cell phone with good coverage is a must if you enjoy your privacy. Before I had to stay at home waiting for calls, work AT home or at work. Now I can use my palmpilot and CE clamshell and have my whole office anywhere I desire, generally in the mountains or elsewhere.

I can give my family more of my time because I can conduct business as it happens instead of 8 hours a day and cut off. A quick incoming call, break out the palm, set an appointment, get back to the family.

I wouldn't be without it now. Heck I don't even shut it off at night for fear of missing a morning call (I'm good at picking up and sounding like I've been awake for hours).

As for the "my time" issue, thats waht caller ID is for :)

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[SN74S181]

There's an inherent almost fascism in the obligation many people feel to pick up a ringing phone. It's conditioned into us. Some of that conditioning broke down when Caller ID came into existence, because people could screen calls.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[mce]

People who have a need to get in contact with me generally know one or more of my e-mail addresses. When I explicitly need to be reachable by phone, I stick around one, be it at home, at work, or wherever else, and make sure that those who may want to get in touch and that I am willing to hear from know where I am. Also, anybody who has good enough a reason to "invade" my use of my time at the weirdest moments, can always call back (half) an hour or so later if they didn't get hold of me the first time. And as I wrote already, I will carry a cellphone when I consider that to be useful. But that's a rare occasion for which I refuse to buy my own that I then "cannot get rid of anymore". I strongly prefer e-mail (or, of course, direct face-to-face communication) over using the phone.

You see, the problem is not about needing devices to be reachable. The problem is people assuming that everyone has to carry these devices anyway and thus is - and by illogical but very commonly used extension has to be - "permanently" reachable, which they consider to be A Good Thing. Well, it isn't one.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[SN74S181]

Yeah, and then they call you when you're totally unprepared, right after that f*cker cut you off in traffic on the interstate.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[cpt kangarooski]

No, I'm basically that guy. But to be more precise:

It's not a matter of Aqua v. Platinum, though there are some issues along those lines regarding space efficiency, visibility, color perception, etc.

UI is basically about _behavior_. OS X, even if it looked just like MacOS, still would behave differently.

Which isn't a defense of MacOS -- it should've been put out to pasture gently no later than 1995 or so. Just that OS X is a step backwards. MacOS has the best UI ever commercially available, and it wasn't very good. Sadly, no one is managing to get anywhere near to topping it; certainly not Apple.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[duck_prime]

Bringing a mobilephone when you go skiing/hiking/some-non-nerdy-activity creates a sense of false security.

This is starting to sound like special pleading against cell phones. Sure the cell phone can break, in which case you're no worse off than if you didn't bring it. I like to have a cell phone while driving, so that when the car breaks down I can call AAA.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

You totally missed what he's saying. People will do stupid things, things they wouldn't otherwise do, when they feel safe doing them. Someone without a cell phone might think "I shouldn't wander off the path here because I'd have no way to contact someone" while someone with a phone might think "I may as well go where I want, I can always call for help if I get lost."

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[crux6rind]

or maybe you just dont have enough friends to legitimize having a cellphone. seriously, i own two cellphone. one for work related calls, the other for friend and girlfriend. none of those interfere with my being alone when i wanted to. i just simply ignore the calls when i dont want to be bothered. no problem. and when the real emergency calls like an SMS tellin me that some relatives died or had an accident or something like that, i would know instantly. wether i want to do something about it or not is entirely my decision to make.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[BJH]

Let me call "bullshit". If it's your boss or a client, you'll use polite language whether you're on the phone or talking to them face-to-face.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[lvdrproject]

I can see where you're going. Personally, though, it's not using them or being around people using them that i hate, but rather a specific group of people using them that i hate (using the word loosely). In my school (i'm in high school), every single student that i've come across, from 7th grade to 12th grade, has a cell phone. I have yet to meet one that doesn't. And they all whine and cry about how they're not allowed to have phones at school, and how they need them for safety and emergencies and all kinds of other bull shit, but in fact they only use them for calling their drop-out boyfriends in study hall. And they all have "lists" (or whatever you call them) with like a hundred persons on them. The size of one's cell phone list is the equivalent of one's penis size at my school. It's really fucking sickening, i think. Anyway, i hate people like that. Heh.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yea, not enough friends, or as a previous poster pointed out, not being able to turn the power off or on.

You say that it is your decision if you want to do something about a message. The truth is that some people are not in a position to make such a decision. If I get a call from the company CEO at 8:00 while I am eating dinner, I have to answer. If the VP of sales calls with a stupid computer problem, I have to help him.

I know that you think that my job is help desk, and I should expect such, but my job has nothing to do with fixing computers; I am a programmer.

The point is that companies use cell phones to leash employees, and it is no way to treat people.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Mark (ph'x)]

Modern communication is about intrusion. Irritating impatient rings. "Youve got mail!". "Drop whatever you are doing, this _might_ be more important!"

I have a mobile, but when I'm doing something with friends I have it on silent. If someone calls then I see whose calling and then I make the decision to answer it, or call them back later.

I dont mean any offence when I cancel your call, I just am not in a position to rudely drop all my other interactions.

Text messages are nasty... a pet hate is people that ask me questions via SMS. "Hey does a P4 work with a Uber-2 motherboard?" What? You expect me to pay 20c to answer your question? Call me ffs!

There was an interesting artical here a while back on the Amish and their views on technology. I cbf looking for it, but they are not techno-phobes, they just examine the tech to see if it will intefere with their way of life and their community.

Remember though... You dont HAVE to answer a ringing phone. You can call back later.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[cmallinson]

It's stupid to not have a cell phone in your car.

I totally agree. I'm not sure about the U.S. or the rest of the world, but in Canada, even an inactivated cell phone can call 911. The cell company has to let the call through, whichever network picks up the signal. Whenever someone I know gets a new cell phone, I tell them to take their old one, and put it in their glovebox with a car charger. That way if anything happens, there is always a phone to use.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[cmallinson]

Sounds like a whole lot of trouble on your part to resist a technology that would allow you some more freedom. Why would you prefer to have to "hang around" a phone?

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[cmallinson]

Hey! I don't want work calling while I'm supposed to be off or worse, when I'm sitting on the can.

If you haven't pitched a proposal to a VP on a conference call while sittin' on the thrown - you haven't tasted freedom.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

I agree with this. 8 months ago I worked at a major computer corp, requiring a BlackBerry 2way pager, a Nokia Cellphone, a personal Cellphone, and a wireless modem to a laptop carried at all times, 24x7. Even when taking vacations I would be required to have at least the personal cellphone on at all times in case something happened to the servers, and god forbid I didn't have the wireless modem and laptop within arms reach. You have any idea how hard it is to go backpacking with a laptop, 2 cellphones, big bulky pager and a wireless modem just so they can get ahold of you when they need you? Or Even worse...Mothers funeral, had to take time off, turned phone off, got reamed because network went down and I was unreachable.
At one point I believed cellphones/pagers was a necessity in life, some way that SOMEONE always just in case needed to get ahold of me. But after the big dotcom layoffs (I was one), I moved away from the big city into a small town where I am a very happy NON owner of any cellphones, pagers, 2way pagers, wireless gunk, nothing. I am still heavy into technology and all that, but no more leashes forme.
If someone needs to get ahold of me they can call my house and leave a message.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

Your not alone. I really don't have a need for one and I'm not important enough to be indispensable.

Sign a contract with a telcom to or pay termination fees? Yeah right. I love (insert telcomco. ) so much I'll pay you no matter how you treat me.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Helvick]

Am I the only (one) that finds it hilarious that the technophile ubergeek culture that is Slashdot seems to be overwhelmingly afraid of a technology that has thrived by being accessible to the masses.

The idea that a cell phone is a status symbol is well and truly dead, at least in those parts of the world where people have been given the opportunity to avail of them and haven't been afraid to embrace change. In most of the developed world and much of the developing world they are a universal technology because they are cheap and manageable. They have grown the base market for telephony enormously by making phones truly personal devices that anyone can own.

The topic of the post was about the social change it has brought about in Japan but the same applies here in Western Europe too. Social groups can coordinate quickly and much more efficiently when you can simply and reliably get information into the group any time you want. With things like send to many SMS texts it is very easy for a social group to coordinate and decide to do things without running around in circles trying to get information to people who aren't near their usual land line phone. Individuals in the group can stay involved without having to put up with the intrusiveness if they choose, something that is difficult or impossible with a land line phone.

The arguments against mobiles all seem incredibly luddite, a bit like the engineers of the early 70's insisting that calculators were terrible things that couldn't compare with a good slide rule.

And anyone who still insists on raising the "safety" issues. Unproven and extremely unlikely to ever come close to the safety problems that plague our favourite technology of the last 100 years - the automobile. I'm happy to take my chances with both.

I like my phone - it fits in my pocket and no-one else has to see it or hear it. I no longer wear a watch because my phone has a good network sync'ed clock. I don't need a separate pda (not that I ever had one) because my phone is one. It goes over a week between charges. I can sort of browse the web with it if I'm stuck somewhere boring with nothing to do. And I can be contacted wherever I am if I need to be (and most importantly) if I want to be. The choice is mine - and I like that

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Gossy]

The idea that when they ring you should interrupt whatever you are doing and answer them just seems impolite.

When somebody comes over in the office to talk to you, they're normally interrupting whatever it was you were doing before!

I also don't like talking to people on the telephone due to the amount of information you lose.

Sure, you lose a lot of information, but you lose even more by not talking to the people at all who want to get a message to you (or just if they want to chat).

I own a mobile, and often carry it around with me, but it's turned off unless I either need to make a call, or know someone actually needs to talk to me.

I've got a friend who does this, and it's unbelievably frustrating. Most of the time he has his phone off - nobody can ever get hold of him. Sometimes it can wait, other times it can be really quite important - how on earth are you supposed to predict when people actually need to talk to you?

If you're in a meeting, turn the phone off, or at least on vibrate. If someone calls you just divert them to voicemail if you really can't talk, but I don't think you can always assume that just because their call wasn't pre-planned, that it isn't important.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[TheGrayArea]

:-) Hmmm... Makes me wonder if some of the stuff management proposes is what they pull out of the throne before flushing.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[domebot]

OMG!!! When did they remove the "off" switch on cell phone????

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[jo42]

Yes, wonderful. But you would probably drive better if you had that cell phone stuff up your ass - sideways. Humanity has survived for thousands of years without cell phones - now we can get along without them? Geeze, you have been suckered in by modern marketing. Around here, the local cell phone companies think their customers are either dogs (Fido) or monkeys (Telus).

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[mce]

I don't "prefer" to hang around phones. I prefer other things in life that more or less automatically make me be near a phone when needed. Note the "when needed" bit.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[m3000]

I can give my family more of my time because I can conduct business as it happens instead of 8 hours a day and cut off. A quick incoming call, break out the palm, set an appointment, get back to the family.

But that's what bothers me about cell phones. I don't want to be interrupted when I'm with my friends or family. I don't want to be in the middle of telling someone a story and then go "just a sec, gotta check the cell" I know if I ever got a cell phone it would be off most of the time, and only on when I was specifically expecting a call.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[m3000]

As for as the police thing goes, it was probably because you called about an obstacle on the freeway, so she assumed you had just passed it and was reporting it then. If I see something in the freeway, I'd assume that in the 15 minutes it took me to reach home, someone else would have called it in already on their cell and I wouldn't bother. So I think her assumption was completely justified.

Other than that, I agree with your thinking. It amuses me at the people I see who HAVE to always talk to their friends the minute they get out of class or as soon as they're alone. Heaven help them if they had to walk alone or strike up a conversation with a stranger.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

You missed the point. The point is that you wouldn't even be telling that joke, because you'd have to be at the office.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Anonymous Coward]

Not just the gov't... the media inspires us to fear everything. Media needs an overhaul... gov't too.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Erik Hollensbe]

This is pretty close to the way I handle it.

Personally, I'd rather not have a mobile at all, but work requires that I do, so I make the most of it.

I like SMS for the fact that I can get a quick answer out of someone (if they choose to answer) without making a giant interruption out of thier current situation.

Commonly, a text message of "NWN?" will be shared amongst myself, two co-workers, and a mutual friend of ours. Generally we don't respond unless we're up for playing. "Beer?" is also applicable, but not as often (thank god :).

SMS is nice, but I'll find that if I have something that's going to be expressed in more than 3 words, I'd rather just call them.

One thing that I hate more than anything is getting called in the car, TELLING the other person that I'm in the car, and they don't care. I don't live in a large city anymore, so car time is generally pretty short, and I can call you back when I get OUT OF THE CAR, DAMNIT! :)

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Cro Magnon]

What did I do before I had a cell phone? I drove with smoke pouring out my car, praying I got to safety before something blew up! And though something like that probably won't happen with my current car for a very long time, there's many other things that could happen. Yes, I survived for years without a cell phone, sometimes in crappy cars, but I had some tense times where I wished I had a cell phone.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[Jonny Ringo]

Actually they had horse power. Which I would prefer. Sure, your ass will be sore at first, but man your transportation will have a lot more personality then any Honda or Ford. Fuel will cost less to. Just let them go graze, or feed them some hay. You don't have to import hay from Saudi Arabia.

Or maybe I'm just a big fan of westerns.
I'm your huckle berry.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[esonik]

I think the vibrate feature is essential. It's a shame that so many people don't use it. It's even more a shame that so many people don't bother to change the default ring melody and/or have the ringing volume set to the maximum. OTOH, the situation is improving - it was worse one or two years ago.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[esonik]

It's also not true in Japan, as we can read in the article. Nevertheless, it is interesting to hear that the people in Hong Kong value the time of somebody calling on the phone more than the time of somebody that they have put some effort to meet personally.

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[AyeRoxor!]

Dammit, grandpa. I said stay off my computer!

Re:Am I the only that hates cell phones?

[pyrote]

since it was an ANON, I'll repeat it with a score. he has a point.

by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 09, @08:10PM (#5473736)
You missed the point. The point is that you wouldn't even be telling that joke, because you'd have to be at the office.

gotta remember this is a japanease

[Archfeld]

article, They are technology crazed in a way most westerners can only begin to imagine. I used to think I was a techno geek, until I went to Japan. Now I feel like a luddite sometimes. The devices and the infrastructure are just not here in the west.

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[Anonymous Coward]

Depends on the western country. In 2001 95% of 15-24 years Finns had a cell phone. Not having one naturally disconnects you from other to some extent.

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[tjansen]

It's not much different in Europe..

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[Archfeld]

true, there may be 'many' of them, but not having been to Finland, I can only ask does their society revolve around the device ?

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[Izeickl]

True, heh Americans tend to forget that although their not as popular in America, their as common as muck in Europe and Asia, and thats a bloody big market!

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[Wee]

At the university in Southern California where I work there are a lot of Asian students. I'd say they aren't much of a minority. It had been a while since I was in college, so I was fairly surprised at all the changes in the students when I starting working here last year.

I'd say, safely, that your odds of finding an Asian student not carrying (or more likely, not actively chatting away on) a cell phone are about the same as being struck by lightning while being bitten by a shark.

Every Asian student has a cell phone, and they all use them when walking around. I'm serious. You won't see many students walking between classes unless they have a cell phone nearby. You'll even see groups of three, four, six girls walking together... all talking on their phones. I swear they are actually talking to each other.

When I was in school nobody had a cell phone. Now everyone does. It's amazing what ten years can do. I liked it better the old way. Then again I usually leave my cell phone in my truck, and it's never turned on anyway.

-B

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[Ami Ganguli]

It's not so much that society revolves around the device, it's that people assume that you'll be reachable regardless of location.

So if I'm meeting somebody downtown, I won't necessarily specify an exact time or place. Just before I leave I'll send a text message giving a time estimate, and then when I arrive I'll send another to say where I can be found (or to determine where I can find my friends).

If somebody didn't have a mobile phone then I probably wouldn't see them as often. It would just be too much hassle to plan ahead.

Of course, that's very much hypothetical. I've lived in Finland for a year and a half and I've never met an adult Finn without a cell-phone.

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[The Cydonian]

Ten years? TEN years? Two years back, you couldn't have called for rickshaws in India using cellphones. Now you can.

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[Anonymous Coward]

God, tell me about it.

People take absolute spazzes if you let your cell-phone battery die out here.

Also, some people are actually taking it as an insult that I don't have the money to get my phone back on-line, because I have to pay through the nose for my food. The kicker is that these people live in the same house with me. If they're too lazy to climb up the stairs, they can just ring the doorbell, since they're on ground floor anyway. Hell, that has video capabilities built in. It's not like I can leave the house anyway when my balance comes to about $8 American.

Ok, my entirely personal and subjective rant is over. Sometimes we all need to vent.

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[Archfeld]

I've got a blackberry, a nextel and a bloody pager and I LIVE for the brief periods in which I can shut them ALL off and BE unreachable. I honestly think that if work did not require them I would have NONE of them and still be very happy, but then I screen my calls on my unlisted home phone as well :) I must be a throwback or somthing...Archie

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[Ruddygore]

It's not so much that society revolves around the device, it's that people assume that you'll be reachable regardless of location.

Interesting. One of the reasons I prefer cell phones to the point of now using one as my regular phone is that I have precisely the opposite experience: people expect not to always be able to reach you on your cell phone. They expect that sometimes it'll be off, or in the next room, or you could be in a no-service area, or you could be driving in traffic and not feel comfortable answering the phone, or you could just be busy (since it seems that ignoring a cell call because you're busy is acceptable, while a landline call is expected to interrupt anything you're doing). If I ignore a call on my cell phone, no one thinks twice about it. If I ignore a land-line call, I'd better not have been home.

But maybe I just know strange people. I have literally never sent anyone an SMS message, nor received one.

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[Ami Ganguli]

The cell networks in Finland are _very_ good. You can get signal almost anywhere. Even the metro stops have signal (although that doesn't always extend the entire distance between the stops).

But there's no feeling, as near as I can tell, that you have to respond to a phone call if it's inconvenient. And really you don't make a voice call unless you think the other person wants to talk to you. SMS is much more discreet so you can send it any time - even if you think the other person might be sleeping.

I actually never bothered to get a land line when I moved here. I don't have much use for it. None of the 20-somethings I know have land lines in their homes.

Re:gotta remember this is a japanease

[GregWebb]

We're not as bad as the Japanese but pushing it.

I tend to scare myself when I do the maths on the value of kit I'm carrying. Pretty much everywhere, I'm carrying my phone (Motorola T250, not available any more :-( but used to cost £150ish) and Psion 5mx (cost me £200 and tended to retail ata bout £300). Quite often there's the digital camera (Fuji 2800, £250), too.

When you start adding in clothes, glasses etc it gets worrying!

Disruption

[prof187]

By sending messages like "Can you talk on the phone now?" or "Are you awake?" text messagers spare each other the rude awakening and disruption of a sudden phone call.

Wouldn't it wake them up just as easily from the phone ringing when getting a text message as it would if they just got a phone call in the first place?

Re:Disruption

[jbrayton]

That line caught my eye also, but in a different way.

When my phone vibrates and I don't feel able to talk to the caller, I just don't answer my phone. Although I could answer the phone and say "can't talk now", I would feel rude doing that. So, instead I don't answer -- which is arguably equally rude.

But regardless of the interruption, at least the text message *asks* if the person is available to talk. Even if the person just calls, starting the conversation by asking "is now a good time for you to chat?" just seems very polite. Would be a good practice for those of us in the U.S.

We'll see who's laughing...

[Quaoar]

...when everyone in Japan ends up with a mysterious head cancer.

Re:We'll see who's laughing...

[Anonymous Coward]

If that would result in your laughter, you have one twisted sense of humour.

Re:We'll see who's laughing...

[SlashdotLemming]

Don't worry, they'll adapt.
Brain tumors will become a new fetish.

Re:We'll see who's laughing...

[JDWTopGuy]

You might be right, considering eating (possibly) poisonous fish is an "extreme sport" over there.

Re:We'll see who's laughing...

[duck_prime]

...when everyone in Japan ends up with a mysterious head cancer.

Yeah, but at least all their friends will know how to get 'em a condolence message. They won't have to guess which hospital, look up the front desk number, etc etc...

Re:We'll see who's laughing...

[trash eighty]

i personally would not find millions of people getting cancer funny but maybe thats just me.

New necessity

[nadadogg]

It is a new common assumpion that everyone has a cell phone. Thanks to digital networks, it is affordable to even the average joe to be connected at all times. They have long since eclipsed pagers as "the thing to have", making them, in some situations, more of a status symbol than as a way to stay connected. Pagers were at one time seen to be something carried by drug dealers and doctors, but never so with cellphones. This is probably due to the fact that everyone likes to have conversations, talking or by messaging. This trend is only going to continue, and get bigger and badder, hell, even smaller as well. I think that sums it up for me.

Re:New necessity

[BrainInAJar]

"This trend is only going to continue, and get bigger and badder, hell, even smaller as well. I think that sums it up for me."

Smaller? God, I hope not. as it stands right now, my cellphone is smaller than my keychain or wallet. If it gets much smaller I'm going to be dropping it my ear canal accidently and have to go to the hospital. How embarassing would that be? "Uhh... I slipped and my cellphone's lodged against my eardrum. Please take it out"

Re:New necessity

[Anonymous Coward]

This trend is only going to continue, and get bigger and badder, hell, even smaller as well.

Well, praise Prophet nadadogg and halleluya! Glad to see you've covered all your bases.

about letting the battery die

[adamruck]

well... Ive done a little reading on rechargable batteries, and ive always heard that to make the battery charge last the longest, your sapposed to let the battery drain all of the way, then fully recharge the battery, another words letting the battery get half dead, then charge it up, would be the worst thing to do for it.

Can someone please correct me if Im wrong?

Re:about letting the battery die

[repsychler]

It's not as important with newer batteries like Lithium ion as it was with NiCads.

Taboos through the ages...

[$$$$$exyGal]

Taboos through the ages:

• 14,000BC - Eating your dead parents.
• 1200AD - Using your left hand to wipe your butt and eat your berries.
• 1690AD - Having sex with your parents.
• 2003AD - letting your cellphone battery die.
• 2015AD - having 3d virtual sex with your parents.

Re:Taboos through the ages...

[Anonymous Coward]

Shouldn't answering the damn phone in the theater have been taboo before letting the batteries die? WTF!?

Incidentally, sex w/ the folks has been taboo at least since Oedipus.

Re:Taboos through the ages...

[Anonymous Coward]

So i suppose having sex with your dead parents while talking on a cell phone with your mouth full of shitty berries is wrong then too?

What is this world comming too!? :P

Re:Taboos through the ages...

[Anonymous Coward]

2003AD addendum: Tucking your cock between your legs and pretending to be a girl. See Eric Krout/$$$$$exyGal for further information.

Re:Taboos through the ages...

[JDWTopGuy]

2004AD - having a .sig reading "I'm a girl. See my naked parents in my slashdot journal (1,422+ freaks!)"

Re:Taboos through the ages...

[Anonymous Coward]

Another interesting post from the man himself. Here's a little more information on Eric Krout, the man who you know as $$$$$exyGal.

He's been posting here for quite some time, and has seemed to take pride in manipulating users on Slashdot for the duration of his visit. Not that he picks any particularly intelligent method of doing so..in the past, his actions consisted mainly of rehashing quotes, or entire posts from other users, modifying them by a few words and reposting them under the same thread for karma points. As a related example of his startling unoriginality, feel free to view a cached copy of his webpage (http://www.google.ca/search?q=cache:I697VZxlipwC: listen.to/ek+eric+krout&hl=en&ie=UTF-8), in which he modifies an article from The Onion by a few words and plasters it onto his front page. These days his webpage contains very little, save for a copy of Webalizer to keep track of whoever might be stumbling onto his website address.

Lately he's also taken to calling himself $$$$$exyGal. He does somewhat less trolling this time around, instead preferring to collect karma points and friends on his list. He's still just as much of a braggart and a fan-whore as he used to be (see the user information of ekrout for an example, in which he even compares his list of fans/friends to that of other popular users..sound familiar?), save for that he now claims to be of the opposite gender. He recently also created the account Anti$$$$$exy in an effort to throw people off his trail, pretending that he had "resolved" the issue of his supposed gender with a user that magically appeared in the midst of the argument. Since that point, Anti$$$$$exy doesn't seem to have posted any of the supposed evidence he has, or anything at all for that matter.

Don't support Eric Krout, or any of his other accounts. He enjoys making you look stupid. Don't give him that opportunity.

Re:Taboos through the ages...

[Anonymous Coward]

$$$$$exyGal... we've known each other for a long time, we know each other better than anyone else and I think it's time we took the next step. Will you... will you go a date with me tonight?

Re:Taboos through the ages...

[duck_prime]

1200AD - Using your left hand to wipe your butt and eat your berries.

Y'know, that one still kind of makes sense.

Re:Taboos through the ages...

[Ozymandias_KoK]

Even worse, if they are Dingle Berries...(not the Irish ones.)

Leave my mobile phone at home

[angelgabriel]

When I go into town I tend to leave my mobile phone at home. I only take it with me if I go away. I really don't see why I need to be contactable 24/7, especially not if I'm just popping out for a coffee.

Social what?

[Neophytus]

I got a mobile phone when the price and charging was right for me. Before that I used my chargecard in payphones perfectly happily, the only disadvantage of that now is that less and less are being constructed.
I had my first phone for at least three years, and when I replaced it not last month it was not because it was obsolete but because I was fed up of some of the restrictions that now don't exist. Not being able to text straight to someone in my phonebook being one, lock not locking the power button another. I am confident I shall keep my current phone for a similar length of time. I don't keep up with the Joneses, I simply take onboard new technology when I feel the time is right.

Re:Social what?

[nadadogg]

I had my old phone(a motorola startac) for about 8 months when i decided to change providers, due to my ALLTEL phone having problems with caller ID/voicemail when roaming, something my Cingular Ericsson t60 not having a problem with. I dont think ill upgrade phones again until people i know get phones with MMS(multimedia message), becuase getting a phone with MMS would be a waste as of now.

Re:Disruption- Make it vibrate!

[nadadogg]

Not sure about older phones, but I have both my cell phones(personal and work), set to vibrate when i receive SMS. That way, if I am asleep, I wont be brought to ringing reality, or be interrupted in a meeting at work.

Here we go.

[SlashdotLemming]

All the "I'm too good to own a television" people now get a chance post "I'm too good to own a cellphone"

Brace yourselves.
(Did I mention that I don't own a cellphone?)

Re:Here we go.

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm too sexy for my cell phone, too sexy for my cell phone, too sexy yeah!

Re:Here we go.

[Anonymous Coward]

I dont think that many amish people read /.

Re:Here we go.

[david614]

Finally, a voice of sanity. For a nerd website the luddism of half of the people here is incredible. Hypocrisy too. After all, how many computers do most people who frequent Slashdot own? More than one? How can you justify that -- what a waste of energy! Now, tell me about those awful "posers" using cell phones.

But the japanese, are, weird :)

[Monkelectric]

I don't think anyone cares what a few yuppie Japanese do with their cell phones. Most people use them to make phone calls.

This isn't the "future" of society we're seeing, its just a waypoint on the path to complete ridiculousness began by an unhealthy obsession with social rules and kitschy gadgets.

Re:But the japanese, are, weird :)

[Izeickl]

Maybe most people in the US, but mobiles are becoming an every day item for every day people in Asia and Europe, text messaging, picture messaging, phone calls, not just yuppie Japanese, but grandmothers/fathers too primary school kids are all making use of them.

Re:But the japanese, are, weird :)

[Stig_Soleng]

No, it's not just a few Japanese. I'm Norwegian, and most of the article applies here too, along with Finland and Sweden. I think those percentage
figures in the article are pretty much the same over here, only difference is that we are only just beginning to get MMS (multimedia messages) now, which the Japanese have had for a while...

I spent a year in the the US, and one of the biggest differences for me was that not everyone had cellphones. I remember spending an entire night by myself, missing out on whatever was happening because I just wasn't used to a mobile phone-less life. I spent that night cursing the Americans for being so "backwards"... :)

So this isn't the future, it's the present, at least where I am.

Re:But the japanese, are, weird :)

[silence535]

You're US American, right?

I understand, that ROW (Rest of World) is weird to you.

"I weep for the species."

-r

information overload....

[stonebeat.org]

serious information overload. when all you are getting is information, but you have NO time to decipher it, it is no good.....

Marshall

[bernz]

I keep thinking how Marshal McLuhan said that our new inventions change the way we view the world. This is 'obvious' now, but was quite a new idea when he thought of it. In the 40s and 50s you "needed" to get a (land line) phone, then it was cars, email, and now cell phones. What's next? Is it simply a matter of keeping up with the Joneses?

ALVY
I mean, d- He can give you - Do you hafta give it so loud? I mean, aren't you ashamed to pontificate like that? And - and the funny part of it is, M-Marshall McLuhan, you don't know anything about Marshall McLuhan's ... work!

MAN IN LINE
[Overlapping] Wait a minute! Really? Really? I happen to teach a class at Columbia called "TV Media and Culture"! So I think that my insights into Mr. McLuhan - well, have a great deal of validity.

ALVY
Oh, do yuh?

MAN IN LINE
Yes.

ALVY
Well, that's funny, because I happen to have Mr. McLuhan right here. So ... so, here, just let me - I mean, all right. Come over here ... a second.

MCLUHAN
[To the man in line] I hear - I heard what you were saying. You - you know nothing of my work. You mean my whole fallacy is wrong. How you ever got to teach a course in anything is totally amazing.

ALVY
[To the camera] Boy, if life were only like this!

Re:Marshall

[Anonymous Coward]

What?

Re:Marshall

[Night Goat]

You're making no sense... or I'm not enough of a nerd to make heads or tails of what you just posted.

Re:Marshall

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a scene from Annie Hall .

Re:Marshall

[Anonymous Coward]

Woody Allen's "Annie Hall". Go rent it. Now.

Re:Marshall

[The Cydonian]

.. and here I am, thinking telephone conversations were Kafka-esque experiences to behold.

Oh wait, that was sex, and that too with that Woody Allen character.

Oh well, what's the difference? It's all mental masturbation anyway.

(Btw, great gig; better than mine)

Re:Marshall

[Anonymous Coward]

That whiny bitch? I don't know man, he's very irritating. I'm not in his target audience, pussy city dwellers who can't fend for themselves. Fuck Woody Allen and his modern bullshit.

Oy...

[Judeccan]

I'm fairly certain I'm the last man living in California who doesn't own a cell phone. Not that I feel bad about it mind you, but I get sick of people asking for my cell number and then giving me the "Are you Amish or something?" look when I tell them I not only don't have one, but wouldn't ever own one by choice.

Re:Oy...

[TheRaven64]

You really should get a mobile phone. The land-phone always missed one feature that I consider vital. This feature is present in all mobiles, anmely the 'off' switch / button. Calls to mobiles are more expensive as well, so it acts to discoutrage people from phoning you in the first place.

Re:Disruption- Make it vibrate!

[prof187]

ooh, i don't use sms so i wasn't aware you could set it differently from the phone. I know on mine that if I get voicemail, it just follows the ring style of whatever the phone is set to

The Jones'?

[Montgomery Burns III]

More like keeping up with the Kim's

Re:The Jones'?

[jcenters]

Kim would most likely be a Korean name. I doubt they have many cell phones in Korea.

Re:The Jones'?

[JDWTopGuy]

Yeah, that's funny but isn't Kim mostly a korean name? (watch me get moderated either 0, Offtopic or +5, insightful)

Re:The Jones'?

[Montgomery Burns III]

My humble apologies.... Japanese Names

Re:The Jones'?

[Anonymous Coward]

You're kidding, right? The country with the highest penetration rate in the world for ADSL? The country that is more wired than Japan?

Perhaps you were thinking of North Korea. I know it's hard for you 'Merikans to keep track of all these different foreign countries, but perhaps you should learn the difference between North and South Korea before you start bombing Seoul.

Re:The Jones'?

[Anonymous Coward]

Funny when Korea is several years ahead of the USA in technology.

Re:The Jones'?

[Anonymous Coward]

You have to keep in mind that the only way Americans learn geography these days is by watching Fox News to see which country they are bombing. Can't find Iraq on the map? Look its here! We're bombing them. Can't find North Korea on the map? Look its here! We are going to be bombing them soon.

Re:The Jones'?

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you retarded, or did you post in a temporary state of stupidity?

Re:The Jones'?

[Anonymous Coward]

i always admired how well versed americans are in the affairs and customs of the rest of the world . dan quayle and george the second are proud of you . you are aware of the fact that there is a korean state other than that of the beloved leader kim jong il exists - samsung rings a bell or a cell ? sesons greetings from very old europe

Re:The Jones'?

[Anonymous Coward]

i always admired how well versed americans are in the affairs and customs of the rest of the world . dan quayle and george the second are proud of you . you are aware of the fact that there is a korean state other than that of the beloved leader kim jong il exists - samsung rings a bell or a cell ?

It definitely has grown quick

[Sk3lt]

I remember around 5 years ago the only people who had a cell phone (or in Australia we call them mobile phones) were rich.

Nowadays I see kids who are 7 years old with the latest mobile phones.

It's all about prepaid, they just allow kids to manage there funds abit better.

Anyway in the future we will still have mobiles but the Net will be a standard on them, WAP is slowly getting more advanced.

Re:It definitely has grown quick

[The Cydonian]

WAP? You need to update your buzzword dictionary buddy, everyone knows that SMS is the next big killer-app.

Re:It definitely has grown quick

[Sk3lt]

SMS? Killer-App? HAH!

Text based messaging WAP Email

You do the math.

What's next? The *real* Net

[GCP]

I think what's next will be an always on connection to the Net, the medium thru which all electronic information ("phone" calls, "TV" and "radio" shows, live chat with your different social groups [family, office, etc.], the Web, traffic cams, baby monitors, etc.) will eventually be transported.

Make it so you have, and maintain, a high bandwidth Net connection no matter where you go (some places might incur a surcharge, of course), and then deliver everything else thru it, and it will be more important to daily life than electricity is now.

Re:What's next? The *real* Net

[Anonymous Coward]

When that day comes, I will hate the Internet and everything it has given me.

I don't want the things I do to be "cool." I don't want my life to be "hip."

Being cool is shit. It's dumb. I will die a loser, and I will be happy that way.

Re:What's next? The *real* Net

[Anonymous Coward]

Being cool is shit

Of course it is. Being hot is the key. Most people find it out around the age of 25.

Not Just Keeping Up

[sfranklin]

Cell phones don't fit into the "keeping up with the Jones" category - at least not any more. It's become practically a necessity in my line of work (software consulting), where out-of-state travel is the norm and client business is getting increasingly harder to obtain. Being constantly connected, even on the road, is something that clients want.

And outside the workplace, it makes a lot of sense to have a cell phone these days. You can usually find a rate plan nearly as good or even better than a land line, so cost isn't a major factor. My parents got rid of their land line entirely - and so would I, if the pizza people would deliver when I use my cell. :)

Re:Not Just Keeping Up

[Sk3lt]

Yeah I know exactly what you mean but that's one of the main reasons I hate my cell..

My Staff always call me up whenever I'm trying to sleep or am busy and ask the stupidest questions heh ;)

Re:Not Just Keeping Up

[jlechem]

I agree, My wife and I gave up our land line completely and now just use our cell phones. A new cell phone would be nice but I don't need to get one. My friend has this kick ass Samsung that I would love to get but I don't see it as keeping up with the Joneses.

I see them as just being so damn convienent that they are taking over the world. And even though I only use my cell phone to call people I still talk and interact with a large amount of people in my day. I don't think person to person communication is going to stop anytime soon. If you IM someone it's because they are too far away to have a normal conversation with anyway.

Re:Not Just Keeping Up

[MCZapf]

I still have my landline because I absolutely hate talking on my cellphone for any length of time. The call quality is variable; I often have to repeat myself because of the "static" (digital garbling). If you are talking to someone else on a cellphone, that just compounds the problem, as there are now two over-the-air connections that can go wrong. Landlines, OTOH, are generally always clear.

My phone is a few years old, though (CDMA, Verizon). Are newer cell phones any better in sound quality?

Re:Not Just Keeping Up

[Yer Mum]

GSM almost is as clear as a bell, if you've got the coverage.

Unfortunately GSM coverage is very limited in the US.

Ho hum.

I guess I'm just outta the loop.

[DaCool42]

Got no car. Got no cell phone. Don't want either. The day I get a cell phone is the day I'm given one for free.

Re:I guess I'm just outta the loop.

[JDWTopGuy]

The day I get a cell phone is the day I'm given one for free.

So you're getting one next week?

Re:I guess I'm just outta the loop.

[Anonymous Coward]

Mine was Free--Provided by my boss. It's just an electronic ball and chain. Don't call me a Luddite--I work in the mobile phone industry, but would never own one of my own accord. Can't tell my customers that though.

I don't need a cell phone!

[Anonymous Coward]

I barely get any landline calls. :-(

Re:I don't need a cell phone!

[TheRaven64]

I get very few landline calls. Not answering the landline for 2 years has put people off. I only get a few mobile calls, although I'm slightly more likely to answer them. The only people I'll really consider talking to on the phone now are people who live a long way away from me. Anyone else can email me with a time and a place, and I'll either meet them there or reply explaining why I can't make that time.

Texting before calling

[Animats]

The social convention that you send a text message before calling is significant. What it really does is give phone calls subject lines.

Some communications systems have subject lines. Memos and E-mails do, but phone calls and letters don't. Voicemail usually doesn't, although some online voice chat systems do have introductory messages. Telegrams didn't have subject lines. SMS, arguably, is subject lines only.

Subject lines help enormously in managing information overload. Subject lines for phone calls could be a real win. Especially if you could input them by voice. Hmm.

Actually...

[Yo Grark]

In my pocket of the world, people are recognizing that they can survive WITHOUT cell phones. They have become a BURDON instead of a necessity.

I think it was when Telco's starting charging $0.10 per text message, and rounding the seconds used up to the minute. People are finally sitting up and saying "whoah, this sucks".

I know at least 30 friends and family who have given up on their cell phones. Even the "pay as you go" is not worth it because the minutes expire.

If anyone needs me, they can call me at home or catch me at work. For emergencies I have a non-serviced cell phone (911 works WITHOUT subscribing to a service)

Yo Grark
Canadian Bred with American Buttering.

Re:Actually...

[Izeickl]

In the UK Pay As You Go minutes used to expire aswell as per minute billing rather than seconds, but no longer, eventually telcos start to realise people wont put up with it and they become much friendlier.

Re:Actually...

[Anonymous Coward]

They have become a BURDON instead of a necessity.

If you're gonna hilite it and make such a huge deal out if it, at least spell it correctly. It's BURDEN.

Re:I'm Sacrificing +2 Karma To Say You're A MORON

[TheShadow]

Umm... maybe you need to take the cell phone out of your ass.

how old are we?

[fermion]

This just goes to show that anything invented after a person is 16 is weird, and anything invented after 30 is just wrong. Increasingly cell phones, SMS, etc are as necessary for teens and young adults as land line phones were for those of us that are much older. How many of young people without land phones had social lives in the 80's. How many young people without e-mail have social lives now.

Increasingly, especially for young people, dates are being made online. For friends, there is no reason to plan things out days in advance. Just call each other up at the spur of the moment and see who available to party. Is this good or bad? Not really either.

I have all this technology. People can request my attention using a number of methods. However, I do consider all of these requests. It is my choice to answer phone, reply to email, whatever. This pisses people off. Just because someone asks for my attention, am I for some reason required to drop everything and respond? I think not. Rather than showing our age and railing against rational uses of technology, I think we should accept those uses and teach how to use technology rather than have technology use you.

There was a time when people would come to your house, and, if there was time, you would put out some biscuits and make some tea and have a good sit down. This was obviously inefficient and complicated. However, I am still more inclined to talk to someone who would come to my apartment for a chat rather than randomly pick up phone and call me. OTOH, there are some conversations that are better on the phone and email. For instance, i remeber the first time a girl broke up with a friend of mine over email. It saved a useless conversation.

Re:how old are we?

[Elwood P Dowd]

Conversely, I remember when a (self absorbed, egotistical) friend of mine wanted to break up with his (self absorbed, controlling) girlfriend. He was asking everyone for advice on how he should break up with her, and he eventually decided, "I know I can't just break up with her on the phone. I'll invite her over."

I said, "Do it on her territory. Don't make her have to leave, drive home, etc."

So he called her, and said he was coming over, there was something they needed to talk about. She says, "Look, if you're breaking up with me, just tell me now and get it over with."

"Um, no, that's not it. I'll be right over."

Boy, what a dick. There is nothing wrong with doing it the impersonal way in situations like that. She felt bad about being rejected, and then she felt bad for letting this asshole see her get upset. Hell, in that case, it might have been better if it were an SMS:

New SMS From Alan:
Hey girl. I h8 u. Nvr call me again.

Re:how old are we?

[sidb]

When I was a kid, I used to ride my bike over to my friends' houses and knock on their doors if I wanted to talk to them. Getting a flat was the ultimate social faux paus: it could leave you disconnected from just-in-time information on where and when you were in the social networks of time and place. What a bummer.

Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[wackybrit]

It's entirely necessary if you're the sort of person who can't bear not to have contact with anyone human every 5 seconds.

Seriously, there are a lot of people like this, even in the nerd sector. They struggle to go for a few hours without calling someone, or having a conversation.. whereas lots of us are quite happy to sit hacking Perl or playing with servers until 4am.

So socially, no, I don't think phones are necessary, unless you're an extrovert who suffers from a loneliness complex.

Business-wise, however, cellphones are pretty damn useful. I can give an impression of being available 24/7 wherever I am, and that's worth a lot. A cellphone also allows me to easily call back into my work answerphone and catch up on calls. That's pretty useful stuff.

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[samael]

whereas lots of us are quite happy to sit hacking Perl or playing with servers until 4am.

I'm going to assume either sarcasm or that you're referring to geek society here. Most peoples lives revolve around their social life, not hacking on perl or playing with servers.

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[dswensen]

I think you make a great point. Cell phones can easily be used as a social crutch, whether to assuage loneliness or just plain old insecurity. In one article I read, Maria Kalman referred to cell phones as "pacifiers for adults". It's an assessment that I by and large agree with. Plenty of people use their cell phones for perfectly legitimate, business-related uses or whatever. Others are just obnoxious turds who are still laboring under the mistaken impression that a cell phone is a status symbol.

I don't blame the technology as such, but the technology does bring out behavior in certain people that makes them more annoying than they would be without the cell phone.

See the article for examples of what I'm talking about. My personal favorite:

During a recent performance of "Death of a Salesman," its star, Brian Dennehy, was startled to hear a cell phone ring near the end of the second act.

Even more disturbing was to hear the phone being answered, and a woman in the audience clearly saying, "It's almost finished," and going on to make dinner plans.

Say what you want about the technology not being to blame -- without a cell phone, this woman would not be engaging in this type of behavior.

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[wackybrit]

I'm going to assume either sarcasm or that you're referring to geek society here.

But this is Slashdot. We are not 'most people'.

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[Warin]

There are inconsiderate jerks in every crowd. They will be inconsiderate jerks whether they have a cell phone or not. When I walk into a theater, my phone goes on vibe if my son may need to call me, and off otherwise. And if a theater owner is worried about jerks with cell phones and pagers not respecting others, there is a handy little device called a cell-jammer that pretty much nullifies reception in the small area of the theater. They work wonderfully and arent that expensive.

Any technology will be open to certain abuses, and there will always be jerks to abuse them. that doesnt mke a technology bad as such.

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[macshit]

Maria Kalman referred to cell phones as "pacifiers for adults"

The analogy that comes to mind is cigarettes (which, thank god, are declining a bit, even in Japan), surely the original adult pacifier.

I live in Japan, and when I first came here I was all excited to get a cell-phone, since they seemed like a very cool gadget, and downright handy.

However, the way people interact with their phones here is so downright creepy that I now want no part of them. People no longer look around them if they're walking down the street, they stare down at their phone, and thumb the buttons. If there's a group of people on the train, much of the time they all stare at their phones instead of talking to each other. This sort of `idle' use seems far more prevalent than actually using the phone to talk! Sure there are lots of other such things gameboys, books, newspapers, etc., but nothing seems to keep people's eyes superglued like a cell-phone, and there's this distinct feeling like they're Not There (that you don't get when someone's just reading a newspaper).

I certainly recognize how handy they are, and I think most people have good reasons to have them, but I think this is going to be one of those technologies (like the TV) that goes down in history as both a blessing and a curse.

[Sure people `could' choose not to use them, but people are weak...]

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[duck_prime]

I think you make a great point. Cell phones can easily be used as a social crutch, whether to assuage loneliness or just plain old insecurity [...]

This sounds pretty reasonable to me. Your loneliness needs assuaging ... call someone on the phone. Where's the problem?

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[dswensen]

The problem is if you need to be talking to someone on the phone while in public, all the time, every day. In restaurants, in movie theaters, on the bus, etc. I think there's a level of excess where it stops being about plain old loneliness and starts being about neurosis.

Also, people who call their friends to assuage loneliness don't usually do it very loudly in front of other people so everyone can be impressed with the fact that they can talk on the phone. I see cell-phone users doing this all the time.

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[plecto-a-go-go]

"If there's a group of people on the train, much of the time they all stare at their phones instead of talking to each other."

um.i don't think that's anything to do with mobile phones - people don't talk to each other much on the train anyway (at least they don't here in tokyo...).if they weren't using their phones they'd probably be either sleeping or staring out the window...

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[macshit]

um.i don't think that's anything to do with mobile phones - people don't talk to each other much on the train anyway. if they weren't using their phones they'd probably be either sleeping or staring out the window...

No you misunderstand -- I meant groups of friends, who are clearly hanging out together. The sort of group that would normally be talking loudly about inane subjects (hmmm, maybe there's an upside to all this...).

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[Yer Mum]

The problem with your sweeping generalisation is you only notice the people who have left their phones on and tar the rest of us who have turned them off before going into the restaurant/cinema/etc with the same brush.

Re:Socially, cellphones are for lonely extroverts.

[dswensen]

If you actually read my posts you'll see I did no such thing. I was very specific in saying some people with cell phones can act this way, not all people with cell phones, and that cell phones in and of themselves can be great tools and are not inherently bad.

Lucky for me, everyone I know personally who has a cell phone is very considerate in how they use them in public. They bear absolutely no resemblance to the people bellowing into their phones during a movie, and thank God for that.

What I find odd...

[Black Parrot]

...is when I see friends together at a restaurant or something, and one or both of them spend the whole time yakking to someone else on their cell phone rather than talking to the person they're actually with.

Re:What I find odd...

[Anonymous Coward]

last night my gf and I were at Tony Roma's Restaraunt, and there was a table of teenagers out for dinner as friends, probably about 10 of them. There was this one girl, whose phone rang when they were first seated around 9:15. First, she let it ring on high for like 2 minutes, then she answered it and talked at a volume level at least 3 times louder than normal conversation in the restaraunt, which was not concert level loud or anything she would need to shout over. She talked on that damn thing for 45 minutes straight, and then exclaimed even louder, "my damn battery just died, stupid peice of crap" to which I could only exclaim rather loudly so that they probably heard me, "Thats too bad, maybe the stupid cunt can talk to her friends she chose to go to dinner with (oh wait, she didnt order food, she merely is sampling everyone elses plates, cuz shes not hungry). If the phone hadnt died, I dont doubt she would have continued to talk to the end. the conversation by the way was mostly "and I was like, totally, and she said, no way, and i was like yes way.." and no I am not kidding. I am 21 and use a cell a lot, but thats just offensive. If she was my friend, shed suddenly never get invited to participate in anything i did.

Re:What I find odd...

[tuffy]

...is when I see friends together at a restaurant or something, and one or both of them spend the whole time yakking to someone else on their cell phone rather than talking to the person they're actually with.

Maybe they're talking to each other on their cell phones. Wouldn't surprise me...

The Ballad of Marshall McLuhan

[egoff]

great song by The Vestibules

Here we go again

[fondue]

Please refer to the surrounding 200+ posts for variations of the same idiotic, luddite American bleating about how 'cellphones' are SO EVIL.

You're pathetic. What the fuck are you doing using a computer, let alone reading Slashdot, if you think useful, accessible and empowering advancements in technology should be scorned and feared?

Guess what guys? We've heard your fascinating anecdotes about how some lady in the grocery in Buttpoke, OH was shouting into her phone about the tins of tuna she was buying. Because you've been bleating about it like whining, inept little pissants since about 1994. Get over it. Mobile phones are here to stay, the more you carp about them the more of an inconvenient, unemployable, fat annoyance you will be seen as by the rest of the world.

Re:Here we go again

[egoff]

But wait, I thought my President said that its okay to make spiteful, unthinking remarks without thinking first?

Re:Here we go again

[Anonymous Coward]

I agree. The poster sounds like he is from an Axis of Evil country like France or Iran. Let's bomb him!

Re:Here we go again

[Anonymous Coward]

This should be "Insightful" (yes, I agree, it's not polite). I can say, because I was thinking the same. Most arguments against mobile phones are not valid. Most people arguing against mobiles have made an *irrational* decision, but try to bring excuses that sound reasonable. Then, to cover their decision and "not lose their face" they refuse to listen to valid arguments and keep their *irrational* decision even when they know better.
Making irrational decisions is not good: the decisions are then governed by forces that you do not recongize.

Re:Here we go again

[freeefalln]

no, only public officials *namely our president* who are appointed to office rather than elected, whose had only 4 years of political experience, can make comments like that. people know hes an idiot.

hmmm

[drfrog]

i think the question this make me asks is..
who is asking us to buy these things and for what prupose?

ie is it always just invention.. or is there some social engineering happening

Great...More people bugging me with phones...

[Dfiant]

It's the interesting nature of communications technology--it becomes more valuable because everyone posesses it, rather than only a limited number of people having it. It's backwards from the "normal" type of service.

The social rules that are arising from it are very intriguing, though, indicative of how popular phones and messaging are. Increasing use of text messages as a "knock" seems to be something useful evolving out of it. Sometimes I wish people would IM me before calling so I don't get distracted. (Cooperative vs. Preemptive Dfiant-tasking. ;-) It 's good that people are starting to respect each others' time a little more.

Now can we please make the next taboo not having a hands-free headset while driving? I'd like to decrease the odds of me being splattered all over the pavement from the sociable idiot in the SUV near me who either a) drifts into my lane and almost sideswipes me, b) drives slow in the lefthand lane but fails to yield, or c) didn't know where that red light/stop sign/parking lot came from.

For some people it's some sort of unhealthy social addiction. If you can't just run down to the store briefly without yacking away to your friend while you sift through the items on the shelf, it's just a little weird and annoying. Especially if you have friends there standing next to you. But when I'm constantly seeing peoples' lives endangered, that's where I draw the line.

Re:Great...More people bugging me with phones...

[IIRCAFAIKIANAL]

it's not holding the cell that's the problem, it's the distraction of talking to someone.

Same thing if someone is in the car, actually, but I guess two sets of eyes make up for the distraction.

Re:Great...More people bugging me with phones...

[Caradoc]

Are you saying that driving with your head tilted 80 degrees to the side to press the tiny cellphone against your shoulder doesn't increase the level of "distraction" by any measurable amount?

Or that trying to juggle the stick shift, the steering wheel, the $BEVERAGE, and the cellphone isn't more dangerous than just the stick, wheel, and $BEVERAGE?

I've lost count of the number of times I've seen the silly bint in front of me try to look into his rearview mirror so he can try merging left, only to lose the cellphone he was holding between his empty head and his shoulder, then try to recover from dropping it while swerving halfway into *both* of the other lanes (left *and* right!)

I won't go so far as to say using a headset *removes* the distraction, but it certainly reduces it by quite a lot over trying to drive with the damned thing in your hand. Voice control over the headset also removes the distraction of trying to *dial* while driving.

Re:Great...More people bugging me with phones...

[xigxag]

Now can we please make the next taboo not having a hands-free headset while driving?

Irrelevant. At least one study seems to indicate that it doesn't matter whether the phones are hands-free or not, the risk is still there. According to the same link, a previous study revealed that talking on the phone impairs driving ability significantly more than talking to other passengers in your vehicle.

Re:Great...More people bugging me with phones...

[Dfiant]

Quite frankly, you can use a study to prove anything. Look at the way the study was conducted--people in a simulator who clearly must have known what was being studied. I consider that a tainted experiment. My own non-controlled, non-simulated observation is the basis for my annoyance. I have a 32-mile commute (each way) daily, the majority of which takes place on the interstate highway in a major metropolitan area. I consistently see people doing what I mentioned.

Now, I'm not saying that only people on cell phones do these things. If there are multiple people in the car, and a heated conversation is taking place (arms flailing), it tends to happen as well. So, I will concede that correlation does not mean causation.

I think it's still significant, though, given that I have tried talking on a cell phone and driving, and noticed in the middle of it that I was moving slower than I should have (I only noticed due to the behavior of drivers around me), and when I tried to rectify that situation, I also realized that I didn't have as good a degree of control over my vehicle as I'd have liked. Driving with one hand on the armrest is different from driving with one on the wheel and one up to your ear. I didn't run a light, though. ;-)

You can think it arrogant if you wish, but my own experience kind of weighs more with me than a bunch of University of Utah people strapped into a simulator, psychology Ph.D. or not.

Re:Great...More people bugging me with phones...

[Dfiant]

No, I don't think so. As I noted in my other response, I've tried talking on the phone in the car and there's a big difference (at least for me, and everyone I know) between talking on the phone and talking to someone in the seat next to you.

My opinion of contributing factors for passenger vs. cell phone:

* Without a phone, I have both hands at the wheel, so less attention to coordination is needed.

* With a passenger in the car, I tend to pause more in my speech, particularly when my attention is needed for driving. The passenger sees why and doesn't pay any mind. If I were on the phone, I'd probably get a few "Hello?"'s.

Case in point: once I was with a couple of my friends in the car. Friend #1 was at the wheel talking to Friend #2 on his phone. We approached a light with a turn lane. The left-hand lane adjacent to the turn lane was quite full, but had almost enough space to get in. The driver proceeded to keep talking on the phone and tried to wedge through. Friend #3 and I (in the car) kept yelling "Hey, stop! You don't have enough room!" but he kind of shrugged it off, and next thing you know *scrraaape* "Uh, Friend #2, I've gotta go now. I just caused an accident."

Fortunately the damage was superficial. In any case, I'm certain it wouldn't have happened if he wasn't talking on the phone. The cause, IMHO: reduced field of concentration, lack of situational awareness, and not listening to a couple people yelling at him. ;-) I'd say that's at least one example where phones have been more of a distraction than passengers.

Re:Great...More people bugging me with phones...

[xigxag]

??? Not sure if I understand your point. I don't see that your personal experience in any way contradicts the results of the study.

As long as we're talking anecdotal experience, here's a little experiment that anybody can try in the safety of their own home. Call up any of your friends during their favorite television program. (Don't tell them you are using them as labrats.) Talk to them about something else other than the show. After the show is over, see how much they can recall about what they saw. I think you'll find that results will vary. Some people will ask you to call them back -- they simply can't talk on the phone and watch TV at all and they're aware of it. Other people will talk with you but really won't remember any of the show -- they become oblivious to their surroundings. Others will remember some of the show but will have missed a lot of it. Others will interrupt the conversation frequently while things are happening on TV -- their conversations will be disjointed because they want to focus the bulk of their attention on the screen. And a few rare people will be able to successfully multitask, watch their show while holding a full conversation with you on the phone. The last two groups are probably reasonably safe phone drivers. As for your other friends, try not to get into their cars if you can help it!

Re:Great...More people bugging me with phones...

[Dfiant]

Yes, quite true with the TV multitasking point. In your example, I would be the one that tells them I'd call them back. It's either that, or my attention switches between the two and I often end up losing both.

My point is that it doesn't hold true unilaterally with driving; talking on the phone for me and a great deal of other people creates a distraction greater than that of someone sitting next to you. Heck, it could be greater than or equal to. The point that it's a danger still holds true. I can carry on a conversation with a person in the vehicle without it affecting my driving. However, talking on the phone while driving does have a noticable effect. And you said yourself it's a rare number of people that can successfully multitask. Those are the few people that could get away with it. Pity they aren't a majority, or it wouldn't even be an issue.

Anyway, I think we've beaten this subtopic to death. All I want is to not have to be plagued by people that can't multitask but try to and fail horribly. I respect peoples' freedom to do it, but when it starts endangering others I'd really rather they didn't. I don't think that's too much to ask.

I'm glad it's the Japanese...

[HotNeedleOfInquiry]

I, for one, don't like cell phones. I carry one or call one only when I have to.

I live in a college town and most of the college kids take them everywhere. I'm sick of hearing people take calls and talk on them at plays, movies and restaraunts. A student at the college told me that cell phones have destroyed the community atmosphere as the students are only interested in getting out of the class and getting on their cell phones.

I think by and large we'd be better off without them.

Re:I'm glad it's the Japanese...

[duck_prime]

A student at the college told me that cell phones have destroyed the community atmosphere as the students are only interested in getting out of the class and getting on their cell phones.

Sounds like these students are calling the people they want to talk to ... where's the problem?

Re:I'm glad it's the Japanese...

[Anonymous Coward]

It's really great to have all these disconnected
bodies romaing around with their minds elsewhere.

How about a future with everyone walking around with
virtual reality helmets on? A warning buzzer goes
off in your helmet if you are about to collide
with something.

They'll all go blind...

[vandan]

I hate mobile phones. I get a sharp headache after using one for only 2 or 3 minutes. One of my sister's friend's nose started bleeding uncontrollably (also accompanied by a sharp headache) after using one for a few minutes. They blast all kinds of radiation through your head which is designed to go through some pretty though stuff - buildings, concrete, pretty much everything apart from solid metals. In particular they emit microwaves. These obviously travel though your brain and eyes. Not good. Even if they don't heat up your flesh a significant amount, they do cause damage. Microwaves shake water molecules violently - this is how they heat water. So basically all the cells in your head are being shaken violently - almost to the point of noticably raising their temperature, but not quite...
And then there is the fact that we don't really know the relationship between brain & consciousness. Do we really want to be throwing a spanner in the works in this way?
Mobile phones should be for emergencies only.

Re:They'll all go blind...

[AmigaAvenger]

Sorry, wrong frequency... cells are generally 829 to 849 mhz. close but not quite. (also probably non-ionizing radiation)
Ham radio operators have been using radios that use 100x as much as a cell phone (max of 3 watts for a hand held mobile). Driving by a broadcast radio antenna will give you many times the dosage a cell phone will.
Finally, microwaves suck at going through stuff!!! they only heat the top 2 or 3 millimeters of food, and the little microwaves can't even get through that metal grid on the front of the microwave oven!
Do i dispute the fact of your symptoms? nope, but I suspect you believe it so much it is true, for you...

Re:They'll all go blind...

[technomom]

I hate mobile phones. I get a sharp headache after using one for only 2 or 3 minutes. One of my sister's friend's nose started bleeding uncontrollably (also accompanied by a sharp headache) after using one for a few minutes.

Hint: To stop headaches and nosebleeds, stop whacking your face with the cell phone.

Re:They'll all go blind...

[Jucius Maximus]

"I hate mobile phones. I get a sharp headache after using one for only 2 or 3 minutes. One of my sister's friend's nose started bleeding uncontrollably (also accompanied by a sharp headache) after using one for a few minutes."

I think that this depends on the phone. My parents used to have this old, honkin' big Sony Ericcson mobile phone, the first one ever offered by Clearnet in Canada. On that thing, I would instantly get a headache after only 5-10 seconds of use. But the newer ones do not bother me. But most other newer phones do not bother me at all.

Nowadays, though, I almost never have the phone next to my head because I use an earpiece so that I have two hands free.

Re:They'll all go blind...

[MerlTurkin]

Actually hand held ham radios (known as "HTs") can have a max power of 7 watts, most have 5 and are run through an outside antenna (when mobile) which is further away from your head than a cell phone's. Most hams use a regular mobile rig in the car running higher power,10-50 watts.

Re:They'll all go blind...

[doom]

Interesting anecdotes. There's some bad news out there for cell phone addicts:

Hold the Phone? Radiation from cell phones hurts rats' brains

is the culture...

[Anonymous Coward]

The truth is Japanese culture is very different. I dont see a lot people playing with their ketais while taking a ride in the subway in the US.??

Japan has stronger society links

[jago25_98]

I heard that there is a difference between Japan and here:

here we're more individual and over there they're a lot more social.

This is really noticable if you work for a Japanese company like Sharp. Working in a factory for Toshiba we noticed that in Japan they have them all stand up at the start of the working day to say team-like stuff alligience... wierd. I think they were hoping they could inspire the same team spirit over here :D

I'd like to say more but it'd be offtopic.

correction

[iamthetrollofdeath]

I am a jerk and will know correct you.

You "needed" a car as early as the 20's. After all, they wre roaring ^^.

It's just that the cars back then suxored

The cool people

[Openadvocate]

Once you would have a cellphone if you would like people to think you were important(silly yes). But these days I think that the truly cool people are those are those who turn it off. So what if the company can't contact you, it should be the job of the monkeys to be available 24/7.

Japan...you should see Singapore....

[zoobaby]

I was just in Singapore and Japan. As a whole, people in Singapore use their cell phones much much more. In Singapore they are used as a tool for work and for normal uses. Answering a phone in a meeting is not taboo, I found it annoying, but it is accepeted there. Also many of these people use the text messaging (SMS) to recieve news updates, request songs on the radio, to send jokes, and to buy soda from vending machines.

As for wanting to not be contacted, two easy solutions, shut off the phone or don't get one and continue to live in your cave attached to your computer and be available via some messenger service and email. Cell phones here are easy to get by without. However, can you live without your computer?

Re:Japan...you should see Singapore....

[Ozymandias_KoK]

How do you buy a soda from vending machines using SMS?

Slashdot - Technology heling a new social network

[yy1]

Isn't this what slashdot aims to be? Using technology to help people communicate better. You see the way social networks are formed by the friends lists, the way some people are famous (or infamous) etc.

Technology can facilitate it and broaden the scope of the social group, but it doesn't really change the social dynamic that forms time and again.

In the case of cellphones, it lets a social group form that in previous decades might have only been able to form in a neighborhood, but cellphones let them be far flung over a large city like LA or NYC where friends live in different section and can use the cellphones to coordinate meet ups where as before everyone would just go around the corner or down the street etc...

I sorta think of slashdot as a representative discussion group, where sometimes people say something, sometimes they moderate (vote) for someones who has said something that they think should be heard. And bouncers to chuck out the people who start shouting incoherently. Anyway it lets (or some would say attempts to let) the number of people that can have a meaningful discussion be much larger.

This has happened with every meaningful technological invention, including WRITING. People naturally form social groups around technology, not because of technology.

You're wrong, but so is everyone else :)

[freeweed]

This is a common myth that's repeated like Gospel amongst people, but for good reasons. Allow me to elaborate:

The very earliest types of rechargable batteries, used on things like satellites, suffered from what is known as a 'memory' effect. In silly terms, it basically means that if you charge a half-full battery, it'll 'remember' where the charge started from, and only go on to do a half charge. When it reaches the halfway point, the battery 'thinks' it's empty. So you've just halved your battery life. Wash, rinse, repeat until the battery is useless.

When consumer rechargables started becoming common, early chargers (and a lot still do this today on NiCads) would keep applying current to the battery, even if it was fully charged. This 'overcharging' can seriously decimate the life of a battery - it renders useless the chemicals needed to drive the electric current.

So basically, people were overcharging their batteries left, right, and centre. Manufacturers started telling people not to continuously charge their devices, ie: leave the cordless phone off the hook for a while, things like that. Between noone explaining the principle of overcharging, and companies not fully understanding it themselves, we've moved on to 'completely drain any device before you charge it again'. Ironically this can actually lessen the life of many types of rechargables, including the new funky rechargable alkalines you see everywhere.

Anyway, the memory effect was only ever seen with batteries that never made it into consumer hands. But the myth lives on. There never was a reason for the drain-and-charge cycle. Overcharging was the problem all along.

Re:You're wrong, but so is everyone else :)

[Clueless Moron]

You can read a handy tech note from GE about nicad memory here . As the parent poster points out, it essentially doesn't exist in real life.

I've been using nicads since they were invented and have never seen any "memory" effect. I have packs that are over TEN YEARS OLD that are in heavy use and still work. All I do is make sure that I don't overcharge them or run them flat.

Re:I'm Sacrificing +2 Karma To Say You're A MORON

[Elwood P Dowd]

Mr. Poag, you're my favorite /. blowhard.

I'll point out that you're paying money every time you talk to your friends. You could have been spending that time getting paid.

I pay money so that I can talk to my friends, and I wish I could do it more. I'd keep spending more until I was spending 100% of my time talking to my friends. Then I'd be as happy as humanly possible.

Talking to my friends is the reward I get for being alive. I'll do whatever it takes to get more. Tell me what's wrong with that?

You made your bed....

[NDPTAL85]

....now lie in it.

Thats the price you pay for being different. Most people have cell phones and you choose to not have one to be "unique". Can you blame people for looking at you funny?

Its like those Christian Scientists who turn down antibiotics when they've got gangrene.....they get funny looks too!

Re:You made your bed....

[Judeccan]

I didn't choose not to because I wish to be 'unique', I chose not to becuase I have no use for one. I don't run a business, I'm not a manager for an IT department, I'm not a doctor or a lawyer, I'm just a college student, who am I going to be calling? Not only that, but I also look at it this way: my family and friends with are important to me, but I don't *need* to be in contact with them every second of my life. I don't need to always be 'in touch', and I think little of people who do. How uncomfortable must you be with yourself and your own thoughts to constantly need human interaction no matter where you are? And it's not anywhere near as bad as the Christian 'Scientists' example... A cell phone is a worthless bit of techno-fluff, antibiotics can be an important part of staying healthy.

Re:You made your bed....

[OblvnDrgn]

I don't need to always be 'in touch', and I think little of people who do.

Wow. Way to condemn people who think differently than you. First off, if you're a college student, you might be calling your family or your friends back home. If you're at a college in a different area code than home, for many people a cell phone is actually much cheaper than paying long distance fees. You pretty much have to work at it to buy a cell phone that charges you a lot for long distance these days.

Aside from that, it has nothing to do contacing someone every second of your life. Without the somewhat contrived "Emergency!" examples a lot of other posters are using, it's a simple matter of not needing to be in your own house to get a call. I'll get called from friends to meet somewhere, I'll call them when I get to a crowded/large place to find them, I'll call if I'm running late, and I'll get a call if I'm waiting somewhere and they can't come. There's a million uses, that while may not be the most important thing in your or anyone else's life make a mobile phone a lot more than a "worthless bit of techno-fluff."

Here's a hint for the future. Just because your close-mindedness when it comes to cell phones doesn't let you think of any good reasons doesn't mean there aren't any. I have no problems with you not owning a cell phone, and you shouldn't have any problems with me owning one.

Those photos really bug me!

[bugs_me_too!]

I'm really concerned about people taking pictures of me without my consent. It's too easy to do with these new cell phones. Especially when someone might catch you in an off moment. I own a cell phone, but rarely use it. I got one for my personal use because every body else has one./p?

Re:Those photos really bug me!

[jabberw0k]

I've not seen a phone that takes a picture yet.

What does the person at the other end see -- an extreme closeup of your ear?

some reasons why?

[kevin lyda]

if i'm late i can ring up someone in the group i'm meeting and let them know.

if i'm going to meet up with a friends at a houseparty i can call ahead on my way there to see if they need anything to pick up. or they can call me. or if it's my house everyone is going to i can ask someone who's coming.

directions. going to a new place with the knowledge that i can call for help on how to get there is an amazing stress reliever.

we might agree to meet up somewhere and discover that it's packed, lame, closed. the first ones there can redirect people to the new place.

and on a variation, a group might agree to meet up at a pub and then go on from there to an undecided restaurant. stragglers can be called when a decision has been made.

my phone, like 99% of phones, offers caller id. i can choose to answer who i feel like answering. my phone also offers an on/off switch. if i want to be left alone i can turn off the phone or only answer calls i want answered. even better then ignoring a landline i can explicitly reject calls i don't want so i don't have to listen to constant ringing.

people moaning about mobiles need to get a clue.

It's not "keeping up" - look to the past

[morcheeba]

> In the 40s and 50s you "needed" to get a (land line) phone, then it was cars, email, and now cell phones. What's next?

It's not about keeping up just for keeping up's sake; it's new technologies that are useful and become part of most peoples' lives. To explain, let's go back in history... these things were all new-fangled at one time, but now, even though some people live without them, seem pretty "essential":

- 4 walls and a water-proof roof.
- clean water, delivered to your faucet.
- sanitation system - sewer, garbage, etc.
- health insurance, vacinations for diseases you don't even have yet!
- 911, police, and fire services
- a legal system, property ownership
- currency, bank accounts, lending, credit cards
- a regular job (as opposed to self-empolyed farmer/blacksmith/etc. and directly bartering your skills with others)
- prerecorded music, books.
- transportation (taxi, rail, plane, boat, postal system)
- automation (copy machines, computers)

The vast majority of us integrate these into our lives because we feel they have value that exceeds their costs, and not just to keep up.

Re:It's not "keeping up" - look to the past

[Anonymous Coward]

Many (most?) of the things you list are 'necessary'. Clean water is, but not to the house. Some societies are based on a collective well, where marriages are arranged and local politics is sorted out. When everyone got a private sink (through a Western technology sharing/charity program) their society collapsed because people couldn't socialize the same way.
"A regular" job is completely subjective. What do 'consultants' and 'contractors' do? Single employee 'companies' are happening a lot now. Even blacksmiths, etc. had apprentices: wouldn't that be like secretaries and such.
Transportation: what about walking? If you live in the suburbs you more or less need a car. I however live closer to the centre of a city so most places (delis, bakeries, veg. shops, banks) are within 10 minutes walking distance. It's good excercise.

Re:It's not "keeping up" - look to the past

[MythosTraecer]

Yes, yes, I completely agree! Remember at one point the printing press was so revolutionary the Roman church wanted to ban it. But could we have gotten to the point we are today without cheap, widely available books? Cell phones aren't just the latest fad; they are truly useful tools. Sure, not everybody uses them properly, but that doesn't mean they are useless because of that.

Re:It's not "keeping up" - look to the past

[morcheeba]

Transportation- How do you think the food gets to your deli or bakery? In the old days, your choice of husband/wife was limited to about a half-day's walk from your home - if you lived in the boonies, then it's tough luck.

Neat story about the well & socializing, thanks!

Regular jobs are still in the majority; consultants are possible because their networking opportunites are greatly expanded with the use of a phone, a car, and sometimes a computer. My contracter friends swear by payroll services, again a "necessary" worksaver.

Like I said, some people live without many of these things; for others they find them far more beneficial than their costs.

Its worldwide

[NDPTAL85]

Cell phones don't destroy communites. They just allow you to hold onto the friends you've made first longer instead of always having to make new ones. Tell that student to get a cell phone and some friends to call of his own and he'll be happy again.

Re:I'm Sacrificing +2 Karma To Say You're A MORON

[Bowie J. Poag]

Actually, no, i'm not. I live in Tucson. Local phone service is free.

I guess that makes you an idiot.

Pizza Deliveries

[Cyno01]

You can just order your pizza over the internet, i've actually found it quicker, and they have no excuse for screwing up your order.

Freedom

[vigata]

My cell gives me freedom.
I can arrange meetings, get in touch with people while I'm doing other time wasting things like laundry, shopping, driving to work or while I'm on my daily walk.
If I don't want to talk with anyone I just turn my cellphone off. Simple.
I no longer have a landline.

For me, its worth the price.

Much less likely to happen in the US.

[Jartan]

Japan may be a lot like the US in some ways but in others its very different. Lets remember this is the same society that puts so much pressure on their children in school that some of them just flip. They're a lot more into peer pressure than the US. A lot of people try to do peer pressure in the states but with so many different peoples from varied backgrounds it doesn't fly so well.

So sure maybe our bosses will try and pull crap like keeping us on call by cell phone 24/7 but none of our friends are going to look down their noses at us for letting our battery run out acting like its some sort social taboo.

Either way I don't see as it will become much of a problem. In all reality the phone proves just as much of an invasion of privacy at home as a cell phone does walking around. Just get caller id or turn it off. Nobody can make you answer it.

Jartan

Re:Much less likely to happen in the US.

[DeionXxX]

Hahahaha.... "so much pressure on their children in school that some of them just flip." hahaha... yeah much better than parents and teachers totally not giving a fuck and the "jocks/popular" kids ridiculing everyone that's different and making them just "flip". Except kids in Japan don't have easy access to guns as kids here do, so they just take their own lives instead of taking their lives and the lives of 10+ others.

That was such a stupid ignorant comment.

It's an ego thing

[realmolo]

It's not that people LOVE talking to their friends all the time. It's that people LOVE feeling like they are important enought that they need to either: a) keep all their friend updated on their activities and whereabouts and/or b) must be available 24/7 so people can talk to them Have you LISTENED to what most people talk about on their cell phones? It's inane. So it's not a communication tool, as much as a "make me feel more important than I am" tool. This is born out by the fact that people who are REQUIRED to carry cell phones or pages for their job, because they ARE important, hate the god damn things.

Memory effect in NiCads

[frdmfghtr]

The memory effect that was mentioned for satellite batteries applies to Ni-Cad batteries as well.

-In my college chemistry class, I asked the professor this very question. According to him, a Ni-Cad battery develops a memory due to the plates in the battery crystallizing if not used for a long period of time. If a battery is only half-discharged before charging, the metal that is not used in the chemical process will eventually crystalize and not react even if the user tries to discharge the battery beyond half-capacity. A battery conditioner, if I understand properly, will discharge a battery completely before recharging, ensuring that the metal doesn't have a chance to crystallize. For batteries that have the effect already, teh conditioner will deep discharge the battery, "ripping" the metal atoms from the crystal structure and gradually restoring battery capacity.

When I was in the Navy, the submarine battery would show an increase in capacity if was deep-cycled a few times (like when running casualty drills over a period of several days).

-(from http://wireless.berkeley.edu/services/battery.shtm l#NICKEL%20CADMIUM)
Partial cycles will form dendrites on the plates which cause the memory effect. My speculation is that these dendrites will either (a) undergo rapid chemical process when the battery is used because they are thin relative to the plates or (b) break off and not take part in the process at all.

So the "memory effect" is no myth. I would suspect that battery manufacturers have engineers who are well-versed in such matters and probably have at least half a clue as to what they're talking about.

http://www.valence.com/chemistries.asp
http://w ww.batterycanada.com/Battery_Facts.htm

Re:Memory effect in NiCads

[silentbozo]

While you do get memory effect in individual cells, what kills the battery pack is when you start overcharging other cells to make up for the cell that is pulling the pack low. For example, my cordless phone has a 3.6v pack made up of 3 2/3 AA size batteries, each at 1.2v, soldered together in series. It's a much better solution to keep cells in a pack separated so you can swap out cells that due to natural variability, have started pulling the pack either high or low. I've charged packs where two of the 3 cells read 1.4v right after being charged, and the last cell reads 0v due to voltage reversal when the pack was discharged during operation. No way to salvage that without a soldering iron and a spare cell, especially once it starts leaking...

No Celling Out For Me

[borgasm]

I'll keep with the posts about hating cell phones.

If one more phone rings while I am taking my EE exams, I am going to take the loaded weapon out of my bag and shoot the person/phone/both.

How many people have been interrupted mid-conversation by some asshole taking a call?

Everyone please raise their hands.

The world isn't going anywhere in the few hours that you might not have your phone on you. People survived for thousands of years without being attached at the hip to a communication device.

I'll opt out of being wired all the time. I personally hate most people, hate the phone, and therefore don't want to talk to them.

Re:No Celling Out For Me

[Lemmeoutada Collecti]

Here here!

When a cell phone interrupts a conversation I am in, I walk away. Apparently the conversation was not important. And I won't go back to it. Same for the rare theatrical event I attend. Once the phone rings, I know some idiot is about to have a 50 minute conversation rather loudly. To me, it's a matter of courtesy and principle (sp?). I have had a cell phone, it served no real purpose. I have even gone so far as to tell my employer that I will not carry one. Nothing is important enough to me to warrant it.

heh

[machine of god]

I was talking to one of my friends from over there about cell phones, and how people consider it rude. Today at lunch (in a cafeteria mind you) someone's phone rang, and his friends were hushing him before he even picked it up. I guess it's just not like that. Here it's almost considered rude to be talking on your phone in a public place. I feel like I need a telephone booth to use mine. I guess it's just not that way at all over there.

Speaking as one who has to carry a pager & cel

[bryanp]

... I have made it well known that if I ever strike it rich I will be taking both to the firing range - one last time.

Social faux pas, my eye

[dswensen]

It's articles like this that make me glad I don't have to have a cell phone for work (because I wouldn't choose to have one on my own).

Feeling like you "have to" have your little digital gadget in order to feel "connected to the world" is something I find not only humorously ironic, but it also smacks of being a slave to your own technology, which is an idea I find unpleasant. Cell phones can be great tools, but they're not status symbols anymore (at least, not in the positive sense), and they should not be running your life.

Re:Social faux pas, my eye

[Anonymous Coward]

Spoken like someone who thinks himself better than those of us with cell phones.

I used to be like you. Then I got laid.

Re:Social faux pas, my eye

[Anonymous Coward]

Sure you did, pal. Sure you did.

keeping up with the joneses?

[Anonymous Coward]

if we're to believe slashdot, it's keeping up with the gooks. give it up. go jerk off to akira or something.

Theatre work - cell phone is deity-sent

[Scodiddly]

A lot of people here bitching about cell phones are probably those who have fairly regular locations (normal office hours, then home).

I do stagehand work, among other things. Most stagehands around here carry cellphones, and that's the primary contact for the union business agent (BA). In this case it's important to be reachable, and the BA rarely wastes one's time on the phone anyway.

I'd much rather be able to be anywhere - home, at another gig, downtown in a tea shop, etc. than have to be constantly checking my messages at home. I suppose they had methods before telephones became common, but I have better things to do than drop by the union hall every morning to see if there's work.

Re:Theatre work - cell phone is deity-sent

[mce]

A lot of people here bitching about cell phones are probably those who have fairly regular locations (normal office hours, then home).

I can't speak for the other bitchers, but this definitely is not the case for me. I'm at home about 11 hours a day (including weekends). 7-8 of those are put aside for sleeping, during 1-2 of them I'm on the net (which in my case locks up my phone). In addition, my working hours are shifted by about 2-3 hours compared to those of the average person, so people will indeed have a hard time catching my on the phone (definitely when at home). Finally, the only people who know my office phone number are 1) immediate collegues, 2) my parents. Mankind survived for a long time and produced some amazing things without everyone being reachable all the time.

I definitely agree

[offpath3]

Having lived in Japan for 6 months, I can totally agree. I had very limited internet access, but I had the equivalent of IM on me at all times. If I didn't have my keitai on me I didn't know where or when my friends were meeting. It was like not having AIM/ICQ/email is here in America as a college student.

Re:I definitely agree

[Anonymous Coward]

This is exactly right - as others have mentioned, here in Australia mobile phones are used far more for SMSes than for actual phone calls. It's MSN/ICQ/AIM to go

only...

[Anonymous Coward]

only fags and whiney women like martha stewart come up with this social taboo horseshit. fuck you all ill do what i want. i will not check my email more than once a week, ill let my phone battery die when i feel like it. fuck aim its for whiny consumer oriented teenie boppers. if wanna get a hold of me, to fucking bad. you wannacommunicate with me, write me a letter. does any one actually do that anymore? hey fuck rags, do you actually know how to write?

I really dislike cell phones

[grasshoppah]

My major problem with them is that they fragment social interaction and thus decrease its quality. Plans are no longer respected or valued since "you can call me when you're ready to do somethin'. I should have my cell on"
The most major annoyance i have is when I'm hanging out with someone, having a good time, and they get a call and an invitation to go somewhere else. Its just overly intrusive and disrespectful

Re:I really dislike cell phones

[entrigant]

Perpare yourself, my evidence is going to be as unsubstantiated as yours, but that's ok 'cause this is more fun ;).

Plans are no longer respected or valued since "you can call me when you're ready to do somethin'. I should have my cell on"

Think about the point in making a plan and keeping time in general. The whole idea is that you decide to do something while your in contact with a person, and then time and location is the only means you have of "contact" after that. You show up at the specified time and place, and hopefully the other person did too.

New technologies obsolete that kind of thinking, and provide us with the flexability of being able to do things on a whim and while on the move. It's a step foreward, not backward.

The most major annoyance i have is when I'm hanging out with someone, having a good time, and they get a call and an invitation to go somewhere else. Its just overly intrusive and disrespectful

There will always be rude people unfortunately. This is a problem with their attitude than the new technologies. I'll make plans with people while I'm already engaged in something else, but I'll make the plan in a way that doesn't sell short the current situation. IF I PLAN to do something like that then I let someone know, like "hey I got something comin gup, but I don't know when.. wanna chill 'till I gtg?"

"Required" email

[technomom]

I just filled out form for a week-long drama camp for my son. The entry field for "email address" was REQUIRED. That's the first time I've seen a required email address for something that was not an electronic order or membership.

JoAnn

no use for a cell phone

[Kevin]

I have no personal need for a cell phone. I have to carry a pager for work, but that has 2-way capabilities. I enjoy not being tied to a cell phone, quiet time good.

Re:no use for a cell phone

[Cro Magnon]

I just recently got a cell phone. Strictly for emergency use; it would suck if my car broke down in the middle of nowhere without it.

Breaking Stuff

[the.pornlord]

So far it has only happened once, but I was disturbed numerous times by the same person in a movie theatre. He happened to be sitting right in front of me, and answered his phone a total of 3 times, after it ringing loudly. The first time he was asked politely to turn it off, the second time he was told to turn the f***ing thing off, or it would be broken. The third time it was broken.
People who think that letting your battery run out is a taboo are the least of my concern. Those who feel that they can interrupt anyone anyplace with their meaningless conversations are my concern. Quite simply, people need to stop and realize that they don't need to be tethered 24/7.
Just my $0.02

Re:Breaking Stuff

[PigleT]

"The third time it was broken."

Good on ya!

I'm on my ~5th mobile in as many years, myself, and consider it my main voice-mode comms device.

And I tend to agree - there are those who really cheese me off by either wandering down the street yelling into their phones ("HI! HOW'RE YOU?" - to which I invariably reply `fine, you?'), or by relaying every single pause on the train to their office.

The technology exists to make mobiles quiet and unobtrusive - vibrate-then-ring on Motorolas, easy choice of different "profile"s on Nokias, various ways to filter calls (either by simply not ringing or actively filtering calls down to a select group): you name it. The problems we experience are simply due to other peoples' inconsideration and/or willful ignorance of how to operate the blighters.

News flash, technology changes communication

[Christopher Bibbs]

You're absolutely correct, in my opinion. In the same way moveable print radically changed mass communication and then followed by broadcast mediums, point-to-point communications caused a massive up heave in interpersonal communication which was altered again by person-to-person communication. That's what we're really talking about here, isn't it? For those of us old enough to remember the last time a socialist ran for the presidency of the United States, getting a hold of someone used to mean calling them at work, then trying them at home, and possibly calling the club/bar/gym to see where they were. Today, you call the person regardless of where they are. That also means that you never get the brief contact with another person at the same location because thats not the way it works.

Just a few thoughts.

keeping plates clean

[zogger]

--not sure of it's effectiveness on solid chemical batteries, but the lead acid storage batts we use in the solar rigs here all have "oscillators" on them that act to stop or reverse sulphation on the plates. They seem to work well, too, I noticed a significant lessening of charge cycles (to basically run the same amount of stuff the same amount of time, normal daily use) and a return to visual clarity of the electrolyte after they were installed for a few weeks. Commercially they can be found under "desulphator" search. From what I understand of the tech, granted I am not an EE so not an expert, but they attach across the terminals in a short circuit manner, using the batteries own power as their power source, very small amount of draw obviously. They at a certain frequency pop a charge back and forth, shocking the sulphates off the plates and back into solution as sulphuric acid. Keeping the plates clean allows a better transfer of power with the chemical reaction. Result, more efficiency and greatly extended battery life. I hope that's a good representation, perhaps someone else here more knowledgeable and who is versant in this tech can explain it better or more accurately.

Re:I'm Sacrificing +2 Karma To Say You're A MORON

[Chump1422]

You're really dense. You're paying in opportunity cost (what you could have earned during the time spent talking), not money, retard.

And you're paying for that local phone line somehow, whether or not you use it to talk to your friends. Actually, that makes you the idiot -- you're not using a service you already pay for. Not that I think talking to friends would really be something you'd have to worry about consuming lots of time...

Re:I'm Sacrificing +2 Karma To Say You're A MORON

[Bowie J. Poag]

Nope, sorry.

Where I come from, "free" means $0.

I pay $0 for local phone service.

Keep trying tho. I'm still holding out a little hope that it'll click with you one of these days... You know, that you're an idiot?

Not suprised

[Dynedain]

I live in Los Angeles, and my friends give me shit whenever they can't reach me because my battery is dead.

Consider this...

[The Kow]

Some people use cell phones as a means to contact people when it is most convenient. They do not project some sort of social status upon it, they do not attempt to impress people with it, they do not answer it when they don't want to, and they don't perceive their friends hate them if they don't answer immediately.

I can't understand why everybody (who's posting, at least) has this big hang-up on cell phones. It's like this approach to being 'cool' by hating that which is perceived as 'cool'. Is it okay to be 'geek' and not be a social troglodyte?

It feels like middle school, where everyone was so afraid that they saw uncertainty through 'threat' goggles.

SMS

[Kjella]

I really don't feel the need to be availible 24/7. I forget to charge my battery from time to time, or turn sound back on after having silenced it in lectures etc.

That said, I read SMS messages on a regular basis. Why? Because those I can ignore, read, reply as I choose. While not great for long conversations, something like a short message and a reply is easier over SMS than over the phone.

"I'll be about 15 mins late today" "Ok, I'll be in the computer lab" is typically what I want to do with a mobile phone. Not talking for hours, if I wanted to do that I'd normally be at home with a normal phone anyway. So while cell calls are overrated, cell phones are not.

Kjella

Re:I'm Sacrificing +2 Karma To Say You're A MORON

[SurgeonGeneral]

Dont you pay taxes?

What message are you replying to?

[GCP]

There wasn't a single thing in my post about "cool" or "hip".

It was about a single underlying communications infrastructure that would have all the value of today's cell phones, plus today's TV medium, plus the Web, plus individual needs such as a baby monitor or "help button" for the elderly....

With all of those services delivered via the same underlying transport, the need to remain in touch with that transport ("the Net"), will be the sum of the need for all of those services. Even though every person will value some of the services highly, some other services just a little, and most services not at all, the value of the Net connection that makes them all possible will be huge for almost everyone.

Therefore, maintaining an always on connection to the Net will become enormously important.

What about that idea -- essentially a discussion of a new utility like running water or electricity -- sent you off on a rant about being "hip"? Is having electricity and running water too hip for you, too?

Re:What message are you replying to?

[Lemmeoutada Collecti]

I am glad you said almost everyone. I am finding the value of each of those, internet included, is rapidly falling off for me. What communications needs I have are met by face to face, the only net sites I use are NOAA and (of course) slashdot. The more I see of this trend, the less I want to be connected. Just my view, but I want to spend my time on something other than constantly being interrupted.

Re:What message are you replying to?

[GCP]

Yes, in fact I suspect that any trend this strong will provoke a strong backlash, creating a market for "unplugged vacations" and that sort of thing.

This is an utterly extraneous observation

[SurgeonGeneral]

So humanity comes to the brink of Star Trek-like communicator devices that allow instant messaging with anyone, anywhere, and we are supposed to be suprised that this has changed the way people interact?

In case this guy hadnt noticed, humans didnt come this far through pantomime. Human interaction consists of words expressed either orally or in writing. cell phones affect interaction? oh wow.

Re:This is an utterly extraneous observation

[Anonymous Coward]

As the original submitter I wasn't saying that I'm surprised.
I submitted to the story to generate a discussion.
Slashdot is a site geared towards people with work with and around 'technology'. I think it's healthy that every so often we reflect on how we use it. It's a good thing when we take time out of our busy schedules and think.

-- Mortimer.CA

Yes, you are.

[AndyChrist]

News for NERDS....the sort of people who will have to go farther afield to find their social circle. Anything that makes that simpler is a good thing, IMO.

A lack of civility

[gordgekko]

I'm rather tired of people blaming cellphones for a lack of civility by their owners. A lack of manners didn't rise up concurrently with cellphones, it predates their widespread introduction. Cellphones merely allow their owners to be uncivil in newer ways. The term asshole wasn't coined in the early 1980s, was it?

I own a cellphone but I turn it off/vibe mode when I'm at a theatre or any place where it's ringing could be disruptive. I do not stop talking to someone merely because my phone is ringing unless the call is of considerable importance or business. Many people do this but a large minority does not and therefore paints the technology as disruptive and not the person.

Frankly, people who don't wash every day bother me more than a ringing phone, and I hate the sound of ringing phones.

where is the point?

[Anonymous Coward]

we still need pussies...

Health risks

[deragon]

I dislike cell phones because of the health risks. Remember the following Slashdot article?

If it were not of the health effect, I would cancel my regular phone line and go for a cell phone all the way.

Mobiles 'cut teenage smoking'

[Anonymous Coward]

Another effect mobiles are having on youth culture is that there are fewer teenaged smokers. Mobile phones are replacing cigarettes as a symbol of rebellion and fashion. For more details, see http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/1004239.stm

Also, sometimes, people smoke because it gives them something to do instead of just sitting there by themselves looking and feeling awkward. Sending a text-message (SMS) by a cellphone has the same effect and is a substtute for smoking a cigarette.

Same Phone Number

[socalmtb]

I only use my cell phone because I always have the same phone number. Even if I move every six months, my number can stay the same. I don't even have a land line now.

I don't have a problem with my phone interferring with life. If I don't want to talk to someone, I don't answer it. Actually, I usually don't want to talk to people, so unless I'm expecting a call, I usually don't answer it.

I think the article is partly right about leaving your phone off being taboo. I find that people get upset when my phone is off. The seem to think something is wrong and that I won't get their message. This is why if I really don't want to be bothered, I turn the ringer off.

At first I thought that people are stupid for thinking that I'll get the message quicker if my phone is on than when it is off even though I sometimes go as long as week without checking my voicemail (those who really need to reach me send email). But then I remembered that when my ringer is off, I still get to see missed calls and I will call friends back without checking for their message.

No cell becoming a status symbol

[0x0d0a]

If all that makes me a social outcast, than so be it.

I was reading about how owning a cell phone used to be considered a status symbol -- you were so important that you had to be contactable at any time.

Now, things have moved more towards being powerful enough that a company can't force you to lug around a phone to break in on you being a status symbol.

I don't really care one way or the other about status symbols, but I very much want to never have to carry one. It's a leash, and it takes away the justifiable excuse ("I wasn't near a phone") that essentially gives us the last vestige of privacy and solitude in our lives.

I've done some security work, and the implications of carrying a cell are more than a little disturbing. You can be monitored by law enforcement by having your phone kick into listening mode automatically. People's movement is regularly monitored, and that information sold -- Slashdot even ran a story about one of the companies using this information to locate traffic jams. Essentially, not only your current location but the paths you travel become commercially salable information.

Here's to a cell-free life.

Re:No cell becoming a status symbol

[mce]

It's a leash, and it takes away the justifiable excuse ("I wasn't near a phone") that essentially gives us the last vestige of privacy and solitude in our lives.

That is very well said! Here's to a cell-free life.

Amen to that!

Re:No cell becoming a status symbol

[DoraLives]

That is very well said! Here's to a cell-free life.

Indeed. Gave my last tv away in '98. No radio, no vcr, no nuthin. This PC has a dialup connection and that's MORE than enough of this crap for me. Peace, freedom, self-sufficiency, and tranquility. Any problems with that? The hive mentality is NOT for me. If you like it, then fine. Drink as deep as you wish. Just don't go pushing any of that snake oil my way, 'cause I ain't buying.

Edward Abbey was right.

Re:No cell becoming a status symbol

[Anonymous Coward]

*groan*

To beat the dead horse...

[ewhenn]

About this whole cell phone issue. The user is at fault if they are interrupted. If you want to be left alone, turn it off. If you are feeling particurlarly adeventerous (and female) set it to vibreate and stick it down your pants.

I use that button all the time. It is an off button, quite an elementary concept. A little piece of clicking plastic is all it is. On...off...on...off. I dont need to know immediately if my neighbor is attempting to stick his hand up my dog's a$$ while playing dixie on a harmonica. Well, actually I would want to know about that, maybe I'd even try to get home to tape it and sell it.

So if the above happens, call me immediatly, hopefully the power is turned on, if not, it's off for a good reason.

Metcalfe's (sp?) Law

[Anonymous Coward]

The value of a network grows with the scare of it's connections. (Or something like that; check the Jargon File.)

Taboo?

[CAIMLAS]

If not having a cell phone is the 'new taboo', what was the old taboo? I'm not aware of any sort of cultural taboo here in the US, unless it's something like sleeping with the ugly whore, or actually caring about something higher than yourself.

you didn't have +2 karma to begin with

[smitty45]

so you're saying that if you don't have a long distance plan in Tuscon, then you pay NO telephone company NO money, yet you can call someone on a local number from YOUR phone ? you pay $0.00 for phone service ? bullshit. not only do I not believe you, I challenge you to tell me how you manage to do that.

where *most* americans come from, you DO have to pay to use a phone. I have a cell phone, and I don't use it to talk to friends. If I DIDN'T have a cell phone, then I would not have work, period. I need it for my job, and so do a lot of other people. Maybe you'll be happy when you don't have a cell phone to call 911 after you have a heart attack driving on the desert highway, huh ?

Who are you, to imply that having a cell phone is useless ?

Re:you didn't have +2 karma to begin with

[Bowie J. Poag]

I've never seen a person get so defensive over a vibrator. Wow.

Cell phones are too damn unreliable

[thick-n-chunky]

I got rid of my cell phone recently. Yes, they're annoying, and people that use them a lot are annoying, but the real reason I got rid of it was that I was tired of having calls dropped, of not being able to hear the other end, of them not being able to hear me, and of calls just not going through. I asked around to see if anyone had had a better experience with their provider and the universal response was "no, they all suck". So until they don't suck, I refuse to give 'em any more of my of my money.

lonely

[Anonymous Coward]

people who chat on cell phones CONSTANTLY cant stand just BEING where they are. wherever they go, they want to be somewhere else. it makes them feel like they are important and have a life. the truth is they are constantly running from life.

The new taboo

[bmckeever]

'One college student I spoke to described leaving one's phone at home or letting the battery die as "the new taboo."'

Great! Just what the Japanese need - another way to lose face.

For what it's worth

[Asahi Super Dry]

I lived in Japan for a year and I can verify that you pretty much need a cell phone if you want to conduct any sort of social life. It's a kind of ritual to exchange numbers very shortly after meeting a new person: you'd slip right through the cracks without a cell phone. And as has been posted elsewhere, text messaging completely overshadows voice conversations in terms of frequency of use/effectiveness. After you get used to it you can type quicker than you might think on the keypad (though somehow it seems that Japanese is a little better suited to that sort of entry). Their phones are also years ahead of what's available in the US.

Re:For what it's worth

[RAZOR]

The only thing i was thinking about while reading that article is how incredibly annoying it is to write SMS in english, and cycling though all letters again if you accidentally skipped the one you wanted... typing anything more than "i'll be at 8:30 there" seems like sooo much work

And japanese input system would seem even more strange/difficult with all the extra charachters available. How DO they input stuff? Is it more convinient that english sms T9 or whatever it's called?

Well, not this Jones.

[coloth]

Is it simply a matter of keeping up with the Joneses?

I know this guy named Jones who is a complete dummy. Keeping up with him is like sleeping in slow motion.

It's got to be something else.

Keeping up with the Joneses

[MythosTraecer]

Is it simply a matter of keeping up with the Joneses?

I think the most positive aspect of cell phones are that you can keep up with the Joneses, but not in the way you think.

When landline-based telephones started to become widespread, they allowed people to communicate over long distances. You could keep up with Mom, Dad, Grandma, and your friends in another state. But only if they were home. Answering machines partially solved this problem, because you could leave messages, but it isn't the same. Cheap, affordable cell phones have allowed the world to keep in touch much more easily than ever before.

I'll use myself as an example. I live in the Western USA, while most of my family and some of my friends live in the Eastern USA. Most of us work weird schedules; some work 12-hour hospital shifts, some work 3rd shift, others normal shifts. There's no real way to keep track of when someone's available and when they're not. Calling a person's house doesn't mean much; is the person at work, or are they just not home? Call their cell phone. If they can talk, they'll answer their phone and talk. If they can't talk, you can leave a message and know they'll get your message as soon as possible, not when they get home (whenever that is). None of us would ever be able to actually talk to each other without cell phones; we're hardly ever home at the same time.

A lot of people don't like cell phones; they don't like the potential of being bothered every minute by others. That's fine (though if you need privacy for awhile, you can just turn your phone off). But many people enjoy the being able to keep in touch with friends and family much easier. Being able to immediately reach the actual person you want to talk to anywhere on the planet at any time has caused the world to be just a bit smaller. This positive benefit outweighs most of the negatives, IMHO.

Back to the caves!

[Cid Highwind]

Better get underground quick, then. There's radiation coming down from space that makes cell phone signals look insignificant by comparison.

You might want to avoid computers in the future, too. They spew all sorts of radiation, mostly at the user via the CRT.

Re:I'm Sacrificing +2 Karma To Say You're A MORON

[DoraLives]

This just about says it all

Inseperable!

[turiel]

My cell phone and I are inseperable. Seriously! I will not go ANYWHERE (including bed, shower, meetings, toilet) without it. Why? Cause I WANT to be contactable all the time.

I'm kinda getting the impression from some of the above messages that the "I hate cell phones" feeling is rather US-centric? I live in Dublin (Ireland), and I read a statistic recently (yeah yeah I know statistics can lie) that 9/10 adults in the city have a mobile phone (85% of which are nokia btw).

I've seen homeless people living on the street with mobile phones. I'd imagine the 10% is mainly comprised of the older (70+) age group. I'm involved in teaching a youth group of 10-16 year olds, with 30-40 in the group. Every single one of those children have phones. And no, their parents are certainly not rich.

So it really is the minority over here at least who are in the hate-cell-phones camp. Someone though made the point above that in Europe we have SMS - its actually a huge factor. In their personal lives (as opposed to their business/jobs), people simply do not ring anyone; everything is done via text.

I could actually rant on quite a bit more about this but... eh... its 3am, screw you guys I'm going to bed ;)

Re:Inseperable!

[Goth Biker Babe]

You and me both. The last estimate put 85% of the UKs population as cell phone owners. I originally bought a cell phone because I ride motorcycles and some of them are classics (ie old and knackered!) and so when they go wrong, which they do every now and then, I can call the recovery people and get myself home again.

Now I can't live without it. Me and my phone are inseparable. To me it's not just a phone it's a portable communications device. Yes I can receive and make calls with it (I use profiles to determine which calls I actually want to handle and which I want to automatically forward on to my voice mail), I can text people, I can send and receive e-mail (I used that recently to send an e-mail to my boss to tell him I was running late because my train to work had mechanicals problems). I can access information sites such as train time tables, the news headlines, phone directories and the like. In fact many of the uses of my phone mean I *don't* actually have to talk to people. Finally I use it as a walkman (MP3s).

I hardly ever use a land line. But I'm not being disturbed all the time by my cell phone rining. Because I live a life which means I'm often on the move the phone is an essential way of keeping in touch with my nearest and dearest. I see my cell phone as a social tool. I really can't understand the phobia that many slashdotters (predominently american) have of cell phones.

Japan... is that part of that axis of evil thingy?

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't think anyone cares what a few yuppie Japanese do with their cell phones.

Sign off slashdot, and go back to sitting in front of FOX News. Much more comfortable now, aren't you...

Placing cellphones before email?

[Tsuzuki]

Mobile phones are used way more in Australia than e-mail; while most people here look down on regular (or constant) net use as a nerdy thing, almost everyone with the means to do so owns a mobile phone. They're popular even with low-income earners and people on welfare. Like the author of the article, I noticed that when I was 15 my phone card was a permanent fixture, but now I don't carry one at all.

Some posters have said that this article refers to "a few Japanese yuppies", but three out of five people, or 80 million people, own a mobile phone. I don't call that "a few" by any stretch of the imagination! Their tech trends are very interesting to keep an eye on, as the majority of them will manifest themselves in the rest of the world to some extent. They're not always talking, they're writing e-mail to each other as well. I found that this article was pretty eye-opening with regards to mobile phone trends and usage in Japan.

I'm constantly noticing on cellphone threads that a bunch of posters complain with the subtext of "I don't use it, so the rest of you suck!" You do realise you probably sound like non-geek old fogey parents, right? ;)

Re: Japan has stronger society links

[Anonymous Coward]

Presuming "here" means the US... God forbid you should show team spirit about anything that doesn't involve two groups of multi-millionaires and a ball.

it is progress

[g4dget]

In the past, being excentric was very expensive. Today, you can be excentric and save money, too, by not having E-mail or a cell phone. Isn't progress great?

To people who hate cell phones for some reason

[Priyadi]

- You can turn off the phone if you don't want to be distubed, the caller will get voice mailbox instead
- On newer phones you can set only a few people that actually ring the phone if they call, others can be silently ignored or dropped.
- GSM supports two phone numbers on one SIM card (but I don't know any service providers who offer this service), then you can give the first number to all of your friends but give the second number to only a few important people
- Use SMS, treat them like email, check them whenever you have the time.

SMS Advertising

[X00M]

If not happening already i belive the "next big thing" (p.i.t.a.) with cell phones will be advertising through SMS so every store you walk by everyones cell will beep with a coupon or special which would get really annoying...

Xoom

wow, losers

[delong]

Frankly, if someone chided me for letting *my* cellphone at home, or off, or the battery dead, I'd tell them to go f*ck themselves and get a life.

This is really a case of technology run amok, if you ask me. A phone is a tool. I own the tool, the tool does not own me. There is nothing so urgent and pressing that my friends need to be able to contact me 24/7 wherever I am. It is intrusive, compulsive, obsessive, and frankly more than a tad wierd. Get a life, freak. Really.

One of my coworkers has a girlfriend that's one of these cellphone wierdos. She's calling the guy every 10 minutes, just to hear the guy breath. What the hell could you possible have to say? The girl had an 87 page, four column, front and back itemized cell bill last month. That's out of control. Turn off the phone, read a book. Take some time out to be alone and THINK for awhile, instead of losing yourself in idle shallow banter.

Derek

Re:wow, losers

[Zelig321]

A phone is a tool. I own the tool, the tool does not own me.

I have to agree. Cell phones are making slaves out of most people.

It reminds me of Bell Mobility's (in Canada) publicity, which was showing people outdoors. The narrator was talking about how much liberty you have when carrying a cell phone wherever you go.

Whereas actual liberty is the total opposite: there are MANY places where I choose not to be disturbed. The day you can't choose anymore, you lost that liberty.

Conversations in a car vs on a cell phone.

[Anonymous Coward]

What I have never understood is why talking on a cellphone (hands free, one button press answering) is more dangerous than talking to people that are with you in the car? Is it becasue of the distortions it's harder to process, you going out of range of the cell annoying to effect your driving?

Re:Conversations in a car vs on a cell phone.

[Anonymous Coward]

When you're in a car with someone, the conversation temporalily pauses when your in a "danger" situation (which allows the driver to concentrate more on driving).

However, this doesn't occur when people are talking with someone else on a cell phone.

Don't believe me? Hold a conversation with someone driving, and watch what happens when you're entering some problem areas.

Re:Conversations in a car vs on a cell phone.

[Anonymous Coward]

Yep, you're completely right, except you're missing one thing - on a cell phone, the person at the other end of the line cannot sense that the driver is in a stressful situation. The driver feels a social pressure to keep up the conversation, and doesn't pay enough attention to the road. It's amazing how I can spot a cell-phone talker just based on their driving actions: typically just tailgating the person in front of them. This happens even if there is no reason to tailgate (there never is, but I mean there is no traffic), or if the car they are tailgating is driving too slow and should be passed, or even if they are tailgating a someone who's already pushing a yellow light.

Re:Americans...Some Suitable Adjectives

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, you did. You fail to mention which little shithole of a country you're from. I would be more than happy to ridicule it in my own boorish, unsophisticated, loud, ignorant, stupid, insular, clueless, racist, xenophobic, stubborn, pigheaded, meddling, hubris way.

Re:Am I the only that hates Americans?

[Anonymous Coward]

That's ok, we love you anyway.

It is important to remember...

[fightinjoe]

that in Japanese society, many students as well as professionals spend at least an hour riding public transportation every day. This provides quite a bit of time to play with one's cell phone. In Japan, cities are crowded, streets are winding and only occassionally named, and buildings are numbered non-consecutively, making the finding of meeting places difficult. In Japan, where three to four generations usually live under the same roof in a house whose walls are hardly thicker than two inches, privacy is unheard of. Thus, anything that provides a sense of privacy (a personal cell phone from which you can make personal calls, write personal emails (not just text messaging), take personal photos (ooh la la)) is attractive.

While it is possible to live in Japan without a cell phone, the benefits of having one are vast compared to having one in the United States.

All is not positive, though. With cameras on mobile phones vouyerism has never been easier. And with such huge mobile phone penetration with teens and young adults, mobile phone companies in Japan are now looking for new users and are targeting elementary school students.

/. crowd

[Anonymous Coward]

Why am I not surprised that most of the comments that get any karma in this thread start out with something like, "I hate cellphones"..or "I don't really need phones".. etc etc. You get the point. The majority of the slashdotters seem to have some kind of hate relationship to the phone, and they can't understand why cellphones are important. I can tell you from personal experience (yes, I do live in Japan and I do have a keitai) why a keitai is a must.

I should be honest though, I didn't want to get one at first, but as time progressed it became a necessity. Most of my friends don't have a "normal" phone, just a cellphone. The prices to get a land-line phone from NTT is just outrageous. So if everybody else has a cellphone, well, that means you have to have one too. Not because it's cool, or anything like that, but just because it's the number one way of getting in touch with people.

People flaming about not wanting to be contactable every single second, there IS email on these phones. This is what I use my phone as mostly, a portable e-mail client and web-browser. It's damn convenient! And remember, a lot of people don't have computers, but they do have cellphones. So you can access alot of information over it, how long is the bowling alley open? Where is the nearest post-office? Are there any seats left for that new movie tonight? etc etc.

So in conclusion, let me pull an analogy. People who aren't good at math, think math is stupid. Socialy incompatible nerds don't like tools that help you talk to people and get in touch.

Rasmus

Cell phones changed my life

[Harald74]

I'm married today, mostly because of the cell phone. My then-girlfriend was an exchange student here (Kongsberg, Norway) when we got together, but then she had to go back home (Latvia). The alternative to keep in touch by cell phone was the one land phone in the student dowm (less private, had to arrange beforehand) or letters (less interactive in the short term). So I _love_ cell phones! I've spent a small fortune on phone bills, tho'...

the new taboo

[edxwelch]

leaving one's phone at home or letting the battery die as "the new taboo." What about people who have conversations while they are carring out essencial body functions? This to me seems to be a much worse taboo, but maybe it's just because I'm old fashioned (or not Japanese). I mean don't they think the person on the other end is a bit put off by the strange noises? An I don't even want to consider the hygene issue.

Re:I'm Sacrificing +2 Karma To Say You're A MORON

[Anonymous Coward]

I find it hilarious that you people have been suckered into paying what amounts to a daily fee for simply communicating with your friends.

Of course, Bowie's parents pay for the basement Internet connection he uses to talk on the web or email. Not that he has many friends there...

Yes, I occasionally eat my own words.

And since Bowie is invariably talking shit, that must mean... ew.

Last Post!

[alpg]

Oxygen is a very toxic gas and an extreme fire hazard. It is fatal in
concentrations of as little as 0.000001 p.p.m. Humans exposed to the
oxygen concentrations die within a few minutes. Symptoms resemble very
much those of cyanide poisoning (blue face, etc.). In higher
concentrations, e.g. 20%, the toxic effect is somewhat delayed and it
takes about 2.5 billion inhalations before death takes place. The reason
for the delay is the difference in the mechanism of the toxic effect of
oxygen in 20% concentration. It apparently contributes to a complex
process called aging, of which very little is known, except that it is
always fatal.

However, the main disadvantage of the 20% oxygen concentration is in the
fact it is habit forming. The first inhalation (occurring at birth) is
sufficient to make oxygen addiction permanent. After that, any
considerable decrease in the daily oxygen doses results in death with
symptoms resembling those of cyanide poisoning.

Oxygen is an extreme fire hazard. All of the fires that were reported in
the continental U.S. for the period of the past 25 years were found to be
due to the presence of this gas in the atmosphere surrounding the buildings
in question.

Oxygen is especially dangerous because it is odorless, colorless and
tasteless, so that its presence can not be readily detected until it is
too late.
-- Chemical & Engineering News February 6, 1956

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