Worlds Largest Computer Party, In Progress

cyb97 writes "As I write this the worlds largest computerparty is going on in Hamar, Norway. The Gathering 2003 is in action with over 5.000 participants! Webcams and participants are live on the internet through a 1 gigabit line, so you better lock down your servers tonight!" Some of the webcam images are just surreal. Update: 04/17 01:00 GMT by T : Speaking of images, reader vvizard (currently Gathered) directs you to this directory of high-resolution images.

Comments

Geek Mecca

[dtolton]

This looks a lot like Woodstock for computer geeks.

The Tech Group (TG) has a page explaining the differences
between a "LAN Party" and a "Computer Party", here is an
excerpt:

"But LAN party and computer party is the same thing!"
No. LAN party and computer party is NOT the same thing. At a
LAN party everything is centered around the network. Everybody
just sits there, staring at their screens whilst copying porn,
warez and playing games. A computer party is much more. There
are competitions, both in computer games and computer
art. People meet, people talk, and there is plenty to see and
experience even when away from you computer. (I didn't even
bring my computer to TG01, and I had a great time!). Sometimes
there are shows on the stage (LAN parties don't even have a
stage), and even speeches you can go to to learn more computer
stuff. How about learning something new and fun to impress your
friends when you get back home?

If you want to read the full page go here:
http://tg.nlc.no/notalan.html

We need to get one of these going in the US. :-)

Re:Geek Mecca

[Eneff]

We had one.

It was called NAID. (Or wait... was it in Canada? I forget...)

In any event, it folded after a few years.

Re:Geek Mecca

[override11]

No, we rich geeks bring it all too.

1) The leather padded seat (folding chairs suck ass)
2) The tower with 6 HDD's all with rounded cables and neon light kit for oohs and ahhs
3) The flat panel monitor (beats lugginng that old viewsonic P810 21", you know which one I'm talkin about)
4) Premium headphones with extension cable (nothing worse than gettin cozy with your PC since that 5 foot cable barely come to the front of your pc)
5) And last but not least, a laptop, to scour the network with ShareScan and download movies, iso's, and games while fragging your friends into oblivian.

Re:Geek Mecca

[zaffir]

A LAN can have all of that. There's no golden rule prohibiting a stage (last MPCON i went to had a pretty big one with a dj and other stuff), or coding, or interacting with other people. In fact, every LAN i go to has lots of interactions that don't involve the computer. There's more reasons to go to them than low pings for gaming and lots of bandwidth for file sharing.

True, a "computer party" emphasizes that and more, but that doens't mean everyone just stares at their screens at a LAN.

Re:Geek Mecca

[Anonymous Coward]

Geekstock?

Re:Geek Mecca

[zedmelon]

...said the pot to the kettle.

Or at least the pot THOUGHT it was speaking to the kettle. It didn't even realize that the European standard for printing numbers exhibits an apparent reverse of the American usage of the period and the comma.

So, while an American might say there were "five thousand attendees" and type "5,000 attendees," someone else in--oh, I don't know, NORWAY?--would type "5.000 attendees."

The raindrop who lives up to his name quite well: is he a hypocrite for shouting the label "stupid," or is he merely ignorant? And is that any better?

Strange how some folks can never see around the corner, even living in a glass house.

Re:Geek Mecca

[machine of god]

That's interesting, because I place people who type in all caps in that category too.

Re:Geek Mecca

[Quixotic Raindrop]

It's funny you should mention that, because half the message is in sentence capitalization.

Re:Geek Mecca

[ciroknight]

Hey, have you heard of Million Man Lan? That's this lan party with 4k people in the us, with about 1k in kentucky (my ol home) and 3k out in cali connected over oc3. Pretty fun, but sadly im not going to be able to make the next one :

Re:Geek Mecca

[xmda]

Ok, I'm from Sweden. That means that I normally use a decimal comma. When writing in *Swedish!* Comprende?

This fact aside, I have started to think that using comma as decimal separator is not a very good idea. Just one example, look how strange a coordinate may be written (x,y): 10,5,20,5. Eh? At least in this context, the "english way" of doing it is more readable: 10.5,20.5.

One yhing I dont understand is why the english (or is it only american-english?) word for 10^9 is "billion" but the Swedish (and other Scandinavian anguages, and I think also French but I'm not sure) is "miljard". The reason this gets confusing is that we also have "biljon" (10^12) which I guess is trillion in english, right?

Just my two cents.

Re:Geek Mecca

[sniser2]

This looks a lot like Woodstock for computer geeks.

Well, actually it's a Woodstocks for sceners. If you want to become one, too, click here =P

Re:Geek Mecca

[zokum]

Ok, I am at TG, and this my 6th or so, and there seems to be a lot of misconceptions about what it is.

It is a scene-event, with some gaming compos thrown in for good fun. This means people program demos, intros, track music or make gfx and enter compos. This is nothing like a LAN-party or QuakeCon or DEFcon. And as for size, take in mind that the first 3500 or so tickets they put iut for sale were sold in 2 days. TG could have been a lot bigger, if there was a suitable place, and if there was a point. It is also 100% BYOC, and is regarded as one of the biggest parties in the world, along with Assembly, Dreamhack and Breakpoint. Websites for those are easy to find.

As for the scene-culture itself and downlading the stuff I mentioned earlier, try a site like: www.scene.org

Re:Geek Mecca

[zsazsa]

It was in Montreal in 1995 and 1996. It's still sorta around, at naid.net though it's only really about coding now.

There have been other smaller North American parties, but nothing approaching the size of NAID.

Re:Geek Mecca

[Quixotic Raindrop]

Yes, I know that. Did it ever occur to you that I did it on purpose? Specifically because it is "like" shouting?

Oh, yeah, that's right. This is slashdot after all. The odds of any particular person doing it intentionally are slim to none.

hmmm

[fjordboy]

If I wanted to watch geeks playing on computers I'd either go to work or get a mirror. Webcams...bah!

Re:hmmm

[Graspee_Leemoor]

" If I wanted to watch geeks playing on computers I'd either go to work or get a mirror."

Yeah, better use a 'mirror' in case you slashdot yourself...

graspee

Re:hmmm

[Graspee_Leemoor]

My username is my real name. I wonder how bored you had to be to insult me.

graspee

Sure, the webcams are great...

[TheBrownShow]

... but what about the SMELL of that many computer nerds gathered in an area like that! I hope the place has proper ventilation.

Re:Sure, the webcams are great...

[morbuz]

Hmmmm. no. :)

Re:Sure, the webcams are great...

[NanoGator]

"... but what about the SMELL of that many computer nerds gathered in an area like that! I hope the place has proper ventilation. "

What about the roar of laughter that'd ensue if soembody let one of those smells out? Deafening.

American numbering...

[c_jonescc]

Perhaps there are only 5.000 participants, but that would imply the ability to have 5.001 participants, and that is just sick.

Seriously, for all the times people complain about /. being US-centric, I had to re-read the number because of it's crazy euro-scheme.

No Alcohol

[AppyPappy]

Beverages containing alcohol is not allowed inside the hall or anywhere near it

--

Well, what's the point then? 5,000 sober guys all trying to impress each other with the size of their equipment. It's like Hell.

Re:No Alcohol

[gl4ss]

well, nobody else made a proper comment to this.. so here goes:

that means that if you want to drink inside, you have to smugle the beverages, which means that when you want to drink you wander outside(besides, it's norway, drinking is f**** expensive). also it would be hell for the organizers to get permits for an event where drinking would be allowed and minors would be present, also, this way, they can deny access by all the guys that are _TOO_ drunk for their own good(happens at most parties, that are 'alcohol free').

the 'no booze' is just a remark that the organizers try to keep the boozing to minimum and not scare away any parents too(would you let your kid into an event that said 'drinking is ok, bring your own booze'). however drinking has been, is , and will be a very common in demoparties.

Re:No Alcohol

[matvei]

If you had ever participated in a demo party (or "computer party" as TG organizers have called it for the past few years) you'd know that the "no alcohol" policy doesn't mean that people don't drink alcohol ;-)

Usually the majority of demo sceners (the people who come there to participate in the art competitions) spend most of their time outside the party hall, boozing around open fire with other likeminded folks that they can only meet at parties.

When the Finnish equivalent party, Assembly (it is also one of the oldest demoparties along with The Gathering) is held, there is a shadow party called Boozembly going on in the nearby woods and you can find all the demo scene legends out there when there are no competitions running.

I hope that the quality of releases at TG will be OK, but I'm afraid that the majority of people will go to Breakpoint instead which is a strictly demo scene oriented party.

1500 drunk guys all trying to impress each other with real-time computer generated art. It might not be heaven but it's far from Hell.

Oh well, back to coding my demo for BP..

Re:No Alcohol

[phorm]

5,000 sober guys all trying to impress each other with the size of their equipment. It's like Hell.

And you think 5,000 drunk guys would be better? At least this way the few females attending the event don't have to worry about being drooled on too much.

Re:No Alcohol

[ManoMarks]

Or a great night on the town for 10% of us.

Re:No Alcohol

[ciroknight]

nah, they have caffiene drinks like bawls.... that's gotta cause problems like alcohol after you've had so many... i drank like 3 of them at the last lan party I attended (lanwar) at once and had to fight off the snakes coming out of my monitor with my chair :)

Oops

[xanadu-xtroot.com]

I think we all slashdotted Norway...

/Me high fives everyone.

Re:Oops

[brianosaurus]

heh. I guess their Gigabit connection is stuck behind a dialup somewhere.

Re:Oops

[MoonBuggy]

...participants are live on the internet through a 1 gigabit line...

Well at least it serves those 500 errors very quickly...

Re:Oops

[agallagh42]

You could put a few dozen gigabit lines in, and it still wouldn't do you any good if the web server is running on a 486SX.

Re:Oops

[MoonFog]

I think we all slashdotted Norway...

Damn .... I thought traffic was slower today than normal, took me 15 more minutes to get home from school..

Heh

[NanoGator]

"As I write this the worlds largest computerparty is going on in Hamar, Norway. The Gathering 2003 is in action with over 5.000 participants!"

They'd have 10,000 participants if they brought datess!

Re:Heh

[AppyPappy]

"They'd have 10,000 participants if they brought datess!"

Dates! What a hoot! If they could get a date, they wouldn't be THERE!

Re:Heh

[telstar]

"They'd have 10,000 participants if they brought dates!"

• Yeah, except for the fact the half of them are dating somebody from IRC who's actually a guy, and the other half have developed crushes on their Sims.

Re:only 5.000?

[Anonymous Coward]

5 people is a huge amount of friends to the average slashdotter.

In most of Europe

[Razor Blades are Not]

they use a "." instead of a "," to delimit their thousands. It's not a mistake. It's a communication deficit. Get over it.

Re:In most of Europe

[morbuz]

Yep, an I hate it. Annoying giving coordinates as ((0,4),(2,4),(2,4)). "." as a decimalmark is some of the (few) things they got right in UK&US.

Re:In most of Europe

[colin_n]

It annoys me when people make jokes that prove their ignorance.

Re:In most of Europe

[stratjakt]

And SI says to use a space, and a "." as the decimal separator. Europe and America are wrong.

It's 5 000 000.00, not 5,000,000.00 or 5.000.000,00

Friggin people and their friggin lack of respect for standards.

And it's gibibit, not gigabit (unless it's actually 1 000 000 000 bits per sec)

Re:In most of Europe

[Anonymous Coward]

>It's 5 000 000.00, not 5,000,000.00 or 5.000.000,00
>Friggin people and their friggin lack of respect for standards.

I just wish more people would use standards for dates too (wtf is "01-02-03")

Today is 2003-04-16 and there's 5 000 people at the Gathering 2003, and that's all there is to it!

Re:In most of Europe

[agallagh42]

Generally, lines speeds are measured in base ten, so gigabit is correct in this case.

Re:In most of Europe

[mrand]

> And it's gibibit, not gigabit (unless it's actually 1 000 000 000 bits per sec)

Considering they are likely referring to a gigabit Ethernet connection, gigabit is correct.

GbE uses a 125.00 MHz (or divided version of that) reference clock, multiplied by ten, to transmit data with. When you remove the 25% 8B/10B overhead (how efficient is Ethernet again?), it effectively transmits a bit on every clock cycle of the 1000 MHz clock.

gibi (and kibi) are typically used with regard to things that have address lines (memory).

Re:In most of Europe

[agallagh42]

Yeah, I agree with the date thing. Neither the north amercan nor the european date format makes sense. mm-dd-yyyy or dd-mm-yyyy, neither of them will sort correctly if you're doing numerical sorting.

The ISO standard is yyyy-mm-dd, so why doesn't everybody just use that?

Re:In most of Europe

[c13v3rm0nk3y]

...or it means that /. is locale-nonspecific and conforms to some defintion of I18N.

Take your pick!

Re:In most of Europe

[MalleusEBHC]

What, do you think we are gullibe? Next thing you are going to tell me they do something weird like switch the month and day around when giving the date.

Re:In most of Europe

[phorm]

• /. is an American hosted site.
• It is read all around the world
• The event is not in America, it's in Europe
• Residents more local to the event would find this more interesting, as they might want to join in if they have time, or sign up for the next event - unless you feel like a flight to Norway in order to participate?

but it does give rise to childish comments.
I think you just explained yourself readily enough. The explanation of the . is fine, no need to make a big issue of it.

Re:In most of Europe

[Xerithane]

It's as improper to use European numbering here as it is to post stories in Kanji. Not that what's improper stops anyone from doing it, but it does give rise to childish comments.

Actually, they block out Japanese text on here. It's really annoying. I've tried to post in Japanese a few times in my journal using different Japanese charsets (UTF, JP-EUC) and it will throw them out each time.

If it's my journal, why can't I write in Japanese, damnit! I guess there is always slashdot.jp... Oddly enough my uid is in close range there, as it is here :)

Re:In most of Europe

[Evil-G]

in most of europe, "." and "," switches YOU!

Re:In most of Europe

[alekd]

But in Norway they don't use neither at period nor a comma to delimit their thousands, they use spaces.

Re:In most of Europe

[Eslyjah]

they use a "." instead of a "," to delimit their thousands. It's not a mistake.

What? No Europeans arguing that a period is BETTER than the American comma? You guys have really eased up lately.

Re:In most of Europe

[RzUpAnmsCwrds]

I just write my dates this way:

16 Apr 2003

The only problem is having a month name in English.

Re:In most of Europe

[TarPitt]

So that means we need to start calling the "." a "freedom comma"?

Re:In most of Europe

[Tyreth]

Slashdot is far from being just an American site. Sure, it's hosted there, but it could easily be hosted somewhere else.

I see no problem with representing these things as should be. There are a number of europeans here, and it's not hard to understand once informed - whereas Kanji is clearly unacceptable because:
1. Almost everyone here wouldn't have a hope of reading it
2. You can't quickly explain in one post how to read Kanji

Re:In most of Europe

[a302b]

The Japanese do use the yyyy-mm-dd system.

Wait a minute. . .

[bplipschitz]

I thought the Internet *was* the world's largest computer party. *Now* you're telling me it's Norway?!

If you want...

[Niles_Stonne]

I have both of the girl's phone numbers, if anyone is interested...

Re:If you want...

[deblau]

My, um, friend is interested. Yeah, that's it. He's standing right next to me. Send me those numbers, will ya?

Re:If you want...

[fobbman]

...and I think that I saw one of them with Eddie Murphy the other night.

Re:If you want...

[Beek]

Congratulations! You got the joke!

Re:If you want...

[Kumiorava]

You are just jealous because you have seen too many documentaries of blonde Scandinavian females mating habits.

Seriously that kind of parties are not meant for girl searching. In my opinion they beat traditional male bonding activities like poker night, beer drinking or superbowl any day.

Besides it's not a LAN party where porn, warez and fragging is the only purpose.

Re:If you want...

[Mikey-San]

I guess if you can't use 'em, give 'em away, right?

Waste not, want not! :-)

-/-
Mikey-San

My mate has gone to this..

[Idimmu Xul]

and he's taken over 400 CDR discs with him.

Not that I'm emplying anything ;) I can't wait untill he gets back \o/ *cough*

Re:My mate has gone to this..

[Dark Lord Seth]

Oh noes :(

Re:My mate has gone to this..

[pmsr]

Yeah yeah! I have a condom in my wallet, but it doesn't mean i have sex.

/Pedro

Re:My mate has gone to this..

[secolactico]

Yeah yeah! I have a condom in my wallet, but it doesn't mean i have sex.

But, would you carry 400 condoms if didn't intend to have sex?
Personally, I make balloon animals with mine. But not after I use them... *ducks*

Pr0n & warez? Not!

[IAmRenegadeX]

A LOT of great stuff has come out of this event, if you follow the demoscene. I remember checking constantly to download the Amiga demo winners from this event. That stuff was cutting edge! I haven't looked at the last few years' winners, but I bet the competitions are still churning out some amazing code.

A few of the coding groups at these parties went on to form actual "money making" companies, like Team 17.

While I wouldn't characterize The Gathering as a Geek Think Tank, it most certainly ain't all about pr0n, warez, and fragging.

Re:Pr0n & warez? Not!

[Sesse]

While we're at the demoscene, this feels like a good place to link to TG03's invitation intro, for those interested. :-)/* Steinar */

Re:Pr0n & warez? Not!

[bheerssen]

While I wouldn't characterize The Gathering as a Geek Think Tank, it most certainly ain't all about pr0n, warez, and fragging.

It's not? Damn, I guess I'll have to cancel my flight.

Re:Pr0n & warez? Not!

[IAmRenegadeX]

Sad to hear that. I admit, along with death of the Amiga, I stopped keeping an eye on TG and Assembly, among others. :(

Well, with the dismal state of computer employment, there are certainly talented folks without anything else to do but code for fun.

Were it not for the worthy call of Open Source, the unemployed programmer denziens might be strongly tempted to code demos for competitions such as this. :)

"Party report"

[termos]

I am sitting at The Gathering at the moment, and I can say that there is not only gamers here. They made one section of the area a demoscene area (with a no gamers allowed banner).
It's a step in the right direction.

Re:"Party report"

[Anonymous Coward]

haha.. me too.. in fact I see you from where I sit, you're like 4 rows in front of me!!! (waving hand) ah well... Now to go back to cracking/DOSing all the Windows machines on the network.

Re:"Party report"

[argmanah]

I am sitting at The Gathering at the moment, and I can say that there is not only gamers here. They made one section of the area a demoscene area (with a no gamers allowed banner).

Ah, the demoscene. Am I the only one reminded of conventions like Assembly '9X where groups like Future Crew and others made our machines do ridiculous things?

It's hard not to miss the good old days before bloatware became the status quo.

Re:"Party report"

[Tim Fraser]

This event looks like great fun! I'm looking at the sea of monitors showing on one of the webcam images: I guess they don't have to worry about heating the building.

Perhaps you could post a more detailed report so those of us stuck at work could enjoy The Gathering vicariously?

The on-line schedule mentions deadlines for various "hand-in"s. Are these opportunities for attendees to register items for presentation? The schedule also mentions voting. What's that about?

- Tim

Re:"Party report"

[banzai51]

You act like that would be a good thing. Buch o'Geeks swamming around saying my computer is more 'leet than your computer doesn't sound like any fun unless you can frag him into oblivion. Oh, and our Lan Parties have live DJs. Screw you gamer-hating types! ;-P :-)

Re:"Party report"

[unicron]

I live in Vegas, and I still hang out with a lot of the guys from the old 702 and Ice crews. Some awesome demo & ansi guys, plus guys that formed the first few Vegas BBS's. Demo parties died because people thought they were lan parties. Subsequently, the commonness of broadband in homes killed lan parties. Remember the kids at lan parties that had dial-up at home? The ones that just leeched the pipe for 6 hours with warez and mp3s? I remember some of the smarter guys started yanking the line to the outside world during lan parties. It was a great idea, and funny as shit..but the 15 year old aol hacker dorks would pitch one hell of a fit..so lan parties quickly faded out for the most part..they turned into EQ/AC parties where NO ONE said a fucking word for 5 hours at a time..I blame the shitty lan's for my boredom and subsequent involvement in the rave scene...

Damn..that was a fucking rant..stupid lanarchists.

Re:"Party report"

[MagPulse]

Future Crew was ahead of computer game companies, so they get credit for "making machines do ridiculous things". Today game companies have budgets rivaling movie studios, so they get all the attention. But small teams and even individuals can still make great demos. Here are the three big demo parties and some recent results (may not be the latest):

• The Gathering - 2002 winners
• The Party - 2001 winners
• Assembly - 2002 winners

Here are some other sites with demos:

• Pouet - Has a big list of demos, intros, and lots of comments.
• 256b.com - If the 2-10 meg demos on pouet are too bloated for you, check these out.
• CFXweb - A community web site with forums and a magazine.

My favorite demo of the moment is IV-Racer by The Lost Souls, though it uses mostly pre-made 3D models instead of calculated effects. For a good tiny one, try this one by Haujobb. They both have incredible atmosphere that I'd love to have in a game.

Re:"Party report"

[Knos]

what? demo parties are dead?

Re:"Party report"

[vskjefst]

Ah, yay for that. The last time I went, I had three caffeine junkies behind me playing Quake II with their dad's loudspeaker on "earthquake", constantly making loud pig-like noises. Try to track anything in the middle of that.

Re:"Party report"

[Tokerat]

Cause everyone knows these giant parties didn't originate from the demosceners or anything :-P

Go code a realtime-rendering visualization demo and hook your DJ into it, then call me for your LAN party. Shit, I'll even come spin a set if you put an LCD projector up.

oh well...

[caino59]

so much for that high-speed line ;oP

Re:wow 5 whole computers

[UnixRevolution]

I guess my office has the biggest commputer part ever with 8.

I really don't see what the number of computers in the room has to do with the size of the computer's parts.

But the fact remains...

[LordYUK]

in the end, there can be only one.

Unles of course, there's Magic involved.

Thank you, thank you, I'll be here all week.

Nerds

[Mr.Dippy]

This kind of thing gives nerds a bad name. Go out side and kiss a girl or play soft ball or something healthy and not in doors for god sakes!!!

I was coming up. . .

[Limburgher]

..., so they had better have gotten that party started.

Seriously, I'd so much rather be there now than at work. (sigh)

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[confused philosopher]

No.

Confused Philosopher says:
What is metric?

--
Befriend me if I made you want to think.

Bah

[mrpuffypants]

I'll take QuakeCon any day over that.

This year Quakecon will have 2000 BYOC attendees and estimated 4000 total attendees.

Dallas will swell and pop from all the nerddery

Re:Bah

[gl4ss]

eh, so?

the gathering, the party, assemblies, and other european DEMOSCENE-parties are first, and foremost meant to be DEMOSCENE-parties, they're not meant to hell-of-a-size lan gaming parties anyways. they're about having good time, having couple of beers, shooting the breeze, checking some cool new/ancient hardware, toying around, catching up with old times. you're meant to compete with your creativy, not with your speed of wrist and accuracy in sniping.

the bigger demoscene events have been slowly turning into laning events though which is a shame.. the unity is left out, and the newer attendees don't often even know the history behind the events..

the number of attendees has nothing to do with the amount of fun, a lot of the smaller demoparties have been very funny events that have left many good memories.

if you're only a _gamer_ you take quakecon over that, if you're a demoscener, you don't even think quakecon as an option (except maybe have your own shadow party in the woods, telling legends over a camp-fire drinking beer).

btw, is it really so now that the gathering is _the_ biggest? 5000 for real? couldnt find accurate information on their webpage.

Re:Bah

[say]

Yep. They're the biggest. Swedish DreamHack is almost as large (and has been bigger previous years), but TG is the biggest ever. They're 5100 people (as stated in this FAQ).

Re:Bah

[Lord_Dweomer]

"you're meant to compete with your creativy, not with your speed of wrist and accuracy in sniping."

Something tells me anybody attending this has VASTLY developed wrist muscles....and no, its not from Quake......

Re:Bah

[tholomyes]

they're about having good time, having couple of beers

just a couple of beers?!? what kinda good time is that?

no, my friend, a good time is when you don't remember splashing that voka tonic across your monitor, but don't remember caring, either. wow, my apartment is still recovering from that night.

Re:Bah

[gl4ss]

'couple of beers' is a nice way to say 'drinking so much that you end up running naked in the mall' like some finnish sceners did at gathering one previous year(iirc).

or.. the video that was on one compo at alternative partys this year,, you most likely _don't_ want to see that :D

I don't get it

[whoppers]

What's the male/female ratio here, like 5000:1? and the smell of 5000 youngsters, this place will have to reek something fierce, so what's the attraction here? Sure, 5000+/- computers on a Gbit line is pretty kewl, but so is the Blue Ridge Parkway if you haven't been before.

Re:I don't get it

[say]

When I was there the last time (2001), the male/female ratio was about 10:1.

The smell is rather terrible, yes.

The attraction is generally to meet people who do the same thing that you do in your spare-time. Remember that Norway's largest city is less than half a million, and most people live on the countryside. Not many geeks to socialize with.

Only gigabit?

[cperciva]

Those poor geeks... that's only 200kbps per person. Even my cable modem is faster than that.

Re:Only gigabit?

[adpowers]

Why would you need much internet bandwidth? All the game servers are local and I am sure you could find all the p0rn and warez ever created on the local network. The only reason you would need an internet connection for is checking e-mail and web surfing. If 9/10 people are busy crawling the LAN for p0rn or playing local games, then each person actually using the internet gets 2 mpbs.

Great Googly-Moogly

[0x00000dcc]

Is it me, or is the dude at the bottom center-right of this image of the gathering using a plasma tv as a monitor? If not, sure does look like a 42 inch screen. Maybe it's a new Apple flat panel ;-)

Re:Great Googly-Moogly

[BitHive]

It looks like one of those three-panel LCD deals. I'm too lazy to dig up the URL, but I'm sure someone on /. knows it. Never fails to cause in-pants ejaculation.

Re:Great Googly-Moogly

[drunk_as_in_beer]

It looks like 3 monitors to me. The two on the sides look like flat-panel monitors. Though, I don't know, it looks like one long monitor at other times.

Re:Great Googly-Moogly

[jemenake]

Oh great... for when you're starved for attention but you can't look like you're starved for attention. I'll bet he's got a 500W subwoofer and $400 of case-mods, too.

That's what sours me about this kind of thing... it's seems to invariably devolve into a technological pissing match, albeit an implied one.

Re:Great Googly-Moogly

[adpowers]

It looks to me like one of the Mass Multiples monitors, mentioned on /. a few years ago.

Re:Great Googly-Moogly

[EZmagz]

I can't see the image (/.'ed already), but Samsung does make a 40" LCD TV that can double up as a real nice monitor, doing 1280x720 ( href="http://www.samsung.com/Products/Semiconducto r/TFTLCD/LCD_TV/LTA400W1/LTA400W1.htm>link

Hope you're not unemployed like my ass, because stuff like this DON'T come cheap! Heh, if I win that lottery though...

Re:Great Googly-Moogly

[ScottKin]

PanoramTech

Need I say anymore? YES!!

Desktop Display Systems
Workgroup Systems

ScottKin

Re:Great Googly-Moogly

[RogerWilco]

Hmmm, maybe my summer holydays should be used to visit Norway
afterall...

Greetings from the Netherlands.

Adriaan.

Way to kill the party

[zapp]

They have a 1gbit link, and we go and /. them.

'course, they DID post all those webcam shots, they were just asking for it.

Helpdesk call

[HaloZero]

'Um, hello? I'd like to get Norway installed on my PC. It's Mac compatible, right?'

Re:Helpdesk call

[agallagh42]

They have the Internet on computers now?

What is happening?

[termos]

If you are interested in what will happen here in the next few days, take a look here: Schedule.

Wow...

[TopShelf]

Just imagine the size of the pizza that they'll order for delivery...

Re:Wow...

[sharkey]

Just imagine the size of the pizza that they'll order for delivery...

And the smell later in the evening.

Re:Wow...

[thatguywhoiam]

Just imagine the size of the pizza that they'll order for delivery...

Even worse, imagine the poor bastard who has to try and placate the toppings preferences of 5000 geeks.

Hey! I just found a legitimate use for P2P!

Not the only Gathering

[McBeth]

Alan Moon's Gathering of Friends is going on right now too. It is a 10-day board gaming event. Personal invitation from Moon only. Check out Terminal City Gamers and Plenary Games for "live" reports from the event.

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[leviramsey]

We have conclusive proof that lower UIDs do not correspond with higher intelligence, as abcxyz has just shown that (s)he is stupider than a lobotomized squirrel.

FYI, European convention is to use decimal points where US convention uses a comma and a vice versa.

Retard.

sounds like

[SHEENmaster]

this has dangerous potential for becoming diluted with no-nothings and w@nn@b3 31337 |-|@>
I think the US should do a Coding Party and show Norway how to have some REAL fun!

party beowulf project

[cur3]

just imagine the computer power of 5000* pcs!

give in the entrance of the party a tiny bootdisk/cdr whatever with a **party distributed beowulf project client**tm to each participant

add to the party a **party bogomips competition**

at a given hour the competition begins and all people entry the beowulf, and when the competition time runs out, run a little calc to measure the power of the machines.

Then return to each screen a cool party logo with the total amount of power plus number of puters.

The code detects the cpu type and send it to the central node, each participant screen display a grafic with the percentage of x86, PowerPC.. etc

the bootdisk could be easy to do in linux it supports all mayor architecturs

(*asumptin a computer for user, i been to party's with 3 pcs, not counting smp or other power machines)

please don't blame my english, its my 2nd language :D

Re:party beowulf project

[BitHive]

Actually, that is probably the lamest thing I can think of doing at a party like that. Why even bother coming? Why not just have everyone send in their machine specs beforehand and have a perl script tally up the bogomips if that's what turns your crank?

power

[x kepa x]

now i understand why everything in my house works at half capacity...

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[42forty-two42]

So, 1,234.5 becomes 1.234,5?

Obligatory Beowulf comment

[binaryDigit]

Imagine if everyone connected their computers and created a beowulf cluster!

They could then calculate the average time it's been since any one of them actually had a date (hopefully no overflow errors occur).

Re:whens the NA one coming?

[basscomm]

Million Man Lan 2 is coming up June 26 - June 29. Got room for a couple thousand I believe.

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[Mr_Matt]

Ahh, and now we have conclusive proof that familiarity with European numerical conventions does not necessarily imply familiarity with geek-humor.

FYI, it looks like a joke. Note how grand-parent post geekily describes the number '24'.

Assclown. :)

Downloads 'r' Us

[semaj]

On their website, they link to their own Harlem-client for Windows for browsing SMB shares.

It seems to work from outside of the party too - anyone looking for a few thousand Windows boxes with shared files on might want to take a look. :o)

Re:Downloads 'r' Us

[jclendenan]

It's too bad that it's a centeral server model, it seems to be only for those at TG03.

hrumph.

For a cool app that does the scanning it's self, check out Share Scan

Great for campus networks...

So people won't get "Hamared"

[Idou]

If you see this message, you need to increase your "comment threshold."

Re:So people won't get "Hamared"

[pellaeon]

Let's mod parent up and have a very quiet evening :)

Surreal?

[heldlikesound]

Only on Slashdot could a blurry picture of what appears to be a few thousand computer users called surreal. Not only that, but one of the other webcams is pointing at a guys power supply. Breathtaking.

Re:only 5.000?

[VivianC]

They have found a bug in the party. It is now 5.000 pl1. Thank goodness the party was open source!

Future Crew

[jbucher]

Is future crew going to be there? They are the best ever :)

Re:only 5.000?

[angle_slam]

5 computers? Reminds me of the Simpsons quote:

"Mr. Simpson, this government computer can process over nine tax returns per day. Did you really think you could fool it?"

I'd love to go to this...

[NanoGator]

...just to see the result of somebody calling me a camping fag in person.

Symbol Convention

[Andy_w715]

so in Norway this site is called /, ??

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[Quixotic Raindrop]

Yes, that's exactly how it is displayed.

Re:wow 5 whole computers

[WegianWarrior]

Periods are used to 'split up' large numbers, commas to mark where the decimalpoint is. So, if I had fivethoousand, threehundred and sixtitwo kroner and fifty øre in my vallet, I would write that as 5.362,50 - which incidentaly is the same number as is written om this winters electricitybill...

Photos from Gathering 2002

[BrianWCarver]

Here are some photos from The Gathering 2002.

Of course, this guy put sooooo many thumbnails on this one page that Slashdot will likely kill this after five seconds.

pfft, no booze? no me.

[23orgFlea]

While this looks really fun for "that kinda guy" I'm a little put off by the concept of this being a party. No booze? pfft.

If they all left their machines and started drinking/pushing people in pools/dying the fountains/reprogramming the enviro controls/TALKING TO GIRS then it'd be defcon. :)

Hot Damn

[yintercept]

Every time I boot me up the Linux box and log me into Slashdot.org...I know I'll be whoopin' it up in the world's largest computer party...that just gets wilder and whackier by the minute.

We don't need no stinking human contact.

Oh, the carnage!

[Gefiltefish11]

The mass of unwashed humanity reminds me of another festive event

Beware Linux users!

[mrmag00]

Apparently they lock their linux users up in a cage and they don't even notice when nobody else is there.

I'd stay away from there if you don't run windows!

Anyway, pictures of all the nerd stuff are at http://bilder.jodal.no/tg03

Just consider...

[wastaz]

Just consider for a moment what you could do if you got all of those 5000 participants computers connected in a beowulf cluster...

Step 1) Knock all participants unconcious
Step 2) Connect all computers to giant beowulf cluster and run SETI@Home
Step 3) Profit!

Whats the LAN like there?

[bizitch]

A Gig link to the net - with 5000 users? Thats got to be a smokin LAN ....

I'm impressed.

[IMarvinTPA]

I'm not sure how they did it, but they're confident in their count of five to four significant digits! I wonder if they got it notorized too.

IMarv
PS For those who don't get it, this is a joke about the use of periods and commas to separate groups of numbers and to divide numbers into decimal fractions...

Assembly'02/03 @ Finland

[archonon]

Largest? How about annual Assembly party in Finland? They even had OC, Modding & Coooling compos :D

http://www.assembly.org/
But at least the partyplace was bigger & bolder:

http://www.hartwall-areena.com/englanti/c/c_main.h tm

Re:wow 5 whole computers

[WegianWarrior]

We don't - thats the anglo-american word for it. We call it 'komma'.

5000?

[MC68040]

I'd like to remind everyone to have a look at dreamhack, that "also" is the largest lan (dreamhack.org) in Sweden twice a year... Which had over 5000 participants in 2001 and even more in 2002.. *arhem* Biggest you say?.

Re:5000?

[Sesse]

TG is bigger. DH02 was bigger than TG02 (by about fifty seats, IIRC -- how you count crew, press, VIP, etc. is a different matter), but TG03 is even bigger than DH02 again.

TG and DH are sister parties, BTW -- for instance, the network crew at TG03 consists of people from DH.

/* Steinar */

They're fake!

[jemenake]

Those females must have been photoshopped in.

In the images, I've seen at least three and they looked like females and they weren't being mobbed like moths around a flame. In fact, if you look closedly, not only are there no nerds leering slack-jawed at them... I don't even seen the geeks looking at them, PERIOD.

I can only surmise that those females aren't really there.

Re:whens the NA one coming?

[ccwaterz]

Blech. Its in Louisville. I just spent a good part of the past 5 months in a hotel accross the street from that expo center. If you get bored there go next door to Kentucky Kingdom (Six Flags theme park).

Surreal, huh?

[ElGanzoLoco]

Some of the webcam images are just surreal.

Girl. At LAN-party. Surreal. Indeed.

Re:Surreal, huh?

[LuckyStarr]

not surreal, but rare.

Wow

[reelbk]

Those webcam shots are insane. This is the first time I've seen such a media-intensive page withstand a slashdotting. And I'm sure a site like this is interesting for most slashdotters.

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[bvk]

I have no opinion on which is better, but at least Europeans get date formatting right. Who in their right mind would come up with the US format of mm/dd/yy? Heck, why not just intermix the digits, like mdmydy. Today is 014063...

Alcohol is your medic in emergency.

[LuckyStarr]

From the Page:

Alkoholholdige drikkevarer er ikke tillatt medbragt i hallen eller i dens umiddelbare nærhet

Beverages containing alcohol is not allowed inside the hall or anywhere near it

poor bastards. :-)

A fascinating idea

[rice_burners_suck]

Wouldn't it be really interesting if an entire ideology of computer software could be designed down to the finest detail by a number of individuals hired for such a task? This would include an entire operating system and all the software to run on it. An enormous party would be thrown, to which would be invited hundreds of thousands of programmers. Each would be assigned a specific portion of the system. At the end of a single day, the entire software system would be completed due to the sheer number of programmers working on it. It would take years to plan and organize, yet only a single day to execute from beginning to end.

Yeah... I think it could be done tomorrow.

TODO

[Anonymous Coward]

1. express mock confusion over European method of writing numbers
2. crack joke about the stench
3. post link to phony mirror (no, not goatse)
4. make inane soviet russia quip
5. write some "funny" source code
6. claim that hussein/bush is dead
7. submit more xbox articles
8. craft a list that ends with "PROFIT!!!"

Re:TODO

[stud9920]

9. ???? 10. PROFIT !!!

Re:Yes, but...

[Sesse]

Try to do that with a full B-net to scan, and 5000 people each doing the scanning. There was a reason why we went for the centralized model. :-)

(Oh, and I've blocked it for outside access now. :-) )

/* Steinar */

laptops?

[magarity]

The webcams show people have lugged in their tower cases and CRTs. People, please, there are plenty of laptops on the market with GeForceGo chips and decent pixel fade time displays.

Re:laptops?

[cybergibbons]

Oh fuck off you idiot. Why would you want to spend twice (or more) the money to own a laptop of similar specs to a desktop to use for a couple of days of the year? It's not a particularly good idea.

Re:laptops?

[AbRASiON]

You fucking rock man - straight up ... these "laptops for lans" tools are so funny

"no really a gf4 go will run anything and everything dead smooth game wise"

My balls,.. his chin.

The Gathering

[mkro]

I went to The Gathering every year from 93 till 00 (except 95), and it just got more and more crap. That is, from the perspective of someone who is more interested in the creative aspect.

• From year to year the following increases:
• Younger and younger participants.
• More and more gamers.
• The focus IS on the network, network games and "bringing empty harddrives". Oh, and meet the cute girl you talked to on #teenchat
• "Look, my dad bought me bigger soundsystem than you got from your dad. Now, hear. Everyone hear."
• Ticket prices. Food prices.
• Nazi security guards. "Does it smell beer here? Please come with me."
• Sponsors trying to adapt the compos to fit the "market" more.

It might be me that got old and grumpy, but in the end it seemed like ~95 percent of the people didn't even realize that there were demo compos going on, they just turned their stereos louder.

The Gathering is a LAN party, even though they throw in a striptease, a DJ or a "Microsoft talks about their exciting new technology" conference in the middle of it. DO NOT GO THERE IF YOU COME FOR THE DEMO SCENE.

If you want creativity, check out Breakpoint, a party held in Germany from the 19th till the 21st of April. Yep, this weekend. I'm going, and I am from Norway.

Re:The Gathering

[Sesse]

Yes, TG00 was crappy scene-wise -- TG01 was a little better, and TG02 was actually quite good (but of course, you can't match a scene-only party like Breakpoint -- you'll have to accept all the CS-playing fourteen-year-olds, but you can still meet with other sceners and have fun). I don't really know how TG03 will be yet, but it looks promising so far :-)

/* Steinar */

Re:The Gathering

[Niflar]

> Younger and younger participants.

Perhaps you got older?

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[banzai51]

Slashdot isn't just Euro-centric you know!

Good lord, I've been waiting to counter volley with that one.

worse than that.. no caffeine

[abhisarda]

Sales of consumer products containing a defined amount of coffeine is not permitted in Norway g..

WTF?

Re:worse than that.. no caffeine

[Looke]

Beverages containing excessive amounts of caffeine are not allowed for sale in Norway. The author just meant to say that there is a limit to how much caffeine a drink is allowed to contain.

Re:worse than that.. no caffeine

[Anonymous Coward]

All that means is that if the amount of caffeing in your drink is undefined, it's ok.

Re:worse than that.. no caffeine

[TheRealBlueEAGLE]

There is still noone that can stop you from brewing your espresso two, three or four times to get a ridiculous amount of caffine in you blood at the shortest amount of time.

I've heard of ppl bringing a primus and 8 kilos of espresso coffee and an espresso boiler, and actually consuming all of it.

I get the jitters just by thinking of it.

Sigh...here we go again.

[EnderWiggin99]

1) "Imagine a beowulf cluster of $artcl_subj!!!"

2) "In Soviet Russia, $artcl_subj $op_verb 's YOU!!!

3)???

4) Profit from clueless moderators who know a good joke when they see it. :)

Karm's gonna roast for this

[thatguywhoiam]

But I simply cannot resist.

AGENT SMITH
Can you hear me, CmdrTaco? I'm going to be honest with you.

I hate this place. This zoo. This prison. This Gathering, whatever you want to call it, I can't stand it any longer.

It's the smell, if there is such a thing. I feel saturated by it. I can taste their sweaty mice and every time I do, I fear that I've somehow been infected by it.

I must get out of here, I must get free. In this mind are the cheats. My cheats. Once the Gathering is gone, there's no need for me to be here. Do you understand? I need the cheats. I have to get some fresh air.

You have to tell me how... or you're going to die.

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

One day we'll all be networked together

[192939495969798999]

Then we can all have a party! A friend of mine said that, and shortly thereafter I remarked, "every computer networked together... you mean like the INTERNET?"
sheesh!

Re:Gathering bigger than ASM?

[MagPulse]

I think it might be a difference in culture. In the U.S., employers want to see people that have already done what their job description would be. This includes entry level. So people like me who want a job need to focus on getting a game done, since no one buys demos. Also, I see people on demo boards in eighth grade taking C++ and graphics courses that are taught in their public schools. Not all of them will want programming jobs, they just see demo making as another form of art.

I think the U.S. indie game community is pretty healthy, though I don't know how it is compared to the one in Europe. The GDC was last month, and there were a lot of individuals and small teams who made games for little or nothing.

That all said, a U.S. demo party would be cool.

Re:pfft, no booze? no me.

[dacetone]

Ahh, defcon, where I was offered everything from bottles of whiskey in the pool, to beer walking around/at talks, and I'm not even a good looking girl ;) then again, our room came with a fridge full of beer and a (locked) liquor cabinet, too...

The Gathering - Now and Then

[vskjefst]

Then: Computer party. Now: One large Counter-Strike LAN.

Re:The Gathering - Now and Then

[Lobo93]

Roger that! Back in the old days(hark-hark), when I first attended the Gathering(I think it was the second one staged at the time) we had no friggin' CS or RvS, and to vent our geek-rage we had to blow up an Atari in the nearby soccerfield! Heh, I guess the bastard flew some 10-15 meters into the air - and the crowd went into a frenzy(you would as well; couple the jihad of Amiga vs Atari with mamut-sized coffeine-pills and things tend to get ugly ;) )

Anyhow, the Gathering was indeed a demoscene-affair at the time, mostly emphasising the the C64 and the aforementioned Amiga. Those pesky sub-geeks who dared enter with their PC's and Atari's where quickly stuffed in a corner, only to sulk and cry vengance. Heh, weird how things have turned out..

This event must have been in 1991 if I recollect it correctly; I remember watching "T2 - Judgement Day", which was on those huuuuge fsck'in' CDROM's - pre-cinema as it was, I must admit the warez-scene was well and kicking in those days as well: Razor 1911 anyone! lol!

And there were babes as well! That's right, a crowd of exactly 2 females made it into the building. I guess there's more of these oddities now, but still marginal.

Anyone remember "Das Boot" by U-96(Alex Cristensen)? If I'm not mistaken, the dude was attending the Gathering when he made the finishing touch to the song - I can still feel the horror of trying to hold on to my speakers, coca-cola, pizza and joystick at the same time whilst this guy shook the air(and ground) with a criminally loud droning of bass and torpedo-drums! Who gave a shit for those eardrums anyway?

The Gathering '91 was: a week of hard techno and AC/DC, depraved of sleep, eating pizza and drinking coke, dropping caffeine-pills, the frequent lynching of unlucky bastards who accidently tripped on the power-cables and unplugged 50+ boxen, trying for hours to fix a mess of assembler-code only to end up with a psychedelic raster-line, admiring those hardcore Oslo-geeks in leather-jackets only to get punched in the face upon code-inquiring; Ah! Those were the days!

CS-fluffy wannabe-geeks can kiss my shiny pale ass!

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[abcxyz]

Damn -- 50.000 european comedians out of work, and here I am trying to be funny. Should've know better, 'cause I've never been able to get the timing right.

-- he

And let's just say...

[Kjella]

...that on average, each has 10gb of "stuff", being warez/appz/gamez/mp3z/dvdripz/linux distros, and you have 50tb = 50,000gb on the internal network. I think you can download 24/7 all through TG and still not need to get online...

Kjella

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[Looke]

Actually, by Norwegian standards, it should become 1 234,5 (should be a non-breaking space in there, but Slashdot wouldn't let me), but 1.234,5 is very common as well.

What do you think DefCon is?

[DanEsparza]

Ummmm... apparently you've never heard of DefCon? Not to rain on anybody's parade -- but I was there last year (@ Defcon 0a) and we had more than 5000 peoples I think. This year will be bigger. The Norwegians have NOTHING on us (DefCon is even in Vegas). Dan

Re:What do you think DefCon is?

[mink]

Defcons content is not the same as what goes on at "parties" go to www.scene.org and look at the history that lead up to things like The Gathering.
Yes there is crossover.

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[b!arg]

It's no better or worse than the european method. Just like saying, "It's May 6th, 2003" (5/6/2003) is no better or no worse than saying, "It's the 6th of May, 2003" (6/5/2003)

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[confused philosopher]

"5.000 isnt metric."

You sir have the insight of a drunken Socrates.

5.000 is metric to the precision of 3 decimal places in North America, OR it is notation in Europe to the precision of 0 decimal places.

My point about "metric" was that the USA doesn't conform to world standards.

They Do

[Pfhor]

Its called MacHack, 72 hours of coding fun!
http://www.machack.com/

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[Hrshgn]

> It's no better or worse than the european method.

Come on! Day --> Month --> Year is a much more logical sequence than Month --> Day --> Year.

btw

[Hrshgn]

Am I the only one using high commas as separator like:

5'000,00 ???

Rince

PIZZA? Where should we deliver that?

[krray]

"Oh -- I've over at 63.22.86.14"...

Take 63.22.14.1 to 64.18.195.1 and turn right.
When you see 63.22.86.1 slash to the left and I
Should be the 14th one on the right.

appropriate humor

[abhisarda]

Lan of the Lost

Re:Under-exagerated the participant

[b!arg]

So you are saying that if someone asks me what day today is and I say, "April 16th, 2003" I am being illogical? I'll grant that the european way is sorted in ascending order, but that's about it.

Note to wwizard: more blonde pics plz

[writertype]

Who wants to watch 5,000 unwashed geeks when he's kindly posted pics of some cute little busty blonde? (see original post for link)

Also, can you please just organize them into a folder called "cute blonde"? I hate clicking on all of the other pics and getting some dumb sunset. Thanks!

all lanparties are not the same

[kaworu-sama]

Now let's not start stereotyping LAN parties as a bunch of gaming tightwads arguing over who "hax."

Take LANwar for example. Parties such as LANwar are more of a fun time. There are no cash prizes, just small, nothing-too-outstanding tournaments like CPL. The aim is mostly fun

Also, there are forums set up with people from Tom's Hardware, ATI, AMD, Corsair, and people from other companies to talk to. Not to mention the ever-popular case modding competition. On the whole, the event isn't a typical LAN party. Everyone tries to have fun rather than pwnzor bitches and calling each other haxor noobs.

MML2 is coming up in June, it's slate for 1200 people or more i believe, probably one of the biggest events in North America.

You don't believe it? Read this...

[Allman]

What? You don't believe it? :-)

Yes, this year's TG is actually the world's largest computer event/party (ever held). I just read a bizarre posting claiming that TG is fake/hoax and that there was no proof on the official website. (I won't even bother to find and reply to that posting, I'll just start up a new thread.) Well, if you don't believe us - here is a link to the original floor plan layout:

PreTG03-Floorplan-v1.2

As you can see, the "body count" was actually supposed to be around 5400. However, because of safety/security and BS/misc reasons it was eventually cut down to 5064; here is the final/official floor plan:

Current/latest floorplan

Small version: Small version of current/latest floorplan

Allman

high resolution images?

[tommut]

High-res? Really? Are you sure? Does anybody want to see high-res images of these guys?
http://194.0.98.125/~wizard/TG03/pict1862.jpg

The fact that I room with these guys and get to see them every day is pain enough. Leave it alone. Please.

Gb-line

[Senilix]

http://www.network.party.gathering.org/admin/inter net.html

You didn't manage to slashdot the link, but one of our axis-cameras with integrated http-server got a bit hot...

Floating comma, sinking point

[more]

In accordance with an ISO Council decision, the decimal sign is a comma in all ISO documents. ISO 31-0:1992

The ISO 31-0 recommendation of using a space as a thousand marker is a good rule to follow in English.

It is the Americans with inches, acres, letter size paper, decimal point etc. who do not care about the international standards and agreed procedures -- not us Europeans. We did your homework a hundred years ago, just like you were supposed to. No sane person would call Europeans weird for just following the international agreements on decimal comma. I want to remind, that without international standards and people following to them we will have more lost mars probes, and continual cost and risk increase in many, many industrial areas for unneccessary unit and format conversions.

million, billion... help me!!

[fantomas]

I'm 36 and from the UK. When I was a kid growing up in the UK, 10^6 was a million, 10^9 was just known as "a thousand million" (maybe they were protecting us kids from more big words, but I am pretty sure adults used this expression as well, though "milliard" is a damn fine word!) and 10^12 was a billion. I remember being told at school that we should call 10^9 a thousand million but that Americans referred to this as "a billion". I think there was general impression that those overexcitable Americans preferred hyperbole and that was why they used the billion expression for 10^9 :-)

I think the logic as far as I remember it was thousand x thousand = million so million x million = billion, there is already a word for thousand x million and that is thousand million. And yes, I grew up thinking billion x billion = trillion so I am not sure what a trillion is these days... thousand billion (US)?

Somebody help me! what are the international standards for these words!!! :-)

I suppose these days if somebody says "a billion" I assume they mean 10^9 but I'll be damned if I have to go back to feet and inches and perches and rods and goodness knows what ;-) !