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South Korea Plans National 100 Mbps Network
prostoalex writes "Korean Ministry of Information and Communication is planning to wire the entire country with high-speed 50-100 Mbps network. A total of $80.4 billion will be spent on the project that's expected to be completed in 2010."
You mean when "high speed" isn't high anymore?
Don't quote me on this.
If there is a wired rollout, there would probably already be tons of dark fiber between all central exchanges. Why not just wire them onwards to consumers' homes?
This give better speeds to your neighbour (which is always the nearest "mirror"), and have CableTV, Voice and Data services all integrated onto the same little strand of glass | plastic that comes to my house.
US is now divided as the "Red" and "blue" states. Red States = communist countries. Coincidence? I think not
Compare the size of the US to Korea. Now you're talking trillions.
Thank you and have a nice day.
think about those two factors for a while...
Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
As if those Zerg weren't fast enough already...
"It never got weird enough for me." - HST (RIP)
If you think about it, that's about $2000 per Korean, perhaps $6000 per household for high speed internet access, which won't be complete for 7 years. Are they really getting a good deal?
This is an interesting approach to infrastructure. Now, the next question: how will this approach affect Korea's economic development? What types of businesses will get located in Korea specifically to because of the ubiquitous availability of this type of infrastructure? How will the universal availability of broadband affect Korea's land use of development patterns? Will folks still commute via cars? Will factories start to become remote controlled?
I'm convinced.
Selfish Koreans, they could have liberated an entire other country and freed them from an oppressive dictator and his sadistic cronies, giving future generations a chance to live in a decent world with some sense of empoerment. Instead they'll just be watching pr0n and spewing spam.
I know it sounds like a lot now, with 1.5 to 3 Mbps being the closer to the norm for broadband here, but if you're going to build an infrastructure for an entire country by 2010, why not build with the latest technologies? 1Gbps isn't exactly ground-breaking any more.
;-)
Although, I suppose they've thought of this, and will lay fiber capable of much faster speeds, and just get cheap equipment rated for 50 to 100 Mbps. And I suppose 1+ Gbps EQ will be mcuh cheaper in 10 years..
As I think it out, perhaps they're smarter than I thought
I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous...
The US government shits $87bn in social programs.
Are you saying the US should fund this in Korea? Otherwise I would assume you mean wiring the US, which would clearly cost upwards of a trillion dollars - a number that is slightly more important.
They do. Many of the best gamers are from Korea.
Don't quote me on this.
Throughout their country, they have true 10mbit connectivity for most of its citizens at roughly 13$ US per month. That is insanely awesome when you figure in the fact that here in the US, we pay around 45$ to get at best 2mbit connectivity that peaks out at right around 140k most of the time. And thats just downstream.
While technology is increasing rapidly enough to make local network connectivity at extremely high speeds economically feasible for the first time, WAN technologies are still another story and lag behind by a few years. You still want dedicated 1.5mbit connectivity, you are STILL looking at around 800$+ dollars a month. (Key word being dedicated).
Good for the S. Korea!
hrrm.
If you look at the numbers their complete budget for 2000 was only $95.7 billion. Assuming it starts now & ends on time, without any cost overruns, we're looking at something like 12% of the government's spending going towards this project.
That's some commitment to closing the 'digital divide'. Well, as long as they make reasonably affordable computers available to their citizens when this thing goes live.
my sig's at the bottom of the page.
I'd gladly give up 66% of my 1.5MB cable line for 66% improved latency.
More importantly, how useless is this? Even in 2010, who will need as much data as you can download with a 100MBit line? Maybe if that much bandwidth is available there won't be as much need for storing files localy.
Pretty Pictures!
Okay, for those of you already piping in that this isn't as fast as it can get, I'd like to see your present hi-speed home access push far over 1 Mbit/sec. Nevertheless, this begs the question:
In 2010 will 100 Mbits be considered fast or slow? Is there a "Moore's Law" for Internet access speeds? Back in about 1982 I was connecting to the local BBS with a 300 baud modem. A megabit download speed (today in 2003) is roughly 3000x that speed, and we're there after 20 years. That equates to almost exactly a 50% increase in speed per year. So if we go another 7 years at that rate, by 2010 we would consider 16 Mbit/sec to be fast.
Okay. I'm envious.
Murray Todd Williams
An idiot who knows the difference between a LAN and a WAN.
I wonder if the US will be in charge of their Network security as well as their national security ;-)
NTT and other companies have already been offering 100Mbs fiberoptic lines to homes in Japan for quite awhile now.
The best part is it's cheap,
They usually cost a little more than $40 a month.
Of course, it's still twice the price of 12Mbs ADSL lines in Japan like Yahoo BB who offers 12Mbs speed for $21/month. Most people don't know what to do with 100Mbs anyways.
Well really I just saw an article with no posts and posted something quick and dirty to get FP. :)
But obviously (size of USA) >> (size of SK) so its not a fair comparison.
If we "shit $87bn in social programs" why is there all this debate over $600mil to keep Hubble in the sky until Hubble2 is sent up? Crap like this is annoying to me. To say nothing about the $87bn in Iraq.
E V E R Y T H I N G I W R I T E I S F A L S E
...and not to be out done, North Korean President Kim Jong Il has asserted that his country can compete with the decadent capitalist South by establishing the Socialist Communication Organization (SCO) to provide tin cans and string to 1 out of every 100 loyal members to the party.
-Crolis
I can't believe they couldn't find a better use for all that money. High speed internet shouldn't be something that is critical in a nation that still needs much development in basic infastructure. For that much money in the US we could do so much it is beyond most people's comprehension.
The only justification I see this having is the 370,000 new jobs, but how temporary are those jobs. Will most of them disapear after the system is put up and there is nothing left to build let alone money to build it with. To learn more about what we in the US could do with $80 billion(around what is being spent in Iraq go here
If we need it for such basic things I would think a less developed county would need it even more.
While everyone is saying 'wow go south korea must be nice to have that kind of connection', consider the infrastructure in the US. We have multi-gigabit backbones crossing the US to many NAPs, and 100+mbit connections to just about every major city. And that's just the dedicated IP infrastructure, our voice-based and other private network capacities is many times that. The difference between us and them? We have to pay for ours directly. We have the freedom of choice, we dont have to wait for our government to decide how fast we should access our networks, and hence we bear the cost directly instead of indirectly. Just thought i would point that out.
Will more Koreans get first post, before even your hastily scribed ditty?
Classical Liberalism: All your base are belong to you.
Ok great. So they will have the infrastructure -- publicly owned. What hoops will potential ISPs (State-run or private?!) have to pass through in order to provide service on this marvel?
Bush has so far wasted 160 billion on Iraq...
For that price we could have covered the entire country TWICE with 10Mbit Ethernet!
It's all about perspective man!
Down with Bush! Up with 100Mbit ethernet!
In fact, that's something that I've often wondered when I hear about super high-speed connections in other countries (like 100MB DSL in Japan for ~$30 a month). Is it only in America where we've let the industry cripple the future potential of broadband in such and insidious manner? (i.e. offering connections that can't really be used w/o having to pay extra)
Tierce
Who sponsors your feelings?
I understand.
I also find your honest to be very humorous.
That's cool.
I see alot of people out there thinking this is a lot better way to spend 80 quadrillion-billionty-thousand dollars than rebuilding Iraq. This is probably true. However, realize that all S. Korean citizens must serve in the military by law. I think it's only a two year term...but still.
That's a great misconception. Quantity does not always equal quality. They are competitive, but overall, no better than Europeans or gamers from other Asian countries. WCG has them at #3 in the final medal tally.
As for the topic at hand, good for S.Koreans. It's nice to see a nation thinking forward and wiring it's population with a forward thinking attitude. The government has its finger on technology's pulse. Unlike in US, where we still have anti-competitive carriers/ISPs monopolizing regions and not getting reprimanded for it. We, as Americans, are behind the progress curve, in terms of broadband connectivity. There is a huge chunk of population still using 56k modems. I mean, Christ. Broadband should be a cheap commodity and a requirement in every house.
While Asia, Europe and other continents are focusing on the future and doing something about it, our politicians are dicking around with special interests and not thinking of the implications 10 years down the line.
South Korea: Lets build a grid and give every citizen access to broadband.
United States: Let companies decide instead of the consumers. Profit comes first.
South Korea: Technology is the future. Internet access is a basic human right.
United States: Intellectual Property is being violated, lets greenlight tyrants like **AA to set the agenda. MP3 Downloading has to stop.
South Korea: Open Source in Government? Lets keep our options open.
United States: Let Microsoft get away with everything, as long as they contribute to political campaigns.
As you can see, we'll be still arguing about having pioneered the Internet and other technologies in irrelevancy, while other nations surpass ours and make the rules.
"Are they really getting a good deal?"
Would you pay 11$ a month if you could get 3-6 megabyte/s download rates? I would. Even if I had to wait a few years before it fully kicked in. It's still a great deal.
--
Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
Its not like this is the first residential 100 Mbps service in Korea. They're talking about wiring *the whole country*. That includes residential areas *and* rural areas. Do you see this kind of service in the Japanese countryside?
If you even skimmed the article before posting, you would have found that Korea is already the most wired country in the world - even ahead of Japan.
Advantage of a small country. . . .
Need help treating your acne? Come here!
Cute korean cam girls in superior definition and framerate video is what you should be thinking about.
It certainly seems as though wire(less)ing up a country as small as S. Korea could hardly cost $80 billion dollars and current wireless technology can already provide 50Mbit speeds. What gives?
I have to wonder if download/upload limits will be enforced on this system. Think of what we get in the US with many cable ISPs and especially college connections: high speed, as long as you barely use it at all. There are 2-3 GB/month limits, in some places. Or, perhaps, they could charge by usage instead of offering a flat rate.
(There's no mention of this in the article, so perhaps they haven't decided yet.)
With a network like this - that trend is going to continue.
sigs are natural, sigs are good, not everybody has one, but everybody should...
When you are that small it is easy to do things like that. I wish there was some way to get this here in the US.
OK, maybe it is spread over five years, but that's still the kind of pork barrel you get when something's being proposed more for political image than actual economics.
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
Err... Are you trolling or do you really not realize that there are two Koreas? The article is referring to South Korea--the republic with universal suffrage and a GDP per capita rivaling that of many European countries. It's hardly a despotic hell hole.
An interesting anagram of "BANACH TARSKI" is "BANACH TARSKI BANACH TARSKI"
Your $30/month DS1-or-better speed xDSL line doesn't come close to paying your ISP's cost for that much bandwidth. Instead, you're sharing bandwidth with everyone else, under the assumption that not everyone max out at the same time. If you don't like sharing, I'm sure your ISP will gladly sell you a T1 just as soon as you pony up the cash and sign a 1 to 3 year contract on the loop. Otherwise, make sure the caps are stated up front, shop around for the most lenient provider, and get used to it.
This has nothing to do with letting industry cripple anything. It's simple economics. If it weren't for bandwidth caps, you'd be on a slow line, your ISP (who pays the full price for bandwidth whether it's used or not) would be throwing cash down the toilet, and we'd all be wasting bandwidth.
As long as we American remain blinded to the possibility that government is good for something, we're going to remain forever a society of technological haves and have nots just like they have in the third world nations.
Also, this country pays $400,000,000,000 dollars each and every year for the military. That's over 20% of our annual budget. And after the Iraq war this year, it's probably closer to $600,000,000,000. It's quite astonishing to me that there is absolutely zero national debate about the size of our budget. We could have this entire country wired up in no time if are priorities were straight.
---Technology will liberate us if it doesn't enslave us first.
I have been in Soul and Inchon and it didn't seem like a despot ruled hell hole.
Even if it was, the money from spam would go to the despot. Do you want to support a despot with spam?
Fight Spammers!
"hmmm what's a better way to spend the money???"
Boy am I sick of hearing this. "Let's bomb an evil dictator out of his country, but not spend the money to leave the country in better shape than we left it."
"Derp de derp."
Why would a country pump billions into another independent country, one where the interference wouldn't be welcomed, instead of ensuring the economic prosperity of its' own people?
Hi,
the article raises, first, the general issue of technological anticipation in the IT field.
The problem is : is it wise to make plans that are supposed to be completed in seven years ? Is the tremendous amount of money provided worth a pure credential position ?
Furthermore, it seems to me like a race to the fastest network. RoK is well-known for its quick development in that sector, but this is now turning into a craze for speed. Maybe the technological process of networking will have changed at that time ; and if not, probably only a minority will need to download at that pace.
This article is already four years old. But it underlines the fact that connectivity might not be considered the same way in 6-7 years.
Actually this paper sounds like optimistic/futuristic sci-fi, but the Korean did make the same kind of bet by enforcing such a plan.
Regards,
Jdif
Let's overcome our weakness.
Indeed, one wonders why they don't go with fibre, or 1000Mpbs networking. In 7 years, 100Mbps may be the equivilent to dial-up.
However, the flipside is that if nobody else is installing even 100Mbps for future considerations, won't they still be ahead of the game in 2010 unless some new technology emerges to use on the existing networks/infrastructure?
I'm amazed at the number of poor posts that get moderated up whenever there is a telecom related article.
/. Reader has a ADSL line and got lucky with no neighbors using outflow bandwidth and an ISP that doesn't care (yet), so therefor any nonsensesical pronouncement that would lead to the whole world having a service that now costs $5,000/month being provided to them for $21.95 makes perfect sense.
I just scanned through the two dozen that made a +3 or better so far and I'm astonished at the number of poor assumptions about physics, economics, network operations, and life in general.
The physics was the most egregious of the bunch and I think everyone who is smart enough to navigate far enough to see this *should* understand, but I can't resist brushing some of the others.
Moore's law is just an observation - its *NOT* a law. Why is someone applying this to available circuit speeds for WAN access? WAN access lines are very expensive and thusly that ground has been throughly worked by every telco equipment vendor - copper pairs are good for a about 2 mbits at the typical distance between a home/office and a CO, the next step up is DS3 delivered on coax (low loss, damned expensive compared to copper, and fiber refits in existing areas are crazy expensive. If it was possible high value DS3s filled with 672 voice channels would be the first thing going on some new wonder technology - this isn't happening, ergo it doesn't exist.
And why are they making statements like "100 mbit stuff is cheap on ebay, just build a national network out of it". Ethernet is a *LAN* protocol - 300' limit in most cases for copper, Cisco 2950-LRE are only good for a few thousand(hint, long reach ethernet == DSL), and who would want to manage a pile of crap from ebay? The number one expense in any network operation is almost certainly payroll and a crapola network guarantees 127% of revenue will be spent unfornicating it. If you want reliable service you pay for reliable gear. Once in a while you get lucky on the cheap but no business big enough to do a neighborhood size rollout would fool around like that, let alone a big telecom organization.
It seems to me the underpinnings of many of those posts are pure emotion coupled with a sense of entitlement - J Random
Mod me brilliant, mod me troll - the opinions of the readers are foolish and the moderators deserve a timeout for promoting such crap.
I am very easy to get along with, but I don't have time to waste being nice to people who are being stupid. -Theo
Look at the cases of the phone systems in Britain and Argentina when they were in a system of a welfare state (pre-Thatcher)..
So not only will the tech be outdated by the time they finish half of the rollout, but getting a repair to your line that got cut by someone digging for a new building will take 2 years at least...
Generally it's best to let private industry manage the "commanding heights" in an economy (power, transportation, infrastructure). History has proven this time and again.
THE MAGIC WORDS ARE SQUEAMISH OSSIFRAGE
While this sounds like a good idea, and may well be, these types of projects tend to go way over budget, and tend to be mismanaged. Feelgood social projects are always nice in principal, but often the downsides and pitfalls are not fully explored.
I think its unfair to take pot shots at the USA, and villanize us. We have a different system than South Korea, its more of an economic ecosystem rather than an engineered environment. If their system works for them, then great.
I am doubtfull of how sucessfull it will be, but I admit that I do not know exactly what the economic environment is there, and nor am I an economist. I would guess however that neither do you have these credentials.
Economic practicality, I think, should over-ride socialist philosophy, because once you break the bank, there isnt any money left for social programs.
Finally, there are plenty of socialist countries, this simply isnt one of them. If you disagree with the economic system, then fine, but put forth thought out arguements rather than flamebate overstatement. I certainly am not impressed with your generic US bashing. There is good and bad in every system.
Im not here now... Im out KILLING pepperoni
I'm not going to get into whether or not the country should spend that much money on the network when it has many other problems, but...
People saying 100Mbps won't be fast in 7 years? Screw that. If you think we'll have even 1/10th of that in even 1% of the US in 2010 you're out of your mind. Huge areas of the nation don't even have 56k-capable telephone lines, let alone broadband. This won't change until it's profitable for the businesses to do otherwise. Monopolies own all the lines, and there is no government incentive. There won't be, either. (Which is good and bad)
I've got 1.5Mbps right now, with planned 3Mbps in a year or so. I've only had it for a few months. I don't see it going up much more by then, considering how long it took me to get above dialup...and certainly not to or above 100Mbps. Hell I bet 20Mbps will be a lot in 7 years if you live in the states and we're talking average residential internet speeds. Same goes for globally.
So which telecom stock do I put my money into?
I read your comments about broadband access to those using slow modems and have to chuckle. At present, the FCC is contemplating yet another technology that has the potential of providing access to rural users, however it won't happen because the profit does not justify the cost of hardware. We as a country will never have universal access as long as the private sector foots the bill.
My thoughts exactly. Not to mention the global economic ramifications of freeing millions to pursue their own dreams, build businesses, etc.
High-speed internet is an incremental improvement for Korea.
True democratic liberty and freedom is a giant leap for Iraq.
A fool throws a stone into a well and a thousand sages can not remove it.
For $25 a month (in Iowa) I had 100Mbps ports in my apartment, 1.5Mbps symmetric to the internet, and almost no interference from other tenants (I suppose they just like to check email).
If they are smart enough to use fibre, a single strand has very good possibilities for future expansion using DWDMs (dense wave division multiplexers). Basically these are devices which take incoming data, split it into different streams and fire those streams down the fibre as different wavelengths (aka colours). The beauty of light waves in a fibre is that they don't interfere with each other, so you can have lots and lots of colours.
When I am king, you will be first against the wall.
Clueless American detected!
Scanning Geography knowledge.... scan complete!
Results: Geography knowledge of -10%!
So, let me get this straight: You were willing to sacrifice the lives of several thousand people (possibly many times more), deal with the massive cleanup required thereafter, and have survivors suffer terrible scars and increased cancer rates just so you could prove a political point?
Yeah, that's a balanced view. IHBT.
Prices have probably gone up since I was there (about a year ago). Nonetheless, even at 25$ a month for 2mbit, thats still much better than the 45 - 75$ range for cheap American 2mbit that turns out to be closer to 256k.
hrrm.
keep on waiting...
I was in my networking levture the other day and the lecturer mentioned that the actual bandwidth limit of the cable which we have in our cable systems here in the uk is about 500mbps. If this is true (is it?) why not just lay that instead of 100mbps network cable?
Extended Warranty? How can I lose!
If Iraq chooses an anti-US communist or islamic regime, you seriously think that the White House is going to just shrug its shoulders and say "well, that's democracy".
If the US was interested in freedom, they'd have intervened in Zimbabwe and Rwanda (but I guess that they don't count because they don't have oil).
Personally, I'd rather see South Korea become a major tech power, and the population of California start making T-shirts in non-unionised conditions for a far eastern company. Maybe the US will learn something soon.
Incidentally, it won't get broadcast much, but Bush is in the UK, and most of us think he's a scumbag, even though our Prime Minister would like you to think otherwise, and that marches against Bush are being suppressed.
actually, sweeden leads the world in counter-strike, by teams like Schroet Kommando. the US is a close second with teams like 3D. (resource.) korea isnt really big at all in that game, but the most popular game there is Lineage. here in the US its actually close between counter-strike and bf1942, but i cant find a link for that. :(
The US government shits $87bn in social programs.
Actualy I think the money is mostly going to U.S. contracters, so it's more like corporate welfare, if you can call that a social program.
traffic map of polish educational backbone. 10 gbit/s in most cities.
Incidentally, it won't get broadcast much, but Bush is in the UK, and most of us think he's a scumbag, even though our Prime Minister would like you to think otherwise, and that marches against Bush are being suppressed.
Suppression? You've been reading IndyMedia for too long. Suppression is Tiananmen Square 1989.
Any legal or procedural roadblocks that have been thrown at protest organizers can hardly be termed "suppression".
Idiot. No Iraqis flew into any buildings. It was Saudi-Arabians, which are allies with the US. Al Quaida got support, training and materiel from USA for its purposes, which later backfired with stunning effect. More correctly, Al Quaida in its present form did not get support, but other related organisations did. Same thing with Iraq - USA, France and other western european contres supported Iraq because they were fighting Iran. Backire! The talibans in Afghanistan got support, because they happened to be fighting the russians. Backfired! Basically it is a bad idea to pump money and weapons to organisations and countries that happen to be your enemy's enemy, because 10 years later they will turn against you. Weapons in the hands of idiots is always a bad thing, which means about 100% of the world's population.
Wow... this thread just went from a fast network to Iraq. "Please try to keep posts on topic."
What, so people's right to freedom of speech to protest publicly about Bush arriving in the country isn't being suppressed then?
You mean Saddam is dead and not just waiting, waiting... Ditto Bin Laden. If you're going to do a job, at least do it properly.
--
This sig is inoffensive.
Well, i guess that's why you are not into diplomacy.
Too bad that many or your political leaders are as narrow minded as you.
I don't have a sig.
Anyone else think Blizzard (the gaming company) is behind this?
this 100mbit connection is not for the network backbone. south korea's network backbone is already in the gigabit range: http://stat.nic.or.kr/network/m/2002/06.html (flash) http://isis.nic.or.kr/english/sub03/sub03_index.ht ml
although it's written in korean, the four things you see in the center are the national switches which also connect korea to the world.
this 50-100mbit connection is planned to be the average connection for the home user; average, in a country where the basic connection is around 2mbit. this does not preclude private companies from offering faster home connections.
Don't blame us. Blame Karl Marx.
--
"What do you want me to do? Whack a guy? Off a guy? Whack off a guy? Cause I'm married."
Heh... not sure if this is real or a troll, which makes it a great troll if it is one. But one point about the Marshall plan: the money pumped into Europe mostly had to be spent buying stuff from US companies. (Classic "tied aid".) So there were expectations of payback. That's not to say the Marshall plan was a bad thing, but it was more enlightened self-interest than selflessness. As "for ensuring the world is a better place": [insert standard comment about South American countries fucked over by US foreign policy].
In a way they liberated themselves from oppressive ISPs and their sadistic tactics. Sorry, that's what I get for posting just after paying my optimum online bill...
Just in time to be obsolete!
In the 50's, 60's and 70's we were ahead of the game with transportation and housing. We built one of the best transportation systems in the world. Over the last 30 years we have seen our infrascture start to decay and now we find ourselves scrambling to find something new to carry us. The 90's were bad for the economy but semi-decent for technology itself in the US.
Now in 00's, 10's and 20's the asian infastructure is going to be networks and technology. South Korea doing this project and China going to space. They WILL surpass us in very little time.
I imagine that South Korea's system IF put in place will easily last 90% of the population until 2030 or later. The rest will slowly start adopting newer technologies. starting in 2020 you will start to see a decline.
My new title at the office is "Vice-President of Everything Else"
...to be reminded of the costs of re-integration of countries split during the Cold War.
In case you haven't noticed, North Korea is impoverished.
I'll bet the ratio of per capita incomes between North and South Korea in 2003 is more extreme than the ratio between East and West Germany in 1989.
IIRC, West Germany had a couple of years of financial indigestion trying to re-integrate its eastern block counterpart.
Assuming North Korea doesn't use it's disproportionately developed military to attack the South, it will conceivably want to be peacefully re-integrated and re-built.
That task could easily require more than $80.4 billion.
"Provided by the management for your protection."
No, your right to get close to his motorcade is being suppressed. Except that you had no such right in the first place.
And haven't you read the latest polls? More Brits favo(u)r his visit than disdain it.
[PowerPoint] is a tool for capitalist presentation
When the government is using tax payer money to fund projects like this, no price is too high!
Healthcare article at Kuro5hin
sounds like they want to make a huge cluster..
- Hi I'm Linus Torvalds and I pronounce Linux, Lih-nix..
- Population density of South Korea -- 459 persons per SqKm
- Population density of the United States -- 28 persons per SqKm
While it is a valid position to take that the US should be doing more to encourage broadband availability, you glossed over the details, don't you think?And when a paranoid nutcase goes round punching people in the face "because they looked at me funny", he's the one who should be locked away.
Ever hear of innocent until proven guilty? I thought that's how the USA was meant to work?
All of this just for StarCraft? :P
Perhaps it is a very wise move to give access to everyone, and let them decide whether or not to use it. At least they are not being denied access. The government is helping break down barriers to access to what is surely to become a great cultural advance, as everything moves to an online information delivery model.
If you want a driver license, apply online. Check your government benefits? Go online. Pay your taxes... online.
Can't get online? Nonsense.. every house has been wired.
Won't America probably be entirely wireless with speeds easily reaching 100mbps, but probably closer to 200 mbps? I mean I don't know about outside the city, but where I live there are wireless networks everywhere. Both 802.11b and g, so once this is expanded upon, there will be at least 52 mbps wireless commonplace. By 2010, I would hope that we at least double this speed, if not quadruple it or more. This Korean thing isn't really advancing anything, its tying them down to old technology. I've got a mile (not exaggerating) of Cat5e that I've never even touched cause I went with wireless instead. Its dirt cheap, I feel like I should just give it to them or something, perhaps I will.
That's some commitment to closing the 'digital divide'.
You need to see the state of Asia, I hear.
They are not closing it, they are opening it further. And the US is on the low end side of the divide.
Dialup connections are around $7/mo now.
I live in a giant bucket.
...the sheer power of 11.3 million open SMTP relays, connected by 100MBit networks.
Please. While Finland's ISPs haven't yet gone down the path of having customers pay for additional bandwidth, our network connections are far from good. Actually, I believe were are the worst off of all the Nordic countries as usual. Mostly our problems are caused by the moronic telecom system we have in place, namely every area has a single telecom monopoly operating in it which is usually the only ISP too. The telecoms will do anything to stop people from getting faster connections, so it's doubtful that the situation will get any better. I pay 50 euros a month for 512/512kbit ADSL and I'm one of the lucky ones, a lot of people have to pay more for less bandwidth. The only exception to the overall shitty bandwidth/price ratio is the city of Oulu, which has some sort of special deal with Cisco. It didn't really help that our goverment blew tons of money into digital tv (which is a completely retarded system in the first place as it can't even compete with analog signals in terms of quality), apparently a sum large enough to have covered the cost of building a fiber network which would've reached the majority of the people in Finland. So now we have a digital tv broadcasting system nobody gives a damn about and which can't be used for anything else instead of a proper fiber network. As for our wireless connections, well, Japan is lightyears ahead of us to name one place which has things better.
(sorry for posting twice, had the text type as html in the first one so it had a slight lack of paragraphing)
Please. While Finland's ISPs haven't yet gone down the path of having customers pay for additional bandwidth, our network connections are far from good. Actually, I believe were are the worst off of all the Nordic countries as usual.
Mostly our problems are caused by the moronic telecom system we have in place, namely every area has a single telecom monopoly operating in it which is usually the only ISP too. The telecoms will do anything to stop people from getting faster connections, so it's doubtful that the situation will get any better. It didn't really help that our goverment blew tons of money into digital tv (which is a completely retarded system in the first place as it can't even compete with analog signals in terms of quality), apparently a sum large enough to have covered the cost of building a fiber network which would've reached the majority of the people in Finland. So now we have a digital tv broadcasting system nobody gives a damn about and which can't be used for anything else instead of a proper fiber network.
I pay 50 euros a month for 512/512kbit ADSL and I'm one of the lucky ones, a lot of people have to pay more for less bandwidth. The only exception to the overall shitty bandwidth/price ratio is the city of Oulu, which has some sort of special deal with Cisco.
As for our wireless connections, well, Japan is lightyears ahead of us to name one place which has things better.
Have you noticed that there are more people in the US and that the US is bigger than South Korea? Do you suppose that the cost for this might be more than $80b? Maybe this would cover California or part of the Northeast, but we aren't getting any national 100Mb network in the US for $80b.
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master."
Lids may not fit on jars but pr0n will fit in bandwidth!
Speak truth to power.
"That's an amazing invention, but who would ever want to use one of them?" ... President Rutherford B. Hayes in 1876, after Alexander Graham Bell demonstrated the telephone to him at the White House.
"There is no likelihood man can ever tap the power of the atom," ... Robert Milken, Nobel Prize winner in physics, 1923
"Heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible," ... Lord Kelvin, President Royal Society, 1895
"Who the hell wants to watch movies with sound?" Who said this? Believe it or not, it was the president of Warner Brothers Studios, Harry Warner, sometime around 1918.
A lot of our government offices are going digital, correct? So lets say we have an entire country (ie korea) that has X Million/Billion PCs on 100mbit internet connections, and they were to launch a DOS attack on our puny US networks. I'm not some big conspiracy fan but it's not that far-fetched.
And then there was E
Why are they spending $60.8 billion on internet connections when they can fully fund their own military and allow the US soldiers to return home? This just boggles the mind. Here we have an economy 20 times the size of their northern aggressors, and they decide to spend the extra cash on an internet connection?
If you lived within artillery range of a hostile nation that is openly aggressive, would you rather have your money spent on a faster internet connection or a military force to keep the enemy at bay? Heck, with that kind of money they can overthrow Kim Jong Il and perhaps set up a peaceful government in its place, or even unify!
The radical sect of Islam would either see you dead or "reverted" to Islam.
That country is pretty well developed. I mean, look at how good they are at Starcraft! And when we finally meet those hostile aliens, they'll probably be in charge of Earth's future robotic army. Don't worry, they'll 0wnz the aliens too.
Buy Steampunk Clothing Online!
Obviously the relative size of each country has eluded you. South Korea is about half as small as Texas. How would you imagine the US lay out a GRID all across the US and it's territories? The magical money fairy? It would cost several times the full national budget. Also, you're comments don't even make sense.
South Korea: Technology is the future. Internet access is a basic human right.
United States: Intellectual Property is being violated, lets greenlight tyrants like **AA to set the agenda. MP3 Downloading has to stop.
You're idea that internet access is a basic human right is as ridiculous as some of RMS's idealistic utopian society rants. South Korea never said internet was a basic human right. I think you need to learn what human rights are. Your pipes most likely lead to the city septic system. Is that a basic human right to have indoor plumbing? Thinking of a commodity as a basic human right is very American attitude for such a US basher.
The US government uses open source heavily. Yes they use Windows alot too. Just like South Korea.
All in all, none of your points are even romtely valid, and your post just goes to show that you don't really understand either the difficulty and
inherent problems in rolling out a nation wide network, nor the difference in geographical size.
Heck while we are it, since it's so simple, why not just set the whole WORLD up on a 100mbps network. I mean, think of all the human right being violated in third world countries. Those people don't need food or medicine, they need broadband!
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. It's just that yours is stupid.
Well if they just left it to the stupid taxpayers they would just waste it on food, clothing, education, etc. Its a good thing that the government knows how to spend the peoples money properly.
Maybe this would cover California or part of the Northeast...
or a very densely populated Indiana. South Korea is the same approximate size as Indiana but has an estimated 48 million people (CIA's WorldBook)compaired to Indiana's 6 million (stats.indiana.edu).
I'm guessing trillions, so heck, why not? double the defecit, but get free broadband...
Well, I am sure not all Finns have broadband, but I immensely enjoyed my Sonera 1024/256 connection (18 euros, no connection/equipment fee, no traffic limits) during a year of my studies in Lappeenranta. :) The education sucked though...
Future Wiki -- If you don't think about the future, you cannot have one.
Exactly, I think the major misconception here is "obsolete" Vs "somewhat outdated" or just "not cutting edge."
1.5MBps isn't really "cutting edge" anymore, but it's not yet outdated. Even 56k isn't obsolete, as a surprising amount of people still use modems, and lesser bauds can even go for fax machines etc.
My main point was, that if S. Korea implements 100MBps around the country, and nobody else does even that... well they might not be cutting edge comparative to some other locations, but they'll still be ahead of the game
600k skorean troops stare across the dmz, all funded by the skorean government. they spend 4% of their gdp on defense, which totals to several billions in defense... 30k american troops nearby, funded by the american government and who don't have to pay rent on the land they use. skorea's rich. when you're one of the 15 largest economy in the world...
Yeah... I guess you can watch multiple streams. Kind of like watching tv news with picture-in-picture.
One other thing I forgot to mention is that the capacity must increase for a LARGE segment of hte population. If only a few people (like geeks) have the capability, no one is going to offer any services. For example, most computer games are still designed with 56k modem in mind (also LAN but that's another thing). Except for the latency you get with a cable modem/DSL, you get no other benefit. Similarly, most websites are still text-oriented and the extra bandwidth is useless (unless you are downloading something)...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Seeking the meaning of life... @slashdot of all places
Since there will be industrious engineers out in the field installing all this network gear, perhaps they could take a few moments per site and fix their Metric Korean Assload of open proxy servers. Which are so popular with 'net vermin.
...build an adequate interstate highway system. Oh, wait a minute...
Never let a lack of data get in the way of a good rant.
1) Who says we are in an "age of abundance"? I don't feel anything is more abundant for me than it was for my parents. Besides the internet and various tech gadgets, where is this abundance?
2) Who says capitalism is unsuited to abundance? It works quite well in commodity markets.
I just hope I don't lose a leg to net congestion. :/
Let me get this straight: your political stance is "I don't care about the outcome, I just want to be right."
You would RATHER (in YOUR words) have innocent Americans die so you can be *right* than have the peace of mind that we don't have to worry, personally, much about national security?
I am conservative in my views, but I would much, MUCH rather have the US military do a good job protecting us, and have the threat remain non-existant, than have innocent people suffer so I can tell someone "See, your ideas are wrong, and I am right; HAH!"
If your you only beleive something so you can be "right", you obviously don't beleive them for the right reason.
"If you put butter and salt on it, it tastes like salty butter." -Terry Pratchet, on Popcorn.
Yeah but the price diffrence between the two is also preventing a turn.. but in most cases copper will suffice short range transmission needs so optics will remain pricey...
Who needs WiFi when we can have Packet Over Sheep! http://datacomm.org/PoS-InternetDraft.txt
What would you call restriction of the right to protest then? Administrative guidance? Anger displacement orientation? Maybe we could even work in the word "paradigm"...
Don't you have a knowledge of geography? There are two Koreas, you know.
Reminds me of people who complain about all those people trying to enter the United States from New Mexico.
For?
Somehow I get the feeling we have another poster who doesn't know the difference between North Korea (communist...ish) and South Korea (capitalist).
Somehow I get the feeling that you didn't read the parent post I was responding to.
Had you done that, you would have realized that I was responding to a post from someone in Russia complaining about his crappy internet connection and lack of good options.
--
"What do you want me to do? Whack a guy? Off a guy? Whack off a guy? Cause I'm married."
Somehow I get the idea you're right. Gosh darn filters set too high!
My humblest apologies.