Slashdot Mirror
Genre-Defining Games?
Gamasutra has up responses from its frequent feature, the question of the Week. This week's question was a call for the best of the best. "For any genre of your choice, what is the game that defines that genre for you?" From the article: "For the RPG, simply Final Fantasy 6. It has the best story, greatest variety of characters, tons of different music, and added many secret areas. It was the first game to truly to define a real experience of an RPG to the player.
-Anonymous" What games would you refer to as Genre Defining?
Of course Half-life As of right now.. MMORPG - World of Warcraft
Gotta be pong!
Wouldn't a genre defining game have to be something which MADE a genre? To me, FF6 isn't even close for RPG's. Pick one of 'Wizardry' or 'Bard's Tale'. For FPS, Castle Wolfenstein. (I'd accept Doom, since that's what really made FPS 'take off'.)
A genre defining game is hardly the same as 'best game in genre'.
My UID is the product of 2 primes.
No mention of the pure classic that is Populous? It's the classic God-genre game; although it's a genre mostly consisting of Peter Molyneux games. It's got to be a strong influence for many RTS games, though. I also see the infamous Brandon Every puts his (apparently) unqualified oar into the proceedings...
Puzzle:Tetris
Fighting:Street Fighter 2 (championship edition if you want)
Platform:Mega Man 2
FPS:Half-Life
RTS:Warcraft 2
Space:TIE Fighter
and I don't know the genre, but Civilizaition 2
The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
There is a moment in Max Payne 2 where you can listen to recorded messages from Max's tapped phone lines. You hear a couple of phone conversations that push the story a little, and then there is one where Max calls a phone sex line. He sounds depressed, lonely and in a way, confused.
The whole game you have Max in your ear, talking in this very noir tone. He's narrating his own story, if you will, and telling the player what he wants them to hear. That moment when you hear the phone sex call was almost like a breach of privacy between the player and Max. It was on Max's intention for the player to hear this low moment in his life.
Games are great at making one scared, surprised, intrigued and a bunch of other emmotions, but that was the first time that I felt empathy towards a video game. It's not genre defining, but it was a moment that shows that there can be a lot of depth to what games can be. They can be more than just shoot-em-ups. They can convey some serious, complex emmotions. We will see more of this in games in the future.
I would say that the original DOOM would have to define FPS for me. I remember, and also played, Wolfenstein 3D, but seeing the levels in DOOM with the graphics and new weaponry was just fantastic. Even today, DOOM is still mentioned as one of the pioneering, and defining, games of the genre. The DOOM pack (DOOM, DOOM 2, and Ultimate DOOM) makes for quite a nice weekend every once in a while.
Try actually thinking for yourself. It's quite refreshing.
The Legend of Zelda: Link to the Past was amazing. One of the best 2d games ever IMO.
That list was more like "My favorite games". Starcraft didn't define the RTS genre, it was just a popular RTS game. Plenty of games before Starcraft defined what Starcraft would eventually become.
same with all the other genres.
The Final Fantasy games are considered RPGs? Oh right, they're "console RPGs".
It has the best story, greatest variety of characters.
OK.
tons of different music
So? If the music is really exceptional, it might be worth noting, but quantity is different from quality.
and added many secret areas
So?
It was the first game to truly to define a real experience of an RPG to the player.
Hilarious. So prior to FF6 (released in 1999?), there were no "real RPG experiences"? What does that even mean?
And how old are these people? I'm only 19, but I'd go with Ultima VII as the genre-defining RPG.
LOAD "SIG",8,1
Definitely was a ground-breaker in FPS (First PostS) games.
"What game is the most archtypical for its genre, and is also a great game?" The flavor of the experiment is to find a title that defines the ideal of the genre - add anything and it gets weaker, take anything away and it gets weaker. I agree with World of Warcraft for MMORPG. It has every generic MMORPG feature, but does them all in a great way. For FPS I'd say Doom. Everything since then has been window-dressing, unless you want to say Q2 or Half-Life for the modding scene. RPG has a lot of flavors, but FF6 is a good choice. I've always loved the SNES RPG types best (Secret of Mana, etc). Hell, I might go with Dragon Warrior, though. Sports game, you have to give it to Madden, the original. Well, for me '95 is The Year of Madden, but Tecmo Super Bowl is STILL the best football game.
"What game is the most archtypical for its genre, and is also a great game?"
The flavor of the experiment is to find a title that defines the ideal of the genre - add anything and it gets weaker, take anything away and it gets weaker.
I agree with World of Warcraft for MMORPG. It has every generic MMORPG feature, but does them all in a great way.
For FPS I'd say Doom. Everything since then has been window-dressing, unless you want to say Q2 or Half-Life for the modding scene.
RPG has a lot of flavors, but FF6 is a good choice. I've always loved the SNES RPG types best (Secret of Mana, etc). Hell, I might go with Dragon Warrior, though.
Sports game, you have to give it to Madden, the original. Well, for me '95 is The Year of Madden, but Tecmo Super Bowl is STILL the best football game.
I think that grand theft auto and it's sequels are their own genre, and a fun one at that!
it's in it's own style a good game.
but heck.. not a lot of role playing going on there. pre-determined story that you advance with fighting, that's what it is.
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
I think my absolute favorite would have to be Final Fantasy Tactics for the PSX. It had a great storyline, the music is probably the best i've heard in any video game, and to top it all off, the job system is well balanced. Mostly I like the tactical aspects of the game, as battles can be won and lost by where on the map you start your party. Hell, this game was released a little after FFVII and I'm still loading it up and playing it at least once every few months. As far as replay value goes you can't beat that.
Gotta be Metal Gear Solid(PSX version). IMHO he was the first to truly introduce the concept of stealth play in a seductive way to the masses.
Nowadays its hard not to find an action game without at least a level or mission in which you must avoid being spotted or setting off the alarm. Stealth game play its the perfect complement to action gameplay enriching the experience.
MGS also one of the first and better aproaches to film-like videogames according to the frame of reference of mainstream movies. RPG's always have been better at storytelling but the true aproach to plots, cinematics and characteres following hollywood films was first made with games like MGS or Silent Hill.
---------
Thinking never hurt anybody --MacGyver
We'll probably never get over it's reiterations.
Tactical of course Rainbow 6.
Granted, it's a very very youngish genre, but important, nonetheless. Natural Selection, of course. The most popular to date multiplayer RTS/FPS out there. I give points to Savage for prettiness, and Allegiance for intricacy and hardcore fanbase. But NS really brought the genre to the fore, imho.
"Genre defining" I think means the game that best represents what the genre is about. So not necessarily what made a genre take off or started a genre but more like the first game that comes to mind when someone mentions a genre.
meep
Most of you are probably two young to remember, but before these fancy-schmanzy E-G-A video cards and Mice, we had (mostly) text games. AND WE LIKED IT!
.sig), and influenced the humor in many games.
Zork was one of the first, and one of the best. It established some classic puns (See my
Now, go find that Grue.
94% of Repubs and 21% of Dems voted to renew the Patriot Act
I think it's a toss up between Mega Man 1 (Rock Man) or Mega Man 2. If memory serves me correctly, Mega Man 2 was released stateside before Rock Man. Otherwise I would say Rock Man deserves the 'genre defining' title. Both games are amazing though. If you were to create a new category of 3D platform, then I think without question Mario64 would be the game that defined that genre.
It DEFINED the super-cutesy Korean anime-based MMORPG!
Going back to school for entry-level jobs?
I'm sick of all these FF6 zealots, FF4 is the best.
True genius is grasping a situation like a peice of fruit, and peircing it just right so that it drains dry.
Final Fantasy Tactics Also, Starcraft for RTS and Civilization for Turn Based Strategy.
It really got the ball rolling on the whole genre.
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
I hate how people will go out and buy hype, then manifest their current eagerness everywhere they can. I guarantee you, in a year, God of War won't be considered the platform game. Besides, isn't God of War technically a hack 'n slash? When I think platformer, I think of games were half the difficulty comes from maneuvering. Prince of Persia: Sands of Time is a good modern one, but Mario Brothers 3 perfected the art, if you ask me.
Back to my point, it just seems that a lot of these entries are either hype-mongers or uber-nostalgists. I don't care that Guy #1 is old enough to remember getting an insane score in Pitfall, nor do I believe that a game that came out a month ago is the best of its series. If the same guy can play four really good games in the same genre six months from now, and go back to God of War, and still say it is the best in the genre, then I'll believe him.
Fighting:Street Fighter 2 (championship edition if you want)
Indeed. Street Fighter 2 brought a welcome new addition to the realm of fighting games: sexy girl fighters! Think about it: before that, fighting games were just one brute fighting another. With SF2, all of the sudden you could choose to fight with Chun Li or Cammy instead of some overmuscled brute! Needless to say, it was a brilliant way to stimulate young hormonally-charged boys even more and pretty much every fighting game since then has featured some sexy babe character!
In the last few weeks, a new breed of popups have appeared at Slashdot and a few other sites I visit. THEY BREAK MY WEB BROWSER. It's as if they steal focus permanently for a page, and I can't do damn thing with it.
Advertisers: fix it or I'm making a list of who is being advertised in these things and making a point to never give them money. I can't take this anymore.
Empire or Civilization 1 were genre defining games for turn based strategy. Civilization had descent graphics for its time and endless playtime.
If you want arcade fun, then GT4 certainly sounds the business. But for serious racing, even 7 years after its release there's still nothing like it for accuracy and immersion - although LFS and our own favourite open source project Motorsport are getting close.
Don't make the mistake of thinking this is a nostalgic sympathy vote for a game that would look dismal to fresh eyes. See for yourself. If you're seriously into driving, you owe it to yourself to spend the $10 or so to check it out. If you're up for the challenge, start with this.
Aegilops
Wing Commander 2 was the best of the series. It broke the modern-video game industry (esp. if you bought the speech pack).
The system requiements were really high, the graphics were awesome, the interactivity (and changes in story line as you progressed were somewhat unheard of). I remember as a kid saving up to buy the first soundcard in my PC just so I could buy the speech pack and play.
Of the modern games which are listed, I must agree - Legend of Zelda Ocarina in Time is probably the greatest game made. Dare, I say, one of the best made in the last 10 years!
sp2 was the best game
thx
I'm suprised Fallout didn't show up on that list. The game and its spiritual predecessor Wasteland were genre defining in a way - post holocaust RPGs. Granted, a very small genre but on their strength alone they should have gotten at least honorable mention.
the only genre-creating and defining game
First Person Sneakers!!!!
this sig has been discontinued.
Adventure: The Hobbit and Myst
Real Time Strategy: Total Annihilation
Turn based Strategy: Alpha Centauri.
First Person Shooter: Battlezones (Atari Arcade)
Cheers, N
Oh gawd, there are just SO MANY GENRE DEFINING GAMES... ddr, gta, wow, moh, mgs, smb, loz, hl, cs, rtcw, pos, sol, stfu, bfh, wb, afk, ffa, wwf, kkk, peta, asd, qwe, ert, uio, opa, sdf, fhj, jkl, zxc, vbn, oh yes and of course the famous eew... and that's just to name a few!!!!!!
Final Fantasy 6 is an awesome game and I personally don't think that a game has bested it yet. However, to me it didn't define the modern console RPG. That honor goes to its grandfather, Final Fantasy 4.
While it wasn't the first of its kind, FF4 defines all the aspects of a modern console RPG and was the framework on which everything else built on top of. It gave us ATB and a battle system that was fast, fun, and at times totally insane. (Remember Plague?) The storyline was fairly deep for its time, and you gained a lot of respect for the characters even in the crappy US translation. In the real Japanese FF4 you had a small yet noticable amount of strategy in battles.
Moreover, while it seems primitive today it was mindblowingly awesome when it came out. Everything was simply perfect in its simplicity - nothing really stood out on its own but instead everything just blended together seamlessly to produce this memorable piece of art. The music was the best of its time. The graphics were primitive, but blended into the game wonderfully. The story gripped you. (Name a single video game character that went through half the crap Cecil went through by the first quarter of the game.) The characters were the most well developed of its time. (Rydia is the penultimate video game heroine, IMO.)
It all just came together so perfectly that you can literally see a "pre-FF4" and a "post-FF4" split in console RPGS. FF6 is a work of art, but those who played FF4 when it was released will know that it can easily hold its own against FF6.
It's a shame that the "young pups" can't see past a game's graphics. This is a often overlooked gem that made a huge mark in video game history.
I compare almost all strategy games I play to X-Com.
Mr. Boogaloo will always be the genre defining grasshopper game to me. I don't think any other game has quite captured the act of grasshopping like that game.
There is only room for one genre-defining slealth game, and it's Pac-Man! Pac-Man ownzorz your boxxors !!!1
(apologies)
"When the atomic bomb goes off there's devastation...but when the atomic bong goes off there's celebraaaaation!"
First console RPG with dynamic characters. You changed class in the middle of the game, and it isn't fighter-knight stuff. Your character actually does a 180 turn in style.
FFVI was overly epic. It wasn't simple and sweet like FFIV.
Advenutre: Adventure Roguelike: Rogue Rogue
I'm sick of all these FF4 zealots, FF6 is the best
---------
No, i'm not going to defend my position because i'm being sarcastic
I'm just going to point out some things that I think.
I would take Planescape: Torment for RPGs over any Final Fantasy game, hands down.
Ico had an emotional pull like few other games I've played.
Not that I don't love Splinter Cell, but I'd rather play any of the Metal Gear Solid games any day.
I hate to use newer games that have just come out really recently, but in WWII shooters, Call of Duty and Brothers in Arms are just head an shoulders above the rest.
In the category of Graphic-Based Adventure Games, I nominate The Secret of Monkey Island. It was not the first by a long shot. If this were a thread about "created the genre" I'd probably put King's Quest in this place.
I almost said Grim Fandango, but really Grim Fandango is just as good as Monkey Island or Sam & Max Hit the Road or Day of the Tentacle but not so hugely better that I'd think it defined the genre. Re-introduced it, yeah, and that was wonderful. Monkey Island was funny, intelligent, not so entirely hard that I couldn't finish it, and has a fantastic soundtrack. (MI2's was even better.)
My love of Monkey Island 1 & 2 was what made the cancellation of the second Sam & Max harder to take. We all want to re-live the glory days in new and interesting ways.
This now concludes our broadcast day.
the only genre-creating and defining game
Roguelikes!!!!
Analogies don't equal equalities, they are merely somewhat analogous.
Can't FF 4 zealots and FF 6 zealots get along? Both games totally rule. It's FF 7 that is the enemy!
Seriously, the first 10 hours of the game were not fun, IMO. Midgar City was not at all fun. NOT FUN!
Hungry Hungry Hippos defined mindless button mashers before there even was such a thing.
I would say that Genre defining game has the following characteristics.
1) It sets the standard for its gameplay type.
2) It has signifigant retail success.
3) It is imitated.
The third one is very important. Metroid succeeds at the first two, but it is hardly imitated.
Diablo, Doom, Warcraft 2, Final Fantasy, Super Mario Brothers, and Street Fighter 2 are all genre defining.
END COMMUNICATION
For me, any game to be genre defining needs to pass a couple tests.
1) If I pick up the game a few years later, will it be hard to play, because the genre has moved on so signifigantly, that it feels wrong somehow? (controls off / genre defining things haven't appeared yet)
Super Mario Bros 1 is hard to play for me because the controls feel stiff and unresponsive now (even though they felt fine in 1986). And the inability to go back is frustrating. Contrast this with Super Mario Bros 3, which plays as well as it did the day I first picked it up. Doom is practically unplayable for me today, because the controls are simply so alien to what I'm used to in the FPS genre. No third dimmension, no mouselook, etc. If a game is prototypical enough that it's unplayable years later to a follower of that genre, I'd say that it can be said to have inspired the genre, but not defined it.
2) Do lots of games try to imitate a game after it's appearance?
How many Mario clones were there in the late 80s and early 90s? How many Tetris clones? How many fighting games came out at the peak of Street Fighter II's popularity? These games defined the genre, simply by all the copycats that folowed in their wake.
3) If after a game appears, does the genre suddenly die, because those imitators can't keep up? (This can't be an instant death, this takes some time)
There are very few examples of this, but they do happen. R-Type is the best one I can think of. After it came out, it defined the genre. There have been shooters since, but few if any as good. Certainly none that managed to truly surpass it. Basicly, I'd say that R-Type was so good that it killed the genre. It killed it by perfecting it. Gamers didn't pick up new shooters much after that, because they all felt either like either inferior titles, or just like more of the same.
Touch everywhere, even when inappropriate.
Final Fantasy defines the Console RPG, which is to real RPGs what tofu is to beef: a poor substitute that people will continue to try and insist somehow fills the niche.
That's just what I was wanting to say. As PC RPGs go, I would submit Ultima IV as the genre-defining game of my own experiences. It was just one of the most enthralling gaming experiences I can remember. I played that game forever.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
The question is unclear. The game that defines a genre is typically never the epitome of the genre. For instance, Wolfenstein 3D clearly defined the FPS genre as we know it today, but I would certainly pick a more modern and advanced FPS as the epitome of the genre.
Similarly, Super Mario Brothers on the NES clearly defined the side-scrolling platformer, but I think I would have to call it a 3-way tie among Sonic the Hedgehog 1, Super Metroid, and Super Mario World for epitome of the genre.
Personally, I always loved a well-done video pinball game. My second favorite was the Epic Pinball series for the PC. My favorite was some series that was originally done on Amiga and then ported to PC... I think it was called Pinball Madness or Pinball Chaos or something. Anyway, it was just a hair better than Epic Pinball IMHO.
Skate or Die and 720 tie for defining the skateboarding genre, but I think the Tony Hawk Pro Skater games take the cake for best representing the genre.
Moderator hint: a comment is neither "Flamebait" nor "Troll" if it is true.
I'm impressed that the article mentioned rogue! (And you should all be impressed that I at least skimmed TFA.:)
But by the standards they used for choosing the other games, I would have to say that Nethack really defines the genre that rogue started. More so even than Diablo.
I did like this, though:
"Best game ever - Nethack"
-John Root, id Software
Nope, FF6 was released in 1994 or so if memory serves, pretty close to the same time as the vaunted Ultima VII you're pimping there.
Both are great games, and genre defining, but way to be dead wrong.
I take it then, that you haven't played the GTR racing simulator. Now THAT is a seriously awesome simulator.
As for off road, Richard Burns Rally takes the cake.
You call it excessive, I call it ambitious.
Some reasonable enough picks in the article, but a lot of very strange omissions and perhaps a few unwarrented inclusions as well. Of course, it's hard to make just one pick per genre, so I'm not even going to bother trying.
Adventure:
I don't see how anybody can talk about genre defining adventure games without at least a nod to Zork. The license may have been driven into the ground since then, but it still has vast significance. Moving forwards, I guess the next big genre-definers were the Sierra adventures. I'm not sure which of these actually came first, so I'm just going to name the Police Quest, Space Quest, Kings Quest and Leisure Suit Larry games. Next came the Lucasarts games; I'm thinking particularly of Day of the Tentacle and Sam & Max here, although Monkey Island also merits a nod. With the "no deaths" gameplay and the quirky humour, I think these basically represent the high-point of the genre. Finally, the Syberia games deserve a nod for trying to resurrect the genre on modern hardware.
First Person Shooters:
Wolfenstein3d and Doom were probably the big early genre-definers here. The former basically introduced gamers to the concept, while the latter really showed what the genre could do in terms of atmosphere and adrenelin. Quake probably represented the biggest technical advance, and hence has been massively important in defining the genre, but its single-player gameplay felt like a massive step back from Doom. Of course, it also popularised the idea of online gameplay to an extent that none of its predecessors have managed. I don't actually see Half-Life (or its sequel) as being particularly genre-defining... they were just examples of existing concepts done very well; they don't bring anything new to the genre.
Action/Platformers:
The early Mario games are obviously the most significant influences here, although I think Sonic also deserves credit for bringing a sense of fun to to the series (at least before the hideous 3d incarnations) that Mario never quite had.
Racing:
I think the most significant early racing game has got to be Outrun, which was massively popular in arcades for a while, with its big, shaking cabinet. Hard Drivin' was also significant; it had a more "realistic" feel than Outrun and its clones (despite the insane stunts) and I think modern racing games ultimately owe more to it than they do to Outrun. In the modern era, I think Ridge Racer was really responsible for bringing the genre onto modern hardware, while the Gran Turismo series have pretty comprehensively established the racing-sim category.
RPGS:
Ok, this is the section where I think the contributors to the article get it most "wrong". Very disappointing to not see a single nod towards the Ultima series. These defined the whole non-Japanese RPG world up until the early/mid-90s, even if the series did have a pretty dire ending. Of course, Ultima Online was also the first really successful MMORPG. Moving on to more modern games, it's probably right to recognise Baldurs Gate and its sequel, as they revived the fortunes of the "Western" RPG at a time when they were pretty low indeed. On the Final Fantasy front, I don't actually think VI is worthy of recognition, even though it's the one the fanboys like to drool over. It was essentially IV or V with a better story. I think you have to either point at II, which was the first to have any real story at all, or at VII, which was the first time that Square had the technical resources to do their story justice. Diablo probably deserves a nod as well, for largely inventing the action-RPG genre.
RTS
It's sad that so many people picked Starcraft here. Successful though it was, I fail to see how it defined the genre. Obviously, Dune 2 and Command & Conquer were the really important titles; I think C&C was more so, because it introduced the now-obligatory drag-click system, as well as multiplayer. Total Annihilation should get a nod for proving that RTSes don't have to look like crap.
My list:
- FPS: Doom
- Text adventure: Zork
- Graphic adventure: Much as I'd like to say Monkey Island, gotta go King's Quest.
- Puzzle: Tetris
- Realtime strategy: Starcraft
- Turn based strategy: Civilization
- Tycoon: Railroad Tycoon
- RPG: Ultima 4 (or Wizardry)
- Software toy: Sim City
- Flight Sim: MS Flight Simulator
- Sports: EA NHL (93 or so)
- Cards: MS Solitaire
Think that's most categories. Games that were hugely successful, spawned sequels, as well as imitators. PC-centric perhaps, but didn't want to get into the stand alone games like Pacman, Donkey Kong, Asteroids, etc.I think Commander Keen deserves an honorable mention, but for my money, Super Mario World for the SNES is the defining platformer. Every single level introduced some new idea or challenge. Although, something has to be said about my new favorite platformer of all time, Doukutsu Monogatari (Cave Story), a freeware Japanese game that fans liked enough to make an English Language translation patch for it. Like Zelda crossed with Megaman or something.
Slices, dices, eats your lunch.
Delphine Software produced Out of this World and Flashback in the first half of the 90's. While not the two most recognized games from that time, they brought a deep cinematic experience that I hadn't seen on consoles prior.
The big silver tables down on the Santa Monica pier. Nothin like 'em.
The big silver tables down on the Santa Monica pier. Nothin like 'em.
Apperently I'm not the only one that doesn't agree a bit with TFA.
How on earth could HL2 even be considered genre defining, or HL1 for that matter.
It clearly has to be Doom or maybe Doom 2. After these games came out a lot of "clones" pop-ed up (Dark Forces, Rise of the Triads, etc.). It was the true beginning of the clone wars. Unreal Tournament could be seen as a new definition for Online FPS games.
As for survival horror, it has to be Alone in the Dark, it's defined the whole concept of survival horror.
Adventure, well this is a though one since you've got text and graphical adventure. So it's difficult to say which one defined it. For graphical it most likely would be one of LucasArts or Sierra's games.
Platform, how can this be anything else but Super Mario Bros. The first platform game for the PC was even a Super Mario Bros. proof-of-concept wich later became Commander Keen.
RTS, well either Command & Conquer or Warcraft 2. Total Anhiliation is a great game, but not defining it. Just look at all the other RTS game that came out, hardly any game followed the works of TA (which is a shame).
I could go on for a while, but you get my point. TFA is plain and simple crap. Featuring games that didn't define it, just followed a definition of it. It doesn't mean they're great games (well, except for a few maybe).
FPS/RPG: System Shock 2
:(
Absolutely ground breaking game, just not accepted widely enough
Jan
Jan
The game which defines Real-time strategy today and played by thousands.
Starcraft.
Was cruising through this thread, and didn't see any lists that I thought deserved modding up, so I figured I would post my own list. The problem I had with most of the lists that I saw were that they seemed to come from people who've never played a console game.
Platformer: Mario Bros.
Adventure: The Legend of Zelda
Graphical Adventure: The Secret of Monkey Island
Text Adventure: Zork
Japanese RPG: Dragon Quest
American RPG: A Bard's Tale
MMORPG: Ultima Online
Tactical RPG: Ogre Battle
FPS: Wolfenstein 3D
Sim: Sim City
Flight Sim: Sid Meier's F-19
Space Sim: Wing Commander
Fighting: Street Fighter
Real Time Strategy: Command and Conquer
Turn Based Strategy: Civilization
Puzzle: Tetris
Survival Horror: Resident Evil (or Alone in the Dark)
Sneaking: Metal Gear
Party: Mario Party
Music: Dance Dance Revolution
Racing: No idea, but I will tip my hat to Rad Racer
Sports: Ice Hockey (I'm Canadian)
These of course, are the games that defined their genres. The games that really laid down the track, and defined what the genre was. They might not have been the first, but they were the first of the popular ones, and served as a role model for the rest. I might have forgot a genre or two, but I think I have the majority of them. A few of my categories may be incorrect... especially the last couple, but I think overall, it's a fairly decent list of who's who.
They overlooked flight sims. And the Genre Defining Flight sim is definately Austin Meyer's X-plane.
Sticking just with consoles, two series come to mind that wallop the tar out of every FF game. Granted, these are from 32-bit systems, but the LUNAR games started on the Sega CD and were still better games.
-Suikoden I/II (Please ignore III and IV, they're the inbred cousins we don't talk about). 108 characters, all of which actually have some value to your party (unlike...say...Relm), deep storylines, and storylines that actually respond to the player. Unlike the FF games, which are on rails and thoroughly nonresponsive to the player.
-LUNAR: Silver Star Story Complete and LUNAR: Eternal Blue Complete. They're on rails, and the combat is somewhat outdated--but if you don't find the LUNAR stories to be up there with the most touching you've ever played, I can't do anything but shake my head.
Most of the posters just don't seem to remember back far enough to see the real genre defining moments.
For adventure type games it simply has to be Zork. Everything after this has simply added pretty graphics and different user interfaces. Fun though Sam & Max and Day of the Tentacle are, they both show heritage back to the earliest text based games.
Racing games. How has no-one mentioned Pole Position? Or for the more simulation oriented how about Revs? Which directly lead on to the Grand Prix series of games. Everything since has just added more cars, more tracks, better graphics and better physics. The games aspect of getting round a course a quickly as possible hasn't changed.
First person shooters. Wolfenstein 3D - no doubt. Choice of weapons, ammo levels and health. Doom was a better game, more fun but still clearly an evolution from Wolf3D, as is quake, unreal and half-life.
Platform games. Manic Miner on the Sinclair Spectrum. The basic elements of collecting things and getting to the exit are there. MM has each room as an individual levels to be completed, the sequal Jet Set Willy had an enormous map of connected rooms but still the same basic principle. Mario and Sonic are just the same really - they all trace back to Manic Miner.
Puzzles - Tetris. Nothing else needs to be said here.
Space simulators. This is the one that has amazed me the most - NO ONE HAS MENTIOED ELITE!!! The original space flight / fight / trading games from the BBC Micro. That has spawned enormous numbers of versions and countless derivatives.
Innovate games are getting very very rare now. I personally think this is a great shame. The most innovative game I have played recently is Darwinia which combines aspects of several other genres to make something unlike most other games.
Its still not truly innovative though.
I wonder if we will ever see anything utterly new again.
not a 'game' category per se
But doom was distributed FOR FREE- with only a 1/3rd of the game.. but it was a complete game- it made you DIE for more- and to buy it!
nobody put top of the line software out for free.
every day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random
In the "Oh my god if video game marketing continues like this I may never play video games ever again" genre I nominate Yo! Noid on the NES
This is a genre defining question. Without question
GPL defined the racing 'simulation' genre. A good GPL ranking is still a thing of pride.
That being said, GTR, and its base (GTR is a mod), F1 99-02, have surpassed GPL in some respects. For a 1998 game, GPL is still 'current' though, as long as you spend the time to get the force feedback settings right.
If you race real vehicles, as I do, the particular sim that is best for practice depends on your class. I race Rotax and TaG class karts (30hp on 355 lbs total weight, almost 3Gs), so F1 99-02 is actually the game that matches the rythm, grip , and timing of my real world class.
The real noticable upgrade of GTR/F199-02 over GPL is the tire model. GPL, true to what it is simulating, is on treaded bricks. Even Jim Clark did not always put on new tires for an F1 grand prix. I'd imagine, engine-wise, the tire modelling is the biggest thing papyrus added to their nascar series (descendents of GPL itself).
Any racing sim modeling modern racing slicks classes needs to get this right.
The other thing GPL is lacking is a good aero model, which is probably why papyrus chose the last year F1 had no aero as the year to simulate.
The bottom line is that GPL 'defined' the genre, but GTR/F199-02 finally surpassed it...6-7 years later. (Technically, almost by definition, the papyrus NASCAR series surpassed it much sooner, but I disregard it purely on the grounds that it is NASCAR).
For rally, I like Rally Masters best, although it is not so much accurate 'rally simulation', as it is 'realistic-like handling model' crafted into a wonderful multiplayer setup. I concede that Rally Masters does no genre defining.
UT2004's Onslaught mode more-or-less qualifies as FPS/RTS, you expand across territory to control resources. I could imagine having fun playing it top-down starcraft style controlling a team of bots (anyone done that mod yet?).
:)
Anyway, it certainly defines the "Onslaught" genre if not FPS/RTS
I don't think that anyone that knows about GPL wouldn't know about GTR.
I own GTR, and I suppose the physics engine is very accurate. But watching a few replays or spinouts and other offroad excursions, the behavior of the car in GTR looked somewhat more canned than in GPL, where it looked extremely authentic, with every small bump affecting how the car moved about its 3d axis.
But all that aside, GPL is just a lot more fun. You can really get those cars sideways, and experience some great opposite lock. GTR is a lot more subdued. The Porsches gon't give out a lot of wheelspin even when the accelerator is all the way down coming out of a turn, and at the other end of the spectrum, the smallest bit of gas in a Ferrari in a turn and the smallest bit of rear end step out results in an unrecoverable spin (loss of aerodynamic grip, etc).
Besides, GPL has the greatest race tracks: the ones so unsafe by todays standards that no one would even think about driving.
And the extensive community that GPL created created a bigger market for other developers to create simulation games. Look at all the graphical updates, new tracks, car mods, that make this 1998 game look better than stuff being released today. Look at all the renewed interest in historic racing. People making trecks to France, Belgium, and Italy to take pictures and drive on long forgotten tracks, a lot of which are being torn down.
GPL has already gained the title of the greatest simulation game ever. Just wish Papy would have released the source.
Whereas I am currently playing Ultima III on my Palm Pilot...
The Legend of Zelda is the best game, and LOZ Ocarina of Time may just be the best in the series so far. It was the first one with non turn-based fighting. And turn-based fighting sucks.
Utinam me logica falsa tuam philosophiam totam suffodiant.
Five buttons arranged like a piece of piano keyboard and a turntable (like a button but you prod it as opposed to pushing it). Stuff scrolls down the screen, press the curresponding button/tt exactly when it hits the bottom and noises are made. Play accurately enough and the noises combine with the background track to form music.
... interesting how Konami can sell essentially the same game 20 times but with different music and have it continue to be successful.
The TWENTIETH release of this game (Beatmania IIDX 12th style) is coming out in Juneish and the series is still going strong, and although IIDX added two extra buttons and the most gorgeous looking and sounding arcade cabinet you'll ever lay eyes on, it's still basically exactly the same game, just that the range of difficulty is much (much much much MUCH) wider; the songs are all about two minutes long and one of the new ones has about 1800 notes to press in that space of time.
That and it spawned DDR and all its knockoffs, and the similar Popn music series (nine huge domed buttons and no turntable, different music style. Popn is currently on its 13th iteration I think)
It's definitely quite
Herzog Zwei or Dune II was some of the first RTS games.
I agree on Tetris though. Lot's of clones.
Space invaders had a lot of clones too and later resulted in Galaga and the whole spaceship shooter genre.
SPACEWAR! probably inspired in Asteroids and Star Control.
Then there's TBS... I don't know here. I'd like to think that Archon indirectly inspired games like Advance Wars . There were also Gameboy wars and other earlier mostly japanese games had similar boardgame elements like that (Nadia for NES to mention an odd example).
Super Mario Bros 1 probably had a huge impact because it was so well executed with scrolling, levels, secrets, powerups.
I like Quake 1 the most of the old FPS games. Real 3D and nice physics. The FPS genre hasn't gotten much further, just some ragdolls and stack objects. You still can't blow terrain up like in 2D games from ages ago.
Which brings me to the 2D terrain destruction games. Which was first here? The gorillas with the bananas? I kinda liked Scorched Earth for the Amiga best of the early games. Well, it's not like the genre exist anymore, except for some hobby projects like DIRT (which I'm mentioning cuz I'm working on it).
StreetFighter II certainly did a lot for the Beat em up genre. Other good games worth mentioning are IK+, Yie Ar and Barbarian, and Bruce Lee (C64) cuz it's so charmy even though it was more of an adventure game.
Mario Kart really got the cute racing genre going, but I think there were GoCart racing games before it, just not very good ones.
The Chair Corp. comic(*00-12)
Story driven FPS: Marathon
Multiplayer FPS: Unreal Tournament
Well for the genre of "sex" the game that best defines it has just got to be the "Naughty Cheerleader Tied to the Bed" game.
:)
At least for me
I would have to go for The Secret of Monkey Island for defining the adventure game genre!...Sadly, I don't think any recent game gave me that same feeling... any developer out there up for the challenge? -Mario Di Pesa, Ubisoft
How about Beyond Good & Evil, which came out of your own company? New Coke was better promoted than that game, and now I see why.
Saying Halo 2 is a genre defining FPS is like saying The Darkness invented the electric guitar and glam rock.
It is about the closest thing i have played on a PC.. I haven't played on anything newer than 98 tho. http://www.3drealms.com/balls/
It was this old game where this little yellow dude ....
Not sure what genre(Arcade/console/puzzle), but for a lot of people a generation older than me, it would be the first and maybe only video game they could name.
Can't believe no one has mentioned Tomb Raider, even though it could be a considered a derivative of the treasure game Pitfall!
Pitfall! is also a defining game for the stepping-on-alligator-heads genre which, to my knowledge, encompasses a grand total of one game.
and finally, Leisure Suit Larry!
Game: Player 'Donald J Trump' now has AI skill level 'experimental'.
"For the RPG, simply Final Fantasy 6. It has the best story, greatest variety of characters, tons of different music, and added many secret areas. It was the first game to truly to define a real experience of an RPG to the player. -Anonymous"
I can only assume that Anonymous' finger slipped and he meant to type "Final Fantasy 7," because that makes a lot more sense in reference to "best story" and "a real experience of an RPG" and such. Of course, even FF7 doesn't completely fit the last sentence, which suggests that every RPG made beforehand didn't really feel like role-playing.
Here's what I would think of as a much better list of genre-defining RPGs:
Console RPGs:
Early traditional: Dragon Quest/Warrior
Modern traditional: Final Fantasy 7
Early tactical: Shining Force
Modern tactical: Final Fantasy Tactics
Early action: Secret of Mana
Modern action: Can't think of one offhand (note that Zelda games and the like are not RPGs)
Computer RPGs:
Early top-down: Ultima 4
"Second generation" top-down: Ultima 7
Modern top-down: Fallout, Baldur's Gate, Planescape: Torment, take your pick
Early first-person: Wizardry
"Second generation" first-person: Ultima Underworld, Eye of the Beholder
Modern first-person: Morrowind
Rob
R-Type is the best one I can think of. After it came out, it defined the genre. There have been shooters since, but few if any as good. Certainly none that managed to truly surpass it. Basicly, I'd say that R-Type was so good that it killed the genre. It killed it by perfecting it. Gamers didn't pick up new shooters much after that, because they all felt either like either inferior titles, or just like more of the same.
Radiant Silvergun kthx.
Somebody mod this up.
Defines the genre of games that are undefined.
It's a 1994 game.
Though the date you provided is eerily close to Everquest's release date -- Which should have been your first indication that maybe they had made a mistake.
I'm not sure you can really say Japanese RPGs are more story driven than their Western counterparts. Maybe this more "Adventure drive" style you speak of was true of early Western RPGs, but it was also true of early JRPGs (which featured no major story elements to speak of either). But Planescape Torment, maybe KOTOR, System Shock 2, Deus Ex, some of the Ultima games, and more all feature similar or even more storyline than what you find in current JRPGs.
I think the only major difference is that Japanese console RPGs generally have much larger budgets, and so they feature flashier and more extravagant storytelling (via plentiful cinemas, endless little 3D talking head scenes, and the like). Maybe it stands out more to some gamers because of this. There are also more of them released every year, probably because they are one of Japan's most popular game genres.
Another problem might be that a lot of gamers confuse games which definitely are nothing more than dungeon crawls like Diablo 2 with RPGs. They then associate that kind of game with Western RPGs, which is naturally nonsense. And it's also ignoring that Japan releases quite a few dungeon crawl RPGs every year as well.
JRPGs also feature storylines which are considerably more juvenile and shallow than what you find in a game like Planescape Torment, but that's another topic I suspect...
There is no excellent beauty that hath not some strangeness in the proportion. -- Francis Bacon
I think something like this is infinetely influenced by the games we were most exposed to in our past. Given this, here's my list:
Adventure: Can't help myself when I continually think back to the original Zelda for the original Gameboy. Was and still is great fun! Zelda Ocarina of Time for N64 was very, very strong, and I also own Windwaker, but the boat in Windwaker seemed just tedious to me. Yea, I play other adventure games besides the Zelda series, but the Zelda series seems to have that perfect mix of action and exploration.
FPS Single Player: Toss up for me between Wolf3D and HL2. Just because Wolf3D was so awesome to behold back then, as HL2 is now.
FPS Multiplayer: Genre-defining, I would have to say Quake 3. That's when all the buttons hit just right, and all the cylinders were fired at just the right times. It's not that innovative, but still tons and tons of people play it, and it's always great for a quick game. As a personal favorite, I would say UT2004...Onslaught is such a great addition to multiplayer fps, if you haven't tried it, you just have to get the UT2004 demo.
2D Platformer: Obviously mario, but my favorite in all the series is SMB3. I really, really wish Nintendo would release a NEW 2D mario game. No more stinkin retreads! Though I wouldn't really call SMB3 so much "genre-defining" as I would call it "genre-ending." There's basically no chance of anyone ever coming close to the greatness of that game. Ok, a little overboard? Maybe, maybe not...a couple other good ones...Duck Tales for NES...Yoshi's Island (underrated)...Mega Man 2...
3D Platformer: Mario 64, period. Mario Sunshine is too cumbersome but Mario 64 had the perfect mix of simple control and good level design.
Racing: Never have cared for racing games, I just like the typical Mario Kart and GTA games, and I don't even care which one is genre-defining.
Side-Scrolling bashers!: A game I always compare the side-scrolling bashers to is oddly enough, Streets of Rage 2 for the Genesis. It got the fighting feel down pat. For just playability and fun you might say River City Ransom for NES.
RPG: Chrono Trigger. Finally, you can actually not fight enemies if you don't feel like it! That alone qualifies it against the god-awful random fights in other RPGs.
RTS: Hate em, who cares.
Off the beaten path:
Rom Hacks: Okay, this is a weird category. But when ROM hacking was just getting started, translating FF2 (famicom) into english was all the rage for probably over a year! I always think of that one when people are doing hacking or translation projects. Hehe. Just wanted to throw that in. Also as a non-translation hack, Super Mario Wheelchair Bros. is a hilariously simple hack made to the original Super Mario Bros.
Emulators: Okay, talking genre-DEFINING here, and that's definetely what this is for those of you that remember. NESticle! The perfect GUI, great speed, tons of options, and great compatibility (for its time). I doubt any emulator bypassed NESticle in popularity until the later incarnations of ZSNES or maybe MAME, but I think tons of us always will look back at NESticle as the emulator that probably really did get the ball rolling in emulation as far as getting thousands upon thousands of people and coders interested in emulation.
Shooters: I always think back to Life Force for the NES as a shooter to be reckoned with. You could possibly say Star Fox defined the newer shooters...if there are more than a couple for this to actually be a genre.
Posted by yintercept - "...science...[is] the study of the 'divine creation.' "
Surely defined the games-you-play-and-suddenly-it's-next-morning genre
Thinking back now, I can't believe how many hours I spent on various platforms organizing 6 different blocks...
I think that that game on the original Game Boy created the entire hand held gaming industry.
So you're preferrance of GPL over GTR/F1 99-02 is taste. That is fine, although even in GPL driving tidy is often faster than heavy drift. The gross level 'look' of GPL is more dramatically real mainly due to the spring rates. Watch a real-life F1 spin. It looks a little canned too. Also, I think GPL is less damped in its simulation, which leads to GPL's unrealism at the other end of the spectrum (energy gets injected into the simulation, due to low damping on an explicit solver) where cars can go flying to extreme heights in certain cases.
GPL's track database is unbeatable. I agree. The tracks are a big reason I still play GPL a lot. Plus non-aero F1 is just plain fun, like you say.
If you do ever venture into real racing, your taste would have me reccommend Formula Ford, a showroom stock class (like spec Miata), or a club tire kart class (like American 100cc classes, not ICA).
- Lemmings -- I love these little critters. What was great about the gameplay is that there is no exact correct way to solve it.
- The Seventh Guest -- one of the first games that really used the "new" CD-ROM media. (Who remembers the MPC recommendations
:-)
- Myst -- you're directly immersed in the game with nearly zero hints/tips/documentation. You're forced to discover the game.
- Doom -- First pseudo-3D immersive FPS. Made me get my first Pentium-66.
- Descent -- First real-3D game engine which.
- Quake -- Real 3D FPS action, written by Carmack et al. 'nuff said.
I haven't kept up with games after that. (I guess that's what getting older does to youOkay... I'll do the stupid things first, then you shy people follow.
[Zappa]
What I find interesting is how few people understand what an RPG is intended to be. I see games like Diablo listed as an RPG, which it is definately not.
So, what is a role playing game...that should be the first thing that has to be thought about.
A role playing game, or RPG is about having the players play the part of one or more fictional characters, and taking control of that character as he/she/it goes through adventures. In the ideal game environment, the player would play the characters according to the statistics that define the character. So a GOOD character would never choose to perform an evil act, while an evil character would enjoy him/her/itself at the expense of the feelings or health of others, or in extreme cases take pleasure in hurting others.
A skilled game master and player(s) will tell a story that revolves around how the players go through adventures and in time may rise to greatness.
So, what happened when this idea tried to make it's way onto a computer screen? Early games such as Wizardry used a simple combat system similar in many ways to Dungeons and Dragons. The idea of going up in levels, getting more hit points and powers, and so on were followed faithfully. While it wasn't exactly the same game system as D&D, it was close enough. Computers wern't advanced enough to allow for a lot of choices. You followed the storyline, but there was no choice. It was a true "hack and slash" type dungeon crawl.
Games like Bard's Tale came out that were a step up in a lot of ways. But again, it was a dungeon crawl, hack and slash adventure type of game. Advances had been made, but a true RPG it wasn't.
There were other games out that were in this same attempt to bring some of the Dungeons and Dragons experience to the computer, including the "Gold Box" games. SSI did bring the D&D ruleset to computers, but still, there wasn't a lot of choice. You did have some choices as you adventured though, so it was closer than those earlier games.
Games have clearly evolved quite a bit since those early games, but it's amazing how many games get a "RPG" label slapped on them. If you have no choice in how you respond to an NPC(non-player character), then it can't really be considered a RPG because you can't roleplay. It's more of a story on the computer that you follow, but isn't a true roleplaying game.
Baldur's Gate 2 is one of the closest games that I have seen to a computer RPG. You have the main character, and for most characters in the game world you talk to, you have choices about how you talk to that character and what you want to say. Planesape: Torment is another that gives you MORE control in some ways, though less choice in gameplay in some ways.
Both of these games give you some choices about what to say and how to say them, but they arn't perfect. The perfect game would also allow you to change sides if you choose, or to give yet more choices in what you say and do to the people in the game world.
A part of the problem is that when a game company uses an existing game world and/or ruleset, you are bound by certain requirements. For example, Wizards of the Coast would never accept certain things to happen in a game based on a world they have licensed. So game developers need freedom when it comes to content. A game that lets the player choose to be good, neutral, or evil, greedy, selfish, sadistic, or a champion of good and doing the right thing is what most gamers look for if they love RPGs. A game where the end really can have dozens of possible endings based on the choices the player has made is also a part of this. What fun is it if you choose to be evil, yet end up being the good leader or sacrifice yourself in the end?
Other game types are out there, but it's hard to say what game or games define a genre without having a good understanding about that genre.
This is a niche genre that I honestly wish someone would make more games for.
My pick.
XCOM - I simply loved this game.
Certainly genre defining as there were several games made later mirroring it. Jagged Alliance and all the crappy attempts to create "real time" counterparts (Fallout Tactics excluded from the crappy qualifier).
Adventure: Zork. The end. I guess we could also go with Myst for defining that particular subgenre.
FPS: Wolf3D or Doom. Tough to call because Wolf3D was first and very popular, but Doom's popularity went through the roof and reached out to people who weren't already games and computer enthusiasts.
Platform: Mario/Manic Miner/Chuckie Egg. Its a platform specific question (geddit).
Racing: Pole position and then maybe Outrun.
RPGs: Rogue? I dont' care how you prettify these things it always comes down to Rogue underneath. Otherwise I guess the Bards Tale must weigh in quite heavily and then we are talking Ultima.
RTS: Dune 2.
I dunno, I wasn't aware any of these issues were commonly considered controversial to be honest. I agree with conventional wisdom on these matters, as above, I guess. Anyone want to pick a hole here because I'm having difficulty seeing where the interest is.
Angband!
Rogue and Nethack were great, but Angband refined them into perfection.
It inspired clones, such as Diablo (which started life as a turn-based game, *very* similar to Angband) and still garners many players around the world.
I've sunk more hours into Angband than any other game I've ever had, and best of all - it's free!
John Conway
Has to be Worms World Party for the PC. No contest.
I still play that game whenever I get a chance.
I'm very responsible, when ever something goes wrong they always say I'm responsible.
I can't believe no one mentioned TRIBES. The first FPS to be a online-only game. First FPS to have vehicles. First FPS to really use a jet-pack (where it's not just a toy). First FPS to have classes for characters, and deployable equipment. First FPS to have an overhead map where you can set waypoints, etc. First FPS to have a quick-chat system for alerting your teammates.
Computers don't make mistakes. What they do, they do on purpose.
Both Rouge and Thief are poor imitations of the game "Sabotage" for the ZX81.