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Microsoft Denies Claria got Spyware Exception
daria42 writes "Microsoft has denied its AntiSpyware application has given adware-maker Claria special treatment. The denial has been issued amid reports MS is looking to buy Claria, and is in response to security researchers' reports stating AntiSpyware had downgraded the threat level posed by Claria's adware products. The downgrade in threat level merely represented an effort to be "fair and consistent with how Windows AntiSpyware (Beta) handles similar software from other vendors," according to a statement published by Microsoft." As reader jfengel writes, though, "they neglected to mention what software that might be, nor did they publish the analysis."
There's some really excellent analysis on this by Ed Bott.
Compare and contrast to the lies and misdirection spread (as is normal), by Microsoft's resident spin doctor Robert Scoble. See his Ballmer interview, aka, The Idiots Guide to Brownnosing, to see his true colors.
Lots of Gator-bashing is rightly occurring all over the MSDNosphere, see here for a funny example. Remember, even Microsoft employees (commenting anonymously, of course) hate this idea.
I'm guessing that Microsoft will somehow integrate Claria's obnoxious 'personal marketing' tactics into Internet Explorer 7 or the new RSS functions to get a chunk of the targeted intarweb ad market which Adsense has completely sewn up for normal web pages. We should go and tell them what we think about Claria and Gator, not to mention their general business ethics. Don't let Scoble's lies deceive you, and don't hold back.
I don't know if you guys know this, but Webroot's Spy Sweeper is also delisting obvious spyware. Microsoft is not alone in this! I personally think this is going to become a real problem with most spyware scanners unless laws are brought on to fight spyware more aggressively and some kind of standard list is defined like there is for viruses.
The real issue here is Microsoft abusing their position of trust within the general computer user community. No, I'm not talking about people like us here...I'm talking about Ma and Pa Computer User...the ones who see a virus or spyware warning and panic. Many of these people rely upon the recommendations offered by the spyware detection/removal applications to decide on how best to manage their systems. By artificially upgrading Claria products from 'remove' to 'ignore', Microsoft is taking unfair advantage of these users' trust.
Also from TFA:As far as I'm aware, no other spyware removal application has promoted Claria products in this fashion. Until Microsoft publishes these 'objective criteria', and shows how Claria products managed to get upgraded from 'remove' to 'ignore' under them, we will have no choice but to assume more ulterior motives.
____
~ |rip/\/\aster /\/\onkey
"We firmly believe that people should have complete control over what runs on their computers," Microsoft added."
Well, 10 million compromised windowsboxes seems to contradict that belief.
Underholdning.info
From the bottom of that ZDNet article:
"'We firmly believe that people should have complete control over what runs on their computers,' Microsoft added."
Anyone else find that funny?
Please take off your tin foil hats, guys!
One might say that Microsoft is primarily responsible for the entire spyware issue (although I suspect Firefox's track record would be worse, albeit better than IE, if it were as popular). But MS AntiSpyware is a fine piece of software, however. It's easy to use and does its work better than many of its competitors.
Excpet for the fact that Ad-Aware already had A HUGE problem recently w/ delisting of products, specifically When-U. I know many who no longer use it as the first tool against spyware, merely for thoroughness.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
I have 2modpoints left, and I'm in bad mood. So I wanted to mod insightful a comment like: "microsoft sucks!" but there was no comment like that. What's up with you guys?
#
#\ @ ? Colonize Mars
#
BSOD existence too...
MS's anti-spyware tool isn't the only one available, it isn't bundled with the OS, it doesn't attempt to prevent the user from installing other anti-spyware tools - in short, it is one option of many and you are free to install others as well or instead of MS's one.
Why is this in YRO? What right is being infringed or threatened? If you don't like MS's anti-spyware tool, don't use it!
It's official. Most of you are morons.
If Microsoft wants to pull these conspiracies off properly, they need to manage the timing of their rumors and actions. If Karl Rove has to resign over this journalist stuff, I'd say he should go work for Microsoft's marketing department. He'd fit right in.
*chuckles*
/. NOone believes it. doesn't matter what it's about.
this is
[evil demonic laugh]MWHAHAHAHA ![/evil demonic laugh]
fair and consistent with how Windows AntiSpyware (Beta) handles similar software from other vendors,"
So, um, what other program has had it's threat level changed?
Your sig(k) has been stolen. There is a puff of smoke!
The small print says they may not be actual spyware, but potentially dangerous items, most unknowledgable people will just remove them anyway, because it's the default option.
'For we walk by faith, not by sight.' II Corinthians 5:7
1. Microsoft Buys anti-spyware, 2. Microsoft buys up all spyware company's 3. Microsft delcares the war on spyware is won & emails 7 billion email addresses announcing that the WinXp SP 15 will be "Spyware Free"
PS. M$ sucks.
Or to use OpenBSD.
Does anyone know of any OSS that is dedicated to the removal of ad-ware and spyware. . .
I manage a number of windows machines at the office and wit he recent declassification's without good explanation that has occurred in the sector i have lost all faith in most of the products
An OSS solution would be wonderful (hell i would rather switch the machines to linux , but that is not an option right now due to certain programs that are required by the company)
Commercial solutions always to me seem rather susceptible to legal action for the classification and or bribery.
The only things certain in war are Propaganda and Death. You can never be sure which is which though
I prefer to use three products in combination. Microsoft Antispyware on a daily basis, and periodical runs of AdAware and SpyBot S&D seem to do the trick for now.
MS antispyware should rather show the threat level the user represents to the computer by analyzing the number of unused files squirreled on the desktop, viruses & spywares on the system, time spent on configuration panel, number of time a double click is performed when a single click is expected etc.
\u262D = \u5350
The LAST thing I need to happen to my kid sister's computer is for the anti-spyware tool to install Debian in place of Windows. Most users can't handle that kind of sudden change.
"Live Free or Die." Don't like it? Then keep out of the USA
MS is going to buy off all businesses that have anything to do with delivering any kind of unwanted software to users' computers. This maybe part of their plan for security on MS platform :)
You can't handle the truth.
So MS denies something they clearly did wrong, what's new?
You, sir, are entirely unfair!
Microsoft clearly said The downgrade in threat level merely represented an effort to be "fair and consistent with how Windows AntiSpyware (Beta) handles similar software from other vendors,"
It's entirely consistent. Microsoft has consistently held their software offerings to, ahem, an improved standard.
I mean, have you ever looked at how Microsoft's C++ compilers, um, pioneered their own standard, entirely different -- and, so long as you don't like correct exception handling, consistent RTTI, or the availability of a Standard library, entirely better -- from the ANSI/ISO standard. Or look at the, um, improvements to JavaScript and the browser DOM.
Or just look at the XML for Word docs. Ok, well absent a non-disclosure agreement you can't actually look at it, but trust Microsoft it's entirely consistently inconsistent with anything else out there.
How anyone can say Microsoft isn't being consistent in its approach I just don't understand at all.
Opinions on the Twiddler2 hand-held keyboard?
Hmm, I'm sure they wouldn't lie and I shall read the statement as soon my flying pig is back.
It's on a mission, surveying the earth in order to prove that it's flat.
ich bin der musikant
mit taschenrechner in der hand
kraftwerk
Is that Claria isn't the only malware to get this exception?
MS's anti-spyware tool isn't the only one available, it isn't bundled with the OS, ...
You mean it isn't bundled yet. Wait for the next SP. As it is, a lot of people will install it since it's being pushed with Windows Updates, so it may as well be bundled.
This all makes sense when you realize one key, critical piece of information.
First, a quote:
Has Microsoft given in to vendors' threats? Or forgotten how badly "adware" damages the Windows experience (ultimately encouraging users to switch to other platforms)?
Now, the key, critical piece of information.
Microsoft's anti-spy ware devision is headed by a MAC user! You see, MAC zealots have infiltrated the Microsoft hierarchy, and are plotting it's downfall from within.
As a matter of fact, this is a pervasive presence, weaving into all levels of the company.
Think about it. Doesn't Clippy make much more sense as MAC sabotage than as an actual feature? No doubt someone floated a mock up with the note, "Looks just like something I saw at the last MAC expo."
Architecture changes that mean the XBOX II won't be able to run XBOX games, the endless delays in Longhorn, the XP default theme, the differences between XP Home and XP Pro, these are all contributed by MAC users who are gradually whittling away Microsoft from within.
And because Microsoft has been shamelessly copying the MAC for so long, all they have to do is float the rumor that MAC is going to do something, and Microsoft programmers and management throw themselves into trying to replicate it, or at least toss together a half asses rip-off of the feature / technology.
"Live Free or Die." Don't like it? Then keep out of the USA
They'll do the trick until you get a really nasty piece of spyware like zestyfind or a bad variant of coolwebsearch and your TCP/IP stack becomes corrupted.
But I digress... This news really isn't anything major. It is just a standard business practice. Though posting up something like that on a site like this will almost always generate anti-M$ flamewars.
Anti-spyware does the trick for me every time, but then again the only thing it ever detects are a few cookies.
It is good that the Claria stuff is still being detected, and maybe it is not necessarily bad that the default recommendation has changed, if one were to assume that all similar products were treated in the same way.
However, with some programs having the "ignore" recommendation, and others having "quarantine", it will probably give users the impression that Claria is at least somewhat ok, or something like that, which it is not (at least in my opinion).
Actually, what kind of impression does that give someone who doesn't know any better?
Something is detected by the spyware scanner, but the default recommendation is to leave it there.
"Hey, this one is ok because it only spies me or invades my privacy a little bit."
- Donny was a good bowler, and a good man.
That's actually the principle cause of all their problems. They don't have an adequate trust model for modern computing, being stuck in the single-user era.
Raise your children as if you were teaching them to raise your grandchildren, because you are.
The software the MS is refering to is the Save/SaveNow software from WhenU. MS is attempting to be consistent, however there are significant differences between GAIN and Save.
When Spybot Search and Destroy did a much more thorough job on the machines I've worked on cleaning up (I don't generally use Windows, so I don't typically need S-A-D...)- I kinda quit using AdAware altogether. It just doesn't do the job the same way as other solutions.
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
I'll probably burn some karma here, but I'm a big fan of the MS anti-spyware product.
There are really two issues. The first is the catalogue of what's spyware and what isn't. I don't know if MS's program is good at that, and the stories we're reading are sort of disturbing. I buy all of that.
But the second issue concerns the product's ability to remove nasty stuff on your machine. And their anti-spyware app is very good at that.
It's much better than spybot or ad-aware, in fact -- especially with the stuff that scatters hundreds of files and registry entries around your system and reinstalls itself after you try to clean it with another program.
There's nothing that will prevent you from running another program to clear off the stuff that MS's product doesn't get rid of. So don't let this situation prevent you from running this software to get rid of other stuff. It's good at it, and it's free.
In related news:
Microsoft has made a stunning leap forward in the field of bicycle locomotion technology, developing a system of operation that allows for the appearance of forward progress whilst routinely backpedaling.
:::: the insomniac's digest
Microsoft is only a Marketing Company, I hear that alot, and it makes sense.
When microsoft bought Giant their antispyware program was one of the best. When microsoft re-launched it under Microsoft AntiSpyware (and marketed as a new product), it got raving reviews.
The effects are that people will start to trust MS antispyware, and will be starting to ditch their other antispyware programs. As soon as the majority of the people are used to the program, microsoft can dictate their own terms to what is spyware and what is not. Ofcourse microsoft will never go too far, but the changes will be "subtle", not enough to get angry about and still have solid bunch of supporters defending the program for microsoft.
I think this is going to MS's way of getting "patch management" into the mainstream.
Think about it...delivering A/V and system updates via clickable Ads - brilliant!
Oooohhhh...and so so profitable.
JB
Given Microsoft's upcoming DRM support, that line should have read "... control over the MS-approved software that runs on their computers."
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
Even Windows has something like a crontab.
And sometimes I start the spy ware tools to keep my hands occupied while I am waiting for the inspiration.
Honestly, how long will this continue?
Before around '98 you needed only 'antivirus' software mainly. Then with the broadband spreading came the 'personal firewall'. In the last few years came Ad-Aware which is 'needed' if you want to get rid of spyware. In the last year and a half i was starting to see reports about needing both Ad-Aware and S&D, and now people are starting to suggest that someone needs 3 independent spyware/adware removal tools to clean up!!! Not to prevent infection, but to clean up!
Seriously folks, when will the madness stop? You can't patch a broken design combined with user unawareness by semi-working cannot be trusted commercial programs!
Personally i stopped using windows around the time XP arrived in 2001. I just had enough. I don't need no antivirus software, firewall software, ad and spyware removal and detection software and to fight an uphill battle trying to contain IE with an alternative browser. It is absolutely ridicoulus what someone needs to put up with.
It takes a man to suffer ignorance and smile
Be yourself no matter what they say
That is what they're saying, though they don't say which other malware they're comparing it to.
If you read their whitepaper, they probably consider the thing to be relatively low on the damage scale, which is kinda true: it doesn't wipe your disk or log your keystrokes. It is sending out personal info, but it's not sending out your credit card numbers. It's just tracking your browsing habits.
I'm not saying that's good, especially since it's potentially worse than the declared intent if there are any bugs or undeclared "features". But the declared intent is comparatively benign. The tin-foil-hatters will tell you that any privacy breach is major, and they're not wrong, but it's not the reason I'm ticked off.
The real evil with Gator is how hard it is to remove. That's what makes the thing truly malicious malware. The "ignore" setting should only be applied to software that can believably be removed by uninstalling it. That's not Gator, at least not last I heard. (I'm sure not gonna install the thing to find out.)
If you install it and you like the popups and don't mind people tracking your browsing, well, bully for you. But if you don't like it and you can't get rid of it, that makes it an even better candidate for the "quarantine and remove" setting even than a keylogger that can at least be deleted easily.
Amen to that.
..... there wouldn't need to be one, would there? We could just comment out the spyware-ish bits before compiling, and distribute the resulting patchfile. On Gentoo, that would probably be part of the ebuild scripts. OK then, what about Open Source spyware removal for Windows?
Where is the Open Source anti-adware, anti-spyware stuff? I don't see a spyware removal tool for Linux. Oh
But the point is that all the Open Source software available for Windows is there by accident. It wasn't written for Windows, it just was ported to Windows from some unix variant. Nobody writes GPL software with Windows in mind -- it's just that some Windows user manages, with more or less effort, to persuade it to compile, and is obliged by the licence to make the source available. {If anybody persuaded BSD-licenced code to compile under Windows, they probably would keep it closed-source -- and maybe even disable some options in an effort to extort money out of users}.
My computer is my property, and I have the right to determine what software runs on it. Installing software without my explicit consent is at least trespass {which is a civil offence and grounds to sue} and may constitute criminal damage {which is a crime, so dial 999 and let the police deal with it}. These things were already offences long before computer-specific legislation was passed. The use of confusing language to persuade someone to install software may additionally constitute Burglary Artifice. If it's a Crown Court, then the odds are in your favour -- out of a jury of 12 people, how likely do you think it is that none or only one have experienced PC trouble due to spyware?
You know, I often wonder what would life have been like if, way back in early 1976, some members of the Homebrew Computer Club had dragged Bill Gates {the author of that letter} into the gents' and given him a bloody good hiding. That has to be my second choice for an "if I could alter the course of history" fantasy.
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
Well MS is badly placed for any kind of critics towards other companies. Didn't MS themselves put spyware onto people's computers before they got nailed for it?
This denial just proves once again MS' dishonesty towards customers, may they be corporate or individuals.
Why don't people act upon the fact that MS is just lying so blatantly? Oh sure, their lawyers are good, but lawyers can't do anything against massive boycott!
Action, to the streets dammit! Make piles of MS CDs to melt!
---- I am certain of only one thing : I know nothing else.
Windows AntiSpyware (Beta): Analysis approach and categories
s oftware/isv/analysis.mspx/
http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/spyware/
This white paper provides an overview of the approach and criteria categories currently used by the Microsoft research team to analyze and classify software.
No one mentioned hijackthis yet! http://www.spywareinfo.com/~merijn/ It might be harder to use but it is damn effective. Especaily when used with the others.
can't someone create a program to tell a user every program/service that is running on his/her pc (including those that like to remain hidden) and let the user decide if they want that piece of software in the first place?
Is it 5:30 yet?
I think that the original poster has a point about MS competing with AdSense, but as many people will bring out, WinXP will be a gigantic installed base for the next 5 to 10 years at least.
.NET developer ... using Pythonnet, or RDNZL. ;) Figure out for yourself where my loyalties lie.
MS is likely hoping to counter Google by integrating an AdSense competitor directly into the browser, in a manner similar to Claria, but shipped with the next OS. However, the huge install base of previous versions of windows is likely to be dominant for the next 5 years at least.
This is their way of ensuring that their AdSense competitor is available for previous versions of their OS -- allow their own viral marketing products to slip by.
Frankly, it would be an intelligent tactic, and not necessarily a bad way of accomplishing their ends.
The less scrupulous way would be to force people to upgrade to the newer OS, but they are rightly wary of losing trust, particularly with corp. clients.
Disclaimer: hey, I'm a
Interesting comment, which reminded me of a story:
I once worked for a bank, where there was a computer that processed all electronic banking files. The majority of the programs on this computer were written by a guy I worked with. This guy considered himself a programming god, while I thought he was below average.
Now, one of the quite critical programs that ran on this computer was in the habit of crashing occasionally. The guy attributed this to an OS fluke, and instead of debugging the program and resolving the error, he wrote a program that simply checked whether the crashing program was running, and if it wasn't, would restart it.
Without our department knowing, the crashes increased in frequency. We didn't know this, because the crashing program was restarted all the time. Unfortunately, at a certain point in time the crashes occurred about every few seconds, and our system basically went down. I was part of the team that analysed and resolved the problem, and, of course, we found that it was a basic DESIGN flaw in the crashing program. I won't go into details, but basically, with some knowledge of file transfer protocols, this flaw would have been avoided.
Now, why is this story on topic? Because Windows is JUST like this crashing program, Microsoft is JUST like the guy who wrote the crashing program, and AntiSpam/AntiVirus/Firewalls are JUST like the program that restarted the crashing program.
What I expect to find, in the not-too-distant future, is that our Windows systems will simply stop running because the patch programs need all computing resources to keep Windows from going down. And the only way to resolve this, is a redesign. Which should be done by people who know how to design a good system, and not by a marketing company.
I Just installed Ubuntu And got the BSOD,followed by the frowny face mac, followed by a the screen caused by a crashed C64, Ahh such a great screen-saver.
I used to have a cool sig, back when I cared
Maybe that's why scan spyware 3.7 always seems to catch stuff the adaware doesn't.I've never had a problem with the junk until my too young nephews starting coming over for visits while their mom is in the hospital.After the youngest picked a "free" screensaver at a game site(IMO,Worse than pr0n sites when it comes to spyware)i spent about three hours trying different products trying to remove the junk so i wouldn't have to dig out my disk images and reload my recent apps.Scanspyware 3.7 was the ONLY one that got rid of the junk that adaware and spybot missed.BTW,Not connected to the company except as a happy user.Great product if you get something that the other two miss! BTW,I'd be happy to switch to Linux if i could find a way to use it with my isp(direcway) without a $300 upgrade.Does anyone know where to get a Linux driver for a Direcway 4000?I really like the look of Damn Small Linux but without a usb driver for the dway it wouldn't be worth the switch.Please god may cable come here soon!
ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
No Guru Meditation?
Following the link to the original story on the status change leads to this page detailing the list of software that has been downgraded. Screenshots included for the doubtful.
...including certain WhenU adware programs, WebHancer and Ezula Toptext. So the Claria downgrade is quite likely part of a bigger picture regarding Microsoft's listing criteria for adware.
Mods: Do you disagree with me? Go ahead and mod me down. Meta-mods will sort it out. Good luck!
I see you have just typed your social security number into a web page. Would you like me to transfer this to all websites ending with .cn and .ru?
(big innocent-eyed smile from the purple paper clip)
MSC++ exclusive features are only slightly different from the ANSI standard, while GCC ones are so absurdly different that you need to learn a whole new way of thinking
;) looks too much like a function call or an expression to be easily grepped for. A C++ cast (MemPtr* a = reinterpret_cast 0xb800 ;) looks like a cast and nothing else. And it's ugly to boot, to remind you that casting should be done only when absolutely necessary.
You make a good point, and what GCCs does is actually a good thing: something slightly different is like The Crying Game -- hey, she looked like a chick until I'd invested in weeks of dating, and when after all that effort I got into her pants, out popped a pee-pee!
Same with Microsoft extension -- you gets lots of people who don't notice the slight difference -- the Adam's Apple, if you will -- and think that C++ is what Microsoft calls C++. Then they get a real girl, and don't know what to do with her, because they've been dating Microsoft "almost girls" all their lives.
GCC's extensions, on the other hand, are like a big, hairy, honest gay guy buying you a drink in gay bar: you see the bulge in the pants, it's totally different, and hey, if you want to try that lifestyle, it's gay, but, as Seinfeld says, "not that there's anything wrong with that". But it's different enough that you know it's different, and you know if you go back to girls, you'll need an entirely different technique to get anywhere.
No offense to anyone intended by the analogy: the point is that obvious differences are honest -- they don't fool you into thinking you're not using an extension. Slight differences are pernicious, not because they're necessarily bad, but because it makes it hard to recognize when an extension is being used.
A similar concern is why C++'s casting is so ugly compared to C's: a C style cast (MemPtr *a = (MemPtr) 0xb800
Opinions on the Twiddler2 hand-held keyboard?
believe any of Microsoft's marketing spin anymore - aren't we all just getting a little tired of hearing how they see the world and telling us what to do with our technology.
They haven't created a "Incredible technical Idiocy" section yet, nor a "shooting-yourself-in-the-foot" department...
Let me give you a hint.
NO!
So if they're going to make any statement about it at all, this is the one it will be. Anybody having trouble understanding this?
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
Duh!
Is anybody else getting tired of reading about Microsoft lies? Should we start calling "dupe" whenever Microsoft issues a "new" lie to be reported on the
How many times do I have to say it: NOTHING coming out of the mouth of a Microsoft employee (at least one who is either being paid to speak to the public or whose job depends on following the party line) should be taken as anything but a deliberate cynical lie.
And EVERY action taken by Microsoft is an attempt to take your last dime out of your pocket and give it to Bill Gates. (And that dime is NOT going to go to charity from his "Foundation".)
Listing them is a boring and pointless effort - on a par with listing the lies of George Bush or Bill Clinton or the former Iraqi Minister of Information or anybody else in the lies game.
From now on, when somebody mentions Microsoft, just say, "That bunch of liars, thieves and incompetents? Who cares?"
Let's move on to more interesting things - like how we can make Linux and OSS so much more impressive than anything Microshit makes that Microshit will no longer be an issue to anyone except the owners of their stock - as they go to the poor house.
Also, every consultant who has to deal with clients afflicted by the crapware made by this company should be resolute in telling each and every client on every support visit that they would be MUCH better off with Linux (or the Mac or BSD or whatever) and OSS software in general.
Let's make the fact that MS is now going to install spyware in their OS (yeah, right, they haven't admitted that either - yet - is there any rational doubt they will?) an issue in our service advertising. According to a recent article, spyware is starting to seriously affect end user behavior and is the one thing about computers they seem to "get" - that "spyware is bad".
Let's put Microsoft as the source of spyware (both as incompetent OS developer and shortly as ACTUAL source) in the end users crosshairs.
Richard Steven Hack - This sig is TOO GODDAMN SHORT TO DO ANYTHING USEFUL WITH! MORONS!
If they actually went so far as to embed ads into the desktop, that would cement my defection to Linux.
"Those who are too smart to engage in politics are punished by being governed by those who are dumber" -- Plato
Okay, I'm not sure if this is a troll, but...
Gator is often installed automatically by other software/websites. The only way to get Opera is to install it yourself, implying that you actually want it.
With Opera, the ads are obviously linked to a piece of software (the browser) and only appear in that software, in a well-defined area. With Gator, ads appear whenever you surf the Web with no immediately obvious link to any piece of software.
Maybe I'm the last to realize this because I practice safe computing, but last week a friend brought over a laptop that he said "wasn't working right" for me to "fix."
McAffee reported 337 trojans/worms/viruses on the system.
I cleaned the system, rebooted, ran McAffee again (which takes something like 3-4 hours on a 20G hard drive!) and once again, 200+ infections.
I killed all non-critical processes. Loaded two different startup program removal and monitoring systems, disabled system restore and a bunch of other steps, and still couldn't get the system clean. McAffee seemed to be as much a part of the problem as the worms/viruses themselves.
This new breed of adware is insideous. These programs attach themselves to the OS as extensions to explorer and are thus protected from removal by many of the antivirus programs; they create system restore data that brings them back to life later, and employ many other tricks. And all of them seem to have back doors where their authors (or the black hat hacker public) can use to install additional invasive software.
After messing with this infected machine for a few days, I realized the best approach would have been to re-format and re-install everything, but I was determined to clean the system and finally did, and in the process I was able to test the usefulness of a number of new utilities. I haven't been a fan of Symantec/Norton, but I have to say McAffee is even worse. There were many infections that McAffee, with the most recent virus definitions, didn't recognize, that AVG, with an outdated def file was able to remove. I would recommend AVG over both Symantec and McAffee, and people are right, McAffee is the slowest software I've ever seen. Spybot proved to be useless; Ad-Aware wasn't terribly helpful either. These new breeds of adware are very tough to remove. I ended up getting the best results by using some freeware programs like Startup Monitor and Killbox.
It really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone, Gates has no morals! Anyone willing to dive this deep into a cesspool for a nickle has no redeeming qualities or scruples left. He is just too greedy to miss any money he can grub anywhere.
Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
Actually, there is some open-source software that is Windows-only (for example, 7-Zip, which I actually run under Wine sometimes when I have some obscure archive format I need to open). It's rare, but it does happen.
Unfortunately, open-source spayware removal software is unlikely because (a) it's difficult to figure out how to remove spyware and (b) there are probably few people willing to write it and risk being sued, especially as they won't make any money from it.
Wonder if anyone would accept it if Microsoft cured a major disease or effected World Peace :-)
Wonder if anyone spouting their venomous comments has actually used the MS Anti-Spyware product :-)
Wonder how many nasty comments were posted by someone from IE/Windows :-)
I have programmed the following template to create surprisingly realistic Slashdot posts. Quasi-original words are substituted for "blah" with a RegEx processor.
TEMPLATE
Blah blah Microsoft is horrible blah I am so happy I'm using Linux now blah blah Microsoft is evil and they are lying to you blah Linux is the greatest thing since the discovery of fire blah blah Bill Gates is a terrible horrible person who stinks blah Linux is innovative blah blah Microsoft is not innovative they just steal all their ides blah blah Anything bad said about Microsoft is true blah Anything good said about Microsoft is by a fanboy blah blah PR spin lies horrible Microsoft Great innovative wonderful Linux and oh by the way BSD is cool blah so is the Mac it rulez blah blah
I _know_ I will lose some Karma on this one. But I am so fatigued with the anti-MS bent here. Come on folks, you are intelligent and thoughtful. Let's have some real dialogue here, and keep it credible.
The opinions expressed in this post are my own, and do not represent the views of my employer, my family, my friends, or my cats.
My comments are my own, and do not represent the views of my employer, my spouse, my children, or my cats.
I only have an AV program running. I think it's sad to see so many slashdot users posting that they're using up to three different tools for this junk. I don't have spyware on my computer, and it's very easy to avoid. The first big step you can take is throw away IE or figure out how to make it stop auto installing applications.
While I don't disagree with your point, I think you sell short the enormous amount of effort put forth by certain Open Source developers to support Windows. Examples include Firefox, Postgresql, and Apache.
Ok, we all know Microshit will be screwing everyone on this, But what ahppen to all the flack the OTHER antispyware companies were supposed to get when THEY DESCLASSIFIED SPYWARE a few months ago?
Just realise the reality of the situation..... There is no reality.
It's a matter of time before the EULA has something along the lines of:
"By using this software, the User agrees to have all his/her traffic monitored, logged for the purposes of marketing you stuff we believe you can't live without.
Any effort to remove the Claria software from your system will result in a personal visit from some Really Big Guys who will have a Quiet Talk With You Out Back"
"Omnis tuus capsa sunt inesse nos"
I guess I am a rarity of sorts on slashdot. I am a fence rider when it comes to OS software, Browsers, processors, and video cards. What does that mean? That means I use Windows and Linux, even though I only dabble in linux. I use IE, Firefox, and Mozilla. I also run AMD processors, as well as Intel. And of course I use Nvidia and Ati. My point? Simple enough, I know it is wishful thinking but can you folks just get over yourselves and your blind brand/product loyalty and actually try before bashing? Thanks now, end of line.
I guess they really want to replace computers with internet devices, and make computers marginal, about like gaming consoles are doing with PC games. That way, you Linux communists can play with your uncompromised PCs while Ma and Pa Kettle are using their Microsoft Officebox plugged into the TV.
I can't put "trust" and "Microsoft" together:
If Microsoft = true, then trust = false.
If you want your life to be different, live it differently.
That could be the solution to their piracy/security updates problem. No "Genuine Microsoft Software"? You get a special update that embeds an ad on the desktop, and a scrolling marquee ad in the toolbar.
I'm reading a lot of presumptions about the Claria response letter, but failed to see a link to the article. I recommended everyone first read the response and judge for themselves as well as take a look at our publicly posted spyware criteria.
Disclaimer: Yes I work for MS =)
On what the hell grounds can you possibly be sued, for writing a program which helps other people exercise their right to control what software is installed on their computers?
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
I'm not sure on what grounds you could be sued, but I *am* sure that any laywer worth his salt could make something up. Note that it wouldn't have to be something that you could be successfully sued over; the point of the excercise is to cause as much hassle and legal expenses for the victim as possible.
As far as I can see, all it would be likely to cost you is a second class stamp -- to send back any solicitor's letter with "ha ha" scrawled across it in red marker pen, while you got on with your business. The biggest expense you might incur would be in actually turning up to court and politely but firmly asking the judge to dismiss the case as it is without merit. That would take a morning at most. You also can't be sued for money you haven't got, so being a skint open source developer could well stand in your favour.
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
OK, I'll give you those. OpenOffice.org, too. But it seems to me that generally, more OSS is ported to Windows from Unix/Linux/BSD/MacOSX, than from Windows to Unix/Linux/BSD/MacOSX. It also seems to me that most Windows software is closed-source, even if it is given away gratis; and the practice of disabling features in order to extort money from users for "enhanced versions" is common.
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
Hell, where I come from trespassing will get you shot.
Love your country always, but respect your government only when it deserves it. -- Mark Twain
I think that Gator is installed with the Win98SE!
I have reinstalled my WIN98SE many, MANY times and the AdAware finds Gator every time. I' pretty sure that the Gator in on the Win98SE installation CD. And, thanks for asking, it is original.
Can anyone verify/deny this ? I guess You, bigman, have to start looking also for other OS's...
Also, you can remove Opera, unlike Gator; Opera is useful, unlike Gator; you can avoid the ads easily, unlike Gator (serials take the form w-* for Windows, u-* for *nix, & I've seen m-*, so they're prob'ly for OS X).
There's no comparison. The only similarity is the presence of ads, & the ones in Opera are pretty inoffensive. Honestly, if you're that peeved, learn to use Google. Most of the Opera's userbase probably uses the same 10 serial numbers.
Disclaimer: I'm using Opera to post this.
Yar.
While GCC extensions are "flashy", meaning that you can easily spot them, they make use of some really messed up and inconsistent constructs. Add that with the usual "you need to work around this bug to make things happen", and you've got your gcc nightmare.