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BitTorrent's Loss is eDonkey's Gain?
MrAndrews writes "According to this BBC article, users in South Korea, Italy, Germany and Spain are using BitTorrent less frequently these days, after lawsuits by the movie industry. However: "While the use of BitTorrent has fallen, file sharers have moved to an alternative network called eDonkey". "
I was under the impression that eDonkey is what everybody uses for file sharing these days, and that BitTorrent was mostly used for software distribution (Free and Open Source, mostly).
Procrastination -- because good things come to those who wait.
shhhhhh
I moved from bittorrent to IRC. Now that's progress!
You can't handle the truth.
Funny... it was because of increased legal activity that I moved from eDonkey to BitTorrent.
...and started using PeerGuardian.
I moved from eDonkey / eMule to bit torrent...Is it back in style again?
...no two people are not on fire.
"While the use of BitTorrent has fallen, file sharers have moved to an alternative network called eDonkey"
Shouldn't this say that users are moving BACK to alternative newtworks like eDonkey?
... that the movie industry moguls had played Whack-a-Mole at the amusement parks before and learned something. Guess not.
Who would call eDonkey and "alternate network"? Really.
;)
Plus being from one of the above countries, this is total crap, BT is going stronger every day. And we know very well that, as long as you're NOT an US citizen, no-one will sue your ass out of a network connection... they might search our homes and compromise our hosted servers, but we dont sue
keep it seeding.
How long is it going to be before the *AA realises that suing everybody they can see isn't working? Cat and mouse game indeed.
There are 11 types of people. Those who understand binary, those who don't and those who are sick of this lame joke.
This is a decentralised file-sharing network, where files are not stored on a central server..
e y_Network)
The most widely used ed2k server software is Lugdunum, although MLDonkey provides an open source alternative...(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/eDonk
Doesn't seems more decentralised than bittorrent to me..
gtkaml.org
If the previous uses of that technology were not valid according to the laws of the country in question, then the people who are sourcing the illicit data should be smacked around in court and life moves on.
If you don't like those terms, stay the fuck away from data that you don't have a legal right to transfer, and produce more original data which will have the transfer rights (public domain, creative commons, gpl, whatever) you prefer.
This has NOTHING to do with the trend to replace [insert your old P2P tech here] with [insert your new P2P tech here].
[
...the last 4 years? That sounds if nobody ever heard of the ed2k network - now known as eMule / Kademlia...
Confused, the MPAA and RIAA have begun massively suing farms all across America.
I never spellcheck and I freely admit it. Save your karma for more worthwhile "lol erorrs" replies
This just shows that no matter what the people in legal suits do, they can't kill the sharing ... they cannot kill the internet RAWRR!! :-p
Seriously, for any network they "shut down" 10 new will popup. The reason for that is that its hard to prove that they're used only for illegal file sharing, many like, BitTorrents and other havea very legitimate use.
But, that's what makes the world go round these days and lawyers are all the more happy because that's more money in their pockets.
If you look like your passport photo, you're too ill to travel. - Will Kommen
One might say that bit torrent is losing ground, but in what sense? The number of GB moving back and forth? the number of times you use it everyday for same purpose? Files found on bit torrent tend to be of higher quality and larger size compared to those found in eDonkey network? eDonkey network has files from 1K to several gigs. And torrent files also usually tend to be more legit than those found in eDonkey (as in falsely named, not always but sometimes and corrupt). So it could be that people are using torrents to download a movie using one step, compared to in eDonkey them having to download several copies at a time or simply redownloading since the first copy that was downloaded was not the right one. And admit it, the process for downloading a movie in both these networks are simple, but eDonkey is defintly easier (I don't think so, but many others do) so wouldn't the majority simply choose the easier one?
What I don't get is why the post doesn't provide link to some information about eDonkey network and some clients to use. I know it can be found on the Net within seconds, but why not make the article more useful.
I would hardly call being the #1 filesharing network a "gain", with the ??AA's being all lawsuity.
"I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar."
-Hoban Washburn
Let me get this straight - these people are moving ON to edonkey/emule? Most people who do filesharing started off on eDonkey and then switched to Bittorrent for the speeds it offered.
At least, that was the impression I came to after I tried to use eDonkey for a while. After a half dozen or so downloads, I finally said screw it and went to Blockbuster.
I figure, in a way, I'm doing Blockbuster a favor. I typically watch movies only once or twice, so I'm just taking their "No Late Fees" policy to the extreme. They are pretty clear that the return refers to the rental, and doesn't terminate your right to view. So I figure as long as I don't distribute I can maintain a moral ambiguity long enough to justify ripping the movie and returning it, on time, to watch when it's more convenient. That way, unlike with a movie purchase, they have the hard copy to rent to someone else, and it's back in the store the day. As long as I don't distribute, it seems to be exactly the same as established precedent law on time shifting.
Flawed logic, perhaps, but a nifty bit of justification I'd say.
Never confuse volume with power.
eDonkey has been around for a while...
Years back they used it at a tv episode sharing website... Unfortunately I can't remember the name of it though. It was originally a page to archive tv shows like the State and MST3k, and moved on to archive other shows... it was eventually shut down though, as it got more popular to share tv shows and the authorities started getting involved.
It operated in pretty much the same way BitTorrent does... you download a small file that has hash information, and the program downloads the file from other users.
Let's face the facts. As soon as the RIAA or whatever organization starts scaring people away from one technology, everyone migrates to the next. To see a story touted as news about people switching from torrents to eDonkey seems like common sense really. In six months or so, I think we'll be reading a post on here about how people are switching from eDonkey to whatever comes next. It's a cycle with the organizing bodies constantly playing catch-up.
Finance tutorials and more! Understandfinance
let me guess, they have a new commercial tool that focusses on eDonkey rather than bittorrent?
If Stallman has something to say, he can say it himself. Forbes is a vile flacid organ that is host to human excerement like Dan Lyons, I admire /. editors for not linking to it.
If they keep *telling* the various special interest groups what we're using to rape their respective industries, no fucking wonder there are new rounds of lawsuits every time large groups of people jump from one sinking ship to another...
Bastard media, be on our side for once.
"How like you to drag your keyboard to a gun fight." - Aaron Bedard (BANE)
What the article fails to mention is that in South Korea, only old people are using BT now.
Bill Clinton: Pimp we can believe in. - The Shirt!!!
The newer eMule clients that work with the eDonkey network, also work with the Kademlia (Kad) network. Decentralization is achieved through Kad. ;)
w00t
Often thought of as a means of evading the anti-piracy wings of corporations and groups such as the RIAA and MPAA, PeerGuardian offers little actual protection against the threat of prosecution. Users of Bittorrent often tout the application as a means of protection, but it offers little more than a false sense of security. Whilst anti-piracy organisations and groups will not be able to connect to peers or seeds using PeerGuardian, these peers and seeds are still broadcasting their IP addresses for anyone, including anti-piracy groups, to see.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PeerGuardian
Bet the Folks at RIAA and MPAA thought it was fun to play whack a mole when they were kids!
See It's Karma! First you have fun whacking the game, Now you're fighting for your lives attempting to whack any file sharing out there!
Ooh, It's Napster! WHACK! OOOH it's KAZAA! WHACK! OOOH IT'S BITTORRENT ! WHACK! OOOH IT'S EDONKEY! WHACK!
_ _ _ Go for the eyes Boo! GO FOR THE EYES!
eDonkey? Never heard of it. Tell me more....
It doesn't matter if people move from Kazaa to BitTorrent to eDonkey, as the article mentions, because the internet traffic still ends up in the same place. At some point, the traffic has to go from your computer to another computer via an ISP or other such service (obviously assuming it's not a LAN). The MPAA/RIAA has taken to issuing subpoena's to ISPs, so even if eDonkey is "decentralized" the users can still get caught. I don't see what the point is, really. I mean, seriously... if the BBC is posting about it, do you think the over-priced greedy hawk lawyers of the RIAA/MPAA are going to ignore it?
Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing ever happened.
How reliable are these results?
Slashdot is not a news agency with that claims to giva a fair and balanced view of the world, it is a blog consisting of links to articles that the editors think are cool. I can't blame the Slashdot editors for not wanting to link to an article where one of the largest figures of the open source movement strongly critizises them.
Try out fish, the friendly interactive shell.
They link to Roland Piquepaille, you can hardly admire them for that..
Don't junkies move from one spot to another to buy their drugs after the cops bust a spot? File sharers are doing the same...
Personally I'm happy to see these people gone. Most likly the ones leaving Bittorrent are the illigal traders. Bittorrent needs these people like a hole in their firewall. Good riddence.
Slashdot is a blog?
Well, that explains alot of things I see here on a daily basis that passes off as 'news'.
"According to this BBC article, users in South Korea, Italy, Germany and Spain are using BitTorrent less frequently these days, after lawsuits by the movie industry."
In Korea, only old people use eDonkey!
Our films are still affected by the destape ("uncover"), an outrage of pseudo-erotic films after Francisco Franco's fascist regime. For you to see this fact, everytime you see a spanish film remember there will be a sex scene.
We're not downloading more films not because movie industry threats (if fact, our law permits private copies) but spanish films are always the same crap about harlots, *sexuals, rude and sexual related humor, sexual relationships and everything related with sex. We download less since the government is investing in spanish movies, and they are produced more than ever. Yes, many slashdotters will be fine with this, but believe me, it tires.
I was under the impression that every geek east of the Atlantic Ocean had an instance of aMule/eMule/eDonkey on one machine or another as the biggest collection of pr0n, music, and warez has been availible there forever. That network has been the best and easiest to use since forever and within a few days I can generally find anything I need or want.
Bittorrent has never gotten me anything at any great speed and I get better results using a download accellerator with mirror search for distro downloads. Whole DVD ISOs in an hour not five or six days.
I don't see how this is news unless you're really estranged from the net.
If my grammar and spelling are off, I am [distracted/tired/careless] (take your pick)
It was pointed out long ago that these "lawsuits" never get to be tried in court. People are sued for hundreds of thousands of $ and settle for an average of $3000. With about 10,000 lawsuits so far that means about 30 million $ for *AA. Settling out of court must cost less than $3000 per lawsuit, so they are making money from this. That explains why they have no problem suing 12 year old kids, grandmas over 70, etc.
Use bittorrent for popular, fast downloads. Once the torrent gets old, nobody is seeding anymore, and it dies off. That's when you fire up your preferred eDonkey client and go browsing. Things tend to persist a hell of a lot longer out there. That bullshit about the files being polluted and corrupted is a myth, as well. Since you can preview them instantly as they are downloaded, it's easy to spot the crap files if you manage to find any.
Of course, now you need to be patient. This is where most people fail. It may take you a solid 90 days to download something old or obscure from eDonkey. It is not an instant-gratification network. Just let the sucker run and it'll come down in its own good time. Let the client software worry about it. I've fished out all manner of content from there that was impossible to find on bittorrent, usenet, or IRC. Old Mike Oldfield concerts, a mint copy of Giorgio Moroder's Metropolis, dozens of old TV shows... average time to download something like that is around seven days. The torrents of the old Dr. Who TV series (every single episode, 26 seasons) took nearly three months. It was around 212GB of data, of course.
You may want to make sure your firewall can handle a couple thousand connections. If your p2p experience is always sucking hind tit, that might be the cause of your problems. That little Linksys router isn't capable of doing it. Well, maybe if you put linux on it, but why bother when distros like m0n0wall, ipcop, and smoothwall exist? It helps loads if you prioritize ACK, DNS, and any small packets.
Hell is being intelligent in a world full of idiots.
Come on people, there are more networks than just BitTorrent and eDonkey!
Don't forget Gnutella, which nowdays really performs very well and is nurtured by various vendor clients so you get to choose the one you like best.
And yes, Gnutella has swarming so there should not be any download speed difference between Gnutella and BitTorrent, provided you have the same amount of sources.
...everything hasn't gone to eDonkey yet!
"Leave the strategizing to those of us with planet-sized brains." -Tycho
> Stallman says it bugs him that VA Software-owned > Web sites, like SourceForge and NewsForge, take > money from Microsoft to run "smear campaign" ads > on its sites. Do they? Maybe I'm blind on that eye.
Dana Lyons, the guy who did the song "Cows With Guns"?
Seriously, is that who you're talking about?
And the RIAA&friends will never get it back in. Sue eDonkey, and there will be a next nextwork which will be used more.
Anyway: To much work to sue everybody anyway, but it keeps them busy, in view, and gets their budget will get bigger to do their work (ie: Sueing)
My wife's sketchblog Blob[p]: Gastrono-me
According to CacheLogic, 60% of the traffic on the internet by the end of 2004 was made up of peer-to-peer activity, though it does not have a breakdown of how much of this is copyrighted material. .. uhm .. something else.
My guess, all of it, except of what is known to be public domain.
Copyright isn't evil. OSS is copyrighted, just like all those "quality" movies from Hollywood.
Why do they always confuse "copyright" with
...in terms of speed and file availability, as well as ease of use (built-in client searching which seems to work really well) it's very nice.
However, the bigger servers (Razorback et al) don't always work very well with NAT - behind an ADSL router you can't change the setup of, you may as well not bother. In those cases, Bittorrent works faster because it usually ends up with more valid, reachable seeds/peers.
Don't know if there's good technical reasons for the edonkey servers not allowing people like me on (my old house had a nice person in charge of the router, new house doesn't, so I can't connect to any decent edonkey servers any more), but torrents do nicely, albeit more cumbersome to deal with...
Game dev and music blog
That is exactly what it is. It just happens to be a blog that is older than the blogging phenomenon. The Slashdot editors have, as far as I know, _never_ claimed that slashdot is anything than a hobbyist news feed that happened to grow pretty big.
Try out fish, the friendly interactive shell.
Why does slashdot keep letting the cat out of the bag? The first rule of P2P is don't talk about P2P.
The government which is strong enough to protect you from everything is strong enough to take everything from you.
1: Do not offer as many features as their Windows counterparts,
2: Not as stable on Linux as they are on Windows,
3: Are plain ugly and
4: Are damn slow on Linux.
The only software I find a pleasure to look at and also exists for the Windows platform is OpenOffice.org and the GIMP. There are more open source softwares out there but I haven't found them.
Except, as editors, they don't really edit. Its really sad they call themselves a "news" site and claim to have "editors" but churn out the utter shite that they do on a daily basis, while smacking the good will of subscribers and the readers with dupes, editor mod-bombings, and allowing people like Jon Katz and Michael Sims to do the things they did without acknowledging it.
Ummm, hate to break it to you guys but eDonkey is not new. The venerable "Donk" has been around in some fashion for about half a decade. Who thought this was news?
-"...bad old ideas look confusingly fresh when they are packaged as technology" - Jaron Lanier (Digital Maoism on Edge.o
FTP.
The ORIGINAL file sharing protocol. P2P's come and go - FTP will remain mighty!!
I downloaded so many of them, that virtually spent all my time burning them to CDs and DVDs.
Eventually I realized that I had no time left to actually watch any of it, so I deleted all my collection.
Now I have more time, but no movies to watch.
IMO is the whole tracker/seed deal. This part should have been made transparent to the point that users didn;t have to see or understand it. I personally never saw it as being that good of a system in the first place. It is not elegant nor does it lend itself to people using the software as it is intended.
The whole BT thing is a good idea for software releases and large files people are looking to download from a single site, say I go to a distro site and have a choice of FTP/HTTP/BT but to use it for P2P is just useless in my eyes.
The whole Zen "the interface is no interface" thing was a little unsettling too as I had no idea that my downloads were being slowed by my firewall back when BT first came out until I used a version that showed that there was a problem.
I still think there is a place for BT and software like it, but not for P2P filesharing. As much as I hate to admit it, I like having n00bs and clueless users on my system so I can access stuff easier and faster. BT was more for the tech savvy and they tend to be smart enough/greedy to never seed a download unless they happened to walk away from a download that completed.
I still pine for the days when Kazaa lite was not full of viruses/spyware/fake files and instead was a great easy quick system to get exactly what you wanted ASAP.
http://teasphere.wordpress.com - A little spot of tea
I've not seen ads on /. in years but I am aware that they run such ads and it has prevented me from mailing non-slashbots links to the increasingly rare insightful comment.
On the other hand why shouldn't MS be allowed to advertise here? Even occasional readers here should laugh at the lies they market as 'facts'.
Anyway, Microsoft's ad revenue is kinder to my wallet than a subscription and it's the least they can do in return for the amount of time I contribute to maintaining and fixing their crappy OS for computer illiterate friends and family.
They've run campains about Microsoft TCO beeing lower than Linux TCO in the past. You probably missed it because you're using an addblocker. ;-)
Personally, I don't think people on Slashdot will look at a Microsft ad in this site and think to themselves 'Well there you go, I was wrong all along. Windows is better'.
Try out fish, the friendly interactive shell.
The last time I was in Germany was April 2003, and everyone I knew used eDonkey religiously. Even nowadays when I talk to my German friends online, they still try to convert me. I didn't like it when I tried it, but this whole thing makes me wonder... why is this on Slashdot? If anything, I think it's the other way around. I recall eDonkey being popular long before BT.
-William Brendel
Yes, Slashdot runs advertisements paid for by Microsoft that slams Linux and Open Source.
I'm kinda mixed on the issue. On one hand, most of the people reading Slashdot are not going to be swayed by MS propaganda, but on the other hand, there is the chance that some CIO or PHB who does not fully understand the issues may be swayed by Microsoft's propaganda and actually believe what they are saying.
I think OSTG should seriously consider the community they are serving before they blatantly take money from the enemy to help their propaganda campaign against Linux and OSS.
Lord High Crapflooder The Right Honourable Vlad Craig Esther McDavenpherson III
Destroyer of Mercatur.Net
Next you'll probably tell me that you pay for porn!
That's interesting - I'd always thought it was a pretty good example of impartiality to even be willing to run pro-Microsoft ads on such an institutionally pro-linux site as Slashdot.
/. crowd seem to view his unrealistic, dogmatic, hippy, philosophical proclamations more as a liability or an embarassment these days.
And TBH I don't know where RMS got the idea that the whole of Slashdot consider him a hero. Quite a lot of the
Me? I'm mildly anti-microsoft (due soeley to their documented behaviour and priorities), mildly pro-linux (in theory - I don't run a linux box, but approve of the idea of open-source). I'm pro-slashdot running MS ads (partly for the irony, partly for the perceived impartiality), and mildly anti-RMS (he's done some very good things for computing, but he has a habit of disappearing so far up his own arse he couldn't see daylight with a telescope).
That said, I'm disappointed Slashdot isn't running the story. Not surprised, but still disappointed.
Everything in moderation, including moderation itself
BitTorrent and Emule don't work well behind NAT routers, because the router doesn't know what machine to forward an incoming request to. A user can forgo having NAT turned on, but this is inconvenient if the user has more than one machine, and it also defeats the protection otherwise afforded from random exploit attempts. A user can set up port forwarding, but many don't know how to do this. But most importantly of all, in none of the above cases is the user's anonymity possible. If there was some way in which a user could get reasonable bandwidth on downloads while using some free wifi spot somewhere, without having admin privileges on the router, this would be a big step forward.
I believe that WinMX may actually have this feature... a node behind a NAT router can't download from another NAT user, but CAN download from a non-NAT user because the network has the intelligence to instruct the NAT user to be the initiator of the session.
Get of your high horse. As editors, they pick out content from submissions. That is editing. You seem to want them to proofread peoples submissions, which is what a proof reader does.
Slashdot is not CNN, it is a nerd-blog. If you want a blog-style news site with excellent editing, proof reading, original articles and corporate sponsors that dictate the contents of the massive political propaganda package, I suggest you read something like TCS. I'm sure it will feel much more like the old media you are used to.
Try out fish, the friendly interactive shell.
Are DVDs that expensive ? I don't object to downloading the occasional movie, but I didn't buy a 42" flat-screen and home theater to watch low-res cams or DivXs with bad sound quality. If it's something I really want, I will buy it on DVD.
I might be in the minority, but for me, watching a rip ruins my viewing experience. Obviously there are a lot of people who find the difference between a DVD and a DivX rip acceptable, but I just wish that instead of going after them by taking legal action, the MPAA would improve the quality of their DVDs to widen the gap. This could be done in a number of ways: anything from including more extras to improving the sound quality and video quality to adding interactive games and features. Perhaps lowering prices will also help, although personally I don't think that DVD prices are too high at the moment.
Liberal Ontarians and French Quebecers are draining Western Canada's wealth. Stop them now! Support Western separatism.
There's basically no documentation or mention of what the prereqs are. They don't even tell you how to get a blacklist! Users are referred to their forums, but there's no link to a forum on the page or their homepage. And you've got to have iptables installed, which I didn't. It became obvious pretty quickly that I'd have to figure out how to set up iptables to get PG working, and if that's the case, why do I need PG?
Maybe it's alright for Windows. But I'm a casual linux user who keeps a FC4 box up for file serving and running azureus. For me, PG is basically useless. I'll stick with I2P and Tor to keep me un-sued, thanks.
There's still not a 100% working OSX version of a client, and any number of BitTorrent ones, so I'll stick to what works for my system.
All the DAP stuff I really wanted I got through torrents anyway.
It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
Just change the name to "ByteTorrent". That'll confuse the MPAA & RIAA for another 5 years.
Whoever named eDonkey must be an eJackass.
What client is recommended for OS X?
Newsgroups :-D
It is still rockin
No, that is picking news. That is not editing. Editing actually means you are not only picking the worthy news stories (even if it means picking Roland Pipquepaille's submissions an inordinate amount of times, or picking out stories that look like thinly veiled advertisements for products), but you are cleaning up the summary, checking to see if it has been posted before (If Slashdot editors "edited", they would at least bother to check the front page to see if the same story has been posted before!), and making sure the summary is accurate. An editor is a proofreader too!
You don't have to have political propaganda (though, you sure seem to conviently forget the "editor" Michael Sims who always inserted his political point of view into stories!) to have a quality news site. Why do you think that these things are mutually exclusive?
Slashdot is not the media - they rely on the very media you slam for their news. I can admit the inadequacies of the mainstream media just as much as I can admit the inadequacies of Slashdot. You see, I can tolerate it and still have a quality experience - there are alot of good things here that I enjoy, just as much as I enjoy off of places like CNN, BBC, and others.
My beef is with your one sided view of what Slashdot is - you have this binary view of things: "mainstream media bad, techno-nerd news blog good". The truth is, its not so black and white. There are shades of grey here. Get off your high horse.
I just checked versiontracker.com and can find no mention of eDonkey. Is there a MAC version?
San Francisco Photographers
to stop illegal downloading is to uninvent the wheel. Make ANY device that can digitize analog data illegal unless they are properly licensed by a *IAA authorized service provider. No home movies. No home recording, unless it is to analog media. In a sense make digitzers like stills. Anyone can make Whisky, its easy, unless the equipment to do so is illegal.
I have little sympathy for the *IAA. Do you think they gave us CD/DVDs because they gave us better quality, or because they increased profit? The fact that they were too miopic to realise that the same technologies that were dropping their bottom line could enable consumers to replace them is karmic.
The creators of optical media suing bittorrent et al, is like the great ship builders suing boeing and airbus. It shouldn't be allowed to happen. Artists need to stop looking for recording contracts and start looking for marketting contracts. You can still make money in popular arts, its just you can't expect to make money by selling digital facsimilies of that art.
Scared of flying, pointy things snce 1979!
There are lots of cable routers which can deal with eMule/eDonkey levels of traffic but DSL / ADSL / SDSL users have a harder choice ahead of them.
Users at emule-project.org have done a lot of testing and found that one of the most resilient DSL routers is the U.S.Robotics "Sureconnect" 9105/9106... as someone who bought one based on their advice I can confirm this.
Avoid Conexant-based routers like the plague, and Netgear DG6xx/8xx or D-Link DSL-30x/50x aren't much better.
I have been a user for about 10 years. This ends Feb 2014. The site's been ruined. I'm off. Dice, FU
Usenet...
Just don't tell the RIAA and the MPAA about the sneakernet or they'll shut that down too. ...oh wait...
READY.
PRINT ""+-0
IRC is also slow and a pain in the ass - too interactive (they frown at automation), too many different ways of doing things and you have to deal with a bunch of pricks that want you to be grateful that you part of their little circle of piracy - too juvenile. Does anyone really still think, "OOH! look at me, I'm a PIRATE!"??
Gnutella is very nice for MP3s and small files - the biggest you want here is a music video perhaps at 50megs or so, there doesn't seem to be much large content like movies. With the swarming ability that the clients have these days, downloading can be AMAZINGLY fast - why does eDonkey get more attention than Gnutella? Everyone should put large content files on Gnutella - do it, now! ;) gtk-gnutella is a nice linux client. It's not as pretty as Limewire, but nicer on the ram, etc.
Bittorrent is the second fastest way that I've seen for downloading large content files, even DVD collections, say, of emulator games come rather quickly, usually approaching 60% of top download speed or more once it throttles up. The downside is the scrutiny at the moment, made worse by the fact that you must leave your download open - that is, you need to keep your client running even after you download the file to share with others - not doing so will get you "punished" in various ways by the sites offering this stuff, sometimes by not allowing you back. This also means that for a large DVD type download, you have 5 gigs of data on your drive much longer than you want - at least it's a problem for me. Further, unless you want to run the client forever, you need to set your upload rate pretty high. On my 1.2Ghz machine, bittorrent takes a toll in resources as well...
The fastest way to download something is via the newsgroups. Yup, the oldest way is still in some cases the best (it's not P2P, but it fits in my rant anyway). The downside here is for good news service, you have to pay, while the other methods are free.
Still, with a service like Easynews, you get 3 week retentions - meaning, a "post" stays alive for 3 weeks. Advances like par and nzb make this much easier and more reliable than it has been - it's almost too easy now. An nzb file points to specific articles in specific groups. For anyone familiar with this process, with nzb, you can avoid the old norms of subscribing to groups, downloading headers, searching for content, marking your choices, and telling it to download. Web pages such as binsearch.info allow you to use a web interface to select your content, and will then generate an nzb file for you.
With a broadband cable connection, you can download DVD sized content in about 2 and a half hours from the groups. Some ISPs still come with news feeds, but they usually aren't worth bothering with. My ISP has retentions lasting just a few hours, with a 1gig/month download limit.
So, IMHO, use gnutella for MP3s, short popular video clips/music videos and other smaller files (since there isn't much large content to be found). For anything larger, use the newsgroups if you have a good news feed. If not, try your luck with bittorrent.
Use the donkey only if you can't find it anywhere else and if speed isn't a problem. Oh, and avoid downloading from IRC...
Of course, I only download legal content :) Legal MP3 files, or copies of files I already own, or emulator ROMS of games I already own, or DVD collections of abandoned ROMs, Linux distributions, or tv shows that I already pay my Cable provider for, etc.
dahlek (will you squirm when you are pecked
You make very good points.
I, too, see RMS as a shrill extremist in the open source movement, but I am willing to give him credit for what he has brought to the movement. Where would Linux be today without him?
Slashdot has a tradition of not wanting to accept criticism. Its engrained in the attitude of their 'editors'. There was an infamous comment that got modded down hundreds of times in a very small frame of time. The post just happened to criticize Slashdot's policies and editors.
Then we had people like Jon Katz and Michael Sims. If you remember either of them, you know what I'm talking about. Katz posted sensationalist news stories about how young geeks were being "oppressed" by society but was finally canned after he fabricated a story about some young Afghani who was getting on the Internet with his Commodore 64 (LMAO). Slashdot refused to acknoledge the false story or even tell us why he suddenly departed Slashdot afterwards.
Michael Sims, the dogmatic and schizophrenic editor who was a former member of the Censorware project. He hijacked the website of a very popular anti-censorware project that was well known in the OSS community, yet Slashdot continued to allow him to be one of the custodians of a website that geeks and nerds all throughout the OSS community supported. The stories he "edited" often contained blatant political opinions and slams against people he didn't like, instead of continuing the tradition of providing balanced news for the OSS community that didn't try to divide the community. Sims recently disappeared from Slashdot. Slashdot continues to refuse to acknowledge him.
So I agree. If Slashdot can take money from Microsoft to slam the OSS movement and Linux, why can't they take some criticism from RMS?
has it occured to anyone that many people may use multiple services. Each services provides different types of files for me. U**n*t (shhh dont say it out loud) provides the big stuff, quickly full albums, full dvd's, entire seasons of shows, etc... Bitorrent provides the same but more variety of harder to find files but of course much slower and finally i move to the basic P2P services for single files like songs, pictures, pdf's etc... Does anyone really find all they are looking for from one service?
Don't ya hate it when the correct spelling of your favorite screen name is taken?
Since anarcho-capitalism is related to libertarianism.
I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!
For those thinking Emule is more secure than bittorrent, please check out this article about spy servers -
http://www.p2pcore.com/stories/238.php
Bittorrent suits usually involve only one file. These spy servers can see all your shares if you log onto them.
To me, Emule is like Bittorrent with seeds and leechers, only much larger, slower and has a lot more stuff.
While this sounds good, at what point does it get far enough up the food chain to be the next *AA target for all-out-war?
ed2k isnt anonymous in the least, and is vunerable.
It also relies on servers ( last i heard anyway )
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Actually, in this case, the "organizing bodies" are not playing catch-up. eDonkey has been in the attention of said bodies for quite some time. Just because they haven't sued users of a particular network yet doesn't mean they aren't preparing to do so.
"The parent post is a perfect example of why media industries regard their "customers" with such distrust."
Yes, because customers have a habit of exercising fair use. They're selfish bastards.
Don't they know they keep putting that guy out of work that I see in the movies? I think he used to be "key grip" or "best boy" or something.
If you are used to FAST bittorrent edonkey/emule is going to dissapoint you. For the most popular files it can take DAYS sometimes WEEKS to get a large file in the 100s of megabytes.
Also...that network is swamped with script bots that download EVERYTHING. I shared out a folder I had with OLD device drivers and out of date software...files that nobody should want. They were being downloaded in a short amount of time which leads me to believe that automated software probably contributes to the slowness.
The sum of users of all p2p networks it tracks is about 8 million. Some of those use more than one network, so the actual number of unique persons using any of those is probably smaller. On the other hand some are not constant users so they show up for a day or two, then show again in a month. So, let's assume optimistically it's 10 million. Now, there is the BitTorrent which is not tracked by Slyck - let's put that optimistically at 10 million. Even if we add another 10 million for all other forms of file sharing not covered otherwise and end up with 30 millions of P2P users it is still just 3% of the total estimated number of Internet users.
This means that file sharers are a tiny minority and therefore file sharing can be successfully stigmatized and kept at bay as a marginal, shameful activity. I believe it's those numbers that make ??AA think they can win. And I can say I'm not sure they won't once I did this estimating.
107 is the four factor test. Again, I'm not a legal genious, so I'll refer generously to Stanford and the EFF for help in this matter.
1) the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;
Personal use is clearly non-commercial.
2) the nature of the copyrighted work;
In this case, the work is creative which is a point for their side.
3) the amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and
In my case, it's a whole copy of the work, another point for their side, however it's a reduced quality copy which is a point for my side.
4) the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work.
With Blockbuster's particular business model, I've already demonstrated it's actually MORE profitable for them to have me rent a movie rip it in 20 minutes and return it. As for future sales loss, that's not relevant to this argument because of a crucial factor - I delete them after I've watched them. The Supreme Court (Universal City Studios v. Sony Corp., 464 U.S. 417 (1984)) ruled that a time shifted copy does not deprive them of revenue, and that was for a broadcast, not even a paid rental as in my case. I firmly believe that the courts would uphold my arguement that I rented the media that it's on but bought a license to watch the movie. In fact, Blockbuster's terms and conditions does not stipulate how many times you may watch a movie that you've rented, it merely stipulates how long you can keep the media. I've time-shifted the right to watch the movie until after the media is returned, but that doesn't negate my right to watch it, and the Supreme Court upheld my right to time shift it.
Never confuse volume with power.
Eek - slow speeds, millions of queues, and the spyware, my god man, the spyware. Stick to newsgroups.
Parker Lewis Can't Lose was a masterpiece of a series, when aired it way ahead of its a time, and it was heavily underrated. I would almost kill to get it published on DVD.
Also, let me add this to yout list:
- Complete seasons 1 and 2 of Get a Life (the available DVDs only have a few 'best' episodes).
The MUTE net was designed do be anonymous. I don't think it has reached critical mass, though.
"I'm never quite so stupid as when I'm being smart" (Linus van Pelt)
That's supposed to be legal. Well we could apply the same logic to bittorrent/eDonkey etc, Somebody broadcasts it and we time shift it. As long as your not selling/redistributing the product for profit your on firm legal ground. However the programs being what they are they do distribute outward as well. So your best defense is Peer Guardian. You know what they say; No Cop No Stop.
Sorry about the writing. Robot fingers, you know? Cliff Steele in DOOM PATROL #23
That's because there is no technical solution and there doesn't need to be. The law is about preserving rights for people, not enforcing restrictions through technology. Consider that copyright violations are supposed to be civil torts anyway. That means the police and the FBI shouldn't be involved because it's none of their business, it's the responsibility of the person who owns the works to decide if they are worth protecting and seek reperations if people are abusing their rights.
Right now the RIAA/MPAA are trampling on our rights because people like you think it's okay to tell people not to exercise rights they traditionally have had because it may encourage someone to incorrectly sue. While I personally would prefer not to be sued, if I was sued specifically for this situation (not the couple of movies I tried to download before deciding it wasn't worth the effort) I most certianly would fight it as hard as I could, even if it meant begging lawyers for pro bono work and representing myself in court.
I didn't volunteer for the military like some of my friends did, but I was called I'd serve. For me, this is exactly the same thing. I wouldn't choose to pick a fight with the MPAA/RIAA and risk losing everything, but if I were sued I'd fight with everything I've got for the privacy rights of all Americans. Feel free to wave a flag if you'd like, I'm not sure if I'm being patriotic or pissy at the moment.
Never confuse volume with power.
but i've been very comfortable with the Gnutella network. I use shareaza and I've found eDonkey to be awfully slow - I want to download some anime chapter and what do I find: 804 people before me in the queue!
I've NEVER been able to download a single file from eDonkey.
Seriously, for any network they "shut down" 10 new will popup.
You think they want to KILL p2p? That'd be like killing the golden-eggs goose.
They're not after justice, or even revenge, they're after the MONEY. And if 10 new networks will popup, do you think the **AA will have a heart attack? "Oh no, we can't stop them, they multiply, ahhhhhhh!".
Au contraire, I bet they're just rubbing their palms thinking about the money they'll collect by suing.
My favorite part of this whole P2P war is when politicians get up on their high horses and say the names of the software. Who would've though we could get politicians to say "Napster" or "eDonkey"? So my new strategy is to name these things words that they'll never be able to say. I'd like to see a Senator get up and talk about how much money "twat 2.0" is taking from the music industry. Or how many children are stealing with "Drippy Snatch v1.0". Let's get creative with our software names! At the very least it'll be fun to watch.
It's a shell game at this point. eDonkey will be in BitTorrent's shoes soon enough.
vk.
We've heard plenty about **IA lawsuits -- but are software companies also issuing large handfuls of lawsuits for software piracy? Do they have their own **IA-ish trade group?
They are pretty clear that the return refers to the rental, and doesn't terminate your right to view.
They are completly clear that the legal right to view ends when the rental is returned.
However I have not heard, nor can think of, a moral argument in favor of copyrights.
Taking money, freedom, or both from people who repeat certain combinations of image or sound has historicaly been (and can be argued, still is) the work of organized crime.
...unless you want the corporate shills^W^W legislators to give the *IA something to bribe^W lobby to get.
Unless, of course, you like the idea of life in the feudal USA...oh, wait. we're already to that point, aren't we?
Indeed. I remember well Jon Katz's articles (although many people bitched about him, I always found his articles at least "thought-provoking", if not always "right"), although I somehow missed his unmasking and ignominious exit from /.
/. need some serious lessons in choosing reliable and mature staff, but I think on the whole they prefer impartiality - they're just not very good at ensuring it happens, or removing staff members who are plainly pissing on their legacy.
I was also around for the tenure of Michael Sims as editor, his mod-bombing of unfavourable comments and eventually his (extremely welcome) exit.
Suffice it to say that although Slashdot hardly has as enviable record in choosing editors, I regard the eventual removal of two such objectionable fuckwits as proof that they at least aspire to impartiality. I mean, if they were prepared to come out and proudly state a biased position, I'd stop reading tomorrow.
Obviously those ultimately in charge of
Given this assumption, I still feel disappointed when they're obviously acting in a self-serving manner, although I'm not particularly surprised by it.
Come on slashdot - grow a spine and report on things unfavourable to you. Putting your fingers in your ears and going "Lalalalalalala" only feeds the trolls, and makes the rest of us think less of you.
Everything in moderation, including moderation itself
"...I tried to use eDonkey for a while. After a half dozen or so downloads, I finally said screw it..."
I'm not sure you're actually suppose to screw a donkey.
I just swtiched to Kazaa
where did everybody go?
Bit Torrent is GGGrrrrrrrrreat! I made an account b/c of this post. Here is a site I've been working on for a list of Bit Torrent sites. There are more then enough now so that now you can search multiple websites instead of being limited to 1 network per program (kazaa, edonkey, napster style) http://www.geekcollective.org/index.php?module=sub jects&func=listcat&catid=2
that is the url. click the free download section for what i've got as far as sites go. there are a few sites that are listing sites (like 200 site list in there).
crazy
The Donkey is nice.... If you are looking for rare, old and obscure things. It used to be my primary client to download stuff, however I would nolonger use it for any "mainstream" things. Thats where bittorrent rocks. Great speeds and easy to find the "real" deal. Edonkey is slow for the most part. But you can almost find anything there if you dont mind to wait.
To sum it up:
Donkey = Old, rare and obscure things.
Bittorrent = Mainstream movies, games, software ect.
Irc(and DC) = If you most have the lastest 0day warez and dont mind using all day browsing the different networks to find does ftp's and Xdcc bots.
Newsgroup = Well..I don't really know, but seems like they also have alot of 0day warez and also lots of rare stuff.
Whenever I download the newest movies & songs-- before they hit the stores, it already comes with a nice little license..
So at least I know that I'm all 'legal' and everythin..
I just can't understand why everyone else doesn't see this =:/
I will gladly loose all of life's battles.. in order to win the war..
Someone will patent the idea of recording brain stimuli. They'll then go on to establish a separate patent on the recording of each particular stimulus and emotion. They'll attach a line directly from your headset gear to the USPTO, so it will automatically file a new patent every time it detects that you're having a new experience you hadn't had before. Eventually you won't be allowed to have a thought without a fully-paid up license from MindCo, and if you can no longer pay, you'll have to have a lobotomy.
espicially when you got sites like this giving you lists of torrent sites. ;)
http://www.geekcollective.org/index.php?module=sub jects&func=listpages&subid=5
(Bit Torrent Bonanza)
Limewire is cool too, but mostly for small files.
if you want porn (who doesn't, really?). I've tried several times downloading stuff I was interested in and no matter what I tried to download it eventually turned out to be porn (like Harry Potter). So now I go to BT for other useful stuff and edonkey for porn. BT is just more organized.
so I'm just taking their "No Late Fees" policy to the extreme
Blockbuster is also taking the "No Late Fees" policy to the Extreme. Their "No Late Fees" policy is a scam. Read the Policy. After reading this, am I supposed to feel sorry for them when someone rips the DVD for personal use?
If you don't return the movie within 8 days, your "Rental" automatically becomes a "Purchase". You then have 30 days to return the movie and get a refund for the "Purchase", but you still pay a $1.25-or greater Stocking Fee. Remember -- it's not a "Late Fee", it's a "Stocking Fee".
And that "FUSF Recovery Charge" on your DSL bill is not a "Fee", it's a "Charge" and is governed by different regulation.
"Can of worms? The can is open... the worms are everywhere."
I use Bittorrent, specifically Azureus, for like tv shows/movies, eMule for applications, and Jubster for finding mp3s. They all seem to do the best in what they aim for.
Azureus is easy to use, nice features, works pretty well. Always does the job well for me from day 1. I really like watching for swarming and visual transfer flow on that one screen, just a neat feature.
eMule has a nice-looking interface, but sometimes the eDonkey network is just pokey to get results(from an impatient point of view). But, you can't beat the results for not being as fake(FastTrack was notorious for this do to the way the hashing only looked at the first 300k of a file).
I came across Jubster a couple of months ago at the recommendation of a friend, and it's very handy at times since it's a p2p/web search hybrid, so sometimes you get lucky and find what you want on a website and pull it down in 20 seconds. Aside from the web, it does the usual p2p transferring stuff on a few p2p nets, don't recall which one offhand beyond the donkey and gnutella nets.
I think most people do it like me, using a few different packages, depending on what you are looking to get. I have yet to find just one program that could do it all the way I want to.
"I drank what?" -- Socrates
Thanks for the tip on Azureus, my python(freeBSD) was crashing on Bittorrent :D
http://www.miniomahasteak.com/torrents/meat/steakd inner-rare.torrent
Don't forget to download tatters.torrent and friedmushrooms.torrent too.
Sorry about the writing. Robot fingers, you know? Cliff Steele in DOOM PATROL #23
The problem I've found with it, is not that it rapes my CPU or RAM, but my PC still grinds to a halt! Very few TCP connections, and using Sun Java.
I had this problem as well until I uninstalled the newest version and installed v. 2.2.0.2 in it's place. now everything works like a charm
Like this comment? I accept Bitcoin! - 153sc8UUBXyp12ofQqfAWDmJrzyiKCYC1x
Non-free software is always wrong. There is no excuse for trampling other people's freedom, Stallman says. Having shareholders who hope to make some money doesn't excuse doing something that is wrong.
Richard Stallman wants to tell me what to do with my source code. This is unacceptable, and why I will always cast a leary eye on the free software movement. People joke that Richard Stallman is a communist, but statements like this show that his communist ideals are no laughing matter.
edonkey has a lot of advantages... it supports HTTP sources, enabling you to seed a file from a webserver without hassles. look at http://ftpz.us/ , a free file hosting service, that offers download via edonkey. you upload your file there and it will be on the edonkey network forever without having you to upload parts of the file over and over again. to "webseed" like this to the torrent network, a pretty resource-intensive php script is used, so the http-source-server not only has to serve the files/bandwidth, no it also has to split, hash and calculate a lot. also edonkey files stay on the network virtually forever. compare to bittorrent, when the tracker for a file goes down, the party is over. on the other hand on edonkey-servers a lot of work is done double and triple. if you log onto more ed2k-servers, all servers get your whole filelist and process it. on torrent for each file is a fixed tracker so no useless double work results from organizing and handing out file-sources to clients. in the near future i see all these networks merge to one defacto-standard technique. p2p is still in its childhood. but a common standard will soon emerge from the knowledge gathered in the last years.
free 880 megs file hosting - www.FTPZ.US - best
I found a really cool sharing network called DVB-T.
All files are in high quality mpeg2 720x576 and come down at 7mbit!!! There are also some higher quality files at 1440x1008 or even 1920x1008 and they come down at 14mbit.
It uses a special broadcast network protocol so that the suits can't find out who's downloading the files. But you can only download 1 file at a time and you need a special modem to connect to the network.
Some of the files contain advertisements but they're easy to remove or skip.
The releases are a bit slow, however, as I'm was getting a complete season of Dr Who but the files only came out once a week.
I'm running out of harddisk space.
Why is the industry still attacking the same Joe and Jane Sixpacks that is willing to feed it $20/$25 for a new CD/DVD respectively while downloading at the same time?
If the industry had any common sense it would stay focused on: hunting down the "topsites", yes the "733t" circles that distribute files before the copyright material even hits the stores/theaters. Almost all pirated material movies, CDs and computer games make it onto P2P or news groups only after trickling down from the "warez scene".
In addition it's even more obvious the old business model is obsolete.
If only Blockbuster or Amazon adopted an iTunes like model where you can speedily download old movies for 2 or 3 bucks and keep them forever without DRM hassles. The corporations could use BT to cut down on bandwidth costs and reward seeders with small incentives.
Just my 2 cents
here in argentina, adsl providers are blocking the ports used for bt transfers on their servers. when u call to complain about the service not working properly, they ask u to open your browser and type 'google.com' while they monitor your transfer speed; needless to say they claim that the service works fine because the test is over a completeley different matter, and when u tell them that your bt software is not working, they tell u that they dont provide technical help on third party programs. it really sucks. cheers! ^_RaMoN_^