Slashdot Mirror
Verizon to Launch Mobile 'Chaperone' Service
Billosaur writes "CNET is reporting that Verizon will soon be offering a service (branded "Chaperone") which will allow parents to
keep track of their cell phone-carrying children. Following on the heels of a similar service started by Sprint in April, the system will allow parents 'to set up geographic limits and receive text alerts if their children, who also carry phones, go too far from home. The service also lets parents check where their offspring are via a map on their cell phone or computer.' Disney will purportedly be offering a similar service when it begins selling mobile phones sometime this summer. It's 10pm -- do you know where you child's cell phone is?"
> It's 10pm -- do you know where you child's cell phone is?
Does someone else know where your child is?
which will allow parents to keep track of their cell phone-carrying children
We are all NSA's children...
Kaa
Kaa's Law: In any sufficiently large group of people most are idiots.
1) Tell parent you are going to a friends house...
2) At friend's house, tie Cellphone to family dog (make 'em think you're actually there and moving around)
3) ???
4) Profit!!!
...in bed
Seriously, the kids will know this kind of watching is being done and will either turn off their phone or leave it behind (or ata friends house inside the "permitted area".
Then if the kids really get into trouble they won't have the option of calling for help.
Sounds like a great plan to me.
Where can I check the maps?
This brings a whole new meaning to those "find available women in your area" banner ads.
but children have no rights. Oh well.
Seriously when I was growing up my parents never had any of this technology and yet they managed to keep me out of trouble. While I agree the world is a different place, and there are lots of new and different problems, it all boils down to the parents taking an active role in the child's life. Things like asking the kids how their day went, what sorts of issues they had, things that let the kid know that home is a safe place. Or how about
making time to have dinner together, or helping with the homework or the millions of other things families should do together.
Is this hard to do, hell yes. But nobody ever said life was easy, and in the long run spending time with your kids will be worth it. Remember it works both ways, when the parents are old and need someone to talk to, the children will be there.
Great idea. Now, when your child is thinking about doing something less than smart, they will also intentionally NOT take their cell phone with them.
This won't work until the phone gets embedded into their kids' skull. Or, perhaps an RFID chip in their arm and a proximity sensor in the phone; yeah, there's the ticket!
1. Teen sets up Call Forwarding on their number, forwarding to a friend's non-tracked phone.
2. Teen LEAVES their tracked phone within set boundaries.
3. Teen goes where teen wants, able to intercept calls from the folks on the other phone.
4. Profit! Or at least an unlimited party region...
"You'd better get home right now. You're mom's looking for you."
"Academicians are more likely to share each other's toothbrush than each other's nomenclature."
Cohen
It's a service, if you don't like it either don't get it or put your tinfoil hat on the phone! I for one would probably use this, at least a little. My children aren't old enough yet, but this would be useful to spot-check on them periodically to be sure that the trust should still be there.
Also useful in emergencies of course.
Those who open their minds too far often let their brains fall out.
Lets see,
Ways to beat the system
1/ Don't turn the phone on (sorry Mum, the battery went flat)
2/ Leave the phone at a safe location while you go elsewhere (sorry Mum, I had the ringer turned off soo I wouldn't annoy people near me)
Can anyone think of anymore ways?
I am Slashdot. Are you Slashdot as well?
Ways around it:
1) Turn off your cell phone.
2) Leave it somewhere.
3) Pay some kid to carry it around (making it look like you're still moving)
4) Hang out in tunnels.
5) Line pockets with tin foil.
6) Get better parents.
If the kid doesn't want their parents to know where they are... then the parent's won't know where they are. All the company is doing is marketing a product to paranoid and overly-protective parents.
However... that being said it does have some merits for emergency situations, knowing where to pick your kid up from, and it could be a fun project to map the paths of a group/herd of friends.
I guess it is a good way to keep kids from taking advantage of all of those free off peak minutes and it will probably encourage them to get their own personal phones the parents don't know about.
So it's a big win: charge parents for an extra service and then make money off of the kids who need to buy cellphones to carry with them when they leave their tracking devices at the house of the friend they say they are "with".
. . . when the phone is shut off so that Mommy and Daddy does not know that little 11-yr-old Bobby went with Sally to see the foo boy band's concert in the next county? "Uh, yeah mom, see, the battery in my phone went dead, and I, uh, popped my bicyle tire? Yeah, that's it. My bicycle tire popped, and, uh, because my phone was dead I couldn't call home, and, uh, I had to make like the professor and rig up a tube patch kit and a tire pump from bamboo and a couple of coconuts."
The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
That way I can take a plane to see that guy I met on MySpace in the middle east.
So much for that Chaperone.
Obama's legacy: (N)othing (S)ecure (A)nywhere and (T)error (S)imulation (A)dministration
While this is an invasion of privacy of your children, this service can also have some benefits. If someone's child were to get kidnapped or abducted, all the kids would need to be taught is to turn on their phone, and they can be tracked. While the percentage of kids who get kidnapped is relatively small, they are also the most common group. Verizon obviously isn't marketing this system as a way to track your kids in case they get kidnapped, but it is a positive side effect.
This service has been around for years. Accutracking for example.
c'mon. If you NEED this service because you don't know where your kid is, your kid already has the solution figured out.
What's that, you say?
*** We're sorry, but the subscriber you have requested is not currently connected to the network.
Considering Verizon's crappy coverage in my area, I think the young delinquents here are perfectly invisible.
Whenever Mrs. Fitch breaks wind, we beat the dog.
this is not really for tracking your children, that's just the cover story. More likely be used for tracking spouses - without their knowledge, of course.
If I had created the world I wouldn't have messed about with butterflies and daffodils. I would have started with lasers
Can you imagine the terror some parents will feel when their child's battery runs out?
Seriously, this is just gonna cause a lot of trouble- Now, kids aren't gonna take their cell phones with them when they're going to do something stupid. Somebody gets hurt, nobody's gonna have a phone to call for help. Way to go, Verizon.
Oh well, I've been wanting to change services for a while now. The iN network is great, but it's the only reason to have Verizon service (instead of Sprint or something else). They cripple their phones like hell to keep you from uploading your own sounds as ringtones and stuff, now.
Earn a % of cash back from Newegg, Tiger Direct, Walmart.com, and more: http://www.mrrebates.com?refid=458505
Real quick - is this simple tower trianglulation? Or is this some GSM tracking trick? Or are we talking about GPS-enabled phones?
house....wow what sort of idiot would actually buy this?
Clue for parents, your kids are going to lie about where they are going, you wont stop that ever. Just set reasonable limits that will be somewhat broken but that your kids dont go TOO far over the line.
Rules will be broken, but it just depends how badly, and tracking on a cellphone sure as shit isnt gonna do anything.
The phrase "more better" is acceptable English. suck it grammar Nazis
Commercial...
Lauren: So like, ummm, did you see my new pics on MySpace, Debbie?
Debbie: Yah, I left ya a msg. Check out Robbie, he put a hot pic up there
-bad reception area-
Lauren: What was that? Can you hear me now?
Daddy: "Yes I can hear you Lauren"
My child wears a collar similar to those from the movie, The Running Man. If the little apple of my eye tries to stray outside his predetermined area of play, BLAMMO, the collar explodes and so does his head.
Better a dead child then a kidnapped one.
Kids who need to be tracked like this will conviently "leave the phone in the car" and carpool to somewhere else.
But this sort of thing is great for salespeople/techs too. You can tell exactly where they are and manage changes in schedules more easily. It helps them do their jobs more effectively and may be easier/cheaper than gps tracking the fleet of cars/trucks.
It seems to me that the group of parents that would want this service is the same group that doesn't want their kids to have cellphones. If that's the case, this service will either, a) flop because of a lack of demand, or b) increase cell phone plan subscriptions because the parents feel better about letting Junior have a phone.
Meh, a real sig would take too long, and I have an MMORPG to play with....
For years, I've found it astounding the amount of discrimination modern kids face. At school, their civil rights are limited; High school students are subject to what, if placed in any other context, would be blatantly illegal search and seizure. Federal law required that internet access at public high schools (and, for that matter, at public libraries) to be filtered for inappropriate content.
This is really no different. Many Americans were furious to discover that the NSA had recently obtained their cell phone records, yet how many EFF members will raise a complaint against this system? None. Why? Because it's OK to discriminate against kids & students.
Think about it. Afraid your kids will be negatively influenced by some content on the internet? Were you warped by exposure to foul language, racism, and pornography when you were in high school? I bet I know the answer to both of those questions, and I bet they're not the same.
Read around on http://www.peacefire.org/. Again, think about it.
Disclaimer: For what it's worth, I'm 20. It's been years since I endured any discimination because of my age.
I'm guessing there's going to be some sort of account system so that people aren't able to track anyone they like, but I'd like to hear about a lot more safety with something like this. It's for safety, and yet it seems to me like they just put together the paedophile killer app. Track those kids! They're not at home! Meet new strangers!
Or what about tracking spouses, or siblings, or parents. Is my phone going to have a special 'kid' chip that I can turn on and off so that I can't be tracked by this network, or is it tapping straight into which cell tower I'm associated to so it's phone independant? It's one thing if the company has access to this information, but making it available to everyone else is a liability waiting to happen. Maybe I'm just paranoid.
I will shred my adversaries. Pull their eyes out just enough to turn them towards their mewing, mutilated faces. Illyria
The only real problem with this is that it would be easy for someone else to find the kid. There isn't any reason why parents shouldn't be able to use this to keep up with their kids though. If the kids don't like it, they'll just have to wait until they're 18.
For heaven's sake, think of the children!!!
For heaven's sake, don't think of the identical chips in your own phone!!!
Slashdot Burying Stories About Slashdot Media Owned
the hell with the kids. Where's my wife?
...where the kid leaves their cell phone in the turbolift while they go over to Billy's quarters to watch pr0n.
It's funny but I was thinking late last week that I would like to implant a GPS in my kids. They're quite young at the moment and would not be able to use a cell phone or other device to alert me to their location. When they play, they play in the backyard and are not allowed out front without an adult (me or a trusted neighbor) out there with them. That being said, it is darn near impossible to keep one eye on your kids at every moment. There are times that, when I do realize that they are out of eyesight; they may have gone from the front yard to the back yard through the garage, I have to look for them. I'm quite paranoid so not but a few seconds go by before I realize they aren't there. I shudder to imagine if they would get abducted.
That's why a "child-locator" device would be so wonderful to have. Think about all the kids that walk home from school and such. I think this is a great idea. Pop the phone in their backpack or put it in their pocket and make sure it's recharged every night and never turned off. I would punish my kids for turning it off for sure.
I think that, as was mentioned in another posts, if you have a good relationship with your kids and help them to understand that this device (or others that are similar) is for their protection, rather than punishment, I think it will be quite beneficial.
Anonymous Cowards are at -6...
And don't forget what could happen if the cellphone rings because mom has a message for her daughter.
Can anybody say "grounded for a year"?
I'm just recently 21, and I can tell you that yes, the exposure I had in public high school has negatively effected me. Making kids (especially those who know what is right) behave responsibly isn't discrimination. It's funny how much negative attention you can avoid by simply not doing the things that attract the oversight of the administration. The principles/administrators/police liason officers had no idea who I was because I did what was asked and followed the rules. If kids (including myself) want to be treated like the sophisticated and responsible grown-ups that we like to think of ourselves as, then we need to act like it.
Meh, a real sig would take too long, and I have an MMORPG to play with....
If the FBI and NSA can track your kids, why shouldn't you be able to? At least when you do it your kids will (ostensibly) know about it.
rooooar
Mr. and Mrs. Lester -
Your son/daughter from Michigan, USA is currently in:
Amman, Jordan
Would you like driving directions to her location?
There are 0x40000000 types of people: those who understand 32-bit IEEE 754 floating point, and those who don't.
This service is being put in place primarily to:
- BENIFIT CELL PHONE COMPANIES.
This service will be of no real benefit as:
- Children have brains as adults do
- Children do not like to be 'leashed' as adults do not
- Children are smarter than adults think and therefore will circumvent the system by any number of obvious means
The ultimate outcome of this service will be:
- Human tracking will be more accepted in society
- Human tracking will continue to be precise only in governmental/highly paid commercial instances
- Human tracking will lead to other various means to seemingly invade our privacy, take away more freedoms we enjoy today and further erode individuality and sense of personal privacy (which, IMHO, will lead to a really, really dull world where nobody truly benefits but those that are not tracked)
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.
So basically I can keep track of the movements of my family over time? How exciting that will be. Work, Home, Olive Garden, Home, Work, Home, Work, Home, Chuck-E-Cheese, Home... ad nauseum. Affirmation that my life is dull. I just hope Google picks it up so I can go to http://boringmovement.google.com/
That reminds me of the new japanese watches with cellphone capabilities. Now imagine a future with watches transmitting the kids' pulse to their parents to make sure they're fine and not in danger (and NOT having sex! Teenagers will of course HATE this one :P )
So now kids will leave their phone somewhere and just go without it. Then if they really get into trouble they'll be without a phone. Also, does this work if the phone is off? If not, I'd just always claim I was going to the movies, go the direction of the theater, turn off the phone and then do whatever I wanted for five hours, cause I saw two shows. :-)
Justin
but children have no rights. Oh well.
This used to irritate me so much when I was under 18. It still irritates me, because no where in the constitution does it say anywhere, "these rights are only applicable to those 18 years old or older".
What I find amusing is that a lot of emperors of China, etc, in centuries past were 13 years old. Somehow, recently, we decided an individual is too stupid to think for themselves until they turn 18.
I think most can agree on here, age is no determining factor for intelligence - look at our politicians - most of them are in their 40s, and still brain dead.
-- If we don't stand up for our rights, now, there will be no right to stand up for them later.
They won't turn off their cell phones in class when they're asked to. Ironically the tracking won't work then schools start shielding classrooms to block cell phone calls during class, the one place parents do want to track. I suppose that could be an excuse, turn the cell phone off and claim you were in class. But I doubt most kids could go cold turkey that long.
After the first 200 calls to 911 that "Tommy's cell phone has disapeared" (only to reappear an hour later when Tommy comes up from his freind's basement) the cops will stop replying to any calls based on this service.
Utterly useless unless you want to find a lost/stolen cell phone which just happened to be left on.
Here will be an old abusing of God's patience and the king's English.
Damn, I though the title said 'Cheaperphone'. You know, the cheap minimalist phone service without all the extra crap that I don't use/want/need?
While a lot of comments here have focussed on shortcomings that will undermine this system as used as a system of disciplinary control for children; used in a more restrained manner in a family that otherwise has good trust and communications, it could have good emergency uses. And not just for children -- I certainly wouldn't mind my wife having the additional information it would provide in the event of something happening to me. Now, of course, there are privacy concerns about keeping the information from unwanted monitors (yeah, NSA guy, I'm talking about you, among other people), but its a technology that certainly has good uses.
Thins won't work as a tracker if the kid doesn't want to be tracked and will have devastating consequences for family relationships if the parent insists on their children using it. First off kids are smart. This system needs power to work so simply taking the battery out of the phone will make the child impossible to track. If this is similar to other tracking systems it will still work if the phone is switched off but take out the battery and there's no way to track it. For those kids that can't figure this out the kids will simply leave their phone at home and say they forgot it. Now many parents buy their children a mobile phone for safety, so if they get in trouble they can call for help. But if you're a kid wanting to go to an event they aren't allowed too, usually something where the parent perceives there to be danger like a party or concert, the kid leaves the phone at home and is in even more danger.
The logical next step is for the parent to insist that the kid carries the phone at all times. What's that going to do to foster trust between the generations? "I love you Timmy and to show that love I'm going to destroy any privacy you have left and check obsessively to see where you are at all times and question you about it when you get back."
I'm sure Verizon will make money on this but the social and emotional costs will also be high and the risk factor is likely to be untouched. The first thing a child snatcher will do is ditch the phone after all. What's next, implants?
Treat your children like idiots incapable of making their own decisions and they'll probably grow up to be idots who can't make their own decisions. Establishing ground rules and boundaries is important, but that doesn't mean you have to spy on your kids. Give them your trust and respect. Monitor them if they violate that trust, but at least give them a chance to earn it.
For example, if they want to know what room you're in at the Budget-99 Motel, probably not.
But if they want to
--MarkusQ
Kids never see their parents...you said it yourself, there is hardly any time TO BE A FAMILY. Hope your kids turn out OK.
Blar.
And what happens in those places where they block cell-phone signals? Let's feed that to the lawyers when something happens to the kid...
Step 1: Enable call forwarding, forward to a friends cell.
Step 2: Leave phone a site of the 'slumber party'
Step 3: Rave all night, secure in the knowledge that Verizon is reporting you at Sally's slumber party while you do cocktails of meth and ecstasy in the middle of the desert.
How many kids have a cell phone these days? How can they possibly afford it? I have a 70k+ a year job and I can't afford a cell phone! It seems that they only way that kids could afford a cell phone is if there parents are subsidizing the cost, which in my experience means that parents are very wealthy. How many kids could this possibly affect?
No geeky kid spawn of a Slashdotter would tie a Treo 700p to a dog, or to leave it in their friend's house, granting them access to their myspace account saved passwords, and private pictures.
Even if it's a cheapper phone, would they leave their phone's private and incriminating pictures at the mercy of their internet posting friends?
The StarWars Kid won't, for sure.
I just had to...6 0517.jpg
http://www.ibiblio.org/Dave/Dr-Fun/df200605/df200
Sorry...
Now the children would turn off the cell if they know they are being tracked and then would be completly impossible to comunicate with them
I wonder why they claim it works on 10 phones only?
:) Probably the next feature I'll implement is to show you the distance to some travel points like cities etc.
They should be able to find the location of every phone connected to the network, only knowing the coordinates of the base station currently in connection with the phone.
A little off topic
I live in Germany and here one of the gsm operators (o2 Germany) sends the location of the base station as a cbs message. I developed a small aplication for Nokia Symbian phones to read and decode the message and to show the coordinates to the user. If you live or travel to Germany you can download the application here (english page) or a little better looking german page here.
I entertained myself, I can add features like kids tracking but decided it is not worth, because simply the kids don't get a Symbian phone for the birthday
let's indoctrinate everyone into a culture of spying. the kids, the parents, everyone. who needs freedom? come on, let's do it for the children.
sum.zer0
Thank you, Big Brother, for allowing me to track my children while you are! I'm glad I'm a Beta.
... that children are unable to use each others phones, nor swap sim cards.
Verizon Wireless released a full featured version in March. http://estore.vzwshop.com/overview/customapplicati ons/fieldforcemanager/
I believe that this is a tool, like any other tool, it can be abused or used for good. I have a story to tell it's happening right now, and is causing two parent considerable grief...
First of all let me frame this story. My wife and I own a duplex, we live in one side of it and rent the other. My tenants are good hard-working lower middle class Blue collar workers. They do their very best to raise their kids (2 boys). Their youngest who just turned 16 is feeling his oats and starting to challenge his parents authority. Talking back, swearing at his parents, staying out late and sometimes not coming home at all. They are at their wits end as to what to do with him. They recently had a friend of theirs a, county sheriff, stop by and talk to them about their options. I also managed to take part of some of this conversation, and related a tory of mine.
When I was his age, I got into an argument with my mother, (I don't even remember what it was about now) feeling my oats and decided that it was a Good Idea to call her a "F*cking Bit.." I NEVER had a chance to finish that cuss, as unbeknownst to me my father had been standing behind me the whole time, and next thing I knew I was on the ground 5 feet away with my head on the other side of my shoulders. I NEVER attempted to call my parents names again as I had learned my lesson. My parents never abused me, this was the ONLY time I was EVER struck by my parents (other than being spanked occasionally when I was younger). I can count the times I was physically disciplined on 2 hands with a few fingers left over. I personally do not consider this abuse, but according to the sheriff, times have changed, and you can go to jail for this sort of "child abuse" now. It's rediculous!
Anyways back to my story, their youngest has now not come home for 4 days, they have no idea where he is, and have now reported him as a "Runaway Child". He DOES however, have a cell phone on him that his parents provided him. I have recommended getting one of the "tracking services" that are being advertised by cell phone companies now so they can find out where he is. They are currently looking into this, and I hope that they can find him.
In this case I think that GPS cell phone tracking is a good thing and an important tool that parents have at their disposal. On the other hand Government agency or private company tracking without a warrant or permission is abhorable.
Weren't PlayStations modded so that pirated games could be played? Aren't cellphones unlockable? Wasn't there a guy who disabled kid's nanny software for $5 a pop?
I can see this going the same way - parents installed a Big Brother system on your cellphone? No problem, just go to the guy down the street and get it disabled for $5, then claim "it isn't working".
At any rate, the cellphone companies are going to rejoice.
"Let's face it, it's a good story. Accuracy would kill it."
Okay. If you were sneaking out of the house. And your parents could tell where your cellphone is. Then leave it where it should be! Next to your bed! I'm sorry this is really stupid and full of holes and security issues! What if my phone "dies" and I "lose" the simcard temporarily? I dissapear! And what is with all theese kids with cellphones! Who is calling them that is sooo important. If your at home use the house phone! I tired of theese little 11 year old kids with cellphones! You only need a cellphone when your 16 and driving. If you really want to know where your kid is then buy a cheap gps set and tag the kid. It'll save you money in overages and downloads. Or better yet! Just put a chip in the kids neck!
It's not -1 Flamebait! It's +5 Funny. You just didn't get the joke...
It is still based on fear: fear of not being sexually desireable. "Buy this NOW or you will NEVER get laid!"
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
What I find amusing is that a lot of emperors of China, etc, in centuries past were 13 years old.
You don't really think that a 13-year-old was independently making empire-impacting decisions all on his own, do you? That culture as a serious venerate-the-greybeards take on things, and any teenage emperor would have had plenty of "handlers."
I think most can agree on here, age is no determining factor for intelligence
But age has everything to do with experience. Sure, there are some kids that are much more worldly than others, but there aren't many kids that are as across the board worldly as their parents (no matter what the kids would like to think that all of their MTV, MySpace time, and first person shooters have taught them).
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
Somehow, recently, we decided an individual is too stupid to think for themselves until they turn 18.
No, I think the people under 18 decided that for themselves with their attitudes and behavior. (I'm 21 so it hasn't been long since I was that age)
Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
Reminds me of the kid that recently got lost in the woods. He nearly starved to death. Why? Because his parents made him so paranoid of strangers that he was hiding from the rescuers. What did his parents tell the press after the kid was found "I'm proud" that he was hiding from the strangers.
I live in Russia, and all three major cellphone providers offer a simular service. Well, I've never seen anyone use it except tech-savvy people (and they usually play with the service for a week and then completely forget it).
This may be convenient if, for example, your kid is unable to reply your phone call - in a noisy environment, while riding a bike or playing football. It can also be useful if your kid gets lost.
And think how this service would be useful if your phone is stolen! You can track the bastard who stole it on a map and teach him a lesson.
geez, we'll use this just to find their backpacks (which are a whole lot harder to keep track of than where the kids are)
How is the Cellular Phone company liable for any abductions that occur while the child is taking an active role in defeating tracking. Where, as well, do you think it will say in the service agreement that Verizon/etc will be in any way responsible for the activities conducted by the tracked children? I can tell you how it will read. Something like:
"We (Verizon Wireless) will not be held accountable for any actions, discrepancies, or service failures while watching a tracked phone. This service is an INFORMATIONAL service and cannot prevent acts outside of parental or legal boundries."
Oops. Guess the laywers are going to beat you to the punch, huh?
Cellular telephone service is a 'best effort' service anyways, not guaronteed service by any stretch of the imagination.
Yeah, but as far as the government is concerned - if you can't vote, who gives a fuck what you think?
What I find amusing is that a lot of emperors of China, etc, in centuries past were 13 years old.
Don't consider this as implying even the remotest knowledge of Chinese history, but were any of these 13-year-old emperors actually running the empire vs simply being crowned while adult aides ran the show?
Somehow, recently, we decided an individual is too stupid to think for themselves until they turn 18.
No, not true. 18 is not the age at which we believe you are no longer too stupid to take care of yourself.
18 is the age at which we as a society stop caring if you aren't.
I strongly disagree with a lot of the blatant abuses of children done by schools; I'm just pointing out that it is wrong to view it as "under 18 is incapable of being independent, over 18 is not". It's just the legal boundary at which societal protections/restrictions are lifted regardless of the consequences.
The enemies of Democracy are
You are a country of in-effectual neurotics, and have skant idea
... to and from school, play and enjoy the beautiful
how to deal with the problems you have, at any level.
First you must QUICKLY, identify, prosecute, sentance and kill the
psychotics within your community, who would harm children.
Then you need to give the children their childhood back; here, in Switzerland,
5-16 walk, skate, ski
countryside. They know what their legs are for.
My kid is going to learn about economics early. Given that I find this kind of service harmful to kids, you can guess who's kid is going to be making a killing offering forwarding services.
Wrong. The threat (perticularly when you have the means) of tracking a person is just as controlling as actually tracking them.
The problem in this "age" isn't a lack of time. It is that too many people accept it as entirely normal that you should have "precious little time enough to have a true family dinner let alone quality time where a family can be together and share ideas and exchange thoughts."
We should not be finding ways to make slavery more convenient. We should demand the right to have the opportunity to raise our children PROPERLY OURSELVES.
I wont even get into the moral issue of whether or not a parent even has any right to force their child to carry a homing device.
No one has a right to their *own* opinion. They have a right to the TRUTH.
Unfortunately, we live in a place where, even if you take blatent actions to defeat a form of service or security, you can still wind up with a lawsuit. For example, a kid can cut through a chainlink fence at rail-road tracks, get amputated by the train that hits him, and the family can still sue the rail-road agency and win. I was just trying to point out that some parents might think the service is more than what it is, just informational, as you have pointed out.
Also, a similar story on bash.org: http://bash.org/?3223
Somehow, recently, we decided an individual is too stupid to think for themselves until they turn 18.
Most, unfortunately, are still too stupid to think for themselves at this age and much older.
A way to remotely enable the microphone, so you can "listen in" on your child (or wherever the phone happens to be).
Why can't they just collide a whole bunch of little hadrons?
Now, name me one phone which does this. I'd buy one in an instant, but they don't exist.
But you can buy mobile phone reference boards which don't have the GPS chip included. Unfortunately, you have to be a real hacker in order to use that for your cell phone.
Many have listed ways to beat this including...
1) Turn off your cell phone.
2) Leave it somewhere.
3) Pay some kid to carry it around (making it look like you're still moving)
4) Hang out in tunnels.
5) Line pockets with tin foil.
6) Get better parents.
Any parent savvy enough to use a system like this won't be easily tricked. If you turn your cell phone off they will see it. When you get home you may not be able to go out anymore.
If you leave it somewhere and they call, you won't be able to answer unless you forward your phone. Even then, all they need to do is ask you to call them back from your phone. If you can't then you are busted.
Have someone else hold it? Again, you won't be able to answer it. It they want to track you and you won't/can't answer your phone, that sends a signal that something is up!
For nearly all teens, the parents are the ones paying for the phone, car, clothes, etc and they can cut all that off if they like. I'm sure many of you will say I work xx hours per week and pay for everything. Good for you. Most others aren't so lucky!
This system may not seem right/fair/trusting/etc. Still, it isn't as easy to beat as most here think.
Ninjas don't carry tic tacs
So you get your child a cell phone because you want them to be able to call if they get in trouble, but then you set a tracker on it, so they end up leaving it at a friends house while they both go off somewhere else. Not so smart. "Hey tommy, can you hold on to my phone while I go downtown for some crack? I don't want my parents to know I was in that area." The first time a kid gets chewed on for going "out of bounds" is the last time they carry the phone with them....
Its easy to take away the rights of children ... and when you do so they don't fight back as hard when those same rights are being taken away when they become adults.
If they can offer this to you to monitor your children, they can offer this to the NSA to monitor you.
Domestic call record monitoring then gets expanded into domestic physical surveillance.
The NSA can now know where you are at all times... i'm sooo happy.
VLC FOR MAC IS DYING! IF YOU DEVELOP, PLEASE SAVE IT!!
It is as bad as having a permanent leash. I dunno for you, but having such a leash on me around my teen would have pushed me to rebellion (or rather a head on conflict), defiance toward my parents, and even complete and uter distrust. After all why should i trust somebody which do not trust me a bit. Trust is to be shared and exchanged. it ain't a one sided issue (unless you are waaaay naive). Worst case scenario if you are a leash for your whole teenage, you do not get to experience by yourself , and even mature. Making yourself unfit for society. maybe you think i am exagerating, but I know of two of such people. And it is quite sad....
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
If you don't want your parents (or the NSA) tracking your every move, just leave the phone in your car, or in your locker at school. Or better yet, just turn it off, and turn it on only when you want to use it. Unless your mother is so OCD that she's constantly refreshing Verizon's tracking page every 5 seconds, your parents will never know where you are, short of the last known location.
The real use of this system will be when you get the message: CELL PHONE TRAVELING IN EXCESS OF 110MPH.
Besides, my kids forget/lose/destroy so many cell phones, this service would be best simply for finding the missing phones again.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
"I just caught my spouse cheating on me!"
"And I did it with this cell phone!"
"Jerry! Jerry! Jerry!"
How many fulltime jobs can one man have?
smokkin' weed in the basement honest. Look it' my chaperone account, I was at mike's all night we went to bed early that's why I didn't hear you call. Boy if this isn't the biggest gimmick I've ever seen. Of course if you can put the words "good" and "parent" in any commercial every consumerist suburbanite can be tricked into buying anything.
Future versions of this device will also include a "Virgin Alarm",
("Designed to go off before you do.").
the UK government has been doing that for awhile now...
-Clio
Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
You teenage daughter is bipolar. She is self medicating with drugs and alcohol. When in the manic state, she has a tendency to run away for a few days, often placing herself in extremely dangerous circumstances. On a daily basis she tends to disappear and come home high or drunk.
Since California law prevents you, the parent, from forcing into a treatment program without her permission (which she won't give) and both parents need to work to make ends meet, it's impossible to keep watch on her 24/7.
This isn't imaginary. This was my life until we were finally able to get the State to pay for placing in her a facility in Utah (had to be out of state since in California she can simply walk out).
A cell phone with the ability to track her would have been a godsend.
--
Posting anonymously for obvious reasons.
...I'm sure they'll be able to figure out all they need to do is call forward their number to a friend's phone, and leave their cell phone where they say they are going. Oh shoot. I think that statement just made this technology...useless? At least to the parents who really need to worry about their kids. My kids are going to be bastards, I know it. That's why I'm gonna staple GPS devices to their backs.
Exactly the kind of situation where, if they got in a bind, you'd want them to have a cell phone to call for help. So at the times they're most likely to need a phone, they'll less likely to actually carry it.
That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
All your children are belong to us...
>Head of the household is a term rarely referring to the husband/father in a family anymore, because complaining/bitchy/needy wives (and subsequentally children in these cases) as well as television/media become the head of the household when the fathers don't take a stand and put their feet down on basic lifestyle decisions that affect the whole family.
Why must a MAN and ONLY a man be the "head" of a household? Do you think, for example, that a woman who lives alone, or a single mother, can't make good decisions? (And, before you spout off about how single mothers are all irresponsible sluts, not all single mothers are single by choice!)
Are you saying only women are greedy and materialistic? Give me GOOD, LOGICAL reasons why a woman shouldn't make "basic lifestyle decisions."
Wait, I shouldn't encourage you to spout more nonsense. Perhaps you see women as "complaining/bitchy/needy" because the ones you know are complaining and bitching about YOUR blatant lack of respect for them. Clearly you see women as eternal children who need a man to tell them what to do. A woman who complains about an autocratic man is complaining for a REASON. If you had a wife who insisted on making all your decisions for you and saw you as an irresponsible child just because you were a man, you'd complain too.
>Same goes for your wife! You're the MAN of the house, and however many people cringe to that statement need to realise that the MAN of the house isn't always an asshole, he's the one that provides insight, focus and direction to a family.
A man who thinks only a MAN can provide "insight, focus, and direction" (meaning a woman can't) IS an asshole. A man who believes that a man should control his wife's behavior and make all the decisions CERTAINLY is an asshole.
Does your wife know you think of women this way? I'm really surprised you're "married to the best woman in the world." You certainly don't deserve her.
Why the hell is this trash modded 2 instead of 1, by the way? We need more women on Slashdot. . .
- Darkflame
if you lose your phone the telcos know exactly where the thing is if it's turned on. Will they tell you? No. I wonder how many tens of thousands of phones were unnecessarily replaced because the phone company would rather you buy a new phone than tell you where you lost it.
It's nice to see they're unrestricting some of these services, but I feel I've always had a right to access the Geolocation information on my own property.
But age has everything to do with experience. Sure, there are some kids that are much more worldly than others, but there aren't many kids that are as across the board worldly as their parents (no matter what the kids would like to think that all of their MTV, MySpace time, and first person shooters have taught them).
Indeed. Heck, I'm 26 now, and looking back at 21, it's surprising how much I've grown in just the last five years, despite how "worldly" I thought I was back then. Unfortunately, our society places far more emphasis on intellect than it does on experience (as is evidenced, I think, by our treatment of the elder members of our society), and so it's not surprising that young people have difficulty understanding why they aren't considered eligible for certain rights and responsibilities.
This is insane. I agree with the "can you molest me now? Good." comment, this is just going to help illegal use of this system. Some wacko can and will buy an extra one and stick it in his girlfriend's car. Also, kids can just leave them at home or put them in their parent's pockets (my god! little timmy is right on me...HE'S UNDER THE HOUSE!!!)
I've been a kidnapping victim - this type of technology would've been A FUCKING MIRACLE FOR ME were I a little child around this time - I could have been saved two days before an Amber Alert was issued, instead of needing to wait 24 hours before an alert was issued - I've seen networks where news of potentially missing children hit the waves before the news even has a hint. I'm talking within MINUTES. Sadly, local networks are still going to be faster than nationwide networks. : We can only hope our bueraucracy catches up with commonplace social networks.
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
You need to go back and re-watch Max Headroom (a.k.a. Max Headroom - 20 Minutes Into the Future). In the future, it's illegal for televisions to have an "off" switch. (I imagine you now saying, "Yes, but this is about phones, not TV's." Then suddenly that look of sad realization as you realize why cell phones have been adding video displays...)
It isn't exactly a Quantum Leap to imagine phones you can't leave behind... Moms in my day used to grind up birth control pills and sneak them into girls' orange juice in the morning. In the future we'll probably have parents making secret deals with the people selling piercings so that when they finally, unexpectedly agree to a piercing you'll later find that it was because there's an embedded GPS device going into your navel. Or perhaps an inertial sensor that can track your incremental movements and for later download -- just in case your friends build a network of Faraday cages for you to get lost in.
Kent M Pitman
Philosopher, Technologist, Writer
Of course the service in itself is bad.
But this will teach generations of kids the value of privacy and how to protect their own private life.
And that knowledge kan be used not only against their parents but also big brother.
Kid = Salesperson :)
;)
;p
:(
Sure the kids will come up with 20 ways around it but my salesmen won't think of any of them
I just think it would be great to suggest the boss go play golf where a salesman is playing hooky
hehe, i do the A/P and get to cut the check for 15 verizon phones, got to be an up side somewhere
Indeed. Heck, I'm 26 now, and looking back at 21, it's surprising how much I've grown in just the last five years, despite how "worldly" I thought I was back then.
If you think that's something, wait until you're 40! I've become convinced that most people born at any time after 1965 don't really grow up until they're 30+. Seen it with my own eyes, over and over. BTW, by "grown up," I mean able to truly see the big picture about most things, before dwelling on the little, distracting stuff.
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
Disney is an MVNO on Sprint PCS. Verizon is third to market. Did Sprint get a /. story back in April?
What's more, taken at all levels, tax rates are especially traumatic. The income tax in and of itself isn't too bad, but when you add Social Security's 14%, Medicare's
Also see my comments here and here.
With that said, I agree that there are many non-essentials that people waste their money one. Some of the best nutrition advice I've ever read:
Food ingredients are cheap, but buying prepared food is expensive because there's a whole chain of suppliers who are taking their cut.
I made pizza for a date last night. I pre-made the dough in the morning by mixing 3.5 cups of freshly ground flour, 1/2 cup coconut oil (would've used a stick of butter, but I was out), 2 cups raw milk, and a scoop of probiotics in the food processor with a dough blade. Let the dough ferment for 12 hours or so (to make the wheat more digestable - something about digestion inhibitors in grains & beans; see the cookbook offered above). In the evening I spread my dough on a pizza pan, baked at 300 degrees for 30 minutes. Added a can of tomato sauce, cheese, chopped garlic, red bell pepper & carrot, and some kind of mildly spicy bell pepper I had around. Was going to make sausage to go on it, but I didn't have any ground meat handy. Bumped the temperature in the oven up to 350 and cooked for another half hour.
The most expensive ingredient in my pizza was the cheese. I guess I paid $9 for the pound. If I had planned ahead, I could've ordered a 6 pound 'wheel' of cheese from the business formerly known as Tucson Cooperative warehouse (delivered to my local buying club) for 3.45/pound. Can of organic tomato sauce from Trader Joe's is ~$1.10. I think the cost of the wheat and vegetables were insignificant. Meat would've added another $2 or $3 (1/2 pound of grass-fed ground beef w/ spices from one of the sausage recipies in the cookbook above)
She liked it, and I didn't pay someone else to cook for us. And while it was cooking, we had some nice private time to continue my touching (girls like to be rubbed). Couldn't do that at a restaurant.
Grandpa had Papa John's pizza on Saturday. When I saw him on sunday, "Wasn't nearly as good as your's".
Learn the rules so you know how to break them properly.
www.teslabox.com
societal protections/restrictions
The protections are lifted at 18, but the restrictions are lifted at 21.
Try buying alcohol, buying a handgun, renting a car, etc when you're 19.
People are expected to contribute to society as full adults but are not given the same freedoms and protections as adults. People in our country aged 18-21 are second class citizens.
Life is too short to proofread.
Until they let their friend borrow their phone while they go around the town...
APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
or you know, you could be less of a dick
The Constitution had almost nothing to say about the rights of wonen, children or slaves. Fundamentally, these were considered matters for state and local legislation.
The Constitution did, however, set minimum age requirements for the President and members of Congress. Rather stiff rwquirements, when you look at the life expectancy of an eighteeth century male.
The rights of children do not become a significant federal concern until the New Deal labor legislation of the nineteen thirties and the activist Supreme Court of ten, twenty, and thirty years later.
I'm sorry, but it's not a priority since a lot of the "men" on slashdot have these same sexist attitudes. I've noticed this a lot more in the computer/technical industry than any other industry I've worked with. It's no wonder there aren't more women in this industry. I'm surprised that any women even want to work in the trade at all. Most of my fellow "men" in this industry lack personal hygiene and any form of social skills. It's as if they never grew up or had any sort of parental oversight when they were growing up.
On slashdot, a lot of them really haven't left high school, so they aren't "grown up" yet and that's ok, but I'm talking about the industry in general. It's almost as if the boys who don't want to grow up are drawn to this industry. Until these juvenile attitudes change, the number of women will remain small.
Do parents really think that their children won't find out that they can be tracked via their cellphone? That means that if they want to go do something without their parents finding out, then they will simply leave it at their friend's house who they are "staying overnight with" and go do what they want. Except now, they don't have the ability to use their cellphone to get help if they get into trouble - which is why they have it in the first place. It seems to be more detrimental than helpful.
"Don't believe anything you read on the net. Except this. Well, including this, I suppose." --Douglas Adams
Would turning the phone off be sufficient, or would the battery need to be pulled as well? I've heard that cell phones still "ping" and can be tracked while "off", but I don't have any reliable sources for this information.
Boundless Expansion, Self-Transformation, Dynamic Optimism, Intelligent Technology, Spontaneous Order- BEST DO IT SO!
The thing about marriage is that it is a partnership. There will be times when your interests are mutual, some times when the interests of one don't interfere with those of the other, and some times when you have conflicts. It's all in how you resolve the last bunch.
Wish I had mod points.
Thank you! It's good to know I'm not the only person on Slashdot who hates the utter lack of respect for women that so many people have here. . .and, if I read your post correctly (the bit about fellow "men"), you are also male. It's especially nice to see this comment from a man. (I'm female, by the way.)
I guess I'm lucky. I work at a software company where, fortunately, anyone who voiced the kind of attitudes so often seen here would probably be ostracized.
"But I get to be in charge, because I'm the booooyyy. Boooooyyyys are supposed to be the bosses! Waaaaaahhhh!" - translation of a lot of the stupid posts here
(Note: I'm only posting as Anonymous Coward because I've been checking quickly in spare moments - I saw these posts casually and felt I had to respond!)
- Darkflame
No, we decided that an individual is too stupid to think for the government until he/she's 18 (i.e. voting age)
Apparently we decided than an individual is too stupid to think for themselves when they're 21 (drinking age)
Tell me that THAT makes sense!
Hey, I'm female and I've been in the IT industry for about 10 years. I do have to say in spite of a lot of the juvenile sexist crap posted on Slashdot, the vast majority of guys I've encountered in the workforce have been intelligent and non-sexist in their behavior toward me. There have been many cases where I was the only woman in the department, and even one case where I was the only woman in the company. I have worked in a lot of different companies in several states, but perhaps I have just been very fortunate in that regard.
I think the GP poster was initially making a good point about personal responsibility, but unfortunately he had to ruin it with all the sexist BS ranting. I suspect that he, like alot of the other guys on here who post nonsense like that, feel safe in the relatively anonymous world of the internet, and post a lot of things that they'd never dare say in person - especially when they know their wife/girlfriend/mom will never see it. The more vehement they are online about it, the more I think they are compensating for their own shortcomings in real life relationships. I bet the GP poster's wife would get a good laugh to hear about how he's the big "MAN of the house."
How do you expect to live this lifestyle when you can no longer work? "No savings anywhere" means you will never be able to be without income.
-ted