Alan Cox's Exploding Laptop

His own fault... by Pink+Tinkletini · 2006-09-23 18:31 · Score: 5, Funny

...for buying an IBM ThinkPad, notorious for their unreliability. Perhaps he should have considered an Apple or Dell instead.

--
And now, a PSA from David Lynch.

Re:His own fault... by in2mind · 2006-09-23 18:37 · Score: 0

.for buying an IBM ThinkPad, notorious for their unreliability. Perhaps he should have considered an Apple or Dell instead.

What are you talking? Notorious?Somehow IBM thinkpad's dominate the corporate world (& I really dont know why.I guess the 'IBM' tag does it.).
As for Dell,come on.Dont joke.They explode as well.

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Wincopy
Re:His own fault... by AKAImBatman · 2006-09-23 18:47 · Score: 4, Insightful

Perhaps he should have considered an Apple or Dell instead.

Or perhaps he should have bought his battery in shrinkwrap from a reputable dealer rather than getting an after-market battery off of eBay? Even if it's a "genuine" IBM, for all he knows he ended up with a recall unit that somehow (*cough*) got resold on the open market.

There are some things you DO NOT trust after-market vendors for. One of those things happens to be a highly explosive Lithium Ion battery pack. There are enough problems with the first party units to give pause to anyone even considering third party units. Getting off of eBay? Now that's just asking for trouble. :-/

--
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
Re:His own fault... by phasm42 · 2006-09-23 19:01 · Score: 5, Funny

Time to adjust your sarcasm detector.

--
"No one likes working in a hamster wheel, and your shop smells of cedar shavings from here." - TaleSpinner
Re:His own fault... by basil+montreal · 2006-09-23 19:03 · Score: 1

"for buying an IBM ThinkPad, notorious for their unreliability. Perhaps he should have considered an Apple or Dell instead."

What are you smoking??? The Thinkpad is one of the most reliable laptops in the market, even since the brand got bought by Lenovo. His own fault, yes. For putting an unreliable battery in. Even a Panasonic Toughbook (arguably the most reliable laptop out there) would explode if the battery you attach to it explodes.

Dell just recalled a ton of their batteries for this very reason, and Apple laptops are generally not business machines. IBM (and now Lenovo) laptops are more expensive than Dells and HPs because of their reliability- your statement is completely without merit.
Re:His own fault... by basil+montreal · 2006-09-23 19:07 · Score: 1

"What are you smoking???"

Yeah... now that I read your post again, looks like I may have missed a little sarcasm... it's 3 AM and I tend to get a little preachy this time of night. Off to bed for me, before I say anything else I can't edit :)
Re:His own fault... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 19:32 · Score: 4, Insightful

The problem is that the "reputable dealers" have ridiculous markups on replacement parts. You can get a digital camera battery for $40 or for $4. For most people the $4 batteries work just the same and don't fail. Actually I am under the impression that more name brand batteries have been the cause of laptop fires than others, perhaps because they are supposed to be the best performing batteries, so they have to cut more corners than generics. One thing which could really help the situation is standardization: It would bring prices down by enabling competition and reducing the number of different battery packs a manufacturer needs to support. That would pretty much eliminate the need or desire to buy off-brand batteries.
Re:His own fault... by Firehed · 2006-09-23 20:00 · Score: 4, Funny

Let me rephrase that for you:

*woosh*

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How are sites slashdotted when nobody reads TFAs?
Re:His own fault... by toQDuj · 2006-09-23 20:00 · Score: 5, Interesting

Hmm, yes, quite like the Exploding Nokia batteries, indistinguishable from genuine Nokia batteries (according to Nokia), but fake batteries nonetheless (according to Nokia again).

Here's my thoughts: Nokia bought a batch of faulty batteries bud didn't want to admit it. Therefore they said the batteries weren't theirs, even though they coulod not make the distinction.

The real reason you should be buying laptop batteries directly from the manufacturer (or in this case, the vendor: Apple, Dell or IBM) and not a reseller, is that the Li-ion batteries start degrading as soon as they're manufactured due to stresses in the crystal matrix. It does not matter much, therefore, how the batteries are used, for they will only last up to three years before cells will break. Thus, you want the batteries as fresh from the factory as possible, which is why you buy them from the vendor and not a reseller, because the turnover speed at the vendor is greater.

Explosions are quite common to high-capacity batteries. It's the energy, you see.

B.

--
Every experiment which ends in a big bang is a good experiment.
Re:His own fault... by pchan- · 2006-09-23 21:06 · Score: 5, Funny

Think of this as a learning experience If Linux had implemented BeOS's is_computer_on_fire()* system call, he would have been able to log the situation, send an email to his friend to alert the authorities, and shut down cleanly.

*Yes, it's actually in the OS.
Re:His own fault... by johansalk · 2006-09-23 22:55 · Score: 1

Can someone please tell me if this applies to AA and AAA batteries too? Or are those ones just unlikely to explode?
Re:His own fault... by dangitman · 2006-09-24 00:03 · Score: 1

Dell just recalled a ton of their batteries for this very reason, and Apple laptops are generally not business machines.
I'm not sure why you say that. If Apple laptops are not "business machines," then why is it so common to see them being used for business? What quality are you referring to that makes them not suitable for business?

--
... and then they built the supercollider.
Re:His own fault... by arivanov · 2006-09-24 00:32 · Score: 3, Informative

RTFA: he bought the battery off eBay. Nuff said, no need to say more, move along.

--
Baker's Law: Misery no longer loves company. Nowadays it insists on it
http://www.sigsegv.cx/
Re:His own fault... by stunt_penguin · 2006-09-24 00:37 · Score: 1

I can see it now........ you're on the phone to Dell/IBM/Whoever, and they're offering you all the crap they always want to sell you

D/I/W : "Also, sir we'd like to offer you our disaster recovery blanket for the low, low price of $24.95, including shipping"

Customer : "Disaster recovery blanket..... what exactly do you mean by that"

D/I/W : "Well, sir..... it's a fold up fire blanket, you know just in case........."

Customer : "Just.... just in case of what, exactly?"

D/I/W : "In case of fire, sir"

Customer : ".................umm...............!"

*click*

--
When the posters fear their moderators, there is tyranny; when the moderators fears the posters, there is liberty.
Re:His own fault... by mpcooke3 · 2006-09-24 00:52 · Score: 2, Funny

"That man has a point" he says whilst carefully taking his nokia-phone/ebay-battery out of his pocket and further away from his valuable parts.
Re:His own fault... by proudlyindian · 2006-09-24 02:34 · Score: 1

Hope the API is hosted on a BeOS system else we are going to have one more exploding server !

--

Striving to be common...
Re:His own fault... by bytesex · 2006-09-24 02:50 · Score: 3, Funny

I also very much like the is_computer_on() functioncall, documented on the same page, which returns 1 if your computer is on, otherwise undefined. Very clever.

--
Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
Re:His own fault... by osu-neko · 2006-09-24 03:14 · Score: 1

For what it's worth, I use a Mac laptop almost daily, but I don't own one -- it belongs to my employer, as do all the other Macs we use at work.

--
"Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies."
Re:His own fault... by jamar0303 · 2006-09-24 03:17 · Score: 1

Maybe it's iMovie, iDVD, GarageBand, and associated software?

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OSx86 FTW
Re:His own fault... by kernel_pat · 2006-09-24 03:34 · Score: 1

"Oh, a sarcasm detector a REAL usefull invention" *detector explodes*
Re:His own fault... by ozmanjusri · 2006-09-24 03:51 · Score: 4, Funny

carefully taking his nokia-phone/ebay-battery out of his pocket and further away from his valuable parts.
Just to clarify, this being Slashdot, the "valuable parts" being referred to are his PDA, and extensive collection of Star Trek trading cards.

--
"I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
Re:His own fault... by Takumi2501 · 2006-09-24 03:59 · Score: 1

is_computer_on_fire()

double is_computer_on_fire(void)

Returns the temperature of the motherboard if the computer is currently on fire. If the computer isn't on fire, the function returns some other value.
So how do you know what return value is the temperature of the motherboard, and what's "some other value"?

--
Sent from my computer.
Now GET OFF MY LAWN!
Re:His own fault... by db32 · 2006-09-24 04:15 · Score: 1

I had a linux box once tell me 'the printer is on fire'.

--
The only change I can believe in is what I find in my couch cushions.
Re:His own fault... by WWWWolf · 2006-09-24 04:26 · Score: 1

Well, Linux already has support for various temperature sensors... but no kernel level sorry-I'm-on-fire support. They even removed the "lpX on fire" error...
Re:His own fault... by dougmc · 2006-09-24 04:58 · Score: 1

Can someone please tell me if this applies to AA and AAA batteries too? Or are those ones just unlikely to explode?
AA and AAA batteries are usually non-rechargable (alkaline, zinc-carbon or others?) or rechargable (NiCd or NiMH. Well, there's also rechargable alkaline, but I don't know much about those.)

If damaged in such a way that the battery shorts internally, they tend to get very hot very quickly, and may even emit steam, but they don't usually catch fire (though they can start a fire if there's something flammable nearby.) What's different about LiIon batteries (like used by your modern laptop or cell phone) is that the same thing happens, but the stuff that comes out is actually flammable, which is why they're so much more likely to burn (they generally don't explode, but can burn vigorously.) Also, if a LiIon cell gets hot enough, the electrolyte can start to react on it's own, no physical damage needed, causing a fire that way.
Damaged or overcharged lead-acid batteries (like in your car) can also emit hydrogen, which is explosive. I'll bet more of these have caused explosions than LiIon batteries ever have.
In any event, to answer your question, your AA/AAA batteries are almost certainly not going to explode or even catch fire. At worst, if you take a fully charged AA NiCd battery and beat it with hammer a few times, it'll get really hot and start steaming -- but probably won't catch fire on it's own, since there's nothing to burn. Do this in a pile of papers and it might start a fire, however.
Personally, I'm wondering what's changed recently -- we've been using LiIon/LiPo cells for years now, but we've almost never heard of fires caused by them in laptops or cell phones until recently. Suddnely, now it seems like every laptop is a fire waiting to happen! Is it that these fires happened before, but nobody reported them? Or are modern batteries more likely to catch fire?
Re:His own fault... by loyukfai · 2006-09-24 05:01 · Score: 1

There're certain risks involved when one buys 3rd party batteries, or genuine ones as claimed, from eBay or other sources but not from the official vendors or reputable sources. However, when one consider that the price differences, which can be as much as 4 times in some cases, and the number of reported cases of battery explosions, it could be hard to resist.

Of course, the number of cases which haven't been reported is unknown as well.
Re:His own fault... by vision864 · 2006-09-24 05:46 · Score: 0

3 years WHAT kind of CRAP are they putting in these, i have a 4 year old toshiba and it still holds as around 2 and a half of the original 3 hour charge, another MUCH older pentium generation hitachi mx150 has a lithium pack that still goes - both packs contain sanyo cells.

Are the really just using the most flea market ass parts they can find, or has QC across the board just slipped that much.
Re:His own fault... by evilviper · 2006-09-24 06:46 · Score: 1

Li-ion batteries start degrading as soon as they're manufactured due to stresses in the crystal matrix. It does not matter much, therefore, how the batteries are used, for they will only last up to three years before cells will break.

The LiIon battery from my MZR30 portable Sony Minidisc Recorder, would like to have a little discussion with you...

I bought it in 1996 and used it more heavily over that time than you would imagine, and I still continue to use it on a daily basis. Not only does the battery work, but I haven't even noticed decreased battery life.

Explosions are quite common to high-capacity batteries. It's the energy, you see.

I've never seen NiCD, NiMH, or LeadAcid batteries explode, despite my abuse. Only LiIons.

--
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
Re:His own fault... by aldm · 2006-09-24 07:22 · Score: 1

Nicholas Negroponte's laptop will not explode.
Re:His own fault... by jrockway · 2006-09-24 07:42 · Score: 1

> What quality are you referring to that makes them not suitable for business?

No way to dock them properly. It is kind of inconvenient to attach a monitor, keyboard, mouse, USB hub, etc. every morning at work. That's why Dells with docking stations are preferred for the business environment.

--
My other car is first.
Re:His own fault... by Beryllium+Sphere(tm) · 2006-09-24 08:08 · Score: 1

>Explosions are quite common to high-capacity batteries. It's the energy, you see.

The main battery in my Prius is about the size of a suitcase and stores enough energy to lift the car straight up 40 meters. Hundreds of thousands are on the road, scooting along without incident. They're NiMH.

If it were just the energy density, you wouldn't see deep discharge leading to safety problems ("A deep discharge causes copperplating, which can lead to a short circuit in the cell").

If you short-circuit a battery, the size of the resulting boom will depend on the capacity and the delivery rate. But most batteries don't short-circuit themselves.

Lithium chemistries are exceptionally finicky, which is why reputable manufacturers put protective charge controllers into the battery pack itself.
Re:His own fault... by dangitman · 2006-09-24 08:49 · Score: 1

Huh? So, because you can use it for video, DVD and music, you can't use them for business?

--
... and then they built the supercollider.
Re:His own fault... by dangitman · 2006-09-24 08:52 · Score: 1

But why would you do that, anyway? I've never seen any business taking such a strange approach to their machines. Most people either use their laptop all the time, or have a separate laptop and desktop machine. Also, the vast m ajority of Windows PCs bought by business are not dockable. I don't think your logic is valid. It just defies reality, because the vast majority of businesses do not use Dells with docking stations.

--
... and then they built the supercollider.
Re:His own fault... by DeadChobi · 2006-09-24 08:57 · Score: 1

In fact, the fact that lead-acid batteries emit hydrogen is the reason that you're supposed to attach the ground in a pair of jumper cables to the body of the car and not to the ground on the battery, as it may spark and cause a gas explosion.

Also, I've had a NiMH battery short in my pocket from touching spare change, and It got hot enough to burn me.

--
SRSLY.
Re:His own fault... by Cramer · 2006-09-24 09:11 · Score: 1

Actually, I've seen more than a few lead acid batteries "pop". Less than a half dozen have actually exploded. See, they generate HYDROGEN GAS when charged, so they can explode if they aren't vented properly. The battery in my bug has a vent hose to get the gas away from the electrical systems and engine. Most of the time, internal shorts boil the acid which causes them to pop. I have two cracked "high rate" sealed lead acid batteries from (desktop) UPSes in a bag at work :-)

I saw the after effects of an Exide UPS battery EXPLOSION several years ago at BTI (phone company) -- building UPS, it's the size of a small room. I'd hate to have been *in* the electrical room when that battery failed... it smelled like someone fired a cannon in there, and from my desk some distance away, that's exactly what it sounded like.
Re:His own fault... by Cramer · 2006-09-24 09:17 · Score: 1

Simple engineering economics... they want to make the batteries as cheaply and quickly as possible. That means quality and quality control go out the window.
Re:His own fault... by Cramer · 2006-09-24 09:22 · Score: 1

I guess you've not seen the latest run of Dell laptops... their "docking station" is a USB dongle. Dammit, that's not a dock! A dock is something you plug the laptop into, not the other way around.
Re:His own fault... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 09:25 · Score: 0

I'll joke. here.
Re:His own fault... by Reaperducer · 2006-09-24 09:54 · Score: 0, Troll

It's an Apple. You only have to connect the monitor. The keyboard and mouse are wireless. And the monitor port is conveniently located on the side, unlike many crappy Wintel laptops which have all the ports in the back where you can't see them or plug them in easily.

I guess that's why they have docks -- to make up for poor design.

Sounds like the Dell's aren't suited for business use if you have to buy so much extra equipment for all of your employees to make up for design flaws.

--
-- I'm old enough to have lived through six different meanings of the word "hacker."
Re:His own fault... by Trogre · 2006-09-24 10:57 · Score: 2, Funny

Yes I can see the message now.

"
Fire - exclamation mark - fire - exclamation mark - help me - exclamation mark. 123 Cavendon Road. Looking forward to hearing from you. Yours truly, Alan Cox
"

--
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
Re:His own fault... by just_another_sean · 2006-09-24 11:23 · Score: 1

But mind you, check what kind of batteries it uses first.

--
Creationist Textbook Stickers Declared Unconstitutional by CowboyNeal
Re:His own fault... by dougmc · 2006-09-24 11:26 · Score: 1

Also, I've had a NiMH battery short in my pocket from touching spare change, and It got hot enough to burn me.
I've had this happen a few times myself -- usually due to my keychain shorting it out.

But the keychain never makes a very good connection, so it's not a complete short. Some creative hammering on the battery itself could probably make a much more effective short circuit. But either way, it just gets hot -- it doesn't generally catch fire.
Re:His own fault... by Achromatic1978 · 2006-09-24 11:42 · Score: 1

Wow, what a troll.
It's an Apple. You only have to connect the monitor. The keyboard and mouse are wireless.

Yeah, because we all know no other manufacturer ships a laptop with integrated Bluetooth support... wait, what's this, My work Dell, and my home Asus... why, there's this glowing bluelight about a strange circle-and-squiggly-line icon. Wow! Bluetooth! No wonder my wireless mouse works. (I prefer the laptop keyboard).
And the monitor port is conveniently located on the side, unlike many crappy Wintel laptops which have all the ports in the back where you can't see them or plug them in easily.

Yeah, my crappy Wintel work laptop has DVI on the side. My crappy Wintel home laptop has DVI on the side. My crappy Wintel work laptop has audio, IR, 2 x USB and PC Card on the side. My crappy Wintel home laptop has audio, HDTV input, 2 USB ports, Firewire, PC Card, and SD / MMC slot, all on the side. <sarcasm>What useless turds, unlike an Apple.</sarcasm>
I guess that's why they have docks -- to make up for poor design.

Guess so. Or maybe not, considering my last paragraph. Perhaps its because the dock has a PCI Express video card in it. Or perhaps the extra DVI and VGA. Or perhaps the TV OUT. Or perhaps the SPDIF in and out. Or perhaps the parallel and serial ports (though these are pointless, almost, these days).
I like Apple design. But you're just a troll-fanboy of the highest order.
Re:His own fault... by sparkz · 2006-09-24 11:50 · Score: 1

My 1999 AJP (Kapok) laptop (http://steve-parker.org/ajp/ ... once listed on linux-on-laptops.org, but that domain seems to have expired and been hijacked) works constantly as my firewall. Granted, it is connected to the mains, but the juice goes through the laptop (and if the mains is cut, the battery does not last long at all). Still, it's never burned my hair.

--
Author, Shell Scripting : Expert Re
Re:His own fault... by mpcooke3 · 2006-09-24 11:56 · Score: 2, Funny

ha ha, funny and so original.

Anyway, I'm going to buy stronger card protectors just in case.
Re:His own fault... by edb · 2006-09-24 12:17 · Score: 1

>No way to dock them properly.

Ignorance of the facts is no excuse. Nonetheless:

http://www.bookendzdocks.com/

--
In theory, practice and theory are the same. In practice, they rarely are.
Re:His own fault... by Mateito · 2006-09-24 14:37 · Score: 1

There are some things you DO NOT trust after-market vendors for.
For everything else, there's Mastercard

--
Norman Cook's Ode to Sl
Re:His own fault... by Tertiacero · 2006-09-24 15:25 · Score: 1

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I do believe that Dell just recalled approx. 4 million laptops for explosive/flammable batteries.
Re:His own fault... by rtb61 · 2006-09-24 17:03 · Score: 1

I wonder if the corporate types would not be above slipping a few defectives in the generic batches to promote branded versions. Four times the price, means a hude leap in the profit margin.

--
Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
Re:His own fault... by linuxrocks123 · 2006-09-24 17:35 · Score: 1

> They even removed the "lpX on fire" error...

Aww, really? Dang :(

I didn't hear about that. Do you know when they removed it?

--
vi ~/.emacs # I'm probably going to Hell for this.
Re:His own fault... by WWWWolf · 2006-09-24 22:13 · Score: 2, Informative

I didn't hear about that. Do you know when they removed it?

Ooops! Looks like it still exists: drivers/char/lp.c: printk(KERN_INFO "lp%d on fire\n", minor);. And here I could have sworn it was removed at one point.

I knew for sure that it did exist all this time in USB printer code, though. drivers/usb/class/usblp.c: static const char *usblp_messages[] = { "ok", "out of paper", "off-line", "on fire" };

And actually, now that I'm grepping kernel source, looks like there is a kernel-level yes-i'm-on-fire message of some kind: arch/i386/kernel/cpu/mcheck/p5.c: printk(KERN_EMERG "CPU#%d: Possible thermal failure (CPU on fire ?).\n", smp_processor_id());

Still, I mourn the fact that libc5 had "not a typewriter" and glibc has "inappropriate ioctl for device"... GNU project produces mostly boring and to-the-point software =)
Re:His own fault... by RMH101 · 2006-09-25 00:51 · Score: 1

Crap. All businesses using laptops (with very few exceptions) will be using docks, so people can't sue them for RSI for using a laptop keyboard and pointer for 8 hours a day. That's what *makes* them business laptops: e.g. Dell Inspiron vs Lattitude line.
In today's climate, if you think businesses are going to fork out for 2x hardware per person plus 2x support costs per person, then you're plain wrong.
I can imagine the number of calls a helpdesk would get if users were expected to manually plug in all peripheral cables every morning, and then successfully get their machine working on the external monitor, and it's not pretty.
Re:His own fault... by commanderfoxtrot · 2006-09-25 00:56 · Score: 1

But that's a decent quality bit of kit. I have the MZR 50, and it's bombproof. Battery life is also exceptional, even now.

--
http://blog.grcm.net/
Re:His own fault... by GreyPoopon · 2006-09-25 02:48 · Score: 1

their "docking station" is a USB dongle.
Does this mean that the monitor has to be plugged in separately?

--
GreyPoopon
--
Why is it I can write insightful comments but can't come up with a clever signature?
Re:His own fault... by Cramer · 2006-09-25 06:53 · Score: 1

Yes. The monitor is plugged into the VGA port on the side of the laptop.
Re:His own fault... by dangitman · 2006-09-25 09:51 · Score: 1

All businesses using laptops (with very few exceptions) will be using docks,
WIll be? What does that mean? In the real world, they don't.
so people can't sue them for RSI for using a laptop keyboard and pointer for 8 hours a day.
That's utterly stupid. And why do you need a dock to do that? Just plug in a USB keyboard and mouse. Not any more difficult than using a dock. In fact, easier.
In today's climate, if you think businesses are going to fork out for 2x hardware per person plus 2x support costs per person, then you're plain wrong.
Why would they have to spend twice as much? A dock is going to be nearly as expensive - because you still have to buy the display and keyboard, plus a dock. CPUs are cheap compared to decent displays. Desktops don't cost as much as laptops, so it wouldn't be 2x even if they did buy two whole machines.
I can imagine the number of calls a helpdesk would get if users were expected to manually plug in all peripheral cables every morning, and then successfully get their machine working on the external monitor, and it's not pretty
What the hell are you talking about? Plug external display into an Apple laptop, and it just works. Plug in keyboard/mouse to USB. If this is hard, then your employees should not be going near computers. And if Windows machines are so hard to use with external monitors, that is not a compelling reason to use them. I've never seen anyone have such problems with an Apple. So they must make more sense in abusiness environment, by your own logic.

--
... and then they built the supercollider.
Re:His own fault... by brunascle · 2006-09-26 09:20 · Score: 1

I also very much like the is_computer_on() functioncall
hmmm... let me think for a moment...
int is_computer_on() { return 1; }

Then the insurance guy says... by __aaclcg7560 · 2006-09-23 18:31 · Score: 5, Funny

"What? Exploding laptop and you're running linux? Oh, we don't cover that."

Re:Then the insurance guy says... by Almost-Retired · 2006-09-23 19:21 · Score: 3, Interesting

"What? Exploding laptop and you're running linux? Oh, we don't cover that."

Sorry, but I believe HP has a trademark on that phrase, as I was so exquisitly told by the circuit city folks when I indicated that the HP5320dv I'd just bought would probably have linux on it in less than 48 hours. I picked up the warranty form and said, well, I just guess the lawyers will have to sort that out now won't we? It did get FC5 installed as soon as I could make backups to dvd's, and works great with FC5 on it except for the broadcom radio in it.

In any event, this, because its Alan Cox's machine, may well be the most famous blowup yet.

I don't know what type of battery is in my HP, but its been very well behaved so far. That knocking sound? Thats me, knocking on the wood of the tabletop here. :-)

--
Cheers, Gene
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 19:57 · Score: 0

I swear, tech support always try to pull the same kind of shit.

"Oh, you use a Mac? We can't help you with your problems."
"Wait! But I also own a Windows PC! For real!"
"Okay, fine then! I'll reset your Yahoo! DSL account password."

WTF? Why did you need me to have Windows for that?
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by jftitan · 2006-09-23 22:28 · Score: 1

HAHAHAHAH I had a similar conversations... but instead I went through the entire 'unsupported' list.

I called to subscribe to Cable internet. (I recently moved, on a risk, that bombed)

me : "Hi I want high-speed.... blah blah blah"
info given
cs : "Ok, I need to know kind of computer you are going to connect to the modem, desktop or laptop?"
me : "both"
cs : "ok, umm which one, desktop or laptop?"
me : "desktop AND a laptop through a router"
cs : "ok, what OS are you running on your desktop?"
me : "Linux Red Hat.."
cs : "I'm sorry, but we don't support Linux. any other OS?"
me : "Yeah, Unix..."
cs : "ummmmm.... (long pause), We don't support Unix either"
me : "Apple G4, OSX 10.4.."
cs : "Do you have Windows?"
me : "Yeah I'm looking out of one right now... oh... you mean Microsoft... yes I have one of those, WindowsXP SP2."
cs : "yes, great we can help you, I can schedule a installer for you for this we..."
me : "so the point of me telling you I'm connecting a router ment absolutely nothing to you?"
cs : "What kind of router?"
me : "Linksys"
cs : "which model?"
me : "DD-WRT v23 SP2"
cs : long pause.... *I hear alot of typing in the background* "I don't see us being able to support that kind of router"
me : "you don't support it at all, I do... why would you support........

OK I'm bored of typing again... but you get the point, I'm an asshole, and I could have played stupid and answered with the correct answers to make that long 25 minute call into a 3 or 4 minute call. Either way, its fun to through detailed answers based on open ended questions. (or at a inexperienced cs.)

--
"Don't Forget to Salt the Fries"
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 22:38 · Score: 0

There is special windows software to control level of charging level and the temperature of 2 sensors from battery.
You have an option to use tp_smapi under linux to have such functionality.
Even it's working fine, you won't have a support.
It's the same with fan control. You can stop your fan under linux and burn cpu. It's your own business.
That's why an insurance guy is right.
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by bigbadwlf · 2006-09-23 23:06 · Score: 1

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/genericDocument ?cc=us&docname=c00517832&lc=en&jumpid=reg_R1002_US EN

Also, the manufacturer's name is at the far right of the printed side of the battery (mine seems to be LG).
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by menkhaura · 2006-09-24 00:20 · Score: 1

Before my ZV5200 was stolen, I ran a 64 bit Linux on it, Broadcom radio included, with ndisrwrapper. The whole WiFi shebang was running quite flawlessly. If you're running 64 bit mode, you should get the 64 bit .dll.

--
Stupidity is an equal opportunity striker.
Fellow slashdotter Bill Dog
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by Almost-Retired · 2006-09-24 01:10 · Score: 1

Thanks, discharge proceedure started now.

--
Cheers, Gene
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by Almost-Retired · 2006-09-24 01:37 · Score: 1

I'm running 32 bit linux on it, with ndiswrapper, and thats working very well when setup by hand. NM is of course a joke.

--
Cheers, Gene
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by stevesliva · 2006-09-24 04:32 · Score: 1

Yeah, it sure was nice of Adelphia to send a guy over just to make sure that I installed their spyware on my windows partition. I probably could have saved him the trip by assuring him that I knew the "Alpha Bravo Charlie Delta Echo Foxtrot" necessary for efficient voice transmission of MAC addresses over the phone.

--
Who do you get to be an expert to tell you something's not obvious? The least insightful person you can find? -J Roberts
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by rcw-home · 2006-09-24 05:44 · Score: 1

I probably could have saved him the trip by assuring him that I knew the "Alpha Bravo Charlie Delta Echo Foxtrot" necessary for efficient voice transmission of MAC addresses over the phone.

Once I was fixing someone's Windows machine and saw that the DNS domain name was set to "sierratangotangolimanovember1.wa.home.com". I'm glad I wasn't drinking anything at that particular moment.
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by DeadChobi · 2006-09-24 09:05 · Score: 1

The Charter guy who came over to "install" my cable basically stopped in to bring me parts, call in about the MAC address of my modem, and to call in about my Digital reciever for cable. He didn't give me any shit about installing software, just made a couple of phone calls, replaced a cable when it was evident that it was split during shipping, then left.

--
SRSLY.
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by speculatrix · 2006-09-24 10:51 · Score: 1

I once had (at work) a Dell Inspiron 5000 whose hard drive (IBM travelstar) failed. It had a company maintenance contract on it, Dell utterly REFUSED to take any responsibility for it because it was dual-boot linux and Windows 2000, so I had to lie to them and say it had Windows 98 re-installed off the original disks before they would even talk to me; I then ran their diagnostics floppy (downloaded and installed to floppy via win2k) and it told me "the disk is f***d", at which point they agreed to sent a new drive.

The new drive worked a treat, and never even got Win2k installed on it, but I never told Dell ;-)
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by Achromatic1978 · 2006-09-24 11:56 · Score: 1

My cable provider used to be quite anally retentive about not supporting routers.
So I was all sly. Put a table near the cable port when the installer came up the driveway... played smart, but good... "Oh, I'll just connect it via this and such." On the other side of the room, in a drawer, was a wireless router ready to come out the minute I closed the door behind him.
Installer was a good enough guy... said "I should look at getting a wireless router. If you had one we could just have set it up now." I decided it wasn't a "test" to see if I was going to be all "unsupported".
"Well, actually, I do have one. Just over here."
It's great when they don't treat you like a clown.
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by LordWoody · 2006-09-24 13:09 · Score: 1

That document is not all inclusive of HP's problem although it is inclusive of what they will replace. We have a number of zd8000 laptops (not listed) one of which went up in flame and explosion last week (factory battery). HP claims that the batteries shiped with zd8000s are safe*, but the battery serial numbers match those of the recall. We are still 'in discussion' with them on the remander of our batteries including three factory replacements which also have matching serial numbers from the recall.

* HP claims that to have an unsafe battery both the laptop model and the battery serial have to be listed in the recall.

We also have zd7000 units with battery serial numbers that match, but zd7000's are not listed nor have we had one of those go up (yet!).

--
Never meddle in the affairs of dragons,
for you are crunchy and good with catsup.
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by Almost-Retired · 2006-09-24 13:37 · Score: 1

Chuckle, that, at the end of the day, is Dells problem, and if they want to be screwed by M$ on a daily basis, then I'd imagine a class action lawsuit might chnage their mind. Dell has a long history of promising linux support, and everytime Michael opens his nouth, he gets a call from BG and thats the end of that.

Thats just one of the reasons I'd never buy a Dell. I thought I was somewhat insulated from that since HP is involved to a certain extent with linux, but apparently they never told the sales dweebs at Circuit City. The service guys at CC are an entirely different kettle of fish, they seem to understand.

BTW, I went thru the battery ID thingy on my HP dv5120us, and that battery is not part of the recall.

--
Cheers, Gene
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by MaerD · 2006-09-24 14:44 · Score: 1

My Hp laptop with the broadcom wireless chipset in it works fine with FC if you use ndiswrapper. RHEL kernels on the other hand, tend to have issues with ndiswrapper.

For the record, it's a zd7xxx series, but it should be the same one. They tend to (over)use it in everything.

--
I put on my robe and wizard hat..
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-26 06:51 · Score: 0

WRONG! no-one should _ever_ run that pile of garbage. Use the reverse engineered bcm43xx driver included in 2.6.17+. It works quite nicely here on my zv5000 in 64-bit mode. http://bcm43xx.berlios.de/
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by Assassin+bug · 2006-09-26 16:27 · Score: 1

Gene, the following comment is totally off topic but the reply to your reply to a comment that I had made regarding Steven Hawking has expired (and your email is not public so I can't email you directly). Thanks for your comment and insight regarding your experiences with scientific adventures. Yes, I have been in grad. school 10 years and not because of a woman. Actually, I think my wife would really rather I be done with it since I've been in school for as long as she has known me. lol. Ten years isn't too odd when you consider that includes a master's degree and a doctoral degree during which time some small but meaningful discoveries have been made (e.g., new morphotype of a rare insect described, new fossil insect discoverd/described, new soybean virus strain discovered and being sequenced) and much has been learned. Oh, and when your 1-year old Seagate high-speed hard drive burns out because the read-head decides to do a cha-cha, and your IT guy tells you that "oh, I wasn't backing up that data drive", and your secondary backup is a year old -- that will set you back a little too. ;-)
Re:Then the insurance guy says... by Almost-Retired · 2006-09-26 22:27 · Score: 1

Ouch! I think I'd have wanted to strangle the IT guy for that lack of attention to detail. But, OTOH, amanda could have saved the day too. Go see http://www.amanda.org/, I do a small amount of support on their mailing list, the simpler stuff that I can answer. And I run it here at home. I also wrote some wrapper scripts for it that make sure the indices and configs in use that made that tape, are also on that tape, so a bare metal recovery can be done. And this is something that you can do if your machine has room for another large, but not fast drive. They last longer, seems like the 7200 rpm models are the best at that, the 5400's are too cheap.. Amanda can use a virtual tape, a directory on a hard drive, and I have a 200GB with 180GB of it setup as 21 virtual tapes here. So my 3 machines are fairly well covered since I also rsync the important stuff nightly before amanda runs. People who visit usually ask whats that blue cable strung overhead from the house to my little shop building. Its a piece of cat5, been hanging out in the weather now for 3 years. It runs to the box that runs my milling machine when I've got time to carve parts with it.

Anyway, hopefully reinventing what you lost won't take as long because you'll remember how you did it the first time. Good luck.

The Amost-Retired handle comes from my situation, I've retired now, I was the CE at WDTV, http://www.wdtv.com/, since 1984, but locally I'm regarded somewhat as a Grand Master, so I still get sent here and there to 'put out fires' because they know it will get done. But I'm also tiring of that scene since I'll be 72 next week. I haven't caught up on my fishing yet either, and I have it on good authority that God doesn't count the time you spend fishing against your alloted time here. :-) With good weather, I'll be on the water again today for a few hours. That might mean there won't be any real progress on a room remodeling we're in the middle of (honeydo's, you've heard of them), but that will either get done or I'll fall over (shrug). It would be a lot easier done, but there should be a law that says 2 packrats can't marry. We need to have a 3 month long yard sale, and goto the dump with what don't sell. Its amazing the amount of stuff 2 people can get attached to.

--
Cheers, Gene

Alan Cox... by in2mind · 2006-09-23 18:33 · Score: 2, Informative

Alan Cox (born 1968) is a programmer heavily involved in the development of the Linux kernel since its early days (1991). Whilst employed on the campus of University of Wales, Swansea, he installed a very early version of Linux on one of the machines belonging to the university computer society. This was one of the first Linux installations on a busy network, and revealed many bugs in the networking code. Cox fixed many of these bugs, and went on to rewrite much of the networking subsystem. He then became one of the main developers and maintainers of the whole kernel.

--
Wincopy

Re:Alan Cox... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 18:41 · Score: 2, Funny

This is Slashdot. We know who he is.
Re:Alan Cox... by phorm · 2006-09-23 18:59 · Score: 1, Redundant

Actually, not everyone does. See, this is a "news for nerds" site... which happens to include science-nerds, politico-nerds, book-nerds, game-nerds, anime-nerds and others.

If you're a linux-nerd, you might know it (I happen to fall in that category as well as a few others), but it's actually helpful for many to know who Mr. Cox is, especially since the exploding laptop might be of interest to nerds of other genre's (say, hardware-nerds or politico-nerds for the lawsuit area of things).

Whomever modded the grandparent redundant is a jerk...
Re:Alan Cox... by houghi · 2006-09-23 19:24 · Score: 1

Actually, not everyone does. See, this is a "news for nerds" site... which happens to include science-nerds, politico-nerds, book-nerds, game-nerds, anime-nerds and others.

It is the 'and others' that is of interest. Everybody is a nerd in some field. That would mean that no subject is off-topic.

Figure-scating nerds, golf-nerds, opera-nerds, they finaly have a place to post. HERE.

--
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
Re:Alan Cox... by ozmanjusri · 2006-09-23 19:42 · Score: 4, Funny

Just to continue the karma-whoring trend, I'll post a transcript of the actual conversation so you don't have to RTFA
Cox: What happen ?
Telsa: Somebody set up us the bomb.

Telsa: We get fire.
Cox: What !
Telsa: Main screen lit up.
Cox: It's you !!
MS: How are you gentlemen !!
MS: All your codebase are belong to us.

--
"I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
Re:Alan Cox... by Millenniumman · 2006-09-24 01:58 · Score: 2, Insightful

But everyone on /. does have the Wikipedia reflex for unknown things. Or is that just me?

--
Stupidity is like nuclear power, it can be used for good or evil. And you don't want to get any on you.
Re:Alan Cox... by generic-man · 2006-09-24 03:17 · Score: 1

Phew. For a minute there I thought something awful had happened to the former morning guy on WXDX/105.9 "The X" radio in Pittsburgh. How ever would Alan have checked his MySpace page when not debating politics with local alternative rock fans?

--
For more information, click here.
Re:Alan Cox... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 04:32 · Score: 0

You just violated the GNU Free Document License.
Re:Alan Cox... by in2mind · 2006-09-24 05:52 · Score: 0, Redundant

For everyone's sake the URL for the text posted is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Cox.

It is added here as slashdot doesnt allow editing comments!
May your soul rest in peace here on!

--
Wincopy
Re:Alan Cox... by RobertLTux · 2006-09-24 10:45 · Score: 1

umm i don't know about #randomyou but i would bet that 85% have day to day contact (to the point of print this out and hand to ..) with a person (of manager type) that doesn't even know what wikipedia is much less have a dive for it as a ref reflex

--
Any person using FTFY or editing my postings agrees to a US$50.00 charge

Maybe by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 18:34 · Score: 0

this is just MS's latest strategy to attack linux? ;) All new Vista-compatible Trusted Computing BIOSes that detect OS==Linux get the bomb switch flicked to on!

Re:Maybe by speculatrix · 2006-09-24 10:59 · Score: 1

All new Vista-compatible Trusted Computing BIOSes that detect OS==Linux get the bomb switch flicked to on!
It's simpler than that, Intel clearly have re-implemented the HCF halt and catch fire machine code instruction!
I think we need to campaign to have a BlueScreenOfDeath machine code instruction - this would allow Vista to be far less bloated since Microsoft wouldn't have to write large code libraries to perform the same task.

Clearly a problem with power managment and linux by dbx6 · 2006-09-23 18:35 · Score: 1, Funny

Yes, that's sarcasm.

Data Recover by Alien54 · 2006-09-23 18:36 · Score: 1

Now this would be worth it, to see just how good those data recover people are, if you ever really need to recover something from a fried laptop. Folks should chip in for the project.

--
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"

Re:Data Recover by Beryllium+Sphere(tm) · 2006-09-23 19:00 · Score: 4, Informative

They handle fire- and smoke-damaged equipment all the time.

At the risk of being arrested and taken to a home for the criminally obvious, don't breathe any of the smoke from an exploding battery. Some formulations burn into chemicals that you don't want anywhere near you, such as hydrofluoric acid. It's not that strong an acid but it's remarkably destructive to flesh. If you do get a whiff of smoke go to the emergency room even if you feel OK.
Re:Data Recover by the_doctor_23 · 2006-09-23 20:50 · Score: 1

It my be remarkably destructive to flesh, but I would worry more about the depletion of calcium ions from the bloodstream... hypocalcaemia can be very bad for your health (i.e. cardiac arrest).
HF is one of the few chemicals I would never touch.

--
"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" - Carl Sagan
Re:Data Recover by Weedhopper · 2006-09-24 00:19 · Score: 3, Informative

Yep. HF is straight up deadly. Eating away your flesh is the least of your worries when 3% covereage with .1M solution is enough to kill you in 48 hours. It's not a pleasant way to go, either.

I used to work with HF in my lab when I was a grad student. Let me tell you, you start to follow lab safety procedures REAL careful like.
Re:Data Recover by Splintax · 2006-09-24 00:44 · Score: 1

That depends on your definition of "strong". In a chemical sense, no, HF isn't very strong, as it's not a "strong" acid like HCl - it doesn't ionize completely like HCl does. However, I'd say that at the same concentration, HF can be far more damaging (and thus "strong" in the conventional sense) than any HCl solution.
Re:Data Recover by sjames · 2006-09-24 02:19 · Score: 1

And to make it worse, if you spill it you can never be absolutely sure you got it all washed off in time untill it's too late.
Re:Data Recover by Ruie · 2006-09-24 04:32 · Score: 1
hydrofluoric acid. It's not that strong an acid

Depends on your definition of "strong":
- It dissolves glass (HCl does not) (practical application - permanent markings on glass tubes)
- It dissolves gold
- It can be used to oxidize argon (inert gas)
The chemical notion of "weak" stems from a technical issue - the acid does not dissotiate much in water. In a way this is similar to oxygen - water would have been an acid except for a definition that involves water in the first place.
Re:Data Recover by Nutria · 2006-09-24 04:52 · Score: 1

It can be used to oxidize argon (inert gas)

How do you oxidize an inert gas?

--
"I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
Re:Data Recover by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 05:11 · Score: 0

With HF, stupid.
Re:Data Recover by DilbertLand · 2006-09-24 05:43 · Score: 2, Informative

Actually, if you have proper saftey procedures in place, there should be a tube of Ca-gluconate cream close by so you can apply it after you wash the exposed area. That will supply a nice source of Ca for any remaining HF. Of course that's just the 'band-aid' you use for the trip to the hospital. As previous posters have mentioned....you're not going to know if it was a lethal exposure until it's too late.
Re:Data Recover by Ruie · 2006-09-24 11:12 · Score: 1

How do you oxidize an inert gas?

The only thing special about inert gases is that their electron shells are full and so it takes a large amount of energy to take an electron away. However, that energy decreases with atom number and for argon is small enough that fluoride can do it.
In fact, the elements with almost complete shells (like O, Cl, F, etc) are even harder to oxidize, however they readily oxidize other elements and thus are not inert.
I might be wrong, but I seem to remember that someone managed to use HF in combination with nitric acid to oxidize oxygen (i.e. form a compound where oxygen was a positive ion).
Re:Data Recover by pimpimpim · 2006-09-24 11:45 · Score: 2, Interesting

I once bought a laptop that was advertised at the chemistry faculty of the uni, where I found out after buying that the owner actually passed away after an accident like this happened. The guy apparently didn't wear a labcoat, or stuff got into his pullover through his labcoat, his story was soon over after that :(

--
molmod.com - computing tips from a molecular modeling

It's not that surprising. by SynapseLapse · 2006-09-23 18:36 · Score: 1, Interesting

Most business that use laptops, will leave them plugged in and charging 24/7. The only thing that surprises me is that we don't have more cases of exploding laptops given the heat generated by a laptop under load and the constant charging of batteries. (Yes, I know, the batteries stop charging when they're full. But you lose a trickle of power here, recharge a few minutes later...)

Maybe this will convince more people to take the battery out of the computer unless they need it.

Re:It's not that surprising. by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 18:52 · Score: 3, Insightful

Maybe somebody will build a laptop that doesn't require you to "take the battery out of the computer unless they need it." I have a UPS battery backup for my desktop system, and I don't have to pull the battery out of it when I'm not expecting to need to use the battery. That would defeat the whole point of having the thing. I think a lot of people are using their laptops like that, it's their main computer and they like the fact that it has a battery too so they can survive without it plugged in for an hour or two.
Re:It's not that surprising. by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 19:28 · Score: 1, Informative

Umm....I think you need to read up on how modern batteries are recharged (and how power managment is done in a laptop). Leaving a laptop plugged in does not mean they are constantly being recharged. Recharging circuitry for modern battery chemistries requires much more sophistication than the old Ni-Cad approach (you can't just throw them on trickle and the circuitry won't be sitting there turning on and off keeping them at peak). I'm too lazy to search for links so I'll just submit AC...
Re:It's not that surprising. by walt-sjc · 2006-09-23 21:39 · Score: 1

I bet you don't have a Li-Ion battery in your UPS either. Totally different tech.
Re:It's not that surprising. by Ghost_3k · 2006-09-23 22:01 · Score: 1

As far as I know if you leave them plugged, laptops will not be charging 24/7 or every other minute. My Thinkpad at least, only starts charging when the battery is below 97%.
Re:It's not that surprising. by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 22:29 · Score: 0

yes, but if you special software for it.
It's comes with pre-build Windows and thinkpad.
But you have to install tp_smapi under linux.
Was it installed in that case? I don't think so.
Even it's been installed, does it work like it should? Nobody knows.
That's why you might loose your warranty.
Re:It's not that surprising. by C0vardeAn0nim0 · 2006-09-24 04:43 · Score: 1

notebook bateries are removable so you can replace it by a fully charged one while on the move.

imagine you're flying from USA to europe, you keep using the notebook. when the batery dies, just pop it off and put another one, fully charged.

UPSes are not portable, so no need to replace bateries.

--
What ? Me, worry ?
Re:It's not that surprising. by damium · 2006-09-24 05:39 · Score: 1

NiMH batteries AFAIK are trickle charged when full. This means that power is ALWAYS flowing into the battery but at such a low rate that 100% of it is wasted to the internal resistance of a fully charged battery. It's how a charging circuit knows when it battery is charged. Also note that NiMH batteries loose charge even when not under a load at a slow rate (30%/month). If you take the battery out when you don't need it and you don't need it for a month at a time then it will be (mostly) discharged when you do need it.

LI batteries have no natural discharge rate so they are not charged up to full unless their charge drops below a threshold. The loss rate of the charging/monitoring circuit is only 5%/month. A good reason to remove LI batteries when not in use is lifespan rather than safety. LI batteries last longer at lower temperatures and at partial charges. Recommended storage is at 40% charge and 0C (32F).
Re:It's not that surprising. by Cederic · 2006-09-24 09:12 · Score: 1

My laptop has been plugged in (with battery attached) for approximately two years now. In that time it's spent 0-4 hours unplugged on maybe a couple of dozen occasions, and once left the house for a week.

Earlier this year it was plugged in and running Windows for four months without a reboot.

Seems to me that this doesn't hurt it at all. Sorry.

Re:Epidemic? by threephaseboy · 2006-09-23 18:46 · Score: 3, Informative

Neither the MacBook or the iBook G4 have two latches on the screen, neither have audio jacks on the front, no apple notebook shipped with a 4 pin FireWire jack (on the front? are they serious??), etc.

--
.

slashdot-proof link by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 18:46 · Score: 0

http://zeniv.linux.org.uk.nyud.net:8090/~telsa/boo m/

Re:Epidemic? by DustyShadow · 2006-09-23 18:46 · Score: 5, Funny

Is that why there is a "Made for Windows XP" sticker on it?

If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive... by WoTG · 2006-09-23 18:57 · Score: 2, Informative

I got curious about how much better Lithium Ion batteries were than Nickel Metal Hydride. So, here are a few numbers I quickly grabbed from the Wikipedia.

Li-Ion:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_ion_battery
Energy/weight ~150 Wh/kg
Energy/size ~250 Wh/L

NiMH:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nickel_metal_hydride_ battery
Energy/weight 60-?? Wh/kg
Energy/size 100 Wh/L

My laptop gets a couple hours of battery life with Li-Ion. It looks like I'd get about 40% of that with NiMH -- not that appealing. I don't think we'll be turning back any time soon.

I just hope that the next generation of battery technolgy is inherently less likely to explode.

Laptop? by RKBA · 2006-09-23 18:58 · Score: 2, Insightful

Good thing no one actually puts Laptop computers in their lap.

--
9/11 Eyewitnesses to Explosive WTC Demolition 1 of 2

Re:Laptop? by Jeff+DeMaagd · 2006-09-23 19:29 · Score: 1

If you pay close attention, you probably won't find any documentation, or sales and marketing information for any of these calling them "laptops". They are very, very careful to not call them laptops. A lot of notebooks have air intakes in places off the center enough where clothing or skin would block them, which I think is almost malicious because they practically know that people will use them on their laps and block those intakes. Apple's notebooks don't have an intake at the bottom but those still run just as hot.

You'll probably find a warning hidden somewhere in the manual saying that they aren't designed to be used on laps or any other surface.
Re:Laptop? by OldManAndTheC++ · 2006-09-23 19:46 · Score: 5, Funny

they aren't designed to be used on laps or any other surface

Drat. Now I'll have to go shopping for a surface-less table. Perhaps "Klein Bottles-R-Us" has what I need...

--
Soylent Green is peoplicious!
Re:Laptop? by novus+ordo · 2006-09-23 21:55 · Score: 1

Cuz these days you get fried eggs and bacon...

--
"You're everywhere. You're omnivorous."
Re:Laptop? by wowbagger · 2006-09-24 03:18 · Score: 1

Drat. Now I'll have to go shopping for a surface-less table. Perhaps "Klein Bottles-R-Us" has what I need...

I think you got the company name wrong:

http://www.kleinbottle.com/

--
www.eFax.com are spammers
Re:Laptop? by stevesliva · 2006-09-24 04:59 · Score: 1

Good thing no one actually puts Laptop computers in their lap.
I'd be worried with them in my space station.

--
Who do you get to be an expert to tell you something's not obvious? The least insightful person you can find? -J Roberts
Re:Laptop? by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 06:19 · Score: 0

Silly old man.

Hang your laptop from four pieces of string, like everybody else. :-P
Re:Laptop? by Jason+Argo · 2006-09-24 11:39 · Score: 1

That's what I thought until I bought Freedom Furniture's "Laptop Table". Unfortunately it will throw laptops onto the floor, probably causing more damage than exploding batteries.

When I get the LCD replaced I'll take my chances with my nuts catching on fire -- there's no way I'm putting anything near Freedom's Laptop Table again.

--
Freedom Furniture Shattered My Laptop's LCD

Did Sony know about the batteries? by Juggler9 · 2006-09-23 19:00 · Score: 4, Interesting

Question: With all of the exploding batteries lately (Apple, Dell, Toshiba, IBM/Lenovo (possibly), etc. Have you seen any reports of Sony laptops exploding?

Does Sony "cherry-pick" the A-grade batteries for their own use and send the B-grade and lower ones to their clients?

If so, what kind of liability issues does that raise. Sony HAS done some questionable things in the past knowingly. ;)

--
Someday we'll all look back on this and plow into a parked car.

Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by Detritus · 2006-09-23 19:36 · Score: 1

It isn't just the batteries, there is a battery charge controller in the laptop. Improper charging can also cause a battery failure, as can physical abuse of the battery.

--
Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by bluephone · 2006-09-23 19:39 · Score: 3, Funny

"Sony HAS done some questionable things in the past knowingly. ;)"
Riiiiiiiight, sure they have. Do you expect me to believe a multibulliondollar international corporation would be so stupid as to do something as underhanded like distribute under-tested batteries or stealth-installer-rootkits on music CDs? Pfeh. Next thing you'll try and tell me Ford made exploding cars...

--
jX [ Make everything as simple as possible, but no simpler. - Einstein ]
Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by Kaenneth · 2006-09-23 23:53 · Score: 1

Wasn't there something about the PS/2 CPU being powerful enough to fall under weapon export restrictions?

Ahhh, here we are.

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a3f27852c0f.ht m
Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by Kaenneth · 2006-09-23 23:55 · Score: 3, Funny

I just realized, Searching for "export weapon restrictions" may not have been the best idea.

If anyone needs me, call the CIA's secret prison administrators.
Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by Megane · 2006-09-24 00:14 · Score: 1

Question: With all of the exploding batteries lately (Apple, Dell, Toshiba, IBM/Lenovo (possibly), etc. Have you seen any reports of Sony laptops exploding?
Yes. Back in August, a 5+ year old Sony Vaio caught fire at this year's US Go Congress, it was in the strong player (dan-level) room, and disrupted play for some time due to the need for evacuation from the fumes. Fortunately, at the time nobody was playing at that particular table when it went off.

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Re: Did Sony know about the batteries? by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 01:43 · Score: 2, Interesting

It won't be a surprise to me that Sony "cherry-pick" A-grade batteries for its own use.

If Sony battery only fails in one particular brand of computer (say Dell), we can still blame Dell engineers for failed charging circuit design. But, now, it is basically everyone who use Sony batteries (with exception to Sony itself). I can only draw one of the two conclusions: First, Sony "cherry-pick" A-grade batteries for its own use and they know the B-grade batteries can explode. That would be criminal. I don't think (and hope) they sink that low. Second, Sony engineers discovered that their batteries will work probably only if they "tweak" the charging circuit in some special way and fail (or reluctant) to release those recommendations to other manufacturers.

If that's the case, should that be classified as neligience or as prefectly okay commerical practice?
Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by fjf33 · 2006-09-24 04:25 · Score: 1

Part of the reason they explode is that Li batteries are so sensitive to the charging that the charging controller is part of the battery. Each one of the cells has its own (usually). This is REALLY dangerous technology if things are not being done carefully.
Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 05:04 · Score: 0

Wasn't there something about the PS/2 CPU

PS/2 is a "personal system / 2" from IBM, known mainly refered to as the particular type of keyboard jack
PS2 is the "PlayStation 2" from Sony.

And by the way Jimmy Dean makes sausage.
Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by evilviper · 2006-09-24 06:07 · Score: 1

Next thing you'll try and tell me Ford made exploding cars...

The Pinto was no more dangerous than other cars of the era. Frankly, I'd prefer my gas tank be in the very back of the car, where an explosion wouldn't harm the occupants in the front-half...

Ford's sin is giving competing car companies an issue that looked scary on camera, that they could hype beyond belief.

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Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by bluephone · 2006-09-24 07:36 · Score: 1

Actually, I was thinking about the pickup trucks that exploded when hit on the side, but thanks for reminding me about the Pinto. :)

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Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by Trogre · 2006-09-24 11:07 · Score: 1

It's possible. Or perhaps Sony just makes their laptops correctly so as to not put undue stress on their batteries.

I've had several PSUs die here, killing the host motherboards. In some cases investigation revealed that there was nothing wrong with the design of the PSUs, but the motherboards were wired not to use the 3.3V line, opting instead to use the 5V line and stepping it down on-board with regulators. This resulted in too much current being pulled down the 5V line, exceeding the PSU specs and blowing it, but not before sending a fatal surge to the MB/CPU.

Just a thought.

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"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
Re:Did Sony know about the batteries? by barzok · 2006-09-24 22:46 · Score: 1

Actually, I was thinking about the pickup trucks that exploded when hit on the side, but thanks for reminding me about the Pinto.
But it was GM trucks that exploded on side impact, not Ford. And Dateline Gatilsday couldn't even make their crash tests reproduce the problem, they had to rig the gas tanks with fireworks for the show.

Ford has had explosion problems with both the Pinto and the Crown Victoria, with the tanks in much closer proximity to occupants than on GM trucks.

I was worried for a sec... by Leomania · 2006-09-23 19:08 · Score: 0

I mean wow, what amazing bits of brainwave energy had found their way into some amazing folds of C code goodness that would become "OH MY GOD, DON'T TOUCH THAT SECTION OF DIVINE WISDOM!!!" that were moments away from being committed... but then I remembered, hey, it's Alan Cox. Silly me! He'll just re-code it tomorrow. Of course, it won't be quite the same bit of code, and the universe will be just a little bit the worse off for the odd different bit of code that is replaced... but still, for cryin' out loud, it's Alan freakin' Cox we're talkin' about here. How random could it all be?

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Re:I was worried for a sec... by mwanaheri · 2006-09-23 19:49 · Score: 5, Funny

I am worried. 'real fire'? How virtual must your reality be to shout 'real fire'?

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Re:I was worried for a sec... by Tim+C · 2006-09-24 23:52 · Score: 1

I know you're joking (and I do get it), but I imagine it's "real fire" as in "proper, honest-to-God fire call the fire brigade NOW!", rather than "Meh, I guess it's a fire, technically; chuck a glass of water on it will you?", like the time I set fire to some toast (long story, but a pint glass of water later and all was well)

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Beowulf Clusters by Greg+Lindahl · 2006-09-23 19:12 · Score: 2, Funny

Good thing we don't make Beowulf Clusters out of laptops, or then I could say...

Re:Beowulf Clusters by eclectro · 2006-09-23 22:57 · Score: 1

Good thing we don't make Beowulf Clusters out of laptops, or then I could say...

It's a bomb big enough to blow off your Beowulf?? oh..wait..cluster

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Re:Beowulf Clusters by TheOrquithVagrant · 2006-09-24 01:52 · Score: 1

"Someone set up us the cluster bomb."
Re:Beowulf Clusters by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 08:56 · Score: 0

Something like a Beowulf cluster of these would make a bare woooooooooooooooooooof sound when they went up

Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by junk · 2006-09-23 19:20 · Score: 4, Insightful

With the current trend in battery explosions for laptops, I wonder how long until all laptops are considered explosive devices and aren't allowed to be used on planes. Perhaps we should start using things that are more stable. Like radioactive material or internal combustion engines. Ooh! Or we could all get neat little hand cranks!

What am I going to do on my flight to Germany now?

Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by LiquidCoooled · 2006-09-23 20:52 · Score: 2, Funny

Instead of a hand crank, some kind of foot powered rig would be good for aircraft (like the old sweing machines).
It would also have the benfit of getting you active and would help to prevent a DVT on a long haul flight.

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liqbase :: faster than paper
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by walt-sjc · 2006-09-23 21:59 · Score: 1

It would not be reasonable for the FAA to ban Li-ion batteries in devices, that toses iPods, phones, cameras, portable DVD players, etc. in the modern world. It would kill air travel. Furthermore, I'm not sure you would want these things in checked baggage either (not that checking laptops and other expensive tech is an option anyway due to the massive mishandling / theft that occurs.)

I'm still waiting for airlines to install power sockets. I've flown hundreds of flights around the US on several airlines in the past several years and I have only found ONE plane that had power.
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by timecop · 2006-09-23 23:19 · Score: 1, Interesting

You think? They already banned toothpaste, nothing will stop them from doing this.

> I'm still waiting for airlines to install power sockets. I've flown hundreds of flights around the US on several airlines in the past several years and I have only found ONE plane that had power.

I just recently flew from Japan to Taiwan on China Airlines, Airbus A330 plane, and they had 110v power on each seat AND a lan socket (but i'm not sure if that was usable as I didn't have a cat5 cable with me). Boeing is behind times with their planes...
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by dangitman · 2006-09-24 00:13 · Score: 1

I am a crank, you insensitive clod!

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... and then they built the supercollider.
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by noidentity · 2006-09-24 01:07 · Score: 1

If I were going to fly on an airplane, I'd sure as hell not want any laptop batteries anywhere on the plane, either in the cabin or the cargo area.
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by l3v1 · 2006-09-24 01:39 · Score: 1

Well, good for you that you don't ever need laptops, don't ever travel for work or business issues, never visit conferences. For the rest of us, such opinions are not one we could even consider. It's not us who should drop our laptops, it's the freaking companies who'd better start not screwing us over with junk, for once.

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Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by sjames · 2006-09-24 02:12 · Score: 1

It would not be reasonable for the FAA to ban Li-ion batteries in devices, that toses iPods, phones, cameras, portable DVD players, etc. in the modern world. It would kill air travel.

So, by all means, ban such horrors as toothpaste, water, nail clippers (cue generic horror movie scream), and lip balm (OMG!!! Did somebody say LIP BOMB??!!!) but never in a million years the one thing that has an actual documented history of spewing out a largish fireball, toxic smoke, and bits of caustic flaming derbris all over the place even when the owner doesn't want it to!!! Let's not forget, it's a trivial exercise to make such a device go off on demand without substantially changing it's appearance visually or in an Xray.
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by tgd · 2006-09-24 06:36 · Score: 1

Somehow I doubt that someone's inability to use their laptop plugged in for a few hours would kill air travel. Thats just rediculous.

At worst, it would cost airlines a lot of money to retrofit ALL the seats (not just first/business) with power outlets. Voila! You want to use your laptop? Check the battery as deemed appropriate and plug the thing in. Suddenly you actually can make the whole flight, too, without the battery dying.
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by Nethead · 2006-09-24 06:55 · Score: 1

Salon's "Ask The Pilot" actually brings up this point in his current artilcle.

http://www.salon.com/tech/col/smith/2006/09/22/ask thepilot202/

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Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by walt-sjc · 2006-09-24 08:47 · Score: 1

You miss the point. Rather than just banning the BATTERIES, they would ban the DEVICE. If you ban the device, that seriously damages business travel since it's not feasable to check it due to the mishandling (breakage, theft, putting it on the wrong plane, etc.) Seriously, I've had REALLY bad luck with luggage. I have a less than 50% success rate with checked luggage. Most frequent is delays of at LEAST 24 hours, seconded by damage to very well packed items. I've had 3 bags in 5 years that I never saw again. Nothing goes in checked luggage that I care about or truely need upon arriving at my destination. Larger items that I need are shipped FedEx.

Furthermore, one option is to not allow the laptops on the airplane AT ALL since they could explode in the cargo hold too. That would be pretty devistating in the modern business world. It would sure fuck over my business travel, that's for sure.
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 11:38 · Score: 0

What am I going to do on my flight to Germany now?
Notice and then actually chat to pretty girls when they are sat next to you?!?

Oh wait this is slashdot.... nevermind... just use your palm pilot instead ;-)
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by albanac · 2006-09-24 21:38 · Score: 1

About a month ago, check the news regarding the great foiled 'terror plot' and the hand-luggage restrictions that were enacted after it.
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by Fouquet · 2006-09-25 02:16 · Score: 1

I'm still waiting for airlines to install power sockets. I've flown hundreds of flights around the US on several airlines in the past several years and I have only found ONE plane that had power.
American Airlines has power adapters (9v cig type) on almost all of their aircraft. I've personally used them on 767, 757, 737, and MD80 aircraft. They tend to be in only every 3rd row in coach, so you need to be aware of your seat assignment ahead of time. Websites like seatguru.com can help with that. Business and First have them in every seat.
Re:Wait 'til the FAA sees this... by Mex · 2006-09-25 10:43 · Score: 1

Have you not noticed that a few reputable airlines have already prohibited laptop batteries on their flights?

You can fly with the laptop, but you must not take the battery with you. You are limited to the plane's power sources.

Real source of "info" on Alan Cox by rsborg · 2006-09-23 19:21 · Score: 5, Informative

...Whilst employed on the campus of University of Wales...

Now where have I read that phrase before? *googles* oh yeah...

Dude, at least site the source of your data (and more complete information at that): wikipedia page for Alan Cox.

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Re:Real source of "info" on Alan Cox by in2mind · 2006-09-23 23:43 · Score: 0, Flamebait

Dude, at least site the source of your data (and more complete information at that): wikipedia page for Alan Cox.
Whats the big deal with you posting the wikipedia link? I didnt post it coz the wikipedia link was there in the story summary itself.What snippet I posted about Alan was for info only without any intention of appearing as if I wrote that. Dont unnecessarily colour things.& keep your dumb detective work to yourself.

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Wincopy
Re:Real source of "info" on Alan Cox by Hebbinator · 2006-09-24 02:30 · Score: 2, Informative

thats why people list sources... otherwise, "credit" for the writing/research is automatically subcribed to you. I understand that there is zero malicious intent, and that you dont actually get anything out of it, but thats what your teachers were talking about when they told you about plagiarism - repeating others work without credit.
Re:Real source of "info" on Alan Cox by Professor_UNIX · 2006-09-24 04:28 · Score: 3, Funny

thats what your teachers were talking about when they told you about plagiarism

For those that aren't aware, plagiarism is the practice of dishonestly claiming original authorship of material which one has not actually created, such as when a person incorporates material from someone else's work into his own work without attributing it. Within academia, plagiarism is seen as academic dishonesty, and is a serious and punishable academic offense.
Re:Real source of "info" on Alan Cox by Unknown_monkey · 2006-09-24 04:48 · Score: 1

Well, since you appear to have directly copied without giving credit to the original source, I think that you've infringed on the Wikipedia copyleft.
From the Wikipedia Copyrights section
"That is to say, Wikipedia content can be copied, modified, and redistributed so long as the new version grants the same freedoms to others and acknowledges the authors of the Wikipedia article used (a direct link back to the article satisfies our author credit requirement). "
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Copyrights
If someone read your post without reading the Wikipedia entry, they would have thought you educated and rather a wordsmith. But that was you taking credit for someone else's wordsmithing. You wouldn't take credit for the work of a metalsmith would you? No, because you know he'd track you down and quench a sword in you. But in this case you thought, "hah, no one reads the articles on slashdot, I'll just copy this" and Turnitin.com caught you.

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Re:Real source of "info" on Alan Cox by Trogre · 2006-09-24 11:37 · Score: 1

[Scotty voice] But how do we know he isn't the bugger who wrote it in the first place?

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"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
Re:Real source of "info" on Alan Cox by Jimithing+DMB · 2006-09-24 15:47 · Score: 1

I wish I had mod points. Very well done.
Re:Real source of "info" on Alan Cox by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 16:34 · Score: 0

You bastard! I wrote that explanation of plagarism years ago!
Re:Real source of "info" on Alan Cox by c4ffeine · 2006-09-25 11:49 · Score: 1

thats what your teachers were talking about when they told you about plagiarism

For those that aren't aware, plagiarism is the practice of dishonestly claiming original authorship of material which one has not actually created, such as when a person incorporates material from someone else's work into his own work without attributing it. Within academia, plagiarism is seen as academic dishonesty, and is a serious and punishable academic offense.

For those that aren't aware, plagiarism is the practice of dishonestly claiming original authorship of material which one has not actually created, such as when a person incorporates material from someone else's work into his own work without attributing it. Within academia, plagiarism is seen as academic dishonesty, and is a serious and punishable academic offense.

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"73% of quotes on the Internet are made up" -Ben Franklin

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by PeterBrett · 2006-09-23 19:24 · Score: 1

I just hope that the next generation of battery technolgy is inherently less likely to explode.

We can but hope. Batteries are devices that concentrate chemical energy in a form that can be easily (and quickly, for high current applications) released as useful work.

On the other hand, explosives are devices that concentrate chemical energy in a form that can be easily and quickly released as useful work.

Why do you think the control electronics are so important to a laptop battery? Because if you shortcircuit any laptop battery the only thing stopping it from detonating in a spectacular manner is the control electronics.

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Pirate Party UK

Phew, that was close by RevRigel · 2006-09-23 19:25 · Score: 2, Funny

Alan Cox is an important leader and resource in the Linux community. On behalf of all Linux users, I hope that, for the sake of our collective Cox, manufacturers can sort out these battery issues.

Re:Phew, that was close by Lissajous · 2006-09-23 20:22 · Score: 1

I hope that, for the sake of our collective Cox, manufacturers can sort out these battery issues.

Note to parent: please read postings out loud before hitting the send button. I just sprayed tea all over my keyboard!
Of course, if that were your intention - bravo, sir!
Re:Phew, that was close by Ryuu · 2006-09-23 23:27 · Score: 1

Well, if you use it in your lap...

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"Don't lose your mind trying to set it free..."

New weapons by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 19:27 · Score: 0

Clearly throwing chairs isn't at kernel devs isn't lethal enough and we're seeing attempts to 'fucking kill(tm)' kernel developers with exploding battery packs.

IBM Tech Support by spoonboy42 · 2006-09-23 19:30 · Score: 4, Funny

We regret to inform you, Mr. Cox, that since you were operating with an unsupported software configuration (i.e. Linux) we can not offer you support in regards to your issue (spontaneous incendiary explosion). Thank you for purchasing an IBM thinkpad.

Sincerely,
IBM Tech Support

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Andy Grove: "Not Much."

Re:IBM Tech Support by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 20:26 · Score: 0

AFAIK Linux is a supported configuration on IBM ThinkPads.
You can even buy a T60p with Linux...
Re:IBM Tech Support by Yonder+Way · 2006-09-24 01:16 · Score: 1

1) He was using a third party battery, not an IBM battery, which is what exploded.
2) The tech support rep gets paid by Lenovo, not IBM.
Re:IBM Tech Support by roger_and_out · 2006-09-25 05:52 · Score: 1

Whaddya think IBM themselves run on their own ThinkPads? Well, Linux, of course!

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Microsoft's fault or global warming? by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 19:32 · Score: 0

Looking at my own desktop from 2003, which has been working fine, I noticed during the summer that the fan didn't stop any more, and it still doesn't. In my world we can rule of brainwaves, so the question is what has changed?
1) Either the environment has got warmer,
2) There is a patch from Microsoft using more CPU, or
3) A virus in my computer (same as 2, different distributor)

So has anyone seen any investigation in these areas, maybe there are nothing wrong with the batteries, maybe the are just being used outside there specifications due to the "patch"?

Re:Microsoft's fault or global warming? by Mister+Transistor · 2006-09-23 19:59 · Score: 2, Informative

You forgot a very likely possibility:

4) Your computer is full of dust.

Every 6 months or so, I take the computers outside and blow out the "Ghost Turds". I have a fairly dusty house, and when they are full of "Dust Bunnies", I know by the fact that my temp-controlled fans kick up speed at inappropriate times.

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-- You are in a maze of little, twisty passages, all different... --
Re:Microsoft's fault or global warming? by Technician · 2006-09-23 19:59 · Score: 1

I noticed during the summer that the fan didn't stop any more, and it still doesn't.

Don't overlook the obvious. The CPU is too hot. Common causes, Lint in the heatsink, dried out oil causing slow fan RPM, bubbles formed in heatsink grease reducing coupling, Once overheated CPU now less effecient, or simular reduction of cooling or more heat generated items.

The MS patch is a good theory. I know my IBM laptop runs cooler after I loaded Ubuntu. CPU idle now can drop to under 2% instead of about 20%.

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The truth shall set you free!
Re:Microsoft's fault or global warming? by codepunk · 2006-09-24 01:15 · Score: 1

4. All of the above.

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Tinfoil hat time by ozmanjusri · 2006-09-23 19:33 · Score: 0, Redundant

A few seconds after the explosion, Steve Ballmer was seen leaving the building, sweating heavily, face blackened, muttering "I'm going to f***ing bury that guy, I have done it before, and I will do it again. I'm going to f***ing kill Cox."

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"I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."

Alternate headline by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 19:33 · Score: 0

"Cox burned by exploding laptop!"

Overlords by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 19:34 · Score: 0

I, for one, welcome our exploding-battery overlords.

Re:Overlords by lostguru · 2006-09-23 20:01 · Score: 1

to late the first post beat you to it

nice try though (who the hell started that shit in the first place)

i personally think that most of this is a mdeia over reaction. yes more laptops are exploding than did five years ago, yes more people have laptops and more people make laptops than did five years ago. anyone who has been through highschool chem (not that i have) should know that lithium is really exciting stuff and should be given due respect

oh well i right now im more annoyed at my laptop's mobo frying after we just replaced it.

to bad this isn't happening to anyone who deserves it *cough*bil gates*cough* it would be funny if a certain microsoft founder had his laptop blow up

--
Jayne: "These are stone killers, little man. They ain't cuddly like me."
98% of America's teens drink alcohol, smok
Re:Overlords by LiquidCoooled · 2006-09-23 21:02 · Score: 1

Even if it *did* happen to him, could you really see him blogging to the masses about it?
We might here some hearsay about it, but nothing 1st hand.

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liqbase :: faster than paper
Re:Overlords by MichaelSmith · 2006-09-23 22:20 · Score: 1

who the hell started that shit in the first place

Kent Brockman, obviously.

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http://michaelsmith.id.au

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 19:38 · Score: 0

Well, you can choose to make up your own definitions for batteries and explosives, but don't expect the technical folks here to accept them. Also you might want to check the definition for detonation before using it again - it's also a very specific term. http://dictionary.laborlawtalk.com/Detonation

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by Jeff+DeMaagd · 2006-09-23 19:39 · Score: 1

For one, keep in mind that it's not a laptop, it's a notebook. Laptop is an unfortunate consumer-ism which the makers don't really bother correcting that usage, they just bury a warning in the manual that it's not designed for use on laps.

The current standard notebooks have the power consumption of consumer desktops that were made a decade ago, so it's not hard to imagine that battery technology had to change to keep up with the power hungry notebooks. If you are willing to take a somewhat slower notebook, you can get one that's lighter and run for eight hours on LiON batteries.

Heh. by Square+Snow+Man · 2006-09-23 19:44 · Score: 5, Funny

Coming Soon Laptops On A Plane!

Re:Heh. by ^Case^ · 2006-09-23 21:29 · Score: 1

So soon we won't be able to bring liquids nor laptops onto planes. Thank god nobody has found a way to make books explode yet.
Re:Heh. by Detritus · 2006-09-23 22:17 · Score: 1

Nitrocellulose.

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Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
Re:Heh. by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 00:07 · Score: 0

Thank god nobody has found a way to make books explode yet.

Books? I'm much more worried about exploding clothing. I'll be damned if I'm gonna fly in an airline issued hospital gown.
Re:Heh. by dangitman · 2006-09-24 00:16 · Score: 1

Well there's that, but there's also the more widely available Stephen King. The goggles do nothing.

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... and then they built the supercollider.
Re:Heh. by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 00:45 · Score: 0

When Exploding Laptops Attack!

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by sethstorm · 2006-09-23 19:47 · Score: 1

Why do you think the control electronics are so important to a laptop battery? Because if you shortcircuit any laptop battery the only thing stopping it from detonating in a spectacular manner is the control electronics.

Apparently those control electronics werent so good in the first place, and the first thing that *should* be done on a 600 series is to get a good battery with it. Trusting the previous batteries on these things is a cointoss now.

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Exploding laptops not a computer flaw by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 19:51 · Score: 0

I read an article on NY Times about this, and the manufacturers have said that the problem lies in the battery making process. Impurities that get mixed into the paste inside the battery, causes a reaction because electrons are trying to pass through it, not around it. There are now opposing standards being drawn out that would compromise the amount of current that can be drained for saftey purposes. The article highlighted the difference in that power tools using li batteries have different manufacturing process as opposed to the laptop batteries. I'm not sure how successful that is but it seems like there has been alot less stories about fires caused by exploding drill batteries.

This is good news, everyone by YetAnotherLogin · 2006-09-23 19:56 · Score: 3, Funny

Great! Sounds like Alan Cox has finally added support for the RJE and EOI opcodes to the Linux kernel.

Re:This is good news, everyone by Craig+Milo+Rogers · 2006-09-24 05:26 · Score: 1

Actually, the ol' HCF opcode.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halt_and_Catch_Fire

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Craig Milo Rogers

"unexploded" batteries by D4C5CE · 2006-09-23 19:57 · Score: 4, Funny

I also took the other two unexploded battery cells out

Now that's one nice word they've come up with, to distinguish the two categories of battery found in laptops. ;-)

Re:"unexploded" batteries by Mister+Transistor · 2006-09-23 20:05 · Score: 1

It also describes Scotsmen who fail to detonate on impact...

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-- You are in a maze of little, twisty passages, all different... --
Re:"unexploded" batteries by MobileTatsu-NJG · 2006-09-23 21:45 · Score: 2, Funny

"Now that's one nice word they've come up with, to distinguish the two categories of battery found in laptops. ;-)"

When they fix this problem, laptop batteries will have a warning sticker that says 'inexplodable'.

--

"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
Re:"unexploded" batteries by noidentity · 2006-09-24 01:03 · Score: 3, Funny

It's a useful word, too:

FS: Two unexploded laptop batteries cheap!
Re:"unexploded" batteries by Kantana · 2006-09-24 21:36 · Score: 1

Actually, it's not a made-up word. It's used in the Explosive Ordinance Disposal (EOD - the military term for "Bomb Squad") business about - well - unexploded bombs, missiles etc - basically things that are likely to go "boom" at any moment, but hasn't yet. These things are called UXO's for short (UneXploded Objects). Now, I encountered these terms in the Norwegian Air-Force, but - what with the terms being english and all - I'm guessing they're used in the States as well.

In light of that, calling the remaining battery cells "unexploded" seems wholly appropriate.

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by imroy · 2006-09-23 20:04 · Score: 1

I just hope that the next generation of battery technolgy is inherently less likely to explode.

I'm not a chemist, but I don't think that's possible. The battery stores its energy in the chemical bonds of its components (electrolyte and possibly the electrodes?). Batteries with larger capacity in the same space == more reactive chemicals. These recent fires demonstrate just how much energy is locked up in these modern batteries.

HP did recall batteries long time ago... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 20:18 · Score: 0

I can not say much about Sony but HP did recall a lot of batteries 1.5 year ago.
Maybe Sony did it as well.

Alan probably bought a recalled one. :)

Also I heard that Dell knew about the problem but ignored it.

Grab the magic pixie dust! by professorfalcon · 2006-09-23 20:18 · Score: 1

Maybe he needs some self-healing pixie dust from IBM.

Alan Cox's Exploding Laptop? by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 20:20 · Score: 0

I'm guessing it was his laptop computer that was exploding, not his actual laptop.

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by zensonic · 2006-09-23 20:21 · Score: 1

I just hope that the next generation of battery technolgy is inherently less likely to explode.

Not going to happend. The majority of a battery is chemical substance that will release its stored energy if asked to do so. The only thing preventing these chemicals from releasing energy too fast is the onboard control logic in the battery and on the mainboard.

Throw in companies that tries to save a dime for each produced unit and are willing to sacrifice security for money and you get a deadly mix of ingrediences.

As for the future. Well, the user driven demand is for faster and faster notebooks and reduced costs..... No matter what chemical substance is used for batteries.

--
Thomas S. Iversen

Oh noes! It's the Machines War! by FFFish · 2006-09-23 20:22 · Score: 1

The sentient web-consciousness has detected us humans, and is trying to kill us!

Well, the geeks, anyway. Quit buggering with computers, you guys!

--

--
Don't like it? Respond with words, not karma.

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by SEE · 2006-09-23 20:24 · Score: 2, Interesting

For one, keep in mind that it's not a laptop, it's a notebook.

So it's roughly 8.5" x 11" (A4 for the metric world)? Because, you see, the term "notebook" was specifically inaugurated for the subclass of laptops the approximate size of -- get this -- a notebook. With the ones even smalled than that being "subnotebooks".

Laptop is an unfortunate consumer-ism

No, it's a manufacturer-coined name for the class of machine small enought to fit on the lap and powered by batteries, going back to the advertising for the Gavilan SC.

Maybe it was a screensaver? by 10Ghz · 2006-09-23 20:26 · Score: 1

Maybe there was no fire, maybe AC just had a really good screensaver running?

--
Lesbian Nazi Hookers Abducted by UFOs and Forced Into Weight Loss Programs - -all next week on Town Talk.

Brigade by Emperor+Cezar · 2006-09-23 20:28 · Score: 1

Who says brigade now a days?

Re:Brigade by stevelup · 2006-09-23 20:44 · Score: 3, Informative

Just about every single person living in the UK...
Re:Brigade by robzster1977 · 2006-09-23 22:21 · Score: 3, Insightful

Pretty much all of the UK. And since it appears that the UK started forming fire brigades just after the Great Fire Of London, that's probably where the name originates.

Besides, 'Fire Department'? What's that? 'Department of Fire'? Hey, sounds like a fantastic place to work! Legal arson! ;)
Re:Brigade by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 00:46 · Score: 0

The British. Who writes "now a days" when we all know it's one word?
Re:Brigade by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 09:53 · Score: 0

The American phrase for 'Just about every single person living in the UK' is "the fucking English."
Re:Brigade by eraserewind · 2006-09-24 11:38 · Score: 1

What about all the married people?
Re:Brigade by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 15:45 · Score: 0

but that's only because they're unaware that the UK contains England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

To IBMs defense by City+Jim+3000 · 2006-09-23 20:34 · Score: 1

From the article: "...with third-party batteries we bought separately"

Shame IBM for not having an "your cheap battery is imminent to asplode" sensor.

The Devil himself against us by QuantumFTL · 2006-09-23 20:40 · Score: 1

"Take that, Open Source!"

how long? by mennucc1 · 2006-09-23 21:19 · Score: 3, Interesting

If a battery is defective and may explode, how long would it take ? For example, suppose you buy one replacement lithium battery nowadays; and you use it for X months; may you say "I have used it for X months, it did not explode, so it is not defective" ? Or, otherwise, is it a defect that may show up in a random moment in the future? Does anyone here at /. know?

Community Fragility by AquaRichy · 2006-09-23 21:21 · Score: 1

I always wonder what will happen when certain luminaries or leaders in Open Source die. I wish I could branch time lines and compare the impact of a loss and a loss averted. I thought about that a lot when Rob Levin recently passed away. What effect would losing Greg KH, Andrew Morton, Linus Torvalds, Richard Stallman, , or even Alan Cox have? I know some of them are less active than they have been, but a few are symbols that give the rest of us direction. How durable is our community? Free Software, Open Source, Linux, can losing a few bring down the rest? I do not really want to know the answer to this yet, so I'll say I'm quite glad Alan was on the other side of the room.

Re:Community Fragility by MichaelSmith · 2006-09-23 22:27 · Score: 1

I always wonder what will happen when certain luminaries or leaders in Open Source die.

Its a serious problem, but possibly not for that reason. What happens if the estate of Alan Cox falls into the hands of his hypothetical evil lawyer brother who, realising that large chunks of the Linux kernel are in Alan's name, has a go at earning money from it.

I know that this can't happen the way the GPL is supposed to work, but I think it has to be considered as a risk that the GPL has never really been attacked by the original author (or inheritor) or the software itself.

What if the new owner finds a way to blackmail users of the kernel into paying for "their" copyrighted works? Should the developers of OSS think about assigning copyright to the FSF if/when they die?

--
http://michaelsmith.id.au
Re:Community Fragility by BitwizeGHC · 2006-09-23 23:23 · Score: 1

People make fun of him for stuff like this, but ESR has accounted for this possibility.

--
N4st0r, trixx0r h0bb1tz0rz! Th3y st0l3 0ur pr3c10uzz!
Re:Community Fragility by Burz · 2006-09-24 00:22 · Score: 1

The answer to those questions is: How attractive and accessible are OSS coders making their products to the next generation?

As an example: If Apache hasn't improved much in the last couple years, then I'd say they are in trouble. Their source code may be clean and nice, but getting hit with the experience of vi and httpd.conf is bound to scare-off budding sysadims and web coders; people who might otherwise take an interest in the innards of their web server given some time.
Re:Community Fragility by digitalhermit · 2006-09-24 00:51 · Score: 1

Im going to do something similar. When I'm no longer able to maintain it, I'm going to designate a few people to take over the maintenance of my vain and pretentious myspace page and my vanity site. I think Chuck Norris is a worth successor. I designate Linus Torvalds to take over my, "My adventure in installing RedHat on my Dell". I designate Andrea Arcangeli to maintain the link to the comments I posted on Slashdot about adding memory to my laptop. I designate Aishwarya Rai to maintain my fan club site. Maria Sharapova can make sure the picture with me holding a tennis racket is always available on the web. Thanks for the great idea, ESR!
Re:Community Fragility by vidarh · 2006-09-24 01:19 · Score: 1

This wouldn't be a problem, as the original author (or the authors estate) can't retroactively revoke a license unless the license itself allows that. That has nothing to do with GPL, and everything to do with copyright law.
Re:Community Fragility by nomadic · 2006-09-24 02:16 · Score: 1

People make fun of him for stuff like this, but ESR has accounted for this possibility.

It's a perfectly appropriate and responsible thing to do. Making fun of ESR I mean.

No worry by G3ckoG33k · 2006-09-23 21:25 · Score: 1

But he doesn't need to worry, it is already covered by Slashdot.

Re:wouldn't it be ironic by MobileTatsu-NJG · 2006-09-23 21:37 · Score: 1

"if he was masturbating and his cock also exploded?"

Not if he's a mobo-sexual.

--

"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

Caption Competition by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 21:44 · Score: 0

Alan receives Red Hot laptop after an unfortunate typo in the Red Hat purchasing department.

(Glad you're okay Alan)

Have there been any fatalities yet? by Erectile+Dysfunction · 2006-09-23 21:46 · Score: 2, Interesting

These defective batteries are exploding a lot now, and it would seem like being directly near one of these would be a source of serious injury or even death. If no one is mamed or killed by this, it will be out of sheer luck. Hopefully this will be a wakeup call to battery manufacturers that, you know, they have to be conservative with battery production. People barely tolerate cars with defects that emerge during accidents; they are not going to appreciate having laptops that are bombs, carried around by their kids and significant others.

At IBM we called them Stinkpads by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 21:50 · Score: 0

And we hated them. They broke often. Crappy Ugly Bricks.
One of the contractors bought a Vaio and brought it into work.
She told us "If you guys are good, I will let you use my Vaio for a bit."

Grrr... We should have stunk a Thinkpad in her Car trunk.
Here the fanactics cry 'IBM IS GREAT!!! >>>BOOOM!!!!!'

Re:At IBM we called them Stinkpads by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 01:43 · Score: 0

Vaio better than a Thinkpad, what the hell are you smoking?

Sony makes garbage. The Thinkpad line may not have been perfect but they are far better than most laptops I have used.

In this story, it looks like it was a substandard non-approved replacement battery that was at fault. Hardly an excuse to bash Thinkpads for.

Like, hey dude! You got one HOT De// by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 22:15 · Score: 0

Blimey! they don't make stuff like they used to

Re:Like, hey dude! You got one HOT De// by ivoras · 2006-09-24 01:56 · Score: 3, Insightful

Shouldn't all this exploding-laptop trend really lead to producing more durable cases for portable devices? Like, if a "laptop" really exploded like this while on someone's lap, the person could be seriously injured. If it [the laptop] had a harder casing, possibly made of titanium, the risk of injury would be much less.

--
-- Sig down
Re:Like, hey dude! You got one HOT De// by Takumi2501 · 2006-09-24 03:41 · Score: 1

I imagine that a laptop would get quite hot before exploding like that, especially if it's caused by a defective battery. You probably wouldn't be able to keep it on your lap before it exploded. Mind you, I could be wrong.

At any rate, I think that the more important thing to consider would be solving the problem that causes it to explode in the first place.

Just a thought. ;)

--
Sent from my computer.
Now GET OFF MY LAWN!
Re:Like, hey dude! You got one HOT De// by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 04:00 · Score: 3, Insightful

I think that would depend on which part would be made more durable. If you reinforced the entire casing then you might just make the explosion build up more pressure and potentially making it even more dangerous. It would probably be a good thing to reinforce the entire casing except the back so the explosion is aimed in the safest direction, like a shaped charge.
Re:Like, hey dude! You got one HOT De// by ivoras · 2006-09-24 04:54 · Score: 1

Mod parent insightful :)

(hmm, but wouldn't that injure the person in front of the laptop? Maybe something like a steel plate on the back of the laptop will be needed, so it doesn't shrapnel or melt.

--
-- Sig down
Re:Like, hey dude! You got one HOT De// by ari_j · 2006-09-24 06:27 · Score: 2, Informative

IANALY, but you are on an interesting track. Products liability law in many jurisdictions in the US imposes liability if the plaintiff can show, among other things, that there was a reasonable alternative design. That is, a design that would have prevented the injury could have been built at the time that the original product was built and still been reasonable, so far as its utility and cost go.

So, if someone does get injured by an exploding laptop and can show that a harder case would have been a reasonable price to pay for the added safety, he can probably sue and recover for his crotchal injuries.
Re:Like, hey dude! You got one HOT De// by WhiplashII · 2006-09-24 14:33 · Score: 1

A good way to handle this type of thing is with a mesh - the hot gasses escape, but they don't take any hot solids with them.

--
while (sig==sig) sig=!sig;

Must have been... by Planeflux · 2006-09-23 22:17 · Score: 1, Funny

An MS conspiracy. Next on the list: Linus Torvalds.

Re:The Devil himself against us... we knew that by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 22:42 · Score: 0

We have always known that.... see Devil ~AC

Re:Epidemic? by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 23:02 · Score: 0

Well it looks identical to my inspiron 710m on which I'm currently typing my post from so its a Dell.

Think I'ld better just double check my battery number again (insert standard lame NO CARRIER joke )

ya know why? by way2trivial · 2006-09-23 23:17 · Score: 2, Insightful

'cause the reputable merchants have to have enough margin the accept returns, and recalls, and make things right.

that's also the difference between the world of walmart, and the world of macys....

--
every day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random

Re:ya know why? by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-23 23:32 · Score: 0

There's markup and there's ripping someone off. They know you have no alternative because you need one specific form factor which is different from every other manufacturer's batteries. If it costs on average $36 per $4 battery sold to handle recalls and returns, then maybe you should improve the quality a little.
Re:ya know why? by dangitman · 2006-09-23 23:59 · Score: 1

A $4 lithium battery? Sorry, I think you are bullshitting us. How is it possible to make a lithium battery (to power a laptop, etc, not a AA battery) with protection circuit for that much?

--
... and then they built the supercollider.
Re:ya know why? by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 00:17 · Score: 2, Informative

I'm talking about digital camera batteries (in continuation of my previous comment). Those are LiIon batteries which replace the NB-1LH and NB-2LH. The original Canon batteries cost around $40, the off-brand replacements cost $4. If you take a closer look at the cellphone or laptop battery market, you will find the exact same situation. I just happened to know actual prices for digital camera batteries, so I used them as an example of the kind of markup which "reputable dealers" put on brand-name batteries.
Re:ya know why? by jridley · 2006-09-24 04:47 · Score: 1

I've not seen $4 camera batteries, but my Canon Rebel uses BP511 batteries. The original from Canon costs $70 (list, $45 street). The aftermarket ones I've been buying cost $12.50 (I've seen them for $8 but not from a place I trust and buy from often). The aftermarket ones work fine and last noticably longer per charge, and have held up as well over several years of life (this isn't my first camera or camcorder that took BP511s).

I've had a Canon and an aftermarket die (after many many charges they got to where they wouldn't hold a charge anymore. I took them both apart and found pretty much exactly the same things inside. A charge controller chip, and a polyswitch (self-resetting solid state current+temp breaker). The cells were both from major manufacturers, Sanyo and Panasonic, though I can't remember which was which.

There are probably some really crap units out there which should be avoided, but I think this shows that the OEM batteries are complete ripoffs. Heck, at the price difference it'd be worth buying an aftermarket one, tear it apart and make sure it has proper protection inside, then throw it away and buy another from the same maker, and you'd STILL be less than half the cost of the OEM battery.
Re:ya know why? by fbjon · 2006-09-24 06:05 · Score: 1

And besides that, if you have a good camera, you can charge the battery outside in a separate charger. AFAIK Li-ion batteries are in danger of exploding if charged improperly, not during normal usage.

--
True confidence comes not from realising you are as good as your peers, but that your peers are as bad as you are.
Re:ya know why? by ari_j · 2006-09-24 06:31 · Score: 1

Not to mention that the markup you pay is, in part, an act of buying insurance that the battery won't explode. It's not only less likely to explode, but also more likely to be recalled/repaired/replaced if an explosion danger exists.
Re:ya know why? by Reaperducer · 2006-09-24 09:31 · Score: 1

that's also the difference between the world of walmart, and the world of macys....

Sorry... you misspelled Marshall Field's . (People in Chicago get this joke.)
Sorry... you misspelled Foley's . (People in Houston get this one.)

--
-- I'm old enough to have lived through six different meanings of the word "hacker."
Re:ya know why? by Achromatic1978 · 2006-09-24 11:10 · Score: 1

That's crap. Well, it may not be crap... but while I own after-market batteries for my Canon DSLR they were around 50-60% of the Canon equivalent.
If you think I'm putting a $4 battery in a $4,000 camera body (or, in fact, two), you would be /stupid/. Batteries leak, etc. Canon batteries may not be perfect, and I'm not suggesting they are infallible - but at least they might recall faulty batteries, and in a worst case scenario, they might even countenance repair to the body (although in my case with aftermarkets, sure they wouldn't). Do you think someone who makes a $4 battery is going to do anything other than laugh at you and say "You get what you pay for"?
Re:ya know why? by kisielk · 2006-09-24 13:10 · Score: 1

I think this is BS. Sterlingtek, a popular merchant of after-market camera batteries and other stuff has great customer service. Their prices are also a fraction of that charged by the camera manufacturers. I know of hundreds of photographers who use their products. They are certainly "reputable" but still have much lower pricing than buying OEM.

IBM's New Laptop Hardware: Exploderometers by RazzleDazzle · 2006-09-23 23:38 · Score: 1

It will be a green LED bar just under the monitor that will fill up with green as you get closer to lift off. Of course it turns yellow then red when you get close to critical levels. With a nice loud Spaceballs-esque countdown to detonation narrator, that way everyone can evacuate from your vicinity prior to the climax. "Have a nice day." If you happen to see any orangutangs after exploding, run for cover.

--
ZERO ZERO ONE ZERO ONE ZERO ONE ONE! Just brushing up for my next big invention: Ethernet over Voice (EoV)

Unorginal battery by extract · 2006-09-23 23:42 · Score: 1

According to the article an unoriginal battery was used in the ThinkPad...sounds as if you can buy your batteries too cheap!

Then the slashdot guy says... by rvw · 2006-09-24 00:02 · Score: 0, Redundant

Then the slashdot guy says...

"What? Exploding laptop and you're running linux? Oh, we don't cover that."

Is his diary still in Welsh? by caluml · 2006-09-24 00:48 · Score: 2, Informative

Is his diary still in Welsh?
That's the silliest thing I ever knew. I used to read it, but now he's effectively cut it off for the non-Welsh speaking world.

--
Get your own free personal location tracker

Re:Is his diary still in Welsh? by caluml · 2006-09-24 00:55 · Score: 1

Yes.

--
Get your own free personal location tracker

Actually Dell is the market leader in this. by LuxMaker · 2006-09-24 00:58 · Score: 1

Dell got tired of being referred to as being Dull and figured a few exploding batteries were in order. The rest of the industry noticed, and decided to follow the trend. ;)

--
I regret that I only have one mod point to give per post.

Re:Epidemic? by Stonent1 · 2006-09-24 01:13 · Score: 1

Not likely. I was using Thinkpad 600's back nearly 7 years ago! Those things are 333MHz at best. Every week where I work, we're junking computers and laptops many times as fast as that. Someone out there, Dell, Lenovo, Apple, or whoever, please give this man a nice Core 2 Duo laptop (or Quad if you can get a hold of the chip)

Reason for blowup: Alan Cox is too powerfu by Mafia$oft · 2006-09-24 01:13 · Score: 1

Excessive AC power in his home...

SCNR

obligatory.. by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 01:31 · Score: 0

yes, but can i still run Vista..? If it ever did ...

You *could* use a vacuum cleaner . . . by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 01:45 · Score: 1, Informative

You *could* use a vacuum cleaner, instead of blowing dust all over the place. It may work better - using a high pressure air stream may end up packing dust further into the cooling system. With a vacuum, you can out most of the dust back out the way it went in. I use a vacuum to de-dust my laptops, and it hasn't caused a problem yet.

Welsh diary? - sounds like a welsh auto mechanic by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 02:06 · Score: 0

babble babble babble crankshaft babble babble babble differential babble babble ignition babble..

Assasination attempt? by Reservoir+Penguin · 2006-09-24 02:06 · Score: 1

This is just too suspicious, and frankly it has "Mossad" written all over it. Now, who could have ordered the elimination of one of the topmost leaders of the Free Software community?

--
US-UK-Israel: The real Axis of Evil

Re:Assasination attempt? by tehcyder · 2006-09-25 23:47 · Score: 1

frankly it has "Mossad" written all over it
Yeah, they've always had real serious issues with Linux users in Wales, lucky they haven't got any more pressing security concerns closer to home, eh?

--
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by basiles · 2006-09-24 02:07 · Score: 1

I just hope that the next generation of battery technolgy is inherently less likely to explode.

I tend to believe it is impossible, since the trend is to pack more energy in batteries (in J/kg -massic energy- or J/m^3 -energy density-. The more energy a stuff contains, the more it can explode (which is the failure when all the energy is released at once) IMHO (but I am not a chemist).

Hmmmm.... by supabeast! · 2006-09-24 02:20 · Score: 1

So Alan Cox's battery explodes... does anyone else think that this whole exploding battery thing is all a Microsoft plot to kill off the Linux kernel team?

Re:wouldn't it be ironic by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 02:22 · Score: 0

This by far the best example of irony ever posted on Slashdot!

Exploding Laptop by Zygamorph · 2006-09-24 02:27 · Score: 1

Sounds like that last kernal tweak was just a bit too "hot".

Interestingly enough my business partner was getting frequent BSODs on his Dell laptop. He called the service department and they recommended blowing out the fan ports to clear any accumulated dust. He did and hasn't had a BSOD since.

I know Linux tends to run cooler than Windows but I wouldn't be surprised if Alan Cox is running his hotter than most.

Re:Why I *don't* ! by Mister+Transistor · 2006-09-24 02:39 · Score: 1

Yes, I *could* but don't. I blow canned air (not so high a pressure as to break stuff) INTO the air vents in back so that as you said, the dust comes out the way it went in. Air pressure seems to get "into the cracks" better than vaccuum, and yes, I have a "toner vac" (tiny attachment) to get into the cracks.

Here's a test - take a crappy old 3" floppy drive full of dust and try sucking out the dust with a vaccuum cleaner, then try blowing it out with a can of air. Which one do you think is going to work better? Hint - it has to do with not getting a good seal with the vac hose vs. being able to direct canned air with pinpoint accuracy.

Oh, and taking the computers *outside* keeps dust from going everywhere, plus it gets you out of the house and into the sunshine, even if only for 5 minutes.

--
-- You are in a maze of little, twisty passages, all different... --

NiMH would be great for Thinkpad 600 by twitter · 2006-09-24 03:39 · Score: 1

The Thinkpad 600 was and still is a great machine but the battery has known issues. It was the best selling Thinkpad ever and deserved to be. The size, shape and weight are just about perfect and that lent to both it's usability and exceptional durability. The screen is beautifully bright and the keybord feels great. I have newer, faster and lighter Thinkpads but still enjoy the 600.

The only problem is the battery and I'd gladly trade it for NiMH or even NiCd. I got my laptop used, so the battery was dead. I replaced it with a new IBM battery, hoping in vain that the issues had been addressed. The battery was good for between two and four hours but it could only do it four or five times! Each time you used the battery, you suffered a noticable loss of battery life. In less than a year of careful and conservative use, that pack was down to a 10 minute life. No other Thinkpad I've owned ever acted like that. There are several websites dedicated to explaining this particular battery failing. NiMH or NiCd would be better at this point and in the future. When the cells that come with such a battery die, it's easy enough to cut open the pack and replace them yourself. If you put in standard sized holders with springs, you will never have to worry about not finding batteries again. The trade off of battery life, in this case, is worth it. Anything would be better than the five or ten minutes the explosion risk Li batteries are giving me now.

I bought my battery in 2004, so I think I'm in the clear for explosions but I'm going to check again.

--

Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.

laptops and terrorism? by fluffykitty1234 · 2006-09-24 03:47 · Score: 1

There have been a few reports now of exploding batteries and laptops. The question for Slashdot is, how difficult would it be make a laptop explode/catch fire at will. I.e. could a terrorist get on a plane with a laptop and some other supplies, and cause a fire/explosion midair?

Already ahead of you by Aexia · 2006-09-24 03:56 · Score: 1

Virgin airlines recently announced they're requiring people to remove certain batteries from laptops before boarding the plane.

Re:Already ahead of you by Animats · 2006-09-24 05:08 · Score: 1

The FAA has already banned bulk shipments of non-rechargeable lithium batteries by air on passenger-carrying aircraft. "RSPA and FAA, working with fire-safety experts at the FAA's Technical Center in Atlantic City, NJ, found that if a shipment of non-rechargeable lithium batteries caught fire in flight, current aircraft cargo fire-suppression systems would not be able to extinguish the fire. A single non-rechargeable lithium battery on fire within a cargo shipment would likely cause all surrounding batteries to catch fire and burn until the entire shipment is consumed."
Lithium-ion rechargeables are apparently less hazardous - they don't start a fire strong enough to ignite adjacent batteries. (Note that in Cox's laptop, one battery blew up, but the others did not ignite.)
For now, the FAA has decided not to ban laptops. They don't see such small fires as a serious threat to the aircraft. However, they're worried about future fuel cell powered devices.

Re:wouldn't it be ironic by Gleng · 2006-09-24 04:08 · Score: 4, Insightful

wouldn't it be ironic if he was masturbating and his cock also exploded?

No, Alanis, it would be a coincidence. It would be ironic if he was working on a battery status monitoring program when it exploded.

--
"Proudly Posting Without Reading The Article"

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by PeterBrett · 2006-09-24 04:18 · Score: 1

Well, you can choose to make up your own definitions for batteries and explosives, but don't expect the technical folks here to accept them. Also you might want to check the definition for detonation before using it again - it's also a very specific term.

The point I was trying to make (clearly unsuccessfully, for which I apologise) is that as battery technology continues to achieve greater and greater energy densities, the distinction between batteries and explosives becomes decreasingly well-defined.

--
Pirate Party UK

It reacts with calcium by squirrl811 · 2006-09-24 04:26 · Score: 1

I know someone who works in a glass factory that used hydrofloric to etch the glass. From what I understand it is colorless, tasteless, and odorless. It appears much like water and doesn't burn on your skin. However, it will seep down in until it hits the bone and then it reacts with the calcium. I have heard that the few who have had a drop of it on their skin and didn't immedaitely wash it off were in terrible pain (delayed a few hours after exposure for it to get to calcium.)

caucasian reversal by draxredd · 2006-09-24 04:42 · Score: 1

Alan Laptops exploding c*** ?

--
--- Back to the trees, back to the trees !

Nice kernel you've got here... by squizzz · 2006-09-24 04:43 · Score: 1

Developers, GPL(v3) your code or this may happen to you...! :)

For a second.. by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 04:47 · Score: 0

For a second I thought it read "Cox Exploding"

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by radarsat1 · 2006-09-24 05:02 · Score: 1

[quote]Because if you shortcircuit any laptop battery the only thing stopping it from detonating in a spectacular manner is the control electronics.[/quote]

sorta makes you rethink whether laptops should be allowed on flights, no?

Standardized Lithium cell sizes by rcw-home · 2006-09-24 05:14 · Score: 1

It doesn't.

The AA and AAA cell standards are for 1.5V, based on Alkaline cells. The only cell chemistries likely to spontaneously, erm, "vent with flame" are Lithium Ion or Lithium Polymer. You don't see those cells in AA or AAA form factors, and here's why: They have a voltage of 3.7V per cell. Putting a 3.7V cell in place of a 1.5V one is very likely to make your device go poof. Also, Lithium cells must be charged in a very controlled manner, with a number of protection circuits. For safety, these must be integrated along with the cells into the battery case before it is sold. In other words, each product's battery is a tailored design, not designed to interoperate with any other product.

It would be possible to make cells in a few standardized form factors with builtin protection circuitry (which would, in addition, have to handle being placed in series with other cells of varying charge status and age) but that form factor would need to be incompatible with the old dry cell standards to prevent accidents. Because of this circuitry, such cells would likely remain very expensive (in comparison with NiMH cells) and designers would not relish having to limit their products design to accomodate the standard sizes.

Technical explaination of battery problem by Animats · 2006-09-24 05:22 · Score: 1

Here's a moderately technical explaination of failure modes in lithium and lithium-ion batteries. There are unexpected hazards; for example, charging a lithium-ion battery at very low temperatures can cause damage which will later cause a fire.

Notice the line in the article "Ebay from where I bought the battery haven't replied to the information I sent them." He bought a battery on Ebay? From whom? Who made this battery? Did it have UL approval? They put up an article on the battery explosion and didn't say that. Not useful.

Re:Technical explaination of battery problem by evilviper · 2006-09-24 06:01 · Score: 1

Who made this battery? Did it have UL approval? They put up an article on the battery explosion and didn't say that. Not useful.

"we are not yet sure if the battery is genuine IBM. The remaining bits of the label I dug out of the remains seem to indicate it may be."

--
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
Re:Technical explaination of battery problem by chawly · 2006-09-24 20:42 · Score: 1

I saw this bit
"charging a lithium-ion battery at very low temperatures can cause damage which will later cause a fire"
and I though "it was wrong of me to charge my lap-top and cell-phone batteries in the 'fridge. Thank you for indicating my mistake. I was told that it would reduce charging time.

--
How many beans make five, anyhow ? ... Charles Walmsley

Either that, or get bits of titanium embedded in by voxel · 2006-09-24 05:37 · Score: 1

Either that, or get bits of titanium embedded in your legs and face...

Melted plastic please!, not hot shards of titanium.

--
Modesty is one of life's greatest attributes

more damn lithium ion crap by phr1 · 2006-09-24 05:39 · Score: 1

Whoever said NiMH would have 40% the capacity of lithium ion, do the math, that is way wrong. NiMH has very close to the same capacity as lithium ion for the same volume, though it does weigh more.

And for those saying use genuine IBM batteries: the cost of those is just ridiculous, like over $100 for a battery. That might be lost in the noise if you buy it with your latest $2000 high-end laptop, but this was apparently a Thinkpad 600, an old but (before the explosion) still serviceable machine with a 233 mhz Pentium MMX processor and PC100 memory (max capacity 256 meg, I think). You can buy them on Craigslist in the $150 range. Do you really want to pay $100+ to replace the battery? 3rd party batteries in the $50 range are a lot closer to tolerable.

Lithium ion batteries are just a bloody scam. I've been trying as hard as I can to stop using them in everything. I replaced by digital camera with an AA-powered model (Canon A530) that I put NiMH cells in. I got a Sandisk M260 portable audio player (powered by an AAA cell) instead of any player with internal lithium. I've been looking all over the place--unsuccessfully--for a cellular phone that I can run on AA or AAA cells. Yeah I know about the "emergency rechargers" that let you transfer some juice from an AA cell to the phone's lithium pack, but I don't want that, I want to throw away the lithium and run the phone on AA power all the time.

It's time to make laptops with standardized NiMH batteries that are interoperable between different brands of machines, instead of all these proprietary expensive packs. For lower powered devices like digicams, it's best to stick with AA's and AAA's for everything.

Re:more damn lithium ion crap by Mage+Powers · 2006-09-24 11:47 · Score: 1

4 AA's or 4 AAA's with a diode that drops the voltage around 0.6 volts (from 4.8 to 4.2)

Actually a friend of mine has an old ass TDMA phone that has 3 or 4 longer AAA's in it.

I replaced the battery pack of a 486 laptop with 12AA's which seems to work okay. Most nimh battery packs are built with cells that are bigger than AA, so I personally call them A cells.

The problem with standardizing battery packs is that limits the changability of the rest of the device, of course with lithium ions only lasting 3 years tops, standardization might not be a bad thing to pursue.

Ridiculous markup? by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 05:48 · Score: 0

Let's see, $150 for Dell's Lithium Battery for my Dell Latitude D610, vs. $29.99 from eBay. Hmmm... which one is more likely to explode? Which one is "overpriced?"

If one of the above batteries does explode, do you think you'd have a fart's chance in hell of hiring an attorney to get damages from the eBay vendor?

Frankly, if you eBay fanboys wouldn't promote reverse-engineered, low budget batteries from Chinese pirate manufacturers, Dell and others might sell their batteries for less money because demand would be higher. Instead, you idiots promote these Chinese pirates and WE pay the price by being banned from using our legitimate laptop batteries on airplanes.

Yes, that price difference might be ridiculous in your eyes, but an explosion as described above suddenly doesn't seem worth the $120 price difference, especially to me, a business traveller who travels every week and needs to have a working laptop at all times.

Instead, we have whiny piss ants like you who complain about the high cost of replacement batteries from legitimate manufacturers. As you've seen, quality control and engineering matter.

If I'm sitting on an airplane, and I find out you are using some $29.99 Chinese battery, I'm going to have your stupid ass thrown off the plane, or at the very least, have the airline attendant take your laptop and separate the battery from your stupid cheap ass fingers. You can then whine about the $150 replacement battery from Dell all you want while the rest of the airplane laughs at you for being cheap.

Re:Ridiculous markup? by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 06:08 · Score: 1, Insightful

sell their batteries for less money because demand would be higher

In Soviet Russia maybe. For a "business traveller" your lack of insight into market economy basics is appalling.

BTW, it is suspected that the recent wave of recalls was necessary due to Sony using thinner membranes to increase the capacity of their batteries. Unfortunately the thinner membranes are more easily pierced, resulting in short circuits and fires. Do you think the off-brand batteries use cheap cells or expensive "high capacity" Sony cells? Can you answer your question which one is more likely to explode, the Sony-made to-the-limit battery or the cheap aftermarket battery with standard cells?
Re:Ridiculous markup? by RMH101 · 2006-09-25 00:47 · Score: 1

You are a fucking idiot. Have a nice day pretending you can throw people off plains for making a choice in consumer electronics you don't agree with. Twat.

MOD PARENT UP by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 05:50 · Score: 0

Good point. I wish I had some mod points.

Lithium batteries. by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 06:13 · Score: 0

I am constantly amazed that safety standards organizations around the world have allowed the use of lithium batteries in consumer goods. Knowing the average consumer, this is just not safe. Lithium batteries should only be used by qualified professionals who understand the dangers involved.

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by evilviper · 2006-09-24 06:19 · Score: 1

So, here are a few numbers I quickly grabbed from the Wikipedia.

BAD /.er! Bad!

Try some real-world tests... Grab your newest LiIon laptop battery, and a bunch of rechargable NiMH batteries (ie. AAs).

Now, lay-out the NiMH batteries in an arrangement that would easily fit inside the LiIon plastic case. Then compare the V and mAH rating on the LiIon battery pack, to the voltage you'd get from wiring that many NiMH batteries in series, and the mAH rating on the batteries.

You'll find things are a lot closer than the Wikipedia numbers would indicate.

--
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by evilviper · 2006-09-24 06:31 · Score: 1

Batteries are devices that concentrate chemical energy in a form that can be easily (and quickly, for high current applications) released as useful work.

Laptops aren't high current applications, as they only draw some 30watts or so. High current is only desirable for fast-charging, and I think most people would be willing to wait 15 minutes longer...

Why do you think the control electronics are so important to a laptop battery?

Because all laptops these days use LiIon, which is so terribly unstable.

The highest current batteries are NiCD, and they need practically NO control circuitry, and are without a doubt the safest types of common rechargable batteries.

Claiming danger is inherent with high current or batteries in general, is utter nonsense.

--
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant

TP600? by andreyw · 2006-09-24 06:45 · Score: 1

Note that the TP600 laptops (I still have a 600X) were notorious for flaky batteries that would give up the ghost in a month or two (there were several IBM FRUs that worked okay, but a) hard to find b) probably worth their weight in gold), so the battery is most likely third party. That doesn't make me very happy :). The actual laptop is built like a tank... its probably 8 years old now, but the quality is amzing. It basically feels like new, although its obviously quite slow (PIII 500Mhz). It's perfect for a light Linux distro.

Exploding Laptops... by rune2 · 2006-09-24 06:52 · Score: 1

Duuude your getting a Dell! Oh wait...

you forgot to mention the huge stick ... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 07:17 · Score: 0

of USB memory.

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by Billly+Gates · 2006-09-24 08:07 · Score: 1

My laptop is perfect for the lap and never gets hot and is very light and compact.

The difference was I did research on chipsets and cpu's and tested them all out at the store. Yes, I have a slower centrino based on a 1.8 ghz p4 mobile but its quite snappy compared to my athlonXP and runs very cool and it supports linux very well.

I tested for heat at the store and it always stays cool to the touch. My compaq pressario is very small too which I liked and had th3 best keyboard.

So avoid the dual core cpu's and look fopr laptop vs notebooks with cool batteries? Yes they still can be bought.

--
http://saveie6.com/

At least if he had bought IBM..... by EmbeddedJanitor · 2006-09-24 08:26 · Score: 1

he'd have that owner satisfaction of knowing it was a Geniune IBM Fire (TM).

--
Engineering is the art of compromise.

What about fires per litre/kg? by EmbeddedJanitor · 2006-09-24 08:31 · Score: 1

Seriously though, this trend is likely to not improve. Vista etc is going to chew harder on batteries, meaning that designers will try do more and more extreme things with batteries to get hours.

How about going the other way? How about designing software and hardware that uses less power and can operate with NiMH?

--
Engineering is the art of compromise.

Re:What about fires per litre/kg? by DeadChobi · 2006-09-24 09:32 · Score: 1

Hell, as a desktop user I'd appreciate that kind of attention being paid. Electricity isn't cheap you know.

--
SRSLY.

This is amazing by Plutonite · 2006-09-24 09:35 · Score: 1

I didn't know there was a website for exploding laptops! So many people have had their balls fried, it's just shocking. I mean, this is art, man. People on the tubes are documenting how other people became sterile - I'm lost for words.

On a sidenote, from TFA:

firemen and sirens and paramedics (happily unneeded) and police and a man with a notebook asking questions for the fire report.

If I were Telsa, I'd be asking the police if they thought it was funny bringing that guy along. Come on..

Re:Epidemic? by zaphod_es · 2006-09-24 09:49 · Score: 1

There are a number of Linux distros that will happily run on hardware like that. Puppy and Damn Small Linux are two that spring to mind. Alan Cox is quite capable of getting very effective use out of an old Thinkpad. Maybe you could give him a replacement many times faster instead of junking them. Come to think of it, put me down for one too :)

Re:wouldn't it be ironic by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 10:18 · Score: 0

Isn't it ironic that Alanis' song contained no irony?

LiPoly is safer by iabervon · 2006-09-24 10:28 · Score: 1

The next generation batteries will be safer, because it's relatively complicated to extract the energy from them. In order to get energy out of lithium polymer batteries, you need electrolyte and carefully arranged electrodes. This makes them a lot harder to make, but also means they're less dangerous, because, if something goes wrong, it tends to make the battery stop doing anything. Of course, the energy density means that if you manage to ignite it, it'll explode, but it doesn't spontaneously ignite.

The reason lithium ion batteries are particularly hazardous is that its internal resistance goes down when it gets hotter, which means that, if it gets shorted, it heats up rapidly and at an accelerating pace until it ignites and explodes. If you short a lithium polymer battery, it heats up until it fails, and then stops producing current and doesn't heat up further; you need an external source of energy to detonate them.

Essentially, the next generation of batteries is more explosive, but the current generation has a built-in detonator, which the next generation doesn't have. Of course, if you short a lithium polymer battery, it'll probably vaporize the thing that shorted it, heat up enough to burn you, and then melt down into toxic sludge. But it's not going to explode into a tower of flame.

So some genius gets a battery off of ebay... by sh4na · 2006-09-24 10:40 · Score: 1

... and it goes bang under his nose. Well, duh!! Here's hoping that'll teach him to buy original components instead of cutting corners and getting any dodgy thing that happens to be available. OTOH, no need anymore, it's already blown :p

--
shana
......gone crazy, back soon, leave message

Does anybody else... by timboc007 · 2006-09-24 11:06 · Score: 1

...find it suspicious/alarming that a "man with a notebook" showed up in response? Or was that a notepad (i.e. with accompanying pen/pencil).

Heh oldskool one... by kosmosik · 2006-09-24 11:14 · Score: 1

I always tought that top-notch Linux developers use nice hardware. TP 600 is a nice machnie but it is way old. It is like 400Mhz P2 processor? I actually owned one... like 4 years ago.

Why he wasn't using some nice TP T60p or something like that?

Re:Heh oldskool one... by metal_might · 2006-09-25 01:28 · Score: 1

boss- what do you mean "nice hardware"? and what do you mean "old"?
linuxmaniacs belly-out their frenzy claiming that linux runs even on old machines, whilst "M$" is resources hungry?!?!
don't know what torvalds thought or thinks now, but we ignorant dumb desktop users always perceive linux is here to "replace" windows and linuxmaniacs always perceive windows-users as "opponents".
i think /.ters have to get a maturity that both OSs have their own +s and -s and use whatever is best for the need, instead of battling and warring, while "M$" and "the stallmans" silently make their bucks. heck - open source / free software - whatever you call it - you can't get them without spending money!
let's grow up.
SS

Re:wouldn't it be ironic by Trogre · 2006-09-24 11:41 · Score: 1

Are you sure that receiving 10^4 spoons when one needs a knife isn't ironic?

--
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by cowbutt · 2006-09-24 12:31 · Score: 1

I just hope that the next generation of battery technolgy is inherently less likely to explode.

I'm not a chemist, but I don't think that's possible.

There are already tweaked Li-Ion battery chemistries that are comparable with Li-Ion for energy density, but which the manufacturer asserts is safer than plain Li-Ion, for example, Saphion.

'site' does not equal 'cite' by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 12:31 · Score: 0

- really, /.rs are grammar idiots, eh?

Re:wouldn't it be ironic by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 12:39 · Score: 0

It would be ironic if you were working in a knife factory.

Re:Clearly a problem with power managment and linu by Nakarti · 2006-09-24 14:57 · Score: 1

Ironically, once I got Kubuntu on it, my (removable-disk-less fanless) laptop was much cooler than with the OEM install of Windows XP Home, or the after-college install of Win XP Pro.
With Windows, or unfortunately the Knoppix that followed when my CD-ROM died, I needed a fan blowing on it to keep it comfortably cool.
Now it just stays cool unless compiling.

RTFSticker by thegnu · 2006-09-24 15:12 · Score: 1

My wild stab in the dark is that the IBM sticker on the bottom means it's a Thinkpad. Plus the fact that it's a fcuking thinkpad in shape, color, and IT'S A THINKPAD!

--
Please stop stalking me, bro.

Re:Boom gos the duynamite by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-24 16:25 · Score: 0

Perhaps if he made the switch to a proper, commercially available operating system like Microsoft's Windows XP, he would be able to take advantage of the wealth of software designed to aid in weight loss, packages that are exclusively designed to take advantage of the features of Windows.

Linux's "halt" manpage is also lacking... by Shag · 2006-09-24 16:58 · Score: 1

Various BSDish Unices point out specifically that the -n flag to "halt" (which prevents syncing before rebooting or halting) "can be used if a disk or the processor is on fire." Somehow, this vital piece of information was left out of Miquel's corresponding manpage on my Linux box.

--
Village idiot in some extremely smart villages.

Fake batteries by mks113 · 2006-09-24 17:01 · Score: 1

I'm having too much experience with fake batteries, particularly from ebay. I bought a Ericsson phone with 2 cheap batteries. They have Ericsson written on them, they have holograms on them etc etc. You plug it into the charger and it says "charging alien battery".

I bought a Sony camcorder battery off ebay. It came in a sealed plastic package with lots of Sony info on it. It looks identical to the one that came with the camera (except one tiny piece of plastic) -- all the stickers, patent #s etc. Plug it in the first time and the camera says "This camera can only be used with Sony Infolithium batteries". Eventually it charged and it does work, but I know it is fake.

Around here (Kenya) you can buy brand name parts for everything from cell-phones to cars -- all of which are fake. I gather that in some cases the fakes are better than the originals!

Re:If you were wondering if NiMH was competitive.. by PeterBrett · 2006-09-24 19:34 · Score: 1

The highest current batteries are NiCD, and they need practically NO control circuitry, and are without a doubt the safest types of common rechargable batteries.

Claiming danger is inherent with high current or batteries in general, is utter nonsense.

Are you sure? Some tests we've been doing here recently indicate that lead acid provides the best current supply capability.

Anyway, that's beside the point - NiCd batteries don't provide anything near the energy density that Li+ batteries do, hence their failure mode is less exciting. But they don't like being shortcircuited either.

--
Pirate Party UK

Irony lesson by TheJaff · 2006-09-24 21:23 · Score: 1

A guy with diabetes gets run over (killed) by a truck carrying sugar - poetic coincidence.

A guy with diabetes gets run over (killed) by a truck carrying insulin - irony.

--
28 days, 6 hours, 42 minutes and 12 seconds... that is when the world will end.

DANGER UXB by Morrigu · 2006-09-24 23:52 · Score: 1

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danger_UXB

Laptop batteries, exploding or not, aren't the same as defusing un-exploded German bombs in London during the Blitz, but hey, the acronym works. :)

--
"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into the area." - Major Mike Shearer, UK

blame by Anonymous Coward · 2006-09-25 00:38 · Score: 0

I blame Microsoft

This is what happens ... by NightStriker · 2006-09-25 01:08 · Score: 1

... when people fall asleep in circuits class. They design circuits that blow up.

Then again, some of my circuits blew up even if I payed attention in class. Gotta watch out for those polarized capacitors!

Alan Cox's exploding laptop by Cervantes · 2006-09-25 04:49 · Score: 1

Funny how someone can misread this two different ways.

First, I skimmed it, and thought someone had snuck a pr0n story through. (Cox...laptop... exploding)

Then, I noticed the particular use of the apostrophe, and figured Cox had has enough Linux and was blowing up his laptop. (Alan Cox is exploding laptop)

Either way, I RTFA and it was a letdown. Though the pix were still cool. Fire is our friend. That's what my friend Ralph says.

--
If I knew the wedgies I gave you back in 6th grade would have resulted in this . . . I might have taken a moments pause.

At the risk of enraging the Apple Zealot Brigade: by Medievalist · 2006-09-25 05:02 · Score: 1

If Apple laptops are not "business machines," then why is it so common to see them being used for business?

It's not particularly common, as I would use that term. I can go for months or years without ever seeing an Apple product being used in a profit-generating context; it would be impossible for me to avoid seeing an NCR or IBM-PC-type product in business use over the same time period.

What quality are you referring to that makes them not suitable for business?

ROI (Return On Investment). Except in particular niche businesses there are cheaper solutions than Apple, so using Apple is less cost effective than other means, and a well-run business will restrict use of Apples to those niches where it provides good ROI. Most businesses have no such niches, of course. Perhaps you enjoy such a niche yourself; if so, your experience is not representative of the norm, as any examination of Apple's product sales will show.

"Le mieux est l'ennemi du bien."

Re:At the risk of enraging the Apple Zealot Brigad by dangitman · 2006-09-25 09:56 · Score: 1

It's not particularly common, as I would use that term. I can go for months or years without ever seeing an Apple product being used in a profit-generating context

You must work with a very limited range of businesses, then.

ROI (Return On Investment). Except in particular niche businesses there are cheaper solutions than Apple, so using Apple is less cost effective than other means,

Only if you don't count the increased support costs and decreased productivity of using Windows. Apples have generally be found to have a better ROI in those few studies that have been conducted. You also ignore businesses like publishing, graphics, video, and music.

Perhaps you enjoy such a niche yourself; if so, your experience is not representative of the norm, as any examination of Apple's product sales will show.

Well, I see them in all kinds of businesses - from your general office worker, through education, and in specialist roles.

--
... and then they built the supercollider.

Re:At the risk of enraging the Apple Zealot Brigad by tehcyder · 2006-09-25 23:15 · Score: 1

You must work with a very limited range of businesses, then[...] You also ignore businesses like publishing, graphics, video, and music.

You are overlooking the fact that even where the "creatives" may be using Macs, the sales, admin and support staff will still most likely be using PCs.

--
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it

I guess I pressed the button, huh. by Medievalist · 2006-09-26 08:25 · Score: 1

We must have a different definition of the word "business". I call places that sell things businesses - you know, like the places that sell hamburgers and toilet paper? I see computers in all those places. Every day. Almost never Macs, though... the PICK OS has better penetration than MACos. So does IBM PC-DOS 3.0 for that matter. If, as you claim, it's more profitable to use Macs, how come nobody does?

Re:I guess I pressed the button, huh. by dangitman · 2006-09-26 09:54 · Score: 1

We must have a different definition of the word "business". I call places that sell things businesses - you know, like the places that sell hamburgers and toilet paper?
So, that is the only thing that qualifies as business? That's pretty insane. newsflash - there are many different types of business. Tell me, what's a "normal" business? That's impossible to define. Businesses do business. Education is as much a business as selling hamburgers. Publishing is a huge business, etc.
So does IBM PC-DOS 3.0 for that matter. If, as you claim, it's more profitable to use Macs, how come nobody does?
Most people are stupid. See for example, the popularity of Windows, despite its huge security flaws and usability issues. See also, the popularity of garbage TV shows, and nonsense diets.

--
... and then they built the supercollider.

Re:At the risk of enraging the Apple Zealot Brigad by dangitman · 2006-09-26 09:51 · Score: 1

You are overlooking the fact that even where the "creatives" may be using Macs, the sales, admin and support staff will still most likely be using PCs.

So what? How does that make Apples not "business machines"? I don't know anyone who doesn't use their Mac for work. Almost all Powerbooks are purchased at least partly for a business task. So, saying they are not capable of being used in business is absurd.

--
... and then they built the supercollider.

339 comments