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Machine Prints 3D Copies Of Itself

TaeKwonDood writes "Automated machines have been around for decades. They have basically been dumb devices that do simple assembly tasks. But RepRap takes that a step further because, instead of assembling pre-fabricated parts, it creates 3-D objects by printing them — squirting molten plastic in layers — and then building them up as the plastic solidifies. It works on coat hooks, door handles and now it can even make working copies ... of itself. The miracle of additive fabrication, coming soon to a robotic overlord near you."

341 comments

  1. I... by __aardcx5948 · · Score: 4, Funny

    ... for one, welcomes our new self-replicating copy machine overlods.

    1. Re:I... by jo42 · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Yeah, whatever. It might be able to 'print' itself, but it still needs a human brain and hands to assemble it and actually make it work. :-p

    2. Re:I... by JustOK · · Score: 1, Informative

      not anymore. The Creator has created and is now obsolete.

      --
      rewriting history since 2109
    3. Re:I... by njcoder · · Score: 1

      ... for one, welcomes our new self-replicating copy machine overlods. Just remember, if you can't outsmart them, get the stupid people to defeat them.
    4. Re:I... by Gerzel · · Score: 5, Informative

      It can't even print itself as it still requires non-printed parts.

    5. Re:I... by Brian+Gordon · · Score: 1

      ..at least, until a human makes it print a version of itself that automatically makes copies of itself. Interesting experiment, what could go wrong?

    6. Re:I... by Sebastien_Bailard · · Score: 5, Interesting
      Fussing that RepRap is not 'perfectly self-replicating' yet is an extremely common criticism. This pedantic but factually true statement glosses over the fact that it's a machine that cheaply and easily makes its own parts*, using inexpensive feedstock. And it can make other useful things. That's the important stuff, which your criticism fails to address.

      *Aside from common stuff from a hardware store and an electronics store.

      (Yes, I'm a RepRap developer, and yes, that's a cut-and-paste.)

    7. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it's ALIVE!!!!!

    8. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... for one, welcomes our new self-replicating copy machine overlods. Are you welcoming Slashdot?
    9. Re:I... by bestiarosa · · Score: 5, Funny

      You comment to this dupe article is is a dupe of my comment in the original article:

      http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=514462&cid=22998000

      I for one welcome our new self-replicating Slashdot article overlords!

      --
      :(){ :|:& };:
    10. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      What it does is print the plastic parts needed to make a copy of itself - you still need steel rods, motors, nuts and bolts, nichrome wire to make the heater core and a handful of small Anduino circuit boards. And of course you have to bolt it together yourself. Pretty soon it should be able to make its own circuit boards - but you'll still need to add electronic components.

      It's a significant step - but the slashdot blurb wildly over-sells it.

    11. Re:I... by MiniMike · · Score: 1

      Great idea, encourage it to build hands and a brain...

    12. Re:I... by LordLucless · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I love the idea of the RepRap as much as the next geek. But it's been posted on Slashdot at least three times that I can recall, and the headline or summary has always claimed, as this one does also, the factually incorrect statement that the "Machine Prints 3D Copies Of Itself". It doesn't. It's cool and all, and it's getting there, but it doesn't.

      --
      Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean there isn't an invisible demon about to eat your face
    13. Re:I... by Fuzzums · · Score: 4, Funny

      Maybe it can print an order form for those parts?

      --
      Privacy is terrorism.
    14. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Perhaps this criticism is extremely common because someone keeps claiming that RepRap is self replicating, when in fact it is not?

    15. Re:I... by empaler · · Score: 1

      I'm ready to send wave after wave of my own men at them.

    16. Re:I... by nmg196 · · Score: 1

      Yeah but it would only take a minor upgrade for the machine to be able to print a copy of itself which is BETTER than itself. Once it's done that, the machine can become infinitely powerful with no human intervention :)

    17. Re:I... by dintech · · Score: 4, Funny

      That's fine. I just don't want to see it mating with my toaster.

    18. Re:I... by Yvanhoe · · Score: 1

      the fact that it's a machine that cheaply and easily makes its own parts*, using inexpensive feedstock
      *Aside from common stuff from a hardware store and an electronics store.
      The problem being, of course, that this machine can easily be made out of stuff bought from a hardware store...
      --
      The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
    19. Re:I... by jbeaupre · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Kind of like those new fangled milling machines! Word is by 1870 they will be building parts for duplicate milling machines. Fussing that milling machines are not 'perfectly self-replicating' yet is an extremely common criticism. This pedantic but factually true statement glosses over the fact that it's a machine that cheaply and easily makes its own parts*, using inexpensive feedstock.

      Oh, and I forget if it was 3D Systems or Stratasys or whoever (don't remember, because it's not important) has built some of their machine's parts on existing rapid prototyping systems for years.

      --
      The world is made by those who show up for the job.
    20. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      First, I love the idea of the RepRap and am seriously thinking of building one.

      But really, claiming self-replication here is only slightly less laughable than someone claiming their inkjet printer is "self-replicating" because it can print the manual that comes in the box.

      What we need is *quantification* - numbers. For example, choose one of the following measures:
      * part count
      * part cost
      * part mass
      * part compexity (harder to measure, but this is what really counts)

      and then find the value of X in this statement:

      "RepRap is X% self-replicating by [measure]"

      My guess is that even by the most favorable measure (probably mass), the number is well under 50%, and by other measures it's under 10%.

      But progress will be made, the value of X will increase, and that's what matters. Publicizing new values of X will attract attention and pique interest. Making unquantified claims of "self-replication" mostly just invites the fussing you're complaining about.

    21. Re:I... by CowboyNealOption · · Score: 2, Funny

      I think the next generation solves the 100% replication problem by hacking into the internet, stealing someone's credit card, and ordering all the needed parts.

    22. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You suck!

    23. Re:I... by thekm · · Score: 1

      Aside from common stuff from a hardware store and an electronics store.

      Rreally?... the stepper motors and stepper motor controller chips from any average electronics store?

      I assume to build it, you'll have the plastic parts formed on the machine, the tubes and structure you could get from a good hardware store. The electronics you'll need to be sending in an order to someone that specifically has the electronics for computer motion control for steppers and controller chips, like HobbyCNC... then you'd just have the machine, and would still need to drive it and also get CAM software that will make the tool path for the driver software. Both non trivial, especially the CAM part. Does the RepRap team have the driver and CAM software made?...

    24. Re:I... by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      We will fight the overlods from behind every rock, tree, and crick!

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    25. Re:I... by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      Soggy toast sucks.

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    26. Re:I... by Samster33 · · Score: 1

      I for one welcome our new self-replicating Slashdot article overlords! Ok, that one made me laugh pretty hard. /salute
    27. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      hope I don't have any

    28. Re:I... by bestiarosa · · Score: 1

      Thank you.

      *bows*

      --
      :(){ :|:& };:
    29. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Technically every other 3D printer on earth can do the same thing. Have it print out the little logo for the company that makes it, then simply attach a 3D printer (which you can easily purchase online) to the logo, and voila!

      I think it's a really cool project, but the self-replicating thing seems is just publicity-mongering.

    30. Re:I... by fugue · · Score: 2, Interesting

      If it can really print itself, the cost of replication goes down to the cost of parts. This is starting to sound a lot like the GPL's provision of distribution for the cost of media. Are we about to see GPLed hardware?

      --
      "The biggest problem with communication is the illusion that it has taken place."
    31. Re:I... by ch-chuck · · Score: 1

      How can a mere mechanical machine with, at best, kind of AI, possibly create a copy BETTER than itself, without resorting to some kind of evolution using random variations and survival of the fittest? Would that be evolution by intelligent design (incremental improvements intentionally created)? That is the question....

      --
      try { do() || do_not(); } catch (JediException err) { yoda(err); }
    32. Re:I... by zacronos · · Score: 5, Funny

      Perhaps, in lieu of making copies of itself, it just dupes articles about itself on /.

    33. Re:I... by richardellisjr · · Score: 1

      I thought it only makes plastic parts, how it going to make the copper leads on a circuit board?

    34. Re:I... by thePowerOfGrayskull · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "The amazing thing about a dancing bear is not how well it dances, but that it dances at all. "

    35. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      in braille too - never the less...

    36. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Sebastien,

      Fussing that RepRap is not 'perfectly self-replicating' yet is an extremely common criticism. Stop repeatedly claiming it, and we'll stop calling you on it. It's not printing a 3D copy of itself, it's building some basic infrastructure which can make up a new instance of the object.

      Similarly flimsy reasoning allows me to argue that my workstation setup can "print copies of itself" because I have a printer that can make nice big Apple logos that look not unlike the one on the front of my iMac.

      it's a machine that cheaply and easily makes its own parts The human body cheaply and easily makes its own parts. Unless you're announcing in the most roundabout way possible that your wife had a baby, please give it up.

      Yes, I'm a RepRap developer Yes, making your incorrect claim repeatedly is not doing you any favours. The ability to build 3D models is cool and all - though far from new - and I applaud your excellent progress as amateur enthusiasts. But the claim that gets you headlines is completely overstating your project's abilities, and will stop people taking you seriously and understanding the actual value of your work.

      *Aside from common stuff from a hardware store and an electronics store. I have the keys to the universe in this box*.

      * Alas, the box is locked.
    37. Re:I... by b96miata · · Score: 1

      How about this - provide a picture on the site of two piles side by side, with a piece of tape in between them.

      One could be the parts the reprap makes itself.

      The other could be all the other parts that go into building a complete reprap.

      And reign in whoever had the bright idea to go around calling the machine self-replicating. If it's a useful, well-designed rapid prototyper that can make lots of useful things, tout that. These untrue claims make me think you're about to sell me a set of chef's knives that never need sharpening* next.

      *Aside from sharpening by common sharpening tools available at a kitchen store or hardware store.

    38. Re:I... by vjoel · · Score: 1

      You comment to this dupe article is is a dupe of my comment in the original article That depends on what the meaning of "is is" is is.
      --
      What part of `yes no` don't you understand?
    39. Re:I... by UnAmericanPunk · · Score: 1

      RepRap soon to rename itself "Skynet"

      --
      Question everything that you've accepted without thinking.
    40. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is is, in fact, a dupe of is.

    41. Re:I... by pac109 · · Score: 2, Informative
    42. Re:I... by onedotzero · · Score: 1

      No no, is is is (the original is). Is is is the duplicate is.

    43. Re:I... by BigJClark · · Score: 1, Funny


      Perhaps, in lieu of making copies of itself, it just dupes articles about itself on /.

      --

      Hi, I Boris. Hear fix bear, yes?
    44. Re:I... by acecamaro666 · · Score: 1

      The new overlords will always need us for when they get stuck on PC LOAD LETTER....

    45. Re:I... by Carnildo · · Score: 2, Informative

      Does the RepRap team have the driver and CAM software made?...


      Yes, they do. They're using a modified version of the open-source Art of Illusion 3D modelling software for this.
      --
      "They redundantly repeated themselves over and over again incessantly without end ad infinitum" -- ibid.
    46. Re:I... by Carnildo · · Score: 2, Informative

      Give it a different printhead, and it will be able to lay down patterns on a blank circuit board.

      --
      "They redundantly repeated themselves over and over again incessantly without end ad infinitum" -- ibid.
    47. Re:I... by iluvcapra · · Score: 1

      :(){ :|:& };:

      And I for one welcome our new self-replicating shell process overlords.

      --
      Don't blame me, I voted for Baltar.
    48. Re:I... by bestiarosa · · Score: 1

      Woah, you got it. Congratulations, mate - it is the first time someone does.

      --
      :(){ :|:& };:
    49. Re:I... by lilomar · · Score: 1

      I did a little research and found part count numbers from a year ago.

      Including fasteners - 14%
      Not including fasteners - 55%

      This was a year ago remember, I don't know what the numbers are today.

      linky

      --
      The creator of this post (Jacob Smith) hereby releases it, and all of his other posts, into the public domain.
    50. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How the f--- is this Informative??

    51. Re:I... by SmokeyTheBalrog · · Score: 1

      I have the keys to the universe in this box*.

      * Alas, the box is locked. Honestly, just break the box. Once you get your mits on the keys to the universe... you could surely get another box delivered.

    52. Re:I... by KutuluWare · · Score: 2, Funny

      If that's the case then it's been around for years and isn't really that big a deal. :x

    53. Re:I... by Locutus · · Score: 1

      how about:

      * custom required parts

      you'll get a 100% on this and this is what the big achievement is. After all, all the other parts are easy to purchase and many can be bought from any number of vendors.

      So what makes a DIY kit "Do"able is that you can get the parts cheaply and easily. RepRap just hit that milestone by getting the accuracy to the point where it can make those custom parts needed to make another RepRap. This really is a big deal. I'm sure somewhere there is a list of the cost of having those parts( all of the custom ones ) CNC'ed and my guess is that the price would probably double at the very least.

      If you look at their design, it is designed to make as much use of off-the-shelf parts as possible. Now, once someone builds one, they can start making parts for another and another, etc. It would be nice if they started pumping parts out and selling them cheap so we can all start building our own. Otherwise, this requires one expensive one with CNC'ed parts before friends can make parts for other friends.

      So start production fellas.

      LoB

      --
      "Anyone who stands out in the middle of a road looks like roadkill to me." --Linus
    54. Re:I... by greyhueofdoubt · · Score: 1

      >>Fussing that RepRap is not 'perfectly self-replicating' yet is an extremely common criticism.
      >>This pedantic but factually true statement glosses over the fact that it's a machine that cheaply
      >>and easily makes its own parts*, using inexpensive feedstock. And it can make other useful things.
      >>That's the important stuff, which your criticism fails to address.

      Then why is is that all I ever hear about are 'self-replicating' machines only to find out that you have to buy/make all the metal/electronics/etc? I work in a machine shop- every tool there is a self-replicating tool according to you definition. The lathes would of course require you to operate them, but the CNC mills are literally capable of building (non-cnc versions of) themselves.

      I find it disingenuous to call anything self-replicating or to say that it makes its own parts unless there is something an order of magnitude easier or cheaper about it then a cheapo Grizzly vertical mill.

      -b

      --
      No offense, but I've stopped responding to AC's.
    55. Re:I... by bit01 · · Score: 1

      "Machine Prints 3D Copies Of Itself". It doesn't.

      It does. It all depends on your definition of "environment". I'd like to see humans "print 3D copies of themselves" without a hugely complex ecosystem, let alone a highly specific physical environment, to back them up.

      In this case the RepRap'ers have a looser definition of ecosystem/environment than you do. They'd like a tighter definition just like you but in the meantime their machine is, loosely, reproducing. It's all good.

      ---

      Stop using tab characters in your code!

    56. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Except in this case, the bear is also reported on slashdot as being self-aware, just because it dances.

    57. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Similarly flimsy reasoning allows me to argue that my workstation setup can "print copies of itself" because I have a printer that can make nice big Apple logos that look not unlike the one on the front of my iMac.

      That's flimsy in more ways than you think - you equate RepRap's work, where it replicates most/all of the complex, expensive custom parts it requires with printing out a little bit of decoration.
      RepRap's output is functional, an apple logo is not.

      Also, a claim of "self-replication" does NOT also imply a claim of "self-assembly".

    58. Re:I... by Crashmarik · · Score: 1

      Ahh no. Unless the RepRap can etch a PCB.

    59. Re:I... by LordLucless · · Score: 1

      Well sure, if you want to lower the bar that far. But then, with that definition, my hammer is also a self-replicating machine. As long as it's environment happens to include me, my wallet and a hardware store.

      --
      Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean there isn't an invisible demon about to eat your face
    60. Re:I... by Locutus · · Score: 1

      it could probably lay down a mask so you can etch your own board. I see what you're saying in that the circuit boards are non-standard parts. Well, IMO, they should be using a 3 stepper motor board from Lin Systems or something like that instead of 3 stepper control boards and 3 driver boards and stop sensors. The Lin Engineering board does all that on one board along with having a bunch of digital IO.

      LoB

      --
      "Anyone who stands out in the middle of a road looks like roadkill to me." --Linus
    61. Re:I... by jlarocco · · Score: 1

      Nobody's saying it's not really cool. It's awesome that a 3D printer can be made for so cheap. It's cool enough that the inventors shouldn't need to make shit up to promote it.

      The phrase "self replicating machine" implies a machine who's output is an exact copy of itself. Not a machine that produces some parts, to which other parts are added, and then finally they all get assembled by a person. When you shove raw materials in one end of the "RepRap", and fully assembled, functional "RepRap"s pop out the other side, then you'll have a self replicating machine.

      Basically, if the "self replicating machine" requires human intervention, you're doing it wrong.

    62. Re:I... by JosKarith · · Score: 1

      "The human body cheaply and easily makes its own parts. Unless you're announcing in the most roundabout way possible that your wife had a baby"

      Cheaply...? I would guess you've never had to raise a child then.

      --
      'Don't worry' said the trees when they saw the axe coming, 'The handle is one of us.'
    63. Re:I... by AP31R0N · · Score: 1

      It's not pedantic. It's true. This machine is making PARTS, not working machines. The headline "copies of itself" is a LIE. It makes copies of its own parts. It's dishonesty used to drum up interest/clicks. This machine makes parts that are similar to it's own, that much is true. Until it can assemble them into another working machine, it is just making parts. It's an extruder. If a woman gave "birth" to a pile of organs that "could" be assembled into a person, she hasn't given birth to a person. Did it make the wires connecting to it? Did it connect the parts? Did it build the software that the child is using? If not, it's not a copy. It's a pile of parts. Your machine is not self replicating. Get over it and get back to work.

      Lie lie lie, but truth.

      I don't mean any disrespect, but your sister's a whore. I don't mean to be rude, but your breath is terrible. I don't want to hurt your feelings, but I've been cheating on you.

      --
      Utilizing the synergization of benchmark e-solutions to pre-workaround action items!
    64. Re:I... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I do!! Got photos?

    65. Re:I... by EkriirkE · · Score: 1

      As ./ has done the last 3 times this "new" thing was announced

      --
      from 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
      to 45 2F 6E 40 3C DF 10 71 4E 41 DF AA 25 7D 31 3F
  2. One step closer to the robot invasion by winterphoenix · · Score: 5, Funny

    While I appreciate the commercial benefit of this technology, the geek in me is a little more interested in the advancement toward the robot invasion. And by "interested" I meant "excited."

    --
    I have the heart of a child. I keep it in a jar
    1. Re:One step closer to the robot invasion by cpricejones · · Score: 2, Funny

      didn't you see stargate sg-1? we're not in the reality that has met the asgaard yet either ...

    2. Re:One step closer to the robot invasion by Dachannien · · Score: 1

      we're not in the reality that has met the asgaard yet either... How do you know? It'd obviously be one of the most well-protected secrets in the world.

      I mean, for all you know, the Asgard could beam me up ri
    3. Re:One step closer to the robot invasion by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      Are we in the reality where the Air Force is supporting a show about secret off world operations as a way to mask true off world operations?

      Or was that from before I walked around the horses?

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    4. Re:One step closer to the robot invasion by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You may find this site of interest: http://www.robotuprising.com/

    5. Re:One step closer to the robot invasion by ampmouse · · Score: 1

      Are we in the reality where the Air Force is supporting a show about secret off world operations as a way to mask true off world operations? No, we are in the reality where the Air Force is supporting a show about the Air Force supporting a show about secret off world operations.
  3. Gotta love the pic by BadAnalogyGuy · · Score: 0, Troll

    I ate the parent! I ate the child!

    Look at our large bellies!

  4. Dupe! by RMH101 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Haven't I heard this before?

    1. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative
    2. Re:Dupe! by Yvan256 · · Score: 5, Funny

      Great, now even the articles are making copies of themselves!

    3. Re:Dupe! by NoobixCube · · Score: 3, Informative

      It is a dupe, but when we saw it last, I think it was only theoretically capable of self replication. From the look of the summary, it may actually be capable of it, now. I haven't read the article yet. I came straight to the comments to see if it wasn't just me thinking I'd seen it before.

      --
      Admit it. You post strawman arguments as AC so you get modded Insightful for refuting them, rather than Troll
    4. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      Great, now even the articles are making copies of themselves!

    5. Re:Dupe! by jonaskoelker · · Score: 2, Insightful

      And I for one welcome our no longer just theoretically feasible new self-replicating plastic robot overlords. I'd like to remind them that as a trusted slashdot personality, I can be helpful in rounding up others to toil in their underground plastic caves.

    6. Re:Dupe! by lilomar · · Score: 3, Informative

      The RepRap blog announced replication several days ago. This is the first time that the machine has been capable of doing this.

      --
      The creator of this post (Jacob Smith) hereby releases it, and all of his other posts, into the public domain.
    7. Re:Dupe! by harry666t · · Score: 4, Funny

      | sed s/articles/posts/

      # the copy is never exact.

    8. Re:Dupe! by fifedrum · · Score: 2, Informative

      but it's still not duplicating the metal parts and the circuits required to drive the copy so it's not duplicating itself so much as printing off plastic casts of parts for a duplicate to use, significant difference between the two states.

      a) perfect working copy
      b) partial copy

      don't get me wrong, it's an awesome device and hell who couldn't use a rapid prototyper at home? I know I could!

    9. Re:Dupe! by renoX · · Score: 4, Informative

      The news here is that it has achieved 'self-replication' (between quotes because the replication is only done for the plastic parts).

      The article gives little detail beside the price of the parts: how much time is necessary for the self-replication? what are the skills needed for the assembly?

    10. Re:Dupe! by swatthatfly · · Score: 2, Funny

      I heard that before.

      --
      keyboard not found! press any key to continue...
    11. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Great now even the comments are making copies of themselves!

    12. Re:Dupe! by kcelery · · Score: 2, Funny

      The article itself makes its appearance in slashdot every six months.
      The RepRap itself actually does not replicate anything useful.
      It would attract more audience if the inventor does not insist the
      self replication feature. By replacing the ugly clear glue with hot
      flowing chocolate, the machine will be 100 times more welcomed. Then
      of course, cold air jet is needed to set the hot molten candy.

    13. Re:Dupe! by STFS · · Score: 2, Funny

      Great, now even the comments are making copies of themselves - and mutating... so eventually we must get intelligent... uhm... comments?!

      --
      You don't think enough... therefore you better not be!
    14. Re:Dupe! by mennucc1 · · Score: 1

      Great, now even the posts are making copies of themselves!

    15. Re:Dupe! by mennucc1 · · Score: 1

      I haven't read the article yet. Welcome to /.
    16. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Great, now even the artic1es are making copies of themselves!

    17. Re:Dupe! by BACPro · · Score: 2, Funny

      Great, now even the comments are making copies of themselves!

    18. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Great, now even the articles are making copies of themselves!

      [I was going for a mod redundant, but the stupid slash code won't let me post an exact copy.]

    19. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The old article was about self replication too. I don't see any difference between then and now other than the expected refinement.

      The parts this thing makes are pretty crappy if you ask me. Like a serious lack of precision. For example, the gears it makes look like shit.

    20. Re:Dupe! by FeepingCreature · · Score: 4, Funny

      Great, now even the jokes are making copies of themselves!

    21. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Great, noweven the arrrrrrticles are aking ccopies of themse

      Uh-oh

    22. Re:Dupe! by dintech · · Score: 1

      You're right. The first one usually doesn't contain posts about dupes.

    23. Re:Dupe! by Tanktalus · · Score: 2, Funny

      I think the proper meme response is, "You must not be new here."

    24. Re:Dupe! by lordofwhee · · Score: 1

      Great, now even the comments are making copies of themselves!.

    25. Re:Dupe! by dkleinsc · · Score: 4, Funny

      You're in a maze of twisty little comments, all alike.

      --
      I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
    26. Re:Dupe! by savuporo · · Score: 1

      Look at blog.reprap.org the photo of the machine and its child are there. The child already produced a grandchild as well. It is now a fact that has happened.

      --
      http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.slashdot.org Errors found while checking this document as HTML5!
    27. Re:Dupe! by spacefiddle · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Great, now even the moderations are making copies of themselves!

    28. Re:Dupe! by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      The record's stuck.

      The record's stuck.

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    29. Re:Dupe! by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      In Soviet Russia, Grues are eaten by you!

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    30. Re:Dupe! by tacitdynamite · · Score: 1

      No one will care about proper memes when we're being attacked by 'temes'.

    31. Re:Dupe! by failedlogic · · Score: 1

      Yes but they certainly have not perfected the fine art. When I commented on the original article, http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/11/01/2048205, I made a comment about the chicken and egg riddle. Now suppose that the machine being duplicated is in the process of making an egg. Does the duplicate produce an egg or a chicken?

    32. Re:Dupe! by Dragonslicer · · Score: 1

      so eventually we must get intelligent... uhm... comments?! You must be new here.
    33. Re:Dupe! by STFS · · Score: 1

      hey... I said _eventually_!

      --
      You don't think enough... therefore you better not be!
    34. Re:Dupe! by Stooshie · · Score: 1

      When I was a kid, I often wondered if the infinite monkeys infront of infinite keyboards could ever be done.

      Then I discovered /.

      [EDIT] OK, so not infinite (for the pedants), but many times more monkeys and keyboards than I could have imagined as a kid. [/EDIT]

      --
      America, Home of the Brave. ... .and the Squaw.
    35. Re:Dupe! by Plaasjaapie · · Score: 2, Informative

      how much time is necessary for the self-replication? Vik Olivier, a core development team member living in New Zealand, printed upthe first full set of Darwin parts in his spare time in about a month. Chris Palmer in the UK, another core development team member, reported this morning that he has printed out about 60% by mass of a full parts set in 72 hours of actual printer operation.

      what are the skills needed for the assembly? You can buy a fully assembled Darwin 3D printer sans the control boards from bitsandbytes.com in the UK. The control boards can be purchased from the Reprap foundation (rrrf.org) in the US. The chips and other bits that go on the boards can be got from places like mouser.com among others. The foundation is planning to offer full parts kits for the boards before too long, I'm told. It is only a matter of time, imo, before some robotics shop or six start offering fully assembled and tested control boards as well.
    36. Re:Dupe! by tmosley · · Score: 1

      What is Slashdot? A miserable pile of twisty comments!

    37. Re:Dupe! by bwcbwc · · Score: 1

      If you go to the RepRap Website, you can see some of the items it has made and how long they took. It seems to lay down about 1 cc of plastic per hour, which isn't going to put it in any factories anytime soon. Definitely a hobbyist/do-it-yourselfer type of tool.

      --
      We are the 198 proof..
    38. Re:Dupe! by nospam007 · · Score: 1

      If you go to the RepRap Website, you can see some of the items it has made and how long they took. It seems to lay down about 1 cc of plastic per hour, which isn't going to put it in any factories anytime soon. Definitely a hobbyist/do-it-yourselfer type of tool.

      But you could have it build a beowulf cluster of itself.

    39. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're in a maze of twisty little comments, all alike. Visible exits are North and South.

      > North

      You were eaten by a grue.
    40. Re:Dupe! by Thag · · Score: 1

      It won't EVER be capable of self-replication, because some of the parts need to be made out of different materials than the printing plastic for it to work.

      If you make the printing stage and the bits that touch hot plastic out of the same plastic, it will just fuse to them and ruin the thing in no time.

      To say nothing of the fact that it can't make its own electronics, particularly the stepper servomotors.

      --
      All opinions expressed herein are my own, and not those of my employers, who are appalled.
    41. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      making
      articles
      even
      now
      copies
      themselves
      of
      the
      Great
      are
      !
      ,

      Some assembly required after printing and the punctuation parts can not be printed and need to be bought from your local punctuation shop.

    42. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Great, now even the articles are making copies of themselves!

    43. Re:Dupe! by RMH101 · · Score: 1

      wooosh!

    44. Re:Dupe! by PAjamian · · Score: 1
      --
      Windows is a bonfire, Linux is the sun. Linux only looks smaller if you lack perspective.
    45. Re:Dupe! by Neo+Quietus · · Score: 1

      You and your significant other (if you have one) can't make vitamin C, which you both need to survive and reproduce, but would you say that you're not self-replicating?

    46. Re:Dupe! by arotenbe · · Score: 1

      Great, now even the moderations are making copies of themselves!

      (Where's that +1 Redundant option?)

      --
      Tomato wedge sperm darts that are Republican.
    47. Re:Dupe! by Dan9999 · · Score: 1

      In Soviet Russia, you are a copy of your copy

    48. Re:Dupe! by Draykwing · · Score: 1

      You're in a maze of twisty little comments, all alike. You may be duplicated by a printer.
    49. Re:Dupe! by Hoi+Polloi · · Score: 1

      Wait a minute, did the story duplicate itself?!

      --
      It is by the juice of the coffee bean that thoughts acquire speed, the teeth acquire stains. The stains become a warning
    50. Re:Dupe! by Phroggy · · Score: 1

      Reminds me of the signature I used many years ago:

      You are in a maze of twisty little base, all are belong to us.

      --
      $x='S24;r)>63/* h@<5+oZ)32"5cz';$me='phroggy'x$];
      $x=~y+ -xz+\0-Tx+;print$_^chop$me for split'',$x;
    51. Re:Dupe! by Hyperspite · · Score: 1

      "uh oh" is right. Random mutations have been introduced. Who knows where this will go!

    52. Re:Dupe! by Hyperspite · · Score: 1

      Well if you add a metal stage that is protected by coolant, the coolant might be analogous to your vitamin C.

    53. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Great, now even the articles are making copies of themselves!

    54. Re:Dupe! by Yvan256 · · Score: 1

      What about doing it with sugar instead?

      http://www.evilmadscientist.com/article.php/candyfab

    55. Re:Dupe! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Great, now even the articles are making copies of themselves!

  5. Sweet by Ninja_Popsicle · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is take piracy to a whole new level. What fun.

    1. Re:Sweet by NoobixCube · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Can't wait to print off some Gundam models from 3d model files, instead of shelling out for the expensive model kits :P.

      --
      Admit it. You post strawman arguments as AC so you get modded Insightful for refuting them, rather than Troll
    2. Re:Sweet by OeLeWaPpErKe · · Score: 4, Informative

      Won't work with this machine unfortunately ... it lacks a support material, so it can only print a certain, very limited class of 3d shapes.

      In fact it can't print any structures that won't retain their shapes when melted to, say 5 degrees below their melting point.

      The safe class of objects that it can print are those that are basically straight-up walls upon a flat base. The most complex stuff it would be able to print is a gothic castle (the ones with tiny windows), and you'd have to put the roofs on top of them afterwards.

      The "full" class of objects it can print are those where a finite element stress analysis (*with* gravity active obviously) doesn't have any red spots.

      (and now translation from technobabble to bad news :)

      It can't print Gundam models. At least not directly. For a less limited class of objects you could make 2 half-negatives, allowing you to mass-produce them. You'd have to paint them afterwards.

    3. Re:Sweet by galoise · · Score: 1

      sounds good enough for me, if the finite element stress analysis could be automatized from a 3d model.

      I've never had any experience with structural analysis, but would it be too complicated to develop a tool that, taking a regular 3d model of stuff, could determine how the rep-rap parts could be built, and if that particular model can be built at all?

      A friendly one, that is. one that required no prior knowledge of finite element stress analysis...

      --
      entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem
    4. Re:Sweet by steelfood · · Score: 1

      I doubt this would happen. China is where the major counterfeiters are, and they're likely the ones making the real parts as well, so this machine probably won't change anything.

      A far more likely application would be for you to be able to "print out" the models you designed yourself. Or, print out building blocks (lego, but not called lego because they're your own) for your own models.

      --
      "If a nation expects to be ignorant and free in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be."
    5. Re:Sweet by Sabathius · · Score: 1

      I'm just counting the seconds until the PPAA (Plastic Parts Association of America) begins suing people for making illegal copies of copywrited plastic parts.

      Welcome to the new economy!

    6. Re:Sweet by Red+Flayer · · Score: 1

      In fact it can't print any structures that won't retain their shapes when melted to, say 5 degrees below their melting point.
      A little difficult to parse, but what I'm getting from this sentence is:

      It can only print structures that retain their shape at (melting point - 5 degrees).

      So the problem is not that it can't print Gundam models... the problem is that Gundam models are not made from the right material.

      Solution: make your Gundam models from a material that holds its shape at t(m) - 5.

      The most complex stuff it would be able to print is a gothic castle (the ones with tiny windows), and you'd have to put the roofs on top of them afterwards.
      So print out your layers, then glue them together. (Some assembly required is part of most models anyway...)

      Articulating parts is another story.
      --
      "Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
    7. Re:Sweet by nicklott · · Score: 2, Informative
      I neither know what a Gundam is nor know how this machine works, but on the reprap site it says:

      There are two heads to allow a filler material to be laid down as well as the plastic. This filler is used to support overhanging parts of the objects being built, and is removed when the process is finished Which leads me to believe that it can in fact make Gundam models.
    8. Re:Sweet by Charcharodon · · Score: 1

      Screw toys, I want to be able to download a car or computer part files.

    9. Re:Sweet by Speare · · Score: 1

      The most complex stuff it would be able to print is a gothic castle (the ones with tiny windows), and you'd have to put the roofs on top of them afterwards. This is a more profound analogy than you initially suggest. It can build anything out of wax on the tabletop that peasants could build out of stone on a hill is a great way of expressing the allowed geometric complexity. The desktop equivalent of wood board floors, thatch panels for roofs, wool tapestries and various fixtures are not included in the construction at this stage, but those are things that aren't typically built on the hilltop either.
      --
      [ .sig file not found ]
    10. Re:Sweet by OeLeWaPpErKe · · Score: 1

      Actually that's a planned feature. It's vaporware currently, and it will never work with the current layout of the device (there's nothing to preven the support material from sliding off)

  6. Close but... by Smidge204 · · Score: 4, Informative
    ...not quite there yet.

    FTA (emphasis mine):

    The materials, plus the minority of parts that the machine cannot print, cost about £300. It also does not actually assemble the parts it creates. So close and yet so far.
    =Smidge=
    1. Re:Close but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah but, for normal 2D printing you still need to buy the ink-supplies as well, right? Ok, these parts are not the same as ink, but it seems fair.

    2. Re:Close but... by NightWhistler · · Score: 5, Informative

      From the pictures in the article it seems to mostly consist of small metal pipes, with pieces of plastic connecting them.... from what I gather it's only able to print the plastic connection parts, so I'm not sure how this counts as "self-replicating".

      Also it has a big bunch of wires coming out the back, which I bet are not replicated either... so someone was jumping the gun a bit while writing this article :)

      Still... this is some seriously cool technology... if the resulting plastic parts are strong / durable enough it could certainly have a huge impact... essentially being able to download physical objects from the internet...

      --
      PageTurner Reader: open-source e-reader for Android with cloudsync. http://pageturner-reader.org
    3. Re:Close but... by Devout_IPUite · · Score: 1

      You mean it doesn't count as a copy when it doesn't copy the metal frame of itself or assemble it? Shucks. I was very surprised to see a lack of 'arms' and an abundance of metal on the thing. Seems both of those are required before it can make a true copy.

    4. Re:Close but... by ahecht · · Score: 1

      Maybe it's a minority in terms of numbers, but from looking at the pictures a majority of the mass of this part was not printed. Basically the machine is made up of metal rods, motors, and wires all held together with plastic brackets and metal screws. All the machine made was the plastic brackets.

    5. Re:Close but... by Joebert · · Score: 1

      I think it's about time I volunteer in my community & start collecting the contents of the plastic recycling bins in front of everyones houses on trash day !

      --
      Wanna fight ? Bend over, stick your head up your ass, and fight for air.
    6. Re:Close but... by smaddox · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The picture makes the child device look like a cheap piece of crap. But, i guess if it works, who cares.

      I would galdly pay $300 to build on of these if it could build new plastic caps for the back of remote controls.

      There are so many little pieces of plastic that break and make a product useless. If I could replace them after an hours work, I would be sooooo happy.

    7. Re:Close but... by n0vu5 · · Score: 1

      It has to be disassembled to ship! Why would you ever want it to self-assemble? The minority of the parts are like the support bars and the heater head. You can't print something out of a nozzle that melts at the same temperature that the printing material does.

    8. Re:Close but... by Smidge204 · · Score: 1

      Why? Let's say you had a true universal construction machine; a magic box that could make anything.

      Set up your future factory and put one of these machines inside. Give it all the resources it needs and come back in a week to find two machines, then four, eight... however many you need. Once your factory has enough machines, set them to the task of building your actual product.

      Self-replicating if it doesn't count unless it actually produces a copy of itself, not a pile of parts with some bits missing.
      =Smidge=

    9. Re:Close but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It also doesn't replicate the computer that controls it.

      Kind of a pointless story.

    10. Re:Close but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can't print something out of a nozzle that melts at the same temperature that the printing material does.
      Then that wouldn't be a very good way to make a self-replicating machine.
    11. Re:Close but... by pipingguy · · Score: 1

      The "ink" costs $5000/litre.

    12. Re:Close but... by bobstay · · Score: 1

      With current technology, this is about the closest we can get. Got any better ideas?

  7. A news item that replicates itself by godfra · · Score: 1

    Continually! Seriously Rob, how much are these guys paying you?

  8. Working copies you say? by elguillelmo · · Score: 5, Funny

    I have some old Natalie Portman's pics to print out!

    --
    Dawkins Revisited: A person is shit's way of making more shit -- Steve Barnett, anthropologist.
    1. Re:Working copies you say? by The+Ultimate+Fartkno · · Score: 1

      I have some pictures of hot grits. Wanna hang out?

    2. Re:Working copies you say? by JustOK · · Score: 2, Funny

      it uses hot plastic, not hot grits

      --
      rewriting history since 2109
    3. Re:Working copies you say? by lonesome_coder · · Score: 1

      Slow down cowboy!

      Hot grits will melt the plastic.

      --
      If you'd just do what we tell you and quit yer gripin' everything would be chocolate sprinkles and rainbows! -AC
  9. Bad business model by stoofa · · Score: 5, Funny

    Won't everyone just buy one, make it clone itself and then send it back for a full refund?

    1. Re:Bad business model by lilomar · · Score: 5, Informative

      The guys who designed this thing aren't a business. They put the design online and the list of parts online for free, and tell anyone who wants to make one for themselves, then print one off for a friend, who can make one for his friend....

      --
      The creator of this post (Jacob Smith) hereby releases it, and all of his other posts, into the public domain.
    2. Re:Bad business model by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      Damn it! I don't have any friends.

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
    3. Re:Bad business model by smellsofbikes · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You joke, but in the woodworking industry companies make enormously sophisticated jigs for production of wooden forms with repeating features, and at least one company has sold their jigs with EULA language specifically prohibiting using it to duplicate itself or make other jigs that allow its functionality to be duplicated, AND prohibit resale of the jig. Completely bogus, obviously, but they've gone after people with civil suits for violating the EULA and gotten settlements, I've heard.
      So, yeah, people are already trying to figure out how to force profitability on things that can self-replicate in a limited sense.

      --
      Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
    4. Re:Bad business model by ch-chuck · · Score: 1

      This was touched on long ago by SciFi write George O. Smith in Pandora's Millions:

      Now that it is possible to duplicate money and precious metals, an economy based on scarcity collapses. The people of the Solar System must fall back on barter, and those too poor to buy matter duplicators are left to their own devices. It is not until the staff of Venus Equilateral invents a material that cannot be duplicated that a monetary system can be re-established.

      What do you know, DRM for material!

      --
      try { do() || do_not(); } catch (JediException err) { yoda(err); }
    5. Re:Bad business model by SuperBanana · · Score: 1

      *WHOOOOSH*

    6. Re:Bad business model by lilomar · · Score: 1

      Um, why do you think he was joking?

      When I replied, there wasn't a +5 funny to influence me into thinking he was trying for a (rather lame if he was) joke.

      --
      The creator of this post (Jacob Smith) hereby releases it, and all of his other posts, into the public domain.
    7. Re:Bad business model by SuperBanana · · Score: 1

      Um, why do you think he was joking?

      Because unlike a lot of other slashdot posters, I don't immediately assume everyone around me is dumber than I am.

      It was an OBVIOUS joke.

    8. Re:Bad business model by tricorn · · Score: 1

      Why is that bogus? That kind of thing is sold with a pre-sale contract, with both sides completely clear on the terms. If you don't like such terms, don't sign the contract, get your jig from someone else or negotiate different terms. This is nothing like the typical EULA on consumer products where it is a simple sale, no opportunity for negotiation of terms, and often no way to even see the terms before you buy it, in an environment where there are significant barriers to competition due to compatibility concerns already exacerbated by copyright and patent issues.

    9. Re:Bad business model by smellsofbikes · · Score: 1

      People buy these online, sight-unseen -- they're basically very fancy dovetail jigs. They receive them and hey, presto, aren't allowed to resell something they've bought because the seller says so? That's bogus.

      --
      Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
  10. Molding by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    These machines have been around since I was in college. Nothing new here. No one mentions the amount of work you have to do with a razor to make it look right.

    1. Re:Molding by sm62704 · · Score: 2, Funny

      No one mentions the amount of work you have to do with a razor to make it look right.

      You could say the same thing about womens' legs.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    2. Re:Molding by everphilski · · Score: 1

      Yeah, but no woman claims to be self replicating.

    3. Re:Molding by distilledprodigy · · Score: 2, Funny

      You see... When a man and a woman like eachother... Well... Go ask your mom upstairs, you've been in the basement too long my friend...

    4. Re:Molding by Yetihehe · · Score: 1
      --
      Extreme Programming - Redundant Array of Inexpensive Developers
    5. Re:Molding by Rick+Genter · · Score: 1

      Actually, I think Madonna did in one of her videos...

      --
      Don't underestimate the power of The Source
    6. Re:Molding by DriedClexler · · Score: 1

      Well, in fairness, the amount of conscious-being-provided material (spunk) that she can't create herself, is less than that of any known non-biological replicator, so I'd say they're pretty damn close ;-)

      --
      Information theory is life. The rest is just the KL divergence.
    7. Re:Molding by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's not ME who has to do that work. She can shave her own legs.

    8. Re:Molding by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      I see you've not read my journals. Lucky you!

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    9. Re:Molding by HeadlessNotAHorseman · · Score: 1

      No one mentions the amount of work you have to do with a razor to make it look right.

      You could say the same thing about womens' legs.


      So you're into cutting too? Emos unite!

      --
      I like my coffee the way I like my women - roasted and ground up into little tiny pieces.
  11. God I want one.. by CFBMoo1 · · Score: 3, Informative

    All the times I've owned something and one annoying plastic part breaks ruining the product. With this baby it'd be so easy for companies to send replacement parts at a fraction of the cost I bet.

    If I still had my old Dell laptop I'd print the latch that broke off a few years ago.

    --
    ~~ Behold the flying cow with a rail gun! ~~
    1. Re:God I want one.. by drrck · · Score: 1

      The reason a replacement part costs so much isn't due to the direct cost of that part.
      The increased cost is all part of the supply chain activities that were needed in order to get that part to you. That part must be stocked in a warehouse, counted, boxed, shipped ect.
      Your one part less cost effective to move than the box of 50,000 widgets that the manufacturer gets from its supplier.

    2. Re:God I want one.. by Skrynesaver · · Score: 1

      I think that's his point, the file describing your broken widget can be sent to you for very little indeed. Then load it up in RepRap, print it off and continue on your way

      --
      "Linux is for noobs"-The new MS fud strategy
    3. Re:God I want one.. by Bruiser80 · · Score: 1

      The problem with 3d printing is that you have no control of the type of plastic used. On top of that, most 3d printers do not make solid parts - the interior of the object is a honeycomb pattern. This combination makes structural soudness an issue.

      3D Printing is great for producing parts for prototyping and decorative parts. Not good for load-bearing parts.

      --
      Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling a pig in the mud. After a while, you realize the engineer enjoys it.
  12. This machine replicates itself ... by can56 · · Score: 2, Informative

    and stories about itself on /. Didn't we have an article/discussion a few days ago, and figured out the only thing this 'self-replicating printer machine' does is make copies of its case?

    1. Re:This machine replicates itself ... by Rhaban · · Score: 1

      And replies about how this story is a dupe are also replicating themselves. I think we're doomed.

  13. Same old thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Until it can make a copy from raw material, not prepaired sheets, and make a complete copy, this is nothing exciting.

  14. Rubbish by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Big deal, it's only a plastic copy of itself. Come back to me when I can use it as well

  15. So... by kote-men-do · · Score: 0

    So I guess these guys just made China obsolete?

    1. Re:So... by Zibblsnrt · · Score: 1

      Not quite; that comes with the printer auto-inserts random toxins into whatever it makes.

      --
      "All that is necessary for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
  16. Ahh, but... by Doug+Neal · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Can it sniff out nearby objects/people, ingest them, shred/melt them down to create new raw materials for buildling copies of itself? Thought not. We're safe... for now...

    1. Re:Ahh, but... by the_humeister · · Score: 2, Funny

      No, but my cat can. I also think she's trying to kill me...

    2. Re:Ahh, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah - Microsoft is a software company.

    3. Re:Ahh, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Can it sniff out nearby objects/people, ingest them, shred/melt them down to create new raw materials for buildling copies of itself? Thought not. We're safe... for now... Yes, but ~I~ can!
    4. Re:Ahh, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, heck, what good is it if it can't do that?

  17. One of best marketing statements ever: by tyler.willard · · Score: 4, Funny

    'Recently, Chris DiBona, Open Source Programs Manage at Google Inc, encouraged people to: "Think of RepRap as a China on your desktop."'

    1. Re:One of best marketing statements ever: by ShiNoKaze · · Score: 2, Funny

      I don't see how you get lead paint out of a plastic susbstrate though...

    2. Re:One of best marketing statements ever: by DragonWriter · · Score: 1

      'Recently, Chris DiBona, Open Source Programs Manage at Google Inc, encouraged people to: "Think of RepRap as a China on your desktop."'


      So, if I set RepRap beside my laser printer, the RepRap will invade and occupy the printer?

    3. Re:One of best marketing statements ever: by Bruiser80 · · Score: 1

      Nah, if you put it near a Samsung printer, the Samsung would invade and occupy the RipRap :-)

      --
      Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling a pig in the mud. After a while, you realize the engineer enjoys it.
    4. Re:One of best marketing statements ever: by mjwx · · Score: 1

      "Think of RepRap as a China on your desktop."'
      Great,

      Now I have to pay Tea Money If I want to use my Games machine.

      Thanks a lot Google.
      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
  18. How did they make the first one? by stoofa · · Score: 2, Funny

    I am assuming that they used another method to make the very first one or else philosophers are going to rake it in for years over where the first one came from.

    1. Re:How did they make the first one? by maxume · · Score: 2, Funny

      It all started when some guy rubbed some sticks together or carried away some of the remains of a lightning fire. Later, someone found some metal. Much later, organic chemistry was born.

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    2. Re:How did they make the first one? by stoofa · · Score: 1

      Was that whole stick thing on Slashdot? Because otherwise I would have missed it.

      Oh, I expect it was on Fox News right?

    3. Re:How did they make the first one? by Welshalian · · Score: 2, Funny

      I am assuming that they used another method to make the very first one or else philosophers are going to rake it in for years over where the first one came from. You're very clever, young man, very clever, but it's self-replicating machines all the way down!
    4. Re:How did they make the first one? by slim · · Score: 1

      The first RepRap was built from a RepStrap.

      It's a bit like bootstrapping a compiler.

    5. Re:How did they make the first one? by Stooshie · · Score: 1

      ... but it's self-replicating machines all the way down! ...

      No No, you've got it all wrong. The first machine sits on a turtle, then it's turtles all the way down.

      --
      America, Home of the Brave. ... .and the Squaw.
  19. Total redundancy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Automated machines have been around for decades."
    Na, really? I thought that they just came out yesterday!

  20. Let the Clone Wars Begin by totallydude · · Score: 5, Funny

    Lord Vader our troops are almost ready but I gotta run to staples to get some more of that plastic injection stuff for the printer.

  21. Nope, don't think so... by MadMorf · · Score: 1

    It works on coat hooks, door handles and now it can even make working copies ... of itself.

    I didn't even have to read TFA to know this ain't true...

    Unless the machine can also make it's own electrical components...Gears and even parts of pumps I can believe, but without some way to move those electrons around, it ain't happenin'.

    1. Re:Nope, don't think so... by smaddox · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Cutting a metal cylinder is easy with a saw. Gluing into the plastic housing is easy with a clamp. Wrapping wire for a engine is easy, as is buying one online for a few bucks.

      The point is we have an easy way to make plastic parts that otherwise would have to be special ordered. This would complete any garage as a prototype fab. It would be amazing for lab work in which I always want a piece of plastic of a certain shape, but end up having to wait a week to get it made out of much more expensive metal in the machine shop.

    2. Re:Nope, don't think so... by LingNoi · · Score: 1

      So what. It's still lying to say it can make itself, when it quite obviously can't.

    3. Re:Nope, don't think so... by Stooshie · · Score: 1

      ... Cutting a metal cylinder is easy with a saw. Gluing into the plastic housing is easy with a clamp. Wrapping wire for a engine is easy, as is buying one online for a few bucks. ...

      OK, but now you also have to have your machine make a saw, a clamp and a wire wrapping machine type thingy as well (not sure what type of machine wraps a wire).

      Effectively, any tools that are used, have to be made as part of the new machine as well. Also the new machine has to know how to use them and be able to build machines that have saws etc and be able to use them ... ad infinitum.

      --
      America, Home of the Brave. ... .and the Squaw.
  22. you silly robotic overlords by circletimessquare · · Score: 3, Funny

    you haven't thought your cunning plan all the way through

    you forgot the part about who plugs you into the wall

    who's in control now biatches!

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
    1. Re:you silly robotic overlords by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      we'll be solar powered next...

    2. Re:you silly robotic overlords by smellsofbikes · · Score: 1

      Last week's New Yorker magazine has a wonderful cartoon, showing a robot covered with spiderwebs, leaning over and holding its electric cord *this* far from a power outlet. Poor emo robot...

      --
      Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
    3. Re:you silly robotic overlords by Stooshie · · Score: 1

      Yeh yeh, then we black out the sky, then they farm us for our body heat. You know the rest.

      --
      America, Home of the Brave. ... .and the Squaw.
  23. Printcrime by Cory Doctorow by skware · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Printcrime

    Copy this story.

    (originally published in Nature Magazine, January 2006)

    Cory Doctorow

    The coppers smashed my father's printer when I was eight. I remember the hot, cling-film-in-a-microwave smell of it, and Da's look of ferocious concentration as he filled it with fresh goop, and the warm, fresh-baked feel of the objects that came out of it.

    The coppers came through the door with truncheons swinging, one of them reciting the terms of the warrant through a bullhorn. One of Da's customers had shopped him. The ipolice paid in high-grade pharmaceuticals -- performance enhancers, memory supplements, metabolic boosters. The kind of things that cost a fortune over the counter; the kind of things you could print at home, if you didn't mind the risk of having your kitchen filled with a sudden crush of big, beefy bodies, hard truncheons whistling through the air, smashing anyone and anything that got in the way.

    They destroyed grandma's trunk, the one she'd brought from the old country. They smashed our little refrigerator and the purifier unit over the window. My tweetybird escaped death by hiding in a corner of his cage as a big, booted foot crushed most of it into a sad tangle of printer-wire.

    Da. What they did to him. When he was done, he looked like he'd been brawling with an entire rugby side. They brought him out the door and let the newsies get a good look at him as they tossed him in the car. All the while a spokesman told the world that my Da's organized-crime bootlegging operation had been responsible for at least 20 million in contraband, and that my Da, the desperate villain, had resisted arrest.

    I saw it all from my phone, in the remains of the sitting room, watching it on the screen and wondering how, just how anyone could look at our little flat and our terrible, manky estate and mistake it for the home of an organized crime kingpin. They took the printer away, of course, and displayed it like a trophy for the newsies. Its little shrine in the kitchenette seemed horribly empty. When I roused myself and picked up the flat and rescued my poor peeping tweetybird, I put a blender there. It was made out of printed parts, so it would only last a month before I'd need to print new bearings and other moving parts. Back then, I could take apart and reassemble anything that could be printed.

    By the time I turned 18, they were ready to let Da out of prison. I'd visited him three times -- on my tenth birthday, on his fiftieth, and when Ma died. It had been two years since I'd last seen him and he was in bad shape. A prison fight had left him with a limp, and he looked over his shoulder so often it was like he had a tic. I was embarrassed when the minicab dropped us off in front of the estate, and tried to keep my distance from this ruined, limping skeleton as we went inside and up the stairs.

    "Lanie," he said, as he sat me down. "You're a smart girl, I know that. You wouldn't know where your old Da could get a printer and some goop?"

    I squeezed my hands into fists so tight my fingernails cut into my palms. I closed my eyes. "You've been in prison for ten years, Da. Ten. Years. You're going to risk another ten years to print out more blenders and pharma, more laptops and designer hats?"

    He grinned. "I'm not stupid, Lanie. I've learned my lesson. There's no hat or laptop that's worth going to jail for. I'm not going to print none of that rubbish, never again." He had a cup of tea, and he drank it now like it was whisky, a sip and then a long, satisfied exhalation. He closed his eyes and leaned back in his chair.

    "Come here, Lanie, let me whisper in your ear. Let me tell you the thing that I decided while I spent ten years in lockup. Come here and listen to your stupid Da."

    I felt a guilty pang about ticking him off. He was off his rocker, that much was clear. God knew what he went through in prison. "What, Da?" I said, leaning in close.

    "Lanie, I'm going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for everyone

    1. Re:Printcrime by Cory Doctorow by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That may be the worst written post I've ever read on slashdot. Ow.

  24. Doom! Doom! Doom! by Detritus · · Score: 5, Funny
    Now all it needs is an attachment that converts organic matter into chemical feed stock and some wheels.

    "Knock, knock"
    "Who's there?"
    "Candygram"
    "You're not a self-replicating cybernetic organism?"
    "No, ma'am"

    --
    Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
    1. Re:Doom! Doom! Doom! by dkleinsc · · Score: 1

      No, it's much worse: it's an encyclopedia salesman.

      --
      I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
  25. No it doesn't by 192939495969798999 · · Score: 1

    It makes copies of the parts needed to make a copy of itself. That's like saying a screw-making machine is making copies of itself because it also contains screws. If it "made a copy of itself", then out of the output area would appear a machine similarly capable of producing a copy of itself. Those are two totally different things!

    --
    stuff |
    1. Re:No it doesn't by SpinyNorman · · Score: 1

      Not even that... it could make copies of *some* of the parts needed to produce itself.

      It does NOT :

      - make all the parts (wires, etc) needed to make itself
      - assemble itself

      It's really no different from a computer controlled milling machine that could of course also be programmed to make some replacement parts for itself. Big deal.

      Good angle to get some press coverage though.

    2. Re:No it doesn't by zippthorne · · Score: 1

      Yeah, those computer controlled milling machines are a dime a dozen. Everyone has one in his basement already.

      --
      Can you be Even More Awesome?!
    3. Re:No it doesn't by bobstay · · Score: 1

      That's not quite a fair analogy. It produces all the specialised shaped parts that it needs, like the extruder mechanism. It doesn't produce the off-the-shelf parts.

      It still means that if you buy the off-the-shelf parts (wires etc) you end up with:

      a) A cheap rapid prototyper
      b) The ability to create more of them without any manufacturing expertise

      That's orders of magnitude easier than building a rapid prototyper yourself from plans.

    4. Re:No it doesn't by SpinyNorman · · Score: 1

      Agreed - it's a neat low cost way of making rapid prototypes, but that's it. I got the impression the story was trying to imply that these things could essentially self-reproduce and might be colonizing Mars sometimes soon!

  26. This is OLD technology... by jxm387 · · Score: 1

    Ok, so maybe they've got a novel way to promote themselves: "our machine can even copy ITSELF!" But this technology has been around for ages. In the late 90's I was personally watching a low tech version layer adhesive paper and cut it out with a laser. The technology has since evolved into photosensitive polymers that crosslink in layers to allow more complex parts that can take a beating. In fact, I was working on projects with the polymer manufacturers to improve interlayer adhesion. This stuff is new? No way.

  27. Antrax by ShannaraFan · · Score: 1

    I see where this is going... I just finished (re)reading Antrax (one of Terry Brooks' Shannara series). We're all screwed when this printer gizmo becomes self-aware!

  28. Reprap.org is self-contradictory by RandoX · · Score: 1

    At the top, it says "RepRap makes its first complete working replicated copy!"

    But below, it says: "You could make lots of useful stuff, but interestingly you could also make most of the parts to make another 3D printer. That would be a machine that could copy itself."

    (Emphasis added)

  29. Star Trek Replicator by sm62704 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The self-printing machine is another step to Star Trek's "matter replicator". Society will have some sweeping changes when physical property is as easy and cheap (or beer-free) as intellectual "property" (imaginary property) is to replicate.

    Someone in an RIAA/MPAA thread said that since physical property was getting cheaper and cheaper to manufacture and took less and less people to make that we need to stake our future to IP. I say this is hogwash - I may be creative, but most people aren't.The record labels are already quaint anachronisms, and the movie studios will soon follow as the cost and necessary technical expertise drop. It no longer takes lots of gruntwork to make an album; the band and a guy running the studio is all you need now. What will those who have no creativity do for a living?

    Heaven on earth is on its way and technology is bringing it here. And the greedy rich are fighting its arrival tooth and nail. Their sense of entitlement and feelings that they are better than the rest of us is sickening.

    --
    mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    1. Re:Star Trek Replicator by the_humeister · · Score: 1

      The self-printing machine is another step to Star Trek's "matter replicator". Society will have some sweeping changes when physical property is as easy and cheap (or beer-free) as intellectual "property" (imaginary property) is to replicate.
      Sure, if you like to to eat plastic...
    2. Re:Star Trek Replicator by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The day that scientists will have girls (wait, there's more..) with bigger boobs is close!

    3. Re:Star Trek Replicator by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Could this be a collary of Goodwin's law? Talking about the RIAA/MPAA in a topic that has nothing to do with the RIAA/MPAA?

    4. Re:Star Trek Replicator by JustinOpinion · · Score: 1

      Someone in an RIAA/MPAA thread said that since physical property was getting cheaper and cheaper to manufacture and took less and less people to make that we need to stake our future to IP. I say this is hogwash I'd say it's worse than hogwash.

      The argument is basically "physical property is getting cheaper and cheaper to manufacture, making it a difficult field to compete in... so let's compete in a field where the manufacturing/duplication is even cheaper (almost zero, actually).

      It will be quite interesting to see how economy and law change as manufacturing prices drop further, or if "object printers" become commonplace. The same silly arguments that are currently used to restrict duplication of information will surely be used by the entrenched players to justify monopolies on objects, and laws against object printers.

      I think we are indeed driving towards a world where manufacturing and duplication (of objects or information) will not be the limited step: it will be design and creativity that will be limiting. I'm not at all convinced that our current models for "creativity-rewarding" (namely copyright and patents) are up to the task of maintaining the economy when that day comes.
    5. Re:Star Trek Replicator by bigstrat2003 · · Score: 1

      the movie studios will soon follow as the cost and necessary technical expertise drop. Really now? That's funny, because, while indie music is viable nowadays, every indie movie I've ever seen looked like shit. We're a long way off from having Hollywood die, if it ever happens.
      --
      "16MB (fuck off, MiB fascists)" - The Mighty Buzzard
    6. Re:Star Trek Replicator by Yetihehe · · Score: 1

      What will those who have no creativity do for a living?
      They will be lawyers and politicians, just like now.
      --
      Extreme Programming - Redundant Array of Inexpensive Developers
    7. Re:Star Trek Replicator by Rich0 · · Score: 1

      Heaven on earth is on its way and technology is bringing it here. And the greedy rich are fighting its arrival tooth and nail. Their sense of entitlement and feelings that they are better than the rest of us is sickening.

      Fair enough, but...

      Just think of how different a society would need to be when labor of any kind is essentially cheap or free. Imagine when machines can do creative activities as well or better than a human. How would such a society operate?

      Our current system is based around the concept of working to earn your pay. Imagine a utopia where nobody needs to work - but then how do you decide how to allocate resources (most likely some resources would still be scarce - such as living space)? Imagine a world with 100% unemployment...

    8. Re:Star Trek Replicator by spacefiddle · · Score: 1

      Someone in an RIAA/MPAA thread said that since physical property was getting cheaper and cheaper to manufacture and took less and less people to make that we need to stake our future to IP.
      ...
      What will those who have no creativity do for a living? I believe you've answered your own question.
    9. Re:Star Trek Replicator by sm62704 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Food is already self-replicating.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    10. Re:Star Trek Replicator by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      I've seen one indie movie I liked, and it only cost a few thousand bucks to make: Star Wreck: In the Pirkinning (2005). It was funny as hell. I'm sure it scares the bejesus out of the MPAA.

      It is the most popular Finnish film of all time, according to wikipedia. But you're right, it will take a while.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    11. Re:Star Trek Replicator by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      How would such a society operate?

      I have no clue. Someone smarter than me needs to start giving it some thought or there's going to be bloodshed. If I'm lucky I'll be long dead first.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    12. Re:Star Trek Replicator by AuntieWillow · · Score: 1

      .... And the greedy rich are fighting its arrival tooth and nail. Their sense of entitlement and feelings that they are better than the rest of us is sickening. As the Greedy Rich, I resent your implications!
    13. Re:Star Trek Replicator by Plaasjaapie · · Score: 1

      I may be creative, but most people aren't. It's impossible to say until "most" people have access to the tools necessary to express any native creativity that they might have. I'm really looking forward to the impact that affordable 3D printers will have on kids. So much of the really innovative things that you see done with the web are done by the very young. Imagine what things will be like when just about anybody can make physical things instead of just images of imaginary things.

      Heaven on earth is on its way and technology is bringing it here. And the greedy rich are fighting its arrival tooth and nail. Their sense of entitlement and feelings that they are better than the rest of us is sickening. Though I'm not sure that Heaven on Earth is where we are headed it is definitely the End of Days for much of our extant socio/economic institutions. Old wealth always fights hard to keep it's perogatives at the expense of everyone else. One only has to look at this year's farm bill and the utterly ridiculous extensions to the copyright laws that our bought and paid for Congress and White House have made into law in the last 10-15 years to know that.
    14. Re:Star Trek Replicator by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      Sucks to be you, then.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    15. Re:Star Trek Replicator by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      It's impossible to say until "most" people have access to the tools necessary to express any native creativity that they might have.

      All a visual artist needs is mud and a stick. All a writer needs is a pencil and a piece of paper.

      I'm really looking forward to the impact that affordable 3D printers will have on kids

      As am I. The great thing about youth is that they do the impossible before they learn that it is, in fact, impossible.

      Old wealth always fights hard to keep it's perogatives at the expense of everyone else

      100% agreed. Too bad people forget that salient fact and fight against their own interests.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    16. Re:Star Trek Replicator by msaavedra · · Score: 1

      Imagine a utopia where nobody needs to work - but then how do you decide how to allocate resources (most likely some resources would still be scarce - such as living space)?Imagine a world with 100% unemployment...

      There is a lengthy short story (novella?) by Marshall Brain (the founder of howstuffworks.com) called Manna that addresses this question, and is available free online. It covers two of the possible outcomes: one of them quite good, and the other very bad. It is a worthwhile read; though it is not great from a plot or character-development point of view, the ideas are interesting.

      --
      "Any fool can make a rule, and any fool will mind it."
      --Henry David Thoreau
    17. Re:Star Trek Replicator by bobstay · · Score: 1

      I think we are indeed driving towards a world where manufacturing and duplication (of objects or information) will not be the limited step: it will be design and creativity that will be limiting. I'm not at all convinced that our current models for "creativity-rewarding" (namely copyright and patents) are up to the task of maintaining the economy when that day comes. But will they need to be? We've all seen how the software piracy community thrives on kudos. Ditto the open-source community - and that's produced some pretty damn good software. What's to say that the open-source hardware community can't work the same way?

      All it takes is one creative and altruistic person to come up with a good idea and put it into the public domain, and nobody will have to pay for that particular object again.
  30. model for evolution? by Fluorophore · · Score: 1

    Just a thought. Could be used as a model system for evolution research. I just saw Susan Blackmore's TED talk - she summarizes Darwin's Origin of the Species as: If you have - variation - selection - heredity Then you *must* have - evolution It would be interesting to speculate how those three factors could be introduced.

    --
    --- I am NaN, I am a free man!
  31. Anyone want to print me off a set of parts? by RandoX · · Score: 1

    Looks like a fun toy, what does it actually cost to make anything with it though? Would it be cheaper to buy a coat hook from Wal-Mart or to print my own?

    1. Re:Anyone want to print me off a set of parts? by Yetihehe · · Score: 1

      Actually coat hook from Wal-Mart would be cheaper. But those printers are suitable where you need a coat hanger for very peculiar coat for example. This is for nonstandard things. So you can have millions of coat hangers for $1 (or sometimes for free), or 1 custom coat hanger for $5 with reprap (or $5000 for custom molds with injection molding).

      --
      Extreme Programming - Redundant Array of Inexpensive Developers
  32. self-replication, ha? by roman_mir · · Score: 1

    So a MACHINE can self replicate now! This is an achievement of a sort that most /.ters can't boast about ;) It's not fair. There must be a limitation built into this machine that would force it to seek out another machine like itself, only a different color and use half of that machine's blue-print to replicate. Then the other machine must be programmed to refuse most of such attempts without giving a logical reason for it (what's logical about not wanting to replicate as much as possible if you are a replicating machine? ;)

    Then the first machine would have to learn all kinds of tricks to fool the second machine into believing that the second machine actually WANTS to replicate with the first one. Then Sex in the Factory show will make it big.

    1. Re:self-replication, ha? by roman_mir · · Score: 1

      then the robot porn will hit it off... show me that circuit, SHOW ME THAT CIRCUIT!

      Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm... bad printer ;)

  33. Obligatory Futurama by Bwian_of_Nazareth · · Score: 5, Funny

    And it can make other useful things. That's the important stuff, which your criticism fails to address. Fry: Isn't that the machine that makes noses?

    Professor Farnsworth: It can do other things, why shouldn't it!
  34. And here's the news from 2009... by dpbsmith · · Score: 1

    The Replicator Industry Association of America cautions that all replicators are required, prior to creating the first device, to first replicate a EULA. By buying a replicator you are deemed to have agreed in advance to this EULA.

    The EULA, rather like the United States Constitution, is a "living document" constructed of active replicator parts. It periodically downloads updates and constantly improves itself to keep up with modern jet-age progress, and the latest court decisions.

    The RIAA suggests you keep the EULA posted in a conspicuous place where you can refer to it periodically to check for updates in the terms and conditions of use.

    The EULA provides that you cannot use the Replicator to replicate itself, nor to replicate any patented or trademarked device.

    To spare you the inconvenience of checking the patent database yourself, the EULA uses BlueTooth to communicate with the replicator and Wi-Fi to search the patent, trademark, and copyright databases. To increase customer satisfaction and continuously improve the product, it also keeps the RIAA updated on what all replicator users are doing with their replicators, so that the RIAA can better serve you.

    And we do mean "serve."

  35. Yes but.... by Welshalian · · Score: 1

    ...does it run Linux? And if it does, do you have to redistribute the 3-d model under the GPL? *ducks*

    1. Re:Yes but.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The software used to control it runs on a linux PC and is FOSS, it runs assembly on PIC processors.

    2. Re:Yes but.... by bobstay · · Score: 1

      Yes. Yes, it does (well, the host PC software anyway).

      And yes, you do.

      See http://reprap.org/bin/view/Main/RepRapGPLLicence

  36. Didn't they use this... by Chysn · · Score: 1

    ...to make a velociraptor skull? Oh yeah, that was Jurassic Park 3. In 2001.

    --
    --I'm so big, my sig has its own sig.
    -- See?
    1. Re:Didn't they use this... by bsDaemon · · Score: 1

      that was the sound chamber in the nasal cavity... and that was a commercial device. The point of these things is that hobbyists can build them at home and use them to build other things. Now that computers have become so comodified and commercial, we need something new and exciting to play with.

  37. Self-replicating? Not by a long shot by Alwin+Henseler · · Score: 3, Interesting

    from what I gather it's only able to print the plastic connection parts, so I'm not sure how this counts as "self-replicating" It doesn't. I'd say you can call something self-replicating if it can reproduce itself using only the essential raw materials. In this case: plastics, metal(s), energy. Perhaps a lot more ingredients, but at least those.

    A good comparison is reproducing an OS in a Linux-From-Scratch style (using only source code, disk space and CPU cycles). *THE* thing you need is a C compiler. But to run that, you need a kernel, and a C library below. Then you need shell scripts to automate it, thus a shell. Most sources include makefiles, therefore you need 'make'. And bigger components use all sorts of preprocessing utilities like awk, lex, sed, grep, and so on. All these programs use a variety of standard utilities for copying/removing files, creating directories, etc. So before you get 'full circle', you need a pretty big set of things to reproduce what you start with (think of a compressed Gentoo stage 1).

    Maybe this would be a good idea for an X-Prize kind of challenge: create a factory that makes *any commodity of choice*, and keeps itself working indefinitely using just the raw materials, and energy. That is, repairs/rebuilds machines if they break, does maintenance, etc. Say that the only role of humans would be to hit the 'on' switch, stock up supplies/energy, and to keep roof & walls of the building in place. I suspect that even for the simplest kind of product, the minimum size for such a factory would be *huge* if you include stuff like electronics (create new IC's from raw silicium to replace failed ones).

    Perhaps all the required technology to do this already exists, but we're still a long way from putting all those parts together.
    1. Re:Self-replicating? Not by a long shot by k_187 · · Score: 1

      Something tells me that while we could probably compile everythign together to do that, it wouldn't be worth it other than to say we did it.

      --
      11 was a racehorse
      12 was 12
      1111 Race
      12112
    2. Re:Self-replicating? Not by a long shot by DriedClexler · · Score: 1

      Make sure one of the requirements on your X-prize is the protocols to make sure those replicators can't engage in undesired, unbounded replication and consumption of their environment.

      --
      Information theory is life. The rest is just the KL divergence.
    3. Re:Self-replicating? Not by a long shot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      create a factory that makes *any commodity of choice*, and keeps itself working indefinitely using just the raw materials, and energy. That is, repairs/rebuilds machines if they break, does maintenance, etc. Say that the only role of humans would be to hit the 'on' switch, stock up supplies/energy, and to keep roof & walls of the building in place. I saw that movie. Eventually the "commodities" will be able to collect their own raw materials from the corpses they create. It ends when they mutate to look like teddy bears and hitchhike back to Earth.
    4. Re:Self-replicating? Not by a long shot by jonadab · · Score: 1

      > create a factory that makes *any commodity of choice*, and keeps itself
      > working indefinitely using just the raw materials, and energy. That is,
      > repairs/rebuilds machines if they break, does maintenance, etc. ...
      > Perhaps all the required technology to do this already exists, but we're
      > still a long way from putting all those parts together.

      The individual technologies exist, but making factories actually work this way would be inefficient and uneconomic.

      --
      Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.
  38. Singularity? by tobiasly · · Score: 3, Funny

    Hmm, I thought the singularity would be more impressive than this. I bet Singularity 2.0 will be awesome.

  39. I'll buy one by chord.wav · · Score: 1

    When it makes it's own plastic cartridges too.

  40. Wahow by ze_jua · · Score: 1

    tagging: not new, old news.

  41. When do we all have one?? by Roy+van+Rijn · · Score: 1

    So this machine is open-source and can self-replicate?

    So when do I get one?

    I think I read it only takes a couple of hours? If the machine does that, the next day you have two, the next 4, the next 8,16,24,48... within a year everybody in the world could own such a machine, pretty cheap!

    So if I know somebody who has this machine, I can easily get a copy now? That is so cool, saves me a lot of tinkering hehe!

    Then nobody in the world will need to buy coat hooks and doornobs, we just fab it!

    1. Re:When do we all have one?? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Someone should teach you how to count by two. Stupid git.

    2. Re:When do we all have one?? by Roy+van+Rijn · · Score: 1

      Its not counting by two, its multiplying by two :) If you call me a stupid git, be sure to do it right. But yes, I made a mistake.

  42. I sensed a disturbance in the force... by kazdoran · · Score: 1, Funny

    As millions of Warhammer gamers found a cheap way of making their own quality miniatures.
    Or not. I'm really not into miniature gaming, so I have no idea of the cost/benefit relation using this machine to make the miniatures instead of buying them.

    Anyone care to elucidate?

    1. Re:I sensed a disturbance in the force... by mark-t · · Score: 1

      The minimum feature size would have to improve substantially beyond what it is presently before it would be even remotely practical for making models with a lot of fine detail, such as what you have in most metal or plastic gaming miniatures.

  43. Re:Close but no cigar... by ortholattice · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Whether a machine is considered self-reproducing or not is somewhat subject to interpretation I suppose. Similar issues arise with quines (self-reproducing programs). For example, consider the classic C quine,

    char*f="char*f=%c%s%c;main(){printf(f,34,f,34,10);}%c";main(){printf(f,34,f,34,10);}
    For me, this is not a true quine, because there is no "#include<stdio.h>". It will not compile on typical C compilers. (There are longer quines that do have the include.)

    Basically, you have to agree on a starting environment and what "self-reproducing" means. Computer viruses might be argued to be better quines than a program that simply prints itself and requires a human (or another program) to take the output and run it again.

    Similarly, one might demand that a true self-reproducing machine be able to reproduce itself in the middle of the desert with only the sand as raw material and sunlight for energy. But most people would accept something in between that and the machine described in TA.

    Self-reproducing lifeforms have similar issues. It is possible for a very simple "lifeform" with only 54 base pairs to be self-reproducing, but only if it parasitic. On the other hand, the simplest known lifeform that can reproduce independently is the Mycoplasma genitalium bacteria with 582970 base pairs. This probably isn't the simplest one that can theoretically exist - it is hard to imagine the right combination out of 4^582970 appearing at random in the pre-life organic soup - but whatever simpler thing existed before it is a mystery.

  44. Really a good thing? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't we have enough problems with plastics, everything from the various tensions surrounding the oil industry to recycling, and reuse. Interesting project, but I can see a resulting boom in useless trinkets made from plastics as a result. I see this further pushing the boundaries of a disposable society. "oh my iPod casing isn't quite as pristine as last week... I'll print a new one!" Maybe not, but you get the idea.

  45. Video of RepRap by OtherFarm · · Score: 2, Informative

    A video of Adrian Bowyer's RepRap can be found at ofpblog.

  46. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 2, Informative

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  47. Anonymous Coward. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We are Borg. Resisance is Futile.

  48. Re:Close but no cigar... by Free+the+Cowards · · Score: 1

    Whether a machine is considered self-reproducing or not is somewhat
    subject to interpretation I suppose. Similar issues arise
    with
    quines (self-reproducing programs). For example,
    consider the classic C quine,


    char*f="char*f=%c%s%c;main(){printf(f,34,f,34,10);}%c";main(){printf(f,34,f,34,10);}


    For me, this is not a true quine, because there is no
    "#include<stdio.h>". It will not compile on typical C compilers.
    (There are longer quines that do have the include.) Overall I agree with your post, but I just have to pick a nit. There is nothing wrong with the quine you mention. It should compile on any C compiler. The include is optional as long as you're using functions whose prototypes match what you get from using them implicitly, which printf does. It won't compile in a C++ compiler since C++ requires explicit prototypes, but C++ is not C.
    --
    If you mod me Overrated, you are admitting that you have no penis.
  49. Another way to destroy the enviornment by physman_wiu · · Score: 0

    So you buy the machine, or get one made for you, then you buy the plastic in cartons (or barrels for some of you). Then you print out something, find out it isn't better than the design that came out of the factory (cause let's face it, not everyone knows how to design perfectly the first time). Then you throw it away.

    Now seeing as this plastic probably won't be polyhydroxyalkanoate (or some other biodegradable plastic.

    Now I could just see our landfills in 20 years when all these Gundam Wing or Sailor Moon models, that just didn't quite work out, start filling it up.
    Sure you can probably dl nice working 3D models, because we all know that there is no way that this is going to mess up the printing process....say like your regular printer does now. Right? Right?

    --
    Physics is imagination in a straight jacket. ~John Moffat
    1. Re:Another way to destroy the enviornment by dave420 · · Score: 1

      Or you can take the plastic models, process them into plastic pellets, and use those to create more plastic for the printers. Biodegradable is not the only option - recyclable plastics are out there too.

  50. Toxic? by GreatRedShark · · Score: 2, Interesting

    What sort of molten plastic does it use? Does it start in a liquid state and then dry when it's exposed to the air? Or does it melt solid plastic and then reshape it? I had thought that molten plastic would result in some nasty, maybe toxic vapours. Anyone here know for sure?

    1. Re:Toxic? by smellsofbikes · · Score: 3, Informative

      It uses polylactic acid, which is thermoplastic, not thermosetting: the machine melts it and prints the droplet of hot material, which then freezes solid. Apparently it can also print stuff that stays somewhat flexible after printing, for softer items.

      There are plenty of molten plastics that don't degas much, and there are some that are incredibly toxic. I haven't found anything about PLA yet, but I know a bit about lactic acid and it shouldn't be the health risk that, say, the stuff coming off melted polyvinyl chloride would be, or any nitrile-containing polymers. Molten nylon's not too bad, though.

      --
      Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
    2. Re:Toxic? by Plazmid · · Score: 1

      Actually reprap can print a variety of thermoplastics, PLA is being given preferential treatment though, because you can make it from plants. However, the best result so far are from ABS. Of course, reprap still needs support material before you can start pirating Warhammer figurines.

  51. Misleading: It Does NOT Yet Copy Itself by Dean+Edmonds · · Score: 1

    Although I am something of a RepRap fanboy, I still find the "it copies itself!" line of hype, which comes straight from the RepRap web-site, rather annoying.

    RepRap has succeeded only in duplicating the plastic bits of itself. While that it is a huge step, it is still not full self-replication. There are still metal rods, fasteners, motors, electronic components and printed circuit boards to go before full self-replication can be claimed.

    --

    -deane

    1. Re:Misleading: It Does NOT Yet Copy Itself by jonadab · · Score: 1

      If the only parts it didn't make were stuff I could easily and cheaply pick up at the hardware store, like nuts and bolts, the "self-replicating" claim would be somewhat less annoying. But it needs motors and circuit boards and stuff, which are not so convenient to obtain.

      The other annoying thing is, you can't build one unless you have access to a rapid prototyping machine. For most of the world that's an unsolveable bootstrapping problem. If they had plans for a version you could make out of nothing but ordinary hardware-store parts, that would be much more exciting to me, even if the raw materials cost more, and even if it couldn't replicate *any* of its own parts.

      --
      Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.
    2. Re:Misleading: It Does NOT Yet Copy Itself by Locutus · · Score: 1

      yes, the marketing droids were definitely busy with this title and it's been brought up ump-teen number of times.

      The deal is that it makes the required CUSTOM parts which make making another one possible. All the other parts are pretty much off the shelf parts with assembly required. So does it really make itself? No. Does it make the really hard or impossible parts needed to make one? Yes and the other parts are so easy to get they are noise to those who have been trying to do this for years.

      It is an amazing achievement even if the title is over stated. IMO

      LoB

      --
      "Anyone who stands out in the middle of a road looks like roadkill to me." --Linus
  52. Only thing left is... by argStyopa · · Score: 1

    ...to teach it to eat, and to incorporate the new DARPA tech for UAVs, where they can seek out and hang on power lines to recharge their batteries.

    Then humans are entirely superfluous and can be gotten rid of. Accountants will rejoice.

    --
    -Styopa
  53. Evolution by l0b0 · · Score: 1

    Now we just adapt it to use Martian soil for building material and sunlight for energy, and ship it off.

  54. Problem with source plastic by Solo7473 · · Score: 0

    The main problem I have with this is the source materials. I looked into RepRap before when I was researching to create my own CNC machine. I like a lot of the concepts, but it took me a while to figure out what material they were using for the source material. After a while of searching on their site, I found out that you have to purchase spools of plastic wire. I do not think that the cost for the plastic spools is at a reasonable price for what needs to be manufactured.

    Until I can use ground up soda cans and water bottles, I don't see how this project will take off. Yes, I recycle the water bottles, but think how much better it would be if I could just insert some used water bottles into a machine and use that as a source for whatever I was creating, skipping the middle-man as it were out of the equation.

  55. Er.... "give it to a friend"??? by mark-t · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Okay... get some perspective here. The materials alone cost £400... which, giving that number a bit more meaning, works out to something over $750 USD. That's not exactly pocket change for a good percentage of people... and they somehow figure that people will just be willing to casually give them away? Sure, it's not out of reach of the average person's budget for the person who wants one, but it still strikes me as being well beyond the typical person's threshold of disposability.

    1. Re:Er.... "give it to a friend"??? by Plaasjaapie · · Score: 1

      Okay... get some perspective here. The materials alone cost £400... which, giving that number a bit more meaning, works out to something over $750 USD. That's not exactly pocket change for a good percentage of people... That's only the first generation machine. Keep in mind that the first IBM PC's introduced at the beginning of the 1980's cost about $4,000 in the dollars of that day. I'm currently working on an open source second generation machine that I estimate will have a parts cost of about $250. You can track my progress at... http://3dreplicators.com/ If I can get sort out a problem with lead screw length of Chinese source for linear stepper motors I should be able to drop that cost to about $100 for parts. I'm pretty sure that I can do that.
  56. self replicating machines by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Didn't they have one like that in the star trek series? Is this one step closer to bringing us to that era?

  57. Online solution by SleptThroughClass · · Score: 1

    The next generation just needs to get on eBay and buy another assembled unit.

    1. Re:Online solution by ipsi · · Score: 1

      The machines are doing a good job of copying us - they're onto Mail-Order brides now...

  58. All it makes is its own brackets by Animats · · Score: 2, Interesting

    It doesn't make a "copy of itself". It doesn't make the plastic output device. It doesn't make the servomotors, the cables, the metal rods, or the control computer. All it actually makes, in fact, are the brackets used to assemble the other parts. The easy parts.

    A manual Bridgeport milling machine, on the other hand, used to be considered "self-replicating". If you have a milling machine, a small foundry, a supply of good quality steel scrap, sand, and fuel, and a skilled machinist, you can eventually make another milling machine and all the foundry equipment. Factories that made Bridgeport milling machines (the design was widely copied) did in fact make them using Bridgeport milling machines. A good 1930s machine shop really can replicate itself with only a supply of good people and raw materials.

    This machine is more hype than substance. It's just a mediocre stereolithography machine. If you want to use a good one, and you're in Silicon Valley, sign up with TechShop in Menlo Park. They have one, and it's not used much.

    1. Re:All it makes is its own brackets by smellsofbikes · · Score: 3, Interesting

      You bring up an interesting point. Lathes and mills, like compilers, can be self-replicating. In a belt-driven machine shop, working with somewhat crude tolerances, you can make a whole new belt-driven machine shop to the same (or maybe even slightly better) tolerances. But a '30's machine shop couldn't make modern vacuum-degassed, oil-impregnated bronze bearing stock, for instance: they could only make machines that had basically the same materials they themselves were made of.
      Our ability to work with bulk materials has always lagged somewhat behind our ability to make specific, custom materials, in other words -- consider what I think is the highest point of materials science, directional solidification casting of turbine blades, where we have figured out how to control not only what goes in, but how the molecules structurally relate to one another in three dimensions. To build a universal 3D printer, we have to learn how to print more than just atom-by-atom: we actually have to figure out how to distort atom-by-atom printing to establish strain within materials -- and that's just to replicate things we're already building.
      Anyone interested in further reading on 3d printers could stand to start by reading Saul Griffith's master thesis (pdf) on the subject. I'm building a larger version of the LEGO chocolate printer he discusses/documents in there, and I've gotten a couple of jobs by explaining to crabby old machinists how I managed to cut a new, true lathe spindle on my old lathe with a bent headstock spindle. The idea of self-healing and self-replicating machines has always fascinated me.

      --
      Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
    2. Re:All it makes is its own brackets by DoubleD · · Score: 1

      Not stereolith. It uses a spool of plastic filament extruded through a smaller diameter nozzle.

      Your manual bridgeport doesn't make all of its parts either, requiring a foundry, refined steel, and most importantly a skilled operator (with lots of time). Being argumentative you could say it only makes the easy parts also as refined steel is the hard part.

      A reprap on the other hand does(will) require some off the shelf components. What it will save as it matures and refines itself is time, lots and lots of operator time.

      What would take hours of careful work and measurement from a machinist will take hours of printing and computer time while said operator sleeps or works on something else. The brackets (or similar in function/accuracy Cartesian positioning systems) are non-trivial and very labor intensive to make as well as expensive. Commercial machines such as a stratesis have far higher cost ~20k afaik and a much higher material cost due to its proprietary nature.

      Look at the potential rather than the limitations. It would be nice however as another poster suggested to have a percent attached to the "self replicating" qualifier.

      --
      "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep in order to gain what he cannot lose."
    3. Re:All it makes is its own brackets by Animats · · Score: 1

      But a '30's machine shop couldn't make modern vacuum-degassed, oil-impregnated bronze bearing stock, for instance.

      Right. You could make Babbitt-metal bearings, which are simply cast, then allowed to wear in. They don't require the tight tolerances of ball or roller bearings. 19th century machine shops were self-replicating by necessity; nobody was making parts. That tradition continued for a long time, and big factories tended to have the in-house capability to make most of their own parts through World War I. This allowed bombed-out factories to boot themselves back up to operation given time and skilled people. The real skills were in the people, not the machinery.

      The whole point of this "self-replicating fab" thing is to come up with some technology that can replicate itself fully, even if it's not optimal manufacturing technology. RepRap isn't even close, even though they like to say "self-replicating" a lot.

    4. Re:All it makes is its own brackets by smellsofbikes · · Score: 1

      Thing is -- even if they can get the machinery duplicated, down to the metal, getting the *brains* duplicated is just unbelievably difficult. We as a species have spent more man-hours on semiconductor fabrication than anything else (if I remember right) and unless a miracle happens, that's not going to be something any simple, small machine is going to be able to duplicate in the next 40 years.

      The milling machine I built was babbitt-bearing for the spindle. It worked beautifully after a few hours of spinning, and it was more true than I needed. I've gotten to look at old machine shop equipment that used high-quality leather soaked in oil and tightly compressed for its headstock bearings -- and they were doing reasonable metalcutting with that kind of technology. It's possible that if the self-rep machine crowd aimed lower they'd get further.

      --
      Nostalgia's not what it used to be.
    5. Re:All it makes is its own brackets by Geminii · · Score: 1
      Interesting... I wonder how possible it would be to effectively create a micro-machine-shop? Something of a size between a small room and a suitcase, which could be plugged into an outlet, given suitable scrap metal, and spit out the parts for a copy of itself? Even if it needed to be plugged into a standard PC to act as CPU, storage, and optional internet connection for downloads?

      (Bonus points if it comes with the absolute minimum number of parts to build the other parts of itself until it can self-replicate. And one of the more popular base-level programs might churn out a micro-assembly line as another PC peripheral, so that the whole thing can make the parts AND put them together. Follow it up with building some materials sensors and scanners, upgrades for the basic starter-kit parts, etc etc... using this bootstrap process, how small could the initial 'seed' device be?)

  59. Great, but the real question is... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    can it make a 3D copy of my butt?

  60. CNC machine, anyone? by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 1

    How is this different than a tool factory using a CNC machine to make CNC machine parts? You know, something that's done millions of times every day, for the last couple of decades...

    --
    Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
  61. An Old Programming Problem by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 1

    One is reminded of the old programming challenge to write a program that accepts no input, and its sole output is an exact copy of its own source.

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
    1. Re:An Old Programming Problem by Teancum · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I remember the contest... and somebody turned in a zero byte length source file. Really! Nothing at all as the source.

      A standard C compiler (like GCC) will produce precisely an exact copy of the source code when the object code is executed at run-time.

      The one thing that kept the contest from getting flooded with additional variations of this software was the requirement to be original and that nobody could use a previously published algorithm. This does make you think, however.

    2. Re:An Old Programming Problem by zobier · · Score: 1

      Ah IOCCC, my favorite entry in the quine category (a circular quine) http://www.ioccc.org/2000/dhyang.c

      --
      Me lost me cookie at the disco.
  62. Let's be honest now by Bruce+Perens · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Let's be honest about the self-replicating capacity of RepRap. If this device were even close to being able to produce the electronics embodied in itself, it would have to be much more complex than just a manufacturer of 3-D plastic parts. Without those electronics, the device is really just a skeleton.

    I submit that without the capacity to manufacture a working integrated circuit, the claim that the device can replicate itself should be considered a deliberate act of fraud.

    Bruce

    1. Re:Let's be honest now by Directrix1 · · Score: 1

      Yeah, they should instead claim (rightfully so) that the machine can print out the parts that would normally take a machine shop to make.

      --
      Occam's razor is the blind faith in the natural selection of least resistance and in universal oversimplification. -- EF
    2. Re:Let's be honest now by Bruce+Perens · · Score: 1

      I wrote an editorial stating the case in greater depth here.

  63. Piracy by slashmojo · · Score: 1

    Paul McGuinness will be calling for the oil pipes to be disconnected next!

  64. Re:Fussing about Self-replicating by alcmaeon · · Score: 1

    My family owned a construction company. We built steel mills, out of steel. The steel was manufactured in a steel mill very similar, if not identical, to the one we were building.

    Now, sure, we were all anthropocentric and said "we" built the steel mill, but by the loosy goosy definitions in the article, it appears the steel mill built itself.

    We need to stamp out this archaic anthropocentrism.

  65. Re:Dupe! - Oblig. Battlestar Galactica Reference by mykepredko · · Score: 1

    "All this has happened before and it will happen again."

    myke

  66. Don't even need robot insurance. by Valdrax · · Score: 1

    Call me when our new, self-replicating robot overlords are made of something more durable than cheap plastic.

    --
    If it's for-profit but free, you're not the customer -- you're the product (e.g., the Slashdot Beta's "audience").
    1. Re:Don't even need robot insurance. by bobstay · · Score: 1

      Well, plastic is fairly durable. And anyway, if it breaks, you already printed off a spare, didn't you?

  67. Hmmm. Does that mean by Mister+Whirly · · Score: 1

    Self-replicating? Oh no. Looks like we have the world's first 3 dimensional worm! (Well, not counting the worms born naturally of course.) What sort of firewall will I need to block it?

    --
    "But this one goes to 11!"
    1. Re:Hmmm. Does that mean by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · · Score: 1

      What sort of firewall will I need to block it?

      You'll need a firedome or firesphere to protect yourself now.

      --
      Your ad here. Ask me how!
  68. What is new here? by Teancum · · Score: 1

    I don't get it. I simply don't get what is groundbreaking about this project at all.

    Open Source?
    3D printing?
    Self-replication?

    None of this is unique, or even original. If you want a high-quality 3D printer that can self-replicate a great many of its parts, and is open-source with some fantastic documentation currently available, see Fab@Home where some progress is being made and has been happening for a couple of years now.

    I've seen suggestions of printable ICs and other sorts of digital circuits that might be used in such a device, and it should be noted that the ultimate goal of the Fab@Home project is a fully replicatable device with some sort of basic supply of "source materials" like resin and copper.

    While the RepRap looks interesting, it doesn't look like they've done a "survey of available literature" to really prove they've done something new or original... and certainly not something worthy of a /. article. Fab@Home has been on /. more than once as well.

    3D printers have been around for decades now in one form or another. If that is what is so ground breaking, these folks need to learn what is standard engineering practice among mechanical engineers. Prototyping machines like this are not only commonly used, but considered essential for any decent engineering shop. All the RepRap looks like to me is a cheap 3D printer.

  69. Now it can even make working copies ... of itself? by macbigot · · Score: 1

    It's PEOPLE!

    --
    Just another veteran of the platform wars. It's a great time to be a fan of tech.
  70. Does it copy its own design? by PhilHibbs · · Score: 1

    In order to be fully self-replicating, the machine that it produces needs to contain the design information to produce another copy of itself. If the design specs are external to the machine, and need to be fed into the new copy of the machine, then it isn't a Von Neumann replicator.

  71. It even copies it own stories! by Pontiac · · Score: 1

    It's only the 4th dupe.. I'm sure it can make more..
    Machine Prints 3D Copies Of Itself
    On June 5th, 2008 with 237 comments
    TaeKwonDood writes "Automated machines have been around for decades. They have basically been dumb devices that do simple assembly tasks. But RepRap takes...
    Hardware  Robotics, Technology
    Score: 2.9
    3D Self-Replicating Printer to be Released Under GNU License
    On April 7th, 2008 with 313 comments
    Rob O'Neill writes "A Kiwi open source developer is working on a self-replicating 3D printer, RepRap, to be made available under the GNU license. 'The 3D...
    Hardware  GNU is Not Unix, Patents, Hardware
    Score: 5.1
    Open Source Self-Replicating Robot
    On June 4th, 2005 with 194 comments
    Josilot writes "CNN.Com is running an article about a new self-replicating robot named RepRap. From the article: 'A revolutionary machine that can copy itself...
    Hardware  Robotics, Science, Index
    Score: 5.8
    Towards Self-Replicating Rapid Prototypers
    On March 17th, 2005 with 285 comments
    Neil Halelamien writes "Researchers at the University of Bath are developing a rapid prototyping machine capable of making copies of itself and other products,...
    Technology  Robotics, Technology
    Score: 2.4

    --
    If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur. --Red Adair
  72. Functional self replication by T.E.D. · · Score: 1

    I'm more interested in machines that can replicate functional copies of themselves. I want to know how close we are to forkbombing the universe.

  73. Lathes by Psychofreak · · Score: 1

    You are talking about the argument for lathes. Metal working lathes are the only machine that can be used, after a fashion, to make ALL of its own components, and even make them to a better tolerance and standard than the machine being used.

    I knew a kid in High School who went over the top in Metal Working. He took home 3 lathes and a vertical end mill after his senior year. All but the first lathe were made using the first lathe. The first lathe was build piece by piece by hand. Was pretty awesome stuff.

    Phil

    --
    Laugh, it's good for you!
    1. Re:Lathes by DamnStupidElf · · Score: 1

      I'd like to know how he was able to turn out the cutting tools for his lathes.

    2. Re:Lathes by jbeaupre · · Score: 1

      I'd heard the same and started to say lathe instead. But I've had more luck using a milling machine as a lathe than the other way around. The extra axis and all. So my personal bias to to think of milling machines as better at replicating themselves. Then again, lathes are a bit simpler, so maybe self replication is easier.

      --
      The world is made by those who show up for the job.
    3. Re:Lathes by iq+in+binary · · Score: 1

      Machinist here.

      No they can't.

      Now, perhaps, having both a mill and a lathe, you could recreate all the parts you need. Wait, scratch that, you can't make the parts with finish requirements lower than 32 or so(like the ways), or that are longer than the X travel of the mill or lathe (the ways). I don't care how much of a genius you are, you're not making an electric motor capable of providing enough torque. Can't forget the mill's table, either. Or the lathe's pinion gears (CNC practically REQUIRED for those, at least for the machine tools we use today).

      An argument could be made for a lathe and mill tandem to be self-sufficient, but only for maintenance. Can't make your own tools save for a couple cheezy HS cutters on the lathe, but nothing you're going to get quality cuts from.

      Manufacturing is a completely different world today than it was even 10 years ago. High tolerance used to be .002", now high tolerance is .0005". CNC equipment is the standard, and good machinists are going the way of the dinosaur. Now all it takes to run a shop is one setup guy for every 3 operators, one programmer for every 3 setup guys. Being 22, I'm probably going to be one of the last living true machinists within the next 30 years. It's a shame, really.

      Machine tools are a different capital now. As a guy who's going to have a couple of them in his garage by the end of the summer, I'm gonna let you in on a little secret: they're both going to be CNC, and while not being able to create most of their own parts, I'm still not worried about how I'm going to maintain them.

      --
      Of all the Universal Constants, here's one I know: Nice guys finish last ;)
    4. Re:Lathes by Psychofreak · · Score: 1

      high speed steel or oil hardening steel. I have made and hardened custom woodworking blades quite easily out of both materials. Both materials will cut unhardened tool steels.

      Sadly I am unsure of the whole process as I was a sophomore and the student machinist was a senior. I do know that a lot of boring bars I used in high school and collage were simply ground hardened steel. Nothing special at all.

      some links:
      build your own lathe

      a different take

      Also my wife was reminding me that her late grandfather built a lathe. It is in her mother's garage. That machine uses an oak frame, not steel, and is powered by a washing machine motor. To change speeds you need to physically remove and change the gears. I have looked at it, but never used it.
      Phil

      --
      Laugh, it's good for you!
    5. Re:Lathes by Psychofreak · · Score: 1

      HSS is awesome, and it can achieve very high tolerances, but the labor gets high. CNC used to be much more sloppy than manual labor. It is a recent achievement to get such high tolerances out of CNC, backlash in the drives screw up precision. Steel was the only cutting material for centuries. It will cut itself. It will need to be resharpened, but try that with a TiN coated carbide cutter.

      Most lathes can be used as a small bed horizontal mill. They can also be used as a shaper or single point broach using the feed to push a tool through the metal.

      I admit to these methods being in-efficient, but efficiency is not part of the argument.

      I also admit to needing a fair amount of manual labor. YES, I HAVE SCRAPED A LATHE BED, under the tutelage of a senior machinist. NOT FUN

      Phil

      --
      Laugh, it's good for you!
  74. University of Bath by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Sounds like an interesting place!

    1. Re:University of Bath by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Looks like they replicated the researches too shown in the bottom pic. one looks a bit shorter, but the face cut is pretty close!

  75. mirror? by qkslvrwolf · · Score: 1

    Can someone please post a mirror that isn't blocked by DOD? They block the stupidest shit around here...

    --
    Or have you only comfort...that stealthy thing that enters the house and guest then becomes host, then master - KG
  76. Wow by SuperBanana · · Score: 1

    Cory Doctorow took what would have been a one-line slashdot troll ("imagine the day when the cops or Manufacturers Industry Alliance arrest you for making counterfeit stuff") and turned it into a badly written sci-fi short story. "Craphound", indeed.

  77. Self replicating comment by naoursla · · Score: 1

    (\x.xx)(\x.xx)

  78. How do you actually make it? by Millenniumman · · Score: 1

    I can't find anywhere on the site about how to make it. I can only find nonsense about how somehow in the future it is going to make itself (which it can't do at all at this point), and how the one you make yourself is called a "RepStrap" or something.

    --
    Stupidity is like nuclear power, it can be used for good or evil. And you don't want to get any on you.
  79. Electronics a problem? by DamnStupidElf · · Score: 1

    Just control the thing with a Babbage Difference Engine made out of little plastic gears.

    Even better if it was a milling machine and could make metal parts.

  80. Silly human by Plazmid · · Score: 1

    Reprap could print our a generator and harness ambient energy: http://forums.reprap.org/read.php?1,11789

  81. Damn you! by DRAGONWEEZEL · · Score: 1

    Why do you allways do something like that when I am taking a drink?

    Enclosed you'll find a bill for the replacement of my keyboard.

    Please pay for the following items:
    *****--- Item: Keyboard PN: 0U81269L333T Cost: $68.32 ---*****
    Total: 68.32
    Tax: 6.14
    Subtotal: 74.46

    We gladly accept PayPal, Visa, & Mastercard. We do not take American Express or Discover.

    Thank you, and come again.

    --
    How much is your data worth? Back it up now.
    1. Re:Damn you! by Gilmoure · · Score: 1

      You should use this chance to upgrade to the Neuvo Model M.

      Just sayin'.

      --
      I drank what? -- Socrates
  82. The original was well written... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...but the copies degraded.

    You insensitive clod!

  83. Obligatory Python by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ah, but do you have a machine that goes *ping*?

  84. Repost by EkriirkE · · Score: 1
    --
    from 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
    to 45 2F 6E 40 3C DF 10 71 4E 41 DF AA 25 7D 31 3F
  85. When will we ever learn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    June 6th 2008, the RepRap project manages to make a perfect copy of its self. The project is seen as a success.

    June 10th 2008, RepRap becomes self aware and starts taking measures to protect itself.

    June 28th 2008, the first Man vs Machine war begins.

  86. True replication by ThunderBird89 · · Score: 1

    Now it just needs an automated assembly facility, maybe a few set of manipulators, and other types of plastic to print the bars and belts. sure, it would still need the electronic components readied by its side to assemble the child, but one step closer.

    --
    Hyperbole: I use it liberally!
  87. haha... by DRAGONWEEZEL · · Score: 1

    No doubt! My work keyboard is a crapy HP stock POS.

    My home Keyboard is a crapy for typing(but versital) G15.

    One of those would make typing @ mork so much more fun!

    --
    How much is your data worth? Back it up now.
  88. This is just the beginning... by bbbco · · Score: 1

    This just proves that the Replicators are real, and thus the Stargate does exist. Man, I am so relieved to know that SG-1 and Atlantis have this all under control.