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Is the US Ready For the Switch To DTV?
tonsofpcs writes "On Monday, September 8, Wilmington, NC will be the first television market (#135) to make the switch to DTV by shutting off their analog transmitters. This forum will be posting updates throughout the coming months to keep everyone updated on how the transition works so that we are all prepared come February 17, 2009. So far, it seems Wilmington will still be going ahead as planned, despite Tropical Storm Hanna's proximity."
Something tells me that after several delays and numerous announcements that the people that are unaware of the switch to digital TV probably wouldn't be too upset about missing out on TV for a few days while they track down an analog->digital converter.
I'm a big tall mofo.
It seems odd that they are not going to wait out the storm.
Mandatory TV Conversion Creates Complications For Prisons
This is going to happen in February, why on earth should a tropical storm delay it if it's still September? For that matter, why would it be delayed at all? Is there something mystical and magical about tropical storms that we don't know here?
Is there something mystical and magical about tropical storms that we don't know here?
Yes. It adds drama! Just image some bold brave techs driving through the rain and wind in order to get DTV to the people!
Read with one of those voice actors saying this in your head.
The struggle. The bravery. The challenges!
Men and women fighting so that their neighbours can stay informed! Keeping them from being cut off from the rest of the World all the while batting Nature's worst! With the bonds that form between people who have gone through hell together!
Mat Damon is .... THE DIGITAL TECH!
If you cable you may need a box to get most channels soon on satellite you are ok and 100% digital right now.
No.
People don't like change, and especially when they have to take action themselves. Come February, a very large number of slackers will wonder why their TVs don't work. Call me a troll, but it will be mostly inner-city welfare-check-receiving families.
I don't understand your grammar. Are you referring to the issue of analog migration for cable television?
[Where certain cable TV providers slowly move the analog channels to digital on their system, thus requiring a "box" if they want to view those "upper" channels.]
I've had cable for almost 30 years. They could shut off all broadcast TV as far as I care. I can't beleive anyone still watches over the air broadcasts, even the poor.
I doubt most people are even going to notice the switch over to digital. Between cable and satellite providers relatively few are going to see the need for a digital-analog converter. On another note... Wilmington just wanted to put a simple "We did it first so we're 'technologically advanced'" stamp on a tourist brochure. Whatever and good luck to 'em (I guess).
"The best way to accelerate a Macintosh is at 9.8m/sec^2" -Marcus Dolengo
Between cable and satellite providers relatively few are going to see the need for a digital-analog converter.
There are some channels that one can get on digital broadcast but not on analog cable, such as the PBS subchannels. The ATSC tuner box also costs much less ($20 after coupon) than the first three years of the upgrade from analog cable to digital cable ($359.64) or the upgrade from satellite TV without local networks to satellite TV with local networks.
Actually, DBS services (like DirecTV) are only offering local channel service to some of the 210 markets, despite promising that they would have all 210 covered by year end. Some markets will require customers to have two dishes pointed different directions (one for local channels, one for the rest); other markets require just a newer box; others are available with the base setup; and that's just for the ones that are "available via DBS", the ones that aren't 'ready' will need an antenna for local channels and a converter box.
As for cable, cable companies will have to convert any received signals (be it by antenna, satellite receiver, or direct link with the programming source) to match their system. Currently, many cable companies are converting digital SD broadcasts to analog. Remember, cable companies have contracts (franchise agreements) with the towns that they offer service in that tend to have many more requirements than DBS, along with requirements from federal regulations.
Video Production Support
That's one way to look at it. The other is "we're biting the bullet first. Let's hope nothing bad happens.".
Shai Schticks:"You don't make peace with friends, you make peace with enemies"
According to the LA Times, the conversion might be postponed due to the storm.
The public safety factor is one concern.
The other concern is the technical one.
As people age, our hearing and eyesight deteriorate.
All this High Def stuff will look EXACTLY like analog
to us.
It is a industry subsidized by the government. I say boycott
all TV until common sense prevails.
Reminders per WEEK from tv news stations about DTV conversion in 2009: > 100 per week
Reminders to register to vote (deadline in a few weeks): about 3 per week
So glad we have our priorities in place in this country.
I wonder how many people who only watch broadcast TV casually now will put off buying the box, and realize they really don't even miss TV?
Is this a news report or a trailer for a motion picture?
People still watch TV? why? use the internets.
How hard would it be to broadcast on all common channels in the area a fixed pattern that says something along the lines of, "TV broadcasts using your current equipment are no longer available. Please conatct... blah blah blah".
Seems that would be better than just turning it off. Maybe just run it for a week or so.
I'm a big tall mofo.
Yup comcast has been airing blatent lies about the DTV switch... "we got you covered" yup they are switching to all Digital across the nation next year forcing everyone to have a converter box (that you have to rent from them at $5.00 a month) and it will make all those pesky PVR's out there stop working unless they take over that digital box or get another digital box for the PVR at another $5.00 a month)
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
As people age, our hearing and eyesight deteriorate. All this High Def stuff will look EXACTLY like analog to us.
Which is why a lot of ATSC broadcasters can choose to broadcast four subchannels: one in 1080i for the younger set and three others in 480i, including programs targeted to older people.
I just tell people:
"If you have cable, dish, or FiOS television, then you need not worry about the over-the-air transition. It does not affect you."
The government is not your daddy. Its purpose is not to raid middle-class neighbors' wallets and give it to you.
Numerous stories mention that prisons are not ready for digital television, and prison administrators are worried.
Generally, inmates pay for their own television sets and (for some reason that escapes me) are not eligible for the $40 coupons.
Prison administrators say"the tube does more than fill year after year of idle hours. It provides a sense of normalcy and is a bargaining chip that encourages good behavior... At Indiana's Wabash Valley super-maximum security prison [a psychiatrist said], far fewer behavior problems were reported among inmates in isolation after they were given small TVs. 'You don't want to be managing prisoners who have nothing to lose,' Kupers."
I expect the test will show that, in fact, prison inmates represent only one example of what will prove to be a large population of forgotten Americans... the people who don't answer telephone surveys because they don't have telephones, the people who don't shop at Best Buy because they don't have cars and the nearest Best Buy can't be reached by public transportation, etc.
I will grant that the amount of publicity being given to the DTV switchover on our local TV stations is so large... at least during the times of day we watch and on the channels we watch... that it's hard to imagine people not knowing about it, but there is always that twenty percent of the population who can't name the President.
Indeed, I'm astonished at the poster who asks "Will they broadcast a notice?" since our local stations have been doing that continuously since February. Either his are not or he, like those twenty per cent I'm talking about, didn't notice.
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
House in foreclosure CHECK Credit Cards past due CHECK Car Repossessed CHECK TV ready for Digital....not a priority
This is for all the people out there who have played Urban Terror. I wonder if the south will turn into the guys in Red Smocks (oe in the case of southerners, gray smocks) vs. The guys in Blue smocks as all those rednecks come out of the Appalachian mountains that "The Commies took muh TV!"
They have to have an unencrypted QAM Teir by law. I have Comcast, and There are 39 availible unencrypted QAM channels. (Only 14 are unique.)
The average age of TV viewers was recently reported as 55 years old. That means the average television audience is 10 years older than the demographic that advertisers pay top dollar to reach, 18-45. That higher average age also means that most of those watching are the least likely to be paying attention to esoteric issues like format changes. Many of them will be quite upset when their TV stops working, especially with a 30% increase in the price of groceries and $4/gallon gas happening at the same time.
So the TV industry heads are going to alienate a significant chunk of the last group of people who still tune in to their programs.
Aging demos, TiVo, writer's strikes, death of the upfront season, competition from other media, and ill-timed format changes are all going to bring the television industry down.
Do what you can, with what you have, where you are.
It occurs to me that if there are "forgotten" segments of the population (e.g. prisoners) who've escaped official notice in the preparation for the switch, and haven't been reached by the numerous public announcements, or can't or don't know how to prepare for it... ...how is the FCC going to find out whether they've been affected?
The same factors that have caused them to be overlooked before the test may cause them to be overlooked in evaluating the results of the test.
The people who have a phone and know how to call the FCC are the same people who won't need to--because they heard the announcements, got their coupons, and bought their boxes at Wal*Mart.
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
What's the big deal? I already switched, and it wasn't bad at all. I get to watch entire banks of channels dropping off and coming back as our post-Gustav power outages continue. :)
Everyone in my family who does not use cable and still has analog TVs, has already signed up for, received their coupons, and purchased their converter boxes. All on their own volition. They heard the messages about it on TV and heeded the warning. They are all happily digital and enjoying it.
Of course, I come from a family where everyone is thoughtful and organized. They are fully able to hear and heed a warning without having someone spoonfeed the solution to them.
My experience with digital TV in the UK is going from analogue at 4.5 channels (5 was not available in about half the places I went) to digital with far too many to count. The signal strength, picture and sound quality went through the roof with the transition too. Plus, no messing around with tuning at all, it just pulls channels, names and schedules out of the ether.
If your experience is typical, the FCC has managed a frak-up of truly epic proportions.
Of course, with all the new channels there's still nothing on worth watching, but that's a problem with the culture, not the technology.
All intents and purposes. Not intensive purposes.
This big push for DTV in the USA, is nothing more than a money grab. I'm on cable, so the switch isn't going to impact me one bit. I'm all for big business, but this one stinks. A. TV manufacturers, who will sell thousands B. Some businesses who want that bank of frequencies such as wireless phone companies. C. The federal government, who will rake in the $$$ when they sell off the old analog(e) frequencies.
I find it amazing that people still watch TV. I don't know anybody other than my parents who still watch TV.
I don't respond to AC's.
I have RCN for my cable TV provider. I had 1 cable box and received cable on my other 2 TVs directly with the cable (no set-top box).
Recently I received a mailing from RCN showcasing their new channel lineup and mentioning one line "We're Going Digital."
The next day my two TV's without the set-top box stopped working.
I was kind of annoyed, but upon calling them, I found out they'd be stationed around the area giving out set-top boxes to their customers.
Plus, they gave me a free hat.
Basically, it's up to the cable service provider. The DTV transition is about over-the-air broadcasts, but that doesn't mean your cable company will continue providing analog channels.
While I can't speak to your situation, overall, I have found over-the-air DTV to be a vast improvement over analog. This is in the San Jose area. The existing analog broadcasts are hopeless due to massive multipath problems (same with FM radio). DTV, including HD, is pretty bulletproof. You have to turn the antenna for a few stations but that's no different than what was going on with analog. Once you get it, it's perfect.
In your particular case, it doesn't seem to work very well, but I don't think that has a lot to do with digital vs. analog per se. Your local stations have had 60 years to get the analog stuff right, and 6 months to get digital right.
Brett
I've been wondering if that would violate their franchise agreement?* Also I wonder if cable has to carry the subchannels along with the main channel?
*You know? The local channels they presently have to carry.
Shai Schticks:"You don't make peace with friends, you make peace with enemies"
If ready means that everyone has at least one digital receiver (built-in or external) then no. People tend to delay non essential purchases these days, and a digital receiver won't be essential until the analog shutdown actually takes place.
So just do it already, people will run to get get the decoders the next day.
Unless of course when your service goes out. You should ALWAYS have a way to receive over-the-air signals. This way when the cable, FIOS, or whatever is your favorite way to pay for programming goes offline (and it does during a hurricane, flood, and severe thunderstorms) you are still able to receive important information.
Nothing sucks like having your generator running and not having a clue because you depended on cable to look after you...
Besides all you are doing is encouraging "lock-in". The cable companies would love to be the sole provider of broadcast content.
Stop giving that shitty advice, and tell your friends to get a converter box while they can still get a discount on them.
These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
Generally, inmates pay for their own television sets and (for some reason that escapes me) are not eligible for the $40 coupons.
No pun intended? :P
Comment removed based on user account deletion
TV is done. It's going to die faster than radio, because I can listen to radio in my car.
RS
Shoes for Industry. Shoes for the Dead.
Got that... It's the cutting edge of technology. I call it a "radio".
Cable operators are not required to have an "unencrypted QAM Teir". They transmit OTA digital channels unencrypted, but that's it.
One problem I have with the switch to DTV is that there are a plethora of disaster radios out there that have analog TV coverage. In an emergency, I can scan AM, FM, and TV stations for what's going on. That gives me a lot of good options. Now my hand-cranked emergency radio has a band that can no longer be used: analog TV. That's a bummer in my book.
The FCC has been preping this small town for the last 6 months with daily advertisements in the paper, radio ads, etc. There has been so much attention paid, that if things don't go well, there isn't a chance in hell the rest of the nation will go well. Even if it does go well, chances are that things will still be out of whack for the nation. This is just a little stunt for the current FCC to show that they will do right before they leave office (notice that they will be leaving this problem for the new FCC just as they take office, with no time to make any changes to the plan).
I'm not hopeful on this one. The last Neison survey showed that 60% of those people who only had OTA service were not aware that their equipment might not work after the transition. This is a problem. Most of these people who were surveyed are probably not tech savvy enough, or they just don't watch the advertisements letting them know. Not everybody can just get up and go to Best Buy and have their sales people tell them what is going on (uh, and incorrectly, I might add. Yes, the only way you can watch TV in the future is if you get this $1,000 tv!).
Well thanks for that bit of advice. Now, would you please come over here and move my house out of this valley? With rabbit ears I can sort-of see one channel, on clear days. With a bigass antenna on the roof, I might be able to get 2 fuzzy stations. Really, there are a fair number of people for whom this changeover won't make a god damn lick of difference.
It would be great to be able to get OTA signals - unfortunately for a fair number of us it isn't a possibility. And, of course, for those of us without generators it doesn't matter either.
Velociraptor = Distiraptor / Timeraptor
Besides... Around here there are only about five different channels to be found using an analog antenna.
"He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing." --Paul Atreides, Dune
during hurricanes as we are so prone to getting, we rely on our portable televisions to watch information about the storm when we lose power. Those portable televisions are going to be useless. As a matter of public safety, we need portable televisions that can receive the digital broadcast, but so far, none have reached the market.
What will I do to protect my family if I have no way of getting public safety information? Radio is one way, but it doesn't convey the same level of information as does television.
what will we do?
They're using their grammar skills there.
tv? what's tv? what do you use it for?
I can't remember the last time a storm knocked-out cable in my area. We live in a civilized area of the U.S. where the cable is buried underground & away from the elements. There's really no need to have a backup antenna-based television, because the cable never fails.
In fact, my brother doesn't even own an antenna!
He couldn't watch over-the-air even if he wanted to.
The government is not your daddy. Its purpose is not to raid middle-class neighbors' wallets and give it to you.
I once worked at a large development with 25 + apartment buildings. I was the guy who answered the phone for the repairs, clogged toilets, etc. One day, the CATV system serving the entire complex went out. Now, it was a Tuesday afternoon, but you'd be amazed. It was the single highest call volume we ever got. Worse was the amount of "re-calls" and plaintive complaints. There's a lot of folks out there who can't function unless they are lashed to the fantasy teat, and they were not all elderly or shut-in. There will be a rash of "grandma can't get her stories" news articles, but in the end, this will be a boon to the Content Industry, for whom HDCP will now be part of the equipment. It buys their business model ten years.
I think many people, for one reason or another, will be unable to make the switch. All these people will suddenly regain consciousness from daily propaganda feeds from Fox News and mind-numbing foolishness from corporate America. Yes, it is almost as if people are being set free because the hypnotist that had them enthralled no longer speaks their language. Indeed, I am looking forward to the day where televisions all over the country stop working.
I live in a valley...
next to an HD-only transmitter.
Needless to say, analog *anything* has been an issue. Last spring, sensing there may a be rush later, I got our two coupons from Uncle Sam, and cashed 'em in. A few points on my experience:
o Direction and gain are definitely more of an issue. Since we barely got anything analog clearly on bunny ear/loop, we got next to nothing with digital.
o With digital, it's all or nothing. Either you have clear signal, maybe with some artifacts, or you have black screen.
o *The* most annoying thing is that sounds cuts first.
o So, I did what any self-respecting tinkerer would do. I build a grey-hoverman antenna out of foam board, packing tape, tin foil, and picture hanging wire - all from from Walgreens (U.S. pharmacy) :-D. http://www.digitalhome.ca/ota/superantenna/
o Obviously, with such rarefied materials I have a less-than-precise design - that works... really well.
o The GH antenna is highly directional. Since digital is crystal-clear, we put up with adjusting the thing in the bay window.
o We get 9-12 clear channels now, instead of 4-5 distorted ones.
o It's best to put it in an attic, or outside. Be sure to ground it, etc. The higher, the better - generally.
o Note that there are two ranges for VHF DTV, high channels and low channels. The Grey-Hoverman seems to do well with UHF DTV and high VHF. Most DTV seems to be UHF.
o Only some DTV is HD. Stations were given sub-channels. Some use only the main channel and switch back and forth between HD. Others put SD on one and HD on the other. Others use all for HD, with different content. The public television stations, strangely enough, seem to be making the best use of the sub-channels.
o The other prominent build-able design is called a Yagi. It consists of connected bow-ties, rather than zig-zag elements. The Yagi design is nice, because its gain is roughly even across UHF. The Grey-Hoverman seems to have better gain than the Yagi on some ranges, but cuts out in others. Check the frequencies of your local stations and compare them to the two antennas' gain charts before deciding.
o Why the range of channels for me? Well, in a valley the signal has echoes. Some echoes are stronger than others. Sometimes the amp makes the two echoes the same strength. In that case the converter box cannot lock in. Thus, if your location is subject to echoes (hills, valley, etc.), design your wiring to allow the easy removal of your amplifier.
o Also, atmospheric conditions seem to have an effect. On clear dry days we don't do so well; on wet or humid days, I think we could get New York City, if we wanted (we're in southern N.E.).
o Finally, going digital with a converter has one interesting benefit for you OSS fans. Since the Neuros OSD is still SD, converted DTV works nicely with it. I don't have one yet, but they are now on Amazon, and I am strongly considering getting one.
Computer Science is all about trying to find the right wrench to bang in the right screw. -T.Cumbo?
That's sort of true. You're correct that the over-the-air transition is only about over-the-air broadcasts, but cable providers may take this as an opportunity to make the switch too.
My cable service provider recently switched to all digital, requiring all my TVs to have a set-top box (I only had one set-top box prior).
You should follow John Walson's example and build a reception tower up on a hilltop with an array of antennas, run coaxial cable down into the valley, then split the coax and share the antenna with your neighbors. You could even call it the same thing, Community Antenna Television (CATV) and maybe even start charging for the service at a later time, making a business out of it.
The hurricane doesn't really affect anything in that market. In particular, the designated Emergency Alert System station for that market is the local PBS affiliate, and they are not shutting down their analog transmitter early for that exact reason.
Not to sound overly cynical about the whole issue, but I do some contract work for a big box retailer. Folks come in all the time seeking the $50 digital to analog converter boxes. Yet the individual stores typically only receive about a eight units a week and sell out within a few hours! Add to that, the overly complicated process of requesting $40 coupon/rebate certificates to defray most of the cost. Then let's not forget that the typical person seeking these boxes does not read Slashdot, is on a fixed income, and uses 'DTV' and 'HDTV' interchangeably, not really understanding the definition of either. So why such little supply for such high demand? Why the bureaucracy? Why the readily confused acronyms? Because the push to DTV allows corporate interests to make use of the prime spectrum currently allocated for analog broadcasts while the retailers get taxpayer funded advertising that essentially tells a gullible public that the path of least resistance is to go out and buy a new LCD or plasma television - The stores just happen to have plenty of them, and gee aren't they pretty! As far as corporate/government corruption is concerned, this is small potatoes compared to many examples seen here on pollution, war profiteering, and eroding civil liberties. However, the callousness I've observed in the push to sell you a bigscreen television--err I mean a converter box, if you really insist; is really going to hit hard in Middle America. I'm wondering if while mobs of social rights activists and anti-war protesters have had minimal effects on Washington, what will happen when a few million pensioners find themselves without access to television?
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I call "bullshit" on that.
The spectrum "giveaway" you speak of was actually an unfunded mandate. The broadcasters were forced to operate dual, redundant facilities for a few years and on 2/17, the "extra" spectrum is going to be summarily taken away from them.
In the meantime, the top 100 MHz of the UHF TV spectrum is being removed from TV service was auctioned off to the wireless industry for billions and billions of dollars.
How, exactly, did Hollywood benefit from that?
Any Slashdotter could do this
1. Get Digital receivers to decode only the channels you want them to watch.
2. Hook up the outputs to some UHF modulators.
3. Output the signals to your existing Television cabels.
4. Re-tune the TV's
Could be done for a few hundred dollars at most.
Some TVs may not be able to (or make sense to) have hooked up to a converter box. I wonder how many portable/pocket TVs exist in the U.S.?
Blog posting of someone realizing his portable TV will done away with.
There are a lot of great online resources to help with the transition. tvfool.com is great resource for understanding where you are in relation to local broadcast towers.
I blog about the transition in my free time (shameless plug - DTV Transition.
Presumably a normal curve: the lights go out the 17th, Best Buy has a busy week selling converter boxes, the media have something to report on, and it'll all work out. With the frequency of TV commercials about the conversion now, the non-stupid should only blame their own laziness.
Visited a couple network booths during our recent state fair to ask them when they would go 16:9 like their competitor NBC and their local news. Got a cameraman doing duty handing out posters at one and it wasn't very encouraging. Standardizing on 720p by February "but for all our cameras!" Got a lecture on how much this stuff costs and I lost count of how many times he phrased something in the hypothetical. "If you watch 1080, yes, you will notice a difference." I made a point at each time to tell him that, yes, I _do_.
So if the stations aren't in a competitive rush to get everything up and standardized at a high level, I wonder whether the majority of the public are very interested either.
us ain't ready. won't be. can't be. here's why: $. digital TVs cost over $200.USD. non-starter for the targeted demographic. another why: tech skills.my mother has Never Used the record button on her VCR. DVD? what's that? last why: there are just too many places in the Vast USA where there is NO ability to get affordable cable or satellite or both....and this audience is the one Still Watching Network TV. Main Stream Media and their TV affiliates will see double-digit-drops. does your ISP "cap" your activity? unanticipated FCC consequences.
What does a hurricane off the coast of New England (or farther, I haven't checked lately) have to do with turning off analog TV signals in North Carolina? Maybe Ike would be a little more relevant?
this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom. -- Lincoln, Gettysburg Address
Most newer (since about 1970s) US home developments are set up with homeowner associations. They manage common areas (playgrounds, pools, etc.) and establish rules (including fines) to ensure all properties maintain a good appearance. Covenants which must be conveyed with the title ensure each homeowner is obligated to play along. In almost all communities, the rules prohibit visible antennas on the justification they are an eyesore.
Homeowner association rules were putting satellite TV providers at such a disadvantage (compared to cable providers) that congress passed a law (about 1990) forcing homeowner associations to permit the newer, smaller antennas (less than a meter across). Older satellite antennas (three meter diameter) and broadcast antennas are still fair game.
Us stubborn people who don't want to pay for cable or satellite get by with rabbit ears or (like me) are willing to self-install an attic antenna.
You'll notice a similar phenomenon with respect to the subsidy program for converter boxes. Had it been anything but TV, we would have been swamped with politicians handwringing about public money going to enable to poor to sit on their asses in greater comfort. Because it's TV(and because, formally speaking, the converter subsidies are supposed to be paid out of the proceeds of the spectrum sale, which will make a huge difference, in the magic land were addition isn't associative) even Slashdot's crack squad of libertarians hasn't said too much about it.
By keeping the spectrum in the hands of the existing billionaire's club, their cozy cartel, and keeping out new competition which might actually innovate and actually compete with them.
--
make install -not war
The whole topic begs the question of how important it is for people to have television in the first place. If a guy doesn't have TV for a month while he waits for a coupon a coupon, that wouldn't kill him. I think waiting until the transition actually happens to buy an ATSC tuner is a pretty sensible approach in the spectrum of possible reactions.
-Dave
"Because the push to DTV allows corporate interests to make use of the prime spectrum currently allocated for analog broadcasts while the retailers get taxpayer funded advertising that essentially tells a gullible public that the path of least resistance is to go out and buy a new LCD or plasma television - The stores just happen to have plenty of them, and gee aren't they pretty! "
Cynical much? Yes they are pretty and I got two because the analog passed it's first smoke test after years of service. The picture's much better for the same size screen. Lighter weight and slimmer profile making it easier to hang on the wall. AND it can be a computer monitor as well as TV freeing up a PCI slot. So overall the transition has been a win win. Sorry it didn't work out for you.
Shai Schticks:"You don't make peace with friends, you make peace with enemies"
I was helping a relative with their new flat digital TV. As far as I could tell for that Digital TV, the only choice was autoscan, and it was a come back in an hour type operation. With the indoor amplified antenna it was only one station I think. It would be much faster to go to antennaweb.org, and put in the few physical channel available in their area. But now 9.1 isn't on the frequency assigned to channel 9 it's on 39, so I assume to reduce that confusion they didn't get them a choice and only allowed autoscan.
At home on Linux and the pcHDTV card autoscan didn't take all that long, but antennaweb.org said I was missing one station. After looking up the frequency, and telling it to tune to that, it locked. Autoscan is nice, but it assumes whoever did it got it completely right. It is also doesn't take additional information, like I know there is a channel here, tune to it, and I'll move the antenna around to see if I can pick anything up.
Tuning was one part of the problem. The other part was they thought their old TV had a better picture, they didn't realize they were still on analog, or how to switch it to digital or how to start an autoscan. Clearly there is a need for some more education. That or they just needed to read the manual.
That was implemented badly. I applied for and received two converter box coupons. The expiration date (!) on the coupon was two months after the date that the boxes were to be made available to the public. It was too bad that none of the merchants in my area had any product available prior to the date of the expiration date of these coupons.
Sig this!
Wow, I haven't seen such a reactionary bunch in a long time. I don't know about in the US, but here in Australia, DVB-T looks a lot better than analogue. I'm in the fringes of a minor city and I get flawless digital reception, and my analogue is plagued with snow, ghosting, and extremely poor colour representation. And before anyone blames my TV, it's the same TV for both. Where I live, digital is undeniably better than analogue.
Enough about my experience, to all of you who are having trouble with DTV, wait. It will get better. If you've survived on analogue for this time, as soon as it's shut off, so too is a portion of their advertiser revenue. It's in their interests to make sure as many people as possible have access to TV, and when DTV is the only game in town, that's what they'll deliver.
You know, there is a difference between trolling and pointing out the flaws in your reasoning. Just saying.
The FCC is allowing the stations to keep transmitting with a notice about the DTV transition. The FCC will also allow the stations to continue transmitting emergency and weather info on the analogs. However, the FCC is keeping the Feb 2009 deadline a hard deadline for a full shutdown of those analog transmitters. Does anyone on Slashdot read AVS Forum? You'd really think there would be more overlap.
I scream. You scream. I assume that means we're both acquainted with the problem. We proceed.
No!!! Americans are not ready! We are all too fat to go outside, so we can't even buy a TV! We are all going to die because of this digital switch! Arrggghghghhg.... *gurgle* *gurgle*
Oregon Public Television received a few million dollars last year from the Oregon taxpayers to convert translators to digital. So far they haven't converted a single one. Since there is no FCC mandate to convert them at this point I wonder how long they are going to stall. They certainly won't be getting any more subscription money from me until they get their act together.
Geez... they're already switching to digital TV?
I'm still trying to get my telegraph hooked up. Technology has me beat.
Congratulations. You live in an area with mild weather and blessed with reliable cable service.
Where I live (US Gulf Coast) my cable turns to crap quickly. Why? Well for one, I live in a very old city, that is heavily populated, and covers most of a county. It's much cheaper to use telephone poles for power and cable.
Also, comcast here in my neck of the woods don't seem to have battery backup in their distribution network. The power goes out in a section of town, so does the cable. I've had times where I had power but no cable.
Newer subdivisions do have buried utilities. Let me tell you a little secret... (Well at least here) Utility poles carry the power and signal wires until it reaches the subdivisions.
But I guess now that I know that you and and your brother have reliable cable, I can rest a little easier...
These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
O really? What is this thing called radio?
I remember back in the old days, people used to sit around a talking box and listen to music, news, and entertainment from a local live DJ.
Unfortunately, now a days most of these radio stations are owned by large media companies that automate most of their operations. Almost all of the radio stations in my area go to network feed after 6pm. The weird thing being that Television is almost exclusively network feed except for programming blocks allocated for local programming (usually syndicated shows), and yet they have actual human beings that man the news room. In fact, I heard rumors that they actually have people in the field reporting conditions and showing live video of the weather event.
But yes, there is radio. That trusty little talk box that allow us to hear music and talk radio. Hell I bet you some of the radio stations rebroadcast the television weather broadcasts during significant weather. Yea, just imagine sitting around an audio only device and listening to the weather man saying "As you can see on the right side of the screen..." and thinking to yourself man I wish I could look at what they were talking about. But no, I had to be the smart ass on slashdot who relied on the radio...
Or better yet, just imagine how nice it would be if you could look at the radar image being broadcasted on the TV and maybe even reading the scrolling text on the bottom. But your right, you can just wait for the next newsbreak or EBS on the radio.
Anyway, thank you dotfile, for reaquanting me with that old technology called radio. Now if only you can show me where the video comes out...
These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
Um, you are factually and provably wrong about that. 100 MHz of the spectrum was taken away from that billionaire's club of which you speak.
Try the fuck again.
Everything has its extremes and aberrations, and apparently you are one (at least in the context of television reception).
Fair amount? Really? Please...
Companies place broadcast towers where the people are. You just happen to be in a bad spot. But I'm sure when they chose the location for the tower, they picked a spot that allowed reception by *WAY* more people than just you.
I spent a good amount of time in the least populated area in New Mexico, and I can verify that the only OTA broadcast available was public radio. Cable or Satellite was a requirement for any sort of television viewing. However, my advice was aimed for the more densely populated areas where the majority of the people live.
I think you really meant to say that because you live in a location with poor reception, the changeover won't "make a god damn lick of difference" for you.
I am glad to hear that cable and satellite meet your entertainment needs, and that you won't be affected by the changeover.
These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
I see a lot of whining about the switch to digital from folks who claim to get fewer digital channels than analog.
Since anecdotes doth not evidence make, I would like to provide a link to an article where some folks actually analyzed what the real net impact of the transition is going to be to the average TV viewer.
The outcome? The peak of the gain/loss graph is at 14% of the U.S. population losing one channel. In other words, the majority of the population will break even or gain channels.
Um, it *IS* coming out of public money.
We the people own the spectrum in the USA and the "sale" of the spectrum should have directly gone into the treasury and not spent on anything else.
This is like that "broken window" story where people think that the store owner who's store window is vandalized is generating other business in the community for window repair people. It's a fallacy.
I wonder how many of those "suddenly without TV" people will just say, "fuck it" and do other things?
Tried it here in PDX with a DTV capture card. Most all the channels I expect are there and working nicely --and that's on a little goofy antenna.
Picture and sound were great. Too bad there is little on, and a TON of commercials.
Blogging because I can...
Since when is a person who speaks their mind about items obviously skewed considered "libertarian"?
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The forum has some updates, including details that the switch will happen at noon and a link to a live press conference starting at 10:30am.
>>>You live in an area with mild weather and blessed with reliable cable service.
Precisely. Which is why I tell the people *in my area* that "if they have cable, dish, or FiOS television, they don't need to worry about the February digital switchover."
Your location may require different advice.
The government is not your daddy. Its purpose is not to raid middle-class neighbors' wallets and give it to you.
The FCC has already passed a ruling that cable MUST provide analog to their customers until the year 2013. The FCC should add a second part to the ruling that states cable may not include a surcharge. Forcing analog customers to pay $5 a month to rent a box is ridiculous & greedy.
My PVR works with the digital box, because the digital box has a so-called "VCR Timer" that automagically switches channels at predetermined times.
The government is not your daddy. Its purpose is not to raid middle-class neighbors' wallets and give it to you.
Er, that doesn't even have anything to do with the overall spectrum auction. They don't get everything they want, just lots of it.
But since you're going to be a cunt when I'm just offering you some friendly insight, you go fuck yourself. With a WiMAX tower, bitch.
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make install -not war
I expected this thread to be about half, "kill your television" and half, "I get all the channels I need with rabbit ears already". I'm surprised to see neither really making any traction. With that said, this will be quite possibly the biggest non-issue since "Y2K". I know exactly ONE person (my office mate) who gets tv over the air. I haven't even seen over-the-air broadcasts in probably 10 years. Call me strange and all, but being a random guy on a random site about technology, I don't think it is weird that I haven't NOT had cable since 1988.
The only time I've ever heard TV audio on the radio was when tuning to the audio carrier of a local TV station. Radio stations aren't what they used to be, but then neither are TV stations.
Now just imagine yourself sitting in the dark, with no TV, no lights, nothing at all, wondering WTF is going on. Gosh, it sure would be nice to be able to listen to the radio so you 'd know what is coming your way. But no, you had to be the smartass on Slashdot who relied on the TV instead of keeping a battery powered radio around... possibly even one with receive coverage of the local amateur repeaters so you could listen to the storm spotters and know what's happening even before the broadcast stations.
But why would you advise against taking advantage of a conversion program that allows you to by a converter for a very reduced price?
Price of a converter is small change compared to what the cable company charges for monthly subscription.
These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
First of all, I was exchanging a smart ass comment for another one...
Nice. Nothing like listening to a bunch of arm chaired weather spotters giving fair weather reports...
These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
It doesn't really affect me because I haven't watched TV on a regular basis for a couple of decades. If there is a show I want to watch, I wait for it to come out in DVD. If I want current news, I check the web or read a newspaper. If there is an emergency that requires extremely current information, I listen to the radio.
I do pity those people who rely upon broadcast TV for their entertainment and/or information. But that IS a life style choice that they make and this change has been talked about for quite a few years not.
They'll adjust. I do suspect that there will be a lot of calls to the local TV stations from people that never listen to public service ads warning of the changes. (I wonder how many of these calls will be from channel flippers that never listen to commercials or public service ads?)
Same positive OTA experience here. Using the same old rabbit ears I can pull it at least as many DTV stations as analog, far more than the four major networks, and on some channels like public television I get several digital variants in programming (9-1, 9-2, 9-3, 9-5) instead of the one analog channel (9).
In addition, the image quality of the digital stations far outstrips the old analog signal which I consider unwatchable now. The Olympics were stunning in HD, and it was all free over the air.
Sounds like this is more an issue of your local broadcasters than digital vs. analog. Or maybe your TV has a crappy tuner.
Living atop the south hill in Pittsburgh, I pick up just about every station listed on TVFool.com, both analog and digital. I'm using a homebuilt antennas, HDHR, and MythTV (FTW!). In fact, I think I get only one single channel from (evil) Comcast Cable that I don't get from an antenna -- TBS. Reception totally depends on where you are, and your ability to pull in the signals. Next project is to build a Yagi to get the PBS stations from Ohio, and see if they have any UK Sci Fi.
Zhrodague.net - I do projects and stuff too.
You're not offering friendly insight, you're offering batshit conspiracy theories, and consequently there's no talking to you anyhow.
I know of at least one station that has already done this KLBY when the went fully-digital back in August. I'm sure there were others who did it even sooner. They cut the analog feed and are serving only the DTV feed to their area viewers. Of the 1629 stations in 211 markets who have informed NAB that they are broadcasting in digital, I'm sure more than a few of them are exclusively DTV.
I never said Digital Broadcasts don't exist, and I never said DTV isn't somewhat active. What I said was that it doesn't truly exist; because as far as the FCC is concerned to a degree it doesn't have to until Feb. 2009. This is a subtle but important difference.
The logic for most of what I said stems from this, particularly the other comment you wasted time arguing with. If this assumption is indeed incorrect than that whole statement (that I made, inferred from that premise) is invalid; no need to attack both. But since you felt the need to in such particular disorder I'll counter with, "And what law would that be?"
Secondly, and back to my main point. The link you provided is broken; tvfool.org does not exist; Not being familiar with it I tried tvfool.com which might be what you meant; but in any event couldn't find any sign of the review you spoke of. Which brings me to point three:
Ironically, after looking at your "reference" I discovered that they make the same point and conclusion that I do. In case you missed it have a read, particularly the 8th paragraph.
http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=50&Itemid=99999999&limit=1&limitstart=1
Either way, do you really think that those channels are going to cease to exist when the analog gets turned off? Similarly do you think advertisers won't notice the problem that fewer people are able to view the adds. OTA has a pretty good service record over the past 50 years; especially compared to Cable. Give them a chance to launch the thing before you rip into them.
By all means if come April things are as messed up as say they are now, sure you win you are right. What that means isn't even clear. The number of factors involved isn't simple enough to say its all FCC's fault or its all the OTA stations fault. Irregardless you can wave around your "I told you so" flag.
But until then, and at this point in time, I feel like the only thing you can do is have a little faith in the TV stations and demonstrate some patience. Either quit complaining about being an early adopter or actually counter something I (or anyone else) have said with a valid, substantiated point.
"Jazz isn't dead, it just smells funny" ~Frank Zappa
EdelFactor
No, they are required to have an ATSC tier by law - and the ATSC tier need only contain the contents of the local stations as per the must-carry rule.
Nowhere are they required to carry anything in QAM. They could all carry it in ATSC if they so chose. They are also not required to carry anything else in clear-QAM - they can carry it in encrypted-QAM if they wish. That's why they're required to provide a CableCard.
Every time I've visited the local Best Buy recently they've had a HUGE stack of converter boxes (well over 100).