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Google, Apple, and Others Remove Content Related To the Confederate Flag
davek writes with news that Google is removing results related to the Confederate Flag from Google Shopping, the company's online marketplace. They're also blocking advertisements involving the flag. They say, "We have determined that the Confederate flag violates our Ads policies, which don't allow content that's generally perceived as expressing hate toward a particular group." At the same time, Apple is removing from the App Store any games or other software featuring the Confederate Flag. This, of course, follows the recent shooting in South Carolina, which triggered a nationwide debate over whether the flag should be flown at government buildings (or anywhere). Major online merchant websites like eBay and Amazon have already taken the step of banning merchandise relating to the flag.
Tired of revisionist history on this nonsense, so why oh why do we still let an enemy oppressor flag still fly in this country? What are we celebrating by doing so?
StarTrekPhase2 - The Five Year Mission Continues!
Fucking liberal, knee-jerk, PC retards.
Search google for "confederate flag" and click the "shopping" tab.
https://www.google.com/#q=conf...
Now replace "confederate" with just about any other potentially offensive term (nazi, communist, rhodesia) and you get plenty of results.
(NOTE: I don't support flying the flag. It's a rebel flag and I don't like it. But banning it from the marketplace? That seems rather self-defeating)
6th Street Radio @ddombrowsky
Only Luddites want Luddite software with confederate flags.
Modern app appers want apps with app flags!
Apps!
Who fought to just leave. What is the definition of oppression?
But that is not sufficient reason to stop selling it to civilians. This is a country founded on the idea of Free Speech.
We believe that the best way to fight evil is to let evil speak so we can hear who is evil. Much better than outlawing their vile ideas and having to guess who secretly harbors them.
In other words, I want to be able to see what shmucks wear/use the flag so I know whom to avoid.
excitingthingstodo.blogspot.com
Amazon, WalMart et al, are still selling that sh!t on their sites.
Just Google Shopping and ads. Fair enough.
Not so much...
The US flag has flown over hundreds of other countries and we have killed or caused to be killed hundreds of thousands in countries we were never invited to. The US flag flies over the NSA, CIA, DOJ, 3 agencies that we are always pointing out how anti-american they are.
I allow others to have opinions I may not agree with so they will allow mine.
Pulling this garbage is not acceptable. A flag only represents something to those who believe in it. To the rest of us it is colored cloth at the end of a pole.
Great to see everyone jumping on the bandwagon. Focusing on the flag once again ignores the real problems since it's easier to find a "magic pill" to fix everything. This is like Obama's first election where, once the flag is down, everyone will declare an "end to racism" and happily ignore the real work involved with tackling endemic bias.
The removal of Confederate Battle Flag items from the market and such is a bad idea.
Walmart, K-Mart, Sears, etc., should all continue to sell "Redneck Pride" crap - promote it, even. Because such things are great visual cues as to who is a moron/dolt/idiot without having to actually talk to them.
--
BMO
Ban the free speech that offends. After all, if you're not offensive, what do you have to lose? And NSA cameras in our houses. Let's get that done. After all, if you're not a criminal, what do you have to lose? And what's that you're eating? I think you should eat healthier. Let's ban that. And then lets all go on about how great America is, unless someone finds that offensive, or terrorists can use it somehow, or it's fattening...
from a British perspective, the US flag is a rebel flag
True. But history is written by the victors, and the United States defeated Great Britain in both the American Revolution and the War of 1812. The Confederate States lost its only war.
I don't understand why there has suddenly been such a huge push to eradicate the rebel flag. It isn't like there has been a sudden groundswell in people who are opposed to racism or race-related violence...
To dedicate so much time, energy and attention on this flag only brings more attention to it, and imparts it with some weird power in pop culture. If what the confederate flag allegedly stands for is so offensive (there's still plenty of heated debates on that topic burning up other parts of the internet), spend that energy combating the groups that push and perpetuate that ideology.
The response to a negative influence in a culture shouldn't be to attack a symbol associated with the influence. Combat the influence.
[nb: I do not own a confederate flag and question the motives of those that fly it]
An internal system operation returned the error "The operation completed successfully.".
Now I WANT ONE!
A flag or something, just because those SJW are banning it
Exactly this. A government agency (state, local, or federal) has no business flying a Confederate flag any more than they can fly the US flag upside down while lit on fire. Citizens, however, have free speech and can use that to express themselves in almost any way they want so long as that way doesn't hurt someone else. If you want to paint a big Confederate flag on your truck while wearing a Confederate flag jacket and a "The South Shall Rise Again" pin (with Confederate Flag), go ahead. Of course, the rest of us have our rights to form opinions of you based on your Confederate flag obsession.
All in all, I think the flag issue is a side track. Yes, it's partially related to the church shooting, but it's not the whole problem. You could ban and burn every single last Confederate flag in existence and it wouldn't solve the problem. So by all means take it off of government buildings, but then let the issue rest and move on to more important issues related to what happened.
My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
Ok, so "Confederate Flag" brings zero results but "Nazi Uniform" pulls up exactly that. And that's OK. I don't want retailers being the morality police and more than I want my ISP to block content it doesn't agree with.
If I want a small Confederate Flag for a historical display, or a re-enactment, or other event these retails think I shouldn't be able to get it? That's crap.
Oh, they can still buy it - retailers simply aren't helping them do so. And in "those states", I guarantee you there are TONS of regional retailers that will continue to sell them - probably in massive numbers now.
So, don't worry - such people will have even more such flags that the rest of us can use to identify them.
StarTrekPhase2 - The Five Year Mission Continues!
Shall we remove all confederate items from museums? Shall we rewrite the history books so the civil war never happened? If we remove the confederate flag from everywhere, will that mean slavery never happened? The civil war happened. Slavery happened. Racism happened, and it is still happening. Removing some flags will not advance the goal of eliminating racism.
Instead of quibbling about a flag that some people find offensive, why don't we work to fight actual racism. Lets stop looking the other way when whites are treated differently than other races. Fighting so hard over symbols while we are mostly ignoring the reality of racism in the US seems counterproductive.
OK, I do see the point of removing the flag from statehouses, but historical displays and museums...give me a break. And, yes this is happening, as crazy as this seems.
The problem is that they're not just removing racist bumperstickers etc but also removing legitimate historical material which happens to have a Confederate flag because (duh) it's about the Civil War.
E.g. the computer game Ultimate General: Gettysburg, who just blogged about Apple removing their program. They note that "We receive a lot of letters of gratitude from American teachers who use our game in history curriculum to let kids experience one of the most important battles in American history from the Commander's perspective."
http://www.ultimategeneral.com/blog/our-game-has-been-removed-from-appstore
Ironic that about the only place left to buy a Confederate Flag is the Black Market
While it's certainly fine for them to remove items featuring the confederate flag in non-historical contexts, as least in the sense that they have that right, they have not done any of this on a case-by-case basis. An Ars article has detailed some of the historical uses of the flag in civil war games that were pulled from the Apple store.
Your country was founded on the principle that the government should not stop anybody from speaking. It wasn't founded on the principle that corporations must be compelled to distribute other people's material regardless of content. Apple are not obligated to publish this material.
Nobody is outlawing anything. This is an example of a business choosing not to publish something.
Bogtha Bogtha Bogtha
You do not understand free speech.
Private companies DO NOT have to allow things which they find objectionable. Censoring your own product line does NOT run contrary to the idea of free speech.
It only applies to the GOVERNMENT - that is, they can't make it illegal to produce/sell/display your own flags.
Any citizen or private company CAN choose not to carry offensive things.
So, I'm not going to be able to get Ken Burns "Civil War"?
History is always revisionist. New things pop up. I actually read a paper in the Journal of Economic On another note - History were the researchers went through English church registries to study some of the effects of the Industrial Revolution on families.
With more and more old documents being scanned, historians are using data mining - Big Data - techniques and are discovering new things about history all the time.
History is not chiseled in stone.
Had this same conversation with my wife. You can no longer buy a Confederate Flag at Wal-Mart, but you can still buy guns.
Would you rather have folks self-identify as racists with license plates, bumper stickers, t-shirts, etc. so you can avoid them (and their guns)? Or would you rather not know who the (armed) racists in the crowd are?
So all of these private companies are removing anything with the confederate flag. They're doing this for their own reasons. No government entity is telling them what to do here. They're simply responding to market pressure. Free market pressure.
However, the same mouth breathers who supported the pizza shop to refuse to cater a gay wedding (which makes no sense since it's rare at best to see a pizza shop catering a wedding in the first place) are the same mouth breathing dolts who are acting like everyone is stomping all over their rights. These same cretins are the ones who are always yelling about giving companies more freedom to do whatever it is they want without interference.
But, like so many things, this is a case of "You should have all the freedom in the world to do anything right up until the point where you choose to do something I don't like". The hypocrisy is overwhelming but not in the least bit surprising.
I guess Ultimate General Gettysburg is getting pulled :(
May your blade chip and shatter.
Ever heard of Corvin Amendment (approved by Lincoln!) which would preserve slavery in states where it was legal? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Basically it was offer to the South to keeep their slaves, if only they would not leave the Union!
They still fought the war to leave, so it was not "all about slavery", more about tariffs.
Paul B.
However on further thought, Google Inc can also make the decision to not support it. If customers don't like it they can go someplace else.
Google is a corporate entity, they can't outlaw anything, but they can choose to not to support it. You don't have to use Google, Companies don't have to sell through Google, and application makers don't have to sell through Google... You might be missing out on some big markets, but you can always go someplace else. Unless everyone follows suit, in which case if you believe there is a big market for it, start your own service...
I support free speech and expression, so if someone wants to promote an idea I'm not okay with (even if it's slavery, treason, secession, not paying taxes, whatever) that expression is something I wholeheartedly support. I reserve the right to freely express myself and tell them they're a blustery fool, but I would not want their freedom of expression to be mitigated just because that's my opinion of them.
As for the Confederate Flag, why stop selling it? It's not like we don't promote slavery to drive the commercial gears of the economy so long as it's outside of America. What, you think those cheap goods you buy at Wal-Mart and Amazon were NEVER touched by a slave at some point in raw materials gathering, parts creation, and/or final assembly? Come on now. Grow up.
This is just the latest PR craze that corporations are responding to in order to get a bit of positive press. It has nothing to do with these corporations actually giving a crap. It's a token gesture and they will still gladly take advantage of the slave labor going on in other countries that allows their business to thrive globally.
What a crock. If only we actually cared about the real issues. Thousands upon thousands continue to work in sweat shops, barely living a life at all, and we can't be damned about them, but God forbid one person with a vendetta should carry out a misguided Crusade against another culture on our soil. Oh no, we can't have that!
Terrible though recent events may be, we always focus on the small matters that generate big press. Heart disease, outside slavery, child labor, gang control of lucrative export crops like avocados.....most of this usually flies under the radar despite more people dying because of these things, but a few people create a spectacle of horror and all of a sudden we "care" because it's the socially popular thing to do.
the Confederate flag means slavery, hatred, bigotry and treason
It's a god damned piece of colored cloth. People who claim it means something more than that are either mindlessly parroting other, louder people, or they have an agenda of their own. The idea of outlawing a piece of colored cloth is about as logical as outlawing a plant.
Look, the Confederate flag means slavery, hatred, bigotry and treason against the USA. It has no business being flown by any US government authority.
But that is not sufficient reason to stop selling it to civilians. This is a country founded on the idea of Free Speech.
But this is not some kind of law forbidding the sale of said flag, this is individual companies and/or people decided they want nothing to do with it and not selling or displaying it in their ads? To put it another way, if you had a store selling flags, do you think you should be forced to sell Nazi flags? Not if you are _allowed_ to sell it if you wanted to, but that you _have_ to offer it because of Free speech? Nonsense of course. I would support your right to sell the Confederate flag (well, if I was American). But if you don't want to, then well, up to you (and good on you... but that would be my personal opinion).
Ha ha!
Apple is intellectually and emotionally dishonest by removing Civil War games that show the Confederate Battle Flag for the Confederate Army. This is stupid politically correct over reaction on their part. If you have a game about the Confederacy, showing the Confederate Flag makes sense in the game to be historically accurate.
Taking down Confederate flag at a State Capitol makes sense, and so does showing the Confederate Battle Flag in a Civil War game. The loss of historical understanding in the US is becoming alarming.....
Google '"For the people" wargame', and you'll get a bunch of links for the civil war card-driven game designed by Mark Herman and published by GMT games. Now, click over to the 'shopping' tab... and you get entirely unrelated content. NOTHING related at all! There are Old Testament games, WWE raw, and a book by Dan Gilmour on journalism, but no content relating to the American Civil War at all.
They're not just going after white supremacist material--they're going after any historically accurate depiction of the period.
(In the game in question, the stars-and-bars are used on the cover, mapboard, occasionally in the rules, in a few cards, and on some counters, and each place it's used is paralleled by a union equivalent)
I am sick of all this political correctness.
Beneath all the hatred of stars and bars for its racist overtones, it is also about suppressing any challenge to centralized federal powers at the expense of individual and states rights.
Remember the 10th amendment !
it's easier to find a "magic pill" to fix everything.
WHO EXACTLY said this was going to "fix everything"? Your straw man and nobody else!
What's being "fixed" here is an attitude. Racists see the racist flag flying over government buildings and they think it lends legitimacy to their cause.
I expect both of the game players that were interested in it are pretty disappointed over not being able to buy that game.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
That makes sense. Clearly the confederate flag killed those innocent people.
Nothing to do with the gun.
I suppose the dukes of hazard will be removed from youtube.
I guess all is well in the world, then, right?
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
It's good to see the US is starting to understand. Freedom of speech is more of a hindrance to the workings of a civil society than an asset. We Europeans know that, and we are better off without wrong ideologies. People do not need nor actually want "freedom". They need unity and purpose and it's up to the State - or in our case, the European Union - to provide that. Americans need to accept that they can't progress unless they learn to follow their leaders.
Me and Rush Limbaugh are both wondering, just how is the American flag any better? It, likewise, flew over slavery, the subsequent racism, and was (still is!) used in imperialist wars. It covered — still does at times — sexism and parochial bigotry.
Whatever you can say against the Confederate flag, can also be said about the American. Yeah, the latter may have been used for some good, but the sheer period of its usage (over 2 centuries and counting), makes it much worse than the former, whose country only existed for what, four years? Five?
Can it get any worse? Yes it can! A recent study has shown, that simply seeing the flag can cause a hitherto innocent victim to vote Republican! And even a single exposure can last for up to 8 months!
As soon as we are done with KKKonfederate rag, we must turn our energies onto the AmeriKKKan one.
In fact, why wait? Let's act NOW!! .
Maybe, those misunderstood ISIS warriors destroying the symbols of defunct states that practiced slave-ownership are onto something, huh? I for one have always doubted Pythagorean Theorem — what can a long-dead White slave-owner possibly know about any hypotenuse?
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
So google isn't free to censor their market place and search results?
It doesn't mean slavery or hatred or bigotry or treason. The national flag of the Confederate States does means secession and slavery, but that's not the flag we're talking about. (That flag is currently the state flag of Georgia, the only difference being the state seal added inside the circle of stars, so you should take up those issues with the state of Georgia.) The flag we're talking about was created to boost morale of the soldiers, and was only for use in battle. It was created first for the Northern Virginia Infantry and was adopted by other state infantries as it gained popularity. It was not a political flag. To the soldiers and their families it symbolized bravery and valor in battle and it honored the dead. After the war it was adopted by the United Confederate Veterans, and it was referred to as "the soldiers' flag."
Its meaning has evolved in complex ways after the war, but if we're talking about its early history its meaning always had to do with the honoring the dead and the brave, and not so much with the political causes for which those people were sacrificed.
That flag represents the brutal subjugation and slavery of human beings for profit. It is akin to the Nazi swastika.
http://www.theatlantic.com/pol...
Some are commenting that Google is not removing shopping results for 'swastika'. That's Google's editorial policy. It has nothing to do with free speech or any other individual rights. It is a double standard though.
In the carolinas and most of the south, this star spangled rag does a disappearing act every 2-3 years. Governors demand it removed and champion equality/unity. successors have it reinstated and champion heritage and history. its removal is about as permanent as the debt ceiling and it in no way addresses the core issue:
in 1865 a band of wealthy plutocrats refused to give up the concept of owning people as pets and cattle. they were so ardently committed to slaves they invented concepts like 3/5ths of a man and an entire caste system of inferiority to justify this system. it worked to prevent poor white sharecroppers form colluding with blacks, but it also kept the federal government from really bothering with the whole thing until it was legitimately scrutinized. 150 years later after a crushing civil war loss, civil rights amendment loss, interracial marriage equality loss, equal housing opportunity HUD loss, equal employment opportunity loss, and an intractable legacy of hate and misery toward blacks, the south is grappling with the seemingly incomprehensible intolerance and disgust for their flag by a majority of americans that no longer care to quietly pretend 13 states are just 'racist' and thats okay. The problem is a neoconservative theocratic moral and ethical sewer culture that feigns patriotism whenever its challenged and cries bloody murder at the very thought of putting its money where its southern hospitality mouth so readily rests.
we have held your hand long enough. Gay marriage, women's healthcare, minority rights, and the abortion debate have all been settled for you by a majority of your peers.
Good people go to bed earlier.
is defined by protecting the right to say things you don't agree with.
This is every bit as stupid as people going to jail in Germany for teaching their dog to give a Nazi salute. (they're even trying to re-educate the dog to shake instead ... who's the crazy fuck now?)
People are still able to sell or purchase a Confederate flag. It is not illegal and I have not heard any reports of the federal or state governments suggesting that is should be illegal. What we are hearing is that major retail (and online) outlets are opting not to sell it. Opting not to sell something is a similar level of "right" as is opting to sell something (that is legal to sell).
You could argue that with the consolidation of sellers (Walmart, Amazon, etc.) there are fewer purchasing choices and that the consolidated sellers have increased influence as to what is in the marketplace, but that issue goes beyond the Confederate flag and other specific goods.
Civil war games with no Rebel flag? How can I relive the triumph of Gettysburg?
We have determined that the Confederate flag violates our Ads policies, which don't allow content that's generally perceived as expressing hate toward a particular group.
But it's alright for them to do things that are perceived as expressing hate toward a particular group? Which is to say, expressing hate towards those men and women of our armed forces who fought and died to protect the rights of assholes to express asshole-ish opinions?
(Yeah yeah, it's their sandbox and they can kick out whoever and whatever they want. That just means I cannot sue to have their decision reversed. It doesn't mean I'm not allowed to complain about it.)
I meant to say "fewer convenient purchasing choices".
The US flag is just cloth, no different that the rags I use to light my bbq grill. The US Constitution is just a piece of paper, as are all of the articles in the Bill of Rights - made of the same stuff I wipe my butt with after take a shit. Your family is mainly a bunch of water and protein stuffed into a semi-permeable membrane, no different than the steak I'll have for dinner.
Sorry - symbols and people are more than the base materials from which they are made. And that one stands for the desire of one group of people to own, buy, sell and dispose of other humans as they saw fit. And it's true whether or not you realize that is the case does not make it not so.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
You can't buy a confederate flag at Wal-Mart, but you can still buy your guns and ammo there to kill those goddamed niggers.
Look, the Confederate flag means slavery, hatred, bigotry and treason against the USA.
Does it? I was born in the northeast and am now located in the south. Race riots were in full swing when I was a kid. I have no love for the Confederate anything and don't feel it should be flown on federal buildings, and probably not state buildings either. But if someone wants to purchase one, then they damn well should be allowed to.
I don't hang out with racists, so I don't know what that flag represents to everyone who chooses to display it. If they claim it's not due to racism, then I'm inclined to believe it. The civil war is over and the south lost. I wasn't around 150 years ago, so I'll reserve judgement on what it was over. But if someone feels it simply represents their heritage, then so be it. In the city I live in, it's been part of the city seal for well over 100 years. Now there's debate about changing this. The British flag is also part of that seal. Shouldn't it be removed too? After all, at one point it represented oppression too.
The swastika was around for a couple thousand years before the Nazi party decided to adopt it as their symbol. (and no, I'm not trying to Godwin this post, it's just a very commonly known symbol). If a group can adopt a symbol that is meant to represent prosperity and turn it into what is now associated with evil. Why can't a flag that represented something bad be reclaimed as something else? It is happening with all kinds of things these days. There's a Jewish magazine called "Heeb". That was considered a very derogatory term when I was much younger. I've been referred to as "nigga" by friends, which I find offensive no matter who it comes from. But it's the intent that's more important than the word, symbol, or flag in this case.
It's supposed to be a free country. If someone wants to be a racist ass, then so be it. As long as they aren't infringing on anyone else's rights, they should be free to be as stupid as they wish to be. The First Amendment is not there to protect speech that everyone agrees with.
This whole Confederate flag business is definitely not a distraction from the recent Senate vote to fast track things like the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP). Look, a squirrel!
Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
A nutjob walks into a church and shoots 9 people. That means we get rid of the Confederate Flags? WTF, the flag didn't kill anybody, shit confederate war soldiers didn't kill those people in the church. It's non sequitur. Getting rid of them through outlets like this will mean, more people will buy them and fly them is all and oh by the way Amazon, Apple, Walmart et all please remove anything with the ANC colors or those of the Black Panthers and Rainbow flags while you're at it; they offend me.
Harrison's Postulate - "For every action there is an equal and opposite criticism"
You guys are screwed. Good luck recovering and creating a reasonable culture.
Helping with organizational effectiveness is our job.
It's interesting that your excellent and informative post lingers with a score of 1, while the ignorant drivel you replied to sits at a fat score 5 (Informative).
It just shows how little the present-day public knows about their own history and, arguably, the most important event that happened in US since the Revolutionary War.
Sounds like the free market in action. I'm sure all the libertarian types will be in favor of this.
Private companies DO NOT have to allow things which they find objectionable. Censoring your own product line does NOT run contrary to the idea of free speech.
Exactly. If you work at or do business with Oracle, try saying something bad about Oracle and see how long you last.
So it's apparently fine and everyone is in love with the idea of banning the Confederate Battle Flag but if it were a Rainbow GLBTQ flag they were banning there'd be charges of hate crimes. I support these groups banning these Battle Flag products from their retail systems. If you are going to allow this kind of right of association you also have to let business like photographers and cake decorators choose who they do business. Governments can't be allowed to tell me who I can and can not associate with or do business with.
It all starts at 0
That's a fine sentiment, but you may be too busy to help barc001, because Pamela Geller's need for support to exercise her right to mock Mohammed is in even graver danger...
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Are these going to be verboten too?
Will Google and others ban suppliers, blogs, websites announcing events and unit mustering?
can't have that general lee around any more.
Agree or disagree with the confederate flag – just remember – True freedom is the right to proclaim you’re beliefs in the face of those who would spend their lives fighting those beliefs.
Crazies will find an outlet, killing freedom won’t stop them. Vigilance and education is the best weapon against ignorance.
All that happened here is the further squashing of freedom.
Technically it's been flown by states (and possibly other more local forms of government) which points to the concept of state vs.US gov't rights. Unfortunately the concept of associating the Confederate flag with the assertion of state's rights has been poisoned, melded, or used as a fig leaf to justify (un)popular southern attitudes towards slavery and then civil rights. That S.C.couldn't be bothered to lower the Confederate flag to half mast after the tragic shooting should have put to rest any arguments justifying it for non-racist reasons (not that yet another reason was really needed).
Wow, saying the confederate flag means slavery, hatred, bigotry and treason and it gets a +5 Insightful? The second part may be insightful but somehow this isn't marked flamebait.
Some people say the flag means that, some people say it means states rights, who knows. But do people actually believe someone who flies the flag is saying bring back slavery or a succession from the Union? Maybe they just want to stand for a weaker Federal government, something many people support today.
Maybe the reason they fly the flag is to respect their ancestors who fought and died for what they believe in. Would you ask someone to take down the original U.S. flag that so heavily fought for their rights and owned slaves?
My point is, people are afraid of a flag that is being flown for many reasons. But the fact remains, that those spreading all of this fear of the flag are just as guilty of perpetrating hatred as those they accuse of flying the flag...and in most cases more so.
I think I'll buy a confederate flag, just to support the right to own a confederate flag. Does that make me a racist? Will America ever stop generalizing everything with labels just to make complicated issues easier? Stay tuned...
Note: Captcha was encroach
If you won't address the substance, attack the symbol.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Who fought to just leave. What is the definition of oppression?
Bull. Every confederate state's secession declaration prominently mentioned preserving slavery. Slavery is oppressive in case you weren't clear on that.
And more on point to the article, government buildings can fly the Betsy Ross version which supported many things we oppose today. Buildings can fly a state flag even though it isn't the U.S. flag. As long as they aren't flying the confederate flag in place of the U.S. flag, who cares? Many Americans fought for that flag and were brothers, welcomed in the Union. Why shouldn't their memory be?
"We have determined that the Confederate flag violates our Ads policies, which don't allow content that's generally perceived as expressing hate toward a particular group." I call bullshit: https://www.google.com/search?...
Warning! Keep Out of Eyes! Wash Out with Water! Don't Drink Soap! Dilute! Dilute!
Some groups use the Confederate battle flag for that purpose.
The KKK will march with that flag. But they'll also carry the US flag, the Texas state flag, and others. Are we going to ban those too?
Ever heard of Corvin Amendment (approved by Lincoln!) which would preserve slavery in states where it was legal? Basically it was offer to the South to keeep their slaves, if only they would not leave the Union! They still fought the war to leave, so it was not "all about slavery", more about tariffs.
Bull. Every confederate state's secession declaration prominently mentioned preserving slavery. The confederate 1%'s wealth was built upon slavery. Various bullshit excuses were made to sell the war to the confederate 9x% who generally were not slave owners and would not be willing to risk their lives to defend the institution of slavery. Hence the northern domination, states rights and other bullshit excuses. One excuse used to sell the war was not entirely bullshit, many people's primary loyalty was to their state not the federal government, true in the north too. Some fought for this reason but the simple true is that despite this personal motivation they were inherently defending the slave based economy of the confederate 1%, the 1% who made the decision to go to war. The 9x% were not part of the decision so their motivations were irrelevant to the initiation of the war.
Why did I use 9x% rather than 99%? There was some racist crazy element that would risk their lives to defend slavery even though they had no personal economic stake in slavery. In other words the minority that would become the "night riders", the hard core KKK members (i.e. the actual lynchers not the mere cross burning flag wavers).
The Union was taken, by (the) North ..., from a contractual institution that can either be cleaved to or scrapped, and turned into a divinized entity, which must be worshipped, and which must be permanent, unquestioned, all-powerful. There is no heresy greater, nor political theory more pernicious, than sacralizing the secular. But this monstrous process is precisely what happened when Abraham Lincoln and his northern colleagues made a god out of the Union. If the British forces fought for bad King George, the Union armies pillaged and murdered on behalf of this pagan idol, this âoeUnion,â this Moloch that demanded terrible human sacrifice to sustain its power and its glory.
... . We remember the care with which the civilized nations had developed classical international law. Above all, civilians must not be targeted; wars must be limited. But the North insisted on creating a conscript army, a nation in arms, and broke the 19th-century rules of war by specifically plundering and slaughtering civilians, by destroying civilian life and institutions so as to reduce the South to submission. Shermans infamous March through Georgia was one of the great war crimes, and crimes against humanity, of the past century-and-a-half. Because by targeting and butchering civilians, Lincoln and Grant and Sherman paved the way for all the genocidal honors of the monstrous 20th century. There has been a lot of talk in recent years about memory, about never forgetting about history as retroactive punishment for crimes of war and mass murder. As Lord Acton, the great libertarian historian, put it, the historian, in the last analysis, must be a moral judge. The muse of the historian, he wrote, is not Clio, but Rhadamanthus, the legendary avenger of innocent blood. In that spirit, we must always remember, we must never forget, we must put in the dock and hang higher than Haman, those who, in modern times, opened the Pandoras Box of genocide and the extermination of civilians: Sherman, Grant, and Lincoln.
For in this War Between the States, the South may have fought for its sacred honor,
Perhaps, someday, their statues, like Lenins in Russia, will be toppled and melted down; their insignias and battle flags will be desecrated, their war songs tossed into the fire. And then Davis and Lee and Jackson and Forrest, and all the heroes of the South, âoeDixieâ and the Stars and Bars, will once again be truly honored and remembered. The classic comment on that meretricious TV series The Civil War was made by that marvelous and feisty Southern writer Florence King. Asked her views on the series, she replied: I didnt have time to watch The Civil War. Iâ(TM)m too busy getting ready for the next one. In that spirit, I am sure that one day, aided and abetted by Northerners like myself in the glorious copperhead tradition, the South shall rise again.
~The grand unifying truth is that the State's power to change us now exceeds our power to change the State.
but I'm surprised how low the level of discussion has been here.
Amazon, Google, etc are private companies. They are not the government. They can remove whatever they want and it's not a free speech issue.
Or have these companies reached a level of market dominance where they are like "common carriers", and if they stop selling something for political reasons, it basically means that you can't buy it anywhere and it becomes a sort of free speech issue?
That's the only potentially interesting discussion here - and nobody's having it.
They're already tumbling down the slippery slope at full speed. Why stop now with the insanity?
Utter bullshit.
No. It was absolutely about slavery. The documents and statements written at the time of secession were all about slavery. The statements made after the war had all the other reasons, revisionist history was being written by the confederates once the defeat was imminent.
The north would absolutely have made a pre-war deal to let slavery continue in the existing slave states. The long vicious debate in congress had been about the expansion of slavery. The south wanted to maintain the equilibrium and wanted half the new states added to the union to be slave states. The south feared that in the future a non-slave majority could abolish slavery and destroy the base of their wealth and economy. The north wanted slavery confined to existing slave states, maybe they would go for self-determination of a territory knowing that most would go non-slavery. In negotiation terms confinement was their aspirational point but self-determination was their resistance point.
So now war film with have nazi symbols blurred and toys/games with nazi enemies will be banned. Since, ya know, i can't flt a nazi flag. You American guys are so free it makes me sick!
just a question.... is North & South game already banned because of this stupidity?
You guys are screwed. Good luck recovering and creating a reasonable culture.
If you think this is bad, then you should see what's happening in American universities:
http://vox.com/2015/6/3/8706323/college-professor-afraid
captcha: autocrat
The Confederate battle flag has not been banned. It has merely been removed from product offerings and search results by private corporations and the national park service. You are still free to purchase and display that flag.
The tables selling the collectable knives at the flea markets will be selling tons of the flags. More now than before.
I know of a couple former bakery and pizza shop owners that would disagree with you.
First, the popularity of the Confederate battle flag being flown over the state houses of US states in the 20th century didn't start until the early days of the civil rights movement. Anyone who thinks it's a coincidence that Mississippi and Georgia and Alabama and South Carolina, etc decided to start flying the Confederate battle flag when black people started fighting for civil rights in those states probably thinks "it's all about states' rights and tariffs", too.
Second, the guy who designed the Confederate battle flag made it crystal clear in his own words:
Yessir, those are the exact words written by William Tappan Thompson, the designer of said flag. Not "fighting to maintain states' rights" or "fighting to something something tariffs", but rather, "the heaven ordained supremacy of the white man over the inferior or colored race". He even referred to it in his newspapers (because he was the founder of the Savannah Morning News) as "the White Man's Flag".
Now who wants to step up and tell me that the Confederate battle flag is not, in 2015, first and foremost a symbol of racism and hatred? The line forms right here in front of my fuzzy ass which is available for your kissing pleasure.
http://www.theatlantic.com/pol...
http://mic.com/articles/121082...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
You are welcome on my lawn.
Censorship is never okay.
This is revisionist history. The North won so obviously they twisted the truth in the history books to make the Southern states out to be demons. Of course they would. MOST southerners DID NOT own slaves during that time. Yet we all went to war. Congress made a series of aggressive moves that pushed the southern states into a war.
No, the revisionist history is from the south. At the time of secession, one secession declaration after another repeatedly cited slavery. The "aggression" was the north wanting to confine slavery to existing slave states with the goal of adding non-slave states to the union and eventually voting in abolition. That was the confederate nightmare, well the nightmare of the confederate 1%. Its this confederate 1% whose wealth and power was slave based that made the decision to go to war, who wrote those declarations.
The confederate 99% didn't make the decision to go to war, you are partially correct that they were generally not economically vested in slavery and most likely not willing to risk their lives to defend slavery. So the 1% had to sell the war to the 99% using different arguments. Imagine that, a war waged for one reason but sold to the public for other reasons. So while some confederate soldiers may not have been willing to fight for slavery itself, they in fact did so because that was the absolute cause behind the war, why the 1% voted for war.
The confederate soldiers were the pawns of the confederate politicians. Pawns that defended their "betters" economic interests, slavery. Yes, this truth hurts. Hence the revisionism, hence the focus on great-great-great-grandpappy's love for his state to rebrand a symbol of the defense of slavery as a symbol of heritage.
Coming soon to a country near you - the Great Firewall of China, ensuring that you only get to see company-approved media. We'll protect the shit out of you.
Wow, saying the confederate flag means slavery, hatred, bigotry and treason and it gets a +5 Insightful?
[...]
Maybe the reason they fly the flag is to respect their ancestors who fought and died for what they believe in.
I think the whole point here is that their ancestors believed in slavery, hatred, bigotry and treason.
You may want to read up on the subject. The Civil was did not start because of slavery and was not because of slavery.
It is you who need to read up, for example read what was written at the time of secession. Secession declaration after secession declaration cites the institution of slavery of the primary cause.
After the was the great coverup began in the south, the rebrand the war as something else. In particular to rebrand the war in terms of some of the sales pitches the 1% used to recruit the 99% for the army. The fact remains that the 1% made the decision to go to war and that decision was made to defend the basic of the wealth and power, slavery. What the 99% thought about why they were fighting does not change this fact, does not change why the war was started. If the war was started over slavery then the 99% fought to defense slavery, period, what thoughts they had otherwise was just the sales pitch made by the 1%. Image that, a war fought for one reason but sold to the public for different reasons.
So you believe the US federal government should have the authority to allow or disallow what flag a state chooses for her state flag?
You must live in a Northern State, Down south our history books tell a different story.
Yes, your Southern history books ignore all the state secession documents that clearly state the preservation of the institution of slavery as a main cause for war. They ignore the fact that the decision makers, the 1%, decided to vote for war and to initiate war to defend their source of wealth and power, slavery. Instead your history books like to focus on the cover stories that the 1% used to sell the war to the 99% with. It doesn't matter if great-great-great-grandpappy didn't personally fight to protect slavery in his own mind, he in fact did so by defending the confederacy which as a government was inherently about the preservation of slavery.
Meanwhile, the Taliban and ISIS continue to destroy religious artifacts and historical monuments that offend their religious beliefs. But this is different, right? We just want to pretend it didn't happen and erasing a small part of it help make it more "okay".
The Confederate flag is a white supremacist symbol
That flag represents the brutal subjugation and slavery of human beings for profit. It is akin to the Nazi swastika.
The current USA flag is a violent terrorist organization symbol.
That flag represents the forceful displacement and annexing of natives of the land they overtook, followed by the overthrowing of their British government by force and violence.
It represents the very definition of a terrorist organization by every sovereign nation including the USA and the annexing of the land a second time from the very British government that just did the same.
if mobile apps can only be installed via app stores (which for 99% of phone using Americans is the case)
The vast majority of Android-powered phones, whether Google Play or Fire OS flavored, have an "Unknown sources" checkbox that the user can enable to install APKs from elsewhere. So among mobile phones that can run apps of some sort, that leaves feature phones, iPhone, and AT&T-branded Android devices prior to May 2011, such as Motorola Backflip, HTC Aria, and Samsung Captivate (Galaxy S1). And even on these early Android devices, the user can load apps through a USB cable using the Android Debug Bridge (ADB) application.
To put in madly, June 2015 is when U.S. Conservative Chechens have come home to roost from a hand hugely overplayed. ACA subsidies have not only been held as valid regalutory measures, but required by the legislation. And now the confederate flag. The error in the logic is that most state houses do not fly other enemy flags. The only enemy flag some fly is the confederate flag. And instead of just keeping it on the down low, they made sure it was always in the face of everyone as a symbol of how whites are still fighting against the blacks or the Mexicans to whoever wanted to take over our country and rape our women. Both of these are strategic losses as a result of overconfidence. And it is a loss because the flag is no longer about heritage, which was a valid argument. The bigots have kept it at such a high profile, that it has lost its dignity. To be clear, a Deep South person, so oI see that some do see a heritage and history, but that has been destroyed by the boots. So as soon as NC builds a Hilter memorial and outs a nazi flag on it, we can talk.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
The Civil War was about states rights and economic power. It was about how much power the federal government could wield against the states. It was about the industrialization of the northern states competing with slave labor economy in the south. It was about money and the slavery issue was the perfect camouflage because it provided the emotional response needed to generate support for the war in both the north and the south.
You are right it was about money. Your analysis is fatally flawed though. In the North slavery was a sort of camouflage, the North was willing to allow it to persist in existing slave states, the Emancipation Proclamation was only valid in rebel held territory, characterizing the war as about slavery was a method to keep the British from aiding the Confederates.
However in the South while it was about money too it is inescapable that this money and the power it provided was derived from the institution of slavery. So in the South the war was absolutely about slavery, secession necessary because non-slave states would eventually outnumber slave states. Most important of all the secession documents all cite defense of the institution of slavery as a primary cause for war. The Southern politicians who voted for war put it in writing when they had all the power. Don't let the fact that many ordinary Southern workers and farmers would not be willing to fight to defend slavery fool you. Secession occurred and war was declared by the Southern elites whose wealth was derived from slavery. Their creation, the confederate government, was therefore absolutely about the defense of the institution of slavery. What was in a confederate soldier's mind does not change this. In the south the camouflage is the non-slavery motivations for war. A soldiers loyalty to his state the camouflage for the defense of slavery.
Except that they're removing a number of Civil War games that correctly used the Confederate flag to represent the Confederacy. What next? Force HBO to stop offering Band of Brothers through HBO Now on the Apple TV because it features a swastika? Remove the Dukes of Hazzard from iTunes because they have a Confederate flag painted on the roof of the car?
No. Band of Brothers and The Dukes of Hazzard are video, meaning they're not interactive. Apple has always been open about censoring apps more than noninteractive works. From the App Store Review Guidelines:
There is a difference between preserving history in books, in museum, and to flaunt it on a capitol place, flaunt it on cars, and flaunt it in the face of those which suffered to it in the southern state. The Nazi flag is history too. Guess what the reaction of the world would be if it got flying again before the Bundestag ? You want to pretend it is history ? Then keep it at home in a shrine. Not on your car as sticker, not on the capitol flying high.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
The flag we're talking about was created to boost morale of the soldiers, and was only for use in battle.
But the soldiers were fighting to preserve a system of hatred, slavery, bigotry, and treason. Many of my ancestors among them. Thankfully, they lost. I don't honor the cause of my ancestors, and I am flabbergasted that anybody would.
As you can see here...BTW when is everybody gonna wake the fuck up and realize they are using this trivial bullshit to get us to ignore the corporate fucking they are trying to sneak through the back door with the TPP fast track?
ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
tell me again about how many bystanders were beheaded by folks waving the stars & stripes? zero? cool, i got the same count.
Yeah, they're really hard to identify *eye roll*
No, your modern southern ideology is bullshit. Read what your southern leaders wrote in their secession documents, the defense of the institution of slavery is their primary cause for secession and war. Its their own friggin words at the time they seceded.
The southern leadership's wealth and power was based on slavery. Their creation, the confederate government, was brought into existence to defend the institution of slavery. The fact that Johnny Reb didn't have slavery on his mind when he signed up does not change this fact. Regardless of what was in his head he fought to defend a government that existed to defend slavery. Johnny Reb didn't vote for secession and slavery, he didn't start the war, he just fought it. The modern southern ideology that focuses on Johnny Reb's thoughts is revisionist bullshit, a denial of the truth of behind southern leadership and behind the confederate government.
Because cultural marxist scum have brainwashed generations of white children through public miseducation and the media into elevating the needs of strangers above those of their own families, children and people. Sadly, I don't think they can be saved at this point, and must be burned along with the rest of the trash filling our countries.
Brave soldiers trying to over throw the United States of America? I suppose those terrorists that crashed a plane into the World Trade Center were brave soldiers too. The Confederate army were traitors. Nothing brave about that.
Yo Zippy - no one has outlawed the sale of the confederate flag. Various merchants have decided to not sell it. How very white of you to think it not offensive - especially after the State of Carolina decided to fly it on its capital building after the passage of desegregation laws.
The North was only letting new states in as 'free' states, to curtail the power of the South.
No, to limit (and eventually abolish) the abomination of slavery. How would a free Southern state curtail the power of the South? There were regions of the South where there wasn't much slavery. Unless of course you are saying that the power of the South was not a cultural philosophical power but rather an economic power based primarily on slavery.
Face it, secession was all about slavery. The southern leadership's wealth and power was slave based. Their words in their secession documents state that defense of the institution of slavery was a primary cause for secession. Their words at the time of secession. How does it not get any clearer than that?
Some people say the flag means that, some people say it means states rights, who knows. But do people actually believe someone who flies the flag is saying bring back slavery or a succession from the Union? Maybe they just want to stand for a weaker Federal government, something many people support today.
The states rights issue is really not a valid one as regards to the reasons behind the Civil War. The southern states were all in favor of forcing northern states to obey the Fugitive Salve Laws and for the federal government to use its power to enforce them over objections of the states; what they didn't like was the specter of the Federal government enforcing laws they didn't like in their own states. So the next time someone brings up states rights as the argument for succession you can point out the hypocrisy in their argument. I realize you are not making that argument and not saying you are being hypocritical, rather pointing out the fallacy of that argument.
I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
Were they? Any more so than ancestors of the north who also owned slaves while acting in treason from the crown who died fighting for their cause? Does that mean the patriots were full of hatred and bigotry? Some of them, yes, others fought with freed slaves. Others murdered Native Americans while their neighbors broke bread with them.
I'm just saying that, IMO, it isn't worth hating people for what their ancestors may or may not have believed. I know many relatives of those confederates and, although I am not one, the point of America is to embrace moving forward. If they want to re-purpose a symbol once seen as bigotry and hatred into something people of today can get behind, that's pretty much a win for us all.
Belongs on a state building? I don't know, to me that's all just politics.
Your country was founded on the principle that the government should not stop anybody from speaking. It wasn't founded on the principle that corporations must be compelled to distribute other people's material regardless of content. Apple are not obligated to publish this material.
OK - So why is some Christian baker required to make art supporting gay marriage?
If the gay couple can sue the baker and force him to make and sell them a cake he finds offensive, can't rebel flag supporters sue those big businesses and force them to see things they don't want to?
Your rant proves the racist point. As for the symbolism of a flag - you're just being ignorant or have you not payed attention to the flag burning issue and passing laws preventing burning the American flag.
You fail to understand the difference between a legal principle, such as the First Amendment, and a moral principle, such as Free Speech.
The First Amendment is a legal enactment of the moral principle. The law stops there (mostly), but the moral principle that says that Free Speech is essential to a free and healthy society continue to apply to everyone - government or private.
Apple's suppression of Confederate flag, and Civil War video games, and silly TV shows set in the South, is evil.
I'm not sure I care so much about what it once stood for, though. Even if it did stand for bigotry, if people are trying to re-brand it as something more positive, that's probably a win for us all.
I'm not sure what your two points are referring to. Can you break your post down for me?
The average phone user has no clue this functionality exists
I'll grant you that for the ADB method on pre-May 2011 AT&T devices. But anyone who has installed F-Droid, Amazon Appstore, or any other third-party store on a device that shipped with Google Play Store, is already familiar with "Unknown sources". The instructions for installing each third-party store explain what the checkbox does.
and further more enabling this would be detrimental to their daily lives. It's like saying "You can have your free speech, just turn off your antivirus and run as admin"
Unchecking "Unknown sources" still lets you run applications that have been installed. So it's like saying "Once the game is installed, proceed to turn antivirus back on, log in to your regular account, and enjoy!"
Don't you know that it's been decided for you that the debate will be about racism and bigotry and intolerance (only on one side though), not freedom of speech and censorship? Just like it was decided ahead of time for those civil war game devs (and all the other creators) whose content was removed.
./ editors "forgot" the censorship icon for this story (just like they forgot it for the story on the reddit banfest).
Either that or it's all a big misunderstanding, and the
Race relations are hard. Society is complicated. Your bike shed is the wrong color. Don't fly that flag on it.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
You know, from a British perspective, the US flag is a rebel flag as well. Just sayin.
True. I doubt it flies above any government buildings in the United Kingdom ...
The US flag flew in the United Kingdom during WW2 in the camps and on the bases of US soldiers, sailors and airmen.
See, when one has a war over a political disagreement an amicable reconciliation is possible. Unlike when a war is fought over the defense of the institution of slavery.
That is a very incomplete and one-sided retelling of American history.
The Confederate battle flag represents the Confederacy, which was formed in order to defend the economic interest of the south to maintain the evil system of slavery. So, it's not unfair to say that it is a white supremacist symbol.
It is, however, dishonest to boil down over 200 years of history in the way you have done. For instance, the U.S. has provided financial support and also apologized to native Americans essentially for driving them off of their land. The American flag represents that as well. It's a complex history.
are the far left - free speech, free expression, as long as it conforms to their speech and their expression
So sick of the pussies that corp Amerika has become. Uncle like people would really stop shopping at Amazon because they fulfill orders for Confederate flag? Really?
You don't want a Confederate flag then don't buy one. Pretty simple.
And unlike a bricks and mortar where *gasp* your sensibilities might be offended by seeing one on display, you aren't going to get a flag in your search results unless you are actually searching for one.
I just tried this for kicks, I googled Confederate Flag t-shirt and while google didn't show me anything on the side in the adspace and google offers, it did show me a slew of websites that do in fact sell this merchandise if I was so inclined to buy.
Still pretty convenient.
Didn't George Washington personally own 300 slaves or something? Maybe the US should rename their capital city first :-D
Yep, we're screwed.
From an American perspective, the Texas state flag is a rebel flag too; culturally speaking that is.
The Texas state flag predates the Confederacy. The Confederacy was created to defend the institution of slavery, the Confederate flag represents that defense of the institution of slavery. The Texas flag does not inherently represent such a defense of slavery, like many other Southern state flags, where the people of the state misguidedly decided to defend the Confederate government.
Of course I am referring to the state flags of old, not those modern state flags that embed the confederate flag.
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If they want to re-purpose a symbol once seen as bigotry and hatred into something people of today can get behind, that's pretty much a win for us all.
FTFY...
If they want to re-purpose a symbol once seen as bigotry and hatred into something white people of today can get behind, that's pretty much a win for us all.
. . . fighting for liberty against the oppressive Unification Government.
(officer): Seems odd you'd name your ship after a battle you were on the wrong side of.
Captain Reynolds: May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.
Nobody is outlawing anything. This is an example of a business choosing not to publish something.
Yes but is there any discretion applied or is it a complete ban? Declining to publish a racing game with a car with a big confederate flag on it is one thing. Declining to publish a military strategy game that uses a historical setting like Gettysburg where Confederate troops on the field of battle are carrying a Confederate flag is something else.
In other words is there any consideration for historical context and historically accurate use?
You fail to understand that free speech is not some grand more-important-than-everything-else freedom. Your right to free speech is no more important, morally or otherwise, than my right to not be associated with your speech.
If we are to really take you at your word, that free speech must be supported by everyone, then you would have no problem with me writing some hateful thing on your car, right?
Honoring them is different from honoring their cause. The Viet Nam memorial for example doesn't honor the cause of ending communism.
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Had this same conversation with my wife. You can no longer buy a Confederate Flag at Wal-Mart, but you can still buy guns.
You know who was a big advocate of gun rights in the south when confederate flags were being resurrected during the 1960s civil rights era? Southern blacks.
Besides blacks, you know what another big market for guns is? Non-racist whites.
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I do not believe the people you refer to got into trouble for refusing to sell some sort of item, but for refusing to sell it to certain would-be customers.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
How very white of you...
How very presumptuous of of you.
If Amazon is going to stop selling the Confederate battle flag, then why are they still selling the Japanese battle flag? How many millions of Chinese citizens died under this flag?
How may native Americans died under the 26 star American flag? There were at least 12 million native Americans killed in the US under various iterations of the American flag. Why should that still be sold by Amazon? Oh yeah, because there's less than a quarter million of them left to complain.
Someone can be offended by just about anything on the planet. This is just getting silly.
The national flag of the Confederate States does means secession and slavery, but that's not the flag we're talking about ... The flag we're talking about was created to boost morale of the soldiers, and was only for use in battle.
No. The confederate national flag was too similar to the US flag. On the battlefield units were being misidentified as friend or foe. So a confederate battle flag was created motivated by the need to a distinctive differentiated look compared to the US flag.
It was not a political flag ... it was referred to as "the soldiers' flag."
OK. The confederate national flag represents a government that was created to defend the institution of slavery. Their words in their secession declarations proves this. So the confederate battle flag only represents those who fought to defend a government dedicated to the defense of slavery. Any non-slavery motivations an individual soldier may have had does not change the fact that he ultimately fought to defend slavery. The confederate battle flag is inherently a symbol of the defense of slavery by force of arms.
Perhaps failing to recognize that the battle flag represents a defense of slavery by force of arms has something to do with it. When the national government is inherently about the defense of the institution of slavery, their words in their secession documents, then the army of that government is also inherently about the defense of the institution of slavery. The thoughts and opinions of an individual soldier does not change these facts.
This flag is a poor choice to remember the soldier by, assuming of course that the soldier did not believe in perpetuating slavery.
The civil war is over and the south lost. I wasn't around 150 years ago, so I'll reserve judgement on what it was over.
You can however read the secession documents written by southern leaders 150 years ago where they clearly and unambiguously state that they are acting in the defense of the institution of slavery.
But if someone feels it simply represents their heritage, then so be it.
Well if their heritage is defense of the institution of slavery so be it. The flag of an army dedicated to the defense of a government that is dedicated to the defense of slavery is an army dedicated to the defense of slavery. Any other meaning is delusional. While individual confederate soldiers may have had a wide variety of motivations and beliefs their army and their government had a clear motivation, the defense of slavery
The British flag is also part of that seal. Shouldn't it be removed too?
The American Revolution was about political differences. Those can be reconciled. When a war is about the defense of slavery there is no reconciliation with the pro-slavery argument.
It's supposed to be a free country. If someone wants to be a racist ass, then so be it.
No problem. The debate is merely about rebranding a symbol of the defense of slavery as something else. You can't even argue that its modern meaning has evolved. It didn't begin flying all over government grounds until the 1960s as a symbol of segregationist opposition to civil rights.
Ok, so to clarify right off the bat, I'm not a racist, not a bigot, not an antisemite, not an extremist, not really anything of importance in any way, shape, or form. But any speech should be free speech. I don't agree with any extremist organizations (or any organizations entirely) nor do I endorse their principles. That said, I believe that everyone, from centrists to extremists deserve the right to be able to say whatever they want. In the case of Google and Apple I don't believe that "showing" those views is an endorsement in any way. The fact is that this is censorship, and I am _VERY_ opposed to any kind of censorship. Just because I don't agree with something doesn't mean it's wrong, regardless of how offensive it might be. I'm sure that I do lots of offensive things, but I think that censorship of speech should never be done by anyone other than the person responsible for said speech. I would not want someone deciding that a really funny joke I made up should be censored because someone might be offended. That would drastically curtail my humor.
Like a wedding cake?
Do some digging yourself:
http://www.civilwarcauses.org/...
http://www.vastpublicindiffere...
Never let a lack of data get in the way of a good rant.
Wow, saying the confederate flag means slavery, hatred, bigotry and treason ... Some people say the flag means that, some people say it means states rights, who knows.
Anyone who read the various southern state's secession documents know. Secession and the creation of the confederacy was absolutely and unambiguous about defending the institution of slavery. Its their words written at the time, that's how we know.
But do people actually believe someone who flies the flag is saying bring back slavery or a succession from the Union?
The resurgence of the confederate flag in the 1960s was as a symbol of opposition to the civil rights movement, a symbol of the support for segregation. So at best it drops slavery and still represents hatred and bigotry even in its modern incarnation.
Maybe they just want to stand for a weaker Federal government, something many people support today.
And their are many other flags to choose from, flags without the baggage of slavery, racism and bigotry. Pick any of the numerous revolutionary war era flags being used for such purposes. People who choose the confederate flag are choosing to be associated with that baggage.
Maybe the reason they fly the flag is to respect their ancestors who fought and died for what they believe in.
While individual confederate soldiers had a wide range of beliefs and opinions one can not evade the simple fact that they volunteered for an army that was created to defend a government that was itself created to defend the institution of slavery. That army existed to by force of arms enact the government's defense of slavery. The flag inherently represents this army and slavery's defense. Its a poor choice to represent a soldier who did not believe in slavery, its a good fit for one who did believe in slavery.
Would you ask someone to take down the original U.S. flag that so heavily fought for their rights and owned slaves?
The U.S. government was create for reasons other than slavery but grudgingly accepted slavery as a concession necessary to form the government in the first place. A concession believed not set in stone but one to be revisited in the future, and one which in fact was revisited over and over again in the legislature. This is quite different than the confederate government that was created to defend the institution of slavery.
My point is, people are afraid of a flag that is being flown for many reasons.
My point is that there are deniers of history and that their opinions can be discarded. The confederate flag was created in the defense of slavery, it was resurrected in the defense of segregation.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
A M E R I C A
M
E
R
I
C
A
Land of the free
And maybe people that burn crosses on other people's lawns are merely trying to welcome them to the neighborhood and is not a threat of lynching.
This may seem silly, but does anyone see this as a first, tiny baby step of a some sort of connected, faster decision-making on a more global scale, with the internet as the medium? To be trite, a kind of internet consciousness (I hate even typing that, but it's sort of what I mean). Will this continue and grow stronger?
It seems to me it's analogous with some of the models of thinking, with the human mind being a conglomeration of agents, each with its own agenda, working together (sometimes) to make global decisions. Just as I am not aware of the agents particularly, or (maybe) vice versa, is there something going on that we are taking for granted and not noticing?
Caveat: IANAneuroscientist.
Except for some officers, virtually none of the Confederate soldiers who lost their live in battle were slave owners. The struggle was really about the right to secede, even though the political class who created the CSA had certain motives involving slavery.
It's no the fault of the flag that the asshole who committed the heinous crime in Charleston wrapped himself in it. Would you feel different about the star-spangled banner if he used it instead of the confederate flag?
> Now replace "confederate" with just about any other potentially offensive term (nazi, communist, rhodesia) and you get plenty of results.
The lesson I take from this is that Google supports Nazis, otherwise it's quite obvious that they would ban them, as they have for everything else they disfavor.
Because of this, I will presume that everything Google hasn't banned is something Google supports.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery#Present_day
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_Haiti#Modern_day
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Qatar#Labor
But do people actually believe someone who flies the flag is saying bring back slavery or a succession from the Union?
For me personally, if I see a truck drive by with a Confederate flag flying from the back of it I don't think "wow, that guy must really be into states' rights", or "wow, that guy must be a huge Dukes of Hazzard fan". I think "wow, that guy is really proud to be racist". It might not be fair but, yeah, that's the first thing that pops into my head.
Also, please stop talking about "succession" or "succeeding" or whatever. That's not the word.
"Our two-party system is like a bowl of shit looking at itself in a mirror." - Lewis Black
Those are based on census data. Back in that time, the census routinely skipped right over a lot of people, especially those who only had a footpath going by their house deep in the woods. That would be exactly the people who could never in a million years afford a slave.
But do people actually believe someone who flies the flag is saying bring back slavery or a succession from the Union?
So you've never been to the south?
US has been supporting uprisings and revolutions around the world, now it bumped heads with Russia over Ukraine (and the West sponsored overthrow of Ukrainian government with 5bn taken from your taxes to support the coup). So it's only natural to clamp down on any revolutionary tendencies at home, just in case someone else (like Russia) decides to throw a few billion to support an uprising. Payback can be rough.... this is just a simple measure.
"What we are hearing is that major retail (and online) outlets are opting not to sell it"
Actually, what we have is major retailers selectively enforcing their vague policies because of public outcry. Many items (such as Nazi memorabilia, The Turner Diaries, etc) run afoul of these same policies, yet these retailers do not remove them because no loud public groundswell has arisen to get them removed... yet.
When the Ban Hammer comes out, eventually everybody gets hit.
And you're assuming these outliers made up a significant portion of the population based on....what?
Never let a lack of data get in the way of a good rant.
I live in a country where we don't have a national day or let off fireworks for heroes (We do for the baddie (boo hiss) Guy Fawkes). There is a St. George's day but today's generation they'd go Meh! after a 20 second explanation of why Anzac Day [Who would fight for a weird motherland on the other side of the world?] is more worth sitting down and raising a glass to.
So, for us in the Kingdom of Blighty it appears a sink-hole has appeared where a Confederate Flag was. What? EITHER you knew all along this was a poor man's KKK in which case why has it taken so long for sanity to appear, you are grown up aren't you? OR You've suddenly found a bunch of fifth-columnists [yeah right!] So what you'll do is not buy their flag. Have I got that right? Nasty men need to be ostracised so we'll not buy their flag. That'll learn them!
Slashdot originated in the days when very clever people saw how to tame computers and shame bureaucrats so perhaps we can remember those founders. Guys that wrote the hackers dictionary and all that. Ancient history I admit, but seeing-through the stupidities and artificial limits is what hackers do. Perhaps the time has come for the multitude of non-political Slashdoters to engage brain?
Look at the solidarity there was in France after Charlie Hebdo. How can you, the wannabe-hacker, strolling Slashdoter, show your solidarity? (We don't have the answer in Blighty, but FFS why don't you Mercian's stop pissing about with flags and start taking sides.)
The nature of the South at the time.
Btw, there are places where it's close to that even now.
"Imagine that, a war waged for one reason but sold to the public for other reasons"
Gee-e - I guess that's not that hard to imagine even nowadays.
Being Dutch, one of our main contributions to the land which now encompasses the USA was the WIC, the West Indies Companie.
Primairy goal of this companie: Streamline the slavetrade.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_West_India_Company
How dare you insult our Dutch heratige by assuming the USA invented slavetrade! Our royalty (the Dutch Oranges) still are the richest in the world because of it.
Oh, and we founded New York.
you're a fucking retard. the government shouldn't by flying racist flags.
Are you capable of a rational discussion without resorting to profanity or name-calling? If the answer is "no", then we really are screwed.
Posting anon as I am modding on this thread...
But this is nothing but pure censorship. I cannot believe that the people of the US are allowing and even advocating for this nonsense.
Racism is evil and wrong, no doubt. But the strength of our country lies in the right of the people to FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION.
When we allow censorship, we diminish everything good about this nation.
Except for some officers, virtually none of the Confederate soldiers who lost their live in battle were slave owners. The struggle was really about the right to secede, even though the political class who created the CSA had certain motives involving slavery.
The right to secede was only considered necessary in order to protect slavery. The northern aggression was the move towards nation-wide abolition. State's rights did not include the right to decide if a state will be slave or not, half the states added to the union must be slave states. Except for possibly loyalty to one's citizenship, which in those days was often considered state based not national based - even in the north, nearly every "cause" cited for the war was just camouflage for slavery or just a misdirection to get Johnny Reb to enlist.
Again, it doesn't really matter what the personal opinions and motivations of Johnny Reb may have been. He volunteered for an army that was created to protect a government that in turn was created to protect the institution of slavery. The army is the instrument which through force of arms slavery was to be protected. Service in such an army inherently protects slavery. The army's flag inherently symbolizes the protection of slavery.
Plus there is also the racist thing. Racism was common north an south, but some poor whites in the south took some satisfaction that there was a permanent slave underclass beneath them. Some willing to fight to maintain their elevated status, legal equality for the "negroe" something they could not personally accept. This continued after the war with the "night riders" and KKK, and admittedly some took up this fight outside of confederate territory. And when these folks wanted a symbol of white superiority and racism in the 1960s during the civil rights movement where did they turn? The confederate flag, it already represented white superiority and control over the "negroe race". Going from a symbol for the defense of slavery to a symbol for the defense of segregation was a small step.
It's no the fault of the flag that the asshole who committed the heinous crime in Charleston wrapped himself in it. Would you feel different about the star-spangled banner if he used it instead of the confederate flag?
What the confederate flag represented in the 1860s, the 1960s and today in 2015 is the same thing. We have 150 years of murderers wrapping themselves in that flag for a very appropriate reason.
http://www.civilwar.org/education/history/secession/
I understand it just fine. The parent commenter does not. He was talking about outlawing the flag.
No, if the First Amendment were a legal enactment of the moral principle you describe, it wouldn't stop at restricting the government's right to curtail speech. It would compel Apple to publish this material. It does not. Ergo, the First Amendment is not a legal enactment of the principle you describe. It doesn't go anywhere near as far.
Nobody has the right to force Apple to use their resources to publish material that they don't want to publish. And Apple choosing not to publish something is not the same thing as them suppressing it. You want the confederate flag, you can get it from other places. Free speech is not about forcing somebody else to publish your crap.
Bogtha Bogtha Bogtha
http://www.civilwar.org/education/history/secession/
So the non-slavery justifications include:
State's rights - Namely the north not respecting the southern states rights to have fugitive slaves returned.
Other - Includes having a President with suspected abolitionist leanings, can't have a President that is not pro-slavery.
Everyone seems to trip over themselves to make sure they loudly declare how much they despise the state-sanctioned racism that the Confederate flag represents. Fine and good for that. But it's a damn scary slippery slope we're on if we start banning symbols and words when they offend people. Who gets to choose what's offensive?
If I wear a Che Guevara T-shirt is it cool in hipster Brooklyn Williamsburg but deserve to get my ass kicked if I go wearing it among the Cuban exile community in Miami?
Yes. Stupid question.
"Its meaning has evolved in complex ways after the war" -- actually that is the more salient point here. It doesn't (much) matter what the Confederate Battle Flag meant in the 19th century, but in the 20th century it was adopted by the southern states and private groups to represent resistance to the civil rights laws and movement and as symbol of determination to preserve the oppression of their African-American citizens. Slavery and the Civil War are dead history, but Jim Crow is living memory -- that is the shame of the Confederate Battle Flag.
racist
I have a feeling this is being used to divert public attention from something much more important (e.g. TTP)
Once in a while stuff like this happens when there is a non-issue issue that the majority of the people could care less (confederate flag) and something controversial happens (censorship in this case) and it pops up in the front pages, then everyone talks about it.
I wouldn't be surprised specially with the not so recent end of the U.S. Propaganda Ban on American soil.
Now hold up, ya self righteous asshole. You used "screwed" in your OP and you used it again in your rebuttal. Screwed is also a vulgar word. One we find socially acceptable to say but vulgar none the less.
If Confederate Flag = Nigger then
Then search engines and shops banning stuff having the confederate flag or containing the word nigger are definitely in the right!
That being said - I'm missing where all of the bandwagon jumpers are blocking rap lyrics - or anything to do with the word nigger.
If we accept Confederate Flag is racist or hurtful to some people and embrace the block, then we must also accept that the failure to do the same with the word nigger means is not racist or hurtful when used and therefore should be allowed and embraced.
That being said - I just changed all of my devices to duckduckgo for a search engine. I do believe that the same amount of hatred directed at the confederate flag should be directed at people calling other people niggers.
I apologize for using the word nigger - but if you sit down and think about it - google is actually being racist.
_ _ _ Go for the eyes Boo! GO FOR THE EYES!
It seemed like a stupid question, until you gave a stupid answer.
I know a woman who was married to a black man, up north, who has the rebel flag on her car. To her it was about freedom.
oh ffs...
Although I think a confederate flag other than the battle flag should be flown I suspect that taking down the stars and bars will cause quite a severe reaction in the south. That flag honors our southern war dead from all wars and not just the civil war. Southern soldiers are well known for ferocious dedication and bravery during really heavy combat. Many people will be severely hurt by states not flying the flag and it may well spark violence. The confederate flag has nothing to do with race at all. Black soldiers fought for the south as well as white soldiers.
Look, the Confederate flag means slavery, hatred, bigotry and ...
...and stupidity. Anyone I've met with a confederate flag was dumb as a post.
Because being gay is protected (as it doesn't hurt anyone), and being a racist isn't (because it is lazy, hate-filled bullshit).
You are ignoring that it was appropriated by people fighting against the civil rights movement, as their battle flag. I think that's what more people have against it - that in relatively-recent memory it was used as the symbol for active hatred towards black people.
You missed the part where the confederate flag was co-opted by those fighting against the civil rights movement, in living memory for many people who it directly affected.
I have a riddle. How is breast cancer like racisim? Breast cancer has no easy solutions. To fix it we need lots of scientists and doctors and we need a society that values STEM fields creating those profressionals. Then we need to give these researchers a LOOOOOOOOTT!! of money. Hard right? Oh I know, let's all wear red bracelets to raise awareness! Yay now I don't have to actually do anything.
How do we solve racism? I don't know but I'm sure taking down confederate jacks won't play much of a part in it.
Because liberals say so. It's a double standard.
You can have fundie Muslims chanting death to America, convert to Islam or die and liberals are willing fall on a live grenade to protect jihadist free speech. Just look how the liberals are trying to silence Ayaan Hirsi Ali. Muslims mutilated her genitals, forced her to leave her own country subjected her to a fatwa for the crime of being an ex muslim apostate, but liberals consider her legitimate grievances and criticisms of the Islamic faith to be islamophobia, aka "hate speech". If Liberals had their way, she would be imprisoned in America too.
Most countries hang their traitors.
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
"I just reply to you when I see you spamming Slashdot with your nonsense"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
Why'd you agree w/ my points on hosts then? Quoting you:
"I'm not denying all those things" - by dave420 (699308) on Wednesday September 17, 2014 @11:39AM (#47927435) FROM -> http://yro.slashdot.org/commen...
Of course not: It's impossible to dispute HOSTS FILES superiority to other methods!
Since my points in favor of hosts SINGLE FILE native kernelmode faster part show hosts doing more w/ less vs. so-called 'competitors' many part messagepassing + cpu/ram use overheads laden slower usermode FAR MORE COMPLEX 'solutions' doing less than hosts do for more security, speed, reliability, + anonymity!
I make creating a superior more efficient solution EASIER!
(That's more than a mere trolling stalking harassing "ne'er-do-well" like yourself could *EVER* manage).
---
"I'm simply pointing out that it takes an AdBlocker to block your spamming"- by dave420 (699308) on Friday June 19, 2015 @10:31AM (#49945047)
I bother you? Then WHY DON'T YOU DO IT & use 'em? Answer that!
(You stalk/harass me instead!)
OBVIOUSLY you don't & you're a "ne'er-do-well" troll & you have "other motivations" (next):
---
* QUESTION:
DO YOU WORK FOR AN ADVERTISING FIRM, or ARE YOU A WEBMASTER/WEBCODER http://slashdot.org/comments.p... , or a MALWARE MAKER, or ARE YOU AFFILIATED WITH 1 OF MY COMPETITORS?
Answer it!
As per your usual you'll avoid every question, or lie & You've been EXPOSED in your "motives" in the last link just above, lol!
APK
P.S.=> See Dave420 the "pot puffing clown" SQUIRM - evasions galore will ensue (as well as effete downmods via sockpuppets to *try* vainly "hide it" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p... )... apk
See subject & LMAO @ U, boy -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p...
* Gonna go "cry in your cereal" now, boy?
(You ought to for being STUPID enough to use OR SUGGEST a blatantly INFERIOR solution! See below... it's fact & truth!)
APK
P.S.=> FACT: "AlmostALLAdsBlocked+" is INFERIOR vs. hosts - hugely so!
AB+ doesn't even DO what it's supposed to fully anymore being BRIBED http://finance.yahoo.com/news/... not to!
AB+ doesn't do a FRACTION of what hosts do for more speed, security, reliability, + anonymity online!
AB+ EATS 128mb of RAM (vs. hosts @ 11 *maybe* tops via my program with CURRENT data, the important kind vs. current threats + ads) http://cdn.ghacks.net/wp-conte...
AB+ adds messagepassing overheads!
AB+ operates in SLOWER usermode (vs. hosts in PnP kernelmode)
AB+ creates huge CPU consumption!
I use what you already have that works & does more with LESS, no less - you by way of comparison? Pile on "MoAr" that doesn't do as nearly as much & what it's supposed to do? It NO LONGER DOES!
AFTER ALL THAT?
AB+ = "better", Coren22?? LMAO - NO f'ing way!
If you say it is, you are *TRULY* stupid & I'd reply saying "argue with the numbers" & facts above, from reputable sources & analysis proving my points for me... apk
See subject & LMAO @ U, boy -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p...
* Gonna go "cry in your cereal" now, boy?
(You ought to for being STUPID enough to use OR SUGGEST a blatantly INFERIOR solution! See below... it's fact & truth!)
APK
P.S.=> FACT: "AlmostALLAdsBlocked+" is INFERIOR vs. hosts - hugely so!
AB+ doesn't even DO what it's supposed to fully anymore being BRIBED http://finance.yahoo.com/news/... not to!
AB+ doesn't do a FRACTION of what hosts do for more speed, security, reliability, + anonymity online!
AB+ EATS 128mb of RAM (vs. hosts @ 11 *maybe* tops via my program with CURRENT data, the important kind vs. current threats + ads) http://cdn.ghacks.net/wp-conte...
AB+ adds messagepassing overheads!
AB+ operates in SLOWER usermode (vs. hosts in PnP kernelmode)
AB+ creates huge CPU consumption!
I use what you already have that works & does more with LESS, no less - you by way of comparison? Pile on "MoAr" that doesn't do as nearly as much & what it's supposed to do? It NO LONGER DOES!
AFTER ALL THAT?
AB+ = "better", Coren22?? LMAO - NO f'ing way!
If you say it is, you are *TRULY* stupid & I'd reply saying "argue with the numbers" & facts above, from reputable sources & analysis proving my points for me... apk
See subject & LMAO @ U, boy -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p...
* Gonna go "cry in your cereal" now, boy?
(You ought to for being STUPID enough to use OR SUGGEST a blatantly INFERIOR solution! See below... it's fact & truth!)
APK
P.S.=> FACT: "AlmostALLAdsBlocked+" is INFERIOR vs. hosts - hugely so!
AB+ doesn't even DO what it's supposed to fully anymore being BRIBED http://finance.yahoo.com/news/... not to!
AB+ doesn't do a FRACTION of what hosts do for more speed, security, reliability, + anonymity online!
AB+ EATS 128mb of RAM (vs. hosts @ 11 *maybe* tops via my program with CURRENT data, the important kind vs. current threats + ads) http://cdn.ghacks.net/wp-conte...
AB+ adds messagepassing overheads!
AB+ operates in SLOWER usermode (vs. hosts in PnP kernelmode)
AB+ creates huge CPU consumption!
I use what you already have that works & does more with LESS, no less - you by way of comparison? Pile on "MoAr" that doesn't do as nearly as much & what it's supposed to do? It NO LONGER DOES!
AFTER ALL THAT?
AB+ = "better", Coren22?? LMAO - NO f'ing way!
If you say it is, you are *TRULY* stupid & I'd reply saying "argue with the numbers" & facts above, from reputable sources & analysis proving my points for me... apk
See subject & LMAO @ U, boy -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p...
* Gonna go "cry in your cereal" now, boy?
(You ought to for being STUPID enough to use OR SUGGEST a blatantly INFERIOR solution! See below... it's fact & truth!)
APK
P.S.=> FACT: "AlmostALLAdsBlocked+" is INFERIOR vs. hosts - hugely so!
AB+ doesn't even DO what it's supposed to fully anymore being BRIBED http://finance.yahoo.com/news/... not to!
AB+ doesn't do a FRACTION of what hosts do for more speed, security, reliability, + anonymity online!
AB+ EATS 128mb of RAM (vs. hosts @ 11 *maybe* tops via my program with CURRENT data, the important kind vs. current threats + ads) http://cdn.ghacks.net/wp-conte...
AB+ adds messagepassing overheads!
AB+ operates in SLOWER usermode (vs. hosts in PnP kernelmode)
AB+ creates huge CPU consumption!
I use what you already have that works & does more with LESS, no less - you by way of comparison? Pile on "MoAr" that doesn't do as nearly as much & what it's supposed to do? It NO LONGER DOES!
AFTER ALL THAT?
AB+ = "better", Coren22?? LMAO - NO f'ing way!
If you say it is, you are *TRULY* stupid & I'd reply saying "argue with the numbers" & facts above, from reputable sources & analysis proving my points for me... apk
See subject & LMAO @ U, boy -> http://slashdot.org/comments.p...
* Gonna go "cry in your cereal" now, boy?
(You ought to for being STUPID enough to use OR SUGGEST a blatantly INFERIOR solution! See below... it's fact & truth!)
APK
P.S.=> FACT: "AlmostALLAdsBlocked+" is INFERIOR vs. hosts - hugely so!
AB+ doesn't even DO what it's supposed to fully anymore being BRIBED http://finance.yahoo.com/news/... not to!
AB+ doesn't do a FRACTION of what hosts do for more speed, security, reliability, + anonymity online!
AB+ EATS 128mb of RAM (vs. hosts @ 11 *maybe* tops via my program with CURRENT data, the important kind vs. current threats + ads) http://cdn.ghacks.net/wp-conte...
AB+ adds messagepassing overheads!
AB+ operates in SLOWER usermode (vs. hosts in PnP kernelmode)
AB+ creates huge CPU consumption!
I use what you already have that works & does more with LESS, no less - you by way of comparison? Pile on "MoAr" that doesn't do as nearly as much & what it's supposed to do? It NO LONGER DOES!
AFTER ALL THAT?
AB+ = "better", Coren22?? LMAO - NO f'ing way!
If you say it is, you are *TRULY* stupid & I'd reply saying "argue with the numbers" & facts above, from reputable sources & analysis proving my points for me... apk
No it was founded on the principle that they objected to paying taxes to contribute towards the defence of the 13 colonies. They felt that this was unfair and Great Britain should pay for the defence of the 13 colonies themselves. The traitors where the biggest bunch of free loaders going.
Unable to win the treasonous rebellion on their own they managed to hoodwink the French king to supply money, arms and soldiers etc. on the basis of your enemies friend is your friend. The "assistance" thus given to the traitors bankrupted the French nation and led to the beheading of said king.
So if you ever feel the USA does XYZ that you don't like the real people to blame are the French for meddling in other peoples affairs in the first place and allowing the USA to come into existence.
do people actually believe someone who flies the flag is saying bring back slavery or a succession from the Union?
Well, yes.
Maybe they just want to stand for a weaker Federal government, something many people support today.
Then why choose a flag with so many negative connotations? Why not design a new "States rights" flag that doesn't invoke slavery and racism?
Maybe the reason they fly the flag is to respect their ancestors who fought and died for what they believe in.
Someone whose grandfather fought in WW2 for the Nazis could say the same thing about the Swastika.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Except that there is a serious knee-jerk reaction going on in regards to anything that shows the battle flag.
If you have been paying attention, Apple and Google have both removed historical genre civil war-era games which have legitimate historical uses for the battle flag. To me, this is just one step short of censoring history. Are any history books about the civil war going to be removed from iTunes or Google Play stores just because the cover may have the battle flag of the Army of Northern Virginia on the cover?
... results are displayed in all their glory.
Being from the south, you have it all wrong. The Confederate flag is a point of southern pride. It does not mean racism. Blacks and whites alike have and use the confederate flag. Stone mountain GA has a monument to the Confederacy depicting Stone Wall Jackson, and flies every version of the Confederate Flag. This is in a primary black community and they few have no issue with it.
Moreover, the civil war was regarding states rights and protectionist tariffs placed on the South's cotton industry. The North's manufacturing industry couldn't compete with the South's cotton industry, so they placed heavy tariffs on the goods. This was do to free labor, but the misnomer that the civil war was fought to end slavery is revisionist history at its finest.
The North also owned slaves up to and well into the civil war. Additionally, the Emancipation Proclamation didn't end slavery. It freed the slaves in the South. At the time the south had succeeded and wasn't part of the U.S. anymore, so the legislation itself was meaningless. It was an attempt to secure more solders to fight for the North.
Finally, I'd like to note I do not agree with slavery or the treatment of blacks in this part of history. However, changing this part of history so overtly is idiotic at best and down right dangerous at its worst. This land of political correctness has gone too far, changing history to suit its needs and censoring a symbol that is part of this nations history. The confederate flag has been around for over 100 years. Fifteen years ago this wouldn't even have been a discussion. All of a sudden the Confederate flag has become a huge focal point of the propagation of racism. We are blaming a flag for the actions of a mentally disturbed individual. Does no one see how wrong that is?
Here is the honest truth, the current state of race relations in the US has degenerated to the lowest levels in 30 years. This is due to a few factors: the current state of news media, continued legislation that distinguishes blacks from whites, and the crazy movement into extreme political correctness. You want to fix racism; ignore the continued news media blasting of racism in America, its only making everything worse; remove legislation targeting minorities, how can one expect to be treated the same as everyone else when they are singled out legally; get over this extreme political correctness, its getting to the point you can't speak without offending someone.
Brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.
...that they remember to ban all of those terribly horrible history books as well, the blue and the grey series, all of the civil war games, all the re-enactment equipmenrt, etc.
It'd be such a shame if they left a single stone unturned. While we're at it, let's ban the washington redskins, the cleveland indians, etc. rename french fries to something else, etc.
Yeah, so did a lot of people in the Union.
Brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.
The only flag that is acceptable to the politically correct is a plain white flag.
If I understand your argument correctly, I believe it is refuted fairly well by that Atlantic article which I linked to.
I'm fully on board for current use, such as government buildings, but as usual thought police have swung the pendulum too far. Now, I'm not on board what has become ridiculous. Wiping the bad thoughts from our hearts and minds prevents us from confronting it. Not only that, historically depicting the flag shouldn't be touched.
Why did some people mark this comment as flamebait? I wonder if they bothered to read the article I linked to. Was the article also flamebait?
All hate symbols should be removed from stores and ads and from our sight. The Klu Klux Klan uses crosses, should crosses be the next to be removed?
I'm astonished in this day and age censorship rears its intolerant head by mob rule no less.
Let's have a good ol' book burning and start up some indoctrination camps to finish off this Orwellian plunge.
You know that the North owned slaves throughout the war, right? The Emancipation Proclamation only freed the slaves in the South. There were a lot of reasons the Civil War happened, but "it was all about slavery!" isn't true.
Examine even your most deeply held beliefs. Nobody is always right.
These are "private" companies overreacting in (knee-jerk) response to an extremely low-hanging fruit, not the US government imposing it upon them. Where the government is talking about removing the flag, it's only where the flag is flying/hung on government property. NPR had a piece that talked a bit about flag-making companies that are not stopping production and expect their sales of the flag to jump by two magnitudes or more over the next few months.
It's a mad scramble to disconnect themselves from the flag in any way, trying to convince stupid people (the same ones who think a politician is unpatriotic if they don't wear a flag pin) that they don't support white supremacy, racism, or any related idea in any way, nevermind that they've never expressed such support in the past.
Once the furor dies down most of these things changes will silently be relaxed. At least, I hope so, because otherwise I agree with you.
You know that the North owned slaves throughout the war, right? The Emancipation Proclamation only freed the slaves in the South. There were a lot of reasons the Civil War happened, but "it was all about slavery!" isn't true.
Actually you got the Emancipation Proclamation wrong. As I mentioned in several posts its only freed slaves in rebel held territory. It did not apply to regions of the South under Union control.
In any case your logic is terribly terribly flawed. The North did not initiate the war. The South decided to secede and to start the war (firing on Fort Sumter) and the Southern leadership that made these decisions was absolutely motivated by the defense and preservation and expansion of the institution of slavery.
There were violent debates in Congress prior to the war regarding the expansion of slavery into the territories. The North wanting to confine slavery to existing slave states, the South wanting to expand slavery into the territories and even require that half of new states admitted to the Union be slave states. The South's primary state's rights argument was that the North was not enforcing the Fugitive Slave Act. At least one, maybe more, of the secession declarations cited the election of Lincoln and his secret "abolitionist leanings", as if US Presidents were required to be pro-slavery. Numerous secession declaration explicitly and unambiguously lists the defense and preservation of slavery as a main cause.
The South decided upon secession and war and that decision was based on protecting their wealth and power and economy that was based upon the institution of slavery.
Sure; I said "the South" when I meant "the rebellious areas". I wasn't precise enough, you're right.
That being said, the North wasn't trying to end slavery. The South wanted to expand it, but the concept at the time didn't need to be defended. The South was certainly in the wrong for trying to expand slavery, but it seems dishonest to me to say that the Confederate battle flag is about defending slavery and not mention that the North wasn't really much better.
Examine even your most deeply held beliefs. Nobody is always right.
The plain truth is that by 1804 all Northern states had decided to abolish slavery, some immediately, some phased it out over time. The North hoped the South would follow their lead. Instead, the South wanted to perpetuate slavery indefinitely and to expand it into new territories. The North's acceptance of slavery in existing slave states was a grudging concession to preserve unity and avoid war.
So no, you are mistaken with the idea that the North was not much better. It was not perfect, its hands were not clean, but it was much better.
As for the confederate battle flag. It is the flag of an army that was the force of arms that a government used to defend and perpetuate the institution of slavery. Whatever an individual Johnny Reb may have held as an opinion or belief, the preceding truth does not change. That flag is a symbol of the defense and perpetuation of slavery. Furthermore in the civil rights era of the 1960s that flag was resurrected as a symbol of support for segregation. So in the original context the flag represent institutional slavery and white supremacy and in the modern context it still represented white supremacy.
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APK
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I mean , hey, it's not like freedom of expression, or speech, or print, is a constitutional right, or anything, right? I mean, if the price of using a product means pull down your trousers and bend over, that's just good business. It's obvious that our founding fathers just *couldn't* see the bigger picture, after spending all that wasted time on such a "flawed document".. The Banksters had the right idea.. I mean, America is REALLY great, because of Walmarts and KFC and megacorps and baubles and trinkets, but mostly because of it's astonishing ability to sucker all these other large countries into buying all our debt from us. We've got a wonderful bunch of helpfull troops to make the process so much simpler too!.. No, we're not great because of silly things like "Freedoms" sand "Rights". these are only things we accuse other countries of violating during trade talks. So we can pat ourselves on the back and say "look at us, how 'free' we are" .. With free pxrn, plus almost everybody's got a mortgage, and credit card debt, *WE* don't stop people out of the blue and ask for their papers, or arrest people witrhout due cause, or disappear people into 'Secret CIA-Style Detention Centers' like to one that "doesn't exist" in Chicago. We don't send people to Siberia for suspicion of un-American activities.. instead we send them to a nice warm summer camp in Cuba, right on the water in guantanamo bay. No, the "Do no Evil" bunch are just good upstanding Followers of the American Way!
What if I want to buy a Confederate Battle Flag to desecrate and send to the SC legislature?
An engineer who ran for Congress. http://herbrobinson.us
It doesn't mean slavery or hatred or bigotry or treason.
And yet, the people I know who fly it invariably hate those damn N....'s, they want ot secede from the union, and if you catch them in an unguarded moment, or commiserate with them, will have all the racist litmus tests passed.
Spare me that bullshit. People fly the second place finisher flag in the great war of northern agression for the same reason skinheads fly Nazi flags - it is what they believe in.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
The flag we're talking about was created to boost morale of the soldiers, and was only for use in battle.
But the soldiers were fighting to preserve a system of hatred, slavery, bigotry, and treason. Many of my ancestors among them. Thankfully, they lost. I don't honor the cause of my ancestors, and I am flabbergasted that anybody would.
It is nothing short of amazing the backpedaling they will do to try to deny their outlook.
Stealth. These are the people who vote for candiidates that make some outlandish racist comment, then retract it. But they know who has their back.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Not conservatives doing this. Liberals wiping out history. Today a flag. What will come tomorrow?
As a non-American, that flag has no inherent meaning to me. It certainly doesn't conjure up images of slavery or racism. The only image I associate with it is the General Lee from Dukes of Hazzard, which was kind of bad ass... Apart from that, I find it more aesthetically pleasing due to its symmetry which the (in my opinion boring) US flag lacks.
But yeah, I understand the sentiment. Over here we got the swastika. Cool symbols forever ruined through association...
"We believe that the best way to fight evil is to let evil speak so we can hear who is evil. Much better than outlawing their vile ideas and having to guess who secretly harbors them. "
Wow. I had no idea that Chairman Mao was the intellectual founder of US constitutional principles. He had some 1000 chrysanthemums program so people in China could speak out. After people spoke out Mao had them eliminated. This was not the motivation of the US founders.
The idea of free speech has more than one aspect
First consider the sane and well regulated mind. The sane and well regulated mind has learned modesty. It recognizes that it is fallible and develops modes of behavior to account for error. In the realm of ideas the well regulated mind can see that it is immodest to force its own conclusions upon others. In the realm of ideas there is no necessity to require other minds to adhere to one mind's thoughts. In the physical realm, other than the physical means to express ideas, the well regulated mind may be required to interfere with others as a matter of necessity but in the expression of symbols it is not. So free speech is likely advocated by the sane and well regulated mind as it allows for modesty and allows for error correction provided by the sharing of thoughts where one can see one's own errors and omissions.
The base state of freedom is that all is allowed including speech. Disallowing things must be justified by some need. Interference must be warranted. If we disallow speech then we have a paradox. How do we determine what is acceptable thought without the ability to share thoughts and argue their merits? Clearly if we wish to have thoughts in our heads that are worthy and best then we must allow those thoughts to be freely expressed so we can consider and cultivate them. Stifling speech is ending our hope of having the best possible ideas and state of mind. Stifling speech ends the ability to be right and sane.
Please note that these ideas are both highly social and individualistic at the same time. The social aspect is recognition and acceptance that other' thought and freedom is of value. The individualistic aspect is that free speech is very much in our individual interest as it provides a means for the individual to make the most of himself. Free speech is not so good at making others adhere to our standards and thoughts but the colonists had already had quite enough of that nonsense.
Now some sociopathic tyrant could narrow his eyes and see that allowing free speech temporarily can allow one to identify thoughts he considers unacceptable in order to do ill to those thought's bearers. This is not actually a commitment to free speech though.
I'm certainly not one to buy or display the Confederate flag, but I see Google's decision as short sighted and disrespectful of freedom and the notions that freedom is founded upon. Google may have every right to exclude sales of some symbols and allow others but they can't honestly claim to be even handed as they allow the sales of many objectionable things.
Whoever modded you up as insightful is an ignorant fraud. The first person I ever saw wearing a confederate flag where I grew up in Kentucky was a black guy on campus trying to recruit people into a southern pride fraternity. I guess you can add black people to your 'shmucks' pile as well since some of them really aren't prideful of their heritage and must be secretly wanting slavery to come back...
Define offensive. I am offended by Nazism, ISIS, and extremists on all edges of the racial spectrum, yet these same companies carry products for these groups. Some of these groups have probably killed, maimed and horrifically destroyed more lives than the racists who are too overweight to waddle off their porch to get their mail, much less commit a crime against those with a different skin tone. Yes a disturbed man killed 9 people praying in a church, but the last time I looked one megalomaniac took the advice of a psychopathic crony and killed 6 million people because of their religion, ethnicity, race, or sexual preference, yet I can still find books he wrote, flags & clothing depicting the symbols he used and even find groups who still revere him. That offends me more than a historical flag that was co-opted into a racist movement that has devolved into a joke. Racism, sexism, religious bigotry all still exist worldwide and I will do what I can to smash those groups, but a company refusing to sell or make certain items will simply raise the price for the existing items and make them more desirable (Hmm this sounds like the war on drugs that we are winning so well in the US...) If ebay & Amazon won't sell these items and if flag companies refuse to silkscreen them, someone somewhere is about to make a lot of money on "banned" items.
"If stupid things work...then they are not stupid."
I suppose it depends on how you define "Northern states", but several of the Union states (notably, Kentucky and Delaware) still allowed slavery until the 13th Amendment passed. Maryland only outlawed slavery during the Civil War, and had not decided anything by 1804. It's up to you whether you consider them Northern states, since that's not really defined.
Slavery is part of the Confederate battle flag's meaning, but I don't think it's the whole meaning, nor do I think you have to agree with everything behind a symbol in order to display it. I also support any efforts to reclaim or purify a symbol from those who spoil it; these have to be approached much better than the South is right now, but there's nothing wrong with trying.
Examine even your most deeply held beliefs. Nobody is always right.
The traditional labeling of northern, middle and southern dates back to the original 13 colonies. Maryland southern, Delaware middle. New York, Pennsylvania and New Jersey being the other middle states and definitely part of the 1804 group that had gone abolition or was phasing in abolition. Kentucky was carved out of Virginia which had expanded its borders west. So I guess we can say all northern and middle states, except Delaware, had decided to abolished slavery by 1804.
The "debate" over "southern" is in some cases a post-war perspective. A rejection by some southerners of their southern neighbors who remained loyal to the Union, rejecting them as not "true southerners".
But yeah Union is not strictly northern. Lets also toss in West Virginia which I think was carved from a region of Virginia that remained loyal to the Union. And the Emancipation Proclamation only freed slaves in rebel territory.
If Dylann Roof had been holding an American flag instead, would they pull all the US flags??? No they would not.
Society is looking for a reason to this guy's insanity and focusing on the Confederate Flag. They do the same with anything else when they can't explain "the why" someone did something....
For example: Remember Columbine? Society blamed the cause on video games.
The same thing happens when someone else does something terrible, and they blame it on "Heavy Metal Music". Or, "porn".
The flag is not the reason this guy committed this crime. He's nuts. Plain and simple. So were the idiots at Columbine.
Will you be there, Dave?
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.