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Microsoft Removes the 'X' From Windows 10 Update Leaving No Way Out (theregister.co.uk)
simpz writes: The Register reports that Microsoft has changed the Windows 10 update dialog and no longer shows the "X" close button. They say once agreed to there is no obvious back-out method and it is now out of step with Microsoft's own documentation on this. They have a screenshot of this. As noted above, the latest move is out of step with Microsoft's Knowledge Base documentation, which says you can re-schedule your upgrade.
There's no X it to this torture chamber!
Try Alt-f4. Works on many apps and usually forgotten by most devs.
The power of inertia is incredible. I can't imagine putting up with a vendor that treats their customers this way.
https://www.grc.com/never10.htm
Technically this is an improvement- it is no longer a dark pattern, there's no more trick. Obviously the sane thing to do is to simply stop forcing this OS change on the users, but each Windows 10 user must generate so much ad revenue that it is worth trying to stomp out each and every one.
Anyway, whatever. Install Linux, that's your only long term fix. You can turn off updates in Windows 7 or 8, or you can get some binary that tries to fight Microsoft on this, or you can do some doodlefuck in the registry. The point is, you're fighting the OS distributor, who is no longer trustworthy. Install Linux, or you must like this shit.
Shill prediction: At some point in the near future, the "free upgrade" goes away. At this point, however, they'll still offer it for free for users of assistive technology: ( https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.c... ). That's nice of them, but that *probably* means that pretty much anyone will still be able to get it for free, by turning this on. So the shill prediction is: that this becomes a "cool trick" that gets posted on forums and stuff, at some people looking to "pull one over" on Microsoft.
Windows 10 uses you. You're the revenue source, because they sell ads. Of course they are willing to let you be a revenue source at no cost to them!
what about Alt+F4 ???
Alllllll these workarounds. Man, wouldn't it be great if your OS wasn't overtly hostile?
The nerds already set the group policy with NeverTen or with AD. It's the muggles who are all getting upgraded whether they want to or not.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
All this time, I thought that was a joke.
Just reject the license upon reboot. Previous version restored!
Microsoft is just digging itself deeper and deeper into a hole, from which it may never be able to extract itself. Enjoy your sprint to the bottom, Microsoft.
The close button (red X) didn't work as users expected. It was a user interface failure, and Microsoft solved the problem. Now the dialog box correctly tells users, as MS intends, that their options are to upgrade now or schedule a time for upgrade. No more users getting surprised and outraged when closing the dialog box results in an unexpected Windows 10 upgrade.
Whether or not you are a fan of MS's upgrade approach, this is a solution to the UI problem. We can still be outraged about forced upgrades, but this isn't a terrible fix.
Does it bother anyone else that effectively you have to stop getting ALL important security, performance, and stability updates for Windows 7 just to avoid the debacle that is Microshit's managing of Windows 10's rollout? I have absolutely no intention of EVER installing Windows 10, or for that matter any future version of windows. After Windows 7 becomes too old to do what I need, I'm moving to linux full time. How can this behavior be legal, or even acceptable? Can this be reported to the better business bureau or something? I just feel like there is nothing I can do except accept the fact that I have to have a less secure operating system just to avoid M$'s nagging bullshit and them possibly messing up my whole computer by installing an OS I don't want.
I can't be the only one this exacerbated, can I?!
It seems like a thin line between what MS is doing and what ransom wear does. Both force you to comply with some demand or lose access to your computer.
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
Except closing the window is taken as hitting "OK" regardless of how you close it. Did you miss the previous article that talked about how this very X button was being interpreted by the Win10 upgrader as the user accepting? The only thing M$ has done now is removed the ambiguity and made it so there is no obvious route of declining at that point. Closing the window accepts the upgrade, regardless of exactly how the user closed it. Its more of an informative popup than a query, the installer has no intention of taking your input into consideration as it has already decided to install Windows 10 and now its just letting you know you're fucked.
Seriously, this could all be parody, and at this point, no one would be able to tell.
It's kind of like recent decades of of the political process: Take normal political lying, intersperse it with assurances that "Oh, now we're going to make EVERYTHING better - government is not the solution WE ARE... when we're government, that is."... then they get in, and it's like 10x more cynical rules being passed.
That said, pessimism is misleading too. PLENTY of scummy businessmen have dreamt of pushing these same models, but were rejected soundly by smaller customer bases - it just takes longer for Microsoft to fall the same way IBM and other scummy folks did.
Also, for politics, if you look at the ages of yellow journalism in ages past, the populace was truly more deeply ignorant in the past, and the politics even more cynical, with death as a much more common side effect of that cynicism - things are genuinely better, which actually makes it relatively shocking to see some small degree of backsliding towards a less classically liberal path. Despite the 'overton window' of recent decades and news, we're actually amazingly liberal in terms of actual policies, with no real show of that stopping.
But yeah - this crap with windows quadrupling down on their spyware-like 'upgrade' practices is in the same vein - an amazing throwback to scummy ideas I'd thought the 'marketplace of ideas' rejected to soundly everyone should still remember not to use them.
I guess we have to keep relearning those things.
Ryan Fenton
If you bought something, that doesn't give the vendor the right to later on take it away from you. And don't start with the "license" bullshit. Like any upgrade/downgrade, you should be able to accept or reject it.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
Menu of Choices:
1. Upgrade to Windows 10
2. Upgrade to Windows 9 + 1
3. Get Windows 10 for Free!
4. Install the latest Windows version from Microsoft
5. Restart your computer, and then have it automatically install Windows 10
6. Let Microsoft decide for you
7. Ten, Windows, upgrade to. -Yoda
8. Just do it, dammit, it probably won't kill you
9. Go to 1.
Table-ized A.I.
it is insanity in this day and age to have to support multiple substantially different versions of an operating system for general population. its unjustifiably expensive and unsustainable.
Then Microsoft should not have sold WIndows 7 and 8 with support windows that extend to 2020 (Win 7) and 2023 (Win 8). Consumers purchased these products with the promise of support as per Microsoft's published Windows lifecycle. If Microsoft didn't plan to do this, and price their product accordingly, that is very much their problem.
Like any upgrade/downgrade, you should be able to accept or reject it.
You accepted it. You chose to keep "install recommended updates automatically", and that's what is happening.
If you want to reject it, don't let Microsoft install things automatically, or to determine what is "recommended" for you.
I have a lot of Windows 7 systems that will not suffer from this nonsense because they don't install anything without my review and permission. Once I accept the update, however, I expect that it will take place -- because I've approved it.
And simply closing the notice that an update has been scheduled isn't saying it's ok to do the update, it's closing the notice. It's lunacy to think that clicking an 'x' or closing a window with alt-f4 would mean "take an action to change the system adminstrator's authorizations."
Windows 8.1 was released less than two years ago. If you switch to Windows 10 today, you're pretty much signing up for the same crap later, being forced to Windows 365 in 2018.
I use CentOS on most of my machines. Each version of CentOS has a ten-year life (longer if you choose to handle your own security updates). For me, a "long term" operating system is ten years. Maybe you consider a year and a half until you have to switch operating systems to be "long term".
My mother just blew through her data cap on her Verizon hotspot yesterday. I could't figure out how she could have used 6.5 GB in one day, then I realized Microsoft had downloaded Windows 10 to her machine. She really needs to learn a new UI at this point in her life, she's 85 and half blind. Now she also gets to pay data overages from her $500 a month of social security that she's living on. Actually, I will be paying it, and will also have to drive and hour and half to go un-fuck her machine. These people really are cruel and heartless bastards.
Correction: two and half years. Not what _I_ consider "long term" for switching OS.
If you find yourself in this inescapable forced upgrade:
Pull the plug, then don't turn your computer back on until Microsoft has gone out of business.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
Except you waived the right to punitive and consequential damages when you agreed to the EULA for your current product. You MIGHT get your purchase price back for the current product, but that's about it.
What if the next EULA says that killing GWX.EXE and other related Microsoft service processes is against the agreement?
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
Why can't you just schedule it to happen in the max date of the dialog? that should be like 2999 or something.
Individuals only got support for Windows 7 until 1/13/2015. They aren't included in the 2020 support plan, and Microsoft is under no obligation to support home users for Windows 7 anymore.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
Just went through a small hell getting QB installed on a spanking brand new Windows 10 machine.
"Microsoft will offer Mainstream Support for either a minimum of 5 years from the date of a product’s general availability, or for 2 years after the successor product (N+1) is released, whichever is longer. Extended Support is not offered for Consumer software and Multimedia products with the exception of Windows Desktop Operating system which follows the Business, Developer, and Desktop Operating System Software Products policy as outlined above." -- https://support.microsoft.com/...
There is an exception for consumers that specifically includes the OS. So, you are wrong, they are covered until 2020.
There lies the domain of the MS Marketing director, who having submitted to the mandatory prefrontal lobotomy (a corporate requirement for the position), sits within the pallid cool glow of his curved LED monitor, simply cannot fathom what is making the users angry.
"It costs too much!" he mocks. "Make it free like OSX!"
So we do-- We make it a free update! We put it on Windows update, so it is convenient. Our telemetry tells us that most of our users dont subscribe to MSDN news sources, so we make it super easy to inform them about the update with the GWX app...
But there is no pleasing them!
First, they say that using windows update to spread awareness is a misuse of the critical update delivery pipeline-- So, we deploy additional telemetry software to verify the claim, and help synergize with development for the new programming apis we will use going forward, and now they complain we are spying on them!
So, we install those telemetry updates in updates more specific to that development harmonization, and they freak out even more!
Corporate wants to know why these users arent on board with windows 10, despite the free upgrade, and wont get off my back! What am I supposed to tell them, since those users keep uninstalling the telemetry suite that would let us know more about the issue!
Now, to top it all off, they complain about the functionality of the close button widget.
Ok, so we change the behavior-- they are still mad.
Ok, so we REMOVE the widget-- Even angrier!!
What is it that these people want!!?
(at this point, an intern enters the dread specter of marketing's office with a thick slab of useless paper copy to make his daily delivery, since despite email being a thing for over a decade, there are those in corporate that still insist on old fashioned interoffice memos. In a quivering, mewling tone reminiscient of a prepubescent youth, the freckled mouse of a man hazards a conjecture to his corporate master, knowing the perils of doing so.)
Perhaps they just dont want the update, and dont want to be told about it anymore?
At this, the dread specter of marketing erupts into a ballmer-esque frenzy, toppling his chair, and spraying thick droplets of foaming spittle as he rages--
DONT WANT THE UPDATE!? DONT WANT IT!?
he shrieks, grabbing the thick slab of papers from the poor interns hands, then throwing them in the air.
FIRST THEY COMPLAIN ABOUT HAVING TO PAY EVERY 3 YEARS, THEN WHEN WE RESTRUCTURE FOR THE NEW ADVERT MODEL, THEY DONT WANT THE UPDATE!?
Cowering on the floor, desperately trying to recover and recollate the precious memos that justify his position in the company, the intern timidly responds.
Perhaps they wanted us to respect their choice of when to do the update?
FUCK-EM! the prince of darkness snarls, returning to his desk and grabbing the back of his chair in a livid clawing motion. WE HAVE A SCHEDULE TO MEET, AND WE ARE BENDING OVER BACKWARDS FOR THESE INGRATES!
Does that mean that we will proceed with the forced updates sir?
The room fills with a thick, suffocating silence for a good seconds, as the knuckles on the back of the chair turn white with rage-clenching, followed by unnatural relaxation. In a now buttery smooth, and altogether inhumanly relaxed tone, the dread specter of marketing smiles deeply..
Of course we will. We owe it to them, after all.
It's very easy to use a WSUS update utility to download and build a Windows 7 update .iso or thumb drive. It's something to just regularly do. I made a final XP update with such a tool on the eol date for XP and now have a permanant final update bundle for XP.
Individuals only got support for Windows 7 until 1/13/2015. They aren't included in the 2020 support plan, and Microsoft is under no obligation to support home users for Windows 7 anymore.
As per Microsoft's lifecycle policy, Extended Support applies to retail purchases, and entitles home users to security fixes until January 14, 2020 (Win 7) and January 10, 2023 (Win 8).
After 15+ years with Microsoft windows, including Microsoft certification and working in the industry for most of those years, I switched over to MacOS about a year ago due to the "forced on you" mindset Microsoft is now employing. I can see why Linux and MacOS are gaining ground. Now if we can only get games to run under Linux and MacOS (real games, not ones released 6 years ago) and that will be the fall of Microsoft.
This is an F'ing nightmare for me. I provide computer support for my extended family, many of which are up in years and are finally happy with their computer and the programs they use. Things have been good for 3+ years or so and stable, as I purchased all their computers for them with pre-installed Windows 7 Home Premium. Now I get called about this "popup" on their screen that they don't know what to do with. Initially I told them to just close the window, then later (I missed the change) one of the computers started to upgrade to Windows 10. I don't have the time or honestly the patience to teach nearly a dozen family members in different states how to use the new Windows, research and pay for upgrades for any app they use that won't work in Win 10 and in general try to figure out how to answer the question "the mail doesn't work anymore". For this same reason please don't suggest that I "switch to Linux" because that doesn't solve my problem it only exasperates it. I've fallen back and snail-mailed all of them USB sticks with the GWX control panel software and a 15 page picture-filled document on how to install the app that is on the thumb drive. Microsoft is unforgivable for this heavy-handed attempt at assimilating the masses to meet their ad-based revenue goals. Oh and some of them have 3 or 4 year old Samsung smart TVs.... =P
This just highlights why it's important to a) turn off auto update, and b) screen all updates as you apply them. It's more work up front, but will save you pain in the long run. Microsoft goes out of its way to make getting info on individual updates difficult. You can't (of course) get the info directly from Windows Update, you have to click on a link from there, and then sometimes follow more links before you can find out. And, in some cases, the real purpose is quite obfuscated in generic language and you then have to more general searches. Update days can take an hour or more of research. But it's worth it. My computer is clean from nagware.
To everyone who has auto update turned on, I offer the old scorpion and the frog adage. We all know who Microsoft is. Take the scorpion on your back and you will get stung. It's Microsoft's nature. And in this day and age where this kind of negative publicity multiplies exponentially, where desktop computing is being increasingly relegated to the back burner, and where there are other viable desktop alternatives, Microsoft really is killing itself too by stinging the frog carrying it. But, as they have aptly... and repeatedly... demonstrated, they really can't help themselves.
"She obviously wanted it! If she didnt, why was she showing leg under that slutty red and black dress, and wearing whore makup at night like that!"
Because that's what the "You did agree! You had had suggested updates turned on!" really amounts to.
The nerds already set the group policy with NeverTen or with AD.
No. Nerds never used Windows to begin with. They were on Symbolics machines or big-iron Unix back in the 70's, Unix workstations in the 80's and 90's, Linux or one of the BSDs in the aughts through 10's...
Windows has never been for techies. We took one look at it in the 80's with no memory protection, 8.3 filenames, no multi-tasking, inability to address more than a 640K without horrible hacks, and said, "Uh... no thanks."
The 30 years of Windows suckage after that have been brought to you courtesy of PHB's, not by the technically literate, except inasmuch as the PHBs compelled them over their objections.
You can do what I did, go to Frys with a wheelbarrow full of cash and buy a Mac. I'm an embedded firmware developer and often need windows based compilers for microcontroller development. (sorry, not everything iCPU is supported by open source compilers). After I was forced to work under parallels for windows work last year I have never looked back. Even windows is more stable under osx. It is hard to blame microsoft developers for all the instabilities as every peripheral maker drops their own conflicting and half baked drivers into the mix. I've been living with dos and windows since it was the next new thing and I'm glad to see the back side of windows machines. Only thing that still drives me nuts is the disjoint copy and paste meta keys when moving test between windows and parallels/windows - it just hurts my brains and muscle memory.
NO.
BOTH are AUTOMATIC decisions, done from wrote repitition.
The woman puts on her makeup, as she always has.
The computer user clicks next on everything as they always have.
The insistance that either is a conscious, willfull choice to have something done to them is sick. Get over yourself.
I use Windows Media Center on my Windows 7 PCs, and since it is not included in Windows 10, no thank you. I'm using GWX Control Panel and am not installing any updates automatically. I have to spend time looking up every one based upon it's Knowledge Base website and decide if I need it and/or if it's a thinly-veiled path to the Windows 10 upgrade. Yeah, I know that there are those who post on this website http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/f... who have gotten WMC to work somewhat on Windows 10 Systems, but somewhat is not good enough for me. For Qugh, Microsoft!
The insistance that either is a conscious, willfull choice to have something done to them is sick. Get over yourself.
The decision to select "install recommended updates automatically" is a causal action for having updates installed automatically. Putting makeup on is not a causal action for rape.
To believe otherwise is delusional and sick. To try to equate the two is sad. You need to get over yourself.
No, that's not the operating system bought.
https://www.youtube.com/c/BrendaEM
But then you get that systemd crap.
This article is false. This screen is encountered AFTER you already have accepted the update.
http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-makes-blocking-windows-10-recommended-update-near-impossible-report/
No, you are rationalizing a decision to do something to someone.
The non-decision to click next to everything, which is where the "install recomended updates automatically" option pops up during first product activation, is an automatic one TO USE THE COMPUTER. It does not mean "rape me!"
Even if it did mean what you try so hard to say it means, the user may well decide that yes, they want updates to the OS they have installed-- not to install a new OS, especially since the OS they currently have has 4 more years of support-- which is the sensible way to interpret that, assuming you consider it a rational, active choice. (which for most users, it is not.)
Microsoft is placidly calling an OS upgrade to a new OS an update to an old OS. These are not the same things, and what MS is doing is wrong in both contexts.
Windows has never been for techies. We took one look at it in the 80's with no memory protection, 8.3 filenames, no multi-tasking, inability to address more than a 640K without horrible hacks, and said, "Uh... no thanks."
And decided that was sufficient to continue to reject it even after NT (standard multiple-address-space OS, long file names, multi-tasking, standard 32-bit address space) came out, presumably.
This is exactly why my windows machines are not allowed to connect to the Internet. Otherwise they start to think they have a mind of their own, and I have to send them to the basement... indefinitely.
The following statement is true: The previous statement is false.
Free as in beer, or free as in Freedom? MS is offering (OK, Pushing really hard) its latest OS for free as in beer. Because thats the only kind of free that corporate America recognizes. Perhaps they are thinking they can circumvent the whole "free as in freedom" movement with "free as in beer". And here we are nearly two decades later and people are just NOW starting to undrstand why the whole GNU/FSF "Free as in Freedom" bit is important.
C|N>K
seriously just stop gwx.exe
cortaaaaanaaaaa
lucm, indeed.
I know the memo was sent a good 20 years ago so surely you have recieved it by now, but have you heard of Linux? Sure it's not perfect either but you can modify it to make it do what you want, now that doesn't sound appealing to many people but if the nerds and geeks here are still Windows devotees trying to work against their OS then it's likely to remain prevalent for a long time to come.
https://www.debian.org/
https://devuan.org/
http://redhat.com/
http://www.ubuntu.com/
https://www.suse.com/
https://getfedora.org/
To list just a few...
MS is just making the choice more binary - either you choose to let them do anything they want with your computer, or you choose to let them do NOTHING.
Not with Slackware
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
each Windows 10 user must generate so much ad revenue that it is worth trying to stomp out each and every one
they could learn from the masters... On the new Kindle there's ads on the screensaver/lock screen. If you don't want to see ads, you have to pay Amazon $20 on top of the $125 or more for the device.
Now THAT is innovation. Ad-supported paid devices.
lucm, indeed.
disclaimer: i don't exactly have a dog in the fight, i'm a mac/unix guy.
If you wake up one morning and find YOUR Mac has been upgraded from "El Capitan" to "Death Valley", and some of YOUR apps have completely changed appearance, other apps don't work right anymore, still others (like your favorite media app) are just plain gone and can't be recovered, and YOU have a whole new flat ugly touch-based color scheme on some but not all of your applications, YOUR menu bar has been replaced with a ribbon, some older hardware doesn't have drivers anymore, and a bunch of ads are now rolling through YOUR dock, and the EULA now says Apple reserves the right to send info about YOU back to headquarters whenever it feels like it, my guess is you won't just smile and be happy because Apple's business model is not "insane".
it is insanity in this day and age to have to support multiple substantially different versions of an operating system for general population. its unjustifiably expensive and unsustainable.
You got it backward. Since when does the market (i.e., consumers... us) have to bear the burden for Microsoft's "insanity"? Let's see how YOU feel about the "insanity" when it's YOUR computer that's changed overnight into a platform for promoting tablets and phones that nobody wants to buy. If YOUR dad calls YOU in the middle of the night because he can no longer figure out how to view pictures of his grandkids, are YOU gonna tell him to be silent and act like a man and accept his duty to make sacrifices wherever necessary to support our Dear Corporate Overlords? "Gee, I know it's hard, dad, but think about (Microsoft CEO) Nadella... you and mom are doing it for the good of Microsoft and Nadella."
"Gosh, son, you're right. I guess I don't need those old picture anyhow. Hail Nadella."
Take it easy, Charlie, I've got an Angle...
"Slackware is archaic". Old does not mean bad or even obsolete. Slackware is still quite alive and well and entirely usable on modern systems as a modern OS
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
An update is not an upgrade. They agreed to updates and this has never happened before. Bringing your SUV to the dealer for a recall and getting a sub compact back is a better analogy than rape. But its better for the environment.. and it was free and its brand new... no, you'd be pissed.
It's like wack-a-mole. Except that moles are cute. Even the moles on my back are cuter than Windows 10.
There was some software I updated recently that said I needed to reboot to complete the installation. The notification gave me choices for how long to delay until it reminded me to reboot, and the last option was for 100 years. So at least one company seems to understand how I think.
Alllllll these workarounds. Man, wouldn't it be great if your OS wasn't overtly hostile?
Exactly! You hit the nail on the head. Spot on. Right on the money. Right on the point. Thank you.
It is disgusting how the IT industry treats their non-corporate clients with such hostility. Probably because majority of simple folks don't have any choice in the matter: They are locked in. Windows is all they know.
How far in the future can you set the date in that calendar in the screenshot?
"What day and time is good for you? "
04/20/2099 works for me thanks.
What if GWX.EXE crashes on its own? How would they tell the difference?
Anything that doesn't run the games I want to play isn't viable as a primary OS for me.
NT was the one time in all of windows history that nerds thought of using it, at the time Linux was pretty painful without a LOT of extra work, and windows, despite all it's flaws, wasn't all that bad. After NT though it was all downhill for windows, and Linux progressed so well, and once Linux became easier to use than windows 5-10 years ago, there was really no more reason for anyone to use Windows except ignorance and inertia.
There's a big difference between discontinuing support with an offer for a free upgrade, and forcing a free upgrade on your users.
The nerds are getting dragged into this to "just fix it" and yelled at as if we work for Microsoft instead of wrangling *nix systems.
"No obligation to support" is a whole lot different from "right to force the customer to take a whole new product"
By the time NT came close to catching up (Win NT4) linux was widely available.
If playing games is your primary use then sure even if you only use Windows to play games then it would be your primary OS and you can do everything else on Linux. There has been much theorizing (for years if we're honest) about how Windows -- and other proprietary programs -- could be used to spy on you, if you don't believe the hype or don't care about that (or value it less than the effort of dual-booting) then by all means just use Windows. I know these claims about backdoors were made many years ago and weren't substantiated by the multiple Windows source code leaks so indeed extrapolation of "telemetry data" to spying could be an equally invalid exagerration.
Probably because majority of simple folks don't have any choice in the matter: They are locked in. Windows is all they know.
They don't care. And why would they? It runs their programs and they have their web browser, that's what an OS is for. You could say (and I already did in the comments somewhere) that they should use Linux but what does that really get them in terms of things they care about? Nothing really. Same thing with iOS, you can argue it is even more overtly hostile in not allowing you to change default programs or install alternative browsers and applications don't work if you don't upgrade the OS but again the majority of folks don't give a shit about that, and why should they?
CTRL+ALT+DEL
Then from the task manager kill the GWX process.
Then change the windows update manager to never check, and then hide the windows 10 update.
Alternately there a several 3rd party apps that will take full control of the update process allowing you to dictate when, how, and what kind of updates you want and get.
You can always set your system to not get anything but critical updates, but someday M$ will decide that getting Win10 is critical, to either them or you.
errr....umm...*whooosh* *whoosh* Is this thing on ?
Anyone have a link to join a class-action lawsuit against Microsoft?
If there isn't one yet, there will be soon. Someone needs to send them a message, and I'm game to pile on.
I absolutely agree with you. For an average user it does not matter what is the OS they run, just that it does not get in the way. And that is perfectly fine!
But here is my point: Why be hostile? What is the benefit of the forced upgrade? Why not just allow the user to press "Cancel"? Let them update when they are ready! if they don't: That is fine, just don't support them. If they come to complain: Just tell them the steps to upgrade.
From my past experience supporting such users, they get absolutely horrified of situations they can't back out of or can't abort. Anything unfamiliar on the screen sends them into a state of panic. And here you have the very worst example.
This is a perfect showcase of an OS getting in the way of the user. He/she could be in the middle of their daily email reading when all of a sudden a system dialogue comes up demanding they right there and NOW make a decision about their underlying system. No, you can't close it and come back to it later. At most you can do is schedule a time, but schedule something you don't even understand or indeed want! Your Windows 7 IE is showing your emails fine! Why (As you eloquently put it) do I need to care about the OS?!
Can you imagine what panic this user will go through if they say OK to the update?! All of the sudden your system is rebooting and installation screens are asking you questions and that only thing you know is that it deals with something you know nothing about!
But here is my point: Why be hostile? What is the benefit of the forced upgrade?
Probably to focus their resources on supporting one platform. You're dealing with people who get fooled by "This is sanjay from Windows, your computer is telling us it has viruses" phone calls, sure they will have to go through an automatic update and restart but it means they are on the latest supported software.
Can you imagine what panic this user will go through if they say OK to the update?! All of the sudden your system is rebooting and installation screens are asking you questions and that only thing you know is that it deals with something you know nothing about!
Well that depends, what exactly are these questions? If it's a clean install then you would be asked about where to install it but that isn't the case with an upgrade. What are these confusing questions you're talking about?
Didn't see the Win10 upgrade dialog myself. But my typical way of dealing with Windows update dialog is to drag it to a corner, so that it won't block my way. Also, it would not reappear again and again (it can relocate itself to center of screen, but less frequent than the reappearance of the dialog)
Well that depends, what exactly are these questions? If it's a clean install then you would be asked about where to install it but that isn't the case with an upgrade. What are these confusing questions you're talking about?
I must confess that I do not know. I never went through the process of upgrading to Windows 10. But even I would be uncomfortable with going through any OS upgrade process without being prepared for it. At the very least backups of my data!
Well what MS is doing is not explicitly prohibited by law, as far as I can tell (IANAL). What isn't prohibit suddenly because a right when you can update your EULA every month and people click through it without reading it. No really, I'm not going to read EULAs anymore. They are 40 pages of mind numbing legalese. There should be a scientific study to determine if reading EULAs causes long term health issues so I can start suing these companies for writing them.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
Might have been true some years ago, but thr current state of Linux desktop environments is so bad that Windows 10 feels fine in comparison. I still haven't recovered from the PTSD after trying to cope with Unity. Current KDE and Gnome are hair-raisingly terrible and XFCE makes Windows 8 feel user friendly.
"It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
Not true.... First of all, 14.1 was initially released in 2013. Secondly, 14.1 was maintained in -current for about a year and a half after release. -current then migrated to being a repository for the upcoming 14.2 release, but all major issues, particularly those regarding security, are still backported to the 14.1 repository. The -current repo was in beta for 14.2 at the beginning of the year and has been in release candidate status since about April. Because one of the foremost focus points for Slackware is stability, Slackware does not tend to promote -current as suitable for end users, but it is still definitely there, and available for users that seek it out.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
1) I upgraded my gaming computer from Windows 7 Pro to Win10 Pro a few weeks ago. I went to do a basic copy to external storage of a large group of files for cold storage (roughly 500GB). I do this every few months but last night, it gave me out of memory error (RAM) during the copy. I've never had a that kind of error under any previous version of Windows.
2) Previously I was running a mix environment of Mac OS X, Windows 7 Pro, and Windows 10. When I share a folder on Windows 7, the Mac OS X picks up the subfolders correctly. But Windows 10 machines will decide to show only half or sometimes only one of the subfolders. After upgrading all my windows machine to Win10, the problem went away. Can't help but think MSFT is sabotaging Windows 7.
3) Sometimes on Windows 10 machines, I can't right click on the File Explorer icon to open another instance of File Explorer.
4) After each patch Tuesday, several of my machines will decide to go to 640 x 480 when they boot up the next morning. Not a huge deal, but gets annoying to redo the resolution every Wednesday. No driver issues or anything, the machines just feel like booting Windows 10 at 640 x 480.
"Microsoft is just digging itself deeper and deeper into a hole..."
Microsoft has been so stupid lately that there has been talk that Satan won't renew Microsoft's contract. The problem? Stupidity is not evil enough.
Other news: The Monkey's Lives Matter organization has been protesting the disrespect of calling former Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer "Monkey Boy".
Sometimes, when things are very, very sad, it's helpful to make jokes to take a break from the sadness.
Except closing the window is taken as hitting "OK" regardless of how you close it. Did you miss the previous article that talked about how this very X button was being interpreted by the Win10 upgrader as the user accepting? The only thing M$ has done now is removed the ambiguity and made it so there is no obvious route of declining at that point. Closing the window accepts the upgrade, regardless of exactly how the user closed it. Its more of an informative popup than a query, the installer has no intention of taking your input into consideration as it has already decided to install Windows 10 and now its just letting you know you're fucked.
Shirley you don't epect us to RTFA. It's Friday and we're having some jolly time bashing MS waiting for the pint o'clock.
I am surprised Microsoft don't sets a date automatically for you and then create a wake scheduler task to install during the night
Obviously the answer is revenue. There are lots of savings to be had. It's much cheaper to maintain one OS rather them multiple versions of the OS. (BTW, expect big layoffs at MS real soon now. Anyone who mostly works on OS code that is not tied to 10 should have their resume all polished up. Blood will flow in Redmond.)
But that part is not enough to explain the ridiculous methods that are being used. When the only way to insure that 10 is not installed on your computer is to never attach it to the internet, there is something else going on. And it must be revenue driven.
The likely answer is that Microsoft is planning on going to a de facto subscription model. Users will have to pay every year to keep their copy of the OS working. Same for Office, Excel, etc. Individual users will end up paying the full purchase cost every year for each piece of software, or maybe half the full price. Of course there will be "bundled" discounts like the phone companies offer, but that won't do much for your elderly relatives. And there will be student rates, but the vast majority will be paying through the nose.
Microsoft lost the revenue war to Apple.They missed out on the iPhone and iWatch. They were late to the cloud as well. Android has driven all the nails into the coffin for the phone/tablet market, which is where the growth will be.Their only play is to fully exploit their monopolist power and embrace extortionist capitalism.
The EU will scream like a stuck pig, but MS already has a strategy in place to deal with them. It will be delay by a series of holding actions, and then eventually have data centers in Europe to satisfy privacy conditions. They might even agree to pay more taxes, which will be less painful given the profits they rake in.
The big growth will be in China, Russia and India, where MS will help the government track everyone. They will do for these countries what the NSA has done to the US. Every computer will be a full time spy. Local data centers with 100% access to the contents of all computers. It is possible that the US will take advantage of this as well. Not that anyone will ever hear about it.
Why is Snark Required?
Some of us prefer gaming for stress relief as opposed to drinking or posting anonymously to online forums.
Sounds like you have hardware issues not related to your OS. Not only have I been running Windows 10 on an astounding number of home PCs (8!!!), but my company is in the middle of a mass deployment and things are working out just fine. The only issues I've hit are an occasional explorer stall out...which appears to be related to the start menu. I even copied 4 TB of data from 2-2 TB hds to a RAID-1 5 TB array without issue. Took 13.6 hours and completed with no problems. Not a fan of microsoft at all (I'm a mac guy with a broadwell macbook pro...though I'm loving ubuntu 16.04...dual booting it!), but senseless bashing shows you are a shill. Don't be a shill. Please?
Might have been true some years ago, but thr current state of Linux desktop environments is so bad that Windows 10 feels fine in comparison. I still haven't recovered from the PTSD after trying to cope with Unity. Current KDE and Gnome are hair-raisingly terrible and XFCE makes Windows 8 feel user friendly.
I have been using Fedora for over seventeen years and in the last seven years on my own PC's and have never struck any major issues that could not be fixed. Currently, I am running Fedora 23 with the KDE spin on my Desktop with the latest Skylake architecture and have not had any issues with that release.
It is possible for me to run MS Widows under a virtual machine (currently Android, SeamOS and Mint) but to date, I could not be bothered since everything that I want and more is stable and works perfectly.
There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
It's a con. Look at it from the layperson's point of view. Microsoft tells them they should enable updates (recommended) and if they don't starts screaming about them with big red warnings about how their system is at risk. So they take that advice in good faith.
A few years later Microsoft decides they want everyone to upgrade to Windows 10. Back in 2009 when they bought their shiny new Windows 7 machine the user took their advice, and nearly 7 years later they assume this means that they want to upgrade to a new OS, re-install their software, and replace hardware that is no longer supported etc. Even if they don't, Microsoft will download a few gigs of update files over their metered connection anyway. And hide the "no thanks" button, because taking Microsoft's advice is basically signing your free will away in perpetuity at this point.
It's like doing a deal with the Devil. Looks innocent enough now, but many years later you find that the small print (which didn't seem to be there when you signed) screws you.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
It is Windows divide by zero, originally handwritten on a napkin, but was eventually interpreted -- or misread -- as TEN
WARNING: Smartphones have side effects--most of them undocumented.
That you cant cancel, is a mandatory update. This has to be illegal. A popup that you cant get rid of, barring doing what they say to do, and even if you don't you still get it. Why bother asking? This i can see ending in a lawsuit.
Fuck you microsoft. Fuck you in the ass you sacks of shit.
Ctrl shift escape, you mean. That opens the task manager (which GP has possibly overridden with Process Explorer). Ctrl alt escape is for pushing the active window to the bottom.
I like Windows 10 but whyyyyyyyyy do they have to be so trolly about it?
hi
Yeah only cause Slackware hasn't been updated since 2012...lets install Windows 95 while were at it.
Slackware was last updated on the 15th of April 2016
I plan on getting lots of calls about this. People will be paying me money to get rid of your crap.
HA HA HA
Flappinbooger isn't my real name
Pretty much the first thing I do when I get a new Windows PC is disable Windows updates.
If I learn about a specific update that figure I need, I'll install that manually (pretty rare TBH). PC sits behind plenty of firewallage alongside other trusted machines.
So far this has worked fine for me, while I have seen friends get their machines crippled by BSODs or endless reboot cycles because of some faulty Windows update that has installed automatically.
In 2017 you will get into your car and set off to work and find your fucking brake cables have been cut by Microsoft employees because you didn't upgrade to Windows 10.
Your widow later discovers there's actually a provision for them to do that, in the latest revised EULA - one that was carefully printed out by a Microsoft lawyer onto a single sheet of A4 in Redmond on November 9th 2016 and immediately shredded, thereby gaining the consent of every windows user in the world.
Fuck you, you fucking fucks.
After our vehicle upgrade agents spent all night cutting the brake cables from every car in the neighbourhood, people started complaining that their brakes pedals weren't working. So we fixed that problem by sending our agents out again, this time to remove the brake pedals from all the cars, but for some reason people still whined.
Yeah, I don't know why everyone is complaining that we removed the pedal that they were complaining was broken.
It only shows it doesn't matter what we do at this point, the haters are out for blood and won't see reason. Best to ignore them at this point I suppose..
Well I am currently running VMware Fusion on my work machine and currently it is doing a good job. Luckily it is also running the Enterprise version of 7, so no upgrade to Windows 10 junk either. The performance is decent... still not as good when it was running Windows XP. Man, that sucker could fly! :D
Honestly, linux hasn't been much better than Windows. linux just expresses its troubles differently. I'm in a tiny company and managing our company's little email and web servers is part of my job. All of that runs on linux and, most of the time, is wonderfully reliable. HOWEVER, every two years (I use Ubuntu LTS builds) there is a significant "upgrade" to the OS. Unfortunately, every single one of those has also included upgrades to various packages (like postfix, php, mysql, etc) that are INCOMPATIBLE with previous versions! When this happens, it can take days to figure out all of the adjustments that must be made to our configuration and, since everything is just in text files that I only look at every two years (because things work so well in between updates) I must re-learn amost everything every time I update. And yes, I've heard all of the scolding and comments about note-taking, etc., but when you have a boss and customers screaming at you to get a server back on line, good note taking is low on your priority list.
I don't run Windows SERVERS, but I have NEVER encountered such major incompatibility issues with Windows or software that runs on it. When a new version is incompatible with the previous, the upgrade clearly informs me and offers to automatically migrate my old configuration to the new while asking for any new settings required. linux may say there is a new config file that is recommended, but it won't contain any of your old settings if you use it. I'd be surprised if the linux desktop is any friendlier. By and large, linux is written and maintained by people who love computers and coding (and are VERY good at both) and they appear to expect that anyone using their system is the same (or at least wants to be the same) as them. IMHO, this is the biggest flaw in linux ever since the first time it was predicted to replace Windows. As a developer, I understand the nearly pointless task of writing a migration tool that will run only once -- but when it will run once for MILLIONS of users it becomes quite a bit less pointless, but still, very few of these are written for linux applications (at least, not for any of the server applications I've used for the past 18 years).
I, too, am against the pushy Windows 10 upgrade system, but I'm not sure where to go in a few years when Windows 7 no longer has working drivers for market hardware. Hopefully, something will be ready by then.
I actually agree with the parent post... something is going on to make this drastic of a change. Normally I would agree with you and say everyone has their tinfoil hats on too tight but there definitely seems to be something else to this. Maybe not a conspiracy but... are they hemorrhaging cash? User base slipping away faster than they'd like? What? These moves have the scent of desperation. Why not wait for the gradual switch by folks via new machines, OS support expiration, etc.? I thought they had plenty of cash/time and inertia to do it. They are damaging their brand, losing any goodwill they have by forcing users over, and not to mention scaring any up-and-coming business into choosing different software/platform (the ones that didn't have an Enterprise version the could avoid the Windows 10 mess).
Oh please! I'm so sick of that "support" line of BS, especially since its been reported that they FIRED the QA and testing teams.
This is about MONEY all right, its about making money off of YOU because with windows 10 YOU ARE THE PRODUCT and the OS is merely a carrot to get to you, your data, and your eyeballs. MSFT wants endless revenue and they make more by spying on you and selling that data to advertisers who then pay them AGAIN for ads on the start screen than they ever made on the OS. with previous versions they got paid less than $100 a unit every 3 years, now? They get paid 365 days a year by advertisers for unlimited access to your information and advertising space on your PC.
I mean for fucks sake man why do you think there is more than 12 pages worth of shit you have to turn off just to get windows 10 to STFU and the vast majority of which you CANNOT turn off unless you are on enterprise...you know, the version you have to pay them yearly for? Because its about turning a one time payment into endless revenue and if that means acting like malware to get more products/users they can sell? Then they are gonna do it.
ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
Until, 100 years later, the PC restarts without another popup.
The simplest way is to get an image that you just copy over the main partition of the drive.
"dd" works for that on the command line of Linux
"rawwrite" is a nice Windows GUI
Then there are USB boot-disk maker.
e.g.: there's Unetbootin which downloads an installation ISO and handles the gory details to create a bootable USB stick out of it.
(And for the curious there's a tool for the opposite direction: making a bootable Windows out of an Microsoft's installation ISO).
The gory details:
There are basically 2 different ways to boot a media.
old-school classic BIOS:
- requires a special master-boot record at the beginning of the disk, which in turn will load a boot loader (e.g.: syslinux or grub or lilo) from a specific place (usually hidden between partitions), which then will handle the necessary boot menu and boot linux.
By writing a whole boot-USB image ("dd" method) these extra parts are written too.
And tools like Unetbootin take care of running the necessary soft for it.
new style UEFI:
- the UEFI is able to handle a lot of its own (access to partitions on disks).
- it requires an executable file (.efi) placed in a specific partition (the first FAT32 partition, usually called the "System partition") in a specific path. The UEFI takes care of loading and executing this file (usually, it's going to be grub2.efi) which then will handle the necesary boot menu and boot linux.
That's usually the intended methode behind all the ultra-simple "just copy the files as-is on the USB stick, lol" HOWTOs.
Images copied with the DD mathod will already be formated in the correct formats and partitions.
Unetbootin will re-format and repartition the USB stick if necessary.
Things can get problematic, if: ...the target PC boots in BIOS mode and the proper sectors (Masterboot and bootloader) weren't written. ...the target PC boots in UEFI mode and the partition isn't liked (e.g.: it's an exFAT or NTFS instead of FAT32)
-
-
So, use DD, or use Unetbootin (or use WInUSB if you want to boot a Windows installer). They all handle the gory details.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
Not as such, and notice I said "came close" and never anything about NT actually catching up. Server space is something MS had trouble getting into until MS Outlook became popular enough to drive a lot of MS Exchange installs.
I really don't understand what you get out of this weird revisionism. Do you actually believe this stuff you have written or are you up to some cynical manipulation?
Not sure where all the hate for Gnome3 comes from. It works very well for multi-tasking and is even a bit similar to OS X (enough that I move between my Gnome3 / OS X machines with ease). I now have more trouble task-switching in my Win7 VM because I'm spoiled by Expose/Gnome's methods.
At this point, the only iffy design choice that I tweak away is the lack of min/max buttons.
Why? Because Microsoft have changed their economic model regarding Windows:
They used to want people to buy Windows and thus they used to make the best OS they could.
They've now changed the business model to that of a mobile OS: Their plan is to make money through the Windows Store, the data they gather about you, etc.and thus they want everyone to run Win 10.
They're betting that by being insistent most people will cave in even if they don't like Windows 10 much.
I hate all of this but it seems things are going according to their plan
I hope I'm wrong, but it seems that you are saying that the poster you were responding to was either making it all up for the sake of bashing Micro$oft, or that reporting problems one has with Windows 10 is bashing the reputation of a fine product which has to be crammed down users' throats. I'm not saying hardware issues don't exist, but isn't Windows 10 supposed to analyze your hardware to make sure you can upgrade? Of course, it's also supposed to do automatic updates when your PC is idle, but several examples from other "bashers" have shown it to fail at that, too.
A year ago, if someone said to me "I disable Windows Updates on all my computers," I would have called them an idiot. Now, I just shrug as I understand why they do it.
Do I know about alternatives that are fairly effective at blocking the forced upgrades? Sure. But I'm not willing to take on an additional support burden to help maintain Microsoft's security posture.
If Microsoft wants to throw away years of trying to convince people that Windows Updates won't fuck their computers up, let them.
This is what we get for using Windows.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
I want to know what happens if you report it to the police as a crime. (But not enough to fall victim to it myself so that I can.)
The TPM is an _outstanding_ idea, but the implementation is flawed by the fact that the owner of the machine doesn't get the keys. It's not actually a "root kit", it's a self destruct that someone else has the key for.
I would _insist_ every computer I owned had a TPM _if_ I were in control of that TPM so that I could have it validate that my (linux) box has not been tampered with.
The technology is great. The implementation, however, is designed to work against me, the owner. Were it not _obviously_ laid out in a way intended to turn my computer into a gaming console or cable television set-top box, it would be outstanding.
There is absolutely no reason that the "publicized" goals of the TPM couldn't be realized while still allowing me my full rights.
But Microsoft et al wanted to make a copywrite tool instead of a true trustable boot experience. Signing keys are, after all, part of the public key not the private key. So I should be able to initialize my TPM with my own key pair, load microsoft's signing keys into it as I choose along with any other keys for my e.g. Linux boot system etc, and then get the security without the nonsense.
There is some rationality to wanting to protect the computer from it's operator. I've worked in tech support. There's more rationale to wanting to protect a computer from root kits and tampering. I've worked security. But there is no reason that the person who actually paid for the device should be denied access too it.
If I had my way in all things, every computer would have a TPM like device. And a little dongle plug. And it would have an SD card slot that the TPM can directly access. When the slot is occupied with a matched SD card, the computer will only do boot maintenance. When the card is not matched it's just regular storage. If you invoke the reinitialization system, the TPM will secure-erase _everything_ in the box then mint a new matched SD card. So now the machine _won't_ run normally if the boot stack is exposed, but it will run normally if it's not, so the average user is safe (they can't make the "leet" decision to leave the matched card in place and still have a working computer). The extreme tamper-evidence of having the machine blanked means that _nobody_ can sneak in a bios keylogger virtual machine layer without wiping the machine. And the owner would have the option to include-or-not the signing keys from the various sources like Microsoft or the Linux distro of their choice, or even signing their custom boot stack as they see fit.
Innocent people shouldn't be forced to pay for inferior software development.
--"Code Complete" Microsoft Press
Issue 1) is probably related to Windows Preview trying to display RAW images as I was copying them from the hard drive to external USB. I was doing a quick drag and drop of 500GB of vacation photos (RAW+JPEG). A quick shutdown of BOINC and a reboot fixed the problem, but I never had this problem with Windows 7 Pro.
Issue 2) relates to how Windows 10 understands folder permission and policy defined by Windows 7 Pro machine. Again, when viewing the folder on a client Win7 or Mac OS X (even Apple TV), all subfolders are display correctly. It's only when I view a folder from a Windows 10 machine, multiple machines. So it's not a hardware problem, just how Windows 10 is following Windows 7 permission and policy. Problem goes away when I upgraded the hosting machine to Windows 10.
Issue 3) is fixed with a reboot but not easily repeatable. Can't figure out the pattern when File Explorer refuse a right click context-menu. And it's only File Explorer.
Issue 4) I have no clue what can cause it. Windows 10 feels like doing something with my GTX 970 drivers while I'm asleep.
I'm not going to dispute your assessment of Slackware's creator... not because I agree with you, but because I am simply not in any kind of position to make such an evaluation. However, this objection to Slackware is founded on personal philosophical differences between yourself and its creator, and has nothing to do with any lack of merits in Slackware itself except to the extent that you are projecting your own disliking of the values of the creator directly upon the distribution. You are allowed to do this, of course, but be aware that this only means that *YOU* are unwilling to use it, not that the distribution is necessarily of no value to anyone else.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
How nice for you that your wife is the most basic of users. She would probably be fine with a tablet by the sounds of it.
My wife needs microsoft office applications for compatibility with her students and colleagues. Can i point and click install that? Is it as easy to crack on linux as windows (autoKMS).
My wife uses quickbooks to do some accounting for some companies. Has linux started supporting quickbooks now?
And please don't say "just run wine". Number 1, it costs money and 2 is an emulator, so is bound to have issues. I don't have time to hunt down obscure issues, post to forums and beg developers for fixes. That is what i do in my regular 9-5 job so sure as shit i dont want to be wasting my time at home doing that.
Im so sick of people saying "just move to linux dummy!" because its not that fucking simple for normal people to do that!!!
I love linux, i run linux servers, but linux on the desktop does not work for everyone!!!!!!!!!!
Windows 7 works fine. The proper solution here is to block updates with GWX control panel and for microsoft to stop fucking around with current windows 7 users who are happy to wait till 2021 to upgrade. Your "move to linux" post is doing nothing but legitimizing microsofts behaviour for linux's gain. Basically kicking people when they are down to try and increase your own operating systems market share.
As a potential lottery winner, I totally support tax cuts for the wealthy
By then I will be too old to shake my fist at the screen.
Not only that, Windows Professional is also used in business a lot. Not every company has a volume license agreement and is running Windows Enterprise. Those businesses are not consumers by the usual definition.
C - the footgun of programming languages
While M$ has never been afraid of alienating their user base, one has to wonder: Does no one use task manager or Process Explorer anymore?
If you go to grc.com Steve Gibson made a small utility called 'Never 10' to set the registry keys documented by Microsoft as a way to stop the upgrade from happening.
although "redswitching" can mung things up. quick shutdown has stopped many other malware takeovers.
the wife got stuck with the GWX virus exploding, but it auto-reverted to Windows 7 when she refused to click the legal folderol following the RAT that Microsoft has been pushing. so far, they have not tried again.
if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?
You are misquoting. What Captain Kirk actually said was:
Kaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhnnnnn!!!!
I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
It wasn't senseless bashing. He was reporting his experiences. My experience with MS is that MS software just hates certain people, for no reason I can tell. You get somebody who thinks MS $PRODUCT is the greatest thing since sliced peanut butter and somebody who has problem after problem, and if you ask question after question and you can't find relevant differences.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
Simple solution. Set install date to something like 1/1/2029. :-) Really stupid that you have to think of things like this though.
- Robert Beaubien - Sr. Software Architect - Kool Software LLC - "No trees were harmed in the sending of this messag
Subject says it all.
Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
Try Never10 from https://www.grc.com/never10.ht... Never 10 is an easy to use utility which gives users control over whether their Windows 7 or 8.1 will upgrade itself to Windows 10.
This isn't a troll, it's how I got past the Win10 upgrade.
Mint KDE, learning curve that's acceptable. Runs my Nvidia card and opens up a steam
account I haven't used in years, so all my old games are back (I do miss my BF3 (not an
option)).
Only error I've received was after changing the desktop theme, crashed, then worked just
fine.
The HOSTS files a tad touchy, I ended up copying my old one and pasting it on top of the
KDE one at etc/hosts.
I'd like to see my e-mailer Forte Agent to make the switch, but don't think Wine has it
in it. I've run it since Win95 (same version just copied an icon to windows desktop) that
will miss it.
And no joke, I use a ASUS wifi card (PCE-N15) - under windows it's acceptable, under Mint
KDE it's at least three time faster, and it's picked up on the install.
Did I mention the default Opera download is 12.14!
Oh please! I'm so sick of that "support" line of BS, especially since its been reported that they FIRED the QA and testing teams.
Except that didn't happen, and more to the point MS has long had their concept of SDET roles.
This is about MONEY all right, its about making money off of YOU because with windows 10 YOU ARE THE PRODUCT and the OS is merely a carrot to get to you, your data, and your eyeballs.
Of course, it's been proven by Google - with Android, GMail, Google Maps, Search, etc... - for the last decade or so that this is the model that the vast amount of people prefer. Most people prefer no cost + targeted advertising while the tin-foil hat brigade harp on about spying and data selling even though that doesn't actually happen.
MSFT wants endless revenue and they make more by spying on you and selling that data to advertisers
I don't think you understand how targeted advertising works, this is not about "selling data". Can you point me to exactly where I can buy this data?
who then pay them AGAIN for ads on the start screen than they ever made on the OS. with previous versions they got paid less than $100 a unit every 3 years, now? They get paid 365 days a year by advertisers for unlimited access to your information and advertising space on your PC.
Unlimited access to your information? If you've got a source for that then I would love to see it, where can I get this? In any case while the system builders and sellers that pandered to Microsoft for years peddling their wares they fueled the dependence on Microsoft rather than investing in and contributing to a free platform, their greed is what trapped them. Thankfully I only use Windows for gaming and a few CAD things, everything else is done on OSX or Linux.
the problen with the win10 forced update is that it doesnt run what they need to run.
What do people need to run that Windows 7 runs that Windows 10 doesn't?
You seem to be confused about what Free Software is, the focus isn't on it being "free of charge" it is on having the freedom to change it (or pay somebody to do it for you) if it doesn't do what you want. If you don't like it then improve it, but this is the big problem with free software today, so many of the users are like you who feel entitled to it and if it isn't exactly what you want you don't want to put in any contribution or effort to changing that.
They agreed to updates and this has never happened before.
All kinds of companies have upgraded software automatically when they are permitted to do so at their own whim. Windows tells me "new software installed" almost every week -- and yes, there's new software from Dropbox. If I had "automatic updates" enabled for my Android apps, I'd be getting new apps every day, probably. And I know that some of them would be completely different versions that don't work like the old ones, and are sometimes useless because of the changed, because that has happened before, and is why I have automatic updates disabled.
If you say "you may update my software based on what you feel is important", you have given someone else permission to update your software as they see fit. The fact that they haven't done an OS update that before way is, well, interesting, but changes nothing. They certainly HAVE updated things in a way that breaks the system and makes it less usable before, so this is not a precedent.
Bringing your SUV to the dealer for a recall and getting a sub compact back is a better analogy than rape.
If you take your car to the dealer and tell him "you may change this vehicle in any way you feel is important", then yes, you've agree to a new car, if the dealer decides it is important for you to have one. Why do you think it is important to get a written estimate every time to take your car to be serviced? Because mechanics have a long history of replacing irrelevant parts and charging you for them when they have your permission to do what they think necessary. So yeah, this is a much better analogy. You give the dealer a blanket approval, you better trust that dealer.
no, you'd be pissed.
I understand that people get pissed when they trust someone and they get surprised. It's a normal human reaction. Instead of being pissed at themselves for trusting someone they shouldn't have (why SHOULD you trust Microsoft to do only what you would like them to do when you say "you decide for me"?) people get pissed at the person they trusted improperly. They misdirect their anger. It's common. That doesn't mean the person they're angry at is responsible for the result. They assumed you meant "yes" when you said "yes.". And here, they not only assumed you meant "yes" when you said "yes", they told you it was going to happen and how to stop it. And when you threw away that notice without requesting an action (by clicking 'x' on the notice window) they assumed you intended to take no action. That's what 'x' on a notification window means, and has always meant. Always.
It is not rape when a company that you tell to provide updates to things they think need to be updated actually does that. Nowhere close. It's sick and twisted to even try to compare the two.