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Owning an iPhone is the Number-One Way To Guess if You're Rich or Not, Research Finds (businessinsider.com)
An anonymous reader shares a report: In the United States, if you have an Apple iPhone or iPad, it's a strong sign that you make a lot of money. That's one of the takeaways from a new National Bureau of Economic Research working paper from University of Chicago economists Marianne Bertrand and Emir Kamenica. "Across all years in our data, no individual brand is as predictive of being high-income as owning an Apple iPhone in 2016," the researchers wrote. There are details and caveats to the research, but the economists found that owning an iPhone gave them a 69% chance to correctly infer that the owner was "high-income," which they defined as being in the top quartile of income for households of that type -- like single adult or couple with dependents, for example.
Trump is going to have to get himself an Android once Mueller is done with him!
You GOP INCEL faggot retard kike nlggers!
I know a better way: owning a Ferrari is definitely even more precise! I am pretty sure the correlation for Ferrari -> rich is close to 100%.
And on my one person sample (me), it's 100% more accurate since I don't own an iPhone (yuck!) but do have a Ferrari (albeit an old one.)
Black holes occur when God divides by zero.
But I hate Apple products. I never cared for the iPhone, iPad, iMac, or iAnything. I preferred toys that made me think more like the generic PC. Boring people with boring status symbols is all that garbage is.
"no individual brand is as predictive of being high-income as owning an Apple iPhone in 2016,"
Seriously? Owning a Bentley is a worse predictor of being high-income than owning an Apple iPhone? Are we sure there are no further qualifications here?
Attitudes make the difference between Space and Time: we want to MAX our temporal, and MIN our spatial extension.
It seems to me that owning an iPhone shows that you are more concerned about image over function/capability. Which is also a pretty strong indicator of being rich
If everyone with an iphone is rich, this is the richest country of fucking retards imaginable
... got skewed again and taken out of context. Click bait again :(
If you're shopping online with your user agent set as
Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 6_0 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/536.26 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/6.0 Mobile/10A5376e Safari/8536.25
You might pay more than someone coming from Firefox or Chrome. This wont impact IE or Edge users as they prefer to shop in person for the most flavorful brand of crayon.
Good people go to bed earlier.
you're poor unless you have two
peasant
Phone brand. Brand of phone. Apple is a brand. Like what cows get. Only it probably hurts a little more.
All the waitresses are richer than me then. // An Android phone owner.
Ferrari may have a lower false positive rate, but they have a stratospheric false negative rate. You need to find a proxy for wealth sold by the hundred millions so that someone merely in the top quartile (not really that wealthy, 75k qualifies?) has a reasonable chance of owning one.
People don't "own" an iphone. They pay a small monthly fee to lease it from the carrier, which pays a monthly fee to Apple for letting people lease their iphones.
People carrying an iPhone don't necessarilly "own" it. Most Americans don't own anything, some don't even own the clothes they are wearing. Most are $400 away from serious financial problems.
They don't own anything, they rent everything, appearances are everything.
I have a Tesla Model S and I bet I have more money than you.
The top 25% of the country does not own a Ferrari although probably most of the Ferrari's in the country are owned by the top 25%. So even though it might be a predictor for the top 1%, it fails miserably as a predictor for the top 25% since you're unable to properly categorize the other 24%.
Instead of paying rent they spend the money they save on luxury items like iPhones. Japan even have words for them. Freeters and Parasite Singles.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Every time I think the internet can not get any more useless, I am confounded. In the USA we can not build an IPhone but we shure as he'll can pull researchers out the nation's collective assholes to prove this bullshit that in now way needs proving.
Now explain to me again why non scientist must accept everything a scientist says as if their word were coming from God Almighty on mount Sinai?
"Genius bar" - I've never been so in need of a damn drink
So when my iPhone having temporary warehouse workers call in and say they can't make it to work because they don't have gas money...they're lying>?!?!?
lol
No, you're poor now, because ferrari garage bills are pure extortion and they are not the most reliable beasts, are they? ;)
Rich in this case probably means something like $80K or more, not necessarily the top 1% or less of society.
Since it's really hard to compete on the low end because of Walmart and Amazon, a lot of companies make "premium" products for the upper 33%. So you need a way to target the marketing to them, and iPhone ownership is not a bad way of identifying that target. Ferrari owners would represent a very small market for many products!
In Europe, it's mainly a sign that you're an obnoxious douche that wants others to think that you earn a lot of money.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Hmm, owning a little mansion with a butler and a staff of 30 to look after the place with a small jet plane and pilot on standby is probably an even better indicator.
Some Android phones cost about the same and they are more open
I own a small airplane that I paid $300k and an iPhone 6. I am by no means 'rich'. I still have a mortgage (average suburban home), car payment (chevy), and I complain about dentist bills because I don't have coverage/etc, I buy items when they are on sale. I do make $140k per year, but with all the taxes, I'm lucky to see about half of that. If 140k per year is the "one percent" group - the portion of the 1% group I occupy is not so great. That being said, I am thankful and have worked very hard for what I have - but there is always room for more. It would be nice to be able to go away on vacation and actually relax instead of having to worry about work/etc.
Both iphones and Ferraris sometimes only predict that your parents are high income.
This space intentionally left blank
Having money is one attribute common to the purchasers. However, it also shows they are gullible enough to buy from Apple. That I believe was the real take-away.
From the article: "The research also suggests that owning an Android phone or using Verizon are a strong indicators of being high-income as well. ".
So there you go. If you own an iPhone or Android, you could be high income. Useful.
It is the same as saying Facebook is Harvard alumni network :-)
It does not work anymore
Well that is pretty obvious, those with more money than sense buy overpriced products for the 'prestige'. Those with more sense than money are more careful with their money.
iOS is much more secure than Android.
And how is it that after a few Google updates, my 16GB phone runs out of space?
And how the battery can't hold a charge over a day?
My iPad 2 with "only" 16GB is chugging along fine and needs recharging maybe every three days with moderate use - I use it more than the phone.
Gotta do something to encourage more people to buy iPhones in light of their dropping market share. I mean, if new colors won't do it - maybe trying to hype up the "you look rich if you carry one!" vanity will work?
Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
It is true but it is publically visually harder to spot also. There are people making money on car rental business. So, how do you publically visually tell the difference between own/rent.
Here is one better:
Owning an Android phone with CFW is the number one way to guess if you are more intelligent or not.
Maybe the researcher should do that next
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- If picture worth a thousand words, how many megapixels is it? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Are you out of your mind? $80K in California is considered fucking poor.
...which was paid for by Apple Inc. /s
You could also be a 13 year old girl. Kind of goes without saying that richer people pay higher prices for subpar specs
Look at the charts in TFA... why is there always a disparity between having a dishwasher and using dishwasher detergent?? The detergent is horrifically caustic so who is using it not in a machine? Either that or what genius is using a machine without detergent? Messed up....
Ferraris, feh. Owning a senator is how to tell if you're rich or not.
Wealthier people more likely to be able to afford expensive product than non-wealthy ones, hence more likely to buy it.
Film at 11...
One thing I know, and that is that I am ignorant...
I drive my Bugatti to the welfare office to collect my checks
So they have a slightly better than 50/50 shot at guessing a coin flip?
I'm also pretty sure that people who need sim cards for two different countries make more money than the average "I don't have a house abroad" iPhone owner.
The fact that iPhones still only sport one sim card is borderline hilarious in 2018.
And their OTT pricing.
Yeah, right, and if we dig deeper who are we going to discover funded this "study"?
A while back some "study" found that it was healthier drinking coca cola than water - guess who funded that one?
There are three kinds of falsehood: the first is a 'fib,' the second is a downright lie, and the third is statistics.
With the dead tree books that never get read, the accumulated dust bunnies and the monster that lives under the bed? I don't think so.
Goodbye, Slashdot!
Owning a Ferrari is a sign that you are going bald and have a small dick.
It has been that forever.
Is this a correlation that people who own iPhones have money to burn, or more of a correlation that iPhones are solidly in the over priced category, like many other luxury items?
Even everyone on SNAP has the latest iPhone...
The article is about "it's a strong sign that you make a lot of money". So what? A lot of people that have fancy toys are up to their eyeballs in debt. That's not rich. There is no prize for being on the hamster wheel of wage slavery and consumerism. In fact, it pretty much sucks unless you're a large corporation. That's America for you. This culture is only concerned about status or appearance. They couldn't care less about the founding principles of the country like oh I don't know, Liberty? You know that personal freedom we fought so hard for that England wouldn't give us? Look what we did with it. We pissed it away. That's why I'm eventually leaving. Shine your bling on your way to the 80 hour a week hell hole. I'll choose freedom tyvm.
We'll make great pets
Owning a Bentley is a worse predictor of being high-income than owning an Apple iPhone?
Yup, because you might be seeing a 25%-er that owns a Ferrari instead. Or one who own a Maseratti. Or one who owns a Tesla Roadster with all the stupid options like SpaceX rockets. Or a Porsche. etc.
But all of them happen to own an iPhone, just like a significant chunk of all the other 25%ers (including that 25%ers who doesn't own any car and entirely relies on professional driver services (you know the services that UberBlack drivers actually do for a living when they're not moonlighting on Uber) )
--
More seriously : we're speaking about the to 25%ers here, not the trop 1%ers.
Given the way income inequality goes in the US (..or at least how it seems to us, when we read news in northern Europe...), that basically covers most of the people who aren't completely broke.
Not all of them happen to own super-car, and some of them aren't rich enough to afford one.
But all of the people in that range happen to have enough disposable income to afford an overpriced smartphone just because they like its design and the model is trendy. (So lots of people in that income bracket will pick an iPhone).
Below this range, people have less disposable income and will more thoroughly think benefits-vs-costs when picking up a smartphone. If they can afford one, they'll go with something surely less expensive and sometimes perhaps even with more features.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
I live in Europe. I can roam the whole continent and probably a lot further too with the same SIM card.
-- Cheers!
But that's just it, their paper covers these caveats; and nearly none of the comments here on /. make sense in light of that.
Let's compare our senator-wallets, maybe we could exchange a few.
In Sweden it's the other way around. All the poor idiots and their kids have brand new iPhones on ~24 month contracts paying like 10% of their salary to Apple for a couple of iPhones, keeping them poor. What choice do they have other than paying the Apple tax? They are too stupid to configure an android phone and they still want the smartphone experience for themselves and their kids.
They're talking about wealth - not income. And thanks to the low class mobility in the U.S., the number one way to become rich is to be born to rich parents.
--- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
"Owning an iPhone is the Number-One Way To Guess if You're Rich" ... through no fault of your own ...
Apparently Bill Gates is an outlying point in their data:
https://www.zdnet.com/article/...
Older Ferrari's do not predict wealth.
The cost of entry is lower so lower end models are available for low(er) dollars. However, they are often not well maintained because the people that buy them have no idea what they cost to maintain. So they aren't mechanically maintained. They are washed and waxed to high heaven, but not mechanically maintained. Actually, last I heard, the Jeep Grand Cherokee was the most popular vehicle among millionaires.
As usual the detective method you want to employ is determined by the type of error you can most tolerate.
IPhone Owner - Higher false positive rate. Lots people who are not rich manage to get their hands on one. So you mistake them for money because they have a phone. Clearly there are still false negatives, even though Apple is considered the luxury brand in the space Samsung for one makes some very nice high end phones as well and some rich people no doubt prefer them.
Ferrari ownership - Higher false negative rate. Lots of very wealthy people don't buy one. They may choose one of many other luxuary auto brands, they may prefer a larger vehicle well appointed by a couch builder and having someone else do the driving. Now I am sure there are some false positives. There are lots Italian car enthusiasts out there and there are some "affordable" 70/80's vintage Ferraris the owners most likely have some means but maybe are not in the top 25%. My Alfa Spider shares some power mirror stuff with them, I just paid $160 for a new power mirror switch. Owning these things isn't cheap, I can only imagine what engine parts must run for them given the limited production; I have not really looked. The cars themselves though show up on bring-a-trailer from time to time in with integer 5 digit price tags.
Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Insofar as it's an indicator of whether people are careless with their money, sure.
// This is not a sig.
Who was talking about California? Nobody.
When you are well off, you have to work for your money to survive.
When you are rich, your money works for you.
what are you, Russian troll?
if youre smart enough to afford a ferrari, youre smart enough not to buy one.
Obviously you don't know the difference between being rich and being wealthy :)
love is just extroverted narcissism
Look at the rent they can afford to pay.
Find the zip code. Take in the average of a city and its rent say in Springfield MO, Akron OH, Tuscon AZ, Rochester NY, Asheville NC, Irvine CA, San Jose CA.
Factor in rent control, Section 8 housing social experiments in the same part of the city and see what the wage, trust fund covers per month.
Rent needs a real double working income? Thats not poverty.
A big brand has to offer millions in real convertible cash to get professional workers able to move to an area just to cover the rent?
A very small dwelling that costs millions just for land.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
Owning an expensive phone is proof of being rich, who'd know?
Yet somehow dual-SIM capabilities is only a common feature in low-end phones designed for 3rd world markets.
More likely an indicator on whether you have more money than sense. Always a laugh seeing the Mac crowd trying to make themselves look special and superior by trying to create fake associations to something successful.
"OSX is UNIX", "'Rich people', for some lame definition of 'rich' - are using Macs/iPhones, and so am I, therefore I'm rich or am at least going to be too". Pathetic, miserable people.
There are a lot of things I would infer about a person with the ownership of an iphone. Wealth is not necessarily one of them.
This signature has Super Cow Powers
First you are right, conspicuous consumption like a Ferrari is a status symbol of the wealthy. The Iphone can be that too of course but that would not really account for it's ubiquity. Instead the greater your income the more you are aware that time/money substitutions. The greater you pay rate the more it makes sense to Rather than use your own time to do something you purchase a product that does it. With iphones there's no big surprises and they work well and if they don't apple has great service centers and there's even lots of other people who can service it too, parts are widely available, and whatever problem you have is probably been seen before since there's a wide userbase. So it's a wise choice if you prefer no hassles in your life.
Consider that almost nothing else in your life gets handles 50 times a day or engages your attention in so many ways. a 700 phone is $1 per day over 2 years . $1 per day for a hassle free phone ithat uses a lot of your time is a no-brainier. Besides that you probably have a $90 a month cell bill which means the cost of the phone is only 25% of the cost of cellular communications for you, so not a big factor. Incrementally, it's even less since you probably were going to get at least $350 phone.
One the otherhand if you earn minimum wage, you probably don't have that big cell bill, and if you have a cell it's going to be a cheap one.
So iphones make sense not as a status symbol (is it a status symbol if everyone around you also has one?) but as the right tool for the lifestyle of the upper income brackets.
thus same correlation but different logical path
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
That cuz international rates are so low, I get roam like home for 5$/day, tops out 14 days no charge for the month after, so basically 70/mo max to use the same data and minutes as long as I'm abroad
Money in the bank is how you tell if you are wealthy or not.
Unvelievable how the phone company's advertising has persuaded a lot of customers that 70$/month extra for a capped service means "free unlimited usage abroad!"
Lol class.mobility? Does it correlate with motivation and intelligence? Born with it, black people being victims of white aggression, these are all conveniently misread statistics that omit in hopes of virtue
It seems to me that owning an iPhone shows that you are more concerned about image over function/capability.
No that's just your confirmation bias talking. The primary attraction of most Android phones is simply price. (which is very reasonable) The features are a secondary concern at best for most users. If you are arguing that iPhones aren't functional you are crazy. Most buyers of these devices aren't worried about using every last feature and just want something that works. For most users iPhones are primarily about function (they mostly work great), reliability, and not image at all. My parent's are a perfect example. They don't give a shit about what phone they own, they just want one that works and that lets them get pictures of the grandkids with minimal hassle. They use a last generation iPhone which they got at a reasonable price. As a bonus they can use an iPad too and not have to learn anything new. Could they use an Android device? Sure, but it wouldn't have any benefit to them over an iPhone - certainly not from any features or capability.
Fact is that the difference in capabilities between similar market tier Android phones versus iPhones is pretty much negligible for most people, even those who are highly geeky. Maybe you need/want some particular feature of a particular phone and that's cool (you be you), but for most users the differences are more a matter of taste than capability. I've used current generation Android phones too and they have no must-have advantages for me or most people over current generation iPhones. Both would work fine for me and probably for most people reading this. People buy them because they have a particular preference or because of price. The only ones fussing over feature lists are the sorts of people who read slashdot.
Oh the irony of the company who claimed to be making "the computer for the rest of us" making half a trillion dollars on "the phone for the richest of us".
Your average THOT owns an iPhone.
Counting on something so fragile is a risky proposition for anyone who gets serious shit done.
In a world of the blind, the one-eyed man is king--and the two-eyed man is a heretic.
Owning an iPhone is the Number-One Way To Guess if You're Upper Class or Not, Research Finds
Top 25% != Rich
Just another day in Paradise
With that UID I'm surprised that you're even allowed outside.
Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
You think sports cars and yachts just look good and aren't actually a pleasure to use too?
In a lot of cases they are only good to look at and definitely not a pleasure to use. Have you ever actually driven a Lamborghini Countach? I have and it SUCKED. Looks pretty as hell and is fast in a straight line but James May said it far more eloquently than I could about why it's a terrible car.
Just because something looks good and has a high price tag doesn't necessarily mean it is something you'll enjoy owning.
Ferraris, feh. Owning a senator is how to tell if you're rich or not.
In Russia, owning a President is how to tell if you're super-rich or not.
"That's the way to do it" - Punch
I have a friend who makes minimum wage in Silicon Valley ($12/hr). He owns an iPhone 7 (256GB), iPad Pro, and two older iPads. No one is going to mistake him for being rich.
Goodbye, Slashdot!
https://learningincect.blogspot.com/2018/07/how-to-do-seo-in-word-press.html
Depends what you think the function of a phone is
Not really. The device in my pocket is called a "smartphone" but the fact that it makes phone calls is fairly incidental to its utility for myself and most people. It's really just a small personal computer with the ability to make phone calls added in. I probably use the phone capability less than 5% of the time I'm using the device and I think I'm pretty typical these days. If you use yours primarily to make calls that makes you something of an outlier.
You won't catch me gaming on my phone or doing other things the screen is just too small.
And why do we care? You be you. If gaming isn't your brand of vodka that's fine but lots of people who own smartphones find it to be a very significant feature for them. I don't do a lot of gaming on mine either but I don't think that fact in any way defines what a smartphone is or how it should be used.
Use android (different firmware), because I won't have apple products in my life. Political decision.
In the top 7% for wealth. Been living off investments, which are growing much faster than my spending.
I drive an 18 yr old Honda, which was bought with a check. I live in a fairly inexpensive part of the US, with a major airport hub. Everyone decides how they will spend their money.
Wealth displays aren't my thing. t-shirts and jeans with sandals.
Honestly, from what I've gathered, owning a Senator is cheaper than a Ferrari.
An iPhone is far more useful than a Ferrari. If a Ferrari were a phone it would be something the size of an iPhone but the features of a 1980's cell phone.
Iphones are not a status symbol, the only people who think they are status symbols are hopeless Apple fanboys.
Actually I'd say the only people who think (or hope) they are status symbols are people who are Apple haters. Given that each and every one of my grand parents (and yours too I'm betting) owns an iPhone or an iPad or both, I think we can pretty safely dispense with the myth that they are some sort of status symbol. There's nothing exclusive about them when my grandmother whose only income is Social Security has one.
$80k a year is at best middle class in any part of the US worth living. It certainly won't let you buy a house in those areas and you might not be able to afford rent.
Meanwhile I can spend $7/month for unlimited data at home and spend CNY 100 for a SIM card with a week of data for when I visit China. And even if I travel to China once a month, I come out $50 cheaper than your $70/month...
Hey Slashdot, here's an idea: delete any comment that includes a link to that website.
iPhones are a very strong predictor of XX chromosomes.
Owning a Ferrari is a sign that you are going bald and have a small dick. It has been that forever.
Can confirm: Thick hair, big dick, no Ferrari.
I browse on +1 so AC's need not respond, I won't see it.
Every deadbeat I knw has an iPhone. iPhone ownership predicts that you live in the USA, it says *nothing* about your income except relative to the rest of the world.
Fascinating anecdote Cre!mer.
Owning an iPhone it is a good sign that you "pretend" to be rich.
(Assuming it's true...)
One of the fascinating implications of this, is that it means rich people are selfless, and less interested in being in control of their lives, wanting someone else to make the big decisions, and they'd prefer for someone else to decide what they're allowed to do and not allowed to do. The rich view an items that they buy (e.g. their iPhone) as something that shouldn't just benefit themselves but should also be working to advance or protect the interests of others, should the owner's interests and the other parties' interests conflict.
Whereas poorer people are more interested in having control, or at least some minor say in what happens, and want to decide for themselves what they do vs abstain from doing. Poor people view items they buy as primarily intended to serve their own interests (since they're the ones who paid the money), above someone else's.
If rich peoples' selfless strategy is, in fact, the cause of their richness, and if poor people's self-determination is the cause of their poorness (these are big ifs, but hey, we're just hypothesizing that peoples' purchasing decisions really are somehow related to the cause of their wealth or lack of wealth) this means people are kind of dumb and they simply do better whenever they submit to authority and obey orders. Democracy would be an almost worst-case-scenario for humanity, because people acting out of self-interest (e.g. those who avoid iOS) actually come out less rich than people who don't give a fuck what happens to them (those who use iOS).
I call BS on that.
Some of the iPhone owners I know are the *last ones* who should be burning money on a device like a premium smartphone because they're the ones who are the least able to afford it.
They just fool themselves into believing they *need* to spend that kind of money on a phone--nothing else will do. Same thing with their tablets, and their laptops.
This is why (well, *one* of the many reasons) I *despise* Apple. They happily take money from people who are simply too dumb to know any better. Crass consumerism of the worst kind.
I live in the United States. I can roam the entire world with the same SIM card in my iPhone.
I think iPhones are a fantastic value. I bought a used iPhone 5 for $200, and it's lasted over two years so far. After two major OS revisions, the OS updates have stalled out, but that's about equivalent to what a new (and more expensive) Galaxy or Nexus would have provided from the same time period.
I see no reason to upgrade. I'll probably use it until the battery starts dying (holding up great after five years!) and buy a used iPhone 8 or something.
I own a country, this counts? :-)
(and four helicopters, a dozen figther-jets, two nuclear-capable bombers (three soon), a lot of tanks and support vehicles. Ah, and two battleships)
Religion: The greatest weapon of mass destruction of all time
The iPhone was just the best single product from a very narrow list of products, not the best indicator.
Owning a passport was one of several better indicators.
And an Android phone is a 59% indicator. Come on /.
And how much will you pay for using it abroad? How much do u pay a month?
I guess much more than our European friend
funny, everyone i know who owns an iphone is poor as dirt.
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
You've paid in polaroid i assume ( dutch flodder reference there... :P )
Eh, 70% or so of families lose their wealth in a single generation link. This narrative that there is no churn or mobility in the US seems like nonsense to me. Sure if you want to be middle class it is probably more of a struggle than in the past but it isn't like the rich are some separate species.
Owning a Ferrari is a sign that you are going bald and have a small dick.
It has been that forever.
Can confirm: Thick hair, big dick, no Ferrari.
Here's a mod point you turd.
Somehow I think the Lamborghini phone likely a better indicator of wealth. http://www.businessinsider.com...
Ferrari may have a lower false positive rate, but they have a stratospheric false negative rate. You need to find a proxy for wealth sold by the hundred millions so that someone merely in the top quartile (not really that wealthy, 75k qualifies?) has a reasonable chance of owning one.
Money's not worth what it used to. In 1985 my dad supported himself, my mom, and 7 children on $25k. Today I'm making $75k+ with a wife and two young children and I consider my situation more financially precarious than my father's back then. I've heard that a million dollars in the bank is considered upper-middle-class these days.
And how much will you pay for using it abroad? How much do u pay a month? I guess much more than our European friend
AT&T charges US$3/minute for using voice outside of the country.
What a fresh and interesting anecdote!
Yes, we know you pay 20/mo to get access to rich guy cosplay accessories. You'd do much better reading the personal finance FAQ on reddit.
Tell us about the investments you made and the amount of credit card debt you have carried through it all?
Because they are designed as burner phones. You wouldn't want to take your main phone into a foreign country like Russia because you will be hacked the moment your plane lands. Instead you leave your main phone at home and buy a burner phone with dual SIM so you can put your main SIM and an international roaming SIM into your phone. When you get back home you wipe the burner phone back to factory defaults.
https://www.reuters.com/articl...
What are you smoking?
You might not be able to afford rent in city X, but god if you can't have a decent life off $80K something is wrong with your financial habits.
Average US income is around $55K and most people are not homeless.
You need around $3K a month to live comfortably, which is around $36K a year after taxes. That's assuming you don't have kids or unusual expenses. Around $7K a month is where you can afford to eat out whenever you like, afford fancy cars, have part time maid, gardeners, etc. That's around $84K after taxes. And so your argument doesn't make sense, unless you live in california where your 1 bedroom aparment is $7,500/month.
With an iPhone, you are the customer. You are buying that device from the manufacturer. With an Android phone, you are the product. Information from/about you, especially from Google apps, is sold to companies/advertisers. You are the product that makes them millions (just like Facebook). Just how does Google make money on a free OS? The same way they do on a free browser, Chrome,... They sell you.
Also, all of the recent iPhones get updates. The iPhone 5s which went for sale in 2013 will (still) be supported by the upcoming iOS 12 in. 2018. A five year old phone with a current OS, current apps, current bug fixes, and with iOS12, better performance. How old and insecure are five year old, or even two year old Android phones?
Also 99% of all mobile malware target Android. Less than 1% targets iOS, Blackberry and Windows Phones - combined. https://www.google.com/search?...
Not true. Suppose you owned a Lambo on the moon back in December ... you could very well be broke today.
No they donâ(TM)t
Lol. âoe3k/month is fine, just live in the boonies and donâ(TM)t have any kids!â
I would do a second correlation to the amount of memory in the phone or the extras purchased eg case etc. I find people with just enough money will buy the base model or bare minimum to get by. because physically you can't really tell until you use it it doesn't have the extra memory or extra features This works with cars and other items.
Your'e all thinking it, I just said it for you
I'm also pretty sure that people who need sim cards for two different countries make more money than the average "I don't have a house abroad" iPhone owner.
The fact that iPhones still only sport one sim card is borderline hilarious in 2018.
Faulty reasoning. The really rich could take outrageous roaming charges while someone just being able to buy a vacation home in another country probably won't.
As for multiple SIM cards: why?
It's 2018. Nobody cares what kind of phone you have...unless it's a feature phone.
True, but the income of your parents is actually likely better than both iPhone or Ferrari ownership as an indicator if you are (or will be) rich. :)
(BTW, i sincerely dubt iPhone ownership to be such an indicator, Apple sold way more iPhones than the number of rich people, even assuming every rich person owns 10 of them
Geez -- I thought the skinny jeans people were all "post-iPhone" and back to the flip !!
iPhone is wanna be rich. Flip is "somebody else reads my email for me" rich.
Owning an iPhone in the UK is an indicator that you are either a hipster, a model, a manager, spoilt schoolkid or up to your eyes in credit card debt. In other words - the iPhone is expensive but still cheap enough for poor people to buy on credit.
To Guess if You're an idiot.
I live in Europe. I can roam the whole continent and probably a lot further too with the same SIM card.
The whole Europe continent area is less than 10% bigger than the U.S. country alone. Your statement doesn't really mean anything when you are specifically talking about areas because it works somewhat similar to States in the US...
Just 59% vs 69% for Apple... so really, if you just own a smartphone it seems to indicate you might be wealthier than average.
And they're more reliable.
Owning a Ferrari is a sign that you are going bald and have a small dick.
It has been that forever.
Can confirm: Thick hair, big dick, no Ferrari.
Can confirm: I have no dick and do not own a Ferrari. I only ride in them.
...but poor taste in cars, apparently.
The claim is just marketing, and the literal details are no more important that the implied promises that the right beer will get gorgeous bikini-clad women to dance with you.
What Apple sells are computers that are less difficult for non-techies to feel comfortable on, while messaging it as a luxury item for the common man. Clever that.
Mind you, that does not mean techies do not like Apple products for good (or bad) reasons, too.
White privilege: it is always the right time to throw in a complaint about melanin, no matter what the topic really is.
Hahahaha... I just woke up, got to my computer to begin my day of work and read this article. I can't start a good day any way better than this. I have an iPhone X and my wife has an iPhone 7+. My wife doesn't work, just takes care of the kids. I'm the only income in the family. I must make a lotttttt of money!!!
On other notes... I take Uber/Lyft all the times, lots of those drivers got an iPhone and claim that driving was their only income. Do Uber/Lyft drivers make a lot of money like I do? I also happen to know quite many low income folks you arm their entire family with iPhones... they must be dealing something other than their jobs.
Oh wait, this study wasn't from 2008
an iPhone is not a sign of wealth when everyone and their mother has one that they got either on credit, in installments, bundled with their contract, or are leasing it. If you bought your iPhone outright cash then maybe so, id wager the % that do that is so small.
There are far more signs that someone is wealthy, and some of the truly wealthy don't flaunt it like a douche.
That would give you high precision, but low recall.
The maintenance and fees on those golems is indeed expensive...
I mean, a total household income of $78,000 qualifies you as in the "top quantile"? I know this gets a bit off-topic of how good an iPhone is as an indicator of being part of that group.... but I find it a bit depressing that our collective incomes have dropped enough to make this a reality.
This isn't talking about individual incomes, mind you - but total household income. 2 parent families with kids and so forth.
That means a husband and wife could each have jobs paying less than $40,000/yr. and yet they're among the "richest" in America that these marketing people are interested in zeroing in on?
I know ..... differences in cost of living by geography and all that. But STILL? My very first "career job" in the early 2000's was doing computer support/helpdesk type work for a small to mid-sized family owned business and I was earning $40,000-ish/yr. pay back then, in the midwest where cost of living was low.
If you're married and the two of you, together, aren't earning at least this "top quantile" of income or darn close to it? It's not even realistic to imagine you can handle paying the typical mortgage for a small home, a couple of car payments so the two of you have vehicles to get to/from work, and paying everything else while saving the minimum recommended amount towards retirement. (If I'm way off base, please explain! I keep reading the economic advice from the people telling us we shouldn't be putting down more than X% of our income on a car payment, and Y% on a mortgage payment, and yet should be putting Z% into a 401K or IRA ... and none of that adds up as possible with a $78K household income, from what I've seen.)
Just about everyone in the greater Washington DC area has an iPhone, even - if not especially - those on food stamps.
They're certainly not a sign you're rich here. In the UK thanks to the way the mobile phone market works they're widely owned by Chavs (think Rednecks) and those who are long term unemployed or may not have ever worked in their lives.
I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't looking good either. - Scott Adams
If you own an iPhone, you are in dept or spent all your pocket money for the year.
No they donÃ(TM)t
donÃ(TM)t.+'${`%&_NO CARRIER
I live in the middle of the Pacific Ocean, but I can roam all of North America (which is larger than Europe, btw) on the same SIM card too. Your point?
Why would techies like Apple products? They don't do anything useful! Try using your expensive iPhone as a storage device....see, useless.
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So you suck dicks then?
Making the computer for the rest of us died with the Apple IIgs and Woz leaving the company.
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
My point is that I don't need two SIMcards for that, unlike the person I replied to.
-- Cheers!
You sank my battleship!
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
$75k for a wife and 2 kids is low middle class where I'm from.
Really? Is that reverse fanboi shit or did you make some life decisions because you are butthurt over stuff that isn't really related to your real life....
Like Woz doesn't even know you and still worshipping Apple IIs? Like really?
And old Ferrari is disqualifies you unless it is some limited edition top of the line one that you can put in a museum.
I know plenty of lower income people that have iPhones and plenty of higher income people that have Android
Spending On Frivolous Things is the Number-One Way To Guess if You'll Stay Rich or Not, Research Finds
My mom made it on 15K, but she just had one obnoxious brat to deal with. I make more than 5X that, and I'm reasonably comfortable, but far from rich, and I still live in a bad part of town.
Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
I have an iPhone 4 that I use to watch porn behind my trailer while the wife is sleeping--I'm rich as F*#k!
Maybe just an outlier, but my daughter is an iPhone owner and is dirt poor. She lives on welfare and family support to scrape by. I suppose if we change the definition of rich to "still able to wear shoes", then sure... Owning any flagship phone is an indicator that one is "rich"
Well, that claim was never about price, but ease of use. The Mac was for "the rest of us" who didn't want to deal with MS-DOS.
Circumcision is child abuse.
Big Dick here and lots of hair. Want a Ferrari.... Will my dick shrink if I buy it?
Owning an iPhone or any other (Cr)apple product only shows that you are an iDiot with more money than brains!!!
Actually, to help make it easier to afford them, a couple of organizations have been set up allowing a form of joint or collective ownership, helping defray the cost of having to buy several dozen congressmen. These are called the Republican and Democratic (hahaha) Parties. They are kind of like timeshares, in that you jointly own a bunch of senators, (and also members of the House of so-called Representatives (hahaha) which are also needed,) and whenever you need them for something, you tell them what to do, they do it, and the rest of the time they do the bidding of the other members of the group of Owners.
For example, suppose in order to finish hoarding your second billion dollars, you need the Pentagon to buy a bunch of tanks they know they will NEVER need, that they desperately do NOT WANT, and that fail to work right most of the time anyway... you give your instructions to a lobbyist who takes your order like a waiter, and conveys it to the appropriate bought-and-paid-for pile of dogshit... er... congressman. He then obeys you and fucks over his constituents and the country, often just cutting and pasting the text of the law you want him to propose and see pass VERBATIM, (this has really happened,) and proceeds to laugh all the way to the bank, which his puppet masters also own.
I have made light of this but frankly, my dears, this is fucking sickening.
Batman?
No joke.
Owning an iPhone is the Number-One Way To Guess if You're DUMB or Not, Research Finds is more likely... ...
Samsung phones are actually getting even more expensive than iPhones
so owning an overpriced model from Samsung is also a pretty good indication that you are a DUMB fuck
that has been spending way more for less... compared to models from other brands
Atleast with a luxery car you ret what you pay for...
With an iPhone you get an old Toyota With lipstick for the price of a Ferrari while Lamborghini sells a model twice as cool for half the price
blah blah blah, I have a tiny dick which I compensate for by pretend-owning a Tesla, oooo... aaahhhh... Tesla... so rich and fancy, OMG I just came all over myself thinking about how rich I am pretending to be while living in my mommaz basement, and posting on slashdot, blah blah bluh blah...
Not anymore, you wasted too much on a fancy go-cart, which my beat-up old pickup truck would EAT, as soon as you had to stop for traffic, or your little toy batteries ran out. Clean up your room, dude, or your mom is gonna bitch you out for wasting time on the computer. And hide all those Swimsuit magazine.
I've made estimates several times based on statements you've made during your manic oversharing episodes. The numbers are always incongruent and then you accuse me of lowballing.
I'd like to see if I can help you afford a dental appliance and behavioral coaching by reducing your expenses. Seriously I'll bet I can get you free up at least a few hundred dollars!
Then I can help you get a much higher paying career.
After that your whole life will be much better!
Btw it's not a proper appliance but have you seen "perfect smile veneers". Not sure if they're any good or not but they're under 15 dollars and they might help you speak and look your best when you need to.
Correct since perception == reality
My eyes reflect the stars and a smile lights up my face.
Eh, 70% or so of families lose their wealth in a single generation link. This narrative that there is no churn or mobility in the US seems like nonsense to me.
Your link only indicates movement in one direction, that is that wealthy families lose their wealth, not that poor families become rich.
It fits the narrative that wealth in consolidated into fewer and fewer rich families very well.
What you need is a link that shows that 70% of the rich families also became rich in a single generation to show that the mobility holds up and isn't just the big fish eating the middle sized fish.
"I know a better way: owning a Ferrari is definitely even more precise!"
Yes, your status is greatly improved in the daily traffic stop.
I would just use a Ferrari-Key, at least you take take that one _into_ the club as a conversation-starter. Much cheaper.
Just as signing all your messages and emails on your Android with 'sent from my iPhone'
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last I heard, the Jeep Grand Cherokee was the most popular vehicle among millionaires
That seriously surprises me. Even American ones have so many better options available.
It's not that the Grand Cherokee is a shit car, it's just fucking awful.
Old enough to realize a good design when I see it- and realize bullshit flash when I see it. Mac was bullshit flash. Even Woz admitted that it was Steve Jobs who killed the Apple III- insisting on a fanless design with no air vents for aesthetic purposes, leading to the infamous "Pick it up and drop it" advice from tech support (to reseat all the chips).
In a time when IBMs had EGA and were headed for VGA, Jobs released the Mac I- with a black and white screen.
And yes- Woz doesn't know me. Never met him.
And I haven't purchased *anything* Apple since 1985. Too damn expensive.
Now if we switched topics to how suddenly, in 2018, a 1mhz 16 bit computer is suddenly relevant due to replacing all of its peripherals with a raspberry pi, that would be interesting (TI99/4A & the TI-PI 32k expansion sidecar)
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
This is a very poor response.
Just because you do not own a Bentley does not invalidate the test, nor does your assertion that you know "plenty of similar people". Bentleys are signs of wealth and your not owning one is irrelevant.
In fact all the typical "luxury" brands are signs of wealth. Piaget watches, Karl Lagerfeld clothes, Tiffany jewelry, Ferrari cars, all of it. The tell is stronger if there are multiple indicators simultaneously. Now add in the signs of travel to swanky destinations, like skiing in the Alps, or snorkeling in Fiji. Does the person stay in 5-star hotels? Do they fly First Class? Do they dine at Chez Maxine's?
And the odd false positive or false negative, again, really isn't important enough to worry about.
You are mixing up the purveyor of overpriced equipment with Commodore, which provided computers for the masses not the classes.
Eh, 70% or so of families lose their wealth in a single generation link. This narrative that there is no churn or mobility in the US seems like nonsense to me. Sure if you want to be middle class it is probably more of a struggle than in the past but it isn't like the rich are some separate species.
It's not that there is no churn, but little / less churn. The US has social mobility, but there it is lower than many industrialized nations:
* http://www.hamiltonproject.org/charts/the_relationship_between_income_inequality_and_social_mobility
There seems to be a correlation between a country's Gini index and mobility, and it is intergenerational:
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Gatsby_curve
Since about the 1970s we have started moving towards a new Gilded Age (and possible aristocracy); see Piketty's "Capital in the 21 Centruy":
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Divergence_(inequality)
Mostly it depends on what area of the country where you live. If you live in Omaha, you can do quite well on 75K - and yes, it's not that hard with professional credentials to get a 75K job in Omaha. In the bay area, I'd say if you make 300K you're still merely middle class.
I don't know about that. It depends. If you have a lot of money in your 20s, likely yes, you were born to wealth. If you have a lot of money in your sixties it's more likely you saved money all your life.
You're hearing the meme that folks are spewing so that we become a socialist and/or a communist country (and YES, I DO know the difference between them, thanks). I grew up...extremely poor. Not *quite* dirt floor shack poor, but I could see it from where I grew up. Now? I'm comfortably middle class, maybe could do more, but I'm happy in my life. No, I didn't inherit money, I merely...worked.
I'm also pretty sure that people who need sim cards for two different countries make more money than the average "I don't have a house abroad" iPhone owner.
The fact that iPhones still only sport one sim card is borderline hilarious in 2018.
If you can't afford roaming charges and have to settle with a different phone number in each country, you are dirt poor.
Predict the opposite
it's actually the #1 phone around here in the low income housing areas. they are nigga rich, driving $500 cars with $3000 rims, and eating hot dogs and ramen noodles.
owning an iphone is only an indication that you spend money foolishly, not that you have a lot of it.
>And how much will you pay for using it abroad?
Donâ(TM)t care, Iâ(TM)ve got an iPhone, Iâ(TM)m rich!
No thanks
So if I buy a second-hand iPhone from eBay, am I still considered rich?
You're probably counting all the square miles of Alaskan wasteland so your numbers are skewed.
Like with any other valuable device, if I owned an iPhone I'd be constantly worried about losing or damaging it or drowning it in sweat at the gym. With my 5 years old Nexus 5 I don't have that problem. Should the worst happen, I can replace it at almost no cost.
I lead kind of a minimalistic life and I follow the same principles with regards to other electronics. If someone burgled my house, I could probably replace all my possessions from a single monthly salary. This doesn't mean that I live like a hermit. I own a number of computers, TVs, consoles and what not but they are no more expensive than what they should cost for their purpose. I find very little sense in buying supposedly high-end devices because someone simply tells me they are worth the price.
All in all, not having much too lose lets me lead a joyous life and focus on really important things instead of worrying.
I know a better way: owning a Ferrari is definitely even more precise! I am pretty sure the correlation for Ferrari -> rich is close to 100%. And on my one person sample (me), it's 100% more accurate since I don't own an iPhone (yuck!) but do have a Ferrari (albeit an old one.)
Where I live an iPhone on a plan is less than $20/week, hardly a good marker for wealth. My teenage kids have them which I make them pay for themselves and they make less than $100 week and all of their friends are in the same boat.
My marker for wealth/income which is a little more accurate is owning multiple properties, or a luxury vehicle ($100k+). There is no way to fake owning a house...
Dude that's not interesting.... like seriously getting butthurt over a computer model a few decades old..... get over it and move on with your life.
One model is good one model is bad... like who harbours that kind of hatred....I don't hate Intel forever because of one shitty chipset.... I just don't buy it until they come up with a better one..... Woz has moved on.... maybe you should too...
One of the reasons why I get in front of the camera and make videos every week is to learn how to speak properly. I don't need a $15 "appliance" to do that. If people think I'm making a fool out of myself, so what?
I thought you were missing teeth right? Put some teeth there. Glad you're having fun with your youtube but I'm telling you to fix your teeth for making better first impressions in your business dealings.
That's because you perceive a problem where one doesn't exist. You're like all the "helpful" people in this essay [nytimes.com], giving advice to a single, childless 42-year-old woman because she is enjoying life.
This would be like that woman if she was single and childless, had an apartment with 12 cats, and hooked up with random dudes just to wake up next to a warm body.
Did you give back the extra part of your bonus when you didn't expect it? Did you return your amazon affiliate check? No you were so desperate for a little extra spending money that you kept pissing people off with your affiliate links and you have to go a without coffee for a month in order to buy a new video card. You also make boring lonely posts and reply to yourself as AC trying to spin up a conversation despite the fact that you know well that it's going to be spammed by people that want you gone.
You may well be generally happy but you could be happier with a little extra money and some counseling.
By the way FNKO is down 7% today
iPhones are for people with more money than brains.
I would be more interested in a correlation with intelligence. Or with tech skills.
At 75k you should be pretty well off. Compare your lifestyle with that of your fathers. How much debt did they get into, how nice was the car they drove in, how often did they go out to eat, did they have 2 laptops, tablets, cable, Internet and cell phones (all of which existed in 1985).
Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
Yet you found it interesting enough to comment on...
Disarm the plebs! Bow down before the Owners!
Cheap plastic junk from China (iPhones) and pretty websites are irrelevant. The cost of food, housing, and fuel remain paramount.
You certainly have worse taste ;)
I have a belt of them.
T-Mobile is free data and text in almost any county youâ(TM)d care to visit. 20 cents a min to talk. Itâ(TM)s not really a big deal unless you are a Verizon cheerleader.
Stupid cunts like you too busy stroking your muzzle while rome burns. Your guns are only useful without civilization. Even in the wild west they didn't allow guns in the towns, because the towns were little pockets of civilization.
All of which have dropped significantly as a proportion of spending.
For example, from 1960 to 2015 food costs as percentage of disposable income have dropped by 43%.
On the other hand, healthcare costs have increased dramatically because we've capitulated to the corporations.
Like a 4S from someone else in early 2015 even though it was released in the end of 2011? Am I really rich? I have been unemployed for over 1 year 6 months 23 days 20 hours 46 minutes 26 seconds! :P
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
Obviously healthcare costs are out of control. Their crazy skyrocketing seems to have begun around the same time the big insurers were demutualized. So yes, corporate profit- and rent-seeking seem to be the big causes.
On the other hand, despite what the well-meaning propagandists at Pravda.. er, NPR.. have to say, I frankly don't believe their bullshit line about the cost of food decreasing. I know some folks implicitly trust all official statistics.. but c'mon, sometimes they are so far removed from lived experience that they beggar belief.
I pay the same as in my own country in every EU country I am in,
-- Cheers!
Pravda.. er, NPR
Ah, engaging in disinformation, what a fookin suprise!
I know some folks implicitly trust all official statistics.. but c'mon, sometimes they are so far removed from lived experience that they beggar belief.
Oh look, truthiness for the fail. fookin alt-fact trumptard
Hey dumbfuck, just because I don't call out your paedophilia in every response, dones't mean I'm not the one replying. Every single reply you get, that's me. BTW, you are right to be afraid of the surveillance-industrial complex, because everytime you respond to me, you inadvertently give up some identifying information.
Broham, you're a hired troll. Presumably funded by a Democrat party affiliate, given the lame political line you push. Not a Stasi agent like in your fantasies. NSA & friends know *exactly* who I am.
It's the #1 way to guess if someone is ostentatious or not.
They are talking statistics. Every predictor has specificity and sensitivity. Specificity of Bentley ownership is indeed 100%, but it has very low sensitivity as only few own it in the upper 25% income population
I am.
Sure you can live on $80K if you live in a shithole, flyover state but you're not going to live anywhere nice on that.
You might not be able to afford rent in city X, but god if you can't have a decent life off $80K something is wrong with your financial habits.
Says the guy who has never lived in California. On $80K, you might be able to rent out an apartment in a shitty neighbourhood, but you'll never live anywhere nice nor will you ever own a house in California.
"White privilege" is a fabrication by insane people who don't want to help themselves.
Take your victimhood elsewhere and consider being responsible for your own life for once.
This is actually a serious philosophical question - the Raven paradox.
Let's say you want to prove a statement like "All ravens are black". This statement is logically equivalent to saying "If something is not black, it's not a raven."
Now let's say you find an apple, and it's green. That is a non-black object, which is not a raven. So the existence of a green apple is evidence in favor of the second statement ("If something is not black, it's not a raven"), which in turn supports the first statement.
But how can finding a green apple teach you something about ravens?
See above link for attempted resolutions.
the method to know if a person is rich is the amount of boats full of whores he has
and when i mean full i mean you cant move inside the boat without touching a whore
Whatever you say comrade. It's governments that have capitulated to them.
Just because "everyone" has one (it's not anywhere near) doesn't mean it's not a status symbol.
It also doesn't mean it is one so you'd not really off to a good start.
>People on Social security SHOULD be budget conscious... yet they constantly select the brand that's known to overcharge for everything and have no easy way to get "free stuff" / pirate?
Overcharge is a matter of perspective. It's not overcharging if you regard it as good value for money. What might be overcharging to you might not be overcharging from my perspective or vice-versa. Apple's perception of charging a lot is more perception than reality. In actuality if you purchase a device with similar specification from one of their competitors you're going to pay a similar amount of money most of the time. People like yourself confuse or conflate the market segment with how it is priced within that segment. Apple's prices are reasonable for the segment they compete in but they don't compete in segments where price is the overriding consideration.
As for why folks on a fixed budget often pick Apple, they pick it because it has a well deserved reputation for being reliable, easy to use, and "just working" which is what they care about more than anything else. They aren't interested in tweaking settings or configuring things or any device that requires a lot of fiddling and maintenance.
As for pirating, why the f*** would my grandparents care about that? They want to see pics of the grand kids, make a few facetime calls, play solitaire, maybe send an email or two. They also want to do this with minimal hassle. They're not going to be pirating software or music or worried about fancy apps. The sure as hell don't care about "easy" ways to get free stuff or pirating software/media. YOU care about that and that's fine but don't project your needs on others.
So I ask you: why did your grantparents buy what they did?I bet it's to fit in, because they think "everyone has one" and they'd be stupid to not have one.
Nope. They bought one because they asked our generation what they should get for what they wanted to do (pics, video calls, email) and wanted something easier than a PC and we told them an iPad/iPhone. Had nothing to do with status because they would have bought whatever we told them to. Minimal hassle for everyone involved, works great, and does exactly what they want for reasonable amounts of money. If they have a problem the Apple store nearby can help them fix it if we aren't around. It cuts down on the problems we have to fix too. Android and Windows tend to require a lot more tech support and I've got years of experience backing that assertion up. (some of the best money I ever spent was getting my dad a Mac with an Applecare warranty and giving him my old iPhone - cut my tech support calls down to close to zero) Has nothing at all to do with status or the indication thereof.
That's the definition of a status symbol - it has nothing to do with actual exclusivity
See you are the one not understanding what a status symbol is. To be clear, my grandparents never take their iPad out in public so it certainly never serves any purpose for indicating social status. They purchased what was recommended to them for a specific purpose. It's a tool and a means to an end. The only people who give a shit about its utility as a social status indicator are people like yourself who seem overly concerned about such things or who are looking for a path to bash Apple. The rest of us are just busy doing the things we actually care about instead of worrying about other people's social status.
AT&T charges US$3/minute for using voice outside of the country.
Is that a lot? That sounds like a lot.
Wanna buy a shirt?
https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
What about albino ravens?
I browse on +1 so AC's need not respond, I won't see it.
Apple hasn't come up with anything better since Woz. And that is why I *have* moved on, and do not consider Apple to be a viable computer company or consumer product company.
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
Who would keep a million dollars in the bank if they had it? Interest rates are so low you may as well buy a ferrari.
No they donâ(TM)t
When I went to Brazil to propose to my wife, AT&T charged me US$3 per minute to call home to the US; my phone was still under contract so they wouldn't unlock it for a SIM from a different carrier. AT&T may charge less when traveling to Canada or Mexico.
Money's not worth what it used to. In 1985 my dad supported himself, my mom, and 7 children on $25k. Today I'm making $75k+ with a wife and two young children and I consider my situation more financially precarious than my father's back then. I've heard that a million dollars in the bank is considered upper-middle-class these days.
Well, back then did children have luxurious toys (e.g. smartphone)? Did your parent have 2 cars (for both)? Did your parent's car(s) have all luxurious stuff like today? Did they have online shopping so that people can easily spend their money? If you cut those unnecessary stuff I mentioned, $75k for a family of 2 kids should do quite OK.
My sons don't have a cell phone of any type (much less a smart phone). I only have one car. My parents had a 9-passenger van and a sedan. If any of us kids wanted a luxurious toy we had to get a job and buy it ourselves. Shopping from a catalog was a thing back then, but stores hadn't made their way to the internet.
With average mortgage of over $3k per month for a 3 bedroom home over here, $75k is by no means luxurious (rent for a 2 bedroom apartment can reach 1800).
Obviously healthcare costs are out of control. Their crazy skyrocketing seems to have begun around the same time the big insurers were demutualized. So yes, corporate profit- and rent-seeking seem to be the big causes.
Premiums for health insurance for my family is $425 / month.
On the other hand, despite what the well-meaning propagandists at Pravda.. er, NPR.. have to say, I frankly don't believe their bullshit line about the cost of food decreasing. I know some folks implicitly trust all official statistics.. but c'mon, sometimes they are so far removed from lived experience that they beggar belief.
I've seen the cost of eggs go from 80 cents a dozen to over $2 a dozen. Other foods have also skyrocketed (green bell peppers went from 20 cents to $1.50 for example).
"the Jeep Grand Cherokee was the most popular vehicle among millionaires."
They can afford to throw away $50k.
I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
...but I got a Glock in my 'rari.
I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
At 75k you should be pretty well off. Compare your lifestyle with that of your fathers.
OK, let's compare 1985 Hawaii with 2018 Mountain West.
How much debt did they get into,
My parents rented a house on the North Shore; I am working on a 30-year mortgage. My parents' home had more square footage. In 1985 my siblings' ages ranged from 19 to 4. I have a 3-year-old and a 2-year-old. My mom paid off the last of their debt last year; I'm 2 years out for medical debt (I don't carry a credit-card balance)
how nice was the car they drove in,
My parents had a full-sized van and a sedan. Neither was super new at the time. I have an older minivan.
how often did they go out to eat,
About once a week my parents took us kids to a restaurant with 5 cent sliders. I take my wife and kids out to eat once a month.
did they have 2 laptops, tablets, cable, Internet and cell phones (all of which existed in 1985).
My parents had a desktop computer (1 MB RAM, 20MB hd) and cable tv (OTA was non-existent in that town). Dialup internet only reached my town in 1992. My parents had a landline. Currently I have a family laptop, cable tv, cell phone for myself and another for my wife, no tablet, no landline, and basic broadband internet. In 1985 we had a single tv in the house; the same is true with my current family.
Growing up, I got hand-me-downs from my brother who got it from a brother who got it from a brother, etc. As my sister was the youngest and the only girl she got new clothes and toys. As both my boys are young I'm constantly buying new clothes for the older son; when he outgrows something it goes to his younger brother. As we're potty-training both boys diapers are still a major expense (almost $100 / month) - an expense my parents didn't have in 1985 (at 4 years of age my sister had already transitioned to panties). As my younger son is extremely small for his age he is on a special diet ($65 / month).
Who would keep a million dollars in the bank if they had it? Interest rates are so low you may as well buy a ferrari.
Maybe not a million, but it would be wise to keep at least one year's salary as liquid assets for the unforeseen. I've been laid off 3 times in the last 20 years. My wife had a hard pregnancy where she went to the ER on a weekly basis (this was $150 per visit). The eventual miscarriage brought on postpartum depression and weekly counseling sessions ($45 per session) for a while. My mother-in-law passed away in Brazil and I had to get my wife there. Life happens, so you need a reserve.
Eh, I dunno. Ferrari's are one of those status symbols that people will reach to try and get to show they've "made" it. Case in point: My father-in-law has a Ferrarri. He is definitely not rich, just really bad with money and has a huge amount of his wealth tied up in it.
I know others have posted, incorrectly presuming that ownership of a fancy house or a fancy car means you're rich, but in actual practice, most people who own fancy houses are not wealthy, but spend too much on flashy stuff, and the same goes for cars.
Rich people care about things they care about, and that means an iPhone.
Mine is nice.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
Sorry, the metric equivalent is about 3 euro. Is 'Murica a great country or what??
No. 90% of all millionaires in the USA are first generation.
Anyone can get one with some carriers.
I know a better way: owning a Ferrari is definitely even more precise!
No, it isn't. There are a lot of people in the top quartile who don't own a luxury car, jet, or yacht. You would get a lot of false negatives from your suggestion.
The misinterpretation of this article is rampant in this discussion. Yeah, I know, I must be new here.
My Ipads are about 5 years old now, my Iphone slightly older. I got them when I had a work contract that made decent money, and since then I've had crap for pay. I'm basically one step away from being out in the street. So...I'm rich?
only dumb people need the iPhone
Surely income is a better indicator of one's.....um..... income?
My daughter has an ( old but still working) i-phone. Her pocket money isn't much more than a few pounds a week. She feels rich, but I wouldn't place her in the top 25% of earners.
Silly season started early, no?
Of course there is churn and mobility. Just not much. It's a classic debate tactic to create a false dichotomy, when really there's a range - a dimmer, not a toggle switch. Other countries (Finland) have much more churn and mobility than we do.
And 3 generations is 75 years. 2 is 50 years. So having wealth concentrated for 50 to 75 years still creates problems that could be alleviated by a decent inheritance tax (right - not a "death tax"; the tax is levied on the living inheritors, not on the dead person, obviously).
Anyway, looking at the (typically brief and shallow) Time article, they don't provide a link, so I don't know what the Williams Group even means by "wealthy", or how those numbers chart across levels of wealth. I wonder how it changes for the 0.1% (PE and Hedge fund executives, with the very occasional tech bro, extraction, or retail exec and their family) versus the merely 1% (married successful lawyers or high-end doctors).
Another way to measure mobility is to look at wealth creation and accumulation - not just who falls, but who rises. I'm curious about a real study that shows both ends.
It's an intelligent test. If you buy one you fail.
Too much people that owns an iPhone and is not rich to consider this accurate enough, the counter positive is too high to take this seriously.
WTF...
why was this even postes here.
Click-bait if there ever was.
No they donâ(TM)t
When I went to Brazil to propose to my wife, AT&T charged me US$3 per minute to call home to the US; my phone was still under contract so they wouldn't unlock it for a SIM from a different carrier. AT&T may charge less when traveling to Canada or Mexico.
Depends on what your plan is--Canada usually is lumped in, Mexico is sometimes, and the per-minute can depend a lot on where you are and what you're doing. Sometimes it may be cheaper to snag a local phone--there are places that'll rent phones to people only temporarily in the country, and you can often snag a local prepaid one if you'll be there a while.
Owning a luxury car is a more clear indicator of wealth. (Though not foolproof; some are bought used at more reasonable prices, given to non-rich people by wealthier family members, or inherited.) But a relatively small number of people own luxury cars; many rich people do not own one.
Smartphone ownership, in contrast, is becoming nearly universal. But the TYPE of smartphone that people own correlates with wealth. That makes it a more useful metric in some ways than the Ferrari, because there are fewer rich people who don't own a smartphone at all.
Yes there is. It's called renting.
Sounds like it was sponsored by Apple as all these comments points to...
My recent Samsung Galaxy accepts 2 of those tiny little sims
Broham, you're a hired troll. Presumably funded by a Democrat party affiliate
No ways man, I'm a crisis actor!!
As if someone would pay anyone to follow a rando luser like you around. Get over yourself shit for brains.
If anyone is being paid to spread agitprop, its you. But frankly, I don't think you are that competent, you come across as a polezny idiot for the fascists. So deeply immersed in alt-facts and truthiness and utterly divorced from critical thinking skills that you don't even know you are a tool, you fucking tool.
. Not a Stasi agent like in your fantasies.
That's pretty fucking funny man. Here's your chance to find out who I am - first system I ever named myself, I gave it the hostname of stasi, linux didn't even exist yet. Don't need to be NSA, don't even need your ip address, but every time you post, you narrow down the list.
Let me just say that if your Dad supported your house and 7 kids on 25K in 1985, ask him how he did it. He has to be one smart guy. I remember those days. Any place to stay was at least $400. A house that would sleep 7 I would think would easily be 1 grand. Then there's food, taxes, gas, etc... I don't know how he did it.
Stalker troll uses Russian adjectives (hmmmm), makes vague threats (creepy!), and openly admires the Stasi (not surprising)... Hey, wait a minute... is this all part of President Trump's reelection campaign? Are you just trying to make people think Democrat Party activists are deranged, sociopathic nutcases? Good job, it's working!
Dude, you are lucky you are out of country. But you should know that Bush passed a law that made ex-pat pedophilia a felony. Next time you come back through customs, you think about that. Real hard.
You really do spend a *lot* of time thinking about pedophilia, don't you?
I go through US customs frequently. Visit the consulate a fair bit too. Nothing to hide, nothing to fear - as stasi apologists like you are fond of repeating. =)
I guess it just blows your mind that a deplorable redneck like me might enjoy living in a prosperous, socially conservative, family-oriented Communist country. With great weather and delicious food.
So you get lost in an elaborate autistic fantasy of what *you* would do if you lived in a version of Phnom Penh you read about once in a book and somehow imagine is located in Vietnam.
Nothing to hide, nothing to fear
Sure, sure, sure. You keep thinking that. You keep thinking that real hard you shitstain kiddie diddler.
Your attempts at disinfo aside, you aren't really anonymous pastor peen.
Look everyone - pedotroll is hurling slander and making vague threats again! Do you suppose his masters pay him an extra bonus for unethical behavior?
cause people who are rich dont care about roaming charges
Look everyone - pedotroll is hurling slander and making vague threats again! Do you suppose his masters pay him an extra bonus for unethical behavior?
Oh my god, you so fucking suck at posting AC. You aren't fooling anyone shitstain.
Pedotroll, pedotroll, pedotroll!
Pedotroll, pedotroll, pedotroll!
Looks like I hit nerve on the head.
Oh, pardon me, the democratic subversion matryoshka think tank that hired me hit your nerve dead on.
There he goes again speaking Russian and hurling slander! Is he paid by the post? You bet he is!
nope iphone ownership just indicates your dealing with an idiot..
I have an even cheaper solution:
Few years back there where a lot of people in a club I went to walking around with Ferrari keys or other expensive cars. Yes, they actually had them. When one asked where my keys where I explained that I came with a driver and not drove myself, so I could drink a lot and not risk anything.
They where impressed. Nobody asked what kind of car I came in. It was a public transport bus.
I learned early on that it is pretty easy to impress people who try to impress people. I personally do not care for such things, although I could probably afford it financially.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
Unfortunately there still are limitations that prevent me from taking a number in a different country where it would be cheaper. International rates is still a thing.
On the other positive side, I can also easily change providers and keep the same number. I think I am at provider 6 or 7 in 10-12 years or so and still have the same number. They even warn me to be sure that I do not have any credits as those will be gone. (I always use pre-paid). And if people call me it is not deducted from my minutes.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
There he goes again speaking Russian and hurling slander! Is he paid by the post? You bet he is!
Ex-pat pedo says what?
No brand as predictive? How about a Ferrari? Or a Boeing?
Um, no one owns the Russian president. HE owns people. Need proof? Ask the dead or imprisoned oligarchs who pissed him off. If billions of dollars won't keep you out of jail, nothing will.
Good point. Heck, you can often buy a used 328GTB for less than a new luxury Ford. Seems like a fantastic deal at the time. Until you need to replace the tires. ($20,000). Or get engine work done, like gaskets and belts and other assorted work. ($10,000or more!). Or repair a dent caused by another driver. Most insurance companies will refuse to cover a Ferrari.. So you've got to go to Lloyds of London. Not cheap, But you wanted a Ferrari, right? ;-) :sigh:
Having said that, I really like the 328GTB. Kind of like the "poor man's" 288 GTO (relatively speaking) Actually, I like the little Dino even more. Or, the Fiat sleeper with the Ferrari Dino engine! Alas, the yearly upkeep cost is more than I earn total on my annual pension