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Just what we need to increase confusion. Look - I agree that there some justification to put this out, but do we *really* need yet another distro? A few well placed distros, each appealing to a market segment would be much better than this helter skelter rush for every man and their (yellow) dog to have a distro.

Wouldn't it be better to have 3 distros, one for techies, one for desktops and one for servers with paid with support. I know that those of you who use distro 'X' will yell "But {Debian,Mandrake,RHEL} doesn't quite match my requirements". Those 3 key distro's are very good, and I'm sure if theres some feature on some other distro, it will be available on one of these when all that hacking talent goes to just support them.

I'd rather we were all talking about and backing 3 very very good distros than over 100quite good ones.

I was going to say I haven't seen anywhere mentioning this but then I noticed Warly suggesting it on the mailing lists. So long as there are at least two non-commerical yearly releases per year I'd continue to be Mandrakelinux user (I don't want to use a "rolling distro" like Debian unstable/Gentoo so switching to cooker wasn't an option). The worry is how long you get security updates / fixes for. If it's less than 1 year / 2 releases or not at all then the deal doesn't look so good.

I consdier this to be analogous to the Fedora/RHEL model used by Red Hat and rumour has it that SUSE will turn into something similar (with Novell Linux Desktop being the RHEL bit).

Netcraft doesn't look at Ubuntu's stats. It's been rising like crazy over the past year, poking its head up to the top of DistroWatch's average hits/day list for the last 3 months and last month. As to the last 6 months (netcraft looks at this period), Mandrake seems to have the top seat.

Looking at percentage increase, Ubuntu probably beats the pants off of Fedora, rising from an average hits/day of 300 in 2004 to an average hits/day of 1916 in the past month; that's a 638% increase. Using the same math for Fedora, we see a LOSS of 8%.

Of course, this is just a measure of people's interest in DistroWatch's stats on distros ... far from complete. However, it shows that increase in Ubuntu is massive. Perhaps bigger than Fedora. Then again, both are very young and very successful; a massive percentage increase should be expected.

No distributor wants to touch a game that is available online cheaper (or even at same price, but 'easier').

Your right. That business model is so flawed. No business would survive if they allowed their customers to download (for free) essentially the same thing they were trying to sell.
</sarcasm>

in one swift stroke and get on enjoying your life instead of reading boring documents about fixing problems someone else created.

Poseidon, I'm sorry to hear that your first experience with Linux was so horrible. I can see why you're so convinced that Linux is worthless, and I will admit that Linux has problems, but what saddens me is that you hit every shitty thing about Linux all at once and now you're missing out on something that could have been very awesome.

The tempation here is to say "your first mistake was..." but that's not right. It wasn't your fault. You got hosed. You were introduced into Linux in what might actually be the single worst possible way. I believe the proper way to phrase what I want to say is "the first thing your friend should have told you is..."

1. Linux has a learning curve even for techies, and MythTV uses just about ALL of it, every piece of your hardware, networking, shell scripts, databases, cron jobs, user management, filesystem management. Installing Myth can be a huge project even nerds who have been using Linux for years.
2. Linux's biggest shortcoming (and it looks like your biggest frustration) is that it doesn't support all hardware. Some works great. Some works OK. And some is never going to work no matter how many lists you scour and how many times you beat your head agains the wall. It's true and it sucks. But it's not necessarily Linux's fault. It's mostly because Linux is still an underdog and most hardware companies don't take the time to write Linux drivers for their hardware, and they don't trust the open-source community enough to hand over specs that would allow us to write our own drivers. This is very much a problem for things like accelerated video drivers, TV tuners, and especially wireless network cards. All of which are -surprise!- major components of a MythTV system. Expect this to change as Linux gets more popular, but for now... your friend should have helped you get started on researching what hardware would be most compatible before you ever spent a dime on it.
3. Because Linux is open and flexible... everyone out there is customizing it to their own uses. This is a good thing, but it does increase the learning curve. You got burned by this in the worst possible way. Your friend should have told you that Slackware is geared towards GUI-free servers and is notorious for its hands-on, experts-only installation. Exactly the opposite of what you want for MythTV, or even a normal desktop system for that matter. He should have steered you in the direction of KnoppMyth, or at least Mandrake.

I feel your pain. Linux and I had a very rocky start. Three years ago I tried it a few times and dropped it because I couldn't get my sound card to work, I didn't have the patience to dual-boot, and I was on dialup. Eight months ago I tried again and things were different. I am in LOVE and I am never going back. I am in total control of my computer, and I don't have to worry about spyware or adware ever again. I've even set up my own Myth box and I love it. Now whenever I use a friend's windows box I'm reminded how awesome it is to have a computer that knows that it works for me and isn't trying to sell me anything. So I hope you try again sometime, Poseiden. You just might find out why we zealots are so zealous.

To sum up... My advice for anyone trying Linux for the first time...

1. Read up on different distributions before you try one. I hear Suse is really easy to get started on.
2. Install it on a secondary machine, or have a roommate's/spouse's computer handy so you can jump back to a familiar interface to jump online and look things up.
3. Have broadband. Linux is extremely internet-oriented. Configuring your networking, staying up to date, and looking up answers to questions are all much easier with broadband.
4. If your distribution offers a Live CD, try that first to see how compatible the hardware is. And if you're

No Linux distro expects "mums and dads" to do .configure .... Actually, it is DISCOURAGED.

With your "Windows-is-perfect-centric-biased" view, without even noticing it, you bypass all the real problems with the Windows model.
What is Hallmark Card Studio ? What is Blues Clues ? Why "choose" these apps ? Isn't there a lot of choice of these types of software ?
How "mums and dads" even got aware of these softs ? They have to actually leave their house to get the software ? How much does it cost ?
Who will install this (newbies are afraid of any dialog) ? Assuming it will install, will it work ? You say it will, nothing is less sure. Even games come with RELEASE NOTES full of identified problems !!!
They can get all these problems. Worse, they do, assuming the countless hours I lost helping people on this OS.

Contrast this with a Linux distro : no need to leave house, everything is there in the distro, nothing to pay, the description is there with a search button to find what you need. Documentation ? Mandrake comes with at least one full manual in each box, with PDF versions on the net http://www1.mandrakelinux.com/docs/Outputs/ !!! Installation of software is a breeze.

I am european (french actually). I see the only thing Windows has left for it, is that it is ubiquitous. USA people do not see it, but there are A LOT of problems due to internationalisation (i18n) and localization (l10n) in Windows, that are properly dealt with in Linux (do not know OSX). I see that americans just forget these problems, when justifying grave design choices in Windows (like no difference between different case of characters). And I see that when Windows comes out on top in a comparison, that is because the comparaison is Windows centric.

On the software front, I think the Linux nerds win. OpenOffice, Kontact/Evolution, Firefox, Amarok and Gimp cover everything that I used my Mac for.

I'm not running any sort of heavy duty server, so fucking forget dealing with Linux.

Umm, these days Linux runs on watches, PVRs, routers, desktops, toasters, and, yes, servers too.

It's also pretty easy to use, if you use the right distro.

Mandrakelinux

Please use the Bittorrent link.

Estimated time left: 54 hour 10 min 30 sec = :-(

I wish people would throw their bandwidth at the Mandrake 10.1 Official iso's that are just now available.

Hit the torrent!

Mandrake Linux 10.1 Official

... Microsoft is willing to part with that amount of money without some kind of catch that is in their favour - which usually means it is not in the user's best.

Mandrakelinux... get it in your box.

Mandrake 10.1 Official does everything you mentioned including Firefox and fully working sound. It has a resize utility(built into the installer program) to allow you to resize your current partition making life a lot easier. I agree that older linux distros (like Red Hat 7, Suse 8.0 or previous) were more difficult to install than Windows but things have gotten a WHOLE LOT EASIER. Be sure the distro you use has a 2.6 kernel. I find that Linux is much faster and is a lot more "fun" than using Windows. http://www.mandrakelinux.com/ http://distrowatch.org/

Gee, why doesn't that surprise me? That is how M$ does business.

If Linux weren't a better operating system, then Microsoft wouldn't see Linux as a threat. If Linux weren't a threat, then Microsoft would have to resort to lies to keep people on Windows.

Want a good OS? Get Mandrakelinux

• Follow this link for a security report entitled: Security Report: Windows vs. Linux
• Here is a nice little report about Viruses: Linux vs. Windows
• And here is The U.S. government's warning to Web surfers to stop using Internet Explorer (IE) browser.

• Follow this link for a security report entitled: Security Report: Windows vs. Linux
• Here is a nice little report about Viruses: Linux vs. Windows
• And here is The U.S. government's warning to Web surfers to stop using Internet Explorer (IE) browser.

From mandrakelinux.com:

MandrakelinuxTM is a friendly Linux Operating System which specializes in ease-of-use for both servers and the home/office. It is freely available in many languages throughout the world.

There's more info on their concept page, but they're basic pitch is Linux for Newbies and switchers from Windows/Macs. I'd say they're going after the end-user market like Linspire, but they're also going after business/government businesses that don't want to spend a lot on "retraining" their users for Linux.

Actually, my experience with Linux was completely the opposite, and I started using it with absolutely zero experience and no one to really guide me. Distro choice may have been a large part of what caused you to come away with such a bad feeling overall.

I personally feel that Mandrake linux is a better choice for a lot of applications, it's got a free download version that I run at home and is also used on production servers at work, and it has well done and understandable graphical config tools, a really easy installer, and great hardware support. In addition, package management is excellent.

It absolutely can be done, and you dont have to be a 'sysadmin' to use it. I say that with confidence, because my mother (a normal end user who had never seen anything but Windows) uses Mandrake Linux 10 at her home. She had no trouble setting up her dsl connection, printer, etc using the Mandrake config tools.

Debian isnt the friendliest distro around, and with Fedora being a testing ground for Red Hat Enterprise, broken stuff happens. It's a shame you had a bad experience, but when I installed Mandrake for the first time in january, (my first time using Linux) everything "just worked" out of the box, and that's why I started using Linux in the first place.

linux is not at easy to instal and use as everyone makes out y'know?

No I don't know. Go and download Mandrake 10.1 for fucks sake. Stop using old rubish 'hey linux is difficult to install' bla bla. That era is gone and you are still stuck on 6 years ago.

People are working on this as we speak....

Of course they do. They are not like you to sit on their ass and complain about how 'difficult' linux is to be installed while Mandrake and Gentoo are just some clicks away.

In anyway, stay on your stinky windowz world. No one cares what crappy OS you use.

For the least painless install possible, try MandrakeLinux. It also is very stable once set up. However, it does many things for the user (eg, partitions), so may find you'd like to be more hands-on. SuSE is a good distro to start on too, as it also has a pretty painless install.

Also, if you plan to dual-boot (Linux/Windows), PartitionMagic is a must.

I installed Mandrakelinux and my computer runs much faster and more secure than ever.

Thanks for the constant patches/updates, crashes, spyware, malware, incompatibilities, viruses, trojans, worms, etc. I realise that I won't have to put up with them much anymore, but thanks anyway.

Regards, greatscot

...by now any intelligent and well-informed person should know how insecure and bad Microsoft products are, the facts are all over the 'net. If you still run a Microsoft OS, then any trouble you run into is your own fault and you deserve to be hacked/virused/trojaned/wormed/etc. If you're not intelligent, or you don't keep yourself well-informed, then you don't need to be using a computer in the first place.

Install a Linux operating system and you won't be bothered by most infections. Mandrakelinux can be downloaded and installed for free and I have found, after installing it on over 100 machines, that it is faster and easier to install and use than Windows. You can even go to Distrowatch and learn more about the hundreds of different "flavors" of Linux, there's a Linux distribution for any need and taste. And, you can go to Easy Linux CD's and pay a few dollars for a Linux disto and have the CD's mailed to you if you don't want to download the files.

Stop being a statistic and do something about the problem. I am sick and tired of hearing Microsofties cry, moan, and complain when there is such an easy and affordable solution close at hand. There's no excuse not to use Linux.

This comment is an attempt to begin to teach people how to rid themselves of the Microsoft operating system problem and everything herein is true, as I have experienced it. However, this comment will probably be modded down due to the fact that Slashdot doesn't really care about the "truth". We shall see how it is modded.

Mandrake says that now now the public may download 10.1 Community:

http://www.mandrakelinux.com/en/ftp.php3

Mandrake says that now now the public may download 10.1 Community:

http://www.mandrakelinux.com/en/ftp.php3

... there are still people out there who are still using Monkeysoft [Microsoft] software. After the thousands of articles on the net explaining how bad and insecure MS software is?!? Hmm... that's hard to believe.

Oh well... if they continue to use M$ software, then, they deserve to be hacked/crippled.

Hopefully, they'll learn their lesson and dump Windows in the garbage where it belongs.

Long live Linux!!!

... there are still government entities out there who are still using Monkeysoft [Microsoft] software?!? After the thousands of articles on the net explaining how bad and insecure MS software is?!? Hmm... that's hard to believe.

Oh well... if they had been running a Linux distro, this wouldn't have happened. Hopefully, they'll learn their lesson and dump Windows in the garbage where it belongs.

Long live Linux!!!

If you get a good Linux distro and learn how to use it effectively (it really isn't that hard), you won't have to worry about spyware.

But, I guess stupid people will never learn.

> MRT and Zebra are now fast-decaying abandoned project I do not follow routing software very near, but you have some alternatives out there: -Zebra
- Quagga
- Bird
>The only Open Source software router I can find is Click
Check these ones:
- LiberRouter
- openrouter

Solution: Take your business (and your balls) away from Microsoft.

I really wonder if MS would so have such a lax attitude towards piracy if GNU/Linux wasn't around? I'm guessing no. To many, an easily obtained, free pirated copy of XP is better than a truly free copy of GNU/Linux. Something MS is banking on since they are better off keeping eveyone possible away from GNU/Linux even if it digs into the short term bottom line.

"Standard Member ($5.50 month/$66 year or 60 year)"

Here is a cooker mailing list post refering to the bug being resolved.

ACPI works well on my desktop (as does software suspend, only one problem so far) but there are reports of laptops suffering beacuse of a lack of nolapic support. It's also worth noting that many machines come with poorly programmed BIOSes and need updates or extra code to have working ACPI. Why not try a LiveCD distro to test with until you find out you have support? It may also help if you pick a big vendor and report the issue to them so that they can track it and have you test fixes...

Windows... Windows... oh yeah, isn't that the operating system made by Microsoft in Redmond? You mean there are still people out there using that crappy, crash-prone, virus/trojan/worm attracting garbage?! Maybe they should try Mandrakelinux and finally see how free and powerful their computer can really be. I have used Mandrakelinux for 2 years and haven't had a single problem.

By the way, don't bother modding or scoring this comment because I could care less what anyone thinks about my comments.

Um, so Linus personally reviewed the code to the 1800 packages bundled with Mandrake 10.1, for example? What about the other 48,200 that are listed as being compatible with 10.1?

Linus reviews all of the kernel code, just Liek I am sure there is some guy/small group in Redmont who reviews all changes the the Windows kernel, but the MAJORITY of software that you are running on a Linux based desktop is coded by the very definition of 3rd parties; lots of them are amatuers or professional programmers who work on these programs in their 'off' time.

Um, so Linus personally reviewed the code to the 1800 packages bundled with Mandrake 10.1, for example? What about the other 48,200 that are listed as being compatible with 10.1?

Linus reviews all of the kernel code, just Liek I am sure there is some guy/small group in Redmont who reviews all changes the the Windows kernel, but the MAJORITY of software that you are running on a Linux based desktop is coded by the very definition of 3rd parties; lots of them are amatuers or professional programmers who work on these programs in their 'off' time.

A common response to the above:

• They must be an idiot.

• * Installation Manual for Alpha
• * Installation Manual for ARM
• * Installation Manual for HP PA-RISC
• * Installation Manual for Intel x86
• * Installation Manual for Intel IA-64
• * Installation Manual for Motorola 680x0
• * Installation Manual for MIPS
• * Installation Manual for MIPS (DEC)
• * Installation Manual for PowerPC
• * Installation Manual for IBM S/390
• * Installation Manual for SPARC

Now all this before they even get started or know what 'rm' is or 'ifconfig' or any other unix specific command. For most people who've just "heard linux is cool" they've already shown a high degree of commitment to give linux a try. Than they run into problems and if they're lucky and know about IRC can check #freenode and be introduced to some 15 yr/old 1337 kid that bruskly tells them to RTFM (which they tried to) before finding someone that knows how to help and is willing, but if not they end up googling around or giving up.

Really take a step back from "I love to read technical documents!" geek world (of which I'm a member) and admit that Linux documentation is a truly dismal resource to a new user. Even Mandrake,safe haven for newbie users everywhere has some pretty intimidating documentation if you truly attempt to look at it with unbiased eyes: Mandrake Install Especially when it isn't even required for any main strream OS.

They have.

- Stealth Dave

There is a really nice alternative to Microsoft Windows. Nice screenshots too. And, free downloads.

There is a really nice alternative to Microsoft Windows. Nice screenshots too. And, free downloads.

There is a really nice alternative to Microsoft Windows. Nice screenshots too. And, free downloads.

I used MS Windows for years and got fed up with the viruses, trojans, worms, spyware, malware, crashes, expense, etc. I installed and attempted to learn 17 different GNU/Linux distros and settled on Mandrakelinux. I installed Mandrake on all 9 of the computers in our house, including two that are in the kitchen which the wife uses for recipes and cooking, one for each of our three children (they love the games and educational programs) and the remainder for myself - including a new laptop - for leisure and work.

All GNU/Linux distros are good for what they do, however, Mandrakelinux is the best GNU/Linux distribution that I have ever seen and I've not had any problems with it. I found it easier to install, configure and run than any Windows OS.

This is a link to the Mandrakelinux website. And, here are some cool Mandrakelinux screenshots. Did you know that you can install software in Linux that will allow you to run Microsoft Windows programs? Or that most GNU/Linux distros are free to download and install? So, now there is no reason not to install and use Linux.

Do yourself a favor and install MandrakeLinux, or whichever GNU/Linux distro works for you, and throw Microsoft Windows in the trash. You'll thank yourself in the long run.

I challenge all Windows users to try a GNU/Linux distro today.

I used MS Windows for years and got fed up with the viruses, trojans, worms, spyware, malware, crashes, expense, etc. I installed and attempted to learn 17 different GNU/Linux distros and settled on Mandrakelinux. I installed Mandrake on all 9 of the computers in our house, including two that are in the kitchen which the wife uses for recipes and cooking, one for each of our three children (they love the games and educational programs) and the remainder for myself - including a new laptop - for leisure and work.

All GNU/Linux distros are good for what they do, however, Mandrakelinux is the best GNU/Linux distribution that I have ever seen and I've not had any problems with it. I found it easier to install, configure and run than any Windows OS.

This is a link to the Mandrakelinux website. And, here are some cool Mandrakelinux screenshots. Did you know that you can install software in Linux that will allow you to run Microsoft Windows programs? Or that most GNU/Linux distros are free to download and install? So, now there is no reason not to install and use Linux.

Do yourself a favor and install MandrakeLinux, or whichever GNU/Linux distro works for you, and throw Microsoft Windows in the trash. You'll thank yourself in the long run.

I challenge all Windows users to try a GNU/Linux distro today.

I did something like this for 10.0 (I wanted the patch indexes to be incremental) but my lone voice wasn't enough. If other people join Cooker, link to the article, and express themselves it may come to pass for 10.2 (10.1 is too far down the pipe already).

It's not as simple as it seems, 'coz those RPMs are bzip2-compressed internally, so a simple binary diff isn't likely to help much; they'll need to do a special stream of RPMs that are binary diffed before compression, which will probably require (more) surgery to RPM as well.

There is no need to run Microsoft products.

Microsoft products are inherently unsafe compared to GNU/Linux. Read this article as well. Microsoft lies to its customers and to everyone else.

I cannot figure out why people still use Microsoft products, unless it is because of sheer ignorance. My company runs Mandrakelinux. Microsoft products are not allowed in the offices nor on the production floor. If we can do it, so can you.

...vouchers for free copies of competing FOSS products?

Done right, that could be an excellent publicity gimmick.

It'll still be a Microsoft operating system. And, unless they do a complete re-write, it'll still be an extremely insecure OS. I bet the script kiddies and crackers will love the people who are dumb enough to run it.

Here you go, this is much better.

How about a safer operating system?

Another example is the Mandrake security center... it has several "uneditable" settings. For example I need the /proc tree to be world-readable.. impossible to change without either a) lowering security level as a whole or b) edit the "default settings" config file in some hard-to-find location.

This is a file permissions issue, please use drakperm to have your own settings on /proc or any other file/directory. There is no need to edit the default settings config (if you do want to edit it yourself, use /etc/security/msec/perm.local).

So, it seems your example is bad - care to provide another one? BTW, you can't edit all settings in Windows either, that's why there's a registry editor ...

And, instead of "writing it myself", you can always file bug reports for the development and stable releases (bugs really do get addressed).