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Why Does Windows Still Suck?
RatBastard writes "SF Gate's Mark Morford asks: Why Does Windows Still Suck? After wtaching his significant other's Windows PC drown in a sea of viruses and worms after only 4 minutes on her new DSL connection, Mark Morford wonders why the masses have not stormed Redmond waving torches and scythes in anger over the never-ending security flaws in Windows. Why haven't they jetisoned the foul beast from Redmond and migrated en mass to the Macintosh or even Linux?"
I'm a gamer.
Wheel in the sky keeps on turnin'.
Why would you let your SO attach an unpatched and unprotected PC to the Internet? Would the author let her walk SF's Tenderloin after dark in a halter, leather mini & fishnets?
"I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismometer." -Ken Kesey
They don't know of anything else, and Windows came with the computer.
Since you left it so obviously vulnerable if it was truly that messed up in 4 minutes.
Because Windows is the worst operating system, except for all the others.
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try.
-- Dr. Spock, stardate 2822-3.
Because it's still Windows.
Why Does Linux Still Suck?
I haven't had enough Microsoft bashing today, I was starting to get a bit punchy!
...pobody's nerfect
Sig? No thanks, I'm trying to quit.
It's not a problem with Windows! The operating system is okay! It's digitally signed!
Someone would be stupid enough not to install their anti-virus protection and anti=spyware protection on a computer before connecting it to the net?
Stupidity reaps it's own kind of reward in this case.
Why? Because Microsoft focuses its resources on market share rather than making a robust and stable system. Once consumers are locked in they tend to stick with what they know and buy the upgrades. It's that inertia that MS banks on when they release repackaged corn-laden turd and call it "Windows NextGen-2010+++ with Lemon Scent" Seriously: what real ideas have they come up with in the past many years? Everything they make is a bit shinier and fatter than the previous versions but where is the innovation?
Trolling is a art,
Because CyberSpace is a vacuum, duh!
Bitch moan. Whine.
Everyone complains complains complains around here. Stop complaining and DO SOMETHING.
For most people, it's simply not worth the effort. It's significantly easier to work around the problems of Windows than to unite to try and get something fixed.
Thank God for evolution.
People just assume there computer is running like a dog becuase "it's a stupid computer"...they don't know how it SHOULD work, and they don't know there's an alternative.
People don't like to admit that they're wrong.
NEWSFLASH! #2
People don't like to change.
NEWSFLASH! #3
People follow the majority.
Know what I like about atheists? I've yet to meet one that believes God is on their side.
Bad UIs, poor hardware support, poorly written software.
Who cares if it's secure, it's useless.
The consumer mass-market doesn't view viruses and worms as the fault of the operating system. Rather, they blame the guys who write the bad stuff -- not the guys who make it possible.
Same reason the people who hate drunk driving aren't going after auto-manufacturers. Instead, they go after the idiots doing the drunk driving.
I'm not defending either position. Simple stating what I believe is the perception of the public.
-- People who hate Windows use Linux. People who love UNIX use BSD.
Here we go lets start another flamewar. Need to get in our weekly windows/ms bashing. Did we have our distro war yet this week? How bout our ipod killer article?
http://www.immigrantornot.com/
A Mark Morford piece I actually agree with. Well, if this can happen, anything can. Maybe Bill Gates will fix Windows.
"Extremism in defense of liberty is more fun."
there have never been any mac viruses ever
Either people aren't aware of other options (and more aren't than you'd imagine) they don't want to make a change from something they've become so accustomed to, or they're just afraid... Don't fear the penguin!
Microsoft don't innovate, they imitate.
:/
There hasn't really been anything "new" since windows 95.
With the advent of DRM, things are getting less fluid and more restrictive, and as they lock the user down more and more, it's only going to get worse
Just MHO.
Because...
1) They're stupid
2) They don't care
3) They don't know any better
4) They're stupid
5) They're afraid of computers
6) They're afraid of change
7) Marketing and brainwashing
8) They're stupid
There are a variety of reasons. Some people have one reason, some people have another. The problem is that just about all of these people have a reason. And most often this reason is that they are dumb as a brick.
People have always had the impression that computers aren't "reliable and stable". Having this ingrained in them means they accept things like Windows crashes. AS for Linux, it's not seen as user friendly as Windows. Some people have the false impression that it's more difficult to install (well, compiling gentoo is more difficult than installing Windows, but installing RedHat definitely isn't). ...and the most obvious reason (that people don't switch to linux/mac) is because everyone else is on Windows! It's what people use at work, and it's what they're most comfortable with.
I store my recipes online (the way nature intended)
They don't care
Sounds like too easy of an answer, but for non-tech savvy people, a computer is just a tool for email, web, etc. If computers were a vital part of people's lives, they might care. Corporations can pay administrators to keep their computers clean, but joe twelvepack doesn't use his computer for anything that he can't do without. QED.
People who think they know everything really piss off those of us that actually do.
Why do idiots write articles?
It's completely programming in Visual Basic.
This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is mine.
Linsux and OS suX suck even more.
Bill Gates has a 'cute little geeky head'?
No synthesizers
How come on a fresh install I cannot get wi-fi support? Where is the built in Win32 support? How come app installs don't put shortcuts in the "Start" menu? How can you ever expect John Doe's grandmother to use Linux?
People have been taught that computers are inherently unstable, will often crash, are very complex machines that are basicly a house of cards. They have been fed the line that 'security is too hard!' so much they believe it.
You build a car, that the purchasers expect to be compatible with every part, seat, and accessory since the begining of the automobile industry and see hwo it goes.
Really Microsoft did write themselves in to a corner by supporting so much legacy code so well, and in such a complicated project, that if any little thing isnt right they get bashed for it.
Mind you I am writing this from mozilla while admining Unix boxes, but really for what they attempted Windows ISNT that bad
Moderators -1 NOT Windows Bashing
#include sig.h
Perhaps if the users weren't complete idiots, they wouldn't be getting said malicious software installed on their computers. Christ, I run two locations using Windows with high speed connections, and anyone with even a base level knowledge of how to protect themselves will not get hit.
The problem isn't the OS, it's educating people how to properly USE it.
Windows at home: games.
Linux at home: media server.
Mac at work: X for using Matlab remotely on more serious *nix hardware while being able to run MS Office (I've never had any problems with MS Office for Mac). I like the GUI too.
The owls are not what they seem
I know all of people who just don't know that there is an alternative to Windows. Sure they have heard of Apple, but for some reason they don't see as a real alternative because they just don't see does computers in their daily lifes. At School they see Windows, at school they See Windows, at the near by Walmart or Best Buy they see Windows. So alternatives are not easily had.
Somebody show this writer what he's missing. You can't consider what you don't know exists.
Other than that, this article serves no purpose, and I'm going to stay clear of this one.
2. People haven't migrated away because it's too hard.
You're welcome!
Have you read my blog lately?
Ease of use.
Tell me how many people even know there are different operating systems.
To most people windows is just something that comes with their computer and thats that.
They can't very well get something they know nothing about.
I don't really think this is a matter of Windows sucking or not. This is just really beating a dead horse; if Linux was the dominating desktop OS, there would likely be just as many malicious things for Linux as there are for Windows now. Besides, any competent user of Windows can steer clear of malware quite easily; usually the only ones that get worms, etc. are mouth-breating mongoloids.
People at large don't know it is Microsoft's fault.
Granny: Those nasty crackers are ruining my online experience. Maybe if I buy the latest Windows, it will go away.
They just don't know that it's largely the fault of Microsoft for releasing poorly secured code. And even if they did, I somehow doubt they would be quick to grasp that there can be such a thing as well secured code.
Like most of the battles in IT, it's an educational matter.
-- Experience is a wonderful thing. It enables you to recognize a mistake when you make it again.
compatibility
Don't get me wrong, I'm a mac fanboy myself, and I agree 100% with most of the author's conetentions, but, some of his evidence is a bit whack:
He links to the Crack a Mac challenge, as evidence that macs are bulletproof. Fine, but read their story- most of the attempts to crack *that* mac were based on old UNIX and NT attacks, and well, duh! HOWEVER- nobody (hardly) uses macs for webserves. If we had been doing that for the past 15 years, well, perhaps there'd be heaps of *known* exploits. The Crack a Mac story doesn't prove that there aren't exploits, it proves that not many folks know what they are.
Apparently the connection is through SBC Yahoo! DSL.
I recently got DSL through my phone provider (SBC) and am torn on if I like it or not. The CD they send with it has spyware, its own browser, and all sorts of nasty things that WILL bring your system to a crawl easily. Sure Windows doesn't do very well, but a provider's CD like SBC Yahoo's does not help at all.
Hooking it into my Linux box with rp-pppoe was nice though - and the speed is impressive.
unf.
Without Antivirus, how do you know it's "clean as a whistle"? It's kind of a schrodinger's cat scenario; you haven't looked.
I don't have a scythe! Or a torch for that matter! :-)
I was afraid too, even though I had used Linux on the campus PCs. I used to have the same problem (immediate infection/total system compromise within hours after hooking up to the net). It was so bad that after re-formatting and installing the online anti-virus software my university provided me, it was already too late. I fearcely battle virsuse for nearly two weeks, then I finally gave up and installed Linux. Now I thank those viruses, and Windows/M$ for failing to do anything to prevent them from entering my system. Had that not have happened, then it's likely I would still be trapped in Windows.
Hero of Allacrost, a FOSS RPG for *NIX/*BSD/OS X/Win
...there'd be no reason to upgrade.
Microsoft is a business. If they wanted to go out of business, they'd just program a perfect piece of software. If it was really perfect, there'd be no one buying support, additional licensing, and upgrades.
and no, i didn't read the article.
Why read the article when I can just make up a snap judgement?
I run 2003 behind a firewall. I backup and patch regularly. Run anti-virus and adaware. I use opera for primary surfing. Windows runs fine. Plays my games and all the productity apps. 2003 is very reliable. I hibernate it for weeks at a time with no need for a reboot. People use it because it doesn't suck.
"By the way, yes, I own a tiny handful of Apple stock."
I'm glad to see he's not in this for personal gain... But on a more serious note there are plenty of reasons not to switch to Mac: PC games being one of the biggest reasons I can think of.Creative Demolition
People are sheep. Big marketing tells them to buy product X because there is none better. Most people will simply do that without ever thinking that there might actually be something better.
UNIX/Linux Consulting
The McAfee site claims a whopping 91 percent of PCs are infected.
What is Microsoft's market share in the PC market again?
Why haven't they taken arms up against Redmond? One reason is because most people don't know there are alternatives (how many average lusers can even properly identify the version of Windows they're using?), and the mainstream press has only recently begun to specifically mention Windows as the main culprit.
The non-tech press always talks about spyware and viruses as if they're inherent to the Internet, as opposed to its most common brand of client. Look up a lot of the old stories about the big viruses that struck back a few years ago (when new worms were big enough news to warrant international press attention) and so rarely does the word 'Windows' ever get mentioned. I never could figure that out. Some people blamed MS PR for handling that but I don't think they're that good. My guess is because the average reporter couldn't grok the specific reasons why the worms were spreading. Of course, anyone who asked MS directly probably got the spun answer that blamed the evil hackers. Then they didn't think (or didn't have the technical ability) to probe deeper into the problems.
My letter weight hasn't gotten a virus since I bought it fifteen years ago, but that doesn't mean I want to use it as a PC.
What is the alternative? All of the software and hardware I want for my laptop and desktop runs on Windows the best. Nobody writes drivers or software for Linux or the Mac because there's no money in it.
never connect an unpatched windows computer to internet without patching it first or installing a firewall, if u update it with windowsupdate a firewall is a must... I'm surprised it last 4 minutes I've seen computer getting infected in seconds..
I dunno.
"Why haven't they jetisoned the foul beast from Redmond and migrated en mass to the Macintosh or even Linux?"
I have. This post was typed on a Powerbook, my server runs Fedora 3 and my wife has a machine for her use that is loaded with SUSE. We migrated all the computers away from MS Windows when XP came out and I haven't used a Windows system for months (the last time was at an Internet cafe on vacation).
Ed Almos
Budapest, Hungary
The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws. - Tacitus, 56-120 A.D.
Second, the average user could no more tell you the difference from an OS and an application than from a Trojan versus a Virus.
Finally, the average user isn't all that clued that there are any other options out there, and there are few if any application or game ads on TV that say "Runs on Mac" or "Runs on Linux" to make them even look.
---
More rants like this on my blog
"For the most part and for all intents and purposes, Macs are immune. Period." They are not immune. If you want a virus to have a big shock, you put it on a system that has the greatest userbase. (and yes i own a mac)
He makes a few good points, but in the end it just turns into a "Macs are better than PCs" rant
"...the Mac OS architecture is much more robust, much more solid, much more difficult to hack into. "
Yeah, and you can do so many more things with a Mac than a PC...
Well, I'm glad you didn't think that everybody who doesn't use your precious lunix must be INSANE!
God, you are a fucking brainwashed fruitcake. I bet you masturbate to the images of RMS and seriously believe that any other license than GPL is evil.
Because how ever bad windows Sucks, Linux sucks more, and Mac is do damn expensive.
Tyler Reddun
Waa waa. I pointed out that Windows is just fine unless you're clueless and I'm a troll. Boo hoo.
His copy of Windows doesn't suck anymore than the idiot that's using it. If his SO knew what he/she was doing it wouldn't have been a problem, and they'd break anything else just as badly if they didn't bother to take any time to figure out what they were doing.
Cars don't suck because they crash when people drive drunk, the drivers do. Windows doesn't suck when idiots connect it to a high speed network unprotected, the moron using it does.
Get over it.
Alito: A vote for Alito is a punch in the eye to put that bitch back in her place!
At least as we seem to be defining suck here, which is that it has features that are annoying or suboptimal. There is no perfect OS, no system without flaws. You'll get the zealots from any camp taht will insist their OS is the One True Way(tm), but they are only kidding themselves. Peopel newly switched to a new platform also often extol the virtues since some bug that annoyed them is now gone, and they've yet to deal the ones on the platform they now use enough to get annoyed.
I'm not trying to start an argument as to which platform is superior, that's a total non-starter, just pointing out that no platform can claim perfection. Linux has a lot that's wrong with it, along with a lot that's done right (or at the very least done better than others do it). So switching to Linux from Windows isn't a switch from a horrible experience to a eprfect one, it's a switch from one set of problems and virtues to a different one.
Many people consider it a good switch, espically here, but I think some people view their chosen OS with bit too rosy a view. They ALL have problems, they ALL have things others do better. Thus, it's not real supprise that many people simply stick with what they have.
Possibly because the average person doesn't even know when their computer is infected, and some of those that do know don't care. It's amazing what some people put up with, thinking that's just the way computers are.
Probably because most people have a firewall.
/sarc On /sarc Off
I've tried this. I have never had a machine "go down" in 4 minutes. I gave up after 30 minutes. Nothing.
Most users have a firewall or some sort of cheap wireless/router/combo unit from bestbuy/compusa/etc.
Nothing to see here but another bogus inflamatory article.. yay slashdot.
Stories like this make my $5 subscription really worth it.
I Encrypt My IM's
People are lazy. It's just that simple. It may sound offensif but this is the truth. I hear a lot of "dammit why is my system so slow" (or other negative comments) made on windows but nobody bothers to look for alternatives. It's there and they will stick with it. Of course, a good bunch of us got sick of it and therefor we look for better alternatives.
If you surf straight to a p0rn site...
Remember folks.. if you want to get your XP box all patched up, or get Mcaffee or the lim,e.. you need to get online to get it.
I imagine a lot of boxes get violated before the finish downloading patches!
jeff
Besides, joe newbie takes a new computer home. Why *shouldn't* he connect to the net and send an email to his buddies right away?
Applications...
I'll dump Windows in a heart beat if Adobe and Macromedia release Linux ports. But I have to have Photoshop to do my job.
Many of us have absoultely no choice.
Windows == tons of software, cheap hardware.
Mac == good amount of software, but expensive to switch. Yeah yeah, mac mini. They'd still have to buy all their software over again.
Linux == tons of half finished software and not user friendly.
Sure, it's easy to install Linux now... pop in a CD and go. But once you start using the system, installing things can be a bitch.
I'm a Windows user at work and don't enjoy it, but for what I do Windows is required. Wish it wasn't. At home I've got a powerbook and a Linux server. I wouldn't recommend Linux for the average user yet. I'd definitely recommend a Mac, if you've got the cash.
It's rather amusing (in a sad pathetic way), but our corporate network (behind the firewall!) is crawling with worms. Any unpatched machine we bring up on the network is quickly infested with viruses, etc. Me? I ran without a virus scanner for a year (CA's eTrust Virus Scanner caused me and others so many problems that we disabled it - corporate policy has just changed and now we're running NAV). I didn't have ICF enabled. I just kept my machine patched. It stayed clean.
then most people out there are morons by that logic...
oh wait. Nov 2nd. 51% of vote...
AHHHHH>...... You are correct...
Users are losers. It's that simple people.
The worms and viruses are designed to be hard to detect. People have infected machines that they don't know are infected. Out of sight, out of mind.
Remember the days when Republicans were the party of fiscal responsibility?
I've been running my Windows 2000 box at home since it came out, no virus, no spamware, no garbage and it runs great. Last time I checked uptime was 3 months and 12 days.
Perhaps this is just human nature. But as a "switcher" who is approaching his one year anniversary with a PowerMac after almost 20 years of Windows and DOS (starting with DOS 2.0!) I can honestly say: Windows users, it's not your fault. Microsoft should be ashamed, not you. Windows sucks, and there are better choices out there for you. Make them! You'll be happy that you did.
that was kinda funny
Pure and simply laziness. Yes there computer is slower, but they can still kinda check e-mail. And when it is really slow they can go out and fork over another $1000 for a new DELL. Also you know the saying "Back in my day..." What that really means is: "I am old and lazy and don't care to learn any new tricks". People are lazy asses who just like to sit around and will easily pay $1000 to make their problems go away without having to "learn" the complicated Apple computer. People are LAZY. They are so lazy that if they thought about it for a minute they would realize that the five minutes it takes to learn OSX (and two days to move files) far outweights the two months of lost time on windows. It really ticks me off how lazy people are.
-Benjamin Meyer
Do you changes clothes while making the "chee-chee-cha-cha-choh" transformation sound?
The masses think that Linux is too hard and Macs are too expensive. The masses don't know any different or don't care or don't want to ditch the devil they know for the devil they don't know.
Every O/S out of the box is exploitable. If its not it just hasnt been out long enough. The argument is poor.
Still, I think the most important reason Windows still sucks is that no strong incentive exists to improve Windows and no obvious definition of what "better" means. To some people it means faster, while to others it means more features. To some it means easier-to-use and to some it means more secure (and yes, there is at least some trade-off here). To some a computer means a magic box, while to some it means raw access to the machine and coding capability.
I also suspect that Windows is good enough and cheap enough for most people, and that, combined with its extremely strong network effect, makes it hard to give MS a strong incentive to make it better.
Look, I think it comes down to one simple word: ubiquity.
When you ask the average computer user why they chose Windows the answer tends to fall into one of two categories:
1. It is what came with my machine.
2. It is what I learned in school (or at home).
Having done so much with so little for so long, I now can do anything with nothing at all.
After wtaching his significant other's Windows PC drown in a sea of viruses and worms after only 4 minutes on her new DSL connection
Hello, we at the NAFC would like to know more about the Windows and DSL connection products, as this could greatly increase our supply of worms. Thank you very much in advance Slashdot!
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
I read so much about people who say after a clean install they're infected with worms/spyware after a few minutes. really, that's bullshit. Windows isn't secure by default, no, but the only way that scenario legitamately took place is if you went straight off to the websites/downloads that are full of that stuff, which is more about the webmasters sucking than windows. I'm no MS fanboy but I don't like these claims. It's like saying you can get aids just by going to China when in reality that claim is based on you visiting a chinese brothel after you step off the plane.
There are 2 types of people in the world, those who find that stupid binary joke funny, and those who don't.
Because if we were guess what all the malware would be written for? That is exactly right - the dominant platform. But anyone who puts up a Windows box on a broadband connection without a $49.95 firewall is asking for trouble.
There are a couple of reasons:
.
1. most software is still for windows
2. windows is easier to use then linux and mac has less software
3. most people have pc's and dont want to buy new hardware.
Linux has a chance at making it big but i think it has to get easier to use. You still have to sometimes compile programs and type in a lot of comands to run things. A non comp geek will not know what to do on linux.
4. also macs need to get faster.
In Slashdot terms, that article was Interesting, but not Informative, and certainly not Insightful. It basically boils down to two things:
What it does not provide, though, unfortunately, is an attempt to explain why that actually is the case. The author goes on to dismiss every attempt that has been made to explain just why Windows is still so dominant (like "Macs are too expensive") - or, for that matter, why Windows is (still!) so inherently insecure (like "Macs have no viri because they are not an attractive target") -, but he doesn't even attempt to offer other reasons for these things. Rather, he just says "these are what I claim to be the facts, they're contradictive, but I'm not gonna explain it".
Considering the article's title ("Why Does Windows Still Suck?") promises an explanation, that's rather unfortunate, and I'm afraid I have to conclude it's just praise for the Mac with little to no informational value, and minor goof-ups like confusing PCs with "PCs that run Windows" just make it even more clear that this is not an objective comparison or explanation attempt.
quidquid latine dictum sit altum videtur.
you know wat? im just tired of people says "Because its windows of because its microsoft." The operating system itself is attacked so much these days because its the most used platform. Its gaurenteed that if linux was as popular as ms windows it too would have worms and all that sht. Dont be idiots. If you dont know how to handle it you guys blame it on the system itself. Go grow up.
Judging from my family and the less computer-knowledgeable people I know. They think it is their own fault for their PC problems, because they think they are not using them properly. Often they do not even know there IS an alternative.
And one might also ask why our economy still sucks and yet nobody storms the White House? People are complacent, too complacent. People are uncomfortable with change as well. People grow used to certain things and are unwilling to make changes, even if they are for the better. The most important thing to a person is to feel comfortable and secure, and the very thought of change, whether it is a change in administration or a change in operating system, is terrifying for them.
I recently got my fiancee a Mac off ebay and she loves the thing. She was up and running very quickly and is having a lot of fun with it. It is easy to use, it is safe to be on the net with it, and she's finding all sorts of fun shareware and freeware out there that has her fascinated. Her old Windows computer was freshly installed Windows 98 at the start of last semester and by this semester the thing was bogged down with general Windows decay. Oddly, Ad-aware claimed she had no adware and the virus scanners said she didn't have a virus--and yet the entire system felt to be about 200Mhz slower than it was at the start of the year (and it was an old box, only about 400Mhz to begin with...). Her new Mac is just a dual 500Mhz G4 but it is lighting fast by comparison and based on my 2 year old PowerBook, which has never had a fresh install, I expect it'll stay that way.
Why use Windows? There are MUCH better alternatives.
Hexy - a strategy game for iPhone/iPod Touch
People don't like to deal with proprietary architecture; I would be using Mac OS X right now--I personally find it far superior to Windows as an operating system--except that it only runs on Apple's hardware. As much as a monopoly on the operating system has inflated the cost of Windows, the inflation in a market where there is only a single manufacturer of computer hardware is even worse. If OS X could run on x86, I'd switch in an instant.
As for Linux, it's just got too many rough edges to be looked at seriously as a desktop operating system for any except those who take the time to learn its idiosyncrasies; it has two completely separate GUI toolkits with different looks and feels, and important programs written in both of these. It has so many different distributions with different ways of installing software and managing settings that an inexperienced user or developer will be left spinning; it lacks the focus for the time being to be considered as a solution by typical desktop users. Windows, for all else that can be said about it, has a strong, consistent look and feel; to Joe Blow and Grandma Ethel, that is absolutely crucial.
It's "cheap", and by cheap I mean free as in "already installed on the PC when I bought it" cheap. No installation work needed, I'm used to using it's features, etc. - that's what the typical computer user would say these days.
And if the computer "breaks" or slows down it's not that expensive to go buy a new one. It's just a part of our American "throw-away" consumerism. Apple computer users are like the Jaguar and Mercedes crowd - they're pretty damn expensive cars, but they'll last for a long time and look great on the road no matter how old they are. Linux computer users trying to use Linux on the desktop are like the "ricers." The car doesn't always work, is usually a "work in progress," but when done right can demolish any comparably priced car. They're still not as classy or long-lasting as the Mercedes and Jaguars, but every once in a while they're pretty cool.
'Cept Linux users don't get hot booth babes at the trade shows.
it was Microsoft's plan all along. start crappy and stay crappy just shift the crap around every few years and you can say things are getting better. People will be so use to the crap that they will testify that thigns work perfect for them. People will claim they've had days, weeks even months of uptime without a computer crash because most of the crashes they don't even notice anymore, they just blindly reboot/restart without a second thought. Most people don't even realize they do it.
Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
It's the same reason why people don't storm the White House...
It's the same reason why people don't storm the RIAA headquarters...
It's the same reason why people don't storm the *insert whatever you like*...
Sure, Slashdotters might get angry and send off snail mail/email/faxes to whoever they're angry at. But we're a minority.
The MAJORITY are just too complacent with their lives. They're happy within their immediate environment. They may think it's not right, but they'll never take the action against it. It's too much of a hassle.
So instead they just acceot it. Windows crashing is obviously not so much of an inconvenience that they must storm Redmond. It's easier to push the reset button.
If people keep buying your product there is little incentive to make it suck less.
If people suddenly stopped buying Windows and switched to Macs you can bet the folks in Redmond would be burning through their billions in a hurry to build a better product.
Oh, wait. What was I thinking. The folks in Redmond would allocate their billions to the marketing department to spread Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt. Only if that failed would they resort to building a better product.
~~~~~~~
"You are not remembered for doing what is expected of you." - Atul Chitnis
And BillyG is the herder. We are are slave to his OS and unable to think beyond it. Mac or Linux are our fleeting attempts to break the yolk of oppression, but, in the end, will be futile. As long as business has no guts to change and the users are clueless as what to do, we will be Windoz users. This was written from my W2k system. I am a linux advocate but at the office, I use this crap.
Why do people eat at McDonald's? They definitely don't make the best burger in town.
Things like consistency, convenience, perceived value, brand recognition, etc., all play a big role.
Macs are too expensive for the true "average" user whose machine was bought for well under $1000 (plus Windows is familar cause thats what they got at work)
and Linux doesnt come pre-installed and no matter what anyone says, no "average" user is going to get a Linux distro loaded and configured by themselves.
And in the end Windows does do alot of things real well.
Why Does Windows Still Suck?
The original product Windows was destined to be a vaccuum cleaner. Duh.
Free XBox, PS2
Linux is great, but I have to admit that Windows is much better. The reason people do not switch is compatability. With linux, I cannot have wireless internet (many of hours trying to find drivers!), I cannot figure out how to install device drivers (NVIDIA or ATI), and last, games...need I say more? Linux will get better and so will Windows - I cannot see Linux ever passing Windows up in usability. Period. /I have used Suse, Ubuntu, Red Hat, Mandrake, Linspire...still always go back to Windows in about a week or so.
There are already a lot of good comments about why people don't switch, but I think we're going to see some of it happening this year. I just spent several hours wiping out and re-installing a laptop here a work because it picked up some sort of browser hijack that we couldn't clear with Adaware, Spybot S&D or the new beta Microsoft spy removal.
I volunteer teach at the local library and have had several people ask me if I hire myself out to clean spyware problems.
I think the media frenzy over the halo effect of the iPod and the new, more affordable Mac Mini is warranted. I think Apple is well-positioned this year to take a decent amount of upgrade business away from M$ precisely because people are so fed up with viruses and spyware. My next purchase will almost certainly be a Powerbook or a Mac Mini.
Try connecting an unpatched Solaris 2.6 box to the internet. Within a day it will be hacked and much more dangerous than any hacked Windows PC.
Caleb
Longhorn will be the first release of Windows authored completely after Microsoft began their Trusted Computing Initiative and released .NET. Longhorn will reimplement and convert major Windows subsystems to managed code. This alone will substantially improve security of the operating system, as while the APIs will remain the same legacy Win32 apps will end up talking to managed code beneath the Win32 API (yes, .NET makes this possible)
This will dramatically lessen the exploitation potential of code flaws in the Windows application libraries. Microsoft has to maintain support for legacy application, but that doesn't mean they can't get a fresh start on the underlying code, and doesn't mean that existing Microsoft applications can't be converted to managed code as well.
damn it, i'm sick of all the windows bashing.. it's an awesome OS... comes complete with a calculator and a paint program, not to mention the ability to clean your disk (i don't know how they do it, but they must have some crazy washer/dryer system inside) I hear this grinding sound inside my computer so that must be it. Also, it has the ability to change the background picture... how freakin' cool is that!? I can put up a picture of my cats!!! IT'S RIGHT THERE ON MY MONITOR!!! What more could you ask for in an OS?! Come on people!
So why ask the world? He should ask his "significant other."
Here's my list of reasons:
- With appropriate antivirus and anti-spyare installed, Windows works well. Finding the "appropriate" software is easy, and installing it is easy too (double click setup.exe, answer yes, hit ok, click finish, and after a possible reboot, you're done).
- If you throw in XP SP2, then pop ups are pretty much gone.
- I already know how to use Windoze
- I can config Windows via menus and GUI programs and not via obscure config files in who know how many different directories, with little help fom the built-in environment.
- There's a TON of games for Windows, certainly all the ones I care about are available for Windows
- Windows runs games on the first try
- Windows is much easier to program in (or maybe it is that I already know how to do it?)
- Getting hardware that will work with Windows is effortless
- Finding and correctly installing updated drivers for Windows is extremely easy
Putting up with the things that make Windows suck (ie, reinstall everything every 6 months or so cuz of incremental instability) is a piece of cake, given all the cumulative time saved.
I guess that makes you ignorant...
If you think A/V is the only way to protect your box or figure out what it's doing, you're probably one of the people who needs it.
Alito: A vote for Alito is a punch in the eye to put that bitch back in her place!
Preinstalling their os with every new computer is huge advantage for them. If the government told them to sell their OS on the market for over $100(xp cost) then people would wise up and buy something else.
Another reason though is that Linux still can be a hassle like downloading firefox and having to use administrator login to install.
Steve Jobs isn't ceo of microsoft...
p.s. I am not serious, this is meant to be funny!
Not a very accurate analogy. Wouldn't it suck if the car were to unconditionally burst into flames unless you were sure to also purchase an extra $1000 in "safety features" and have them installed perfectly before ever attempting to drive it? (And without the dealer actually telling you this.)
Get it now? You microsoft apologists should really get a clue.
What kind of idiot thinks that a computer should require training?
If you don't have a job, go to a public library and burn a CD with all the necessary files. If you're daring enough, do it at your workplace.
You don't have to download anything on an unsecured computer.
the devil you know. Simply put people know and hate windows and you will hear anyone and everyone complain about it, but the majority of users arn't technically minded and the idea of changing to something else is incredibly daunting. The only reasonable alternative for someone like that is in my opinion mac os x, which out of the box "just works". However up until the mini-mac the price of mac hardware was prohibitive. The interesting time will be in 6-12 months time when we see if there has been a big take up of the mac mini. If it gets pimped enough then perhaps Apple will make real headway into decreasing redmonds user numbers.
Promote Charity on Myspace, Show Your Colours!
The WIMP metaphor (windows, icons, menus, pointing device) is just flawed as a general solution for using a computer. Yes, it helps beginners in the learning process, but it is NOT practical for advanced computer use.
The operating systems that don't suck understand this: Basically, most Linux apps are just front ends for command-line utilities that do the real work- If they aren't command-line based they still have very independent abstract non-GUI modules that handle the actual labor (such as the gecko rendering engine for mozilla.)
OSX also is beginning to view the GUI as just a fantastic front end to a UNIX infrastructure.
The sucky OSes are the ones that don't distinguish between the GUI and the real programs- MS Windowses and Apple OS9 were like that and these are/were both pretty ugly to work under, in my opinion.
Think about it, most people use windows. There for most people who create viruses and trojans do so for windows.
Linux and Macs are also exploitable, just not as popular. Make the popular and along comes the junk.
Simple because the average end user is so ignorant, lazy, and or stupid, that they think it is somehow there fault. They are intimidated by computers, confused by them, but they know that EVERYONE has to have one and they don't like looking like the poor sot who can't even drive a car. Everyone knows how to drive a car, right? Well everyone ought to know how to drive a computer? It is all about pride.
Plus it is also about motivation. While everyone wants to learn how to drive most people don't really want to learn about a computer. It's too much work and most of it isn't fun or helpful. At least driving for most people is fun(at least part of the time.) Computer maintaince is just too much work.
Slashdot, home of supporters of free software, free music, and free speech.Except for Moderators that disagree with you.
1) Because it works "good enough" for most people.
2) Because jumping ship means doing something different, and therefore, scary.
3) Software and other vital functionality may not be avialable for other computers... It's like buying a new car that isn't compatible with current gas stations.
People are beginning to switch... We just need to keep our numbers growing enough to hit critical mass, where it won't be as scary (or as limiting, software-wise) to switch platforms.
~D
This sig has been enciphered with a one-time pad. It could say almost anything.
...is: If Windows sucks so much (and it really does), then why didn't Linux take over the mainstream desktop by now?
All I have to say is run your broadband connection through a router with hardware firewall, Firefox, Thunderbird, and install AVG free. I haven't had 1 piece of sypware or a virus since. The only thing you need to pay for is $30 for a router. Easy and simple.... I guess not for some
If all the software that people ran was available on linux and macs, games included, then more people, including myself, would switch. And honestly, I am computer savvy, but I am not even sure if there are still many different versions/releases of linux outhere, where to get them from, wether they are free or I gotta buy them. I know IT guys are all over linux, but I don't think the article, and the question is poses are aimed at IT/programmer types. So in a nutshell, being a regular guy using my computer, if there was more software available for linux, and it was clear how to acquire it, I would be switching. Most people, like myself just want to put a disc in a drive,install and not worry about it any more.
I've been using WinXP since April/2001, used Win98SE for 3 years, and Win95 for 2. I've never had a single worm or virus with any of them. I don't use a firewall or run any anti-virus software, yet I use the internet everyday. My systems don't slow to a crawl, or crash/reboot randomly. The simple fact is: Windows doesn't suck, users do! Stop pirating software/media, start using Firefox, and for Christs' sake: SHUTDOWN YOUR COMPUTER AT NIGHT!
You're all just jealous that we get all the games, and hardware support. Now as for the upcoming Longhorn, that's just evil and shouldn't be touched with a ten-foot-pole.
After experiencing it at work, at home, and hearing about it from friends and family, users become used to it and even expect it. "Computers crash and get infected. That's just a fact of life," they say. To most users it's normal because they don't know any better and haven't discovered or tried any alternatives.
Slashdot: Failed Car Analogies. Amateur Lawyering. Anecdote Battles.
Windows is far from perfect, but the author's bias is really obvious in a few places.
For example:
(Sometime in the later '90s, a Mac org whose name I forget ran a rather amazing hacker competition: they offered a $13,000 cash prize to anyone in the world who could hack into the company's unprotected Mac server and alter the contest's home page in any way. Needless to say, no one ever could).
If the author were half as clever as he thinks he is, or not being dishonest, he'd realize that such a competition says absolutely nothing about the operating system and everything about the person or persons who configured it. I could put a really secure Windows 2003 Server on the net (the easy way: basically disable every incoming network service). Doesn't mean Windows 2003 is secure...
As to why the masses don't migrate en-masse to the Mac Mini.. That's an easy one... They want to actually run applications other than Final Cut and iTunes. For all the greatness of OS X, Apple still hasn't managed to do a very good job of getting widespread developer support behind it. An operating system can be the most secure and uncrashable thing on the planet and nobody is going to give a flying damn if they can't run software they want to use on it.
Um. If you say so, chief. I'd still go buy Windows, because I like it. I'm a gamer and it does what I need and want. It's not a huge hassle to go download a security update when they come out, and don't go all high and mighty and act like Firefox or Linux has never had bugs, including security ones.
No duh pre-installing Windows on computers is a huge advantage, but it's not like the vendors don't have a choice.
Wheel in the sky keeps on turnin'.
Mark Morford wonders why the masses have not stormed Redmond waving torches and scythes in anger...
The same question could be asked about a few other things in North America....
I caught the Mountain Wumpus! He gave me his treasure chest ($100) to let him go free again.
Windows still has a few things going for it - it has a fast responsive gui (lets face it, KDE is like walking through shit), perhaps the best hardware support because everyone supports it because everyone else does. Also, applications come more often than not with easy to use installers so you can have something installed and ready to use within about 30 seconds of clicking next, to get most programs on most linux distros you have to first figure out if its available in your distros package format - eg dep or rpm, if it is then installing is pretty easy, although you're probably gonna have to figure out menu and desktop shortcuts yourself. However if its not packaged the chances are you're in for a make, 9 times out of 10 that means dependencies will be missing and must also be installed - a hassle that the user doesn't want, if it can't be installed easily on the spot the average user will give up in a matter of minutes. Windows isn't that bad security wise for _desktop_ use, spend about a minute installing say Sygates free firewall and you're pretty much set, another minute to install firefox and thunderbird and you're free from adware.
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
Today? Plug that shit in to a world full of malcontents and send your worries packing; it wouldn't be easy if it wasn't safe. You are an idiot if you put unpatched Windows XP on the Internet, as even mainstream news has covered the problem six ways from Sunday. My OEM hands out trial Antivirus and Internet Security suites and preloads the latest SP of Windows on new systems -- demand no less.
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try.
-- Dr. Spock, stardate 2822-3.
"People often prefer a problem that is familiar to a solution that is not." -- author forgotten by me
That's basic behavior, and it's hard to break.
It's true for lousy relationships.
It explains some of Nick At Nite and why there was even a single repeat buyer of the Ford Escort.
"Win treats sysadmins better than users. Mac treats users better than sysadmins. Linux treats everyone like sysadmins."
You'd think that the person that posted this would be a bit more knowledgeable using a real firewall and antivirus software. There are many good anti virus and firewall protection software now, not to mention Firefox browser.
If you want to access the net you have to be responsible and take care of your computer because no one will. If you can't afford $100 for that $1000 computer with that 20-50$ a month internet connection then those people have issues.
No one should cry because people love to live in ignorance. I think this has to do with more of a lack of user education then it does by putting the burden on a single software company. Even anti virus and firewall products have to constantly be updated because of new exploits.
Perhaps it's because they are excercising their monopoly power to keep their position in the marketplace. Just because they got out of that last anti-trust investigation and lawsuit with just a slap on the wrist does not mean they aren't still breaking anti-trust laws. Mincrosoft has a long and distinguished history of behaving in an anti-competitive behavior. The reason Windows is by far the most-used desktop OS can be directly contributed to this behavior.
"If I want a Mac, I'll get a Mac. If I want a Linux box, I'll get a Linux box."
"But you ordered three Windows machines."
"I fear change."
where the wild things are
"A witty saying proves nothing." ~Voltaire
"d'Oh!" ~Homer
The only reason so many Windows boxes get pwned out of the box is because the 'bad guys' have already written exploits that get in through an unpatched bug.
Who's fault is this? Is it Microsofts? Not really, at least how I see it.
I blame the computer manufacturer that you bought the box from.
Those holes that are in your windows box when you plug it into the net already have patches written for them.
It's the manufacturers that refuse to slipstream these packages into the software builds that they stick on their machines coming out of the factory.
Dell builds your PC to order, as do a few other guys.
The hard drive has an OS imaged onto the drive on the line.
And since there is a common image for each machine of the same family, it's a very simple process for Dell to image their machines on the line.
Each model has it's own OS image, based on hardware.
It would take very little effort to slipstream an updated patch into those images. No PC has to sit in an open box waiting to be patched; they are patched when they're built. That is not a difficult solution, it would take the hiring of one or two guys in the factory to add a slipstream into the disk image (and slipstreaming is *very* easy, as long as you know the process.)
It would be easy as pie. Your machine would come off the line patched, and current. It would only be out of date by a few days, the time it would take to ship the box to you from the factory. The likelihood of a new exploit that would pwn you in that time is very, very low.
Same thing with going to a retailer. They should be provided current and up to date boxes when they leave the store. It would not be difficult for BestBuy/CircuitCity/et al to stick the box/laptop you buy inside their secured network, and patch the machine before you walk out the door with it.
Let's use an analogy that the author of the article used; a new car.
You buy a new Ford. Before you bought it, Ford issued a recall, due to a defective gas tank that may or may not explode. When you buy the car off the lot, it may have sat there a few months (parallel = older unpatched windows build). You take it home to find out that the recall was not applied to the vehicle; why not? Because the dealer says it's your responsibility to get it in to get fixed; not the dealers.
Would that be acceptable? No. Not for a moment. The same thing is happening with Windows, and you can't blame MS for it. It's the PC makers that sell you an exploitable box.
" Maybe if his S.O. was a little more competent, Windows wouldn't suck so much."
Think about it. If it was a TV.
"My SO plugged the brand new TV into the cable system and 4 minutes later it stopped working." You SO is a moron. Why wasn't your SO smart enough to open the back of the TV and rewire the power supply!
Or if it was a car.
"My SO just got a new car and the engine was trashed after driving it 4 minutes."
Why was your SO so stupid to drive a brand new car with out first opening the hood and setting the valve clearance!
You statement is just dumb and insulting. She is not a moron. She is just not a system admin. What is moronic is that people are selling Windows XP boxes that are so insecure that they can not live on the Internet long enough to download SP2.
Maybe every Windows Box should come with the network stack inactive. When you want to connect to the Internet a special super restricted TCP/IP stack pops up and downloads the latest updates for you. Windows is being pushed as a consumer item it should be expected to act like one.
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Morford is a pretty well-known (very) liberal columnist, as well as a MacHead. Hopefully people will judge this column on its own merits, not by its author's political views.
From TFA:
(By the way, yes, I own a tiny handful of Apple stock. Do I need to advocate for Mac? Hardly. I'm already happy as can be thanks to the success of the brilliant, world-altering iPod.)
Do any of you get the feeling that this article should have been published on MacWorld?
For the most part and for all intents and purposes, Macs are immune. Period.
And we've all been through this argument before. Perfect security only comes when you unplug the network cable (and that's when it's not an insider job). Talking like this will just make people complacent. Although I personally use Fedora, Windows PCs can be pretty good to use, provided you are behind NAT or a firewall and you don't use IE or Outlook Express...
One good turn - gets all the covers.
I can already tell this article will find itself in league with the all-time great classic technical-discussion.slashdot.org postings such as:
-Why does Windows still blow?
-Why does my Tux tattoo still itch?
-Why can't I still get a date?
and now back to the fallout shelter...
Why haven't they jetisoned the foul beast from Redmond and migrated en mass to the Macintosh or even Linux?"
The simple answer is that Windows does not suck.
I keep hearing about people like this who have these massive attacks on their PC once the system is exposed to air, much less the Internet.
I personally have never seen anything like that, and find it increasingly suspicious that these stories always start with "A friend of a friend's PC..." or "My Mom's PC..."
I think these stories all start with someone who thinks they know PCs and winds up with self-inflicted problems. Or just someone with some ill-defined anti-MS chip on their shoulder.
Personally, these stories are starting to bore me.
Over the Christmas holidays I was visiting my parents from out of town. They had 1 year old system, continuously DSL connected to the net, running XP without SP2, and used Internet Explorer to surf and Outlook Explorer (with the preview pane on) to read email. They had no firewall installed. I expected the computer to be a complete mess, a stuffed basket of viruses, trojans, and spyware.
There was nothing. No viruses, no spyware. Nothing out of the ordinary. The computer ran like the OS has just been installed.
So what is different about the computers of people who claim to have been attacked to oblivion inside of 5 minutes?
Life is like a web application. Sometime you need cookies just to get by.
This analogy sucks. The correct analogy would be akin to this person buying a car and driving straight into the middle of the highway and expecting not to be hit by another motorist.
Put your coat on when you go outside. Wear your seatbelt. Put on SPF 30. Lock your doors. Tie your shoes. Kill the power before you do any electrical work.
We do millions of things each day to protect ourselves. Why should hopping on the 'Net and operating a computer be any different? I don't imagine the author expects that ANY new computer owner simply opens the box and has no problems operating the computer (Mac, Linux, Windows or any OS).
There's evil out there. Be careful.
This space intentionally left blank.
Exhibit:
A) People don't think Windows sucks, they think computers suck. This removes the incentive to switch.
B) Having problems along with 90% of the world yields an illusion that lessens the severity of the issue. If you don't understand a subject, the logical "uneducated" choice is to align with the majority.
C) Those with the knowledge to suggest alternatives are the very same people who fix Windows. Be it pity or greed. My family and friends who use Windows don't need to storm Redmond to fix their problems. They already know my number.
D) People are actually getting good at fixing Windows. There's a crop of Windows users who, while they are not inherently technical people, have garnered the knowledge of self-support. It empowers them. It's like taking pride in fashioning your own crutches when someone breaks your legs.
E) One "investment" aspect of a computer is the x-year support service. Microsoft isn't fielding the calls, because they've farmed support to their vendors. The vendors turn around and sell that support as a value-added feature.
(Although I should explain I'm not calling you an idiot, as you have enabled ICF -- a positive scenario I haven't included in my rant but would have.)
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try.
-- Dr. Spock, stardate 2822-3.
That's why China will beat us in the end.
American government is a bunch of lawyers and businessmen voted into power by the ignorant masses.
The Chinese is government is a bunch of engineers and economists who got into power by working through the party ranks not buying a bunch of attack ads on T.V. with the money they made being a trial lawyer.
I'd just submitted the same item, but with some additional background...
Moreford isn't the only person noting crap quality of Microsoft. The New York Times saw fit to run 2300 words on erasing a hard drive and reinstalling the OS, to terminate spyware with extreme prejudice. I mean, when was nuking your C:\ drive national news? A few months earlier, I was interviewed for an expose of the adware/spyware industry in Barbiarians at the Digital Gates. My own technical followup, Spyware, Adware, Windows, GNU/Linux, and Software Culture has garnered a number of responses, most variations of "why do people put up with this cr*p?!"
Even the local small-town paper's usually Microsoft partisan columnist is suggesting it's time for the Microsoft Empire to begin to crumble. And he's not the only one.
The point is that these aren't geeks and gearheads talking out, it's the current in the popular press. Ordinary people. Which wouldn't be so significant if there weren't clearly identifiable, far better alternatives. Linux. Mac OS X. ABMS - Anything but Microsoft.
I think we're finally seeing the ediface crumble.
What part of "gestalt" don't you understand?
And that is that for computer users who are just beginning, Windows is probably a good choice.
Think about it. When you are a child, you are put up in a crib or a playpen. Your movement is constricted. It is not fun. There are very few toys to keep you entertained, but you are entertained anyway because your scope of knowledge is limited.
That is an analogy for most people who are starting out on computers. And keep in mind that there are quite a few people in the world who rarely, if ever, use a computer. It's hard to imagine, as slashdotting tech-nerds, but there are some people who rarely interact with these electronic hives that we call home.
Now, I've used Macs at home, *Nix at work (ISP), and Windows at school for years now. Macs are my favorite; *Nix is the most powerful; and Windows simply blows.
But we must remember how it is for the vast majority of computer users. The vast majority of computer users want to check their email, surf the web, and type things. And when you think about it, Windows does these things. Sure, it does them painfully for us, but I've seen plenty of people who surf/type at a rate that makes me cringe, and who don't care how fast their computer works as long as it does.
That is why people still use Windows. Because it is hard to learn another OS for people who aren't technologically inclined. If it were easy, we'd all be using *nix.
--Petey
He won't answer you, but I bet that the question will REALLY piss him off :P
It's because end users aren't Microsoft's customers when it comes to Windows.
The customers are OEMs -- the companies like Dell, HP, and all the others that build the PCs the end users buy. For the most part, they're they ones who actually buy operating systems, not end users -- those folks just take whatever came with the PC.
Microsoft has exclusivity deals that are tied to the price of their Windows license with every major PC OEM that punishes them severely if they flirt with providing alternate OS choices on their hardware. This means that when Joe User goes to the store to look for a computer, what does he see? Nothing but Windows (and maybe a Mac or two).
As long as these deals are in place, there's no incentive for Microsoft to improve Windows substantially. Why should they? There's no competition, and no vector for competition to be introduced. The only way for an OEM to introduce competitive products to its customers would be to accept having the cost of its Windows licenses go waaaaay up -- making its bread-and-butter products more expensive than the competitions'. Nobody's gonna do that just to make a political statement.
Until you crack that cozy relationship between MS and the OEMs it doesn't matter how much the end-users squeal. They aren't Microsoft's customers, so don't expect them to listen.
Read my blog.
That is as pithy as an answer can be. Whomever modded this Troll should be permanently fired from M1 Moderation.
(This is an example of M3 Public Meta-Moderation in use.)
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
If everyone used Linux, I am sure some devious persons would start writing worms for the 15 or so security issues with Linux I see every week. Microsoft is just the OS of choice for the majority so that is what hackers target. Everyone writes buggy code, Microsoft's just gets targeted and singled out because people use it.
On a more serious note, most Americans will always take quantity over quality - buffet over gormet. The 500 dollar beige PC wins over the more expensive M.A.C. or the hard to configure lunix box. That's just how it goes. I think based on that simple truth, Apple probably is smart in not trying to become a commodity brand.
Know how long it's taken me to get Windows up and running on it? I still haven't. I've installed XP four seperate times to get the basic rig with an iPod up and running. This weekend I'll spend the entire time trying 2K on it to see if that's any better. Each time a new driver or app is installed, something catostrauphic occurs and it becomes easier to start from scratch than to roll back drivers and troubleshoot. Everything from onboard LAN to firewire cards to USB mice. All stuff that's meant to be run on 2K/XP, but evidently can't. Or at least won't very well.
I mainly run linux boxes, so I forgot how god damn troublesome Windows can be. And the real kicker? For the amount that this box ended up costing me, I could have just bought a Mac Mini for $500 and have it Just Work(tm). I'm far from being computer illiterate, so I can only imagine how hard it would be for a normal lus3r to do this.
What has my experience taught me? Windows can kiss my ass, next time I'm getting a Mac.
from Microsoft. I used it on my Windows 98SE computer at home and it works great except now my Windows update doesn't work. :-(
Worst. Sig. Ever.
The reason they pre-install it is beacuse they NEGOTIATE CONTRACTS THAT REQUIRE IT! They aren't stupid people. Heck, if I could get a contract with my employer that forced them to send me a check even though I screw up everything I do, I definately would go for it.
Cliff Claven
K.E.G. Party Chairman
Founding Leader of: Koncerned for Egalitarin Governance
But a bunch of mostly volunteers working in their spare time for no money can make a car that doesn't crash no matter how drunk the driver, and they're giving it away for free!
I mod down anyone who says "I will be modded down for this", regardless of the rest of their comment
I hate to disappoint all the windows-haters, but this just simply does not happen. You might make an argument if you were plugging into a lan that has been infected with a virus...but not just plugging into the web via your DSL. I've tested this scenario and guess what...nothing happens. Seems to me this is more like, I plugged into the DSL, then I downloaded Kazaa and got some music, I checked out my favorite pr0n sites, read all the spam mail thats been sitting in my box, installed this software from a friendly pop-up that offered to scan my computer for spyware....and next thing I know, the thing is running slow...I couldn't believe it...
I can't argue that there are flaws that are allowing spyware and viruses to infect windows systems...but it's just not true that they are magically scanning every avaiable IP searching for a host.
Bah...mod this down for disagreeing with the level of Windows suckage...
This isn't exactly a post with any value, so perhaps everyone should ignore it.
But I must say what I'm about to say...
The term 'power user' makes me wanna puke. I just can't stand it. It made me close the browser tab when reading the article. It filled me with disgust. I no longer have any respect for the author.
Mac users view Windows like Fox news watchers view the world, this guy included. He just knows Windows boxes are horrible and Macs are God's gift to luddites because he read it in a Mac-oriented rag and it's true.
It creates all kinds of heat, I pay 2 dollars per gallon and it is pretty much not going to last for more than a decade at best.
It pollutes the air, costs $20,000 or more, and is highly inefficient.
Moreover, these cars have accidents EVERY DAY and the roads they have to drive on are crowded and in bad repair.
there is plenty of aircraft that is cheaper and sometimes even more fuel efficient... and it is certainly faster, but I just dont plain know how to use it or where or how to buy it.
I guess all the windows users are just "Stuck in traffic"
The whole topic of games development using DirectX vs OpenGL has been discussed to death here. Sure, the game writers could do it in OpenGL instead of DirectX, but Microsoft has apparently made using DirectX extremely easy. Maybe what it will take is someone to write a translation library that will basically translate the DirectX calls into OpenGL calls. Once that's out there, more games can be done for non-Windows systems. While all that's going on, OpenGL must be made friendlier to use than DirectX.
OK, it's a lot... but if you really want to lure the games developers to the side of platform independence, you have to give them a good reason to do so.
OCO is Loco
I'm running W2K at work the the ZoneAlarm firewall. No worms, trojans, etc. but I haven't been able to run it continuously longer than 6 weeks because I start getting screen artifacts and system slowdowns.
you have just said (something that leads to the conclusion) that morons would be better off with mandrakelinux then with windows.
the fact is that in mandrake it's very easy not to get infected with anything.
Now get off the computer and help your mother with the dishes!
Its simply stockholm syndrome.
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I think this is just a real blatant "let the flame war ensue" story on Slashdot.
the problem with systems these days that are used by the masses, is that the grossly unintelligent are able now to get their hands on a computer and begin, "Surfing the Net". Our company even is receiving support calls from people when typing in a URL do not know the difference between a "slash" and a "dash". So the average IQ of an Internet user these days is much lower than before.
That being said, a lot of Spy ware and Virii on that have infected people's computers were put there by the users own stupidity and/or ignorance.
A good example of this is a user receives a URL from their friend for a funny movie, they click on the URL, a window pops up to install an ActiveX control. "SURE! I must need to install this to watch the movie." BAM! Spy ware, Virus, Ad ware, etc.
The reason for such a prolific spread in spy ware and virii for windows is because there are many less computer savvy running windows.
I mean, could you imagine if one of these "Average home users" installed Red Hat Linux, and just ran the base install for over a year with no virus protection, firewall or updating the kernel/components? You're damned right that person would get hacked!
The problem is that operating systems put the accountability of how your system performs, what gets updated, and what gets installed into the users hands. It's a catch 22 for Microsoft, because they can't DISABLE all the advanced features, because the power users would complain and at the same time, they cant ENABLE all the advanced features because the ignorant would complain that its too complex/hard to use.
The bottom line is, if you have stupid ignorant user, stupid ignorant decisions will be made.
If your girlfriend plugs her Windows PC onto the net without a firewall or updated OS, and clicks "Yes" to install unknown ActiveX controls, and runs her computer without a real-time virus scanning program, then yes, she'll get over-run with virii and spy ware. Is it Microsoft's fault that your girlfriend is a moron?
You have to pass a test to prove you're competent enough to drive a car, why can't we have one for computer use?
Cars don't suck because they crash when people drive drunk, the drivers do. Windows doesn't suck when idiots connect it to a high speed network unprotected, the moron using it does.
Yeah, well your car probably doesn't start handing out fifths of vodka and it's keys to every teenager who happens by, either. Your Windows box does.
People who use windows have learned all of these tricks and recipes on how to use their windows computer. These recipes have been hard won, sometimes it's taken them weeks to get their new machine back to a usable state. They finally found the pictures directory that their camera software uses when it reads the pictures off their digital camera.
They think if they switch to a Mac or Linux they will have to spend months learning all new tricks, the hidden menus for adding short cuts, etc. etc.
They don't realize that they won't have half of these problems once they switch. They don't realize that there ARE no viruses or spyware on the Mac or Linux.
I keep telling everybody who needs help with the PC to down load ad-aware, etc. And then I tell them to notice that there is no Mac version of this software and if they would switch ...
Unfortunately, this problem persists with most software applications, not just Windows. There are quite a few programs out there, riddled with bugs, glitches, incompatibilities, etc. If it was a car, all hell would break loose. It's just software, so people deal with it.
The big question now...how do we fix it? Do we stop buying it? Do we hound the programmers? Do we pester the vendors? Until we actually TAKE ACTION, Window along with many other programs will continue to suck.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts...for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang
Because of the illusion that there is no useful software for other platforms, that other platforms are hard to use, and that other platforms "suck"
Microsoft got a lot of free publicity back in the 'old days' when Mac was a pretty limited platform in terms of readily available software and was plagued by inferior technology.
People hear the word Unix and think one of three things:
-Why would I want some eunuchs? Slavery is illegal these days!
-That's ancient technology, it's only useful for mainframes and servers
-The learning curve is too high, Windows is just easier
Furthermore, I feel that it's important to note that we, the faithful readers of slashdot, represent a very tiny segment of the population that is even aware that there is anything other than Windows available. They may have heard of Mac but they've probably not used one, and don't see any reason to buy a prohibitavely-priced machine when their 300 dollar Dell "Does the same thing, it's fine for me"
Lastly, people are allowed to believe that the problem is caused by the computer "wearing out" or "getting old" They don't understand that the computer is not like a car and that the computer itself doesn't get "slower" as time goes on, the only way it can slow down is increased workload, or parts of the software breaking down because of careless code. Install OS/2 on your 486 in 2005 and it's just as zippy as it was in 1993. It's big money to sell people unneeded upgrades and to charge them from things they should have never had to pay for in the first place. And so long as the common man is unaware of this, they will sit back and take it.
The best thing that we can do as people educated on such matters is to in a non-preaching fashion explain to normals about the problems that exist in windows without scaring them with technical explanations. Resolve any myths that they may have heard about Mac and Linux and let them decide on their own.
(P.S. To all you gamers out there, if gamers execute a mass exodus to other platforms, the games will follow. Developers aren't dedicated to windows, they are dedicated to the money in our hot little hands and will do what it takes to get it it.)
Our greatest enemy is neither a single man, nor is it a nation, it is, as it has always been, our own greed.
Acutally, the morons are the ones who voted for the other guy... You know, the guy that lost? He lost for a reason, and it wasn't because the people who voted for the winner were "Voting against their own interests." I think it's time for a class action suit against Microsoft. He's got PLENTY of money to assemble a team of programmers to go through the Windows code base with fine tooth comb, clean it up, trim it down, speed it up, and close all the open doors and windows that spyware uses to get in. Most people are impacted more by the viruses and spybots that infect their computers than by the loss of functionality that removing all these compromised services would cause. NO Program should be able to modify the registry, the windows directory or the program files directory without the users explicit permission.
Writes like the kinda guy who wants da girls in da stable to bring home the money.
"Yeah. I'm friggin' Santa Claws."
"Ho ho ho, hoe. Now get me my fuckin' dough, be-atch"
MSBPodcast.com The opinions expressed here are my own. If you don't like 'em... Think up your own stuff.
You are completely, totally, 100% missing the point. This shouldn't be something you have to worry about in the first place. You take a Mac, plug it in to the network, and you don't get infected - There aren't even any services turned on by default to infect *through*. Care to explain to me why in the hell a consumer operating system is leaving ports open all over the place for services nobody cares about or uses? More importantly, can you explain to my mother? "Turn on the firewall," you say. Can you also explain to her why the computer runs in an unsafe mode by default? "Get the updates," you say. Can you explain to her why in the world Windows doesn't check for updates when you first turn it on? (The first thing Mac OS X does when you turn it on is, you guessed it, check for updates and offer to install them in a large window that's not likely to be ignored, and easy to be dismissed if you don't want it hanging around).
The problem is that Windows is inherently unsafe out of the box, and requires work to make it safe - whereas all other operating systems are designed to be safe out of the box and require delibarate steps to make them unsafe. SP2 has made steps in the right direction but it's still not enough. And I don't know what Microsoft can do to make it safe - if SP2 wasn't enough then what will be?
My English teacher once told me that two positives don't make a negative. Two words for her: Yeah, right.
I've been using Windows since the Win95 era (using high-speed Internet since 2000) and I have yet to get a single virus infection. The only spyware I ever encountered was a few years ago when I installed Kazaa (gah, what was I thinking?). I feel quite safe using my XP box (although, Firefox IS my default browser).
What's with all the flamebait topics on Slashdot recently? I'm no Microsoft, er, I mean M$, fanboy, but the hatred towards them is absolutely ridiculous.
It is the new flavor of the month.
...but as soon as you are online you are hit by worms.
Did anyone else just get an erotic vision flash in their heads when they saw this stuff? Man, I've got to quit watching so much hentai...
We still use Windows for the same reason people still smoke cigarettes ... utter and complete stupidity. That and excellent marketing.
Having said that, there are still some folks who don't have a choice (for various reasons). For example, I'm not allowed to access my own financial records online with my bank unless I'm using Internet Explorer -- despite the federal government's clear and stern warning NOT to use IE because it's unsecure.
Apparently banks are pretty frickin stupid, too.
Answer: because you still buy it, so they have no real incentive to fix it.
and linux on the desktop is a pile of steaming shit!
I switched from Windows to Linux not long after the release of Windows ME (what a joke), and a couple years later, when I needed a laptop, I bought the only well-polished Unix-based laptop around: a Mac (powerbook). I've had it for 3 1/2 years now, and I just recently bought a 20" iMac (the new nothing-but-screen model) which is fantastic as well, and I'm waiting for my Mac Mini now too. I'm a total convert. I even feel the zeal rise in me from time to time.
I run a web-based software business, which necessitates testing in MSIE on Windows, so I put together a shitty Windows XP box out of the old one I had before, but I can't stand using it. I only connect to it from the OSX boxes via rdesktop anymore. It's amazingly unintuitive (now that I've had better) and not smooth at all. I haven't had any security issues with it lately (knock on wood), but it requires way more maintenance than the two Mac's do (they require none).
I talked with my dad the other day and I asked him about what he thought of the new Mac Mini. He said he read a bunch of PC magazine reviews that could be summarized with "don't bother". I wasn't able to find those reviews myself (although I found a few naysayers complaining about the price). He also said he would never use a Mac because it's a proprietary system. Apparently, Windows is no longer proprietary, due to sheer prevalence...
I tried explaining the misconceptions of the Mac, since he is quite fed up with Windows, and has seriously contemplated switching to Linux recently, but he didn't seem to want to hear it. Oh well, not much you can do.
putfwd.com - 1GB Free file storage with a twist
"...no lietenant your men are already dead." Why don't you run over to avast.com and get thier bart cd (because your compromised OS isn't a viable platform for detection) and run a scan and let us know how many different forms of verifiable infection are found. Maybe not being a moron to you is cutting the cable on your internet connection, but outside of that, your windows box is infected, period. I have seen clean windows 2000 installs with thier browsers hijacked, after all available updates were run before 4 manufacturers sites were reached to download drivers. Maybe I'm a moron too, but I don't think so, I think you are simply unaware that your "clean as a whistle" pc is 0wned.
People, just stop blaming MS for once!
Come on, it should be common sense to install a firewall (no excuse, as Zone Alarm can also get the job done) before trying to access the internet...
Windows XP comes with a built in one, just use it to block off internet connections before doing anything else. Security flaws? I've been using Windows for years (95, 98SE, and now XP) and I've only gotten adware due to downloads, no viruses, Trojans, etc.! It's the user's fault, unless he/she's a n00b. Then, and only then, can you blame MS Support. But support's a different thing.
Common sense, please!
Debugging? Klingons do not debug. Bugs are good for building character in the user.
This is a bad analogy, and would be more suitable for going after the power company for providing power to the computer to run with a virus on it.
On the other hand, what you will find in many places is that bartenders are often held liable for their patrons' actions after the fact, and I'm sure at some point or another people who hate drunk driving have gone after bartenders to accomodate this.
The key difference between a Programmer and a Senior Programmer is that one of them is Mexican.
An operating system is only as secure as the user who runs it. An email containing a virus sent to a someone who opens an attachment on a unix machine can be just a deadly as one sent to a Windows user. Any OS that allows a user to write to memory or to storage is unsecure. If more people had Macs or Linux, then there would be more virus writers comprimising those systems. Right now, it just doesn't pay to focus on those systems because the majority of machine in the internet are using the Windows OS. I haven't had a virus in years. I have made certain registry keys that are commonly targeted by virus and spyware programs read only to EVERYONE except a specific user that I don't use regularly. If I want to install a new piece of software on my machine, I have to log on as the more priveldged and install the software from there. It's not quite running "su -" and typing in roots password, but it's close.
Also, cars sometimes do burst into flames and then have to be recalled...just like there are bugs in windows and you sometimes have to install security updates
From the article:
I know of what I speak. I am not a novice. I've been using Macs almost daily for 15 years.
I thank him for admitting that he's biased. Why blame Windows? Could it have been something else? Do he bother to analyze the situation at all and determine the cause, other than figure that Windows + DSL = death?
One man's Funny is another man's Offtopic.
Since the only thing a virus needs to be a virus is the ability to spread itself, I think it would be very possible to create a virus for Mac OS X. What I would do is write a program that simply reads the user's address book and then uses Mail (or its own mail server) to send itself to everyone in the address book. This program wouldn't need to run as an elevated user or anything, so permissions wouldn't matter that much. The key to spreading it would be to have a spamer like approach to get this message in a number of Mac user's inboxes. I'm willing to be that there would be at least a small percent that would run it if the message was crafty enough. Voila! Mac virus. The only real difference between Mac and Windows with a virus like this is that on Windows you have a much greater chance of having more people run your program simply because of the larger user base. Don't get me wrong, I have a Mac and I enjoy using it, but it doesn't change the fact that numbers do play a large part in this.
SIGFAULT
One: Money. Macs (until very recently) are a cost prohibitive proposition.
Two: Ease of use. Linux was (until very recently) too hard for the average user to maintain and install.
Three: We *like* a monopoly. Flame away kids, bu its true. We like being able to share files. We like being able to share software (illegally, but nevertheless). We like speaking a common tongue. And yes, Linux could be that. But right now, its not.
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
You people are still buying their products! If this guy wanted to know why people are still supporting Microsoft, he should start with his own home.
Rather than sitting there watching the PC, which you've paid money for, crash due to an insecure OS, which you also (presumably) paid money for, you've created your own answer: You should have done the research, and purchased a susperior product to begin with!
Or, perhaps you should have done some research and learned what it means to put an unprotected Windows box on the Net these days. But that wouldn't be as much fun as just plugging in, and surfing, huh?
Which really is the problem in a nutshell: It's easier to just buy a generic Windows box than actually learn about what you're doing, and make an educated decision about whether or not to purchase Windows.
And it's funny... These people are buying something that does nothing but frustrate and piss them off, and then they go out and write about how much their experience sucks. Perhaps if you'd bought a Mac, or learned about Linux, or just investigated what would meet your needs the best, your experience would be better, and rather than complaining to the masses about how you've wasted your money and time, you'd be raving about your new-found treasure, rather than joining the whining, but still loyal masses of Windows users.
To be fair, Windows serves a purpose, but if you don't understand how to set it up, or you don't know about, or care about virii, and spyware related issues, then you shouldn't be running Windows. The given example's a perfect one: Plugging a Windows box directly into the Internet (via cable, DSL, or even dial-up) is just stupid. You're waving a flag that says "I'm stupid, and I have a Windows PC. Come and get me!". A firewall is a requirement in this situation (preferably hardware-based, but software one's are good to have also, just so you're aware of what kind of traffic's going in and outta your box), as is a decent, and updated virus scanner.
But whatever... People who do this deserve the damage they get. They also deserve to pay the prices they do to get their machine's cleaned up! A lot of my side work is cleaning up machines for people who can't be bothered with any sense of responsobility for their actions and computer. And these are the same people who will be calling me in a couple of months after they screw their boxes up again, and ask me to come over and do it again.
It's just annoying after awhile though... It's Darwinism at work on a virtual level. People get what they deserve, and I refuse to feel sorry for them.
Really I am
If you replaced windows with anything else, it would still be a problem. There is no foolproof way of stopping everything. Any OS with a majority market share will be a target.
Yes, this inludes the sainted linux as well. I used to hear people harp about the mozilla browser being so much more secure than IE. Now that Firefox is gaining market share, it too is becoming a target for all sorts of unpleasant cracks
If you really want to bitch and moan about poor internet security, then why don't you look at the ISPs. Why did it take so long for the 800 lb. gorilla of service providers, AOL, to offer free virus protection? Seeing how it is in their best interest and they are much better situated to push the latest updates to the users.
I've started to think there's something to Alter Slash and those people. Even if there's nothing wrong with the answer, but someone doesn't like it, they'll mod it down.
Wheel in the sky keeps on turnin'.
. . . it's not Windows. Or, at least, not entirely Windows. A PC that gets zombied within four minutes of connecting was connected through an ISP that allows incoming connections on Windows networking ports. That's not Windows' fault, that's the ISP's fault. Assuming the PC was brand new, it was sold without current patches already installed. That's not Windows' fault, that's the vendor's fault.
And as long as we blame Windows for things that are trivially easy for the folks actually responsible to fix, stuff like this will keep happening, and the internet will continue to suck.
(And yes, Windows sucks, too, and worse than most other things, but why should Microsoft bother to even try to fix it when they get blamed for stuff that isn't under their control?)
Wrong.
The computer didn't just up and die on its own. It was systematically attacked by OTHER COMPUTERS through the DSL network connection.
The original analogy that compared that to someone else hitting your car is accurate.
JHutch
Rolling on the floor lmao...
the masses have not stormed Redmond waving torches and scythes in anger
Yuppies in redmond don't know sh__t about farming. They just care where the next latte is coming from and what flavour.
Because despite what a lot of people want to believe, Linux still ain't ready for the desktop.
I didn't see the grandparent poster defending their formerly illegal monopolistic practices, or anything like that. In fact, they sound like they're in the same boat as I. I've been running Windows 2000 since it came out, and I moved onto Windows XP after w2k decided it didn't like my SATA drive. I've not had stability issues (or any others for that matter) with either of them.
For the most part, you'll be fine as long as you exercise some clue. Keep up to date on OS and application patches, run a good antivirus program, stay behind a firewall, and don't use insecure software (such as IE/Outlook); these procedures apply to all operating systems, and they've kept both my Windows and Linux computers running happily for years. I certainly don't consider myself to be a Microsoft apologist, though.
By the way - your analogy was terrible.
Is not windows. It's the users.
User fault number one: one simply cannot put a pc or any computer on the internet without a firewall anymore. Period. End of story.
User fault number two: Users have a responsibility to patch their machines. Patching is not going away - people are just unused to the notion that they have to "maintain" their PC's. Thus you get articles like the one just written. The response is indignation, because something Bad happened. The reason that something Bad happened was not the computer - it was the user's lack of attention to their computer.
User fault number three: not staying current with versions. This person is clearly not using the most up to date version of Windows as the Firewall provdided in SP2 would have protected the machine from external attack.
on walmart they see a 500$ laptop with linux.
That reminds me of an email I got the other day when I asked the user if she had MS Word. I'll paste it here:
"I have microsoft explorer xp, but don't think it's microsoft word. It's call word perfect."
If Linux or MAC were the dominant desktop, then people would be asking the same question about them. If you're the biggest target out there, then you're easier to hit. Think about it from the standpoint of the virus and worm writers. Why create a virus that's only going to affect 1% or 2% of the computers out there? Couple that with the ignorance of most people who own a computer and you have a veritable petri dish for viruses to exist and spread.
Wow! Where can I get this mythical operating system that can do all the work of the user and cannot be broken no matter how incompetent the owner!
And, if you say Linux, I'm just going to call you an idiot and point out that if you really think that, you probably never even used it.
Alito: A vote for Alito is a punch in the eye to put that bitch back in her place!
So this author goes on to exemplify the 'suckiness' of Windows XP by relating his experience one year ago??
After all, after his SO buys an iBook "in a year of solid use, she has yet to have a single problem."
XP had some serious flaws. Redmond pretty much ground to a halt and the OS was overhauled with security in mind. Pretty late in the game, but Windows doesn't quite suck that much anymore.
If the author could find a SP2 machine that gets owned, we'll talk.
If this was a "why Linux doesn't get popular" story, the same post would have been modded as -1, Troll. I know it because i've seen it.
Now can someone answer me why "Linux is counterintuitive and F'ing darn hard for the average Joe user" is +5 Insightful on a windows thread, but -1 Troll on a Linux thread?
And more important - WHEN will Linux become user-friendly?
Yes, Linux friendliness sucks. We all know that. But why nobody (who knows to program in Linux) does anything about it?
Many commercial Websites (such as banks, of all places!!!) still require Internet Exploder and refuse to interoperate with any other browser. So, if you must use those sites, you pretty much have to connect a Windows Computer to the Internet.
no operating system has reached perfection. Windows being the most popular system is the most targeted system. Why would someone write a virus or a worm that would attack few systems when you can attack many. Most people that use other operating systems are geeks who know how to repair their computer within moments of infection. The only way to do real damage is to attack the main stream users who only use their computers are typewritters and internet browsers. Most people wouldn't have a clue how to secure a computer no matter what OS is on it.
Don't you people think that if you don't get any spyware or virus on your Linux or Apple system is because it is not the primary target of the programmer who create those malwares? If linux/osx would be the primary OS used by the average user, it would be as full of shit as windows is. Ok, maybe not as full of shit, but there would be flaws since the possibilities of attacks would be greater... (ex : more third party software with crappy security)
I can see it now - him sitting across the room, her with a laptop on a table... then she reaches around the back of the table and saying "Now I'll try out the internet connection".
Slow motion... the guy throwing himself across the room as the hand with the RJ45 inexorably moves into place faster than he can arrive.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!
ALl you need to make it a great scene in a movie is for the laptop to shake, slide off the table, then explode in a huge fireball when it impacts the carpet as the guy knocks her out of the way.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
> I know Macs are (well, were) more expensive, even though they're really not,
Oh, really?
> when you finally jam that ugly cheapass Dell with enough video cards and sound cards and disk burners to make it comparable to a Mac that comes with all of it, standard.
I had to buy a Powerbook for school that cost me $2500. It has 512 megs of ram and an 80 gig drive. For about the same price I built a similarly-performing PC with 5.1 surround, a Radeon 9700 AIW, a 20" LCD monitor, 200 gigs of drive space, and an Athlon 2700 - and that was two years ago when all that stuff cost twice what it does now! Considering that non-laptop Apples cost just about as much as the portables, I really have to ask where this guy gets his PC parts. "Big Al's House of 1200% Markup?!"
I know he's writing an opinion piece and not hard journalism, but for #*&$'s sake...
The Mac really has few, if any, known viruses or major debilitating anything, no spyware and no Trojans and no worms, and sure I've been affected by a couple email bugs over the years, but those were mostly related to my mail server and ISP. For the most part and for all intents and purposes, Macs are immune. Period.
Viruses, trojans, and spyware don't need security holes to work. All they need are careless users. Based on this guys attitude I would guess Mac users are pretty immune and probably careless.
'Same speed C but faster'
The difference here is that thousands of people out there aren't making things to purposefully destroy the car you just bought. This is the case with Windows. I'm not excusing Windows' security holes, but relating it to a car is just silly. If 100 people waited off the lot to carjack you, or throw grenades at you, then sure, I can see the similarity. You think car manufacturers should install every car with unbreakable glass so a car jacker can't shoot you and take your car for a joyride?
it's not like the vendors don't have a choice.
The vendors could pre-install it, or not ship Windows at all. Not much of a choice.
I've run NT4, Win2K, and WinXP as my desktop for many years and I've never had a single virus/trojan/malware etc.
In my whole family, including SO's, we have only had 1 such event.
For myself, I mostly use open-source software (which in my experience is always 100% safe and trustworthy), and I respond NO to every prompt while browsing (with Moz/Firefox only).
Correct me if I'm wrong, but (barring big security holes) you can't actually get one of these nasties passively. I mean that you must run something on your computer, or give an ActiveX control permission, or something like that, right? You're not going to get one of these things just from browsing HTML and Javascript.
I know that many people have more trouble than I do, but I think that articles like this one (which says that four minutes after connecting your Windows PC to the internet it will melt down) are basically FUD.
People are used to things sucking, and hence aren't disturbed by it.
They think it's normal.
People are also used to Windows features and applications, and find switching to something else too traumatic.
And then, people sometimes need windows. No tax software for Linux, etc, there are a lot of needs for which there is a Windows app to fill them, but no Linux app.
Just because it CAN be done, doesn't mean it should!
Windows: Looks spiffy, easy to use, breaks down, but there are lots of highways to drive it on and lots of options and upgrades. Linux: Looks spiffy, the steering wheel is in the backseat, drives great, the 2-lane highways have no shoulders, and has few options with few upgrades. You get what you pay for. Everything is proprietarily open, meaning its Linux, but what "flavor" of Linux? Macintosh: Better known as Macintrash, looks pretty, has reliable hardware, when it breaks down, you take out a loan to fix it. Shares the highways with others, but sometimes cuts off Linux to catch up to Microsoft.
-- Game Developers: Stop porting badly-textured games from crappy console systems!
A large proportion of people don't take an in-depth interest in material pocessions, technology etc, and therefore, are not (alas) qualified to sort the lemons from the cherries. And just as most of us /.ers probably don't pay much attention to mature literature, day to day politics and a few other 'boring' subjects that we are probably not (all) qualified to comment on, the general public just assume (trust!) what they are buying will work. The mind boggles at what would happen if cars were as unreliable as computers. But then there are life or death safety concerns in that market. Either way, there are one or two yet to be revealed to the public 'products' in development that will offer an alternative to Windows. Mac OS-X or Linux Desktop offerings while cool in certain ways, are not significantly different than XP to offer an alternative. Anything that is to unseat MS will need to be both radical and cost effective in the long run. Using the iPod as an example, when launched it may have seemed expensive, but it was only twice the price of the alternative Flash based players, yet stored 20 times as much music. Any new OS will need to be that much better than Windows. Thoughts?
O'WONDERWe're working on it.
There are reasons why products copy another, but they all revolve around "success". Remember when the original iMac came out? Suddenly EVERYTHING came in fruity colors...from power strips to toasters and I believe even the George Forman grill. The reason Explorer is copied is because of it's success in penetrating practically every computer on the planet. Show the masses how similar your product is (thus, not scaring them away with having to learn a whole new way of doing things) and eventually you'll pull some people over.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts...for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang
they don't move because all of the problems are seen as a 'normal' part of computer ownership. We have stable systems here because we are carefull and don't buy crap hardware or crap software, but lots of people buy stuff that is crap hopeing to save a dollar and end up with driver problems etc, not always MS-bugs, just bugs that you get because you have Windows. Same with virii, MS doesnt make them, it just attracts them, but good firewall, which Mac and Linux have as standard, and a lot of problems stop.
There was an unknown error in the submission.
I have three systems at home:
Desktop: Windows XP Home + SP2
Laptop: Windows 2000 Pro + SP4
Server: Fedora Core 3
Both Windows machines are stable, virus, spyware and hacker free. Windows 2000 has given me no trouble at all. Windows XP has had a few issues caused by third party drivers. Windows update keeps everything current.
FC3 is a great system, but it's a Windows world. There is a fair amount I simply can't do because I don't have DirectX, Windows Media Player, Quicktime, or one of many other Windows only (or non-Linux) applications.
The only time I was ever hacked was on Linux (an unprotected Red Hat 6.2 box back in 2000)
Classic MacOS is as (un)stable as Windows 98. MacOS X is quite nice, but my experience is that the hardware and software support still isn't there.
A $20 router/firewall is all you need to protect you long enough to get Windows patched. The bots are fairly dumb and easily stopped. Ad-aware and AVG free edition protect from spyware and viruses. Using Firefox over Internet Exploiter eliminates the browser hijacks.
The biggest problem with Windows is that Microsoft gave a very powerful OS to Joe Servicepack who has NO CLUE how to get it stable and keep it stable.
The Mac has great driver support now, there's almost nothing you can get anymore that does not offer support for the Mac. I can't even think of printers anymore that do not offer Mac support, and they are typically the last line of devices to fold.
As for software, what kind of "general, mainstream" software do people use besides a browser and a word processor? Most games now are on consoles. The Mac mini even ships with Quicken.
Especially for someone buying a new computer, there just are no compelling reasons against choosing a Mac at this point. Even if the other computer is a PC.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Windows PC's are cheaper than Macs. Most stores don't publicize their Linux based PC's (that is if they even have any). Somebody buys a PC and it already has Windows. They don't care if it sucks. If something goes wrong, they'll just have Windows reloaded again. If someone were to offer to load Linux on instead, they'd still probably stick to Windows with the mentality that "well, Windows will work like new, and either way, I lose my data".
If not the writer of the article, then at least the DSL service provider should have added some not-very-fine print in their installation instructions, and possibly an appropriate service pack CD, to make sure that their new customer didn't instantly become a participant in the big ongoing worm/virus/spyware propagation chain.
Next to the user, the DSL service provider takes the biggest hit to their productivity when someone on their network gets their machine corrupted - you'd think they would take some precautions.
Less is more.
Unfortunately, there is no $50 NAT router that supports dialup connections, which many people still use. If you want one that works with a modem expect to spend around $300 assuming you already have an external modem handy.
Connect directly to the internet. Never use a NAT router, they're way too expensive.
Always use Internet Explorer. Firefox is too usable and has too many features anyway.
Run all obscure *.exe's that you get from spam email or file sharing.
For 97 percent of users in the world, Macs would be a more elegant and intuitive and appealing solution. Period.
so... explain to me why 97 percent of users are NOT on macs? look. i use both a windows pc and i own a powerbook. they both do their job well. and it has its own specific use. but until i can play a game like oh, madden 2005 on a mac, well, the sheer flexibility that a PC offers gets my money. and yes, i upkeep it and maintain it.
thousands of glorious iPods have already infiltrated the Microsoft campus up in Redmond, causing MS management no end of humiliation and frustration. Can revolution be far behind?
honestly, this guy's use of adjectives is sickening. to me, his journalistic integrity (for a columnist anyway) went out the door...
she promptly dumped the useless hunk of sad landfill and bought herself a beautiful new iBook.
i rest my case. ugh.
Get him! He's breaking the hegemony!
When you tried to do this, companies would say that you needed to contact Microsoft for the refund. Microsoft would say you needed to contact the computer seller. Once you finished running around in circles, you found out that it only cost the manufacturer about $1.00 to put the copy of Windows on that machine, and that's what you'd have refunded to you.
Of course, if you needed to get Windows back on the machine, now you'd have to pay the $180 for a full copy of it, because you had to return any and all materials from your computer purchase in order to get your dollar back.
Of course, if you managed to convince the manufacturer to sell you a computer without an operating system pre-installed, you had to pay an extra $10-$50 for that choice. Why? In order to be sure the computer worked in the first place, they had to install Windows to test the peripherals and other devices! Oh, did you want warranty support too? Sorry. "We don't support other operating systems."
The whole pre-installation thing was pure genius on the part of Microsoft's marketing department.
OCO is Loco
Actually we are seeing an unprecedented migration of people to Linux and Macs. I only know two people who are still using Windows and both keep begging me to help them rid their infested machines of viruses.
This just shows how uninformed the author is. I know he is trying to be funny, but he shoots himself in the foot by referring to multiple video and sound cards - even if it is sarcasm, it's not funny or informative.
Truth is, I can buy an ugly cheap ass Dell - it will have a super fast CPU and a big hard drive - and spend under $500 for it and, in some cases, may come with an LCD monitor. Sure, if I want to play some games, I'd have to plop a better video card in that budget level machine, pushing it up to maybe $1000 if I bought a really nice card and doubled the ram.
So, if I may ask, when did a Mac EVER come standard with gaming-level video for $1000?
I'm the senior tech for a small OEM. Unlike Dell et al, we custom build our computers. There is no production line, there is no "master model image", none of that. Each computer is tailored to each customer's requirements, and as such, we can take the time to make sure the machine is fully patched before it leaves.
I can set a brand new computer on our network behind our firewall, download every single patch, make sure a software firewall is on, make sure an antivirus product is installed and updated, and make sure the main user for the machine is a standard user (not power user or admin).
Despite having done all that, a non-trivial number of our new machines will be infected with some virus or some spyware within 6 months of delivery. Whether this is because the user elivated themselves to power user or administrator in order to use some piece of software that doesn't play nice with the Windows "security" model, or whether they've been infected with something that made use of a vulnerability in a LOCAL_SYSTEM process, they still get it.
No matter what happened, I have, do, and will for the forseeable future blame Microsoft. Apple had (and still has) the right idea. If Apple had ruled the roost, chances are we would by now see computers as household appliances, instead of some freakish pile of hardware that requires the trained likes of me to keep in an operable condition. Microsoft set the computing idustry back a decade with its shenanahgens, and the article author was spot on with his observations as such.
Don't leave us in suspense: what are the exploits?
there might be a smidge more to it than that-
the article is originally in the S.F. Guardian- a weekly paper along the lines of the L.A. Weekly, the Santa Fe Reporter, the Willamette Week, or whatever your local weekly is (note they all have the same looking back page of ads?)
ANYWAY- the point is this *isn't* wired magazine; it isn't in anything geared toward a high-tech or 'in the know' audience... it's in a regular weekly rag read by tens of thousands normal folks commuting to work or with their morning coffee
it's pieces like that that change attitudes... some mid-manegerial type will be reading that on his bart train into the city, and will stick it on the photocopier, and give the copy to his IT manager with a sticky note on it that says "wadda you reckon?"
i'm not talking overnight change, but these are the kinds of things that start the ball rolling
okay, so I'm not typically one to defend MS's stance on security, or patches, or their 'make good software the first time' approach to good software...but seriously, what kind of network are you attaching to that you get to the point of "drown[ing] in a sea of viruses and worms after only 4 minutes" ?! Are you that inept at operating your PC and immediately start surfing pr0n sites and the like? Did Windows Update's website attack you with viruses and worms (no irony intended)?
I have a cable modem and see maybe one worm an hour on an average day, maybe two to four...I'd say you have a much better chance of getting scanned by someone looking for vulnerable machines...but you didn't mention that threat at all...
I always suspected that my students' love of Linux was more a pose than a genuine belief in Linux's superiority to other operating systems. I teach online journalism and many of my students are fashionably anti-Microsoft. But none of them can ever tell me what is so special about Linux without delivering what sounds like a rehearsed speech on Linux's 'challenge to the norms of capitalism' and its 'usurpation of the profit system' (the word 'profit' always said in a tone that suggests it's the worst thing any man, woman or beast could ever pursue). But what about usability, clarity, simplicity - does Linux have any of these virtues? Who knows...but at least it's doing its bit to 'smash the system'. In an article on spiked, technology writer Fiona Harvey challenges the notion that Linux is a rebellious political movement for the new millennium, and gets down to the nuts and bolts: 'The real problem with Linux is that it is quite, quite unusable. Unless you have a higher degree in computer science, forget it. Do you know whether you should run Yellow Dog or WINE on an Intel processor? Do you want to? And the reason it is so impossible to use is that the people who write Linux don't have to care about whether ordinary Joes can use it. They write only for each other, trying to gain propellerhead kudos with their new "updates to the kernel" or twiddles to PostgreSQL. If you can't keep up, you're not worthy to use Linux.' The end result? Snobbery. 'For all their insistence on the openness of Linux, for all their revelling in their underground status, these Linux people are actually a bunch of snobs', writes Harvey. 'Far from bringing openness and cooperation to the world of IT, Linux enthusiasts want to keep it as closed as possible - while collecting lavish praise from half-baked anti-capitalists - so they can carry on feeling self-important. After all, if these geeks could write real software, they'd be working for a proper company. Like Microsoft.' Now that should kick off a heated debate with my students.
Here is your brand new car, sir. Drive it off the lot. Yay yay new car. Suddenly, new car shuts off. New car barely starts again and then only goes about 6 miles per hour and it belches smoke and every warning light on the dashboard is blinking on and off and the tires are screaming and the heater is blasting your feet and something smells like burned hair. You hobble back to the dealer, who only says, gosh, sorry, we thought you knew -- that's they way they all run. Enjoy!
There's just one thing the dealer in the metaphor didn't say - if you get on the road without putting paneling and windshields on the car, everyone will try to play bumper cars with you - and the gas tank is your bumper.
If he let his SO connect to the Internet on DSL (or cable, or in any way), regardless of the operating system, there should be massive revolt against him. If he wasn't on that connection, what is his setup like?
I have 1 million monkeys on a million year contract to make me a better sig.
Right, OTHER COMPUTERS all infected due to Microsoft security flaws. It was infected because the software installed on it DOESN'T WORK like it should. I find it remarkable that people have such low expectations of software that they are willing to defend such a situation by blaming the user. Not everyone is a slashdot reading geek (for which we should be extremely grateful.)
The original analogy that compared that to someone else hitting your car is accurate.Maybe, if within 4 minutes of pulling out of the driveway and parking beside the curb on a safe street, you could expect to get hit by dozens of cars because you forgot to purchase and install the extra bonus safety reflectors that the dealer neglected to tell you about. Try again.
They don't care
;)
I disagree. My dad, my cousin, and a friend of the family have all called me over the last 2 months to "fix their computer". The fact is they do care, but don't have the know-how or initiative to learn the ins-and-outs of computers.
The general public see computers as something they will never know enough about and are thus reserved to accepting what comes on their pc when they buy it - windows with IE - while accepting the virus, pop-ups, etc. as just a part of their computing life.
And do not go and say most people are lazy and they should get some initiative. That's crap. Most people know how to read, but most people haven't read good classics like Les Miserables or the Brothers Karamzov. It's not because they are not good books and people wouldn't enjoy them if they did, but because they *see them* as huge 1500 page, hard to read barriers, when in actuality it's no different than reading LOTR in 3 books.
...back to the issue: Help your friends and your family. When they have a problem, give them a free anti-vir, Firebird, Thunderbird, 7-zip, or whatever the problem calls for. For some it may very well mean installing Linux or convincing them to get a Mac.
"...but joe twelvepack doesn't use his computer for anything that he can't do without"
And yes, my dad get's really pissed when his Internet goes out. So it is something he can live without, but it's not something he likes going without when he expects it to "just work and paying [his isp] for it".
Give them a break. Give me a break. And stop being so damn harsh. Please
Personally, and I don't think I'm alone on this, I know all desktop operating systems suck.
I honestly believe that NO ONE can say that XP, OSX, or a Linux 2.6 system is, from a use ability standpoint, a better system than another for desktop use, considering system security, stability, and general use. They ALL have horrible issues.
How many machines do you know, that runs Windows XP, that has more malicious processes running than the number of software patent lawsuits filed today? I know several people that have cancelled their DSL connections and gone back to using paper, from this very problem.They buy an overpriced laptop/desktop at a local retail outlet, 6 months later, try to return it b/c it won't respond. So they just give up. It's disgusting that so many persons experiences are like this. Granted some pay to have their systems cleaned up, but most XP Home owners spend 99% of their computer experience, owned by adware.
To shorten this: Linux, hardware compat/general use/software installation/lack of standardization(not saying it NEEDS it, but it holds SW installation back a bit)/games/and I think... too many separate projects(if there was more mass efforts into 1 or 5 apps, instead of chicken scratch efforts into 37 things would be better)
OSX: I'll stick my foot in my mouth on this one. Not that it doesn't have problems, but I last used Mac OS X a good while back and can't remember the details.... all I remember is swearing a lot. But games suck here too.
What do I have to do to get a sig around here?! www.bearscanfly.org
"Why Does Windows Still Suck?
So why not ask this question about Linux? I mean, if it doesn't suck, then why is there a small fraction of people using it?
"Derp de derp."
Seriously, come on. I know I'll be marked a troll for this, but I think the originator of this story is himself a troll. Yeah, let's all get rallied against microsoft because they've made the most popular OS in existence on the commercial market, and because of this, exploits are aimed at them. You shouldn't be taking a look at why people stay with Windows, but whats wrong with Mac and Linux that people won't use them in as large numbers as do Windows. I am and have been a Windows user for many years, but I grew up with macs at elementary school, and with various people I come in contact with, and did work with linux on one of our Office PCs over the summer. I'll help you out by giving you my reasons. First, against mac, I know it sounds weird but the display is just TOO pretty. I think it's artsy and I think that's annoying. I don't need my cursor spinning rainbows when I'm checking the news. I do however think Mac has ground to cover, that it is covering well, in the Audio and Video realms. Linux to me is simply a nightmare. And I'm very tech savvy. The fifteen minute boot up is enough to drive any person used to windows or mac insane. And beyond that, I just find it boring. Plus it is extremely difficult to integrate with the many popular things that computer users today want(I'm not saying that no one ports to linux, but it's not standard). And I've got a problem with the whole open-source thing with Linux. Sure it's fine if it's something like firefox, my trusty web browser, I can cope with mistakes from that(for instance, occasionally, only firefox does this, when I load the /. website I get redirected to mcdonalds) I trust a company I've paid money for my software that pays it's employees, and can be held accountable for their mistakes, like Microsoft. I know that if there's a coked out coder writing some system critical function for my latest version of Windows happens to write something that will crash my system while I'm performing extremely important processes, it's much more likely that will be caught, fixed, and the person ejected before the product is finished. In Linux, the users are subject to these dangers, and must report them themselves. This happens more often in Linux, again, not saying it doesn't happen in Windows. At least, thats my impression of it from what I've seen. That can be another problem, being misinformed.
Microsoft does have larger publicity of problems, but they ARE the most popular. If Linux or Mac were the most popular, I guarantee they'd have the same virus epidemics in their alternative existence that windows does in actuality.
This sig is o Unfunny o Funny
My Thinkpad laptop has Win XP Pro on it and every time I connect it to the internet with XP, it begins downloading and uploading lots of megabytes so that there is not much bandwidth left over for my use. I know it doesn't have a virus, though, because Norton AV says there aren't any when I run it. No spyware either thanks to spybot 1.31TX S&D. So...I think its just Bill Gates and the BSA checking out my machine to make sure it's okay. Thanks for caring, guys.
Wouldn't it suck if the car were to unconditionally burst into flames unless you were sure to also purchase an extra $1000 in "safety features" and have them installed perfectly before ever attempting to drive it?
You mean like how Congress mandated Trains come with air brakes back in the 19th century?
Or how cars have to come with seatbelts and airbags?
I think you need a new analogy.
The poor clueless users who buy a Windows PC are the same people who voted for Bush. They'll beleive anything if ya' scare them enough.
Terror! Terror! == Expensive! Expensive!
I don't like big words..., does that make me anti-semantic?
Nice to see some nice, well-balanced journalism. Let's not get into yet another OS flamewar here. This shouldn't be about "why windows sucks" or "how Linux r0x0rs j00 allz."
;)
There needs to be some serious introspection about this entire subject. Why HASN'T Linux taken over if it's so great? Well, that's a loaded question. Linux IS starting to take over -- in the server market. It's displacing Unix, not Windows Servers, however.
The quick answer why Linux has not taken off as a Desktop OS is because it is truly not ready yet. As a server platform? It's awesome! As a desktop solution? A lot more work needs to be done.
I know that the crown jewel of open source Linux and its various distros is so that anyone can have any flavor they want for any given specialized task. That's Great! I don't think that should change. What should change, however, is the implementation of Standards. Make sure all apps will work in all distros without needing to recompile. Standardize locations of config files! Make it easy for developers to write software once and be absolutely certain that it will run in any flavor of Linux.
Is it really that hard to accomplish? No, it's not. People just need to set aside their egos and pet projects and learn to work together. Cooperation and standards is what will truly set the open source movement into the mainstream.
Why hasn't OSX taken over in the desktop arena? All the Mac fanboys rave about it all the time. One reason Macs are not as popular as PCs is because they are seen as too expensive -- luxury items -- and the perception is that only slacker artists use Macs (I know, it's a contradiction... expensive slacker tools, but it doesn't matter, we're talking about PERCEPTION).
The main reason, I believe, that offices and homes are not crawling with Macs is because of closed source hardware! People, especially businesses, don't want to be locked in to a single vendor for anything. Purchasing departments look around the web using Froogle and Bensbargains.net to find the lowest price computer and components. If a Mac costs two times that of a seemingly comparable PC, why would they buy the Mac? Just because some fan boy tells them it's better?
It's ironic because Linux and Macs are on the complete opposite spectrums and yet they're both unsuccessful as desktop OSes. Linux is so open, there are no real cross-distro standards, MacOS is so closed that the standards stifle expansion.
Windows is somewhere in between the two and I think that's really why it has been so successful. (Go ahead, begin your flames.)
The author of the article is clearly a Mac evangelist. Also, the author of the article is clearly an idiot for allowing his SO to put an unpatched box on the net without so much as a firewall in between. He asks if you would buy a car that failed miserably shortly after you drove it off the lot. Bad analogy. If you maintain your pc - apply security patches, maintain good practices, Windows works very well. Likewise, if you never change the oil in your car, it's going to croak after 10k miles. If you put an unpatched Linux box out on the net, you'd be owned inside of a week. The author has been enjoying the fruits of security through obscurity -- that doesn't work if everyone had a Mac. If everyone had a Mac, you'd hear all day long about how Macs were full of security holes, viruses and spyware.
bance.net
The biggest reason for me is Games.. None of the games I play are available on MAC or Linux at this point. I have secondary PCs I mess with with Linux on them but my "gaming rig" is Windows based and will most likely continue to be until all games I want to play can be played natively on Linux.
Viruses and worms are designed to do harm or cause death by actively exploiting flaws in the operating system.
Automobiles aren't. Even beer is intended for moderate use. Drunk drivers are the result of bad decisions on the drivers, not intentions on the part of auto manufacturers and beer-makers. Drunk drivers aren't exploiting flaws in the automobile; they're exploiting flaws in human stupidity.
More and more people are relying on consoles for the primary source of games.
It's so much easier, and more convienient...
Besides WOW runs on the Mac. Need anything else?
Your life is a lot more pleasant when you switch to consoles to support a gaming habit. Sure I missed HL 2, but then if you only have a PC you missed Halo 2. And you know HL 2 will eventually be out for the consoles - with keyboard and mouse support so you can have the full experience. Also you'll probably not have to buy a new video card for the console when it does arrive.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
A:Because they are too busy soundbiting to bother.
To take the anecdotal situation with your SO and blow it up into a diatribe against windows is inane. Perhaps he should compile a larger data set before making such overarching pronouncements. Take a look out there on the web and you will find tons of sites with Mac users lamenting the hellishly complicated chaos that results when something does go wrong with their machines. I have a Mac and have friends with Macs and everyone I know has problems. I don't use my Mac anymore since Apple dumps support for anything over a year or two old forcing you into an expensive upgrade pattern with their overpriced crappy machines and half-assed pretty software. I run a Windows box with no anti-virus and a cable-modem and have had no problems of the kind mentioned. I hate Microsoft as a company and am not fan of their products but this story is just plain bullshit hype with no content. Of course anyone who things that the iPod, bringing us back to the sound quality of the 8-Track, is that great probably mistakes fads and hype for content. I would say he's lucky that he has a lazy editor but the truth of the matter is that journalism in this country sucks beyond belief. Just hype and bullshit. Way to be on the team adding to the media sewer.
Disclaimer, I use M$FT products only because my job requires it. In my spare time I surf the net on an Ultra 10 through Hotjava......
Hey, you think your house is cool?
If everyone jumped to Linux the hackers and attackers will as well. Those virus writers are ust frustrated, impotent coders. Want to show off how great a coder you are? Write an enterprise suite of business applications.
Microsoft may be evil and windows may be shot full of holes, but it's at least better than the alternatives.
I can A: switch to macintosh, which means that I get a user friendly interface that can't run any of the programs I want.
or
I can B: switch to Linux, which means that I get an overly complicated desktop operating system that I have to spend hours just to install a simple piece of software. I don't get to run any of the sofwtare that I like (and btw, I don't like the GPL alternatives, they lack polish), and say goodbye to gaming.
or
I can C: install a personal firewall, stop running IE / Outlook and viola, problems solved. I get my software, I get my games.
Too bad no one sells hardware firewalls because they are too expensive. Those inexpensive routers are not hardware firewalls. Open one up sometime and you will see a flash memory chip, some RAM, and a CPU (often ARM or MIPS). In other words, that "hardware firewall" is just a low end computer running it's own OS (typically Linux or BSD). There are some ASIC accelerated firewalls but those are still software based. A true hardware firewall would require fabricating new chips (expensive) every time you wanted to change the configuration which is not practical.
I run a support company for home users and I see these spyware adware problems 4-5 times a day. Microsoft ARE at fault here, even without the patches XP shouldn't just let outside entities get into their PC's and change their registry around, not without some sort of popup asking for permission. MS have a long way to go and are taking way too long to sort this out.
The current major problem is that a clean installation of Windows XP can actually become seriously infected before the user has a chance to install certain major security fixes. This is very troubling for a lot of people.... The (annoying) workaround is to get the security fix onto the box before connecting it to the Internet, but this requires having the fix ready to go on a CD or other media.
Certainly not to say that this couldn't happen with a clean Linux installation, but I don't know of any problems quite like the one that affects Windows.
I don't care, but don't let that stop you from trying to tell me anyway.
I love this article. Genius. Well written and an excellent point proven.
I have three XP SP2 boxes at home. Had Cable, now have DSL, both behind your standard Linksys router/firewall. I have never had a virus on any of them. Spyware? Rarely. But even that is practically non-existent now that we run Firefox on all of them. Anyone running on a broadband connection without a hardware firewall is a fool. I don't care what OS they run.
Windows still sucks because it was rebooted an hour ago. It's still sucking the pixies first album here.
http://eika.no-ip.info
Mod me a troll, but the simple answer is that Windows doesn't suck. Putting an unpatched machine on raw DSL connections sucks. Kind of like not wearing your safety goggles when you weld sucks. Hello! Get a clue! There are people out there who don't like you and want to trash your machine. Get over it, spend $29 on a NAT router and then load your patches and AV. That's not hard. Never has been.
oh dear- too much slashdot-- i've been reading the comments on this article for a while, and it took yours to figure out what "SO" meant-- maybe it's time to stop reading slashdot for a day or two
In 2000 my uncle was getting ready to buy a new computer, because his bargain basement Windows box had once again died on him. He had already spent more money on repairs than the initial cost of the machine, and he was sick of it. Knowing that I use Linux, Mac, and Windows boxes, he asked me for a recommendation.
My advice was for him to buy a beige G3 from one of my buddies who was getting ready to upgrade to a G4. All my uncle needed was Office, email, and a web browser. He looked at the machine, played with it for a bit, liked what he saw, and ended up going with a Windows machine. His rationale was that he was concerned that he wouldn't be able to share files with all of the Windows users out there.
The dominance of Windows made him believe that there are two incompatible universes - one that runs Windows, and a much smaller one that runs Macintosh and Linux. Crossing between universes was not permitted.
After that machine died, and the next Windows machine died, he came to me again. He was so tired of having to screw around with viruses, service packs and so on that he said it really didn't matter if he couldn't communicate with "The Windows World".
I gave him my G3 iBook, which I'd already used for two solid years without any problems. He immediately fell in love with it, and was amazed by the lack of compatibility issues. He tells me every time I see him how much easier it is when you can simply use the computer, rather than service the computer then use it.
The amazing thing to me about this story is that it took him four years to break with Microsoft, even after we'd had countless conversations, even though he knew I worked with computers for a living, and even though he truly hated Microsoft.
My uncle is no idiot. To me he is representative of the larger group of computer users who have been told that Microsoft is the only way to go for so long that they simply don't believe there are other, less painful options.
Read the EFF's Fair Use FAQ
What the fuck is that supposed to me? I mean, really.
Wheel in the sky keeps on turnin'.
No duh pre-installing Windows on computers is a huge advantage, but it's not like the vendors don't have a choice.
This article says otherwise.
Some history.
That's why. We have an agreement with IBM to use their hardware (golf course agreement - we send them biz, they send us biz) and for the most part I like it. I think their blade and 44X servers are GREAT.
However, they have subtle differences with each set of machines that come off the production line. You can buy 4 servers at the same time and each will be a LITTLE different. Linux doesn't care. We use the same image with blades that we use with 345s that we use with 445s - no sweat.
BUT, with Windows, 2 blades (or whatever) require totally different drivers to be installed. My team can image (literally) tens (and probably 100-200, although we haven't tested that) of servers at once - using Linux in about a day. Windows - won't work, the requirements for the OS to have just the RIGHT driver for each server is a bloody NIGHTMARE.
Another issue is access. A lot of applications with Windows seem to need admin equivalent access and then want that ongoing to change anything. This means a lot of people need a LOT more access than we want to give out! With *nix, we've managed to use sudo and scripts to keep those boxes better locked down.
Otherwise, to be frank, I don't give a r@ts ass one way or the other. I simply line Linux b/c it works. If we could get past the image issue, I could probably live with Windows (and just suck it up WRT access).
Computer Science is Applied Philosophy
Not a very accurate analogy. Wouldn't it suck if the car were to unconditionally burst into flames unless you were sure to also purchase an extra $1000 in "safety features" and have them installed perfectly before ever attempting to drive it? (And without the dealer actually telling you this.)
Um, what? I got my sp2 disk in the mail free. That's all I've ever needed to keep everything out. Fantastically bad analogy.
Once during spring break, we drove to Chicago.
Half way there, one of the tires blew out. We stopped at a truck stop, and was able to get a new tire. I asked the mechanic what happened to the old one and he replied "Low air pressure."
So I asked my friend, "How often do you check the pressure in your tires?"
I got a blank stare.
We immediately went over to the gas station, I went inside and bought an air pressure tester and put a couple of quarters in the air pump station to fill up the rest of the tires... which were all down around 15 psi.
The morale of the story... Cars require certain care and maintenance. Why do you assume computers don't? Even a Mac or Linux machine is going to require maintenance.
The only computer that I ever had which did not, was my VIC-20. The OS was in ROM, and I never connected it to a network. We could move back to that paradigm, if you are afraid of maintenance.
OK, honestly, I've NEVER owned a Windows machine. I run OSX. I can't say I've never had a crash or lost information I was working on but it's no exaggeration of the facts that in 4 years of running OS X I've had about 5 complete system freezes.
In every case I was running Virtual PC or Windows Media Player or Office or any combination of the above. I know MS didn't invent Virtual PC but there must be something stinkin' about their code, it just can't be a coincidence.
Event Type: Information
Event Source: EventLog
Event Category: None
Event ID: 6013
Date: 2/4/2005
Time: 12:00:00 PM
User: N/A
Computer: NOYUO!
Description:
The system uptime is 14221937 seconds.
That's about 164 days. Last time I got a virus or spyware or malware or anything else even remotely malicious, was in 1991. I was a college kid and ignorant of the matters of computer security. I infected all my 5.25" floppies with the Michelangelo virus.
As for the never ending flaws... Every OS has flaws! How often is Apple patching OS X? (I have a 12" PowerBook BTW.) About every month? The MS's patching cycle is also a month! Linux, and various Linux components are being patched constantly. This has nothing to do with the number or severity of the flaws, because they are everywhere.
Windows flaws are being exploited a lot more because it is (drumroll) the most prolific desktop OS being used by computer-skill- challenged people all over the World! But you knew this already.
Writing secure code is hard. A function coded in, say, C++ may look perfectly sound when the source code is analyzed. But once compiled, and made a part of a much larger app, it may exhibit faulty behavior that can be exploited to inject arbitrary code into the application. This happens all the time, to MS, to open source programmers, to Apple, hell serious flaws have just been found in Oracle DB software.
Firefox has had a number of VERY serious flaws that could have been used to exploit computers, but haven't. Because no one would bother due to the fact that IE is a lot more popular. And the fact that people running alternative browsers are usually more savvy and would know what to do to keep their boxes secure. And it is my belief that another often overlooked reason exists. People who are doing the exploiting, hackers if you wish, are themselves fans of the open source software, namely Linux and OSS browsers and office apps. They don't WANT to exploit their precioussss.
Keep a Windows box patched, get a firewall, install an AV program, don't install "free" programs that you've downloaded off P2P networks or warez sites, and don't muck with your IE security settings unless you know exactly what you are doing. I routinely use IE to visit sites that are chock full of malware (cough pr0n, cough) and have never gotten IE exploited by anyone. Ever. Read that again, for best effect.
And for heaven's sake, log in as a User, not as an Administrator. Would you use a Linux box while logged in as root all the time? I didn't think so! Most home Windows users should not even have any sort of admin access to their machine. They wouldn't know what to do with it anyway. They should find someone who's computer savvy, in their family or circle of friends, and have them admin the computer.
It comes down to this. If you know what you are doing, you can keep your box safe regardless of the OS. Most Windows users are newbs who don't know what the F (shut yo' mouth!) they are doing so they get hacked. It isn't OSs fault. What can MS do? Deny people the ability to make their user accounts Administrators? Lock down security and break a bunch of stuff? Force OS updates on everyone with no way to turn them off? They can't do that. Imagine the headlines and the lawsuits!
I'm a power user. And I have yet to suffer a single debilitating virus or worm or spyware or malware whatsoever. Not one problem in 10 years, save the time I spilled water in the keyboard of my desktop and I took a ahirdryer to it and let it dry out for two days and it worked perfectly.
It's true I have never had a major debilitating virus. Why? BECAUSE IM SMRT. Err. smart.
No Really it's becasue (as my father is so fond of saying) "PAY ATTENTION" if an activex control looks odd I dont run it, if a program seems like it might be bad news, I don't run it. I have always had a firewall and anti-viral software (but have gone YEARS with out it besides periodic installs to make sure im clean with NO viruses). I update windows regularly and I know whats happening in the computer security world. It is true I am no an infosec proffesional but I wasnt always (I just graduated). These steps arent hard, but you do need to devote a little bit of effort (say 30 mins a week) and give your fair share of ue dilligence to not run shady apps.
It's not hard.
There's too many people who are "comfortable" enough with what they've got. I've got a friend who's not willing to try anything other than Windows because he knows how to use Windows. He complains about the crashing and bugs and all, but he doesn't want to have to learn a new system. And avoiding that inconvenience is more important to him than getting a better quality product.
There's also the public image issue. Everyone knows about Windows. Mac still has a stigma of being prone to crashing and annoying users with all those old "Are you rally sure you were really sure you wanted to click that yes you truely indeed did want do do that?" dialog boxes. You and I know those issues are no longer things to worry about, at least they're far smaller bothers than they once were, but the mass public doesn't know that, and they aren't willing to even have a look to find out, much like so many slashdotters here are unwilling to fairly evaluate AmigaOS4 last week or so what that article came up. The mass public echoes your "Amiga is dead!" chants only they point it at Mac instead, or point chants about "What can *I* possibly use Linux for?!" at the Linux crowd.
Linux has other public image issues to work though. Things like "It's hard to install or use" have been addressed reasonably well, but the public again isn't willing to discover that to be true. Linux also has the old reputation of having no applications or games or stuff normal people would use. I know many people that cannot fathom what in the world I could possibly use Linux or AmigaOS for, yet are unwilling to be shown all the everyday applications like OpenOffice, Mozilla, Doom3, Unral Tournament, etc. that exist for Linux or AmigaOS equivalents for many things, and insist on continuing in their incorrect belief that such apps and games do not and CAN NOT exist outside of Windows. Even though the Mac crashes chants are obsolete and Windows has the same reputation, the masses are not willing to bother with reasoning.
The fact that MS pretty much looks like it IS the somputer software industry also has a great hold on users. There are lots who simply believe that since they are so big, they must have the best product. Even with the obvious bugs and other problems they experience, many people believe that since everyone else is such a small marketshare that they must of course have even worse quality products than the market winner has. For example, I can not get my dad to use anything but MS products because of this. He uses MSIE and Outlook, and there's no changing that, no matter how many viruses or spybots or zombies his computer is infected with. The friend I mentioned above is unwilling to use anything but MSIE because he doesn't care to learn anything else, as trivial as that learning curve may be, he's simply not interested even after all of his own complaining about MSIE.
It's not a "problem" with a rational solution, I don't think it'sbecause people are "stupid" or anything like that, I think it's because the vast majority of people simply do not care enough to actually do anything about it. Having what they're used to or what 97% of the world uses is more important to them than having a higher quality product.
Imagine if Apple became the dominant force in the IT industry? Would they rest on their laurels like Microsoft and focus more on increasing the cost of change than on quality of software?
I just have a feeling that if the revolution came all that would mean is the old boss gets replaced by a new boss and were still fucked by an unresponsive company.
Hey - remember when IBM was the ugly monopoly and Microsoft was the hero that saved the day?
(For the record, I am a proud Mac and Linux user.)
- Thomas;
___ This sig is in boldface to emphasize its importance!
> Why was your SO so stupid to drive a brand new car with out first opening the hood and setting the valve clearance!
It isn't that you need to set the valve clearance. That's an incorrect analogy. What about the Ford (or any car) driver who drives for 20,000 miles when the engine suddenly dies? The moron never did any maintenance to the car, they never changed the oil, and the car died. At least with Windows, the maintenance (patches) are free, whereas with a car, you have to pay for oil changes.
The real problem is that Windows is like buying a car with NO oil -- once you fill it up with oil (patch the system) for the first time, you're good to go until the next oil change (updates).
when
Pronunciation Key (hwn, wn)
adv.
At what time: When will we leave?
conj.
1. At the time that: in the spring, when the snow melts.
2. As soon as: I'll call you when I get there.
3. Whenever: When the wind blows, all the doors rattle.
4. During the time at which; while: when I was young, I was sick all the time.
5. Whereas; although: She stopped short when she ought to have continued.
6. Considering that; if: How can he get good grades when he won't study?
pron.
What or which time: Since when has this been going on?
n.
The time or date: Have they decided the where and when?
They dont migrate because the alternatives are worse. linux? puhleeze. linux isnt even close to being a user friendly system. not even close. mac? hello? its too expensive. its too closed. oh yeah and its too expensive. and dont give me the mac mini crap either.
Some time ago, two physicists, both with a PhD degree, were cursing about a Mac that served in our laboratory while trying to figure out how to open that CD-ROM tray. Click on CD icon. Nothing. Special menu. Nothing. Search in the help function. Nothing. The button was sitting on the keyboard, which was about 2 meters away from the console. Not documented anywhere!
Avantslash: low-bandwidth mobile slashdot.
"... Why haven't they jetisoned the foul beast from Redmond and migrated en mass to the Macintosh or even Linux?"
/will/ take over chant the anit-MS crowds... WRONG! Linux is free and it has a great deal of potential but it's just too darn difficult for mear mortals to use, and it doesn't have a marketing machine behind it.
/finding/ and /installing/ software that isn't part of the distributors' plan is really scary, if you don't know what you're doing. So there's lots of free software that a select few are comfortable installing and working with.
Cost and market saturation is the simple answer. Years ago MS and IBM got in bed together and since IBM was buying the 808X chips en mass from Intel MS got in bed with Intel through inderection. Admitedly the cost of a computer back in the 1980's was obsene from today's standards but the marketing machine that is IBM sold them, en mass. Software got developed and IBM/MS/Intel based system got adopted everywhere.
Fast forward a bit and Apple presents the Machintosh, an arguably superior system that has now eveolved into a fantastic system in overall design and usability. Problem: Cost and market saturation. Apple may have been presenting a "better" (subjective) system but by this time the clone market was already starting and driving costs in the PC market downward.
Unfortunately Apple has traditionaly fought the clone market and used hardware that was simply more expensive than x86 designs. To compound the problem software just didn't get developed at the same rate for Apple's systems. This goes back to market saturation, and a couple other factors. Sad but true.
Skip ahead again to the early/mid 1990's and we find that MS has countered the Machintosh with Windows and used it's own marketing machine to sell it. A lot of people use it. A lot of people are leary of it. Regardless, it's everywhere. *Poof* Linux comes on the scene, in a select cult like corner of the computing world, and it's free. It's good. We all love it. Well that is if we are prepared for the complexity in comparison. Linux is FREE it
In the here and now MS continues to dominate the popular market. Apple is starting to present cost efective solutions. And Linux is still free. MS has gotten a pretty interface and has lots of games and it is good. Okay it has a lot of problems but the majority don't know any better and don't care. Apple has continued to improved their interface, there's good support for the systems, but still no real clones, and limited software. They continue to suffer from a heavy blow early on. Apple loyalist however are a force to be reconed with, don't even try to sell them on a diferent system. Linux has gotten a face lift, it's reasonably simple to use and install now. Joe Shmoe can probably install Linux and start using it. Updates are better but a little scary sometimes and
Cost and market saturation. That's the answer to 'Why?' Sorry floks, OS/2 lost and Apple's mentality hurt them.
DISCLAIMER: This is how I recall the events (plus some vocal opinion). FYI, I'm a Linux loyalist from the SLS (download and raw write 56 floppy images) days. I still have to use MS though and I have a Mac in my kitchen. Well that's how my memory of things is...
I am invisble, and you can't see me.
This joker uses yet another tired automotive analogy. This isn't like your new car spontaneously exploding on the way to work. It's more like taking that new car to a racetrack and pounding the heck out of it trying to win with the stock engine and suspension. You wouldn't gripe to the dealer that it was drifting at 130 MPH and the unvented brake rotors were warping. He'd laugh you out of there, and put a big "VOID" stamp on your factory warranty before you walked out. These PCs aren't going to blow up spontaneously sitting on your desk with no network connection. Believe it or not, you can do things with a computer other than access the Internet. But if you want to get on the Internet, you have to take reasonable measures to prepare your computer. People are used to computers being more plug'n'play because they come with networking capabilities. Imagine being sent back through time to 1994 and trying to get on the Internet. You had to buy a modem, install TCPIP software (Winsock, or Opentransport - only OS/2 and Linux had IP built in), and maybe even fiddle with your phone lines if you weren't getting a good connection.
What a whiner.
Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
The problem is the more often Dell puts matches in the master image, the more effort it has to spend fully testing the computer and all software it can possibly ship with against that patch or set of patches.
That I think is why they do not in fact do what you say, because it would require them to raise prices or give up some of the very small margin they currently make.
So literally security is passed onto the consumer as an issue because it's cheaper and easier for them to do so.
You would think support costs would make more timley patches worth deploying though.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Know how long it's taken me to get Windows up and running on it? I still haven't. I've installed XP 4 seperate times to get the basic rig and an iPod up and running. This weekend I'll spend the entire time trying 2K on it to see if that's any better. Each time a new driver or app is installed, something catostrauphic occurs and it becomes easier to start from scratch than to roll back drivers and troubleshoot. Everything from onboard LAN to firewire cards to USB mice. All stuff that's meant to be run on 2K/XP, but evidently can't. Or at least won't very well.
I mainly run linux boxes, so I forgot how god damn troublesome Windows can be. And the real kicker? For the amount that this box ended up costing me, I could have just bought a Mac Mini for $500 and have it Just Work(tm). I'm far from being computer illiterate, so I can only imagine how hard it would be for a normal lus3r to do this.
What has this taught me? Windows can kiss my ass, next time I'm gettin' a Mac.
"Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned for SEGA. ..."
"The biggest problem with Windows is that Microsoft gave a very powerful OS to Joe Servicepack who has NO CLUE how to get it stable and keep it stable."
So the biggest problem with Windows is the users? The solution is clear, then, get rid of Windows users: have them all buy a Mac or install Linux.
Hexy - a strategy game for iPhone/iPod Touch
Simple,
people run windows because they feel free when using it.
linux is not that easy
ive created a small list:
-hard to partition during install
-hard to install too. because you never want the stuff that nerds wanted you to install
-not allowed
-out of contexts
-syntax error
-hard to find config file
-hard to find logfile
-hard to patch
-hard to remember root pass
-hard to play games on
-hard to get help from friends (and nerdy friends that KNOW linux just laught at me)
-hard to use the kde
-hard to use gnome
-hard to calm down when keys hang in console
-hard to calm down when some programs dont print the same
-hard to calm down when shortcut keys are different in every **cking program
-hard to understand why most pro people use progras that were created for command-line use only
yeah and the list goes on, but now im outta this thread. good luck everybody that try to improve linux. i will install it the day it is BETTER than windows.
and mind you, by better I do NOT mean MORE SECURE. all you geeks geek about is security.
Get it now? You microsoft apologists should really get a clue.
Yeah, well you shrill 'linux is perfect' bitches should get a life. If one were to apply the analogy you used, Linux would be a car with now owners manual that was so complicated you need to be a mechanic to maintain it.
HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
No, seriously. I've been using macs and unix boxes for 20 years (I've owned 6 or 7 macs), and pc's most of that time as well. I do most of my real work (academia) on linux, will soon have a mac mini attached to the hdtv in the basement, but....
I spend most of my time at home in front of a dell running windows (albeit w/ an apple display). Why?
Because IT WORKS BETTER!....at least for my "leisure" computing. For printing, scanning, surfing, attaching various peripherals, viewing video clips, playing games, etc., the windows box "just works".
In the aforementioned 20 years I've had two machines cracked, one windows box and one linux box. Neither was a big deal to fix and, given the time frame, the fact that the macs were never cracked during the 20 years is completely irrelevant.
Bottom line is that macs are slow and expensive, linux is Not There Yet in terms of polish, software, and compatibility, and therefore windows boxes are still the best choice for some activities. I have to laugh every time I go to a conference and watch the guys running linux jump through hoops to find and bring up the wireless connection. A click or two on my laptop (booting windows for the duration of the conference) and I'm up. And if you are tied into a specific piece of software that only runs on windows, even more so.
I love linux, I love the control, I love building my own kernels, and I love that apple turned to freebsd when they finally realized their home-grown stuff wasn't going to make it. But windows is still fine hunk of software for certain purposes.
Flame on....
Honestly, what more do you need than a free online virus checker and adaware?
Condemnant quod non intellegunt.
So I was reading /. when I came across a typical 'OMG Windows SuXors' article..
I casually sipped my afternoon coffee, set it down, and clicked the article link, bracing myself for the deluge of mind-numbing numbers and references to obscure studies.
After reading the article, I looked to the right side-bar for a list of other recent articles by the author. Trying to get a feel for the authors views, I decided to peruse a few of them.
Well, I must say. Mark Morford has to be one of the most rabid, extremist, over-reactive, leftist, tin-foil hat wearing, Moore wannabe's I've had the displeasure of reading.
Now, before the flames begin to rise, please understand the last paragraph was a simple reciprocle example of Mr. Morford's diatribes. Basically take a simple statement, and make it appear so sensationistically over-the-top.
So now to my point. How can this article be used on a news site, when it is simply nothing more than a rant? I use Linux and Windows, and on occasion Macs. I rarely have any problems with any of my systems. I have never had my Windows boxed filled with virii/trojans, nor have I had a crash in as long as I can remember. Am I just one of the lucky ones, or do I simply ignore the little monkey moving back and forth in a feeble attempt to evade my mouse click for a Free iPod
Wow, I ask someone what they mean and they grab a dictionary. Only on Slashdot.
Wheel in the sky keeps on turnin'.
I don't think I've ever seen a network stack "pop up"...
quidquid latine dictum sit altum videtur.
A college student who works 35 hours a month in a water chemistry lab on campus for 8 bucks and hour. Seriously, the machine i have sitting next to me easilly meets the hardware requirements for longhorn TODAY (not that it will ever run it - i'm a BSD guy), and i built it when i was working part time for shit wages, all out of my pocket, while still going out with friends and having them buy me beer. This whole "Longhorn will only run on the best of the best hardware when it comes out" trolling is bullshit. IT will require the best of TODAYS hardware, but when it actually comes out, it'll be bottom shelf stuff. Get over yourself and your pious zealotry.
Typical /. stupidity, Robin
Please, tell me. Can i demand an updated Windows 2000 disc? Because it took a freaking hour to download updates on broadband through my firewall asking if it was okay every 2 minutes- and I have SP2!!! Which means it could have been worse!!!
Because it tries to be everything to everyone and that just can't be done.
Why haven't they jettisoned the foul beast from Redmond and migrated en mass to the Macintosh or even Linux?
Ignorance & fear.
When we had RoadRunner hook up our cable internet here in the appartment, it was as simple as hooking up an Ethernet cable to the NIC on the computer. Later we purchased a wireless router so we could keep miho-san in the bedroom. Didn't need any more software, didn't even need to configure PPPoE like I did in PA. It was assigned an IP and off we went. What OS was I running? Oh, right, Windows XP. Hell, Knoppix and OS 10.1 worked fine too. This is how you say, ah yes, a non-argument.
Something sinister, something involving tentacles and Japanese animation...
See?
Oh.
It sounds as if this fellow's so horribly inept that it'd be a grand starting place, sure.
Hrm...
The same way anyone deals with anything. Those that're too stupid to learn how to effectively deal with a problem either cope and are unhappy or pay someone more intelligent than themselves (in that area, at least) to fix it for them. Of course, the truly cunning read, comprehend and understand a problem based upon the scientific method (remember that lovely practice that they taught you in elementary school? No? That somehow doesn't surprise me...) and break it down into its baser parts, develop a hypothesis and perform experimentation. Do it once, figure out how everything works together, never worry about it again.
See my above statement.
Microsoft is in Redmond (as is Nintendo of America, believe it or not). A suburb makes not a city-center, despite what the yuppies there might want to believe.
Yeah, it probably has something to do with the fact that you realize, on some level or another, that Billy G has made you his bitch, Minnie Can't-Driver. Good for him. There's a lot of negative things I could say about William H. Gates III, but his ability to get money from idiots is unparalleled. Bravo, friend.
Nothing technical here, but who in the hell writes like this and considers themselves a professional?
Odd, as you've already seen, my system (my Windows XP system) doesn't have spyware. Nor does hinkypunk, my girlfriend's laptop. Nor does the G3 I own that runs OS X. Nor does the Linux partition on my main computer. Sorry there, sport, but generalizations like 'all' are far from the truth. Don't want spyware/adware/Trojans? Learn to use XP correctly. Use a different OS. Or use a different computer altogether. Hell, those Mini Macs look pretty keen, and they're (relatively) cheap, no? "But I can't use Kazaa or SuperCrapoTimeSetter or PornWatcher5000!" you say. Tough. The only P2P application is BitTorrent, and it has clients for practically every OS out there. Those other apps? Fuck 'em. In a lot of cases there are alternatives that work just as well or better or, in some cases, have versions made by the same company. Photoshop, Office, these are the kind of applications people really need/can't live without, and they're easily available i
There was no verb in that last sentence!
... this is a terrible article. This guys argument is basically "I installed Yahoo's DSL software and my computer started to suck." He offers no real investigation of what the problem was. He makes no mention of running a virus scan to confirm that it was virus'. I have been running multiple windows boxes on a cable connection for a few years now and have never had a single box become "DOA" as this guy describes.
Here's a few of my favorite quotes from the article.
I receive upward of 500 emails a day, much of it nasty spam that often comes with weird indecipherable attachments that try, in vain, to infiltrate my machine. My Mac just shrugs them off and keeps working perfectly.
Your Mac does not shrug them off. Your Mac's Email client does. And so does Thunderbird on Windows.
I'm a power user. And I have yet to suffer a single debilitating virus or worm or spyware or malware whatsoever. I'm a power user and I hever never suffered a single debilitating virus or worm either. I'm running... *GASP* Windows.
I think the situation this guy is describing is more the exception and not the rule. I think Windows has made great strides over the past few years (especially in the area of stability). It still has some distance to go in security but then again, no one is suggesting you use Windows for your mission critical applications.
I think the real question of this story should not be "why does windows still suck" but "why the hell would you install yahoo software"
Your point is extrmemly well taken. If there were laws (god help us, I don't want to see these exist) that regulated the safety factor of an OS like the laws regulate the safety factor of both cars and drivers, then Windows would either be fixed or history. Linux would be labeled an expirimental vehicle and OS-X (and the various unices) would be the Chevy's and Ford's of today.
This msg is brought to you by the letter 'W'.. for Worthless Wuss
Why haven't they jetisoned the foul beast from Redmond and migrated en mass to the Macintosh or even Linux?
If Mac was the prominant OS then 1337 h4x0rs would be attacking it, and finding holes for virii. Same would be true if linux were the dominant OS.
Script kidies and elite alike attack windows because thier virii will affect more computers that way and they can feel like they've accomplished something.
If Windows and Linux market shares were reversed, people would be saying "Why can't Linux have less virii like windows?"
It gets attacked more because the attacks get seen more. How many Apache servers on *nix have been comprimised? I bet it would be the same percentage as IIS servers on Windows servers. Why? Because attacking a website will get you seen no matter what OS is being run on the server.
And if *nix has no security holes then how come there's always security patches for my Linux computer?
DarkMantle I been bored, so I started a blog.
Without Antivirus, how do you know it's "clean as a whistle"? It's kind of a schrodinger's cat scenario; you haven't looked.
That's not the point. Windows is more like an abandoned building with open doors and windows, and wait! It has a friggin' bag of CAT FOOD inside. This isn't Schroedinger's cat... it's much more like "Garfield and Friends".
If Windows had been truly well-designed, we wouldn't need antiviruses IN THE FIRST PLACE.
In my times, you caught a virus because you copied some friend's warez game floppy. NOT because you accidentally left your PC connected to the internet.
Wanna know why windows sucks?
*AHEM!* (clears throat)
I searched about "automatic" services on windows. For instance, almost all of the windows services run on something called RPC (Remote Procedure Call service - and this means network). And many of them are turned on by default (unless you're BlackViper, and 99.9% of the Windows users haven't even heard of the guy).
Furthermore, the default protocol for networks is TCP/IP, meaning anyone can access your network (or machine) directly from the internet. There's no "drawbridge" that could be turned off or something to keep you safe.
Windows is naturally an INTERNET-VULNERABLE operating system. Is it the Joe users' fault that his machine is practically a virus lighthouse with lotsa services running on the background, listening to specific ports, _AND_ being vulnerable to buffer overflows, for Norton's sake?
Furthermore. BillyGates and company, have always had this "run code on data" fetish. Why do you think Microsoft Word viruses came to life? A text file cannot infect your machine because it's data, not code.
And don't get me started on ActiveX, i'm sick enough of this filth and i just finished eating.
One could argue why don't people drop linux and stick to windows.
Linux has lots of flaws just like windows. Your only complaint is virus? please, change one line on a linux OS and you might as well be a virus you have to reinstall. You basicly point to one person that has a problem, but don't point the hordes who don't. I have been using windows for 5+ years, and have had ONE virus that was fixed easy. The only reason this thing comes up is because Linux is not a home user OS, never has been, all the distros that ever came out never last..if you reversed the rolls as Linux having Windows desktop share's. You would have millions of whines about how bad linux is, and every other post saying "You must try windows OS, it rules!".
Each OS has its place today, don't spew crap about the ups and downs of each.
I bet most people here don't want to THINK let alone care about the FACT that lots of Linux longtime users switched to windows? Didn't think so, because slashdot post a positive thing about windows?! right..
Get out in the sun.
How about RTFA!?!
The MDA's that were AGREED to by the OEM vendors gave them discounts on Windows and nothing more. So-fricking-what if IBM lost $3Million over it - I'm sure that their coffers could more than make-up for the loss with no impact on their customers or their bottom line.
And regardless of the BeOS fan-boys here, there was NO MARKET INTEREST in the box or the OS - if their was, then why did they fold and sell their technology to Apple? Be's competitor was the company that bought them out - Apple - and *not* Microsoft.
I'm beginngin to think that the anti-Microsoft faction here has collectively drank from the same batch of Cool-aid!
--ScottKin
I don't give a rat's behind about "karma" here or anywhere else. Don't like what I have to say here? Deal with it!
Is a little "driver training" too much to ask? Any system is a risk if not well configured. I'd never connect a box directly the 'net that wasn't specifically going to run services no matter what OS.
-- Jack
While were at it, let's ban Apple from preinstalling OS X on Macs too.
Oh, my bad... it's only bad is Microsoft does it. If Apple does it, it's a Good Thing. Fucking hypocrites Slashdotters.
Even though I always wanted to use Linux and other open source alternatives, I just feel comfortable using Windows.
I admit I have friends who uses Linux but my best friend said that he had to take a while to learn about the formatting, the instalation of software (compiling for the rest of the Slashdot crowd), and the ocasional file that is hard to find out in Linux.
I had heard of Live CDs and a HUGE fan of OSS (I used to run Mozilla but now I have been using Firefox and Open Office exclusively), but I tend to do my fair share of cd burning and I wonder what is the OSS equivilent of Alcohol 120% or Nero. I am aware of open media players and the popular emulators are Linux native.
The main thing that stands in my way is my fully partitioned HDD and I am running low on space (8 gigs out of a formatted 32Gig HDD, an IBM 40Giger). Once I gain more funds, I plan on getting a niiice HDD and dl some DVD ISOS, and go Linux.
Then my biggest concern is the almighty compiling to install software, not all executables are Fedora/Mandrake executables.
I give Microsoft my hat for copying the best features from the early Sparc/Mac OSes while having executables that enable easy software (mostly a third party solution with most EXEs). Is there going to be a standard executable instalation to instal the the /usr that is compatible with most kernals? Sorry if I sound like a noob who should be posting at USENET and not a blog.
I was talking about cars o_o
(Really, it's an analogy; it's not meant to be taken literally, or expected to be accurate -- it's there to get the point across quickly and easily at accuracy's expense)
I mod down anyone who says "I will be modded down for this", regardless of the rest of their comment
Really. It doesn't. I've been using Mac OS since I was 4, and now there's finally another OS that I mildly enjoy using. Windows XP Professional SP2 is an excellent operating system. It has huge, glaring flaws, but so does Mac OS. (And so does Lunix.)
Author is a jackass. Whatever.
There are no trails. There are no trees out here.
* Wipe machine.
* Unplug from net.
* Re-install Windows.
* Install SP2 from a CD.
* Install a virus scanner.
* Install Firefox.
* Remove IE icon from desktop.
* Plug network cable into machine.
Actually, they don't. Microsoft have repeatedly threatened & upped the price on vendors who sell machines without the OS pre-installed. And they have also charged for a Windows license for every machine sold, regardless of what OS was actually on it. This was the meat of one of the many lawsuits pending against MSFT when W. took office (and then they went away...)
Karma: Excellent (Mainly due to Bill & Ted's Karma Adventure)
It's not all ignorance, lethargy, and a blind desire to follow the herd.
The major reason many don't is that there is a tremendous investment in any given platform. That investment is both in software (real dollars) and in knowledge of the given platform and its apps. It's fine to say use all open source apps on Linux, but come on, that's not realistic. There are many great open source alternatives to Windows apps, but there are many apps exclusive to Windows, further developed on Windows, etc. Not to mention, let's say someone wanted to convert from Windows to Mac. Many of the apps he owns he will need to repurchase for the Mac. I'm not aware of Adobe, for example, letting you convert your PC licenses to Mac ones; maybe they do, but I would suspect many software which supports Mac and PC wouldn't. So, even amongst the cross-platform pay apps you'd need to spend money for the conversion.
Don't vote for Eugene Papansanovich for Congress!
...if you buy a commercial machine with Windows XP installed you usually get at least an antivirus program loaded such as ViruScan or Norton Antivirus.
I wouldn't be surprised that by now for commercial machines they thrown in a full licensed install of McAfee's or Norton's full security suite (antivirus, bi-directional firewall and spyware detection/removal). Don't forget that Microsoft could offer such a thing pretty soon, given Microsoft's recent software company mergers.
Since the article mentions new cars vs new PCs, here's what's really going on...
Imagine the car dealership and the PC store. Both places are pristine, cleaned and maintained daily by a staff of near slaves. They are isolated from the rest of the world.
When you buy the PC, take it home, and plug it into the net, it's bombarded with spyware, worms, viruses, etc. The internet is a nasty place to travel, but various entities do some maintenance so you can travel quickly most of the time.
When you buy a car and take it off the lot, you drive the car on roads maintained by city, county, state, and federal authorities. The roads are usually in good condition. There might be a pot hole here and there, but it's nothing your new car can't handle. And the pothole will probably be patched before you bring your car back to the dealer for it's first oil change. (You did talk your sales person into a freebie or two, right?)
To compare the Internet to the highway system, you would have to have a highway system that was unpoliced, where highwaymen with guns shoot at you, or try to run you off the road in order to steal your car and your credit cards, money, first born, etc. daily. You also have to avoid billboards that pop up in front of you as you drive along, and the drivers who have crashed into them. Yet somehow with all this going on the city, county, state, and federal authorities manage to patch the pot holes, so you can still travel quickly. Assume that armor, bullet resistant glass, and drivers side mounted mini gun are not standard equipment. Sounds wild doesn't it? This is your brand new computer on the internet.
Thankfully most computers sold today do come with bullet resistant glass and armor plating. Some come as accessories in the trunk (Default install on Linux or Windows versions through XP SP1).
Others (such as Apple, and Microsoft post XP Service Pack 2, security mined Linux distributers) have this stuff installed and active by default.
Really, it's not Windows that sucks. It's the buyer who didn't buy their bullet resistant glass and armor plating pre-installed. And the fault of the sales people and PC sellers for not installing/activating these features out of the box.
If the author's SO had purchased a new computer, instead of using an older one that she already had, odds are this specific article would never have been written.
I'm going to go back in my box and will think within the limits of my box: MS Sucks Linux Good I read too much Slashdot.
I know! I know! How about this one?
Those who complain about affect & effect on
Windows now requires you to be a semi-competent user.
:-)
Got new laptop and wanted WinXP pro. When I got it, plugged into hardware firewall for it's first Internet connection, installed BlackICE, Spyware Exterminator and Panda Anti-Virus. 3 months later still running fine (minus some slowness for all the security crap). Which makes me wonder what is worse sometimes, the spyware, or all that you have to do to keep that crap off? Fortunately my main box is Mandrake 10.0
...in bed
MacOS X is quite nice, but my experience is that the hardware and software support still isn't there
I don't follow. I'm just gonna leave the hardware part alone, because odds are you're talking about your circa-1989 parallel-port Epson dot matrix printer or some damn-fool thing, but software? Mac OS X will run virtually any Mac application ever written --there are a very few ancient programs that won't run either under Mac OS X or the Classic environment --and it can run any POSIX-compliant UNIX program for which you have the source code. That means it can run all Linux software plus all Mac software, plus or minus a small fudge factor.
Also, what with Virtual PC, it'll run practically all Windows software.
There's just not a hell of a lot of software out there that can't run on a Mac. So whatcha mean?
...is because it can. It's the dominant OS in the world and despite sucking people still buy it. Why shouldn't it suck?
Why is Mac OS X the best desktop OS in the world? Because it has to be. Apple has such a small market share that it has to have something to really stand apart from Windows. If Macs were still on MacOS 9, Apple would be dead by now. To survive, Apple needed OS X.
I live ze unknown. I love ze unknown. I am ze unknown.
There are excuses/explanations for blaming the user for failures. This makes sense. Until you consider the magnitude of the problem.
User ignorance is sometimes the problem. I'm pretty familiar with computers, programming and things related. I should be able to maintain a system that I use exclusively from becoming infected, right?
Actually, I have a fully patched win98 system at home. 3 weeks ago, after browsing the web for about 2 hours, I went to bed. The next morning I booted the system to check my email. My dial-up connection reported that the modem was already in use as soon as I tried dialing into my ISP (I had booted the system and gone to brush my teeth).
So I unplugged my modem, and after a while of scratching around through the registry and various directories, I found a nasty dialer. My phone bill indicated that it had connected for 8 minutes. I'm pretty careful, and extremely observant. I didn't accept or install *anything* the night before. I was simply using a vanilla win98 and IE5.
Oh- and by calling my bell, I made sure that the charges for the 900 number were not accepted- the roaches who set it up won't get money from me.
That's the kind of stupidity that annoys me with windows.
I also use OsX, and linux, and I haven't had similar problems (in fact to get the spyware removers, I booted that system off a knoppix partition). If it is obscurity that protects them, then why not jump on the bandwagon while it's still advantageous?
Too bad I can't use all the apps I need on other os's.
My form of silent protest: I now do my best to not install windows or MS products unless absolutely necessary (on occasion I do in my lab, or for a family member). When friends and family ask for windows help: I say no. I offer to help if they want to switch.
The problem of bad software being sold is tremendous. No other industry consistently receives revenues for products which fail so consistently. The attitude is often that of an 'as is' contract. If you ever see the program load functionally, then forget about ever getting real help with a problem. Mind you, this is more true for large companies than small software developers.
Well, maybe that's just my rant.
Why should you have to buy that stuff? You expect your new car to come with door locks, right? Maybe even an anti-theft system? A computer shouldn't be any different. Windows comes with almost no protection (that is changing, yes). Linux distros come with firewalls. MacOSX does, too. With a decent OS you get the locks you'd expect and thus the additional safety you'd expect.
Running a stock Windows computer is like leaving a car in downtown Detroit with no door locks and a big sign which says, "This car is unlocked. Please ignore." You'd have to pay extra to get rid of the sign and extra again to add door locks. And of course, if you didn't get those options from the factory, you'd probably have to spend even more to clean the interior that's all messed up thanks to the 3 homeless guys that moved into your car while you were at McDonalds ordering your super-sized fries and burger.
Hexy - a strategy game for iPhone/iPod Touch
I've been running Windows XP Pro (before that, 2k). My Xp box hasn't had a virus attack/adware/malaware ever. I haven't had a single BSOD/Lockup in 18 months. Why? I take a common sense approach to my machines. I patch my machine religiously, keep my AV updated (eTrust AV), have a firewall & don't install anything I don't know anything about. It is the same in every OS. Whenever I install a Linux flavor, what do I see? A bunch of security updates. Same with OSX.
The writer like all typical Mac fanboys is a moron. Whenever they're not masturbating over some rumour of another Apple product (G5 PBs next Tuesday) to waste money over, it is upto bashing XP without any basis.
The author's wife probably had every software under the sun to 'add sounds to pictures' and 'How to treat your husband like dirt' application installed on her unpatched & unprotected machine.
I'm no fan of MS. I dual boot Win XP Pro & Xandros & I have another box running Suse 9.1. I also have an iBook, all sharing beautifully a cable connection.
Slashdotters have become way too much illogical when it comes to OSes. It has become quite popular to agree with the crowd & say MS sucks, Apple blows.
Turds.
Quite right, the fault here lies with the ISP.
With certain items there are some basic assumed knowledge, with others not so much. The supplier(usually as part of the sales pitch) covers limitations and how to use. The internet is on of the more complex and frustrating tools around, a supplier of DSL would be saying: "It's fast, but consider this.... And this is what you need to get around it."
When people ask me about getting DSL, I suggest a router with built in fire wall, and tell them why.
Companies use software to gain productivity.
When some crap software lowers productivity because of flaws, companies hire technicians that know workarounds to support users that continually screw their system around, starting an ever widening circle. Techs love crappy softwares as they can get certifications that ensure they get paid higher because they know how to deal with bad products, instead of learning to fix them, which would make their jobs obsolete. Companies see the cost of techs rising, offshores and starts a new circle of mediocrity (not because offshores represent lower quality-support, but because language, culture and distance make the communication suck).
Software makers see that they can sell crappy products and even charge for support of their broken tools.
Meanwhile, hobbyists and professionnals alike with a conscience start a quiet revolution by embracing new economic and engineering philosophies.
Microsoft, the biggest software maker on the earth sets the pace for the others to follow, and make a culture of mediocrity for the software industry a standard, with ever-growing profits, to prove that even tho they suck, it works, BIG time.
Open source gathers steam and can only settle things in the long run. If the movement uses the microsoft tactic of cloning every potentially successful application, system or idea but making it good, not exceptionnal, just good (which is better than MS can do), they will slowly make the windows dependance recede.
MS is a manopoly and that is why they still suck.
We should have been
So much more by now
Too dead inside
To even know the guilt
You hobble back to the dealer, who only says, gosh, sorry, we thought you knew -- that's they way they all run. Enjoy!
Lotus drivers have lived with this for years. "They All Do That, Sir."
this is the same public that when the doj was acting like it was going to actually punish microsoft cried out how horrible the doj was, and recently reinstalled an lying incompetent deficit bloating homophobic anti-science war monger as president. in other words, because they're mostly a bunch of ignorant fools who are getting exactly what they deserve. they wanted microsoft to be free to "innovate", so now they can bend over, take it, and stfu.
It is because you don't run as root normally and have proper privileges set up? The same is possible on Windows.
Perhaps because you're up-to-date on your patches? Just as doable on Windows.Infected or unplugged. Are those really the only choices?And how, prey tell, did the hijacking occur? I'm sure it's possible, but that possibility would have to be opened up by the user's negligence.You, sitting far away across the Internet, are better equipped to detirmine that than the user sitting right in front of the computer? How could you possibly know if the machine is infected or not?
You've seen stupid users trash their Windows machines before. This does not mean that all users are idiots or that all Windows machines are trashed. Windows is perfectly usable if you know what you are doing.
This is why. At a corporate meeting to decide between Windows and Linux for 10,000 new computers, a Windows sales representative and a Linux sales representative both made their cases for why their operating system is better.
The Linux sales rep went first: If you get Linux, you won't have problems with viruses, worms, crackers, and other problems. Plus, your system administrators can manage all your systems from a single location, and the execution of your applications will be reliable and efficient.
The Windows sales rep went next: By leveraging innovative technologies, content providers streamline compelling enterprise solutions, reducing TCO for CRM applications, and managing enterprise ERP.
The company chose Windows.
That brings us back to:
"The (annoying) workaround is to get the security fix onto the box before connecting it to the Internet, but this requires having the fix ready to go on a CD or other media."
The MS suit on the grounds you mentioned was a Federal Anti-Trust case. Only ONE suit, not many. It was settled during the Clinton adminstration, the paperwork hung around till after GWB took office. The patent infringement cases have been settled out of court and MS has paid a LOT to settle each one. To effectively attack the Borg in Redmond you need to get your facts right.
This is like someone putting water in their car's gas tank, and then "Waaahh!! My car doesn't GO!" Or walking around in Harlem wearing a "I hate negroes" sandwichboard sign, and complaining that someone gave you a dirty look. Or giving yourself a Draino and nitric acid enema and complaining about "discomfort on the potty." Windows on the Internet, sheesh, now I've heard it all.
For all the geek whining about how Windows sucks, and spending hours in vi and obsolete man pages is fun, you'd think they can at least RTFM.
E.g., you don't even need to buy a router or whatever to keep your Windows safe until you download the patches. Just go to the TCP/IP properties and activate IPSEC.
No, it's not a full fledged firewall, but it'll keep you safe as houses until you download a patch.
Now it's not something that's on the first page or activated by default, but for anyone claiming to be a die-hard Linux geek, here's the deal: it takes less time to fucking look at the IP properties, than to write a whine on a blog or Slashdot.
But, nah, whining about Windows is _fashionable_. It's cool. Makes one feel like one belongs to a big family.
That's the problem. Just reading the docs, or god forbid actually taking the time to configure it right, that's soo unfashionable. Just gets one branded as a "windows luser" or worse. Nah, better let her get virused instead, so we can fashionably whine about Redmond.
*sigh*
Look, folks, I'm not saying windows is perfect. Or even that good. But clueless whining and mis-presenting one's own complete incompetence as definitive proof that Windows sucks, that's just sad. It doesn't even do anyone a favour.
A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
You didn't read his posting carefully enough: it won't run all the ActiveX BHOs that he wants to install on people's computers. (ActiveX IS THE PROBLEM!).
Walmart doesnt sell Apples and Game companies don't make enough profit to port a many games to MAC
The pain of Windows' troubles so far doesn't outweigh the cost/pain of having to relearn how to use the computer. It just hasn't gotten bad enough for people to justify the switch to themselves. And alot of viruses don't do things normal users can see exempt make the computer slow down. In a virus free environment windows still makes computing easy enough for your casual user. If that balance changes then we'll see some migration.
Stop intellectual property from infringing on me
Why is it always only Microsoft's fault? They do make a buggy OS, but what about the ISPs? We should hold them accountable, too, for not securing the Internet.
Why are ISPs renting modems without a built-in firewall? A firewall is now a requirement. It wasn't a few years ago, but times have changed. The ISPs need to step up and update their hardware. If every broadband household modem came with a built-in firewall so that mom & pop don't have to go out and buy any more hardware if they don't want to, many of these Internet worms would have been stopped.
Call your ISP and demand that they take responsibility to secure the Internet!
The original analogy that compared that to someone else hitting your car is accurate.
Yes, there is an aspect of that to it. However, have you noticed that car designs tend to take this into account? There are cars with bodies that are ding resistant. The damage from low speed collisions is primarily cosmetic. There are all sorts of safty features designed to protect the contents of my vehicle.
Not too long ago, I was in an accident big enough to "total" (more expensive to fix than replace) my car, but nothing in my car was damaged, myself included. I don't think this holds up as an analogy, as I don't know of anyone who had to do a reinstall where they didn't also have to restore data from backup.
Remember what minor rear end collisions did to Pintos? This was a big deal. Shouldn't Windows be expected to deal with expected events?
Yes, there is a third party in these failures and we should hold them accountable for their actions, but that doesn't let Microsoft off the hook for failing to address this expected occurance.
Personally, I find the widespread acceptance of "computers fail" and "users are stupid" disappointing. Hell, throw in "politics is dirty", "corporations should just maximize profits" and "you can get away with anything if you have enough lawyers" too.
and know that Windows is the best! Ask every MSCE... Check Microsoft web pages... you know, Get The Facts! As for the viri and worms... it's just the way it is. It is the way computers work. And if I ever lose my very important data kept on Windows machine (assume I am THAT stupid) it's only those malicious script kiddiots (they should be all sentenced to death!) who are to blame, not Windows and certainly not the most famous software company in the world!
Now, mod me down freely. My karma can't get any worse...
A $20 router/firewall is all you need to protect you long enough to get Windows patched. The bots are fairly dumb and easily stopped. Ad-aware and AVG free edition protect from spyware and viruses. Using Firefox over Internet Exploiter eliminates the browser hijacks.
You're missing the point.. you shouldn't have to *do* anything when you buy a new Windows computer. You should plug it in and it should be secure.
These computers are just accepting data over the network. Streams of bytes. People act as if it is somehow inevitable that one of these streams will "slip through". It isn't. The computer is a big state machine. Software should be correctly designed, and unneeded services off by default. Grandma doesn't need half the stuff that Windows ships with on by default.
The biggest problem with Windows is that they have absolutely no incentive to make their software better.
Oh, and if it's a "windows world" you'll have to tell me how I've run a successful Unix consulting business for the last 11 years without ever once owning or needing a Windows machine.
Then what the fsck are you doing at Slashdot?? Did you not notice the image of Gates made up to look like a Borg? Microsoft has forums too. Make a new home for yourself.
Virus scanners and other malware removal tools try to clean up infections. Infections aren't always removable, and in the mean time they get to do whatever they want with your computer. A scanner would be unable to stop malware from deleting all your files; by the time the scanner gets involved, it's already too late.
It's much better to avoid getting infected in the first place, and yes, infection is very much preventable without sacraficing usability. Even on Windows.
You just need a better comparison.
Windows doesn't randomly create viruses and ad-/spy-ware for your computer - at the very least, this isn't the issue in the article.
The comparison should be if that car were sideswiped by someone that was pissed off by someone else. Damage to your car caused by someone who didn't know you but decided they needed to hurt as many people as possible. Maybe the angsty person targets Fords because Ford refused to recall a certain model of vehicle?
Still, that side-swipe could have been avoided with a defensive driving course, but most people don't know about those or don't have the time/money to learn.
You know all those major companies running big expensive servers with expensive software built to be secure? They're behind firewalls.
A firewall is a standard piece of hardware that every net connected computer needs regardless of what it's running.
Windows is not special in this need.
We didn't use to have a big "use a condom" mentality either. Times have changed.
Not too long ago everyone had dial-up. Dial up users tended to go through the ISPs proxy which prevented anyone from connecting directly to their system. With broadband comes your own personal IP address that people can try to connect to.
This is why firewalls are needed now while they weren't before.
Work Safe Porn
So you want to switch from a system in which a monopoly stems from a decent product being pushed by a relatively unremarkable marketing scheme to a system of complete economic totalitarianism run by the same people that brought you efficient, sensible things like the US tax system and the billion-dollar deficit?
...it's really a sad day for America when we require a goddamn ACT OF CONGRESS to make our DVD players work properly. ~
I like Windows, it's me versus the operating system. I switched from a Mac to Windows XP, classic theme. A Mac's eye-candy gets in the way of graphic design. A nice neutral grey interface is why I use Windows. That, and I built a Dual Xeon for $1500, and a Mac that fast would have cost me twice as much.
As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
Why haven't they jetisoned the foul beast from Redmond and migrated en mass to the Macintosh or even Linux?"
If/when these become popular, the virus writers and hackers will spend more time hacking those also. We don't know how they will really stand up to the "popularity load".
Table-ized A.I.
Nighthawk, you speak as though windows and linux are even compairable security wise. Well, i've got news for you buddy: they are not. Windows. You know why they call it that? Because it gives everyone a nice clear view into your computer. Also, gaming is not something that is only on windows. Ever heard of MacOSX? Yea......I pretty much figured. OSX, linux, unix, and BSD are the future. Windows wont be arround to much longer, I guarintee it. Every day, hundereds of people switch from windows to an alternative OS. It will only be a matter of time before all you windows junkies wont have anything to support. The iPod just proves that Microsoft is fighting a losing battle. Microsoft has pushed and pushed, but apple has pushed back even harder. Go buy yourself a power book, or if you happen to be short on funds, start downloading some iso immages.
Is this whole thing rhetorical? It doesn't take a mental nothing five seconds of searching to find out WHY... sad.
You didn't read his reply carefully enough: Virtual PC is the solution.
1. Most people, even with the help of a telephone support technician, can't handle configuring X. They certainly aren't going to pull off 3D support for a nice Nvidia or ATI card.
2. Have you ever found a preconfigured Linux PC from a reputable manufacturer at Best Buy, Circuit City, or Costco?
3. Macs cost too much for most consumers, although the Mac Mini may change this for consumers who have no interest in playing games.
4. The US Government requires most of its contractors to submit documents in MS Office format, and as a result of said requirement, most of those contractors require the same from any company they do business with. MS Office doesn't run on Windows, and OpenOffice can't keep up with all of the crazy formatting used in recent versions of Word and Excel.
5. Most recently released games will not run at all on OS X, and will only run on Linux under WineX.
I read /. almost religiously everyday, and I barely ever feel the need to comment, but this guy goes on and on about how crap Windows is, and maybe it is compared to Mac. But most of the problem lies with the fact that most people are just plain stupid and naive when it comes to using a computer. Admittedly the Mac (which I have never really used) may be better out the box against worms, but I doubt the Mac would do any better against adware were it as popular as Windows. The other problem comes down to ISPs being more worried about selling their services than keeping their networks clean.
Let me just state, I sit on public IP address at work, 24 hours a day. I run Windows XP, I do the updates religiously, I even set up SUS at my office to save on bandwidth costs. I personally run NO anti-virus, I run NO firewall. I installed ad-aware once, thought it was a waste of time, and ununistalled it a week later. My computer has NO malware on it, I do not have pop-up problems, I do not have strange task in my running programs list.
How do I get away with this, well, since code red and nimda, Microsoft has always managed to release fixes, which is what actually alerts malicious programmers to the vulnerability, before a worm hits. Also, being an intelligent user (I don't even have any real post-school qualifications), I know what NOT to click, and the golden rule in life: "There is no such thing as a free lunch." which keeps me away from dubious software, particulaly things like Smiley Central and Date Manager (see these on client machines too often). I also use Open Source software where it is convenient. Particularly eMule and Firefox.
I personally believe that perhaps grannies shouldnt be allowed on a PC wihout at least a little knowledge, in the same way a granny who has never learnt to drive shouldn't be on the road. I don't know how it works in th US, but where I live, before you can even get in a car to start learning to drive, you have to write a test PROVING that you know the rules of the road, why don't people do this for PCs? I mean this applies to life as well, any good mother wouldn't leave their kids alone in a big city on the street, unless they were confident that after years of teaching their child simple self survival techniques were sufficent, basic things like: "don't walk into dark alleys with shday characters lurking around".
PC's are the same, we have these zombie nets, simply because people are irresponsible with their PCs, and don't make the effort to make sure they are "internet worthy", i mean if a car is unroadworthy, you get fined, and chucked off the road, this is not just because people are picky about these things, it's becuase roads are quite important, and we can't have morons making it unusable for basic needs. I would say the internet is pretty damn important for business, particularly e-mail, shouldn't people have to prove their competence before being allowed on it?
Windows, when configured correctly, does not suck. Windows is used ALL OVER the world for mission-critical applications. It is simply the target of many more attacks because of it's popularity. If Linux ever surpasses Windows in popularity, it will also have quite a few previously-unknown vulnerabilities exposed.
Today, my Mother had Lasik eye surgery. The computer which controlled the laser was running Windows XP. The authors of the laser-control software didn't choose windows at random, they chose it due to it's stability. If the computer was to crash during the procedure, a patient could be blinded for life. Apparrently, they trusted Windows over any other OS for that application.
I work at a small chain of radio stations in west-central Missouri. We use a total of 4 computers in the studios, all running Windows XP Professional. Our primary satellite control/automation computer has several months of uptime. It has never crashed, and was rebooted most recently due to the installation of updates.
Although it is extremely popular these days to insult and bash Windows simply because it is popular, 99% of the problems that people have with windows aren't because of windows... it's because of either the user's inability to use the operating system correctly, or the installation of some kind of malicious software. The majority of Linux users are intelligent enough to know what is safe to do and what is not. Most Windows users (the general population) are not computer experts, and therefore don't know. If you picked a random person from the general population and sat them down in front of a computer running the latest, most secure, most user-friendly distribution of Linux, they would probably encounter problems within a short period of time.
Darwin FAQ
Intellectual Property is a monopolistic, selfish, and defective concept. It is "tyranny over the mind of man"
Well then you've only dealt with very short stacks.
i call bullshit. my wife just bought a laptop w/ xp pro on it. when i checked windows update there wasnt a damn thing to install.
always mosh clockwise
"The real problem is that Windows is like buying a car with NO oil -- once you fill it up with oil (patch the system) for the first time, you're good to go until the next oil change (updates).'
But when you buy a car do you ever ask, "Is there oil in it?" My guess is that you assume that it has oil when you buy it. If you bought a new car and it had no oil you would be pissed off and demand that they replace the engine under warranty! That is my entire point. You should always have the latest patches on any brand new computer when you buy it. Yes you have to do updates but is it even possible to have a none updated XP system survive on the Internet long enough to download and install SP2?
What about people with dial up?
You also said...
"What about the Ford (or any car) driver who drives for 20,000 miles when the engine suddenly dies? "
The original poster said four minutes! Not a year, not a month, not a day but four minutes!
Yes Microsoft sucks for letting OEMs ship computers that can not stay explote free long enough to download the updates!
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Seriousily, where has this woman been in the past few years. If she had any brains at all she would have known, and the author of the the article should have told her, that she needs to have a firewall and virus protection when you have a broadband connection. It justs makes sense. I hate how many people on this site always jump on the I hate Microsoft and evil corporations bandwagon. Granted, Microsoft does have many sercurity problems and issues. However, Windows is the most widely used OS. As a result they have the most attackers in the world. If you were a spyware or virus creator, hacker, or whatever what would you attack. A realatively small market such as Linux or Mac or would you go after the largest market. I know Linux probably has better security in some respects, but we all need to look at the Microsoft situation from their perspective from time to time. And I don't completely like Microsoft. I pretty much thought all their OSs unitl XP completely sucked. You have to give them credit that XP was a huge step forward in the right direction from ME. Just thought I'd put my 2 cents in.
Bullshit.
I admined pre-OSX boxes for years.
Some dialogs do stop processing, but it's not "any time you get a dialog on the screen".
Your problem is more likely FileMaker, which is horrific at these things. As soon as *FileMaker* produced a dialog of its own, then *FileMaker* services stop working.
The whole machine doesn't though.
i don't read slashdot anymore.
You might want to replace "creatives" with "people under the illusion that they're creative". If they were actually creative, then they wouldn't form a distinct marketing segment, as they'd have a variety of needs wider than one narrow product set could satisfy.
...it's really a sad day for America when we require a goddamn ACT OF CONGRESS to make our DVD players work properly. ~
It's not all Microsoft's fault for Windows market share, it's people like me: computer consultants.
Go back to 1990 (give or take a few years) - small businesses were just discovering LANs - Novell ruled the server world and pc's were ruled by 3 DOS apps: WordPerfect, Lotus123 and FoxPro and were relatively inexpensive.
When Windows came out and MS invented the Office Suite, users loved the common interface. So did everyone who had to train and support them - it was so much easier than all those different DOS and application commands and keystokes.
So the years go by, hardware gets better but Windows and Office needs more horsepower, but that was OK since it looked better and had some neat features.
The Mac world had the coolest features, but other than desktop publishing, it wasn't what was needed for regular business. Plus, as a PC based consultant, I had no incentive to switch to Mac: no deals on hardware whereas in the pc world, I could build my own. Software was cheap (or easily copied) and it was easy to sell as a whole package to small businesses.
By getting everyone on the Windows/Office addiction at low costs (MS was the supplier, we consultants the dealers), MS could slowly up the price and we dealers could keep offering upgrades. Add some pretty features and the users are kept happy.
Prior to the internet, the biggest threat to pc's and their data was viruses (passed around by the sneaker-net) and that was easy to combat with AV programs and some new user education, part of which was using copied or pirated software was part of the problem. Voila, more sales!
Now the consultants are as hooked as the end users on the MS upgrade/maintaince loop.
Only a few can get off the merry-go-round of MS upgrade/patch/maintain and switch to Mac or Linux.
There's no incentive at all for a pc consultant to do so, unless the users say they want to switch to a new, easier to swallow drug (Mac). Linux offers no one in the biz any incentive to switch (the users will hate it and the biz owners won't see any savings in my consulting fees)
Now I cheerily visit my clients to install the latest fixes from MS, remove spyware, cleanup temp files, change their anti-Spam settings and commiserate with them over just how bad MS software is.
There's a whole industry outside of MS supporting their products - it's too lucrative to jump ship now!
Windows works fine for me. Is everyone else incompetent?
The reason is because, even though you can't officially say it is, M$ is a monopoly and when you depend on the product of the monopoly so much, you can't do anything because it controls the market.
It would not surprise me if this was a sort of crystalization point where the average user realizes that instead of buying a $500 celeron box to push text surf pr0n, or play UT2k4 (ps don't try it on a $500 celeron) they can guarantee a stable, secure, f'real to the core multi-user BSD based experience. No rant but widows has the same half-life and stability as a 16 yr. old's love life. It's like this for the same reason that people drive SUVs and watch daytime TV or get drunk and pick up that oversized hussy at the end of the bar (not knowing enough to want better), but that is a whole nother kettle of fish.
As a tech, my private life is not billable losing some-most-all of my family data or some-most-all of my personal time fixing things that should never hapen just because Win32 is popular is not worth a Stack of Sony Vaios. settle for less or worse and that is what you keep.
Win32 is dodge Mac is Mercedes, it is not about speed or stability it is about 'total cost of ownership' and safety. And the ever elusive definition of value. I am writing this on a 500MHZ pismo that makes the commute to DC daily and runs like a champ. It routinely runs 8-12 of this years apps AND a DVD window without thrashing, but it is about 4.5 years old and reaching the point where I can pass it off to my son and spend another five years with a new (or even slightly used PowerBook G4)
so I bet you $500 that you can buy a computer that you can be proud of
And if not what do you lose? Spyware, malware, Virus alerts security holes...
--Shaddup and support your local PBS station Plan for it
Okay, first the obligatory note that I've done my share of Microsoft bashing in my time. I'd also be the last person to stand up and declare an MS box "secure" in almost any regard.
... let's not exxagerate just because it makes the article sound better.
That aside, there are enough problems with TFA that I feel the need to point out some issues with it.
Heck, let's look at the first sentence: "So about a year ago..." We're in the computer field here, folks. Have I complained about things that took place with Windows ME? Yeah, I have. But I also acknowledge that what's out today can be a lot different from what was available a year ago.
Certainly if I were writing an article about what was wrong with something, I'd check to make sure I was reviewing a recent edition. SP2, while not the ultimate solution to everyone's problems, is a darn sight better than what the author is writing about. Would I put my parents online with just the built-in firewall? Probably not long-term, no. But I certainly wouldn't be afraid that within four minutes they'd be "DOA."
Also, when the author is posting the rhetorical "why not a Mac?" questions, he throws out lines like: "I know Macs are (well, were) more expensive, even though they're really not..." which is, well, disingenuous at best. I've had several Macs, and loved them all -- but yeah, guess what? They were several times more expensive than the beige-box PCs I'd put together from my local shop, even after all the "video cards and sound cards and disk burners to make it comparable to a Mac." There are lots of reasons to love Macs
All in all, the article reads as a whiny post to me, rather than anything well thought-out. There are reasons Windows sucks in many ways, but this article just rehashes the tired old "my hardware is better than your hardware" stuff we all (I hope) got sick of years ago.
The biggest problem with Windows is that Microsoft gave a very powerful OS to Joe Servicepack who has NO CLUE how to get it stable and keep it stable.
Ok so how do you explain OS X's security/stability? I got fed up with my brother and wife getting spyware/adware/viruses in windows (even a good firewall can't stop email viruses or spyware). I got them both using macs at their last upgrade cycle (about a year and a half ago) and neither of them has had a problem since. But guess what OS X is no toy OS, I use it on a daily basis for network programming, system administration, java development, everything. I can get into the guts of the system and do anything, and for multimedia mac kills windows.
Point is, Apple managed to release a very powerful OS that Joe Servicepack (or my wife or 16 year old brother) can use every day to do things they need to do, without having to worry about virus updates, spyware updates, etc. No viruses, No hacks, no slowdowns, no system reloads, everything just works.
So if Apple can do it, why can't MS? MS is what Novell used to be, you have to be a sysadmin to make it run properly, but what 99.9% of people want is an OS that can run itself reliably without having to call the $300/hr tech every week.
Why is Mark Morford's SO so abjectly stupid?
Hooking any computer up to the Internet unprotected by a firewall is like having unprotected sex with everyone you see--you will catch something. Should we have sympathy for the chronically stupid? I say "no." I'd wager she's a blonde, too.
Well this may be because Linux and the Mac cant be mass produced consumer products. Remember windows deals with a few hundred million units to distribute, ensure compatability with hardware, give some ease of use and standard look & feel, and then deal with hundreds of thousands of tech support calls a day. Linux does not have the common look & feel across distributions or even among programs in many distros. Also most companies wouldnt be able to handle the legistics of dealing with so many customers. Lastly the ease of use of Linux is still awful (even with Linspire). Dealing with things like Drivers (especialy video card drivers that are updated montly), updates (most distros dont have a good update and patching system), and installing of applications (which often install apps in odd locations of the file system and place the shortcuts in folders that break the navigation bar's system of classifying files). The only way to get the avarage person without their own tech support member of their family would be to give on site service and support contracts for helping out with these things. Training classes would also probebly be required. Buisness linux is easy, most distros have the basic buisness applications highly integrated into their installs and are mostly logical where they place the links for them. But once you add things like heavy multimedia use, games, ect you get into problems with normal people using it. As for Mac the problem is the economics of scale. That is to say there is no scale when it comes to a mac currently. Microsoft and Linux has it easy, they dont run on propetary hardware systems so they dont have to also take care of hardware construction and design. As such Apple simply would find it hard to deal with suddenly having to deal with tens of thousands of units moved a day. They would also have to deal with support contracts (though they can outsource those). Since they have usualy only one source for each peice of hardware all you have to look to is the iPod shortage due to lack of little hard drives last christmas to see the problem. On the other side Mac has tightly controled and integrated hardware which makes hardware problems less likely and allows almost all updates for the system to be done though the OSX's update system. Now the problems for both systems is once they start getting more popular with the avarage consumer then the user becomes the major weak link in security (Current Mac and Linux users are rather well versed in their OS currently I belive). This with a larger install base will make these systems a target for Viri, Spyware, Adware, ect. Now these are only a few of the problems with moving to another OS. To date there is no real alternitive for Windows users to move to on mass.
Any tard who plugs ANY machine into a DSL/Cablemodem/Broadband connection with no protection gets every virus, trojan and bit of spyware they deserve.
Congrats. You've just described at least 95 percent of all Windows users. Perhaps they'd be better suited with something better designed, and easier to maintain. Like a Mac for example.
For every annoying gentoo user, are three even more annoying anti-gentoo crybabies. Take Yosh from #Gimp for example.
You see it right here on /.
People simply don't believe that there actually are reasons why Windows in particular has deep problems that are nigh impossible for Redmond to fix, because they've been using Windows and in many cases DOS for years, and each new release from Redmond is a bit better for them than the last, they just figure the non-Windows apologists are behind the times, that Windows is better now.
Mac users used to be like this, too, back in the '90s, back when Mac OS was a pile of junk, before OS X. They didn't believe that concurrent multitasking was a good idea, or that a system could be responsive if it didn't give "the application" all the CPU time it needed. Systems like the Amiga or later Windows 9x (yes, really) weren't really any better. They couldn't be, everyone knew the Mac was the best.
It's normal. People who haven't experienced a better system really don't believe that having their cars catch on fire six miles from the dealership is avoidable.
Point of order: if Macs or even Linux desktops (*shudder*) were the dominant connection mechanism to the Internet, then that's where the bulk of the malware would be aimed. If Linux desktops (*hork* *ghack* *hurl*) ever become the dominant environment, then someone somewhere will be asking "Why does Linux suck?" on Slashdot about five times weekly. All that's really necessary is for alternative commodity-priced and consumer-ready platforms to reach a critical mass. Then they become interesting to the virus, Trojan, and adware/spyware crowd. The first viruses were aimed at Macs, lest we forget the lessons of history. And it's not that any given platform sucks, sucks harder, or doesn't suck. What sucks is that people exist with nothing better to do than write these little cyber-gremlins in the first place. Put the blame where it belongs, Cowboy.
Heck, if I could get a contract with my employer that forced them to send me a check even though I screw up everything I do, I definately would go for it.
That is called a "Union". Popular for that very reason...
Windows has major security flaws found and not necessarily fixed in a regular basis. Plus, it has a idiot-friendly interface, attracting users with less brain than would be necessary to breath while you think. You mix these things and voilá, windows sux. But don't you think brainless windows lovers deserve this kind of problem?
(oh, yes, I run Linux - Gentoo. And althogh it's hard to install, it's MUCH MORE EASY to install software on it. Like "hey, I want firefox. Emerge firefox". So cute. But my parents run windows and I put them behind a hardware firewall. They never got viruses or spywares. Also, they have brain enough to ask me to make their home network safer. That's a big difference. And they don't run any kind of cpu-eating antivirus. Only thunderbird for mail, firefox for web and openoffice. So cute, huh? )
If a Linux box had the same problem, and people said that Linux sucks, people here would immediately rise to Linux's defense, saying the user is not setting up the system properly (running as root, no firewall, etc),
I did not say that computers should be maintenance free. But let me ask this.
Where the tires brand new?
If your buddy had just gotten 4 brand new tires and one had blown out after four minutes of driving and when you got them fixed the mechanic said they where under inflated would you blame your friend or the tire shop?
BRAND NEW is the key. Four Minutes!
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Why does a crappy article like this show up on Slashdot?
Why? We'll never know.
Personally, I've never experienced any of the described problems on my Windows machine... nor on my Linux machine, nor my Windows / Coop Linux box.
t ml
Of course, I've also never downloaded malware from the Internet nor have I hooked up a machine to the Internet without some sort of firewall.
Compare all of the current versions to Windows 1.0, Linux 0.97c (the first copy I downloaded), and the original Mac. All of these OS's have made leaps and bounds progress.
What do you expect? If I drove my Hummer off a cliff while attempting to off-road it, you think the manufacturer would / should apologize or even consider it his fault? I'm sure he'd be happy to sell me another one, though.
Here's another's opinion that contradicts the article's opinion that you might find amusing (although a little outdated)
(Copy and paste, referrers aren't allowed) http://wildbill.nulldevice.net/archives/2003_08.h
Let's not be naive.....windows is the only game in town for the broad spectrum of home PC users.....the average PC user doesnt know there are a few linux distros out there that will install virtually autonomously and surf, email, and word process. Gamers are still almost completely out in the cold.
As for suing M$....come on, with the army of lawyers they have......
You want a better question? Try asking why we're so apathetic that we still havent put up a cry over the EULAs that allow software manufacturers to disavow all responsibility for their product and keep all control.
Slashdot's EvilAlien asks: Why Does Mark Morford's Significant Other Suck? Afterall, the amount of malware circulating which targets any number of OSes is well known, particularly the fact that the vast majority attack the very dominant Windows platform. It is irresponsible and possible even stupid to connect any computer directly to the Internet without benefit of a firewall or without having been patched. The availability of patches, SP2 on CD for free, personal firewalls, antivirus and antispyware applications, and other security measures should lead everyone to toss accusations of negligence at users like Mark Morford's Significant Other.
perl -e 'print $i=pack(c5, (41*2), sqrt(7056), (unpack(c,H)-2), oct(115), 10)'
"Not a very accurate analogy. Wouldn't it suck if the car were to unconditionally burst into flames unless you were sure to also purchase an extra $1000 in "safety features" and have them installed perfectly before ever attempting to drive it? (And without the dealer actually telling you this.)
"
Then Linux must suck too. It has the same problems.
TV's don't require maintenance. Cars do, but they tell you that when you buy it, and even give you a little book with a chart that tells you what maintenance you'll need after how many months-- at least they did withevery car I've ever purchased. They even gave me a list of authorized service centers in my area.
Have you ever purchased a computer and had someone give you a little chart about how often to run patches on what, how often to defrag, and everything else? I haven't. Does dell give you a list of "authorized maintenance shops" in your area, where you can take your computer in and they'll give you a tune up?
So no one is telling customers the sort of maintenance they need to do or where to get it done... Why wouldn't they assume that it's like a TV? Plug it into the electrical socket, plug the cable in, and use it until it breaks or you decide you want a better one.
I'll believe it when I see it.
Never let a lack of data get in the way of a good rant.
"After wtaching his significant other's Windows PC drown in a sea of viruses and worms after only 4 minutes on her new DSL connection" No firewall or anti-virus? Well I say welcome to the learning process. You'll know better next time. You're going into a war zone without a shield??!! Its not all microsofts fault, that hackers and virus writers will be around even if MS isn't. They're are the ones to blame. "The McAfee site claims a whopping 91 percent of PCs are infected." Is this counting cookies as spyware? "Mac owner everywhere on the planet simply looks at all this viral chaos and spyware noise and Microsoft apologia and shrugs." I use Windows, And I look at all the "chaos" and shrug too.
Ok so how do you explain OS X's security/stability?
Because the average Mac user treats their computer like a WebTV.
If there had been news articles running for well over 10 years that indicated that plugging in a TV right from the store would cause it to fail, but that you could insert a device between the TV and the wall that would prevent this problem, then yes, your SO has a problem .
This comment is guaranteed*
*not guaranteed
Switch from Windows to Linux? Sure, if you are comfortable with computers in general. Most of our mom's or wife's don't qualify here...
Switch from Windows to Macintosh? Sure, if you are willing to pay more for upgrades and have much smaller selection of application software to choose from.
In short, there are *no* compelling arguments to switch for most people!
Many of the posters here were quick to point the finger at Microsoft for their perceived lack of quality. However, regardless of what you think about the relative quality of Microsoft's products one must concede that Windows gets the vast majority of the attention from virus writers, crackers, and other malcontents. It is not fair, for example, to conclude from these attacks alone that an alternative operating system, such as Linux or MacOS, would be more secure if it were placed in a similar market position (most popular OS run by 90%+ users out there). There could be many holes in the alternative operating system just waiting to be exposed when the previously mentioned malcontents turn their full efforts and attention to the new arrival in the number one slot. I am not trying to suggest that Windows is the best choice available, but I submit that one cannot draw a well founded conclusion about the relative quality or security of an operating system until it too has been in the hot seat and faced the brunt of the attackers' efforts over a period of years.
I've seen the reluctance (hell, I've seen it in myself... I've been a steadfast Mac user since 1984, even during the "dark years"* [1993-1997]) and I've also seen the light.
I sincerely hope that the Mini changes some creaky minds, if only (and this is the usual litany these days) to provide MORE STIMULATING COMPETITION for that maker-of-game-machine-or-sql-server-OS'es, Microsoft!
*By the way, the apple "dark days" were completely manufactured by the media, as the real problem was that the Apple clones were stealing bottom line from Apple, Mac marketshare was actually INCREASING, yet the media insisted on focusing only on Apple. Leading Steve to kill off the clones. Gil Amelio was still a poor CEO, however...
Those holes that are in your windows box when you plug it into the net already have patches written for them.
It doesn't take a long look at Secunia's listings for Microsoft software to see that gaping ("highly critical") holes from literally years back have not been patched yet. In the case of MSIE, for example, there is a "highly critical" and unpatched flaw from August 2003 that allows arbitrary code execution on the victims machine just be visiting a web site. This is possible because Microsoft allows any web site to install anything signed by Microsoft without user intervention or even notification, even if it contains unpatched flaws that the perpetrator then takes advantage of. So in the case of this attack, the malicious site installs a flawed Visual Studio ActiveX plugin without the users knowledge that it then exploits to run arbitrary code on the victims machine. And how is this the fault of the box makers again? This is just one example, not only of an old and major unpatched security flaw, but of a mind bogglingly stupid policy that makes Microsoft Windows insanely insecure.
Steve
--- What?
SP2 has been the default OEM install since last August.
you have to ask? Really... /.
You must be new to
Because loaded questions like this don't serve as a reasonable base for a conversation.
/. Where many the de-facto backround noise is anti-MS and Pro-Linux by default.
But hey, this is
uR iGn0ranc3, Their Power
Uh, try some Slashdotters. This Slashbot would love to be able to buy Apple hardware without their lame OS on it. Well, maybe not so much, but I couldn't care less if you restricted both Apple and Windows from preinstalling an OS on a system, except that then you'd have to prevent anyone from preinstalling. Even Linux. Even devices like Tivo maybe. Don't make no sense. Especially since just about every home computer ever sold since the days of the Apple II has come with some sort of OS on it (in the case of my beloved c-64s it was hardcoded in ROM, even).
iPod proves windows is losing? They're not even competing in the same marketspace! My toaster doesn't run Windows either (yet), so obviously Redmond is losing the war? Puh-lease! And besides, even Apple had to cave and release iTunes for Windows... because limiting iPod use to OSX users was killing their market share.
And don't tout OSX as a gaming OS please. With the exceptions of a few staunch cross-platform gaming houses (granted, some of them are big exceptions) gaming on OSX pretty much blows. Anyone who wants to play today's games today, and not in six months or a year, is using Windows. Hell, even Bungie made the leap, and they were one of the Macintosh die-hard shops.
I'm not a microsoft apologist by any means, their security is indeed pretty poor. If it improves as much as stability has since '95 though, watch out.
Ita erat quando hic adveni.
...Mac OS is secure. Surely if he doesn't state what Windows his SO is using we should assume he isn't running OSX (well, maybe if she's running XP.)
I've been a software engineer on Irix/HP-Unix/Solaris(SunOS)/Linux(mostly slackware and mandrake)/NT3.5[.51/4]/2000/XP for 15 years and I've NEVER been hit with a virus on any of those systems. Some of it is luck, most of it is caution.
People who are STUPID enough to connect their machine to the internet, regardless of OS, without a software firewall or without using a router, should expect to be punished.
You don't think my Linux boxes aren't getting scanned for SSH vulnerabilities? LOL.
Slashdot shouldn't have given this author the publicity of printing his article. There are much better ways to deconstruct the illusion of 'Microsoft Quality.'
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Isn't this entire post "flamebait?" I got marked flamebait when I replied to someone that my G4 powerbook runs too hot and has short battery life and that I wished Apple would do something like Intel centrino. Oh slashdot, must you be so transparent?
Shoving is the answer.
Windows does indeed "suck" on some technical points, but it does not suck all that bad (talking about 2000, XP and 2003 here).
The problem is the customer. Not the product. Microsoft makes whatever the average (well, very average) customer wants. They keep saying this. Just listen. There are open security holes in most Microsoft products, but a lot of them come from design choices that were made consciously because there was more demand on some features than there was potential anger from the customers the product was aimed at, at the time.
And even so, with some minimal education before using a computer running Windows, you just never get any virus or any worm. I've been using Windows for years, and I've never gotten any of those. Ever.
The problem that Microsoft is now facing is that they actually counted on their customers' stupidity to be successful, but I think they never realized how stupid they would be. Microsoft has been "out-dumbed". So to speak.
I agree though that they have given the masses the proper weapon to shoot themselves in the foot - and that they must be held accountable for it. When people open their eyes, Microsoft will become what it should have been in the first place: a software company, nothing more, nothing less.
Whatever happens in the future, I strongly suggest to promote alternatives. That's just healthy.
Ummm, WITH antivirus software how do you know that it's clean as a whistle?
Here's a hint:
What comes first the virus or the scanner?
How many times have you seen reviews of virus or spyware software where each version finds different sub-sets of the total infected load on a PC?
Assuming antivirus software provides 100% protection is simply naive.
I would rather opt for a more secure OS out of the box than a weak one that requires 3 or 4 programs to provide adequate protection.
Longhorn will not be the answer. Managed code will not fix users from breaking their machine. One of the first and foremost reasons why computers get messed up is because of user mistakes. Using social engineering a virus tricks them into running something they shouldn't. No amount of "managed code" will protect the user from pressing the wrong buttons.
The answer has been staring at us for 20 years now. Many of the security problems in Windows are born of legacy. And ironically they were problems born from not learning lessons learned by other Operating Systems.
But in typical fashion, Microsoft is throwing more software at the flaws instead of fixing the fundemental design which created the issue in the first place. The whole chain about any virus using IE as an vector should show you this.
There are fundemental issues that were learned by other systems along time ago that MS continues to ignore and throw more software upon in an attempt to obscure the problems. So many things would go away if users never had the previliage to screw up their system easily. So many things would go away if the web browser was treated as a viewer instead of a platform for execution. So many tools could be simplified and made less confusing if they fixed the underlying problems...but they won't.
I'm sorry to sound like flamebait but I'm sick of it. Longhorn will get released and people will harass me on what in the world "code group permissions" are. People can't figure out IE's "zones" and they want me to explain to users how "code groups" work?! Thanks Microsoft...thanks for completely avoiding the problem.
Did you actually read the comment, he was suppporting preinstalls by saying that clean installs are very vulnerable.
They simply aren't availbable on Macs - DUH
And no, I'm not talking about stupid word processors or image editing programs.
I'm talking about healthcare apps.
We run 3 hospitals with Windows as the client. That's 8000 users. I am part of the Citrix team - we have over 3600 concurrent connections to our farm. These are clinical appliactions. We are a paperless hospital. There are no paper charts. Everything is digital. Nurses use Wyse Winterms at the bedside. What do they see? A (highly secured) windows desktop.
The Windows platform works well for us. Patients lives depend on this platform.
Screw this author and his old lady using Word on a Mac. When you can replace the clinical apps in a hospital with Macs - write about it . Until vendors offer their applications on a different platform what choice do we have?
geezus... It pisses me off that people think that Windows users and admins sit around fighting spyware and running word all day. Our job is to keep our applications UP. We are judged by our uptime, not our platform choices...
I was naive like you once. You won't realize how bad you have things until you try something good. Once you get used to being productive, and not having to constantly fight against your computer to try to get anything done, you won't be able to imagine how you ever put up with windows.
Probably for the same reason that the metric system is so hard to adopt. If someone said Spanish was a better language do you really think everyone would switch? I mean English is full of exceptions and strange anomalies. If English is so bad we should want to change right? But we don't.
"Creatives" is a catch-all term used by management and executives in various media industries to describe the artists, writers and other talent who make the text, images, and sounds in ads and other forms of commercial communication. It's not my buzzword; I guess it just sounds better than "labor" or "employee" to PHB ears.
Those who complain about affect & effect on
Everyone is mentioning games. Aren't there computer users who don't play games on their computers? I know I have drifted a bit from gaming over the past couple years. Why these people switched to another platform?
Because linux is sooooo perfect that only the gods use it. Oh and linux is sooo user-friendly that its users are not arrogant at all about considering themselves computing gods!!! macs are a different story. they're expensive. and there's nevere enough software for the mac. I do like linux and its users but c'mon. You know a bunch of you are very conceited. Microsoft is still best at *showing* an attractive and friendly face to it's end users. Why people doesn't like reading better than stupid football/soap operas that's a mistery.
Ever since buying a $50 router from Best Buy 3 years ago, my several windows installations and subsequent updates during after have gone virus/spyware free without exception according to McAfee, AVG, AdAware, Spybot, and a wide assortment of other apps. On top of that, I have found myself confronted with less instances of virii/spyware than I can count on my fingers... and those times were only because my stupid little brother used my machine behind my back to look at porn.
Now, I'm not such an emblazened supporter of Microsoft Windows to deny that it has holes, but by the same measure I'm not so naive to think that *nix and MacOS don't.
At Mississippi State University, the security portion of the Computer Science graduate program (from which i come from) ran a multitude of tests on both windows machines and *nix, patched and unpatched, router protected and otherwise. While we found that the windows machines ended up with more infections... much MUCH more... the *nix machines had the more severe infections... very VERY severe. A handful of linux machines of assorted distros (inluding RedHat and Gentoo), "fully patched", were left on the outside of a router/firewall and infected within 5 minutes. A handful of these machines even had rogue processes running under root. THAT kind of scenario scares me more than any onslaught of slave windows machines, because the vast majority of windows machines lack many tools i would consider "useful for hacking, cracking, or otherwise devious behavior", an in any case would simply be too damned slow to do much more than annoy anyways.
So, no, I'm so inclined to believe that Windows is so much "worse" than *nix or MacOS... simlpy more popular and more widely used, and thus a bigger target (at least if you're going from a security angle... i REALLY don't see the argument from an applications or UI angle as "better" is then simply based on acceptance and/or preference). To believe otherwise, only shows how insidiously brainwashed or ignorant you have become.
Back to the topic at hand though, the real lesson to be learned is this:
GET YOURSELF A FUCKING ROUTER, STOP VISITING X AND Y PORN SITE, AND STOP OPENING ATTACHMENTS WITHOUT HAVING FIRST SCANNED THEM FOR VIRII!!! IT IS CALLED COMMON SENSE YOU FUCKING TROGLODYTES!!!
Common sense may not be a perfect solution, or even a solution to the problem at all. But it IS a big enough roadblock to deter all but the most dedicated attempts to breach security.
> For all the geek whining about how Windows sucks,
> and spending hours in vi and obsolete man pages is
> fun, you'd think they can at least RTFM.
Pray tell, in which manual would one find the admonition to never, EVER plug the computer into an Internet connection?
-Mark
I won't make any changes to it, no patches, no turning off of services. Anybody want to bet that it will be compromised fairly quickly? If Linux was the dominant operating system it would receive a lot of attention. Now granted, the design is better and therefore it presents less of a profile than Windows, but I'm not going to play dumb and act like I don't have to work on keeping my Linux box secure. The same goes for Mac OS X.
Am I the only one getting sick of people comparing computers to cars? First off, the automobile has had over 100 years of engineering put into it to make it what it is today. Second, automobiles are not general purpose machines. You can't wash clothes with them, use them to build a house, use it to do your taxes, etc...
In reality, cars do nothing more than go forward, turn left/right, go backwards and brake. (I'm talking about the essence of a car, not all the fancy computer bells and whistles that you can get with them nowadays). The interface to a car is standard, well known and SPECIFIC PURPOSE. A steering wheel turns the front wheels, the brake decelerates, the accelerator pedal, you guessed it, accelerates the car.
Face it people, computers are GENERAL PURPOSE machines. We don't know what use the owner will put it to. Therefore, they are hard to learn because every software manufacturer does something a little different. This makes them extremely hard to secure. What if the "moron" user needed to use a program that had to have a hole poked in the firewall to operate?
Calling people morons because they don't spend every waking moment behind their computers gets us nowhere. Case in point, I switched back to Windows (yes, I'm behind a firewall) from Linux as my desktop OS because I got sick of having to download and install or compile 15 different libraries just to get a DVD player to work.
And offtopic a little bit, [rant]shouldn't we be past the point of having to recompile programs from source to turn on a COMPILE TIME OPTION???? If it's an option, it shouldn't be forced in COMPILE TIME![/rant]
I just finished reading the article on "Why does Windows still Suck?" I have been a PC user for about a decade now, shackled to what Redmond releases. Over the past year, I have been learning Linux and soon will be rid of Windows. The only things that keep Windows on one of my systems: games and a few programs that I use regularly. But that should change as the Linux platform grows.
Why haven't I gone Mac? Because I already have PC systems around my house. I might go Mac when I replace these systems next round.
I have been running Slackware Linux 10 for the past six odd months now. No firewall, no anti-virus, and no spy-ware detection. I have yet to see an issue and it is far more stable. Nothing has bothered my rock solid Linux in the least. I might screw it up, but those are errors between the keyboard and the chair. Sitting next to it, a Windows XP pro machine. Patched, Protected, and Locked Down. Alarms are always going off with some exploit being stopped. The thing I like best about my Linux OS, the price. It's free, but they except donations for further development. Not all distributions are free (far more inexpensive compared to Windows), there are those that come at a price and they include customer support.
All Bill Gates has done is either stolen or bought things that he couldn't develop himself. A perfect example is the recent acquisition of Giant's Anti-spy. All they did was slap the MS logo on it and began to release it. Microsoft as a whole has perpetuated nothing but stupid computer users. It has made computer users as a whole lazy when it comes to technology. They complain about windows & it's flaws, yet do nothing to protect themselves. And to think about the price of Windows, it borders on extortion. I can walk into a retailer and purchase Windows for somewhere between $200 (Home) and $300 (Professional); yet school just offered me two full legit copies of Professional for $10 each. Even at that price, I have to question myself "do I really want this buggy thing on my computer?"
If I thought it might bring about a good OS, I would storm Castle Redmond with a Torch and Pitchfork.
Ok, pray tell how does a person who buys a new Windows PC "protect it"?
1) Access the Internet and go to "Windows Update"
2) Access Microsoft Security site and read about how to protect said computer.
If one can't do those two things without your Windows box being hacked then there are problems.
Say, tell me again how you protect your "Gold CD" Windows XP without downloading all the patches ahead of time from a "protected" machine?
Thanks!
I've been using Windows (as well as other OSes) for as long as I can remember, I believe since Windows 3.0. I am currently using XP Pro, 2000 Pro and Server 2003, and I have had ZERO, yes, I said ZERO problems with Windows (other than the occasional spyware...which I no longer have a problem with thanks to MS AntiSpyware Beta 1). Am I missing something here? I've helped family member with horendous problems and I don't understand what people do on their windows machines that they get so many problems, while mine are so limited. Nothing special either...AV / hardware NAT / and Anti-Spyware is the only security. Steve
http://www.libsdl.org/projects/SDL_net/
Although quite frankly, networking is the easiest part.
how do all you dorks have time to play so many games. Oh, that's right, you all have about as much social skills as the comic book guy on the Simpsons.
Games are for kids and f*gs.
Just because it's flamebait doesn't make it false.
That's trillion, with a "t", not billion, with a "b"
You statement is just dumb and insulting. She is not a moron. She is just not a system admin.
You need to be to use Windows effectively. The fact just isn't well advertised.
Great!
Now look up "twat".
at user friendliness? Yeah, it's trolling/flame bait but so is this stupid article. Go put that in your pipe and mod it.
'Microsoft have'? Since when is 'Microsoft' a plural noun?
That's true. Fortunately, every time they want to do anything on the Internet they get "no route to host" message, so it's fairly easy to notice this common mistake.
Sincerely,
Pan Tarhei Hosé, PhD.
"Homo sum et cogito ergo odi profanum vulgus et libido."
Windows does what I want it to, when I want it to. It runs the stuff I need, and it runs the games I want. It has decent support, meaning I only have to do very general things to keep it from dying, roughly analogous to not driving a car off a bridge into a tree. The interface is simple, and designed so that I don't have to memorize different command sets to access bits of different programs.
To suck, windows would have to be insufficient for my purposes: that is, it would have to either lack one of the above capacities, or it would have to exhibit some flaw that posed enough of a problem that it presented an actual threat to my well-being and was not easily avoidable. Frankly, spyware and viruses can be prevented by the simple expedient of "not being an idiot", which I've generally gotten the hang of. (And when I slip up, there's this thing called "third party software" that makes repairing what damage I cause fairly easy. I mean, really. It's not like running the OS prevents you from running programs not published by Microsoft.)
Basically, I'm quite happy with my windows machine.
Ok, I'm done feeding the troll^H^H^H^H^Harticle now.
...it's really a sad day for America when we require a goddamn ACT OF CONGRESS to make our DVD players work properly. ~
I used to work at an office supply store, and more than half my customers didn't even know what a firewall was. Most homes still only have one computer so they don't get a router. In fact, most people think getting a second computer means they need a second cable/dsl modem. They have no idea what a router even is, or how its different from a switch or a hub.
At least the latest PC's are shipping with SP 2 installed so the ICF (better than no firewall at all) is enabled by default.
Tommy
Open Source for Open Minds
is Windows users. Where I work we sell and repair computers as well as provide internet. When something goes wrong with someone's computer, it's always our fault. So they don't pay their internet bill and come back to us six months later saying that we broke their computer and want us to fix it or give us a refund. Nevermind that they clicked on all of the smiley face pop-ups they ever see and that their 14 year old boy learned how to bypass the family-friendly content filter to download pr0n. Nevermind that they disabled their Norton AntiVirus while online since it wouldn't allow them to access some cool website or that their bank requested their credit card number and password. Nevermind that when the power went out they had their computer plugged into the clearly labelled surge protector side of the battery backup and when it came back up they decided to bypass that "little blue LinkSUS" and plug straight into their cable router because something kept saying it needed to connect to their computer. Nevermind that this happens on a weekly basis...
You're kidding, right? I've patched my Suse installation twice in the last week. Jesus, take off your blinders man,
"As the intrepid kobold companion continues his journey, he begins to wonder... if priests raises dead, why anybody die?
After wtaching his significant other's Windows PC drown in a sea of viruses and worms after only 4 minutes on her new DSL connection
Seriously, there are many reasons Windows may suck and I'm not defending still open security holes, but the specific reason in this case of auto-infection after a few minutes is most likely due to lingering Sasser worms. Since months back the RPC hole was fixed though, and SP2 fix it as well. I haven't heard of another reason anyway, and anyone is free to show me I'm wrong by pointing me to active auto-infecting worms that works even in SP2.
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
"you shouldn't have to *do* anything when you buy a new Windows computer. You should plug it in and it should be secure."
The article is just flamebait. This is the case with new systems. XP2 is installed already and the firewall is on.
"Oh, and if it's a "windows world" you'll have to tell me how I've run a successful Unix consulting business for the last 11 years without ever once owning or needing a Windows machine."
You answered your own question. Not all of us can run Unix consulting companies though.
My Linux Command of the Day site : LCOD
If only I had mod points...
Battling Beasts
Shouldn't that be "of classical greek proportions"? You could try titanic as a familiar but compatible term.
Logi - I can do anything, but not everything.
Microsoft does not need to keep backward compatibility in Longhorn. They bought VirtualPC. They only need to rewrite the video card emulation to allow for d3d, and then only up to the current version. Once that is done, they include VPC and a preinsalled WinXP image that has the emulated hardware drivers hard complied into VPC.
This solves the backward compatibility problems, even for games. It keeps people from copying the drive image to use on stand alone PC, and frees Microsoft to rewrite any part of Windows they want without the slightest thought to backward compatibility. Heck, if they really wanted to do it right, they could include an image of every version of their OS all the way back to DOS 1.0. That would make Longhorn the most backward compatible Windows yet.
Not a very accurate analogy. Wouldn't it suck if the car were to unconditionally burst into flames unless you were sure to also purchase an extra $1000 in "safety features" and have them installed perfectly before ever attempting to drive it? (And without the dealer actually telling you this.)
Yet another inaccurate analogy. The auther is referring to attacks from the outside. Not inherent bugs in the code that cause undesired operation.
A better analogy would be to say you bought a new car and door locks are optional. It won't catch fire without them, but it makes it easy for somebody to break in.
Linux.... when rebooting is for adding new hardware.
Carmack didn't adopt opengl in doom3, he's used opengl all along. You do realize there was some "quake" game people played way back when right?
And the opengl vs direct3d argument is moot. Only a moron, or a company trying to sell a 3d engine and not a game writes their own 3d engine. If you are just making a game, use an existing engine. There are already dozens of high quality, portable engines at various price points for different needs, writing your own is just dumb.
Why don't IT managers buy Macs? Because a) they don't understand them and b) Macs require far less IT bandwidth.
Less IT bandwidth means less IT managers.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
All righty. I use MS because I do pro recording, and by buying software for Microsoft instead of protools I got access to a much wider array of software for much cheaper prices. Protools runs too steep and the hardware wasn't sufficient for recording on the scale I needed. I'm pretty sure that most educated consumers of the microsoft platform have it configured for proprietary uses - and gamers are the same deal.
I will never understand how people who use macs get so preachy. Yes - you have fewer viruses. Yes - your OS is pretty. I do not care. I have much more flexibility with my PC. If I had $500 to drop on a word processor/net surfer, then I probably would. But that's all you can really use a mac for. It's an appliance - like a microwave or a refrigerator. And guess what - if everybody started using Mac tomorrow, then hackers would start releasing mac viruses. The only reason mac doesn't have them now is that it's easier to propagate them with PCs because there are more PCs (duh).
The mac is not an invulnerable castle of superiority. It's just not the mainstream. That's all. So instead of talking so much smack, just relax and let people enjoy their own choices.
Wtaching? Wwhy wis wCowboyNeal wusing wa wtachometer?
Well, when I run a SuSE 9.2 live cd, without firefox, I just plug in my usb stick that has firefox on it, and run it from that. Also have a nice home page on the stick and set firefox's home page to that, and I'm good to go.
To save myself the trouble of having to plug in the usb stick, etc. (when I'm in a hurry) I just put my Knoppix remaster in the drive and boot that instead. I put both Firefox and Opera in the remaster, and a few other things, so I have just what I want.
On a cable modem, I'm up and running without a hassle.
All is not roses, however, as only SuSE detects the sound card in this box. (I have other boxes that Knoppix picks up the sound card on, so it's just Dell's choice of a sound card, probably recommended by Microsoft, to go with the preinstalled XP.) Just a fluke that the sound card wouldn't get picked up by Knoppix, I'm sure. Can't blame Microsoft.
No, as I recall, the anti-trust settlement between the government and MS occured something like 3 days after 9/11.
I've always been suspicious that those infamous "NSA_KEYS" had something to do with the settlement..... I could easily see MS proposing something like "drop this nonsense and we'll give you boys all the inside crypto keys you want, we'll keep Windows insecure and you can keep everyone owned.."
Check... You'll see, settlement talks during GW's tenure were even in NY as I recall!
They've been found guilty after all... No other convicted criminal is/has been allowed to keep their illegally gotten wealth after being convicted!... It's unprecidented, but TOTALLY slipped by in the hysteria after 9/11!..... There's a government connection here, they certainly wouldn't let me keep the money after robbing a bank!... It's unprecidented!
Why oh why does Windows always set up accounts as administrator by defalt? Linux doesn't. OSX doesn't. It just doesn't make sense for Windows to do it.
I got tired of cleaning out my in-laws' computer so I installed W2K and set them up with a restricted user account. Since I've done that he's been virus and spyware free.
It's such a SIMPLE solution for Microsoft to implement. Why won't they do it?! Logging in as administator now and then to install software is MUCH easier than reinstalling your OS.
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
Come on this sounds likea wives tale, only four mins being on the internet? That is just bad external protection, and if he truely set up Windows XP without lying about the time it should have had the Firewall (though stupid should keep stuff at bay for more than 4 mins). I really think this is a hoax or just unscrupulas jornalism.
You would only have a point if OS X were made by some company other than Apple.
Apple makes their computers and makes the OS specifically for their computer--you can't run their OS on any non-Apple machine. And you are essentially given the OS for free when you buy the machine, you only pay for significant upgrades.
If Microsoft made their own computers, they would be justified in putting whatever OS they wanted on them. It ought to similarly be the case that Dell or HP or IBM should be able to put whatever OS that they want on the machines they sell. Instead they are coerced by Microsoft, an external company, to put that Microsoft's OS on the machines they sell, regardless of whether the end-user wants that OS installed.
I responded to this in my journal.
When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a skull.
>The original poster said four minutes! Not a year, not a month, not a day but four minutes!
Time moves differently in different areas. People are still driving cars which are 15 years old. My computer is barely 5, and I already want a new one. Computers have a much shorter lifecycle than cars.
"And don't tout OSX as a gaming OS please. With the exceptions of a few staunch cross-platform gaming houses (granted, some of them are big exceptions) gaming on OSX pretty much blows."
This is due to one and only one factor: Installed base. More Macs==more Mac games. It's only a matter of time.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
Apple putting Apple software on Apple hardware is wrong? How?
Microsoft bullying vendors (who are not Microsoft themselves) into pre-installing Windows is another fucking matter.
We are not hypocrites. You're just not very smart.
If you need a firewall in order to use the 'net safely, why isn't it bundled and included in the price of these $499 pcs?
This is why I get irritated at people who constantly go off about how much cheaper PCs are than macs. They never mention these little things, and these little things start to add up real fast.
You go out and pay $70-$100 for a firewall, get a mcafee virus scan subscription for $35/year. Oh, just to be safe you better grab yourself the latest copy of AdAware, another $40-ish dollars down the drain. Holy cow, your $499 pc now cost you like $700 for the bare minimum! And that's just the beginning of the pain you're in for. You can't use your regular browser, no sir! You need Firefox to avoid totally foobaring your computer. Download and install that.
Meanwhile, my barely-computer-literate sister's iBook is online without a firewall all the time. She did what the computer recommended and enabled autoupdate and forgot about it. She didn't need to go out and buy any extra software or hardware to use the internet.
Yeah, Wintel-ites may get a whole bunch of copies of FPS games with new, inventive graphics. I get the privledge of having a hassle-free computer.
Slashdot. It's Not For Common Sense
No group forms distinct marketing segments, except for marketing directors.
Having said that, the computer needs of a publisher or an architect are pretty different than those of a code jockey or an IT flack.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
That assumes that virus/adware/spyware purveyors were doing it because they dislike/hate/have issues with Microsoft. I find it hard to believe that, I think they are simply opportunistic.
More like if one car brand were more easily broken into than another. ( Your counter argument ought probably be that "no, its not that they are more easily broken into, there are just many many more of them..." There is a debate there, the truth is probably part of both... )
Thieves would target that brand, as the return on investment would be higher. That and most customers dont know to buy/find/install the AntiSideSwipe cage that fits around the car and protects it from all others ( firewall ).
emt 377 emt 4
Bad analogy, bud.
The internet is the highway, OS/Apps the vehicles. Drunk drivers are the miscreants --> Viri, Trojans, Spyware, whatever. The drunks/viri are dangers to all the other drivers out there. With more and more drunks on the road every day, the regular users need more protection... seatbelts/airbags --> firewalls/viruschecks and/or VEHICLES THAT ARE IMMUNE TO IMPACTS FROM DRUNKS (safer, more secure OS.)
If I plan on driving the same roads with drunks, I'd rather have a homebuilt M1A1 TANK than a mass produced Jugo.
http://www.winsupersite.com/reviews/winserver2k3_g old1.asp
Windows NT was originally developed for Intel's x86 successor processor, the i860, which fizzled due to project management problems at Intel. This processor was, for the time, a fully-featured RISC processor which indeed implemented protected mode. Windows NT was originally a microkernel which pro-actively utilizes multitasking to offload kernel chores into userspace wherever possible. Over time the microkernel functionality, including the display server, would all be eliminated as everything was eventually factored into the kernel itself.
Windows NT was designed with isolated (and therefore relatively trusted) business networks in mind. Although not initially designed as such, mid-90's releases featured multi-user support( although not in the traditional sense of a time-sharing operating system) through NT LAN Manager, allowing centralized administration and logins on a business network. And indeed, the 4.x series brought full multi-user support with Terminal Server Edition.
The drastic change in requirements, which I noted in my first post, was a move from isolated, relatively trustworthy business networks to the commodity Internet, a completely untrustworthy network. This was coupled with development of a browser which, sadly, was designed with ease-of-use in mind over security, for tasks as dangerous as installing software and upgrading the operating system, something previously unheard of via the web.
These two problems, the dramatic design paradigm shift in NT from isolated business networks to the commodity Internet and the misprioritization of IE's design and implementation goals, which accomplished their short-term business ends (crushing Netscape) extremely well, are the reason Windows is being plagued by the problems it has today.
Go to MS' website and find the page where you can download ALL the critical patches for XP. Actually, don't bother, becasue it doesn't exist. So if I install XP fresh and want to patch it, I can go to Windows Update and hope that the patches download and install before my box gets owned...and I've seen freshly-imaged PCs get compromised after being on the network for less than two minutes. Or I can use a patched machine to hunt through the MS website and download all the patches one by one. Ridiculous!
Service Packs are not sufficently up to date, and don't get me started on SP2. Why don't they have ONE page to download all the security patches so I can then burn them to CD? If such a page does exist, they do a great job of hiding it, which supports my point.
Never let a lack of data get in the way of a good rant.
If the roles were reversed and Macintosh and/or Linux had the marketshare that Windows does now, then I would be willing to bet that we would be sitting here griping about THEM. It's a well known fact that it's the big guy on the block that's always targetted. Give Mac a 90% share of the market and you'll have thousands more Mac Viruses and you would have the Windows community thumbing their collective noses at Steve Jobs for creating such a flawed peace of software.
More like "Linux would be a car so unfriendly you'd need to be a mechanic to buy it, much less drive it."
---
Mod me down, you fucking twits. Go ahead. I dare you.
(I read with sigs off.)
Well, we did. So let's download them, burn each of them to a CD-ROM, pick an appropriate pen to write the respective download URL and these words
on the disks, and spread them all across the campuses of our schools or companies. And of the one you like best, just make another dozen copies a day...Then, next time you get that desperate call from someone claiming their computer is broken, and asking you to fix their Wintel, in most cases you'll be able to help them simply by saying...
There were a few vendors (*cough*quark*cough*) who took forever in porting their apps over, but we're through that now. Besides, the longer Quark took, the longer InDesign had to take over.
I use Macs to up my productivity, so up yours Microsoft!
what is the difference between a 'clean install' and a 'preinstall'.
always mosh clockwise
And aren't Jaguars famous for being finicky unreliable peices of expensive shit?
don't forget unsafe.
Your *best* argument is the following:
Tell me how to secure a new windows PC without buying additional hardware, or obtaining service packs/hotfixes from a third party?
Microsoft still tells folks to "go to windows update" which involves connecting to the internet. They also don't account for the large number of dial-up accounts. Every try downloading XP - SP2 on a dialup account?
Oh, and about that CD that they make available: With patches coming out *every* month (and sometimes more often) that are *critical* it's almost impossible to use this to be "up to date".
There's a lot to apologize for here, so let them keep trying.
You didn't ask me what I meant. I was being a smartass.
If you talk about personal responsibility and "precautions against evil", you should make yourself personally responsible for using a certain free software alternative and play a part in seriously reducing the problem.
while (!asleep()) sheep++
Didn't you know that on Slashdot, everything is George W. Bush's fault? By the way some people talk around here, you'd think the DMCA was put into law under the Bush administration instead of under the Clinton administration in the 90s...
Like... a gazillion Windows-only programs ? Fred's garden designer ? Comfort Soft club manager 3.4 ? The whole load of stuff most people here give a damn about but that make computers worthwhile for non-geek types ?
Just playing dump and pretend that being able to run ten different smtp servers on your computer replaces the garden designer for Dad who wants to redesign his garden over the winter does not count.
Yeah, Virtual PC, I know.
Microsoft has more viruses and spyware because there are more copies of Windows and hence a more attractive taret for attacks, but primarily because it has inherent and intentional design defects. That is definitely Microsoft's fault. For example, a huge number of Window's attacks were due to ActiveX. Microsoft create ActiveX as their response to Java applets. Everybody told them they were insane, but Microsoft didn't care because they were afraid that if Java enabled browsers could do things that IE could not, customers might switch. The slew of ActiveX viruses was inevitable, and surely Microsoft was aware of the problem (since they were warned repeatedly), but they did it anyway. That has been their modus operandi from day one; do whatever it takes to keep a customer regardless of how much damage it does to the customer. Unfortunately, Windows user's, just as Bill Gates predicted, ARE like heroin users. They know it is killing them, but they can't stop.
Since colour and honour lost their 'u's, aluminium was stripped of its 'i' and "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics" was attributed to Mark Twain.
I'm a gamer.
this is Informative?
So the biggest problem with Windows is the users? The solution is clear, then, get rid of Windows users: have them all buy a Mac or install Linux.
And then we'd be hearing instead, "The biggest problem with MacOS/Linux is that Apple/Linus gave a very powerful OS to Joe Servicepack who has NO CLUE how to get it stable and keep it stable."
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
Moderators, you may wish to refer here prior to making your moderation selection.
Windows 98? Sucked. No arguments from anyone about that. Windows ME? Sucked. Again, little defense even from MS. Windows 2000? Not as sucky--marked improvement in stability. Windows XP? Much better. Not perfect, but glad to see it's better.
If you're going to run Windows the simple fact of life you're going to have to get used to is this: high maintenance. Well, maybe it's not all that bad...
- Patch and then patch again.
- Before you even think about plugging into the network, patch it from CDs after you re-install the OS (don't trust what comes from the factory)
- install your anti-virus and your adware prophylactics before you think about going on-line, too.
- Install Firefox and turn off that damned built-in firewall on XP2 after you install a 3rd party firewall package like ZoneAlarm.
- Don't log-in as Administrator ever and make sure you're using a 15 character password with a few unicode characters in it for all accounts.
- Install a firewall router on your LAN and work from behind it.
- Don't use the same password on any other computer.
- Update your virus DAT files daily--maybe twice a day
- Run RKDetector everynow and then just to make sure.
- Boot from a Knoppix CD once in a while to make sure you're not owned.
- If you enabled any kind of services, turn them off.
If you're running linux, you'll need to practice the same kind of vigilance. Those boxes are 0wn3d more often by "real" people instead of zombie processor or worms. In fact, crackers like Linux boxes much more than Windows because they're more fun and harder to 0wn.Macs are easily knocked over two if you're running services like SSH. A dictionary attack is trivial.
They all still suck
I might know what I'm talkin' about, but then again, this is Slashdot...
They're on to something, it's called registry bloat and it's usually the reason I end up reinstalling. Also, it seems every other program you install these days has a background helper process to engage in file association wars or to just piss you off.
However, if you are careful with your machine and what you install, windows can be an incredibly productive work environment. IMNSHO, expert users can achieve common goals quicker with windows than linux because linux always needs hacking. It can do anything, but it always has a price. Windows is easy and consistent and I like that. The command line OTOH is extremely powerful and doesn't change like the GUI of the month. In the end, when the sh*t hits the fan, I reach for a windows box with putty installed.
By comparison, is the author a moron? Can he write a cohesive article without saying "and and and and" all the time?
Obviously the idiot can't satisfy his SO which is why she feels the need to visit porn sites which kill her with a barrage of popups.
I mean seriously, 4 minutes. Gimme a break. Thats BS and he knows it. Typical user installs DSL, goes to Hotmail, searches on Google/Yahoo, and then starts wondering what to do next.
For Heavens sake quit your whining about MS and do something (a bit more) productive - and mods please stop allowing crap articles like this. Soon enough Slashdot will just be known as an anti-MS website...oh wait...
4 minutes my big hairy ass...
I'm sorry, but your comment doesn't make any sense at all. First of all, Apple makes the hardware and the software of the package, so what you are saying is equivalent to saying. Hey, Sun shouldn't install Solaris on their servers, but then again, what else will run on it? On the other hand, Microsoft doesn't make any piece of hardware in the computers that Windows comes pre-installed on, therefore OEM's should have a choice of what to put on their machines.
1. Comes with PC, "there is choice?"
2. Plays games, "Linux doesn't do 3d!"
3. Advanced Technology, "we're serious developers".
[the last one is from my interview with a RiM employee].
Basically people are ignorant about computers and it serves them right. If they only picked up a "nerdy" computer mag or two they would learn about the existence of linux and bsd...
I say in this world of vast reams of available information if you still end up with a lemon computer... well you suck.
And for crying out loud stop buying Dells... fuck, Celeron P4 cpus are worthless!! That's why the boxes are cheap!!!
Tom
Someday, I'll have a real sig.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but (barring big security holes) you can't actually get one of these nasties passively. I mean that you must run something on your computer, or give an ActiveX control permission, or something like that, right? You're not going to get one of these things just from browsing HTML and Javascript. You can catch several worms simply by being connected to the internet - you don't even have to be using it - just connected. You can get even more malware (viral, spy, trojan, etc) simply by surfing the net. Some, like Cool Web Search, are brilliant at evading ALL anti-virus, and anti-spyware systems available. In fact, the guy who wrote the software to get rid of Cool Web Search (CWSShredder) GAVE UP maintaining the project because he couldn't keep up with the hundreds of variants that come out each year. Tommy
Open Source for Open Minds
From TFA: "... she promptly dumped the useless hunk of sad landfill and bought herself a beautiful new iBook.
And of course, in a year of solid use, she has yet to have a single problem. "
According to your theory, the simple action of getting a Mac seems to have cured her moronity at a stroke. Or almost. She continued to have problems with MS Word.
So many people come in to the helpdesk where I work bringing their Microsoft Office XP cd when they should have brought their Microsoft Windows XP cd.
:(
Besides the confusion from the similar names, they have no idea that their is a difference between Windows and Office. I have had people argue with me on this point.
"Aren't they the same? What's the difference?"
Also, don't forget, if everyone knew what we know about computers, we wouldn't be special anymore...
Everything I need to know about copyrights I learned from Slashdot.
[A] misguided, lost and carnal individual... filled with vexation and ignorance of God [who will] gladly cheer the anti-christ." and Bush voters to a "T".
Play Command HQ online
Mod = -1 pedantic
The sound support has been sub-optimal, sure it plays .wav etc. with low latency, but the new Soundcards offer nice dsp for positional audio. These are the main things which DirectSound AFAIK addresses and there has been nothing. I believe there are not even the drivers yet in linux.
The timing function have not been reliable, too.
At least not in py_sdl...
SDL is nice but it needs a lot of work to be comparable with DX.
At the graphics side, I think that OpenGL is absolute comparable with Direct3D.
I can't freakin' TRUST the operating system. My network rule? Windows isn't ALLOWED to talk to the Internet. Actually, the only Windows boxes left are for the engineers ... running specifically AutoCAD. Piece by piece the software was replaced/migrated to various other platforms. Linux rendering mini-farm for the animation work. BSD on the front Internet end. A mix of Linux, BSD, and Netware hosting the data with a mix of Linux and Mac clients throughout. Except for the Windows boxes (which can completely see _their_ intranet [even they are on their own private subnet off the corporate "networks"].
;]. Now, keep in mind:
:)
... now, you tell me why windows still sucks???
Heck, I have a Windows 2000 "Professional" box I use regularly for my various CAD needs. We regularly do work with outside engineers, surveyors, builders, architects -- and they all pretty much use AutoCAD as well [today
- This Windows box isn't allowed to talk to the Internet [via MAC address blocking].
- I know better than to use IE, with one exception:
- It is fully "Microsoft" patched (and certifiable when that day comes
- It has current Anti-Virus and Firewall software ON TOP OF IT.
- It runs a licensed copy of AutoCAD [fully patched].
- It is even a recent re-format/re-install (not a "old" clutter machine)
Today I find:
eTrust EZ Antivirus Version 6.4.0.4 Dat file: v8912
Started scanning: 3:29:51 PM, 2/4/2005
Scanning boot sectors...
C:\ Master Boot Record is OK: standard Win2000 (1).
C:\ Partition Boot Record is OK: standard Win2000 (2).
Scanning file(s)...
C:\WINNT\systb.exe - Win32.Imiserv.C dropper. Deleted.
Finished scanning: 4:20:00 PM, 2/4/2005
Number of files scanned: 143177.
Number of files that could not be scanned: 36
Number of infections: 1
Number of infected files deleted: 1
Microsoft in Poland sells Windows XP for over $100 on the market. And yes, people HAVE wisened up. They use pirate copies.
"Long run is a misleading guide to current affairs. In the long run we are all dead." (John Maynard Keynes)
AU$300 for an out of date version of Windows XP pro.
This is from a company whos distribution costs are at most $5 per unit.
If the auto industry did what Microsoft does, I.E. knowingly release faulty cars, they would be sued and regulated out of business.
Why should Microsoft be allowed to sell software on CD media which is known to be faulty, and then expect the end user to fix it?
Get real. As with every durable goods you buy out on the market, you as the purchaser are required to performance regular maintenence on it to keep it in good working order. If you think otherwise, it's about time to return to reality.
As everyone is stuck on the car analogy, it's not about driving the car off the lot. It's about once you do, you need to take it in for regular oil changes, tire replacements/rotations, 30k service, 45k service. Let's see how far you get if you think you can just neglect these things and expect it to run safely and 'securely' without maintaining it.
Better question yet, why will Linux never suck?
Because it will never reach the popularity or have the ability to reach as many users as Windows has. Simple fact.
Now please put some useful articles on Slashdot. I for one (as an Anonymous Coward) am sick of the MS-bashing.
Bad wording. An OEM preinstall can be patched up beforing it gets shipped to the user, and typically doesn't sit around in the box long enough to become obsoleted. A box copy of XP, on the other hand, is off the same master that was RTM'd months and months ago and it's been sitting on that shelf getting out of date and vulnerable to creepy crawlies ever since.
No relation to Happy Monkey
clean install means you are installing from the windows XP disc yourself onto a clean hard drive, the preinstall means that the factory installs the software (usually from an image they have on the network, or pushed onto their hard drives). XP Disc was made two years ago, image that was installed on your wifes laptop is probably updated every week. Big difference.
No amount of "managed code" will protect the user from pressing the wrong buttons.
ahh...but that is where you are wrong. The whole point of managed code is that it compiles to an intermediate language runtime which is run in a virtual machine. It is not possible to execute native assembly in this environment (or at least it is not possible to execute native assembly without going THROUGH the virtual machine and therefore the security layers) and therefore all methods can be checked for permissions right down to the instruction level and because there is no direct access to the native assembly which is running on the hardware there can be no exploit which bypasses the security layer of the virtual machine and therefore the operating system. Now, having said this there are still bad things which could happen if the program was executing with root level privileges, but at that point they have pretty much sunk your battleship no matter what platform you are running on. So don't run untrusted programs (programs not signed with the cryptographic keys of a party that you trust) when you are logged into the root account.
From here
Or this:
From here
Ashcroft and James didn't have their positions in Clinton's administration.
Bad Moderators, go sit in the corner and think about what you've done.
Open Source Java DAO Generator
If everyone started using Linux, then it would have as many security flaws and viruses as Windows does now.
Windows is better because there are more users?? Yeah right..that's like saying Toyota and Honda is better than Porsche and Mercedes because there are more of them on the streets.
People need to do their research before they open their mouths. I have an eight year old Mac that blows away the brand new PC I have at work. Main reasons why people buy PC...because they are CHEAP. You get what you pay for.
People also say that Mac aren't upgradable. Nothing on my Mac is stock. I'm using the same hardware you're using on your PeeCee (hard drive, memory, mouse, keyboard, video card) are all cross platform.
Yeah you are right. Its a M$ product and it really bites. the latest version was months late and really wasn't worth the wait. It isn't virtual pc btw, its virtual windoze. They do not offer the sort of support for non-windoze os that vmware offers in terms of the video speed up. They only put that out for windoze. Net result is that something like Suse runs like it is running on an 8008 as far as the screen goes. Like I say, its a M$ product and it bites.
Microsoft sucks. Mainly on the basis of being a predatory monopoly. But that is a whole other article
But windows is not that bad, not the best, but not as bad as the article paints it.
While the article attempts to make light of it, the fact remains that being the dominant player attracts the most Malware, Virii, spyware etc...
But you can avoid problems by staying away from the pillars of the monoculture:
Use Firefox instead of IE,
Use Thunderbird instead of Outlook,
Use Open Office instead of MS office,
Use Media Player Classic instead of MS WMP 10.0.
Use some other chat instead of MSN (I use Miranda and Yahoo).
90% of your problems are now gone. Everything is free. You are now mostly divorced from the monoculture. There is one last piece of the puzzle:
Personal Firewal. I use Sygate Personal.
You are now at 95%.
That last 5% relies on being careful. At this point the crap you get will most likely be installed by yourself.
That is why I always look for opens source programs first. To me nothing says secure and safe like open source.
When I get beyond open source, google is my last line of defence:
Do a google on "divx spyware" and this...
Do all of the above and you should be pretty safe. I surf lots, Download all kinds of programs/ media etc and my system is clean whenever I check it.
A couple of years ago I did nothing till I got a few viruses, then I wised up. Clean sailing since then.
It's more like...
I buy a Ford, drive it out the gates and out of nowhere a gang appears with baseball bats and hammers the car to pieces and then I blame Ford for not giving me an armour plated car.
I'd say software is a big one, but what about hardware?
Wouldn't it suck if the car were to unconditionally burst into flames unless you were sure to also purchase an extra $1000 in "safety features" and have them installed perfectly before ever attempting to drive it?
You criticize an analogy by following up with an even more irrational one. Windows doesn't set itself on fire. It's other people writing the programs that set it on fire--essentially, it's vandalism by others.
Also, it doesn't cost "$1000" to download free updates. Linux distros issue monthly patches all the time for their supplied apps and services (LinuxSecurity.com), much more than Windows ever did.
Get it now? You microsoft apologists should really get a clue.
Someone has a HUGE chip on their shoulder...take a breath. We're just talking about an operating system here. This entire article is flamebait, but hey, it got the required page hits for OSTG's ad clients. Hook, line...and sinker.
You forgot the native-looking Java Runtime enviroment that nicely ties in to the Mac, along with Apple's X11 server that also is aqua-themed (looks pretty close to native) and runs most any linux/*nix GUI app, along with command line apps.
For me, Mac is has the largest(by far) number of programs it can run. Add in VPC and it is reaching high 90's in % of available software being able to run on my laptop(excluding really hardcore old *nix stuff that just doesn't run; old, old mac classic software; etc).
The preinstall on a new laptop will have all of the latest updates already installed, because it was made that way. A clean install is off a cd, which, unless you're going to spend 150 bucks every month for a new copy, will not have the latest updates already integrated, and you would need to install them afterwards.
He say 1 and 1 and 1 is 3, got to be good lookin' cause hes so hard to see...
I doesn't really suck that bad . . . it's just targeted much more than others. And people won't make the change over to MAC or Linux because people are afraid of change.
I'd have to say I disagree, but maybe not for all the reasons you're giving....
The thing is, hardware firewalls have gotten quite inexpensive -- to the point where you can often pick up a firewall/4-port router for as little as $19.95 or so after a rebate or sale.
At this price point, why *wouldn't* you invest in one, if simply for the sake of putting a seperate piece of hardware between your computer and your net connection? Think of it like the front door on your house... You probably have *both* a bolt lock of some type AND another lock on the doorknob itself. Why bother with this, if one lock should keep a door locked anyway? Well, it's one more measure of security and it's inexpensive enough that most people find it to be of value.
If some hacker figures out there's an operational piece of equipment at your IP address, it's nice to know the first thing he's reaching is a dedicated hardware firewall device instead of a fully functional PC with full-blown operating system on it. It's going to be a lot tougher to make a D-Link or Linksys router execute your arbitrary code/commands than a PC....
So what do you say when the FBI's Linux e-mail server gets hacked, or the kernel mailing list announces a new kernel vulnerability and the developers shrug it off because they only guarantee about one in three "stable" kernel releases will actually be stable anyway?
I am a forty-five year old guy who knows jack about computers.Got my first one used from a family member for free with windows 98 18 months ago. By taking the time to read stuff like slashdot and other tech sites I have gotten a liitle bit savey about dealing with all the trash that comes with useing the internet. It really gets me that there is such a steep learning curve for the basic tasks I require a computer for. But I wasn't learning how to do tasks, I was learning how to secure my machine. I thought the hard part would be learning the various programs not security. Windows was not really made for people like me, of which there are many, but it should be. I can't wait to get Mac and leave my part time security job behind.
Its not about the Operating System.
Its about applications and Microsoft's OS commands the largest share of applications. Apple's recent success has nothing to do whatever with its *better* OS but its iTunes, iDVD, i**** is solely responsible for its OS success against Windows.
And hardware matters, only when the interface is dependent upon it.
handful of their boxes can get owned if they don't run Windows update
Get a job fixing computers. Then you may have a clue.
Did it really take 4 mintues of browsing to bring the system down, or are you just taking creative licsense to your story telling.
What where you browsing for? Porn and warez and clicking yes to everysingle box that popped up?
I have a hard time beleiving this story. I have been using windows machines for 10 years. Total viruses contracted = 3. Adaware has never existed for more than week. All my problems have come from driver problems and poor programming/bugs. I won't claim windows is perfect, but serisously, if you know what your doing you won't have a problem. Mac users suffer from the same "idiotitis" that windows user do.
I typo'd. What else could I have meant?
Wheel in the sky keeps on turnin'.
The reason Windows is so problematic is that it's still largely built on a codebase that was never designed to be connected to an enormous untrusted network like the Internet.
*LoL*LerSkates
NT 3.4.1 ? The BSD source is very frickin stable...
WTF are you talking about?
Answer: Monopoly
people attack windows because they ahte bill gates, or microsoft or somply put because most people are running windows.
when soemone wants to come up with a way to hack or exploit someones amchine they want to be able to use that explaoit to affect as amny people as possible.
If more Macs were sold than windows machines than we would see mac owners being the target of these attacks and everyone would be pissed off at Apple for so many "security flaws"
plain and simple Microsoft has more victims so that is why people exploit Windows flaws, Im sure if Mac were the world leading OS then the situations would be exactly reversed.
I RTA. He's right, it is ridiculous. Ridiculous that he let his "SO" online without proper precautions and education. Having worked in IT for about a decade, and having worked with users of various skill levels, I must say that I rarely see an even moderately knowledgable user experience anything near what he describes. It does happen, but rarely.
Most computers I've seen saddled with spyware and/or viruses are owned/operated by incompetent users. I'm not saying everyone who uses a PC needs to know how to fix it, or even how it actually works. Just how to actually use it. I don't need to know how a car runs to use it, and all I can fix is a dim headlamp, but I still had to learn how to properly operate it.
Is that too much to ask? That people who use computers take a little time to learn what to do and what not to do when you're using a PC? I don't think so. It sure would reduce the number of viruses, if not spy/malware.
Despite conventional wisdom, I've discovered you can blame a guy for trying. It's called "attempted murder".
Oh crap, all the politicos suck.....
Hey, you think your house is cool?
A 'clean install' means you format your hard drive and install the O/S from scratch. Then you have to download the security patches and updates by yourself for the O/S, firewall, and anti-virus software. Many times before you get the chance to down load the patches, the PC is infected.
This can be minimized somewhat by connecting to the internet from behind a firewall. Some DSL/Cable hubs have them built in, or you can do it through another computer with a firewall using NAT (Linux), Connection Sharing (XP), or other mechanisms. A firewall with stateful blocking (only accepting inbound packets from outbound connections you establish) will stop a lot this stuff. At the same time you need to go only to the update sites for your O/S and anti-virus/firewall software until all the patches for these are applied to your system (still no guarantees, but this seems to work for me). If you have no anti-virus software, and especially if you have no firewall, you are likely to be screwed very quickly.
As a note, the last time I had a virus that disabled my PC at home was in 1995. At work, I only had one in that same time, and that was in 2003. I am a programmer, and I access the internet a lot... always with high speed connections. For the last few years I have been using a Linux box with iptables for my firewall, and NAT/ipforwarding to a few computers behind it.
-- I ignore anonymous replies to my comments and postings.
Macs are fine. OSX is nice. But there are no games.
Also, it's expensive to own a Mac. On Windows, there is tons of free software to do anything you can think of. There are a million websites dedicated to NOTHING but freeware. In Mac-land, everything costs money. Every stupid little utility is crippled, time-limited shareware. Fuck that. Yes, there's a ton of BSD/Linux stuff you can run on the Mac now, but how much of that has an actual Mac-ish GUI? How much of it has a GUI at all?
Then, of course, there's the price of Mac hardware. For $1500, I can build one hell of a Windows machine. Top-of-the-line, including a monitor. What kind of Mac does that buy me? A 1.8 GHz machine, with 256MB of RAM (when everyone knows that OSX needs 512MB), and NO MONITOR. No fucking monitor. Apples prices are just outrageous.
Yeah, the security problems with Windows are getting bad, but they can be avoided. And for most people, they'll gladly put up with that stuff to have a computer that is cheaper and is compatible with everything.
Didn't Quark run under Classic? I don't know myself because I wasn't working in print during that period, but I seem to remember that was the case.
But yes, Quark is always the canonical example of a vendor who thoroughly fucked their customers and paid the price for it.
This really starts to get boring. I have already written about it countless times only to get completely ignored every time I dare to point out that the emperor is naked.
I find it truly amusing that people who say that there are other advantages than only Digital Restrictions Management of using "trusted" computing and Palladium-like platforms usually talk with great enthusiasm and excitement about the new and innovative security features that have already been implemented in the 1970s for crying out loud, only better and with no strings attached. All TCPA zealots are usually completely ignorant of the existance of such operating systems as KeyKOS or EROS with formal proofs of correctness for God's sake and without all of the silliness of "trusted" computing.
And no, this is not only my opinion that we don't need DRM to get security. I am not the only one who says that everything that TCPA can possibly do to security can also be done in software, with the only exception of DRM, and in fact it has already been done, decades ago. I am not really surprised at all why it is completely ignored by the TCPA and TCI pushing industry. I am only outraged that there are so many naïve people who once again will gladly do anything no matter how dumb it is, if only their good uncle Bill Gates says that it's good for them.
Please, people, if you want to learn about real systems security, then read some old papers by Jerome Saltzer, Michael Schroeder, Norman Hardy and Jonathan Shapiro. If you want to learn about cryptography, read texts by Bruce Schneier. Microsoft is not a reliable source of knowledge in that field.
People always ask me where are the real innovations in systems security and I always say them that they are in the seventies, and have been being ingnored since then by major software vendors because people don't demand using them. This story and this thread is a great example: "Yeah, this version of Windows may suck, but still I am looking forward to buy the next one."
Wait, I've already heard it... In 1995, 1998, 2000, 2003... Oh, you mean that this time they really mean it?
Sincerely,
Pan Tarhei Hosé, PhD.
"Homo sum et cogito ergo odi profanum vulgus et libido."
While were at it, let's ban Apple from preinstalling OS X on Macs too.
It's absurd to prevent a company from install its OS on the computers it sells. We have no problem letting Microsoft put Windows on the hardware it sells.
I guess you have never heard of slipstreaming service packs on to install cd. You can merge latest SP with existing setup files and burn it back on to CDR.
By the way some people talk around here, you'd think the DMCA was put into law under the Bush administration instead of under the Clinton administration in the 90s...
Which party was in control of the 105th Congress?
Besides, President Clinton had no power to prevent the Sonny Bono Copyright Term Extension Act or the Digital Millennium Copyright Act from becoming law. Both bills passed both houses through a voice vote. It takes 81 percent assent to get a voice vote through each house of the U.S. Congress but only 67 percent assent to override a presidential veto. Had Clinton vetoed the Bono Act or the DMCA, Congress would probably have overridden the veto.
there is still one win me machine in my castle used to digitize old LPs, and it is nicely cleaned up and patched to avoid evillities. there is also no install of LookOUT! on that machine, which is always a help.
but I do seriously love my mac.
if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?
why can't we put this topic to rest? seriously, anyone who connects an any box directly to any network in today's landscape without atleast a hardware/software firewall, anti virus and their os upgraded to the latest rev is asking for trouble. i just find it amazing that i spend somewhere around 8 hours a day connected with a winxp box and have NEVER had a virus, worm, been a zombie, etc. either i'm incredibly lucky (not) or i have the where withall not to go to every porn or russian software site in the first four minutes of setting up a box. whatever...
Honestly, if you lurk around this site for more than five minutes you might hear of one. THat will protect your flimsy little Winders boxes till they get updated and then the next exploit comes out. I have not had a Winders virus since I put in a firewall and started using anti-virus software from Grisoft (free, by the way).
I use IPCop from www.ipcop.org and am very happy with the functionality, flexibility and protection it offers, for free also. And IPCop is Linux too.
--Somewhere there is a village missing an idiot.
If you install a windows computer, stick it online, yep, it probably will get infected. Yes you could install Linux, or by a Mac, but, unfortunately, 90+% of the software isn't written for those OS's. I've had a DSL connection for 4 years, never had one virus, spyware hit me. I keep everything up to date, and sit behind a firewall. Yes it is a pain, but if you DO NOT keep your (PC) computer up to date, it will get hosed. Would I switch to a Mac, or Linux? Yes, if the software I use at work was written for those.....but, it isn't. I don't play games, to that argument doesn't bother me. I doubt if the software I use for work is going to bother writing something that 2-5% of the world uses :(
I am online upward of 10-12 hours a day. I run multiple Net-connected programs at all times. .. I'm a power user. And I have yet to suffer a single debilitating virus or worm or spyware or malware whatsoever.
What is his definition of power user? Simply someone that uses computers a lot? Plenty of people put unusual stresses on their machines simply because they don't know better. To me, a power user is someone who is knowledgable about his equipment, takes advantage of its strengths, and works around its weaknesses.
Sure, Windows has a lot of flaws. A lot of them are due to its basic philosophy and operation: it is insecure by default. Nonetheless, it has gotten improvement. My uptime in Windows 98 was measured in days. My uptime in WinXP is now measured in weeks (or months, if not for reboot-requiring updates).
The useful lifetime of a Win98 installation was measured in months. It would get unbearably slow or unstable at that point. I have been using a single installation of WinXP for a year and a half now with no perceived loss of performance.
In the end, I use Windows on one of my machines for the software that only runs on Windows. However, I prefer OS X on laptops and Linux on servers. I have found a niche for each of these platforms, and see no reason to force any platform into another role. Is Windows insecure by default? Yes. Is it insecurable in the context of an inexpensive home network, especially by a "power user"? No.
--
"Extra Anus Kills Four-Legged Chick" -- Headline
I don't know why you would be moderated as informative. The article does mention many times of abuse.
But equally, it's a disincentive for corporate purchasers who want to ghost an image of Linux onto a pre-specced PC.
Clearly scrutiny has had some effect. Hewlett Packard's decision to bundle Apple's iTunes player dismayed Microsoft, but the prospect of retaliation didn't deter HP from cutting the deal. However, Microsoft has had notable success in dissuading OEMs from preloading Linux. Dell and IBM used to sell certified Linux notebooks
Anything else dimwit ?
In order to be sure the computer worked in the first place, they had to install Windows to test the peripherals and other devices!
That may have been an excuse in 1999, but Knot anymore.
well, you just want to start up a computer on your high speed internet connection, and never have to worry about anything. anything means, the way you behave as pedestrian: though many of you are killed each day, it is highly improbable with the usual precautions (strange emails with attachements etc.). no reason to buy any anti virus crap (unless one of those rare accidents happens, and you need a doctor), or have hardware firewalls etc (they will help, but should not be necessary in the first place). i never did it any other way. i never used windows (on a personal machine, may it be at work or home). it is absolutely stupid to slam the author for not being smart ass enough to "protect" his so's (whatever that means) machine. he, too, does not have to be a computer security expert (on the level of the average slashdot windows user).
right, right. that is what i figured, but i guess i also viewed a clean install as what came from the manufacturer because its not an upgrade or anything. my bad. i am one of those people who knows enough to be dangerous and not get owned, but not enough to not make an a__ of myself. thanks for the info.
always mosh clockwise
If they were actually creative, then they wouldn't form a distinct marketing segment
Then instead of the marketing term "creatives", use the copyright law term "authors of works". Authors of works, especially advertising works, have very specific needs.
rm -rf /
Fuck, 800 plus comments as of now, and no one with any real insight gets modded up? Perhaps that is the problem, in itself? No one, not one person that I saw, attempted to take the arrticle and make a decent discussion out of it.
Premise 1: We have a computer user, who is a journalist, has been using Macs for nigh on 15 years, is not extremely tech savy (Get to that in a mo') and sees that his fellow computers users, most of them on one of the millions of brands of PC and one of the various flavours of Windows, be it from Win98 to WinXP, have, in general, more problems with their computers than he does.
What does all that tell me?
I am a Mac user myself (well, I use a PC as well with Linux and Win2000 on it and I used to be a Windows shop sys admin). I agree with his OBSERVATIONS 100%. I mean observations because apart from his subjective ranting on why the world doesn't string BillG up from the rafters, which is his OPINION, his article has a good point.
I have seen and expereienced the same problems with Windows machines, until learning better, such as the 20 seconds till being hacked when first going online with WinXP and the numerous bugs in the OS over the years. Yes, I know as well as you that putting a simple router in front of the machine stops 90% of the bugs and being careful about mails and what you download and keeping up with pacthces will stop the rest, but it is a real pain and, in my experience, one has to ask the simple question: why?
In that I agree with the article. Using Windows is more complex than a Mac with OSX. Now on to the tech savy bit. The author writes about the prize that was offered for hacking the webserver Webstar, which was the only real webserver on classic Mac OS. It was never used widely in the server world and thus is not a good example of application security. The guy reveals his lack of expertise because, all those who know that OSX is based on BSD know that the webserver shipped with OSX is Apache, the same one that upsets the numbers game of OSS with respect to commercial offerings when compared to IIS.
Also, the argument that Windows has more software available is a real one, especially for gamers and for CAD and specialised business applications and the situation will stay that way while Windows has such a dominating marketshare.
And that is a reason for staying with Windows, but it isn't the reason why 90% of the world's computer using public uses PC's and Windows. That reason is simply because PC's are more available and most people have no idea that there are alternatives and are only interested in getting a "computer" with which they can chat, browse, mail, write letters, store photos, listen to music etc. Although a Mac arguably, in my experience, does all of this much better than Windows does, most people will simply go to the nearest shop and use what is there.
Ahmen.
I think this has to do with more of a lack of user education then it does by putting the burden on a single software company. Even anti virus and firewall products have to constantly be updated because of new exploits.
And other operating systems make the executables unchangable by common users and don't require antivirus programs. Other word-processing systems don't come with virus support systems preinstalled; the first Word virus came out in 1997, but later versions of Word still supported running viruses.
We don't sell microwaves and mock people because they didn't buy the microwave protection screen and got hurt. The company has the responsibility for making sure their products are at least reasonably safe.
So, other than games, which is a real catch-22
To those who like to gripe about Macintosh computers not having a decent selection of games sold at retail, just stack a ####### GameCube on top of your Mac mini already.
Is it just me, or are there lots of similarities between AOL and Microsoft?
1) Early provider of technology in a new area.
2) Commanding lead in user base
3) Targetting "clueless" users
4) Dropping status among geek users "in the know"
5) Attemp to move from technology service to media
6) Inability to expand outside early-obtained cash cow. (Aol=access, Msft=Win/Office)
7) Encroachment of free/reduced cost options eating at core profit center
Given all this, will Microsoft follow AOL's fate?
I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
Becuase, as my wife's Abnormal Psych prof (Whitman College, Walla Walla WA) once sagely noted...
"Half of all folks are below average."
There is nothing wrong with yr Internet. Do not attempt to adjust the picture. We are controlling the transmission - NSA
Turn on automatic updates.
Problem Solved.
According to this article: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,1745930,00.as p and the related link http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.a sp (scroll down for OS statistics), Mac growth is being outpaced by both Linux and Windows XP.
Looks like MacOS is going.... going.... almost gone.
Hmmm witty sig or funny sig? Maybe elitest techy sig!
I've read the sibling posts and it seems like people that switch do so because there's nothing tying them to Windows and they want to change. There's 3 types of people:
1. People that want to switch, pay for a new Apple computer and enjoy it.
2. People that are used to Windows and have money invested in PC's.
3. People that cannot switch because they are tied to PC's.
I'm a part of group 3. I have games like Half-Life 2 that are only offered for Windows, and I also am in the middle of developing a GUI for a senior design class I'm taking that uses the serial port, which modern Apples don't have legacy ports.
If you mention OS X to me, we can discuss it but the true zealots always try to "discuss" it but they end up using an accusatory/condescending tone, trust me because I've been on the sour end of that conversation.
The real Apple fanboys are too busy being elitist and saying how much Windows sucks and wonder why more people don't switch, but they don't realize the people they are trying to switch are reluctant to switch when they make them feel inferior about their current operating system choice, people don't want to associate themselves with a negative group.
If I owned an Audi and I came up to your Honda Civic and said "hey you, get an Audi because Honda sucks", would that inspire you to buy an Audi because I told you that you are an idiot for buying a Honda?
This is a SONY computer, and sony is renound for putting so much crap on their computers, they don't work out-of-the box. This is hardly an unbiased review. ANY operating system preloaded with crap like this would come to a halt when actually used.
"Go buy yourself a power book, or if you happen to be short on funds, start downloading some iso immages."
Does this mean to imply that there's some sort of connection between a cd image and a physical computer?
Only on slashdot will you find some computer "gamer" getting mad at other nerds for answering his dumb question.
:-|
You're being taught self-help. Nobody made a tutorial on how to play the game of life, if that's what you were hoping for.
sorry
If I throw a stick, will you go away?
you can't just arbitrarily decide what does and doesn't count
So I'll reword it to express more precisely the point that I think mattyrobinson69 was trying to make:
"I play games, and on machines that do not require questionably-lawful modding in order to run arbitrary code, I use GNU/Linux exclusively. I have an Xbox console."
A freind of mine (Mac-head, like me) has a sister who had an XP system that got all hosed up from adware.
She reinstalled the OS, put it back on line, and the problems continued - she thought she had a hardware problem. So she gave it to me to take a look at.
Now, I've done Windows development and systems integration for 14 years. I've never really had to deal with a Windows system that was exposed or used like this; my home-admin skills are Mac/Linux-based. I've read the whole spiel about how bad this is - but I didn't actually realize how bad it was, until I started working on this woman's computer. I booted from a clean floppy to DOS, ran virus scanners, disk checks, looked at all the hardware, everything was fine. So I booted to her OS, and was greeted immediately with buttloads of Dr. Watsons. I looked in all the usual places for auto-run software, and found about a dozen things that looked suspicious. I would delete them from the registry, AND THEY'D PUT THEMSELVES RIGHT BACK! I got sneaky, and booted to safe-mode, and replaced the evil binaries with read-only zero-byte stub files - hopefully that will block re-install of those particular programs.
This was a real eye opener for me. I had no idea how totally fucked up things are for the poor Windows people. I tried Ad Aware, found 43 MORE baddies - I tried Spybot S&D, and it found 75 items. I had it remove those - which required several reboots. I mean, holy crap, why do people put up with this?!
So I asked her. She's a real-estate agent. She runs a special MLS software that's Windows Only.
I showed her how to configure her firewall.
I showed her how to use Spybot S&D (fwiw, I hear there's some adware that disables Spybot S&D!).
I showed her how to use FireFox.
I showed her my PowerMac, and Virtual PC.
1 week with her old system back, and no complaints yet. But I can't help thinking that the arms-race is just going to escalate.
We need laws.
We need people going to jail.
Because if everybody just goes to Linux/Mac, the assholes will just write more Linux/Mac spyware.
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
I'm always up for change though and I'm rooting more for linux as an HTPC OS but I dont see Linux being ready to replace Windows in this use for some time now. Atleast 5 years.
Gentoo is what i'm keeping my eyes on but I currently use an old box with a Knoppix live CD just to fuck around with.
As someone who pretty nearly switched to all-Mac myself after OS X came into "prime time" ... I still have to say this SF Gate article comes across as a little too strongly Mac-biased.
Why indeed won't people switch computers despite the spyware and virii? It's the APPS, stupid! I know a LOT of engineers and surveyors who all think the Apple Powerbooks are teriffic little notebooks, but none have purchased any. They all use AutoCAD as a staple item in their daily job, and AutoDesk doesn't offer a Mac version of the product (or of any of the related products, like Inventor).
Even in areas traditionally considered "Mac strongholds" like MIDI and music production, the Mac falls short all too often. For example, I used to own a Yamaha Motif synthesizer. One of the big selling points of the Motif was its flexibility in integrating with your computer. That is, if your computer runs Windows. The whole time I owned it, Yamaha never released any Mac software to work with the add-in expansion "PLG" boards for the Motif, nor did they have a native OS X compatible patch librarian/editor for it. I had a similar problem with a Korg Triton synth. There were loads of great freeware and shareware Triton editors, librarians, etc. - but absolutely nothing for OS X.
But even IF the APPS aren't an issue, familiarity is. I've done lots of virus/spyware cleanup for customers over the last couple years, and typically - they either have these problems with a fairly new PC (about 1-2 years old), or it's a pretty old system (4-6 years old, typically) that they recently hooked up to broadband as a spare or kids' machine. In both cases, they'd nuch rather spend, say $120-250 or so for a service call for a professional to clean the PC up and install software to protect it from future problems than spend 4x that or more for a whole new system. They either figure "I didn't buy this thing that long ago - so it should still be good for a long time if someone just gets my problem all sorted out." or "This thing served me well for the last 5 years already... I don't think I quite believe this hype about needing a different type of computer to get one that's reliable."
In short, sure - Windows sucks. But the right "cocktail" of anti-vorus, anti-spyware programs, an alternate browser like FireFox, and a firewall should make it pretty safe for use on the net. You just need to learn how to do it yourself, or pay someone who does know to do it right for you.
You criticize an analogy by following up with an even more irrational one. Windows doesn't set itself on fire. It's other people writing the programs that set it on fire--essentially, it's vandalism by others.
Windows is vulnerable to these attacks because it has flaws. They are bugs, defects, ,istakes in the design and implementation, holes, errors, the designers messed up and you're vulnerable only because they messed up. Computers are not supposed to be this vulnerable to attacks. Do you understand it yet or do I have to use more italics? The original analogy is far more accurate, although quite frankly none of these car analogies are a perfect fit.
Here's a better anology: you buy condoms from a manufacturer, except that you don't know the manufacturer has cut corners in the design and manufacturing to save money, and every third one or so has a few small holes in it big enough to let all sorts of nasties through. Soon you have a few STDs. Were you "stupid to have sex at all" (i.e. the "stupid to plug your computer into the Internet"?!? argument), or should the condoms have worked to a much high expectation of safety? Of course the condoms should have worked, and the manufacturer is liable, legally too.
Gosh, when did it get so bad that believe genuinely believe that "plugging your computer into the Internet" is inherently a "dumb thing to do"? This is entirely abnormal.
(And yes, similar things happen to Linux too, but that's also because Linux, although it has a better security track record than Windows, is still far from perfect, and rational Linux devs and users admit it's not supposed to be this way, and that you are supposed to ideally be able to plug a newly installed Linux distro straight onto the Internet without having to worry at all. The reason we currently have to worry is because developers of subsystems made mistakes, not because computers are inherently vulnerable. If there were no bugs, then by design the system would be 100% secure. The perfect condom.
This is a cool article that talks about secunia's reviews of vulnerabilities on various OS's. http://www.techworld.com/security/news/index.cfm?n ewsid=1798
OSX is good. Darwine realloc() sucks for applications that are not tweaked for it, but in all other cases (where it is made to work like malloc with #defines) it is significantly faster!!! And aqua theme? Doh!
OSX good. Solaris 10 bad. 10 moves behind.
OK.
Somehow, however beleaguered Apple gets, my Powerbook keeps, like, working.
I don't care what "you" use for any value of "you".
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
A $20 router/firewall is all you need to protect you long enough to get Windows patched. The bots are fairly dumb and easily stopped. Ad-aware and AVG free edition protect from spyware and viruses. Using Firefox over Internet Exploiter eliminates the browser hijacks.
In which case there should be a warning on the box that this is not a "stand-alone" product. Kind of like with electronics and batteries, windows should have a "security sold seperately" label.
The biggest problem with Windows is that Microsoft gave a very powerful OS to Joe Servicepack who has NO CLUE how to get it stable and keep it stable.
Of course Joe don't know, it's not like Windows comes with a manual he could read first.
TommyOpen Source for Open Minds
In fact I stopped hating Microsoft (for a while) after my first 10 installs of 2000 Server and Active Directory. I fell for the hype, which was mostly true, until I used Novell Netware 6.0 with eDirectory.
eDirectory is the same, plus better and it runs on Linux, Windows and pretty much any place you want to install it. The licensing is a lot more straight-forward, it's better than Active Directory, runs on Linux and it's Novell. We love Novell now don't we?
I say the question is:
Get your Unix fortune now!
hahha what you gonna do when the oil runs dry? gonna sit right here, gonna watch those arabs die
people like you make me sick. YOUR A DISPLEASURE TO THE WOMENS!!!!1
Simple reason why people don't switch: fear of something different. A basic human instinct. People tend to stay with what they know, even when it sucks. You can see this all throughout human history. It takes a LOT to get people to try something new en-masse.
And this happens well before any considerations about whether the different system is better or worse in any way. Most people won't even bother considering if a Mac or Linux is better than Windows, simply because its different than what they already know.
This is why Apple's effort to market their pcs by getting them into schools is brilliant: get the kids used to Apples so that they will want them as adults.
-- Senior Software Engineer, Attorney appearance services, locallawyerapp.com.
http://www.techworld.com/security/news/index.cfm?n ewsid=1798
No intergration with free open source antivirus and no good intergration with spamfilters.
Upgrade to openexchange see the difference it intergrates well.
Personally openexchange needs to be ported to C or C++ to get better performace but it still does a better job.
Also linux core servers lets your art department using Macs talk to you admin department usering windows.
Change your server room drop Microsoft notice the difference. Users can use what they like.
Active Directory Nice little bug in here. Breach system tweek Active Directory and all systems will except a remote desktop link. Note microsoft remote desktop link without encryption. Really nice builtin complete backdoor install program. This flaw kinda scared me with all the other system holes
The OS already is sold on the market for over $100. Haven't you been to Best Buy, CompUSA, Buy.com, etc. lately? Asking for the government to cripple your opponent will just come back 3x as worse against you.
Slashdot: Playing Favorites Since 1997
Agreed. A computer is not a simple thing to use. It isn't like a fridge or a toaster - just plug it in and away you go!
He should never have bought that sort of computer. Its like giving matches to a child and then calling it stupid for burning the house down. The warning is quite clearly printed, after all.
Microsoft Windows, should be no different to any other product. It should contain clear and obvious warnings:
"VIRUS WARNING!! Microsoft Windows is extremely virus prone! This item is NOT FOR HOME USE, except by by qualified personnel ONLY. Business users MUST HAVE a qualified Systems Administrator."
Shop staff should ensure that the people they sell Microsoft Windows to know how to use the system, and the buyer must show their computer usage license.
What most people need is something like simPC.
Mark Morford, despite what he claiims in the article, is not a technical user. He's just a guy who insists that when he or his significant other plug a computer into the network, it should continue to work successfully.
... right?
It's okay to say that if you're a technical user you can secure Windows by simply obtaining up to date firewall hardware and/or software, loading SP2 from CD, buying $100 worth of anti-virus and spyware programs, and installing them before you connect your new computer to the network. Technical users can do things like that. Of course if you, as a technical user, value your time at more than $0 an hour, you've already spent the difference in cost between your generic PC and a 17" iMac with the gorgeous screen.
With Microsoft, Dell, HP and all other PC OEMs selling products to the public in an irresponsible manner, I don't think it's the fault of the users. Users who are buying something marketed as an appliance should not have to know how to make it safe. It should be sold to them safe, or the manufacturers are committing fraud on the public -- which is what both Morford and I believe.
If Mark and his SO have found a better way through Apple, I personally applaud them for making their choice. I've made the same choice, with the same results. I'm not as bullish on Apple as he is, since for some reason the person on the street is highly resistant to change, even when it's from a lousy product to an excellent one. But he's right in insisting that the computing products he buys adhere to minimum standards, such as, well, continuing to work after you plug them in the network.
I'm a technical user - I develop software for a living - but I would rather avoid a platform that makes me work harder on keeping it running than doing the work I need to do to perform my job -- which is plenty hard enough, rest assured!
Certainly you would have to agree that, for the point of view of all but the most rabid technical users, a product that doesn't blow up five minutes after you plug it in is far superior to one that does
D
A firewall cannot stop malware that exploits weaknesses in your browser.
A firewall containing a junk-blocking HTTP proxy can. A soft firewall can also allow explorer.exe and iexplore.exe to connect only to trusted ActiveX sites such as microsoft.com, trendmicro.com, cartoonnetwork.com, etc., blocking all other outbound connections from IE.
Apple has made bold plays for this segment. Instead they chose to court Alias|Wavefront. Was this a bad choice? Possibly. I don't have empirical data but I doubt there are a lot of serious Maya users who use OS X, pleasant though it may be to use.
Would the case be different had they landed Discreet's 3dsMax app? Dunno.
Until Apple gets of port Max, I'm stuck (and not so grudgingly mind you) on Wintel.
Morford is also wrong about cost. I have an iBook 700 and a Thinkpad t23. The t23 costs less than an iBook (on froogle) now but still whoops its ass on some common multimedia apps. Photoshop and playback of Flash apps come to mind.
This shouldn't be the case since they both have the same video ram but sadly it is.
If Discreet did port 3dsMax over to OS X the results would probably be disappointing. The PC version would probably have a more active plugin community. Such has been the case of Maya on Wintel versus the Mac market as well.
Do I love my mac? Um, yeah, whatever, sure. As for getting the job done, i.e. what gives me a paycheck on art contracts though, it's Windows all the way baby.
Get a job writing code, then maybe YOU may have a clue. Then thank your stars that Windows breaks, or you wouldn't have a job fixing computers. Then try to write something better than Windows. Then study Linux, realize that statistically there are just as many security bugs. Then shut up.
There are plenty of "creative" people who refuse to use Macs because they consider them "dumbed down" and overpriced platforms.
My other first post is car post.
Day 1: Couldn't partition my hard drive because the Slackware installation disk doesn't have drivers for SATA disk controllers. Spent the rest of the day searching the web for work-arounds.
Day 2: Located a message board where someone had posted a custom ISO image of Slackware disk 1 with a SATA-enabled kernel. Was able to partition my hard drive and get setup running, but when it came time to pick a kernel to install, it refused to let me insert disk 1 to grab the SATA kernel. Spent the rest of the day searching the web for work-arounds.
Day 3: Finally figured out that I could put the setup process in the background, unmount the CD, eject and re-insert disk 1, then bring setup back to the foreground. Completed setup and got X running. Copied over source for 2.6.10 kernel, which I had burned to a CD. Started doing configuration, and realized there were no Linux drivers available for my wireless network card. Spent the rest of the day searching the web for solutions.
Day 4: Discovered ndiswrapper, a module that allows you to use standard Windows drivers for wireless NICs under Linux. Downloaded and built it with no problems. Tried to load my NIC drivers, and the entire OS immediately locked up. Rebooted and tried a couple more times with the same results. Spent the next 2 days searching the web for solutions.
Day 6: Finally found a single post from someone who had the same hardware revision of the same card, who had been able to get it working using the 2.6.9 kernel. Burned the source to CD and installed it on Linux box, configured, compiled, rebooted, built ndiswrapper and it worked! Unfortunately, I couldn't get an address from DHCP server. Spent the rest of the day searching the web for solutions.
Day 7: Took a day off.
Day 8: Found out that I was using the wrong command to query DHCP (I was foolishly running dhcclient instead of dhcpcd, it's so obvious!), so now DHCP works and I can connect to the net without having to assign a static IP address. I spent the next couple days configuring the video drivers, audio drivers, and getting all the modules to configure correctly at boot-up.
Day 10: Started working on getting the video-capture card drivers working. Ran into a myriad of build errors right off the bat. Did some research and learned I needed to compile some extra features into the kernel before the drivers will build. So I reconfigure, build, install, reboot... and the kernel won't load. Decide to call it a day and have a few stiff drinks before I am tempted to toss the computer out the window.
Day 11: Okay, turned out it wasn't anything tragic, I booted to an older kernel, rebuilt the new kernel, and everything worked fine. But the capture card drivers still wouldn't build. Spent the rest of the day searching the web for solutions.
Day 12: Finally realized that all info I've found about using this particular capture card refers to the fact that the user was using a 2.4 kernel instead of 2.6. So I download the kernel source, configure, build, install, reboot... and now I can build and install the capture card drivers. Unfortunately, there are no drivers available in the kernel source for my motherboard sound chipset. But I figure I can address that problem later. I do a bunch of configuring, ho
I have yet to get a virus through sp2 IE.
How did you get a copy of SP2? I know a lot of users who would have to buy the CD online, for under $10 shipped to most locations. "I have broadband" is not a good answer; residents of many parts of the United States would have to move house in order to get cable or DSL, and even where it is available, broadband is still much more expensive than Netzero or Netscape dial-up for people whose Internet use is limited primarily to web and e-mail.
I thought there was an issue with Quark and Classic (never used it myself). It got to the point that Apple actually had to keep available the last G4's which 9 supported, until Quark got their act together.
Adobe PageMaker did run in classic. but it was ugly. Fortunately, my last client switched to InDesign months ago (and with that, the last app from my Applications (MacOS 9) folder disappeared)
Palm is a close second to Quark. Eventually I got it running in classic so that I didn't have to dual boot to hotsync. They took their time porting it. Of course, one of the 10.3 updates killed it so I actually had to offload hotsyncing to a beige G3, and then sync the calendar across the network.
Umax provides the only app I'm still required to use classic for. I bought my scanner around the time of DP4 and they never released a native X driver. I can understand old hardware not being supported, but something a few months old?
(of course, their software is garbage so I won't buy one from them again)
Nothing beats Microsoft though. The last version of office to connect to an exchange server is 2001 running in Classic. Office 2004 may have fixed this though.
I use Macs to up my productivity, so up yours Microsoft!
Or if it was a car,
"My SO just got a new car, parked it in the middle of the street in a bad neighborhood with the keys in the ignition.
I tried that, but it's taking way too long, even for Gentoo. I'm going to abort it, if it doesn't finish in the next few minutes.
As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
Bah! Plugged in the camera (none of this loading drivers and setup nonsense) and everything JUST WORKED.
Unlike most of the newer digital still cameras on the market, many older cameras do not present themselves to the host as a USB Storage device. In fact, my Olympus D-340L (1.3 Mpixel) is old enough not to even have a USB port. Instead it has an RS232 serial port.
Windows crashing is obviously not so much of an inconvenience that they must storm Redmond. It's easier to push the reset button.
I used to wonder why things that annoyed me a lot about Windows, and the fact that it's crap, didn't seem to bother other people so much. Then I realised that, apart from the usual valid explanation that most have had their expectations lowered so much regarding computers that they're almost impossible to disappoint, only a small percentage of other users I know spend as much time on a computer as I do. Most people just spend maybe a few hours a day on a computer, e.g. do some simple tasks like e-mail and web, maybe a Word document or spreadsheet. So if something annoys them, it's for a short time and then they go about doing other things. But as a software developer, I basically spend nearly all my time behind the computer - a 40 hour week is rare relaxation, 60 hour week not uncommon. So when some little Windows bug annoys you, it annoys you 10 hours a day, 6 or 7 days a week, for months and sometimes years. I think this inherently puts a different perspective on it. It's one thing being annoyed for an hour or two then going back to what you enjoy and do all day. It's another if what you enjoy and do all day has become annoying all day due to the system you're using being crappy. Because you also 'explore' the system deeper, you also uncover far more bugs and annoyances. It's like, if I drive to work in a junky car, that sucks but only for 20 minutes a day. But if my job involves driving all day, then having a decent ride is going to make a world of difference.
Have you ever thought how improbable it is that you are going to have a world without MS Windows? I myself am a linux developer as well as user. And I feel alive when I am using Linux. But I do not mind using windows. Here is why: 1> Windows is not the best OS out there. How do you categorize best? It is completely subjective. As far as the geek community definition, a good OS is one which is *implemented* well. Which means that the design is clean, and elegant. Simple things are simple. Difficult things are possible. Many of Windows problems lie in somehow in the inherent way Windows was developed. Linux has never had those handicaps because there are a hell lot more people out there who know about the heart, the kidney, the liver and the intestines of linux. If someone comes up with a bad idea, it is usually NOT accepted. Linux is NOT driven by business needs - such as deadlines, "competetive" business practices, and the other real-world things that make professional software development have its own problems. Having said all that, yes, Linux is here to stay. And yes, it is and will be a mainstream operating system. But NO, it will not replace the simplicity of Windows. While I can get all my computing tasks done by Linux, it is often a lot more effort to get Linux to work the way you like it, even though it is definitely rewarding. What I would say is this: DONT fight, let people who use Windows use it. Let Microsoft be, it is a big part of why computers are popular today outside the geek community, whether you like it or not. And yes, Microsoft have contributed a lot to technology, even though business needs have always been their priority. As long as you keep your windows distribution patched, and dont directly go on the net without a router (I know such limitations are ridiculous if you are a geek, but think about your grandma.), you are going to be fine. And as a side, DONT try to make Linux as simple as Windows, simplicity vs power is a tradeoff. There will be distributions that try to look like MS Windows (say Linspire), but atleast currently, Intel x86 computer users are divided between those that use Linux and those that use Windows.
i believe organisations have always been referred to as such.
only in the past 30 years or so has the "organisation as an entity concept" taken it into the singular.
i could be wrong, but i cant be bothered to prove it either way.. (nice weed ya see)
bah!*@%!
- It's the same reason why people don't storm the White House...
I may not have voted for Bush and I may not like the RIAA but that doesn't in any way justify what you imply.It's the same reason why people don't storm the RIAA headquarters...
If you're serious with that kind of attitude, what you're implying is mob rule, majority or not.
there's nothing "nice" or "grand" about that...
in way free market economies are mob ruled, there the consumer "votes with his feet", I'm fine with that, but thinking that this approach is transferable to politics by appling force and violence is silly, what you in the end get is chaos, anarchy, might-makes-right...
______________________________________________
sigamajig...
If you see nothing wrong with paying an extra $100 on top of your $1000 computer and $20-50 a month internet connection then those people have issues.
Warning: Apple/Nintendo fangirl. Likes her electronics cute & cuddly. May be rabid.
Windoze PC off the Net and the problem solved!!!!!
Why? Because decent spec Macs are too damned expensive. Jobs could grab the market by the goolies, if he just dropped the price of his computers across the board. The Mac Mini helps, but it's woeful spec leaves a lot to be desired.
As if... I have always had auto-updates active, and I can guarantee you (happened a few days ago when someone else used my computer) that if I fire up IE, I'll be flooded with spyware within five minutes. My computer is up to date. IE just sucks balls.
So don't run untrusted programs (programs not signed with the cryptographic keys of a party that you trust) when you are logged into the root account.
How can we trust inexperienced users not to run questionable binaries, when Windows XP Home Edition creates new accounts in the Administrators group by default and many legacy apps require an Administrators account?
Why is someone who can't install Windows on the front page of /. Worst troll eva!
And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
*giggle*
You almost called Quicktime a Windows-only application. I bet you went back and added the parenthetical later.
Warning: Apple/Nintendo fangirl. Likes her electronics cute & cuddly. May be rabid.
they are only appt that run on it.
I don't know enough about kernel design to say if Linux is innovative, but I know that some of the GUIs for linux (gnome, kde, xfce, etc.) are quite innovative. not only that, but the whole idea of package managers was invented for the linux platform.
Ibmouse, that is the best analogy I've ever read...
MS XP is McD's
Linux is Homemade
Perhaps Apple is like a small bistro or deli!
People should eat what they like, but it might benefit them to try out different things now and again.
Sometimes you have a craving for those crispy fries on the go, sometimes you want something that has a little ambiance, and sometimes you want to stay home and cook.
I'm a terrible cook, but that's my own fault.
Sometimes I get a terrible meal at McD's (only my fault for going there.)
Once in a while at the bistro, someone will give me a little attitude because what I want isn't on the menu!
Heterogeneous User.
91% of Windows-running computers isn't my idea of a "handful".
Would you buy a brand new pair of pants that had a huge long hole right between the back pockets and use them for walking around in public (assuming your real name is not Cher). Well, I could make a fortune selling patches so all your asses aren't hangin out.
The government which is strong enough to protect you from everything is strong enough to take everything from you.
And besides, for a real-world desktop system you shouldn't be listening on -any- ports.
Desktop machines double as servers more often than you'd think. Start any open-source client for eDonkey, BitTorrent, or Gnutella, and see how much better it runs when you open an incoming port.
You Sir are a Flamer; my TiPB agrees too... and my Panther Install nearly paniced (but chose not to, being of good Unix kin) at reading your comment... BTW, a fresh, SP2 slipstreamed, XP install I did the day before yesterday is already at its second "crash & reboot" I most strenuously disagree with you; at most I criticize Apple for putting the whole Cyrus IMAP install inside /usr/bin/cyrus and not including mailbox ACL controls in Mail.app and Workgroup admin. Oh well... let's hope in Tiger.
Mi domando chi à il mandante di tutte le cazzate che faccio - Altan
another article for the apologist.
there are few if any application or game ads on TV that say "Runs on Mac" or "Runs on Linux" to make them even look.
There are all sorts of ads for GameCube games. You can run all your GameCube games "on" a Mac because a Nintendo GameCube fits on top of a Mac mini.
This article reminded me to mention that SourceForge.net's February 2005 Project of the Month is ClamWin an Open Source antivirus application for Microsoft Windows 98/Me/2000/XP.
Interview with the developers can be read here:
here.
Patrick McGovern
Director, SourceForge.net
Pat@sf.net
"Commercial Firewall + antivirus blocks 99% of it "
I'm sure you just said "99%" to get your point across but...
I have a fully patched system with a firewall. I just scanned my windows xp box and ran across 12 adwares. 0 viruses.
If that is just 1% I really should be getting around 1188 adwares. Which is actually very close to the number of adware that my friends computer had when it was unpatched and running with out a firewall or anti-adware!
99% may actually be very close.
There's already at least one game on the market using the halflife 2 engine, some vampire game I don't remember the name of. They most definately license their engine to third parties.
Exactly. Very true.
And trusting an anti-virus program instead of actually knowing how to know if your OS is healthy, that's maybe even worse than not having one at all.
I don't know if you noticed that too, but surprisingly (well, not!), people who have anti-virus proggies and completely trust them are the ones who constantly get viruses and need to re-install the whole system every month. Does that not tell you anything?
I for one have never used any anti-virus (well, I did have one when I owned a Mac Plus, many years ago, how funny is that!), and never got any virus. The rules are pretty simple: don't install any program you can't trust and never (I say never, no matter where they come from) launch any attached executable files from emails - even if you think they're gonna be "cute". On top of that, never use Word nor Outlook Express, and you're all set.
But believe it or not, when you tell people not to use those programs, they just don't want to listen to you! They feel like they would be sort of "left out" of something if they don't use them like everyone does. *Sighs*
Bungie didn't "make the leap". They were bought out by MS for the sole purpose of delaying the release of Halo and holding it out for the xbox.
An American or a British trillion?
An American trillion is equal to a British billion, or 1e+12.
Yes. This is messed up.
But you need to know what you are doing (Red Hat in paranoid security mode would be a good start).
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
This Mark Morford column hasn't been brought to you by the words: orgasm, bliss, -mongering, enlightened, tantric, or tantalizing, and/or the number gazillion.
...now you need a week-long training class in IT security before you can buy a (Windows) PC.
--R.J.
Electric-Escape.net
Exactly. How dare people be computer-illiterate. They should be born knowing how to secure that worthless swiss cheese. Of course Internet Explorer allowing dodgy websites to download any old crap is the fault of the user not the software company.
Does a Christian soccer team even need a goalkeeper?
If that's the case, then why do people like this exist? All you have to do, according to them (and my experience) is pick up a consumer grade firewall with embedded Linux and you never worry about non-user initiated exploits. Aside from default password problems, can you name 5 remote exploits affecting consumer grade firewalls that prevent the user from being able to download patches?
Seems like everybody I know has one of those boxes (or their equivalent) and I'm the only one who knows how to upgrade the firmware on 'em. I did it to be security paranoid, but they've never had any problems. Shouldn't the default install of $CONSUMEROS be as security tight when it comes out of the box? Shouldn't anything else be considered a premature release?
I don't know what a TiPB is though.
I'm actually planning on buying a Mac Mini, but not because I consider myself "creative" in some narcisisstic way.
My other first post is car post.
Wow. Hardware synths are so...yesterday!
Karma Schmarma
None of Windows, Linux, and OS X have a real sandbox architecture.
It's easy to withdraw a given program's capability to access things private to a given user account. Just create a limited user and su to it to run questionable apps.
the better educated Indians seem to speak with an educated British accent (as opposed to a non-educated British slang accent, or an Indian accent).
My other first post is car post.
By now, I just flatly refuse to be involved in their computer problems: My advice usually boils down to a polite version of something like "Buy a Mac mini or shut up." Even if they want to keep a Windows machine for games, at the mini's price, there is no excuse not to surf with a Mac anymore.
Well, then, it's a good thing MacOS X is very stable out of the box, and doesn't require the user to do any major maintenance to keep it that way.
--R.J.
Electric-Escape.net
Hello this is my first post, I usually just visit the site and read comments, but this article really irritated me...(and maybe because it's friday and I'm trying to procrastinate at work) But anyways I'm by NO ways a Microsoft fanboy, but the author of this article does not see the bigger picture. A Microsoft OS of some sort runs on a MAJORITY of servers, and workstations worldwide. If I were a smart spammer and hacker I would definately target my spyware and viruses to the MAJORITY of the systems, which happen to run a Microsoft OS. So yes MACs do have less viruses and spyware, but this is because there are FEWER viruses and spyware being written for and targeted towards at MACs. So if what the author so slyly suggests everyone switches to MAC, I'm sure the MAC would face the same problems as a PC with a Microsoft OS.
I thought there was an issue with Quark and Classic
Could be. I don't know anybody who even tried to use it.
Palm is a close second to Quark.
Are they still making software? I thought iSync put them right out of business.
The last version of office to connect to an exchange server is 2001 running in Classic.
If you've still got an Exchange server, man, you've got way bigger problems than Mac OS X compatibility.
What is this BS about swamping of computers? My brother-in-law operated, until this last summer, with a totally exposed PC on cable. He only had problems after a neighbour fear-mongered him into installing Black Ice (he has an old HP which didn't seem to like the software). No identity theft, virus, or worm ever plagued him. He also never surfed porn (apparently ...), never opened attachments from unsolicited email, nor clicked on random advertising and pop-ups.
The article makes me think the SO is the one with the problem. Sort of the kind of person who would walk naked down poorly lit streets late at night. Sure, she should be able to do so safely but that just isn't reality. And the author is a bit of a sadistic passive aggressive wanker who probably watches her do it, get assaulted, and then decries the lack of safety.
"Consensus" in science is _always_ a political construct.
Yes, when Apple switched from the 68000 processor to the PowerPC, people with 68000s suddenly found that their computers weren't worth as much. Know what other crime against humanity goes unpunished? Every year, car companies come out with newer, better, more capable cars, and they refuse to provide existing customers with an upgrade path. I bought a 325 in 1996, and when the 330 came out a couple of years ago, I was told in no uncertain terms that the dealer absolutely would not swap my engine out for me at any price. The bastards!
Old motor vehicles do not become incompatible with newly constructed roads nearly as quickly as old computers become incompatible with newly published computer programs.
That was kinda my point. Doesn't matter what OS or what firewall (remembering that a "hardware firewall" is just a specialized appliance-PC running a limited OS), sooner or later someone will find a way to breach it. Sooner or later it will need SOME sort of attention.
ISTM that we've become stuck on the notion that there are only two choices in a mass-market OS: insecure and easy, or secure and difficult. Does it really HAVE to be that way??
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
I wonder when Linux-People stop wasting they're energy just to spit on Microsoft, Windows and Bill Gates? This wasted energy could be used to really make it happen that Linux would became as popular on home and office desktops as Windows now is. Have you people really, really adult like ever thought why Windows is so popular and more used on desktops tha Linux is?? Just for example, forget the monopoly theories etc. for starters. Spitting on another competing products isn't the way to improve the image of Linux. I have now been using Linux for ten or more years and I am fed up with this shit! Not the Linux but the "people around it". And even the writer of that article only visions the worst possible scenario when user gets online and gets bugged. This is not the reality folks. At least here in my country teleoperators are selling internet connections with firewall and virus detection software so the "bugs" from the Internet are not the issue what so ever. Microsoft is developing it's own antispyware which is going to turn things around and make surfing more safe. So, my final word is that start to fucking really develop the Linux to suite us all or we are going to be pushed aside. And.. STFU! Do some work instead!
More and more people are relying on consoles for the primary source of games. It's so much easier, and more convienient...
Name one shareware, freeware, or free software game that will run properly on one of the major consoles before installing a questionably legal modchip or softmod.
Well if windows only held 10% or 1% of the market then i would complain about the viruses. but when it holds nearly 90% you can't really say you didn't see it coming. why would a virus writer attack linux or osx when their target audience is very small. alot of people use windows, including alot of inexperianced people. this is such a huge target it's like trying to spit on the ground. you're going to hit it no matter where you aim.
I think that because Windows comes installed on most new PC's, people don't necessarily feel that they bought the software, and so there is not much motivation for complaining about what you seemingly got for 'free'
Logic, macros, and more
Whats funnier is that the Windows fanboys have officially taken the place of the linux fanboys.
Amazing how quickly they have become the people that they railed against on this website for so long
"ITS THE STOOPID USERS FAULT "
And finally a list that is currently modded up to +4 insightful of tasks that the average user must perform everyday to use the Windows operating system. Of course if this was for linux then we would be reading +4 insightful posts about how linux is useless because "the average user" can't be expected know anything.
Yes Windows is just so easy to use.
Just crashed on me again today
Every Windows believer should follow that and give an honest (that doubly and overly emphasized) try on some Linux distro.
I have tried Mandrakelinux, and hardware showed up as unsupported. I'm not willing to spend money to replace my still-unsupported-by-SANE flatbed scanner unless you can demonstrate that switching to GNU/Linux is worth it, and I'm not willing to spend money to buy a second hard drive unless you can demonstrate that dual-booting is worth it.
The Slashdot crowd may be heavily into games, but I'm not sure the average PC user is. My father-in-law, for example, who turned down a 17" PowerBook because "It's not a Microsoft computer". This is a guy who thinks nothing of spending $3-5k on a computer, on which he will work with three things: Office, AOL, and Quicken.
An awful lot of people I know play no games. Even those that do don't play them at work, which is where an awful lot of Windows computers are. I've got three Macs and a Linux box at home, and every one of them, including the eight year old Mac, does everything I do at work better than the Windows machines I use there, which are maybe a year and half, two years old. And they essentially need to be wiped clean and everything re-installed once a year or they cease functioning at even their current half-assed level.
The reason Windows is still the standard is that it is perceived as the standard...nothing more. People get it because they don't want to get something that isn't the norm. They want to be able to talk to people about their computer without having to explain to people what it is. They use Windows at work, or grew up with it at home, and they don't want to learn another OS.
I've eased about half a dozen people through transitions to Macs and Linux, and not one of them has expressed any regret or desire to go back (That said, I think Linux still takes more than the average user can stomach, but it's getting there.)
This machine (the one i'm using right now) is running Windows XP Pro, on a very low quality (the brand name is Mercury) motherboard, a 900 mhz duron processor overclocked to 1.2 Ghz and 312 Megs of RAM. It's one of the cheapest boxes you can get on the market.
It has been online for more than a year without rebooting, i don't have SP2 installed, i don't have a firewall, both FTP and HTTP ports are open and i use it every single day to browse the net (which includes p0rn sites full of dialers and spyware programs, of course), listen to music, download files, music, videos, etc. and develop and test my web applications.
All this facts should make my machine to be unusable at this point, but hey, i have all the visual themes enabled (i love eye-candy applications), no spyware or viruses whatsoever and it's really REALLY fast.
The only thing i did was to disable the RPC service which solved almost all my virus-related problems (Sasser, Blaster, etc.) and i obviously use firefox as my default web browser.
Don't get me wrong, i'm no windows fan, i use it because i have to (and because iTunes, Flash and 3D Studio MAX are not availible for Linux) but i didn't have any problems for almost an entire year.
On the other hand, i have another machine running Fedora Core 3 and some times i get hardware compatibily problems and both xfce and gnome likes to freeze once in a while (i know it's not a linux kernel problem, but i'm taking the linux word as the whole system).
I'm no IT pro, but most of the slashdot crowd is, so why is it that i don't have any problems with windows at all and most people had so many bad experiences with it? Am i the only lucky guy that never had a single (SERIOUS) problem with windows on earth?
Games don't count
Tell that to any family with children under 13.
It's absurd to prevent a company from install its OS on the computers it sells. We have no problem letting Microsoft put Windows on the hardware it sells.
And I'm sure you're willing to apply the same standard to Novell, Mandrake, and Red Hat, right? God forbid a software company be allowed to pre-install an OS on a system that somebody else built!
By that standard, we'd have exactly three choices in computer hardware today - IBM, Sun or Apple. It's not very FOSS-ish of you to argue that less choice in both software and hardware would be good for anybody. Besides, if MS had to, you know they'd be able to outspend any of these guys on developing consumer hardware, so they'd still be a monopoly. You'd just have less Linux out there.
MS can be blamed for a lot of things, but really, this article is just a lot of pro-Mac, anti-MS hooey. Why it gets featured on Slashdot is not really a mystery given the site's post-OS X pro-Mac bias, but that doesn't make it really newsworthy either. I don't honestly even believe the guy's story about installing Windows on his SO's machine; the 4 minute attack is lifted straight out of an article that appeared here about 4-5 months ago. Seems a bit coincidental that a self-confessed lifetime Mac user would suddenly be installing Windows XP on his SO's machine just so he can write about how awful it is.
The second half of his article just goes on at length with the standard Mac fanboy arguments that we've heard for years - it stops being about security and instead touches on the prices of Macs vs. PC's (he argues PC's are actually more expensive once you bring them "up to the level" of a comparable Mac), the user-friendliness of Windows vs. OS X, the innovativeness of Apple vs. MS. I mean seriously, blah blah blah. If I wanted to read this, I'd just search the Usenet archives from 1986.
There's no doubt that Windows XP has its share of security problems, moreso than most OS's. But there's no new info in this article and lots of annoying fanboy hyperbole. I've seen more insightful writing in Slashdot posts, and that's saying something.
Why haven't they jetisoned the foul beast from Redmond and migrated en mass to the Macintosh or even Linux?"
You think that Linux and Mac are safe? Trust me, if Linux becomes the de facto operating system, it will have all the beautiful worms and viruses of the Windows World. Same goes for Mac. There is just no need to make spy/malware for systems only few people use.
That isn't a firewall. That's a web filter.
A lot of the higher-end products that include firewall capability also include at least some sort of web filter.
If, by some unlikely circumstance, your suggestion derives from astroturfing nor trolling and you honestly believe in the effectiveness of web filters, then pity prevents me from responding to it.
Then you'd agree I have the last word.
When MAC announced their "I-Mini" McIntosh, it caught my eye. Wanting to buy/build a small computer for my already cramped breakfast bar, I started pricing out similar hardware. The results startled me. Most of the configurations I found were more than the humble US$499 of the "I-Mini" McIntosh. To match price I had to configure with a much bigger shuttle-style case.
My question is this. What PCs are currently on the market to compete with this? When my wife asks for the "cute little MAC", what real computer can I buy instead?
Additionally even in NT based machines like Win2k and WinXP you have to be administrator to install certain applications. The difference is most Windows people log in as administrator all the time. Window's makes it very difficult to do it any other way.
If you see spelling or grammatical errors don't blame me. I tried to preview but IE here at work borked the CSS
Installing clean and then updating from behind a NAT works fine. Most home users should have one anyway. :)
#6495ED - cornflower blue
There's no reason whatsoever for a workstation to have ports open to the outside.
Other than the fact that one of the latest killer apps for a workstation, especially a residential one, involves making it double as a server? BitTorrent, eMule, Gnucleus, and IM file transfers do this.
Ok, I might be way off base here, but one of the reasons bungie made the switch to windows might be that they were bought out by Microsoft. Just a thought.
Bungie made the leap and dropped Mac support? You mean like when they were bought by Microsoft?
Of *course* they dropped support for a rival platform. This has nothing to do with technical limitations.
Really it's not their fault. They built an OS that can do tonnes of things and do them easily.
Virus writters are simply trying to destroy, it's totally antisocial behavior and should be punished to the full extend possible under the law. A simple system to track virii backwards and fixing should lead to the writter.
Spyware and Adware should be illegal, it's totally absurd how much damage it causes while companies get rich from slowly crapping up people's computers.
Linux is all about opening up information and allowing users to change things, but Microsoft wants to make it easy to change everything as well.
Assuming there will be people actively trying to destroy what you make is self defeating, not every party has someone counting beers and food.
There exists a duality here. Windows users see nothing but their beloved system (even though when put to scientific scrutiny, theirs is the worst system on the planet), and William Henry Gates III and his shareholders know that fixing something (anything) costs money. So long as Microsoft users refuse to change, so will William Henry Gates III (and his shareholders). So long as nothing changes, you don't need to anything. A paying customer is a happy and satisfied customer. Linux and other systems can only look good to dissatisfied Microsoft customers (and other dissatisfied customers of other systems). It's simple. If you are a happy Microsoft customer, then you will keep sending in the money (and of course, won't complain on ./ or anywhere else, as you were the one who sent in the money). If you aren't happy, then don't send in the check. It comes down to that.
If you want to sell a copy of MS Windows, whether you're a big box store, the guy on the corner, or Dell, you have to committ to selling a fully patched box at the time it walks out the door.
So what should the big box stores do on the first few days after Microsoft releases a new patch? Should they have to destroy all copies of Windows retail edition in their possession and order new ones from Microsoft? It's rather hard to slipstream something into a stamped CD.
We use windows becuase there is no viable alternative. Honestly. I'm sorry to say, for me, and 100s of millions like me... there isn't.
Luckily, this won't always be the case. Apple and the many Linux distros will continue to get better and better. Will Windows keep up forever?
I wonder how long the Micro$oft monopoly will last...A decade... a century???
Um, last I check Microsoft wasn't a hardware OEM and wasn't preinstalling software of any type on anything. Make it lucrative for Dell to install one of the 50 Linux distros people fight over and I'm sure they'll do it. Though since Linux is just really a simple rip off of a 30 year old OS (unix) I dont think you will see this very soon. The OEMs were never big on *nix on the desktop.
It amazed me, to this day, that people are still pro-Microsoft. All I have to do is LOOK at windows and I know it's ancient. It just looks that way (xp included.) It's a lot better than it used to be, on the surface, but the usability it ATROCIOUS and the security vulnerabilities are rampant.
And, no, OS X is not more secure by obscurity. Let's just stomp that idea into the ground now. It's inherantly more secure. Period.
So the author is correct-- why on Earth do people use windows anymore? Switch. You know you want to.
"Politicians find new names for institutions which under old names have become odious to the people."
You don't need a second hard drive to dual boot.
I apologize for forgetting to state that I have only 3 GB free on this hard drive.
I'd easily argue that less that 99% of their machines run fine.
When was the last time you needed 3 full time, over-paid IT employees to look over a Macintosh network of 50 computers? Windows is a joke.
"Politicians find new names for institutions which under old names have become odious to the people."
I find Windows 98 running on Win4Lin so damn cute!
Bart quote from simpsons : I never knew it was possible but this both sucks and blows at the same time.
I thought what I'd do was, I'd pretend I was one of those deaf-mutes. - Catcher in the Rye
A dedicated Mac user that loves macs is from San Fran and probably gay want's to know why everyone doesn't want to hug a mac.
You need to realize that you work for support. People aren't going to call you up and say, "everything is working wonderfully!!" Yes XP has problems, so does EVERY other OS. The people that use *nix are usually so technically competent that you'll never hear a peep out of them. Windows boxes are cheap, making them available to a wide variety of people who don't know what in the hell they are doing. As someone who has worked in tech support I have had plenty of idiot calls from Mac users as well who managed to screw something up (however minor they can't fix it).
...just the "works just fine" part is erroneous. 99% are owned, hosed, rooted, screwed up, adwared, spywared, virus infected, spam spewing, buggy disasters. I cannot think of a single person I know in meatspace who owns peecees and hasn't had serious run ins with windows bogusness. Zero, even leet windows professionals who do it for a living. I know people who have literally bought new computers because their windows installs were SO bad with malware that they thought the hardware itself was broken. After people have thrown hundreds of dollars in software add ons at it, installed every patch they can,undergone multiple trips to the local puter fixit shop, there comes a point that something needs to be said and admitted to, and this dude in the article nailed it dead on square on and right on.
It's way past time for all the people out there to realise it's not raining, that really is Microsoft pissing on their back. and they pay for that privelege.
Now I don't care what private folks do with their time and money, that's their business, but in the public sector, there's no longer any need for that using tax payers money to prop up that company and it's alleged products that make them hundreds of billions of dollars and come with no warranty whatsoever and got enough bugs to keep a flock of entomologists happy for several millenia. Now free software is another thing, you get what you pay for, but those hundreds of billions of dollars dropped on MS software scribbles they pass off as "intellectual property" and demand it be treated like valuable property for their profits sake is another kettle of rather ripe and steenking fish. And that's where I think the law-line should be drawn too,changed drastically and I hope it does and I hope it shakes the software world to it's roots and the dirt beyond, if anyone pays for it, it's a commercial product and it should have a warranty, simple as that, same as any other product, bought, sold, or leased. Change that law, get rid of the get out of responsibility EULA nonsense they push for stuff that's sold or leased. If windows is so great, billy bob buckets of profits can do it voluntarily, there's a challenge to the microsofties who charge money (or anyone else who charges money for their IP "products") put a warranty on it that you back up or quit calling it a product.
signed, joe software consumer
And what about my SO's PC woes? Well, after her Vaio was so violently debilitated, and after being told by various experts that it would require nothing short of a complete (and very expensive) Windows system debugging and OS reinstall
I say:
Reinstalling windows takes 60 minutes and from windows 98-present (highest home user edition is XP Media Center Edition) will prompt you and give good tips on the whole reinstallation process.
Furthermore, this system was a sony Vaio, and sony has very good reinstallation and imaging disks. So good in a fact, that if you had made a short free call to the manufacturer they would have told you to insert the disk and to follow the on-screen prompts.
-- Yes, I am a experienced x86 man, I am a PC diehard. But being that, I also know bollocks when I see them, and this particular section is. In a word, owning a PC, just like owning a Mac, just like owning a car, you need to be able to follow simple directions for simple maintenance.
Maybe I'm a flamer or a troll, but I don't like when facts are cast to the wayside for a biased opinion.
If the Windows patches were directly accessable by web browser, any non-MS browser could be used to download them. Windows Update forces the user to keep IE on his system, further leveraging the monopoly.
Better to ask why does Anything suck?
Why do American cars suck?
Why do most TV shows suck?
Why does Congress get away with writing laws for the highest bidder?
Answer to all: Because everybody lets them.
...was the downfall. And you had to have a sales receipt from your win98 purchase! WTF.
(Score: -1, Fucking Redundant) Enough said, you just repeated your post, asshole. Dude, you just repeated the same thing you said in an earlier post. Thank you come again. your friendly neighborhood troller general
i agree with you about not going around calling people morons, that's fair enough, but let's look at the computer/car analogy at little closer:
In reality, cars do nothing more than go forward, turn left/right, go backwards and brake; fair enough. in reality, computers do nothing more than add and subtract 1s and 0s from larger strings of 1s and 0s
computers are GENERAL PURPOSE machines. We don't know what use the owner will put it to; alrighty, but so are cars: they perfor a limmited set of operation (forward, back, left, right), but the possible uses are *infintely general*: buing groceries, long trips from san diego to anchorage, doughnuts in the parking lot, drang racing, sex (when parked, hopefully), etc... and, they may be used in almost *any* weather conditions... the majority of these things are taken into account by the manufacturers, and (this next bit is really important): when they find that part of the device doesn't work in one specific set of circumstances, the product is recalled (think ford/firestone tires, that would blow if underinflated and driven too fast on warm days)
it's really the same with computers-- they have a very limmited set of functions, which can be put infinite uses depending on how those functions are performed (i.e. software)... the difference is that because lives aren't at stake, there's less motivation to patch things up when they don't work correctly.
the other place the analogy breaks down is the fact that malwear and spywear are mallicious third party creations.... to hold that up to the ford analogy, it would be like saying ford needs to do something about the kid who keeps slashing your tires....
so, yeah, the analogy isn't perfect, but i don't think it's fare to dismiss it out of hand... where it might be useful is in terms of cultural understanding of cars....
do you read john steinbeck? in east of eden and cannery row he gives *excellent* descriptions of how people approached automobiles when they first appeared in the marketplace.... it's not too different from how non-tech folks approach computers now... and, as you say, there's been 100 years, so, while most people aren't very tech-savy about cars, they have some idea of how to care for them.... let's give it 30 or 40 years, and see what happens
You question begs another:
... because, if you had, you'd know that Mac OS X can be connected to the internet without any firewall or virus protection of any kind without a single problem.
Have you ever tired connecting to the internet with Mac OS X?
I don't advocate that as a habit, obviously, but Mac people don't have to worry like Windows folks do.
"Politicians find new names for institutions which under old names have become odious to the people."
Hey.....my wife uses Linux!
=)
To Do: 1. Take over world 2. Pick up Milk and Bread on the way home
... bash Windows. Ingenious! Who'd've dreamed this would ever happen here? :)
and is still in the whitehouse?
Complacency.
Pretty much everything bad in the world can be put down to good (relatively speaking) men being too lazy to get off their beer-guzzling arses and do something to change the world for the better.
Suprise suprise.
Taking an average computer user you have a serious problem to deal with. The users limited ability to use the computer and of course their little to non exixstent knowledge of how a computer really works. There are millions average computer users and yet very few are can be considered power users and even fewer are like you, me and everybody else in this forum. The key to this problem is simplicity. In other words Windows. It is easy to use. The drawback on that is of course security and stability. But you know what, they are secure and stable enough for people to use them. And if you really know to use them there is littile possibility security holes and viruses will affect you. I do not even remember when was the last time my machine got infected with a virus. And yes I am running windows. Obviously Microsoft targeted the masses, something Linux does not and something Apple lately started to do. In addition to that Microsoft is there to make money! And it does it very very well. And yes, Bill Gates IS a genius. And no I do not think so is a bad person. The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation worths 24 Billion!!! That is not bad at all! See it from the business point of view. I bet if you were him you would do exactly the same or maybe worse. And as for the viruses. Why someone would want to write a virus for other OSs since close to 70% or more of the users have windows.If I was to write one I would go for the masses. There is no point chasing the few... Simplicity + Business = Microsoft Just a few thoughts of mine.
Even though I use Linux at home myself, I still think that Windows controls most of the public mindshare... in that everybody knows Windows and are scared of moving to new platforms. People tend to stick with the devil they know. I really wish both Mac and Linux would start gaining some ground here, and they will, as long as Microsoft keeps ignoring security problems and not updating IE. That's right Microsoft, just keep sleeping...
Meh.
There's sort of a fatalistic acceptance I've seen displayed by some Windows users. They just accept that they have to reinstall the OS every so often because it slows down to the point it's barely functional.
Look at it from MSFT's perspective. They can pork users with product activation, back-stabbing EULA's, DRM, forced upgrades, file format lock-in and they just keep taking it. What's the incentive to change their behavior?
That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
iSync uses Palm's hotsync software, even though it syncs into iCal.
Plus, there's no memo pad conduit, so those go into Palm Desktop.
I use Macs to up my productivity, so up yours Microsoft!
There's a big difference between shipping an OS that has every service known to humanity running by default and shipping an OS that will selectively enable services as and when you need them.
Have you ever tried to disable some of the windows services? They all seem to depend on one another, and half of them seem to have something to do with networking and/or some file sharing protocol or other.
Not so in UNIX; you can just turn them off as and when. The most complex that springs to mind is NFS, which only requires 4 or 5 daemons, all of which you can turn on and off without crippling some other part of the machine. UNIX seems to follow the KISS rule alot better than windows.
Not that I'm saying modern distros make it evident (and TBH I'm totally out of touch with modern GUI-based distros; I use Debian mysel) but it'd be a simple matter.
Moderation Total: -1 Troll, +3 Goat
The official versiom of the game was played on THPS 2 on a friends dreamcast using bleem and drinking 151. Any version of the game will do and any form of booze. It's embarassingly simple.
:D.
-setup for 2 player rounds of graffity
-each player can choose a character (all characters must be of similar ability unless a handicap is agreed on).
-PLAY
-loser does a shot of booze and passes the controller. Winner stays for upto 3 rounds. (some varietions included making someone who won too much drink)
Pretty simple. The two minute rounds keep it interesting. Of course the more you lose the drunker you get and the more you lose and... If we played before the bar we rarely made it there
"If you are going through hell, keep going." - Winston Churchill
1. Windows has a ton of more games than Linux.
/. that's probably what will happen aways. But just remember as you lay down to go to sleep clinching your Tux plush doll, Linux is a hacked, disorganized, bandaid, foster child. Windows has a 40 billion dollar a year company behind it and in a business world that means everything. (and IBM doesn't make $40 billion a year).
2. There is only 1 distro of Windows, the one Microsoft put out. If I had a problem, I could go directly to them. They have an HUGE knowledge base on their site where I can find answers to any problems I might have.
Linux has like 100 different distros, each coming with different programs and problems. There is no 1 Linux company that I can turn to. Yeah sure, if you buy Red Hat, you go to Red Hat, however who would goto if you installed Slackware?
3. Windows has for more applications available to it then Linux and most companies only make Windows versions of their app. I'm a ColdFusion Programmer and I have yet to see a copy of ColdFusion Studio or DreamWeaver for Linux. And don't even fucking mention that half ass piece of shit program called Eclipse.
4. Windows is a lot easier to use than Linux is. It's the truth, get over it. From installing applications to using the desktop, it beats Tux over the head with a dead fish. Don't sit there and try to pull that RPM shit on me. RPM this moron. When I need to install an application I want to double click the install icon and go. Not sit there and have to jerk around with command line parameters or some half ass, half designed installer program. Uninstalling programs is just as easy as well.
5. Exchange. Nuff said. Find me a Linux equivalent to that and then you can talk. Don't come to me with Thunderbird and what ever shitty app Mozilla is trying to put out for a calendar.
6. Application data sharing. Love the fact that I can share data amoungst the application in Windows. Like cutting and past a chart from excel into word, or into Outlook. Try doing that with KOffice.
7. For that matter CUTTING AND PASTING in general. Every app has a different way to do it. Can't there be just one way to do it amoungst all Linux apps.
I could go on and on and on and on. Face it, Linux is a hobby OS, always has always will be. The companies that sell are just breacking even and will never be as successful as Microsoft is.
Go ahead and mark this as a flamebit. Since it's
find it increasingly suspicious that these stories always start with "A friend of a friend's PC..." or "My Mom's PC..."
Not in my case. Having no firewall, but only anti-virus software allowed me to, one day, leave myself online for about 7 hours, and view the kind of things that happened. Over 200 different virus-has-been-blocked windows were waiting for me when I came back. Not to mention the other mal-ware that were uncovered with a subsequent scan with Ad-Aware and Spybot.
I just bought a Dell about 2 months ago. I took it out of the box. Plugged in the internet connection and never had a problem. The version of XP that came with it had SP2 already on it. I set it up to auto updates and haven't had a problem yet.
Personally I think this guy is on crack.
All the naysayers here want to bash the article but what they forget is
a) most people unpack, plug in and go
b) whatever is preloaded is what will be running
c) if it's trialware it will be expired before it's purchased
d) do the math, you're talking about 2-3 hrs per machine post purchase setup and tuning
e) when it goes bad add another 1-3 hrs per machine per event
f) monthly maintenance time is 1-2 hrs per machine with updates and patching
I just bought my 2nd new complete PC since 1990. It's an eMachine and it comes with as complete a complement of automated system management of fix software. It is the 6th PC in my house right now. Almost all the others I put together from parts. I have been using PCs since 1982. I have been on the internet since before there was an internet (1988). I was an MVS, AS/400, Unix and Windows systems admin and systems programmer. I currently support 4 different flavors of Windows on my home LAN.
I know WTF I'm doing.
I am seriously considering that this will be the last Windows PC I ever buy. Intel based probably, Windows? Nuh-uh.
And lemme tell you cats that unless there are lots of people who think like me, 2005 will be first year of declining PC ownership and declinging connections to the Net. It's just not working anymore and the faster we run out of this burning building the better.
They have no real competition. Whether you require a specialized business application, have to run somebody's telebanking software, need help from your ISP, would like to upload a list of phone numbers to your mobile phone or just want to play the latest games on your PC, most roads still lead to Redmond. Windows will always suck as long as this is the case. As long as Windows is making money for M$, why should they fix it? We must all do our best to educate the people around us that there are alternatives to Windows, especially if all they want to do is just type and surf, but we're still up against a formidable foe. M$ are a real monopoly, which means they are very powerful: they can and do raise their prices arbitrarily (86% profit for Windows in 2002) -- something they can do without harming their market share -- and they defend their position tooth and nail, making heavy use of marketing, FUD, misinformation and of course, a practically unlimited budget.
Every free-market economy has (or should have) antitrust laws to protect it from the unfair competition and business practices of a monopolist defending and exploiting its monopoly. In 1907, John D. Rockefeller's Standard Oil Company had cornered 64% of the oil market. The United States government took him and his company to court and won, after which it was broken up in 1911. Unfortunately, though the law may be clear in this area, justice is never automatic -- it still has to be enforced by the government. And since governments are run by people and people can be corrupted, it's possible for the monopolists to get anyway with their evil practices anyway. In 1998, the DOJ under the Clinton Administration took M$ to court for similar reasons -- and by that time M$ had cornered a lot more than 64% of their market. But, alas: before the trial could be concluded, the Bush administration had taken over from Clinton and within the space of only a few short months, uncle Bill and his buddies were off the hook. The DOJ's case, representing years of hard work and $200 million of the taxpayers money, was simply flushed down the toilet. Boy, what little money in Washington can do for a guy! What's ironic in this comparison is that Rockefeller, although ruthless, was not as successful with his monopoly as you may think: the price of kerosene had fallen from $2 a gallon in the early 1860s to about six cents a gallon by the time of the Standard Oil trial. On the other hand, by 2001, M$ was raking in ridiculous profits for its Windows software, but they're the ones who got off almost scot-free.
For PC users, I believe that things will eventually get better. Alternative operating systems, such as OS X and Linux will slowly eat away M$'s lead, but I feel this may take a long time. At one point, a critical mass will be reached and the makers of business software will begin to offer Linux versions, as will the banks, your ISP will begin to offer support for OS X and the gaming industry will no longer be able to afford to focus on Windows alone. Exactly when this day will arrive is anybody's guess, but I sure do hope it arrives sooner as opposed to later.
I believe that Fisher-Price has a soluiton to the problem. Just need to get users to start off with something simple until they can train into the more advanced version once they've learned the basics.
Indirectly, you make a good point wrt a critical difference between commandline and GUI: once you get into GUI territory, HOW you *present* config settings becomes as important as the config settings themselves -- because if you don't present them in a way that average folk can understand, the very people the GUI is *meant for* won't be able to figure out how to configure stuff, and like as not will get it wrong.
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
It's not like anyone that reads the paper or wathces the news doesn't know that Windows is the prime target for malicious malcontents. I have done 3 clean XP and 1 Win98 installs for friends and family in the last 2 months and not one machine was infected during the process or afterwards even though they were live on my DSL. Maybe it's because I know the vulnerabilities and I make it a point to patch, then apply AV and firewall as soon as I can. If this genius tried this maybe he wouldn't have these problems. Also, the new car analogy is completely flawed and specious at best.
You do realise that if you could just install any arbitrary peice of software as a non-privileged user, then any client app bug could be exploited to install anything.
And you don't normally have to download firefox, since it tends to be included on installation disks now.
Isn't a lot of the problem with Internet Explorer and how it integrates with Windows?
Better question? Will anyone be reading post # 1600 in this thread?
Except for ending slavery, the Nazis, communism, & securing American independence, war has never solved anything.
not to mention that XP service pack 2 is alot more secure and the defacto version pre-installed with OEMs these days but lets not mention that.
"That is called a "Union". Popular for that very reason..."
Oh, let me assure you that having a union is not necessary. My current employer (not software related) seems to operate? that way and there is definitely no union....
Wow. An astonishing troll of an article. Well done!
Neither you nor he can read a table.
Mac usage went up from 1.8% to 2.8% from March 2003 to Jan 2005. That's a 1 point or 55% rise in market share.
Linux usage went up from 2.2% to 3.2%. That's a 1 point or 44% rise in market share.
Windows went down from down from 93.2% to 89.3%. That's a 3.9 point or 4% fall in marketshare.
someone will
I am virus and spyware free, and so is my entire network. There is so much out there designed to take advantage of windows useability. Then take over. Though most of this nasty software is installed due to users input. If linux was more user friendly to the beginner, people would complain its too restrictive, then after a while, new gadgets would be included in the OS and people would be exploiting it. Eventually it always comes down to the user. Having the right protection and checking your own system from time to time.
sshd if off by default and there is no working root account on default install OS X (or any standard account that you can log in with - the only account that has a proper shell is the user account). I'd like to see that trivial dictionary attack of yours on OS X...
If you look at all the defending arguments of Microsoft, you'll find the analogy's to the tyranny of a King uncanny.
One definition of tyranny is "a rigorous condition imposed by some outside agency or force "
It's is difficult to imagine a more rigorous tyranny than Microsoft. And to say that Microsoft's 90% market share, 40 gazillion dollar profits by unjust business practices justifies its theivery and unjust business practices is just bizarre to say the least. Microsoft is the King of business and financial tryanny.
No product, no matter how much technically better than Microsoft will every supplant it without a business war to back it up. This country had to overthrow the tyranny of Britian's unfair business practices through revolution. This country will require legal revolution to dethrone Microsoft. Technology alone will never defeat it because Microsoft's rise to power was via proven unjust business practices, not technological competition.
Overthrowing Microsoft's tyranny will never be done via better technology. To believe so is to believe a peasant too can someday be King.
um the store copy of XP i just bought had sp2 on it. I had to buy a legit copy because of my new 200 gig hd needed 48bit LBA in order to recognize size larger than 135 gig and thats only included in SP1 and up
Windows can be virus free if you know what your doing. With a DSL line, one can download updates and spyware and virus protection within 4 minutes. Unfortunately, most people don't have this level of intellect. And you are lying to yourself if you don't acknowledge that the root of all Windows security problems is the fact that it's so mainstream. I use Windows, and I've been virus free since I installed it. I tried Linux, but it's a lot more limited. I couldn't imagine any of my friends switching to it and not being extremely frustrated and/or bored. Also, consider the fact that a new Linux version comes out constantly but it takes Windows a couple years. Users are not going to upgrade an operating system every 6 months; they wait until they have hardware limitations. This doesn't make them lazy, it just means they expect a little less maintainence than Linux gurus, who have to upgrade a lot more often. Personally, I think Microsoft can fix it's reputation by fixing their users. It takes a full 15 minutes to secure a Windows machine, permanently, but neither Average Joe nor Linux nerds understand this. If Microsoft just put out a TV ad showing a beautiful woman going to Tools -> Windows Update, maybe you'd all understand.
I am well aware that Apple makes quicktime.
.mov movies I make with my digital camera in Linux.
But I don't want to beat my head agaist the wall trying to get mplayer to play the
Nor do I want to beat my head against the wall trying to get Linux to recognize what to do with a site that requires a Windows Media Player plugin.
My mother-in-law has a dual PowerMac G4 with a midi keyboard.
Her experiences with the hardware and software on MacOS 10.2 were as follows:
1) Printer (HP Photosmart 1000 USB) has been flaky.
2) Scanner (Epson USB - not sure of model) - paperweight.
3) USB Mac Floppy drive - paperweight in OSX.
4) Midi - not only did she have to buy a new interface, (old mac serial was obsolete), but midi support in 10.2 was quite primitive.
5) Finale 2002 - A Classic MacOS program that could not access the hardware it needed in MacOS X.
Needless to say, they were quite disappointed.
I live in New Zealand, so I can't speak for how it is in the US or Europe, but why don't Apple advertise? They certainly don't here. When people who just want a machine for home to get on the "interweb thingy" do some letters and email, they look at the adds for "Harvey Norman" or "Noel Leeming's" (Big chain stores here) and see Dell's advertised for cheap, so pop out and buy one. Now, if Apple advertised not only their machines but why people should change, then I think the average consumer would start to get the picture. They'd simply be better informed.
I see it all the time. My family have all bought PC's and they're computer illiterate, so in no way would they know what a Macintosh is and what it could do for them.
I would rather have the "dumbed down" of Mac OS X (and darwin) than the just plain dumb of Windows.
Things like having the ip address reported outside the configuration screen, but not in it, user data folders that don't contain all of the data for the user make me glad that I haven't had to deal with Windows until now, and that is just to migrate the users away from it.
It's compatibilty retards! I don't understand why Linux fanboys just can't understand I don't want to program and compile my own drivers for some un-supported uncommon hardware. Let alone configure and recompile the core libaries or kernal or whatever else I need. I don't have the time, or the know, how or the patience. Hardware comes with WINDOWS drivers not LINUX drivers.. WHY DOESN'T ANYONE UNDERSTAND THIS?
________
I spell like a programer
Palms don't speak SyncML yet? Silly rabbits.
I run a mix of OS X, Linux, and Win2k machines at my home office. I'm familiar with network configs on pretty much everything, and have been putting together mixed networks for over a decade.
... and looking ... ... and looking ...
...and hunting... ...and hunting...
... like setting up a 2-node network via crossover cable with IP's 10.0.0.1 and 10.0.0.2. I've been doing that on other machines since college. I've tried FOUR times with XP machines, but never succeeded.
... it was the XP machines! Go figure. All the Win2k machines were fine.
But the first time I saw XP was when a friend brought over his shiny new laptop. He wanted to go online, so we just plugged in an ethernet cable, and I went looking for the setting to turn on ethernet and DHCP, nothing more.
"Set up new internet connection" wizard, asks if i want to set up a home connection or office connection. I don't know, I want a fscking ETHERNET connection with DHCP, but I figure the idiots in Redmond assume all offices have ethernet and all homes have dialup, so I try "office". No joy. I try "home". No joy. Both give me the same options, and are asking whether I have ISDN. (why the... in 2003? ISDN?)
After fully half an hour, I finally realized that the "new internet connection" wizard only does dialup and ISDN, but that it still somehow thinks there's a difference between homes and offices that is relevant. Can't do ethernet through the wizard, and I can't find the control panels.
Of course the owner of the laptop knows bupkus about his shiny new system.
So I started hunting for other ways to configure the network.
I finally figured it out, but it took me an honest 90 MINUTES to figure out how to unhide the icons in the control panel so that I could actually connect the damn machine. Any other computer would have taken me 30 seconds, tops.
And don't even get me started about all of last year, when my girlfriend had an XP laptop that needed to have a different static IP, plus different wireless network name, at my house and at hers. My powerbook switches between full net configurations in two seconds, straight out of the apple menu, and I can store as many as I like. Every time she brought that laptop to my place, it was a five-minute hassle to hook the f*cker up and switch the IP/DNS/gateway by hand. Every time she went home, it was a ten minute tech support phone call to get it working again.
The incompetence of Microsoft's human interface engineers is completely unreal. Instead of fixing their poorly-organized control panels that were powerful but hard to use and cluttered with unnecessary details, they simply hid them entirely and replaced them with wizards that are completely unable to configure anything for anybody.
There are things I still can't manage with it
And setting up filesharing. I can't fileshare between my XP box and any other machine in the house. I have to fscking FTP files to and from my mac with it. My last LAN party: six geeks, six PCs - and we had to distribute level files on burned CDs because we couldn't get sharing to work on more than half the machines, even with all the configs set identically. The machines that couldn't connect to the server? Why
Since XP came out, the amount of time I spend supporting friends and relatives has absolutely quadrupled. The patheticness of its' configuration design and unpredictability of its networking code is jaw-droppingly, embarassingly, bad. I mean stinky.
Hang on, I'm starting to get the urge to tell you how I REALLY feel.
I stole this sig from someone cleverer than me.
OSX is not a bad system.
However, it is not the ultimate solution to all of the computer world's problems. It still does not have the software base Windows does, unless you buy an emulator.
Linux, on the other hand does not have "the basics" for average users yet and is a nightmare to configure correctly. I don't have a day to get my soundcard working or, god forbid, the wireless card.
Printer (HP Photosmart 1000 USB) has been flaky.
I had one at my old office. Worked perfectly.
Scanner (Epson USB - not sure of model) - paperweight.
I have one on my desk. Works like a charm.
USB Mac Floppy drive - paperweight in OSX.
My ex-girlfriend had one that she used for sneakernetting documents back and forth to the office where she worked. Standard USB mass storage device. Plug-and-go.
Midi - not only did she have to buy a new interface, (old mac serial was obsolete), but midi support in 10.2 was quite primitive.
I don't do audio myself, but my friend the composer doesn't have any complaints.
Finale 2002 - A Classic MacOS program that could not access the hardware it needed in MacOS X.
Like I said, never used it myself. However, seeing as how programs like Logic --hell, even Garage Band --work perfectly on the Mac, I'd say this was an isolated case.
In fact, because of Core Audio's incredibly low latency, doing audio on the Mac is dramatically superior to doing it on any other platform.
Okay, you're just making crap up. I remember how it went down.
COMPUTER! Whatever happened to Blueberry Muffin?
It's also called being a CEO. Not only that you will get a bonus when you decide it is time to 'spend more time with your family'.
putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
Ok, this argument might have flown 5-10 years ago. But OS X ... "dumbed down"? That's a silly argument.
How exactly is OS X "dumbed down" compared to Windows or *NIX?
COMPUTER! Whatever happened to Blueberry Muffin?
Ok, I've been using M$ products since DOS and windows 3.11. Up untill recently I never really thought of switching. One of the main reasons is that I'm an avid gamer and it's extremely easy for me to install a game and be playing it within a few minutes. That being said, it is my only compliment I have to give. I have become a pro at reinstalling that friggin Windows OS time and time again because of one virus/worm or other malady that windows felt like striking me with (often driver related). I won't go with macs because they are grossly overpriced (I can BUILD a comperable machine for 1/3 the price *excluding the mini which is the best decision mac has made*). So my choice has fallen on linux. The problem (so far) has been: which one. Well, let me tell you, I've tried a few. Mandrake was the first, Debian (shuddering at the pain in the ass install which was never able to boot into the gui), Suse 9.1, and Ubuntu (the one I've decided to go with). Linux is a really beautiful OS. The customizeability of EVERYTHING is a real dream come true. The multiple desktops and task switching is truely a gift from god. The speed and reliability (hardly any crashing) is impressive, even on old machines (I'm running the LiveCD off of the office PC). That being said...WTF is with installing software people. I understand the concept (mind you, the concept) of running command lines and compiling, HOWEVER, linux couldn't make it any harder to do (as far as a windows user is concerned). Granted, the selection of programs that comes automatically on the OS is great (love gimp and gaim), but they make it so friggin hard to install any other program that doesn't come with the OS (compared to Windows or Mac). I also had a few problems figuring out the networking configuration, but nothing TO far out of what I'd expect. I feel that linux has great potential and could even knock M$ off of it's throne, but if it really wants to indear itself to the general public it's going to have to fix the above mentioned problem (I haven't mentioned games or windows apps because I know that wine and cdega work even though I haven't been able to install either in ubuntu/suse). So, there's my big first post ever, do what ya gotta people.
Linux and Mac suck EVEN MORE!!
and you keep trying to compete.
Right up front I will say that I am a Linux user. Before that, I was a Windows user. Before that I was a Mac user. And before that I was an Atari ST user. All of this is my personal experience with many OSes and not work related at all. When I was an Atari ST user, I got very used to the fact that I could easily download any software I wanted from the internet and use it. A lot of it was shareware (a concept I misunderstood at the time. I assumed I could use it without paying for it and it was just an option to pay.) and some of it was freeware. At the time, I was basically JUST a user. I didn't write my own apps or even tweak config files. I just ran the shareware, freeware and some purchased software and JUST worked. That was OK. I also played some games. That was OK too. Then I moved onto GFA Basic and also got a C compiler and learned how to start writing my own apps. That eventually was OK too.
Then I got the chance to use Macs in college. They separated me even more from the technical side of computing and threw me even farther into the JUST a user crowd. This was OK. I had a chance to pursue more creative artistic endeavors without ever having to think about the computer as anything more than a music making tool, or a graphic editing tool, or a desktop publishing tool. This was OK.
When I graduated, I found that I couldn't afford a Mac and the Atari ST world was drying up. I was employed by a desktop publishing outfit that was PC based on an associate basis after I graduated. My employer was also kind of a mentor. I told him that I was in a quandry over PC vs. Mac. As he'd clearly gone the PC route but was handling desktop layout (engineering catalogs) for really big clients, I wondered whether or not I really needed to go Mac myself. At one point, I'd told him about the memory upgrade I built on my own for my Atari ST (I wired up a board to install SIMMs in it to get up to 2.5 Megs of RAM and saved myself considerable money) and he told me that I'd definitely be able to build a PC on my own. Up to that point I was afraid it would be too hard compared to the Mac. So in August of 1994, I built my first PC and installed DOS/Win31 on it. What surprised me was the lack of non-nagged shareware for DOS and Windows compared to the Atari ST. I wound up having to spend a lot of money on commercial products from Norton, Procomm, Microsoft, Aldus and Adobe. I found that Ihad to buy new versions/upgrades almost every year to year and a half as well. I went from Win31 to Win95. I learned that there were lots of thing about the Windows world that were half-assed compared to my experience with the Mac or even the Atari ST.
I got sick of the cost of computing with Windows and I tried Linux in 1995. I already had experience with *nix from a dial up shell account I got access to in College as well as VMS. So the prospect of running a nice flexible and easy to use CLI on my own PC compared to Windows 95 was very appealing. I had actually tried Linux in 1994 but when I failed to get X to run properly, I gave up on it since at that point I really wanted my PC to work like a Mac. The "killer apps" that got me to switch to Linux were Enlightment and GIMP. They were much closer to what I was accustomed to on the Mac and the ST and even my limited Amiga experience.
So between 1995 and 1999 I gradually moved further from Windows and more solidly to Linux. Al the while I've kept tabs on the Windows camp and I will say the Windows XP is probably the best version of Windows that Microsoft has made to date. It's the most stable version and the most user friendly version. It took the nearly 20 years, but they finally achieved parity with Mac OS 7 in terms of usability. Microsoft also finally acknowledged that the artistic community (musicians, graphic designers, videographers, etc...) is important too. I would argue that they are more important than business which is something that Microsoft still seems to fail to understand, but that is another discussion. However, these
-"...bad old ideas look confusingly fresh when they are packaged as technology" - Jaron Lanier (Digital Maoism on Edge.o
>Microsoft needs to be banned from preinstalling.
Yeah, right. And Windows users should wear a distinguishing mark on their foreheads.
Are you insane?
Even Bill Gates hasn't said that Linux should be banned.
So why do they call us, a ragtag group of neighbors, friends, and relatives to fix their computers instead of having them professionally serviced by computer repairmen?
Computers just aren't important enough to people to justify spending the time or money to do right.
People who think they know everything really piss off those of us that actually do.
Valve won't port HL2 to another platform themselves -- this has been discussed already, and they're (a) not interested in porting and (b) more or less obligated not to.
One of the larger Mac gaming companies have looked into porting it. The price Valve wants to allow a port is astronomical to the point there's no way sales would ever cover the source plus development.
But more importantly, despite Havok running on far less powerful PPC/graphics combinations than modern Macs (GameCube), there's no Mac SDK for Havok.
So even if someone could magically pony up the cash for Source/HL2, the game wouldn't go far with no physics engine.
Me too, yet I use Linux. Please explain this apparent discrepancy.
Karma: It's all a bunch of tree-huggin' hippy crap!
there can be no exploit which bypasses the security layer of the virtual machine and therefore the operating system.
Assuming the virtual machine implementation is perfect.
Note to ACs: I usually delete AC replies without reading them. If you want to talk to me, log in.
The reason why people haven't made a run on Seattle is because they are just as happy to have me or whoever the techie is reformat their hdd and re-install their crap for them. I'm happy to take their dollars. However, that doesn't necessarily mean they are happy with what happened, but recoveries from this crap aren't terribly difficult, just annoying. Most of them don't know they have a choice. However, I do start them down the road to OSS/FSF world. I give them OOo, AVG, RealAlt, and lots of other free stuff, that is immediately useful to them and doesn't take long to learn to use.
I think I understand what you're saying, but if all you want to do is web-browsing and homework, then having to spend an hour or several a week cleaning off malware sucks.
Anyone who whines about being modded down should be.
If more everyone (win users) bought Macs, they'be come down in price, if everyone migrated to *nix/bsd we'd have a more centralized development, some money flowing in and better all around products. but instead microsoft hires these people who get paid to think, yet they have an obviously inferior product. what does it take to get a following to accept this kind of reality?
... It takes a full 15 minutes to secure a Windows machine...
It takes zero minutes to secure a Mac permanently. That is infinitely faster. The article writer is right, if any carmakers behaved the way Window computers do, nobody would buy those cars and the makers would be sued into oblivion.
All theory is gray
Dispite the critical security flaws, and poor programming of Windows, most of the time it is the user's fault for allowing viruses, trojans, spyware, and other malware to migrate onto their system.
You've got the elder generation that didn't grow up with computers, and can't seem to figure simple stuff out. Then you have the younger generation that grew up with computers, but doesn't understand them because they never progressed passed playing games. My generation, which was born into the era of personal computing, seems to have a lot better grasp of things in general.
(hooray for the nintendo generation!)
I think you misunderstand the purpose and reason for a union (as in "trade union" or "workers union"). No union ever provided, in the past or now, protection against being fired for cause.
That is not the reason a union exists. The purpose of a union is to provide collective barganing power, not to protect individual rights. This is the most important thing to realize as you educate yourself.
Your misunderstanding is very common and exploited by the Republican party of the US, but the misunderstanding is a grievous myth. Unions do not protect anybody from being fired if they screw up. They can only fire you for a just cause which is specified in the contract. The contract says the union employee will show up on time, perform the job to requirements and so on.
In reality a union employee can be terminated for pretty much anything the employer wishes if the employer wants to get rid of a particular employee. It can be punching in a minute late, sub-par job performance, insubordination, or any of a number of things. But a union employee has zero protection from the union if the employer wants to terminate him for just cause.
They only real protection the union members gain is by making a contract that says the company must pay everybody in the union the same negotiated wages for doing the same job. This means the union cannot summarily fire you in order to replace you with somebody who works for less. This is what unions are for!
The trendy way to get around this is to outsource. Outsourcing has the advantage of also working against non-union employees.
but the possible uses are *infintely general*: buing groceries, long trips from san diego to anchorage, doughnuts in the parking lot, drang racing, sex (when parked, hopefully), etc... and, they may be used in almost *any* weather conditions.
The difference here is that the HUMAN in the car is doing all those different things, not the car. The driver decides which way to go from San Diego to Anchorage, gets the doughnuts, eats the doughnuts, has sex, etc... not the car. The car is just along for the ride (pun intended) and does nothing more than turn left, right, speed up or slow down. You can generalize a computer into 1's and 0's, but that's taking things down to much too low a level. In reality, data on a computer is handled infinitely many ways.
Imagine if the steering wheel did something different if you were going to the grocery store than say, to a sports game (say accelerating instead of turning). That's the way current computers operate. There has been some standardization in the way that most GUI programs behave, but it's still far from ideal. And actually, GUI standardization has been helped along by, of all people, Microsoft! I'm not saying they are saints, but there's really no better alternative (maybe OS X, but that requires expensive, proprietary hardware)
That is true mac's market share did increase by 55% of it's own market share, and linux did increase by a smaller percentage of it's market share. Since we're being technical on it... let's take a look at window's XP alone. It rose from 29.1% to 61.3% which is about 210% increase in market share.
Of course that way of looking at it doesn't make any sense, and those numbers are pointless.
Since we don't know the total size of the market in 2003 nor do we know that it was the same in 2005. Presumably the size of the market increased in those two years by a considerable amount. So we have to consider the market as a whole.
Linux and MacOS both rose by 1 percentage point. Therefore they both increased by approx. the same number of users. What does this mean? Well the older versions of windows dropped drastically in market share in the 2 years, obviously from the emergence of a newer OS. We can't say for sure from this data, but the looks of it, most windows users shifted to XP and some moved off onto Linux and Mac, of course it could be anything, but this is most likely.
The only thing we can say for sure is that XP is growing very steadily and very strongly. Also, linux and Mac are still in a head to head battle for second.
NOTE TO RESPECTIVE FAN BOYS: I am not saying anything about any OS, I'm just breaking down the table.
Hmmm witty sig or funny sig? Maybe elitest techy sig!
...Anyone who wants to play today's games today, and not in six months or a year, is using Windows...
Only someone with 2 - 3 thousand dollars to blow to get the same game experience to be had with a Playstation or X-box for a couple hundred or less. Many games come out for these dedicated game boxes before they mak it to a PC or Mac. Hardware will always be faster than software and the game boxes have special hardware just for games.
All theory is gray
...and thus begins another Pontiac owner's tale of woe.
"OH SHIT, THERE'S A HORSE IN THE HOSPITAL!"
How in the world does a computer get messed up 4 minutes after using it? What kind of sites did she try to visit? She surely didn't get her entire system halted by going on google or Yahoo? Either she went to some freaky porn site, an off shore warez site, or some messed up song lyric archive.
And more than anything, why would someone in IT be so foolish? You don't need to install the provider's software to get a connection, just let Windows autodetect the network on install, even the preconfig brand name machines do this when you go through registration and first boot.
Second, visit nothing but secure sites before updating. Limit to google, your mail provider, and if you must, stuff like ebay, imdb, gamefaqs, slashdot, fark. If you really cared though, you'd disable the net connection and first configure windows right
That means: services modifications, windows component add/remove, uninstalling any and all programs you don't need, going through each control panel and setting it up all right, disabling ALL power features, system restore, error reporting, and setting the page file to a static size, and for the sake of performance, stream line the entire interface to windows classic with no visual enhancements and small icons with no text.
Then after all that, you go to Windows update, install every single update there is, that means SP1, SP2, and everything else that goes with it, as well as the IE6 service packs, the OFFICE ones if you have OFFICE, and the latest DirectX. Then you look around the Microsoft website and download TweakUI, and further customize the settings. Also, fully update all drivers for all hardware to the most stable version
Afterwards, once you make sure your system is fully configured, completely updated, you install all the applications you might need, making sure to custom install each one, then you reboot, run from safemode, do a full virus scan, and full spyware/adware scans. Reboot again, run from command line, run check/scandisk, then go into safemode again, and defragment the entire disk
Then, be happy, and use your computer. Run the spyware/adware checkers and virus scan about twice a week, use your computer right, and enjoy..this is what I've done ever since I started with Windows, and I haven't hard one problem...and the performance is top of the line
And those of you who like Firefox and use a third party firewall or have an actual hardware firewall will have even MORE security....
I always post the same thing, but a fully tweaked and configured Windows XP is probably the best operating system we'll see until Microsoft gets it straight or there's a Linux truly ready for the consumer market [and no, it's not macosx]
There's a lot you can't do simply because Fedora doesn't ship multimedia software which has non-free codecs enabled. You can hit FreshRPMs, add in their repo, and start getting the stuff Red Hat leaves out (because their lawyers told them to).
How am I supposed to fit a pithy, relevant quote into 120 characters?
Thats why new editions of windows XP come with sp2 built in.
Furthermore if you enable windows firewall and make sure that windows is fully rebooted before you plug in the net cable you can keep out the nastiest attackers for long enough to get sp2 downloaded with no infections.
Or you could use a hardware firewall to achieve the same thing.
I intalled xp on my machine a few weeks ago and by using the firewall wisely I was able to get zero infestation. SP2 has even kept my wife from accidentially getting spyware from sites she goes to.
The big problem is that people don't know how to install the software correctly in the first place in a way that keeps them safe. The same issues would exist for linux if general people were installing it and trying to get it configured and it was popular enough to be attacked.
"You can now flame me, I am full of love,"
That's too easy. Users should have to right-click and choose "New" and then "Folder".
Stupid Mac OS.
Albuquerque PC
May be off-topic, but I just wonder, is the word "WIFE" a taboo in the US nowadays? Significant other... yuck!
Don't you see there may be a correlation between using M$ Window$ and calling your wife a "significant other"? Think about it... or ask a psychologist.
People resist change because change requires energy. People resist change until they believe that it will cost them more in terms of energy to stick with the status quo than to make a change.
So Windows users put up with Windows until it becomes so painful that the energy required to buy a Mac, learn to use it, transferring all of their files, and purchasing Mac versions of the software they use on Windows, etc., is less than the energy required to continue to put up with Windows.
I will say that in our office where we have both Macs and Windows, it is only the Windows PCs that give us grief. The amount of energy needed to support our Macs is close to zero.
Starting in the late 80's before Billy G. had 7 heads and 10 horns, a bunch of us bought computers. 1 bought a Mac and the others bought or built DOS machines. One of us worked at a Windows software development firm. Guess how many of them bought their own licensed copy of Windows 3.1 when it came out? Doom 2? Quake? Pagemaker? AutoCAD? One guy bought a Packard Bell that came with WinWord 6. Guess which word processor we all used after that? Guess how many games the Mac guy got from us? By the time Win95 came out, there was about $2000-4000 worth of software on each machine that no one paid for. How can you cost justify switching to Mac? In '97, I bailed and jumped to Mac. I had to pay for Photoshop, Claris Works, Starry Night, Pagemaker, SCSI scanner that actually worked. At least 3 installed '98 off the same burned CD. But now, guess how many of them are using XP... you betcha! Zip, Zero, NADA.
Aside from Pirating from work, often times, the work environment uses a software which is only Windows. Apps like Exacitmate, CardScan, AutoCAD, Medical, VPN clients. And before they went 'Net, my bank software was Windows only. If that's the case, it's hard to justify two computers when one MUST be a Windows machine.
Walk into any Walmart/Sam's or equivalent, buy a bucket o' bacon, 5 pounds of parmesan cheese and the latest version of The Sims shrink wrapped with 3 other lamer games. But I live in an area with Best Buy, Circuit City and still I have to drive 40 miles to buy a Mac Mouse. When generica offers Mac's or Linux, the migration will begin. And where can I get that rack in the front of Best Buy with scads of $10 software for MAC? Or does that fall under Asimov's "90% of everything is crap" rule
When Win95 came out, we still had lots of DOS stuff, we wanted to run. We've had machines given to us, we've cannibalized memory out of a machine and pitched the bones. Someone upgrades a hard drive, we get the old one. It's difficult to jump to Mac and throw away all that free stuff and our old favorites. (Tho I'm doing that with Mac's now.)
Aside from my obligatory Rush quote, it is the glaring flaw of MAC marketers and retail stores like CompUSA which have both Mac and Windows... Every been to CompUSA and see a Mac running MS Office? (Or Linux?) They have those cool demos, and if I were a Radiohead fan and movie editor, I'd buy it. But what about showing the public Safari? Show them MSWord X, Mac Quickbooks. Let them see how cool the apps they know are. Then show them the ADDED cost of buying anti-virus, anti-spyware, ADDED time of security patches. Tell them to put a quarter in a jar for every malware that Ad-Aware finds and make that the Mac Fund. They'll have a G5 in no time.
I asked a friend who literally doesn't know the difference between an email address and a 'web sight [sic]' why she bought an $1100 Gateway all-in-one when she could have gotten the equivalent iMac for $999. "Gateway offered payments", $80/mo for 24 months... Yeah... Macs are expensive...
1) it runs from root 2) users of it are dumbed down intentionally by MS for "ease of use". which as a result leads to... 3) 3rd party programs users from no. 2 don't know what to install and not install so they click ad pop-ups which install spy ware, adware, and other annoying things which slow their rig down and otherwise cripple their system. Basically it comes down to pure ignorance on the users behalf, MS isn't 100% to blame, they can be blamed for making it run from root and encouraging users to be stupid to how computers work by making things "easier" but not everything.
Linux, as it stands, is complex, and most computer users are ignorant.
No, I wasn't trying to troll, but it sure sounds like it, doesn't it?
If only it were that way in the Netherlands. Over here the unions are very powerful. When the government tried to cut in the pension plan because it will be waaaay to expensive when all baby boomers reach age 60 (almost there), they organised massive strikes.
The goverment was forced to reduce cuts and conesequently my pension will be when I'm 70. Supposedly, unions are all about solidarity but I guess it's a one-way street.
actually, i work in internet security and if an unpatched windows machine is brought up online, it can be compromised by a work in 4 minutes if there are other hosts on a dsl network that are infected.
The "91% of computers are infected with spyware" DOES come from McAfee who just so happens to have a vested interest in selling tin foil hats to the populace.
How do they get these stats?
1. They count every Kazaa download and call it 1 user who has spyware.
2. They count anyone with a "doubleclick" cookie as having spyware.
3. They have 1337 h4X0Rs p0wning us all and they have a progress bar in their mountain lair fortress showing how much of the InterWeb they now control! MUHAHAHAHAAHAHHAHA!
This reminds me of the stat that says Bit Torrent downloads are using a vast percentage of available internet bandwidth.
With that said, I have cleaned MANY of my friend's windows computers and they generally have some sort of horrible infestation going on. Granted they often have the file sharing software du jour and they have no idea of what windows download is.
Come to think of it... I think I have dumb friends. Damn.
I used Xandros desktop 2 and no one mentioned that on their forums.
Good points.
A lot of applications with Windows seem to need admin equivalent access and then want that ongoing to change anything.
I hear this a lot, but aside from installing new programs (which generally requires root access on a Linux machine as well), can you give me an example of a Windows app, once installed, that won't do something particularly useful without Administrator privileges?
--grendel drago
Laws do not persuade just because they threaten. --Seneca
*By the way, the apple "dark days" were completely manufactured by the media, as the real problem was that the Apple clones were stealing bottom line from Apple, Mac marketshare was actually INCREASING, yet the media insisted on focusing only on Apple. Leading Steve to kill off the clones. Gil Amelio was still a poor CEO, however...
;)
It's a self-fulfiling prophecy, actually. People were scared of buying Macs because of stories of Apple's death and IT people used the stories to solidify their jobs by standardizing computers in Windows. As the result, the marketshare dropped and Apple had losses, which fed the media even more of Apple's death stories.
Gil Amelio might be a poor CEO, but he was the one who bought NeXT and brought Jobs back, effectively saving Apple. So, in a roundabout way, he did his job.
In my opinion, the PC is one of the biggest marketing scams ever perpetrated in the United States.
Think about it - in the 1970's, PCs were for hobbyists. That is, people who actually CARED how they worked.
In the 1980's, Apple marketed this cool box with a keyboard and a screen, and everybody thought they could do their budget and write letters on it just as powerfully as corporate HQs did a few years back. It was a good typewriter, but doing an average household budget is much easier with pencil and paper. Always has been, always will be.
So what people had was a $1,000 typewriter sitting on their desk. You remember, don't you? So the kids came in and started playing with it, and playing games and programming games, since high schools started to have a few Basic-enabled machines lying around.
Flash forward to the late 80's and early 90's: Gaming was getting to be big business. Adults had to have a PC mostly for status. Except for the kids who were getting older and making better games and writing more sophisticated programs. Then the Internet came in, and BAM!, everybody HAD to get online. I mean, if you were 23 and not a millionaire you were an IDIOT! You had to have a PC just to be part of the New Way! What are you, a luddite loser??
Flash forward to the late 90's and early 00's. E-mail, websurfing for shopping, porn, and maybe the odd recipe or medieval reference to look up. That is what people use their computers for.
(I relegate gamers to the hobbyists of the 70's. This issue needn't concern them, because they do care how the machine works.)
This is the average household. This is the world that no engineer at Intel or Microsoft ever sees. Because in reality their job is mostly for corporate, academic, and government customers. And these customers have extensive technical support coming right in with the machines and software. It is the marketing department that made the average home want the newest and greatest PC, which is most likely sitting in their den, used only for e-mail, shopping online, porn, and the odd recipe or medieval reference.
Nobody has ever made a PC for the average user at home. How long did it take the computer manufacturers to change the color of the plastic chassis? Twenty years? And look how proud they were of themselves!
Nobody I know needs or wants to read 600 pages on how to use Microsoft Word!! These machines are built, designed, and made for engineers and enterprise-level organizations. To save money, and avoid making machines for average people, they just told the marketing department to make people all giddy about MHz and RAM and Cache.
If you are not a gamer, and you are not running an enterprise-level organization, then there is no PC for you. It is a colossal waste of money and time and energy. But one has to have e-mail, and one has to have internet access in today's world. And in order to do that, one must buy a machine that uses 65,000 running processes just to check their damn e-mail!!!!!!!!
And for all you fat-ass know-it-alls telling people to be personally responsible for their computer virus protection: Screw You! Do you buy a car and then check the ignition timing in your garage every 30 days? Why not, don't you take personal responsibility for your life?
Jackass (es)
The solution to the problem of Microsoft and OEMs giving bogus prices is to let people trade in Windows licenses, even those installed by OEMs. If you get a full version of Windows for your computer, you should be able to sell a full version of Windows to the highest bidder on E-bay. No "refund" or arbitrary pricing needed.
Day 1:
....
...
I purchased the magazine which had Knoppix 3.x cd on the cover and booting my Father in laws pc ( windows , infected , dying ) proceeded to knx-hdinstall the operating system into the pc ( 3 yr old machine with router for internet connection ) . Completed the install of Knoppix Linux ( email configuration ) and rebooted. Showed In laws how to login , and mail and surf.
Day 2
Added In laws new digital camera
Day 3 through 365 : hear nothing from in laws but praise for system that works, has not been inconsistent and lets them use their computer as they "expected" to be able to use it
Day 366 : read story about user who makes poor purchasing descision and then complains about the product.
Day 367 : write sequel to story
okay the version of knoppix last year was old, but backing up their data to a usb flash drive and reinstalling to 3.7 the other day toook less than 10 minutes !
And thats why Firecrackers and kittens don't mix.
Windows is for people who like to fiddle with things, like their cars, and make them more to their liking. Apples are for people who would buy a car with the hood welded shut and are happy to be as plain-jane as everyone else on the road, as long as it works.
Dells are for people who would buy a used Yugo.
Yeah, a more interesting discussion would be: "Why does Linux still suck?"
That is a valid question. But valid as it is, it comes down to that all operating systems suck; Linux just sucks a lot less than Windows, and it also sucks less money and time out of you. And that's a good thing.
I'm sorry, but "positional audio" is not something you need to create a great game; even in current Windows games, it's an option. Windows became the preferred platform for game writers long before DirectX even existed, simply because Windows is the most widely used.
SDL has all the functionality you need to make many great games. And if you don't like SDL, there are plenty of other gaming libraries.
But the Machintosh is a car that will only drive on 5% of the roads, so no one will buy that either...
Or ciggies. Or booze.
The fact is, consumers will go on buying all sorts of products that do much worse things than get viruses or spyware. They'll eat themselves into obesity, smoke their way into cancer, drink their livers all to blood n' piss, and yes, explode in small gastank-combustible Fords one year and, a generation later, break their necks rolling over in giant top-heavy Ford SUVs.
In a disposable culture where life is cheap--and fella, I'm not talking about Timbuktu--a certain fatalism is woven into consumption patterns, literally and figuratively. The latter is what we should try to address. Why are people so easily fleeced, so unable to think and act rationally at the intersection of money and desire, even with piles of reeking evidence shat all about them? Wait--could it not be because we're irrational, urge-driven tribal creatures, historically prone to going over the cliff with our fellow lemmings--in short, not nearly as perfect as "power user" Mark Morford?
But even that self-professed credential is suspect. If you can't configure a Windoze box to resist attack for four minutes, you're no power user. Indeed, you have no business even plugging one into the fucking wall.
This is not to defend Gates' crapware, merely to point out the shallowness of believing that Windoze represents something unique in the annals of consumer innocence (the nice word for it) or stupidity (the unkind one). As the Windoze cancer has metastasized, we see just another measure of a culture that cannot rid itself of addiction to reality TV, lying politicians, overpaid athletes, cheating accountants and corrupt CEOs, epic tax forms, etc. We see, in short, ourselves.
And one last thing: when, by dint of pluck, intelligence, accident, or blind luck a person manages to avoid one of the many stupidities to which we're all prone at some time or other, what's the most winning attribute? Is it to go before the world and pound your chest? Do you bray over others' failure and congratulate your success? I'll let Morford give his answer:
Great! Now what are you gonna do about being smug, bitchy and naive?Windows is the dominant operating system, and anyone writing viruses always targets the platform that would have the largest impact. Trust me, we'll start seeing Firefox vulnerabilities if it gains > 10% market share. Macs are holding strong at 4% so there are only a handful of potential viruses there.
Many times people ask why they can't protect their OS more. Uncle Sam has measures in place that ensure Microsoft can't have monopolies, which is why MS doesn't include antivirus software as standard issue on their OS. McAfee, Symantec, et al. would cry monopoly in a heartbeat and we'd have yet another lawsuit.
Remember what many of you out there who are Americans already know: it's tough being on top. Remember how everyone hated the British empire for so long, or how about the Roman empire? Whoever is the dominant player will be the most revered as well as the most hated.
I sometimes find myself agreeing with his premise, but when he gets into one of those frothy paragraphs where he's talking about "spread-thighed enlightenment" or whatnot, he's kinda lost me. I can just imagine him, a balding, ponytailed ex-hippie, hanging around at Berkeley and trying his so-tired-it's-fresh free-love schtick on the local young and impressionables.
--grendel drago
Laws do not persuade just because they threaten. --Seneca
So in essence, all of you repliers are saying that everything he did wrong was his fault? Because he didn't know any better? Isn't that exactly the same problem with Windows? The users don't know any better and thier machines get infected with all sorts of crap and become unstable. The true problem is that there is no "perfect OS", none of them are even close. Windows, if it isn't patched / behind a firewall, has pathetic security. Linux (any version), give a Linux installation CD to your mother, tell her to install it, get it on the net and secure it. Mac, give your Mother a Mac, let her get that frowning face error and tell her to call mac to fix it. Then, after they come out and fix it, have any one of her firends giver her a CD to install. Seriously, if any /.er really thinks that the masses are anywhere near savvy enough to do anything with a computer, we have some problems.
Living in Vegas, I love a wager, I would wager $1000 that if you took 100 completely random people and gave them all the same, simple 1990's VCR and told them to set the clock, less than 20 would actually be able to do it in the minute it would take any of us.
And THAT, dear friends, is the real problem with Windows, and computers in general.
At my kids' school in the UK, IT is about learning MS Office. Thats all the teachers know, so kids think PC and Microsoft are synonymous. Difficult nut to crack, unless someone in Education policy had some balls, an interest in freedom and a desire to really save some money....
Fuck! Let's beat a dead horse! Before I begin, I own several Computers with several OSes and they ALL suck! (MAC OSX is not exception) I am sorry but why are computers still so damn complex? It seems we add more features but have failed at making anything better!
/bin, and even though you show him where the Documents folder is he still tries to save it off the root or is he in /usr/local. Hiarchial data driven file systems should go the way of the dodo-bird. CPM can be more intuitive then some of the modern command line crap. I love Unix, but Joe-user should not have to be exposed to it for every thing -- including figuring out where to save a file!
... AppleScript could easily be hacked because it would not take much to get a user to run an applescript application to fuck up their computer. All you would need to do is fuck with metadata. You have to type in your password for everything anyways, and the average joe would not know the difference. Hell, you can run almost anything as root in AppleScript!
With a modern filesystem a user should not have to wade through directories to find the pictures of his/her kids. It should be more like a damn database. If I am bringing up word processing files I should only see word processing files. Does grampa care about
User interfaces are all rehashes of old shit. Hell, Mac OSX looks like OS/2 2.0 interface on steriods. It has the same ungly dock (with lickable sugary looking shit added to it), but doubled the complexity for new user by adding the finder into the foray. Closing a window in Mac OSX sometimes saves the contents, sometimes not (sometimes there is a save button). The only saving grace is the bouncing buttons, too bad it eats up so much CPU power! Windows looks like A 1984 Mac or Amiga Clone (ripped from Xerox), with better graphics.. but a LOT slower. Premptive Blah, blah.. has done little for the real user. It still crashes! The geek has got more, but what does windows do that a 1985-86 commodore Amiga couldn't do? Not much in the OS realm.
Yeah, OSX does not crash usually (but we do get something I have heard other people refere as the grey-screen-of-death which is a kernel panic), but it sure can freeze while waiting on something like network. The candy stripe twirly thing can get really anoying when you are wainting for you AFP share to update! It freezes forever and you cant even force quit. You can't do anything else requires a restart This freezing problem is better in 10.3, but still exists when you do certain things on the network and it sorta hangs (remote printing is a good example) Windows XP rarley ever sees a blue screen, but freezing happens the same way as Mac OSX. You plug in a USB device and the twirly thing hangs the system. Or the computer is "sleeping" and when you wake it up it gets frozen on the twirly thing when it tries to refresh your fileshares.
Mac OSX is new, and I am not talking about NexTStep on X86 or 68000k from years back. (less than 5 years -- 2 years of substantial growth 10.2 - 10.3 (2003 - 2005)
A lot of websites do not work properly with the default installed "Apple Recommended" browsers. I always have to download firefox because Safari and Internet Explorer 5.2 fuck up a lot of web pages.
Bottom line is I work, play and use OSX every day and I think it SUCKS! I love the underlying unix part of it, but it is nothing new. Why can't someone in this decade come up with a new way of doing things that is not cluttered with crap! "think different" is really a marketing slogan for more of the same?
Apple has done two things right IMHO and it is not the Macintosh OS. It is iLife and the IPOD. Without those packages the mac would just be another computer.. instead it is becoming a consumer appliance.
Microsoft Windows kicks Ass in the Office arena. I am sorry but it has more productivity and Office packages than anything else. Excel and Word are good solid products, and I still think that is the reason people buy windows.
At this price point, why *wouldn't* you invest in one, if simply for the sake of putting a seperate piece of hardware between your computer and your net connection? Think of it like the front door on your house... You probably have *both* a bolt lock of some type AND another lock on the doorknob itself. Why bother with this, if one lock should keep a door locked anyway? Well, it's one more measure of security and it's inexpensive enough that most people find it to be of value.
Your desktop OS should be secure in itself. You shouldn't need a separate device to protect it. It's a symptom of broken design.
Your analogy is a bit off. A better one would be: Microsoft is shipping houses without doors and people are required to buy brick walls to protect themselves from thieves. It makes some everyday tasks difficult and is just the wrong approach.
If some hacker figures out there's an operational piece of equipment at your IP address, it's nice to know the first thing he's reaching is a dedicated hardware firewall device instead of a fully functional PC with full-blown operating system on it. It's going to be a lot tougher to make a D-Link or Linksys router execute your arbitrary code/commands than a PC....
Actually most of the consumer grade "hardware" firewalls run some sort of embedded linux. Many of these boxes have serious bugs. Add to that that joe average seldomly changes the default password and you realize they often provide no more but a false sense of security.
So what you get is another single point of failure (our siemens DSL router at work freezes up and has to be power cycled about once every two weeks...) and a *weak* workaround for a broken OS-design.
In practise it's not even necessarily tougher to make a cheap DSL router execute arbitrary code/commands than a sane OS. In reality it's not even hard to bypass most of the routers that are deployed in SoHo/Home-environments due to the flaws and broken default configurations I mentioned.
A linux box can be easily secured even without packet filtering (assuming you know what you're doing and enable only trusted services). Mac OSX is fairly secure out of the box and comes with a *working* point & click firewall.
I can only repeat, the whole "DSL router should protect my OS" thing is a symptom of how used people have gotten used to that their OS (Microsoft Windows) cannot be trusted. The boxes are not a solution to the problem. A box of hardware can't protect you from a network attack (by plug'n'play as they're suggesting) when you don't know what you're doing.
To be fair, if you managed to get your freshly installed system nuked within 4 minutes you can't have bothered to run a firewall or to install SP2! There is no way your system should pick up that many viruses that quickly, unless of course you're going to some very dubious sites. I think you're just spreading more anti-MS crap here, which is no surprise - this is Slashdot after all!
dedicated to all the people who say consoles are better for gaming.
enjoy your outdated graphics, stupid games for kids, and your completely useless controller.
consoles are the gaming for retards.
You want to know why i dont use linux? because my windows box can do **********more of the things i want it to do********* than your linux box would be able to do in 20 years, and that is, in one word: GAMING.
ALL the people who say linux is their os but they prefer consoles to play games, just because its less hassle, are FULL OF SHIT. THE TWO FUCKING THIGS ARE CONTRADICTORY, YOU MORONS
..let the end-users do it all by themselves?
Does that help?
that sounds convenient.
In Windows, I usually do "right-click, w, f", so I don't need to move the mouse much.
My other first post is car post.
We do millions of things each day to protect ourselves. Why should hopping on the 'Net and operating a computer be any different?
Because on other Operating Systems "hopping on the 'Net" can be done without much immediate harm. And it's not like that's because some magic voodoo incantation or something.
The people here are not screeming "Please make Windows more secure!" because they are lazy. They do because it's within reach for Microsoft to make it more secure.
What a lot of wibble. The fact is that Mac and Linux market shares are rising, and Windows market share is falling. Dvorak is a bit of a numbnuts, he always has been. He read the table wrong. He got it exactly the wrong way around. Perhaps he was reading dwon instead of up. And you just quoted him and the tale link without actaully looking at the figures yourself.
Linux limiting? I don't think so, but that's a different can of worms.
And yes, you are correct that a new Linux version is released every month or so. However, for the most part these are minor kernel versions, and not even worth upgrading to unless you know what you're upgrading for. If you are referring to a new distribution releases, that is completely different to a new Windows release. Windows releases do not have easy or rolling upgrade paths. Also, with Linux, you aren't frozen out of certain services because they require a newer version of Windows (or at least, something like this is extremely rare, and... it's not like you have to pay for a new version, or anything).
The point I'm trying to make is that I inferred from your post that upgrading Linux distributions/kernels is mandatory and regular, but I think it is neither. Also, it's free. Windows upgrades aren't.
Now, the security point. You could say that it takes someone with Windows know-how 15 minutes to secure it, or at least protect it from some worms. I'd say it's even quicker than that. I'd also say that even Joe Desktop could happily click "next" a lot on the Fedora installer (for example), and end up with a completely secure system, unless he is actually being targetted by someone, in which case Windows is going to be screwed too. I suppose I've just made the same point as the Mac fan who replied to this also. Also, Joe Desktop who clicked "next" a lot in the Fedora installer has probably ended up with a desktop he is perfectly happy with, with all the applications he needs to do what he does.
Maybe IHJBT, but whatever.
So have the people in China. Except the people on slashdot are sinophobes
Insert Knoppix CD, Boot up, go to a root terminal, type $knoppix-installer, follow instructions, no more Windows problems.
It really is that simple
Cheers
* Carthago Delenda Est *
Why do people post articles like this? Many similar articles have written in the past. Writing about the number and readiness of attacking worms targeting windows seems to be a frequent topic of advocates for alternative operating systems that have run out of story ideas. It is not news. It is an excuse to bash Windos. Newsflash: windows is not perfect. However, software/ease of use make it easiest for people to use when all they do is access email and check ebay. So stop asking why people use it.
Headlines like this posted on slashdot are annoying and incredibly stupid. Yes, windows has flaws--some major ones. Every OS has problems. But with a headline like "Why Does Windows Still Suck?" all that is displayed is a bait for thousands of geeks to bash Microsoft and say, "Linux is perfect. People should use linux. Window sucks. Windows users are morons. OSX is where its at. My dick is bigger than your dick," and other BS. This is not news. This is a flamebait, and judging by the 1700 responses, I would say a successful one.
-Kruton
FTA:
"Am I being unfair? Maybe. Hell, I'm sure Windows has its gnarled and wary defenders, war-torn and battle-tested folk who still insist that, because there's more software available for the Windows OS, it's somehow superior -- though I challenge them to name one significant, common activity the Mac can't do as well as, if not better than, PCs. For 97 percent of users in the world, Macs would be a more elegant and intuitive and appealing solution. Period."
1) Play the latest windows games.
2) Have 100% compatibility with Office on the Intel platform. There are issues with documents that go back and forth between MS Office on x86 and the PPC platform.
OT Rant:
Ok, I no longer play games; however, everyone and their mothers, brothers, fathers, sisters, cousins and freakin dog send every document out as a *.doc file.
You cannot send a resume to a company unless its in *.doc, nevermind the fact that:
1) *.HTML can be viewed by IE
2) *.pdf can be view by Acro. Reader
And somehow these HR, Recuriters and so forth are collecting resumes for positions in the technology sector (WTF).
What is the BS that exists in the world that your documents have to be in Word.
Hell, I cannot even submit a time sheet to get paid unless I use IE.
There has to be something that Gates dropped in the global water supply.
A live bootable OS, with a GUI, Filesystem, web browser, networking & NIC/modem support, all off a standard floppy
Have a look here. It's made by people having the same problems as you (although I personally think you failed to start with the right platform) and they just went ahead and created their own.
Now imagine something that Windows doesn't support (like working in a reliable fashion, but I digress) - you'd be stuck.
I guess the real problem you're highlighting is that you still need to do a bit of upfront research, and that I'd agree with. Getting a HP PCS range printer to work on SuSE 9.2 Pro is still pretty crap, for instance (you have to avoid the normal installer),
Insert
Because what I've said is that Windows has buit in packet filtering (sort of a poor man's firewall) at least since NT 4.0. Probably even earlier.
So you _can_ connect a computer to the Internet long enough to download the patches _without_ getting virused.
But that would require having a brain. Something that's actually lacking among most of the whining crowd. Because otherwise 90% of the complaints about Windows wouldn't boil down to "I'm too incompetent to configure it."
There are also other solutions, all of which takes less time than whining. E.g., downloading a firewall on your own computer.
A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
Yeah, and while we're at it, let's weld car hoods shut, because you just know there are people who are going to try replacing the oil themselves and screw it up, thereby requiring a costly visit to the garage.
The answer to social engineering is awareness, not taking away choices. Because as long as a user has some power left to customize their environment, there will be social engineering tricks that can be applied.
"So about a year ago..." We're in the computer field here, folks. Have I complained about things that took place with Windows ME? Yeah, I have. But I also acknowledge that what's out today can be a lot different from what was available a year ago.
So what? You buy a Sony Vaio today (the PC in the article), what does it come with? Windows XP. What did a Viao come with a year ago? Windows XP. And unless Sony started rolling patches into their OEM installs, a Viao today will have the exact same vunerabilities that a Vaio would have had a year ago. Nothing has changed.
Certainly if I were writing an article about what was wrong with something, I'd check to make sure I was reviewing a recent edition. SP2, while not the ultimate solution to everyone's problems, is a darn sight better than what the author is writing about.
But you can be compromized before you even download the first patch, much less SP2, which is a 266 meg download.
've had several Macs, and loved them all -- but yeah, guess what? They were several times more expensive than the beige-box PCs I'd put together from my local shop
No shit, Sherlock. Apple is an OEM, and as such, you'll always be able to own commodity parts for a lot less. But the *same thing* is true for any OEM - you'll be able to build your own PC for a lot less money than getting a Dell or HP.
That view is simply one of the most laughable ever. What do you think things would be like *without* the unions?
Here's a though that should provide an answer; bosses will never cut into their profits by paying a living wage if they don't have to. The self-interest that conservatives think makes the market so wonderful dictates that. That's one of the base features of capitalism.
Workers have to take concessions from the bosses via organized mass movements, and Unions are a powerful, and nessecary, tool of that struggle. Easy historical evidence of this is available; look up the Ludlow Massacre, the Teamster Rebellion of Minneapolis, or any one of the dozens of labor struggles in the depression-era U.S.
Hell, before that, the bosses profitted by exploiting the labor of *slaves* until they were forced to stop.
Fight for something better: www.socialistalternative.org
Easy:
Yes but the pendulum always swings both ways and usually to the extremes. I agree that Unions served a purpose at one time, however the comfort they usually provide doesn't last a lifetime or that of the next generation. Visit any plant where any Union is strong: you'll see 60 year old guys with an eighth grade education telling you that you can't step over the yellow line without protective shoes; and he'll write a grievance. Granted he's getting $65,000 a year to do this but it's also why the average cost of a new car or motorcycle sets the consumer years into debt. Better? I say worse. We're now to the point that fostering this attitude is a detriment to the economy and the consumer. The work ethic isn't dead in America; it's just hiding behind outdated rules; like Unions. They served their purpose at the time and the pendulum will swing the other way.
I still can't get the screen shots of Castle Wolfenstein for the Apple IIe out of my head.
Face it... as we can tell you are in a union from your FUD... but Unions suck, they leech off everyone, they protect the LAZY that could not survive on their own.
Sure... at one point in time unions were a nessecary evil, but now they are pointless.
Just another moron MS bashing.
Move along, nothing to see here.
Visualize Whirled P.'s
The current default install of XP enables the firewall by default.
Is that Windows XP RTM, or Windows XP with slipstreamed SP2? If the latter, do all major Windows PC OEMs preinstall SP2, and do retail boxes include slipstreamed SP2?
Besides, until SP2, I seem to remember that Windows XP started the network stack before it started the firewall, giving worms a window of several seconds to r3wt your machine.
[Testing new programs as a limited user] comes solidly under the category of "way too much work".
Not if the shell puts "Run as limited user" in the right-click menu. In Windows Explorer, it would take only a small registry hack. Remember that you are working with a computer, and scripts can take care of the grunt work. Blame Microsoft and other OS distributors only for not bundling such a script, not for making a "fundamentally insecure" model.
"And you just quoted him and the tale link without actaully looking at the figures yourself."
Oh, maybe you just didn't read my post.
First off, you're analysis of the table made no sense. It's statistically invalid due to the reasons I stated. I assumed that most people would be intelligent enough to understand what the table meant, for that I apologize.
Secondly, I never said that linux and mac OS weren't rising. But their grown is anemic to the growth of Windows XP.
Third, it's bogus to consider windows as a whole from that table because it's counting legacy systems that are on their way out.
I'm absolutely amazed at how dumbfounded you are by what I'm saying. Next thing you'll tell me is that since OSX is based on Linux, those numbers should be combined as 322.8% of the market share.
Hmmm witty sig or funny sig? Maybe elitest techy sig!
I think one problem is that most people simply lack the imagination to be able to think "this could be better" when using any aspect of a system. When I use Windows, I am continually seeing all sorts of little things that make me think to myself, "gee, with just a little bit of effort from Microsoft, this could easily have been much better". It's not so much the big things in this case, but literally hundreds of little things, I could make a long list (in fact I have). But most people just take what they see as being 'how things are' - they don't take a moment to wonder how it could've been better. Perhaps my inclination to think "this could be better" comes mainly from being a software developer, I don't know, but even many software developers seem to lack this ability to 'imagine' up ideas, and mostly only clone other people's ideas that they've seen. In my mind, someone who sits and uses Windows and doesn't see any of the hundreds of things that 'could be better', simply lacks the imagination to see the broad potential for improvement.
Also there is a general lack of comparative knowledge in the public. When you have a depth and breadth of experience on lots of different systems going back at least a couple of decades, then it often happens when using some (possibly "new") feature in Windows that you are already aware of some other system that "did this better, ten years ago already". Most people don't have that knowledge, so when they see the feature on Windows the first time, they really do think it's new, and they really do think Microsoft came up with it. Having broad experience also helps one to 'see' that Windows is always lagging so far behind, slowing everyone down, and only copying from others. People who aren't familiar with other systems don't have the perspective to see this. For all they know, Windows is "state of the art". There are hundreds of examples, well-known amongst them are things like the "Recycle Bin". I remember a colleague raving about the ability to have skins when Windows XP came out, I think he'd never seen skins before, while I got "bored" already of playing with skins on various window managers on Linux five years earlier already (and by late 90's OpenSource replacement Win95 shells copying Linux window managers even allowed skins already on Windows systems). Remote desktop / terminal services is another example. File manager thumbnails. Even PaintBrush is obviously a really poor clone of MacPaint if you were one of the few who had experience on mid-80's Macs, but most people have never seen or used MacPaint.
True enough consoles are not prone to shareware having terrible licence fees to get involved (although the original PS for a while had a cheap dev kit that would let people play with it, and I'm sure there's some stuff for the official PS2 linux).
However, there are some pretty darn good shareware games on the Mac. In fact I'd say that's probably better done on the Mac than the PC, since Mac owners historically have been more willing to actually fork over shareware fees. So I think my point still holds.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
MS only appears to get the most complaints -- and for that matter the most viruses and worms written for its OS -- because it's by far the most popular.
In ratio, you can find just as many drawbacks, deficiencies and things to complain about in ANY extant OS. If Linux - right now, magically - acquired a comparable userbase to Windows, does anyone really think there would be less complaints about Linux than there are about Windows?
Windows has problems? Well, so does your pet OS, whatever it is. So what? If it bothers you, don't use Windows -- why do you have to voice your negative opinion of it in public, repeatedly, and constantly? Windows-complainers on Linux-themed sites remind me of tabloid-readers who complain about celebrities or royalty, but can't stop reading about them.
If you hate Windows, don't use it. And shut up. It's really that simple.
Ultimately it boils down to people not having enough knowledge to really safely operate their computers. Two people can run identical computers with the exact same operating system and access to any freely downloadable program on the net. The average person could easily destroy their OS install in a few hours The average well-trained person could use the computer, regardless of its OS for at least six months. (Its been my experience that windows seems to still pollute itself beyond my tolerances for workability within about 6 months)
The biggest problem with Windows is that Microsoft gave a very powerful OS to Joe Servicepack who has NO CLUE how to get it stable and keep it stable.
No, you idiot, the problem is that there is simply no excuse for Windows not to BE STABLE OUT OF THE BOX. Mac OS X and most Linux distributions have been able to do this for years. Take a Mac or Debian box from 2001, slap it on the net completely unpatched, and you'll still be completely safe from viruses and worms. Putting the blame on the user, when it's the inherent design flaws in Windows that are at fault, just lets Microsoft off the hook.
Name me a single consumer product that takes as much work to make it "safe" unpon installing, or needs constant maintenance after that. You wont find one.
And then we'd be hearing instead, "The biggest problem with MacOS/Linux is that Apple/Linus gave a very powerful OS to Joe Servicepack who has NO CLUE how to get it stable and keep it stable."
No. We wouldn't. Because Mac OS X and Linux ALREADY ARE STABLE AND STAY STABLE. You have to work to make either of those insecure, compared to Windows where it comes insecure and you have to do a lot of work and maintenance to fix it.
I am currently running knoppix from a cd, that's my general preference as well. Which should be a viable option for windows by the way, a highly usable live cd version of windows would be a great boon to a number of people, one of the many things our friends in redmond haven't pursued. Comparing apples to apples, there is no way to run as a non-root user in windows, if you have access to the drive you have access pretty much, that is, you can't keep a user from running software that causes registry entries, and thus there is no security model, as the windows registry is pretty much the holy grail of owning the windows box. I have the option of removing software with which there are known security issues but no patches available on an installed linux system, you have that option as well, as long as there isn't a microsoft line of bs about it being an integral part of the OS. So if you have a windows box and there's a IE vunerability you have no supported option for removing IE, and if redmond has decided they aren't going to fix it, you're out of luck. I suppose you could simply implement a policy that IE is never used, although this relegates you to manually managing updates, as IE is the automated tool for Windows updates. Lets get away from "infected", lets use "should be treated as compromised", in my experience these machines are "infected" but lets implement a policy of "treating a machine as compromised" that has been a situation where someone with malicous intent could have run arbitrary code. I think that your average linux box has a life expectancy about 1000 times as long as your windows box, before it should be "treated as compromised" under such a policy. We can even wait for evidence, we won't "treat as compromised" the windows box until we have a registry change we can't explain, or a logfile entry that we don't know what is. Or unexplained network traffic from the box.
As to how the hijacking occurred, I suspect that there was a vunerablity in IE that was still unpatched after windows updates had been run, and that one or more of the four manufacturers websites I went to had compromised webservers, probably related to under-patched IIS installations. This machine was running no services and was NATted a couple of times, including running by itself on the second NATted subnet. Unless I was a the stupid user, doing something stupid by running windows updates and downloading hardware drivers, there was no stupid user intervention on this install. Sitting far away across the Internet, I am better equipped to determine than anyone trusting in the security of an unpatched windows box with no anti-virus protection of the status of that box, if he believes he's "clean as a whistle". I've seen Windows compromised repeatedly by people using it without having done anything paticularly "stupid" . Blaming the user seems to be the windows model of security, but I find this to only be reasonable if you agree that windows is insecure if you "USE" it, and thus all the problems are the "USE"rs fault. I tend to believe that I know what I am doing and I don't find Windows to be "perfectly" anything, paticularly usable. I am guessing that you have not tried avast's BART product, as I suggested to the original poster, if you'll give it a try, I think you'll find otherwise unknown but quite verifiable malware running on your machine as well. http://avast.com/eng/buy_avast_bart_cd_vi.html
Beware, because I used to have such confidence as you that things purchased will work together as advertised. I lived through the festering growth of Wintel (from the Very Beginning), and I used to pride myself on being able to make mix-and-match parts work together - was quite good at it in fact. I had watched ISA turn to VLB turn to PCI/AGP then continue to evolve (devolve?). Like many early computer buyers, I was not rich and I watched too many of my own dollars ground to dust by the ever-faster wheel of obsolescence, and the more I suffered the more I tended towards cheaper parts.
In winter of 2000/2001, with the intent of finally ridding myself of M$, I bought 5 sets of verious brands of parts to make 5 computers and have deeply regretted it ever since - I was able to make Win98 work on all combinations thereof, but Linux of many flavors, FreeBSD, OpenBSD all firmly resisted my many, many hours of (literally) screaming aggravation and wasted effort. Why? Many forget the "intentional incompatibility" efforts of hardware mfrs to covertly make themselves appear "better" than their rivals, coupled with secret arm-twisting by M$ and/or Intel for similar purpose. Yes, I am quite sure, because I have dug down to root-cause enough times to be sure. Failures may be subtle and/or sudden, but nearly always crippling in some way after seeming to work correctly for a while. Mfrs/vendors/monopolists deny it unless caught, of course, but because of generic (or camouflaged) symptoms it's usually difficult and time-consuming to prove, and probably too late by then to get your money back.
Maybe I was particularly unlucky because I chose parts based on cost factors alone, but this method had always worked very well for me previous to this disaster, hence my overconfidence. I was burned so badly by this one-time overconfident purchase that now I always tell my clients and friends who ask to buy ONLY hardware that is "recommended" to work together, preferably bought from the same vendor and pre-tested as a unit. (This is probably good advice even if you intend to use M$ on it.)
In my own case, my next replacements (now that I can finally afford buy them) will be strictly Linux/BSD-recommended hardware based on the best information I can find online.
for FPS a keyboard and mouse are a must, or at least standard console controller suck. I hated Golden Eye for that.
Did you mean GoldenEye for N64 or GoldenEAye Rogue Agent? And have you heard of the SmartJoy FRAG adapter that lets you use PS/2 keyboards and mice on a PS2 console, letting the console finally live up to its name?
Are you meaning to tell me that you actually BELIEVE that OEMs would have had gone out of business if they hadn't bundled Windows instead of just having it on their shelves?
Yes, its a fact, dumbass. The PC business is commoditized to an extreme. You think Dell could just add $100 to the cost of every PC they sell and expect to keep their business? Yes, Linux is good enough to sell to some customers, so was BeOs back in the day - but it's impossible for a sizable OEM to forget the Windows discount and not go out of business.
...It still does not have the software base Windows does...
I am getting so tired of that old saw. Please tell me a computer JOB that the Mac cannot do rather than telling me what programs it can't run. Outside of small number of special proprietary programs and games, what computer function is there that 99.9% of all users need, that a Mac does not have software for? I also have Windows, and like Windows itself, most software that runs on it also sucks.
All theory is gray
... is why are you so hopeless at protecting your significant other's system? I run approximately 12 Windows systems - I run firewalls, AV and Spyware removers. I have *NEVER* been hit by a virus, *NEVER* fallen victim to hackers. My systems chug along quite happily day to day. Several of my systems have been up for months and have only been rebooted for required security upgrades.
Basically... you're incompetent if you can't keep a single box up and running and safe. You're the kind of moron who pours hot coffee on his leg and then screams that you should have been told it was hot by the person who handed it to you. FOOL!
Visit any plant where any Union is strong: you'll see 60 year old guys with an eighth grade education telling you that you can't step over the yellow line without protective shoes; and he'll write a grievance. Granted he's getting $65,000 a year to do this
So what? What is wrong with expecting to be able to make a decent wage without a college degree? What is wrong with making $65,000 a year without a degree after you've been there 40+ years?
We're now to the point that fostering this attitude is a detriment to the economy and the consumer.
No, that would be the desire of CEO's to be paid 500 times what the average worker gets.
I have to say I fully agree. I'm not Windows fanboy, but that article was just the same old Pro-Mac drivel that Mac users want to force on us all the time.
Personally I rather run Win 3.1 then ever return to work on any type of Mac. Those things are so far removed from the techical side of things it just breeds stupid users. A mac power user in my eyes is still a total novice user. Perhaps a little harsh, but most Mac users are so estranged from how computers actually work, it's scary.
And while I am no Windows fanboy, I do get a bit tired of this endless windows bashing. The Windows machine I use here has never had any problems, no trojans, no viruses, no spyware. And I actually take very little effort to make this "magic" work. Just don't use IE, don't use Outlook, perhaps a firewall and know what you do. Usually that's enouth. Not really that special.
And while Windows is perhaps inheritly more insecure then other OS's at present, I'm sorry... but NO OS is 100% secure like that author likes to claim (another good show that using a Mac makes one dumb to how Software works). Mac users are indeed also just not an interesting target. Partly because Windows is the most used, partly because Windows has a lot of security problems and partly because it's just "common" to hate and target Windows.
I have and continue to use all 3 major players (Linux, Windows and Mac). But the Mac really only when people force me due to something work related. I actually started on a Mac, but Mac's where once good... before they cared more for how the damn thing looked on the outside then how it worked on the inside.
A slightly more important question might be: Who elected them into office?
What?
The analysis I gave were absolutely true and valid. It is unquestionable. It is simply a summary of the table. There is nothing in your post that that invalidated them. It doesn't matter that that market has grown in size. Markets always change is size. It doesn't mean that you can't make market share comparisons.
As to conveniently trying to take just the latest Windows version, to try and imply that Windows is growing. Let me say that if you do that, it also makes a mockery of you original post. Because you'd also have to just judge Mac OS by the latest version. Which means that Mac OS (Panther or OSX, take you pick) has been growing for it's entire life!
Oh dear. You've created a hole that you can't dig out of either way. You lose. In fact you lost as soon as you decided to reference Dvorak - it's quite clear from the article that he didn't notice that Mac OS was growing in that table.
(Of course the only sensible way of judging market share of any product is to use figures for all versions of the product. And it's quite clear Windows is losing market share, to both Linux and MacOS)
P.S. I'll assume you know that OS X isn't based on Linux.
"My SO just got a new car, parked it in the middle of the street in a bad neighborhood with the keys in the ignition.
All of the things the parent mentioned "would" have happened during the normal use of the product, like (gasp) connecting a computer to the internet. Your example is decidely not using the product in normal fashion, and is just stupid.
That's an incorrect analogy.
So is yours. If you buy a new car, it's engine isn't going to fall out 4 minutes after you drive off the lot. It is entirely possible for Windows to get infected before you even manage to download the first set of patches, much less the 266 meg SP2.
The real problem is that Windows is like buying a car with NO oil -- once you fill it up with oil (patch the system) for the first time, you're good to go until the next oil change (updates).
More problems with your analogy. You need to put oil in your car because physical friction wears down the engine. There is no such problem with software. You can take an upatched Debian box or a Mac from 2001 in their defualt configurations, put them on the net, and you'll be just fine. Furthermore, car manufacturers have to pay to fix their own defects. Microsoft has never compensated anyone for a lose resulting from a defect in Microsoft's products.
Time moves differently in different areas. People are still driving cars which are 15 years old. My computer is barely 5, and I already want a new one. Computers have a much shorter lifecycle than cars.
Wow, ignore the point much, or are you just really stupid?
Cars require certain care and maintenance. Why do you assume computers don't?
Because cars have physical wear and tear, and software does not? Duh? Duh?
The fact that any monkey could do his job and that when these monkeys do get paid that much the price of everything goes up? I believe in a minimum wage, and the usual fair labor laws preventing discrimination, but that's about it. Besides, this is discrimination! The person best able to do the job doesn't get it because some old geezer has seniority. That's not good for anyone except slackers. Unions create a nation of slackers. I freely admit that sometimes they do things which are necessary for workers but I think that the purpose would be better served by just making sure that we pass laws worldwide saying that ALL employees must be paid a living wage for their area, have health insurance, et cetera. How we provide those things to them can vary from country to country and not necessarily depend on the employer for all of it, if we decide upon an acceptable amount of redistribution of wealth - I'm easy on this one. But, in order to have the good stuff, you should have to work for it. Otherwise we're just all couch potatoes. Why shouldn't we reward [healthy, lawful] ambition? Why should we reward a lack of flexibility and motivation?
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Ill take it a step further. Microsoft is like a drug dealer who gives you free stuff until you are hooked.
I owned a small screwdriver shop in the late 90s and I owed much of the success I had (which was limited!) to Microsoft. They gave me tools, free software and rebates based on how many copies of Winsows I sold. They also helped me get Igram Micro and Tech Data accounts that let me "sell bigger" than I was. Those acounts in turn helped me get better deals on credic card processsing, other supliers, etc. The price for this? I could only sell Window OS, I pledged not to work on systms with cracked copies of Windows and I was "encouraged" to only sell systems sith Windows preinstalled. I wasnt nearly big enough for the real discounts tht went along with never selling an OS-less system but I was working on it. At that time the most expensive part of a system for me was the Hard Drive. The OS was #2. Given a chance to reduce the cost of my second most expensive component I would.
Before you think I am a MS cheerleader, Im not. Im a Mac guy who would be in an all Mac house if his daughter hadn't begged for an evil Dell machine for games. What I used personally and what I could sell in my store were two different things. Dell, Alien, and just about every other PC maker not named HP started as a guy and a screwdriver and they owe a lot to MS and MS makes sure they remember.
Because you can't play EQ on Linux very well yet.
Why does Windows suck? The simple answer?
The biggest difference between Windoze and *nix is that Gates made the *dreadful* design decision to move the GUI *into* the operating system for 95, as opposed to *nix, or, for that matter, even Windows 3.x, where they are on *top* of the o/s.
Had M$ put virtual memory and at *least* foreground/background multitasking into DOS 3.0, when it was clear it was needed, in '83, Windows would have worked a *hell* of a lot better....
mark
That's where a customized KNOPPIX disk comes in (or a USB boot fob). It's probably easier than trusting Windows to not bail on you.
Free Software: Like love, it grows best when given away.
You could run as a non-admin, non-root user since NT 3.1. Every registry key has its own ACL, with specific permissions. By default, normal users cannot write to keys for the system or access keys in the profiles of other users. I run my web browsers as the user "Internet". This user has its own profile, with its own registry section. It cannot write to things outside of its profile, registry or filesystem. The registry is not a magic doorway for local vulnerabilities.
Not having a supported way to remove components (other than XP embedded, where everything is optional) is a problem. The marketing crap about these things being an indespensible part of the Windows Expierence (R) is annoying. Still, like you said, you don't have to use those components. Either that or mitigate the risk by not running it as admin, at least. Viruses and other malware can't affect other users without admin privileges.
You ran a web browser as admin. Wouldn't that be considered stupid on UNIX? The computer wouldn't be infected if you hadn't done this. I never run IE, or any other browser for that matter, as admin.
I think that Microsoft makes it too easy to be an idiot on Windows, but that's where user responsibility comes in. Nobody's making you keep the defaults. Nobody's making you log on as admin: that's what RunAs is for. It's the user's fault if they don't know how to secure the machine properly.
Better equipped than anyone? Isn't that a bit presumptuous?
Just what is it about Windows that makes it impossible to secure? It has protected memory, user identification, ACLs on all objects from files to events to threads, priveleges... what's missing? What makes you so sure that every Windows computer must be infected, so that it's normal to need scanners to clean it up?
I use Windows every day. I don't need any scanners because I don't get infected in the first place. I use proper privelege seperation; I don't log on as admin, things that require admin get it on a case by case basis. I use Software Restriction Policies to blacklist the profiles of restricted user accounts. It's like mounting their home directories as noexec.
You're practically admitting that you don't know what you are doing. You don't even know about registry security. You apparently run everything as admin. If you are willfully
As long as many popular consumer choices are only readily availalbe to Windows (or only "known" to be for Windows) you won't see the majority of the comsumers go to other platforms. It's not that they don't want to, it's just they don't "see" anything compelling them to make the choice to go there.
It's not just writing programs that can do the jobs, Linux and Apple has some damn good alternatives, but there is very little press showing the examples of what Linux can do (Apple is in a better position, but it also does not have much command over WalMart shleves either, and lookig at Comp USA yeasterday, the Mac offerings there don't 'look' very healthy either).
"Enjoy what you're doing! If it becomes drudgery, you're doing it wrong!" - Jim Butterfield
well, maybe I'm just better at doing default installs than you.... I haven't had a soundcard or wireless nic issue in a very long time in linux (like 2000 with redhat 7.1 I think was the last time my wireless nic wasn't discovered in the install). I have a much easier time configuring wireless nics in linux than in windows. the last time I spent a day getting some hardware to work it was a wireless NIC that windows didn't like because windows thought it could use its built in driver, but that crashed the system, and then windows wouldn't let the third party driver install because it conflicted with the default driver windows had installed already...
Anyway, obviously ymmv, I have wireless nics that I know linux supports, I don't support hardware vendors that force me to pay $300 for an os....
As for OS X, my wife and brother have been using it exclusively for about a year and a half now... do they miss windows at all? Have they ever bugged me saying "This OS X is great, but I can't do x, y and z now cause I don't have the software"? No, not once. What software are you looking for? Some proprietary oil services/exploration software? GIS software? For 99.9% of computer users, email, web, calendaring, photos, movies, music, file sharing, palm pilot, office suite, etc... The mac has software for all of that, and all of the mac's default software for that stuff (minus file sharing obviously...) is much better than windows equivalents.
Major games that have released same day:
World Of Warcraft (indeed anything from Blizzard), and most other MMORPG's
Unreal Tournament (all of them).
Myst Revelation
Note the PC has this same problem - eventually the PC will get Halo 2, and Knights of The Old Republic 2. It doesn't have them now though... Why is that not as much of a problem?
Now you name even five major PC games that did not also have same-day releases for consoles. Basically you have Doom 3, and Half Life 2. Basically the only one I'm the slightest bit sad to wait for in the whole PC gaming scene is Half Life 2. The rest I can wait for the Mac version of just use on a console.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
you don't have much exposure to unionized places, do you? Try state government in unionized states.
I personally know of several states where - because of the union - you could practically kill your boss, and not get fired.
When people get fired they complain to the union and the union fins *some little way* to sue and get the job back with back pay and penalties...
Happens all the time. So managers then just ignore people who they know to be active in the Union because it is more trouble than it is worth to try and fire them.
"P.S. I'll assume you know that OS X isn't based on Linux."
Yes, OS X is based on FreeBSD's core. http://developer.apple.com/unix/.
I no longer have the time or the energy to go into a statistics lesson for you. Enjoy you ideas and opinions.
Hmmm witty sig or funny sig? Maybe elitest techy sig!
What an ass hat. When you grow up you'll learn that it doesn't kill you to admit whan you got things wrong.
People who know little about computers are the ideal candidates for a mac. And they are pretty close to ideal for linux too. People who don't know about computers just click their icons and use their programs. Anytime something happens they don't understand, they call "insert young relative with computer experience" anyways, so why not have that relative install and admin linux instead of windows?
Well, if your Siemens router at work freezes up every couple weeks, I'd suspect it might ether have flaky RAM in it, or it's just an especially poor design. That certainly isn't the "norm" for even bargain-basement priced firewire/routers! I've got a Linksys WRT54g over here that's been running non-stop since the day I first plugged it in, and has only been rebooted to apply a few firmware updates as they've been released. Never a single freeze-up.
I agree that people who "don't know what they're doing" are not going to be able to secure their system, firewall or not. But most Windows software firewall solutions are BY FAR the worst offenders for this problem. Every time a new app tries to connect to the net, the software firewall prompts the user "Should JOE23BLOWIAM.DLL be allowed to access the Internet this time only, from now on, or never?" The user has no idea, so he/she gets scared and says "No, never!" - and thereby permanently disables his/her new instant messenger client from working properly. OR - he/she says "Yeah, sure... whatever!" and clicks "always allow" on the latest trojan horse virus to infect his/her PC.
Given that alternative, I'd much rather put a hardware firewall on the "average clueless user's" PC than trust them to operate ZoneAlarm or McAfee Personal Firewall or whatever properly.
I agree with other members regarding security -- firewalls, common sense, etc. beat constant reactive patching any day.
My big problem with Windows is the user interface, which hasn't really changed since 1995.
Things that shouldn't take any time (opening the file search pane, right-click for context menus) can take forever, everything important is saved in a single arcane "registry" file, and there is no way to realistically disable the "swap file" even if you have way too much RAM.
Oh, and it can't multitask for sh!t.
Regards, Lex
What MS should not be allowed to do is engage in anti-competitive practices such as penalizing vendors (with stiffer licensing fees and such) who offer pre-installed Linux systems.
"What an ass hat. When you grow up you'll learn that it doesn't kill you to admit whan you got things wrong."
After reading some of your other posts, I believe that this was a post of self-reflection. I forgive you for accidentally posting it online.
I'm not exactly sure how you're lack of understanding of statistics relates to me not being able to admit defeat, but I don't care to know. Somebody once said that you can never beat an idiot in an argument. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
Hmmm witty sig or funny sig? Maybe elitest techy sig!
the 4minutes thing, was the absolute truth for me on winxp. moreover, i was behind a linux nat+fwall box!!
Nobody else is reading this anymore. You're no longer playing to the peanut gallery. Both you and I know you got it wrong. Who do you think you're convincing? Yourself?
Three excellent points! I agree completely. I just wish my ex-wife and the jury had seen things the same way you do..
Heh .. I kill me. :-P
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I fear the white box is too small to impress the bumpkins
1. The answer is obvious. Buy an empty PC tower case, fit a Mac Mini into it, and sell it for about the same as the average Windows box to the "bumpkins". 2. ???? 3. Profit!!
Buy a Mac??? I rather sit without any computer when with Mac fuck that shit. Mouse with one button?? Fuckin english style to close windows?? I had a mac at the first time and after 4 days i trow that shit away fuckin stupid. I don't kno guys i am not fuckin genius but MAc stinks I actually against that shit. Windows the best even tho it has many security holls still fucks mac in the ass. And about 13000 thosands which were offered the person who can crash
Mac or whatever. That stupid idiot will comes on public to show what he can do? Only if he wants to be lock up? Brake MAc ask some rusian hackeer he will show you
All you've said is a bunch of retared boilerplate anti-union propoganda that was old in 1950. Just because some union, somewhere, at sometime, had some bad rules, that those problems apply to all unions, and so we shouldn't have unions at all? Let's apply that logic to buisness for a second. Enron screwed over their customers, their investors, and finally their employees. Therefore, lets ban all businesses!
Just because you join a union, doesn't mean you'll automatically be paid based only on seniority (so the slackers get paid as much as the go-getters); that's the oldest red herring around. Neither does it meant that the company wont be comeditive or that it will go out of business; unions are fully aware that if the company folds, they'll lose their jobs. There have been numerous cases where unions have agreed to sacrifice pay and benefits so the company wouldn't go under - most notably in the airline and auto industries. No, all a union is really for is to make sure workers are treated fairly and get their slice of the pie.
The greatest trick wasn't pulled by the devil, making people think he didn't exist. The greatest trick has been the one pulled by Republicans and big business in convincing workers and consumers that standing up for themselves is a horrible, horrible thing, because you might be in a union or put some money in the pocket of a lawyer.
Please... this wasn't some hostile takeover where the employees were railroaded into Redmond so some stockholders could make a quick buck by selling out Bungie; they entered the deal voluntarily with full understanding of what signing on with Microsoft/Xbox would mean for their plans for Macintosh. After Myth was so successful on PC, they wanted to reach the far bigger PC gamer market, and were also working on breaking into the console market at the time (Oni), both of which Microsoft could offer them.
Ita erat quando hic adveni.
Oh, my bad... it's only bad is Microsoft does it.
Good point.
Microsoft could sell their own hardware bundled with their software - just like Apple.
In which case there is no issue of Microsoft coercing the hardware vendor (except they'd have even more incredible leverage upstream on CPU and peripheral manufacturers).
"Provided by the management for your protection."
I can't beleive three years of negotiation were redone in such a small time. Since we didn't know the details of what Reno's people proposed, how can we know that this was a lot different? RUMOR was Reno was going to break them up, I never saw confirmation of that. As in every negotiation,each side didn't get 100% of what they wanted but the final deal DID solve a lot of problems. And yes, M$ could figure out ways around them. A breakup would have had the same problems, each of the companies could "collude" with each other and each require the other's parts of a system. THat would probably mean Windows would cost MORE and then if something broke you get finger pointing and nothing gets fixed. So, you lose one way, you lose the other way. Pick which way you want to lose!
That's ridiculous. How do you expect ot get the cooperation of the bosses, capitalists, and the rest of the ruling class (Who do you think sits in congress?) to pass those laws, when they can't even stand a simple trade union? You'll only see the same arguements you just made, replacing "living wage laws" for "unions." George W. Bush and John Kerry both have alot of profit to lose if the businesses they invest in are forced to actual pay their workers wages that aren't exploitive.
Unfortunately, people like you will buy it, spread the FUD, and try to hold the masses back from securing a better world and life for themselves. All this without ever seeing that the capitalists don't care about you, and only allow the middle classes to exsist as a way to fool the people into believing in upward mobility, as a tool to keep the lower classes from revolting against their exploiters.... There's something profoundly sad about a traitor to his own interests. I have more respect for a capitalist, really.
I'll flip it around on you; why should we reward capital accumulation instead of actual work? Why should the surplus value of societal labor go to a small group of already wealthy individuals as opposed to those who need it?
He wasn't installing Windows, he was connecting a windows box to the internet through Yahoo! DSL. Any software installation would have been the PPPoE authentication. Funny he called himself a poweruser and said the fix would require a "expensive" reinstall of Windows. I've installed Windows thousands of time and it never cost me a dime. Of course I consider Windows free software as well...
Oni was finished before the purchase... As for their feelings on the deal, we'll never know. But look at MS's history about the question of taking over a company to get a hot item: Seatle Computing, Rare, Wizkids... Most of them, anyone who didn't agree with the "changes of direction" were fired outright... If I enjoyed getting a paycheck I might not be willing to say much knowing that history.