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First Looks At XBox
adpowers writes: "You can find a picture and description of the Xbox at the press release from Microsoft." There's also shoots from Gamespy, news from C|Net, and a report from Reuters - and lastly, a report from MSNBC.
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Yeah but the developers won't have to worry about things like hardware confilcts, so they will be able to use the hardware to its max, so the games will be better optimized than anything you could sell for a regular pc.
I dont understand how this machine seems "small". Look at the GameCube...now that's small. This thing looks about as big as a stereo component. It wouldnt be easy to lug this thing over to a friend's house to use it. If you want to drool at something small and powerful, look at the G4 cube...and it doesn't even have a fan. My TI-86 graphing calculator is more powerful than those old room-sized computers, and a hell of a lot smaller. Just because X-box is smaller than the average warehouse doesnt make it small.
Still the problem with batteries. And the increased price of radio links (wouldn't bluetooth be a perfect solution for this). My friend has a wireless mouse, and at practically every LAN party I hear "does anyone have some AAA batteries?" And that rumble feature that everything has would drain batteries even more.
Maybe a perfect wireless controller would use lithium ion batteries and a small charging station, and maybe an emergency cable you could use if your battery was dead and there was no time to charge. Would cost a lot for a game controller, though. Somebody want to make one?
Overall, I think this looks like a good system, if you ignore the monopolistic corporate empire that makes it.
My only major problem with it is the hard drive. Given Micro$oft's past with software, they'll use it to store patches for the OS and/or games, available either through the internet or a CD mailed with monthly updates on it. The reason I like consoles is because you can just plug it in and it works. No need to apply patches to fix bugs, increase functionality, optimise drivers, etc. That's all supposed to be done before I get it. Lets hope M$ uses its vast bank accounts to spend a little money on beta testing and bug squashing. Since it's likely they'll succeed with the Xbox anyway, given their marketing/hypnotising budget, might as well hope it doesn't suck too much.
Oh man, my mock-up Xbox was so close! If only I'd thought of using a low profile case and not a minitower. :-)
My Xbox mockup
My PS2 will eat this hideous thing alive. :-)
Good uses for the hard drive, but I think the reason M$ wanted a hard drive instead of a faster DVD drive is that they can write more than a couple of MB of data to it and the stuff will be stored after the unit is turned off. Perfect for installing patches to. Now M$ doesn't have to spend as much money beta testing as Sony or Nintendo, because they can now fix their mistakes after they make them! I predict days where X box games will say: "Requires Service Pack 7 to play" on the box.
Let's try not to let fact interfere with our speculation here, OK?
If this puppy runs Linux :)
The difference between Canada and the USA is that in Canada healthcare is a right and gun ownership is a privilege.
I'm pretty sure the Playstation 2 has a hard drive in it. It's got these loading screens where you can hear the DVD drive spinning and the sound of a hard drive in use.
MS is certainly doing this the open way, at least for now. Of course, it's no more open than PC gaming, which is where they're coming from. The PS2 definitely suffers from insufficient testing on the games right now-- there are bugs in almost all of the ones I've seen which could not have been missed if anyone actually played the games through before the release.
I expect to see things turn more closed later. Perhaps the DVDs are encoded in some way that makes them inpossible to write without a license, so, while you know exactly how the box works inside, you can't get code into the actual hardware. Developer kits would be less strict, so you could write games, but you could only use them on consumer models if MS has approved.
299.00 for the console, 50+ for the games and you are bitching about the cost of 8 AA batteries every 60 days!
Sega Rally uses WinCE. It runs slowly, so maybe that's not the best example :)
You can see the giant case fan in this shot: http://www.theregister.co.uk/media/313.jpg Bet it makes a ton of noise. Will people really use this thing for watching DVD movies, if it has a whirring fan on all the time? I can hear the transport motors in my oldest CD player, and it bugs the hell out of me. Home theater gear with fans would drive me berserk.
I don't want a cord at all, read the post next time.
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All you have to do is make a game CD/DVD/cartridge with Linux installed on it, with loadlin.exe (to boot you into Linux).
Actually, that makes it a very good example why 99% of developers don't use it.
Apart from that, it seems much emu software on the Dreamcast (for Spectrum etc.) uses it; presumably because the dev-kit is so readily available, and it's close enough to "real" Windows for Windows developers to write for.
The point here is that Windows on a PC is not optimized for running games. The OS on the X-Box will be. Heck, it probably won't even look like Windows API-wise once you get above the kernel.
And known hardware is easier to optimize for. Hence, the games will run faster on this box than a PC even if they do port them to it.
This is one arena where I hope MS does succeed.
Some game developers will make a lot of money programming for the Xbox. I hope to be one of them.
Don't forget that not every component of the X-Box are standard: the videocard, the chipset, etc.. are NOT.
And all it takes is a shortage of ONE component to delay the whole box of course.
And the shipping of the X-Box in Europe have already been delayed, so yes Microsoft is quite likely to suffer from the same problems at the beginning.
Second, I don't think that the shortage of the PS2 will still be a problem when the X-Box will ship.
I do think that the X-Box will be a winner, but you'd better think twice about the shortage problems..
Yeah, that's the first thing I thought when I just looked at those pics. I was going to post a new topic, but a quick search found that I'm not the only one thinking that!! :^)
It's definitely a Borg-looking device. Imagine how many fans and external heatsinks people are going to bolt onto the thing, and it'll look like a Cube in no time...
Mike
Pinball, arcade video, tech and more: www.micsaund.com
well, if you had actually read the article, you'd know that the Xbox uses non-standard USB ports.
My plan is to pimp before they realize I'm a jackass. Hit 'em hard and fast.
So maybe multi-gigabyte games aren't really desirable? What are you going going to use those gigabytes for, anyway? More boring cut-scenes? Why? I want to play a game, not watch a movie. What else can you use massive amounts of slow storage for? You can't have more textures or geometry than you have RAM. Sounds to me that if you're spending all your time and budget making gigabytes of pretty pictures you're focusing a whole lot more on eye-candy than game-play anyway.
<span style="OLD_FART">Why, back in my day, designers actually cared about making a good game. You couldn't sell a game based on gratuitous eye-candy when your target platform was an Atari VCS or Intellivision. You actually had to make a game good enough to immerse the players without tens of millions of 32-bit mip-mapped subpixel rendered polygons.</span>
Chelloveck
Chelloveck
I give up on debugging. From now on, SIGSEGV is a feature.
So you're saying there is hardware out there that Microsoft software can RUN on?
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"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
It would appear that they are already preparing for upgrade revenue to the Xbox 2002. From the press release:
...pastel colored buttons on controllers aren't cool...
Judging from the pictures of the controller, they clearly have pastel-colored buttons. Why would they go to such trouble to find out that the "gamer culture" does not like pastel-colored buttons, does not want pastel-colored buttons and feels that pastel-colored buttons are "not cool," just to put them in anyway? Xbox 2002 will probably have non-pastel-colored buttons, so the "gamer culture" will be compelled to upgrade to stop being "not cool."
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"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
Read my post. I'm not talking about what's printed in the specs or on the box. I'm not using Gates in the 'Gates=Microsoft' sense. I'm refering directly to his CES keynote where he says "And the controllers use USB, only we use a different connector, but you'll be amazed at what comes out for it." That's what I'm taking issue with. No more, no less.
Just another example of Microsoft Gas for Microsoft Roads, only this time there's a Microsoft Car too!
Kevin Fox
Kevin Fox
Its supposed to drop bellow 90% this year.
------ 24.5% slashdot pure
A few years ago, they invented these things called rechargable batteries. Get 2 sets per controller (actually, wouldn't need that many, unless you play 4-player all the time), you'll always have batteries ready to go for your wireless controller(s) and just buy them once.
No, it dosen't. Developers have the choice of using WinCE or Sega's OS. 99% choose Sega's OS. I can't think of any game that uses Win CE on the Dreamcast.
How many times have you yanked your CD player off the shelf ? Or your VCR ? I think the harddisk will survive normal household use.
The irony of your reply is that my sister-in-law called me penis-breath...when she was 3 years old. Do your parents know you use a computer?
-- Who is the bigger fool? The fool or the fool who follows him? --
"Luke got the idea for the ribs on the console when he was walking around his office playing catch with aluminum heat sync from a computer he had recently disassembled. The palm-sized sync, which helps dissipate heat inside a computer, has metal spines that resemble those on a car stereo amplifier."
I'm no genius at thermodynamics, but I wouldn't have a clue how to sync heat with a piece of aluminum-- even if it is palm-sized.
...Isn't it supposed to be "heat sink"?
By that logic, I can speed up my computer by putting racing stripes on it...
Only if they're made of black electrical tape. Trust me, it works. =]
Karma: Dyn-o-mite!(mostly affected by Jimmy Walker reading your comments)
`I've been to a talk by J Allard (the head xbox guy), he claims that the system would only run :)'
Microsoft-signed data on DVD-9 media, making it pretty damn difficult to hack it. He offered a job to anyone who could boot linux on it
Surely they're not that stupid. Am I the only one who thinks that is waving a red flag in front of a bull? And it's a bull smart enough to ignore the flag and gore the smartass wearing the sequins.
`It's a stinking black box with a 100baseT port on the back.'
Did Microsoft buy Cobalt when we weren't looking?
I wonder if the name was picked to add to confusion over X.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Comment removed based on user account deletion
my experiance with USB shows me that they disconnect real easy... the only change is probably a deeper connection so little kids wont pull the controllers out.. although that may be a bad idea, because now they'll just pull the system down off the tv and damage the 8gb harddrive, oops :)
That's a major reason (IMHO) for making controllers easily removable! Many console games can detect controller removal and automatically pause the game.
Maybe MS won't care if the linux hackers try to run X on it, etc. Seeing is they'll have to BUY the X-box to do it. Linux hackers might laugh and rejoice if they pull it off, but MS will be laughing their way to the bank.
I don't think many Linux hackers are going to try to run Linux on it, because isn't the operating system stored in the hardware. But then there are a lot of linux hackers with plenty of time on their hands. If they port linux to the X-box, I wonder if you would be able to PC games on it. That could be useful, because you wouldn't have all of the overhead that a regular PC has.
Hell, I sped up my Chevy Chevette by doing that!
However adding a big exhaust pipe plus the racing stripes on the sides == TURBO!
Of course that is all relative to myself.. I feel faster though!
About the only "non standard" thing in here is the GPU, but since the X-Box uses a Direct-X API, anyway, that won't matter. The X-Box is designed so you can almost literally take your Windows 32 code and recompile it for the X-Box.
Even the PS2 is firmware updateable. Sony has been slipping code on new games to update the firmware. I've noticed a few revisions change since I originally bought mine.
:o)
My biggest problem with the X86Box is the list of XBox developers.. Console game developers are used to releasing throughly tested games, because there is no way to patch them afterwards.. you only get one shot at a release.. However in the case of the XBox, ALOT of them are PC developers who are used to releasing games prematurely (to meet deadlines, public pressure or whatever), then releasing a 'patch-of-the-week' to make it work properly (anyone remember Ultima Online?). The fact that each and every XBox will have a hard drive builtin will, IMHO, only propagate this problem.
On the bright side, once someone hacks Linux onto the beast, it will make a kick-arse cheap webserver.. all courtesy of Billy..
I see, you just want to buy a fresh set of AA batteries for each of your four radio-enabled controllers every two months. Me, I prefer to flush my money down the toilet.
They're called NiMH rechargeable batteries. I use them in all of my IR controllers and remotes. They last about 2 months between charges for me and take and hour and a half to charge. I'm guessing that that's about 30-40 hours of gameplay.
A pair of AAA's will run about $5-$8 at your local Radio Shack. You can pick up a NiMH charger for $15-$25.
The wireless IR controllers I have for my PSX put the original wireless pads for the NES to shame. They take AAA's, so they're a lot lighter and the design is very comfy.
Is it just me or do all the latest controller designs suck? The only standard controller I've found 100% confortable is the PS{X,2}'s.
Dreamcast is a beautiful system, but the controllers are worthless. N64? Well, I was never very fond of the system itself, and the controllers were a big reason why (far from the only one, though).
Anyway, why do all the latest system designers (aside from Sony) believe that you have to have a MUCH bigger surface in order to add extra features? IMNOSHO, everybody should pay attention to how Sony went from the standard PSX controller to the Dual Shock configuration. They managed to add TWO thumb-sticks without making me grip the controller any differently. I want a controller I can wrap my pinkies and ringfingers around - and I don't have the hands of a 5-year-old!!!
I wouldn't expect the bandwidth of the gaming controller to be anymore than that of a mouse (see Logitech). What? 36400 bps should do shouldn't it? Even for a 256 bit joystick? (Some people call them analogue).
Rod Taylor
Am I the only one who fears that with Gates is holding back the gaming development industry here? Forcing game developers to develop for a medium system. I mean 750 Mhz ain't that much. I know the fill rate is covered but nowadays the game looks come from the processor. If X-block's specs are frozen for... let's say 3 years (remember the PS1? What was it? 4 years??)... You can imagine how development goes with designers making games on a 3 year old system. If you build a game now, build it for a system which will be there in 2003, not for a system which is medium NOW!. I guess Intel&AMD ain't happy now that games are being developed for a target processor which is almost not even produced anymore! X-box is made for parents who don't know jack. It's made for the hype. I wonder how long it boots and how long a reinstall takes. How long it takes to install Office for it and Micro$ releases a keyboard. -Danny
I'm sure the last thing in the world Microsoft would ever want to do is have their new console associated with that X. Ugh, the thought of a console using X makes me wanna puke shoot.
Maybe it has something to do with DirectX? Ya think?
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Nicotine free Amish .sig.
Probably because of the Microsoft publicity machine. They probably sent huge press release materials to newspapers, magazines and TV shlock, I mean TV news programs. I'm betting they diddn't send one to Slashdot. Why? Well, considering all the negative press they've earned here, and the fact that their target audience is the mass consumer market (of which Slashdot readers are just a teeny tiny sliver), they probably figured that slashdot could get the stuff second hand, and it did.
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Foolish human! Feel the Dolphin Brain Blast!
I think the real reason is that USB connectors are a little flimsy and gamepad connectors have to be rugged enough to be plugged by 3-year olds and other mechanically challenged gamers. But it would have been nice if they had put one real USB port on the back. For *ahem* expansion *ahem*; keyboard, mouse, linux...
OTOH, assuming they didn't change change the electrical spec's, it should take about 10 minutes to make an Xbox gameport-to-USB-adaptor. :-)
Another point is that Microsoft makes some of the best development software in the world and DirectX is a very mature programming library. Miles better than anything Sony or Sega puts out for their game systems. Game developers are not going to lack for tools to do their jobs.
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Well, since the SegaOS and WindowsCE game development kits are expensive and scarce, it might make a nice Linux-based games platform. Could SDL be ported to it easily?
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I think the real reason is that USB connectors are a little flimsy and gamepad connectors have to be rugged enough to be plugged and unplugged by 3-year olds and other mechanically challenged gamers.
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Console systems are sold with the most common demoninator of hardware. You want wireless controllers, you buy them separately. Similar to your computer, you want dual headed video, you buy it separately (ok, arguably, you could special order it, but that's basically the same thing).
I will stick to my CPU. I can do more and play more than any console.Different classes of games, though there's some overlap. Consoles are generally better for arcade style games, computers are better for thinking style games, but as I say there is overlap. Nobody's forcing you to buy XBox. :-)
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Another good reason to redesign the USB port is that the standard USB mechanical design is a little flimsy for a device that's going to be used by kids plugging and unplugging controllers frequently.
Don't count on this. The advantage counsols have over PC's (I am told) is that the hardware is 100% standardized so that things can be super-optimized. This also means that due to the optimizations software developed for counsosn't work elsewhere.
My original impression was that a dedicated MPEG chip would handle it and it would largely by a separate system, but you're probably right in that it will probably use a software decoder. An idle chip will definitely not need the cooling of a fan, though. My notebook hardly rarely uses its fan unless I have something that's consuming 100% of its processor time (like SETI@home) running on it. As a result, I don't use the SETI@home on it.
If it's gonna bust the hard drive, it's gonna bust the DVD drive, too. People just gotta be more careful. The advantages of a hard drive far outweigh the costs and the inconvenience.
... and that Linux-running DC has done what for you so far? It's far more useful as a DC than a Linux DC.
The sound of the fan in my DC is insignificant compared to the whirring of the GD-ROM drive spinning up and down. Besides, why would the processor be on if you're just watching a movie?
It doesn't really matter what your desktop can/will do. The competition is against other consoles. In general, people aren't interested in configuring this, that, and the other thing. They want to plug it in and make it work.
Also, like all other consoles, the cost of the hardware is being subsidized by the royalties in the sales of the games, which means that you'll be able to buy more power for less money.
I hate to break it to you, but the capabilities of the system and the quality of the games are the deciding factor for most people (along with price). Maybe they could have made it smaller, but they didn't. I don't think that's going to sway very many people at all. Nor the controllers. Please trash Microsoft with real complaints only.
8 GB is not for one game. You do the install process same as in current PC games and create installation directories where information is cached and profiles/characters/scores are stored. You could store dozens of games' information at once and still have space to spare for downloading email and browsing the web. Not all games need more than a few megs of temporary space, but some could really use it.
Yes, 6 games to break even is about right. Last I heard, Dreamcast in the US required 4.5 games to break even, Dreamcast in Japan required 5.5 games to break even, PlayStation required 9 games to break even, and PlayStation 2 required 15 games to break even. I don't know about Nintendo, but they've got to be comparable to Sega, at the least. Microsoft has very, very deep pockets, and we learn a couple of things from them. 1) They have the money to spend to run the numbers on this to make sure they'll make money on it. 2) They've spent millions on user interface studies. Maybe they're not 100% right, but the MS Mouse has always been the best for years. The innovation of the wheel mouse and the explorer buttons on the mouse are real productivity improvers.
If there are enough companies in the market, then why are they all facing problems? Nintendo has completely missed the boat with N64. Their arrogance has caused them lots of problems. Don't be surprised if they disappear in the next couple of years. Sega is facing massive losses and isn't expected to recover until about March. Sony is banking huge with the PS2 and the jury's still out on whether it's going to succeed. There's no question that it's superior to the other systems out there right now, but it's pricey, hard to find, and didn't quite live up to the hype (at least so far). Rumors are rampant that they're going to take huge losses with it because the thing costs so much money to make and there aren't enough good games to help make that money back.
Stupid? Hardly. It makes it nice and easy to get royalties on any licensed accessories. Every other console maker does it -- it's suicide not to use such marketing tactics.
Actually, I don't consider the cartridge to be its weakness. You're right in that it has a lot of advantages, but their biggest failure was to sign (or hold) their developers and market the whole system effectively. They failed the business test, not the technical one. I'd love to see them succeed, but they seem to be having some very hard times. GameCube is going to make them or break them.
psxndc
The emacs religion: to be saved, control excess.
sigh
The emacs religion: to be saved, control excess.
What do you expect?
The emacs religion: to be saved, control excess.
Heh anyone else notice that the color lights in the X-Box are green? Microsoft is going to asimilate the gaming market (probably not though)
Hmm, death beam. What an interesting way to deal with your opponent who's sitting next to you :).
Player1: Take that! *Click* *Zap*
Player2: AAARrrrgggGGhhh!!!
Player1: Haha! (To Players 3 4 and 5) Who's next?
Players 3 4 and 5: (Turn around and exit room in a hurry.)
Player2: (Sits stunned, wiggling a little.)
Withdrawal before climax is very ineffective and those who try this are usually called "parents."
Yeah, of course. And even 36400 would be overkill. But the problem still exists of figuring out how to allow the controller/receiver to continue to communicate without bad stuff happening when the signal has been obscured.
:).
I still think that, after all the R&D had been performed (And MS does this very well, when it comes to hardware. Just look at their mice. Maybe they aren't "revolutionary", but they certainly are nice.) the cost of creating a wireless controller would be so expensive as to make it a bad choice. And the wireless controllers I've seen (ok, only one, for the 8bit NES) are clunky and heavy and require AA batteries. However, looking at the size of that controller, they could probably add on some more [weight, size] and you wouldn't really notice. The NES controller isn't all that ergonomic, either
Withdrawal before climax is very ineffective and those who try this are usually called "parents."
In worst case you only need to reflash or replace the BIOS. CPUs do not check signatures on boot yet :-) I would certainly be curious about that, and surely I will find a use for a network-enabled, 750 MHz/64MB/8GB box!
He offered a job to anyone who could boot linux on it :)
This means that neither he nor his people know how to do it. Why would I want to work with them? :-)
I thought that a copy of the OS is included with every game, tailored to the game (like it should be). This allows MS and developers to do whatever they want with the underlying OS - you said it yourself in this very comment. So why I can't plug a newest Super-Force-Feedback Joystick which uses standard USB? If I have access to the OS and all the hardware it's my problem, not MS's!
I, personally, am looking forward to the XBox.
Same here. It would be a great pleasure to legally take money back from Microsoft :-) Of course, I won't be buying any games - X itself is the game in town :-)
The X-Box won't even have 1/10 the demand the PS2 got at it's launch no matter what amout of hype the X-Box gets.
It's probably another one of those great microsoft methods to "create consumer value" by creating things that break more easily.
The Powermac G4 cube has no fan, and certainly has more CPU processing power than these machines.
wireless controllers exist my roommate has one for his Playstation 2, in reality it is the remote control for the DVD but it works just fine for game play to albeit a bit awkward. a bugg
Yes, but no one wants to see Pitfall on their 300 dollar playstation 2. That's why they still have the Atari.
The entire argument that gameplay is unequivocally more important than graphics is a) trendy these days and b) dumb. You need both to have a good game. Gamers these days look to a far higher standard than they did, say, 10 years ago.
Oh yeah, and graphics AND gameplay are both integral factors in "immersing" gamers. So if Tetris works fine for you, then play Tetris, but don't dis pretty looking games because they're pretty.
Well, whatever else happens, there'll at least be ONE person buying an Xbox. This guy gets aroused just thinking about it.
"The Microsoft designers reinforced the idea of Xbox's unforeseen potential and power by putting a raised "jewel" on the top of the console. Luke compares it to a porthole on a furnace, nuclear submarine or atomic collider. "You can see the fire inside burning," Luke explained." . . . . riiiiiiight.
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Don't worry, being eaten by a crocodile is just like going to sleep in a giant blender.
Yeah. If you can't beat 'em then just ignore that they exist completely.
The List of Grievances with Slashdot.
This is easily the first time I've ever seen a report about Microsoft on the local Eleven O'Clock News before it was on Slashdot.
That is kind of disturbing.
I guess everyone of us was trying to figure out how we could steal one instead of sharing that information with the Slashdot Community. (That's what I was doing.)
The List of Grievances with Slashdot.
I really hate that the Xbox is turning out to look like a good piece of equipment, because I don't expect to ever see myself buying one. It's not that I have anything against it or Microsoft - I never have. I just believe that three companies is enough for the console market. On the other hand, if Sega actually vanishes into the night, Microsoft might be a good addition to the console wars. Still, I think Microsoft should stick to making their software better instead of entering a new market. They've stuck their nose in nearly every electronic market in existence as is ... I don't think we can stand much more. Hopefully the Xbox will prove to me that they deserve this market. If not, Microsoft may lose my support (of course my support never meant anything... I'm just a kid).
I've seen Linux ported to iPaq handhelds and even some models of Cisco routers. Knowing how PC-esqe this hardware is, I don't think it'll be long before we see a similar porting effort.
I/O Error G-17: Aborting Installation
All the reports say the same crap, show the same pictures, so why link to 4 different articles? It took /. a whole day to finally post something about the xbox. This is old news, im sure everyone and there mother has read about this already
I'm no console fan, haven't bought one since SNES in '91 or so. However, with all the aparent mass exodus from PC development to X-box/console development, one good thing may happen.
Since the X-Box hardware will essentially be frozen for a year (assumption - I'm thinking there will be X-Box2,etc.), developers will focus more on gameplay than fancy bells and whistles. Since the CPU is in reality 1/2 speed of current state of the art, developers will have less CPU horsepower to rely on for fancy bells and whistles, relatively speaking.
This is of course assuming that the titles eventually DO get ported to the PC platform. I'm thinking that's not too big a stretch given the X-Box's similarity to a true PC.
Praying for the end of your wide-awake nightmare.
Whether that reasoning played more of a factor than straight up marketing is quite debatable.
Of course marketing is involved! MS sells the console at a loss and the recoup costs thru hardware and software royalties. This is how every other console company works.
Aside from this a console is based on the concept of fixed hardware. If you could plug in any old usb device you could possibly run into compatibility issues... this is not what a console is about! MS wants all the hardware ( and software ) QA to go thru them to ensure that people do not run into these problems. This is not a PC! Tom
Tom the Sigless
This should take care of most cases....
Fortunately, though, one of the guys in QA told me that part of the design process for the final case involved making it tough enough to survive the life of an average console. The final design has been crash-tested to survive a fall from 2m onto a hard surface. At Microsoft's R&D plant, there's a machine that's been dropping Xbox prototypes onto the floor 10 hours a day, seven days a week since September.
Tom the Sigless
Warning: X Box does NOT run X Yet. ;-)
The current rumor is that the case was designed to damage the pc board if it's atempted to be opened. Tom
Tom the Sigless
Seriously.
They got this great thing called LinuxBIOS developed in part at Los Alamos, but damn if you kin find anybody using it to make SBC linboxes (the obvious thing to do). No, everbuddy's got to have their own Gigantor-Beowulf clusters these days - no luv for the SBC and the lowly LAN station. I say the world don't need no more nuclear simulations than it's already got...what we need is cheapo linboxes that boot up in < 3 sec. with / on a flashdisk, and that mount /homer from the old 30gig PC down the hall. ALL the parts are there waiting to be used, but only MSFT and cronies are using them.
Johnny Quest has two Daddies.
Nintendo of America ALWAYS believed their audience was dumber, and inferior to their japanese market. I can sight NUMEROUS examples...
Well, hopefully they never expect us to learn how to spell. I did not see any of the examples you sighted. It sure would be nice if you would cite them, so I could see them, too.
Slashdot is jumping the shark. I'm just driving the boat.
Maybe it's all bullshit. Maybe they didn't visit anyone at all and just came up with the ideas playing around the office like they mentioned. Who would know (or really care)?
Would YOU let MS reps into your home? I hope they were giving away some serious freebies :-)
One could argue that instead of sitting here and posting on Slashdot, you should be spending time with your family, yes?
Anyhow, I don't think that just because a console is new or next-gen or whatever means it's going to be more addictive. It takes time for the developers to be able to exploit all the strengths of a system, so basically the REALLY good, immersive games (Think Zelda64, think Final Fantasy 9) take at least a year after the initial release of a new system to come out. The only real reason to get a new console is the most obvious, the graphics. Chances are you probably don't have to worry about losing the kids to the TV based on flashy visuals (except maybe if it's p0rn).
At any rate, if the kiddies want to play video games, let 'em. If you want to be more family like, then hell, buy yourself a second controller and try playing a game or two. The key here is to be flexible, I almost lost a child to NHL 97 back on the SNES until I started doing shootouts with him ;)
Not to mention the fact that it drives the price of the damn thing up a good 60-100 bucks.
If you don't pretend to be anyone, are you?
Now even you can make the controller for the X-Box. http://www.htloz.com/xbox_gamecube/XBOXMACHINE.htm l
Apparently a joke, but a funny one.
Vcr's and CD players don't have cords easily pullable by your hands(controller).. Although the cord is long, people are probably going to wrap it up a bit in the middle or something..
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Ive had my dreamcast and other systems ripped out countless times btw.
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I dont even have any games for my dreamcast nor do I use it either. Ok, im done now.
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I am glad to see that they decided to put in 4 controller ports. It is amazing to me that the Sony decided to put only 2 ports on a 128-bit console, they should understand by now that the multiplayer aspect of gaming is usually the most fun. I am also glad to see that the box is in a more conventional console design, and not a free-standing "X" like some of the earlier photos seemed to suggest. As I understand it, the Xbox is designed to be like a console version of a PC, and I see no reason to play PC games on an ultra-low-res television screen. Why would I need a console that outputs at 200x 320 (or whatever television resoloution is), when I can play on my 19" monitor at 1600x1200 courtesy of my GeForce 2?
Also, why the hell would anyone need 8 Gb to store game info? I can see benefits to it if some of the HD was used as cache for the FMVs, etc, but damn, that is a lotta space for an application like this. On a more personal note, I dont trust RAM management in the first place, I have 256 Mb on my box, and in an hour, I have 200Mb of swap space taken up. I have no such problems on linux, naturally. Flames aside, I am sure that they could have reduced the cost of the machine by making that magnetic bucket a bit smaller. Also, I predict that with 4 128-bit consoles out, there wont be a lot of competition. I say this because we are already seeing a lot of games released for the DC, and later the PS2. Tony Hawk 2, a game that I believe is available for the aforementioned systems, is being made for the XBox. I am betting that games will be made for each console, and that the selling points of the different consoles will be the optimizations they make to the games, and of course, their price. Finally, I would like to say that I believe that the new Nintendo system will not follow this pattern, as Nintendo has in the past relied more on second and first party developers, ones that would be less likely to make cross-platform games. Whether this will be a good or a bad thig remains to be seen.
So you are saying that my PC is already an XBox emulator? Gates is NOT gonna be happy.
Does anyone know if OpenGL will be supported (making Linux ports easier). Alternatively, does anyone know how Wine is handling DirectX these days? The problem I see is that developers will say "OK, we can design from the ground up to work with Win32 / X-Box using DirectX, or we can design from the ground up to work with Win32 / Linux using OpenGL but sacrifice the X-Box market. Please don't kill my OpenGL...
Let the hacking begin, I can't wait to see it boot linux, ala dreamcast
________
Does anyone actually have a Java program designed to control air traffic, or for the operation of a nuclear facility?
Aside from the transulect green spheres in the middle, it looks ugly to me.
The controllers look big and clunky (2/3 the size of the machine it seems), and the machine itself is boxy, it looks like a suitcase.
Does any else think the buttons are too high up on the controller? It looks like someone would have to put their hands at a ring angle to each other to be able to use the controller easily?
Actually the controller only has three buttons.
They are..
Ctrl-Alt-Del
They are selling DVD playback as an upgrade, so I'd imagine it was in software. This would also let them having to raise the cost of each system to pay for the DVD licensing... Since keeping the price on the boxes down is important, it's a logical move. If they really wanted to dominate Sony, though, they should have include DVD out of the box. Now Sony can say "Well, we have DVD! In the box! Xbox don't!"
Josh Sisk
So maybe multi-gigabyte games aren't really desirable? What are you going going to use those gigabytes for, anyway? More boring cut-scenes? Why? I want to play a game, not watch a movie. What else can you use massive amounts of slow storage for? You can't have more textures or geometry than you have RAM. Sounds to me that if you're spending all your time and budget making gigabytes of pretty pictures you're focusing a whole lot more on eye-candy than game-play anyway.
I don't know if multi-gigabyte games are really needed... But I don't think you could even cram the average crappy PSX game on a N64 cart, much less a next gen game with large textures and complex models and levels... Carts really limit what can be done. And they are expensive.
Josh Sisk
Why is it when consumer electronic manufactuers release updates to their products under the guise of calling it "firmware" that's ok, but when Microsoft does it, it's evil? Sony is already being bitched about providing a firmware update for their buggy dvd playback. The hypocrisy of you faggots is amazing.
I think he was more concerned with developers suddenly being able to ship games that have massive bugs. This is common in the PC market, relatively rare in the console world- at least so far. But a console with a built-in HD opens up the possibility.
Josh Sisk
The sound of the fan in my DC is insignificant compared to the whirring of the GD-ROM drive spinning up and down. Besides, why would the processor be on if you're just watching a movie?
DVDs work with this thing called COMPRESSION. It needs to be decompressed and it's seems as though the Xbox will feature software compression... So the processor will be very much involved. Besides, the processor on any computerized device is never OFF... maybe idle, but not off.
Josh Sisk
The only things I can think of are making you buy official MS gamepads and because the adaptors on USB cable are sort of flimsy, at least compared to a PSX or DC cable.
Josh Sisk
I don't know it that's a fair criticism of Carmack, since I don't believe he even does game design these days. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't he mostly responsible for engine design? Q3 definitely wasn't creative, but it had a pretty damn good engine...
Josh Sisk
-733 mhz Intel chip, compared to about 233 for Dreamcast, 300 for PS2. -They've bought/gotten exclusive contracts from a lot of really great game suppliers, who are either making X-box only games, releasing them first, or at least publishing for the system as well. -Hard drive space, for add-ons and saves without buying additional memory cards and all that. -Less bugs than the PS2? Maybe. Certainly availability. -That neato Nvidia chip, too. This is one powerful little sucker, and I love my PS2. Just because I don't love windows doesn't mean their console will suck. Only time will tell. --OblvnDrgn Yes, I work retail in the game industry. Yes, I already reserved my X-box.
What's that green ball for? Is it a trackball?
For some reason I think the XBox controller resembles the Dreamcast controller more than anything else... hmm. Why couldn't Microsoft just put the word(s) X-Box on the controller instead of making that ugly green thing? They could've done something like Sega's VMU, because they do have slots for cards on the controllers (I think). Also, they shouldn't have used a tray DVD/CD drive. If I have 10 immature people running around in my not-huge basement, they'll probably end up breaking the XBox tray... that's not good. Hopefully it automatically closes when you turn off the XBox, otherwise, I just know it'll get broken. AAlsooo..., the CD/DVD drive should be in the middle, it's... bad looking... over on the left. AND I think that IGN.Com did a better job putting their logo on the XBox than Microsoft did. The white XBOX on a black console just doesn't look right, they should have used gray. That's all I can think of for now...
!-!_!-!_!-!
PC graphics have gotten thousands of times faster in the past years, but hardly as much more fun. We don't need any more graphics acceleration, we need FUN ACCELERATION. But don't look to Michale Abrash and John Carmack for that: they're stuck in a dead end rut, a tedious hell of their own creation, and have never demonstrated a drop of talent for creative game design.
-Don
Take a look and feel free: http://www.PieMenu.com
try plugging in all sorts of USB device, and become quite confused and frustrated when nothing happens
your really reaching here
Anyone else think this thing looks like a space heater? Or possibly one of those LCD projectors. Although I must admit it looks better than Nintendo's glowing purple blob of a "Game Cube."
char sig[120] = "\0"
The X-box will not come with dvd support right out of the box. They are selling a remote that will enable dvd playback. x-box will not be able to utilize the controller for navigating the dvd menu. Why they did this, i may never understand.
the remote will sell in between 24-30 dollars. I read this on ign's website where they interviewed an xbox staff. sorry i couldnt find the url.
Well, now that its out, I wonder how long it'll take before MS releases X-Box Service Pack 1? Or perhaps you'll just buy a game from Microsoft that'll perform the update and integrate Internet Explorer into your gaming.
The clash of honour calls, to stand when others fall.
I'd be damned if will not be hacked, and
such as xboxhacked.com would provide all the
directions to install Linux on it, and make it
webserver and run my Kicq =)
Beowulf I SAY!
If Microsoft starts seeing you move into their turf, they get scared. When they're scared they'll either buy you out or kill you by competing against you.
Time and time again they've done this... Netscape, Java, Novell, and now... Dreamcast/PS2.
It's like this. When they start seeing network adapters in these consoles, Microsoft start to imagine a day when these video game consoles slowly morph into set-top boxes... and then into personal pc's. This is what they're most afraid of... That these video game systems pushing their way into the consumer pc area, thus threatening their chokehold on operating systems, internet browsers, etc...
Even Bill Gates himself hinted this once. Asked what he'd like to do if he didn't run Microsoft, he said something like "I'll get into a $100 million dollar business that Microsoft isn't interested in". He's basically warning people not to step on his company's toes. Because once you do, they'll move in for the kill.
Remember a few years ago? Microsoft wasn't even interested in doing a video game console... and now suddenly here they are... Doesn't it surprise you that now they're into video game systems?
It's the same game with Netscape back in '96. At some lecture over at MIT he mentioned that Netscape was fast becoming a threat to Microsoft because at the time, Netscape commanded something like 96% of the browser market. And he predicted that they'll start adding "operating system" features into the browser bit by bit, until the day comes when Windows was no longer needed.
Look at Java. Same story. Operating-system-independent programming language? "I don't think so", whines Microshaft. Hmmm... let's kill it by first messing with the language itself by introducing our own "dirty" version of it, J++. And then let's make IE5+ NOT install the Java Virtual Machine by default... And then let's promote and install Macromedia's Flash onto all of our browsers so we encourage the market to use Flash instead of Java to do their "cute little" animations and other client-side stuff... A few years later? It worked. When was the last time you saw a java applet? And when you did, what happened to your browser? Did it not freeze up for like 20 seconds and piss you off?
Sad, but Microsoft indeed does deserve to be broken up.
You're kidding right? I'm sure I'm not the first to point this out, but the court action against Galoob was taken out by both Nintendo and SEGA. Sony haven't been out of the press much in the last year, what with the Apple Mac Sony PlayStation emulator and the PCs bleem! emu. How about Atari's arogance towards everyone else ("no you can't develop for our system, only Atari can" - where do you think Activision came from?) No, Nintendo aren't perfect, but understand they are out to protect their IP, as any company would - sometimes they do stupid things, but after weighing everything up, they still make some of the best videogames.
No, they are a market.
See now THAT is funny.
The DVD playback was never buggy on PS2...they just added a couple of features (zoom,slomo). You kiss your momma with that mouth?
Gee, I wonder if the fact that zdnet is in Gates' back pocket has anything to do with that, hmm...
I'm looking for information on tech company ethics and I haven't come across any on game consoles yet.
Hotmail does suck ass now, but remove that to email...
The screenshots server is slashdotted at 0020 EST.
Now, when can we rip it apart and make something useful out of the components? Would it be worth buying it just because of the PC hardware inside?
"NOT EVERYTHING MICROSOFT MAKES IS JUNK"
:)
You're right, my Intellimouse works great in GNOME.
--
I don't understand what youre saying...
I'm not bashing MS. I use the imps2 driver, and it really does work great, i use the wheel and everything.
--
Now all we need is for someone to hack it and boot NetBSD on it. heh
--------
It's an x86 with a hard drive and a video card, isn't it?
"Ancillary does not mean you get to rule the world." --U.S. Circuit Judge Harry Edwards, speaking to the FCC's lawyer
Here's a nice little story on Gamasutra about how the spec for the X-Box has changed over time.
- Check out the difference in the polygon counts and having to fork out more cash just for a remote to play DVDs.
Go to your local PC shop, buy a USE keyboard and plug it in. It should just work, you then have to figure out how to map the keyboard buttons as to what they were on the controller which shouldnt be hard.
why should there be!
>>I will stick to my CPU. I can do more and play more than any console. I really think that gaming is best on the >>desktop but then again, I like my dual heads and my keyboard and my multitasking... That is just me. My CPU kinda sucks for gaming--it just sits there. Once I tried to use it as a checker piece, but it didn't really fit into the squares very well. I suppose you could probably run a pool around the office about how long it takes to fry an egg or something. Once I put it back in my computer, it was OK, but too far away from the couch.
/* This post not warrantied for mission critical applications. */
Why did the other guy that posted this link earlier only get modded up to two? (comment #38)
What's this Submit thingy do?
While I'm essentially too young to remember Nintendo's jerk-like attitude, I will mention what I think of shows like Dateline and 20/20...
They're sensationalistic crap.
Again, I'm no expert, but just the smug look on one of the anchors of Datline was enough to make me think twice about taking the show seriously.
I don't know what Oprah is like; I never saw it. She may or may not be just as sensationalistic as all the others.
I don't know if M$ makes any assumptions about its audience's intelligence, but those other practices sound kind of familiar....
What's this Submit thingy do?
Another Microsoft Failure
ummmmmmm you might not like Microsoft but they don't really fail too much. Especially when you consider that they have 98% of desktop OS share.
The surest way to make a monkey of a man is to quote him. --Robert Benchley
I have been following the development of this XboX crap from microsoft. This isnt flame bait or anything like that.
All this thing is:
- intel p3 cpu
- rambus RDRAM
-nvidia integrated chipset:
"3d" sound
2d and 3d video
network
memory controller
What is so funny about the nvidia part is this. They will be releasing the same thing to the general public as a north and south bridge for intel and amd platforms! Whats more interesting is that this "next generation nvidia chip" is nothing more than what will be in my AGP slot a few months from now. There really isnt anything special about this box except it is proprietary, small, and will cost you a little less than my entire system. But then again, it can do a whole lot less than my entire system.
Two infinite things: your stupidity and mine. But I'm not sure about the latter. If my sig offends you, I'm sorry.
Price?? Anyone seen anything about price? My guess is that this bugger is pushing $600...and, like the Jaguar, it may price itself out of the market, even though it is the "best hardware" out there.
I'm not supporting Microsoft in anyway, nor am I bashing Nintendo, so don't take it as such.
But, when you say "The controller design is very innovative. It feels very good in your hands but is extremely intuitive and usable." Have you actually had the controller in your hands? As far as I know, Nintendo has said "look, don't touch". On the point of innovation, I personally think the thing looks like an ass-backwards Playstation controller.
I do agree with you about the stupid green logo space on the X-Box controller, though.
Huh? Sports tend to involve far more socialization (not all of it good, mind you) than games, and develop gross-body coordination and fitness.
The idea that the adults should blatantly pander to the game consoles by "hanging around" their kids in a desperate attempt at togetherness is ridiculous. It seem to stem from a peculiar, very American idea that if kids want to spend endless amounts of time on the Playstation or in front of the TV, there's nothing that can or should be done to stop them.
That being said, I don't think that the realism of the X-box is going to make any difference. Games have reached the level of sophistication that you can play them for hours - they did that a long time ago for most people. Hell, I wasted long, long hours on Elite on the C-64.
Not to defend Microsoft (I don't think they even need to get into this industry), but there are still plenty of other consolse out there, and one more won't do much more harm.
Don't be so worried that kids are spending so much time playing games, they could be doing plenty of other things that would take away from family time such as sports, and whatnot. Sure, sports may sound better than games, but they're all just hobbies and if the kids like games, it's good they've found something they like. Adults are much more flexible than children, so maybe if the parrents spend time with the kids while they play the games, it would help.
From what I know of the English language the ex- prefex is used to mean, no longer, such as ex-wife. Now with the title X-box, sould it not be nolonger a box. If they did what to keep it square the could have called it X-ball, or X-pipe, X-teapot (just to reach out to all those 3dsMax users). And the green ball thing, what a waste of space on a controler. It would be great if the put it in as trackball, so you could use it as a mouse, because it just looks like it ads mass and cost. Plus is the design not copyrighted by Dreamcast or any other controller they ripped off. I may buy it still, I did the same thing with Ps2, cut it up, called it crap, but now i am loving ever minute of it(except for loading times).
Come on! This is a choice find! It's only worth 2 f*****g points?
I would think that the 8 gig harddrive *is* for holding that piece of shit OS called windows. I don't think it would be that hard to take out the harddrive, format it with ext2 and stick linux on it. I am guessing that it will probably be incased in something to make this difficult, if not impossible without breaking the xbox
LOL! Thanks, I will.
See you in hell,
Bill Fuckin' Gates®.
See you in hell,
Bill Fuckin' Gates®.
(This post is ©2001 Microsoft(TM) Corporation.)
The plight of the GNU/Linux user is tragic, and unfortunately increasingly common. After the user is able to trick himself into believing that the UNIX-wannabe is actually well-built and useful, he begins a downward spiral which leads to isolation ("Let's not invite Linus to the movies... he's probably too busy playing with his Linux machine to care."), unemployment ("We're sorry, Mr. Cox, but we just don't have a need for so-called 'experts' in UNIX clones. We're doing just fine with our Dell workstations and IBM servers. Maybe you should take some MCSE courses?"), and eventually, death.
If you know a Linux user, you can help. Purchase a copy of Windows Me (the one-stop solution for the home desktop user) or Windows 2000 Professional (the e-business platform of the new millennium) and ship it to them immediately. While you're at it, why not buy a copy for yourself, too?
Buy a Linux user a copy of Windows today. Because if you don't help them, who will?
See you in hell,
Bill Fuckin' Gates®.
See you in hell,
Bill Fuckin' Gates®.
(This post is ©2001 Microsoft(TM) Corporation.)
I made a clay mockup from the photos (and from some measurments) that Nintendo provided. So, techniclly, no, I have held the controller, but I have held a scale mockup of it.
This is totally screwed up. Much of the space on the controller is wasted by the translucent green "Xbox" logo. They could make the controller much more useful by removing it.
Also, how are they going to make money on this? PC motherboards and Pentium III's aren't cheap. I know that they can lose an amout of money on the hardware and make it up with the software (like the PS2), but selling a system which costs $600 for $300 - a net los of $300, means that they have to sell at least six games per system to even break even.
I, however, am looking forward to to the NINTENDO GAMECUBE (all upper case is the Nintendo-approved way to write it). The controller design is very innovative. It feels very good in your hands but is extremely intuitive and usable. GAMECUBE is powered by a 405MHZ IBM "Gekko" CPU (the Gekko is a PowerPC plus special instrucions for gaming). It has a cool ATI graphics chip which can apply up to 8 effects per pass (alpha, mip-mapping, texturing, bumpmapping, lighting, triliner filtering, etc.). While the XBox is a black box, the GAMECUBE is a small box (
My point is, that the XBOX's design is very disappointing. It's a black box. The controller is nonreviloutinary. It's a stinking black box with a 100baseT port on the back.
This is like other Microsoft hardware - "thuroughlly disappointing".
What is with that video? Those kids look as if they were forced to play it. Then all of a sudden the tv sound is off and Microsoft amplifys the sound of the kid pressing the buttons.. With videos like that, and the other ones on that site, you know for sure the console market is becoming over saturated
from the article:
Xbox designers even toured 130 of these gamers' homes to see how and where they played games
He also visited shops where gamers hang out or buy consoles and games to "absorb the culture, see what they see every day," Luke explained
"Visiting gamers in their homes helped put us in their shoes," Luke explained. "We are designing on their behalf."
So now gamers are a culture?
OK I know there is the image of only 16 year old pimply face nerds liking these games, but its not true. Parents play these games, even grandparents, so how did the determine the typical gamer??
Nevermind all the new whizbang features and those pretty graphics. That doesn't impress me. The part that impresses me is that they've managed to make the thing so damn small. Back when I was a kid in the thirties, trains were still steam-powered for the most part. When I got started with IBM in the early fifties, those machines were enormous: an entire room, sometimes two, just for a single computer with only a few hundered transistors, each individually programmable and each the size of, well, I can't remember what but they were big. You had to hire water buffalo to wade in your kiddy pool and splash water on them to keep them cool, if I recall correctly, which I probably don't. Or do I? I can't remember.
Even Microsoft made it small. That says a lot, since they're the experts in making stuff bloated. Or, how can I put it a different way. Microsoft's X-box is to Bill Gates what Eisenhower's tax cuts were to Eisenhower: they should've been huge, but in the end, they were the tiny little buggers, even too tiny. Wow, that really brings back the memories. I think.
Read the rest of this comment...
My Logitech wireless mouse is great. In the 6 months I have had it I haven't had to change the batteries. And thats with heavy use. It is really nice not tugging on the mouse chord all the time. You should give wireless an open minded try yourself and see if you like it. I did, and I didn't look back.
I killed 3 men and 2 cats to get this sig?
and I refuse to anything from Microsoft, ever again. EVER.
P2P Anonymous Distributed Web Search: http://www.yacy.net/
If Microsoft starts seeing you move into their turf, they get scared. When they're scared they'll either buy you out or kill you by competing against you.
Time and time again they've done this... Netscape, Java, Novell, and now... Dreamcast/PS2.
It's like this. When they start seeing network adapters in these consoles, Microsoft start to imagine a day when these video game consoles slowly morph into set-top boxes... and then into personal pc's. This is what they're most afraid of... That these video game systems pushing their way into the consumer pc area, thus threatening their chokehold on operating systems, internet browsers, etc...
Even Bill Gates himself hinted this once. Asked what he'd like to do if he didn't run Microsoft, he said something like "I'll get into a $100 million dollar business that Microsoft isn't interested in". He's basically warning people not to step on his company's toes. Because once you do, they'll move in for the kill.
Remember a few years ago? Microsoft wasn't even interested in doing a video game console... and now suddenly here they are... Doesn't it surprise you that now they're into video game systems?
It's the same game with Netscape back in '96. At some lecture over at MIT he mentioned that Netscape was fast becoming a threat to Microsoft because at the time, Netscape commanded something like 96% of the browser market. And he predicted that they'll start adding "operating system" features into the browser bit by bit, until the day comes when Windows was no longer needed.
Look at Java. Same story. Operating-system-independent programming language? "I don't think so", whines Microshaft. Hmmm... let's kill it by first messing with the language itself by introducing our own "dirty" version of it, J++. And then let's make IE5+ NOT install the Java Virtual Machine by default... And then let's promote and install Macromedia's Flash onto all of our browsers so we encourage the market to use Flash instead of Java to do their "cute little" animations and other client-side stuff... A few years later? It worked. When was the last time you saw a java applet? And when you did, what happened to your browser? Did it not freeze up for like 20 seconds and piss you off?
Sad, but Microsoft indeed does deserve to be broken up.
P2P Anonymous Distributed Web Search: http://www.yacy.net/
Can't wait to play it!
There was a kuro5hin feature on multi-player games at parties and whether it was a Good Thing.
-- Eat your greens or I'll hit you!
-- Eat your greens or I'll hit you!
-- Eat your greens or I'll hit you!
-- Eat your greens or I'll hit you!
(in a neo-christian all gods are the same lets talk about our feelings kinda way)
-- Eat your greens or I'll hit you!
-- Eat your greens or I'll hit you!
Its all about marketing....see for yourself
click here for a Xbox demo (playable!)
If I were a console manufacturer, I would not want the hassle of dealing with all the emails and phone calls wondering why this PC game controller won't work properly with my console.
So, in actuality, this is about standards. Standards for the MS Xbox, which need I remind you is not a PC.
It is under no obligation (nor would it be easy or wise) to try to comlpy with standards for PCs simply because it uses some stock PC parts.
Why aren't you complaining that you can't use your ThrustMaster FCS on your Platstation? Maybe it's because the Playstation isn't a PC either. But I don't see near as many people on slashdot bashing the PS. Maybe because the PS isn't MS.
I like what I see so far from the Xbox. Despite the fact that it has M$ all over it, I believe it will be a fine peice of hardware with the games to back it up. I am looking forward to it. Above all I read facts when I have time to, and use general common sense, so I can differentiate the anti-M$ hype from what is real.
Whaaaa..... More MS bashing?
Both the Dreamcast and the Playstation 2 have cooling fans, but where's the hate for them?
What a Crock!
Stop bashing this thing simply because it's MS. Look at it for what it is supposed to be (according to the specs) A damn fine gaming platform!
Besides, whith the empasis they are adding to sound performance, I'll have that Dolby 5.1 cranked so loud I won't even be able to hear the phone, much less a fucking fan! BTFW.. My Tivo has a Fan and HDD and is not noticeable. Maybe because it runs Linux it's not such a crock.
your really reaching here
Please explain this comment. USB devices just don't magically work you know. There must be software to make the device work. I can plug my Wingman Force into my moms PC, but it isn't gonna work without the drivers.
Using a non standard form of USB is a really smart thing for MS to do. Not so they can protect their bottom line, but so when some guy like you comes along and tries to plug his frickin' scanner or Wingman Force in there, they don't get calls asking "Whaaaa.... Why won't it work? Whaaaaa".
Noone has ever said that MS is going to be the only ones making hardware for this thing. I would wager that if you had the right license, you to could design and sell hardware for the Xbox, but it will be Xbox hardware, not PC hardware.
So all you guys should (read please) stop whining about them not adhering to PC standards. It is not a PC, it is the Xbox. It is ruled by Xbox standards the same as the PS is governed by PS standards and the CD is... etc...
Also, the HD won't necessarily be used just as cache, I suspect they'll also use it to save games.
You will also be able to DL game demos from the net with that high-speed low-drag Fast ethernet connection and play them from the HDD. Frickin' cooooooool!
To put it briefly, I'm complaining because Gates is trying to ingratiate himself to people who like standards by touting USB compatability while at the same time keying it to the X-Box so people have to buy new equipment. Microsoft is trying to give with one hand and take with the other.
/. I really don't think that Gates is trying to do what you claim in your first paragraph.
Every peice of official MS Xbox documentation that I have seen Refers to "modified USB" when refering to the controller interface. I just don't see how this is so misleading. To me, modified in this sense is synonymous with Non-Standard.
There could be several reasons for this, all of which have been discussed in detail right here on
Playstations and Dreamcasts make no claim to support standards......
Neither does the Xbox, since the available official MS documentation clearly states that it uses a modified version of USB.
hehehehehehe....
long cord.. why even bother? I don't want a cord, he talked to the wrong people.
I see, you just want to buy a fresh set of AA batteries for each of your four radio-enabled controllers every two months. Me, I prefer to flush my money down the toilet.
the DVD is a moot point, I don't care what medium they use it is of no consequence to me... The damn games better load fast. I would rather a cartridge (no scratches).
Making cartridges is way too expensive, especially if you want to allow game designers to actually produce something cool (i.e. big textures, movies, etc) The age of Nintendo using tiny texture maps and crazy compression hacks is over - the challenge nowadays is making a good game, not making a game work. Multi-gigabyte games are financially impossible with cartridges.
the Intel processor is great but it is going to cause everyone to say things like "let's hack it"
I've been to a talk by J Allard (the head xbox guy), he claims that the system would only run Microsoft-signed data on DVD-9 media, making it pretty damn difficult to hack it. He offered a job to anyone who could boot linux on it :) Regardless, I don't think we'll see anything of interest hacked onto the console; after all, what would it bring? crappy games made by 14 year olds? I can get plenty of those for my PC already...
I assume you mean wireless controllers? No thank you. I've already paid $XXX for the console and $XX for games -- I don't want a recurring cost as well for batteries. (Rechargable you say? Okay, the console better come with recharable batteries AND a charger -- again, I've already paid $XXX...)
Nor have I ever been impressed with the performance of wireless controllers. Bleargh!
If you WANT wireless, buy them as accessories.
Potato chips are a by-yourself food.
Wow that's even more stupid than I expected. I cannot think of a single advantage to a USB port with a non-standard physical connector. I guess they don't wan't people making a knock-off Xbaux? But some Taiwanese company will start making USBXbox physical adapters for $0.85, and whatever reason they could possibly have had for using non-standard connectors will be moot.
I think the hard drive in this console is a really truly bad idea. After that box gets yanked off the top of the TV once or forty times, the hard drive is going to stop working. These boxes aren't targetted at the same people who buy laptop computers, and they shouldn't be built like laptop computers.
long cord.. why even bother? I don't want a cord, he talked to the wrong people. I want to sit where ever I am and be free (and not have people tripping over the damn wire, or the dog pulling it out in the middle of a 1 hour GT2 endurance race).
.02
the box is meant to bring about feelings of the loudest stereo you ever could imagine? It looks like the N64 or any other console ever made. It makes me think of a console, not a stereo.
the DVD is a moot point, I don't care what medium they use it is of no consequence to me... The damn games better load fast. I would rather a cartridge (no scratches).
the Intel processor is great but it is going to cause everyone to say things like "let's hack it" "how many is Saadam going to buy" and "what about
a beowulf cluster of these". I want something original!
I will stick to my CPU. I can do more and play more than any console. I really think that gaming is best on the desktop but then again, I like my dual heads and my keyboard and my multitasking... That is just me.
Just my worthless
But, yeah - my TiVo has been running its hard drive 24/7 for about as long as they've been available on the market (a year and a half?) without any definitively drive-related problems. (I've recently started to run into occasional freezes or heavy artifacting that could be from drive read errors, but I haven't tried to verify the cause. I just know that if I back up and watch the same bit again, it's fine the second time around.)
They should have played wrestling legend Fred Blassie's classic record, Pencil Neck Geek, in the background.
Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
Isn't that what they said to Jesus? Incredible...
Some people never learn.
Wow can that guy not grab a room, even when he has worthy hardware.
Watching Gates try to sell the X-Box reminds me of going to Frys and having people tell me why Windows ME is the best OS.
Kevin Fox
Kevin Fox
Sony PS2 doesn't have a hard drive in it.
There is an expansion unit comming in the future though.
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Would you like a Python based alternative to PHP/ASP/JSP?
IBM and others are proposing a new USB connector for Point of Sale equipment that will support +12V and +24 Volts as well as the standard stuff.
Too bad google isn't helping me find a link.
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Nicotine free Amish .sig.
This link has a video link for X-Box (Broadband Report; 3/4th in the video clip).
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
I'm not concerced about the hard drive impacting reliability, either. I've had Tivo for quite some time, it records a few hours of stuff every day and plays back one or two, and very few people have reported problems.
The fact is, MS makes good hardware, and this will quite possibly demonstrate that again.
Also, the HD won't necessarily be used just as cache, I suspect they'll also use it to save games.
I think you merely failed to grasp the excellent game design that went into many C64 games. Perhaps you prefer eye candy over content.
I, for one, spent a ton of time gaming on my C64. If it wasn't Gunship, Archon or some RPG, I was online with Q-Link playing chess. I play tons of chess online, but no experience, be it ICC or Yahoo, or Chessmaster matches the intimate chess community on Q-Link. Of course, this was until the night they shut it down without warning to use the hardware to start something called America Online.
The fact is, people have been babbling with the same complaints when radio came along, then TV, then arcade and computer games, and most recently, the internet. It is a parent's job to regulate what their kids do, not a corporation's job to limit children's options.
Gamespot by far has the best coverage of this thing. They even got to play with it, more then gamecenter or the register can say, for the moment.
_____________________________
The sun beams down on a brand new day, No more welfare tax to pay, Unsightly slums gone up in flashing light...
Umm, yes, hard drive capacity is definitely going to be needed, and lots of it. I don't think, like someone above mentioned, that games themselves are going to get installed to the drive like current Windows games are--I think just basic config info and saved games are going to be put on the hard disk, and the games themselves will be run from the game CDs and DVDs.
.NET service which will include running word processing and other apps. Don't underestimate the role of the Xbox in .NET--MS is secretly hoping to replace the PC with something they own, which won't run anyone else's software unless it's licensed, and which will require an eternal service contract with the .NET service in order to keep using apps. MS is clever. There's a damn fine reason MS is making this thing over-powered just for console gaming. It's a new type of MS-controlled PC.
Why do I think this? Because if the games installed much to the 8GB drive, it'd be eaten up very quickly and people would have to uninstall stuff and reinstall it a lot. Gamers, esp. kids, won't want to do this. I mean, have you installed a recent title lately? I just installed American McGee's Alice, and the install took 525MB of my hard drive space. Only ~15 games could be installed at a time if the install were anything like current Windows games, which is why I say the games will be run from the media and only install basic config info and use the HD for saved games.
Now, this still takes a large amount of HD space, since MS doesn't want users to have to worry about uninstalling things from something as simple to use as a set-top game console. Consoles are supposed to be truly "plug-and-play," with no configuration needed beyond inserting a game and choosing easily understood game settings. And I say a large HD is necessary because new games will have to use more and more space for saved game data. My new American McGee's Alice install I mentioned--well, I have only 3 saved games, and they take up almost 8MB of disk space. The more complex maps and character placements and options get, the more space needed to save a game to disk. Hence, an 8GB hard drive just for saved games and a few config options is NOT overkill. In fact, I guarantee that HD upgrades will be available.
Also, the Xbox isn't just for gaming. It'll have internet access, and presumably a special MSN/WebTV type of service. As such, a hard drive will also store web cache and probably allow saving of downloaded material. MS isn't stupid. They aren't using a 733MHz Intel CPU just for its gaming potential. The Xbox will be Microsoft's proprietary replacement for the PC. People will be able to get a subscription to the
"The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws."--Tacitus, *The Annals*
"Gamers are going to know right when they see this console and controller what to expect when they turn on the Xbox," Luke said recently. "They are going to know they are playing on a system that offers more power and new, unforeseen gaming experiences than they've ever seen on a home console."
The power Luke speaks of is easily evident in the raised ribs that run across the rich, black exterior of the console,
By that logic, I can speed up my computer by putting racing stripes on it...
--
As for MS "redesigning" the USB port - while initially it sounds like an assinine thing to do, it actually does make sense (at least to me). Otherwise, folks are going to see the port and try plugging in all sorts of USB device, and become quite confused and frustrated when nothing happens.
I agree with most of you comment, except for that bit which sounds like you've been listening to a bit too much MS marketing. If they're making this box for the "average consumer", that sort of person isn't going to be closely examining the port and thinking about what they can put in it. When's the last time your mom looked at the S-video port on your VCR and the PS/2 port on the back of your computer and double-checked to make sure they were different? Probably never.
The real reason to change the port is to ensure that hardware manufacturers tailor their hardware at least a little to the X-Box. You could still say this is a good reason-- perhaps they won't try to pitch some PC joysticks that are totally unfit for XBox games as "XBox compatible". Whether that reasoning played more of a factor than straight up marketing is quite debatable.
The X-Box's design is what the PlayStation 2 should have been.
I like the design of the X-Box and the GameCube. They look like neat little gaming boxes.
The PlayStation 2 looks like it should be mounted in a rack, not sitting on my living room floor or sitting with the other components.
Refrag
I have a website. It's about Macs.
Plus, the standard USB connector would allow the controller to become disconnected too easily.
Refrag
I have a website. It's about Macs.
Well, it gave me a bit of a giggle anyway.
Warning: X Box does NOT run X
;-)
Yet.
That's a lot closer to the Rock than the first post.
- I don't care if they globalize against free speech. All my best free thoughts are done in my head.
Man their propaganda reads funny, this was my favorite excerpt:
"The power Luke speaks of is easily evident in the raised ribs that run across the rich, black exterior of the console, giving it the look of a supercharged car stereo amplifier."
Yes the Xbox, with plush corinthian leather...
Man they are just sooo lame
To make even more of an impact, Gates called on the incredibly popular WWF wrestler, The Rock to help him unveil the uber-machine. :-)
Now call me a troll if you must, but why did this make me line laugh so much.
The Rock: I will pummel you Gates!!
Gates: No wait, we are presenting my new machine.
The Rock:Oh yeah, you're right. Well buy this box kids, you know Gates kicks ass. We are the new tag team ready to take on everybody. grr
Gates: Yes we are really cool dudes, I am really in to that WWWF(v4.0) think too.
The Rock: Let's get in the ring, put on your tights, Gates, grr
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An NVIDIA graphics processing unit (GPU)
An Intel 733MHz processor
An 8GB hard drive
OK, Sounds like a PC (easy hack). What I want is a reverse hack, taking the software (even the crappy MS OS out of this, and putting it on my PC (that's already faster than this thing!). Why do I need to buy all the same crap again???
-Spack
The xbox has 64 megs of ram. How is microsoft code supposed to run on it?
Whether it's a "PC" or a "game console" doesn't make a difference. It's still a cheap plastic box that has some cheap and mediocre hardware in it. It's a box that lets you play finger twitching games. Now, there is nothing wrong with that--lots of consumer devices like that are lots of fun. But terms like "it will rock" or "powerful" are misplaced, and don't let some glitzy PR campaign fool you about that.
If you want the real thing, get the real thing. Go to the gym, climb mountains, ride a motorcycle, or fly an airplane. If you want a powerful computer, get a 256 node Beowulf cluster and find something real to do with it. Computer games are fun and entertaining, and even challenging in their own right, but don't let some marketer confuse you about whether they are the real-world thing or not.
Why is it assumed that every product to come from Microsoft is so awful? Microsoft may produce closed-source software, they're evil, blah blah blah, etc., but I still haven't seen a web-browser that works in linux that is as fast as Internet Explorer! I think we should face the fact that NOT EVERYTHING MICROSOFT MAKES IS JUNK. This could actually turn out to be a good system . . . who knows . . . we'll have to wait until we can ACTUALLY USE it before we decide it's a heap of junk . . .
It'll get hacked. Console games depend on licensees paying to use the platform. But if gamers can hook it up to the net and download free games, then the value to the licensees plummets. And so the licensees migrate to other (closed) platforms.
I have been unable to find official XBox dimensions anywhere, but if the DVD drive is a standard 135mm drive then using ign.com's photos you can approximate the dimensions as follows:
Height ~ 86 mm
Width ~ 334 mm (Front face)
Length ~ 274 mm (Side length)
This makes the XBox the biggest console of 'em all. By volume:
GAMECUBE:2,656,500 (mm^3)
Dreamcast:2,889,900 (mm^3)
PS2: 4,179,084 (mm^3)
XBox:7,687,344 (mm^3)
It's a behemoth!
I remember being shocked 6 months ago when I visited my brother, to find that his kids were using their playstation to play "Spyro the Dragon" all the time! I mean, they hardly spent any time at all with their family!
I think that the X-Box will likely be even more addictive, and will offer internet gaming, so I have already cautioned my brother about the 'next generation consoles'. I just think that children should have more of a childhood, and not waste it in the sort of digital oblivion that M$ profit from.
But then, maybe if *I* got addicted I wouldn't be so wary, hehe ;)
--Anticipation of a New Lover's Arrival, The
How long after the Xbox is released will it be running a .NET client?
Something to think about -- Microsoft has the cash on hand to take a bath on the console sales (think $150-$250), which prices it below the PS2 (its nearest competitor). I remember reading (somewhere) that there was a PSX in 3 out of 4 homes in the USA. Imagine that kind of saturation with the Xbox.
Now, think of .NET running on the Xbox. Suddenly, all these el-cheapo consoles are full-bore computers with MSN satellite or DSL broadband connections with MSN email addresses, MSN Instant Messenger and MSNBC running in a window in the corner while you're using MSPhonePad to dial up your friend to arrange a network game of MS FlightSim...
Hrmm... suddenly MSFT at 49 11/16 is pretty darn cheap, DOJ or no DOJ.
Potato chips are a by-yourself food.
Actually, one thing a LOT of Xbox detractors totally miss the point is the fact that anyone who knows how to write a DirectX-compatible game for the Windows 9x/ME/2000 platform is ready to write a game for Xbox.
People forget that many of the best PlayStation games also run on the PC platform: Madden NFL 2001, NHL Faceoff 2001, even Final Fantasy VII and VIII! And the graphics when running on the PC platform is flat-out great if you have the right graphics card.
Also, Microsoft has sent out thousands of Xbox developer kits already around the world, with most of the world's best-known game publishers already writing Xbox games (including a LONG list of Japanese companies). The only company I know o that is not writing for Xbox is Square, but I think they'll be on the bandwagon within a few month themselves.
And UNLIKE Sony, Microsoft is using as many easily-available components as possible. This will ensure that Microsoft will have massive supplies of Xbox consoles available worldwide by the time the machine ships around early October 2001.
In short, Sony's inability to ship enough PlayStation 2 units to meet worldwide demand will play right into Microsoft's hands.
Raymond in Mountain View, CA
Why aren't you complaining that you can't use your ThrustMaster FCS on your Platstation? Maybe it's because the Playstation isn't a PC either. But I don't see near as many people on slashdot bashing the PS. Maybe because the PS isn't MS.
To put it briefly, I'm complaining because Gates is trying to ingratiate himself to people who like standards by touting USB compatability while at the same time keying it to the X-Box so people have to buy new equipment. Microsoft is trying to give with one hand and take with the other.
Playstations and Dreamcasts make no claim to support standards so I don't berate them for doing so in the wrong way.
Kevin Fox
Kevin Fox
Gates: "The controllers use USB, but it's a different kind of port. Still you'll be amazed with the kinds of controllers that will come out for it."
Yay standards!
Kevin Fox
Kevin Fox
Seriously..I feel like I am getting a console stamped with Charles Xavier's signature!
Cyclops says, "I have had my eye on this one for a long time!"
Storm says, "A man without an Xbox will never get a blow from me!"
-- Who is the bigger fool? The fool or the fool who follows him? --
http://www.htloz.com/xbox_gamecube/XBOXMACHINE.htm l
The Register, UK published some secret specs on the XBox on Thursday.
Mmmm.. Donuts
>> The controller design is very innovative. It feels very good in your hands but is extremely intuitive and usable
From what I've read, "No one knows how confusing GameCube may be to operate, however, as Nintendo has not allowed outsiders to touch it."
The XBox joypad looks pretty comfortable. According to people who actually handled it at the CES, it is supposedly VERY comfortable. Have you touched the controller yet? I don't think so, yet you even claim the NGC has a better controller, when nobody in the industry is allowed to hold one yet!
Speaking of Nintendo, I hope and PRAY Nintendo NEVER EVER regains any status near it's old NES/SNES days. Do you actually remember those days? Nintendo was comprised of the biggest group of bastards ever.
Lemme remind you of some things Nintendo did (move over MS!)
1) Remember the artifical shortages for video games... like the time Zelda 2 came out, and 20/20 even ran a 30 minute special on the limited quantity and ended up finding a WAREHOUSE FULL OF THEM!
2) Remember how Nintendo reacted to developer demand to making the N64 CD-based? They ignored them, (which means they lost most of them, including SQUARE!!!) and created a cartridge based system. Why? Because they control the cost and licensing of the cartridges, which is why even today "classic" N64 games cost $39.95.
3) Nintendo of America ALWAYS believed their audience was dumber, and inferior to their japanese market. I can sight NUMEROUS examples, including the censored FFIII (FF4 in Japan) that made it to America with many missing plot elements becasue they believed "American culture can't handle them." Oh, and there was also the dumbed-down version of FFV. At least Sony has never dumbed/censored the FF series (they even synced the numbering with the japanese system.) Oh, and the Japanese version of Super Mario 2 didn't make it to american shores until 7 years later (for the SNES) because they felt Americans wouldn't be able to handle so difficult a game.
4) Nintendo forces companies to get their products authorized for their machines. Remember when Galoob got sued for the Game Genie by Nintendo, and the judge stayed sales so people had to import it from Canada? No OTHER console company has ever sued a product... oh and then Nintendo also sued (and failed at it) TenGen for created "unauthorized" games. So essentially they designed new NESes that stopped them from working!
I can go on and on and on over Nintendo's ridiculous stances. You think MS with a monopoly is bad? You obviously don't remember Nintendo.
-Nick
Be forewarned - this is a long and very XBox friendly rant, going over many of the comments that I've seen posted that have forced me out of my lurker status for a 2nd time. I give this warning because, though I believe I have made rational, unbiased comments, my post does not include the normal slashdot "Yeah Linux, Boo M$" rhetoric most seem accustom to. Here goes...
:)
:)
The hard drive isn't for MS to store an OS. Or patches. Or ANY of that crap. MS doesn't need to patch the OS. EVER. A copy of the OS is included with every game, tailored to the game (like it should be). This allows MS and developers to do whatever they want with the underlying OS, and not worry about breaking anyone else's code. But if the hard drive isn't in their for the MS, why on earth is it in there? Could it be... for the DEVELOPER? <sarcasm> Wow, what a STRANGE and MYSTICAL idea! A part in the gaming console is actually meant to be used for the gaming console! </sarcasm> I, personally, am THRILLED at this inclusion - now it's possible to cache stuff to a hard drive instead of hitting the DVD, making it SO much simpler and down-right faster to handle gameplay that requires more then what 64 megs'o'ram can hold. And, just to make sure it's mentioned, the OS DOES NOT support virtual memory - the app's get to manage the space for themselves. Why an 8 gig drive? Well, as of this point in time, 8 gig drives are the cheapest, readily available drives that are produced in quantity.
As for the hard drive complaints concerning uptime - I shared them for quite some time... till someone pointed out that the DVD-drive is expected to be the *real* uptime problem. And how many here complained about the PS2 including a DVD drive? Personally, I think a tray-loaded console is just ASKING to be broken...
Also, to respond to the (rather childish) posts saying that 64 megs couldn't possibly be enough to run an MS OS on. Apparently, the XBox is running a heavily stripped derivation of Win2k. The entire OS fits comfortably in ~500k. So, I *think* 64 megs can handle that.
As for MS "redesigning" the USB port - while initially it sounds like an assinine thing to do, it actually does make sense (at least to me). Otherwise, folks are going to see the port and try plugging in all sorts of USB device, and become quite confused and frustrated when nothing happens. Remember, MS isn't building this thing so we can enjoy hacking it - they're building it for the average consumer. And, since the USB port is such a simple pinout, I really found it hard to swallow that MS is doing this just because they're plain greedy - if a hardware house can't figure it out, they don't deserve to be making hardware!
To the folks who say developers "dont have anything to do with hardware" in response to someone's stable system-configuration comment, what the hell have you been smokin'! Do you know how HARD it is to try and wring all the performance out of a chipset without breaking another?! If hardware differences weren't an issue, cap-bits and vendor extensions wouldn't exist...
Also, to the pundits that cry that this thing is bad because it's a PC, I ask, what the hell is wrong with that?! I *like* my PC - it can runs games very well, thank-you-very-much. And Remember that this is a UNIFIED MEMORY SYSTEM, so... there is no AGP BUS!!! And, the thing is going to be running an NV25. To put this in perspective, the GeForce 2 is an NV15. Consequently, this thing is around 2 generations ahead of what nVidia has available for the desktop. My guess is the NV25 is a performance tuned NV20, based off the existence of the special "Enable NV20 Emulation" option in nVidia's drivers.
Also, from what I've gathered, MS *is* including a VGA port in-the-box, so no special breaker box needed for monitor support.
MS is NOT going to be making money of the machines themselves - they are selling these at a loss, just like every other console (don't know about the Indrema, though - anyone know how much that box is expected to cost?). But, from talking with a fellow involved with the XBox, I found that MS isn't expecting to lose more then $20-$30 per box. And, when asked during a tech-talk what the launch price of this thing is going to be, the MS fellow said "No console has ever successfully launched for more the $299 in the US." MS plans on being successful. You do the math...
I, personally, am looking forward to the XBox.
MS has made the entire API available for me to play with on my own PC. MS has set up a hobbyist program to help people to learn to do stuff for the system. MS has TOLD you what is in the box. MS has even setup an "incubator" program to help small game development startups. I'm sorry, but for all the closed-source M$ bashing, MS has made a system that is a shit-load more open and accessible then Nintendo, Sega, or Sony. MS's willingness to give me all the information I need to work with the hardware is why MS has guaranteed that I'll be buying and learning to develop for this box.
And so ends my long and winding post. But before you replay, I would like to state that I tried to be rational, unbias, and coherent throughout my post. I only ask that you do the same.