Slashdot Mirror
DOJ Already Monitoring Cable Internet Traffic
According to this Wired News article, the Justice Department is already using its new powers under the USA Patriot Act to obtain subscribers' identities and other information from cable operators without judicial oversight under Section 211 of the new legislation. Assistant Attorney General Michael Chertoff also says that the act has allowed police to obtain IP addresses of cable subscribers and has enabled DOJ to obtain court orders for ISP logs outside a court's traditional jurisdiction. The Senate Judiciary Committee has convened hearings to review the impact of the Bush administration's actions on civil liberties, but A.G. Ashcroft is not scheduled to appear until December 6. One wonders what effect the upcoming cable failure will have on government surveilance of the potentially criminal citizenry.
The important, and difficult, job is to fight the temptation to give up, and keep on fighting for our rights.
Nurse! More coffee!
"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." -- Goethe
Is anyone else bothered by the fact that we are losing all of our privacy?
They will find out that there is a lot of porn on cable traffic.
watch me.
I'm moving under my bed, maybe they cant get through my Acronym filter sheet.
Anyone care to join me?
Check out the Register article on anonymizing yourself...
And have your friends use Hushmail.
"Flyin' in just a sweet place,
Never been known to fail..."
The people who don't have Internet connections are surely criminals. They must have something to hide, otherwise they would be gouged with outrageous prices and restrictions in order to be further monitored.
*waves at DOJ*
Everytime you look at porn a devil gets their horns.
Quite a few European countries have had problems with terrorosts for years. The UK with the IRA, the Spanish with the Basque (sp?) seperatists etc etc.
In these countries laws on human rights and free speach prevail. (Albeit precariously sometimes, I admit!)
The US, confronted with some of its first terrorist attacks imediatly goes into panic, ignoring the spirit of its consitution.
I can only hope that over the next few months things will calm down, and the US will realise the importance of human and civil rights laws.
Anyone quoted by a reporter knows how little they understand
Don't believe what you read is the truth.
The fears of the informed seem to have come true. What remains is this question: will the informed be able to get the uninformed interested enough to rise up against this new police state? This is either the start of the real Third Reich (before you hit that flame-bait button, read on) coming to you in 25 years from now, or the last straw to make the people regain civil liberties from Corporatism and mis-guided politicians.
We will need to ring the bell louder, make more people aware. We have the obligation to do so because we know. If you let this go unchallenged, don't come complaining in 25 years time that your children have no rights, no liberties.
Should this sound absurd to you, read into some European history for the years 1900-1939, to read the reasons for WW I, WW II and what happend in the "interbellum". You may very well not like what you find. For WW I a single event was enough to set it off. For WW II the foundation was laid by a repressive reaction 'supported' by the 'people'. 2001-9-11 may very well be the one event, the repression of civil liberties in reaction to it may very well bring it on for real.
Again The waves are eating at the lime-stone, slowly but surely. In the end the rock _will_ fall.
Karma? What's that again?
The silly, and scary, thing about this, is that the worlds population would kick up seven shades of shit if the authorities said "we're opening ALL your post before you receive it AND after you send it, and shove your rights right up your ass" - which is precisely what is happening with our internet data - they are basically opening the envelope and inspecting every packet.
The "powers that be" are meant to be working FOR us are they not? Not being paranoid ABOUT us? Oh sorry, I thought the UK (R.I.P. Bill) and the US (Whatever you lot have got) were "democracies". Seems like the definition of democracy has changed to "you can do whatever you like so long as we know what it is and that it's not harmfull to the "government"...
:(
In my eyes, the local Cable company is worse than our Baby Bell (especially after that NAT bashing article recently). I can choose my local and long distance phone service, I can't choose my Cable TV company. Plus the Cable TV goes largely unregulated. The phone company has a concept of CPE vs. CO, etc. The cable co. regards everything as their network.
Now, if I used a cable modem, I have even less of the microscopic amount of privacy I had before? Great!
Regards
I like teamwork. It's easier to assign blame that way.
This is either the start of the real Third Reich
I thought they now call it the "New World Order"
--jrd
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve your problem, you're not using enough of it. --AC
I have actually asked rooms full of people wether they think, even given the extremly long odds that they would ever be involed in a terror incedent, it is a god idea to give these controls to the goverment and let their rights to privacy, speech and fair trial be vacated. Most of them said yes they would give up a portion of the rights. One I explained to some that giving up these freedoms would only create the illusion of security, but in fact would not make them any more secure a few even said that that was ok too.(I almost started screaming at those folks)
I think it is now starting to get better, but some of it is to late. It is going to be very difficult to take away the powers that have been given to law enforcement.
I honestly don't know what to do about the situation. I try to talk to friends and family about it and even people in grocery store lines and such. But I have to admit I am worried that there is nothing to be done. And I am sadly glad that many Americans are armed and am now a left wing liberal who supports the NRA. Scary.
http://www.counterpunch.org/presspatriot.html
Should be fun to watch. Just make sure to not get caught yourself in the FBI's net.
According to a Wired article and BBC news article I read [see my sig for my opinion of reporters!] This was partly brought about by preasure from Bush. We all know that where ever the US goes, Europe is sure to follow!
impossible to _not_ be recorded by CCTV
Agreed!
Being part of the most watched nation on earth is very bad
Anyone quoted by a reporter knows how little they understand
Don't believe what you read is the truth.
A: Hey check this, that guy finally found some k3w1 p1c5/m0v135 of [whoever], let's add them to our filebase...
B: Oh, he's using a members only site, let's ask his magic lantern for the password... this stuff is REALLY weird, thanx Dubya
I know!
Jack Straw was a wanker.
Fortunately this WILL be overturned by the European courts as it is breach of the human rights act. We are waiting for the first test case.
Anyone quoted by a reporter knows how little they understand
Don't believe what you read is the truth.
I hate to dissapoint you but bridges are quite safe in the US
Between Carnivore, Echelon and now that, I can only think of one thing: should China [replace with your favourite dictatorship] have the money to do it, I'm pretty sure they'd do the same.
If I were a dictator, or planning on becoming one in the near future, I'd watch the USA really closely for practical applications of modern citizen monitoring methods.
What's next? The US selling the technology to other governments? I can imagine the brochure already... "Snoop on all your citizens without moving from your chair" or "Freedom Anihilation for Dummies" sound pretty much like it.
Scary.
/max
-- It's always darker before it goes pitch black.
Better buy your accelerator cards, before they become illegal.
If you're worried that they are going to force you to give up logs outside of the normal court procedures that the constitution has set forth ... then just say, "Screw you!" when they come knocking on the door.
Section 211 doesn't give them the right to gun you down with machine guns and photon torpedos if you don't comply.
So, you might get arrested, but hey, at least you'll go to court!!!!!!!!!
We all know that where ever the US goes, Europe is sure to follow!
That's for sure
And the sad part is that sources of good media coverage like K5 can't even afford to stay up continuously.
Hell yeah.
Bring them slanty bitches over here. I'll kill that tight yellow punanny. I jam it in one inch at a time, till all 12 are buried in that sweet sweet honeypot. Mmm mmm mmm. Finger-fuckin' good.
The sea of red white and blue made me nervous from the start.
How long will it be before every word you type/say/think is neatly stored away for later retrievial. The most of this technology is possible right now, and we can add video later as storage becomes cheaper. The problem I have is that words can so easily be taken out of context, you will need to be lawer in this new world order... don't convey any thoughts against the powers that be or else they will make you love big brother.
great democracy you have over there...
you too?
wow.
what did you expect ?
echo '[q]sa[ln0=aln80~Psnlbx]16isb572CCB9AE9DB03273snlbxq' |dc
The most disturbing suspension of civil liberties is the power the Bush administration has given itself to try suspected terrorists in secret military tribunals - all non-US citizens, even long time residents of the United States, can be tried and sentenced in secret military courts.
0 8_1.html
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/vvny/20011126/lo/301
If you're non-US citizen residing in the United States, you should be extremely worried.
Kuro5hin, uniformity of opinion on politics. Politics for nerds...
The site fucking sucks.
I thought that's what Carnivore, I mean DCS-1000, was for. Didn't it not require a warrant or anything to be issued, therefore, it could be used pretty much at whim?
at least you'll get fucked up the ass by some big brother who wants you to be his bitch!
Quite a few European countries have had problems with terrorosts for years. The UK with the IRA, the Spanish with the Basque (sp?) seperatists etc etc.
In these countries laws on human rights and free speach prevail. (Albeit precariously sometimes, I admit!)
The US, confronted with some of its first terrorist attacks imediatly goes into panic, ignoring the spirit of its consitution.
Not. Jingoistic bunk.
UK Antitterrorism legislation has been around for more than a decade, provoked precisely by the IRA issues. It, too, had sunsetted but repetitively renewed investigatory powers and it, too, treats hackers as terrorists.
It was one of the models from which PATRIOT/USA was cast.
No doubt, the US fell to the standards of its EU allies in adopting PATRIOT/USA, focusing more on getting trains to run on time to defend a nation than to maintain a nation worth defending. No doubt, it was not the American thing to do.
But far from being an icon of liberty, the EU legislation was the harbinger of what happened here.
When the government is sneaky, people learn not to trust the government.
When the government is sneaky, much more is lost than ever can be gained by being sneaky.
Trust is absolutely necessary in a democracy. If we cannot trust our government, we do not really have a democracy.
When a government cannot be trusted, the government becomes a suspect in every major crime.
Governments are not sneaky because sneakiness benefits the government. Governments are sneaky because there are people who like to be sneaky and be paid for it, and they sometimes gain power.
The facts seem to be this: For years the U.S. government acted in an un-trustworthy way toward Arabs. For years some Arabs became mentally unbalanced by this and threatened to retaliate inside the United States.
Now, the U.S. government is using the results of its unwillingness to be trustworthy to justify even more un-trustworthy behavior.
Here are links to respected news sources that show how U.S. government policy contributed to terrorism: What should be the Response to Violence?
Bush's education improvements were
Quite a few European countries have had problems with terrorosts for years. The UK with the IRA, the Spanish with the Basque (sp?) seperatists etc etc.
In these countries laws on human rights and free speach prevail. (Albeit precariously sometimes, I admit!)
The US, confronted with some of its first terrorist attacks imediatly goes into panic, ignoring the spirit of its consitution.
Not. Jingoistic bunk.
UK Antitterrorism legislation has been around for more than a decade, provoked precisely by the IRA issues. It, too, had sunsetted but repetitively renewed investigatory powers and it, too, treats hackers as terrorists.
It was one of the models from which PATRIOT/USA was cast.
No doubt, the US fell to the standards of its EU allies in adopting PATRIOT/USA, focusing more on getting trains to run on time to defend a nation than to maintain a nation worth defending. No doubt, it was not the American thing to do.
But far from being an icon of liberty, the EU legislation was the harbinger of what happened here.
WTF? How is this a troll? The guy is right - all the government wants to do is take more control over people's lives, at the expense of personal freedom.
Common sense is an increasingly rare thing today. You only need to look at unenforcable laws being passed by unaccountable governments to see that we're all headed for serious problems...
If his goal was to destroy the American way of life, there is no doubt he has succeeded. Alas, our conduct in defending this nation has had the effect of making a nation less worthy of defending.
It would be more tolerable if these acts truly were focused in a good faith effort to stop terrorism. They are not -- just a naked broadening of executive and investigatory power, cynically and wrongfully executed simply because the "time was right." The selfishness of corporate "citizens" with their hands out for "patriotic" retroactive tax breaks only adds to the cynicism.
This is just selfishness wrapped up in a flag. It sucks.
Are you guys not just getting excited over sheet all nothing?
So the G can find out who is using cable modem, they can even find your IP?
Goto my website, I can find your IP too...
Oh no, watch out, its the boogy man!
Someday, I'll have a real sig.
Still time to do something about it though. Write (e-mail, letters may take awhile) your Representative and Senators. Get your friends to write. If enough voters object the law will be modified or repealed.
Best Slashdot Co
Sorry to rub it in, but here in the Netherlands I can only laugh about the 'news' CNN is showing 24/7 when it comes to the tragedy of 11th of sept/binladen/afganistan etc. It's from 1 single POV: the patriotic USA-first government. When I compare it to our dutch news-agencies people in the USA miss a hell of a lot of information which is IMHO VITAL for making the right judgement about what's right and what's wrong.
For starters: the secret tribunals where pres. Bush will pick who's on trial and who's not is similar to every 3rd world dictatorship out there, yet I have to see 1 single message from mainstream USA newsstations critizising this IMHO shocking development. Thankfully the EU isn't co-operating with Bush on this: f.e. spain is not handing over al-quaida suspects.
Never underestimate the relief of true separation of Religion and State.
Calm down everyone.
A couple of points:
1. There had to be legislation that dealt with government eavesdropping and the Internet sometime in history regardless of September 11 or not. The ACLU and others will press court cases that arise from abuses from these laws and some of these new powers will be curtailed. It's evolution, it's growing pains. It's law meets new technology and no one gets it perfect the first time around. A lot of people here laugh at the less technophilic portions of our society, the luddites who look at every new innovation with suspicion and distrust. Hey- guess what y'all sound like when it comes to this legislation? Legal luddites, to coin a phrase.
2. The police need to wire tap phones, they need to bounce lasers off glass windows, they need to spy on portions of society to protect us from the bad guys, ok? Yes Virginia, there are bad guys out there and you need some of this legislation to deal with them. That is a perfectly valid impulse. This is not Freemasons in smokey rooms plotting the destruction of your constitutional freedoms just for the fun of it. This is just good people trying to do some good from a bad situation. Imagine that! Of course there will be abuses- haven't there always been!? Have some simple faith please in the maturity of our society: the abuses will be curtailed. There are many ways it can be done. Maybe a future Rodney King of the Internet incident will happen and someone with the net traffic version of a camcorder will capture it all and cause an uproar. Or- brace yourself, a good judge on a bench somewhere will smack down the spooks who get out of line. Or, get this: has anyone here ever heard of the free press? Inconceivable! We're all going to hell in a handbasket... yeah right, give me a break.
3. We are in a very emotional time right now. We are all human, we overreact when someone jumps out from behind a tree at us. We are in knee-jerk reaction territory right now as a society: a nation at peace just had the equivalent of 3 ICBMs launched at it successfully, killing thousands of its citizens and destroying a major landmark, compliments of a bunch of religious fundamentalist lunatics. You can forgive a little backlash. It's been less than 3 months since September 11. Take a deep breath, wait a year, have the press run a few exposes on some rights abuses, and watch how the tide of popular opinion runs then. Forgive the tide of popular opinion at this particular point in time for running into the scary nether regions it seems to be running. Let everyone calm down and contemplate reality with a little distance between themselves and September 11, whenever that may be.
4. This a tempest in a teapot. Think about how much hot air will be wasted over these kinds of net tapping efforts when no one has really stopped to think about what kind of people we are really dealing with. Remember Star Wars of the Reagan era? Remember the missile defense shield of recent history? Billions of dollars spent on orbiting gigawatt lasers, and what the heck did that do? Less than 2 dozen guys board planes with box cutters fer chrissake and a few hours flight training. A lot of good all that tech did, or will do, if these guys ever get their hands on one of those 50 or so nuclear suitcases the Russians seem to have misplaced. And a lot of good all these Echelons and Magic Lanterns will do against the kind of enemy we are dealing with. Do you really wants to fight the Feds on their new net snooping initiatives? Forget about talking about fundamental rights- talk efficacy, talk utility, talk results- the Feds ain't gonna get any hanging around on the net. Tell them to go hang around the box cutter aisle at Home Depot instead if they want to catch terrorists- that is as high tech as the enemy seems to get.
6. And finally, forgive me for spreading some of my own FUD at this moment about nuclear suitcases and such, but there you go: I think that's where the FUD properly belongs. Think about it. These guys really hate us. They want to kill us. All of us. Why are you worried about your government? So blow hours of your life fretting over what your government is doing photographing you when you run a red light on your way to 7-11 at 3 am to buy some Cheetos... Go ahead, drive yourself crazy about the government knowing who everyone is on your AOL buddy list. Is that the real problem? These fruitcakes want to put ricin in your watersupply and smallpox in your local McDonalds. So go ahead, wail and bemoan that the feds can see your pr0n downloads... the terrorists could care less about the Internet and Microsoft versus Linux and the RIAA and your damn TiVo viewing records... the terrorists are over at the local dam, planting dynamite. Sure, this is FUD, but post-September 11, it is rather convincing FUD!
This post about cable Internet traffic tapping has very, very little to do with cyberspace, really... as I said before, if you really want to make a good point about trampling on our electronic rights to the Feds, tell them that they are just wasting their time looking for terrorists in cyberspace. Tell them to go hang out at the reservoir.
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
Indeed, the American public has become a victim
of its own government's paranoia. Welcome back
Gestapo! It's business all over again.
if you *tell* anyone that you have had to hand your keys over, you get 5years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
*ahem*
Unless of course, Ashcroft is trying to recreate J. Edgar Hoover's secret blackmail files. I know why Hoover did it, but why would Ashcroft do it. What is he trying to hide?
Depending on *what* the ISP logs, this may or may not be considered a wiretap. A simple IP address is not big deal. What would they do with that? Any real terrorist will encrypt non-trivial communications.
Once again, the legislature allows the real criminals to go unpunished and untouched while the average joe gets a large peephole drilled into the wall of his internet connection.
Thanks, Legistlators!
So What? The article also states that the DOJ can get the logs of an ISP without a court order. That would be the equivalent of them asking the phone company to put a DNR (Dialed Number Recorder) on your line without a judicial hearing!
With the logs, they can tell where you have been and what you have sent to whom on the internet!
Most cable modem DHCP pools issue IP addresses based on the MAC address of the requesting device.
How to Set the MAC Address For Dummies:
[root@box]# ifdown eth0
[root@box]# ifconfig eth0 hw ether 00:14:D9:AC:D3:12
[root@box]# ifup eth0
This should get you a new IP address on most cable modem services. Replace the MAC address (that string with 5 colons) with any similar string in the format
00:XX:XX:XX:XX:XX
..where each X is a value from 0-9 or A-F.
Write a script and set it as a cronjob. If your IP is changing every 15 minutes they're going to have a hell of a time keeping tabs on you. If thousands of cable users' IPs are changing every 15 minutes they're going to have a hell of a time keeping tabs on anyone.
I honestly can see both sides of the issue... On one hand, we want to be safe. On the other, we want our privacy protected from corporate america and from "big brother" as some would put it.
Personally:
If you have to worry about big brother, you are either paranoid, a conspiracy nut, or how I used to be....
I stopped caring, about it and now fill my time with useful stuff like hacking linux, programming, etc...
On the other hand I still DO CARE, because I do not want corporate america spamming me with sh*t because they can now check which sites I'm going to by getting logs. In short if the DOJ does it... Nothing we can do, if Amazon does it.... That will have to stop.
And think about it... Only in corporate america do we really have a say. We can just stop buying their product or give a backlash to them... The DOJ... Nothing. Really if you think about it. You can call your Rep. but really what does that do. If things don't go their way, they can just find a way around it. And laws are passed in their favor despite what many may think.... It's like a town meeting I once went to: you know the Yeah's and Neigh's, well we voted audibly on a subject and the Neigh's had it voted down considerably but the Power's to Be, said Yes instead..... Why? Well they already bought the object in question. So they had to pass it whether the people wanted it or not... That's the truth on how things are run, both small time and big time.
www.slightlycrewed.com - Because aren't we all?
It gives some of us the excuse to say we need to backpack through europe for the 4 or so odd years the law is in effect.
An Education is the Font of All Liberty
Am I the only one here who remembers the Sixties? I woke up one morning and the National Guard had shot and killed four students at Kent State University. Crazy thing was, most people in the 'establishment' thought that they deserved it, and that it was a good beginning. We thought we were all going to die just for something we believed in. Fortunately, we kept up our protests, the war ended, Nixon quit. We won that battle, but the war continues. Don't stop fighting for your rights, or you'll lose them.
There's somethin' happening here,
What it is ain't exactly clear.
There's a man with a gun over there,
Tellin' me I gotta beware.
I think it's time we stop,
Hey, what's that sound,
Everybody look what's going down.
- For What It's Worth, Stephen Stills, 1966
Serving your airship needs since 1995.
Wait, wait. So we should just sit back for a year, let the government make whatever laws it wants to, and then try to fix it all later?? You simple, simple man. You ever heard the expression, "It takes 1 year to make a law, and 100 years to unmake it"? If it was so easy to fix laws, then why do we still have all those supid laws like "don't feed a carrot to a donkey" or some such crap.
After Sept 11, the government started enacting new, unconstitutional laws within, what, weeks? In the name of national security. These laws won't do jack squat against these terrorists. Most of us knows that. But they will serve a future purpose.
Sure, let the government do what it wants. And then when we have another terrorist attack, let it add a few more laws to that. And then after that, a few more. It starts small. It always does. That is why you see people scrambling to stop the legislation. 'Cause it's insane what they're doing and how fast they're doing it. And people are scared. Of the government. And rightfully so.
I'm more afraid of Aschcroft than I am of the terrorists. I think he is our generation's Senator McCarthy.
And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start
To mold a new reality... closer to the heart
I thought that it was China who was meant to be improving its human rights record based on examples from the USA, not the other way around. Or am I missing something here?
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
Is is really a bad thing that Web server logs are going to be treated the same as telephone logs? You don't need a court order to obtain logs that show who called whom, but you do need a court order to tap someone's phone and listen to the content of the call. The same now applies to Web connections.
The really bad legal attacks on freedom in cyberspace have involved attempts to grab powers and impose controls that the technology makes feasible, but that are not supported in the laws regulating conventional media (e.g., the cases and controversy surrounding DMCA, UCITA, DeCSS). Lawrence Lessig makes the argument that legislators need to move slowly and carefully, making new law by extending the old law according to carefuly drawn analogies. The worst thing that can happen is to take the potential for control through computer code and enshrine that in law (as with the DMCA's restrictions on who can read what and where).
It seems to me that the Justice Department made a successful argument for treating cyberspace the same as older communication media. In the long run, that's a good thing. The law already contains protections against unwarranted surveillance, and to apply that same body of law to cyber-communications is a desirable outcome.
*** "Freiheit ist immer die Freiheit des Andersdenkenden". -- Rosa Luxemburg ***
The new law essentially lets the FBI get info to get _leads_. Under old law, the FBI could force you to give up info on someone already suspected of a crime. Now I think they can go further and try to find leads also.
Of course, none of this was in the slashdot blurb.
Stop the negativity, the sensationalism, and the yellow journalism. This is an _Open_ _Source_ _Development_ _Network_ for christ sake. It's not the _misinformed_ _anti-bush_ _activism_ _scare-mongering_ _network_.
Take your anti-RIAA/MS/BUSH/ASHCROFT/MPAA FUD and post it on usenet or something.
Slashdot has become hypocrisy online. Every day it devotes space to content that is based on Fear-Uncertainty-Doubt (FUD (TM)).
....and keep in mind, the DOJ may not catch all of the enemys of the state, so if you suspect your parents and neighbors of 'Anti-Americanism' it is your civic duty to report them to your local branch of the FBI.
a lot of information on losing your rights is at http://www.infowars.com, listen to his streaming audio. Alex Jones is pretty interesting to listen to, especially when hiding under the covers, paranoid that Big Brother is lurking inside your closet :)
...they might as well use the information they gather to set up a dating service. Think about it - the government spies on your every keystroke, but to make up for it they send the sexual partner(s) of your dreams to your door. How many people will still be complaining here after that. "Damn government helping me get laid... Oh well, gotta go, no time to bitch and moan about the complete erosion of civil liberties, I'm gonna get me some." It gives new meaning to the term "public relations..."
Arrrgh. First off: I'm Canadian, and have a different perpective on this whole mess. Canada just passed our own version of this nightmare legislation, albeit with a little more dissent from the opposition parties. Hopefully something will be done after the next election. I doubt it. That said, there are a number of problems with your logic and I need to raise a few points:
A lot of people here laugh at the less technophilic portions of our society, the luddites who look at every new innovation with suspicion and distrust. Hey- guess what y'all sound like when it comes to this legislation? Legal luddites, to coin a phrase.
The problem is that the people passing these laws either don't understand what they're doing, or they understand FULL WELL what they're doing. Any way you cut it, a citizen's right to privacy has been greatly reduced. Download hard encryption tools while you still can. Not that it matters much, since you can now be arrested, detained, given a "trial" and the keys likely beaten out of you without a soul ever knowing. Freedom of speech and a right to privacy mean that yes, even the bad guys (tm) get those rights as citizens of the country. If you're not a citzen, of course, all bets are off. Letting the government decide who is a bad guy (tm) without oversight is a very dangerous thing from a historical perspective. I wonder if this is where a lack of knowledge about history in the general populace shows itself.
orgive the tide of popular opinion at this particular point in time for running into the scary nether regions it seems to be running. Let everyone calm down and contemplate reality with a little distance between themselves and September 11, whenever that may be.
You calm down BEFORE you act, not after. History also shows us that once given extraordinary powers, they will almost never be willingly given up. Action is required, but there has not been enough (or, depending on how you look at it, ANY) debate on the topic. Think about what makes the western world different than China or the prior communist Soviet Union. Freedom of expression. A expectation of privacy. A justice system that is open to public inspection and review. Tribunals? What?
Billions of dollars spent on orbiting gigawatt lasers, and what the heck did that do? Less than 2 dozen guys board planes with box cutters fer chrissake and a few hours flight training. A lot of good all that tech did, or will do, if these guys ever get their hands on one of those 50 or so nuclear suitcases the Russians seem to have misplaced.
This one really drives me insane. It should illustrate to you the futility of trading away freedom of expression and privacy, along with due process, for some ILLUSION of safety. Now, all the lunatics would have to do is hijack a plane and the US government will blow it out of the sky for them. Do you think that massive wiretapping, secret-police style arrests, and disinformation will change anything? I have news for you, buddy. Engineering schools are open, and we are VERY LUCKY in North America that these people were not more educated and fanatical than they were. Anyone with rudimentary intelligence could cause widespread disruption of electrical, water, and communications systems and there isn't a DAMN THING anyone could do about it.
Some other clues, for the clueless - The government cannot completely control people in prison. Do you think granting them power to track "subversives" is going to help?
What does make sense is EDUCATING the public. Let them know their freedom is not without responsibility. Show them how to take down a hijacker. Have them watch water resvoirs and electrical substations. Have people get involved with their neighbours. Encourage open debate! This is what makes north america great. Weakening the freedoms we have paid a bloody price for does nobody any good. (hint: a hell of a lot more people died in WW2 than did in NYC).
And finally, forgive me for spreading some of my own FUD at this moment about nuclear suitcases and such, but there you go: I think that's where the FUD properly belongs. Think about it. These guys really hate us. They want to kill us. All of us. Why are you worried about your government?
Nobody will play the nuclear card. Any nation who deployed a nuclear weapon on US soil would be nuked off the face of the earth. I would be far more worried about biological attacks on the water supply. There is a price that comes with freedom, my friend. It is called responsibility. Nothing a government will do can eliminate terrorism. Granting obscene powers is not the way to go about this. Government already had exessive power before 9/11. Ceeding freedom and responsibility to the government will not help; In a way, we have given up what infuriates the fanatics the most: Our freedom to express and do what we want, how we want, when we want, so long as no one is harmed.
This post about cable Internet traffic tapping has very, very little to do with cyberspace, really... as I said before, if you really want to make a good point about trampling on our electronic rights to the Feds, tell them that they are just wasting their time looking for terrorists in cyberspace.
The government is full aware of that. Look at their definition of terrorist, if you were provided with one, that is. Funny how newspeak works like that, eh? Would someone working against the FTAA be a terrorist? Would someone who was seeking to change the political system? What about someone who held fundamentally communist or marxist views? What about the author of this post?
What's really sad is I don't feel comfortable posting this under my nick. That makes me worry. Alot.
I don't have the time handy to dig up the link right now, but there was one senator who voted against the bill because he knew it was bad, but he didn't know why -- he never had a chance to read the bill, or even a synopsis of it, before voting on it. It wasn't for lack of trying, either. To read the story, it sounded as if the committee drafting it was stonewalling everyone who wanted to see the bill before the vote.
Not to mention the unofficial peer and constituent pressure to vore for the bill -- it was the PATRIOT Act, what kind of un-American bastard wouldn't vote for something called the PATRIOT Act?
There wasn't much chance of it being good before, but now that people are starting to examine it and read it closely, we're realizing that it's much worse than originally thought.
Pax, Ardax
At least everyone in my area is configured to proxy off of http://www.
This is of course the very first place to look to see who is visiting what.
Yes, carnivore and its like can probably deal with this subterfuge quite easily...
Let's look at what this prick has done in the last 2 months:
- Sped through the patriot act, which has us on the road to a police state, allowing for secret searches of property and seizure of information, urinating directly on the 4th amendment.
- Trashed our system of justice by authorizing secret trials, using secret evidence, and even allowing secret executinos. The "evidence"will not be avaiable for the accused to refute, with no opportunity for the accused to appeal. In doing so he has invoked the divine right of kings, not even asking for congress's approval.
- Carrying out acts of war without declaring war(declaring war against a tactic doesn't count, war is by definition a conflict between 2 nations, not some open ended crusade). Only congress can declare war(or approve a declaration of war), and so far it has not done so. In addition, he has justified all these invasions of civil liberties by claiming that we are indeed at war.
- Deciding which american citizens will be protected by the constitution, claiming, "you don't deserve protection if you are hiding and committing acts of terror"(Ed note: or are suspected of doing so)
I dunno about you, but this is a hell of a lot more serious than clinton getting his dick sucked by some slut and then lying about it.
Got Freedom?
Thinking?
But most hackers are in a sense terrorist.
Just some bother more people than others. Yes a 12 year old who sits at his parents computer and launches DoS attack against companies or just Marge reading her AOL mail should be considered a criminal.
The crime is easy to commit, and hard to deter since audit trails are small to none. So the punishment must be bad enough to scare you away from doing these things.
Other USA Patriot Act sections mean that police can obtain an Internet Protocol address, which identifies a cable modem subscriber, as readily as they can learn someone's telephone number.
Chertoff said the government also has used its new powers to obtain court orders for logs from Internet providers that are outside of the court's traditional jurisdiction.
This doesn't seem that much different from a sys admin pulling an IP from his logs and doing an rDNS on it, and then contacting the ISP. They still have to get a court order to get the logs, and since most Cable ISP's are running DHCP, the IP address does not automatically ID someone.
The whole article at Wired and here seem to have a definate bias.
however, when I hear the EU is against the death penalty for these criminals, it makes me want to puke.
The fact that the US has a death penalty makes most Europeans want to puke. (You can be executed in the US for a crime you commited when you were under 18 FFS!)
Under the European Human Rights act, the right to life means that a suspect cannot be extradited to a terratory where they risk execution for thair crimes.
Maybe Europeans see this as just another terrorist act
Errrm
It was another terrorist act! (A bit like bombing the Afghans)
You like tax-free shopping on the Internet? You will disclose your personal information.
You want regulations that keep bandwidth affordable? You will accept government monitoring of your private communicaton.
You want to be/stay in business as an access provider? You will log everything and make those logs available on a whim.
The REAL jabber has the user id: 13196
What you do today will cost you a day of your life
One non-secure surfing/games box, and a standalone (preferably *nix) box for stuff that your government doesn't need to see (financial records etc). And no, I don't have anything bad to hide, it's quite simply none of their business. Store all your encryption keys on your standalone box and get your correspondants to adopt a similar configuration,. If you need nocommunicate securely,compose and encrypt/decrypt on the standalone box only, transferring encrypted text only files between the boxen via floppy. It's actually quite frigntening...what have our governments becomethat we all feel the need to protect ourselves from them?
You're using her as bait, Master!
If you need nocommunicate securely
If you need to communicate securely
You're using her as bait, Master!
I believe they can already do that, although the use the guise of "monitoring system performances" or some bullshit.
~~~
...that the government has a built in "rollback" feature. if not i might have to migrate to a new platform, like Canada.
"i was saying gnu-rd"
Ah yes, the telltale whine of some moron who had his ass handed to him for making an idiotic argument.
The funny thing about this stuff is that back when they were talking about how intelligence failed to detect the Sept. 11 attack, they were saying that they were suffering from "too much data" to sift through. And now they have an even larger haystack.
What the hell is a "congress-critter?"
OK, so the feds can ask an ISP for the IP address of a suspect; this would be useful for purposes such as magic lantern, or otherwise trying to crack the suspect's box. The feds can also obtain logs from the ISP; I've never worked at an ISP, so I'm wondering what do ISPs (or especially overloaded cable ISPs) actually log anyway? I can't imagine the information would be overly extensive, since for the most part it's not in the ISP's best interests to keep verbose logs over an extended period of time. Anyone who knows more care to chime in?
-- Never hit a man with glasses. Hit him with a baseball bat.
I live in Austin and have to see this guy on the local cable channel. Trust me, this is not the guy you want to be getting your info from.
Elvis flying around in black helicoptors eating fried peanut butter and bannana sandwiches, AND HE'S LOOKING AT YOU!
Let me guess you voted for Clinton, right!
Looking over at CNN you see that over 100,000 people have voted that the 'new powers' of the government are not too much, while only 30K or so think they are too broad.
As a rock-in-roll Physicist once said, No matter where you go, there you are.
I don't understand the level of panic I'm seeing in most of the replies to this article. Have any of you folks actually read the legislation? Most of it consists of running "sed -e s/phone/phone, voice or internet" on existing laws. E.g., the ability to obtain IP address/name pairs from cable companies is analogous to the ability to map phone numbers to names. We're not exactly shredding the Bill of Rights, here.
There is a real tension between civil liberties and physical safety, no matter what Ben Franklin said; we have enemies who want to slaughter us wholesale, and the freedoms available to them in this country are enabling them to do so. In this context, the USA Patriot Act is a reasonable compromise, despite the newspeak name. The freedoms it sacrifices are non-essential (yes, there is such a thing), and yet it has a fighting chance of being effective. It represents a sweet-spot in the freedom/safety trade-off.
Even if it were the piece of totalitarian toilet paper some would have us believe, it at least has a sunset clause. I.e., on Dec. 31, 2005, the USA Patriot Act ceases to be the law of the land. Not quite what you'd expect from a fascist power-grab.
I suspect the most hyperbolic complaints about this piece of legislation come from people who are upset about the general erosion of civil liberties underway. If you fall into this category, your energy is wasted on the USA Patriot Act. Executive orders allowing military tribunals and spying on lawyers are massively more troubling than the FBI being able to find out whose machine is at 65.12.14.153; if you don't understand why, I'm afraid you've been spending too much time on slashdot.
Well as long as they just catch terrorists downloading movies off the web I see nothing wrong with this...
I've been reading the Patriot Act and I cannot find a clear definitions of the word "terrorist" which aren't self-referential -- ie: "someone who commits an act of terrorism", and so forth.
Am I reading the section correctly? Because if so, it would seem to me that, without a clear definition, it's open to interpretation at various points along the way from suspicion to arrest and detainment to trial to sentencing...
--------
Bleah! Heh heh heh... BLEAH BLEAH!!! Ha ha ha ha...
The Senator you are referring too is Russell Feingold (D)of Wisconsin. He proposed a series of amendments which would have tempered the "worst" aspects of this bill. Only six Senators voted with him on the amendments. When time came for passage of the bill, Sen. Feingold was the only dissenting vote.
This is not the sig you are looking for...
Here is an email I received from my local provider (Cox) I received it today 11292001:
Dear Cox @ Home Customer:
As you know from our previous emails, Excite @ Home, our vendor in delivering
your Cox @ Home service, filed for Chapter 11 Bankruptcy protection at the end
of September. We have endeavored to keep you informed of the potential impact
this Bankruptcy could have on your Cox @ Home service and are writing to you
today to provide the latest information we have available.
First, we want you to know that we are committed to providing you uninterrupted
high speed Internet service. Cox Communications has been working diligently in
negotiations with Excite @ Home and using all legal avenues available to protect
you, our valued customer. Meanwhile, we have been forging ahead with our
plans to deliver reliable high speed Internet service to you on our Cox-managed
network. You will soon be receiving additional information about our new Cox
High Speed Internet(sm) service, along with information to help you convert to this
new service.
The latest developments with Excite @ Home:
This month, Excite @ Home's creditors petitioned the Bankruptcy court with a
motion to allow Excite @ Home to terminate service agreements with its cable
affiliates on November 30th. This includes agreements with Cox, Comcast and
AT&T. If the Court grants the creditors' request, there conceivably could be a
temporary disruption in the services that Excite @ Home provides to
approximately 3.7 million customers served by its North American cable affiliates.
We are doing everything possible to see that there will not be a disruption in your
service, but also want you to understand the possibilities and to be prepared:
*If the Judge's ruling states that Excite @ Home may terminate its service
agreements with Cox and the other cable affiliates, this does not mean that
Excite @ Home will automatically turn off the service on November 30th.
*With the Judge's approval, Excite @ Home would then have the ability to make
a decision on termination; however, we are negotiating with them to prevent any
service disruption.
*If Excite @ Home decides to terminate service despite our efforts to negotiate a
temporary arrangement, the question remains as to when the service would be
terminated. We are doing everything we can to ensure that your Cox @ Home
service continues until we can transition you to our new Cox-managed Internet
service. In short, we are doing our best to make sure that you will never be
without high speed Internet service.
Additional help Cox is providing:
In addition to exercising legal avenues, negotiating with Excite @ Home, and
building our own high speed Internet service, Cox is also offering the following to
help you and to keep you informed during this transitional period:
* Toll Free Customer Information Line (1-877-832-4751). You can call in for
the latest updates as we work to quickly resolve any service issues.
* Website Message Center at www.cox.com/info We will provide online
updates and a "Frequently Asked Questions" (FAQ) section to address your
concerns.
* Automatic Account Credits. We will credit your account automatically for
service and leased equipment so that you are reimbursed for any time you
are without service.
* Free, temporary dial-up Internet access. In the unlikely event that you
should experience a service disruption, we have arranged for temporary
dial-up access to the Internet via NetZero(r). In order to take advantage of
this precautionary option, please see the "What Should I be Doing Right
Now" section that follows.
Cox has a long history of outstanding service in your community. We pride
ourselves on providing high quality products and the best customer service.
Please know that we are committed to our customers and understand the
extent to which you enjoy the services we provide. We recognize that you
have a choice in service providers and we will continue to do our best to
remain your choice now and in the future. In advance, we apologize for any
inconvenience that the Bankruptcy of our vendor Excite @ Home may cause
you.
Stay tuned for more details, and thank you for choosing Cox.
Sincerely,
The Cox High-Speed Internet Team
Cox Communications, Inc.
_______________________________
What Should I be Doing Right Now?
1. Check your Cox @ Home email daily. Opened messages will be saved
automatically to your hard drive.
2. Download free dial-up Internet software. In the unlikely event that Excite
@ Home terminates your service, you would lose connectivity to the Internet and
access to your Cox @ Home services such as email and webspace. We do not
recommend that you install the software at this time, just download the software
and save it so that it may be installed should you have an interruption in service.
In order to restore access to the Internet and to set up a temporary email
address, we recommend that you register for dial-up service via NetZero and
download the necessary software. You will not be able to download the software
from your home after your Internet service has already been disrupted. While a
free dial-up connection is not ideal, it will give you temporary access to the
Internet for surfing, making transactions, etc. However, you will not be able to
access your Cox @ Home email accounts while the service is shut down. For
information on how to download this software, please visit www.cox.com/info
3. Back up your personal web page to your hard drive or to a CD. (This is a
good precautionary measure to follow at any time.)
4. In the unlikely event that there is a disruption in service, keep your cable
modem connected to your PC until service is restored.
5. Watch for more information from Cox on the transition of your service to
Cox High Speed Internet. At such time that you can make the transition to our
new service, Cox will be providing you with all of the information you need to make
your transition as smooth as possible.
It seems like they are trying their asses off not to lose any customers, which seems to be a very good sign.
I hate sigs.
Give me a break. I know 12 year olds with more sense than 35 year olds.
Well, considering the US has been known to put to death people who are mentaly retarded (ie those with a mental age of a 12year old) this is hardly supprising!
i'm for abandoning the DOJ acronym. it's not the Dept. of Justice, it's the Dept. of Self-Interest. justice doesn't enter into their agenda. from now, it should be DOSI. *gives DOSI the finger*
Which reminds me about the disturbing trend in naming legislation over the past 10 years or so. There's the PATRIOT act, which we're discussing here. It's not just a US phenomenon, though - witness the UK's effective removal all regulations on investigators with the "Regulation of Investigatory Powers" act.
All I know is that when they come up with the "Saving Our Children's Cuddly Kittens, Sad-Eyed Puppies, and Fluffy Bunnies" act, I'm getting the fsck outa dodge.
We're the "leader of the Free world". We're supposed to be setting good examples for every nation. That includes not sinking to lower forms of behavior.
It's all very simple; if you voted for Bush you asked for this war, this return to budget deficits, this destruction of the Constitution, this theocratic government and this headuptheass way of looking at modern life. Screw all you stupid bastards who voted for Bush and support him and the theocracy. America belongs to the ages; we all now live in MERIKA - the most powerful totalitarian state that ever existed. Tune in the network news any night and get all the propoganda you can stomach, especially from FOX, CNN, MSNBC, CBS and ABC. This isn't even about technology - it's about life itself.
Of course it doesn't really matter, since they will still be able to sniff at the ISP. How about anonymizers that use SSL or a VPN? That would be ideal.
*sigh*
Bush and his father share friends, attitudes, money and methods. Bush's father is on record as saying that aetheists should have their citizenship revoked because, by definition, they can't even be patriots.
We have fundamental disagreement about the road we're on. I say that the past year has seen the disappearance of America and the emergence of MERIKA, the new theocratic state, after the coup of the election of 2000.
Nobody here should be trying to calm down.
The US gov't must have the same marketing guys as Microsoft. They come up with some good names for tricking the American public into supporting abusive crap. "Patriot Act." What upstanding citizen wouldn't back something with a name like that?
You are having basic trouble with grammar and spelling, I see. You are also having trouble with any realities which have more than two dimensions. In your dreams life would be so simple as to be neatly defined in terms like democracy and republic. In such dreams you can piss on people who live complex lives and do not fit into the meaningless definitions which give you so much comfort.
TLS is a way of sending e-mail using SSL. When you send an e-mail from your TLS-speaking server to another TLS-speaking server, it will automatically travel encrypted. TLS also has support for certificate verification. Most popular mail servers, including sendmail and postfix, have TLS support. Debian users: apt-get install postfix-tls and follow the README.
"It should be noted that when he seizes a state the new ruler ought to determine all the injuries that he will need to inflict. He should inflict them once and for all, and not have to renew them every day.
Whoever acts otherwise, either through timidity or bad advice, is always forced to have the knife ready in his hand.... Violence should be inflicted once and for all; people will then forget what it tastes like and so be less resentful."
With all due respect, bunk. It affects us all, at least those of us who use computers, and particularly those of us who consult using computers.
The FBI is now free, without court order or even timely notice, upon "reasonable suspicion," to circumvent and monitor your electronic transmissions, physically enter your home or install by remote hacking a keylogger, and to use or disclose such information freely.
They can now assert and make stick Computer Fraud and Abuse charges, with enhanced penalties, that would not have held water yesterday; and you are also exposed to substantially greater civil liability under the CFAA.
But most hackers are in a sense terrorist.
Just some bother more people than others. Yes a 12 year old who sits at his parents computer and launches DoS attack against companies or just Marge reading her AOL mail should be considered a criminal.
The crime is easy to commit, and hard to deter since audit trails are small to none. So the punishment must be bad enough to scare you away from doing these things.
Ridiculous, when you compare the costs of such threats. Yes, your daughter is more severely deterred from hacking, but the cost is that virtually every computer consultant today is inherently liable for extraordinary liability under the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act, by the mere shift of a few words. It seems that whatever marginal "deterrence" is gained by the USA/PATRIOT Act was lost by the years of productivity and commerce due to the unceasing caution and uncertainty caused to those who provide technical services.
By regulating technology more closely, so too are we choking one of our nation's greatest engines of commerce.
The error is grave.
One other thing. Do you think that the kinds of terrorists to whom the USA/PATRIOT laws are directed are subject to intellectual arguments of deterrence? Do you seriously argue that ANY law would have deterred a person willing to turn himself into a human bomb?
No, we are only deterring normal people from doing normal things, as our life is turned upside down from statist overreaching. The terrorists are unaffected by legislative efforts to "deter" their conduct.
The ACLU has a nifty-neato page where you can simply enter your ZIP code and generate an email, fax, or postal letter to you Congress critter for free to express your views on post Sept. 11 civil liberties and the USA Patriot Act and urge Congressional inquiry.
The govt. will do whatever they want. Period. Laws and Constitution/Bill of rights be damned! In the past few years (and yes, Clinton is guilty of starting this) the govt. has become less for the people and more against the people. This 'them vs us' attitude of elected officials towards the very people who voted them into office is troubling. In the past few months I've faxed both my senators and congressman in Washington and told them that their recent votes do not represent my view, the view of one who voted for them and whose interests they're supposed to represent. One of the three sent me a boilerplate response, the other two...nothing. These people are more concerned with feathering their own nests then any of us. It's going to take a major shift in voters' attitudes to change this and it's not likely based on the fact that the majority of voters simply don't vote any more. The ones who do vote usually stumble into the booth and vote for the incumbent. In other words: We have found the enemy and it is us!
http://www.cpusa.org
Walk around washington DC with a gamma ray source and you'll know what I mean. It is near impossible to shield the fissile material adequately, and there is classified procedures, personel, and equipment to deal with this.
You seem to forget that the internet is not as closed system as the phones are.
I mean, as a website owner I can log and display your IP on my pages [actually I do] all I want.
Your ISP owns the log of what you visit too, not you. So they can give out the log if they want [and lose customers at the same time I imagine].
I agree that scrutiny should be placed on divulging logs to people but in the log run it isn't a big deal.
What if I as a website owner submitted [voluntarily] my access_log to the government. Would I be violating your rights then?
Someday, I'll have a real sig.
and this is a surprise to anyone?
wake up, they monitor everything and they have since the 1950's. "legal" doesn't enter into it, they are above the law.
I dare the DoJ or anyone else to use these "laws" against me :P~~~
:P~~~
Just becuase it's a "law" doesn not mean it's constitutional.
That's why we have the Judical system...to smackdown crazed politicians
And just so you all know...the Feds having a piece of paper with some IP's typed out on it does not mean your in any trouble....just means they know your IP and can type...now if they had video surveilance of you sitting at that PC at the time in question then ya might be screwed.
Last time the Feds went for me all they had was some lame ass traceroutes and some text files...we had it dismissed on day 1...cost me a bunch for the lawyer...got to see DC though:)
come on you Feds...come and get me
I taunt you....
Your mother was a hamster and your father smelled of Elderberries
i saw this on my friends im profile:
1. WITCHES!
2. COMMUNISTS!
3. TERRORISTS!
Anyone else see the connection?
Got Freedom?
Thinking?
okay, so here is the question:
it says "may" now, which tells me, that the FBI may ask, and it is up to the ISP to decide whether or not it wishes to comply. Before, the ISP was, by law, required to have a court-order in hand before giving out any information. Now, a court-order is required to give out information to a private person or group; and it does not need a court-order to give it to a governmental organisation. It can, however, tell the FBI (or whoever, for kicks, say the FDA), to goto a judge. Of course, the ISP could also tell the government (maybe even a state-level government, tho I can't say) that it'll be friendly neighbor and let them in.
Am I reading the "May" correctly?
It is surprising how those laws are similar to israel's genocidal mision... Perhaps hitler should have finished his work, we would not have all those stupid jews controlling the world...
Conversation I had with my ex-boyfriend a few weeks ago. And no I'm not making this up !
Him: "What is the secret service ?"
Me: "Basically they are spies that work for the government . Why do you ask ?"
Him : "Well, these two guys in black suits came to my parents' house on thursday [note: that was 2 days before the conversation]. They said they were from the secret service and they had a card to prove it. They asked for me by name."
Me: "What did they want ?"
Him: "They wanted to talk to me about some comments I made in an AOL chat room back in October. I was bashing Bush and the government. At one point I said in the room "Someone should mail Bush some anthrax". They told me that was a threat and they were investigating.
Me: "So what did you say ?"
Him : "I said I was just joking of course, which was the truth. Whatever happened to freedom of speech in this country ?"
Me : Sigh.
-- Julien Pierre http://www.madbrain.com/blog
WAR? What about Serbia? (No war declared there,
it was a Peace mission...)
Civil Rights - heck, what about the right to
defend yourself and property? (2nd admendment?)
OR are you forgetting that one?
You seem to think that I approve of clinton's "legacy"(notice from the sig that i'm libretarian). I certainly don't. I would have supported his impeachment if it was for what he actually did instead of the whole lewinsky thing. then it would have had more meaning. otherwise, what was the point.
Got Freedom?
Thinking?
It's because there are too many perpetual optimists and "Do it for the children!" weeniers out there that think humanity is inherantly good, and that those in power, are also those with all the knowledge. It may be far from the truth of what power is like ("Aboslute power corrupts, absolutely."), but too many people these days overlook that because they believe we're products of evolutionary chance, and inherantly good beings. Hello, the opposite is true on both accounts, and the more power you get, the harder it is to resist the temptation to abuse it.
Because my web service disclaims any and all responsibility for user content/traffic/etc., I think I will be making a few 'adjustments' to just what the system logs, or rather, does not log.
They want IP addresses? okie dokie, I can give them the last 30 minutes of IP addresses, sure. Seeing as how I only check my e-mail once every hour, and my phone line is more often than not, busy. I sure hope they can get ahold of me in 30 minutes for those precious IP addresses, user logins,e-mail traffic logs, etc. etc.etc....Have to keep that /var directory neat and tidy you know. :)
"We demand logs of this time and this user under the such and such act of blah blah blah! you must comply!"
"Uh, sure, one problem, they dont exist anymore, sorry. have a nice day! *click*"
But seriously..c'mon :P
My new top secret key -> C>N|KB
Has anyone realised yet that patriot is a BAD word??
But ever since I learned in US History class in 11th grade, that the government can actually strip you of your constitutional rights for the sake of WAR-TIME, I have feared this country EVER going to war.
At the time I figured shit, the US go to war? Bah, we haven't been in a war since I was old enough to remember. But it was a scary thought anyway. Imagine, if they could take away your basic freedoms that were guaranteed to you in the CONSTITUTION, just because the country was at war... that blew my mind.
Then I figured, why would they do such a thing even if we DID go to war? I mean, what good would it do to take away our freedom of speech and whatnot? Nah, they wouldn't do that in these modern times... they have more smarts to go on now, they have more experience under the belt right?
Then again, what if the whole "AT WAR" concept was used, just so they could solve issues that were way too complex or difficult if not impossible to solve by regular ways and means? What if our government went berzerk and decided they were going to use the pretext of WAR after any provocation to do whatever necessary to do things the way they wanted them to be done... no matter at whose expense.. even the the very people they are supposed to be "representing" and governing.
Very scary thoughts indeed. Never thought I would actually have to live them.
The way things are going, I'm planning on getting the fuck out of here whenever the opportunity arrives. I'm not going to stick with a country that just decides that the rules they so strictly enforce on the people, no longer apply to those creating and enforcing them. That's just plain wrong, and idiotic. It cannot work.
One last point about the whole "we're immune to the constitution" attitude. What if the people decided they had had enough of obeying all these pathetic, shitty laws. What if the people rose up and decided they were just as immune to the rules and regulations as those who enact, enforce, & regulate do. What then?
That's quite a bit to think about.
And we as a nation have lots of thinking AND acting to do.
If you don't hear from me ever again, they showed up at my house and made off with my body.
If only I didn't get busted with pot I'd be trying to become an FBI agent right now.
sorry dude.. that sucks. i've had some close calls myself. they got evidence against me in case they want to arrest me. but only paraphanelia and like 0.05 grams. still sucks, that was the best glass pipe i've ever owned.
smoke a joint
First off, you need to start hitting CSPAN.org and thomas.gov. Those sites offer coverage of the meetings and events that happen BEFORE legislation makes it to the floor, at least on the national level. Some states' cable providers offer televised local and state coverage as well. Then you need to get people to watch those sites. Of course, nobody really watches those sites; given a choice between football, survivor, and cspan coverage, cspan will always be the loser.
Most news media makes no money on letting people know about legislative hearings and sessions before something hits the floor. Part of this is because the news media doesn't want to be in the business of trying to interpret laws for the public. The other side of it is that many of their stories come from governmental contacts and favors- and if you piss on someone's pet project, then you get less help later on (like when you need a building permit to make alterations to your office).
Right now, I am working on the problem of hidden legislation and what to do about it. I just moved to the capitol of my state, and I am finding further problems in that local governments do not offer any of their schedules, legislative copy, or postings in any kind of electronic form. In some cases, "last-minute" notices requesting community input are posted next to the printing office, which is in the basement of a building that you have to pass through a metal detector during business hours in order to reach. It is not as bad with the state, but the level of obfuscation on public hearing locations and names of legislation is truly astounding.
Something else for everyone here to think about- if you are finding it hard to make a living doing tech and science work, maybe you should consider taking a year or two off and going to law school. Really, activism only can go so far, and if it is not backed up with real experience and knowledge it ends up going nowhere fast.
'Hail Eris, baby, hail Eris...pfffffffttt.' *cough* 'Yeah.'
Maybe we should require everybody to sing the Star Spangled Banner before eating at restaurants and Pledge Allegiance to the Flag before buying groceries. If we had everybody sign "Loyalty Oaths" and refused to deal with anybody who didn't, that would make everybody patriotic and get rid of all terrorists, right!? And anybody who refuses to participate or questions the validity is obviously unAmerican.
I have not bothered flying a flag, despite the fact that I consider myself patriotic, because it almost seems to me that a third of the people flying them are flying them because it is currently the thing to do, and another third are businesses using patriotism as a sales pitch! (Though I must admit that they are being solidly American in doing that.) There are better ways to show patriotism, like voting and taking an interest in pending legislation and expressing that interest to representatives. (which I have done)
Also, how will the media react when they learn that the next terrorist to act was a very "patriotic" person, who had flags plastered on his car, flew a flag from his apartment, etc. If there is another terrorist attack anytime soon, any intelligent person knows that this will be the case. Any average intelligence terrorist would fly a flag from his car, because then everybody around would know he was a good, patriotic person, and would ignore the fact that he was asking where he could by 1 ton of fertilizer and attending flight school.
i'm not affiliated with them or anything, so i'm adverstising, but instead of sitting around feeling helpless, register(donate money) to the ACLU. This way, when the government has the right to come check on the length of your penis, you can say you tried. http://www.aclu.org
i'm not affiliated with them or anything, so i'm adverstising, but instead of sitting around feeling helpless, register(donate money) to the ACLU. This way, when the government has the right to come check on the length of your penis, you can say you tried. http://www.aclu.org
You know when you are running a Windows machine and you do the online update? Do you realise what happens? Micro$oft says that there is no information being uploaded to their site about "your" computer. Well, if government agencies now have the power to, for lack of a better term, take information from ISP's about "your" IP address, could Micro$oft be in on this too and associate your IP address with your entire computer's hardware/software configuration, for said government agencies to "take?"
My point exactly! The "Do it for the children" thing seems to be the big controlling force in society. *We* know we're right, but no-one bloody listens to us...
MAC addresses are carefully assigned by vendor to assure that there are no two devices on earth that respond to the same MAC address. This eliminates computers with the same MAC address on the same loop of network stomping on eachother and causing errors, dataloss, and other such confusion.
Even though there is very little chance of actually colliding with somebody else on your loop, it's still an invitation for errors and unriliability.
---
Play Six Pack Man. I
Everything created by man has some flaw in it. The United States government boasts "justice" when all they really try to obtain is revenge. Honestly, I think that we should elminate the deemed "terrorist-state" But we should do this with quickness and and surgical precision. If this man, Bin-Laden, had been a citizen of the US, he would be deemed just another crazy with a militia. Bin-Laden and his cohorts should be eliminated in one way or another, skip the flashy light show and media coverage. He sucker punched us and now we need to retaliate.... but even if you manage to end the terrorism of one bully, there well always be another somewhere else. Not one law in place will secure our "freedom" or sanctity. These laws will only give a glossy coat to what the people now see, and those people who comprise our government know that. They are using this event as an excuse to obtain justification and make the people of the United States feel that it was their choice to make these laws for the "greater good." Decomposition of our privacy may put a small enough crack in our civil rights to allow them to push forward and shatter the rest of them. Most of those representatives of our government have law degrees, were once or wanted to be lawyers, and love to manipulate things in their favors alone. They take things seriously but still treat their work as a giant game. Many of them do not understand how these choices will harm the common man, when they think that their lives are how everyone should live. Look at our past presidents, born with silver spoons in their mouths. Have they ever done any REAL work? It disgusts me to see people who make laws because they think they're never wrong. The only reason that they make so many laws is because the ones made previously were flawed. Logically you would see that every child law will be flawed because its parent has never been perfect. Perhaps they should stop trying to govern people by telling them what NOT to do.
It is a Federal offence to threaten the President, even as a joke. Just saying something like that out loud is a crime. This is not a new law that was enacted after Sep 11, this law has been around for years, maybe even decades.
It's the same thing with bomb threats at airports. Just saying that you have a bomb, even if it's just a joke, will get you arrested. I've heard stories of families travelling by air, and their stupid 8-year-old kid thinking it would be funny to say there's a bomb in his dad's bag. As you can imagine, all hell then breaks loose, the entire family gets carted away, and they miss their flight.
Not only that, but the Secret Service are not spies that work for the government. The SS has one job: to protect the President and other important people (Vice President, Presidential candidates, etc). The are required by law to investigate EVERY possible threat to the President.
Your ex-boyfriend is lucky he didn't get arrested, because the SS could easily have done that. I'm surprised the SS didn't explain that to him.
And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start
To mold a new reality... closer to the heart
Lets all remember that we lost 0.002% of our population to the terrorists. Shall we trade the liberty of the other 99.998% in return?
- In a knowledge based industry your main asset will always be people -
For your right
To party!
No, but seriously, when I think about it I can't honestly remember when this country was ever free. When I was a kid I remember my friends having their money or personal property taken away from them for walking across the street. I don't know what freedom is, but if you can't walk across the street without breaking a law I think you've got a long way to go. That's why I don't understand all this propoganda today. Our government filled my head with all this freedom and patriotic crap when I was in school. And now it has the audacity to tell me that fighting terrorism is preserving the freedoms I still lack. The freedoms my government still keeps from me!?!
When I think of the flag (other than those cheap plastic ones people hang off thier cars) I think about freedom from tyrany and oppression, I think about the 4th of july, about cannons and guns and the men that died fighting for our constitution. The very constitution my government now finds inconvenient in their War on . And it makes me sick to see all those flags flying today. Normally when I look at the flag I feel patriotic. I'm one of the men that's willing to give his life for the freedom I'm still fighting for, without hesitation. I'm also willing to kill for it. But when I see a flag today I don't feel patriotic. I hate you and everything you stand for, for making me look at my flag in this wartime context.
Its a sad day for this American. I wish a country existed that cared more about its people!=consumers and education/Freedom of Information than money. If there is one and you're looking for sys admins, programmers, network engineers or people willing to work for free for the common good, I'm ready to move.
-Caleb
P.S. I wish I could fix this great nation, but I honestly don't think its possible to repair it. How can you explain love (peace and understanding) and technology to a nation of devout ignorants who thrive on sex, violence and destruction?
Oh, well, that's different. If my government wants to cleans humanity then I'm all for that. And here I just thought they wanted to enslave the population of the planet in some globalization of corporate powers and trade. Either way at least I'm in the country with the biggest guns. We have become so efficient at killing people there is no way you can stop us. And if we cleans humanity by killing all the people that disagree with us, then everyone will agree, and thus be happy. :)
Oh, no, I'm not being sarcastic. I'm an American.
People have a fundamental separation between themselves and the government. (This is part of a general human trait, to categorize others into various groups and view them as "other") But, the essence of a democracy is that the government is the people. There is no separation between us and the government -- the power is derived from a manadate from the masses, to paraphrase Monty Python.
She sat at the window watching the evening invade the avenue.
I agree completely.
The U.S. government has separated itself from the people, and has become a largely secret entity in itself. Therefore it is no longer democratic government.
Bush's education improvements were
Here here!
But the advantage of having some semblance of a democracy is that we don't have to have a bloody (literally) war with the government. Take away the power and give it to someone else.
Then wait for the new government to become corrupt.
Repeat as necessary.
She sat at the window watching the evening invade the avenue.
I agree that we have been getting a lot of patriotic news recently, but criticism of the "war on terror" is easily found in the US media. NPR recently had an article discussing the fact that there have been double the complaints filed by university professors for being reprimanded, etc. for expressing their view on what Bush is doing. In fact, the article said that it was mostly PRO WAR professors that had most often been punished for expressing their views.
No courts involved.
Didn't you hear? Military tribunals. :(
Insightful! Mod parent up!
Thanks for the clarification on the secret service. They did tell him they could have arrested him, but he protested about free speech and they did not.
You missed my point though.
If you make a verbal threat at an airport, you know who is listening - the people who are present and can hear you.
When my friend made his comment, which was a joke, it was intended for the people in the chat room, not for the secret service, or I don't believe he would have made that joke. I have no reason to believe that there was anything prior to this event that would have specifically attracted the attention of such agency as the secret service on him.
There are only two ways I can think of that attracted the secret service attention on him :
1) someone in the chat room reported him to AOL, which then forwarded the information to the secret service . This is certainly a plausible explanation, since it happened after 9/11 . Someone in the room might not have liked the joke.
2) the secret service or some other agency is monitoring everything that goes on the wire of my cable's friend and/or AOL . We have all heard of carnivore. I'm afraid unfortunately it's not just rumors...
Unfortunately my pessimistic nature makes me believe the second theory is closer to the truth .
-- Julien Pierre http://www.madbrain.com/blog