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HP to Launch Music Service, Player In 2004
securitas writes "HPShopping.com CEO Peter Appl told Reuters that HP will launch its own branded online music service and a portable MP3 / digital music player in 2004. Appl (the CEO) said that the newcomers would compete with Apple (the company's) music products such as the iTunes music store and iPod music player, among others. HP expects its store to be a branded version of an existing service. Appl also said that the launch will take place at the 2004 Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in January. Compaq sold its own line of digital music players, now discontinued, before its merger with HP. Mirrors of the Reuters story at CNN and Boston.com. A quick check shows that HPMusic.com resolves to an
'HP customer care local language selection' technical support page, and the domain has been registered since 1999."
(checks crystal ball)
I see only one of two possible immediate outcomes to all of these music services going up at the same time:
1. The collapse of the RIAA's scare-tactics business model for coercion to expensive copyright, and a change in how people listen and contribute to the music industry.
2. The total destruction of all online music sales, as all said businesses compete eachother out of existence.
In either case, the indies will be getting a *huge* increase in power, wealth and the ability to remain flexible to meet market demand and handle new distribution opportunities.
I think this is really good for everyone... especially when you consider that most of the traditional corporations have mission statements like: "Our goal is to competently build virtual data to allow us to conveniently disseminate quality content for 100% customer satisfaction", and compare that line of thought to the mission of indy music, which is more along the lines of "create the best, most innovative music and get a huge fan base, because we ROCK!"
"If Apple can do it, so can we!"
Joining dell on the music bandwagon. Oh well, I guess it's a good thing. Competition inspires innovation, right? right?
- Sherman
more evidence that HP is trying to go out of business.
Let's get the Now You're Comparing Appls And Apples jokes out of the way.
Help savingAmigaOS and a free PowerPC market
OSS suffers from too many developers scratching the same itch. Pfffftt.
Slashdot: Where people pretend to be twice as smart as they really are by behaving like children.
...is that HP's entering the business. They're not creating anything new on their own: instead, they've decided to brand an existing product. Yawn.
I meta-mod all positive moderation Unfair, because it's abuse of the system.
HPShopping.com CEO Peter Appl
Coincidence? I don't think so.
Imagine a beowulf cluster of online music retailers!
Seeing as HP has lots of support for Linux (mostly enterprise, but you can buy some of their desktop models with Mandrake preinstalled), maybe they will push to have a Linux version. Here's to hoping ...
With all the recent desires to open a branch in the music industry, you have to wonder what would happen if Microsoft got it's hands wet, "Sorry, you cannot play this on linux" or "Sorry, this is an apple product." Still, at least SCO or Al Gore isn't involved:
SCO: You must have a license to listen to music, available for a modest fee.
Gore: Sorry, but I invented music.
Microsoft: And I invented the stringent EULA's and Windows, which runs flawlessly.
RIAA: You all must bow down to me, the screwer of all artists.
Prehaps hp just went through a list of domains they owned and thought, how can we make money off this and off they go. Wonder if they own hpporn?
Rus
Cheap UK and US VPS
I can already see it:
* Equipped with a 192-bit DAC for maximum output quality
* Sound recording feature with 1MHz sampling rate
* Full-color spectrum analyzer
* Sturdy, "expensive plastic" design- you can drop it, drive a truck over it, and it will still work.
* Modem line-quality test feature: just let it record the sound of your modem
* The MP3 player uses 3 DSPs for fault-tolerance
* Costs $15000
Tsunami -- You can't bring a good wave down!
With half a bajillion companies now offering song downloads at $0.99 and none coming to us without some sort of DRM involved, why would we choose one over another? The Apple iTunes store has had so much success because of (1) the sales success of the ipod and (2) the ease on integration of iTunes and OS X. Now let's turn this into a look at HP. HP's MP3 player (while the MP3 player in question is purely speculative since it has not been released) is probably no different than any other MP3 player and I doubt they could be much better than the Neuros. So this gives us no need to choose the HP music store over any other store. Further, HP hardware is not proprietary in the sense that getting music from the HP store would either be a required method of getting music or the easiest because of a lack of other sources. This seems to tell me one thing: HP's journey into online digital music sales will most likely be short lived.
It's really painful to watch HP crash and burn. Thanks, Carly!
What's with all these music services tied to specific players? What a stupid idea. I'll never buy music in a format for which there are only a few manufacturers. I rather buy and rip CD's (as stupid and inefficient as that is in this networked era.)
Thing is, portable mp3 players are 10 a penny.
Hell, I can walk into my local computer store and find at least three different flash drives, all with inbuilt mp3/wma players.
If they want their product to sell, why not make it worthwhile and put in stuff that tech-savvy people would use, like Tremor (integer Ogg Vorbis decoding) support for those who don't want to pay Fraunhoffer.
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
As unimpressed as I am (I loathe HP, its products and all it stands for) all these music services/mp3 players coming out means that 2004 looks to to be the year where mp3 players become commodities. The hardware is at a decent stage (thanks to the iPod). Now all that's left is for prices to come down to walkman/discman-like levels.
Linux, you magnificent bastard, I read the fucking manual!
However, Napster, BuyMusic, Dell, and HP should be shitting their pants now that MS will be in the business. They're all dealing with the same DRM (wma files), the same catalog, and the same music. MS has the resources to make sure they wind up on top.
Do you even lift?
These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.
For one reason: The popping up of all these services can only strengthen WMA.
Since everyone except iTunes seems to rely on WMA DRM, this slew of services may well be the thing that takes WMA from an also-ran joke to a serious media format.
I don't like the idea of MS having real power in the world of media formats.
I'm awefully distressed that Apple's music player isn't getting more recognition in consumer electronics houses. I went to Best Buy recently to pick up a much needed case fan, and was surprised to see that they carry iPods. Unfortunately, they have all their iPods in a locked transparant glass case at floor level, making it very difficult to look inside. Additionally, all the iPod boxes are oriented in such a way that the size is the only visible part of the box. On top of this case is the latest offering from Creative Labs, in a nice clear plastic case, showing off the (rather bulky) HDD MP3 player. It is impossible see what the iPod even looks like in the display. As I was doing my Christmas shopping at the time, I had my own iPod with me. I was asked about it by two moderately interested individuals, who were complete unaware of the presence of the product in the store. It's really too bad that the bottom line plays such a big role in the way these products are marketted. Best Buy has a much more significant markup on the other MP3 players, but its a little deceiteful to tuck the good stuff away like that. OK, enough of my griping. - J. B.
How in the world can this lead to sales of Inkjet cartridges for $40 each?
Packard Bell today announced it would re-enter the US market with the introduction of a new online music service and branded media player. Company spokesman Mr. Fuzuoku said "we will avoid repeating past failure by competing only in markets with no competition from DELL and H........D'Oh!!"
Sometimes, watching the computer industry is like watching a bunch of lemmings. Next thing you know, SCO will be launching a music service as well! :)
It was good enough for Time Warner, and lord knows HP can only make printers.
no, it wasn't.
Before the iTunes Music Store I had never heard of a WMA-compatible portable music player... now it seems like every computer manufacturer is releasing their own self-branded WMA player to go with their self-branded WMA store
I have to wonder if Apple kind of shot themselves in the foot by creating the iTMS, the movement it engendered almost seems to have encouraged the adoption of WMA, at least in portable devices...
Because tech-savvy people are a very small market compared to the masses of people who are not tech-savvy. Hate to break it to you, but the average person could give two flying fucks about Ogg Vorbis. HP is not doing this to fill a niche market, that is typically done by smaller, more agile companies who need to break into the industry. Instead, they are going with the biggest market possible with a tried and true product/business plan and they will attempt to muscle their way through things.
Buy Steampunk Clothing Online!
I have CD's that are 17 years old. They still work and I have been able to rip all of them and use them in my MP3 player. The beauty of an open format.
DRM sucks. The files only last for as long as you have the software/hardware to play them. What is my guarantee that I will be able to listen to this music in 20 years after I spend the money to license it? Let's face it, at $10/album or $0.99/song it is not as good of a deal as a $16 CD. The data is in a crippled format that is less valuable to me because I may not be able to use it in a few years. If HP or Apple or whoever later decides to stop supporting the format then I am screwed, I can't legally convert the files to another format unless the vendor is nice enough to provide me with an officially sanctioned tool. Do you think they will do that instead of forcing me to buy another copy in a different format?
How am I supposed to keep track of which file came from which vendor and thus needs player X to play?
You don't read slashdot on a very regular basis, do you.
Ah, it's a lovely thought, but let's get real: that HP is long dead, and the bits they didn't spin off with Aligent got taken out behind the woodshed and shot.
No, this thing will be designed by ex-Compaq engineers. It'll be bigger than the Creative Nomad, flakier than the Rio Karma, heavier than the Zen, and more expensive than the iPod.
News for Nerds. Stuff that Matters? Like hell.
all these music services/mp3 players coming out means that 2004 looks to to be the year where mp3 players become commodities. The hardware is at a decent stage (thanks to the iPod). Now all that's left is for prices to come down to walkman/discman-like levels.
How long after the high-quality mp3 player becomes a commodity will it take for Apple to lower down the iPod from luxury-item price levels?
This is the second time today I have written a beware for a similar image. It is not for kids, grandparents, or any faint hearted person. Can someone please mod this down.
1) Servers
2) Printer Supplies
The rest of the product line was basically dead weight. This strikes me as one more piece of dead weight. HP seems desperate to find something that will make money-desperate enough to do just about anything except create strong incentives for technical excellence.
My prediction: The iTunes Music Store will still be going string five years from now, but all but one or two of other digital music stores will be gone.
Lawrence Person (lawrencepersonh@gmailh.com (remove all "h"s to mail)
http://www.lawrenceperson.com/
Word Processing program for Windows
Online Brokerage
Auction Website
Internet Porn
Filesharing App
The Wheel
Sue Open Source for an undisclosed reason
The list just goes on
Sheesh
Finkployd
I can only hope that this one will be availible in Canada. The Apple iTunes sounds really good, and I do *want* to pay for my music downloads, but right now it's just not possible. (Yes, i'm aware of that Canadian service, but the reviews seem to be mixed).
1) burn the
2) rip the virtual CD to your choice of file format
3) place the resulting rip in the right place
All you'd have to do is listen to your music.
Size: Rack mount form factor
Weight: 60lbs
Toronto-area transit rider? Rate your ride.
Al Gore is involved.
When was the last time you saw who's on the Apple board?
Well, I guess thats it. I'm the only entity in the known universe that doesn't have their own online music service.
I thought there was hope for a while, but then when 7-11 was closely followed by Jiffy Lube into the online music business I began to wonder. Next thing you know, like the domino effect each unit in my townhouse community hopped on board the bandwagon.
I'd set up a server too, except there is no longer any music that isn't tied up by exclusive agreements of one kind or another.
And besides, if it were not for me, there wouldn't be any customers^H.
Apple says "We're really not making any money selling tons of music over the interent"
AOL, HP, Wal*mart, Microsoft, Napster, etc all say: "Not making any money?! Shit! I gotta get me some of that!". Hilarity ensues.
Trees can't go dancing
So do them a big favor
Pretend dancing stinks!
do you want a system where music is distributed and listened to in a proprietary format? someone should inform them music companies of this horrendous mistake in the making.
-end of post.
"You can burn every song you download from the iTunes Music Store onto CD".
I admit that Apple's DRM still sucks a little - it means you have to go through the hassle of burning a CD in order to keep your music forever. But it's nowhere near as bad as you think it is. Itunes does not lock you in to Apple.
In fact, a quick Google shows that even the need to actually burn a CD may be optional. Hee hee! Designing a DRM system really is like shovelling back the tide.
If HP tries to achieve lock-in by selling tunes that can't be burned onto plain-jane CDs (and then re-ripped into MP3) then the service will die, just like the old DIVX service died. Why else do you think Apple's DRM has this enormous loophole? It certainly isn't the RIAA's idea.
Aw :( Pete Appl's last name is tantalizingly close to being Apple's Ticker Symbol. Why oh why can't you be "Aapl," Pete?
caritj.org
Equipped with a 192-bit DAC for maximum output quality
That's probably market-speak for an 8-channel by 24-bit DAC, useful for 7.1 channel audio.
Sound recording feature with 1MHz sampling rate
Sony's SACD system, based on pulse density modulation, does 2.8 MHz at one bit per channel.
Have you even used the karma? I've owned one for 3 weeks now, you can read my review here on /.. Yes, the initial firmware release was buggy, but with latest firmware, I've had no problems. I also remember that 2 years ago when I bought a 5GB ipod, the firmware was just as if not more problematic.
Or have their DRM'd files be based on an industry standard.
The AAC bitstream in iTMS purchased tracks is an industry standard, but the DRM wrapper around it is not.
for fellow muso's like myself, you'll be happy to hear how much of that 99cents is REALLY going to the artist... different medium, same assgrind 35cents to apple 53cents to record label 11cents to artist
### http://www.gunfinger.com ### greed / tec
Now most people will start clammering about how the majority of music buyers can listen to 128kpbs aac, mp3, etc, but the people who spend a lot of money on stereo stuff are also the same people who buy the most music. The only pay music site I've seen that caters to audiophiles is livephish.com which offers NON DRMED audio downloads available as a low bitrate mp3 or for audiophile's lossless flac at a higher price. For a music service to truly reach all potential customers it needs to provide multiple quality levels for consumers with different needs.
With Dell, HP, Gateway and the like jumping onto the bandwagon, there's little chance that Microsoft will introduce an upgrade that will break the functionality of the iTMS.
One thing that's missing from all other online music stores it seems, though, is outside promotions. Apple seems to have the jump on everyone with it's Pepsi promotion. I don't see Napster or Dell trying the like to gain market share and brand awareness.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
HP used to be have a good name in computers, while I remember nothing about frustration about Compaq. Anyone remember bios on the hard drives?
I know Dell makes total crap and has terrible tech support for standard users. I've never had less then a 45 minute wait, and their standard fix seems to be to replace it with another POS by overnight mail.
I was wondering if anyone has noticed any changes in HP quality since the merger. Are their computers still worth getting, or have they become more like touchy like compaq? I'll be buying a new computer after christmas and any stories would be appreciated.
What is my guarantee that I will be able to listen to this music in 20 years after I spend the money to license it?
The majority of the music the RIAA is making widely available is stuff you wouldn't want to listen to three years from now, let alone twenty.
And what is it about people here who keep conveniently forgetting that they can, in most cases, burn their purchased DRM music onto CDs and archive them that way? Quit whining already. It's not like the music isn't available on CD at the same time.
I have a HP DE100c (they were discontinued around the time of the merger). It's great 40GB HD, cd burner (can write CDs of MP3s or audio CDs from your MP3 collection), networkable (there is a SMB share that contains a folder where you can upload music to it, and one where you can download music to is).
When you stick a CD in it it goes out and checks CDDB for the artist, album, track titles, etc and displays them on the display (and on the TV via video out). Then you just hit record and they're converted to MP3 and stored on the HD. It has an optical and coax digital out, you can record to MP3s from analog sources, etc.
It is built on RedHat Linux with some sort of SW from RealNetworks helping it do it's charm. It does Internet Radio and there are USB ports that allow for a keyboard (makes typing in unknown CD info faster) and uploading to one of several supported portable MP3 players. These and other features were obviously lining it up to become a device people would use to sample and purchase music online (from an appliance/sterio component, not on a computer, and it updated itself with new features at night by phoning home).
Anyway, I obviously love mine...it's bee good to me. If you Google for "HP DE100c" you'll find there are many people who have now hacked it (they did a decent job of locking people out of the HD) and are doing things like installing ApacheMP3 so they can stream MP3s (so they can enjoy their music when they're not at home).
They're both small hand size edible fruits. ( I got that out of van der lindons just java book)
The big ones, Apple, Microsoft, Dell and HP.
Dell and HP won't last long against MS, assuming MS "helpfully" integrates their music service into Windows Longhorn. Then all the non-technical musicphytes will see an easy way to buy music right away. Apple, on the other hand, with it's already strong following, could stay. Unless, of course, MS moves into the Mac market. Integrating it with Office X, perhaps?
After all, MS really loves helpfully integrating everything, especially when it can't be removed (MSN Messenger, IE, etc. etc.) by standard means.
rio karma....rio karma....rio karma....rio karma....
</subliminal message>
---- Den ene knappen er powerknapp, den andre er Bender voice knapp "Bite My Shiny Metal Ass"
(Unbelievably, this is completely real. It was in a local newspaper in Rugby, Tennessee, which I have seen with my own eyes.)
RUGBY- Contributing Writer
Spencer U. Xahl, a janitor at Wilimington High School in today announced he would the launching the SUX Music Service to compete with new offerings from major companies. Xahl, 42, of Rugby, has never before entered into the technology market, but believes that with his initial launch deal with local band Rocket Saws to provide 75% of the 14 titles to be available he has quite a chance against other major offerings, from companies such as Microsoft, Apple, Dell, HP, Wal-Mart, and others. "I just got this idea, and I think we will do real well once people see the selection in our library. Yeah, I can see SUX becoming Number One fairly soon. Those other companies just won't be able to compete." Xahl told us in an interview yesterday. Xahl also told us he invested nearly $30 in SUX, and plans to have a return of nearly $3 million during the first year. SUX will be available for download in the end of December at it's coming-soon website, www.suxmusicserviceonline.us. We will follow this interesting development in the music industry as it develops.
now what do you have to say now that youve been bitchslapped and RTBLed?
dont whine when you never moderate again.
They're just building a smaller market,
No, they're not. They're messing around with the already existing and rapidly shrinking little joke of a userbase. Maybe you meant they're "building" a smaller market from a subset of the current one?
They're making Hyperion's work on AmigaOS4 an excercise in futility. The project is deliberately being made a waste of time, but ainc's hoping for some quick trademark licencing cash to come out of it all to pay for lawsuits and rent, should they find new offices.
are planning on targeting a larger market with the platform-independant AmigaOS 5 later on
No, they're not. There are no real plans for any "Amiga OS 5", much less any platform independent such. (Besides, their lunatic licencing scheme is supposed to limit the market for "all future versions of AmigaOS", so your point is moot according to ainc itself.) There's some old marketing nonsense on www.amiga.com mentioning "Amiga OS 5" in very ambiguous wording. Nothing about being based on Tao's Intent ("AmigaDE") or providing any platform independence (which long ago proved to be nothing but a pipedream in CTO "Fleecy" Moss' imagination). Note that their web site has so far only been used for outright lies, half-truths, broken promises, laughable estimates, misused dotcom buzzwords and legally dubious fundraising schemes. This is no different.
Competition is good, okay. What bothers me though, is that all of these music sellers are 1) tying your music to a certain platform (windows PC, or Mac OS X for Apple) 2) tying your music (in particular Apple) to a certain hardware (iPod).
Now how am I supposed to buy music from the three or four different sellers (Apple, Dell, HP for example, MS in the future) and keed it organized in one simple library of songs / one MP3 player?
Simple: I can't. I have to have iTunes reading the iTMS songs; WMP playing MS's files, and so on (OK, maybe WMP will be able to play Dell's and HP's songs; doubtbful, but even though, WMP is crap, I want iTunes for all of them).
Just as if I had to organize my CD collection according to the place I bought it in: one shelf (and one dedicated CD player) for CDs bought at FNAC (french retailer), other shelf and CD player for CDs bought at Virgin Megastore, other shelf and player for my favorite independent music store, and so on...
This is total rubbish, and once again in every single case of "format wars" (think DVD-R/+R) I can think of, the consumers are being litterally run over.
Given the fact that only Apple's iTunes is cross platform (thus at least giving me platform choice), i'd go for iTunes. But this shitheads at Apple won't enable WMA on iTunes OR on the iPod. (By the way, don't they face a potential lawsuit situation of unhappy competitors that want to see iPod WMA support?)
That's why I wouldn't buy at the Music Store even if I could (France & Egypt: out of the U.S.), no matter how cool it is: I want to see those matters publicly addressed by the online stores.
I really hope that Apple (and later, the other competitors, which seem unable to do anything differently from Apple) soon realises that format protection is USELESS, and, just as protected CD's, only damages the *customers'* experience (the ones who REALLY want to put their music online for others to download will always be able to, anyways. Apparently with a digital output you can get a perfect copy of your AAC track, not DRM'ed). I hope (somehow paradoxically) the store will be so successful Apple will be "strong" enough to renegociate the deal with the majors and remove DRM for good. But it won't happen, mostly because they make money off iPods, not the Store (therefore the "iPod only" policy is key to their benefits, at least as long as the music store doesn't make money)
Now there is my question:
Would it be possible to build an open source player that would act as a "common interface" above all of the proprietary players (I'm thinking, only remove the GUI part of those players and leave the decoding / DRMing libraries in place, and use them). Probably not, but that would be a project worth a very nice bounty!
Hello! I'm a disaster waiting to happen!
Mods be warned that this is a troll trying to built up karma by rehashing other people's comments.
We all fall for the scam. We follow. We are lemmings. We cannot question The Standard. It's god-made. No one questions The Standard. We know - we fall for the same pyramid scheme. Over and over again. But we can't help it. Maybe we hope for mercy. They couldn't -possibly- push us out of the business after we build it up. Could they? Could they? Noooo.. That would be too evil. Even for them. No way. No way.
What's the outcome if you use WMA - or any other Microsoft-owned standard?
Two possibilities:
- If your business model (heavily dependent on WMA) is a big success, M$ will jump into the game and kick you out by leveraging its control over the standard. Your devices become incompatible. Strange errors creep in. FUD spreads. You are out.
- If you lose money or break even, M$ will stay out of it. Great.
Bottom line: You lose.
Why they do it - i can't comprehend.
You are aware you are at the mercy of one of the most merciless companies ever known? Oh you are, ok.
we want it... we want the shiny thing... yess yess..
HP MusicJet?
They looked at a crowded market place and said "Me too!" -- Homer J Simpson
I am not a number! I am a man! And don't you
With purchased iTunes (FairPlay AAC) you can use an audio capture program (like Audio Hijack Pro) to record the sound output of iTunes.
Second, the iPod will play unproteced MP3, AAC, AIFF, WAV, as well as Audible files (plus a couple of games, display your calendars & contacts, and offer a basic note reader, record voicememos, store digital phtotos, and work as a firewire hard drive).....but more importantly, Apple could simply liscense the Windows Media format so that the iPod will also work with songs purchased from the assortment of other online music stores. Hmm, the leading digital music player just got better all with a simple free software update.
Sure this would really only help the Windows users since the Mac compatible online music store choice is rather limited, though after looking at the other ones at work I can't see any reason why I would use them over the iTunes Music Store.
The collapse of high-bandwidth ISPs didn't compete the market out of existence - it left a few high-priced giants behind and prices soared. Let's hope that's not what happens to music. Considering HP/Compaq were one of the big-bidders on the name "eServer," as opposed to the ones that run on Wizard's dust, one has to wonder whether the e in Apple's name will give them "that edge" or if Appl's lighter load will carry him to the finish.
# sed -e s/Invent/Imitate/p
OGG?
Free programs (i.e. costs zero dollars) that rip to MP3 are plentiful, on every platform. Who cares if those who distribute these programs throw a few dimes Fraunhofer's way?
As for hardware support, all MP3 players play MP3s. Somehow, they have already afforded that, even while paying licensing fees! By contrast, they haven't included OGG support, even though it would cost them no license fees! This proves that license fees are not a problem, and not what's blocking OGG adoption.
This is not to say that MP3 is the best format. I, for one, no longer encode to MP3. I use MPEG-4 AAC instead. It has similar quality benefits to OGG, but unlike OGG (and MP3Pro) actually has the only hardware support that matters. And just like MP3 and OGG, the encoder didn't cost me a dime.
I'm not picking on OGG as a technology, and I don't support the patenting of such silly things as the letter "S," the circle, and the phrase "Your mom." I just don't feel the MPEG patent is terribly cumbersome. It is not as if it requires you to pay royalties every time you encode or play a file for personal use. Fraunhofer invented it. So let them ask a little money of the large corporations that make encoders and players and record labels if they (har har) tried to sell MP3 files, and let those of us who wish to, use a "non-Free" codec. This doesn't hurt the consumer. Now Vorbis is welcome to exist in my universe. It does (at least attempt to do) some cool things that I will freely admit, such as bitrate peeling. I'm just asking you to look past your ideology and see which format has the most benefits to you.