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TiVo to Sell Your Fast-Forward Button
Thomas Hawk writes "PVRblog is reporting today that TiVo will begin to place banner advertisements on your screen when you are fast forwarding. As one of the whole points for people getting a TiVo is to remove obtrusive advertising, it seems like a really bad move to force advertising on people at the exact moment that they are using your technology to avoid advertising. This act points to the desperation of TiVo and their management team and although it might help them in the short run it will most certainly backfire in the long run." This is ironic for a company whose slogan used to be "TV Your Way," but not surprising, since its CEO says he wants to move to a largely advertiser-supported revenue stream. I've bought three TiVos in the past four years, but my next PVR will run MythTV -- unless HR2391 passes and makes me a criminal for skipping commercials.
.... I mean, its not like you are looking at anything useful while you are fastforwarding, and "free tv" needs some sort of revenue.
"When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back!" -- Cave Johnson
Then hammer them with advertising. Its the american way :)
Pete Carr Owner Chatmag.com
All the more reason to get a ReplayTV! I love mine, which I've had for a few years after upgrading the hard drive to a 250 GB model. And DVArchive rocks: download shows and save them for later! Store a whole seasons worth on your PC and access them over the network from your ReplayTV unit.
I don't know, but it works for me.
Suffering Viagra ads while I'm skipping to the money shot.
The real value-add from TiVo here (for me, anyway) is not so much avoiding commercials as it is saving time.
...
If the banner-ad-while-fast-forwarding still allows me to skip 4 minutes of commercials in 5 seconds, that's fine with me, as long as the banner-ad goes away when I'm *not* fast-forwarding
First of all, HR 2391 doesn't make it criminal to "skip commercials".
It's meant to disallow technologies that bypass commercial and advertising content explicitly (such as things like the commercial skip features of old which skipped all ads, regardless of length, and returned you to the programming, or features that simply delete or auto-skip ad content altogether), but it won't prevent good ol' "fast forward" and 30 second skip features from working, nor will it make their use, even for commercial content, "criminal".
However, it's the implementation that is the concern. If the law is *interpreted* to mean that even things like fast forwarding through commercials are inappropriate, well, then we have a problem. But that is NOT the intent nor the purpose.
On the subject of TiVo and placing banner ads during fast forwarding, and the general idea of *automatic* ad content skipping/deletion:
If the entire TV industry is predicated on advertising, and the idea of advertising is predicating on paying to have as many people see your ads as possible (and the payment is proportional to proven amounts of people who may be watching), if an increasing number of people (many in educated and financially stable demographics) have the capability to avoid ever seeing any advertising, what, exactly, makes it worthwhile for advertisers to continue paying for it, at least at the same levels? You are choosing to watch content whose creation and delivery is funded in large part by advertising revenues. What funds it if that model is completely broken?
Sure, your cable/satellite bill can, but only to a point. There are billions of dollars that come from advertising. Is there not that side to this story as well?
What about newspapers? Sure, you can argue that newspaper ads aren't "intrusive", in a time-dependent way, but would a newspaper or its advertisers welcome a service that made it free or easy to eliminate all ads, and keep the other content, while still keeping the newspaper cost at 50 cents?
Additionally, I've seen people here and elsewhere say they actually wouldn't mind "advertising" for products and services they're actually interested in - but at the same time, people argue against giving anyone the data needed to do exactly that kind of targeted advertising as a violation of privacy.
So, my question is, what takes the place of the advertising revenue? How and when is it acceptable for products to be advertised?
Next announcement: It will be a criminal act to get up and take a leak while the commercials are on.
Tivo should be careful. As I imagine more people will become interested in messing with the software in TIVO as it does run Linux. Example, on the major Tivo boards, they don't talk about subscription stealing because Tivo threatened legal litigation over such discussion - fair enough. But if Tivo Corp goes too far than there will be a backlash and people will go just as far. People would (and some do) install a larger drive, hack the advertisement feature, re-add 30 second skip and while messing with it mid as well get a free subscription to boot.
I don't really want to see Tivo go down the tubes but I can imagine that the development community would pick up the charred remnants and actually produce a better product.
I'd think most peoples' motivation is to save the time of viewing commercials, not because of some aversion to advertising.
I'd think as long as the banners don't make the ffwd through commercial slower (by assuring they're on the screen for some specific time) people won't mind.
Better for the marketing folks to pay tivos electric bills then us.
It looks like we've finally found the advantage to being stuck with Series 1 hardware and 2.5.5 software. Almost makes up for not getting Home Media Option and all the other additional features...
TiVo stock was up 7% yesterday on no news whatsoever and another 4% today. (Where "no news whatsoever" means "already known through back channels to everybody on the rumor boards, as well as close personal friends of the executives.)
So the people who own TiVo seem to think that this is a profitable idea. Not just "profitable" in the sense of "charging more" but profitable in the sense of "making more money total", i.e. revenue - customers lost - lawsuits.
Wow, talk about overreacting.
Do you really think Tivo is stupid enough to alienate its customers? If you read the article you'll see that this in no way interferes with skipping commercials. It basically expands the "press thumbs up for more info" tag that appears in the top right of the screen during some commercials and makes them more of a billboard size. This is actually a popular feature among Tivo users as you could say, get a brochure for the new Corvette sent to your home by simply pressing thumbs up during the Chevrolet commercial. I welcome this.
I don't know why anyone bothered with Tivo in the first place - the promise was of "TV Your Way", but TV my way has always been best served by Bit Torrent. It's quasi-legal to be sure, but I can get a 400 meg HDTV broadcast of one of the very few shows I do watch over TV, the commercials are nicely stripped (so I don't even have to fast forward them) and the service is fast and reliable, especially on third generation high-speed internet technology.
If you're getting a TIVO, I'm assuming the moral issue of skipping the stations precious advertisements don't matter to you that much anyway, right?
Allow me to begin by saying that I just purchased a TiVo less then a week ago. I actually netted it for a lousy $30 ($180 on Amazon - $50.00 promotional certificate - $100 mail-in rebate) figuring that I'd get the cheapest one and could always add a Hard Drive later (thanks to TiVo still being somewhat hacker-friendly).
In one lousy week it has already changed the way I watch TV. Just the quick case in point: I didn't start watching Amazing Race until 9:45pm last night. By 11:30 I had seen both Amazing Race and Jon Stewart -- without watching a single commercial. That's 45 minutes of my life to do productive things (or surf Slashdot).
Needless to say I will be the first one to cancel my service (after-all I only have a $30 investment) and stick pins into my TiVo voodoo dolls if they take the fast-forwarding away from me. What the heck would be the point of a DVR if they were to do that? I'd just go back to my VCR days.
But if all they intend to do is place some advertisements on your screen while you are fast-forwarding then what exactly is the big deal? Did Jamie bother to RTFA before he went on his rant about switching to MythTV? To quote: "Kent says the advertising revenue will probably bring down the cost of TiVo to its 2 million subscribers -- currently $12.95 a month" So they sell some ad space (that I can just ignore for those 5-10 seconds I am FF'ing -- less if you use the 30 second hack) and my service becomes cheaper?
Perhaps we should adopt a wait-and-see approach before we break out the torches and pitchforks.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
I apologize for all my whining when I heard that TiVo was going to stop updating my Series 1 software. Now I'm glad I stuck with my old classic.
Once again, our Series 1 value bounces back. I have a series 1 w/ network card, additional hdd, web interface, and lifetime service. You couldn't pay me to trade a series 2 for my series 1.
Listen, TiVo needs to make money. They're a company selling a product. Everyone seems to forget that and whine when they don't give you everything for free. I applaud them for coming up with a way to sell ad space without interfering with normal use of the product.
Nobody's asking to get anything for free. TiVo already charges for the unit and you have to pay a monthly charge to just use the damn thing. If they want to add banner ads and give me the service free, that's great, but it's not what they're doing.
Let them know that you are not pleased. I just sent a message to directv and will follow through with cancellation if this becomes reality. I have a PVR just don't use it because the Tivo is easy for my wife and kids to use.
d back.ds p
Here is a link to the Directv Feedback page,
http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/glb/Form_Fee
and a link to Tivo's contact page
http://www.tivo.com/5.9.asp
TV is a waste of time. The shows are glorified advertisements and the commercials are overwhelming. The best solution is to just skip the whole thing. Spend more time with your family.
Okay then, why not use skip-ahead 30 seconds button or random-access? Oh, TiVo doesn't have that either.
Wrong.
During playback, on your remote, press:
Select - Play - Select - 3 - 0 - Select
and you'll have 30 second skip on your tivo until it loses power for whatever reason.
...yet.
I still have 30-sec skip out of the box and the ability to download shows to my PC with free tools over the built in NIC. Sure, it may not run Linux, but it has 2 advantages over TiVO:
1. It doesn't force me to watch commercials while fast forwarding.
2. It doesn't assume I'm a gay octogenarian and record shows it thinks I'll love.
-EvilMagnus
I used that app for a while too. We didn't have TV for the last 6 months up until this fall. It was nice and my wife and I got a lot of other stuff done, including starting a business. Its amazing what TV sucks out of you. We turned it on again so that we didn't overwork ourselves. Its good to have a break now and again.
I've been tempted to buy a Tivo, but I don't want to dedicate that much to watching TV.
Banner ads while fast-forwarding - what will they think of next?
After hearing about and drooling over the TiVo boxes. I'm glad I built my own HTPC using SageTV and Hauppauge PVR-250 cards. I can record and encode three shows simultaneously while playing a fourth. I can also stream to a client version of the software on my notebook. RealVNC lets me have in-depth control of the HTPC via my notebook to take advantage of my 1680x1050 notebook resolution.
I've got a writeup and pictures of my Home Theater PC setup on my website.
Terry
-phixxr
ungggghhhh
I actually wouldn't object to ads so much if they were more targetted. I couldn't care less about the latest grill or set of knives etc. However if your telling me about a new cheap plasma screen, ipod etc. then I don't mind so much.
I still want to be able to skip ads, but you never know if they were more targetted perhaps I wouldn't skip them as much in the first place *shrugs*
What would you do if you went to the cinema and every 30 minutes they showed you adverts? you'd be a bit miffed.
Being able to skip the commercials is to me about not having my viewing pleasure interrupted by commercials for products I'm not going to buy. I don't need advertising to make an informed choice about buying a product.
Good for TiVo for using their technology for profit. Isn't that the point of going into business?
Ideally (this is how I think it should work, I don't know exactly how it works...):
Think of how many commercials are on the air. If advertisers are concerned about commercial skipping, they pay TiVo for the software needed to encode a billboard into their ad, similar to the "press thumbs up to record" or "press thumbs up for more info" that you see often on NBC.
When TiVo is fast forwarding through the ad and sees the bill board encoded in the video stream, it displays the bill board.
So:
- TV stations are happy because advertisers want to buy longer ad slots in order to increase the time their bill board is on the screen during a TiVo fast forward.
- Advertisers are happy because they have a captive audience for their ads. (you actually have to attentively watch the screen or you'll fast forward into your show)
- TiVo is happy because they have another revenue source.
- TiVo owners are still happy because they are still getting through commercials at the same rate as they did before TiVo added this feature.
Who exactly is loosing?
I'm going to go back in my box and will think within the limits of my box: MS Sucks Linux Good I read too much Slashdot.
In order to use my PC as a PVR I need to be able to bypass my cable box; right now I can't do that, the internal tuner has to stay on channel 3. Does anyone know of software for the Radeon that will descramble the signal? I suppose it would be illegal here in the States?
www.mythtv.org is slashdotted, if that's what it does.
The good and new comes from no quarter where it is looked for, and is always something different from what is expected.
First of all, RTFA... This is not about putting banner ads during fast forward. It is about putting up interaction during ads. This has already been tested and is shown to work. (IE people respond to it).
It is also an article showing that TiVo can provide advertisements that have better response rates than interstitial advertising provides.
But this slashdot posting is editorializing from beginning to end. I can understand that *you* don't wnat to see any advertising ever... Good for you. (but look at the banners at the top and right of the the slashdot page you nit.) But you know nothing about why I or many people have TiVo! And for the most part all this editorializing is WRONG. The interstital is being replaced by the more attractive click-ins. The ads are better produced, more entertaining, more informative. And they are not being replaced by more intrusive advertising. It is being replaced by *less* intrusive and more interactive advertising. And you can still opt out of the data collection! Get a friggin grip.
tivo can do this right by offering service credit to those willing to watch the ads while fast-forwarding. if they really mean "tv your way" then that's the right way. (the wrong way, like the caller-id crap, is to charge the customers to not watch ads during fast-forward.) if you respect the customers, tivo, then give them the choice.
Now your 'jump to index button' (the right arrow pointing at a pipe ->|) will jump 30 seconds if you are in play mode. You can change the 3 and 0 to suit your needs. The 'jump to index' still works as it used to if you are in rewind or fastforward mode.
Big difference here. You paid for your magazine expecting ads. It's part of the package. Now if your magazine offered you a more expensive subscription that would give you a special edition without ads, how would you feel if they suddenly decided to place "a few" ads in your magazine?
I know I'd be hopping mad.
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
Just enable the 30 second skip and you'll never use fast forward to skip commercials again. When it's enabled, the -->| button becomes a 30 second skip button.
To enable:
1. Grab your TiVo remote.
2. Bring up any recorded program. (You have to be watching a recorded program rather than "Live TV" in order to enable the feature.)
3. On your TiVo remote, key in the following sequence:
SELECT PLAY SELECT 30 SELECT
4. If you've successfully entered the code, you should hear three "bings" in succession to inform you that you've successfully enabled the 30 second skip.
The only down side is that any time your TiVo is rebooted (such as after a power outage or a software update) you'll have to re-enable this feature.
The whole point of Cable TV when it was introduced is to offer people a scheme whereby they payed to NOT see commercials. Then execs realized they could make more money by forcing you to watch commercials in addition to paying for TV.
Same thing with movies. For a while, the justification of higher movie ticket prices was the fact that you didn't have to see commercials before the movie. Now they brought that back, so you are once again paying for both content and commercials (typically I will be 10-15 minutes late to a movie so I don't have to sit through commercials.)
Even websites are getting increasingly annoying. A web browser without a popup ad blocker is almost useless. Half the websites you go to, you have to register to view any content, so the company can spam your inbox with product ads. God forbid a person read any content without a million ads in their face.
Now even TiVo has sadly succum to what seems to be a very bad trend in the US. TiVo was one of the few companies that seemed to understand that people DON'T want to constantly be smothered by rediculus ads. One of the few companies using a technology to give power back to the people. But it looks like it wasn't meant to last. Time to kiss that all goodby, and say hello to more pop up ads and spam.
And execs wonder why people do things like pirate TV shows and movies? When you treat your customers like little babies, guess what? Eventually people get pissed off, and will go out of their way to find an alternative system that works for them. Even if it's illegal.
The advent of TiVo undermined this quite a bit, of course, which is why there's a bit of backlash now. Again, I think more people are in it to save time (although there is that "skip annoying commercials" aspect to it...), but circumventing advertisements that pay for the shows you enjoy is a bit of a grey area.
Also interesting is that TFA doesn't make it clear whether the banner ads will be equivalent to the commercial being skipped over, which would raise some issues if advertisers making payments to TiVo overruled those who had paid for a certain time slot. Even if the ads=the commercials, there is some question of who will end up profiting from the exposure-Should Tivo share its money with NBC because one of its banner ads was triggered by a commercial broadcast during one of NBC's programs?
Thank Christ I'm not in advertising!
I feel bad for Tivo owners. I love my ReplayTV 5000. It skips commercials automatically with surprisingly good accuracy. It rarely if ever incorrectly skips content...but sometimes it doesn't realize that a commercial break has begun. In any case, I can just instantly jump forward 30 seconds (or however far I want).
Tivo is the AOL of PVR's.
There is no gravity...the earth just sucks.
I mean seriously folks.
Advertising is here for good. It's a mainstay of our entire socio-economic model.
Of course, as television changes, so will the way advertising works.
For all of you that are 'shocked, shocked' that Tivo intends to get into the ad business, wake up and smell the coffee. Business is about money and ads are where the money lives.
nuclear iraq bioweapon encryption cocaine korea terrorist
Yes, I use TiVo to skip over commercials. I also use FF for shows I can watch without sound and faster than real time. Will the service know if I'm FF over a commercial or for some other purpose?
For example I can watch a 3-hour football match in about half the time. I don't need the analyst's inane chatter, and I can always go back to regular speed to catch a big play.
In addition, this 'feature' contradicts TiVo's own marketing. There's no sound while a show is in FF, but one of TiVo's tips is to turn on the closed captions and read the dialogue while watching the show faster.
If the banner ad is anywhere on the screen where I can see it, then it is intrusive.
"Listen, TiVo needs to make money. They're a company selling a product. Everyone seems to forget that and whine when they don't give you everything for free. I applaud them for coming up with a way to sell ad space without interfering with normal use of the product."
That's just wrong. TiVo gives NOTHING for free. I've already paid for the hardware and paid for the service, and I didn't whine about it. This is TiVo unilaterally changing the terms of the deal after they have my money. Would you applaud nVidia if they decided to display banner ads on every computer with their graphics cards? Listen, nVidia needs to make money, right?
"What would you rather have, no fast-forward, forcing you to watch commercials, or a fast-forward with a small screen overlay that you only have to look at for as long as you are fast-forwarding?"
I'd rather have the service I paid for. But you're missing the real question, would you rather have FF with a small screen overlay, or a boat anchor that's useless if TiVo goes out of business and no other company picks up the service?
Doing a bit of digging, I find that Tivo is a public company. Some information on them:
Company Profile
Company Two Year Stock Chart
This move seems to be a result of the hard stock price drop which occurred between March and September of 2004. I've always thought of corporations as one of those huge Euclid off road dump trucks with the 12' tires, and no power steering.
Pete Carr Owner Chatmag.com
I have a mythTV with 500GB of attached storage and it just rocks... I originally owned a tivo (added 80GB to it), loved it, but didn't want yet-another-monthly-bill after that tivo died and wanted something where I can dump my DVD collection with either a DVD jukebox or massive storage. its absolutely brilliant, no monthly fees, I get CVS builds once every few weeks, I have a nice quiet Antec Sonata case hidden away, and I have over 200 DVDs I ripped using mythTV so I can watch them whenever I want, however I want. LOL i use mythTV more for the ripped DVDs than TV, I probably only watch 3-4 hours of recorded TV per week (daily show, 24, amazing race, will & grace). The only improvement to mythTV I hope to see is picture quality... imo the PVR-250/350s that most people use for recording isn't the highest quality, I think my Tivo had slightly better TV quality and much, much faster channel changing while watching live. Hopefully a next generation of HDTV PC cards will come out without silly cap'ing problems and we will all be happy :)
These days, companies are finding it harder and harder to stay in business. It's a bad economy. In a better economy, there would be more TiVo customers, and they would be able to make enough revenue, but unfortunately, every company, and TiVo is no exception, is finding it hard to make ends meet.
We're used to hearing about how greedy companies are. And there are plenty of them, with Microsoft being their poster-boy. But when you're a company with real competition, then you're walking a fine line between making enough income and selling at a competitive price. It's hard to balance. Apple is one of the few companies that seems to be able to charge a premium with impunity.
I'm not saying I know for SURE that TiVo is struggling financially, but given the statistics, they probably are. Making that assumption, they are faced with a choice between increasing what they charge customers or finding some OTHER way of increasing revenue. Selling banner ad space is just such an alternative.
Frankly, I suspect that most people would prefer to see an unintrusive banner appear when fast-forwarding than to have to pay a higher monthly fee.
Will I get cheaper monthly service fees for my Tivo because their costs will be offset by *shudder* these banner ads?
Granted, if TiVo needs the ad revenue to stay solvent, I guess it's necessary (the TiVo is doorstop without the service, well sorta =))
But they might be shrinking their market to tap these new ad based revenue streams, which will make the ad placements be worth less...
Apparently it won't be cable companies clumsy DVR's, or even us diy PVR'ers (shameless plug), or dillution of "brand/identity" that kills TiVo... it will be TiVo killing TiVo with practices and commitments that aren't in their CONSUMERS best interest.
Why would someone who buys a special box and pays a monthly (or lifetime) service fee to skip commercials put up with replacement commercials during the commercial skipping process?!?! Whiskey Tango Foxtrot!
Furthermore what advertiser in their right mind would want to reach people that ADD and disposition makes them actively adverse to ads? And if tivo's DVR/PVR share decreases what will those banner ads be worth to the advertisers then?
Will DirecTivo's be effected by this change? (and will this hasten DirecTV's dance away from TiVo specific DVRs?)
*Shrug*
Build Your Own PVR/HTPC news, reviews, &
Skipping the commercials in broadcast television is no more theft than eating from the sample tray at your grocery store. The broadcast company is gambling that as you watch their content you will be convinced to make a purchasing decision based on its the advertising portion. Just like your local grocer is gambling that you will may like the products that he has on his sample tray enough to buy them.
The problem here is that this gamble hasn't been paying off lately and the advertising industry has been looking outward for someone to blame rather than looking inward and seeing how they are a large part of the problem. Our world is so filled with advertising now that it's impossible for any one spot stick out. The result is that none of the advertising is persuasive and the industry is losing its gamble wholesale. The broadcast industry is at risk that their clients will decide that this type of advertising doesn't work.
If we are very very lucky this entire industry will collapse or explode and everyone will get up off of the couch and go running or read a book like you say.
-- Ecks
My other Beowulf cluster is... er...
Been using mythTV for over a year now and commercials ARE that bad. My broadcast channels show commercials that are far worse than any commercials on my dishnetwork channels.
Once you are used to watching commercial free and something happens (computer crash etc...) and you watch TV you feel assaulted after watching the commercials. I don't want to know (nor my kids to know) about the newest (fe)male enhancement drug.
I don't care about the next episode of some stupid sitcom with low ratings.
People say tv makes you dumber. I would have to say that commercials just add to that. Why waste 15 minutes watching an hour show when you can watch it later and in shorter time
The only dissadvantage to not having commercials is trying to make time for a pee break(oh I guess that is what the pause button is for)
Can you ping me now?... Good!
This just in: "A new bill being lobby for in congress will make it illegal for you to leave your television off." Providers of entertainment, in desperate need of more money intend to enable police officers to detain you for not watching television.
God: "I don't leave footprints!"
I doubt they'll lower the cost; they'll just consider this a way to lower losses.
I'd own a second (and possibly third) Tivo if I didn't have to buy subscriptions for all of them. That's just lunacy, especially when the two other units could just copy the data from one of the units, in effect costing Tivo zero in delivery costs.
If the banner ads are a problem, I'll just keep using my 2nd gen standalone until it craps out and then rent (for $5 per month) a hidef PVR from the cable company. It'll suck more than the Tivo, but it'll record Hidef (satellite HDTivo isn't an option where I live) and I won't have any money sunk into the hardware.
Among Tivo's many idiotic decisions are wasting too much development effort on non-core features (such as MP3s and photos), failure to deliver more core features (batch save/play), no cablecard-based unit on the horizon (HD recording, no IR blasting for digital cable channels), and little if any evolution of the hardware (firewire disk expansion and DVD-R add-ons).
Adding banner ads is just another stupid decision on their part to cover up the other stupid decisions on their part.
It's about time for the cheap, generic PVRs from China to start appearing. Pure product, no service, price around $79 and dropping.
Just over four years here.
Whenever I get stuck in the vicinity of a blaring TV set (e. g., waiting room) I become very uncomfortable; it feels to me as if I were being pounded on, the absolute worst being daytime shows like low brow talk shows featuring low class idiots and corresponding commercials (used cars, bad credit, shysters, plugs for other idiot shows, etc.)
I bring something to read, but if I can't find a quiet place to sit, I might have to consider bringing earplugs.
Best troll I've read all week.
Sigh. Trolls used to be a whole lot better. In the old days, someone would have argued that not watching advertising was equivalent to murder, or something.
TiVo is essentially capturing a TV signal, filtering out the original advertising, and replacing it with their own. If this isn't IP theft, I don't know what is. The TV networks and their advertisers should sue, and if they do, they should win.
You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
TiVos by default do not have any "quick jump" feature. You have to literally fast-forward through commercials. However, there's a widely-known code you type into the remote to turn on a 30-second instant skip feature. So when I skip commercials, I'm never fast-forwarding; I press the jump button 6 or 8 times and that's it. The whole thing takes like 3 seconds. As long as they don't remove that feature, super-anti-commercial people like me will still be happy.
I own 3 TiVO's and have modified them with larger disks, network connectivity, and video extraction capability. I've been doing this since I bought my first TiVO in Fall 2000.
One of the primary drawbacks to root'ing your TiVO was that the next time a software update was transmitted from the magic entertainment boob in the sky, all your hard work would be erased, as the update would wipe the OS install clean (usually).
While my work in the TiVO community has dwindled significantly in the past months, I did happen to take note of a warning that said something to the effect of "Disable Remote Update". I'm not certain what this feature of the hack does, but it sounds (at least from the name) that it would not allow TiVO or DTV to upgrade your TiVO's OS from 3.1 to 3.x in the future.
I'm going to go look into that option now. But I think that if you really feel strongly about TiVO and DTV whoring themselves to the ad-nipple in California, you might want to invest a Saturday afternoon in root'ing your TiVO so that you won't receive this unwanted feature.
-c
Do it for da shorties
Once upon a time, I watched little to no TV -- and by that, I mean I watched a Simpson's episode once every few weeks, and that was it.
Then TiVo came along (my wife, who watches TV, wanted it) and I was totally drawn in. Freed from having to pay attention to programming schedules and whatnot, and given the ability to pause live TV and skip commercials, I started watching more TV. Now, a weekly roster includes NASCAR racing, three or four programs from the Cartoon Network, the Daily Show, and other tidbits.
Then, several months ago, TiVo tried a new kind of advertisement wherein an interstitial ad popped up when you tried to reach the main menu, asking you if you wanted to find out more, or continue on to the menu. It infuriated me (and others in public forums) because it put the advertising in the way of the menu I was trying to access, which was highly intrusive.
I was ready to get rid of TiVo at that point, but evidentally the TiVo folks got a lot of flak for it, because the next ad showed up as a link in the main menu instead -- and I decided it was acceptable since I could safely ignore it.
Well, my jury's still out on this one. If the ads are merely visual annoyances that can be ignored (I do, after all, watch NASCAR, so I'm used to it) I'll continue the service, but if the ads in any way interfere with the usability of the device, I think I'm done.
And that, at the end of the day, would be a good thing. It's too easy to forget that TV is a toy, not a necessity.
Expecting something for nothing is not a new concept but doesn't scale well. Skipping commercials is a technological response to an economic problem, and won't legitimately work. If we want commercial-free programming, the money's gotta come from someone other than advertisers. While I'd like being able to skip the commercials, and could set up a MythTV box to do so, the economic model can't support everyone doing so.
Until we adopt pay-tv like Great Britain, in the American model of TV economics it's those pesky commercials that pay for the non-premium programming.
Slashdot's name? When my compiler sees
It may surprise you to consider that producers of television entertainment are not in the business of delivering entertainment to consumers.
They are in the business of delivering consumers to advertisers.
Delivering entertainment to consumers is simply a side-effect of their reason for being in business -- it's just one means to achieve their purpose. As soon as it doesn't work, there's no reason for them to keep producing the side-effect (your shows) instead of looking for a better way to deliver your attention to advertisers.
$0.02,
ptd
I'm an animal lover -- they're delicious!
Ok, before you all go & cancel your subscriptions, you might want to READ THE DAMN ARTICLE. "TiVo viewers will see "billboards," or small logos, popping up over TV commercials as they fast-forward through them, offering contest entries, giveaways or links to other ads." Not quite the overwhelming barrage of advertising that some of you seem to be implying. Would I rather the ads weren't there? Sure. But I don't really care that they are.
Contrary to what the post implies, people don't buy a Tivo to "avoid advertising". They buy it so they can watch shows how & when they want, and so that they can fast-forward through advertising. You can still fast-forward through the ads, you'll just be shown a logo on the screen during the ad you're fast-forwarding through. This will likely be no more intrusive then the "Record this program" logo that shows up one ads for certain TV programs already. Not the end of the world, really.
Finally, I want to know, why is there such an overwhelming anti-Tivo sentiment on Slashdot? I understand the anti-Microsoft sentiment. But Microsoft is a company that makes frequently bad products, charges outrageous prices (that you really have no choice but to pay), offers lousy customer service, routinely violates anti-trust laws, Etc.. NONE of these really apply to Tivo. Some people object to their monthly fees, but if you don't like it you can feel free to build your MythTV box. But you'll probably end up spending considerably more in the long run, and be prepared for lot's more hassles, Oh, and your TV litings, though free, won't go as far in advance (last I checked xmltv only gave you one week of listings), and be prepared to upgrade xmltv at least every couple of months, sometimes twice a week (usually with no advance notice-- your listings just stop working).
Tivo makes a solid, VERY well designed product. They sell it cheap, but charge a reasonable monthly fee to use the service. They're even reasonably supportive of the hacking community. Yes, they hope to make a profit in the process. What's really wrong with that?
You know, executives are crazy. Why force people to watch something when you already *know* they will watch it if you give them access to it voluntarily?
For example, commercials... Anyone ever heard of the endless commercial channel known as "The Shopping Channel"? Crap, I'm paying to get this thing in my cable setup. There are people who have this abomination hard wired into their TV so that they don't have to be subjected to any actual content in their viewing pleasure.
Here's what I want from a PVR: When the commercials are coming up, instead of skipping them, give me a menu of all the commercials and allow me to choose to watch one if I want. Also give me a an option *not* to watch any. Give me the option to ban specific ads (for content inappropriate to my family) on my PVR too. Finally, give me a list of all the ads associated with a show and allow me to save the ads separately (in case it's a particularly good one and I want to show my friends).
Let's face it. Some people don't want to see any ads. Showing them ads will just piss them off and make them *less* likely to buy your product. The *vast majority* of people actually want to see some ads and would choose to watch them at least once or twice if given the option.
I don't see the point in forcing people to view an ad for a product that they don't want. In some cases (McCain's!!!!!) the ads themselves are so bad that some people (I won't mention any names) boycott the product just because of the ad.
What if you got MythTV working well on an X Box? Then you'd have a Tivo replacement that's about the same price as a Tivo, but (obviously) with all the advantages of open source.
Linux already boots on XBox, so isn't it possible to make MythTV work? Am I the first to think of this?
I, for one, welcome our new Antichrist overlord.