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Independents Push For Second Firefly Season
ovanklot writes "It seems that Brilliant Screen Entertainment is looking to see if there is an audience for a second season of the science fiction show FireFly.
From the article: 'It's possible that subscribers may choose one of three playback options; monthly DVD deliveries, TV On-Demand using your cable or satellite provider, or computer viewing via Streaming Download.'" They are asking folks to fill out a short survey to gather demographics for support in their efforts to get Fox to release the show to them. The site also stresses that they want neither money nor confidential personal information.
Tried to fill out the survey but there is no option for "pirate box" under the cable/satellite operator.
Buncha cowardly, inbred piss pots...
"Sic Semper Tyrannosaurus Rex."
Wouldn't science fiction of the real future already know this information?
The Custom Mary
The absolute best fans can hope for at this point is a straight-to-dvd 2nd season release.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
I both liked the series and the Movie, but to have to "pay" for MORE of serenity, I'd rather not have to sign up for yet another service. I would rather Sci-fi channel pick the series up than give it to these SOB's who just want to make more shows and then make you pay for em. I first rented serenity, then bought the series, saw the movie in theaters and bought the movie. I have way to many "subscriptions services" as it is and there is no way in hell i'm going to sign up for just one more for just one show that i like.
It's about time that production companies considered DVD subscriptions.
I filled out the survey, and I encourage others to do the same. It takes less than two minutes and you don't even have to give any personal identifying info if you don't want to.
FOX (or any other major network, for that matter) will NEVER release the rights to any of their shows. The X-Files 2 has been in talks for years but nothing has been moving because Chris Carter is fighting for control over the franchise from FOX. The big networks have all the chips; for what possible reason would they give that up? Unless you're going to drop a huge pile of money on their desk, you are not going to accomplish anything. The television industry is just as greedy as the music industry. You wouldn't expect Warner Brothers Music to give up control of "their" music; why would you expect them to give up control of "their" show or movie? The studios make a lot of profit from selling old shows, music, and movies. They are not going to give that up.
Seriously - do these guys have any standing, any connection, any track record that would lead anyone to suspect that they could actually produce the show? And do they have any connection with Whedon and company that would indicate that Whedon would *let* them produce it?
If you're not interested in the show, why did you even bother to read past the title? Nobody forced you to invest any time and you're not entitled to a refund.
Good, inexpensive web hosting
I've never seen Firefly and I probably wouldn't be that interested in it, but I'd rather encourage people to fight for what they want, than sit back and spout pointless cynicism.
But, this isn't the way the broadcast world works. You aren't going to find any execs making decisions out of the kindness of their hearts. The only way they would sell the rights would be if someone made a large enough offer and I doubt this group can come up with that amount. Not to mention how Whedon would feel. Last interviews I read he said the Firefly universe was done for him. Also, an amateur production or even low budget might do more harm than good in the eyes of Fox so they might not let it go for that reason as well.
http://whedonesque.com/comments/9347
The creator has said it's done, fox has said it's done, it has underperformed time and time again. And if you think there is any chance of a studio "surrendering" the rights to a show you know even less about the entertainmant industry than I do.
"The crows seemed to be calling his name, thought Caw."
The absolute best fans can hope for at this point is a straight-to-dvd 2nd season release.
That sounds significantly better than a TV release to me!
If Firefly is judged on actual sales instead of some idiot at a studio imagining that some lesser show would fare better in the same time slot, then FireFly will do pretty well - as evidenced by DVD sales thus far.
Frankly I could stand to have TV as we know it disbanded and just buy all entertainment either online or via DVD. I would not miss these archaic things we call "channels" whatsoever.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Ya know, seeing Serenity cured me of any further desire to indulge in the act of watching Firefly...
That's a pretty bold statement.
A republic cannot succeed till it contains a certain body of men imbued with the principles of justice and honour.
I don't see this as anything more than a larger level fanboy effort.
You mean like the one that managed to get a major motion picture created from thin air?
This is the age of large level fanboy efforts actually gaining traction.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
It looks a little on the underdone side so far, but they're looking for information. That info could sway serious financial backers. Nothing like numbers to convince money-men that there's a buck to be turned off of us Browncoats... even if the numbers come from a goofy web form. It's probably the same folk what tried to finance the second season through donations (you may remember from a couple of weeks ago... they had to return them for reasons). I filled out the survey as I would like to see more of the show. I urge y'all to do the same. Maybe start to figure out a way to get better TV made and delivered in the process. I think it's shiny.
-mattzog http://www.micromatic.org/
Really folks, can't we get rid of this sort of stuff?
Well, if I buy the DVD of the series I will be paying $2 per episode...
Send email from the afterlife! Write your e-will at Dead Man's Switch.
After they killed the best character in the series, Wash, in the movie, I suddenly stopped caring about firefly altogether. I even gave away my DVDs of the original series because I was so disgusted.
Just my $0.02.
Oh God, oh God, please bring back Firefly and we can continue to live!
Obviously they pulled the plug because of perceptions about how many viewers they had. Afterwards, the movie "Serenity" came out. I think the best strategy to get the show back on is to get copies of "Serenity" purchased and rented, and the same for the DVDs of the series. That way, the studio should say "Oh, I people didn't know about this before and do now since the movie came out". If they see signs that more people will be watching, they will probably renew. I also think getting the old episodes on iTMS or other video download or pay-per-view would be good, but they might try to milk the hardcore fans instead of actually renewing the series on non-pay channels, like Sci-Fi.
Sure many of us here do. But after the "Abysmal", and thats being polite, showing of the Firefly Serenity movie, Where would the motivation even be?
Is that if Fox brings it back, the bunch of idiots will make money. I really hope they release it to someone else with more sense.
-All that is gold does not glitter - Tolkien
www.ra
Fans can make new episodes with their home gear and dedication, right?
Trekkies are producing new "original series" episodes, so why wait for a studio to pick up on Firefly?
I've never seen Firefly and I probably wouldn't be that interested in it, but I'd rather encourage people to fight for what they want, than sit back and spout pointless cynicism.
Bffft, but that takes effort and doesn't provide me with instant gratification or a false sense of superiority. What fun is that?
Help me take back Slashdot. When did 'News for Nerds' become 'FUD and Conspiracy Theories for Extremist Nutjobs'?
This series is what got my fiance hooked on sci-fi. Now she's watched all the star wars films, and wants to read/watch more sci-fi stuff. I'd love to see more Firefly.
I loved firefly. I loved the dynamic between the people. After what Joss did to some of the characters at the end of the movie (unless, certain people with the name Wash get resurrected, which may happen in the Buffy-verse, but I doubt will in the Firefly-verse), the show might be over for me, even if it is brought back to life. I thought the interaction between Wash and Zoe was one of the great parts of the show.
In the end, I did fill out the survey, and said I would definitely watch it if they were to bring it back. I have faith in Joss, and hopefully he can remedy his errant ways.
I've never seen Firefly and I probably wouldn't be that interested in it...
Which, translated from Reaver-speak means "You'd be hooked by the 3rd episode".
"To make a mistake is only human; to persist in a mistake is idiotic." Cicero
Guys, while I absolutely love the series, I dont' think it'll happen either. WE aren't just looking at the idea of Joss Whedon coming back into the picture (especially while getting moveis like Wonder Woman) but think about the time span since the series. Do you really think they're going to be able to get all the actors back into the series? and will the chemistry be the same? What I wouldn't mind seeing and would be a possibility is maybe the same universe but another cast, with writers like Tim Minear on it again it could be doable. But frankly there's never going to be the money for it. After cancelling Angel right before it's last season was to wrap up when it was the top show on the network Fox pretty muched showed it's ineptitude.
In that case I live in hope that Fox Japan will show it at some point in the future.
If Spock can be resurrected, so can your favorite character. Remember, it's science FICTION. Personally, my favorite character is the one played by Jewel Staite (the engineer).
I have seen some of it, and I found it awful, but I'd *still* like to see something like this happen because:
1) I'm not the only person in the universe - just because I don't like something doesn't mean that I should be opposed to other people having it, especially since...
2) I don't have to watch it.
3) This type of model - DVD subscription or something - might get applied to something I *do* like.
4) It's kind of funny when people who are fans quote the show at me and I look at them blankly - fans are always surprised when they discover that someone like me is a non-fan.
So good luck.
Since I can't tell them apart, I treat all ACs as the same person.
My guess is that there will either be a prequel, or a lot of flashbacks. Remember, there are 8 months of un-accounted for time between the series and the movie. Whatever it turns out to be, I trust the guy's storytelling abilities enough to believe it won't be cheesy.
In any case, Wash and Book are not gone.
My script don't crash! She crashes, you crashed her!
This is about the same as some independent mod team looking to make a game mod out of someone else's IP (actually, much more pie-in-the-sky thanks to the costs associated with producing the actual episodes, if they did get permission, which they won't).
It wouldn't fly no matter which big broadcaster owned the Firefly rights, and the fact that it is Fox should make this extremely obvious to anyone with half a brain.
I wouldn't mind seeing a series based on River and her kicking ass as a psychic assassin in the renewed revolt against the republic.
Maybe I'm just too much of a geek, but 'Underhill' is always a pseudonym to me.
I signed up anyway thought...
-- I care not for your foolish signatures.
Redundant indeed.
Stop saying what we already know.
I watch very little TV and had little interest in either Serenity or Firefly ... that was before a friend suggested it over the weekend.
I'm up to the 5th episode - and actually look forward to watching a little each night.
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet
Very relevant, and far more detailed, links:
e wtopic.php?p=50254
e wtopic.php?t=1580
"Investigating FireflySeason2 dot com":
http://www.serenitymovie.org/browncoats/forums/vi
FireflySeason2.com's founder, Mr. Ace Underhill, responds and explains:
http://www.serenitymovie.org/browncoats/forums/vi
The Whedonesque thread surveying the brouhaha:
http://whedonesque.com/comments/9347
The Trade Paperback of the 3 Serenity comics by Dark Horse is coming out 2/01/06
1 0-759
http://www.darkhorse.com/profile/profile.php?sku=
Insert Sig Here
Wait... that made WAY too much sense and showed a high level of intellect and decency...
What the heck are you doing on Slashdot?
I've been thinking about how a viewer-funded TV show could generate additional income without requiring copyright to protect future profits. One way I came up with would be fan-paid trips to the set, and even fan-paid walk on appearances.
I've offered to US$500 to sponsor another season of Firefly. I'd likely pay US$2000 to get my name in the credits somewhere. I've done it at museums and other sponsorship activities -- not out of altruism but out of pure ego.
I'm not a browncoat, but I do love the show. I bought the DVD set before watching the TV show or even hearing about it anywhere, and it sat in the shrink wrap for months. Once I watched it (after 2 false starts) I realized that we need the first viewer-produced show.
I'd love to see Firefly v.2 be Whedon's real trial into seeing what one could do with an Open Source style show. Honestly, the costs of doing a show differently than a la Hollywood could bring in way more income without having to require people actually pay for the show. Let us produce it (meaning pay for it), let it be freely downloaded by the masses (maybe give it to the sponsor/producers first though and let them give it away to friends and family and then throw it online).
I think it would be very interesting to see how it goes. Of course Whedon would never allow it, but I'd put my money where my mouth is to get it going and the best way to generate interest is to offer it as the first big major production given away, with the full rights to the characters and name in the public domain. Imagine the fan fiction that could come out of it if the production company also offered to add fan-fic vignettes into the actual "official" episodes. Render your own battle scenes, video tape your own bar cut scenes, whatever. Want it in the show? Send it to us. Help us keep the show alive with your cash, while you're at it.
Serenity/Firefly is the most anarcho-capitalist plotline I've ever seen. I'd love to see freedom in the next production, not just in the plotline.
If there were another series or movie, I'd like them to ditch the superhero karate girl, and downplay the comical zombie creatures. The characters are and the setting as originally conceived were interesting, and should have merited a more grown-up movie.
after the end of the movie, it seems pretty clear that a season 2 would be pretty pointless. I mean (not to spoil anything, but) there's almost nothing left at the end-literally.
Why wait? Amazon is your friend!
You can order the FireFly Series on DVD...
or the Serenity Movie (Widescreen, of course!)...
And yes, Amazon ships to Japan!
I would watch the series first, though, as the characters are introduced in much more detail, and it has many very comical scenes (especially concerning Shepherd and River... I giggle just thinking about her "fixing" the bible...)
Salud!
"To make a mistake is only human; to persist in a mistake is idiotic." Cicero
I don't understand why you would post that, is it for kicks? Surely if that is what you believe, you would have the stones to stand by your remarks and not post as an anonymous coward. no?
In the beginning there was nothing. Which exploded!
I didn't watch Firefly when it aired on Fox. I just wasn't hooked by their commercials, and it didn't come on with regular frequency.
Based on fanboy comments and movie reviews, I purchased the series on DVD a few months ago. I now like the series very much. And even though someone thoughlessly revealed spoilous (sp?) info, I've just purchase Serenity from http://dvdempire.com/. I look forward to watching it.
Long Live Wash!
Bello vel Pace Paratus.
I wrote in my profile that I consider a 40-minute episode of Firefly at least as valuable as a full-fare ticket to a movie, which would make a 22-episode season of new shows worth about $200 to me.
There are thousands of people like me out there. The signal will not be stopped.
-- I wanna decide who lives and who dies - Crow T. Robot, MST3K
Are the actors supposed to just sit around/modify their schedules for this?
Ah, but 'sucks' is such a relative judgement, isn't it?
I thought TV sucked 15 years ago when I discovered the internet* and stopped watching, but Judith H. Crist! have you watched anything on the tube lately???
Watch MTV or Elimidate for five minutes and listen...that's the sound of your brain cells losing turgidity, collapsing into flaccid heaps.
Firefly could only be an improvement.
*-Yes, yes, yes, the internet sucks too, but it's interactive suckage, man!)
"To be fair, I was left completely unsupervised." ~Anon
i didnt give this show a chance when it was on tv, because it was on Fox. I have a low opinion of Fox shows, other than the Simpsons.
Not because I hate Fox or anything, but because I just don't get alot of their shows.
I wish I had given this show a chance, because once I saw it on SciFi channel, I was hooked. I can't believe that it didn't survive on network television, but I'm thinking it might be because of dumbasses like myself (not watching it).
The way that Mal guy acts and talks is perfect. He has a perfect grasp of that character.
Why can't the SciFi channel pick this show up? It'd be a ratings success. just throw it in the mix on Fridays after Battlestar Galactica or something to start out, that'd be one helluva lineup. Stargate, Stargate Atlantis, Battlestar Galactica, Firefly. wow.
Hey, Where'd Walsh and Book go this season?
If Joss makes it, my family and I will watch it. I'd love to buy the a DVD set of season.
Keep on flying
I loved the series. I hated Fox for cancelling it, and the TV-viewing public for not getting it. I pre-ordered the series DVDs and picked them up the day they came out. I saw the movie in theaters four times, the first time a preview screening for which I stayed up until midnight waiting for tickets to the Georgetown showing to go on sale online (I got mine in the 2-4 minutes it took for them to sell out). I got five other people who had never heard of Firefly to watch the DVDs, after which all went to the movie. And of course I bought the movie on DVD as well.
So to those browncoats who just won't let it go, from a fairly rabid Firefly fan: GET A LIFE! It's dead. Done. Joss tried. Fans tried. Fox fucked it up, but Universal gave the movie a decent shot and it died a quick death, this time on it's own. There is no audience. Enjoy the comic books, but MOVE THE HELL ON.
You people scare me. Seriously.
Did they bother polling Joss Whedon to see if he... you know.. felt like writing a second season?
"Eagles may soar, but weasels dont get sucked into jet engines."
You need to get to the point where the CEO of Fox starts throwing chairs when somebody mentions Firefly. Maybe then, they will decide to sell the rights.
(This joke was stolen from Penny Arcade)
My script don't crash! She crashes, you crashed her!
(Have to pick firefly from the drop down box) http://cubemonkey.net/quotes
http://cubemonkey.net/quotes -- fortune-mod quote generator
Is it just me, or does the little Star Trek "Corbomite Maneuver" head (used as Slashdot's Sci-Fi icon)look a little more surprised than usual?
Just because you can mod me down, doesn't mean you're right. Shoes for industry!
First, you actually read the post, then you posted it. So, no you can't have 20 seconds of your life back. In fact, you owe me a couple of minutes. Pay up.
Anyone who whines about being modded down should be.
Since the movie pretty much solved all the primary mysteries and romantic tensions from the TV show. The only thing I think they didn't explain or solve was the back history of the Preacher. So they's need to start from scratch with a whole new plot.
What I'd like to see is the whole thing released to the Creative Commons and let the fans start making their own content. Similar to the way Lucas does it with Star Trek, but without all the fascist rule mongering and Copyright trouble.
Peace, or Not?
Why piss with airtime - when the real money is in DVD sets and rentals?
make the DVD set HDTV widescreen...
and reencode it in iTunes for people who just want to 'pod it, at a slightly lower cost.
Big fans will get the HDTV DVDs,
slight fans will grab the pod versions.
The video quality of the next iPod should be better, by the time they got a whole season shot.
Will it turn a buck?
I donno...
And the hair ... there's just too much hair ...
Elvis has left the building... um no he hasnt. Elvis has finally left the buliding!!!! Wait Elvis still seems to be in the building. (BANG,BANG) Elvis has been shot and killed in the building.
"As if sitting in front of a computer isn't enough, your going to go home and watch tv? Get a life." ... said the guy named P3NIS_CLEAVER on Slashdot.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
It's like Star Trek, but with more Civil War-type uniforms. Kinda.
I've only watched the first episode or two. I wasn't impressed.
the guy who put up this site is apparently just some looney who hasn't even spoken to joss whedon:
http://whedonesque.com/comments/9347#107035
that I will gladly accept all of the money and personal information that would have been sent.
The cost _per episode_ of the original series was $2,000,000.
Unless there are at least two hundred and twenty thousands of people just like you out there then you're still coming up a wee bit short.
This is a series that just wont die.
Why should it? People are dying for it. Its got the same buzz that StarTrek had before it got screwed up with bad writing.
Let them find funding and NOT struggle with the networks for the show's distribution.
Let them shoot it in HD-TV and podcast it themselves.
I'd download it directly from their servers via the iTMS for $5.99 an episode.
Wanna bet that the next Disney Pixar feature is made available in EXACTLY that way.
Wanna bet that 'straight to DVD' features go straight to podcast instead?
Why pay for even DVD production right when you can get the money right out of consumer's pockets?
That how you make money. By cutting out the middle man.
No theatre to pay for.
No film 'canning' and reproducing to pay for.
No ad-men to pimp out your show with product placement to 'maximize the revenue stream.'
That's what I'm talking about...
MSBPodcast.com The opinions expressed here are my own. If you don't like 'em... Think up your own stuff.
I was under the impression that FOX owns the television broadcasting rights to Firefly for 10 years, and they were unwilling to give it up to other studios without lots of money to entice them. What FOX gave up was the movie rights to Universal - or something like that.
FOX knows there is a following behind this group, and giving up the rights away will only make the other people ("not FOX") money - the network doesn't want THAT to happen, so better off just holding on to the rights, so that NOBODY profits (look what happened to Star Wars, all that MORE money Fox COULD have made). It's kinda like the greedy kid with all the toys not willing to share - well, that's my theory anyways.
Forget Fox and Joss Whedon and everything else like actors doing other things.
It costs a min of $3 million per hour in Canada with a favorable exchange rate and subsidies to shoot non-effects dramas like those Lifetime stuff. For an effects laden show like Firefly make that about $4-5 million. Studios gamble on running a loss during broadcast (nets only pick up about 1.5-2 million per) to get the lucrative back end syndication deals and DVD sales.
There is no there there with Firefly. The movie lost considerable money at the box office, and DVD promotion was minimal at best from Universal. While it's possible that pushing the show yet again could make it a hit, it's possible you might win the lottery.
Subscription based TV has to cover the costs of $4-5 million per episode. At a price point of $15 per episode you're talking about 350,000 just to break even. The problem is that you need the cash upfront to finance a full season; or 12 episodes, or whatever. That's a huge risk considering that the movie itself bombed despite a VERY frugal budget.
Let's face it. A lot of problems happen in the entertainment industry because of lawyers. People just don't "play nice" because it would be a good thing to do for the fans -- they want MONEY. And nothing happens without the lubrication of MONEY.
... well, it doesn't look like a profitable venture.
Look at it this way:
The MAX HEADROOM TV SERIES -- is it out on DVD? No, it is not. Why? Rights issues.
DARIA - the Animated TV series from MTV -- out on DVD? No. Why? Music rights issues.
And unless someone is willing to fork over the dough to clear those rights and pay the rights holder and their lawyers what they want, it will not happen. And studios runs their excel spreadsheets and calculate that rights costs versus what they are projected to make on DVD sales isn't enough, then blammo, absolutely nothing happens and everyone sits on the rights they have until the other side budges, but they never do.
So, will Fox just "hand over" the rights so that Sci-Fi channel can make more episodes? NO, of course they will not. They want MONEY.
And if you take your excel spreadsheet, calculate the cost of the rights, the cost of production and the cost of everything associated with the production, versus what you'd make,
Easier and cheaper to make something bad, but original, that you don't have to buy the rights for or fork over a percentage of gross.
This is why Lucas made Star Wars and not FLASH GORDON.
If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
I have seen some of it, and I found it awful...
Would you care to elaborate on that?
Seriously, this is not a flame. Every single person I have ever introduced this series to loved it, and I am curious about the reasons why you disliked it. I always love hearing differing opinions on "cult" pop-culture phenomena.
For security, the MD5 hash of this message and sig is 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0.
Damn, i read FireFox and thought some independent survey concluded that Mozilla is safer :)
I feel sleepy.
Patents Drive Free Software as Hurricanes Drive Construction Industry
I don't necessarily hate TV itself, I more just hate the way it is run these days. It's very distracting to have the action interrupted every 30 minutes for 10-15 minutes of advertising. Networks seem incapable of keeping shows on at a consistant time throughout their run, with gaps in the middle of seasons and shows run out of order, and even then they leap all over the schedule so you have to be eagerly monitoring your TV guide to make sure you don't miss it.
If they didn't have the advertising (charge more for cable!) and would keep a show on at a consistant time every week for an entire season I wouldn't mind so much. However, since TV can't provide me with the viewing experience I want, DVD makes a much better alternative, and one I'm certainly willing to pay for to get the ability to control my own viewing schedule and to watch entire episodes uninterrupted at my leisure. The only thing it's lacking is the ability to try the first episode before plonking down the cash for the rest; I took that gamble for Firefly at Christmas and it was worth it, but it'd be nice to be able to buy online an episode to watch before I decide whether I want to buy the DVD. From what the captions on TV shows have been telling me recently, some shows are now available for download on iTunes, which is a start.
Correct.
Learn to separate truth from illusion. Because in this world, it's the hardest thing to do.
As a European who has seen a few episodes of Firefly, I have to say I don't understand what all the excitement is about. In my opinion, Firefly is very badly made, with actors that don't seem to have any rough edges at all, characters that never leave their predestined sterotypes, lots of tired old sci-fi and western clichés, and dialogue that seems as if taken straight from a dime novel. Just like Buffy, yeah.
I just love the user comment on the IMDB site:
:-) Well, it doesn't!
What was FOX thinking?!, 10 October 2003
It really says a lot, doesn't it?
FOX must have the greatest talent scouts in the world, but the worst executives. "Firefly" is the best example. It was simultaneously the best new show, the best western series in decades, and the best sci-fi show on TV (and coming from a die-hard Trekkie, placing them above "Enterprise" is saying something). They didn't have a single bad episode, and some were spectacular. The premise, the characters, the plots and the dialogue were all top-notch. And FOX cancelled it without even really giving it a chance.
Judging by the 96% of people who found that comment usefull, the author probably is not alone. Having a poll done to see if there's an audience is a great marketing move. It'll attract die hard fans to the TV if they'll air it, and it will attract free promototion for the station on various news sites/papers (e.g. slashdot). Brilliant! Even if the show is a complete disaster the move is really a good one (from a business/marketing perspective).
So what are YOU going to do on your deathbed? Are you going to tell your grandchildren about how you put your life on the line when the proxy server at work went down, or how you once suffered with a cellphone without a camera, or how many witty comments you made on slashdot? When your last breath leaves your body are you going to say to yourself "boy, am I glad I spent those countless hours watching TV. I wish I could stay alive a little longer so I could watch more."
/., this place is simply a diversion from a boring inane job. The difference between you and I is that one of us recognizes this fact. Even the creators of this site hint at this. Is there a big difference between "CMDR_TACO" and "P3NIS_CLEAVER"? They are both genital references if you get your head out of your ass.
For the majority of us on
Stuff that matters indeed.
Please sign petition to restore sanity to our banking system!!!
http://financialpetition.org/
In Soviet Russia, the movie watches you!
Well, my first experience was the pilot - not the first episode that aired.
In that, I found that the pace was glacial, the acting was wretched (like most other ensemble shows - they didn't seem to have gelled yet) and the dialogue and storing bored me greatly. I got about 20-30 minutes into the episode, turned to the friend who was trying to introduce the show to me and said "For this you wait in line all night?" (This was after Serenity came out). So, I don't think I gave it a really fair chance.
I've since been told that if I were to start with the first episode instead, I'd like it more - something about a train robbery? - because it shows more of the "real" show. Anyway, I'm waiting until I can get the wretched pilot out of my memory, and then I'll try again.
Since I can't tell them apart, I treat all ACs as the same person.
Are you gonna put P3NIS CLEAVER on your headstone? Just so I know where to pee when I stop by!
They will put ten times as much money or effort into preventing anyone else from doing anything with the show than they put into it in the first place. This is an epidemic accross the entire industry though and it's been with us for years. I halfway believe that their death grip on Firefly is a direct result of what happened when they let Futurama and Family Guy end up on Adult Swim. Cartoon Network made alot of money _and_ Fox was exposed for the fools they are. Would that Seth McFarlane had stood his ground on both American Dad and Family Guy Take 2...
Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun.
/oops
There's really two different items that you mention in your comment that you don't like: commercials, and not being able to watch at your leisure. I would argue that the first is good, and the second is nearly irrelevant.
There's plenty of channels on TV that have no commercials: HBO, Showtime, Cinemax, Starz, etc etc. I almost never watch these channels. They're impossible to watch! How can you sit down and watch something for an hour, for two hours, without ever moving. Without the commercial breaks, you can't get up to so much as grab a drink of water without missing something. I like commercials for that. Also, there's the rare commercial that's either well done, informative, or both. These ARE useful things - we wouldn't know about a lot of products - both good and bad - if it wasn't for advertising.
Secondarily, and to address your next point, DVR is the answer. If you want to watch something - and indeed, to skip commercials - record to DVR. It's a pretty easy solution (and cheap, these days - Comcast DVR is all of $6 or so, once you have HD).
One last point worth making is that at the moment, HDTV signals are considerably higher quality than DVD. Of course, this doesn't help for non-network shows, but on the networks, you can't beat the quality of the HD signals.
This isn't to say that it isn't worth it to buy DVD's - I own a large library of DVD's. But more often I watch television - and I don't have DVR.
-Daniel
"I've since been told that if I were to start with the first episode instead, I'd like it more"
Or possibly not. That was the first episode I saw, and it didn't grab me, nor (and here I lose all my geekish cred) did the two or three others I caught at one time or another. Perhaps it's because I found the combination of sci-fi premise, Reconstruction-era trappings, and Whedon dialogue jarring. Or maybe it's just than Nathan Fillon bugs the hell out of me. Either way, I don't get it. Like Doctor Who, it's going to be one of those things which remains beyond me, and I envy those of you who get such joy from it.
Yep, you heard me right: Google.
"Hey, but don't they just do searches?"
Do searches, yes. Just do searches, no.
Here's why Google should get into video production as well as sales:
Just my five cents (was 2 cents, but inflation...)
When I watched Firefly though I really liked her, she's more like a confused kid. And while she's still bright and even dangerous ... well she's far from the l33t superhero from Serenity, and seriously I don't think Firefly is the place for such character.
Just my 2 cents
Please moderate parent +1 Shiny. :)
Yep. It premiered on Showtime, which was the only place it could show full frontal nudity (and yes, there was some in the first episode). After Showtime didn't think it was doing well enough, they dropped it. Unlike FOX, however, they were willing to let the rights go. UPN then picked it up and it did well for a few seasons until it wasn't doing well enough. Then they, again, sold the rights. It's been on Sci-Fi and sucessful ever since.
What are you talking about? UPN never produced Stargate SG-1. Yes, it was a Showtime original series -- but after 5 seasons on Showtime, the show went straight to SciFi channel for Season 6 and beyond. UPN has never been part of the picture, though you have have seen syndicated episodes on UPN. Showtime and SciFi are the only homes Stargate SG-1 has had for original episodes.
Also, I seem to recall hearing, way back when the first season was airing on Showtime, that Showtime had made a 5-year commitment to Stargate SG-1. Indeed, the show was aired on Showtime for the full 5 years. After that contract expired, Showtime decided not to renew it, and SciFi picked up the show for a 6th season, and has continued producing new episodes since then.
Imagine if a broadcast network were actually willing to make a multi-year commitment to a new show! Showtime should be applauded for their foresight. Stargate SG-1 is an excellent show, especially seasons 3-5 from Showtime's watch...
Deven
"Simple things should be simple, and complex things should be possible." - Alan Kay
Not even close, Sparky. Dumbasses who spout this don't know anything about how the REAL numbers work. They look at a movie and say:
"See, its made $28 million at the box office and it's budget was $40 million. So all they have to do is sell $12 million worth of DVD's to break even."
Ehhhhh...WRONG!!
Here is what those numbers actually mean.
First of all, the $40 million budget for Serenity doesn't include distribution and marketing costs. Judging by how extensively this thing was promoted (I couldn't turn on the damn TV without seeing the promo for about 2-3 weeks, even my damn Tivo was harassing me to see it) and how amny theaters it opened in, you can conservatively figure a marketing/distribution budget of $20 million. Ergo, Universal had already spent $60 million before it showed in a single theater, not 40.
"So what," you say "it still made 28 million at the box office and so they only need to make up $32 million." Ehhhhh...WRONG!! Because the studio actually only gets a *percentage* of the box office. Remember that neighborhood theater down the block where you saw Serenity? Well, the people that own it don't show movies out of charity. Opening weekend a theater will generally take a 20% cut of ticket sales. After that, they take 50%. Therefore, of that $28 million, Universal MIGHT have actually made about $19-20 million.
"Okay," you say "so they have to sell a few more DVD's. But at $20 a pop, that shouldn't be too difficult." Ehhhhh...WRONG!! Because that assumes that the full price of the DVD goes back into the original costs of the film itself. Read my lips: "NOT EVEN CLOSE."
You see, first of all, your local Best Buy (like your local theater) doesn't sell shit out of charity. Retailers generally get a keystone markup on any product they sell. This means they share a 50/50 split with the original wholesaler. they have to do this because it costs money to stock and item, pay employees to sell it, keep the store clean, etc.; and still make about a 5% profit on it.
"Okay," you say "but that's still $10 per DVD that goes back into the original budget." Ehhhhh...WRONG!! Guess what? It costs money to produce, market, and distribute DVD's. That fancy packaging your new DVD comes in didn't come for free. Someone had to design the artwork for it, encode the DVD, manufacture the packaging and DVD (complete with full-color inserts, color screening on the DVD, etc.), market the DVD with a whole new batch of promos, pack them, and then ship them to retailers. So, on a $20 DVD, only about $4-$5 will ultimately go directly back into the IP (the film itself).
So, let's have a review and look at Serenity:
Serenity was budgeted at $40 million.
It cost $20 million to market and distribute.
It made Universal $19-20 million at the box office.
It will make Universal about $5 per DVD.
So, given these REAL numbers. Let's see how many DVD's Serenity will have to sell for the film to break even:
$60 million minus $20 million = $40 million
$5 into $40 million = 8 million DVD's
Now, if I may be anecdotal for a second, I will note that my neighborhood Blockbuster only had a small shelf of these DVD's in stock, compared with dozens of copies of other movies (Blockbuster being one of the biggest single purchasers of DVD's in the U.S.). And, as far as I can tell from the numbers released so far, Serenity didn't even break the million mark in its first week of release.
In other words, Serenity is *NOT EVEN CLOSE* to breaking even.
-Eric
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
I'll admit, I'm a big fan of Firefly and Serenity. The problem that this whole thing would run into (hence me calling it a larger scale fanboy effort) is simple- money. The TV series, by most reports, was pretty darned expensive to make. The movie cost a paltry by today's standards $45 million to make, not including marketing, etc. that took place. The studio- the SECOND STUDIO TO OWN THE PROPERTY- has not recouped that money yet. Even by the creative accounting that takes place in Hollywood, that's seen as a failure. I hate to see it be that way, but it is nonetheless. I'll buy the comics and the books, but I don't seriously expect there to be any further movies or series. If I'm wrong, I'l be the first to admit it.
Ok, so Wash and Book are dead. Barring some JR-esque revival, that writes them out.
So what cast do you have left over?
Still a decent cast, but mising comic relief and the mysterious preacher/warrior. For the second I can think of one character who'd have a similar past and bring lots of dramatic tension: the nemesis warrior in the movie. Have him save Mal, the crew, and the ship again, and have him take up Shepherd's footsteps by going to same preacher school, and I could see that happening (or Mal would shoot him which is prob more likely, have be a convincing reason for this to happen).
Comic relief, hmm good question. For that I'd go back to the series..remember Mal's "Wife", the one that tried to steal the Lassiter? Work her into the plot, on the same ship as Inara and Mal. Again, you'd have to work out the dramatic reason, but let's face it..the probability of the original cast coming together and staying together was pretty low in the first place, so it can be made to work.
Just my 5 cents (was 2 cents, but inflation...)
I'm wondering if it would be sensible to sell shares rather than focus on selling (streamed) episodes or DVDs. I.e. set a target of $50 million (enough to produce either a movie or a TV show with some left over for marketing and the share selling). Offer 50 million shares for sale at a $1 per share. If they don't sell all 50 million shares, everyone gets their money back minus some transactional amount (e.g. 10 cents per share). If they do sell all the shares, then they produce the show.
Now, once the show is produced, they sell episodes, DVDs, etc. The profits from that get sent back to the shareholders. Now, maybe that means that each shareholder only gets forty cents on the dollar. However, that's all right, because we also get a new season of the show.
Some people won't buy any shares. They just buy the episodes/DVDs when they come out. They pay around $40 (going from previous shows' DVD set prices). Other people (who really want the show) buy $160 in shares and pay $40 for the season. Other people pay for $10,000 in shares.
The keys:
1. Finding a way to minimize the transaction cost in case they can't hit the target for shares. The ideal would be to return 100% of the sales.
2. Allowing people who have more money and interest to subsidize those who have less. Finding a way to make people want to do that. Maybe a monthly lottery where those who win get to have dinner with the cast and crew? The more shares you have, the better your chance of winning?
The fundamental problem is that Firefly/Serenity is a cult favorite. It has a bunch of really big fans but not enough decent fans. Having fans willing to pay $200 doesn't matter unless you can actually collect it from them while at the same time still collecting $40 from those willing to pay that.
Make a new show using the same plots, similar characters, different names and new sets and call it something else. Hollywood recycles ideas every day, why can't you?
I hope second season (and more) happens for Firefly.
My wife and I are relatively new to Firefly -- I happened to see SERENITY in the theaters while killing time on a business trip in October 2005. I knew the movie was from some TV show that I'd never watched. Enjoyed the movie so much I walked out of the theater and into a bookstore to buy the DVDs. And into another bookstore when the first didn't have any more in stock (they were sold out -- go Browncoats!). Finally got 'em. Convinced Wendy to watch "just the first episode" with me, and she, too, fell in love with it. We watched the entire 1st series and then SERENITY and are hooked.
http://www.drewvogel.com/
We got our movie. Be content with that. If we keep flogging this thing, we could easily wind up with another "Highlander 2" on our hands. Let it lie.
"We reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals." --The American President (20.1.2009)
Almost all the Firefly fans I know saw the movie, even though they knew the DVD would be coming out soon. Which demonstrates that the view held by theatres just isn't true: we don't go to the theatre because we can't get the movie on DVD or cable, or because we can't wait to see it. We go because we want to make seeing the movie a special event: huge screen, surrounded by our friends, making a night of it, etc.
User Training for Busy Programmers
"The difference between you and I is that one of us recognizes this fact."
And that's supposed to be the guy saying stuff like "Are you going to tell your grandchildren about how you put your life on the line when the proxy server at work went down, or how you once suffered with a cellphone without a camera, or how many witty comments you made on slashdot?" because he blew a gasket over a Slashdot article?
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
Thanks for humoring me.
I've since been told that if I were to start with the first episode instead, I'd like it more - something about a train robbery? - because it shows more of the "real" show.
Yes, that is likely the case. The pilot, while intended to introduce the characters and the setting, also set out to convey the laid-back Western attitude of the Southwest United States -- very much the attitude of most frontiersmen, which these characters are. I can see how that would seem glacially slow to someone not used that.
The later episodes didn't deal with that much, mostly because they had to tell a story in a shorter amount of time, and so the slower pace was sacrificed to move the story along. I watched the pilot last, and found it to be very enjoyable, because I was already familiar with the characters, and it was nice to see their origins on screen.
I've also found that the vast majority of shows, regardless of genre, don't really "work" until about the 4th or 5th episode. By then, the writers are familiar enough with the mythology to work within it, and the actors are comfortable enough with each other to make things seem more natural. This is why I am so disappointed when shows are cancelled after only 3 or 4 episodes; they never even had a chance to succeed.
As to the question of Joss Whedon's dialog: my guess is that his dialog style is strictly a "love it or hate it" proposition. Personally, I have never really enjoyed the dialog in his other shows (Buffy and Angel), but for some reason the dialog in Firefly struck a chord with me. This is not Star Trek, where everyone is highly educated at the Starfleet Academy before they are let anywhere near a starship. The crew of Serenity are more like truckers: their speech is crude, colorful, and full of colloquialisms, which, this being 500 years in the future, will be nothing like ours. I like it, but others will not. A similar phenomenon is the dialog in Aaron Sorkin's Sports Night. I find it very difficult to listen to, since the rapid-fire delivery seems very contrived, silly, and way too rehearsed. However, lots of people swear by it, and enjoy it very much.
My suspicion is that if the dialog style bothered you, you will not enjoy the rest of the series. However, I would encourage you to watch it anyway (or a few episodes, at least), and give it a proper chance. Joss Whedon's strengths lie in his ability to develop a character over many episodes, and create a wholly convincing mythology for his characters to exist in, continuity included. Both of those require the viewer to see more than one episode to appreciate.
For security, the MD5 hash of this message and sig is 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0.
1. I prefer them using ties than silver jumpsuits; really, do you think people in the future will abolish ties or suits? We are in the 21st century and you'll go NOWHERE as a corporate monkey/government official/elected official unless you wear a suit and a tie (in MOST western countries, at least). In my jurisdictions, lawyers can't go to court without a suit and a tie (or accordingly formal attire in the case of women) and it's 83 degrees F (45 C) outside today.
2. It's not a formerly democratic society, they have scheduled elections AFAIK... Pres. Roslin is just an interim administrator (and military commander-in-chief).
It's better to be the foot on the boot than the face on the pavement. ~~ tkx Kadin2048
Blew a gasket? You don't know trolls very well. You are looking for something, aren't you? You are reading at -1.
Please sign petition to restore sanity to our banking system!!!
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"Blew a gasket? You don't know trolls very well."
Heh. Yeah. "I mean to do that." Smooth.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
Your the one arguing with P3NIS_CLEAVER.
Please sign petition to restore sanity to our banking system!!!
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(which I don't consider myself -- I really enjoy some lame shows [and when a kid, I was a big Dukes of Hazzard fan])
But I really set my bar higher, and I am not indecisive at all WRT what I do want to watch or listen, at all times.
I loathe the radio (it doesn't run anything I like, ever) -- I don't have a car radio (I prefer to sing while driving) and when I'm in a car with radio (like my wife's), I tune the news station.
I do have a lot of shows in divx, and I really program myself to watch whatever I like (atm Lost, SG[1A], BSG), on TV or in the PC. And I have a videoclub subscription (5 DVDs with me at all times [for up to three workdays each DVD] for R$28/month [~US$11])
It's better to be the foot on the boot than the face on the pavement. ~~ tkx Kadin2048
Heh. So my joke isn't funny until you're using it?
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
It's like Star Trek, but with more Civil War-type uniforms. Kinda.
;)
n gs.html
I've only watched the first episode or two. I wasn't impressed.
I didn't really "get it" at first either, but it turns out it makes so much more sense when the episodes are in order.
See, those first two episodes ('Train Job' and 'Bushwhacked') are the first two episodes, not the 2-part pilot (Serenity, parts 1 & 2), which didn't play until episodes 11 and 12.
Way to go, FOX!!
http://www.tv.com/firefly/show/7097/episode_listi
"God is a comedian playing to an audience too afraid to laugh." -- Voltaire
Ironic, isn't it?
Please sign petition to restore sanity to our banking system!!!
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Actually, yes, it is. Not in the way you intended, though.
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
-snip-
I'll keep my TV thanks.
Thankfully, the overwhelming percentage of your co-workerbees feel the same way, which preserves Our continued reign.
I still watched it. You should too.
I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
7. Zoe
... but most are left in the dust (Don't even remember name, but was one about space marines that was decent if not great, that I was sad to see go).
I believe you're thinking about a series called "Space Above and Beyond" which aired in 95-96 for just one season, which can be purchased on Amazon. It really was a great show -- I was also sad to see it go.
SciFi Wire interviews both Ace Underhill and Whedon's spokesman: