Slashdot Mirror
Microsoft Confirms 6 Versions of Vista
Darthmalt writes "The BBC has a story confirming that there will be 6 versions of Vista. They are
Vista Business, Vista Enterprise, Vista Home Basic, Vista Home Premium, Vista Ultimate, Vista Starter. Also included are some of the differences between each version."
One thing that I'm not clear on in this article is if they have plans for the server version (similar to XP vs. Windows Server 2003). Tied to that, of course, is if/when there will be "Windows Server 2007 Data Center Edition," for 32-way type systems.
The original names of each version were: Groucho, Chico, Harpo, Larry, Curly and Moe.
There is a thing called a "re-gifter". I think it was coined on Seinfeld, but the concept has been around forever. At least since the invention of the fruitcake.
Why get your news from the BBC when Microsoft released this information yesterday?
confirming that there will be 6 versions of Vista.
I'll take the Windows Vista "Half Way Decent Security Out of the Box" Edition please....
According to Edgadget there will be 8 sources: Windows Starter 2007 - Vista without Aero, probably meant for developing nations. Windows Vista Home Basic - Basic Windows Vista for your single PC fam, doesn't sound like much going on here. Analagous to XP Home. Windows Vista Home Basic N - European version of the same, but without Media Player (because of antitrust rulings against MS in the EU). Windows Vista Home Premium - This is the one we're all probably gonna own. It's got Media Center functionality, Cable Card support, the whole home-media shebang. Windows Vista Business - Think of it as XP Pro, but Vista. Windows Vista Business N - Think of it as XP Pro, but Vista, but Euro. Windows Vista Enterprise - Business version of Vista with numerous enterprise features, like Virtual PC, volume encryption, etc. Windows Vista Ultimate - Love that name. This one does all of the above (and more); what else do you need to know? It's ultimate Windows..
I just wanna know which one won't crash! Is it Vista Linux?
Nothing for you to see here. Please move along.
:)
Um, that's not what a vista is
I've still got to be sold on Vista. It seems to offer less new stuff than XP, and at least most people got a benefit from going from 9x to XP, in that it was a far better OS underneath.
I'm getting Vista Home Basic just for the the Basic interpreter.
org.slashdot.post.SignatureNotFoundException: ewg
"We don't want customers to be forced into buying something that isn't going to meet all their needs," said Barry Goffe, Microsoft's director of Windows client product management.
Translation: We understand from psychology that people can only make effective, informed decisions when the number of choices is low, typically around six. We understand that one of the principles of building is a successful company is to segment your market according to their willingness to pay. Hence, I propose we offer six versions of Vista, each priced differently, each with a clear difference in feature set so that we can effectively capture our consumer surplus without our customers being constrained by the tyranny of choice.
Simon.
Microsoft spends money to develop Vista. In a free market, Microsoft could then sell Vista at a market-set price, generally close to the marginal cost of production.
Microsoft then spends more money making crippled versions of Vista. IE, "Home" and "Starter" cost them more to produce than "Business" did (if we assume "Business" is the full operating system without the Enterpirse add-ons, which seems likely given 2000 and XP).
Despite costing Microsoft more money to produce, they sell it for less. This is an inefficient market. They pay more to cripple their own product, and then sell it for less.
Sigh. Well, at least maybe for once I'll be able to install Windows on a machine without having to download a million drivers (something I've never had to do with Linux). Here's hoping.
All's true that is mistrusted
So this article tells us that we have 6 versions now...no, wait, plus the European N versions.
So this article tells us the same things that we've heard countless times before.
Wonderful
If this doesn't keep the software bundling lawsuits away I don't know what will.
Although it will make it a bit harder to get through the wire...
Cheers,
Adolfo
And people complain about how many Linux distrobutions there are!
If "disco" means "I learn" in Latin, does "discothèque" mean "I learn technology"?
Debian Project manager announces that there will be two different versions of Debian:
Debian GNU/Linux and Debian.
But it's different, trust us!
This is called "market segmentation" - anyone who's studied marketing will be familiar with it.
What I find difficult to believe is this:
Vista Home Premium includes everything in the Basic version and adds the new graphical interface called Aero.
So they're going to be selling a version which has a deliberately crappier interface (Home Basic)? Is that sensible from a business perspective?
One useful mental exercise I often apply to my own work is "What would Steve Jobs say about this?" I think Microsoft should try it with this particular decision...
"We don't want customers to be forced into buying something that isn't going to meet all their needs," said Barry Goffe, Microsoft's director of Windows client product management.
Most customers get what is bundled with their computer. Most do not know if they have Windows 98, ME, or XP. Customers will be forced to buy what is the most economical for the OEM's to include with their machines.
Computers were supposed to be "multi-purpose" machines. Now that hardware is leveling, the differences are all in the software. The purpose of these levels is marketing and price control. Do not believe for a minute that this is about providing "choice" to the consumer.
I only look human.
My mother is a halfling and my dad is an ogre, so that makes me an Ogreling
and each and every one of them looks JUST LIKE OS X (only with less features, stability and security).... damn those Microsoft guys are smart.
"Vista Home Premium includes everything in the Basic version and adds the new graphical interface called Aero."
.NET everywhere already. New Media Player, XP. So what's new for home users?
So what the hell is the advantage of "Starter" and "Home Basic" over XP Home Edition with SP2? Security?
MSH not bundled, will likely be runnable on all upon downloading. IE7 available for XP.
45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
This would be a great time for Steve Jobs to step forward and remind everybody that there is only one version of MacOS, you don't have to cross reference your need chart to the features matrix of like you do with Vista.
I read the internet for the articles.
My main concern is consumer confusion, yes. Imagine going to buy an OS, or going to buy a new PC, and being confronted with pricing "ladders" based on Vista version. Most folks just want the stuff to work... most don't really understand the complicated logic behind the release of many sub-versions of Vista.
Another concern I have is the total cost of ownership for businesses (large and small businesses). Will companies' IT departments have to support a myriad of Vista versions (on top of the typical legacy width and breadth)?
A Passionate Independent Musician
Namely the emerging market of people frustrated with the other five versions...
GetOuttaMySpace - The Anti-Social Network
If low-end versions of Windows don't support a full feature set, it's going to be a real headache for third party developers of consumer apps... or maybe it's Microsoft's intention to have tech support folks telling people "Oh, sorry, you need to upgrade to Windows Vista Clever Edition to run our app." Or developers could just develop for the lowest common denominator, and let any shiny new features in Vista go unused.
Overall this sounds like another good reason to look at OS X.
Six too many, to be exact.
http://www.heise.de/ct/english/05/12/148/
I didn't mean that as an attack on Microsoft; I for one don't see the distorted market as Microsoft's fault. They're playing (largely) within rules that were not of their making and I can't fault them for that.
All's true that is mistrusted
I've always argued that windows is far better than linux, because it's not
going to fragment in the way linux does. It's a huge problem. You write an
app for linux and you can never tell what their system is going to be like.
They could be on redhat, or ubuntu, or any of the popular distros.
With windows, it's nice and clear. Either they are in 2000. Or XP (Home or
Business). Or Vista. That is Vista home. Or home premium. Or business.
Or richer business edition.
Think I'm going to buy a mac.
Phil
If Starter edition have support for DirectX it will be known as Vista Gamer edition. "The Starter edition is a streamlined version intended for low powered PCs found in many developing nations." .. Linux for work and Vista as a game Os. Ahh i se it now..
Wow-- if the only reason to buy the Home Premium edition is to get the Aero interface, MS won't sell many copies. (I bet it will be the default OEM version, though. The first thing I did when I got XP was turn off the hideously ugly tinkertoy interface and select the "Look like Win 2000" options. MS is going to need more than that to sell a "premium" edition.
For a moment I had misread Vista Starter as Vista Stable. Made my heart skip a beat. :(
...all those versions actually make sense.
# Vista Business - XP Pro
# Vista Enterprise - XP Pro with enterprise utilities that people have been wanting
# Vista Home Basic - for grandma's aging PC that won't run the latest, greatest stuff
# Vista Home Premium - Essentially the replacement for XP MCE.
# Vista Ultimate - XP Pro for home users
# Vista Starter - for when even Basic won't run on your PC.
120 characters for a sig? That's bloody useless.
Don't forget Slackware: "for the REAL nerds" (not the INTEGER nerds) Slackware == Hobbiest + people w/ Linux knowledge + people who like control
we'll all end up using the same version (hmm.. that sounds like piracy)..
Mbr>The idea of an operating system is that it should have common features across every install, otherwise software packages will need to be tested and rated for each, i also forsee the winxp home networking problem appearing, using xphome is not a choice for most users.
it was my understanding that manufacturers increasingly tried to make their products the same so they're cheaper to manufacturer.. then maybe have an upgrade system which allows people to buy a new cd-key as and when which enables the new features
--AlexC
Just because I dont agree with climate change doesnt make me a troll
Has anyone heard what will follow XP Embedded? I'm expecting something from the Vista "line" eventually, but have heard nothing yet.
Correction. There are eight versions of Vista including plain ol' Vista and Open Vista.
Seven's the magic number. Lucky Seven. Marketers usually have either three price points or seven. They must have planned for seven and then been forced to drop one. I wonder what the missing one was?
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
Windows Vista Enterprise - Subsystem for UNIX-based Applications enables users to run UNIX applications unchanged on a Windows Vista Enterprise-based PC.
I used to do tech support. The "what operating system do you use" was already the question that created the most ridiculous answers. Sounds like that question just got a whole lot more fun.
I think Microsoft is subscribing to the "Pokemon" school of marketing - they are banking on developers feeling they "gotta catch'em all".
Consider: you develop for Windows. You now have to test your app against between 1 to 6 versions of Vista (depending upon your target market). If you are targeting ALL Vista users, you now have to check against 6 version of Vista - and thus have to BUY six versions.
Consider: You support Windows (e.g. ISP, IT department, hardware vendor). You have to test against 6 versions of Vista.
The only plus is that the virus and script kiddie tool writers will ALSO have to test against six versions of Vista.
www.eFax.com are spammers
DOS 6 stank, DOS 6.2 was much better. Win95 stank, Win95 with the updates worked very good. Win98 was a disaster, Win98 second edition very decent. Windows XP sucked, Windows XP servicepack 2 did it.
So I'll have the 2nd vista please.
Oh yea, me see Microsoft in article and me think: will bash Microsoft and get cool points on Slashdot! So here what me say:
Microsoft do it for evil purposes! They want to confuse people! They want world confused and then while confused sell them all XBOX-es, Origami phones and Media Center PC-s!
Nothing MS does it good, it all EVIL! All EVIL!
(so now I play the waiting game, sit here and refresh waiting be modded +5 Insightful by a bunch of Microsoft hating Linux users)
Now do we have to add "didn't want to bet my job on deciding which variant of Windows would best fit our needs" to the top of our list of reasons for migrating to Linux altogether? ;-)
How about ...
# Windows Vista "Cheapskate" Edition
# Windows Vista "Reasonably Priced" Edition
# Windows Vista "Expensive but worth it" Edition
# Windows Vista "Expensive to the point of Insanity" Edition
# Windows Vista "If you have to ask you can't afford it" Edition
"We don't want customers to be forced into buying something that isn't going to meet all their needs," said Barry Goffe, Microsoft's director of Windows client product management.
So nice of him!
Muahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
But, Doctor Evil, that already happened.
Isn't this just like haveing 100 different distros of Linux? Common guys, what's the big deal.
A basic question for this brand (not so) new OS is: are all the 6 versions supposed to be compatible each other?
Is there anyone out there that can trell something proven/provable about this point?
Maybe Computers will never be as intelligent as Humans.
For sure they won't ever become so stupid. [VR-1988]
the number of retail copies of XP sold, compared to the number shipped preinstalled on systems is pretty inconsequential. MS don't *have* to offer much beyond continued support and patches, some eye candy and an iron-clad OEM agreement with the PC manufacturers and it'll end up on millions of desktops by default.
the real question is how much leverage will it put on new markets for them: mobile devices (activesync as core component, "plays for sure" tie-ins to MP3 players, windows mobile messaging integration into exchange server, media center and xbox 360 integration - if done successfully it'll leverage a whole load more of joe sixpack's home into the MS domain...
Which version to I buy, that will tell me which version I should get? Jeez. they should have offered one more version, so I can use a different version each day of the week!
G.
I need a version of Windows without the HTML control so I don't have to worry about some third party app bringing Internet Explorer back to life.
Can you do that?
"Sure, Bob, that's the Windows Vista Crippled Edition."
Then people could just compile their own version with the features they want.
Microsoft challenges this with, "We are offering 20% off a Windows Vista upgrade package though"
groan
1) Windows Starter = £50 - but you can't browse outside MSN network.
2) Windows Business = £75 (per license, minimum 10) - Everything but printing
3)Vista Enterprise = £125 (per license, minimum 10) - Everything including printing
4) Vista Home Basic = £99 - Everything but you don't get admin rights and we control ad placement
5) Vista Home Premium = £199 - Ok, you get admin and no ads
6) Vista Ultimate £299 - You get all of Vist Home Premium + DirectX10...bargain.
groan
karem
When all is said and done, nothing changes...
Is anyone else here reminded of the bad old days at Apple before Jobs returned to the helm when they had some blue bazillion Performa models, and you couldn't really figure out which one did what you wanted? Yeah, I remember those days when inventory overstocks almost put the company out of business.
I think this is going to turn out to be MS shooting themselves in the foot. This sort of "pay another 20% for this next feature" nonsense may fly in the business world, but it's going to cause massive confusion in the mass market and is going to leave a lot of end users feeling burned and cheated (especially when you combine the high system requirements and new DRM lock-outs of everything).
If it's for-profit but free, you're not the customer -- you're the product (e.g., the Slashdot Beta's "audience").
Among my roles at work is web development. I keep a whiteboard here that says, "COMMIT TO STABLE SOFTWARE!" and it has two sections: "DAYS SINCE AN IE CRASH" and "LIFETIME RECORD." Sort of like those signs at factories that say, "198 days without an accident." Anyway, the "DAYS SINCE AN IE CRASH" is currently 1. The lifetime record is 2.
"I have never won a debate with an ignorant person." -Ali ibn Abi Talib
I'd like Vista with mushrooms, onion and barbequeue sauce, please.
Not Free SF Reader
Now Windows is only 600,000 versions less than Linux.
We don't want customers to be forced into buying something that isn't going to meet all their needs
Great. So, you are going to let me buy a laptop not preinstalled with windows ?
I suspect that this will lead to developer confusion. One of the main benefits of developing for Windows is that you know that everyone has it. But now, you're application is going to have to check to see what version of Vista it has to see if it can run or not. It will also make it harder to sell your app if it requires one of the more expensive "premium" versions. So people will have to decide whether it is worth spending money on your program as well as having to spend money on upgrading Windows.
Which is the version that you don't buy because it sucks?
All 6 flavors suck? K, Thanks for playing.
i am building a computer for my grandmother. it's a compaq, and the first thing i did was format the hard drive. then i install from my copy of windows XP Home. it turns out that Compaq CD keys don't work for a regular version of XP Home or XP Corporate. i can't find the cd that came with the computer. so now i own a license for windows XP Home but am unable to install it. it's really a royal pain in the ass, especially when i have access to other versions of XP but cannot use my cd key with them.
...as in beer. I mean, what else could they mean by the following quote from the bottom of TFA:
"We don't want customers to be forced into buying something that isn't going to meet all their needs," said Barry Goffe, Microsoft's director of Windows client product management.
Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
Apple hasn't released a retail version of Tiger, and Apple has frequently bundled versions targeted for the system they're bundled with... it usually turns out they're bootable on more than just that model, but it's not like a retail version.
If you count customized bundles as separate versions, there's thousands of versions of XP.
So really there's only two versions, Mac OS X and Mac OS X Server.
Has Apple stated that Leopard will be released in two versions or in a single "Universal" package?
Well, with 6 different variants we have a very good battle field the theories.
Personally I don't think that the "Intelligent design" theory can lead to anything: it's Microsoft, dudes!
On the opposite side, the "Evolution"should instead prove itself in this very case. Starvation should select the best one among all: DOS.
Let's sit down and wait.
Maybe Computers will never be as intelligent as Humans.
For sure they won't ever become so stupid. [VR-1988]
Make 6 packages, each with 1 required function.
People then need to buy all packages, or the premium version.
I'm a home business game player - so I'll be spending $1000 for the OS ?
EMail: 0110001101100010010000000110001101110010 0110000101111010011011100110000101110010 0010111001100011011011110110
I wrote: "Apple hasn't released a retail version of Tiger".
I meant to write: "Apple hasn't released a retail version of Tiger for Intel".
I even previewed it and I still missed that.
According to TFA on MS's site, part of the Windows Vista Business edition will be the new Aero GUI...wtf? So you mean to tell me that for my organization to upgrade to your new OS, we will not only have to upgrade our processors across the board, but we will also have to shell out a couple hundred bucks per box for high end graphics cards just so it looks extra pretty for the ditzy secretary on the 2nd floor? Ahem, no...I don't think so.
Unpleasantries.
Vista Super Edition Plus (only available in a CD binder with 64 other titles)
You can get \/|s+/\ here!!!! (via email from Whitlette Rosalia)
Vista BitTorrent Edition
Gates ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. And Gates blessed the seventh verstion, and sanctified it; because that in it he had rested from all his work which Gates created and made.
-From the holy book of bad programming practices
The six are really:
Vista MoneyVacuum edition for BigCo and DumbGov accounts
Vista CopyApple edition for people who get work done at home
Vista CashSucker edition for BestBag,CompUSuck shelves and CDW
Vista MentalInsult with lots of help on how to use the help
Vista SuperHaloGamerExpoTasticGentooRicerXBOX375+++ for gamers
Vista ScrewLinuxPremium for everyone
http://tinyurl.com/4ny52
Vista Home Premium includes everything in the Basic version and adds the new graphical interface called Aero.
Either they misunderstood and misquoted their source, or Microsoft has finally gone off the deep end.
Just looking at Redhat choices, they have 4 offerings each removing parts on purpose to segment the market.
Red Hat Desktop - for basic home users
Red Hat Enterprise Linux WS - for power home users / business desktos
Redhat ES - Enterprise version
Redhat AS - Flagship product
MS doesn't see any different.
This version is RUN entirely on BASIC. For the BASIC interpreter you will need Vista ULTIMATE (Duh!)
All editions except Vista Ulitmate come with annoying pop-up ballons ...
"The Windows User Analysis engine has determined that based on your usage habits you bought the wrong Vista Edition, click here to upgrade to Ultimate Edition (and have your credit card handy)"....
"We don't want customers to be forced into buying something that isn't going to meet all their needs," said Barry Goffe, Microsoft's director of Windows client product management.
If you do not want to force comsumers into buying something that is not going to meet all their needs, then why force every consumer who buys a computer (DELL, Laptop, etc...not barebones) to also buy a license to your DRM encrusted, monopoly prolonging, memory leaking, privacy infringing, virus ridden software.
And I use the term software in the loosest sense.
The cancel button is your friend. Do not hesitate to use it.
Formerly known as Windows Mobile. Pricing will start in the mid-70's.
Vuja De: That sinking feeling that this is going to happen again. Often occurs in meetings with Product Managers.
http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2006/feb0 6/02-26WinVistaProductsPR.mspx
For older machines, hardware support is built in for Linux, almost in every case. For instance, I have a 700MHz Dell workstation (not all that old), which "just works" under Linux. Conversely, every time I install Win2k on it since it became my kids' machine, it gets harder and harder to find video drivers.
I'm not about to buy a new version of Windows that'll barely run on this machine, so Windows is basically going bye-bye when I can no longer find decent drivers for it.
Windows may have the market cornered on bleeding-edge hardware drivers because of de-facto manufacturer support, but it fails miserably in the "long tail" of hardware support, and that's where it counts most for an increasing number of people whose 1.0Ghz machine is still more than enough.
I wish I knew how to make a ROFLCOPTER. :(
wiki entry for 666
Well there are 6 version of windows
released in 2006. The last number 6 will be revealed soon, but then it will be too late.
What about Windows Vista 64-bit? Everyone says they won't upgrade to Vista, and a lot of people wont but give it a year and all new pcs will come with Vista pre-installed and you'll have no choice. (Not that you ever had a choice in the first place :p)
If you try to build something idiot proof, someone builds a better idiot.
sorry if this has been said but :
so WHY WHY WHY release 6 versions of it, if you release 1 version that "does it all there" is 0% risk of someone buying something that doesnt meet their needs (im allowing for an operating system to "meet peoples needs" just now k?(im also allowing that the author of TFA isnt a completely cynical bastard))
with this scheme there is a 100% certainty that someone, somewhere will be forced into buying something that doesnt "meet their needs" on the basis of the difference in cost between different versions alone.
complete non-sequitur there ol' boy!Steve Jobs would say "If they want to use Vista, then they'll just have to upgrade all thier hardware. If they don't want to do that, they they don't get Vista."
Apple's version of "Aero" is Aqua. Aqua was released with the first version of OS X on the G3 iMac.
You could actually run Mac OS X through 10.1 with Quartz and Aqua on a Powermac 7600/180, or any other PCI Powermac with a 603e or better processor, even with the native motherboard video and no graphics acceleration. You had to use a hack to get it to allow the install, but once it installed it worked. It was slow, yes, on the equivalent of a late model Pentium-I... but it had all the fancy GUI effects including smooth translucent windows and dock effects.
The latest version of OS X still runs on the G3 iMac... it's just slower (and to make up for that things like Dashboard and Exposé don't use all the features) because it's not making as good use of the GPU as later versions, but it does run with the hardware acceleration the ATI Rage chipset can manage.
Any PC that's comfortable running XP should be able to run any conceivable "Aqua-like" GUI... unless Microsoft did something really really stupid. And even then, there's no reason they couldn't simply let Aero enable itself when your hardware was up to it... there's no reason to have two versions and force software developers that want to take advantage of the new functionality to deal with two versions.
Vista Cruiser :)
--fatboy
Before, you had a point, but there are now a ton of places you can buy no-os systems, or linux systems. I'm sure Microsoft is still strong arming somewhat, but if you want it, you can find it. It turns out, most people are just uninformed, don't want to be informed, and XP works for them. I'm a linux guy myself, but blaming the market, which has in the past couple years begun to work the way it's supposed to, for linux's failures to make inroads into the home market (if that's what you were getting at, I may be off a bit), is disingenious as best. Really, microsoft has been working and making a better product, thanks to pressure put on from apple and linux. Linux now has some catching up to do in some areas before some CEO or COO decides that they're going to offer it as a viable alternative to their customers. Who knows, it may happen, I just don't think you can blame MS for the market anymore.
For a good time call www.sawkie.com
While this is true for desktop systems, it's still very difficult to find laptops without windows. Not impossible, but difficult. Difficult enough that the non-motivated customer doesn't care enough to bother, and just pays the standard 120 Euro Micro$oft tax.
Vista Purple, Vista Orange, Vista Yellow, Vista Blue: includes Pokemon based GUI themes.
Vista CEO: Special version with simplified GUI and regular soothing popup messages such as "You deserve your seven figure salasy despite being utterly innumerate" and "CEOs have a God give right to cocaine and whores."
Vistapanimation: Very special incarnation of Vista Prime for sphere of Asian marketing. designed it for rapid speed styling of existence, and make very fast go go go!
New Vista: reformulated version designed to fail and be replaced with Vista Classic.
VistaDali: A surreal version transmuted to the underlying fish for dinner. Shades of red invade my shoes.
And so on...
"a major re-working of Windows that makes changes ...to the way the operating system ... handles sound"
Is this the encrypted 100% digital data channel that will not play music without a DRM license? And MS will not certify hardware that includes analog out?
For "deliberately crappier interface" read "basically XP's interface".
And your point is...?
Consumers are complaining about not having any choice. Finally, Microsoft is listening to its consumers and now decides to release many different versions of the same product. What a wonderful idea!
What more crap are they going to come up next? This is so UNREAL! Honestly, I'm so flabergasted!
I've been using computers since my Tandy 1000 SL, which used DOS 3.0 and some desktop software called Desk Mate. I was not a GUI guy, I did everything in the command line. Believe it or not I never touched Windows 3.1 and jumped straight to Windows 95 when I bought my first Pentium 100 Mhz.
I first thought windows was so freaken awesome until I realized for the first time, my machine is getting slow.. I'll tell you something, during my DOS days I've never seen my computer as slow. Back then, I was functional, I could do everything on that old tandy machine, my homework, qbasic programming, bbsing etc, play shitty games etc.. If i needed to do repetitive work I would write quick batch scripts and I was no real programmer back then.
Since windows came along, each and every release from the Microsoft Corporation demanded a stronger machine and more dependancy on using my mouse. I don't know why we bother having a keyboard anymore. Just make a virtual keyboard instead and add a second mouse for my other hand. Maybe I'll get more out windows that way.
So what's my point?
Aren't computers supposed to be more productive today than yesterday?
I used to be able to dish out 50 page research papers in less time but now I spend more time formatting my document using my mouse and waiting for my software to do actually do the action. My machine is getting too slow again! To help things I can't type long papers and have to cut it up, because the software I'm using is getting too heavy.
Why on earth on we always forced to upgrade? Software is supposed to get better not worse.
So screw that, I'm not touching Vista just like I didn't touch windows 3.1. I've made the switch completely to Linux now. I can do my work using just my keyboard, type documentation using latex, write scripts like I used to with batch files, i can stay in my console all the time again. On top of that I'm still using a Pentium III with just 500 Megs of Ram and its fast enough!
Vista can kiss my ass!
"If a show of teeth is not enough, bite
That I will agree with, but is it strong arm tactics from Microsoft, or is it that linux does often not have the driver support to work on said laptops? Or at least the QA guys don't want to go through the testing of another OS on the laptop, and they don't want the tech support to be need to be trained on another OS, adding more lines to the script they already follow. The laptop market is getting as cut-throat as the desktop market, and lowering costs any way, which may include not offering a different OS to keep support and QA/testing costs down helps keep the profit there, while under-cutting your competitors.
I'm not sure which it is. I don't work for the laptop industry. We buy IBM laptops, and they don't seem to have to compete with lower prices, but I still think their thinkpads are worth every penny we paid. At home, acer laptops are dirt cheap, and there are a ton of other companies now in compition for your home laptop dollars.
For a good time call www.sawkie.com
How about just TWO versions of the operating system?
Windows Vista - optimized for business, development, or personal use. Allows up to four discrete processors (eight-way proccessing on quad dual core systems). This will assure that customers are buying the right edition, and whitebox dealers will be compared on an even keel against Dell because business customers won't be comparing an unusable stripped version of Windows against one capable of joining a domain. Also, Activation becomes more customer-friendly because it allows for easy license transfer without accusing the customer of being a criminal.
Windows Vista Media Center: Windows Vista with native support for more media devices, a(n optional) user-friendly interface which is optimized for use as a media appliance.
But no, that would make it too easy and would end up with the result that a customer won't have to eat a Home license and buy AGAIto get real network functionality.
The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
Don't forget "Hasta la Vista" for the Linux lovers
According to the MS webpage there are 12 versions. All of original 6 are available in both 32 and 64 bit versions.
Buy the new Windows Vista.
You can have:
- More features
- More efficiency
- More reliability
- More easy to use
just pick two of these choices
and we deliver you the experience of them
(other choises will be excluded from the selection)
Well, unless you have a crappy Fujitsu Siemens with broken ACPI, this should not be an issue. And even in the case of the Fujitsu Siemens, whose fault is it really if:
Or at least the QA guys don't want to go through the testing of another OS on the laptop
Then just ship it without any OS whatsoever.
and they don't want the tech support to be need to be trained on another OS, adding more lines to the script they already follow
Just train them to escalate the call to somebody more knowledgeable if they encounter a situation not covered by the script.
The laptop market is getting as cut-throat as the desktop market, and lowering costs any way, which may include not offering a different OS to keep support and QA/testing costs down helps keep the profit there, while under-cutting your competitors.
Seems to me that saving 120 € of licensing costs would be an advantage, rather than a disadvantage.
At home, acer laptops are dirt cheap, and there are a ton of other companies now in compition for your home laptop dollars.
Incidentally, ACER does offer a Windows refund. However, the procedure has deliberately been made cumbersome and uninteresting for the customer:
- Customer needs to send back laptop to ACER, so that they can remove Windows (rather than just asking for the license sticker, or doing the thing in the shop)
- Customer only gets 30 € back (rather than 120 € which Windows originally costs)
- Customer needs to pay insured shipping both ways (leaving not much left from the paltry 30 €)
Understandably, not many people want to take up ACER on the "offer". Who indeed wants to wait 3 more weeks for their new laptop for a feeble cashback of a couple of €? Prices might as well have dropped for more than that by just waiting three weeks.However, the offer does exist, and in the unlikely event that a customer did take them up on it, they would still face those hypothetical QA and customer service issues mentioned above.
So QA and customer service are not the real issue. They are just excuses.
The real issue are illegal and secret agreements with Microsoft which are designed to make any windows-less laptop as difficult as possible.
This gives them the opportunity to not have to pay for a graphical interface they can't or don't want to use.
They're paying for it whether it's included or not, since it looks like just about everything else will be a service pack to XP anyway. Unless they get it with a new computer, but what are the odds any new computer will leave Vista out?
And what if I buy a new computer and it includes an OEM version of Vista... and I want to run in Windows-2000-classic mode. Can I get a rebate?
I have security requirements that Microsoft's HTML control can't meet. I've been wanting a version of Windows that doesn't need the HTML control for over 5 years now, so I don't have to worry about some third-party app resurrecting Internet Explorer by embedding the HTML control in a web browser again.
Any bets on how often this version (or 6 Versions) of Windows will crash? Or will they finally make a product THAT WORKS consistently???
Sniper's Motto: One shot, One kill- If you run, you'll only die tired.
I work for a software company that I'm not going to name here, but we basically did the same thing : releasing a "no frills" version of the software. The customers we got into this package were essentially those that make their decisions purely on price, but not one has been impressed by the interface that was supposedly designed to meet their needs - they are all in said offering simply because it's cheaper, and most complain about how the software is "gimped". People may act stupid sometimes, but they aren't blind : they're going to see this exactly as it is - Microsoft is attempting to nickel and dime for their new OS.
If they would just sell the added features as separate softwares, like other competitors have to, they wouldn't have to worry about selling what's going to come off as a poorly written OS. What's going to motivate someone to switch from Windows XP into some kinda of Basic feature stripped Vista?
And that's ignoring Microsoft's long standing tradition of releasing its OS full of security holes and show stopping fatal errors.
You can get 15 minutes of fame, but you can go down in history for infamy.
Has BSOD been upgraded to RSOD in all the versions or only in specific ones?
What's going to motivate someone to switch from Windows XP into some kinda of Basic feature stripped Vista?
....
:)
Ummm...how 'bout
The system requirements for Doom 4 are Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate Edition or higher, please contact your Operating System Vendor to obtain an upgrade and retry your installation.
Right now you have the choice of the Classic Windows-2000 look, or the new Fisher-Price look. Since they're describing the Fisher-Price look as "Classic" now, does that mean the classic "Classic" look is gone?
Most people who have a choice will buy the cheapest option when it comes to electronics (I-POD being an exception, but it is a fashion accessory). This is because of the WallMart effect and commodity hardware/generic software.
Because of this, MS is going to try to split out their market, much like GM did in the post WW2 era: Get poor and young people to buy cheap, no frills. As they advance up the economic ladder, upsell them to the higher end product. The core product is still the same (same engine, transimssion, even in many cases, the same body), but add on more/"better" options like leather seats, climate control, 8-track tape players, marketing, etc.
The only problem with that model is when real competition shows up, you have to start adding the better options on to the low end cars to keep up with the competitor. At some point there is a knee to the curve and there is no difference at all between Cadilac and Chevy, except for the name plate, marketing and cost. This completely kills your most profitable market (high end) because the customer doesn't want to drive a Cadilac that looks exactly like a Chevy Cavalier, and they've long since moved on to something else.
At some point the marketing department takes over the company and decides that they need a product that they can sell, not one that makes sense. Sadly, we are at that point now with the SUV (made worse by stupid laws that require fuel economy calculations to be an average of the fleet of cars and trucks instead of on a per-unit bassis). After all, when was the last time you saw an SUV ad that didn't feature at least one shot of the truck on some back road out in Montana with the perfect family at the campsite? Or a pickup ad with some cowboy roping steers out in West Texas (with his good friend the oil wildcatter, getting dirty out in the back 40)? Who wouldn't want that lifestyle? I sure would, and, apperently, so do most women aged 25-50 who can't park.
I think this is why apple will be the next big deal, and some low end OS, written mostly in India or China will be the end of MS. Microsoft will be forced to compete on features with some low end OS that just beats them at there own game (HINT: It won't be Linux as we know it, but it may be something that is based on it, much like the Subaru boxer engine was a knock off of the VW*). This will piss off the high end, who will move to Apple, kill MS R&D's budget and MS will be the first major company to crash and burn in the infromation age. Remember: What's good for GM is good for America? That was said at a time when 60% of the cars on the road were GM built, and the biggest threat to them (as precieved at the time) was the Sherman Anti-trust Act. BTW- Microsoft will, after releasing Visa, will announce their biggest quarter ever. Buy your stock just before the release, and sell it 3-4 months after their biggest quarter ever. Don't look back, because they won't be around much longer after that.
*Linux is the VW microbus of the software world: cheap, reliable software you can fix yourself. Just that you may end up going uphill in reverse since the reverse gear has much higher touque than first, but you know that already since you fixed the tranny yourself. Just know that thost people pointing and laughing wouln't know how great a vehicle you have, and yes, you are superior to them.
"Well, good luck finding a judge that doesn't run a bestiality site."
Give me a "v", give me a "i", give me a "s", give me a "t", give me an "a"... What's that mean?! V = voyeuristic I = inquiring S = surveillance T = tracking A = agent Microsoft before = "Where do you want to go today?" Microsoft after = "What would you like to show us today?" Move over Sony, there's a new kid in town!
"To err is human, doing it again is downright stupidity!"
If you are only going to transport cargo you can forgo the rear seats and extra windows and end up with a cheaper van. Even more extreme, say you know exactly how your van is going to be used. You could even remove the passenger seat and end up with a Fedex (the brown parcel vans) style van that allows the driver to get out on the passenger side.
It makes sense in physical products to only get and pay for what you need. It saves the manufacturer in resources so you will pay less.
But software is totally different. It doesn't cost anything to give everyone a dvd with EVERYTHING because it costs the same to press a dvd with Vista Basic as Vista Ultimate.
The only 'cost' is the development costs. Wich in fact increase by having different versions. First of is the extra cost of development to get the different versions in the first place and then there is the support and marketting costs with having to explain it all.
Remember the economy of opensource. Why does it work? Because to cost of making a billion linux kernels is the same as the cost of making one. If I bake a delicious apple pie then I can share it with perhaps half a dozen people before the pie is up. Software (and other stuff that can be digitally reproduced for 'free') is different.
MS incurred extra costs by making XP Home and Pro and made support more costly while it would have cost them nothing to just sell everyone XP Pro.
But there has to be a reason. Of course there is. Think EVIL(TM).
Their are two ways to be evil with a fake system of a product range. It all deals with upsell. First, you sell people the cheap version wich you sell as low as you want so that it can cheaply included with each new PC. Then you clean up when people have to pay for the upgrade because the basic version doesn't do what they want.
This gives you:
Lots of money from everyone upgrading and fake low prices for your OS so that nobody can claim you are overcharging. What is not to like?
Software is a funny business. I can understand that I pay more for a car with a 3 liter engine then a 2 liter but what exactly makes a Windows wich runs on 1 cpu more expensive then one that runs on 2?
This is one of the reasons Linux is so popular. People who think costs of purchase often only think in terms of desktop but when you got a 32 cpu box free becomes a whole lot cheaper all of a sudden.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
Well, unless you have a crappy Fujitsu Siemens with broken ACPI, this should not be an issue. And even in the case of the Fujitsu Siemens, whose fault is it really if:
Again, it costs to test, so they don't. If they make 15 points or 25 points or whatever the formula is, and keep the costs lower enough to offer their laptop cheaper then their competitor, they will do so.
Then just ship it without any OS whatsoever.
Well, that's user friendly.. That'll keep support costs way down. 1 machine configured one way and sent out is easier to support, lowering their costs.
Just train them to escalate the call to somebody more knowledgeable if they encounter a situation not covered by the script.
This requires keeping staff that they can escalate too, costing much more then a standard tech monkey. It's a cost/benefit thing.
However, the offer does exist, and in the unlikely event that a customer did take them up on it, they would still face those hypothetical QA and customer service issues mentioned above.
No, if you have them remove windows from it, you're pretty much on your own. They do not support it anymore. The costs of number of people this will piss off is a lot lower then the cost of keeping even 1 higher level tech support staff member.
Those are also Acer's policies, not Microsofts.
The real issue are illegal and secret agreements with Microsoft which are designed to make any windows-less laptop as difficult as possible.
illegal and sexret agreements that you know about how? I thought they were secret?
the real issue is customer demand. If enough demand it, it will happen. But not enough people care. If they offer both with windows or no-os on their website, more people will go for the cheaper option, then there's going to be a lot more support for them, unless they offer no-os with no support, but that will piss a lot of people off, because everyone will go for the cheaper option, then get "Sorry, you should have bought windows' when they try to get help installing their own copy of windows or whatever.
Business bends to the will of the majority of it's customers. When the majority of it's customers demand change, business changes, or is left behind by the competition who offers what the customers want. The company who caters to it's customer base is the one who stays alive. That is what we've been seeing in the past couple of years, and it will continue. More and more places will offer linux, niche markets at first, maybe it will stay that way, maybe it will continue to grow, but I don't see the artificial barriers created by microsoft anymore, and choice has returned in limited amount to the marketplace.
For a good time call www.sawkie.com
Actually this could backfire. Having multiple choices that are difficult to choose among drives people to alternatives. People are systematically irrational in this way. If somebody prefers A over B, then they should continue to prefer A over B even if choice C suddenly becomes available, right? Wrong. Often they will go to *B* is it's too hard to choose between A and C, and all three choices are close in value. A famous study illustrating this had people choose their compensation for participating in a quick study. They could choose between this fancy pen (told it was worth around, say, $5) and like $3 cash. People almost invariably took the pen. However, when other people were given their choice between two different but comparable pens, each worth around $5, and $3 cash, they just took the cash. They didn't have a good reason to pick one pen over the other (says one theory), or the cost of debating the choice was higher than their preference over the third alternative (says another theory), so they go for the neutral, third alternative. There have been many, many similar experimental examples.
So, if people are stressed or stymied by having to choose among even two copies of Windows, much less six, and they have been at all flirting with an alternative option (i.e., another OS, or just don't bother upgrading at all), this could easily put them over the edge.
(This comes for the reason-based choice work of Eldar Shafir and others)
My problem is that Microsoft generally hides hou to turn these sort of features on/off, and there's nothing like a timer to turn the feature off for a time period after the first administrative activity or while an administrative area. If I've just been web browsing, then I might not be intending to make an Administrative change, but if I've just spent the last few minutes tweaking display settings, it's more likely Does the administrative query come up when one clicks on control panel or for Adminstrative Tools or just for passwords, of for varying degrees of each?
I suppose it's the Vista Ultimate Edition that will double as the Vista Pirate Edition.
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
Windows XP has gotten incompatible with QuickBASIC Check out FreeBASIC instead which strives to be compatible with QB: http://freebasic.net/
Well, as a customer, I expect that they test their shit before shipping it... (... and after "repairing" it too...) Fujitsu Siemens apparently thinks they'll need to do neither...
If they make 15 points or 25 points or whatever the formula is, and keep the costs lower enough to offer their laptop cheaper then their competitor, they will do so.
While they're at it, why don't they just do it the southern-Italian way, and ship an empty case?
Oh, I forgot, there's no way to install Windows into an empty case, that's why...
Well, that's user friendly.. That'll keep support costs way down.
So why aren't they doing it?
This requires keeping staff that they can escalate too
What about, hmmmm, the "developpers" (or integrators) of this crap? Or did they already fire them?
costing much more then a standard tech monkey. It's a cost/benefit thing.
Not having an escalation procedure in place is not really a solution. Enterprising customers will just start phoning random numbers on their exchange, and hope to be "escalated" to the proper place by whomever picks up the phone... except it won't be the proper place at the first try. So in effect they'll have wasted the time of lots more people than if a proper procedure was in place to begin with!
No, if you have them remove windows from it, you're pretty much on your own. They do not support it anymore.
By law, they still must support there hardware.
(But they won't need to support any software obviously, as they wouldn't have shipped any...)
illegal and sexret agreements that you know about how? I thought they were secret?
"Secret" in the sense that they don't acknowledge these agreements officially (they can't. Such agreements are a blatant violation of anti-trust laws). "Secret" also in the sense that the exact punishments for non-compliance with Microsoft's desires are not known. But it is a pretty well-known fact that such agreements do indeed exist, even if their exact contents is not known.
the real issue is customer demand. If enough demand it, it will happen. But not enough people care.
Not enough people care, that's indeed the issue. Probably out of laziness (they'd rather spend 120 € more on a piece of shit software than spend a couple of hours to fight for their rights). However, if they do keep their windows on their computer, and if they do (predictably) catch a virus or a Trojan, or lose their 120 page Microsoft Word dissertation, they'll come whine to the family geek...
What for?
Conserve Oil, Recycle, Boycott Walmart
Microsoft never fails to bring new meaning to the words "Dumbass" with each new release.
Their should be only two Vistas.
Vista and Vista Server.
6 different distros, that's the spirit! Glad to see Microsoft is ACTUALLY trying to compete with Linux! :)
And Dell is sure not to go and make several images of installs of the different versions of windows. They will choose one.
Hyper Windows Vista Zero Alpha 3 Blue Limited Edition Revision 2
Finally! An operating system for the fine folks at CAPCOM!
So why aren't they doing it?
sorry, I forgot to put the sarcasm tags there. Shipping a computer with no os means every non-tech person who purchases one will call for support when they turn on their new laptop and get "No Operating system" or whatever the error is that's going to spit out. Of they can ship it with FreeDos! That's just as user friendly...
Not having an escalation procedure in place is not really a solution.
Not having to pay people who know linux is a solution. You just don't offer linux on your website, anyone who wants to install it is on their own. It's simple, it saves more then it will cost you. Do you think if someone just offered linux on a PC, customers would be beating a path to their door? Suddenly, windows would be driven to 8% market share 30 seconds after the initial offering?
But it is a pretty well-known fact that such agreements do indeed exist
Did exist. Before the anti-trust trial. I'm not apologizing for microsoft here, I've just seen no evidence that they are abusing their power anymore. What I've been seeing over the past couple of years is in fact the oposite. Choice is returning to the market. It's not going to happen over night, but options have become available. This tells me Microsoft has less and less control over the market, now what's needed is viable competition. Apple is doing great, but costs are keeping them down further then they should be. Linux, I don't find, is going to be a viable option. I use it, but my mother doesn't, and couldn't.
It's all about what the majority of the customers want, and if something will make them money, and I don't see linux making Dell any money. Niche markets have opened up, and they may get larger and larger, but right now, the market is chosing Microsoft. It's changing, but with the illegal practices of Microsoft removed, we do see the OS market has changed, and will continue to do so. It's just not the over night revolution that some were expecting, but most knew would not happen.
For a good time call www.sawkie.com
Bill: Vista, eggs, sausage and Vista, that's not got much Vista in it.
Me: But I don't WANT ANY Vista!
nautical timekeeping
Microsoft seems to forget why they have this monopoly in the first place. People bought Windows because don't want to read what is on the box. They bought Windows so they whatever they bought would just work. They don't want read or think about system requirements. Now Microsoft with %90+ market share still in 2006 thinks that attitude has changed. When a customer walks in a store, he will be greeted with 3-5 version and will have to sit down and read to figure it out. I feel sorry for all those compusa salemans.
You don't have to be smart to use a Mac, you just have to be smart enough to buy one
I hate to go to the GUI then do the Command Prompt thang.
VISTA spelled other ways: ATSIV VATIS ATISV VASIT SVITA ASTIV TASIV TISVA just looking for some good new Linux distro names.
Help end the use of Sigs. Tomorrow
Ah, right, that worked so well for Java.
Switching to an API that Microsoft controls and can create incompatible extensions for, instead of one where the company that controls it is at least TRYING to maintain compatibility. That sounds like a winning approach.
I am sick of wrestling with software on the family XP boxes which does not support the user v. administrator permission scheme. It's now 2006 and running Windows XP Professional with a limited "user" account is still a hit or miss proposition. Sooner or later I need to make the account an administrator to get certain software to run properly.
I read this story and I hear voices. I know whose voices they are. They are my siblings, my bosses, my friends, my father, and my co-workers. I can make what they are saying. They are questions from my near future. I am confused what version should I buy? Why do make things so complicated? What does Aero do? Do I need Ultimate? I have formulated one answer for them.
Buy a MAC!!!
You don't have to be smart to use a Mac, you just have to be smart enough to buy one
Let's hope so.
In every other industry, this is not a problem. You don't see people say "I didn't know I had to take car insurance extra. I thought that was included in the sales price of the car." to the cop when caught driving around without insurance (even though at some time, there were such offers of insurance bundled with car available).
"Batteries not included" is a common sight on small electric toys.
You can buy your GSM phone together with a contract, but also without (and no, mobile phone maker's tech support lines are not overburdened with calls "why do I see 'No SIM card present' on my phone's display").
You just don't offer linux on your website, anyone who wants to install it is on their own.
No problem with that. But then they shouldn't re-imburse Windows to those people who don't needed, no questions asked, and full price.
Do you think if someone just offered linux on a PC, customers would be beating a path to their door?
If the price is right, why not? (And for the record: about a year back, some German stores did have just this kind of offer, and the PCs were sold out the same evening...) Oddly enough, they didn't repeat the offer. I wonder whether they got a call from Microsoft...
Suddenly, windows would be driven to 8% market share 30 seconds after the initial offering?
Well, it's quite rare that any paradigm shift would just take 30 seconds. However, if indeed it was easier to buy notebooks without windows, and if shops kept those offers running for any sensible length of time (best: permanently), rather than those one-time deals that they do now, with a sensible choice of hardware (usually it's either el-cheapo PCs or overpriced "business notebooks" but never the middle ground), then, sure enough, Microsoft's market share would suffer!
Did exist.
They do still exist. I know a guy with close connections to ACER, and he did indeed confirm me that at least ACER still has such "obligations" to Microsoft.
I've just seen no evidence that they are abusing their power anymore.
They still do. And these contract are just one aspect. Blatant bribing of public officials to ensure government markets in smaller countries is another one.
It's all about what the majority of the customers want
How meaningful is customer choice, if, for all practical purposes there is only one product to chose from (or 6... all made by the same manufacturer).
Customer choice is not a very meaningful concept if one alternative is offered to you on a silver platter, whereas you have to jump through hoops to get the other.
Subsystem for UNIX-based Applications enables users to run UNIX applications unchanged on a Windows Vista Enterprise-based PC.
The five different versions of Windows Vista are designed to fit the way you intend to use your PC:
What a mess that is. No doubt, just like previous versions of Window$ the most crippled version will have the exact same code base as the most-featured version. Won't be long before the hacks are out for turning one type of Window$ into another.
:o)
And talk about confusion! Linux vendors are all going to be saying "Gnome", "KDE" or "both", and M$ is going to try to sell six different options. Are consumers going to know the difference? Will they get the version that supports the X-Box just in case they get one? Why doesn't everybody get improved encryption and security? Surely Mom and Pop's banking information is worth protecting just as much as company data...
Microsoft has really screwed up this time. They've had too many brain-storming sessions by the look of it
...combine to form Vistatron, hero of the universe?
Look out evildoers...
So which one is the "We've screwed you six times already but you keep comin' back for more!" edition?
Inquiring minds wanna know.
Happy Monday to all.
Everything in the Universe sucks: It's the law!
http://www.dublindrpepper.com/
Try it. The difference is astounding.
Back on topic:
People buy things for various reasons. I know many people who bought gateways because they liked the cow spots on the box. My concern is that the user experience is going to be divided. Lets say person A buys a computer which comes with the DVD burning tools. Person B buys a similar computer that does not. Person B is going to wonder why they didn't get what person A got, even though they have a new computer with Vista or whatever came on it.
I only look human.
My mother is a halfling and my dad is an ogre, so that makes me an Ogreling
I didn't say they were attractive to people who knew about the alternatives. I said they're going into Vista, and like it or not Vista will end up on a lot of people's desktops. It'll leverage MS tech into the home. Whether this is a good or bad thing is immaterial.
Oh, and Activesync is one of the good bits of MS software, along with Exchange server.
perhaps this is one of the reasons they're doing a "basic" flavour: they can point the EU monopoly people at it and say "look, we've produced a stripped down version you're free to buy!" whilst not actually losing much in terms of monopolies as the OEMs won't ship it...
Just as long as none of the versions have any of those scary raw sockets.
Read the best of all of Slash: seenonslash.com
i hust want to know the differences of the six(?) editions? please hurry. ... whats the difference, pls? pls?
why pay more. same code faults
This has been a problem for me at work. With all of the different versions of Windows it is difficult to produce a one size fits all image that I can make and keep up-to-date. It is already enough I have to use 3rd party programs like Ghost and SysPrep to take a snapshot of a system, but it is even worse when every user has a different OS type. They're just doing this to squeeze more money out of their market, but I really wish they would just take the time to add features that really matter, otherwise they're going to end up losing market share. They're shooting themselves in the foot.
:)
It was nice and easy with Windows 2000 because the only differences were between workstation and server versions, and for the most part I can understand a differentiation there. But, with Windows XP they split it into Home and Professional, and the various server versions of 2003. And then it got even worse with Media Center Edition and Tablet Edition. So, when you make an image you have to do it for every installation type. The Media Center Edition and Tablet Edition are just overlays onto the Professional version, so it should just have been application installs and not a different version of Windows.
The rumor is that even though the product line will be confusing and fragmented for Vista it will be simplified by a few different systems. Apparently the differences between the different versions can be downloaded over the web, so if you install the base version you can update to the version that your version supports through a Windows Update type procedure. And apparently volume licensed customers, like myself, can use the most complex version and use SysPrep, or some equivalent, to strip out the unsupported features when you apply it to a specific computer. So, they're simplifying a complicated system, which may not be better than just providing a simple system, but at least it's better than just providing a complex system.
So, let's look at the product line:
Vista Starter: Streamlined (aka stripped down). It's not designed for the US, and I'll be surprised if you can even buy it in the US.
Vista Home Basic: Just like XP Home.
Vista Home Premium: Adds Aero. I imagine this is what most users will use.
Vista Business: Most likely supports domains, whereas the Home versions won't. So, this will be like XP Professional.
Vista Enterprise: Supports domains but also adds lots of DRM. This will be big in some businesses that do not trust their employees and are paranoid of their computers being stolen.
Vista Ultimate: The eXtreme version. It supports domains, DRM and has Aero. This will be the most pirated version and it will consume an inordinate amount of RAM.
So far I don't see the reason I should switch to Vista. I am happy enough with XP. It is also rumored that Vista will support "Hybrid Hard-drives" that will feature fast flash memory that can be used for extremely quick booting and for low power modes, but beyond that feature I haven't heard of anything all that interesting. Most of their features usually involve throwing huge images over my folders so it will be even harder to work.
And even when I (have to) move over to Vista I will most likely do exactly what I did with XP and that is make it look and act like Windows 2000. There were some nice features added to XP, and I am sure there will be nice features added into Vista, but it's going to be hard to justify a 500MB memory requirement.
"The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds, and the pessimist fears this is true." --James
These are some scary times we live in!
"To err is human, doing it again is downright stupidity!"
They forget to tell us which version wont crash.
MadOgre.com
I haven't used Windows as a personal OS for a while now... but I can see the huge potential for Vista Starter among gamers.
If I ever go back to windows, it would be for gaming and wouldn't care about the other bundled features of the OS (assuming OSX/Linux don't already have the game available)... assuming of course, that Starter version will support DirectX and all that multimedia stuff in order to play games.
Vista Starter is not a choice. It is only for people in 3rd-world countries, supplied with government-funded computers, and you can't even buy it in the US or other well-to-do countries.
Vista Home Basic is only for computers too old to support Aero. For home users with older systems, Home Basic is the only edition for them.
So it's not quite 6 choices. There is no XP equivalent of Vista Starter and Home Basic is offered to avoid requiring everyone to have 1 GB of RAM and a dedicated 3D card.
~CGameProgrammer( );
In other words, the manufacturers/integrators are the ones who will be making the "which version" decision. Only people like us who build our own machines are going to care.
...quite correct, but they will be deciding what to put on their machines based on price points, and whatever deals are being offereed by the MS OEM sales department. So the flavor of OS on your parent's new computer next year will be the result of a decision of some sales and marketing people at DELL trying to maximize their profits.
Cazart.
HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
I work for a medium sized ISP, and as a consequence, I have had to do tech support. One of the biggest problems in tech support is establishing what the person on the other end is seeing. The question, "are you running windows XP, or 98? or Me?" Never works, end users have no fucking clue, I get answers like, "yeah, I'm using Microsoft Navigator..." or, "American Online 7.0." So, I have to ask the person ot describe what he/she is seeing, and I can usually figure what I need to do from there. This just makes that worse....
Fuck you microsoft, fuck your useless software, fuck your lame brained security, fuck your belief of, "well, we have so much money, must be because we can do no wrong!" Just fuck you.
--Nuintari
slashdot : where an opinion can be wrong.
OMFG.
What's next a live license lock out and activation.
One of Linux's supposed liabilities is it's broad range of distros or even wide choices of programs for each purpose. We'll see how much of a defect it is when Microsoft does it.
If it wasn't for like Microsoft, I just couldn't do things, or buy stuff. Like adults pay me to put their ads on like everyones computers and stuff. There's even money in like getting dudes personal data and like selling it to other clueless dudes; Wow! Now with this new Vista coming out in 6 flaovrs?! Woe! I can make like 6 times the cashe. I figure that when I get old, like 18? I can retire, and hang lose about Social Security. Rock ON Microsoft!
- Windows 2000 Pro (I don't think there was a home)
- Windows 2000 Server,
- Windows 2000 Advanced Server
- Windows 2000 Datacenter Server.
With XP there were two main workstaiton versions. Home and Pro. Of course home was a lobotomised hunk of smelling do-do but the trend is showing there. And then there were some weird ones with local releases in Europe (and I'm not counting CE and real time stuff). Add onto that the various versions of server 2k3 and they distros start to add up.6 versions of Vista is getting a little carried away. But it's just a continuation of the theme they've already established. I expect there will be 3 versions of smelly lobotomised OS's, one version most use, and maybe acouple with features no one wants or cares about
btw I don't know where the BBC sourced their "6" from but MS seems to bthink there are five versions
The original Xbox needed a Media Center Extender to do this. The Xbox 360 doesn't need the Extender. Currently, Windows XP Media Center edition is required. When the article says "Premium edition," it means Vista Home Premium, which has the Media Center functions built in.
TO START
PRESS ANY KEY
Where's the 'ANY' key? I see Esk, Kitarl, and Pig-Up...
The BBC article makes no sense, in light of decades of experience with Microsoft.
A simple error in Mr. Goffe's quote best explains the confusion.
Suspecting a transmission error, I made 1-letter, then 2-letter, then 3-letter changes to the message and applied a credibility metric to the result.
The smallest change to the message which results in a plausable quote results in:
"We don't want customers to be forced into buying something that is going to meet all their needs," said Barry Goffe, Microsoft's director of Windows client product management.
...clearly they've moved on to Nintendo with Windows Red, Windows Blue, Windows Yellow, etc.
Gotta crash em all.
The official Microsoft Windows Vista web site indicates there are only 5 versions. -lotd
Do any programs not run on XP Home or Pro? Its just some internal difference. 99% of all future Vista owners will be OEM owners. And most of them are happy campers if they can surf the E-nternet ...
"Freiheit ist immer auch die Freiheit des Andersdenkenden" - Rosa Luxemburg, 1871 - 1919
"Yes, your honour, we have released a version of Vista that is in compliance with EU ruling that M$ Media Player isn't included with it... Erm, Vista Basic Beginner For Dummies and Idiots Trailer Park Edition, I think you'll find it's called."
"The Vista Ultimate Super Deluxe Edition? Selling like Hotcakes, your honour... the huge publicity drive and 20% off R.R.P. incentive for Ultimate Super Deluxe Edition is sheer coincidence... hey, it's not like it's against the law to advertise our products and compete against eBay prices, your honour."
... or in other word, pirated Vista Ultimate. All the dumbies that buy cheap PC's with preloaded will have Vista Home, but eventually they will all upgrade to "Free Vista".
Meh.
Which has vastly more to do with the vanishly small interest in Linux for both laptops and desktops, than anything Microsoft could do.
Lets ignore vista starter and look at the other 5 editions.
:) ultimate. People who need media functionality (or who own a 360 and want to connect to it) buy the media pack. People who need mobility buy the mobility pack. And enterprises who need the enterprise tools get and use that.
IMO, 5 editions is way too many.
What they should have is this:
1.Vista Home. Same as current Home Basic but with Aeroglass UI as an optional component (i.e. people on lower spec machines dont have to install it, everyone else can). Should be better designed this time so that the things "missing" from XP home that made some apps not work (something about security I think) are all there in Vista Home. Especially, proper support for setting file permissions and for using Vista Home in a reduced privilage environment should be present.
2.Vista Media Pack. Includes all the media functions (DVD creating, HD movie maker, xbox 360 connect, photo features, PVR type functionality etc) currently in Vista Home Premium.
3.Vista Mobility Pack. Includes Tablet PC, PC-PC Sync etc.
4.Vista Business (or Vista Pro). Includes the business features currently in Vista Business including backup, encrypted file system, remote desktop (I dont know of very many home users who need Remote Desktop and those who do can buy Vista Pro/Vista Business), web server, fax, domains, offline folders, multiprocessor support etc. Not sure if they should keep the mobility stuff in Vista Business or have business users buy the Mobility pack. Certainly they should take out all the media functionality (premuim games in Vista Business??? Who needs that...) and have business users who DO need it buy the Vista Media Pack to get that functionality.
Enterprise customers would get Vista Business too under their big multi-site licence deals.
5.Vista Enterprise tools. This would come with the unix stuff, the copy of Virtual PC, the enterprise level disk encryption and the other stuff currently in "Vista Enterprise". Big enterprises who actually need this stuff would be able to get (and use this) under the same site licence they have for windows.
6.Windows Vista Ultimate. Would include everything. Essentially Vista Business + Vista Media Pack + Vista Mobility Pack + Vista Enterprise tools.
Essentially, you now have the following versions of Vista:
Windows Vista Home for home users
Windows Vista Business (or Windows Vista Pro) for business users
Windows Vista Ultimate (for those who have to have it all)
Plus these addons
Windows Vista Media Pack (for those who need Media Center, DVD authoring, HD movie maker, xbox 360 connect etc)
Windows Vista Mobillity Pack (for those who need tablet PC, PC-PC Sync etc etc)
Windows Vista Enterprise Tools (for business users who need the advanced stuff)
Much less customer confusion. Home users buy home, business users buy business & geeks & gurus & etc buy (or pirate
Much simpler (IMO) than all the distinctions between Vista Home Basic, Home Premium, Business, Enterprise and Ultimate. Plus it provides upcharge opertunities later on if someone decides they DO in fact need the other stuff (e.g. the media functionality)
vista will come in yet a few more versions, in addition to Vista Ultimate:
Vista Penultimate
and
Vista Antepenultimate
In addition, Microsoft will offerVista Aspire for free download. This will be crippleware which displays the above-mentioned red screen of death with a dialog that says "A fatal exception has occured. Please click OK to continue." This will be followed by a dialog that says "Click OK to lose data." And another that says "Are you sure you want to lose data?" If you click OK, you get the black screen of death.
_______
DIY Linux virus removal:
1) [root@localhost ~]# rm -rf /
*cue Twilight Zone theme*
May Peace Prevail On Earth