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Hollywood Says Piracy Has Ripple Effect
ColinPL writes to mention a Washington Post article about a new study backed by Hollywood on intellectual piracy. The study, which they're presenting to lawmakers today, claims that piracy has a ripple effect on the economy. According to the study, lost revenues may have as much as three times the impact previously imagined. From the article: "Lawmakers and federal agencies such as the Justice and State departments have helped Hollywood battle physical piracy -- specifically, counterfeit DVDs. But now the stakes are especially high for entertainment companies as they sell more of their products online in the form of digital songs, movies and other intellectual property. Internet piracy may be tougher for lawmakers to conceptualize, entertainment companies fear."
I think the word Hollywood is looking for is *hoodwink*.
Eye implants, ala Minority Report. Only instead of just targeting you with advertising when you go somewhere, they also dictate what digital media, books, magazines and lazer light shows you can view. If you paid your fee you can see for the day.
No sig for you!!
Just in time for elections here in the U.S., "Hollywood" (who the fuck are they kidding, it's the MPAA/RIAA) has to start it's round of FUD. This is such a complete bullshit study, especially since it was back by themselves, so you bet they are going to make it sound like they need help to stop those pirates! UNDERSTAND THIS YOU ARROGANT, GREEDY BASTARDS, /no one/ wants to fucking download your DRM'ed/non-DRM'ed bullshit movies and music. Oh and by the way Hollywood, the public in the U.S. could give a shit about you losing money. In fact they prove it by not going to see every piece of crap movie you try putting out.
"...Internet piracy may be tougher for lawmakers to conceptualize, entertainment companies fear."
Nice one there guys, I sure hope our "lawmakers" realize that you just said that they were to stupid to understand your study (greed and FUD). How long is the U.S.A (especially lawmakers)going to let these greedy fucking vampire Hollywood typess dictate your lives? How far does it have to go for the public and government to STOP allowing these extortionists to keep doing "business?
I would have posted not-AC, but I don't want the MP/RIAA's thugs coming for me. I didn't get permission to say the words Hollywood and Godfather.
is sooo small economically wise it is rather pathetic they have as much pull as they do...the candy industry is about 10 times the size
The phrase "more better" is acceptable English. suck it grammar Nazis
They interviewed a crew hand from Waterworld and, aside from forcing him out of a job, the unnamed victim reported that piracy forcefully entered his home and raped him in front of his youngest son. Piracy has taken not only his source of income but also the joy that he and his son once shared.
The report concludes with piracy being at large and dangerous. Piracy is capable of flipping bits in a pattern that resembles music and is also known to cause cancer.
So when are lawmakers presented with the Piracy Is Actually Pretty Bitching for Consumers report? What about the Economics Research is Bullshit & Baseless report? Oh, that's right, the other side of the issue never gets to hear it's voice heard and no alternatives will ever be explored. Silly me.
My work here is dung.
*Everything* has a ripple effect on the economy. That's why it's called "the economy" as a whole. You can't expect a noticeable shift in traditional cash flow to not have at least some sort of chain reaction or reactions elsewhere.
"No fair, you changed the outcome by measuring it!" - Professor Hubert J. Farnsworth
All Hollywood has to do is change the language so words like "theft" apply to non-applicable situations such as copyright infringement. After they succeed at this, they can transmute the words arson, rape, and murder to describe it. Make sure "think of the children" is mentioned occasionally.
Where were you when the voynix came?
Making crappy movies.
Sueing your audience.
Making your customers go through crap that people who don't pay don't have to go through.
If you think education is expensive, you should try ignorance -- Derek Bok, president of Harvard
This study recieved funding from NBC Universal and the MPAA. Why am I having a hard time taking it seriously?
I stopped buying DVDs since I'm never certain if the version out today won't be replaced by a extended version in six month and/or a gift box set next year. I want to spend my money only once. Not twice or thrice for the same product with extra features that should've been there in the first place.
Oh no, piracy is killing minimum wage video store clerk jobs! How will the economy function!
This is not the greatest
Sure - if you rip off films you'll have cash free to spend on other stuff instead! I'd have thought that was the whole point.
Ripple effect is fine. I just don't want to see a butterfly effect. One person pirates, and the next thing you know we have a chimpanzee for president and our rights are being eroded every day... Oh damn.
-matthew
"THERE IS NO JUSTICE, THERE IS ONLY ME." -Death
Good cover for given the green light to big budget dud's and over-estimating box-office returns.
Need they say more?
Good. Cheap. Fast. Pick Two.
Is this anything like the ripple effect in the 4400? Is the future of the world at stake? ARE WE ALL GOING TO DIE?!?
lost revenues may have as much as three times the impact previously imagined
I see a bright future for cdr and dvdr sales. And Ipods. Eat it, Hollywood.
Your sig(k) has been stolen. There is a puff of smoke!
It's important to remember, however, that even though piracy prevents money from reaching the movie industry, those dollars probably stay in the economy, one intellectual property expert said. Ridiculous! Doesn't everybody do what I do? That is, sink every penny I save through downloading pirated films into doubloons I keep buried in a chest in my back yard. Pieces of eight! Pieces of eight!
The study reveals that the ripple makes everyone happier and wealthier!
Oh wait, this was funded by Hollywood?
In that case...
The ripple materializes a "Boston Strangler", "Jack the Ripper", or an "undead Abe Vigota" in every neighborhood, everywhere. FEAR THE RIPPLE!
I figured it out. If there was less or no piracy every video rental store would have to hire additional employees to keep up with the crowds that would be lining up outside the doors.
Hmm, perhaps the memories of the members of parliament, senators, congressmen and women should have their memories refreshed.
In fact, it's the pirates who benefit the economy most, they produce the goods at a far lower cost, the benefit is far and wide, what is saved on music and videos can be spent on more important items.
Deleted
Hollywood study finds that Hollywood deserves more money. Big surprise?
What about the study about how only three movies this summer were bearable to watch?
(Pirates, Sunshine, Superman)
"I only speak the truth"
Karma: null(Mostly affected by an unassigned variable)
Which has a worse effect on the economy? Think about it for a sec... It increases costs of R&D of consumer electronics, it delays to market consumer electronics. It makes so only a select few can market products that will play the content. It makes the hardware more expensive. It decreases the size market that might buy the content.
what exactly is "intellectual piracy"?
Maybe it goes like this:
"Excuse me Steven. This music file you are listening to is exciting. It reminds me of the third movement of Beethoven's 6th. Like that under-appreciated piece, this quite moves me to tears."
"Yes Robert, this tone poem is a diamond in a sea of stones. Just the title alone is juxtaposition of Victorian sensibility, combined with the strength of early American art deco, and hints of carmel."
"Oh? Pray tell, what is the title of the folio? And what talented individual brought forth these sounds, from his womb of creativity?"
"The gentleman's name is '50 Cent', and the title of his masterwork is 'What Up Gangsta'"
*raising eyebrow* "Scandalous!"
After the recent studies lessening the effects of piracy who is really surprised with one that states that the vastly overblown figures were actually "conservative" now they can go to whichever politician they have in their pockets and whine that the original numbers have to be true.
I would love to see a week or better yet a month where "piracy" by their definition ceased to be. Friends didnt pass on mix tapes, no one downloaded a game or song, no one loaned out a book, no one tried to move their windows license to a new computer, etc, I would then really love to see the real results of the ginormous sales they really think would happen. My prediction they fall drastically across the board. Yep alot of people pirate, but alot of people also buy things based on having heard it, played it or seen it and liked it.
...now that immorality is hurting them. Is this the same Hollywood that has been overtly hostile to people who insist that there is such a thing as right and wrong? Piracy is just one of the many effects that Hollywood's fuzzy morality is having on society, and it happens to be the one that's directly biting them in the ass. I don't feel a bit sorry for them. In the various ways they've attacked traditional values over the years, I can't help but wonder how they didn't have the foresight to expect their current predicament.
-Walrus
Now that anyone can record a song (that they wrote themselves) in their own home and distribute it over the Internet, isn't that going to reduce the value of the commercially-produced ones that the 'labels' make ? In effect, the 'control of the distribution channel' is gone, and we will be flooded with potentially-brilliant music for free (as advertising for band concerts, or as hobby).
To a lesser extent, it must be true of films, too. I don't think many individuals are capable of producing 'Star Wars' at home; but maybe some collaborations are.
I for one welcome our new mpaa mandated pirate overlords
SCO.
1) Stop making good products
2) Whine that it is everyone elses fault
3) File frivoulous lawsuits that are difficult to defend against.
4) Profit
5) Whine, rinse, repeat.
5b) loose all your money to the gaming industry, and try to sue them also.
6) whine, rinse, repeat.
entertainment companies fear
Until they will listen to what we fear [regarding fair use, copying, drm, etc.] I don't really care what they fear. But then again, I'm no lawmaker, and they will listen and do everything to make that fear go away. It's our fears that remain and slowly become reality.
I am putting myself to the fullest possible use, which is all I can think that any conscious entity can ever hope to do.
Vizzini: Inconceivable.
...
Inigo Montoya:, You keep using that word. I do not think it means, what you think it means.
"Don't you know you're going to shock the monkey?"- Peter Gabriel
Can I propose a "Parable of the magically fixed window"?
Let's say I have a broken window. Perhaps I don't care about it, perhaps I absolutely need it fixed, perhaps I'' only have it fixed if it's cheaper than $x. It doesn't matter.
If I can magically download a new window from the Internet for free, and if I would have bought one otherwise, I am now free to spend my money on something else. The money goes elsewhere, the economy as a whole should be fine.
If I wouldn't have had it fixed, then there's no money unexpectedly left free, and the economy is unaffected. But I do have a magic window, that's a plus.
Now this obviously sucks for whoever made the magic window and was legally entitled to get paid for any downloads, can't argue that. But the economy as a whole? I don't think so.
(perverted from the well-known-on-Slashdot-since-a-few-weeks Parable of the broken window, may contain obvious stupid mistakes)
I believe posters are recognized by their sig. So I made one.
Most the crew are a paid the minimum rate for 12-16 hour days if the movie succeeds or not. There's only one mainstream I'll be seeing this year and that's Scorsese's, you couldn't pay me sit through the rest.
Remind me, why does the world owe hollywood a living?
RIAA: Those danm Pirates are attacking our economy with their Voodoo Economics!!
Pirate: Arrr!! But 'tis naught to the voodoo that you do so well!! Ye scurvy dogs!
May the Maths Be with you!
Every time I download something to fix my broken Windows, it ends up making it worse.
Where were you when the voynix came?
There has been nothing worth copying! The stuff they put out is so pathetic that I would not want to waste bandwith copying.
I have not been to a first run flick for over 1 year. I have been seeing only 70's and 80's classics such as Blade Runner and Xanadu and James Bond.
Hollywood's product has really be very dissapointing to say the least. Perhaps Congress shall pass laws that dictate minimum quality to this stuff.
Luv
Cleara
I'm pretty sure that pirates bury their loot on tropical islands.
Hollywood needs to start getting its house in order before it can critise piracy for it's falling profits. http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/19/business/media/1 9hollywood.html?ex=1313640000&en=a3d7d097e8c79a00& ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss
Maybe if they stopped making remakes of old movies and never ending sequels to bad movies people would actually go SEE a movie.
I find myself picking up older movies (pre 1990) in a walmart for $5.50...I'd rather watch "Moscow on the Hudson" again than some of the movies that are out now.
And music??? Don't get me started...Maybe they should pull Allan Holdsworth out of that job as a salesman in a used car lot and give him a decent record deal.
Why is it impossible to find Pat Metheny CDs in the record store?
Lately the only thing the United States Government cares about is the "State of the Economy" (and terrorists). We are constantly being bombarded with news stories on why such and such law would stimulate the economy or this and that could be bad for the economy.
Whatever happened to the government "For the people, by the people"?
Wait, let me answer that - it has been replaced by the government "For the Corporations, (paid for) by the Corporations".
The multiplier effect Hollywood is referring to is a well known economic priciple. Basically money spent in the economy has a ripple effect greater than its actual amount (money spent helps pay someone's salary, who then uses the money to go out and buy goods, etc). The assumption they're erroneously making is that the money not being spent on movies because of piracy (and let's face it, they grossly overestimate that by claiming that every pirated copy is a lost sale) is not being spent elsewhere in the economy instead, thus making ZERO NET IMPACT on the economy as a whole - it's just Hollywood that loses out as spending shifts to different areas.
...and you've eaten your pen. simply stunning.
Any study that is backed by "Hollywood" (whomever that is), is nothing more than the movie studios and the guilds getting together to figure out yet another way to control technology. These are some of the most greedy corporate tools on earth! I was once told by a union executive that all the new technology is great because they can digitally superimpose products into scenes (that were not originally in the scene) and get more money from advertising. Forget art! We can sell more Doritos!!!
My hero and friend, Richard Stallman has a lot to say on the topic of piracy and "Hollywood" in the new documentary ALTERNATIVE FREEDOM. It also features Lawrence Lessig, Danger Mouse (of Gnarls Barkley and the illegal Grey Album) and and others...
Buy a copy to support the folks out there who are trying to spread better information than "Hollywood."
http://alternativefreedom.org/
--they say that piracy has a ripple effect to the negative, but globalization and outsourcing good paying manufacturing and IT jobs doesn't???? Nonsense! Many intartubes financial experts would beg to differ! Let's look at this .....
If we follow the globalist economist's ideas, then "outsourcing" Hollywood movie distribution to "pirates" should be GOOD for the economy! They need to get with the globalization program!
This is how globalism works, pay attention MPAA:
The jobs go elsewhere where the capital investment is less expensive and you can leverage tech and labor costs downward to the cheapest levels possible acording to sound capitalist guidelines-check! Nothing is cheaper or more efficient than using the pirates to duplicate and distribute the movies!
The resultant product is also then cheaper for the consumer-double check! YAHOO!
It's GLOBALISM! Thanks Wall Street, we are TEH SAVED!
I imagine the effects on our descendants will be infinite...
It doesn't matter which ape activates the Monolith
I agree 100% that there's a ripple effect. Many of us will download a quick and dirty copy of the latest blockbuster movie, see that it's absolute shit, and in turn, not go see it at the theaters or buy the DVD. Previously, millions of people were duped into paying hard earned money to see absolute and total garbage. I agree 100% that there's a ripple effect. I hope the ripples get bigger.
dear mpaa,
i'll be glad to stop pirating movies once the price of DVDs drops to $5. lets face it, we usually only watch a DVD once or twice, so $20 is ridiculously overpriced.
sincerely,
movie pirate
Please keep your bulshit greed to your own home country and stop exporting it to my region.
"Thanks for all the money you paid to us. We've used it to buy off ISO among other things" -Microsoft
All these anti piracy adverts at cinema's and on DVD's and people who buy pirate movies never go to the cinema or buy legal DVD's.
but in other breaking news slashdotters deny evidence for global warming, the moon landing and Bill Gate's charity donations. (though admittedly that last one is a little difficult to believe, but hey, not wanting to believe something doesn't make it false)
The follow up report will be about how all forms of entertainment on earth will be destroyed, taking with it almost all life on earth except for the main characters who are probably working in the mall or at the cable company with you. It's aNOTHER side effect of piracy. You might have seen it in such Hollywood blockbusters as "Armageddon", or "Volcano", or even "The Day After Tomorrow". You see, without Hollywood, we wouldn't have known that these catastrophes were even possible, much less how we might actually survive them. I for one thank God almost every day for the Big 5 [Movie/Music studio]'s whom without which we would all be dead. And Tom Cruise. Always for Tom Cruise.
It's not like people are hording money that would have been spent on DVDs. The money is still flowing through the economy. So this is hardly a bad thing for the economy as a whole, it just means that other sectors of the economy are earning more money.
-Rick
"Most people in the U.S. wouldn't know they live in a tyrannical state if it walked up and grabbed their junk." - MyFirs
What with all this hot air. Boom...boom...If you're going flog it, flog it like a dead horse
"Piracy means the economy as a whole gains _both_ the wealth inherent in an extra copy of a certain material for the particular consumer _plus_ the wealth inherent in whatever else the money is spent on."
Mr "IP is worth something", meet "Media sux" and "I never would have bought it anyway [since it's not worth buying]". Discuss amoungst yourselves.
Maybe it is time to examine the absurdity of a mix of sounds being worth millions of dollars.
These studies are based on the bogus premise that those downloading would be willing to pay the retail price for content if piracy was not an option. This is such a bogus assumption I think it is fair the label those did the study and those who tout it as liars. There is ZERO evidence for such a claim.
Because there is not a good way to price discriminate in the CD & DVD markets (charge less to those willing to pay less without charging less for everyone), it's quite possible that Hollywood and the RIAA would get ZERO additional dollars if they found the magic technological or legal bullet to kill priracy (which mythological entity that does not exist in this reality, but that's a different story). Somebody who trys to get content for free is by definiation not willing to pay for very much for the content. If they were willing to pay $20 for the DVD, they would have ordered from Amazon.
Hollywood and politicians are two groups that know nothing about basic micro economics and will be happy to undermine the liberty of the citizens of this country for an illusory pot of gold at the end of the DRM rainbow.
The 70's one with ONJ and rollerskating?
There is no right to feel safe thru security vaudeville at the expense of everyone's freedom, privacy and tax money.
It works for the defense companies.... (e.g. Wars anyone?)--sorry had to say it.
---------
Gov't is like a business that needs no sales people. Your forced to pay [taxes].
Not that I disagree with your conclusion, but your reasoning is terribly faulty. If our economy tanks...we go into a depression...and while yes the corporations did lose alot of money...they lost it because the PEOPLE were struggling to stay alive. So the state of the economy is a terribly important thing for the government to worry about, in fact, that really was the main purpose for our government even existing, to manage interstate commerce of our united states (USA isn't just some catchy acronym...it actually used to stand for United States of America...as in a group of independent states working together). I am more concerned why they are so worried about all this other garbage that really has no place in government instead of the state of our economy (which is pretty shakey from a peoples perspective) but not terribly shakey for the global corporation. When you can make stuff for pennies in China and sell them to "rich" by comparison americans...your company is doing great, but the American economy is going to suffer due to the displacement.
The only change I can believe in is what I find in my couch cushions.
The films have gotten steadily worse but at least the garbage we were duped into watching prior to 10 years ago was watchable. It's funny that the decline in quality coincided with an increase in the number of films being made, the number of sycophants on-set making the films and an ever increasing reliance on CGI to sell a weak story.
Noticeably, the digital revolution hasn't produced any great auteurs. Perhaps the distribution model needs to complete it's transistion first?
So with all these pirates running around, will the earth stop warming?
I just finished reading an article where they are releasing Superman Returns in Malaysia on DVD for $1.75. The Expanded Edition is going for like $2.50. When they come out in the US in November they are going to be something like $25 for the base and $35 for the Extended Edition.Now if they can justify selling the DVD over there to avoid the piracy issue, why not sell it for that price over here? I have been arguing for years that the prices are too high. I picked up the Directors Edition of Blade Runner in the Wal Mart bargain bin over a year ago for $5. One of my favorite movies BTW, but they are still trying to gouge people $15 for it in Best Buy, Circuit City, etc.. Make the price of a new release DVD $5, park them along the checkout lines in Wal Mart, and you'll sell millions. At that price they become impulse buys, but $25 is too high. Heck, make them $2.50 and sell twice as much!
Hollwyood needs to get back to basics and the only way it can do that is more films, more choice, less risk. This can only be done through making movies more cheaply. This will help develop talent, more chance of developing franchies and offset the costs of piracy as movies will go into profit easier. Hollywood also needs to keep an eye on technology and develop a business model based on this. Although the technology is here the infrastructure is not. They need to work with ISP's, the googles and dare I say the microsofts so that they can provide a service that people will pay to watch movies rather than pirate them. I would love to see in the near future, where I can watch a movie at a press of a button, I can browse online and get recommendations to other films based on the film I watch and then at a press of a button I can watch those movies. I can also discuss online to other people who enjoy a particular movie and afterwards click a button and watch the movies they recommended. I want to do this where I don't need to wait more than a few seconds and at a price I can afford. This of course is pie and the sky stuff at the moment and takes the joy of finding out going out to the cinema to see a movie.
The report being released today -- which was largely paid for by Armey's think tank with some funding from NBC Universal and the MPAA -- takes the previous study, conducted by consulting firm L.E.K., and applies a model used by the U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis to calculate the potential ripple effect of those lost sales, factoring in lost jobs, worker earnings and tax revenue.
It's called, "Velocity of Money." It is econ 101 (literally - it was in my first econ class at a mediocre state school). Anyone who knows anything about formal economics knows about the velocity of money. Unfortunately, that probably means noone in congress will know about it.
Velocity of Money on Wikipedia
But it sure would be satisfying to hear a Senator say, "You brought us this? How much did you spend on this? We already know about the velocity of money. I could have explained it to you in 3 minutes. I mean, most people don't know about this because they don't have to, but understanding economics is, to put it lightly, important in your field. You mock your customers with your ineptitude."
Stop-Prism.org: Opt Out of Surveillance
I'm sure that everybody was far too busy thinking up cute "+5 Funny" comments to go out and actually take a look at the actual study... but for anybody who's perhaps interested in formulating a defensible position on the matter based on facts rather than groupthink, the actual publication is available here.
For a bunch of geeks, I'd think that doing a bit of research & gathering the facts before reaching a conclusion would be the *first* thing you'd do when trying to combat what you decry as a campaign of FUD & misinformation. Sarcasm isn't going to win the case in a courtroom, or in Congress. Deconstruct their argument & their methods. Show their assumptions & conclusions to be faulty.
"All Hollywood has to do is change the language so words like "theft" apply to non-applicable situations such as copyright infringement."
Or "Identity theft" or "Cable theft". They should be "Identity infringement" and "cable infringement". I hate it when something that doesn't hurt anyone is made to look bad.
In parts of Asia you can buy all kinds of pirated DVDs, software, etc. at stores and elsewhere. It probably employs hundreds of thousands of people who pay for media, equipment; rent storefronts, etc. Is Hollywood worried about what ripple effects they'll have on the economy when they crack down on those operations? I thought not.
Maybe if the actors earned reasonable salaries, the "ripple effect" would be much less "damaging."
at this point all I know is that after I did Linux hardware driver support from a freely available SCSI standards (MMC-2) doc for Linux (in prehistoric time) because of a test program written I wrote directly from the standards doc that got swiped and modified in some insane way I end up "most wanted" (a few puns intended) for no reason (of course, now cleared up)...
:)
christ... well, at least unlike before I actually have a reason to act like a punk
too bad I can't rap too well...
...Everything has a ripple effect.
"Internet piracy may be tougher for lawmakers to conceptualize, entertainment companies fear."
Well, they're right to be afraid about this, when you consider that lawmakers have a tough enough time conceptualizing the Internet.
Seriously though, does anyone who's not in their pocket actually believe any of the statistics spewed by the RIAA or MPAA? If their math got any fuzzier their press releases about it would have to be shaved before the text could be made out.
~Philly
a lot of people are not willing to pay anything for it. Thus the pirating. I suppose the true value is the average of what's payed for any copies of it.
"Making crappy movies.
Sueing your audience.
Making your customers go through crap that people who don't pay don't have to go through."
Apparently a (+5:insightful) is worth more than the facts.
Let's see. I bought MIB (I like 'crappy' movies). I put this DVD into my player (OH the crap!). Saw the "FBI warning" and then hit the menu key to skip the commercials (Ah relief!). I'm still waiting for the MPAA to sue me. Guess I'm doing something wrong. According to slashdot, I'm overdue for a beating.
I'm a cinematography student, and i'm always quite sadenned when reading comments on slashdot about movies and tv.
Id therefor like to share some of my thoughts on this matter, as someone who will hopefully make his living in the industry.
One of the things that has always struck me as weird, are the comments that first bash the quality of movies, and then say they should make better movies instead. Well, firstly, if a movie is crap why would you even download it, and secondly, even if you wouldn't pay a sum of money to buy a DVD or see it at a theater, what right does that grant you to download someone elses work and property without permissions to do so?
There also seem to be quite a few comments on how new distribution channels (mostly perhaps the internet?) and advances in technology so to speak make the current industry irrelevent? Many people seem to think that perhaps a group of individuals are able to make movies on their own. This has ofcourse happened, in Finland for example there are the Star Wreck movies. But truth be told, i find the quality in these movies well below the commercial ones. Making movies costs alot of money, and requires alot of talent. DVCAM/DigiBeta/HD they all are good and cheap formats, but they fall way behind 35mm, and in many cases 16mm film.
People are quick to say that they want cheap/free movies, but when these are shown to people they start whining about the quality (or perhaps the elusive "film look") not being there. There are also ofcourse other considerations, color correction of for example DVCAM material can be a bit hard with only 256 colors per channel, and most usable and consumer priced editing solutions won't color correct material with better bit depth on colors. Using for example 2K DaVinci color correction station costs alot of money, and there are reasons why these are still used.
As far as distribution goes, most cinemas today still require film copies of movies. In the future perhaps HD will become more dominant becouse then you can have a digital distribution channel from the start to the end. But at the moment copies shipped to cinemas cost alot of money. I think the prices in Finland are around 2000-3000 per copy. This can be done alot cheaper in many countries, but in large countries as the US there surely are also more copies needed?
People on slashdot (yes i'm generalising) seem to scream about GPL issues. When a company uses GPL code and doesnt distribute the code all hell breaks loose. But at the same time, taking someone elses "art", be it music or movies, and distributing or copying it in a matter not intended seems to be fine? Now someone will surely post that these are legally not the same things, but in spirit i feel it to be the same. I have a feeling that most posters are simply trying to justify their copying of content that they don't have the proper rights to. If i'd make a short movie, and spent alot of time and money on it, i'd feel that i have the right to choose how it should be distributed. Many coders most likely feel the same way of their code. If i feel that it should not be free, then i think people should honor this, even if they think my movie is "crap" or that it's "information that wants to be free" or that the "law is flawed".
I can see the effects of a mini economy around Piracy.
o nomic-Thought/dp/0792383109/sr=8-2/qid=1159566373/ ref=sr_1_2/104-5959278-4596701?ie=UTF8&s=books
The Hollywood leakers, plus the illegal dubbers in South America combined with the rouge servers provide an avenue for people with burners at home that can go and sell this pirated content in flea markets and feed their families. It happens with books, music and other stuff....
Is it illegal and bad? YES....
So is WAR... (and it seems to fuel economies too...)
Read: http://www.amazon.com/Political-Economy-Recent-Ec
Oh well...
It's all about opportunity cost (the link is an interesting read even if you know what opportunity cost is)... as the article points out, if we're not giving money to rich middlemen, we might be instead spending it on MP3 players or video games. The money doesn't disappear from the economy just because it's not spent on movies.
My server
Identity theft usually involves hurting someone financially. Watching cable without paying for it may or may not actually hurt the company (usual arguments about not buying it if you couldn't get it illegally), depending on how much physical damage you do, i.e. splicing your own lines into theirs, or some such thing, which they then have to pay to repair.
Ignorance is not linguistic drift.
Bad laws (or laws that are disrespected) are likely to bring the law in general into disrepute - leading to a rise in lawlessness and crime.
Unlike piracy (where the effect might be debatable), many of these will clearly have a negative economic impact.
The MPAA already has issued reports saying that piracy costs them billions of dollars of revenue a year; and now they're trying to claim that they grossly underestimated the losses?
What they fail to realize is that DRM is what is costing them billions.
-Kinsey
Internet piracy may be tougher for lawmakers to conceptualize, entertainment companies fear.
Feh! Like's that's ever been an obstacle in the past...
MPAA: Mr. Lawmaker, Internet Piracy of our copyrighted works is bad. When everyday people decide that they can download movies illegally without fear of repercussion, we find that sales plummet, the industry suffers, and the culture as a whole is significantly damaged.
Lawmaker: Eh?
MPAA: We're hemorrhaging money thanks to Intarwebs!
Lawmaker. Oh.
MPAA: And you see, accounting has this weird thing where our profits are directly linked to the campaign contributions that we make to you.
Lawmaker: And what would you like your new law called?
"Piracy has Ripple Effect"? Boats, water, violence...OK.
"Copyright infringement", on the other hand, is too truthful and neutral to be recognized and exploited by the *A.
"For a bunch of geeks, I'd think that doing a bit of research & gathering the facts before reaching a conclusion would be the *first* thing you'd do when trying to combat what you decry as a campaign of FUD & misinformation."
The "bunch of geeks" are the four and three-digit UIDs that use to post about eight years ago. Look who's posting now.
"Sarcasm isn't going to win the case in a courtroom, or in Congress."
We don't even vote.
"Deconstruct their argument & their methods. Show their assumptions & conclusions to be faulty."
That sounds too much like work.
For a bunch of geeks, I'd think that doing a bit of research & gathering the facts before reaching a conclusion would be the *first* thing you'd do when trying to combat what you decry as a campaign of FUD & misinformation.
You must new here.
"All great wisdom is contained in .signature files"
Man, you have got to re-read the Constitiution and other early documents (try Common Sense) - The gvt was mainly formed to ensure that everyone had rights without stepping on the rights of others - interstate commerce was a very small factor, ensuring no one was a "king" was the main factor.
I am NOT supporting the industry's study here, but there is a flaw in this:
It's important to remember, however, that even though piracy prevents money from reaching the movie industry, those dollars probably stay in the economy, one intellectual property expert said.
This doesn't really prove anything. Let's just consider what these dollars that "stay in the economy" anyway actually means:
1) The dollars "stay in the economy" but are saved. This doesn't seem likely in today's economy, but it is still a possibility in some cases. Dollars that aren't moving within the economy aren't as useful to economic growth as dollars that do.
2) The dollars are spent on something else. This seems most likely, BUT, this doesn't mean that the economic benefts of the dollars spent on other things, are the same. Money spent on taco bell has a different effect on the economy than money spent on music, and money spent on music as a different effect than money spent on software, etc...
I remember at least one president who didn't get this. His name was George Bush Sr. He once said something really stupid, something like "I don't care if Americans are making potato chips or microchips..." Every American should care, because there is vast difference in the economic benefits between a potato chip economy and a microchip economy.
That being said, I would trust this report backed by the music industry as much as I'd trust a report backed by the tabacco industry that claimed some benefit from tabacco. I'm ONLY taking issue with this one argument. It is a fallacy, sort of a "broken window" in reverse.
"Our morality is good, theirs is repressive."- Partisanship Rule #3
Yeah, a shitload of people have bought songs from itunes. A much much bigger shitload of people are downloading songs and movies for FREE from various sources. These dickheads need to realize the much much bigger shitload of people are wise to their bullshit, and won't buy it.
So your comment was wrong about who the target is. The people who are already paying aren't the target group, we are. And we're not buying their shit. And only an idiot would believe their bullshit argument. "Gee, these people aren't buying our products. That money must be sitting in cookie jars and mattresses all over the country; no one's spending it on gas, rent, the ever-increasing copays and other medical expenses etc etc."
O~ Him that studies revenge keeps his own wounds green. -- Francis Bacon
If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
Yeah, and if someone invented a star trek replicator, but it had to be seeded with something to scan, the candy industry would freak out against them because people could copy their candy bars instead of buying them. But eventually, we all know what would happen.
O~ Him that studies revenge keeps his own wounds green. -- Francis Bacon
According to the study, lost revenues may have as much as three times the impact previously imagined.
If nothing proves they are imagining things more than this, I haven't seen it. Doesn't this statement indicate their losses are imaginary and that these new estimations are three times as imaginary?
I hate to say that it's time for another law but I think there should be "rules and ethics of evidence" introduced into law. Such a law would state that any studies submitted to the senate or congress must have, at the very least, an impartial study to balance out the claims of special interests. We all know how stats and studies can be twisted into outrageous lies and exaggerations. It's time we start disallowing such crap on a regular basis. If these special interests are willing to fund their own studies as evidence for a need for legislation, then they should also be willing to have another study made as ordered by the legislative commission that will be reviewing the information. It would seem like a natural extension of our other fair and balanced matters of law such as in the case of evidence presented in a court.
I'm sure I'm not the only one who's tired of the lies, damned lies and statistics given as evidence to write new laws. And while we're at it, let's stop the dairy companies from recommending our RDA of milk that seems to go up at every opportunity. Talk about conflicting interests.... and oil companies denying global warming? Enough already!
Just because you don't buy a cd with your $20 doesn't mean you won't spend it elsewhere and just throw it in the bank.
What this goof is referring to is the multiplier effect, something elementary to economists. Thing is, you might spend your $20 and buy yourself some uber awesome coffee and dessert for you and a friend at Starbuck's instead. It's entertainment dollars spent differently.
And that money spent at Starbucks too has a multiplier effect - money goes to the pastry shops, the landlord, the employees, and some makes it back to the cheap, not fair trade coffee farms and stuff too.
This article is Bollocks.
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
The economy actually benefits quite a bit from piracy. Digital entertaintment hardware and software, communications equipment and services, technology as a whole leaps forward mainly because of digital content. What would I do with a broadband line if it wasn't for movies? What would I do with an iPod with 2000 songs if I had to pay $1 (or $2 according to their wishes) each? But you wouldn't expect the content industries' assosiations to enlighten you, would you? They just want to squeeze a little bit more out of peoples pockets.
When you put money in the bank, the bank invests it.
In theory, this generates returns on investment (ROI).
If ROI > the interest the bank pays you, everybody wins.
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
I own shares in General Electric. (Some of you may be confused at the relevance of the last statement but hold on and it will become crystal clear.) GE owns NBC/Universal. NBC is wasting money funding dumbass reports like this and paying for lobbyists to take these made up reports and present them to congress. Now this is fleacing my wallet in two ways:
1) GE is directly out the amount of money the spent making and showing this report. GE is also out because of lost customers who tie NBC with the MPAA and all of their evil doings. GE has nothing to show for all of this wasted time and money.
2) My tax dollars are wasted because Congress is wasting time listening to this bologna! Congress should just say no but more importantly, NBC/GE should not waste their time and they should not waste congresses time!
So I propose a solution. NBC/Universal which is owned by GE should stop funding this kind of lobbying and stop wasting their money and taxpayer dollars targeting "Piracy". They should let the FBI do their jobs and enforce the laws already on the books. In return they will get to cut all the lobbyists from the payroll and see an imediate effect on their bottom line. This is important because their stock has been stagnant! GE should do this as soon as possible. I guarantee that the "Pirates" will not take this as a "sign of weakness" and attack them. You can quote me on that.
Show their assumptions & conclusions to be faulty.
I don't need to read their bullshit report to do that, the answer is right in the US constitution. Recall the copyright establishment clause of section eight with me:
Notice the term "limited"? DRM is forever and therefore unconstitutional.
More fundamentally, the reason for copyright has nothing to do with publishers, or publishers making money. The motivator is the public good. The whole purpose of the limited exclusive franchies granted for works of art and inventions is to grow the public domain. The founding fathers wanted people to share instead of keeping things to themselves. They knew that education only comes from sharing and that no one can advance the state of the art unless they are familiar with that state to begin with. At the time, they thought it would help to encourage artists and inventors by creating an exclusive use right at the cost of free speech and action. The term they thought fair, two hundred and twenty years ago, when paper and publishing was fiercely expensive? Fourteen years.
So, the fundamental assumptions of the copyright warriors are totally bogus:
The public good will be served much better when patents are issued for real inventions and other works of art are once more made public domain while relevant, that is within the life span of the author. Things are so bad right now that no laws at all would be an improvement. Yes, this will bring more art and more money for more people. Education makes art and people will always pay for both.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
From what I read on this, it is hazy to say the least but how can you put patents on ideas and concepts assocaited with movies?
if you consider the loss from the poor guy who works an extra shift to buy the latest boxset or movie. If he pirates the movie/show instead, he doesn't work the extra shift. i.e. he's less productive. So the economy loses there. Now, whether you think it's good that the poor guy doesn't have to work an extra shift just to escape from reality for a few hours...
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Right, when I typed that, I envisioned kids building their "cash stash" instead of heading to the music store. At least that was common for my friends and I back when I was a bigger music consume, we didn't use the bank much. I consider $s in a savings account as in motion.
It's worth noting that this is again another question of whether or not the money is as advantageous to the economy sitting in the bank as opposed to being spent. You putting money in the bank has a different effect throughout the economy/supply chain than when you spend it on something else. Ironically(ironic because I made that comment about savings without thinking about the bank) at this point in time, I personally think the nation would actually be better off slowing down frivolous spending a little, and building up savings IN THE BANK. But that's another topic.
"Our morality is good, theirs is repressive."- Partisanship Rule #3
Inigo Montoya:, You keep using that word. I do not think it means, what you think it means. ...
I say it's about time he drop this new "Criminal Minds" dren, get back in that ring, and kick some Hogan ass...
They're continuing to make shit up that suits them. Intellectual piracy is buying an ebook of Dostoevsky from a street bazaar in hong kong. Intellectual property is such that it can only be covered by patent. Copyrightable works are not property, unless you count my DVD collection. Those are my property. But, apparently, a property which I don't have any rights to. If it's intellectual property, then that implies it's not copyrightable. Which is it, a product or a license? If it's a license, I'm going to trade in my 60 or so VHS tapes for the DVDs. I'm tired of buying the White Album again. If it's a product, it's not copyrightable and, therefore, not covered under the bought and paid for laws like the DMCA.
The **AA wants their cake and your cake and make you watch them devour both.
They're using their grammar skills there.
Back in the 20es when they were stamping on hollywood's "liberties" about making socially controversial films.
See, today the opressed became the opressor, and this time the opression is not for what is right or wrong, but for MONEY.
Just when are you going to die out, 55+ generation ?
Read radical news here
This paper makes reference to video stores. It is widely known that video stores are closing down to cheap DVD's and online rental sites not online piracy.
the politicians & crack-whores... uh ... did I just repeat myself?
If you want your life to be different, live it differently.
It also makes comments about Theatrical Exhibition Losses. The text automatically assumes that if people did not have pirate DVD's they would flock to the cinema. With movies coming out on DVD for rental or buying in x months and on satellite x months later then TV x months after that, would they really go to the cinema?
This is truly the case of the pot calling the kettle black.
Hollywood is probably the most incestuous place on earth. How many movies, TV shows and records are copies of what is popular. How many TV shows have used the old tried and true plot lines time after time after time. J-Lo brittney, Christina, Shikira.....same place, same thing. Intellectual and Hollywood are Oxymorons.
"Given those facts, the study says, movie piracy causes a total lost output for U.S. industries of $20.5 billion per year, thwarts the creation of about 140,000 jobs and accounts for more than $800 million in lost tax revenue."
If you can call copywrite infringement theft, then I guess you can call this lame study based on lame statistics "facts". In fact, I like to call potatoes french fries, because I'd like them to be fries. Don't tell, but I know they are really potatoes. Wouldn't it be nice though if fries grew in the ground? Anyway, since we are calling this factual, I would also like to state as "fact" that all consulting firms kill babies. Yes, I believe they kill children by taking money from corporations that could instead be spent on hard working employees so that they may adequately feed and provide medicine for their children. Instead, these poor children must starve and die. Won't someone please think of the children?
And then ninjas come and dig it up and use it to buy frisbees, swords, throwing stars and red bull.
Read my short stories - You won't regret it.
Piracy has a ripple effect?? You want ripple effect, look at the people shooting up schools because they watch violent movies. Hey, I can make up bullshit arguments too!
The best way to defeat BS is with more BS. Oh wait, I'm not a politician.
Read my short stories - You won't regret it.
I just love torrents. Why just today I bootlegged a copy of an unfathomably torrid film, in which the most gargantuan object was withdrawn from the naughty bottom of an evilly-grinning woman. The triple-ripple fireplug was the size of a newborn baby. The squishy sound effects were awe-inspiring as she delivered a 10-lb mass of vinyl from her dark hole of oblivion. Dirty, dirty, but it looks like fun to me.
The problem is that commercial films like this poo-spattered greasy butt-hungering morsel aren't even available in the adult shops around here. Even if I could buy them, I wouldn't want to be seen frequenting such an establishment, or have a physical DVD for my spouse or grandkids to run across. And what if my boss at the daycare found it when she comes over for tea? No, I can't have that. Am I stealing from Hollywood? I think so. Am I going to stop and go get a legitimate copy of each one? Not until the grandkids stop downloading music. And I'm pretty sure I'll be dead and buried by then.
-Sad for Hollywood.
It isn't any more "pro-piracy" to point out the fact that copyright infringment is not theft than it is "pro-rape" to point out the fact that rape is not murder. Different situations, different words.
Where were you when the voynix came?
Great idea. That whole "impartial study" thing is a great idea too.
"Consider the extreme case: everyone pirates all movies. Here, the entertainment industry will disappear, but the video game industry (or tourism, or books, or whatever you want to put here) *grows*. These "ripple effects" are straw men designed to get society to think it impacts them. There would be a negligible impact on GDP or taxes."
Unfortunately your argument flies in the face of the "let my culture go!" crowd. Now YOUR argument really isn't any better. Thinking that what happens to an entire class of industry doesn't have an effect is pure naive.* How many times do I have to tune into slashdot and listen to the latest rant about IT and your jobs going overseas? How about we all follow your argument and let the entire IT industry disappear? Guess all that money that originally kept you employed will go somewhere more deserving. Sucks to be you.
*Or for an earlier example the steel industry and middle america.
"The idiocy of these "ripple effect" arguments is that they're using partial equilibrium to derive general equilibria effects! In other words, they're using a model that assumes nothing else matters to draw conclusions about the very things the model says doesn't matter."
Someone posted a link to the paper. Why don't you read it?
Does it cause oil prices to skyrocket? Does it stop interstate commerce?
In communities with no Hollywood presence does it cause the local factories or offices to close up shop?
Does it intervere with the manufacture of raw goods like steel and farm crops?
The "study" neglects to acknowledge that entertainment is a non-essential expense - we can live without it when the budget is short or if the quality is substandard.
Nothing to see here. Move along...
Eternity: will that be smoking, or non-smoking? I Corinthians 6:9-10
I see I'm going to have to draw a diagram in order to explain what keeps flying over everyone's head.
*
Content----[Distributor]----->{cable company B}
| |
| |
| |
[Cable company A]------->[customer]
As you can see both are getting the same digital content.
*The difference is that Cable company B is not paying for it's content either up or down.
As you can see it's not an equal or even near equal competition.
Now make Cable company B a pirate offering the same thing that Cable company A is offering but isn't saddled with the same constraints.
That's the present situation.
"As I posted above, these studies almost always make the assumption that if piracy were stopped, those who pirated copies would be willing to buy the content at the prevailing legal price."
Willing? No? Have no choice? Well if "actions speak louder than words"? Then I'd say that they would grugingly do so. The alternatives are either do without (which we both know they're not doing now), or find an alternative (looking on the lates P2P traffic most of it isn't "alternatives", but mainstream stuff.). So the assumption isn't completely groundless.
Your idealism is admirable but your realism is lacking. The key point of our union of states was to allow the states to basically handle their own business while the federal only existed to ensure the states played nice with eachother. A UN of sorts. If you think that the Civil War had anything to do with slavery you are sadly mistaken and need to reread your history. The Civil War was all about states rights, the slavery issue is just a nice way to polorize the people against states rights by making states rights = all about slavery. As much as I deplore slavery of any form, I'm afraid the wrong side may have won. But if you don't believe me, tell your state to change the speedlimit or drinking age and see what happens to the federal dollars. The feds will take taxes from a states citizens, and then if that state doesn't do what the fed wants them to do (see drinking age or speed limits for example) they refuse to give the money back to the state. The whole reason for the federal government was to maintain that union, and a huge part of that is the interstate commerce aspect (not levying huge import/export taxes for example). Those days are LONG since gone, and now the federal government lords over the states...and you see our rights suffering because of this.
The only change I can believe in is what I find in my couch cushions.
so 'they' say that piracy hurts business.
otoh, it helps PEOPLE who aren't in business. right? the business might lose $15 for an audio cd, but if a person pirates that audio content, there is no REAL loss for the business; but now that person HAS $15 more he can put into the economy. or save in the bank.
which way do you want to slant things: toward the business or the consumer?
don't we have ENOUGH 'protections' for business? I think that's what a lot of consumers feel - they have been dealt a short hand and feel they have to do whatever it takes (..) to tip the scales back to some kind of balance.
it may not be right, technically; but I CAN see why consumers feel they have the short end of the stick, lately.
would I feel bad bypassing sony (et al)? NOT ONE BIT. sorry if that offends, but these days NO ONE is looking out for the consumer's rights anymore, so its time to take things into our own hands. and guess what, that's what many of us have done..
--
"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
MPAA: Look here we have $20bn in lost revenue. ... ... ... ... ... ...
Lawmaker: Wow, we have to act. What do you need.
Consumer: I believe that number is a flawed estimate.
MPAA: Ok, let's meet at $19bn
Consumer: But that would still be almost $1900/consuming-citizen/year. That seems implausible.
Lawmaker:
MPAA: We have another study that says our losses are $100 trillion. So $19bn is already a compromise, in fact losses are much higher.
Lawmaker: Wow!
Consumer:
MPAA: Lawmaker, what are we going to do about this? The future of the country hinges on this.
Lawmaker:
MPAA: And think about the children and how piracy supports terrorists.
Lawmaker: Oh my God. What are we going to do?
Consumer: What do children and terrorists have to do with this?
MPAA: Lawmaker, think about your campaign contributions!
Lawmaker: Crap, I had no idea it's so God damn serious.
MPAA: See. This planet is in jeopardy because of piracy.
Consumer:
Consumer: But what about fair use? My rights? Freedom?
MPAA:
Lawmaker:
MPAA: Hey Lawmaker, meet me in the other room.
Which DVD player do you have?
Mine wont let me skip the FBI warning or any *shudder* crappy Tom Hanks movie previews.
There are a lot of pissed Harry Potter fans...
"We know what happens to people who stay in the middle of the road. They get run over." - Aneurin Bevan
Three times nothing is still nothing.
you've just reduced your benefits costs by 1/3. You've got those workers doing the work of one extra guy after all. Often, even with overtime this is economical. And if they're in the class of white collar workers who don't get overtime any more thanks to our Republican congress, more's the better.
And ya, the world is too obsessed with money. What they need to obess over is standard of living. If I've got 100,000 rubles, I've got lots of money, but if I'm in Russia, I'm probably still living like crap. But as for sorting it out, pretty soon a big war will kill off most of the poor, and just like it did in the Renaissance and after WWII that'll fix things. Either that or cheaper, more effective birth control, but I won't hold my breath...
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For everyone to really win the interest the bank pays you must also beat inflation. Typical flexible savings/checking accounts don't have very good interest rates. You still win over stuffing it under your bed, of course, but typically if you really want to get a good return rate on savings you have to have enough money to make it worth it to pay the fees necessary for the kind of accounts/investments that will yield you a good return. Otherwise it's a big win for the bank and nothing for you. Takes money to make money, blah, blah, blah.
If hollywood does not want to get their work out, then it is an obvious opportunity for VCs, Bollywood, etc to fill the bill. Right now, they can capture a good percentage of the market. Any indie that makes it big in this space can elect to sell it on the big screen later or to TV. All they have to do, is keep their copyrights on the media. In doing so, they get their work out to a small fraction. If any of the big players steal the idea or the actual work, well say hello to LOADS of Lawyers.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
It is spent on other things. This study is seriously flawed.
As soon as the RIAA and MPAA decided to go along with "pirate" as the preferred term for a downloader of unlicensed material.
If they could've gotten people talking about music "thievery" or even something dry like "unlicensed copying," people might take them seriously.
But "piracy"... how the heck can we consider it a serious offense? ARR, MATEYS!
Prolly too late for a little karma whoring here, but since i've been here in karaoke 5 years, I have to tell this tale.
In 2001 I was a laid off Sysadmin in Silicon Valley. I had no desire to move from here, I was staying. I took a job at a karaoke bar after looking for 6 months to get back into the trade I had been in for 10 years. I figured at this point, anything as long as it was money.
Being a Sysadmin type, I showed the former KJ how to use a PC with karaoke. After he quit, I got promoted from doorman to KJ. Shortly after I got promoted, I started broadcasting the show online, got a shoutcast partner sponsorship from Nullsoft, got printed up in the new york times and the rest was history. My tips skyrocketed, business here at 7 Bamboo was slamming in 2003.
We got printed up in a lot of newspapers around here as well. Folks would come in, see our PC setup and figure if it's that easy, they could do the same thing themselves. San Jose has seen a hardcore proliferation in PC based karaoke setups over the last 2 years.
Well, here's where the trickle effect comes in.
I would say most of these new KJ's are pirating. 7 Bamboo has been in business over 20 years, and has a collection of about 6000 songs. (Retail value of over $15,000) Most of these new guys have collections of anywhere from 20-100,000 songs. How is it someone that has only been in business less than a year can afford that much karaoke? The answer is they can't, the answer is they just download songs from limewire, alt.binaries.sounds.karaoke and other P2P type places. Karaoke piracy is so rampant, it's really affected our attendance here.
In 2003, we were one of only 5 or 6 venues here in San Jose. Now there is over 50. When my old 70yro boss scratches his head wondering WTF is going on, it's hard to explain to him. Conversations go like this:
Toshi: Bobbysan, what's happening? (note, heavy japanese accent)
Me: Toshi, bad people, steal karaoke, start business
Toshi: Steal from us?
Me: No toshi, steal from the internet
Toshi: Should unplug the internet when you leave
Me: No not like that toshi
Toshi: Oh? Explain bobbysan
Me: There are places on the internet people download them for free
Toshi: Oh? Why don't we do the same?
You guys get the idea. Trying to explain this to a 70yro Japanese man is near impossible.
Bottom line though is there are so many new karaoke venues that have been enabled by piracy, it's really hurting us. We play it straight, but remember karaoke is a small pond compared to film or regular music. A small pebble of piracy here is like having a boulder chucked into a puddle.
--toq
Where have I heard this before? I tell you where. It sounds exactly like the propaganda the BSA would spew, about software piracy basically costing billions and billions of dollars in losses. Nevermind the facts, here comes the propaganda. Forget about the fact that many of those illegally downloading all those programs probably couldn't afford to buy them anyway, or wouldn't even if that meant they couldn't have them at all.
Besides, if we're using their logic, what about the internet? I doubt Internet service providers would have such an easy time selling broadband internet to the masses if it wasn't for piracy. Isn't that part of the ripple effect as well?
If a train station is a place where a train stops, what's a workstation?
... and Microsoft's Vista is going to improve Europe's economy.
So, they extrapolated from their initial made up number, eh?
This type of false logic is called the Broken Window Fallacy. Read it.
IPI appears to be a wingnut corporate propaganda factory. I'd be surprised if there were any reputable scientists associated with the organization.
They've got the same kind of credibility that any study of "the danger to American children of DRUGS" funded by the DEA has got.
If you want to dig through the sewage they produce for a nugget of truth, go for it, nobody's going to stop you. But don't expect the rest of us to waste our time on it. I've read some of their stuff, it's food for thought only if you like eating shit.
Tech Public Policy stuff
So they are actually losing 3*i*y dollars for every pirated movie out there?
New economics indeed..
Privacy begins with
One of the things that burns me up is the rampant, instutionalized piracy of Japanese animation (anime DVDs, music soundtracks, toys and so on) in Taiwan and China. Not only do they have no respect for the law in their own countries, they are happy to export pirated anime products on a large scale to Europe and the U.S., where unwitting consumers of course buy it, then wonder how subtitles could be so bad. The boxed sets of Hayao Miyazaki DVDs for ridiculously low prices on eBay and sold all over Europe are pure crap, but they make lots of money for the companies that bring them out. Anime fans with consciences know to avoid music CDs by Song May and Ever Anime, which are all unlicensed pirate versions from Taiwan. The Japanese companies producers have shown no interest in taking on countries like Taiwan for their large-scale piracy, which is lot worse IMHO than file sharing and "fan subbing" (which has both positive and negative effects on the market for anime products). File sharing may be bad for some resons, such as reducing the resale value of anime products to overseas markets, but at least no Chinese organized crime group is getting wealthy off it.
My two yen.
You've got a friend in Japan: http://www.jlist.com
They must feel kinda left out now that the RIAA has taken their place as "most hated content industry organisation" - but let's be honest, the RIAA have really toiled for that, so please, no hard feelings please.
Oh well, so they basically say "For every 1$ we ''lose'' through pirace (display extremely inflated numbers) the economy loses two dollars extra." Yes, I know its hard to believe, but that are the facts - I mean, all this surplus money, it just vanishes, being flushed down the toilets or is spent on some imported goods. Its not that just the MPAA members lose out, but the whole economy does. Besides, all those bits and bytes that those pirates steal, do you think nobody will miss them? No! The US economy is slowly being bled dry out of bits and bytes and soon they will have to import expensive foreign bits and bytes to keep operating - which might not even fit will into the pipes of the internets and clog that up too. This is the true threat of piracy.
+++ MELON MELON MELON +++ Out of Cheese Error +++ redo from start +++
Insightful my eye.
Your statement was answered on slashdot. The answers were even moderated were anyone could read them. Why didn't you?
"Despite that, the MPAA does exactly what the RIAA has been doing with its plethora of lawsuits aimed at filesharing instead of targeting counterfeiters."
Apparently the poster you replied to didn't read the interview either. So why did we have the damn thing then?
Oh right!
As far as their profits are concerned, these are indeed negligible when you compare them to other "businesses" who work hard
to keep America and the rest of the world unhealty. Look at Altria (the merger of Philip Morris Tobacco and Kraft Foods).
However as far as the Druids in Hollywood are concerned, their impact is actually incalculably high, because their propaganda and
role model programming goes a long way to keeping the status quo.
As a matter of fact: One way to really hurt Hollywood in their mission would be - if it were only technically feasible - to cram
the prole feed they put out into a highly secure DRM system making piracy almost impossible. You can depend on it that they would
leak keys or get rid of a system like that altogether if it means that so much fewer people are exposed to their garbage.
Their main interest is to get into your living room and into the space between your ears and not the money they may or not recap
on the movies they put out.
As an interesting side note, Germany is about to abandon the concept of free television reception altogether. In the first quarter
of next year, Germany's private television stations will all switch on the encryption on their digital signals and after analog
is phased out by 2009 if Herr von Kraut wants to watch television he will have to pop in a smart card into his receiver.
Watch this scheme burn and get abandoned once they find that even less than 3% fewer people are watching.
Marijuana is a gateway drug too.
A ripple in the rate at which the entertainment industry sucks up our money? Or is the ripple effect money splashing into consumers wallets? Its a buck that will be passed somewhere else. Not to mention a millionth case of "We paid these people lots of money to say: ... "
Pay an artist, @#$% a corporation.
When I don't give my money to the music industry, I don't spend it again. It just sits in my bank account in perpetuity. Food? Rent? Computers? Toys? No. The money I would have spent goes directly into my bank account, and I don't spend it again. I just wait until inflation has rendered it valueless, then I flush it down the toilet.
(And I STILL bet that they lose more hard currency from people like me who don't feel like sponsoring lawsuits against dead people and little kids than they do from piracy. I'm much happier listening to unknowns who have no record of suing grandmothers, kids, and dead people.)
It's been a long time.
I'd love to download old episodes of "Are You Being Served?", but no one seems to be seeding .torrents for them.
I can't figure out why...
This would be a good place for this
There are two things to gleen from the above. One music and movie piracy has raised an entire generation on the idea that what's yours should be mine. The other is that piracy DOESN'T stay confined. It spreads like a cancer. Today it's movies, music, games, software, and books. Next it's skins and plugins from those who give away. What will be next, because greed knows no bounds? Thank God I'm not an artist trying to survive in that vast wasteland that immorality and humanism has created.
141,030 Jobs every year lost due to movie piracy? That doesn't really sound right.
If the motion picture industry is really concerned about US jobs, why don't they just stop filming half their movies in Vancouver?
No excellent soul is exempt from a mixture of madness. --Aristotle
It has been one long advertising campaign, why not just stop throwing money and publicity at it, and let piracy sink back into obscurity where it belongs, stop the lawsuits, stop the prosecution and media attention to the subject, and instead of millions of people pirating, you'll find maybe 100k people, which sounds better, and more managable.