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Apple Gives $100 Store Credit To iPhone Customers
MooRogue writes "In an open letter to all iPhone customers, Steve Jobs responds to hundreds of emails from upset iPhone customers. Apple will be giving early adopters who are not receiving rebates or any other consideration $100 store credit at the Apple store.
Details will be posted on the Apple website next week"
I just found 1300 iPhones in a dumpster. That's $130,000!
"Believe me!" -- Donald Trump
Perhaps, but now many more people will know about the iPhone's price drop.
Say what you will, but what other company figurehead in recent memory has came out and apologized for other people's willingness to spend their money?
Maybe it was all planned out from the day one though, and if that's the case, I wish Steve would run for the next presidential election. Talk about planing for every contingency...
If you don't know what AltaVista is (was), get off my lawn.
wtf is wrong with these early adopters who complain about paying more? they knew from the beginning that apple will drop prices. whiney bunch of pussies
How can you "lose" $100? Does Steve Jobs mug you on the street? You paid $599 for a working product, end of story. Early adopters pay out the nose for bragging rights, film at 11.
Auto-reply to ACs: "Truly, you have a dizzying intellect."
"Please provide apple with your phone number, address, receipt from the place of purchase, original UPC..."
*slaps forehead*
sigs... don't talk to me about sigs....
At $599 with a 2-year contract and no rebates, early adopters HAD to know they were paying a hefty premium. By now Apple fanboys should be so used to this Steve Jobs could've stuck his entire fist up their asses, without lube, while reaching for their wallets, and they'd be chanting "Thank you sir! May I have another?"
If you buy new gadgets on Day 1, especially from companies that charge a premium for brand, expect to get reamed.
Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
They didn't "lose" anything. That is just the price you pay for having it a few months before people are willing to wait. If your stupid enough to waste $600 or so on a phone, it your own fault.
The dumpster hungers.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
When the SE/30 was released Jobs was not in charge. That was Sculley's reign.
HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
Correct, and apparently people two weeks before the price cut and still have the receipt get the full $200.
Funny how that's vastly different from refunding $100, or even the $200 the phone users are out -- Apple will simply lose the production costs of the items sold under that store credit (not to mention gaining profits from any accessories bought as a result beyond the $100 credit). It's not to say such hardware prices wouldn't normally fluctuate, but a month or two is a bit quick for something that's seemingly so successful. I wonder where to draw the line between truly normal price decreases, and jacking the price on something you know will sell like hotcakes...I'm not all that business-savvy, so feel free to educate me if there is indeed such a line.
Quiz: True or False -- On a scale of 1 to 10, what is your middle name?
Yeah, Dell owes me too, big time. I can buy this laptop from them for much cheaper now, pay up, err gimme *in store* credit.
I hope this sets a precedence. I will give Apple products much more consideration in the future if a few months after buying it I can get credit towards my next techy purchase from them.If everyone that purchased an iPhone, goes out and purchases an iTouch for $100 less, how will Apple ever make any money?
If you give $100 Apple Store credit to the sort of people who bought an iPhone on iPhone Day, that's all the excuse they need to buy a new iPod, or a MacBook or another iPhone.
What would you have bought with a credit for your SE, a IIe?
What I'm listening to now on Pandora...
Google's Super Secret Search Algorithm: SELECT @search_results FROM internet WHERE @search_results = 'good'
your iPhone would stop working, and you'd get a $2 store credit! -ichabod
Damn you apple! Now I have no more excuse to not buy that 160GB iPod classic... Somehow I feel like they will actually get a net profit from this move.
I, for one, welcome our new karma-whore sig writing overlords
....but you've probably seen theregister.co.uk lately?
My web domain.
Hell, if you pay $400 for a phone, you're a complete moron.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
It's not just a phone, so it's hard to evaluate the price. Early customers thought they could trust Apple about the fact that the iPhone was worth $600. Now they lost their trust in Apple, and Steve Jobs is trying to buy it back.
No one has mentioned it but it is a great move by Jobs, $100.00 "Apple Store Credit" probably costs them $40.00 and in addition it is that incentive mentioned earlier. So,in no way does it cost Apple 100.00 to look like they are meeting Joe "early adopter" halfway.
"Computers are a lot like Air Conditioners" "They both work great until you start opening Windows"
Really? Steve sat down and personally read hundreds of emails that all boiled down to "I paid $200 more than I could have so you suck."? Really? You don't think that after 35 or so he'd have gotten the idea?
(My GF's response when I showed her the article)
Years ago, when the HP LaserJet 4 first came out, I bought one at Fry's for $1600. Three weeks later, they were selling it for $1200. I didn't whine.
Who hasn't bought a computer, a flat screen tv, or a car where there wasn't a discount or price reduction a few months later? Why would anyone expect the iPhone to be exempt from economics?
Clearly, Apple is doing the right thing as far a public relations are concerned, but the idea that you are entitled to a refund for something you bought two months ago is ridiculous.
There wasn't a 16GB Model at the $599 price point.
I was annoyed, but not 'urge to kill rising' simpsons style or anything. Just seemed cheap that I've barely gotten my second bill for it and yet somehow they can drop the price $200 for no reason other than because it makes sense.
I'm no stranger to buying tech, I paid $499 I think it was for the Treo 300 when it came out day one. It didn't get a discount until probably six or so months later. But 10 weeks? Bit much but meh.
As a rock-in-roll Physicist once said, No matter where you go, there you are.
I'm myself bordering the state of Apple fan boy, but this is scary. People crying fool yesterday now praise the company for being responsive. I'm not into conspiracy theories, but if Apple had had this planed, this would be pure genius. Lowering the price and then getting the people who payed more to cheer you. Just scary how perfectly they play their crowd.
I don't think this was planed. But I think Apple knows that we now live in an attention society and that people highly regard companies who admit errors and change. In fact people overvalue this since they do not expect it (yet. Microsoft will obviously copy it someday). They did it with "greener Apple", they do it again with credits for iPhones which will generate more money for them due to people buying stuff in the Apple store.
memomo: free web based language trainer DE-EN-ES-FR-IT
For the same reason that I can't go to Intel and ask for $200 after every round of price drops. If someone chooses to buy a product he or she must make a decision if the purchase is good value. Yes= buy. No= don't buy. Just wait. Early adopters thought the price was right at launch. Just because a new, better deal comes along it doesn't change their initial decision; the purchase was good value. Surely they knew a price drop was innevitable, granted perhaps not so soon or so much, so any free money is a terrific deal.
As Mr. Jobs so delicately points out these people technically aren't entitled to anything but Apple wants to keep them happy. If they were given all $200 then they get the benefit of being the first to have an iPhone for nothing. People who decided to wait for a price drop would be a little upset if there is no 'early adopter penalty', and that they could have been using an iPhone all this time if only they had known they could get $200 back.
Ha hah!
It's even better than that - since it's store credit, the insane markup on Apple products means they are probably only going to end up giving away $30 to $40 worth of things away.
I agree with what someone else said though - if you want things on the day, you pay extra. It's always been the way, though maybe 2 months after release is a bit soon for a price cut like this. Jobs cites the holiday season as a reason - why not cut the price in November then? At least that lessens the chance that every iPhone owner is going to want your head impaled upon a pike so they can wave at it in a funny way.
"It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him." - Tolkien
"If you give $100 Apple Store credit to the sort of people who bought an iPhone on iPhone Day, that's all the excuse they need to buy a new iPod, or a MacBook or another iPhone."
Even better if most of them spend it on Apple software. Such as, I dunno, maybe Leopard? Due out next month?
Teh Steve is laughing all the way to the bank, and this time I'm laughing right along. This is so brilliant it almost has to be on purpose.
With reasonable men I will reason; with humane men I will plead; but to tyrants I will give no quarter. -- William Lloyd
Selling more songs on iTunes. Getting more people on iTunes that otherwise wouldn't have. Lock the iPhones in like the iPods.
the price of the iphone gets below 120 US dollars and I can use the iphone with any provider including the no-contract providers like tracfone or gophone...
Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
Please don't call iphone buyers "Technology Whores". the Iphone is old technology that even myself as a self confessed technology whore openly scoffs at. "Technology whore wannabe's" may be a better term. or simply "Gullible".
Certainly not the normal "Please piss off, and have a nice day." response of:
"We're sorry to hear of your disappointment with our product.
Unfortunately, we have a very large volume of customers who
are very satisfied with our products, at the the prices
we offer. We do our best to please every customer"
.
boycott slashdot February 10th - 17th check out: altSlashdot.org
Telling a bunch of geeks that they're morons for buying tech gadgets on a site specifically targeting the people who would purchase those items just seems...moronic. Or did you forget to click AC?
...who wants to sell me their apple store credit for $50?
As of 10/06/03, I hate COBOL developers.
This is the "market will bare" guy.
I thought that was Larry Flynt.
(You don't mean "bear," do you?)
Intel's a great example, considering they just re-priced their Xeon line so that the quad-core chips cost what the dual core chips of the same clock speed had cost the day before. How many end users that purchased quad core processors the day before do you think saw a refund of any of the several hundred dollar difference? What about the people who bought the dual core chips the day before? Is intel going to send them a free core?
If a product is worth the price to you when you pay for it, then you should be comfortable with price changes after you made the purchase.
Baby, meet bottle.
And yet the post got modded up. Maybe the demographic here ain't quite what ya think, eh?
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
With this rebate, the price goes down from $2000+ to $1900+ ($60x12x2+the purchase price+charges for use beyond your plan). The rebate (and the price drop) don't seem so significant anymore.
Don't buy stuff from naked people...
I take it you don't meta mod very often. You'd be amazed at the crap that gets modded insightful, or how many informative posts get modded troll. Give it a try sometime.
... what they charge in other countries. If it looks like the price is going to drop dramatically after a couple of months, who's going to buy? On the other hand, if they don't charge so much and don't drop the price, people will complain that they were expecting a refund.
Heh I knew someone would point that out, but the pricing model (imho) has always been Steve's (until Spindler and the clones about 95).
/\/\icro/\/\uncher
It isn't a refund. It is store credit.
So customers who feel jipped by the $200 price drop can pick up $30-40 worth of additional apple merchandise.
Of course to get your full value on this offer you will have to pick up something that is at least $100, but will probably be $120+. So you still end up paying $20 for a product that costs Apple $40-50 to produce. They just soothed your $200 feeling of injustice for $20.
Or, very likely you will use it to buy a $250 iPod for $150. So you will fork out another $150 to Apple for a product that costs $125- to produce. Apple will end up making money on this little conciliatory offer.
Another way to look at it is that instead of saving $200 on your formerly $600 iPhone (a 33% savings), you instead get a $100 discount on $850 ($600 + $250) worth of merchandise (an 11% savings).
This isn't a criticism of Apple. I'm just observing how the game is played.
An item will sell for exactly what both parties (seller and buyer) believe is a fair price at the time of sale. Those that claimed that they got ripped off are just complaining that they fell for the "early adopter" technolust that comes with the launch of a new gadget. Instead, we should be cheering on those who couldn't afford one before but can do so now; "Hey, good for you! You're getting a deal!" instead of "Oh screw Apple, they let me buy something on my own free will at a higher price! Maybe I can join up with those non-user-replaceable-battery whiners and bitch about my lack of self-control and impulse buying."
And for the record, I paid $600 in early July, and feel that it was worth the price I paid. Mind you, if somebody wants to give me some form of credit after the fact, I won't turn it down, but I won't bitch about being allowed to spend my money on my own free will, either.
Government's idea of a balanced budget: take money from the right pocket to balance...oh who am I kidding?
APple has publicly stated they are lowering margins for the next few quarters - did you not notice that in addition to the iPhone drop, the new iPods are cheaper than the old or offer significantly improved features?
Beyond that since they did not even really have to do ANYTHING to start with, why can't it just be great for Apple and the iPhone customer that we get a rebate? Sounds like a win-win.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
... you're just as moron.
The Raven
In the phone world, I've found that other companies stop right at step 2, except perhaps to add "3. Repeat" right after. So why shouldn't we like Apple more? Are you upset that rather than a constant ball kicking there is some relief to let you notice there once was pain?
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Hmmm... I'm trying to decipher this. Is English not your first language? Are you saying there's something with my anatomy? Are you saying someone should copulate with me until I cease to function?
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
For me, they lowered the price of my phone $100.
$100 over a 2 month period, while a fair amount, isn't crazy high.
I'll take it.
I see the mental retards that spent small fortunes on a stupid web-surfing phone are feeling a little inadequate, but rather than looking the mirror to look at the half-wit really responsible, they like to blame those that point out the severe lack of intelligence they exhibit with their pathetic Apple groupthinking mindfucking ways.
I laugh at you, sir. You're a sad, sad human being.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
What I find annoying about Apple pricing (or rather "potentially" annoying, as I'm not one of their customers) is the centralized, tightly controlled pricing, combined with a strategy of infrequent price changes. The cost of a flashy new CPU or videocard will start high but drop steadily day by day (with some fluctuation). With Apple, they keep their cards close to their chest and then Wham! the thing you bought yesterday depreciates 30% overnight. It's perfectly reasonable for customers to be annoyed by this, because it's Apple's secrecy and pricing strategy that create the problem.
Anything beyond this month doesn't really exist. Besides, a lot of people already have big cell phone bills, so it's not really fair to account the cost of service to the iPhone.
Does that mean Apple's target market consists of strippers and nudists?
Momentarily, the need for the construction of new light will no longer exist.
Think about it - if this had really been planned, the best timing would be to announce the credit a week or two AFTER the new iPods go on sale. That way a lot of customers buy new iPods, then head back to the Apple store for accessories after they get the rebate. If Apple was as devious as people claim, issuing an announcement about a rebate ahead of the actual rebate is a terrible non-profix-maximizing idea.
Like everything else in life, the reality is probably between the two extremes - Apple probably thought recently about deep price cuts, and held in reserve the strategy of a rebate if complaints about the price drop from current owners were loud enough (which they were). Apple is a company yes, but Jobs is not a Ferengi (or Mother Teresa in a turtleneck).
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Apple keeps receipts electronically - they just email then to you. Proof of who you are is generally enough (along with the serial number on the back of the iPod).
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Me, I'm against Global Warming and Global Whining.
It doesn't matter to me what Apple's costs are, it's still something $100 cheaper to me. I plan to use it on Leopard which I was going to buy anyway, as I'm sure a lot of people will - how is that not a direct and pure loss for Apple since every dollar of purchase went to paying off R&D on the new OS?
Some things might go for things Apple paid less for, but I just call that Win-Win. Since Apple didn't have to do anything, something is way better than nothing.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
When the iPhone launched, it sold out at both the nearby Apple Stores. If you weren't in line on Friday, you couldn't get one on Saturday. One of my co-workers waited until the middle of the next week, called a couple of stores to check inventory, and just walked right in and bought one.
Those people standing in line weren't just standing in line to get an iPhone. If that's all they wanted, they could have waited a week or two for the second shipment to arrive. What they stood in line for was the opportunity to have it first. They "paid" extra by waiting around for several hours when they could have been doing something else so they could get an iPhone before anyone else did.
Whatever the motivation -- bragging rights, enthusiasm, impatience, etc. -- there is a cost to getting there first. Conversely, there is an opportunity cost to biding one's time: Anyone who waited for the price to come down has gone the last few months with no iPhone.
If everyone that purchased an iPhone, goes out and purchases an iTouch for $100 less, how will Apple ever make any money?
The tens of millions of other people that also purchase an iTouch will help out greatly in that regard.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
The iPhone was an overprice piece of junk in the first place.
This just encourages whiners and the worst kind of whiners. The people up in arms about this are not the people who were unwilling to pay $200 more. Clearly, they bought the phone at that price. What they are up in arms about is that a cheaper phone may mean that other people will be able to afford them, therefore their status symbol is not as exclusive and their feeling of superiority is diminished. The rebate doesn't solve this problem at all and will not please them anyway.
Psychology aside, from a business perspective, there's absolutely no justification for Apple to give a retroactive discount past the return period (see below). When you buy something, you buy it for a price at a particular point in time. If you want to wait and see if the price will go down, you may do so. If it's worth it at the set price at that time and you buy it, short of manufacturing defect, you have absolutely no claim that you should later get it at a lower price. It violates the social contract to demand otherwise. Would if Apple said you should pay them $200 more for the phone you already bought?
The only reason that some merchants have retroactive prices is that the product is still within its return period and it's not worth processing all the returns as people re-buy the product. This is the only case where it makes any business sense to retroactively price a product like this.
Apple just beat the scalpers at their own game.
I gained two months of phone use over someone who has waited; and I have made good use of the phone in the last two months, it's been way more useful to me than the previous phone I had. Well worth the slight extra amount I paid.
After all, any electronics purchase is a gamble - you never know when prices will be cut. But it's a gamble you cannot lose if you like what you bought and you buy at a price that works for you.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Why not cut the price in November? Because it's September in 2007. The holiday season has already begun. By 2011 it will be starting in August.
At my age I find coming up with a witty signature too exhausting.
But hey, look at the bright side: For those early adopters who shattered their glass screens, you can actually get a new 4GB phone with your $100 store credit for less than the cost of replacing the glass screen!
OsX 10.5, probably, as always @ 100$
Live Electronic Music
> Now they lost their trust in Apple, and Steve Jobs is trying to buy it back.
No, there is some PR aspects to this deal but Apple didn't need to do this. It's a way to make sure they keep happy customers. People were lined up to drop 6 portraits of Ben Franklin for a toy. Being a phone anyone (ok, Miss Hilton probably doesn't have the brains to know better but with her money she can afford not to care) with any business in those lines should have realized the price would drop before the year was out. It's a cell phone people!
I certainly ain't no Apple fan, anyone looking at my posting history can see how many times I have rated flamebait/troll for failing to be affected by Steve's Kool-Aid, but when they do something cool I gotta be honest and say that too. And tossing half the price cut back to every buyer and the full difference to everyone who bought in the last two weeks is just high class.
Democrat delenda est
How about a replacement for Microsoft Office. Oh wait. That's $20 less than $100.
Sammy / still loving, loving, loving my iPhone and now look forward to seeing more people with them!
So they bought their phone on eBay, 'cause they were all out, or 'cause they got it for $559 ("cheapest price on the Internet!"). Now they have no recourse to "their $100" and just to rub salt in the wound, the guy who bought it at the store gets another $100.
Or, the guys all trying to sell the iPhones for $559 just had "their market" bottom out. To sell, they have to get price-competitive. There's a $100 pantsing they have to suffer.
Whoops! Speculation has its price!
[Error 407: No signature found]
I laugh at you, sir. You're a sad, sad human being. Have you considered that are people for whom $400 isn't a small fortune? You can mock people for making a good living if you want, but it seems kind of ineffective.
"You have a lot of money and can afford nice things, you LOSER!" doesn't have quite the sting you seem to think it does.
One can only imagine what Zune owners think of this....
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Mwo? Malsum mani turossoyo...
I'm thinking:
"Stretch Armstrong" and "Bullwinkle" (Hey Rocky, watch me pull a rabbit outta mah hat...). You kinda make it sound as if he's got a HUGE fist. Butt, JUST how big IS Jobs' fist.
Pangapsumnida.
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
You completely missed the point. GP was implying that the iPhone isn't a nice thing, not $600 worth of nice anyway. Even if it isn't a stretch for your budget you still shouldn't give that much money for such a product.
ResidntGeek
No, the GP made the point to cover any phone that costs >=$400. If he meant the just the iPhone, he would have just said "Hell, if you paid for an iPhone, you're a moron."
Well, in his comment before that he said "Hell, if you pay $400 for a phone, you're a complete moron.".
There's a name for it: iFucked.
Name: Mr. Anon E Mouse; SSN: 555-55-5555
So, by 2019, it'll be Christmas year-round? Yay!!
Visual IRC: Fast. Powerful. Free.
Get a grip - its only $200. The ability to be smug for the last 2-1/2 months is priceless ...
Well, I'd have to say they totally missed out on their chance to get conversations started with hot babes by whipping out their iPhone and showing off. If they'd been on that train it never would have occurred to them that they paid too much for the thing.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
An item will sell for exactly what both parties (seller and buyer) believe is a fair price at the time of sale.
Please refrain from introducing basic economic concepts into this discussion. You could start a dangerous trend.
But seriously, for priding ourselves on our supposedly rational behavior, geeks can often be just as irrational as anyone else.
Read the EFF's Fair Use FAQ
I bought my iPhone on my American Express Card.
I called their dispute claim number at 1-800-297-8019.
They said they would process the claim for my 200 bucks.
No guarantees, but they will let me know if I get a refund through them.
Worth a try if you bought on a credit card.
There seems to be a large disconnect in this thread between long term apple customers and other early adopters.
The reason this is a big deal to apple customers is that in terms of apple's history this much of a drop after such a time is unprecedented. In other parts of the tech sector a 33% drop in price after 2 months may not be uncommon, but just for apple it is. There is another reason this is a big deal for apple customers, in the past with their ipod line, except when the first 20gb model, when a capacity of ipod has gone down in price, it has also been revised so that there was a discernible difference between people with the last gen high-end model, and people with the current gen cheaper low-end model. With this price reduction there is no early adopter badge.
No, there is some PR aspects to this deal but Apple didn't need to do this. It's a way to make sure they keep happy customers [...] tossing half the price cut back to every buyer and the full difference to everyone who bought in the last two weeks is just high class. Indeed. I'm often shocked by how much more open hostility there is on Slashdot toward organizations that try to treat their customers well. Google is constantly accused of being "evil" for
Over and over we see the same thing. Companies that do right by the community are attacked. Cutthroat and downright evil companies that just ignore us (G.E. comes to mind) are ignored in turn. We're training the corporate world to do us no favors.
That's not different from a lot of high-ticket consumer products. Want to by a new Lexus from the dealership, or a tailored suit, you'll find the pricing just as foggy. If you want to buy a computer priced like gasoline, buy a Dell, but they're just as weird and capricious about their prices, they just hide their actual price in a vast system of rebates. Apple's pricing is also supposed to be simple to make their market segmentation simple. If I'm looking for a cheap iPod, it's easy to see which one's for me and compare it (well, not as easy as it has been, but still). I don't have to wade through four or five different lines with different price levels, rebate options, compatibility, capabilites, form factors, etc... There's both a downside and an upside to going with a single vendor.
With Apple, they keep their cards close to their chest and then Wham! the thing you bought yesterday depreciates 30% overnight.I know you picked that number off a tree, but just about any computer (or car, or expensive resellable item, for that matter) depreciates 30% the moment you take it out of the store. I would also direct you to eBay to compare the relative resale values of 2 year old Macs, compared to 2 year old Dells or ThinkPads.
Don't blame me, I voted for Baltar.
Wham! the thing you bought yesterday depreciates 30% overnight.
Depreciates? Were you planning on selling it?
I don't really think there is a market for used cell phones or for used ipods...
No sig for the moment.
You are clearly the most benevolent person who ever lived on the face of the earth. Please let me know when I can spend even more of my money so I can replenish your shrinking corporate coffers. Now if you excuse me, I need to go see if there are any other items somewhere that I can overpay for.
Is intel going to send them a free core?
:)
The mental image of some geek at his house opening the mail to find a little 40 mm^2 (or whatever the area of a single xeon core is these days) piece of silicon and going "wtf am i going to do with this?!" made me laugh. Thanks
The enemies of Democracy are
Comment removed based on user account deletion
The iphone is worth whatever you are willing to pay for it... it is not a tradeable commodity
No sig for the moment.
Apple structures their prices in this manner so that people do not wait to they purchase products. This is also the reason they do not engage in price trickery (different prices for different verticals for no reason, arbitrary, limited-time rebates).
In practice, as long as I've been following these things, I have not seen the actual prices change muchh. The units get upgraded and the prices stay the same. Therefore, while it is true to say that your unit is worth less, it is difficult to make a direct dollar comparison. You just get more for your money - sometimes incrementally, sometimes radically. In this case, well, they probably weren't selling as many units as they wanted, or figured they were losing points with the demographic that made the iPod famous because of the outrageous prices.
The only other area I've noticed with radical price drops was the monitors. There are good reasons to lower their prices. For one, they have price competition from other companies who are making very similar or identical products, and it's harder to push the idea that a monitor worth just more for being Apple. Secondly, the iMacs are so cheap, and the desktops so expensive, that the potential market for the monitors is much smaller.
You've had it for up to 2 months. Why should you get the full $200 back?
"Hey, sorry our stuff didn't work! And that you can't get your money back! Here's virtual money to spend on more of our crap!"
~Eien no Inori wo Sasagete~ Searching for my Hatsumi...
I'm with you on this one.
I bought two: an 8gb for myself and a 4gb for the wife, and we stood in line on opening day.
I honestly believe that the phones were worth every penny that we paid for both of them ($499/$599 retail).
For the record, my wife let her phone slip while she was walking out of her parking garage, and smacked it at the pavement while flailing to catch it. The sleep/wake button got jammed inside the buckled aluminum, and we had to bring the phone in for service.
Apple took the phone back, offered us a loaner ($25ish, IIRC... we didn't take it), and had a *brand*new*phone* shipped to us the very next morning. Priority overnight Fedex, 7:45am, I might add. For a phone that my wife admitted to beating up and was ready to pay for repairs.
So, that was two weeks ago, now Apple offers us $100 apiece for being early adopters.
You just don't get that kind of service in the technology industry anywhere else these days that I've experienced.
I mean, I bought a Vista OEM copy and an nVidia "Vista Ready" mobo on launch day (it's my job to know how to support *everything*, turd or not). You don't see MS or nVidia offering to make things right because little things like on-board sound and networking don't function...at all...nVidia passes the buck to MS, and MS passes the buck to nVidia, and eight months later now, I still have to use USB dongles on that particular mobo for sound and ethernet. And neither of those companies have any intention of making things right. And that's just driver issues. Let's not even get into Vista quality (utter pile of refuse, kthanxbye). No rebate, no exchange for something that actually functions as described. Not even an option to downgrade to XP from MS.
Anyhow, I contrast that experience with something like buying my iPhone, Macbook Pro or any of the dozens of other Apple products I've purchased over the years and there's just no comparison. The iPhone is a *killer* product, and they're going to gain a ton more goodwill out of a gesture that they didn't have to make.
Long story short, the wife is now an absolutely fanatical Apple supporter just from these experiences.
Blogging Whiners are whining because they paid a premium to be an early adopter? Well, duh. I had no illusions that it wouldn't be substantially cheaper by EU launch or the holidays.
Reminds me of a T-shirt I saw recently.
--d
Bah! We already have Christmas in July... now we just need to get people to start giving gifts for that, and we've got two starting points for the marketing...
We can advertise Christmas in July from Dec. 26th until July 25th, and Christmas from July 26th until December 24th...
Although... I'm pretty sure the first store to have year round Christmas carols will get firebombed...
Nephilium...
Supply and demand works in reverse too. Say for example, you only had a capacity to produce say 100,000 widgets a month. If you were expecting to sell out on opening day, but have a new shipment ready the next day, wouldn't you set the price at a point where by the demand would be limited so that you never had to tell someone "sorry, come back another day"
While this is probably the most prudent thing Apple could have done, I must say, I was enjoying the strange turn of fate bestowed upon all those folks who just couldn't wait to buy the latest and greatest.
Hey Steve,
I'm pissed. I didn't buy an iPhone because I was waiting for the price to drop. And, now your'e refunding a big part of the price cut.
I missed out on all the ohs and ahs of showing one off. You owe me big time.
I'm still not going to buy one. I have a laptop that gives me a great internet experience and email and third-party apps and all that other great crap and I have a perfectly good cell phone to make calls with. Since the duties of my employment pretty much require me to have these items on me at all times, what would be the advantage of purchasing an iPhone other than to prove I have the biggest iPenis? Brand whores unite!
I bought my iPhone on 8/24, which is 12 days before the annoucement on 9/5. It's great that I can get a $100 store credit, but do I qualify for the full $200 rebate (the standard Apple offer)? Is the window for that rebate 10 days or 14 days?
As others have noted, there was absolutely no need or duty for Apple to do anything. They did, though, and the fact that we can see it is in their best interest should not, IMO, automatically nominate it for criticism. For some folks there seems to be an assumption that if it's good for a business, it must be really bad for everyone else. But the whole point of private markets is that they create value for everyone.
This is a net gain for all parties. Apple will gain in both brand loyalty and direct revenue (most people go over the store credit amount when using it). And the customers gain $100 in Apple credit, which is a win because clearly this is a group of people who like Apple stuff. Both sides are gaining a benefit they wouldn't have otherwise had.
Build a man a fire, he's warm for one night. Set him on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.
On the one hand I was happy to shell out $600 for the iPhone given that I've been waiting for a wifi PDA/smartphone that doesn't suck for years (the iPhone has its limitations, but frankly I was fed up with Palm's and Windows Mobile's problems).
On the other hand, while I fully expect price drops and product improvements ~6 months after buying something like this, $200 (33%) after 10 weeks is pretty rough. So I think a $100 credit is a fair compromise. Had Apple not done anything, they would've risked tarnishing their brand name (which is perhaps their most valuable asset).
In fact I suggested this exact solution over at the Apple and brighthand forums. Apple deleted my thread, but the important thing is that they're actually doing it.
...things like on-board sound and networking don't function...at all...
Do you know what an RMA is?
um, slashdot is supposed to be all knowledge, but yet, i see nothing on precedent...
apple is known for doing stuff like this, e.g. aperture. the situation was somewhat different, but the response was generally the same, offer refunds to early adopters.
this is almost 100 million dollars in good-will... and pure apple. in fact, expect some lawyer to devise a class action suit on behalf of aggrieved shareholders -- angry about apple being too gracious with customers.
Hell, if you pay $400 for a phone, you're a complete moron.
ROFL. I spent more than that taking your mom to dinner last night. Goddamn, that woman can eat.
If I wanna buy a new iPhone, should I wait until Christmas for prices to drop?
2 years != 2 months. With such an articulate post, I'm surprised by the horribly fallacious comparison.
Wow you have the ability to put together your own computer, that's so impressive. Can you fabricate your own chips too ? No, because your just some dumbass monkey who buys off the shelf parts and plugs them together. That's about as hard as putting together a HDTV and cable box and dvd player.
Even better if most of them spend it on Apple software. Such as, I dunno, maybe Leopard? Due out next month?
Teh Steve is laughing all the way to the bank, and this time I'm laughing right along. This is so brilliant it almost has to be on purpose.
Something you learn in basic economics, is that opportunity loss is a loss as any. I know what you think: "haha, software costs $0, so they didn't give you anything at all".
Nope, piracy of the OS itself is almost non-existent on Macs, and those early buyers would purchase Leopard for $100. Those are $100 lost for Apple, never mind how they are going to be spent.
The benefit for Apple here is that it's not cash but store credit, from then on, what they do with it is doesn't matter.
$100 store credit is a slap in the face. $200 STORE CREDIT would have been a nice gesture. As is, Apple is only digging themselves deeper in my estimation. Attempting to lure customers to spend MORE money in your store after such an ridiculous pricing debacle is disappointing... I would expect better of Apple.
RMAs are all well and good until you wait a month or so for "last minute driver issues" to be sorted out, and no one's going to RMA an open, activated OEM Vista.
I think my point was more that Vista itself is an utter, inexcusable mess and MS hasn't even owned up to that... much less even attempted to make things right (make it right? there's no problem!) amongst its customer base. I was contrasting the level of service you come to expect from companies you deal with.
Insane markup? Luckily for you, Slashdot is not about journalistic integrity. Otherwise I'd have to ask you to cite some sources for your "facts". It is so much easier to throw accusations around without having to back them up, isn't it?
( Just making a point.
A refurbished iPhone is already $349.99 for the 8GB version, if you want to snag it before the holidays. Take a look here.
Ahhh yes, the guy who was ousted because of his management style was in fact setting the prices that whole time. Good call.
how many times did i tell you that you were getting fucked by jobs?
Everything Spindler tried to do was too little too late. He was faced with a hostile, arrogant, and oppositional work force that was so caught up in the culture it sabotaged all the efforts. Rebuild a working modern OS - forray into consumer devices - move to open document formats and standards - all under Spinder. Sure, Copland, Pippin, and OpenDoc failed - but if you look at the market 5 years after - what do you see?
Amazing how many fan boys and x-apple employees lurk on slashdot.
/\/\icro/\/\uncher
Awwww, you're just jealous. You might be supprised at how many people make more money than you and like gadgets. We don't go around calling you a "mental retard" because you can't get a better job.
I will not buy an iPhone until:
1. Apple and ATT pay ME $599
2. Randall Stephenson's mom sucks my dick
3. Steve Jobs licks my nut sack
Beat that.
True, true. Apple will miss out on, oh, let's call it 400,000[1] credits used * $100 = $40,000,000 of potential unrealized revenue.
However, they don't just give that money up and get nothing for it:
* They get great publicity that makes them appear responsive to customers - the story is all over the non-tech news.
* They restore a lot of goodwill among early adopters, who are an important crowd for Apple.
* It's a great loss-leader to get those people - known big spenders - back into the store to spend more money.
* If it's used on Apple software or hardware, it will increase their installed base and marketshare.
So yeah, they're going to miss out on $40 million, but they get value for it that's probably better than the same amount spent on advertising in any media.
[1: Assuming they've sold 800,000 eligible units and 50% of buyers acquire and use their credits.]
With reasonable men I will reason; with humane men I will plead; but to tyrants I will give no quarter. -- William Lloyd
They must be worried about the iPhone in order to do something as crazy as that. Dropping the price of the phone 2 months after it's released by 33%? It's bad for several reasons but mainly because it pisses off the early adopters big time as evidenced by the emails/rebate. The $100 will appease them, however, they will be extremely gunshy to jump on the boat again, that's for sure. One of my friends who bought the iPhone said exactly that, he will wait a few months now and won't be fooled by Apple a second time.
And they know all this because they are savvy business people at Apple. Compare the iPhone to the PS3. More people bought the iPhone than did PS3 at the same price, yet it took Sony 1 year to get a $100 price drop as opposed to Apple's price drop.
So the only reason to me is that it's desperation. I'm guessing that report about how only 136k people actually signed up must have them pretty worried and they need to reach a critical level sooner.
Me personally, I smell blood in the water. I'm waiting for the price to drop even further before I begin to consider buying it. It would be interesting to see how many people feel the same way and if that will actually curtail pickup of the iPhone until closer to Christmas.
Thanks to this incident, it is highly improbable that Apple will ever be able to come out with something innovative and new that is a success ever again... because if they try to, a lot of people will hesitate to buy it right away, thinking that perhaps Apple might lower their price in the not-too-distant future. The result will virtually inevitably be a marketing failure.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
Strange logic you've got there. The apple online and retail stores sell all sorts of things, many of which even a non-apple-owner would find useful. At competitive prices. The thing you're also missing, is that if I've bought an iPhone (I have), I'm likely to buy other things because of direct personal positive experience with the products. Did I deserve to get a free $100 bucks off my next purchase of any vaguely IT-ish product? Not at all. Did I expect it? Nope. Am I gonna spend it on more Apple stuff? Sure. Was I gonna buy that stuff _anyway_? You bet. So tell me again how I'm only gaining $30 or $40? Seems to me it just made my next iPod purchase go from $300.00 to $200.00...
I agree with what someone else said though - if you want things on the day, you pay extra. It's always been the way, though maybe 2 months after release is a bit soon for a price cut like this. Jobs cites the holiday season as a reason - why not cut the price in November then? At least that lessens the chance that every iPhone owner is going to want your head impaled upon a pike so they can wave at it in a funny way.
I find it odd that people are treating Apple poorly because they're (a) dropping the price, and (b) giving early adopters (adapters?) something that is completely unexpected but a nice gift. Somehow they're the bad guys for doing this. Not saying you specifically, but an awful lot of that sort of thinking in this thread.
It's a good phone. It integrates the various apps well. One-button checks for traffic, weather, stock prices, email, etc etc etc. The workflow is well thought out and intuitive. Yeah, I can do all (well, most) of this same thing with my Treo but, the UI on this thing is so much better. And my monthly contract with AT&T is 20 bucks a month less than I was paying Verizon. I'm not seeing a downside.
Not really. Plugging cables != assembling a computer. Although they are both easy tasks to perform.
Obligatory blog plug: http://www.caseybanner.ca/
One wonders if the $500 suckers have learned from the folly of their impatience? Apple's tricks on people's perceptions of value could return to bite them in the ass. I can easily see lots of people (me included) never purchasing an new apple product until they slash (\ ha! ha! the pun...) the prices by about 30% about a month or so after the launch.
Fair enough, I was gonna anyway. Thanks Steve!
nVidia doesn't make motherboards, they make northbridges and southbrides for motherboards. nVidia also makes some generic motherboard drivers, but they dont work with some mobo's.
I'm going to go with the "You are a incompetent moron" option.
I agree. I can't believe there are people who are actually upset that Apple is doing this. They'd rather have us get nothing. That is just a crappy attitude IMHO.
I'm willing to bet that just in time for the holiday shopping season a new iPhone will be released (iPhone nano, anyone?) and that this was the best way to liquidate the current inventory in preparation for that.
(599 - 399) / 599 * 100 = 33.4 ~ 30%
I think the grandparent did a rough estimate in his/her head, rather than picked that number off a tree.
Don't blame lord Jobs. If the fanboys want to waste $600 for it, with a 2-year lockin, Apple is ready to rake in your moolah. You could get other phones on the market with the same features for much less. Blindly following your leader lord Jobs does come with some drawbacks.
And how does Apple repay you? By getting you to buy *more* apple stuff with that $100. Nice.
I call bullshit..... Once you buy it you don't have to tell anyone you are gay....
a minority of fanatics who believe that iPhone costed every single dollar of those $600 they paid.
I'm not sure those people are wrong.
I've seen lots of stuff that focuses on the cost of the parts. These people seem to act like it was inevitable that if you dumped enough of the specified parts into a vat together that they'd eventually inevitably produce an iPhone.
I've only seen speculation about costs for manufacturing/assembly, software development, and hardware R&D. Probably because only Apple really knows. But I'm sure those costs are there. Perhaps others that aren't immediately obvious.
This isn't to say there wasn't a good margin built into the iPhone on top of that. However true it actually is that Apple actually is a damn smart company that is in fact driven as much by a desire to produce quality products as the desire to reap profits, it and its shareholders also probably desires to reap profits. They probably knew they could command the price of early adopters and many would pay it.
It's also possible that high price helped them recover development costs, and with that done, they're free to drop the price.
It's also possible the high price likely keeps it in the hands of people who want one so badly they're willing to overlook some Rev A problems.
It's also possible the price itself was intended as a quality/caché signal.
Tweet, tweet.
For example, the guys at Will it Blend blending that one iPhone. They bought the iPhone, but no longer have it. Will they be able to get the $100 credit, even though the remains of the iPhone were sold to someone else? (And thus blend the new product?)
Also, in a more reasonable situation, what if someone bought the iPhone only to resell it, or was unsatisfied with it and dumped it? Who gets the $100 then?
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 SU CK IT MP AA
Have you considered that are people for whom $400 isn't a small fortune? You can mock people for making a good living if you want, but it seems kind of ineffective.
I don't consider the folks up the street (who have an obnoxious home, a Gallardo, two Hummers, and a Cayman) stupid.
I consider their purchases stupid.
Take a lesson, GP.
Maybe Apple just didn't sell enough iPhones for there to be enough angry people.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
yeah, because putting a chip is a socket or a card in a slot is nothing like plugging in cables.
This story was carried by everyone all morning including the popular press and every tech blog out there - except this one.
Were you concerned that Apple might look "bad"?
Who the fuck is running the show around here?
I find it really curious that anyone has a problem with the generous gesture. Regardless of your operating system of choice buying technology as soon as it comes out means you pay more. Period. I have never seen a gesture like this before and it makes me feel really good. As for Apple's secrecy policy, imagine having a huge company like microsoft try to copy everything do it badly and still have most computer users use the inferior (in my humble opinion) product. I guess you'd want to slow that stuff down a bit, huh?
I meant that you at least picked your components out when you placed your order on the OEM's website: such and such size memory, exactly what processor model, what speed/brand hard drive, that sort of thing instead of the traditional consumer approach of going to the store and "buying a computer" by just looking for the box with the lowest price tag, maybe be persuaded by the smooth talking salesman into a "multimedia" upgrade or something. I consider that far below the Slashdot crowd. So it was a compliment, not a troll.
The reason that Jobs announced a $100 rebate to people that bought the iPhone within 14 days is because AT&T allows people to return iPhones within 14 days for a refund minus a 10% restocking fee.
Lots of people must have started returning the phones and buying them for the discounted price (which is very expensive for Apple), so they figured that if they offer $100, and you're only going to get $540 back for a return after the 10% restocking fee, and you have to deal with the hassle of returning and buying again, you'd rather get the $100 refund from apple. It's pure economics.
Here's a quote from AT&T's site: "Apple branded equipment is covered by a 14-day return policy and must be returned to the original point of purchase. If the Apple branded equipment is returned unopened and in the original shrink wrapping, it will be refunded back to the original payment method. Opened Apple branded equipment that is returned within 14 days will be subject to a 10% open box restocking fee. All products must be packed in their original, unmarked packaging including any accessories and manuals that shipped with the product." See: http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-phone-service/leg al/return-policy.jsp
Incidentally, all other phones have a 30 day return period and no restocking fee, so perhaps the price cuts were planned, or Apple was afraid the phones might have problems that would cause them to be returned.
Jobs doesn't care about the users, it's all about the benjamins. Once again he's sucked everyone into the Apple spin zone.
this is a lesson from the ultimate hustler. satan himself couldn't have come up with a better scheme. well played mr. jobs, well played...
That's an interesting observation. I've seen a lot of people give their used cell phones to shelters, or to students or friends. I think the "market" for them exists, but its lubricated more by social currency rather than dollars.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
Having maps and email and web browsing on hand, has in fact been worth $100 over two months (since I was going to buy Leopard anyway, the $100 credit is real enough to me). I have made excellent use of it over the last two months.
And I do not "flash it around". I hate even admitting I have some expensive phone. I generally try to use it when it's not obvious I have one (except answering calls of course, you don't get to pick exactly when a call will come).
Your mistake, as has been the mistake of Apple haters since the dawn of time, is in think any Apple product is about looks when it's all about features and usability.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
That actually comes from experience of going to an Apple store in London and also knowing someone who runs a shop and therefore the price of obtaining these things from the manufacturer.
Having said that, that is London, and as such your mileage will almost certainly vary.
"It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him." - Tolkien
It's not like nobody warned these people. In the comment section of every iPhone story (and there were a lot) people were saying that the smart thing to do was wait for the next revision and/or the price drop. Hell, most of the reviews said as much. But no. They marched to the Apple store, fingers in ears, singing the "I can't hear you" song.
You can feel cheated all you want, but don't make me listen to it. It's like when you're boss complains that he has buyers remorse from his brand new Mercedes. Great. You're rich. I get it. Now don't sob about being taken for a fool when you spend your money on frivolous things.
Usually when Apple announces something like this in a special event they get tons of free press describing their new product becuase their events are interesting enough to be news. Just look at the recent iMac announcement and the articles on cnn.com and other places. But now what made the news was this price drop that was uncharacteristic for Apple and how the drop made the early adopters mad and how it must be a sign that their not selling enough iPods. All this and barely a mention of the iPod touch outside of the tech websites like ars....
:)
But C'mon the iPod touch is freakin' cool, and way more newsworthy than the iMac. The Steve really f*cked up by announcing the price drop at the same time as the iPod touch. This $100 rebate is his effort to try an recover from this and hopefully get some positive press.
Yeah, the rebate is good customer relations and preserves the brand... but I think the main benefit is in squashing the 'disgruntaled iPhone people' meme before it got out of control.
I'm not saying this to be critical of his motives, but to admire him for doing a good job protecting shareholder value. As a little-guy shareholder I am really greatful that he works so hard to protect my investment's value even though most of his personal wealth comes from his other business (Disney/Pixar). This rebate is really good (and timely) damage control. Next step: he has to give Pouge and Mossburg free iPod touches
There are 10 types of people in this world, those who can count in binary and those who can't.
iTunes Gift Cards.
http://www.apple.com/legal/sales_policies/retail_u s.html
Should Apple reduce its price on any Apple-branded product within fourteen (14) calendar days of the date of purchase, you may request a refund of the difference between the price paid and the current selling price. An original purchase receipt is required, and you must request your refund within fourteen (14) calendar days of the price reduction.
Hmmm... I'm trying to decipher this. Is English not your first language? Are you saying there's something with my anatomy? Are you saying someone should copulate with me until I cease to function?
either that or untill you run out of money
or maybe he's visibly upset and had to shout some expletives because you broke his asshole, or something..
Um, except Apple is offering a rebate to anyone who has bought an iPhone, ever. Not just within the last 14 days. You can still return an iPhone if it was purchased within the last 14 days, then buy a new one, if you like.
Trust is a very hard thing to earn amongst geeks. Ok this is way offtopic, but anyways.. I believe a lot of it comes from our social environment - we get beat up in schools as a kid, growing up the local bully would trick us into doing something foolish at our own expense and their entertainment (from our innate desire to 'fit in', so to speak), even so far getting trolled by our own kind in various outlets (getting PKed from people you considered 'friends,' or being goatse.cx'd), or being victims of various exploitations (at work, at love, etc). Growing up in that kind of environment, at times when I see a genuine gesture of grace, I can't believe it for a minute, and my head is spinning thinking of all the possibilities and reasons of why someone would do such a thing, likely at my expense nonetheless. Maybe it's just the nature of geeks to think ahead, *shrug* I don't know.
But in any case, it will come as second nature to us to be distrustful. Sometimes that manifests prematurely - perhaps the sales of the iphone are worse than expected and Jobs is trying to boost sales in order to look good in front of the other cellphone carriers - I could be thinking. Or perhaps: sales really did go well early on, but they noticed a sharp drop after the first month because they priced themselves out of the sweetspot (coupled with the whole ATT bundling push fiasco). A PR maneuver like this could bring forth a few more customers, maybe. Or maybe this was planned from the start, and luckily their supplier had better than expected yields for hardware parts and Apple took that to their advantage in order to get a jump on more marketshare against the other cellphone manufacturers (at the same time looking good towards consumers and not looking like total price-gouging capitalists which any true-blue american company in the business of cellphones is so well known for). Who the hell knows? Perhaps the cellphone carriers looking to take advantage of apple forced apple to price their units high (perhaps with aid from other manufacturers that had stake at the carriers, like clique'y capitalism), so Apple played the game according to the rules set upon them - untill the time was right for them to turn around, give the carriers the finger and set the rules how Apple wants to play them. (too much tinfoil hat?)
Anyways, it's a refreshing change of pace, and a nice gesture for Apple to go forth and do all that. For the rest of us that know how Apple rolls, we've all be patiently waiting for the price to go down (and more carriers to be supported) - or we've been waiting for the ipod touch instead. Or we're waiting for revision B down the road when something wacky happens with the iphone 6 months from now.
...I have yet to see any store that is *not* an Apple store carry Apple computers. This wasn't always the case, though, IIRC. In fact, in recent years Apple has disallowed third-party sales of new Apple systems for various reasons, including the price fluctuations that occur.
iPods and iPod accessories are a different beast - prices vary due to the large amounts of retail outlets that carry iPods and the resulting competition.
The only way to purchase a new Mac computer is through Apple Online or an Apple Store... as for used systems, that's what Craigslist and eBay are for. (MacMall is a good authorized used-system reseller, however)
Why should people expect rebates if they willingly buy some stuff that's overpriced and it gets cheaper a few months later?
If it was faulty or you got less than what was advertised then sure.
WRT rebates for punishing companies, I personally don't think fines/rebates are that effective. Bosses being sent to prison is definitely more effective...
I just bought a new Nokia last May that had just come out for 990 euros. And now they are selling it for 700 euros down the street! - I want my money back!
Nokia should have told me that they will drop the price later, and the cost of manufacturing the phone is less than 990 euros! They should have told me that they are making profit on me buying the phone early. It's just wrong! Someone should tell me these things, because I didn't know the price of the phone would drop. I thought a 990 euro phone will always be a 990 euro phone. The price would even rise, because the value of the money always drops. So in two years when I'd sell the phone, I would get over 1000 euros for it...
If all else fails, pull the plug and get out...
The Life is out there...
Blogging Whiners are whining because they paid a premium to be an early adopter? Well, duh. I had no illusions that it wouldn't be substantially cheaper by EU launch or the holidays.
That is the key to frustrations, everyone assumed it will be discounted by EU launch or the holidays (I would have guessed by $100), which would give good 4-5 months time. Now the discount happend in 2 month time and it was significantly more than expected. Society has certain unwritten rules on how prices can be dropped without getting backslash, and this price drop was definitely too soon and too big.
To be honest I believe Apple got some sort of revenue share deal with AT&T (similar to what they got from European carriers) and it suddenly made financial sense for AT&T and Apple to discount the phone price. In Europe Apple gets 10% of the revenue iPhone generates, if same was done with AT&T then it would mean about $240 extra income for Apple during the lifetime of the contract, assuming $100 per month spending. Suddenly Apple has incentive to finance the price drop and get huge step closer to that 10 million iPhones sold mark.
Bottom line with the discount is that suddenly the mechanics how iPhone price is calculated got twisted and people before this overhaul were left paying substantially more than what the price should have been. iPhone should have started with $399 price and drop to $349 or $299 by Christmas, thats how the phone prices behave normally.
I just wanted to add to your praise of AppleCare. It's more of an insurance than a guarantee, really. I broke a PowerBook taking it apart (don't ask). Called them on the last day of my AppleCare year. They fixed it for free, and also replaced the slightly scratched bezel.
My friend broke the screen of his iBook which he had in a backpack while skateboarding. Free replacement from Apple. My brother broke his iPod in a biking accident. Apple replaced it free of charge. A friend of mine stumbled over a pre-mag-save PowerBook cable and the cable ripped out of the plug. Apple sent me a new charger, no questions asked.
I would tell anyone to extend AppleCare to three years for portable devices. If anything happens, Apple will fix it.
So you're saying that you think the markup on Apple's products is high because you know somebody who runs an Apple shop who told you that he has high margins on Apple's products? The term "pants on fire" comes to mind, considering that resellers have been complaining about the low margins on Apple's products for years.
Apple does usually have margins in the 20-35% area, but the resellers don't see anything like this, and Apple's margins are so high because Apple generally doesn't pay for software (such as Windows). In fact, Apple's products aren't really more expensive than comparable products from companies like Creative or Dell.
I've used more Nvidia based boards for both Intel and AMD from pretty much every mobo manufacturer out there, from cheap OEMs to high-end premium boards. It's been a while since I couldn't find a device driver for Vista. Being an early adopter sure doesn't help things and should have been expected. It's not like the R600 Linux drivers were out the day the 2900 came out heh.
While its nice to support everything, learning how to use an OS so you can work on one doesn't really mean you need all devices to work. I too support more hardware than I care to admit and when I needed to learn how to use it, nothing VMware can't handle, or my Macbook, desktop, etc.
(...)
The only way to purchase a new Mac computer is through Apple Online or an Apple Store...
WTF are you talking about? Where I live, we have dozens of Apple resellers. No Apple store, though. Even normal electronics stores and some upscale grociery stores sell Apple systems. New ones, by the way.
Do you have any sources for your absurd claims?
So what did those early iPhone fanboys think? That the normal ways of commerce don't apply to them?
When I bought a combined harddisk/DVD recorder less than 2 years ago, it cost me $1500. Recently I spotted one for less than $250 (OK, it did have 'only' a 250GB disk, while mine had a 400GB one).
Am I getting a refund or extra store credit for not wanting to wait until the price dropped? ZILCH. NADA. NOTHING.
Did I ever expect any such thing? NO.
Jesus Jobs! Don't you know you've been ripped off by Apple?
I'm really loving all the whining going on here! Apple didn't have to give a $100 rebate, but they are, because for some reason they seem to care about the customers who slag them off at any given chance...And now you're still not happy because it wasn't the full $200 price drop. Goods change value over time, anyone who expected the iPhone to stay at the same price is quite silly. They dropped the price, deal with it!
It seems that the rebate in the UK will be 50 GBP. It is re assuring to see apple realise that the 2 to 1 exchange rate is there (particularly when giving money back). Sadly MS and many others (apple too) oddly ignore this when setting prices.
Wonder why?
But Google refunded 200% of the wasted money, not just 50%.
This just goes to prove what we already know, Steve Jobs is cheap.
I think they realized that they had set the opening price a little too high. If the top end had sold for $499, they would have sold more at the opening, and then nobody would have objected to $100 price cut. What do the early adopters think, they bought real estate instead of a rapidly-devaluating piece of personal electronics? A $200 drop, so soon, made the upper classes feel ripped off, instead of bravely paying off the development costs for the rest of us. Show a little damn noblesse oblige, iPhone nobility. Keep paying the premium price for your phones, so they can lower the price to $299, at which point, I bite. The lower classes will thank you brave price pioneers. Scratch me behind the ear and I will tug my forelock for you. No, it doesn't mean that. The forelock is the little tuft of hair in the front of your head that the serfs would tug at to show obeisance.
Actually Apple does participate in limited price drops and rebates. They just don't make it their marketing gimmick. They just hide it somewhere on their site in a block of text that it's happeningI picked up my Dual Core Macbook, and a 30GB iPod video right before Apple dropped the price of the 30GB iPod Video from $300 to $250.. Price was dropped $100 on the Macbook, and got a $150 rebate on the iPod since it was bought with the Macbook (plus a student discount). Zero problems getting the rebate since everything was bought at an Apple Store, and the rebate was sent to Apple's main offices. Even picked up the Intel rebate that came about a couple months later related to Dual Core notebooks without issue.
I know one person who did get a full $200 store credit simply by asking for it. Apple seems to very conscious of the fact that dropping the price so much so soon is going to make the early adopters cranky, and seem willing to make reasonable accommodations for those folks if they ask for it.
This seems to be more than most companies would do in the same situation, and it's preferable to keeping the price artificially inflated for everyone else just so the people who were happy to spend to $599 can feel better about themselves.
Because Apple wants people to go buy the new touch iPods and not wait for three months to see if the price drops. It's not the feeling of entitlement of the early adopters, it's Apple's marketing and their desire to take care of customers.
this isn't really unprecedented. I know of many retail chains that will give "price adjustments" within a certain number of days after a purchase. I think that they mostly limit it to 14 days, maybe 30 days.
Instead of the story being "Apple lowers price, because of dismal sales", the story is about how people who paid too much are pissed and are getting a rebate.
Maybe when it hits $200 and works with t-mobile out of the box, I'll consider buying one.
Leopard = tiger +5 cute new features
I think the people that rushed out and bought one of these over-hyped devices got exactly what they deserved. I am so sick of hearing about these things, they are phones with mp3 players in them basically and they have a cool screen you can touch. I get the same result with my Zen Nano and my Samsung phone. Maybe next time they come out with a new toy, wait a while before you buy it. It's just like shopping for cars.
If carrots got you drunk, rabbits would be fucked up. - Comedian Mitch Hedberg R.I.P. 03/30/68-2/24/05
That the terms of the store credit have not been decided. How much would you like to bet that certain products will not qualify for this store credit. Steve may have dropped the price sooner than expected but he is by not means an idiot. I would expect there to be some rules that govern the purchases you will be able to make with said credit. Maybe like $100 off anything over 200 dollars.
I think you're missing the point. There's an element of expectations about future pricing that people had when they paid $600 for the phone - expectations driven by Apple's historical pricing behavior. Some people's willingness to pay $600 for the phone was driven in part by their expectation that they couldn't possibly get it for $200 less 10 weeks later. Apple violated those expectations, which is why early buyers are mad.
The processor market is actually a good example, but not for the reasons cited by other posters. In that case, consumer expectation is that prices continually drop in a largely predictable fashion, so the trade-off between buying now at a higher price and buying later at a lower price is well-understood and taken into account at time of purchase.
Imposing Libertarian views on everyone online since 1992.
The quad-core 3.00GHz Xeon does *not* cost the same as the dual-core 3.00GHz Xeon.
...if you actually think that Stevie is just a good person and that Apple didn't plan this, at minimum, weeks in advance. The RIAA has the stripper mentality. Apple has the pimp mentality - how many people can we get to suck our dicks in adoration? What can we do to make them suck harder? I know! Calculated PR moves like letters about how much we actually hate our proprietary monopolistic DRM policies and about how we really want to hook up our customers with $100 credits to buy more shiny white shit in our overpriced stores with archaic return policies! Marketing is marketing, even if it's coming from Apple. If anything, Apple's marketing is more sleazy than that of other corporations.
I'm a geek girl. Seriously.
I think we should get more than $100 back for being locked into using iTunes -- the buggy, incredibly vulnerable program that led to hundreds of thousands of apple software users' personal information being stolen, etc --- Don't you?
You are so far off that you will need a map just to find a clue. http://www.americantv.com/itemList.do?pg=1&catCd=6 001&vend=APPL
I'd site hundreds of others, but it gets redundant after awhile.
Wow, store credits just in time for the new batch of IPods.
Coincidence?
Maybe he's advocating that the broke people of the world turn to prostitution?
New punctuation update "~" (no quotes) at the end of a line to indicate sarcasm. ~
I just sold a 3 year old iMac (screen-on-a-stick model). It was only 1GHz, 768MB, 30GB. 17" display. I got $525 for it... plus shipping. This was actually lower than other bids I had seen close in recent weeks. I've seen 800MHz Imacs go for over $600, in August of this year!
You spend more for the machine than competitors, yes. Part of that is sheerly for the aesthetic of the beautiful machine, a small part for bragging rights, and the rest for the solid tech inside the box. Apple regularly, and suddenly drops prices when they add new models. This is typical of many companies. If you know there's a Mac Keynote coming up in the next 30 day, WAIT!!! Don't buy anything. Or at least make sure where you are buying it from has a 14-30 day price match guarantee.
Outside of that, what's your mac worth after 3 years compared to something else? I have a 1 year old $1100 IBM business notebook. Core Duo, advanced graphics, SATA, and more. on ebay, it's worth about $450... A 2 year old Gateway gaming notebook (my wife's rig) was $1300 new (after rebates). It's worth about $250 on ebay right now. My mom's 2 year old powerbook? Still worth 50% of what she paid for it... In fact, it's worth more used than machines with faster processors cost new today.
Add to this the hundreds of dollas I've saved in not needing AV or spyware software and that only 1 of the 11 Mac's my family has owned since 1984 needed anything more than a hard drive replaced, and that was storm damage, not really Apple's fault there. Every mac we have ran for at least 5 years before being replaced, including a Mac Classic we bought in 1988 that STILL works today, an original blue iMac that failed back in March of this year (7-8 years old?) and an ols LC II I got in 1991 that ran until 1997 when I sold it for $400 (yes $400 for a $1200 computer that was 6 years old...)
I applaud Apple for giving $100 in credit to all iPhone adopters. 2 months was a BIT quick, I'll admit, for such a drastic price drop. Honestly, I expected a $100 drop upon the intro of the new iPods as I was expecting the touch to be $100 more expensive than the classic iPod (note to Apple, you set the price too low there, I would have paid $400 for it without blinking) I expected a discount from AT&T of another hundred by mail in rebate in November and doubling that to $200 rebate in January.
Apple will be in trouble shortly as they actually won't be able to move too many iPhones on their own once their exclusive contract ends and other vendors start pushing iPhones with big rebates for big contracts. Sure, if you have a contract and want an iPhone you can just buy one outright for $400 or so, but anyone who is changing service contracts might be able to get one for $100 or $200 for signing up for a contract they needed anyway. Sure, Apple gets the kickback, but at OEM/wholesale pricing, not full price, so their money train will be stopping shorlty.
There is no contest in life for which the unprepared have the advantage.
If it's had dismal sales, then I must be really lucking out, because I've seen more people using iPhones in the past week than I'd have ever imagined. I thought Apple's sales predictions were nuts, ten times too high for something that isn't even really a smartphone *and* required the majority of potential customers to change carriers, but I was totally wrong about that. I'm even getting interested now (not gonna get one until Apple supports a real API* *and* I can get it without changing carriers, though).
* Apple should license PalmOS for it and run it in a sandbox... most PalmOS applications have completely table-driven UI and layout and can be skinned with jello widgets.
Steve Jobs is Egyptian (partially, by descent), and electronics goods are purchased in a new kind of souk.
Consumers haggle over price by using time and patience. If we don't haggle with those tools, we're either truly busy (and the value of our time merits the initial higher cost), or we're treating ourselves to something sweet.
Some of us shouldn't indulge in such treats
People know this (obviously you do) and yet they *still* buy Apple stuff when it first comes out. It's always been this way and you know the fancy Apple thing you just bought is going to be way cheaper later. Some people want it right now and pay the premium. Others choose to wait because they know the price will come down like before. It's the customer's call, don't blame Apple.
this is my sig
Maybe I'm just being cynical, but I'm starting to think that Apple planned this entire thing out. Sure they could have sold the iPhone at this price the entire time. They could have sold it at it's current price from the beginning. The could have even sold it at $100 more than the original price. However, with the maneuver they just pulled, these are the reactions they will get.
Soon to be be iPhone users: Wow, Apple just dropped the iPhone $200. They're such a great company. I'm going to buy one now. It's only $50 more than an iPod.
Current iPhone users: Wow, Steve Jobs is great. He's giving us $100 out of his pocket for being his loyal lap dog. Time to put that in store credit to good use. New iMac, here I come!
They're managed to milk an extra $100 out their die hards and win the loyalty and adorations of pretty much all parties involved. It all seems just a little too perfectly executed to not be preplanned.
That's just a rationalization you cooked up trying to look less like a frigtard. You were not ripped off because you bought an iPhone at a price that, in all honesty, looked like a pretty decent bargain compared to the other crap "smart" phones on the market. iPhone was not priced out of line with comparable phones, and the suck factor was a great deal lower than a Windows Mobile or PalmOS phone. The cool factor for iPhone was so high that iPhone probably could have got you laid. Since you didn't get that done before the price dropped, you felt ripped off. Oh! I didn't score a chick with my iPhone now everybody else is gonna have them too and I won't get my chance! fraktard.
piracy of the OS itself is almost non-existent on Macs
What?
Either you and I live on different planets, or it's a joke and I didn't catch it. I know exactly two types of Mac users:
-those who keep the Mac loaded with whatever OS it came with,
-those who borrow the latest OS from a friend who just bought a new Mac, or leech it off bittorrent.
I've never, ever, seen anyone actually buy a boxed copy of OS X (or 9, or 8, for that matter). I would add that mac users feel "entitled" to the latest copies of the OS since they've usually spent quite a lot on the hardware.
Hello! I'm a disaster waiting to happen!
I was happy with the iphone at 599. I bought mine a month ago. I went to the apple store with my receipt to see if they would do anything. There was a line of people, all to try to get something back. Everyone that I saw that had a receipt got the difference back. I had bought two and got 400 plus tax credited back to my card. No hassle. I ended up walking out with an 80 gig classic ipod for my sons birthday and still had 120 left over.
Like I said. I've never had a problem with the phone. It's been the best smartphone I have ever owned. Yeah, the price drop was kind of sudden and not normal for Apple unless the product was being bumped down because of a new upgraded model. I'm not sure why the store I purchased them from was giving full credit to the people past the normal 14 day period but I will say that quite a few of them bought something before they left.
The magnitude and rapidity of the iPhone price drop is probably not exactly matched in the cell phone industry, but the pattern of rapid and substantial price drops in new cutting edge cell phones (and other electronic gadgets) is quite common. One well-documented example is the Motorola RAZR, which started out with a very high price and was all but unavailable even at that price for months after its release. There was a scalper market for the things in the early *months* because Motorola couldn't make enough of them. For a while people paid something like eight hundred bucks to get one. When the manufacturing ramp up kicked into gear, the price fell, and fell and fell and now they are only a step or two away from giving the things away with a contract. There was no big internet whine-fest when that happened, and the initial price drops were large and rapid. Oh, the list price maybe didn't fall that fast, but people were getting between a hundred and two hundred and fifty dollars in rebates if they bought from Amazon and signed a year contract with the carrier, by the time all the various rebates were added up. It was a big, rapid drop in price.
There is something strange and different going on here, but it's not the rapid price drop, it's the reaction to it.
I think it has something to do with the trade press. Nobody can make any money writing stories about how pissed off Motorola RAZR customers are because they bought it early and the price fell, because nobody really cares about Motorola because they so seldom do anything interesting. They look like a one-hit wonder with the RAZR. Nobody even knows anything about, let alone carries in their pocket, the newer Motorola phones. The SLVR (shortly after the RAZR) and the KRZR (more recent EDGE entry) for example were basically flops, by the standards of the RAZR. Nobody would write stories like this about Motorola dropping RAZR prices:
Poked in the i (which is still linked on their front page).
Apple Slashes iPhone Prices: slaps 1 million idiots
So the trade press is using the John Dvorak model of Apple coverage to generate advertising revenue, and work early iPhone customr up into a lather with righteous indignation for having... I'm still confused by this... bought the coolest phone ever made in the early days before the inevitable and expected price drop?
The interesting question really is whether Apple structured the drop and timing on purpose to exploit the free publicity engine, or if they were caught by surprise.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
Either you and I live on different planets, or it's a joke and I didn't catch it.
Well, which planet do you live on?
/me goes to Apple Store. Buys Apple. Done. Wow! Look at all the time I saved.
It's not just the price drop about which people complain. They don't like the fact that there is no upgrade for the old phones. The new iPhone is much better because it has DTT.*
*Digital Turnip Twaddling (I'm quoting what I think you will agree is an authoritative source.)
(The problem with the old iPhone is not that it was version 1.0. The problem is that Steve Jobs is version 0.9 Beta, after all these years.)
Does anybody know any method I can use to inexpensively buy an iPhone from Europe?
Ebay is filled with overpriced auctions, by people trying to monetize their iPhone unlocking skills. I just want one brand new phone, at Apple store price.
I've also been checking mail forwarding companies like http://www.myus.com/ and http://www.usabox.com/ but they all require you to set up an expensive account that does not pay out for just one gadget.
Does anybody know any other company that does cheap one-time packet forwarding from USA to Europe? Any other hint?
Globalized world my ass.
Yeah, but that $100 iTunes gift card (just to pick something) would still have cost ME $100, whatever their costs.
Secondarily, no one held a gun to our head and forced us to buy anything. Apple made an exceedingly cool product and we weighed the "cool" and utility against $600, made a decision, and bought it. They could just as easily spent millions making a technological flop like the Zune, in which case all of those R&D and marketing costs would have been a total write-off. They gambled and rolled the dice.
You may also notice that they made an Apple iPod HiFi dock... that just disappeared from the store. They made the AppleTV, which isn't exactly blowing off the shelves. In fact, I was just in a store yesterday and saw the new nano. Don't like the form factor, build quality, or the interface. So I'm not getting one, nor recommending them, nor buying them as gifts. Maybe other people will make the same decision and do the same. Maybe not. The point is that people don't buy EVERYTHING Apple makes just because it has their logo on it.
On the flip side, my MacBook Pro is the best notebook I've ever owned. OS X makes other most OS's look like they were designed by brain-dead committees (if that's not redundant). Aperture and Final Cut are some of the best tools on the planet. And if a truck rolled over my iPhone I'd be back in the store in a second buying a new one.
Fan? Yes. But I'm only a fan for as long as they continue to make great products.
Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
What motherboard did you buy (as in the manufacturer and model number?
I don't really think there is a market for used cell phones or for used ipods...
On the contrary, there really is a market for used iPods, or there was a few years ago. I bought a used iPod for my wife's first mp3 player, and I had to be quick to respond to Craigslist ads, because they were going fast. People were selling their previous-generation iPods to get the current version, and plenty of people were happy to take advantage of that opportunity. Beneficial all around. I doubt this has changed terribly much.
It's not just the price drop about which people complain. Those who bought the original iPhone paid $600 for something that after 2 months is completely obsolete. A better iPhone can be bought for $400. Apple customers didn't see that abuse coming.
People don't like the fact that there is no upgrade for the old phones. The new iPhone is much better because it has DTT.*
*Digital Turnip Twaddling (I'm quoting what I think you will agree is an authoritative source.)
(The fundamental problem with the old iPhone is not that it was version 1.0. The problem is that Steve Jobs is version 0.9 Beta, after all these years.)
MOD PARENT UP! That is certainly not an Offtopic comment. If the jokesters attack a Slashdot story in the beginning, that generally ruins any chance of a real discussion. As the parent poster predicted, the jokesters got control, and the rest of the discussion is confused.
I disagree with the parent poster that what Jobs did is "classy", however.
Those who bought the original iPhone paid $600 for something that after 2 months is completely obsolete. A better iPhone can be bought for $400. People don't like the fact that there is no upgrade for the old phones. Apple customers didn't see that abuse coming.
The new iPhone is much better because it has DTT.*
*Digital Turnip Twaddling (I'm quoting what I think you will agree is an authoritative source. Opus threw his obsolete iPhone in the trash.)
The fundamental problem with the iPhones is not that a phone that is two months old is obsolete. The fundamental problem is that Steve Jobs is version 0.9 Beta, after all these years. Now Apply customers fear that if Mr. Jobs did it once, he may do it again. Maybe there will be 3rd version of the iPhone in time for Christmas.
"Now Apply customers fear that if Mr. Jobs did it once, he may do it again. Maybe there will be 3rd version of the iPhone in time for Christmas."
should be
"Now Apple customers fear that if Mr. Jobs did it once, he may do it again. Maybe there will be a 3rd version of the iPhone in time for Christmas."
Note that I upgraded to the new version of my comment without charge.
That was my point. This was a reply to your other post about backing up your facts. Sometimes you are the source (how can you prove that over the internet?) and sometimes the source is a news story you read six months ago, and it would take a long time to find the link.
I bought my iPhone this past weekend (dumb move in retrospect, I should have waited until Wednesday).
.NET/SQL Server development), we upgraded my wife to a 15.4" MBP last month, and they've now "suckered" me into two iPhones.
To do so, I had to break contract with Verizon for two lines, but the total monthly package at AT&BigBrother was the *same* price as my old Verizon package, but had 300 extra minutes, 200 SMS, and the unlimited data on my line (the iPhone). Also spent $100 to hook my wife up with a phone, figuring she would inherit my iPhone when v2 came out.
Today, I walked into the AT&T store, showed my receipt, and got a $200 credit on the iPhone purchase since it was purchased within 14 days. No hassles, and it was a credit directly against my bill, not toward future purchases.
So I turned around, returned the wife's cheapy-phone, and got her one of the last $300 4GB iPhones. Now I'm paying $20 more a month than I was with Verizon (since I had to add the data package for her iPhone).
Apple has, for now, won me over on service and design. After my Mac Pro purchase a year ago (a BIG switch for me, since I used to build my own PCs and my career is
Made my first Keynote '08 presentation last night, in a fraction of the time it would have taken in PPT, and Steve Jobs will have another $200 or so next month when Leopard comes out.
So, I guess that makes me a fan-boy. Anyone wanna buy my old Audiovox XV-6700?
Really?
Interesting I've only known one person who bought an iPod. The CTO at a local e-commerce company. Everybody else seems to still be demanding crackberries.
Yes, because nothing in the iPhone ancestry (that is to say, iPods) would have hinted a reliance on iTunes, now would it have? That was just sprung on you, wasn't it? You poor little victim...
New punctuation update "~" (no quotes) at the end of a line to indicate sarcasm. ~
No, not at all. Pricing is one of the main points Jobs criticized Sculley about later on--Jobs initially wanted to go with a low-price, high-share strategy on the Macintosh. (You might note that Apple since 1997 has maintained that strategy--but this was already after the issue had seemingly already been decided in favor of Windows, leaving Apple with no choice but to stay in a high-margin niche.)
In Repressive Burma, it's not just your connection that dies. slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=314547&cid=20819199
You just don't get that kind of service in the technology industry anywhere else these days that I've experienced.
After closing their video store (which sold DRM'd videos), Google offered a "full refund" in Google Checkout dollars, then got slammed for it. Days later they did the right thing and give full cash refunds.Apple isn't "offering" you $100. They're giving you store credit. That's very nice IMO, but it's $100 in store credit for their own store.
I mean, I bought a Vista OEM copy and an nVidia "Vista Ready" mobo on launch day (it's my job to know how to support *everything*, turd or not). You don't see MS or nVidia offering to make things right because little things like on-board sound and networking don't function... And neither of those companies have any intention of making things right. And that's just driver issues. Any Slashdot reader knowledgable enough to buy OEM software (which obviously doesn't come with free support from Microsoft) should know that neither Microsoft nor NVIDIA (the chipset maker) are responsible for the failings of your motherboard manufacturer (the one who fucked up the sound and networking components). Who made your motherboard? ASUS? Foxconn? ECS?Since OEM software is clearly meant for "system builders," it's up to you (the system builder) to know WTF "Vista Ready" means. NVIDIA's chipset is Vista Ready because, with enough memory and updated chipset drivers, it (the chipset, not the motherboard) can run Vista. Whoever made your flakey motherboard is the one who integrated the sound chip and networking components that weren't Vista Ready (I'm assuming you checked your motherboard manufacturer's support page for updated Vista drivers).
If you bought a motherboard (or system) from a company with a good reputation like Intel (yes, they make motherboards) or Apple, then you wouldn't have driver problems for products they call "Vista Ready."
Let's not even get into Vista quality (utter pile of refuse, kthanxbye). No rebate, no exchange for something that actually functions as described. Not even an option to downgrade to XP from MS.Anyhow, I contrast that experience with something like buying my iPhone, Macbook Pro or any of the dozens of other Apple products I've purchased over the years and there's just no comparison.
Vista works well with non-crap hardware (unlike like your motherboard). Since you don't even know who to blame with your problems, you probably shouldn't have attempted to be a "system builder." You should have just bought a Lenovo ThinkCentre or Dell Optiplex with Vista preinstalled. Or you should have bought an Intel-brand motherboard that's had working Vista drivers for all its components since the early beta versions.Anyhow, I guess you didn't buy Apple products like OS X 10.0 or Aperture 1.0. By your standard for Vista, those Apple products were pure crap. They eventually got better with free updates (OS X 10.1 and Aperture 1.5), but Microsoft has done and will continue to the same with Windows Update and Service Packs (which they also did with Windows 2000 and XP).
BTW, I agree that those complaining about the iPhone price cuts are whiners. The $100 store credit is a very nice gesture, but not unprecedented in the industry like you suggested. Also, like Microsoft, Apple has released crap products. Some were always crap (like many iBooks) and others were initially crap but got free updates. Vista is only crap if you bought crap hardware and will get better with free updates.
I sell all my old iPods and cellphones through online auction sites, and get good money for them. So yes, there really is a market for used cell phones and iPods.
This also allows me to upgrade each of them yearly (or more often, if the mood hits) without getting caught with a nasty bill. I essentially just pay a small upgrade cost (ie the difference between the resale value of the old time and the retail value of the new item). Same goes for my laptops and desktop machines - I auction them off yearly, and end up only paying a small upgrade cost to have a new laptop and desktop every year.
I'm with you both. I bought it for 600$ and enjoyed two months of showing off.
... half a cent per kilobyte cost. Thus two cents per kilobyte is equivalent to paying 9.6 $/minute on a voice call).
On the other hand, the experience that remains disgraceful is that of ATT's international pricing. I made the mistake of taking the phone with me on a trip to Argentina. Five days of basic email (9 megabytes EDGE usage) costed me 190$. At two cents per kilobyte, downloading the front page of the new york times costs 30 bucks, you see. I called to complain and was told that this is their price period.
(Calculation: using a 64 kbps modem, over an international roaming voice line costing 2.4$/minute would give
You bastard!
Anyway, I still have my slightly worn-out but faithful Nokia 1100. If I wanted some of that Multi-Touch goodness, I'll buy iPod touch when it's available here in the Philippines (that's probably sooner than the iPhone, anyway).
Ah, the advantage of living in Southeast Asia, where we get to first watch Americans and Japanese fumble with tons of new gadgets, so we can see which ones truly are worth buying (either the original or the Chinese-made clone :-P) when they finally arrive.
- Francis Ocoma
Please wait while Sig Request is being processed...
Look, Apple's sales targets for the iPhone are insane, you can't take them seriously. Which means that even absolutely staggering success could still leave them far short of the target. I mean "it failed to live up to some of the wilder expectations on Wall Street" is hardly unexpected or crushing news.
Sheesh.
You can lead a fan-boi to water, and you can make him drink.
Cake or Death? Cake Please!
exactly flying off the shelves recently (they sold less in each of the whole months July and August than in the two last days of June), what else could Apple have done than lowering the price, and drastically so?
Obviously, Apple did not expect the turmoil that followed, so they had to do something, quickly. So they chose the vouchers.
Btw, I wonder how long the 4GB iPhones, officially discontinued, will be on special sale "while supplies last" in the U.S. online store? The duration of their availability (starting the day count last Wednesday) will give non-insiders a rough idea how big the inventories have actually been.
By Brian Briggs
http://www.bbspot.com/News/2007/09/jobs-offers-apple-lisa-early-adopters-store-credit.html
Cupertino, CA - Early adopters of the iPhone weren't the only ones receiving in-store credit from Steve Jobs. In an overlooked announcement, Jobs said that early adopters of the Apple Lisa would be receiving a $7000 in-store credit.
Apple released the Lisa in January of 1983 for $9,995, and the similar Macintosh was released a year later for $2,495.
"I've felt bad about people who bought the Lisa for a long time. Anybody who bought one of the first Apple Lisas really got screwed," said Jobs. "Now that we've got some cash, I think it's about time we made it right."
People interested in the refund will need to bring in an original receipt showing they bought the Lisa in 1983 and proof of purchase from the Apple Lisa box. Sales figures from that year show that if all people who bought the computer claim the refund, Apple could be liable for almost $70,000.
Steve Bloughs, who bought a Lisa, said, "When I heard about the iPhone refund, I was furious. The Lisa screw job was much more egregious. I've been waiting over twenty years for Apple to make this right. I'm glad they finally have."
Related News
Apple Stores Begin Charging Entrance Fee
College Professors to be Replaced by Apple iProf
iPhone Hacker Headed to Guantanamo
Analysts think that Jobs could be setting a bad precedent which could cost Apple millions. "What about Newton owners? Apple III owners? This could quickly get out of hand," said industry watcher Devon Scanlon from Goldman Sachs.
Apple representatives said that consumers shouldn't expect a refund every time a product bombs or prices drop. These two cases were the "exception rather than the rule."
Shares of Apple stock were down on the news.
http://appsafari.com/news/1036/100-credit/
I have decided to take this opportunity to help a Windows user finally get a Mac. Normally, none of us have a $100 to give away at random, but Apple gave me $100 for a product that I purchased two months ago. I choose to buy my iPhone the day it came out because I wanted to be apart of it's movement and a promoter of change in the industry. In order for that to happen, people have to support it. If I knew the iPhone would drop $200 two months later, I still would have bought it. Next.
Although I appreciate Apple's generosity, I would rather take the $100 I normally wouldn't have and helping a Windows' user switch to a Mac - someone desperate to get off their PC. I get that most of you think of me foolish to give away my $100 Apple Store Credit - keep it real.
The world needs it and we know it.
Please visit http://www.ryboflavo.com/ for more info!