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Discord Bans Servers That Promote Nazi Ideology (theverge.com)
A popular video game chat service with over 25 million users announced today that it had shut down "a number of accounts" following violence instigated by white supremacists over the weekend. Discord, the service "which lets users chat with voice and text, was being used by proponents of Nazi ideology both before and after the attacks in Charlottesville, Virginia," reports The Verge. "We will continue to take action against Nazi ideology, and all forms of hate," the company said in a tweet. From the report: Discord declined to state how many servers had been affected, but said it included a mix of old accounts and accounts that were created over the weekend. Among the affected servers was one used by AltRight.com, a white nationalist news site. The site's homepage includes a prominent link to a Discord chat which is now broken. The company said it does not read private messages exchanged on its servers. Members of those groups reported messages in the chats for violating Discord's terms of service, the company said, and it took action. "When hatred like this violates our community standards we act swiftly to take servers down and ban individual users," the company said in a statement. "The public server linked to AltRight.com that violated those terms was shut down along with several other public groups and accounts fostering bad actors on Discord. We will continue to be aggressive to ensure that Discord exists for the community we set out to support -- gamers."
They should have checked with some three-letter agencies first. They might have appreciated leaving them up a few days.
Didn't you read the article? They already closed your account.
You are welcome on my lawn.
Here, let me help you with this. It's called False Equivalence: a logical fallacy in which two opposing arguments appear to be logically equivalent when in fact they are not.
[End Of Line]
https://twitter.com/FuxNet/sta... They get banned there too.
White nationalists: we have a clear message of nationalism and family unity.
Internet: nobody cared 70 years ago, and you're about to find out no one cares now.
Good people go to bed earlier.
I'm no fan of these idiots, but any time we start stifling free expression I think we're on dangerous ground. I know Discord is a private company and it's their right to do it. However, I think there's value in letting it go. Let these fools demonstrate what fools they are. At least everyone will know who they are and what they're all about. Censoring them doesn't change their mind it just forces them underground.
I don't believe in karma, I just call it like I see it.
Boy does BeauHD come up a lot in these whiny propaganda heavy threads.
It's frustrating seeing racist assholes of any color using race to breed violence and hate.
It should be this: people who stand against bigotry vs. all bigots, no matter which group an individual bigot is blaming for their failure at life.
Tired of useless bigots blaming their problems on "politically acceptable targets".
Calling every association choice by a private company "virtue signalling" demeans the meaning of the phrase. Virtue signalling goes to intent, and claims about intent should be carefully made.
It strains credulity to think that you made an argument that white nationalists are not violent. If your claim is that the guy who ran a car into people was an outlier, nevermind that it was well documented that other marchers were violent, then where is your nuance when considering left-leaning protesters?
Reality is a slackware box running on a 386 tucked away in god's sock drawer.
https://tox.chat/
Seem like a good option.
https://wiki.mumble.info/wiki/...
Likely safe from "we know better than you" trash-people.
https://wire.com/en/
Maybe?
https://about.riot.im/
Maybe?
http://www.teamspeak.com/en/te...
Guess running your own server removes the issues.
https://ring.cx/
Seem like it could work.
https://www.evolvehq.com/welco...
That's the stuff which came with AMD drivers before? Likely not safe for your freedoms.
https://app.twitch.tv/ .. Anything owned by a company like that I guess want to act like the anti-white globalists and their followers in idiocy want so .. likely not a good option? Unless one already use it and they haven't fucked around yet.
Curse was direct competitor to Discord before. But Twitch
Yeah.
Thankfully some very good peaceful freedom loving men from the middle-east have a list full of ideas what to do in a situation like ours.
that you made an argument that white nationalists are not violent
An insane majority of us aren't.
If we aren't supposed to threat Muslims like genocidal terrorists then white nationalists definitely aren't either.
Now go fuck yourself.
Have you ever met a real Nazi? I have. And they aren't like in the movies. They are by and large likable people who love their country. I would never be a Nazi myself. For one thing, I'm not a joiner. But it is unfair to demonize them. They are just every day work-a-day Joes. Leave them alone.
Yes, they're people. We don't have to hate them to hold them accountable for what they support. We don't have to give them protection from being removed from a private company's service, either.
Reality is a slackware box running on a 386 tucked away in god's sock drawer.
I thought the politically correct phrase was "economic anxiety"? ;-)
You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
If you believe in Net Neutrality, should this also include 1st Amendment protections for content that is legal but offensive?
I'm not sure if we want to add ISPs to the (relatively small) list of entities where the First Amendment is explicitly applied. On the other hand, I'm afraid of the consequences if internet companies have unlimited rights (subject to other existing laws) to decide what content is and is not made available on the internet.
(Do Telephone Companies have to right to refuse telephone service, and utilities the right to refuse power, water, etc? I don't know!)
It takes a few brain cells and an apt-get install to get an IRC server up and running.
Or just use one of the dozens already out there.
Be very careful about censoring speech and shutting off outlets for people to vent legally and peacefully. JFK might have said it best:
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
Yes, yes, we get it. Everyone who disagrees with your viewpoint is a nazi. Now go play with your toys and let the rest of us discuss the issues rationally.
More important than doing the right thing, which is to ignore them.
What's wrong with the world today, in a nutshell.
HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
An insane majority of us aren't.
Sure, an insane majority of you aren't. Plenty of you are, by implication. The post I was responding to, in case you may have missed it, was implying the white nationalists were not violent and the leftists were. I was asking, where's the nuance. I think you also demonstrated that you can't appreciate the nuance. In essence, you implied agreement with me while misunderstanding what I was saying.
Now go fuck yourself.
Reality is a slackware box running on a 386 tucked away in god's sock drawer.
There's an elephant in the room that no one's talking about.
"Unite the right" was not afforded the protection of law during their rally.
Furthermore, law enforcement purposely directed the rally-goers into the antifa crowd, putting them in significant danger.
The Antifa crowd was flinging urine, poop, and one ralley-goer suffered permanent eye damage from having acid (!) thrown at him. The police were widely observed as doing nothing to stop the fighting.
Think about this for a minute: The government withdrew the protection of law from a group based on their political ideals. The state governor and the mayor simply decided not to enforce the law for an ideology they don't like.
This is a profoundly scary thought - that a political faction within the government can simply decide not to enforce the law in order to promote their narrative.
I'm going to have to side with the ACLU on this one. Hate speech is protected speech, and UniteTheRight should have been allowed to peaceably assemble.
A service named Discord is banning people who are causing discord? They need to rename their service.
Yeah, because when I think of peaceful revolutions, I think of the Nazis. It's not like they silenced dissent when they were in power, or that their entire ideology is based on the genocide of anyone deemed genetically inferior?
Does it still count as a peaceful revolution if you plan to commit terrible violence after you're in power?
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
The situation is degenerating into mob justice now:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-intersect/wp/2017/08/14/a-twitter-campaign-is-outing-people-who-marched-with-white-nationalists-in-charlottesville
Everyone is focusing on the people who were the victims of violence and ignoring things like the two police officers who the violent left got killed.
So you claim. Anything to back that up? How were they killed by the left?
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
Wouldn't trust a word from that SJW corporatist site.
...says the person desperately trying to equate antifa and BLM.
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Much in the same way the Taliban destroyed statues if the Buddha, destruction of history should always be opposed, or should we tear down mt Rushmore?
You can tell by the police response - the police generally left the Unite the Right protestors alone and only had to deal with the violent so-called "antifa" fascists who were there to cause trouble.
Yet are we seeing antifa websites taken down and Black Lives Matter servers shut down? No. No we are not.
You would see them taken down if members started driving cars into crowds of people.
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
Much in the same way the Taliban destroyed statues if the Buddha, destruction of history should always be opposed, or should we tear down mt Rushmore?
No, not like that at all. They don't want to destroy the statue of Robert E. Lee, they just want to put it somewhere else, e.g., in a museum.
If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
Well you can't ask Chavez so maybe send a telegram to Maduro. See what he has to say.
An insane majority of us aren't.
So you condemn the violence that occurred, right? Because that's the problem in the Muslim world (I'm an ex-Muslim atheist, FYI).
Even reasonable, or secular, Muslims are often apologist towards violence or terrorism because a part of them feels it's justified by historical events (Western foreign policy, propping up dictators, toppling legitimate democratic governments, etc.). I have often told my Muslim friends that it was predominantly white Christians who fought and died to defeat the Nazi's, and so it must be Muslims who must unite to defeat Islamic Terrorism. The problem is internal to the group, so the group must fix it.
Muslim terrorists are terrorists. White nationalist terrorists are terrorists. Can we agree on that?
You describe yourself as a "white nationalist", and I'm not going to read into that in any way, it's just a label. All I'm asking is that if you are truly not violent, then don't turn a blind eye to those on "your side" who are.
Like with Islam, you may quickly find that if this minority becomes large enough (which can still be very small) it will usurp your movement, and you will find it very difficult to separate yourself from them. Similar to the secular/moderate Muslims, you may find your legitimate concerns or grievances being constantly overshadowed, and you will be unable to gain any real traction in achieving the change you want.
And, again paralleling Islamic Radicalization, you may find that you are their first target. The people who primarily suffer from Islamic Terrorism are other Muslims. I guarantee ISIS hates me more than they hate you, because I am an apostate. The first thing radicals do is eliminate the moderates within their own group.
Tread carefully, my fellow American. I mean that in all sincerity.
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
As opposed to what? the non white non male discontent of blm and antifa that's allowed to get away with violence?
You know those aren't just movies, right?
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
Except they kinda are.
On the left you have a fringe group that want to actually exterminate all whites and a bigger group that cheers for "the whites not being a majority anymore" and do things to speed up the process.
While on the right, you have a fringe group that want to exterminate the blacks and jews and a bigger group that cheer for expelling the immigrants etc..
I'm sure you'd be singing a different tune if a service dropped a BLM or antifa channel.
Hilarious, it is left wing racists that have murdered far more people in the last 40 years, destroyed property, glorify living like a savage.
Do you just have a feeling that should be true because it fits neatly into your world view or do you have any type of evidence?
It is virtue signaling. If corporate execs cared about the bottom line, they'd be as a-political as possible. The public line would be "We love people who love our products."
Irrational belief often leads to violence, especially when other expression is suppressed. White nationalists/KKK are no different than BLM or antifa. They each have self-interested, identity driven agendas and try to claim the moral high ground, the former based on a claim of supremacy, the latter under the guise of equality. Idiocy all around.
"The goal of all of this nonsense is to create FUD in the populace and divide the nation"
Says the fucking Russian troll. Fuck off.
I don't respond to AC's.
Then the worthless fucking neo-nazi pieces of shit should be loving it.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
I don't approve of either the Scalise shooter's ideological faction or the Charlotteville driver's faction but I don't remember this guilt by association purge being enacted all the times leftwing violence was committed.
Hate to tell you this, dipshit, but ISIS is as conservative as they come.... probably even more-so than the evangelicals here in the US. It's not religion that's the problem so much as it's the fucking authoritarian bent conservatives who take charge of it.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
you're funny, you're blind to what is going on right under your nose on in the news.
Ahh, you're one of the stupid cunts who thinks fascism and socialism are the same. Does it hurt to go through life so fucking stupid?
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
If you agree with the NAZI propaganda, like you obviously do, YOU are a fucking NAZI.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
I'm not sure I understand your point? There are other dictators who aren't Nazi's therefore...? Profit?
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
I am not arguing that there was no left wing terrorism, but in the modern context your statement is either vacuous or incorrect. The violence you are talking about was a generation ago, entirely different groups with different causes in a different political landscape. If you want to count 40 years back, we could include Timothy McVeigh on the right-wing side and he alone would outweigh all the deaths on the left. But I don't because, again, that was a different political climate.
Today, you are just being ignorant or stubborn if you honestly believe that there is more violence from the left than the right. I am not saying there is no violence, so don't throw that straw man at me, but to claim that the left is equal to the right (let alone vastly outweighs as you say) is just wrong.
People like you, who lie apparently at every chance they get, are part of the problem. Muslims routinely condemn the violence done in their name, it's just doesn't show up on the likes of fauxnews and drudge because it doesn't fit the stupider-than-fuck narrative that you've posted here. It's fringe groups that commit the violence, just as with groups here in the US. The problem here is, the rightwing has been radicalized the past 30+ years so that those fringe groups now feel that they're acceptable enough to come out in the open. Look around, pull your head out of your ass if need be... but quit being a lying little parrot.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
Much in the same way the Taliban destroyed statues if the Buddha, destruction of history should always be opposed, or should we tear down mt Rushmore?
No, not like that at all. They don't want to destroy the statue of Robert E. Lee, they just want to put it somewhere else, e.g., in a museum.
Really? I guess that's why they broke off a chunk of it and spray painted it red?
Those are the same thing, and they're all worthless pieces of shit.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
virtue signaling is when someone is trying to make sure his comrades know he doesn't agree with the politically incorrect position. He's not necessarily interested in actually making a point one way or the other or achieving anything relevant.
Virtue signalling is when you are JK Rowling or George Clooney, and say that people and governments need to do more to help refugees. This becomes virtue signalling when you do absolutely nothing to help any single refugee personally - especially when you have multiple residences and ample resources that could easily house a good number of refugees - but you choose not to.
READY.
PRINT ""+-0
Just lump them under 'authoritarian' and leave it at that.
There is condemnation, for sure. And sometimes the media is not quick enough to report on it. And I am also happy to have seen more and more Muslims taking direct action recently. It pains me very much to watch my culture and my history be maligned and vilified, and I do not take this position lightly.
I am not lying, there are many secular/moderate Muslims who are the way I describe. Some are within my own family, who are highly educated (often in Western countries), and highly secular. They call themselves Muslims, they participate in Ramadan (generally), but they drink alcohol, don't pray 5 times a day (or even at all), and generally are like most Christians in the west. Like me, if they actually thought about it, they would probably become atheists.
Often they will make arguments along the lines of "The US invasion of Iraq was an act of terrorism, and that was much worse than ." Again, very similar to the right pointing the finger at BLM or whoever in response to what happened in Charlotte. It's not that they are right or wrong, but rather that it doesn't matter. You can't deflect from your problems by pointing out others' problems.
The War in Iraq was wrong. 9/11 was wrong. What happened in Charlotte was wrong. Period. Moderates on all sides must condemn violence in all forms, without hesitation and without caveat.
Many people are familiar with the Bill Maher/Ben Affleck/Richard Dawkins argument on radical Islam. After that episode aired, I showed it to my very devout (but completely OK with my apostasy :D) friend, Mohamed. He is like a brother to me. At the end of the argument, the comparison was made between fundamentalist Christianity and Islam. Bill Maher said (paraphrasing) "One is herpes, and the other is cancer." That is a very strong statement, and my initial reaction was to take offense, even as an atheist.
After that, Mo and I discussed the issue at length. It was very heated, although we weren't arguing against each other, per-se. At the end, he looked at me, his eyes misty, and said "I'm mad. But I'm mad because they are right."
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
Here, let me help you with this. It's called False Equivalence: a logical fallacy in which two opposing arguments appear to be logically equivalent when in fact they are not.
For those of us above the left-right divide, the equivalence isn't remotely false. The "antifa" idiots have done far more damage than right-wingers in the last 7 months. Take a look at Berkeley when Milo was going to speak, for instance. Did anyone talk about taking down their servers because of violence?
I hate fascists - whether they're on the right or "antifa". When there's a boot on your neck you don't really care who it's attached to.
Do you have ESP?
I am aware. Are you aware that those bombings were almost entirely without casualties? One right-wing terrorist, Timothy McVeigh, killed 20x more people than all those bombings combined. Having said that, what do the 1970s have to do with what is happening here, today? This is a whole different generation, with different groups and different motivations.
Really? I guess that's why they broke off a chunk of it and spray painted it red?
Sorry, are you saying the Charlottesville city council did that? That would be a huge story if true.
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https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DD...
You are welcome on my lawn.
Am I? I saw the news when Jeremy Joseph Christian stabbed two people on a train saying he was a patriot. I saw when Alexandre Bissonnette killed six people in a mosque. And when Dylann Roof killed nine people in a church while they were praying. When James Harris Jackson killed a black man on the street because he was afraid that interracial relationships were destroying the white race. When Adam Purinton killed two Indian men in a bar because he mistook them for Iranians. Just fuck right off if you really think that violence is all on the side of the left.
On the left you have a fringe group that want to actually exterminate all whites [...]
Not saying you're wrong, there's plenty of nutcase to go around, but which group is that? I don't believe I've heard of it.
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The "antifa" idiots have done far more damage than right-wingers in the last 7 months. Take a look at Berkeley when Milo was going to speak, for instance. Did anyone talk about taking down their servers because of violence?
How many people have antifa killed? And how many have right-wing terrorists killed? Okay, now tell me more about servers and cancelled lectures.
What does "BLM member" mean in this context? Did he go to any meetings? Attend any rallies?
I honestly don't know, that's why I'm asking.
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do you have a source that is a reputable news organization for that?
Which part? The ACLU just confirmed that the police were told to stand down, and the permanent eye damage thing comes directly from the victim.
What was lies exactly? Here I will copy paste right-wing terrorist attacks from the last year that I wrote on another comment:
I saw the news when Jeremy Joseph Christian stabbed two people on a train saying he was a patriot. I saw when Alexandre Bissonnette killed six people in a mosque. And when Dylann Roof killed nine people in a church while they were praying. When James Harris Jackson killed a black man on the street because he was afraid that interracial relationships were destroying the white race. When Adam Purinton killed two Indian men in a bar because he mistook them for Iranians. Just fuck right off if you really think that violence is all on the side of the left.
Are you really trying to imply that a private company that chooses not to allow people they don't like to use their servers is in any way like fascism? Really?
Karma: Terrifying (mostly affected by atrocities you've committed)
Clever white males take all the money and jobs. Stupid white males blame it on the blacks, Mexicans, Asians, Muslims, women, transsexuals, etc, basically anyone but the real cause. Some clever white males have taken on the job of stirring up the stupid white males for their own ends.
Ok and Timothy McVeigh killed 170, injured 700. What do you have the compares to that? I don't even give a flying shit about numbers anyway, I am not defending any of the groups you listed. If they committed violence then I denounce them. I am just fucking flabbergasted that you, and so many other people here, are defending literal nazis. I am not afraid to denounce left-wing terrorists, but you apparently cannot denounce actual, self-proclaimed nazis. What the fuck is wrong with you?
Maybe it's more like not putting up a statue of Erwin Rommel in a Jewish neighborhood? You know, Lee didn't just fight on the losing side, he fought to enslave the ancestors of people who walk past that statue every day.
You mean after the Nazis ran protestors over, the remaining people who were still alive were a little pissed? My goodness.
Maybe you ought to work on your analogies.
I don't give a fuuuuuuck because I am not defending Stalin or Mao. You are defending nazis, which is the whole point here.
Do you have some evidence that the shooter was involved with Antifa or BLM? You know, perhaps a video of him marching with them in their uniform?
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
Eh, they have a premium service that charges a few bucks a month but most people don't use it since it doesn't really offer much in terms of extra features.
I happen to enjoy it because it brings my VOIP and chat (which is just IRC with some extra front-end features) into one app. If it goes away, I can always go back to the mumble/IRC combo that I used before.
Never underestimate the stupidity inherent in all human beings.
The Nazi's rose to power in large part because the German people were disenfranchised and, yes, oppressed, by the Allied powers following WWI. Suppression doesn't eliminate hatred, it fosters and nurtures it. It's not that I think this ideology should be broadcast to the world, but all these kinds of bans do is fuel the narrative that these Nazi's aren't really evil, and are simply being misrepresented and prevented from speaking their piece. This is outright censorship, government enforced or not (and members of the government did try to enforce it), and censorship never works, and never has, and never will.
Yeah, because when I think of peaceful revolutions, I think of the Nazis.
Well, they did rise to power peacefully, and might even have remained so had they not been so focused on the whole "genocide" thing. That's in sharp contrast to something like Communism, which is openly endorses (and, often, requires) violence, yet strangely is still widely accepted, or at least tolerated... I suspect in large part because it was so strongly suppressed in the US (and many other western countries) that most people never came to understand what it really stands for.
"None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
corporate censorship is government censorship...
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
Wow, if you're going to go off against "racist assholes" you might really want to attack countries like Japan, China, Indonesia, India - wait... - most countries of the world in fact which are ethnically homogeneous (and want to remain that way).
No one would even know Discord was being used in such a way unless they opened their mouths like this.
HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
The difference is, supporters of neo-Nazi groups are really few, while a good part of leftist public figures (politicians like Sanders, CEOs like Zuckerberg, etc) support BLM.
Thus, this time it's the left that's the bigger problem in the US. I dread the next time the pendulum swings...
In the meanwhile, Poland, Hungary, Turkey have far-right in power.
The creatures outside looked from Alt-Right to Antifa; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
It's not an organized group exactly, but part of the BLM etc..
No, it proves you can make a strawman argument, and stick by it for a hundred words or so.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
Wow, if you think that Hitler's rise to power was peaceful, you need to seriously take a refresher in history. Ever heard of the brown shirts? Or the burning of the Reichstag?
Also, Communism is 'widely' accepted and tolerated? Where? Even in China they're Communist in name only.
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
I want to add to my other comment that I am not detracting from your point about post WWI and the Treaty of Versailles, which absolutely gave Hitler a fertile ground to fuel his rhetoric.
Woodrow Wilson did predict exactly what happened, and it's why the US never joined the League of Nations.
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
That's the point the radical conservatives in this country don't get. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all came from the same religion to start with, and share a very large portion of their beliefs and teachings. Christianity and Islam have the addition of having their messiah return already, as apparently the Jewish messiah ain't quite got here yet. Thing is, the beliefs of conservative evangelicals in the US are more strongly based in the old testament than the new, and in many of the evangelical churches a lot of what they teach is exactly opposite of what Jesus taught.
I would have modded you up if i had the chance, because your question hits at the crux of many of the problems we're facing.... but you knew that already.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
It's hard out there for "white male discontent".
I'd say free speech is taking quite a beating.
Hard fascism and hard socialism are not the same, but both are authoritarian. This puts them in the lower part of a Nolan chart, the upper part of a Pace News chart, or the right side of a Pournelle chart.
No. Free speech is fine. It's Nazis that are taking a beating.
https://68.media.tumblr.com/84...
You are welcome on my lawn.
The parable of the sheep and the goat is the epitome of Christianity:
‘Come, blessed of my Father, inherit the Kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world; for I was hungry, and you gave me food to eat. I was thirsty, and you gave me drink. I was a stranger, and you took me in. I was naked, and you clothed me. I was sick, and you visited me. I was in prison, and you came to me.’
“Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry, and feed you; or thirsty, and give you a drink? When did we see you as a stranger, and take you in; or naked, and clothe you? When did we see you sick, or in prison, and come to you?’
“The King will answer them, ‘Most certainly I tell you, because you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’
And what do we get from conservative churches here in the states: homosexuality is bad, abortion is murder.
And lets be clear about that.... the bible calls homosexuality an abomination.... along with idolatry (you know, that cross you see people wearing, or the image of Mohamed), eating seafood that lacks fins or scales (oysters, clams, scallops, lobsert... which i'm ok with lobster being called an abomination, i can't stand it myself), or eating insects, or eating birds of prey (the bald eagles thank you, by the way), dishonesty (i'm all for that, but it seems to be an abomination that a LOT of people embrace), eating unclean food (like...bacon.....), adultery (you know, like getting a divorce and remarrying.... like over half the people in this country, with a higher percentage of divorces occurring in states that vote conservative....), oppressing the poor and needy (check out the republican political platform), a sower of discord (.... seriously, Proverbs 6:19), justifying the wicked, touching pig leather (there goes my fucking billfold).... and the list goes on and on.
Now, as for abortion, you'll notice one thing that DIDN'T make the abomination list; abortion doesn't show up in there, and abortion (through chemicals... herbal) was a known thing back then, and the only time it's mentioned in the Bible is when it is specifically said it MUST be carried out whenever the father demands it. In Jesus's time, in the land where Jesus would have been born, grew up, and one would have to think, learn a few things..... the Roman Empire was law of the land. And guess what they did..... lots of herbal abortions. It was such a common practice that they LITERALLY drove the herb they used into extinction. Yet, let me quote what Jesus had to say about the practice:
.....
But, those are the two things conservative churches teach... anti-homosexual, and anti-abortion..... not anything that Jesus actually taught (they do give lip service to some of them, but then they turn to their false prophets to pack the house, apparently). So there are things within religions that are good and moral, but once hatred and fear take over, it pretty much turns to shit.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
I happen to enjoy it because it brings my VOIP and chat (which is just IRC with some extra front-end features) into one app.
But how much RAM does this "one app" use while running in the background, compared to an IRC client like HexChat? Some PCs are still being sold with only 2 GB, particularly compact laptops. As I understand it, Discord is like recent versions of Skype: an Electron app that uses over 300 MB because it's running inside a copy of Chromium.
It's not like they silenced dissent when they were in power, or that their entire ideology is based on the genocide of anyone deemed genetically inferior?
Does it still count as a peaceful revolution if you plan to commit terrible violence after you're in power?
If we are basing this on violence done in the name of revolutions , the communists and socialists have everyone else beat hands down. So using your logic they need to be shut down, their groups outlawed and demonstrations broken up.
You willing to call for outlawing socialists and communists ?
You willing to call for outlawing socialists and communists ?
I wasn't aware that Discord wrote the laws. This changes everything!
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
Ah! Clearly I misunderstood!
I was under the impression that people were saying things they wanted to say (free speech) and other people were stifling that speech by removing / hiding / disappearing it.
So you're saying that free speech isn't being stifled and something is being done to the Nazis themselves?
Strange how I missed that part.
Oh come on, that's not fair. Never once did I mention that I support Communists, Socialists, or a law banning either them or Nazis. And yet, because I point out that the Nazi's did not rise to power peacefully, you accuse me of exactly that.
I'm sorry, but if you're going to paint my position in an extreme light with absolutely no basis, then I am not going to take you seriously.
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
Definitely more left wing political violence in the last 2 years that are directly tied to left wing political organizations.
No, it proves you can make a strawman argument, and stick by it for a hundred words or so.
> "You're Using a Strawman Argument"
> "Literally everyone to the right of Stalin is a Nazi."
Well ok.
I think I would be reconsidering my affiliation with "white national"ism if I had a problem with what happened. You don't protest dressed up as Nazis (or the president while chanting Nazi slogans!) If you're peaceful. At a minimum, the ideas of Nazi Germany and how it ended up at the Holocaust and WW2 are a very clear warning. It is not a peaceful movement. Only now there is no longer any pretence
Oh come on, that's not fair. Never once did I mention that I support Communists, Socialists, or a law banning either them or Nazis
Pardon weren't you the one who took the position it was OK to silence the NAZIs because of perceived potential danger ?
Be very careful about censoring speech and shutting off outlets for people to vent legally and peacefully. JFK might have said it best:
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
Yeah, because when I think of peaceful revolutions, I think of the Nazis. It's not like they silenced dissent when they were in power, or that their entire ideology is based on the genocide of anyone deemed genetically inferior?
Does it still count as a peaceful revolution if you plan to commit terrible violence after you're in power?
I mean that was you.
Now you want to argue that DISCORD is a business and can enforce its TOS anyway it sees fit, I am really fine with that. But you need to realize that cuts both ways and if it doesn't cut both ways people will support whoever promises to give them the knife.
"Sub ethnicities" = variations within one ethnic group = same primary ethnic group
You didn't invalidate my point.
Pardon weren't you the one who took the position it was OK to silence the NAZIs because of perceived potential danger ?
No, and that isn't what I said in what you quoted. I guess if you squinted your eyes a bunch you could infer that, but then your inference is wrong.
My point was really that if someone supports the Nazi ideology, then they cannot claim to want a peaceful revolution, by definition. Part of the Nazi ideology is to inflict violence and terror on those deemed inferior, whether by forced deportation or outright genocide.
I also absolutely did not mention Communists or Socialists, or say anything in support of either. Yet conveniently your latest reply ignored that detail, which you completely pulled out of your ass in order to, again, paint me in an extremist light that was not warranted.
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
Erm yes, that's literally the definition of NAZISM - it was also the exact same arguments Shitler made.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Tolerance is a peace treaty, it only works when all sides accept a live-and-let-live attitude. NAZIs literally define themselves by their unwillingness to let others live (here). They won't abide by the treaty, so they don't get protection under it.
And since, historically, their tactics have been murderous - punching them in the face is a very restrained response.
When somebody wants you dead and you ONLY punch him in the face, I admire your peaceloving nature.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
A problem for the AltRight movement is that it's been infiltrated by actual Neo-Nazis. I think it's similar to the problem GamerGate had, in which their message got mixed in with sexist and harassing behavior of women who posted their feminist-slanted treaties on videogames and culture. Those treaties were, in my opinion, at best pondered as an interesting discussion point, and at worst simply ignored. Whatever sort of "ethics in journalism" message GamerGate had was far overshadowed by those who used the GG moniker to commit sexist acts.
The left *tried* to poison the image of the Tea Party movement, but only partially succeeded, because the movement was more about tax reform than overly ideological (hence, the name), and most of the members were reasonably well behaved. So, "Tea Party" is really only vilified by the left - but then again, so are normal conservatives and Republicans in general, I suppose. But here, we have actual, avowed white supremacists associating with and endorsing the movement. I don't see how anyone can view that movement as anything but fatally poisoned.
BTW, I self-identify as a generally right-leaning, conservative Republican with a sprinkling of liberal or libertarian views on some topics. So, I hope you don't dismiss this as someone who actually disagrees with many of your core concerns. But I'll be damned if I ever get anywhere near the "AltRight" moniker myself.
Irony: Agile development has too much intertia to be abandoned now.
Do these website banning the alt right accounts not realize that no one has been convicted, yet? US has now had a long history of neo nazi and clan marches with nothing more than elevated rhetoric. Yet when ANTIFA shows up, violence ensues. Do they not understand that banning these groups could constitute defamation? The only person charged, so far, might win a self-defense case. The police did refuse (not fail, but refuse) to protect the alt right rally from the ANTIFA. If this guy can prove that he felt the people he came to rally with were under threat of physical violence because police actively looked the other way, it's gonna be hard to convict him for murder or anything else. The police was already there and they didn't even separate the 2 opposing sides.
So Japan must really be off the scale Nazi then? What about China? What about Indonesia or in fact most other countries in the world which are ethnically monolithic and wish to remain that way?
We have been trying to warn you about the actual Nazis who are in your midst, but you keep having little fits of rage like that one.
It's in your own interest to acknowledge this problem and try to deal with it. This rally and the violence from the literal Nazis who where there has damaged both the alt-right and Trump. Is that what you want?
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
The Nazis in the 1930s claimed not to be about Nazi ideology, just defending their people and opposing immigration and all that stuff that Spencer is now saying. That's how they work, pretending to be socialist until they get into power.
Don't fall for it. Again.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
So basically what you're saying is that because there happen to be some people - not mainstream people nor leaders - who call themselves AltRight and are neo-nazis, that irrevocably invalidates the AltRight?
In any grouping of people there will always be things like that to occur. That doesn't invalidate the group and it doesn't invalidate what prominent members/leaders of the group state.
The Wikipedia page of Richard Spencer and others is almost a complete lie, based on extensive direct statements he has made many times.
The bottom line is the AltRight is being deliberately maligned.
Perhaps it would help if the alt right were to clearly condemn and denounce the violence perpetrated by actual Nazis?
To be honest, I never suspected that the alt-right were as extreme as they have demonstrated themselves to be. Cowardly, whining arseholes, yes. But the number of posts from alt right I've read over the last few days, justifying the murder of someone whose only crime was to stand up to Nazis (a stance that we used to be PROUD of) has made me change my mind.
AltReich is great replacement for alt-right as they seem to support Hitler and his flag
"The hands that help are better far than lips that pray." - Robert Ingersoll (1833-1899)
shame you got modded down on that as its correct
"The hands that help are better far than lips that pray." - Robert Ingersoll (1833-1899)
And since, historically, their tactics have been murderous - punching them in the face is a very restrained response.
Well, historically members of my clan waged war on the English. Punching me in the face is not a restrained fucking response.
How about you learn how to manage a difference of opinion without initiating violence.
It is still censorship if you stop them from saying it. I do not support right wing nut jobs but I totally support free speech. Just as I am free to say that they are morons they are free to say all the moronic crap they like.
I love stacking my barbecues in the shed at the end of summer - you can't beat a bit of grill on grill action.
I agree. I am simply responding to the poster who tried to deflect from the original point by saying that violence all comes from the left.
If there were nazis that marched but didn't actually commit any violence, should they be denounced?
Yes. Because they are FUCKING NAZIS.
He shouted, "that's what liberalism gets you" as he stabbed a guy in the neck.
Well, they did rise to power peacefully, and might even have remained so had they not been so focused on the whole "genocide" thing.
Yep, except for a never ending string of violent rallies, attacks on the government, special powers introduced to defend pro-nazi functions from dissidence, and the arson attack on parliament with a few people sentenced to death here and there. Other than those *minor* details the nazis were perfectly lovely people until they gassed Jews.
Take a history lesson and also apply a bit of logic. When in history has a disenfranchised nation peacefully handed over absolute power to a government.
First off, I don't know who the fuck you are because you post AC, so I can't separate your comments from the dozens of other cowards on here. I'm just going to respond in general. If your first thought in this discussion, as many have posted here and what started this whole thread, is, "yeah but what about left-wing extremists?" you are deflecting from the discussion. This article is not about left-wing extremists. If you are deflecting away from the discussion of these nazi extremists, then you are defending them. If you are not defending them then just stfu for a bit.
Well, that's gone and educated me a little. Although I instinctively reject charts that try and label politics as left or right because individuals invariably get stereotyped by a crude placement on the chart, disregarding their actual views or behaviour towards any specific policy or issue.
The Pournelle chart at least avoids that left/right divide but will suffer the same stereotype issues. I think the rationality axis could be better named too; while it offers an interesting mechanism to differentiate political creeds, describing some as rational and others as irrational works against objective evaluation and exploration.
In particular writing off extremist views as irrational is a barrier to understanding and countering those views.
But all three charts only work at the macro level. Individual communists still have a sense of personal ownership of belongings, anarchists form power structures, white supremacists can believe in the welfare state. Where is the chart that acknowledges this individuality and supports exploration of the issues and not the identities?
The acts of last weekend have the same relevance as those of 1642: if someone didn't physically attack you then you have no legal or moral grounds to assault them.
That's called civilisation, consider giving it a go.
Instead you throw around labels then insist that violence is acceptable based on those labels. Hope nobody labels you.
It's an issue of perception among the general population. Whether it's spread by misinformation is completely irrelevant. What people actually believe is, and we've provided beautiful ammunition for that. Sorry if that smacks of realpolick rather than ideological purity.
Think of the swastika symbol as an example, which is ironically appropo, given the circumstances. The swastika was a symbol of peace and good fortune for thousands of years before the Nazis appropriated it. Do you think that any amount of effort could transform it back into it's original meaning, at least in western / European countries? There have been a few who have tried, like a company that tried to rebrand it in its original intent. All efforts have been shut down due to public pressure. Even the Japanese government, in preparation for the upcoming Olympics, has decreed that swastikas shouldn't appear on maps printed for the benefit of tourists (they typically depict Buddhist temples, I believe). They recognize the reality of our entrenched perception of that symbol as a mark of hatred, bigotry, and evil.
To me, it's a matter of choosing your battles appropriately and wisely. After the past few days, I think the battle of AltRight's public perception has seen a tipping point, and I'm just not sure there's any coming back from it. The "truth", as you claim, is fine and good, but the point of politics is to effect change. You won't do that if the majority of the country believes that AltRight is associated with the white supremacist movement, as you won't get them to listen beyond their initial pre-conceptions. Conservatives have a hard enough time courting minorities to our side without an infusing of KKK members.
The movement doesn't have to die - at least the non-racist parts of it. But I think it's probably ripe for a re-branding. I just don't believe the "AltRight" brand is worth as much as it appears to be costing us.
Irony: Agile development has too much intertia to be abandoned now.
I'm not labeling people. I'm labeling an idea. People choose to adopt an idea and can choose to abandon it again.
But they cannot choose the things that idea labels them on. They cannot choose their color or their country of birth.
That makes using such labels evil by default with no possible redeeming value. But labeling ideas is inherently good and fighting evil ideas is called heroism.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Those who wear the flags of genocide and treason are busy threatening your life personally and inciting others to harm you as well.
Any action against anybody wearing those flags is self defense because the flags themselves are a declaration of war upon you
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Assaulting people because they have different ideas to you is an evil idea.
Be a hero, punch yourself, you bigoted ignorant twat.
You can't win a debate with the willfully ignorant. I do wish you luck, however.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
Consider this scenario. You are sitting quietly in a pub minding your own business. Suddenly a big burly drunkard gets up, starts approaching you declaring loudly his intention to beat you to death.
It's clear he means it. But thanks to his drunkenness you see a moment where you can get a first swing in. Do you take that opportunity?
Or do you wait for him to throw the first punch not knowing if you will still be able to fight back after it connects?
Me - I throw that first punch and I do not stop until he doesn't get up.
And no judge or jury would convict me because I defended myself against a credible threat.
This is no different. Wearing the swastika or the fasces or the KKK cloak is a credible announcement of your intention to murder me. By making that announcement you give me the right to pre-emptive lyrics defend myself. And there is no other credible meaning I should be expected to infer from it beyond your announcing your intention to murder me.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Good luck with the inevitable court hearing.
The guy who punched Richard Spencer in January has not been charged. Not a single counterprotestor or antifa was charged on Saturday. Only the NAZI terrorist who killed someone was charged. The cops won't even arrest me because they know no jury would ever convict me.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Well, there is that. Deny justice to a large and well armed group, good luck recovering in hospital.
They are not denied justice. They are the guilty party.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Right... But wearing a fucking swastika is not, in your book, evidence of hate? You are a profoundly disturbed individual.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
In and of itself? No.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/417...
I may or may not be profoundly disturbed. I'm also aware of the meaning of justice, and prejudging someone's guilt and imposing a penalty based purely on their clothing is not justice.
"Nazi ideology"? Use of that term is a joke.
If only.
The AltRight is not about Nazi ideology.
Yes, it is.
Spencer has addressed the topic at length for anyone who actually cares, which clearly most don't since they just want to spew shit against any movement that unites the interests of native European peoples.
His arguments are bullshit, a transparent attempt at thinly disguising Nazi ideology among people who have not already bought into it, as you have.
Basically anyone who doesn't support open borders, unlimited immigration, and ethnic replacement = Nazi.
If you buy into the ridiculous conspiracy theory that anyone is "replacing" your ethnicity, then yes, you're on the path to Nazi ideology. All else is window dressing and implementation detail, because they've already caught you in the Big Lie. If you aren't a monster yet, you're a dupe. Turn back.
A bunch of angry people with fasces and swastikas shouting "blood and soil" oh and killing people and I'm supposed to, what, assume they are there for a fucking kumbaya singing and a drum circle?
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Ah yes, the "but mommy, he's doing it" defence.
"Old man yells at systemd"
https://newrepublic.com/articl...
Look who you are defending. You seriously think those guys give a fuck about anybody else's rights? Do you see any reason to doubt their violent intentions? Because I do not. This is not a bad taste outfit at a fancy dress party. This is a bunch of rampaging white supremacists on a warpath.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Strange, you seem to think I'm defending someone. I'm not. I'm pointing out how irrational, illogical, illegal and immoral your stance is.
I don't disagree with what they did, but Discord is a bad product either way, it's has an awful UI and it's filled with cringeworthy memes, plus they probably sell your data. Use teamspeak or mumble.
Take a history lesson and also apply a bit of logic. When in history has a disenfranchised nation peacefully handed over absolute power to a government.
Here is the only example of how Thailand abolished slavery peacefully by the King Rama V back in 19th century (read the section "Abolition of corvée and slavery"). Not to disagree with what you said about Nazis. This is just to show you the only example I knew that there exists a way to do things the right way but would take a long time.
Actually, according to Wikipedia, the word "Sawastika" is supposed to referred to a different symbol (clock-wised drawing), and its meaning is on the good side. However, the one that Nazis used (counter-clock-wised) is called "Sauvastika" which is the bad side of "Sawastka". However, people kept calling the bad symbol as "Sawastika" all along, so now the word is referring to a bad meaning regardless how it is being drawn...
My stance is that punching those guys was a perfectly acceptable, indeed heroic, thing to do.
I applaud the people who stood up to those bullies.
That is the whole of my stance. And I think it's the only conceivably moral stance there can be in this situation.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
Or it could be all the Nazi flags and Hitler salutes. Just saying.
Go set up your own discord and host the nazis there. Whinge while you do it.
I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
You willing to call for outlawing socialists and communists ?
Are Nazis outlawed in the US? I thought this was about a private company exercising their right to control what is on their platform. Man, you know your argument is weak when this shit is the best you can come up with.
It's legal to spout nazi shit in the US. It's legal for a company to decide they don't want it on their platform. Grow the fuck up and deal with it.
I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
Hilarious, it is left wing racists that have murdered far more people in the last 40 years, destroyed property, glorify living like a savage.
Seriously? You are trying to justify your own political point of view with amount of violence of the opposite political point of view people did? Violence is NOT OKAY regardless the perpetrators' political point of view. There should never be a comparison which side did what. All of those who commit violence are wrong. Period.
I like a nice conspiracy theory as much as the next guy, but Hillary! supporters aren't exactly the core of the hard Left.
the dallas shooter flat out said he did it because of BLM
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
ALL americans get rights, even the wackjobs like the nazis or the wack jobs like the SJWs or the wackjobs like (insert whatever wackjob you wish here)
you cant just assault people for having differing views
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
There haven't been many deaths, yet. (And, no, right wing terrorists haven't committed more attacks than Islamic nutjobs since 9/11 - that's been thoroughly debunked everywhere)
We do know that an "antifa" idiot was whacking people over the head with a bicycle lock at one violent event. We know that a left-wing kook shot and tried to kill Republican congressmen a couple of months ago. We know that one used the SPLC's map to find the family research council and go in looking to kill people. The left-wing violence in Charlottesville was over the top - the white supremacists were forced by the police to walk through the crowd of left-wingers, who then attacked them.
Do you have ESP?
Just saw this:
http://legalinsurrection.com/2...
Again, they're escalating their attacks.
Do you have ESP?
you mean after the person hit dudes car with a bat freaking him out? you did see that video right???
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
berkely? furgason? NYC? LA? all left wing violence (that they justify on the grounds of...but nazis!!!)
no, the left wing violence in america today dwarfs the right wing violence. walking down the street with a torch isnt violent. suckerpunching and pepperspraying people walking with a torch is
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
jeremy was all about bernie and jill stein.... stop flat out lying
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
no one is defending nazis right to be violent. however we are defending americans right to PEACEFULLY assemble without the fear of being sucker punched and pepper sprayed regardless of how stupid their beliefs are
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
moving the goal posts. we are talking about violence not murder
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
Oh man kind of exactly like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
He literally yelled, "this is what liberalism gets you" when he stabbed a guy in the throat. He is on video saying that. Is that fake news?
Why are you trying so hard to find some way of tallying up violence so that you can put nazis on the "right" side? Think about your life for a second.
well yeah, hes a liberal.... it was a rally call
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
They have identical ideologies.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
The BLM and Antifa are racist and bigoted individuals that have no place in this country.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
Ok that was actually funny lol
thats not the intent of this post im not defending "nazis" im defending "americans" and in american we have to defend the rights afforded to us, even to the worst kinds of people. most violence over the past year (i said violence) has been done by antifa and other far left groups. this isnt even debatable. if nazis wanna walk down a street, they should not have to worry about getting sucker punched by some violence scumbag unless they themselves are in fact being violent. otherwise you open up a whole can of worms.
do the rest of the country get to attack BLM supporters and other people who agree with antifa unprovoked simply because they support them???? of course not!
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
Apparently you haven't seen the thuggery by the left, aided by cops - whether it is racist left of Berkeley or their fellow travellers in Charlottesville.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
This isn't really about Nazis, but about smearing conservatives with the label to silence them.
If you want political correctness, go to Germany.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
So all we have to do to remove rights from groups of people is stick them with arbitrary labels?
Neat. I can see no possible downside.
How about you, Mr. Neimoller?
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
too retarded to comprehend the argument ergo it must not be valid defense. sorry.
I watched a good portion of the events live. What I saw were 2 groups of people doing their best to prove the negative stereotypes about themselves.
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
It started with a woman that harassed a man, with the help of many in the media.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
thats what i saw as well. at first i totally condemned the driver however after seeing his car getting smashed with a bat right before he hit the gas. i can understand the reaction
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
So I take it that you're a leftist, which means that you support the murder of 50 million people.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
The irony, is that one of the funders of leftist violence is also a Nazi supporter - George Soros.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.c...
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
So you support ideologies that have an equal thirst for blood - if they don't obey leftist narratives?
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
They were peaceful until left-wing agitators showed up and started causing violence.
Sure. That's why they peacefully showed up with peaceful guns and peaceful shields.
Not Nazis. They only get provisional rights if they happen to be famous rocket scientists, and there are no rocket scientist alt-right nazis.
We settled this in the 1940s.
You are welcome on my lawn.
Leave them alone.
No.
It's not an "arbitrary label" if you call yourself a Nazi, carry a Nazi flag, wear Nazi armbands and give the Nazi salute. It then becomes a very specific label, and a voluntary one.
You are welcome on my lawn.
Funny how the video doesn't show any of that. Is this some vision you conjured up in your fevered imagination?
Just referring to BLM (not going to talk about Antifa), that doesn't seem to be a fair comparison. The IDEALS of their "organizations" aren't similar. Yes, you can find examples of calls for violence and actual violence within the BLM community but their message certainly is not "get rid of everyone that isn't black".
Specifically to your point: If BLM was actively promoting the elimination of whites, as a member of that race you can bet your ass I'd be singing the same tune.
> "Literally everyone to the right of Stalin is a Nazi."
Clearly you just need to clean the shit out from between your ears, because that's the stupidest thing i've read all morning... although with the number of neo-nazi appeasers and wannabe's on this site, i'm sure there will be much more stupid to come.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
Well what good is condemning it after the fact when they knowingly harbor them until they nail people to walls at concerts? Unless they're willing to outcast and report those people before someone dies, they don't belong in our civilization
Are you referring to neo-nazi terrorists or muslim terrorists?
>They don't want to destroy the statue of Robert E. Lee
I do. I want to destroy all statues.
I do not believe in karma. "Funny"=-6. Do good and forbid evil. Yours, Oft-Offtopic Flamebaiting Troll.
So you condemn the violence that occurred, right?
No, and in classical also Muslim inspiration "why would I have to do that? It's not my responsibility ('as a neo-Nazi to do that!')"
That's a completely fine argument for the sand-people so I guess it's ok for us from the forests too. Or? Maybe different rules for different people?
Because that's the problem in the Muslim world (I'm an ex-Muslim atheist
What's the problem? The lack of condemnation? Right.
Western foreign policy, propping up dictators, toppling legitimate democratic governments,
If the first is enforced by the west then I agree.
As for the dictators if the dictators are the one they had in Iran for instance then I don't know if the west is really to blame for his existence (first half of the 20th century?) I guess for Saud one could kinda blame the west.
As for any democratic ones I'm not for democracy at all but rather for freedom. Muslim democracy often seem to lead to Islamism anyway and western democracy at-least here in Europe lead to socialism and neither is free and both suck so no thanks to democracy. Democracy is bad. Freedom is good.
I have often told my Muslim friends that it was predominantly white Christians who fought and died to defeat the Nazi's, and so it must be Muslims who must unite to defeat Islamic Terrorism. The problem is internal to the group, so the group must fix it.
Yeah our idiotic government who drench Sweden in Muslims seem to think that's just fine because we've decide freedom of religion is fine because religion is fine and hence any amount of Muslims and any amount of Muslim behavior is fine because religion is fine ..
Pretty stupid.
And then they likely think that they can change the mind of Muslims, which they likely can if just a few come here, but if you let enough of them come then they can group up and keep their ways and then there will be less of that. And it's unlikely Muslims whatever in the middle-east or here in Sweden will really want to change because someone from outside tell them too.
Muslims simply shouldn't be welcomed here to preserve our people and freedom and then we could encourage progress and help develop the Muslim world instead. Insane amounts of money are used up on a few Afghani immigrants in Sweden rather than what could had been accomplished for such amounts abroad.
White nationalist terrorists are terrorists.
Any terrorist is a terrorist. But terrorist is just a word on something using violence for political means without being a legitimate state power. As is Europe is being invaded by Muslims defended by our own police, courts, politicians, military and media. As you know the USA is no stranger of using violence for its political ideas. Neither is Saudi-Arabia. So what's the difference when some other group do it? The only difference is that they made up the law that it would be a difference. Erdogan calls the Kurds terrorists while bombing them in Syria. Of course there's no difference to Kurds bombing Turks. Terrorist is a bullshit word. We should rather just call it warrior I guess. Warrior for different purposes. If the terrorists was a white nationalist when it was a warrior for his people, whereas an IS terrorist may have been one for his, or for your ideas. Whatever. The state which try to prevent that and kill them they are also warriors for their ideas and authority. No difference whatsoever. It's as useless as an argument as "racism."
Also since in Europe in kinda no country we've got freedom of speech and hence can't say what we feel about this and the politicians clearly haven't listened and prevent it we haven't had any democratic means and influence to affect it. So what's left? You can't blame us for not accepting the result when it never was our choice! Sweden isn't a democracy, it's a socialist & capitalist democrature.
Are you saying that coming out with firearms against the violent protesters in Berkely would have been excusable?
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
Nobody's being crucified for economic anxiety. The media is being crucified for pretending a bunch of racists voted for Trump because they weren't really racist, nah, they just had "economic anxiety".
You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
I think I would be reconsidering my affiliation with "white national"ism if I had a problem with what happened.
That would be insanely stupid.
It would be like saying "I'm not a Muslim!" because some other Muslim blew himself up. Why would you do that? Something tell me you're not a white nationalist at all and hence don't really give a shit / want people to not claim they are because that marginalize and destroy them even more so.
Muslims would simply say loud and proud that they are Muslims anyway. And that whatever some other Muslim did isn't their problem.
You don't protest dressed up as Nazis
No why the fuck would I? I think the NSDAP gear and symbols should be just fine to wear here. It's not because the idiots consider that persecution of people groups which I find completely retarded because the preservation of my own people haven't got shit to do with the destruction of other peoples. They are different things.
If you're peaceful
Of course you can wear nationalsocialist gear to show your opinion and yet be peaceful. This is complete bullshit of yours.
At a minimum, the ideas of Nazi Germany and how it ended up at the Holocaust and WW2 are a very clear warning.
Yeah. It's a warning about how America and socialism fuck things up alright. Nothing really new there. America is the world leader in destroying other societies and socialist ass-hats want their shit everywhere too.
It is not a peaceful movement.
It is. But by now we've kinda got no other means to reach our goals than to fight.
No. I defended punching them. Not killing them.
Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
But, not for beating on passing cars with bats, or tossing bottles full of fireworks into crowds.
Gotcha.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
no, we didnt. and that attitude of yours is doing nothing but breeding contempt from a large number of people who may not be nazis but see nothing but you people saying its ok to assault others if they disagree
you are causing more violence with your statements than they are
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
...You have so much on your plate that you can't remember all there is to do. Only the things that make the most noise, hit your desk the most, etc, get focus and everything else is forgotten until it makes noise again. Just sayin'.
White supremacy and remarks about Hitler were just ignored and/or not a big deal until something happens, now punishing the people that are involved in any way will completely stop it, right? Uh, telling people they can't do something makes them want to do it much more. See: drugs, see: alcohol, see: anything people are told they aren't allowed to do.
"Donny, don't stick your finger in that light socket, you'll get shocked."
- 1 minute later -
"DONNY! Why did you do that????? You're so stupid for not listening to me!"
Socialists/Communists ideology killed hundreds of millions (5x more than Nazism alone) in the name of their ideology. We fought Wars with them and they have explicit goals of tearing down Government to implant their own. I think we should ban everything Communist/Socialist too.
Maybe it's more like not putting up a statue of Erwin Rommel in a Jewish neighborhood? You know, Lee didn't just fight on the losing side, he fought to enslave the ancestors of people who walk past that statue every day.
The irony is, Lee opposed any statues of himself whilst he was alive.
Most of the Confederate statues were erected decades after the war, the 1920's was very popular for it (far right extremism was just popular then).
Lee wanted the US to heal after the war, which is why he didn't want anyone glorifying his actions.
Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
If there were nazis that marched but didn't actually commit any violence, should they be denounced?
Yes. Because they are FUCKING NAZIS.
Almost.
If your political philosophy cannot withstand a little valid criticism, then your philosophy is wrong and needs to be strongly denounced if not willingly given up.
That's what happens with James Alex Fields Jr, he couldn't handle people protesting against his philosophy. He couldn't meet them with rational discussion and wouldn't ignore them, so he drove a car into them.
Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
'all forms of hate' is now a euphemism for all political speech they disagree with. It's the same bullshit excuse that youtube is using to shut down independent journalists by demonetizing and quarantining their videos, under the banner of 'fighting extremism.'
Ironically enough, the very definition of fascism includes social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition. I hope those celebrating this move enjoy having their speech dictated to by a corporate controlled media, because once censorship is the norm, eventually they'll get a turn at being silenced or excommunicated because the goal posts are always being moved.
If your political philosophy cannot withstand a little valid criticism
You just said that nazis have valid criticisms.
The Chinese and Japanese have a seething hatred for each other that even a klan member would have a hard time understanding.
What is wrong with you people? When did I mention Communists at all? Are you dyslexic or something? Seriously what the fuck? Is it just deflection so that you can defend Nazism without appearing to defend it directly?
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
And Japs get nuked, too, eh? We settled that at that same time you know.
When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
The Japanese aren't still trying to create a white entho-state in 2017.
You are welcome on my lawn.
N/T
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
No they are not, but that doesn't mean shit based on your conjecture that we settled something with a war last century.
What I am pointing to is that your approach is beneath you. Yes, NAZIS are fucking scum. Yes, it is self evident to all but the most stunted and malformed of us. You can do better than that. There are much better terms and much more universal principles to base this off of besides who won some war.
For instance, if war results are the basis for argumentation you will need to lay off of Israel, and I am sure you don't want to do that. Do better.
When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
So what? When did I say I was a part of or supported those groups or even that I was anti-Trump? Also, smear the Nazis? I'm pretty sure their reputation speaks for itself.
Unless of course you were also "smearing" the Communists?
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
Nothing to say? That's what I thought.
Only crack the nuts that crack. You don't put the ones that don't crack in the sack.
I agree with you, of course. But you do know that the entire purported reason for the alt-Right/Nazi march last weekend was to argue war results, right? The Civil War, no less.
Do you have any moral corrections left for the people who would march to preserve the Confederate "heritage"?
You are welcome on my lawn.
Individual communists still have a sense of personal ownership of belongings, anarchists form power structures
Which is why anarchism, communism, and anarcho-communism don't touch the edge of a Nolan chart. They come close but aren't quite to the extreme.
white supremacists can believe in the welfare state
Hence the "socialist" in "National Socialist German Labor Party" (NSDAP). To capture where different ideologies fall relative to the National Socialists and their successors, you might need a different chart with economic regulation and ethnic discrimination as its axes.
Where is the chart that acknowledges this individuality and supports exploration of the issues and not the identities?
These charts improve on the left/right divide by adding an additional axis. But a chart really can't summarize more than two orthogonal aspects of a political position for one practical reason: An image on a piece of paper or computer monitor has two dimensions, as does the human retina.
What's more American than violence against Nazis, anyway?
I'd definitely put freedom of speech WAY higher in importance than violence against Nazis.
Putting aside for a moment that freedom of speech is a defining characteristic of America to be proud of, I would say the removal of the freedom of speech would present a far greater threat to our country than Nazis.
Do they really frighten you that much?
Aren't you a patriot?
Absolutely. Why aren't you?
Just like you're blaming whites, attacking them for collectively advocating for their self-interests, calling us Nazis and supremacists, etc.
Right.
All your convoluted rhetoric is is nothing more than anti-white hatred.
It's not an "arbitrary label" if you call yourself a Nazi, carry a Nazi flag, wear Nazi armbands and give the Nazi salute. It then becomes a very specific label, and a voluntary one.
OK, fine, but they still have rights, whether you like it or not. The exact same rights, as a matter of fact, as you, me, and every other person within the borders of the United States.
"We fought a war over this"
No, our grandparents fought a war over something with a similar name but different ideologies. Conflating the two only gives the bastards power.
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Loving your self and your race/people is not bigotry. It's natural.
Also, loving yourself doesn't mean hating others, unless you're a stupid anti-white, hateful Antifa retard.
Found the white hater.
This topic came up after last year's NPI conference and Spencer did a lengthy video about it (on RedIce). The way mainstream media dealt with the very few Roman salutes which occurred was a deliberate deception (Watch Henryk's lengthy analysis of it on RedIce TV).
In the end, because it is recognized AltRight are invariably going to be called Nazis regardless of what reality is, we chose to laugh it off as a joke, as an easy way to trigger idiots who are either intent on deliberately maligning us or else are too stupid to realize the truth.
After what the media did yes people were literally referring to others as Nazi as a joke because that's how absurd the situation was.
You know what? I bet most AltRighters actually know more about the actual history of the mid-20th century, the second Great War, and the politics that surrounded it than the vast majority of people screaming the word Nazi at us.
At this point, constantly throwing out the term Nazi clearly indicates that you're capable of nothing more than ad hominem attacks since your argument is completely vacuous.
It's exactly the same ideology: Blood and Soil, White ethnostate, "get in the ovens", etc etc.
Nazis gonna nazi. And no, they don't get rights because as Churchill said, "Nazi got no humanity".
You are welcome on my lawn.
I have corrections for them, but not the kind I gave you. I wanted to see you make a better argument, not a worse one. I was not trying to undermine you, I was trying to goad you into making a better argument for the same end. For those that would march to preserve the Confederate "heritage" I would take an entirely different tack. I would try to convince them they are misguided at the very least.
Don't just tear these statues down. Relocate them. Create a museum dedicated to the folly of mankind. A testament to how people can feel right about things and still get them completely wrong. Something that could engender humility and reflection, rather than outrage.
The past needs to be put in the proper context, not erased. To that end, the places where these statues were located should be changed to reflect better values than leadership in war. A shrine to the values of the constitution and specifically the 13-15th amendments would be appropriate. There are other ideas that would work as well.
When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
When the Declaration of Independence was written, mobs of American patriots tore down every statue of King George. Every single one.
But I'm nothing if not a conciliatory and reasonable gentleman. I will agree that we should relocate all of the Confederate statues to a landfill, and call it a "museum dedicated to the folly of mankind". We can even put up a big sign calling it, "The Donald Trump Museum of the Folly of Mankind and Presidential Library". That fulfills your need for putting the past in a proper context.
Satisfied?
You are welcome on my lawn.
Is there a particular reason for anybody to believe anything that that guy says? let alone the fact you included yet another conspiracy theory, withotu any evidence other than the insane rantings of a right wing extremist.
not at all, i find it funny when the far left and far right fight each other. 2 groups of morons taking each other out is good for the rest of us americans.
have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
yes you're hilarious citing cases of a few deaths when I am talking about hundreds of murders per year.