Slashdot Mirror

I like Kino - so much that I actually contributed to it. Lots of people seem to like Cinerella There are a lot of other projects.

A decent app for editing is Screenblast. I have only played a little but seems rather nice.

Me personally, I prefer Kino. I have heard good things about Cinelerra, but have never used it.

ASSORTED FEATURES

VU meters
unlimited tracks
16 bit YUV compositing
background renderfarm
free form editing
Firewire, MJPEG, bttv video I/O
Firewire, OSS, Alsa audio I/O
Batch capturing
Batch rendering
SMP utilization
realtime effects
still image panning
Quicktime, AVI, MPEG, and image sequence I/O
OGG Vorbis audio
64 bit internal audio representation
LADSPA plugins
Bezier masks
Track routing like a real console
Track nudge for audio and video

The sun rising in the west, recall elections, heroines running for president: they all pale compared to the insanity Cinelerra brings to your web server box.

It is interesting piece of software, but if you want a true professional video editing software for your Linux box, I suggest you use Cinelerra. It's an amazing software - equivalent to something that would probably cost hundreds of thousand dollars - and yes, it is open source.

Find some more information here .

*eth1394 (depends on ieee1394 - and both are in the latest kernels - I know it's in the 2.4.20+ for a fact *use it myself..not eth1394, but ieee1394...*)

• but Read this site carefully, check your kernel,
• download a patch & patch it if necessary... the 'usual common sense'-principle...

  so grab a supported/the patched kernel...,and don't don't forget to configure & compile it with these options:

  • 'OHCI-1394 support'
  • 
    'Ethernet over 1394
    'Raw IEEE1394 I/O support'
    ...ps, and maybe while you're at it, add 'SBP-2 support (Harddisks etc.)' too ...
    

  (btw, in 2.4.20+ - you'll need to enable "Code maturity level options --> [*] Prompt for development and/or incomplete code/drivers" , or else you won't see the "IEEE 1394 (FireWire) support (EXPERIMENTAL)" all this is under..)

  if you compiled 'all of these things' as 'Modules', don't forget to load up these modules(and try to do them in that order....):

  • ieee1394
  • 
    raw1394
    ohci1394
    eth1394

  elsewise, load only those that are modules .... - and if you compiled all of them into your kernel, just skip all of the above...

  !PS - on some hardware it's also required that you first unload 'ohci1394' before you remove your the Firewire Controller (ONLY for PCMCIA users ...)

  !PS - if you are a really 'unfamiliar with loading & unloading drivers' & 'don't know how to automate these things'.... don't bother, stick with your windows/OS X box... }:-)

• DVTS - for some furthur info if you don't manage on your own ( they are implementing a "..DV streams from IEEE1394 over IP.", sorta related, I guess)
• FIREHOSE - "FIREHOSE gives you a basic data transfer over multiple network devices supporting TCP/IP layers. Stripe multiple 100Mbit, Gigabit, 10 Gigabit, or firewire to give one humungous pipe for firehosing your gigabytes and gigabytes of data." (I guess, also related...)

There was one snippet of news buried in the last page that I think is pretty big:

"Another interesting development is that we currently got a team of about 7 french students who are going to make a GStreamer-based non-linear video editor as the final year project."

7 students running a final year project suggests it ought to be good, so does that mean we might finally have some really high quality video editing software other than Cinelerra? If so, that's brilliant!

I like the fact that GStreamer support is now filtering even into non-GNOME apps like Juk (in KDE). Good stuff :)

There isn't a version of QuickTime or iTunes for Linux and Open Source folk can't even build something compatible since these are closed source, proprietary, etc.

Yes, it's such a shame that nobody can build an open source, interoperable quicktime library. Damn Apple and their closed, proprietary formats. *rolls eyes*

Final Cut Pro ... [is] a nonlinear editor, something which really can't be clustered effectively, especially not with dirt cheap boxes.

Take a looksie at Cinelerra. It's still under development, but it's cluster support is working fine already. I've used it with a renderfarm of 20 low end PII boxes (and if they're not dirt cheap boxes, I don't know what is), and it worked perfectly.

And before you accuse me of not knowing what I'm talking about, I used to build and maintain clusters professionally.

Given the above counter example, can I accuse you of not knowing what you're talking about? :)

But on the other hand I will still be on windows because I need high end video editing.

Have you checked out Cinelerra? I've been eyeing it for a while but haven't gathered the gumption to try using it yet.

directX should die, it's holding lin games back

Huh? I haven't seen anything intrinsic to DirectX that would hold back third-party implementations of it; it's just yet another object-oriented (sort of) pile of graphics, sound and whatnot APIs. I think it's more likely the sheer size and complexity of the Win32 standard platform that holds up porting; who wants to go through their code rooting out all those pesky API calls and proprietary libraries when just coding for Windows is going to get them 90% of the users?

I've been working on the media player detection and control code for VegasWebcast.com, and let me tell you, dealing with browser and platform differences at the same time as trying to dance around plugin/ActiveX versioning issues, browser and media player implementation bugs, and other sources of pain is an adventure.

Crap! It's the Acacia Technologies lawyers! RUN!!!

This would be very handy to me, since I use XP for Video

Transcode,
Cinelerra, ...

Photo Editing,

Gimp, ...

Gaming

Nethack :)

Try again... What do you need windows for?

Firehosegives you that power. FIREHOSE gives you a basic data transfer over multiple network devices supporting TCP/IP layers. Stripe multiple 100Mbit, Gigabit, 10 Gigabit, or firewire to give one humungous pipe for firehosing your gigabytes and gigabytes of data

A good example of a high-end movie compositing tool on Linux, that is absolutely free: Cinerella.

Anyone care to contribute more links to free software that can be used in movie production?

Codec, API, compression format... Let's look at a site of people who know what this is all aboutQuicktime 4 linux

CODECS

Be aware of one thing: Quicktime for Linux won't read any of the movies you download from the internet. Quicktime is a wrapper for many different kinds of compression formats. What you knew as "Quicktime 4", "Quicktime 5", "Quicktime 6", are really different distributions of compression formats. The codecs we support are mainly uncompressed.

So, basically, you confuse two things that come under the same name. True, Quicktime is a player and API, and it's pretty much open. But there are the quicktime compression formats too (just like divx, mpeg or xvid which are yet another compression formats), which are decompressed using proprietary software only, and which could be decompressed using standarised codecs, to be played i.e. in WMO or The Playa, if just said codecs were written - and were legal to write.

We are confusing several terms:
File format: Wrapper for some content. .avi, .mov, .rm... May contain data created using different compression methods.
Compression method: mpeg, mpeg2, divx, ogg vorbis, qt5, qt6... Data compressed using given method can be contained within certain file format (many different methods in 1 file format).
Codec: Standarised software layer (de)compressing specific compression format to standarised media player. Note, "standard" codecs for qt* as such are nonexistent. There are some highly proprietary codecs that come with QT package, and allow to play QT-compressed content (from .mov file format) to be played only in QT player (which is by no way "standard") and Apple doesn't seem to be willing to allow anyone to create anything more standarised, i.e. codec that would allow to play qt-compressed data in WMP.

I hope that clarifies the problem and shuts up those who insist QT is not a codec. By some means, it isn't. What people mean as QT codecs is some obscure software layer in official Apple QT player that does nearly but not quite what codecs should do and because of some dumb law regulations, can't be made into something a real codec should be.

Examples? Video editing.. nothing available for linux can touch adobe Premiere.. not even the old version 5.0 of it.

Taken a look at Cinelerra lately? Or MainActor?

There's always Cinelerra.

It's not quite Premiere, but it's reasonably close for most run-of-the-mill video editing. Too bad the interface is hideous.

Several threads here have mentioned the limitations of iMovie.

Linux users may want to check out the free package Cinelerra, it's a very capable piece of editing / compositing software. It's probably something that would be valuable on OSX, if it hasn't been ported there already.

# Ms Office Standard (Win: 347 / Mac: 357)
# Photoshop (Win: 580 / Mac: 590)
# Illustrator (Win: 390 / Mac: 403)
# Premiere 6.5 (Win: 540 / Mac: 533)
OpenOffice.org
The Gimp
Dia
Cinelerra

Sum: $0

apt-get install cinepaint dv-utils kino transcode vcr

Cinelerra
Video Capture and Editing under Linux
Consumer Video Editing in Linux
Linux Tutorial: Video, DVD, TV and Multimedia

Now let's all repeat after me...
Google is my friend.

Seriously, are you people just to lazy to type 3 frickin words into Google?

There are already MPlayer, the ffmpeg library, mjpegtools, bbmpeg, Ogg Vorbis and Theora, Cinelerra... I for one don't feel that I need a bone thrown to me by Real, much less a proprietary, binary-only, NDA-encumbered (no, more like encrusted) one.

Others' mileage, of course, may vary. I admit, I may be just preaching to the choir here-- but I hope that what I just named off the top of my head can show potential moviemakers some of the options that are available.

Ardour is a multichannel hard disk recorder (HDR) and digital audio workstation (DAW).

Audacity is a free audio editor. You can record sounds, play sounds, import and export WAV, AIFF, and MP3 files, and more.

JACK Rack is an effects "rack" for the JACK low latency audio API. The rack can be filled with LADSPA effects plugins and can be controlled using the ALSA sequencer. It's phat; it turns your computer into an effects box.

Kino is a non-linear DV editor for GNU/Linux. It features excellent integration with IEEE 1394 for capture, VTR control, and recording back to the camera. It captures video to disk in AVI format in both type-1 DV and type-2 DV (separate audio stream) encodings.

Cinerella combines most of the basic functions needed to produce motion pictures with a capable compositing system. Advanced editing, YUV compositing, and realtime effects are some of the things Cinelerra does. Cinelerra's 16 bit YUV compositing engine has been optimized for multiple CPU's, reduces generation loss, and significantly reduces compression time. Capturing from IEEE1394, Video4Linux, Motion JPEG, and screenshots is supported.

Third, animation:

Blender is an open source software for 3D modeling, animation, rendering, post-production, interactive creation and playback.

Fourth, post-processing:

CinePaint(formerly Film Gimp) CinePaint is a free open source painting and image retouching program designed to work best with 35mm film and other high resolution high dynamic range images.

Hey! Somebody please submit a story of Linux video editing software! THIS IS SOMETHING RADICAL AND EARTH SHAKIN'! Superior _professional_ video editing software made by some uberintelligent individual for Linux and it is open source! A truly unbelievable piece of software!

Here's description from the website:
---
Movie studio in a box.

Heroine Virtual Ltd. presents an advanced compositing and editing system for native Linux at no cost to users.

Native Linux: that means no emulation of proprietary operating systems and no additional commercial software required. When you run a native Linux program, it's like you wrote the software yourself and are completely untied from corporate interests.

Of course, Linux isn't the first word that comes to mind when you think of content creation. Neither would you dare say Linux and general purpose computing in the same sentence, unless you were insane. That was before Cinelerra was invented.

For guys like you - Linux gurus who also like general purpose computing - there's eliteness in doing the unusual. You want to create your own niche. You want to try things no-one else will.

Cinelerra is not for consumer use. If ease of use, simplicity, and convenience are your thing, you should use Virtualdub, Kino, MJPEG tools or MainActor instead.

If you want to make movies, you want the compositing and editing that the big boys use, you want the efficiency of an embedded UNIX operating system combined with the power of a general purpose PC, or you just want to defy the establishment, the time has come to download Cinelerra.

Along the way, we discovered video processing takes too long to do on a single computer so we put renderfarm support into Cinelerra. The biggest difference between this renderfarm and normal renderfarms is you don't need to pay for node licenses.

Then of course, you don't want to wait for effects to render before finding the result of your tweeking, so now there's background renderfarm. For now on, no effect is too slow, no resolution too high, to get realtime previews. Keep piling on terrahertz Athlons and terrabit ethernet to background render more. No terrahertz Athlon? Make someone invent it. With background renderfarm, the only limit is the crumbling national economy.

Imagine a laptop which didn't need dongles to run anything. Imagine not having to phone in and wait a week to renew licenses every week.

Now Cinelerra is by no means a lightweight program. You'll need something slightly less sexy than a handheld organizer to run it most effectively.

Somebody please submit a story about Linux video editing software! THIS IS SOMETHING RADICAL AND EARTH SHAKIN'! Superior _professional_ video editing software made by some uberintelligent individual for Linux and it is open source! A truly unbelievable piece of software!

Here's description from the website:
---
Movie studio in a box.

Heroine Virtual Ltd. presents an advanced compositing and editing system for native Linux at no cost to users.

Native Linux: that means no emulation of proprietary operating systems and no additional commercial software required. When you run a native Linux program, it's like you wrote the software yourself and are completely untied from corporate interests.

Of course, Linux isn't the first word that comes to mind when you think of content creation. Neither would you dare say Linux and general purpose computing in the same sentence, unless you were insane. That was before Cinelerra was invented.

For guys like you - Linux gurus who also like general purpose computing - there's eliteness in doing the unusual. You want to create your own niche. You want to try things no-one else will.

Cinelerra is not for consumer use. If ease of use, simplicity, and convenience are your thing, you should use Virtualdub, Kino, MJPEG tools or MainActor instead.

If you want to make movies, you want the compositing and editing that the big boys use, you want the efficiency of an embedded UNIX operating system combined with the power of a general purpose PC, or you just want to defy the establishment, the time has come to download Cinelerra.

Along the way, we discovered video processing takes too long to do on a single computer so we put renderfarm support into Cinelerra. The biggest difference between this renderfarm and normal renderfarms is you don't need to pay for node licenses.

Then of course, you don't want to wait for effects to render before finding the result of your tweeking, so now there's background renderfarm. For now on, no effect is too slow, no resolution too high, to get realtime previews. Keep piling on terrahertz Athlons and terrabit ethernet to background render more. No terrahertz Athlon? Make someone invent it. With background renderfarm, the only limit is the crumbling national economy.

Imagine a laptop which didn't need dongles to run anything. Imagine not having to phone in and wait a week to renew licenses every week.

Now Cinelerra is by no means a lightweight program. You'll need something slightly less sexy than a handheld organizer to run it most effectively.

WHERE IS THE FUSS ABOUT THIS SOFTWARE? Somebody please submit a story about this revolutionary Linux video editing software! THIS IS SOMETHING RADICAL AND EARTH SHAKIN'! Superior _professional_ video editing software made by some uberintelligent individual for Linux and it is open source! A truly unbelievable piece of software! Intelligence taken to the limits! Kudos to the programmer! He seems to be the smartest man on the block.

Here's description from the website:
---
Movie studio in a box.

Heroine Virtual Ltd. presents an advanced compositing and editing system for native Linux at no cost to users.

Native Linux: that means no emulation of proprietary operating systems and no additional commercial software required. When you run a native Linux program, it's like you wrote the software yourself and are completely untied from corporate interests.

Of course, Linux isn't the first word that comes to mind when you think of content creation. Neither would you dare say Linux and general purpose computing in the same sentence, unless you were insane. That was before Cinelerra was invented.

For guys like you - Linux gurus who also like general purpose computing - there's eliteness in doing the unusual. You want to create your own niche. You want to try things no-one else will.

Cinelerra is not for consumer use. If ease of use, simplicity, and convenience are your thing, you should use Virtualdub, Kino, MJPEG tools or MainActor instead.

If you want to make movies, you want the compositing and editing that the big boys use, you want the efficiency of an embedded UNIX operating system combined with the power of a general purpose PC, or you just want to defy the establishment, the time has come to download Cinelerra.

Along the way, we discovered video processing takes too long to do on a single computer so we put renderfarm support into Cinelerra. The biggest difference between this renderfarm and normal renderfarms is you don't need to pay for node licenses.

Then of course, you don't want to wait for effects to render before finding the result of your tweeking, so now there's background renderfarm. For now on, no effect is too slow, no resolution too high, to get realtime previews. Keep piling on terrahertz Athlons and terrabit ethernet to background render more. No terrahertz Athlon? Make someone invent it. With background renderfarm, the only limit is the crumbling national economy.

Imagine a laptop which didn't need dongles to run anything. Imagine not having to phone in and wait a week to renew licenses every week.

Now Cinelerra is by no means a lightweight program. You'll need something slightly less sexy than a handheld organizer to run it most effectively.

My native language is not English, so I can not do it. Somebody please submit a story about Linux video editing software! THIS IS SOMETHING RADICAL AND EARTH SHAKIN'! Superior _professional_ video editing software made by some uberintelligent individual for Linux and it is open source! A truly unbelievable thing! Kudos to the programmer!

Here's description from the website:
---
Movie studio in a box.

Heroine Virtual Ltd. presents an advanced compositing and editing system for native Linux at no cost to users.

Native Linux: that means no emulation of proprietary operating systems and no additional commercial software required. When you run a native Linux program, it's like you wrote the software yourself and are completely untied from corporate interests.

Of course, Linux isn't the first word that comes to mind when you think of content creation. Neither would you dare say Linux and general purpose computing in the same sentence, unless you were insane. That was before Cinelerra was invented.

For guys like you - Linux gurus who also like general purpose computing - there's eliteness in doing the unusual. You want to create your own niche. You want to try things no-one else will.

Cinelerra is not for consumer use. If ease of use, simplicity, and convenience are your thing, you should use Virtualdub, Kino, MJPEG tools or MainActor instead.

If you want to make movies, you want the compositing and editing that the big boys use, you want the efficiency of an embedded UNIX operating system combined with the power of a general purpose PC, or you just want to defy the establishment, the time has come to download Cinelerra.

Along the way, we discovered video processing takes too long to do on a single computer so we put renderfarm support into Cinelerra. The biggest difference between this renderfarm and normal renderfarms is you don't need to pay for node licenses.

Then of course, you don't want to wait for effects to render before finding the result of your tweeking, so now there's background renderfarm. For now on, no effect is too slow, no resolution too high, to get realtime previews. Keep piling on terrahertz Athlons and terrabit ethernet to background render more. No terrahertz Athlon? Make someone invent it. With background renderfarm, the only limit is the crumbling national economy.

Imagine a laptop which didn't need dongles to run anything. Imagine not having to phone in and wait a week to renew licenses every week.

Now Cinelerra is by no means a lightweight program. You'll need something slightly less sexy than a handheld organizer to run it most effectively.

Additionally, there's really precious little to compare to Premiere for video editing.

2. Games. I do play a lot of them.

Consistency.

Has anyone tried both?

What about Cinelerra? I am afraid to even try and get that running on my 500Mhz k6-2, or else I'd try and see if it really was a decent app.

Ok, ok, hear me out!
PS kicks every other Pixelprogramm up and down the street. I get that.
But what with the rest? We've got Cinelerra for free (beer, speech and all), we've got Pinnacle who recently bought Fast, a kick ass high end Video Tool company and are now shedding their technology in bundles in every Walmart alongside realtime NLE cards for a dime-a-dozen.
And we got Apple who's new Final Cut Pro apears to be kicking the living crap out of Premiere. So I heard from my former Video NLE Teacher the other day who'd wee-wee in his pants whilst raving about the superdooper Premiere just 3 years ago when he tought us.

From what it looks like to me with every software company in the vector/pixel, video and 3D business struggling for life and the cheap ones getting cheaper or even being bought by hardware vendors and Gimp pushing the GPL-freeness envelope on the Pixelside and Sodipodi giving Freehand, Illustrator and CorelDraw the GPL creeps, it seems these companys like Macromedia *and* Adobe aswell would be better of finding new fields of business *fast*.

Just my 2 Eurocents.

So anybody thought of running this on OSX using FINK or whatever? Maybee nice on G5.

Mandrake should grab the bull by the horns and give Linux users what they really want: a distribution that can deftly handle any media type and play big-name games. Adding a boss commercial game and WineX in a pre-configured way ala Sims will encourage people to throw down much needed ching instead of just freeloading (I meant downloading) and may even persuade Redhat users who are bored out of their skulls to switch. The game CivIII makes a good candidate in my mind because the hardware requirements aren't outrageous and the game is addictive as hell.

Also, get rid of all the crufty useless mediaplayers that don't work and replace with one of two that will work. I'll say Quicktime4Linux or RealPlayer with all the codecs so it's ready to play any media format right out of the box. In fact, strip down alot of the unnecessary apps that litter my main menu. More isn't always better.

or did others stop caring a lot about speed somewhere around 1Ghz?

Try running Cinelerra on a 1Ghz. Unusable. Your 3D graphics card will not help, you need raw CPU, and I'll bet with an AMD 3200+ you'd still crave more.

you got Quicktime4Linux from the same people that brought you Broadcast 2000 and Cinellera. And yes, Mplayer handles it too (sorry about that, I had to bring up mplayer)

Film GIMP(now CinePaint) is NOTHING like Adobe Premiere. Adobe Premiere is a non-linear video editor, CinePaint is a high dynamic range picture editor, basically just the Gimp with 64-bit RGBA color capability. Cinelerra is a non-linear editor, but not quite on par with Premiere IMHO. Kino and kdenlive are promising projects I have yet to use to do that same thing.

My son and I have been capturing analog video and producing short digital videos and movies for past few months. We have made a goal to do this entirely in Linux and have learned a bit along the way that may be of use to others. My son has recently made some videos for his high school classes that have been voted best in the class. Here's what worked for us:

1. Start with a reasonably recent model PC, such as an Athlon 1700+ or better built on a decent motherboard. Give it at least 512Mb of RAM and make sure you have at least 20Mb or more of free disk space.

2. Use a relatively recent version of Linux with at least a 2.4.18 kernel. Most distributions which use this kernel (e.g., Red Hat 7.3) include drivers which support the capture cards listed below.

3. We've been using two types of PCI capture cards: an Iomega Buz, and a Linux Media Labs LML33. The Buz is out of production, but it can regularly be had on ebay for $20-$40. It is based on the Zoran MJPEG chipset and Phillips video encoder chips. As a side benefit, it also contains an ultra SCSI controller that is supposedly supported in Linux, though I haven't tried it yet. The LML33 was designed spefically with Linux in mind, and is also based on the Zoran MJPEG chipset, but it uses a BrookTree video encoder. It is also a bit more expensive; we paid $125 for a used one on ebay. Both cards are well supported in Linux, and produce high quality DVD-resolution 720x480 video at 30 frames/second.

4. Install a recent version of mjpegtools. The most important piece of mjpegtools is the lavrec utility, which supports recording from the Zoran cards to either AVI or Quicktime formatted MJPEG files. mjpegtools also includes several other useful utilities.

5. Install a recent distribution of Transcode. Transcode is a very useful suite of command line utilities for transcoding and processing videos and supports just about every video codec available on Linux.

6. Install Cinelerra and Blender. Cinelerra is a bit quirky, still tends to crash a lot, and is butt-ugly, but it has some awesome editing and compositing abilities including multiple layer editing and compositing, and keyframe-based effects control. The most recent version also contains a nice adaptive de-interlace filter. Cinelerra also contains a very nice translate filter that can be used to trim edge artifacts that often appear in captured video. Blender is gread for things like generating 3-D titles and short 3-D blurbs and transition animations if you like to do those kinds of things. Gimp is also quite useful for generating titles and editing individual frames if that is required.

With the above combination of hardware and software, you can achive very close to DVD quality results with very little outlay of cash in a completely Linux environment, and the results can be quite satisfying. My son has been making videos for his high school classes and I have been digitizing old home videos and it's been quite fun.

Secondly, 1/40th real time? My first reaction is ouch. My second is 'Well...so?' I have two Tivo's and I can tell you from experience that we do not recieve a worthwhile signal 1/40th of the time. I should say worthwhile in content quality -- signal quality is fine but most content is crap.

Still this is unoptimized performance. I wonder to what extent distributed processing, ala reusing a Cinerella render farm, might help. With the input being primarly a chronological stream, I don't see much issue. Just break up the signal with a little bit of overlap...

Yeah, I'd be similarly distraught if I were installing RPM's on RedHat 7.2; therefore, I'm pretty happy that I made the switch to Gentoo.

mplayer is all I use for video playback, and this is all almost anyone needs to know... type mplayer followed by a space and the filename, and hit Enter.

What happens on my system? Glorious full-screen video with sound. Sure, there are other keys and options and GUIs and crap, but I don't want or need 99% of it... mostly I just want something that'll play video, and mplayer does a great job of that. (And mencoder looks pretty sweet too...)

As for video editing, I haven't done it, but if I wanted to, I'd probably start here -- ignore the gimpy-looking page, I've used some of this software in the past, and it struck me as being very usable and well-written; maybe not enough to please jwz, but what is? He bitches about Unix too. In fact, I propose that jwz bitching is just a fact of life. If he ever stops bitching, worry.

Although I have no need for (and thus don't know about) "DVD design and writing software", I do a considerable amount of work with Cinelerra, which in my mind is an excellent non-linear movie editor (and suite of associated tools).

Umm Intel was pushing USB long before Apple used it.

Intel pushed USB, but Microsoft didn't, and that was all that mattered, pre-1998. USB had no backers because the PC industry is resistant to change for fear of affecting the bottom line adversely.

I remember in 1997 when dozens of Compaq workstations appeared at my workplace with USB cables--but no operating system that supported it. The USB drivers in Windows 95 OSR2 were busted and practically unusable. There were very, very few USB devices.

In comes Apple, who didn't create USB, but just took an otherwise useful serial bus and installed it in all Macintosh systems since, starting with the iMac in 1998. That very act alone lit a fire under the computer industry's ass, and USB has been commonplace every since.

Also Apple gave away Darwin so they could get free R&D, and talk to me when a quicktime client is available for Linux.

OF COURSE Apple is giving away Darwin to make Mac OS X stronger. Does that make it or other operating systems that do the same thing (giving itself away) any less worthy? I would think not.

As for something that can run QuickTime: you can start here. It ain't official, but many software projects in the *nix world aren't anyway. Besides, why would Apple make a QuickTime client that competes against their own OS? Duh...!

You can also stream QuickTime for free from Linux. Reviews indicate this is the best streaming server out there, even compared to MS and Real.

I guess I won't bother mentioning that Apple is as suit happy as Disney as well. Oh well I did anyway. ;)

Think a little harder on that and then post again.

I'm not expecting Apple to go completely OS anytime soon. But I'm sure a hell not going to forget their proprietary, suithappy past and start slapping them on the back just yet.

A little food for thought: Compaq is a proprietary box. They make proprietary drivers that work only in specific models. They may run Windows, but not without a lot of help from Compaq.

You throw around the "p" word as if owning something or the sole right to change it makes it less worthy. Everything worth something has a proprietary component. Even Linux. Your nose is bleeding from sitting so high on your horse.

Apple is a business, and it is not out there to impress you or cause a revolution. If it can give away something to help their bottom line, great. If it can leverage its technologies to get more computers sold, that's fine. Can it still benefit you, presumed Linux user? Sure. Could Apple lapse back to its own ways? Maybe, but the market forces would destroy it.

FREE native linux video editing: cinelerra
scalable, too.

What about
Cinelerra

It does a suitable job at NLE.

First thing, you should be careful with your terminology.

A modeller lets you create models and scenes. A renderer turns these scenes into 2D images. A compositor lets you turn these 2D images into other 2D images, and usually also lets you assemble them into single-file animation formats. Don't expect to do any "real" 3D work without at least one of each.

It's confusing because many modellers have renderers built in. They are usually inadequate for complex jobs. (Though, in fairness, one blockbuster 100% computer animated feature film has been made using Maya's built-in renderer, so it's not exactly useless.) However, thanks to the wonders of Open Source, the modeller is now the only part you have to buy.

Here's what I suggest:

• Get Maya Complete. This will cost money.
• Get Liquid, which will cost you nothing. This will export Maya to RenderMan(TM).
• Get Aqsis, which will cost you nothing. This is your renderer. It is RenderMan(tm) compliant, which is the de facto standard for communication between renderers and modellers.
• Get Cinelerra, which will cost you nothing. This is your compositor. (Available only for Linux, unfortunately, but it's free.)

If you find yourself making money with these, you can replace and augment bits if you find them not doing what you want. (For example, replace Aqsis with RDC or PRMan and replace Cinelerra with Shake or After Effects. You can even augment Maya with Houdini or SoftImage if you feel like spending money.)

The key here is to stick with standards so you can drop in replacements into your production line.

Good luck.

So, what you want is a linux program that does everything without you going out and having to download 6 other programs, to get the job done that can be done by 1 program in linux? keep dreaming... ha ha...

but seriously, cinelerra Heroinewarrior.com
is a nice piece of video editing software. Doesn't really do exactly what you are looking for, but nice none the less. What i think you are really looking for is something like DVD::RIP which does pretty much the whole process for you, except making the Mpg files into bin/cue files. Oh but that only works for dvd, it won't really do much for recorded video... damn. Why can't someone just make good software for linux...

DO IT EVERY DAY. Texas instruments firewire card and a JVC camera. now EDIT that video... there's where linux dies. nothing remotely useable yet.

I haven't tried this yet, but just wanted you to know a version 1.0 video editing system is available:

Heroine Virtual Ltd. presents an advanced compositing and editing system for native Linux at no cost to users.

Waiting for a DVD to rip.

So:

Go buy any old digital camera and try to download the pics on a RedHat system.

Go buy a DVD-R and try to burn a disc.

Go to any old website showing media (RealPlayer, QuickTime, Windows Media) and see how successful you are at viewing content.

Buy a Firewire DV Video Camera and see how successful you are in getting the video off and editing it.

Try to visit a site that's made for IE.
Go to the store and buy a game. (I'll give you these -- VmWare and other solutions are a serious bitch to setup, and don't work well except in certain Distros)

Buy a PDA and get it to synch up.

Your network card doesn't work, find somebody you know willing to come over and fix it. (Huh? If the card is broken, even your God(s) ain't/aren't gonna fix it.)

>The steps to do any of the above in Windows are very easy

Uhhh, sure... I mean, I mean, if you want to have every two or three DVDs come out as coasters (happens with Prassi Primo DVD for me) sure. Or if you want to use crappy outdated camera software that just lets you easily download one picture at a time through a slow ass serial connection, great (Fuji MX-1200). I've never done DV, but Kino doesn't look too hard. Or you can try Cinerella, which seems more full featured and easier.

>When a DVD-Burner manufacturer is swamped with "Uhh where's the Linux Drivers?"

DVD-R in linux doesn't use "drivers", unless you count the built in generic SCSI support built in linux (since well before DVD was available for most PCs) as a "driver". Try saying that about windows. Especially windows 9x...

HTH. And take it from me, there's NO software in windows that lets you use a Celeron 300 to burn DVD-R at 2x and surf the 'net at the same time.

Linux's motto should be "Spend some time now -- Then do more, quicker".

I do not know VirtualDub (because I run Linux only).
But you may check out Cinelerra an advanced compositing and editing system for native Linux at no cost to users.

Yasa

Look into cinlerra, a full-featured video editing and compositing system for Linux.

With Cinelerra, Ardour, and Blender, I may finally have reason to buy a new machine and stuff this Celeron 366 in a car or something. It's been going strong for 5 years and I'd hate to have to replace it, but there's sadly not enough power in it anymore. :(

Ahh, the joys of been a poor (as in beer) teenage geek.

For the features most people need in PageMaker, that is to say simple layout and no need to re-use old files, I've been using Scribus for a while. It has an astonishing pace of development and is eminently usable.
In terms of panoramic photo stiching, I'm sure there's plenty of software, but I can't reccomend anything.
I've done a lot of digital video editing, and I'd say that AfterEffects isn't bad as a compositor, and Premiere is pretty damn good for video editing. Both are partially replaced by Cinerella
Dreamweaver, Flash 5, and Illustrator seem to me to be the killer apps. Most people's pirate copies of photoshop see less use than PaintShopPro. The GIMP beats PSP. I just wish the GIMP had better support for print output -- like CMYK color. Development seems to be halted, with text output broken in the development version.

What about xanim, CrossOver for viewers?

How about Quicktime 4 Linux/Cinelerra, OpenQuicktime, FFMPEG?

Of course you can stream Quicktime (yes virginia, even MPEG4) from Linux as well, using the open-source Darwin Streaming Server.

Is that enough? What more do you want?

Now I don't know if his fears are well founded or not, but I'm sure he had some reason for taking the action of yanking the previously available source. Perhaps an anti-lemon law with an explicit "software made available for no cost is exempted" would be better, although even then I'm not so sure it's a good idea. Should Red Hat be held responsible if one of the beta products in the distribution is buggy (say, the situation with Mozilla a year ago)? Besides, what level of bugginess is okay? Is 99% uptime sufficient? 99.999%? 100%, every crash results in a lawsuit? I just don't know about this...