Slashdot Mirror

It's not the body of the communications that can be trawled, but the headers. The government want to be able to see who is communicating with who, and when. The plan was written about in The Telegraph last monthbut the plans are much older than that. The last Labour government, lover of all things authoritarian, came up with the Interception Modernisation Programme which in its original form would have had details of all electronic communications sent to a central government database. When the government eventually realised that this would be completely impractical they shifted the work to the service providers, who would all have to keep the details of the communications travelling through their networks and give the government access to their database at all times. The service providers realised just how much this would cost and so the government committed £2 billion to cover those costs over ten years. The plan was heavily criticised by the Conservatives, who published a paper titled Reversing the rise of the surveillance state. (Which is still on their website.) It was also criticised backthen by the London School of Economics.The plan was shelved in 2009 after opposition from communications service providers and a realisation that it would not be popular with the public.

After the election, though, the Conservatives decided to resurrect the plan, giving it a new name, theCommunications Capabilities Development Programme. (CCDP) Questions were raised in 2010 bythe Information Commissioner's Officeand it was mentioned in The New Statesman. Now the government are pushing ahead with the CCDP and the queen's speech will say that they intend to introduce legislation to implement the programme as soon as possible.

There are many things wrong with this programme of spying. It is impractical, expensive, a huge violation of our privacy, it places too much power in the hands of government, a government who we cannot trust. Making the full details of who talks to who available will allow security personnel to trawl through our data on fishing trips instead of requiring some basis for suspicion. Combined with the database for Universal Credit, which will be almost as comprehensive as the National IdentityRegisterthat was criticised so much by the Conservatives, and the centralisation of medical records, this provides private information about us all to the government on anunprecedentedscale with huge scope for abuse and for life-destroying mistakes.

If these plans scare you, please write to your MP to tell them your objection to the Communications Capabilities Development Programme. You can use WriteToThem.com to send it if you don't have their details. Pleasesign theOpen Rights Group's petition against government snooping and maybe consider joining the group too.

You do know there are other eyewitnesses who claimed that was not the case? That's your probable cause right there.

Fabulous! New information! I'm for new information. Here is a link showing the eye witness I'm referring to:

In addition, an eyewitness, 13-year-old Austin Brown, told police he saw a man fitting Zimmerman's description lying on the grass moaning and crying for help just seconds before he heard the gunshot that killed Martin.

And here is another report, which seems consistent with the above, and seems to be someone different:

After hearing raised voice, the witness said he peered out of the window and saw two men grappling with each other on the ground, one on top of the other. He said there were two struggles, both of which were on the grass next to a sidewalk. “I heard the yell for help then I heard another as I would describe as an excruciating type of yell. It didn’t even sound like a help it just sounded so painful,” he said. Following the cry, he described hearing “popping” sounds, believed to be multiple gunshots. One of the men then cried out for help.

And of course Zimmerman was treated on the scene for head injuries, which is again consistent with the other reports.

As it was, the police took Zimmerman in for questioning in handcuffs, and released him. They know where he lives.

Do you have a link for me?

I just came to think that it might be a counter-measure to the Iranian high-speed boats. iirc there was a discussion earlier on Slashdot about how difficult they might be to hit with traditional munitions.

How about the English first worry about how few of their schoolchildren speak English?

Priorities people, priorities...

nonsense. The hobbits were from his childhood, where the local fields (around Hall Green) were being slowly built upon. These became Sarumans' mills, and I understand the nasty industrial areas in the black country could easily be Mordor.

There's a reason why its called the Black country... once upon a time, it was described as hell on earth. - Thomas Carlyle described it in 1824 as "A frightful scene ..... a dense cloud of pestilential smoke hangs over it forever ....... and at night the whole region burns like a volcano spitting fire from a thousand tubes of brick. But oh the wretched thousands of mortals who grind out their destiny there!"

Tolkien was born into the (then) leafy area in Warwickshire, you can take the Tolkien Trail though today there is very little left that he'd recognise.

So yes, ok, Brummie orcs. I didn't think the Americans would know the difference :)

whilst there is a good analogy between the little British people (hobbits) kicking the stuff out of the evil empire of Sauron (Hitler), the entire world is based around anglo-saxon myths, so technically it includes Britain, and the northern Germanic and Scandinavian countries.

Dwarves come from the north part of Middle Earth, so it's natural they got Scottish accents, but they could so easily have been Norwegian instead.

The shire, BTW, is Warwickshire (that's wa-rick-shire), there's still a 'tolkien trail' around Hall Green in what is now a very-built-up Birmingham, not the green fields of Tolkien's youth, but the dark satanic mills of Saruman's industrial progress.

The EU dumped cash into them. The US has a powerful coal, oil, gas lobby.
The lack of a neat feedin "tax" and real political cash at risk makes it different in the USA.
The US elite also like their sailing and views. Power is best from the inner fly over states with lots of poverty.
Reality for the UK is setting in http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100142400/wind-farms-even-worse-than-we-thought/
i.e. the feed in tax in the EU and the energy lobby/wealth vote in the US are two different boondoggles that local politics knows how to work with.

More like out and out racist.. http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/tomchiversscience/100147319/top-banter-liam-stacey-is-an-idiot-thats-punishment-enough-for-his-fabrice-muamba-tweets/ I'm sorry, maybe jail is a bit harsh, but two things: 1) If you had said that in public then there is a good chance you would be jailed. 2) He was chucked off is degree course because he is now an inmate at his local prison - not for being racist. I'm all for freedom of speech and keeping big brother out of the interwebs but.. If you are stupid enough to say something like that then you are probably stupid enough to make your identity known.

Start extradition proceedings! Don't the US and UK have an extradition agreement?

Us Brits invented Baseball to, you know.

In case anyone is wondering, here's a post about what he actually did.

We're already receiving that same kind of attention from the USA, to the extent that they're choosing our political leadership for us.

You seem confused about the facts. Some Australians may have given notice to US diplomats that this was happening, but that doesn't mean that the US decided who was going to be the Australian PM any more than you complaining to your neighbor about a bad boss at work makes the neighbor responsible when the boss gets fired.

It was Australians who made the choice, and Australians who voted on who would be the PM, not the US.

Australian coup: the rise and fall of Kevin Rudd

The boy-faced former diplomat was unceremoniously dumped by senior Labour Party power brokers after failing to secure a lift in the opinion polls and angering MPs by his refusal to consult on important policies.

America, China, neither have real Australians interests in mind, so what does it matter who's meddling most?

Based on the content that is at the link, I think I might see where you are going wrong on this point:

. . . the recent Four Corners program has revealed further evidence that the U.S. Government had advance notice of the coup against Rudd. I highly recommend the following article and others on the World Socialist Website to get the real story about Australian politics - make no mistake there is far more than a clash of personalities going on in Canberra right now

Maybe these will help:

How to Kill Poverty
The Black Book of Communism - - - One of the reviews
Why Doesn't Communism Have as Bad a Name as Nazism?
The Road from 1989

No doubt you will feel cheated if Australia doesn't receive all the benefits of Chinese attention that the United States has received.

FBI cracks down on China's elusive army of amateur spies

The FBI estimates that more than 3,000 "front companies" have been established by Chinese nationals in the US specifically to purloin military and economic secrets illegally.

Let Me Count The Ways China Is Stealing Our Secrets

China: Suspected Acquisition of U.S. Nuclear Weapon Secrets

This CRS Report discusses China’s suspected acquisition of U.S. nuclear weapon secrets, including that on the W88, the newest U.S. nuclear warhead.

China's Secret War

Of course, why worry?

China warns Australia against military pact with US
Aussies fear threat of war with China

Just be glad the Germans didn't win a medal . . . . I'm sure they had "Deutschland über alles" and the swastika flag prepared, too.

Quite.

Their Kampf - Hitler’s book in Arab hands.
Mein Kampf for sale, in Arabic

Hitler book bestseller in Turkey
Mein Kampf, best-seller au Qatar
MEIN KAMPF: Palestinkian Best seller
Mein Kampf: Best Seller on the Streets of Bangladesh
Hitler memorabilia 'attracts young Indians'

Hitler's book now available even in Kurdish

Henrik Ahrens, a German citizen living in Erbil and country director of Media Academy-Iraq, a German-funded academy for training and consulting media outlets in Iraq, says seeing Hitler's book in the bookstores of Erbil makes him disappointed, because it is the only book that has a connection to Germany in the market and it is pure Nazi propaganda. "I was living and traveling in other countries in the Middle East and I know that Hitler's book is a best-seller in many countries in the region. I felt that the success of Mein Kampf is related to the existence of Israel, a Jewish state, and a general anti-Semitism in the region. The Nazi ideology and its anti-Semitism match the irrational hate and prejudices of many people in the region. It's sad but true; many people can identify with its content."

Ahrens added that "Here in Kurdistan, it is a bit special because people consider themselves Arians. But the only ideology that distinguished the German people between Arians and non-Arians (Jews, for instance) was Hitler's Nazi propaganda. So, they feel like we're part of one family. But as a matter of fact, Germans didn't identify with being Arian before Hitler and they don't do it today. I guess that most of those who mention these common roots want me to feel welcome. But it actually makes me feel awkward. I feel very welcome, respected and well treated in Kurdistan and even in the non-Arian parts of Iraq."

The Al Qaeda Reader and Mein Kampf
Is today's Jihad a Nazi movement?"

More stolen phones means more phones being replaced, also if you are on contract you can be liable for a huge bill. The UK government had to actually bring in a law requiring carriers to block stolen phones (or threaten to legislate, I can't remember whether the carriers caved before the law was due to introduced).

The Ogallala aquifier is going dry anyway.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/8359076/US-farmers-fear-the-return-of-the-Dust-Bowl.html

true: Apple, directly or indirectly, uses child and slave labor to make consumer electronics.

true: So does everyone else.

true: You don't care.

If you want to cause change: Either mass-protest ALL of these companies and their products (good luck!), or do a startup if you have a better idea.

Otherwise: Stop pretending and continue loving your "precious" at all costs while screwing underage Chinese girls, you disgusting pedophiles.

true: Apple, directly or indirectly, uses child and slave labor to make consumer electronics.

true: So does everyone else.

true: You don't care.

If you want to cause change: Either mass-protest ALL of these companies and their products (good luck!), or do a startup if you have a better idea.

Otherwise: Stop pretending and continue loving your "precious" at all costs while screwing underage Chinese girls, you disgusting pedophiles.

Yes, its amazing how many Americans don't realise he scurried off over there to avoid the fallout from his disgusting obscene phone call "joke". The kind which, naturally, had a member of the public done exactly the same would have got them prosecuted.

The ordinary people will suffer. This is both an act of war and a war-crime. Collective economic punishment as brutal as burning crops and poisoning reservoirs.

The real reason? Protecting the Imperial dollar as supreme instrument of International economic hegemony.

The nukes are a pantomime

Last week, the Tehran Times noted that the Iranian oil bourse will start trading oil in currencies other than the dollar from March 20. This long-planned move is part of President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's vision of economic war with the west.
"The dispute over Iran's nuclear programme is nothing more than a convenient excuse for the US to use threats to protect the 'reserve currency' status of the dollar," the newspaper, which calls itself the voice of the Islamic Revolution, said.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/commodities/9077600/Iran-presses-ahead-with-dollar-attack.html

Beware the "Ahmadinejad" bullshit in the above post. The position of President in Iranian politics has even less power to establish or enforce policy than does that of a US President.

It's about dollar-backed oil.

The UK has three major political parties. All three are authoritarian now. The current Conservative/Liberal authoritarian government is proposing this move; the previous authoritarian Labour government introduced the long term database that tracks where you drive and keeps the information for two years, and handed access to the US in case they wanted to track people.

Indeed, it seems significantly more responsible than the behaviour of the Nottingham constabulary who left an innocent man with a bill for fixing his front door:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/news/9108550/Police-break-into-wrong-house-after-iPhone-mistake.html

The new cable from London to NYSE shaves 6ms off the 65ms trip: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/news/8753784/The-300m-cable-that-will-save-traders-milliseconds.html

The cable follows the curvature of the planet, and the neutrinos don't, so it's already expensive for such an obsolete technology. And Australia gets closer by a factor of about pi/2, even if they have a perfectly optimal cable now. Neutrinos might be slightly faster or slower than photons in the cable, I don't know. So this invention makes it possible to approach the theoretical network latency limit.

Even if it is an American company, the courts would follow English law.

Wouldn't be too sure, it seems the norm for british nationals to be groundlessly extradited to the US... Basically, the US says "extradite this person" and the UK seems to say "ok" no matter what.

Seemed to work ok here:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/energy/oilandgas/8725682/BP-guard-shoots-endangered-polar-bear-in-Alaska.html

That appears to have worked out just fine. The gun did its job and the threat from the polar bear was eliminated. Now if only the threat from environmental whackjobs was so easy to deal with.

Already done......

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/7745868/Scientist-Craig-Venter-creates-life-for-first-time-in-laboratory-sparking-debate-about-playing-god.html

And even if you are friends with someone it doesn't mean they can see your data.

At one point of time Facebook in the "confirm friend request" step let you add friends straight to a friend list of your choice. You could lock down that friend list really tight, so that they couldn't see much, while you _might_ be able to see their data (and thus decide whether "Spongebob" is really someone you know). Doesn't seem possible now. You have to add them as friend first then move them to the restricted list. So there's a window of opportunity for them to get the data out. If I'm wrong about this do tell me how to do it.

But no matter what privacy "controls" and "promises" Facebook provides, Facebook can see all the data and actions, so NATO officials shouldn't be exposing confidential data and actions to FB. Especially since some of that data may be passed to people outside the USA whether by apps/partners or by people who are paid to moderate stuff: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/facebook/9118778/The-dark-side-of-Facebook.html

NATO officials are reluctant to publicly state who was behind the attack, but The Telegraph says China is to blame. The publication quotes classified briefings in which military officers and diplomats were told the evidence pointed to “state-sponsored individuals in China.” The Guardian agrees, quoting a security source who says “the belief is that China is behind this.”

Seemed to work ok here: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/energy/oilandgas/8725682/BP-guard-shoots-endangered-polar-bear-in-Alaska.html

Puh: that's nothing. HMS Victory was launched in 1765, and is still in commission. She's even older than the United States!

If the UK doesn't reverse course on defense cuts, there may not be much more than HMS Victory left to protect the British Isles, and the only waves Britsh sailors will be familiar with are these.

Cuts to the Royal Navy
British defence cuts will help make ADF shipshape
Navy chief: Britain cannot keep up its role in Libya air war due to cuts
Big British defense cuts weaken Pentagon's top military partner
Defense Cuts Mean UK Would Lose A New Falklands War, Veteran Claims

When you write "denies", or "disbelieves", or "holds", you are essentially expressing some sort of qualification on believe. So, to be more straight forward, and I think accurate:

Atheist - A person who believe there is no god, or supreme beings.
Agnostic - A person who believes we don't know or can't know if god or supreme beings exist.

Once confronted with the question, "Does God exist?", there are pretty much three options: Yes, No, I don't know.

Saying no, means you believe that God doesn't exist, since you can't really prove that in any rigorous, universal way. Realistically you can't know that.

"Atheism is the most daring of all dogmas, for it is the assertion of a universal negative." - G.K. Chesterton

Richard Dawkins: I can't be sure God does not exist

There was surprise when Prof Dawkins acknowledged that he was less than 100 per cent certain of his conviction that there is no creator.

The philosopher Sir Anthony Kenny, who chaired the discussion, interjected: “Why don’t you call yourself an agnostic?” Prof Dawkins answered that he did.

An incredulous Sir Anthony replied: “You are described as the world’s most famous atheist.”

Prof Dawkins said that he was “6.9 out of seven” sure of his beliefs.

“I think the probability of a supernatural creator existing is very very low,” he added.

Collins: Why this scientist believes in God - Dr. Francis Collins

THE RELATION OF SCIENCE AND RELIGION - Some fresh observations on an old problem - by RICHARD P. FEYNMAN

The Public Face of Religion in America

Matthew Parris: As an atheist, I truly believe Africa needs God

Yet, they haven't shot at anyone.

Unlike certain free country which is pillaging and burning things around the world, both militarily and politically.

Stop that fucking nonsense, ok?

Since what you wrote is false, how about you first?

State Sponsors: Iran

Iranians 'targeted Israeli diplomats' - Published: 15/02/2012 at 04:35 PM

Thai authorities charged two Iranians on Wednesday over an alleged bomb plot against Israeli diplomats, officials said, piling pressure on Teheran over accusations of a terror campaign against the Jewish state.

Authorities said they had laid criminal charges against two Iranian suspects accused of involvement in the three blasts in central Bangkok yesterday.

One of the men -- named as 28-year-old Saeid Morati -- lost both legs after he hurled an explosive device at police while fleeing an earlier blast at a house in the capital. The satchel containing the bomb, which he threw at a police vehicle, bounced off another vehicle and exploded at his feet.

A second Iranian suspect, Mohammad Hazaei, was detained trying to board a flight out of the country at Suvarnabhumi airport. A third Iranian suspect is believed to have fled to Malaysia, officials said.

"These three Iranian men are an assassination team and their targets were Israeli diplomats including the ambassador," a senior Thai intelligence official told AFP, speaking on condition of anonymity.

"Their plan was to attach bombs to diplomats' cars." . . . .

Israel accused Iran of orchestrating attacks on Israeli embassy staff in India and Georgia on Monday.

An Israeli diplomat in New Delhi suffered grave shrapnel wounds when a motorbike assailant attached a bomb to her car on Monday.

Experts: Iran's Quds Force Deeply Enmeshed in Iraq

U.S. blames Iran for new bombs in Iraq

Iran’s Quds Force was blamed for attacks on U.S. troops in Iraq

Iran's Quds Force: Supporting Terrorism Worldwide

Leader of Iran’s Al-Quds Forces Says Iraq and Southern Lebanon Are Under His Control

Iran threatens to close Strait of Hormuz over EU oil sanctions

Iranian weapons seized in Afghanistan

One more, then I'm going to stop since this could easily turn into a seemingly never-ending story. I've hardly touched on Iran's activities around the world. I've hardly even scratched the surface of Iran's involvement in Lebanon, and with Hezbollah, and the massive amount of arms that they've been providing. You do know that Hezbollah, aiming at the desturction of Israel, has 50,000 rockets now, right?

Simon Wiesenthal Center: Iranian Calls to Destroy Jewish People Unparalleled Since Nazi Germany

Frankly, I'm baffled by how people miss this. I guess it doesn't come up at the "anti-Zionist" meeting

Yet, they haven't shot at anyone.

Unlike certain free country which is pillaging and burning things around the world, both militarily and politically.

Stop that fucking nonsense, ok?

Since what you wrote is false, how about you first?

State Sponsors: Iran

Iranians 'targeted Israeli diplomats' - Published: 15/02/2012 at 04:35 PM

Thai authorities charged two Iranians on Wednesday over an alleged bomb plot against Israeli diplomats, officials said, piling pressure on Teheran over accusations of a terror campaign against the Jewish state.

Authorities said they had laid criminal charges against two Iranian suspects accused of involvement in the three blasts in central Bangkok yesterday.

One of the men -- named as 28-year-old Saeid Morati -- lost both legs after he hurled an explosive device at police while fleeing an earlier blast at a house in the capital. The satchel containing the bomb, which he threw at a police vehicle, bounced off another vehicle and exploded at his feet.

A second Iranian suspect, Mohammad Hazaei, was detained trying to board a flight out of the country at Suvarnabhumi airport. A third Iranian suspect is believed to have fled to Malaysia, officials said.

"These three Iranian men are an assassination team and their targets were Israeli diplomats including the ambassador," a senior Thai intelligence official told AFP, speaking on condition of anonymity.

"Their plan was to attach bombs to diplomats' cars." . . . .

Israel accused Iran of orchestrating attacks on Israeli embassy staff in India and Georgia on Monday.

An Israeli diplomat in New Delhi suffered grave shrapnel wounds when a motorbike assailant attached a bomb to her car on Monday.

Experts: Iran's Quds Force Deeply Enmeshed in Iraq

U.S. blames Iran for new bombs in Iraq

Iran’s Quds Force was blamed for attacks on U.S. troops in Iraq

Iran's Quds Force: Supporting Terrorism Worldwide

Leader of Iran’s Al-Quds Forces Says Iraq and Southern Lebanon Are Under His Control

Iran threatens to close Strait of Hormuz over EU oil sanctions

Iranian weapons seized in Afghanistan

One more, then I'm going to stop since this could easily turn into a seemingly never-ending story. I've hardly touched on Iran's activities around the world. I've hardly even scratched the surface of Iran's involvement in Lebanon, and with Hezbollah, and the massive amount of arms that they've been providing. You do know that Hezbollah, aiming at the desturction of Israel, has 50,000 rockets now, right?

Simon Wiesenthal Center: Iranian Calls to Destroy Jewish People Unparalleled Since Nazi Germany

Frankly, I'm baffled by how people miss this. I guess it doesn't come up at the "anti-Zionist" meeting

> "First off all many Arab nations and people question the existence of Israel, that doesn't mean they want to nuke the entire country and kill all of its citizens, it just means they don't recognize Israel as a legitimate state. Kind of like the U.S. doesn't really recognize Palestine as a legitimate state."

It should be mentioned that none of the countries in Western Europe recognize the Palestinian state, nor does Canada or Mexico.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_recognition_of_the_State_of_Palestine

Also, the Arab non-recognition of Israel is not like the US (or European or Canadian) non-recognition of Palestine.

For example: During the Clinton administration, the US offered the Palestinians $30 billion dollars in part of a deal to broker peace between Israel and Palestine. The US is going out of it's way to broker peace deals. http://www.deseretnews.com/article/776477/US-offered-30-billion-PLO-says.html

On the other hand, Iran's Khamenei said Israel is a "cancerous tumor that should be cut and will be cut" and "From now on, in any place, if any nation or any group confronts the Zionist regime, we will endorse and we will help. We have no fear expressing this," said Khamenei.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iran/9059179/Iran-We-will-help-cut-out-the-cancer-of-Israel.html

Israel's neighbors have also invaded Israel several times.

From that perspective, the US non-recognition of Palestine is just a sticky diplomatic point for US conservatives, so people don't touch it. The Arab non-recognition of Israel is because they would like to wipe it off the face of the earth.

Of course, I'm not arguing that we should invade or bomb Iran. I'm just pointing out the reality of the situation.

You mean this one? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthnews/8282028/Michael-Mann-vows-to-keep-up-the-street-fight-against-climate-change-deniers.html

Hi, UK here.

We had a third party, the Liberal Democrats.

It all kind of went downhill when they did the exact opposite of the thing that they explicitly said that would do. They pretty much do everything our highly unpopular Conservative Party tells them to. In doing so, they forfeit the tiny bit of credibility that fell to them mostly by default, after our previous highly unpopular Labour government departed.

Scotland will vote for independence

Only if there's no fucking democracy. I live in England, will I get to vote? I'm as Scottish as most people in Scotland, and I'm British not English. An independent Scotland will impact me, I think it's only fair that I get to vote on it.

We also can go to university and not have to pay fees
we have no toll bridges any more, they are all free too
they are actually building more social housing than labour and also not doing it on the disaster that is PFI

Sure. England and Wales would have those things too if the Scottish MPs hadn't voted against it.

Trust me, I'd actually vote for an independent Scotland so that the fucking Scots can't keep voting for anti-English policies. Then I'll claim dual citizenship because - get this - I'm fucking British, not English, not Scottish, not Irish, not Welsh. I have an equal right to live, work and fuck anywhere in the United Kingdom and I will retain that right.

we now have signs up everywhere in our own language Scots Gaelic, and a resurgence of interest in it promoted by the Scots govt

Meanwhile, the rest of the world speaks a common language and looks on you with contempt.

And they have done much besides all the while labour, the liberals and the fucking tories fill their pockets from public funds in expenses

Unlike, say, the leader of the SNP:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/5299733/Alex-Salmond-claimed-800-for-food-on-MPs-expenses-during-recess.html

I personally think that's just fucking corrupt, but hey, maybe you want him running your country.

Welcome to the UK. Pretty much everyone is a criminal by default and the game is simply to stay ahead of the police.

Unless you're a Muzzie, when its even legal for you to throw shoes at police. The UK has gone crazy, native British not allowed to do anything whereas groups who's avowed intent is to destroy freedom and democracy and set up a primative theocracy are given rights to do pretty-much what they like

But the fact remains that for about 10,000 years, since the end of the last glaciation the level of CO2 remained at about 280 ppm.

That's not a fact, that's a supposition based on the accuracy of a proxy. CO2 levels vary *wildly* on the local scale, so much so that the official CO2 measurements at Mauna Kea have to throw out outlying data to avoid measuring local disturbances:

http://www.esrl.noaa.gov/gmd/ccgg/about/co2_measurements.html

" The upslope air may have CO2 that has been lowered by plants removing CO2 through photosynthesis at lower elevations on the island, although the CO2 decrease arrives later than the change in wind direction, because the observatory is surrounded by miles of bare lava."

It's true that a doubling of CO2 would cause about 1C of warming from the CO2 alone but that ignores the feedbacks it produces.

Actually you're right - it obviously doesn't create 1C of warming because negative feedbacks have kept it to about 0.8C. If these negative feedbacks didn't exist, we should have seen much more warming over the past 100 years...and we haven't.

Again, Lindzen: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02148/RSL-HouseOfCommons_2148505a.pdf

So it's a carbon neutral cycle.

That's a false assumption. Thinking that without humans CO2 levels are somehow in perfect equilibrium is untenable.

The fact of the matter is that the CO2 cycle in the atmosphere is dynamic, going in and out of equilibrium on both local, regional and global levels. The system responds to these disruptions of equilibrium with various negative feedbacks, at various time intervals. There's the time it takes for CO2 to be absorbed by oceans, the time it takes for CO2 to be absorbed by plants, the time it takes for plants to be eaten by animals, and for them to release CO2 - it's a dynamic, not static situation.

And when it comes right down to it, CO2, while its theoretical impact for doubling is 1C, is mostly outweighed by negative feedbacks. Lindzen had another wonderful presentation on it recently: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02148/RSL-HouseOfCommons_2148505a.pdf

CO2 does not care if it has spent millions of years in calcium carbonate from before being dissolved in water, and outgassed as temperatures rise. CO2 does not care if it has just come out of a human exhaling, or a tree burning. The idea of a "carbon cycle" with any sort of equilibrium (much less without negative feedbacks to dampen changes in either direction) is...wanting.

Actually there are electronic payment systems that can preserve privacy, if I remember correctly Applied Cryptography explains the whole thing quite well: the basic idea is to have digital certificates which are signed with blind signatures. You could even print them out and use them like cash notes. The real issue is that an electronic payment system with no tracking is not wanted by the government, and is probably illegal in most Western nations, which have implemented strict Know Your Customer and Anti Money Laundering regulations.

In practice, digital value transfer systems that have worked outside the legal frameworks of the West, like egold, became havens of crime and HYIP scams. The operators of egold were alledgedly well aware of the nature of their customers trade - their database supposedly had a notes field with insights like "known child pornographer" "drug dealer" etc. (egold was not anonymous to the server operators, so they had some degree of insight into what was going on). Larger scale "anonymous" systems (off shore banks etc.) are drivers of large scale tax evasion. It is no coincidence that many offshore Swiss accounts were closed when Switzerland announced that it would be collecting taxes on foreign accounts - even though it was to be done in a privacy preserving way, with no personal data being sent to the account holder's national government.

So, the issue is a bit complex. It is hard to justify large scale adoption of similar systems without some idea of the effect it would have on society and the economy. Whilst I like the idea of a non-government controlled currency, the prospect of people switching to a non-regulated currency also has significant downsides for the long-term. Large scale tax evasion would inevitably lead to calls for more government control; not only is it perceived as unfair, but an inability to raise taxes can have significant negative effects on an economy. A lack of accountability would inevitably lead to more Ponzi scams and tracking the proceeds of organised crime would be impossible, which would be a big problem for law enforcement.

I disagree; ChromeOS is dead, it has been superseded by Android, particularly after the launch of the Transformer and now Chrome itself. Sergey Brin had already said in 2009 that the two would likely converge at some point in the future and in my opinion, that's mostly done.

I'd like to see them test the ripping out a man's heart one, though I'm not sure PETA will appreciate them testing on live animals.

Been there, done that: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/7787039/Cage-fighter-ripped-out-heart-of-training-partner.html

You only need one freaked out cage fighter plus random victim.

I didn't say we were no where near the point of the curve. I said where the point was is debatable.

Furthermore, I don't care where the point is for the purposes of this discussion. I merely said the curve itself exists. I pointed out that many democrats deny the entire existence of the curve which actually has to exist. It's not possible for it not to exist. And yet, they deny its existence. There are several people commenting to me in this thread that have repeatedly done that.

And did I say any of this to suggest democrats were less likely to listen to reason? No. I merely said you were the SAME. Get over yourself. You're human beings. The average test scores for democrats going through school is a C AVERAGE just like the republicans or any other political party that wins POPULAR elections. You're not a race of ubermen. You're just people... and like all people you have a large collection of idiots. I'll stress an obvious implication because some people are slow... I am saying BOTH parties have around the same proportion of idiots in their ranks. I am NOT claiming some sort of ideological superiority. The very act of aligning yourself with any large group of people tends to mean you aligned yourself with a bunch of idiots. That sounds elitist but it's simply statistics. And democrat idiots deny the laffer curve. I say that because everyone that has ever done so to me has been a democrat or a political analog of the same. And you'd have to be pretty ignorant of basic logic and economics to deny the laffer curve. It elementary. It's seriously 1+1=2 sort of logic here. Again, where the curve starts and peaks is debatable. That it exists is not.

As to where the curve starts... just for fun... I thought this was sort of funny. There was an article in the UK today about the British possibly finding the laffer curve! They increased a tax and got less revenue.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/consumertips/tax/9097219/50p-tax-rate-failing-to-boost-revenues.html

Now, I am not saying that is a confirmation of the peak on the laffer curve for england. There could be lots of reasons for why revenue fell when the taxes went up. Maybe the economy declined for entirely unrelated reasons. Whatever. This is at MOST a data point. If we get a few dozen more data points from the UK or very similar economies that all seem to show a peak around this number... then tentatively we might conclude that COULD be where the peak of the curve is in the UK and similar economies.

Anyway, I found it funny that this article came out just as I was getting attacked by dozens of angry poodles on the internet.

How often do over reaching laws get repealed? How often does government say "hey we don't need to regulate this realm anymore because circumstances have changed"?
  How often have you seen governments de-centralize things in order to make them more responsive to the needs of the citizens they serve?

Rarely, but it does happen. It does remain to be seen if anything will come of this. However it also remains to be seen if anything will come of the proposals in the article under discussion. A proposal is not a law.

If you do live in the UK, and you do care about the governance of the country in which you live, there are ways of making your voice heard. If we chose not to make use of those avenues, or we chose to limit our actions to posting here then we have only ourselves to blame.

If you're not with Ron Paul and the Freedom movement, you're part of the problem.

If you do not live in the UK, and you're posting in response to an article regarding proposed changes to the law in the UK, why the f*ck does Ron Paul have anything to do with it?

WHAT ARE WE DOING TO OUR WORLD??

Labour wanted mass immigration to make UK more multicultural, says former adviser
Most UK Muslims will vote Labour
British Muslims recruited to fight for 'al-Qaeda' in Somalia
Hate preacher: One day we will stone adulterers
Sharia: a law unto itself?
'Record rise' in UK anti-Semitism
Assimilation’s Failure, Terrorism’s Rise
U.K. Cuts to Military Will Curb Influence
Iran cuts oil exports to UK and France

Much of Europe is in deep trouble.

The US might avoid the worst of it.... if it can prevent Iran from tossing a nuke at it and the EMP sends life back to 1901. The major European powers were supposed to put a lid on the problem - it didn't work out that way.

WHAT ARE WE DOING TO OUR WORLD??

Labour wanted mass immigration to make UK more multicultural, says former adviser
Most UK Muslims will vote Labour
British Muslims recruited to fight for 'al-Qaeda' in Somalia
Hate preacher: One day we will stone adulterers
Sharia: a law unto itself?
'Record rise' in UK anti-Semitism
Assimilation’s Failure, Terrorism’s Rise
U.K. Cuts to Military Will Curb Influence
Iran cuts oil exports to UK and France

Much of Europe is in deep trouble.

The US might avoid the worst of it.... if it can prevent Iran from tossing a nuke at it and the EMP sends life back to 1901. The major European powers were supposed to put a lid on the problem - it didn't work out that way.

WHAT ARE WE DOING TO OUR WORLD??

Labour wanted mass immigration to make UK more multicultural, says former adviser
Most UK Muslims will vote Labour
British Muslims recruited to fight for 'al-Qaeda' in Somalia
Hate preacher: One day we will stone adulterers
Sharia: a law unto itself?
'Record rise' in UK anti-Semitism
Assimilation’s Failure, Terrorism’s Rise
U.K. Cuts to Military Will Curb Influence
Iran cuts oil exports to UK and France

Much of Europe is in deep trouble.

The US might avoid the worst of it.... if it can prevent Iran from tossing a nuke at it and the EMP sends life back to 1901. The major European powers were supposed to put a lid on the problem - it didn't work out that way.

There are some major issues, here.

One, I'm familiar with the study you linked concerning housework distribution. Are you aware that in that study, half again as many men were employed full-time as the women? Do you agree that if one person is employed full time and the other isn't, that the one that is not should take on a greater share of housework? Also, you claim the link points out a correction for this, but I don't see one. Can you cite, please?

Two, recent studies show that lesbian couples experience domestic violence at a similar rate to heterosexual couples, and it is known that men underreport, so I wouldn't say the situation is so cut and dries as "man=criminal, woman=victim."

Three, you attack the "women want wealth" position as not being supported, but cursory searching turns up evidence. Here's a couple:
Women more attracted to men in expensive cars
Women's orgasm frequency increases with the wealth of their partner

Carrying it so far as to imply the majority of divorces are because of crimes perpetrated by men is, frankly, sensationalist. I have seen deep discourse from you on this site, so I know you are not trolling, but your claims, implications, and position here are not defensible.