Review of SuSE 8.2

Pronounciation by n-baxley · 2003-05-01 04:40 · Score: 3, Interesting

A bit OT here, but I have no idea how you pronounce SuSE. Is it like Sussie or like Sousa (without the a)?

Just curious. Maybe this is a lInix/lEEnix thing.

--

THIS SPACE FOR RENT

Re:Pronounciation by reiggin · 2003-05-01 04:42 · Score: 0, Informative

The former. Sue-see. Hence the spelling with the capital "E" at the end indicating its stress.
Re:Pronounciation by Laplace · 2003-05-01 04:43 · Score: 2, Informative

Sousa is correct.

--
The middle mind speaks!
Re:Pronounciation by greenskyx · 2003-05-01 04:43 · Score: 2, Informative

Suse, rymes with Moose... ? That's what I was always told atleast... let me know if I'm wrong...
Re:Pronounciation by ramzak2k · 2003-05-01 04:45 · Score: 1

I believe it is the later - Sousa (without the A). You could also also call it linux with a lizard , they will understand.

--

Siggy Say, Siggy Do
Re:Pronounciation by Afreet23 · 2003-05-01 04:46 · Score: 5, Informative

This should answer your questions.

--
-Afreet
Re:Pronounciation by Elbereth · 2003-05-01 04:50 · Score: 2, Funny

I'm going to tell RMS that you didn't call it GNU/Linux! You'll be sorry when the jackbooted thugs break into your mom's basement and beat you to within an inch of your life, all the time yelling, "GNU/Linux! GNU/Linux! GNU/Linux!"

Who's scared of the BSA, governemnt, multinational corporations, the CIA, or terrorists? You should be scared of the FSF!
Re:Pronounciation by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 04:51 · Score: 0, Informative

Informative...yet utterly wrong. See the susefaq link below.
Re:Pronounciation by jonfelder · 2003-05-01 04:52 · Score: 5, Informative

Who modded this informative? It's wrong. The proper pronounciation is soo'-suh
Re:Pronounciation by shamilton · 2003-05-01 04:53 · Score: 1

Nope, with the a. Soo sah. It's an acronym, and the (German?) word the E stands for starts with an "ah" sound.

--
"[A] high IQ is like a Jeep; you will still get stuck, just farther from help!" --Just d' FAQs, c.g.a
Re:Pronounciation by arvindn · 2003-05-01 04:55 · Score: 3, Informative

SuSE being a German company, I think it should be "soozeh" (which, IIRC, is how SuSE wants it pronounced).
BTW, suse used to be an acronym ("System und Software Entwicklung"), but no longer is. (in contrast to many things in the computing world which started out not being acronyms but later got expansions tacked on to them, like BASIC).
Re:Pronounciation by Daimaou · 2003-05-01 05:01 · Score: 4, Funny

Oh, I've been calling "Soooooossss", all slow and exaggerated out like that. I feel like a freaking idiot.

Thanks for the acronym and pronunciation information.

However, I don't feel ALL dumb because at least I didn't mispell the word proNUNciation (although I probably mispelled others).

Okay, now I feel like a pud again for spontaneously turning into a grammar officer.

Dammit SuSE! Why couldn't you have been easy to pronounce in the first place and saved me all this shame?
Re:Pronounciation by the+bluebrain · 2003-05-01 05:03 · Score: 1

I can only say how it is pronounced in German (and SuSE is a German company, after all): sooz-eh

(... which makes it look Canadian ... go figure ... )

/yesOfCourseThisIsImportant

--
yes, we have no bananas
Re:Pronounciation by Qbertino · 2003-05-01 05:03 · Score: 4, Informative

In germany we pronounce it "Suse". Haha.

Ok, so the first part sounds like "Sue" or "Soo" with a sharp "S" - something like the first sylable in "soup" (like chicken).
The second part is "suh" or "ze", like the last sylable in "nose" (sphinx) or "hose" (gardening).

Note that in german you can read pronounciation even if you have never heard the word before. German pupils can usually read - if not very fluently - after 3 months in school!
I wonder if a semi-unification of writing and speech, like unifying the writing of sylables (something like "nite" instead of "night") would help the iliteracy problem in the US in any way.

To me personally the difference is very significant since both english and german are my mothertounge. I learned both at the same time along with all the advantages and disadvantages. One being that my spelling in both is not that good, whilst I'm able to pronounce third languages (such as maybe french or japanese) allmost accent free. I account this to the oral 'flexibility' you gain from growing up with a german mother and a texacan father, meaning two somewhat different languages in terms of pronounciation. :-)

--
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
Re:Pronounciation by gmuslera · 2003-05-01 05:03 · Score: 1

They have t-shirts for merchandising. One of them say in the front "How do you say superb in Linux?" and in the back the answer for your question: "SuSE.{soo' sah} is {soo' purb}" (not sure how to put that soo in both are with a line over and u is with ^ over, my HTML is not good enough for phonetical writing.
Re:Pronounciation by jdray · 2003-05-01 05:09 · Score: 1

Actually, if I remember my German alphabet correctly, it's (phonetically) like this:
ah, bay, say, day, ay, eff, gay...

--
The Spoon
Updated 6/28/2011
Re:Pronounciation by ClippyHater · 2003-05-01 05:15 · Score: 1

Yes, the letter 'E' (English long e) is pronouned as English long a. When a letter 'e' ends a word, it is pronounced more or less 'ah'.
Re:Pronounciation by Zemran · 2003-05-01 05:25 · Score: 1

Who cares how you pronounce Sussie as long as she goes :)

--
I love stacking my barbecues in the shed at the end of summer - you can't beat a bit of grill on grill action.
Re:Pronounciation by 2logic · 2003-05-01 05:30 · Score: 1

Let's see how a computer generated German voice would pronounce it.
Sorry people, the German chick has spoken. She MUST be right, after all, she's a computer... and a German one too!

--
// TODO
Re:Pronounciation by Fishstick · 2003-05-01 05:35 · Score: 1

I always thought it was pronounced same as this

although I never said it out loud (always just heard it in my head when I read or typed the name).

comes from the German acronym "Software und Systementwicklung"

I did not know that!

--
There is much cruelty in the universe, John.
Yeah, we seem to have the tour map.
Re:Pronounciation by Jack+Hughes · 2003-05-01 06:25 · Score: 1

Test your vocabulary: 20 questions [cjb.net]
..Well, I got 20/20 in 180 seconds.
..so now what? (does everyone get 20/20?)
Re:Pronounciation by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 06:28 · Score: 0

I've pointed this out before, but in Zulu (which
is spoken a lot here in Zululand), most of these
pronunciations sound like the Zulu word for "fart".

I've wondered if this doesn't undermine the good
work done by translate.org.za and SuSE's support
of languages like Zulu and Xhose in S. Africa...
Re:Pronounciation by arvindn · 2003-05-01 06:32 · Score: 1

Try to get 20/20 in under 60 secs. I usually do.
Re:Pronounciation by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 07:24 · Score: 0

like Sousa (without the a)?

Actually, like Sousa with the a.

Like many computer names it is an acronym.
That is also the reason the u is lowercase.

System und Software Entwicklung (System and Software Development)

I might have the 'S' words reversed, I don't remember for sure.
Re:Pronounciation by Wastl · 2003-05-01 07:25 · Score: 1

You pronounce the "u" like in "true" and the "e" like in "the" (before a consonant). S like s.

Sebastian
Re:Pronounciation by BriSTO(V)L · 2003-05-01 07:26 · Score: 1

I appreciate the helpful post from a German, but here in the UK, "nose" and "hose" only have *one* syllable, so the explanation still isn't clear to me...
Re:Pronounciation by Wastl · 2003-05-01 07:28 · Score: 1

Since SuSE is a German company you pronounce the letters like in German, which in turn is very close to Latin. "e" like in "the", but a little longer. "u" like in "true" or "school". Don't know how to pronounce "suh" properly.:-)

Sebastian
Re:Pronounciation by Rolo+Tomasi · 2003-05-01 07:31 · Score: 1

Yep.

--
Did you know you can fertilize your lawn with used motor oil?
Re:Pronounciation by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 07:31 · Score: 0

Actually, if I remember my German alphabet correctly, it's (phonetically) like this:

In english you have ay, bee, see

but the a in the word cat doesn't make it come out like the a in kate or crate.
Re:Pronounciation by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 07:34 · Score: 0

Sounds like "Zoo-zeh".
Re:Pronounciation by Graspee_Leemoor · 2003-05-01 07:36 · Score: 1

"You could also also call it linux with a lizard , they will understand."

I have always called it "lizardy linux".

But then I can be sickeningly cute.

graspee
Re:Pronounciation by Spudley · 2003-05-01 08:13 · Score: 1

...but I never trust anyone who calls *themself* "sickeningly cute"!

--
(Spudley Strikes Again!)
Re:Pronounciation by amber_lux · 2003-05-01 08:24 · Score: 1

most of these pronunciations sound like the Zulu word for "fart".

Now I'm trying to remember what that word in Tswana and Sutho is.

I've wondered if this doesn't undermine the good work done by translate.org.za and SuSE's support of languages

Their decision to not implement spell checkers in Zulu/Xhosa/Venda/Pedi/Sutho/Tswana probably undermines things more.

Wondering if creating a dictionary in Aspell is really that hard. The noun classes and related concords do make it more difficult than, say Afrikaans.

like Zulu and Xhose in S. Africa...

The ditty:
Igqira lendlela nguqo ngqothwane
Igqira lendlela nguqo ngqothwane
Sebeqabele gqi thapha bathi nguqo ngqothwane
Sebeqabele gqi thapha bathi nguqo ngqothwane
neither killed nor disuaded Europeans trying to learn Xhosa.

Wind under Thy Wings

Amber

Wind under Thy Wings

Amber

--
Suppose you did.
Suppose you did not.
Re:Pronounciation by Arandir · 2003-05-01 08:42 · Score: 1

I wonder if a semi-unification of writing and speech, like unifying the writing of sylables (something like "nite" instead of "night") would help the iliteracy problem in the US in any way.

Nah, it won't help the illiteracy problem. Literacy is getting worse with no change in the language or spelling. It's a social problem, not a language problem.

But why does English have such "wierd" spelling? Two reasons. One is that it borrowed heavily from Latin, Saxon, German, French, Spanish, as well as their spelling. The second problem was the spelling reform. The spelling reform happened both too late and too early. It happened too late because some spellings were already codified for pronunciations that had sinced changed. And it happened too early since the language has continued to change since then.

If you think the silent letters in English spelling is bad, take a look at French! No offense to the French, but your spellings, while very consistant, have little relation anymore to the pronunciation.

--
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
Re:Pronounciation by pNutz · 2003-05-01 09:20 · Score: 1

German, eh?

We'll call it "Liberty Linux"

--
Death and danger are my various breads and various butters.
Re:Pronounciation by philovivero · 2003-05-01 11:42 · Score: 1

I pronounce it like "suse" as if the first letter were an S, the second a U, the third an S, and the last an E.

Naturally, this cannot be correct.

It would be as though Linux had a long-I sound, or GNU had a silent G.

--
fifth sigma, inc.
Re:Pronounciation by facelessnumber · 2003-05-01 11:57 · Score: 1

I wonder if a semi-unification of writing and speech, like unifying the writing of sylables (something like "nite" instead of "night") would help the iliteracy problem in the US in any way.

Great! Let's GPL the idea and call it GNUspeak.
Re:Pronounciation by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 11:57 · Score: 0

That's okay, Daimaou, no-one's perfect.

Do note, however, that you are guilty of employing "because" after a negative clause, thus causing ambiguity. What made you "not feel ALL dumb": that you spelt the word correctly or incorrectly?

As well, you employed a double negative.

Rest-assured your spelling is fine. Perhaps you should consider the role of "spelling bee", as your grammar is dreadful.
Re:Pronounciation by runderwo · 2003-05-01 13:40 · Score: 1

However, I don't feel ALL dumb because at least I didn't mispell the word proNUNciation (although I probably mispelled others).
The irony is unbearable. :)

--
LRC, the best-read libertarian site on the web
Re:Pronounciation by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 20:07 · Score: 0

Again, who modded this informative? It's wrong. The proper pronounciation is soo'-suh
Re:Pronounciation by Smid · 2003-05-01 22:10 · Score: 1

>SuSE being a German company, I think it should be "soozeh" (which, IIRC, is how SuSE wants it pronounced).

Is that Kaizer Soozeh's company?
Re:Pronounciation by Daimaou · 2003-05-02 06:05 · Score: 1

Actually, my grammar and my spelling were both wrong on purpose. It was a subtle part of the overall package (i.e. mispell instead of misspell, mispelled instead of misspelled, double negative, etc.)
Re:Pronounciation by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-02 07:44 · Score: 0

like the last sylable in "nose" (sphinx) or "hose" (gardening)

Yeah, except the English word "nose" and "hose" are not usually pronounced "no"-"suh" or "ho"-"ze". The "e" in these two words is silent. The "e" does serve a purpose. It says, pronounce the vowel "o" as a long "o" instead of a short.

These words sound more like "noz" or "hoz". So if the "SE" in "SuSE" were pronounced like the "se" in "nose" and "hose", SuSE would sound like "sooz".

The German pronunciation of "SE" in "SuSE" sounds more like the English pronunciation of the "za" "pizza" (should be easy enough for geeks to remember).

(sheez!) If everything in the open source world sounded like Mountain Dew or Pizza this pronunciation thing would be much easier. ...wait a tick. Is that really "she"-"suh".
Re:Pronounciation by BenTels0 · 2003-05-03 20:50 · Score: 1

I always call it "zoooozuh". It's a German company and the Germans pronounce an "s" like a "z" and a "u" like "ooooo" (like a ghost rattling its chains). They also don't do silent vowels on the end, so I make it zooozuh.

This did not happen by Mohammed+Al-Sahaf · 2003-05-01 04:41 · Score: 5, Funny

Suse 8.2 was not reviewed - in fact it was never released! This entire article is a lie! We have destroyed 2 tanks, fighter planes, 2 helicopters and their shovels - We have driven them back. As for The Register, I have detailed information about the situation...which completely proves that what they allege are illusions . . . They lie every day.

--
Former Iraqi Information Minister Mohammed Saeed al-Sahaf

Re:This did not happen by water-and-sewer · 2003-05-01 05:43 · Score: 3, Funny

Wow, Mohammed Saeed Al Sahaf has his own Slashdot user number.

This will be funny once or twice. After that I look forward to modding you DOWN, dude.

What about Natalie Portman? Is she registered?

--
If this were Usenet, I'd killfile the lot of you.
Re:This did not happen by morcheeba · 2003-05-01 07:22 · Score: 1

Actually, by the looks of it, it was funny 11 times so far. But, two recent posts have been only '1', so it looks like it's on the decline. This will make a cool graph in 3 months time.

--
HIV Crosses Species Barrier... into Muppets
Re:This did not happen by SeanAhern · 2003-05-01 09:50 · Score: 1

Tiny nit:

Your sig should instead link to the journal entry itself rather than your whole journal. It's been a while since you posted that one, so at first glance your link appears not to make sense.
Re:This did not happen by rkz · 2003-05-01 11:11 · Score: 1

You have a fan site: http://welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/

--
There is no god
Re:This did not happen by Mohammed+Al-Sahaf · 2003-05-01 11:13 · Score: 3, Funny

After that I look forward to modding you DOWN, dude.
You can try. I will welcome you with bullets and shoes. Some moderators tried already to downvote me; by the grace of Allah they were destroyed. They will try to enter Baghdad, and I think this is where their graveyard will be. Iraq will spread them even more and chop them up.

--
Former Iraqi Information Minister Mohammed Saeed al-Sahaf
Re:This did not happen by morcheeba · 2003-05-01 11:17 · Score: 1

Thanks, I updated my sig! Hopefully that entry isn't too stale, but I haven't come up with anything especially interesting, except aol kills puppies

--
HIV Crosses Species Barrier... into Muppets
Re:This did not happen by kupci · 2003-05-01 17:04 · Score: 1

Indeed, about as funny as a reference to NP.

This is a good review by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 04:41 · Score: 5, Informative

This review of SuSE is much more informative:
http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=3163

Re:This is a good review by Elbereth · 2003-05-01 04:52 · Score: 5, Funny

BEWARE! Link to article written by Eugenia! DON'T CLICK!!
Re:This is a good review by wct · 2003-05-01 04:59 · Score: 1

OSNews hosted Eugenia articles - a goatse.cx for the next generation of slashdotters.
Re:This is a good review by FortKnox · 2003-05-01 05:21 · Score: 1

Eugenia never does a good job at reviews. She only reviews the parts she's interested in, never the whole story.

The only time you see a good review from her is when she copy-pastes them from other reviews (and she used to get pissed when people put her articles in slashdot in case of 'slashdotting').

--
Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
Re:This is a good review by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:33 · Score: 0

Fuck that bitch, and fuck her asinine opinions.
Re:This is a good review by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:34 · Score: 0

::::The only time you see a good review from her is when she copy-pastes them from other reviews

wow, I have seen lots of lies on the web about people, but going into such lengths as in your post, is really a first.
It seems that Eugenia really pisses you off. What's wrong? Did she say that your favorite distro actually sucks?
Re:This is a good review by Rudy+Rodarte · 2003-05-01 06:54 · Score: 3, Funny

Sorry, I only listen to reviews from Eugenia. Thats why I still run windows 3.11!

--
What, me Tweet?
Re:This is a good review by hkmwbz · 2003-05-01 07:43 · Score: 1

While I don't have a problem with a review being a personal opinion, and never an objective look at how it will work for everyone, I must agree that statements like "most of the users don't use ISDN for example" are completely useless. How does the reviewer know this? And what possible reason could she have for including it? To justify nonsensical comments which she is unable to defend in other ways?
That said, this review wasn't too bad. I must admit that I wasn't really aware of the huge number of people who seem to hate her out there until just recently. But it's a review. A personal opinion. She just has her own style, and it seems to strike the wrong cord with some people.

--
Clever signature text goes here.
Re:This is a good review by dschl · 2003-05-01 14:41 · Score: 1

Beware no more. Use the power of hosts.
127.0.0.1 www.osnews.com
I associate her with osnews, to the point that I won't even go there.

--
Slashdot - the place where you can look like a genius by restating the obvious

ATI Radeon 9000 Pro by doublem · 2003-05-01 04:42 · Score: 0, Offtopic

But does it support the ATI Radeon 9000 Pro out of the box???

That card is a monster to get up an running on Linux. Anyone manage it yet? ARG!!!!!

--
"Live Free or Die." Don't like it? Then keep out of the USA

Re:ATI Radeon 9000 Pro by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 04:45 · Score: 0

No one's got the ATI Radeon 9000 Pro working under linux, but it looks like someone's figured out Juno.
Re:ATI Radeon 9000 Pro by Angry+White+Guy · 2003-05-01 04:46 · Score: 2, Interesting

That sounds like ATI's Problem.

Open up the drivers!

--
You think that I'm crazy, you should see this guy!
Re:ATI Radeon 9000 Pro by mmontour · 2003-05-01 04:54 · Score: 4, Informative

The hardware requirements page suggests that it does:

SuSE Linux comes with drivers for common cards including the following:
ATI: Radeon 9000/9500/9700
nVidia: GeForce 4, GeForce FX
Matrox: G450/G550

I have an 8500DV, which also works (though I haven't tried the special features like video-capture or firewire yet).
Re:ATI Radeon 9000 Pro by Squarewav · 2003-05-01 04:55 · Score: 4, Informative

ati has opened up the drivers, well sorta, xfree 4.3 supports it out of the box, theres a few bugs like in tux racer you dont see the trail tux leaves behind, most of the cutting edge distros like redhat will setup everything for you, unless you have a odd ball mb like mine (ali agp8x) then you need to add the following lines to modules.conf

alias char-major-10-175 agpgart
options agpgart agp_try_unsupported=1

make sure you put a newline after or it may complain at boot
Re:ATI Radeon 9000 Pro by Reservoir+Penguin · 2003-05-01 16:26 · Score: 1

I had to dl a binary kernel module to get 3d accel support for 9000 (non-pro) in RH8 (4.2) and the kernel complained about being tainted with it. What kind of driver does 4.3 come with?

--
US-UK-Israel: The real Axis of Evil

It seems more like... by duncanatlk · 2003-05-01 04:42 · Score: 4, Insightful

a review of KDE 3.1 to me.

Re: It seems more like... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:03 · Score: 0

All the more reason to use a control-oriented distribution like Gentoo. I've had KDE 3.1 since the day it came out!

Having almost-the-latest software shouldn't be a "selling point" for a Linux distribution.
Re: It seems more like... by headCase · 2003-05-01 05:12 · Score: 1

The reviewer mentions that you can get a partial preload of openoffice binaries during the launch of kde. Anyone know how to set this up?
Re: It seems more like... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:14 · Score: 0

Gnome=Pam Anderson "Home Improvement hottie".
KDE=Pam Anderson "Barbwire Drag Queen".
Re: It seems more like... by B3ryllium · 2003-05-01 05:28 · Score: 1

That's a very subjective comparison. We all know that XWindows itself sucks and nothing can be done to save it.

I mean,

XWindows=Pam Anderson "Sucking A Big Cock"
Re: It seems more like... by twener · 2003-05-01 05:54 · Score: 1

It's only the OpenOffice.org Quickstarter.
Re: It seems more like... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 08:24 · Score: 0

"That's a very subjective comparison."

Whats wrong with being subjective? Besides I wasn't aware there were benchmarks for looks.
Re: It seems more like... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 19:41 · Score: 0

Sure there is a benchmark for looks: SpecULUM 2000.

Version numbers by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 04:42 · Score: 2, Funny

You don't have to read the article to know that RedHat 9.0 is better than SuSE 8.2. Linux 2.5 is the worst. It's way behind the rest of the pack.

Re:Version numbers by Pike65 · 2003-05-01 07:28 · Score: 1

Yeah, I know this was thrown in for a + Funny, but in the past Slackware have actually had to retaliate in the version number wars . . .

--
"If being a geek means being passionate about something, then I pity those who aren't geeks." - Pike65
Re:Version numbers by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-02 05:06 · Score: 0

One day in the dim past of the time before time,
we used old vacuum tube radios. We actually did.
They shrilled at us from kitchens and living rooms
telling us that the 'Jap's had bombed a place
called Pearl Harbor as had they earlier when
a fella named 'Fatty Arbuckle' was arrested for
murder. Sellers of these old radios would tout
their sets by bragging on the number of tubes that
they contained. In the drunken parlance of sales
in the forties, SIX tubes were better than five,
and just four was out of the question! This worked well on the unwashed herd of folks who
never looked inside their radios. They read the
warning about 'no user parts inside' and felt that
they were, as users, less priviledged than regular
citizens like bank owners and such. Later when
transistors were invented, the same tomfoolery was
used on the gullible. Often the crooked manufacturers would use weak transistors in
push pull parellel arrangements to magnify the
number of transistors that they could claim. After all, those transistors cost often all of
fifty cents or more out of a retail cost of up to
a hundred dollars of the sets they were in.
Just the same for version numbers. Just put a
number on the version and some idiot will read it
for more than it is. Remember the old Intel
scheme for numbering processors:
8086
80186
80286 ......'286
80386 ......'386
80486 .....'486
(80586) 'Pentium' actually called '586
now what should the following proc have been called........ the '686 the 80686..the
'sexium' to use the latin...but no! It was called the 'Pentium II'.
Get with the program guy...its all hype!
Just like Autodesk calling their AutoCAD 15 product 'AutoCAD2000'. But then if you want to, feel free to look for AutoCAD1439 all you want!
Re:Version numbers by Cro+Magnon · 2003-05-05 02:44 · Score: 1

Gentoo must really suck then. Isn't it only on 1.4?

--
Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.

I could be wrong... by LordYUK · 2003-05-01 04:45 · Score: 3, Informative

but I always thought it was like the girls name "suzy" (soo-zee)

SuSE... ::shrugs::

lets see what google says (note, I have no clue who these people in the thread are, so this isnt necessarily fact)

FROM: Frank Pawlak
DATE: 01/30/1998 23:22:19
SUBJECT: RE: [S.u.S.E. Linux] SuSE History

On Jan 30, 9:32pm, Jonathan Markevich wrote:
> Subject: Re: [S.u.S.E. Linux] SuSE History
>
>
> On 30-Jan-98 Frank Pawlak wrote:
>
> >> Can anyone tell us about the history of the SuSE company? How long has it
> >> been in busness? What does SuSE mean? And so on.
>
> A good question, more importantly, though, how do you pronounce SuSE! I like
> "Suzie", though someone else around here likes "Sooz". Ess-You-Ess-Eee has
to
> go.

Say like so: Sue-sa with a short a at the end. Like Sue-suh maybe.
Regards
Frank

--
This is my sig. Its pathetic.

Re:The regsiter can be nice by L7_ · 2003-05-01 04:46 · Score: 1, Insightful

if you subscribe you won't be forced to look at advertisements.

Not that I subscribe, I just don't complain. -_^

NVidia and SAMBA by BrynM · 2003-05-01 04:48 · Score: 4, Interesting

From the article:

I opted for the RPM because nVidia warns of dire consequences with SaX2 configuration otherwise.

Oddly enough, I did just the opposite by using SuSE's "update" feature and it worked flawlessly (even for my TNT2 M64 which is notorious for problems). This is a huge improvement from 7.x, under which I could never get an NVidia card to work right.

SuSE (and other distros) sadly lack an easy way to share a directory under SAMBA. There are a few utilities to browse windows shares and mount them, but nothing to create a share with a GUI. I can't believe I've been mucking around with samba.conf since 5.X! Having it built into Konqueror would be great, but I dream. Has anyone found GUI tools for SAMBA that work well?

By the way, SuSE can't use the SMB Python library, so the killer SAMBA Python GUI isn't possible under SuSE. Such a bummer, because there already is a great tool written under Python. I don't remember the name off the top of my head though.

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Re:NVidia and SAMBA by nagora · 2003-05-01 04:50 · Score: 1

There are a few utilities to browse windows shares and mount hem, but nothing to create a share with a GUI.
What about SWAT (http://localhost:901)? Is that not installed by default?
TWW

--
"Encyclopedia" is to "Wikipedia" what "Library" is to "Some people at a bus stop"
Re:NVidia and SAMBA by agentZ · 2003-05-01 04:51 · Score: 3, Informative

There are several SAMBA GUIs listed on the Samba web site: http://samba.org/samba/GUI/
Re:NVidia and SAMBA by p.rican · 2003-05-01 04:58 · Score: 3, Informative

I've never had a problem setting up samba using CLI but if you're definitely only interested in a GUI setup, try this:
http://www.webmin.com
It will also let you perform a lot of other admin type stuff besides SAMBA.
I had webmin install with no problems on Debian (Woody testing) and Slackware 7.1

--
/. --"Demented and sad....but social" -Judd Nelson
Re:NVidia and SAMBA by BrynM · 2003-05-01 04:58 · Score: 1

Nope. SWAT isn't installed by default. As for the other GUIs listed at the SMABA site, they either require APACHE (which I'd rather not install on this box) or only support the client (ie: browsing) side of SAMBA.
If only I had the time/knowledge to write something myself. I guess a good follow up to my query would be "Does anyone know of a comprehensive SAMBA util that needs non-programmer help?"

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Re:NVidia and SAMBA by Majix · 2003-05-01 05:29 · Score: 1

SuSE (and other distros) sadly lack an easy way to share a directory under SAMBA.

Red Hat 9 comes with an new Samba configuration tool (GTK2 based, like all redhat-*-config" tools). It's very spartan, but it works quite well and setting up a share takes only a few clicks. It'll also create users, set passwords and manage the samba deamon itself. You can probably rebuild the SRPM for SuSE without any trouble.
Re:NVidia and SAMBA by kmahan · 2003-05-01 06:22 · Score: 1

It would be nice if there was a YaST2 plugin for Samba (both client and server)..

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Invalid Checksum. Retrying.

Updates are much better by jonfelder · 2003-05-01 04:49 · Score: 5, Informative

I think one of the biggest improvmenets with SuSE 8.2 are the online updates. While they still download rather slowly, they actually work now.

With 8.1 the online updater always locked up or didn't complete. It only seemed to work if you mirrored the updates locally and then directed online update to run from your lan.

Re:Updates are much better by lessthan0 · 2003-05-01 05:01 · Score: 1

Things started to go wrong with the Online Update in 8.0, then got much worse in 8.1. Bad enough for me to switch to Red Hat. Now, Red Hat will have do something really bad for me to bother switching back.

I really tried to work with SuSE on the updates last year, but they ignored me. I think they lost a lot of customers because of it.

One of the value added features distros can bring to the table is fast and reliable security updates. If you can't get the updates, you're dead. And this is the one piece of code (YaST2) that SuSE has ABSOLUTE CONTROL over. I hope you are right about the updates working now, because SuSE is over without that.
Re:Updates are much better by jonfelder · 2003-05-01 05:18 · Score: 1

Red Hat has it's own issues.

First, if you actually want decent update capability you have to pay for it. While this isn't awful, it is a bit of a turn off for me. It can literaly take days to get an update from up2date after a major security patch is released.

Second, Red Hat is rather gnome centric. It can run KDE of course, but in my experience their KDE implementation is a bit broken (similarly gnome is a bit broken under SuSE). I find that gnome is much uglier than KDE.

Third, Red Hat only supports old releases for 1 year. This coupled with the fact that they seem to like to release binary incompatable versions without dot releases means (i.e. redhat 8.0 -> 9.0) that I can't upgrade very painlessly and now I have to because in a year there won't be any updates to 8.0. Heck 8.0 is only like 6 months old!
Re:Updates are much better by J.+J.+Ramsey · 2003-05-01 05:54 · Score: 1

"Red Hat has it's own issues. First, if you actually want decent update capability you have to pay for it."

I have used the free "demo" up2date service, and it works fine for me, usually. Sometimes RHN temporarily denies the "demo" users access, but this is fairly rare.

"Second, Red Hat is rather gnome centric. . . . I find that gnome is much uglier than KDE."

That is purely a matter of taste, not to mention that it is fairly trivial to change the GNOME theme if you really want to.

"Third, Red Hat only supports old releases for 1 year."

That is only for the desktop, non-enterprise versions of Red Hat. Red Hat users tend to upgrade the non-enterprise versions fairly regularly, so there isn't that much point in trying to support old releases that have relatively few users.
Re:Updates are much better by twener · 2003-05-01 08:45 · Score: 1

> Now, Red Hat will have do something really bad for me to bother switching back.

Don't they already require you to register, pay and send your system and package information to them? Nothing of this with SuSE whose update work with every anon ftp mirror (and provides fixes for one year more).
Re:Updates are much better by jonfelder · 2003-05-01 08:59 · Score: 1

"I have used the free "demo" up2date service, and it works fine for me, usually. Sometimes RHN temporarily denies the "demo" users access, but this is fairly rare."

I haven't found it to be rare at all. In fact every time I tried to update I couldn't for about a week after the recent samba patches were released.

"That is purely a matter of taste, not to mention that it is fairly trivial to change the GNOME theme if you really want to."

Yep...this is my list darn it! :-)

"That is only for the desktop, non-enterprise versions of Red Hat. Red Hat users tend to upgrade the non-enterprise versions fairly regularly, so there isn't that much point in trying to support old releases that have relatively few users."

So...if I want updates after a year I have to pay for them? This is better than other distros how?
Re:Updates are much better by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 23:23 · Score: 0

Bullshit..never had any trouble. wtf are you
teething about?
Re:Updates are much better by aschlemm · 2003-05-02 04:21 · Score: 1

I know there were some problems with the online update system but after the first update to the online update program is installed I haven't had any problems with it. My gripe with the 8.x online update was that it is alot slower than the updater was in SuSE 7.x. I've watched it run and it is seems very inefficient in that it downloads a huge list of little files one byone.

It would seem to me that a single download of a compressed tar file or something would work alot better. I'm still using SuSE 8.1 on the systems I maintain and haven't been having any problems with any of the online update stuff.

available for $3 by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 04:51 · Score: 4, Informative

It's available for $3from budgetlinuxcds.com

Re:available for $3 by twener · 2003-05-01 05:57 · Score: 1

But only the 1 CD evaluation version. Selling a copy of the full product for money is illegal!
Re:available for $3 by sangfroid · 2003-05-01 06:43 · Score: 5, Informative

Unfortunately, budgetlinuxcds.com is selling the live evaluation disc, not the full distribution.
SuSE offers a live-evaluation disc image for free here. It's not a complete install but it'll give you an idea of what SuSE's all about.
You are allowed to do a full install via ftp (see instructions here). Sure it's not as easy but an FTP install will build some more of that character I'm always hearing about.
I have to say though, YaST is probably the best thing I've seen so far for a Migrating Windows User. It is powerful, flexible, and intuitive for anyone used to Control Panels. SuSE also automatically does some intelligent things like password protect single-user mode (unlike RedHat). IMHO, it's the best new user distribution. Sure, I use Gentoo on my machine but then I'm captivated by watching packages compile for 72 hours straight. -grin-
Re:available for $3 by Moskie · 2003-05-01 07:23 · Score: 1

All the information regarding an FTP install references SuSE 8.1. On top of that, none of the mirrors (even the ones marked 'complete') seem to have 8.2 on them. They have the live-eval version, but not what I would guess is needed for an FTP install. So is an FTP install of 8.2 possible?
Re:available for $3 by daniel23 · 2003-05-01 13:18 · Score: 1

It is so with every new SuSE version: you'll have to wait some weeks until the version appears on the ftp server and mirrors.
If you can't wait to get the newsest stuff, you'll have to buy the box. I can accept that.

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605413? Yes, it's a prime.

Dear Suzy by Letter · 2003-05-01 04:51 · Score: 3, Funny

but I always thought it was like the girls name "suzy" (soo-zee)

Dear Suzy,

Congratulations on your new version 8.2! Your pics on the Register are hot. I think I'll install you on my new P4.

Love,
Linus

Re:The regsiter can be nice by BrynM · 2003-05-01 04:53 · Score: 1

I susscribe, so I don't complain either :)

If you love /., then throw down the $15 bucks for the subscription. It's well worth it. ...Or you could just go read some other news site without ads. If there are any left.

--
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Re:The regsiter can be nice by buswolley · 2003-05-01 04:53 · Score: 1

but what if slashdot did these article

i mean this is feedback to the company of what its users like

--

A Good Troll is better than a Bad Human.

More reviews by gmuslera · 2003-05-01 04:54 · Score: 5, Interesting

In OSNews there is also a good review of SuSE 8.2 for a desktop user, comparing it with Redhat 9.

In the other hand, in Linux and Main they have a mostly negative review.

But, at least for me, it installed without problems in the systems I tried, and it looks more mature than 8.1, is not just a package versions upgrade.

Re:More reviews by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:27 · Score: 1, Interesting

For those zealots with the memory span of a goldfish:

In the orgy of promotion (the register thinks anything with KDE is marvellous, as does slashdot)... let's not forget the fact that SuSE is closely associated with UnitedLinux and SCO... as indeed is TrollTech.
Re:More reviews by MKalus · 2003-05-01 05:29 · Score: 1

Well,

I guess the problem he has is the serial mouse on Port one. I wouldn't be surprised if YAST2 thought it was a mouse, but for what reason that thing waited for a response for over 90 minutes is beyond me.

I had similar problems in old versions of Windows (when I still used windows) during modem installation.

--
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Re:More reviews by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:31 · Score: 0

The same Linux and Main that sold out to Microsoft over a year ago?
Re:More reviews by twener · 2003-05-01 05:46 · Score: 1

> In the other hand, in Linux and Main [linuxandmain.com] they have a mostly negative review.

This is an article about a specific installation problem. The real Linux and Main SuSE 8.2 Pro Review ends with "But again, once it's up and running, SuSE 8.2 Professional is great."
Re:More reviews by shawn(at)fsu · 2003-05-01 06:20 · Score: 1

$0.02
First, so it gets read let me put this part first
The best part of SuSE it how it handles existing windoze partitions. No work is needed on your part, it detects them and adds icons for you on the desk top.

The register was dead on with 8.2 . It had the fastest most pleasant install I have ever had with 6 years of using Linux. I used the updated from NVidia, ignoring the warning about SaX2, it worked flawlessly, and KDE 3.1 is as smooth as ice.
8.2 includes all the packages I have grown to love in SuSE plus allot of new ones. I didn't have to tweak any of my hardware. I was up and running in no time.
If your wondering if it it time to try Linux again or try another distro, try SuSE.

w00t to SuSE, best release ever.

--
500 dollar reward for tip(s) leading to the arrest of the person(s) who stole my sig.
Re:More reviews by GreyPoopon · 2003-05-01 08:34 · Score: 1

In OSNews [osnews.com] there is also a good review of SuSE 8.2 for a desktop user, comparing it with Redhat 9.
The osnews article slame Redhat 9 for how slow GNOME is. I'm currently running an older dist of Redhat and I'm about to do an upgrade. Since I'm familiar with Redhat, I'd rather stick with it. Does anybody know if system responsiveness on Redhat 9 is vastly improved when using KDE instead of GNOME?

--
GreyPoopon
--
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Re:More reviews by z0om · 2003-05-01 14:33 · Score: 0

Up until a week ago, I'd been using suse (since 6.0)

I installed redhat 9 (first time using redhat). I'd have to say, i'm impressed. But as far as gnome vs. kde. Gnome 2.2 runs WAY faster than 1.4 did on my old install (suse 7.3). I tried kde for a couple minutes on redhat 9 and couldn't wait to log back in to my gnome session. I guess redhat spent a lot mroe time making gnome integrate w/ everything than they did with kde. kde just didn't feel or look as nice.

also, antialiased fonts rule.

No ISOs, no testing, no install. by caluml · 2003-05-01 04:57 · Score: 2, Insightful

I don't know how good it is, because they don't let you download ISOs. Simply put, if I (as a user and home user) can't test them, and play, they're never ever going to be bought, and used on my servers at work. Sorry guys, but that's the way it is. You've got to let people try stuff out before they buy. And I don't mean some boot-from-CD-run-in-RAM-thing. If people weren't familiar with MS from using it at home, it'd have a lot less market share in the workplace.

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Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by mao+che+minh · 2003-05-01 05:13 · Score: 5, Informative

The FTP install is free:
Suse FTP install
It is not as nice as having an ISO available, but I haven't installed *BSD from a CD in ages, and I hear Suse's FTP install is even easier and more reliable.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by caluml · 2003-05-01 05:16 · Score: 1

Yeah, I'd heard about this. I mean, I use a net installer for when I need a nice small install of Debian, but for a full distro? I suppose I could mirror it somewhere locally - does the installer allow you to point to the location you want?

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Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by oever · 2003-05-01 05:24 · Score: 1

You can check out the live eval. I haven't tested it and it's probably not nearly as useful as knoppix, but I should give an impression of SuSE.

--
DNA is the ultimate spaghetti code.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by C_nemo · 2003-05-01 05:44 · Score: 3, Informative

You only have to point it to a FTP-server with the suse packages. got one at work, and i have done a FTP install over the net from home, flawless. If you have a broadband connection its as good as iso's.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by barnaclebarnes · 2003-05-01 05:44 · Score: 4, Insightful

...and used on my servers at work.
Someone should tell your boss because that is not how informed decisions are made about what software to install.
/b

--
[Please type your sig here.]
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by DNS-and-BIND · 2003-05-01 05:47 · Score: 1

ISO's are a stupid waste of bandwidth. FTP installs are far more elegant. ISO's just make kiddie users feel elite because they get to download a huge file on their cablemodems or work connections, then burn a CD at 32x speed. They also contribute to distro collecting where some moron has a wallet full of turbolinux, yellow dog linux, and other stuff he'll never, ever install.

--
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by water-and-sewer · 2003-05-01 05:50 · Score: 1

>Simply put, if I (as a user and home user) can't test them, and play...

When you buy underwear, do you like to walk around in underwear in the store before you decide to buy, as well? Suck it up and pay for it. I'm glad to see Linux cheapskates are still around for comic relief. I wonder how many of them decide they need to "test" the product upwards of a year or so, conveniently until a new version comes along that also needs extended "testing."

You no pay. You no play.

Kudos to SuSE for staying profitable in a tough economy. I've been a SuSE user since 2000 and I've paid for every copy, and I've been glad to support a company that provides a decent product. Yeah, I wish it were free. But life is full of cruelty and disdain for people who think they have the right to demand free services from others.

If you buy the product, you will support the company, and in turn they will continue to produce it, cheapskate. Cheers.

--
If this were Usenet, I'd killfile the lot of you.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by twener · 2003-05-01 05:51 · Score: 3, Informative

From the README.FTP: "Preparing your own installation server: Just copy the whole installation tree to your local disk and make it available via network."
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by fobbman · 2003-05-01 05:56 · Score: 1

Thank goodness the folks on the Warez scene were able to help Microsoft with this. Otherwise, Microsoft would have never made it.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by Remlik · 2003-05-01 06:04 · Score: 1

You can install for free VIA FTP. Of course you don't get the tech support nor some comercial packages SuSe can't give away for free.

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Apple free since 1990!
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by TrekCycling · 2003-05-01 06:05 · Score: 1

Not just that, but companies like SuSE employ some of the people that do large portions of the work that all the other distros benefit from. I buy SuSE because it's a kick-ass product. But it also makes me feel good, knowing that I'm at least giving a little something to support the development of OSS.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by Kilbasar · 2003-05-01 06:06 · Score: 1

You can download ISOs of all 5 discs (Pro version) via BitTorrent. The link is:

http://10mbit.com/suprnova/SuSE_Linux_8.2_Pro_5_IS O_set.torrent

God, I love BitTorrent.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by shawn(at)fsu · 2003-05-01 06:12 · Score: 1

You might not be able to get ISO's but you can DL Suse of the net, go to Suse.com and it gives you ftp sites to use. I instaleld 8.1 this way with NO problem.

--
500 dollar reward for tip(s) leading to the arrest of the person(s) who stole my sig.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by madcow_ucsb · 2003-05-01 06:43 · Score: 2, Interesting

ISO's are a stupid waste of bandwidth. FTP installs are far more elegant.
Not for those of us with only one computer. FTP is fine if you have another machine to mirror the tree to, but otherwise your only machine is tied up for god knows how long in an installer. Hmm maybe one of the distros should put in a web browser like you get in a Solaris install...then at least you can stay entertained.

The benefit to ISOs for people like me (living off a laptop at the moment) is that you just need to download one file and then it's on a CD and you can just keep it around. No hassle.

Besides, show me an ftp install that lets you use download accelerator (or prozilla or whatever). Without that I usually get around 100k/sec on my cable. Use it and I max it out at 400.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by BrynM · 2003-05-01 07:36 · Score: 1

Technically, I think the FTP install is faster than an ISO install. Think about it. You download ISO images with lots of packages you never use then run the install.
With SuSE, I download a 20 MB "boot" ISO and download only the packages I choose to install during the actual install, literally avoiding hundreds of megs of download. A side effect is that bad and broken packages can be re-downloaded individually. SuSE's Yast program even remembers where you are at in the install. I had the power go out during the 7.1 install without a problem. I just re-booted and it started back up where it left off! Nice and efficient in my opinion.

--
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Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by DNS-and-BIND · 2003-05-01 07:49 · Score: 1

I have a download accelerator, too. It's called, "Buying the CD".

--
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by madcow_ucsb · 2003-05-01 08:12 · Score: 1

Well I meant to say that the ftp was faster technically, but it didn't make much difference because you can't do anything while it installs whereas you can when you download the (slower) ISO.

I didn't know that the installer remembered where it was - is that a suse specific thing? Or has that been in all of my distributions lately and I just never noticed? Wow - actually learning something from /. Who'da thunk it?
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by BrynM · 2003-05-01 08:26 · Score: 1

If you only have one machine or get bored easily, I can see why you would want the ISO images to minimize the actual install time. The SuSE install disk can be found at ftp://ftp.suse.com/pub/suse/i386/current/boot/boot .iso, but be warned that they don't have the 8.2 directory tree up yet. ftp://ftp.suse.com/pub/suse/i386/current/ always has the most recent online version though. Also note that this is the i386 build. If you need another platform (like SPARC or PPC) then look at ftp://ftp.suse.com/pub/suse/.

--
US Democracy:The best person for the job (among These pre-selected choices...)
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by ctid · 2003-05-01 09:43 · Score: 1

I never understand this argument. Perhaps you can clear it up for me? You want to download 5 or 6 CDs worth of stuff from SuSE. They say, "you can't do that; instead you have to download one bootable CD and then complete the rest of the install via FTP using Yast which is on that CD". Surely you're downloading the same amount either way?

--
Reality is defined by the maddest person in the room
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by utahjazz · 2003-05-01 10:11 · Score: 1

The FTP install is free:
Suse FTP install [suse.com]

Unless I'm blind, that site only has the 8.2 live eval, not the full distro. Where's the 8.2 distro?

Phi(15,-10^125)
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by NineNine · 2003-05-01 11:07 · Score: 1

FTP install? Sure. Now who's gonna pay for my broadband.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by GlowStars · 2003-05-01 11:29 · Score: 1

And how are you planning to download ISOs without broadband??? You'll probably end up downloading less with SuSEs FTP-install anyway because you won't download packages you don't need.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by NineNine · 2003-05-01 11:38 · Score: 1

An FTP install requires a constant connection. That's impossible over a few days with most dialup connections. But I can easily break & resume a regular download with dialup. For big downloads, I often start it up every night before I go to bed and when it's done, it's done. You can't do that if you do an FTP install.
Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by caluml · 2003-05-01 13:12 · Score: 1

My boss trusts me to make the decisions that fall under the job he hired me for.

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Re:No ISOs, no testing, no install. by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 18:29 · Score: 0

You never install all packages from the CDs. You may not install all language packages. And you perhaps can't install every package because some conflict with each other (eg Java VMs, different mail daemons).

Re:The regsiter can be nice by buswolley · 2003-05-01 04:58 · Score: 1

i dont mind ads so much, but when they rollover the link i want to click an i go where i didnt intend, i get mad that is intrusive. The dell add rolled over on top of this suse article. yeah slashdot needs to make money, fine.

--

A Good Troll is better than a Bad Human.

SuSE 8.2 freezes by oever · 2003-05-01 04:59 · Score: 3, Interesting

SuSE is losing more and more credit with me. I bought the SuSE 8.2 Professional upgrade and installed it on a Compaq Presario 1714EA. Result: the machine freezes after about 5 minutes of use! There a few boot options one can try in such a case, e.g. acpi=off. But none of these work.

Right now I'm communicating with the helpdesk and this is no big pleasure either. After my initial mail, I received the advice to reinstall the system with the safe settings (a boot menu option). I had already done this, since the normal settings wouldn't boot.

After saying that I'd already installed with safe settings, I was told that reinstalling really would help. So I did this and it (of course) didn't help.

The next idea the helpdesk had was to ask me to give them a list of the hardware in my computer (this list is also sent to SuSE when doing a support query, but apparently, they lost it). I provided the list and the next day I got an email asking me to check the computers memory and use a special boot option. The memory's ok and the boot option didn't work, so I'm now waiting for their next question.

However, when SuSE is installed, it runs quite well. But many applications are missing and a lot of hardware is not recognized, e.g. my pcmcia network card.

The new update checker is convenient but very buggy! It crashes a lot and after updating, the checker's icon still signals you to update.

So, in conclusion, I can say that I'll continue using SuSE (on the machine on which it does not freeze), at least until the end of the support period.

If you think SuSE is a nice distro for newbies: forget it. It takes ages until you've got it running smoothly. Once it works, it works, but it's not much different from any other disto. The install's horrible.

--
DNA is the ultimate spaghetti code.

Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by ElGuapoGolf · 2003-05-01 05:02 · Score: 3, Informative

Try adding disableapic to your boot options.
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by oever · 2003-05-01 05:13 · Score: 1

I did, it did not help.
SuSE's safe settings are:
ide=nodma apm=off acpi=off vga=normal nosmp noapic maxcpus=0 3
I tried each of those individually and together and still the machine freezes.

--
DNA is the ultimate spaghetti code.
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by leehwtsohg · 2003-05-01 05:24 · Score: 1

It seems that this is more of a kernel problem than a SuSE problem. Did you try booting single, and see if the machine still locks up after 5 minutes?
If yes, try to boot with a different kernel, and see if it also freezes. Maybe you can custom compile a kernel.
If not (which also means that it might not be a kernel problem), it must be one of the programs that are started up. Try finding which it is through elimination.
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by Angry+White+Guy · 2003-05-01 05:25 · Score: 1

What's the graphics card in the machine? If it's an ATI rage128, manually eddit your xfree86 and disable
dri. This is the most common problem I run into with unix. the Rage 128 was used in everything you could hook a monitor to, and it hates DRI.

BTW, what happened to the "Post Anonymously" box?

--
You think that I'm crazy, you should see this guy!
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by oever · 2003-05-01 05:30 · Score: 1

The freeze has happened only in X and most often when running YaST.
I haven't compiled a new kernel yet, but the previous version of SuSE (8.0) on this machine did not have the problem, neither does Mandrake 9.1, so a vanilla kernel should work fine, but it might not work well with the init procedures. I just want things to work without fiddling.

So SuSE shipped a rather unstable kernel and instead of trying to fix it quickly, the helpdesk asks me silly questions.

--
DNA is the ultimate spaghetti code.
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by oever · 2003-05-01 05:32 · Score: 1

Nope, it's an ATI Radeon Mobility something. There's an unstable 3D driver for this with SuSE, but using the stable one without 3D does not improve the situation.

They'll probably ask me about the 3D driver next.....

--
DNA is the ultimate spaghetti code.
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by ElGuapoGolf · 2003-05-01 05:32 · Score: 2, Informative

Well, like the other posters have said, it could be a kernel or graphics problem.

Try booting into runlevel 3 and see if that helps.

I'll also throw another theory out there.. Do you, by chance, have a VIA IDE chipset? If you do, you probably know they're really, REALLY buggy but you can work around that. Anyhow, if you do have a via chipset, how do you have your system configured (drives-wise)?
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by DNS-and-BIND · 2003-05-01 05:50 · Score: 1

Which other distros run fine on your hardware?
Actually I always considered SuSE's installer one of the best. Sorry you're having problems.

--
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by shawn(at)fsu · 2003-05-01 06:30 · Score: 1

It's amazing how no matter how well a program is made their are people out there with a hardware setup that just doesn't go well with the program. Like super Murphy's law. I personally disagree with your assertion that SuSE is not yet ready for n00bs. I will be installing this on my parents machine as soon as a get to take a vacation down to Fl.
I am truly sorry that you had such a bad time with this version and hope you don't give up on it all together.

--
500 dollar reward for tip(s) leading to the arrest of the person(s) who stole my sig.
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by molarmass192 · 2003-05-01 06:39 · Score: 1

I'm too lazy to look up which CPU is in the Compaq 1714EA but have you tried recompiling the kernel optimized for your CPU? I had a similar lock-up problem with an ancient K6-300 that went away by simply recompiling the kernel ... ok ... so the compile took a few hours, eh, big deal!

--

Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws-Plato
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 07:49 · Score: 0

Two possibilities, admittedly neither of which are likely:

- YaST has had an on-again, off-again problem where a helper process will refuse to terminate and eventually exhaust all available memory. Try to avoid the YaST GUI, and when you can't, do one thing at a time and check the process listing after you exit.

- The default configuration for Esound (esd) is wrong, and your system is locking around the sound driver. Rename /dev/dsp and see if that helps, though obviously you won't get any sound that way.

Good luck!
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by StarTux · 2003-05-01 08:29 · Score: 1

Check your ACPI and also memory, 8.2 is just not that unstable...
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by J.+J.+Ramsey · 2003-05-01 10:53 · Score: 1

Just as a diagnostic, try installing another distro to see if it fails the same way SuSE did. That way, you can be sure the problem is SuSE-specific.
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by Enucite · 2003-05-01 12:19 · Score: 1

"...check the computers memory and use a special boot option. The memory's ok and the boot option didn't work, so I'm now waiting for their next question..."
"The new update checker is convenient but very buggy! It crashes a lot and after updating, the checker's icon still signals you to update."
"But many applications are missing and a lot of hardware is not recognized, e.g. my pcmcia network card."

You sure that machine's CDROM drive is good? From what you said it sounds to me like similar cases I've had where the files don't get installed properly because the CDROM isn't reading the disk correctly. I put in a new CDROM drive or reburn the CD and it works fine. In this case since you say you have 8.2 Pro I'd assume they're pressed CDs, and you say you have it running on another computer, this would lead me to believe it's the CDROM drive. Even if you don't have problems with other CDs, I'd at least try a different CDROM drive in there to see if it works.
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by runderwo · 2003-05-01 13:47 · Score: 1

So my (now extensive) experience directly contradicts your own, for which I have to say: it's either you or your system, and not SuSe.
Hmm, I thought we only blame the user when Microsoft is involved, such as when stupid users don't search for and download patches for their operating system thus causing their system to be owned, or when idiots read emails with viruses in them causing their system to be infected through no fault of Windows.
I'm glad to see that Linux distributions are so sophisticated now that the user can now be blamed for any problems that cause them not to work on a given setup!

--
LRC, the best-read libertarian site on the web
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by maxpublic · 2003-05-01 19:10 · Score: 0, Flamebait

I'm glad to see that Linux distributions are so sophisticated now that the user can now be blamed for any problems that cause them not to work on a given setup!

They usually can. Most of the 'problems' I see with Linux installations are with morons who don't bother to see if their hardware is actually supported before doing an install. Then they get all sorts of strange problems and blame Linux for their own lazy stupidity.

Linux isn't for everyone. If you can't stir yourself to do a minimum of research prior to installing - like checking out your hardware to make sure it's supported - then you should really stick with Windows.

That's right, I said "stick with Windows". Not only would it cut down on posts like this complaining that Linux 'doesn't work right' (when in reality it's the user that isn't working right), but it would put an end to all those twits arguing over whether Linux is 'ready for the desktop'.

Max

--
My god carries a hammer. Your god died nailed to a tree. Any questions?
Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes by oever · 2003-05-01 21:55 · Score: 1

In this case the basic hardware such as CPU, video card and chipset is supported by the other distributions. Mandrake 9.1 and Knoppix 3.0 do not freeze this machine. So the problem is SuSE specific it seems.

Now I'm more than willing to help SuSE sort out this problem. But SuSE does not seem to want to solve this problem.

I've been using SuSE for 5 years and I have a lot of experience with GNU/Linux in general. But when I buy a distro and it fails horribly on me by freezing, then I can do two things: just compile my own kernel, on which the problem will probably go away for me, or mention the problem to SuSE so that they may instruct me on how to solve the problem and solve the problem in their distro too. There are quite of few of these Presario laptops around and if everybody trying SuSE on these machines has the same experience, this is very bad press for free software in general, simply because most people will think: 'this free software sucks, I'll go back to windows'.

--
DNA is the ultimate spaghetti code.

Re:The regsiter can be nice by buswolley · 2003-05-01 05:00 · Score: 1

so does M$. so what.

--

A Good Troll is better than a Bad Human.

Yes, they can! by fobbman · 2003-05-01 05:00 · Score: 1, Funny

michael says: "Wow, the Register can actually be nice?"

Thank goodness we can rely upon you to pick up the slack, though.

Re:Yes, they can! by red_dragon · 2003-05-01 06:42 · Score: 1

Uhh... no, Michael did not say that, technoid_ did. Just because it's in the blurb doesn't mean that the editor wrote it.

--
In Soviet Russia, Jesus asks: "What Would You Do?"

Cheaper on linux-screws - not eval by rumpledstiltskin · 2003-05-01 05:04 · Score: 2, Interesting

sorry for the shameless plug. Linux Screws is about to launch. SuSE 8.2 will be available there for 9.95 plus shipping. this will be the full version, not the live eval, because with all of the distributions they provide, the customer will actually only be paying for a computer screw. The linux distribution would be provided free of charge.

Re:Cheaper on linux-screws - not eval by gmuslera · 2003-05-01 05:18 · Score: 1

They offer installed systems or for this 9.95 they will ship the SuSE CDs? because if this is the CDs I think that is against the license. You can install it from the ftp server, have they consent to have a mirror of the distribution, install it in as many computers you want, but distributing copies of the CDs is just the main limitation of the license.
I know that is not good, but if someone complains, I just point that you can download/burn/install mandrake, redhat and more distributions CD images, if someone want suse, well, have to respect what they think.
Re:Cheaper on linux-screws - not eval by p.rican · 2003-05-01 05:35 · Score: 0

Congratulations on successfully installing mod_ssl on Apache?!?!?! I'll check your website again later (linux-screws.com)

--
/. --"Demented and sad....but social" -Judd Nelson
Re:Cheaper on linux-screws - not eval by StarTux · 2003-05-01 08:34 · Score: 2, Insightful

Will this be made from the FTP version? Because otherwise you cannot charge anything for SuSE 8.2 because of the licensing of the Yast tools, unless you have permission first from SuSE.

Re:This is a good review - yup by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:05 · Score: 0

Yup, that is a more in-depth review than the Register's. It does show the pitfalls that could await most people that will purchase SuSE 8.2.

Linux Newbie by Infernon · 2003-05-01 05:09 · Score: 5, Interesting

I'm a linux newbie. I've been using Windows for years. That being said...
I went out and picked up SuSE 8.2 last week and installed it under VMWare and I love it (despite the fact that I can't get VMWare tools to install!). I think that KDE 3.1 kicks the living snot out of Windows, period. I would even propose that my mother could use it without a problem.
As the article said, the installation was flawless and it picked up the virtual NIC automatically. I didn't encounter one problem (except as noted above) and I found that I started running the VM fullscreen despite the low resolution because I just enjoyed working with it.
I'm not ready to get involved on a command-line level as of yet and probably won't until I finish my MCSE (please don't flame me!), but it's definitely a tight package compared to other Linux installs that I've played with before.
Sadly, Linux doesn't seem to have much support for games and it's really the only reason that I haven't dumped Windows from my main machine and taken the plunge. I know that everyone talks a good deal about WINE, but I've heard that there are problems with it.
Oh well, just my two cents...

Re:Linux Newbie by RdsArts · 2003-05-01 05:19 · Score: 3, Funny

A copy of SuSE - $50
A second 20 gig Hard Drive - ~$75
Being able to switch OSes with a simple reboot - Priceless

There are something money can't buy. For everything else, there is larger storage.
Re:Linux Newbie by praedor · 2003-05-01 06:14 · Score: 1

You don't really need Windoze for MCSE. Linux has a whole host of Minesweeper-like games and even Solitaire games. You can get up to advanced skill with either/both in linux and never see a Windoze desktop!

--
In Bushworld, they struggle to keep church and state separate in Iraq as they increasingly merge the two in America.
Re:Linux Newbie by kotj.mf · 2003-05-01 07:09 · Score: 1

Hear hear.
After hosing the RH8 install that I set up in October, I decided to completely wipe it and the Windows partition that I hadn't used for months from my HD.
After getting the 8.2 Pro CDs, I did the install in less than an hour on my cheapass KDS notebook. Other than having to use generic drivers for my LCD, the installation's gone flawlessly.
I'm amazed at how refined the distro is, and the number of packages I got. Beats Redhat, and sure as hell beats Windows. I've had some problems getting used to KDE, but it's nothing serious.

--
hang brain.
Re:Linux Newbie by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 07:20 · Score: 0

A second 20 gig Hard Drive - ~$75

That's a ripoff!! I just bought a WD 80GB 7200 8mb for $79 (after rebate) from CompUSA
Re:Linux Newbie by ccbaxter · 2003-05-01 07:35 · Score: 2, Insightful

I'm not ready to get involved on a command-line level as of yet and probably won't until I finish my MCSE (please don't flame me!), but it's definitely a tight package compared to other Linux installs that I've played with before.
This is not a flame. I never finished my MCSE, but I have learned more about underlying network technology through using Linux via command-line (SuSe was my first distro and what I still use) than I ever did studying for the MCSE. Trust me - you are ready for the command-line.

--
Dude, where's my Karma?
Re:Linux Newbie by ctid · 2003-05-01 09:30 · Score: 1

I use SuSE too. I read a dodgy review and I was trying to decide if I really wanted 8.2, but this positive article has pushed me over the edge. I'm getting it first thing on Saturday!

Ignore the command-line until you want to bother with it. I prefer to use it because that's the way I learned, but it'll take longer if you're used to the pointy-clicky approach.

Now to the point of my post. Games. I'm not even going to create a link, because I'm not a sadist. But I will say two words: "Frozen Bubble". Seriously, there are games, but if you're really into games you'll want to keep Windows around.

--
Reality is defined by the maddest person in the room
Re:Linux Newbie by FrankNFurter · 2003-05-01 09:59 · Score: 1

You mean Frozen Bubble, one of the most addictive games ever? The game the two player mode of which can keep grown up men playing with balls for hours and hours? That Frozen Bubble? Yeah, I guess it would be cruel to post a link to it.

--
"Slashdot - the one place on the internet where guys brag about how small it is." - that IT girl
Re:Linux Newbie by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 11:49 · Score: 0

Linux has plenty of support for games. Now someone needs to use that built-in support and write some games for Linux. I think what you're referring to is a marketshare problem, not a technology problem. Hoping for Linux to run Windows software perfectly is just as reasonable as hoping for Windows to run Mac software perfectly. Adjust your expectations accordingly.

Re:The regsiter can be nice by BrynM · 2003-05-01 05:11 · Score: 1

I guess I would have to agree about that. The "floating" and "hovering" ads are such a pain to me because they force you to do something to get them out of the way. You can't just tune out and ignore a region of the web page. Gamespy and the Planetwhatevergame sites are the worst about this. I wish the advertiser had a way to know that this leaves me with a negative view of the product they are trying to push instead of a positive view like they wanted.

I think that may be more of a trick that Dell is pulling with their banner ad code and not something that /. is doing or may even know about (I don't know their policy).

--
US Democracy:The best person for the job (among These pre-selected choices...)

Re:ATI Radeon 9000 Pro TV OUT? by chefbimbo · 2003-05-01 05:11 · Score: 1

Did you ever get the TV out to work? Currently, I'm stuck with a Shuttle SK41G as Windows media box as I can't get the on board chip to work at all under XFree86. Radeons do work but then only without TV out.

Xandros - GUI for Samba! by Drinian · 2003-05-01 05:11 · Score: 2, Informative

Xandros' File Manager makes this very easy. Xandros has the best Samba setup and usage I've ever seen. It just works out of the box. I know we're talking another distribution other than SuSE, but still it's worth a mention.

Re:ATI Radeon 8500dv by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:13 · Score: 0

also a monster to get tv in/out up :-( anyone do this yet?

ftp by Maskirovka · 2003-05-01 05:18 · Score: 0, Troll

nice, but there are no ftp or .torent link :P

Re:ftp by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:34 · Score: 0

No, and you know why that is? [deathly silence from the SuSE bots in the slashdot cheerleading squad]
SuSE doesn't allow downloads of ISOs, and they enforce this by making their distro NON-OPEN SOURCE by virtue of the license use on the installer. SuSE has always been a pariah... do not use it.
Re:ftp by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:39 · Score: 0

Of course not. SuSE's trying to make money.
Re:ftp by TrekCycling · 2003-05-01 06:08 · Score: 1

Or try to be marginally flexible, open-minded and intelligent and realize that SuSE underwrites a lot of the work doing on OSS, so purchasing SuSE actually contributes to OSS.
Re:ftp by Dri · 2003-05-01 07:36 · Score: 0

http://www.torrentse.cx/download.php?file=SuSE_Lin ux_8.2_Pro_5_ISO_set.torrent

--
Girls are strange. They don't come with a man page.
-- Michael Mattsson

Wow.. by frodo+from+middle+ea · 2003-05-01 05:21 · Score: 0, Offtopic

Is this the shortest slashdot article ever ? At least the sortest linux article ?

--
for the last time people, I am "frodo from middle eaRTH", not "middle eaST".

Re:Misinformation Minister by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:23 · Score: 1, Funny

Your anti-american attitude has been reported to the office of homeland defence. Please stay where you are, you will be picked up shortly. Be sure to have your citizenship papers with you so they can be destroyed.

Oooooo! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:24 · Score: 0

The next Slashdot story will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and see it early!

Oh, Mother! May I??!??

Re:The regsiter can be nice by arkanes · 2003-05-01 05:25 · Score: 1

Slashdot has said they wouldn't run those type of ads, so either they're reneging or Dell is pulling a fast one, or someone just fucked up and put the wrond ad on the server.

Re:This is a good review - yup by B3ryllium · 2003-05-01 05:25 · Score: 1

And it's written by Eugenia, so it's guaranteed to drive people into depression.

List of New Suse Exploits by SlashdotMirrorer · 2003-05-01 05:28 · Score: 0, Offtopic

John Carceni has written a nice article on several remote exploits present in the new Suse.

Wireless LAN support? by badasscat · 2003-05-01 05:37 · Score: 1

The SuSE web site listed "improved wireless LAN support" as one of the selling points of 8.2. Can anyone comment on what this means exactly? I've turned up nothing in anything I've read about this version, in any reviews, or even the comments here so far. I've had a hell of a time installing wireless LAN drivers (the wlan drivers) for my Linksys WUSB12 and have never managed to get it to work with either Mandrake or Red Hat. Does SuSE come with the full suite of wlan drivers (including USB) pre-installed?

Re:Wireless LAN support? by wizardmax · 2003-05-01 05:49 · Score: 1

Considering you mentined WUSB12 and linux, have you been able to get it to work on any distro? How close are you? I am asking because I am in the same boat.

--

Free speech is getting expensive...

OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by larsoncc · 2003-05-01 05:38 · Score: 3, Interesting

Well, while I was in my hippie college days (4 years ago?), I actually tried Linux (SuSE, actually). I thought it was kind of cool, but somewhat difficult to set up. It didn't support anything.

Now, I know this post might be a Karma burn, but what the hell. I don't post too much on Slashdot anyway. I just thought I'd ask for some opinions here.

I am a Windows developer in a Windows world. for the most part, I've really liked it (see, told you it was a Karma burn). I haven't found much that I hate about Windows at all. And I'm not the type of guy to invent reasons to hate an operating system (come on guys, life is too short for that!). I don't think I could ever use the term "M$" without slapping myself silly.

I've used other OSes, but I've never switched. Just hasn't been practical.

My income is currently tied to Windows. While somewhat "plain", I have enjoyed the Windows interface.

So, I guess the question here is... Is it time to try Linux again? What's different now? Slashdot seems to trumpet the arrival of even the most minor Linux upgrade.... Is this different?

Can I install Linux and be productive in less than 5 hours? Can I insert a CD and have the install routine work? Are there any games yet?

Here's a newbie (and odd!) question for you: Can I develop Windows applications from within Linux now? Or at least run VS or VS.NET?

Just wondering. Hope it wasn't too terrible a sin to post this...

--
Video Game News, FAQs, etc

Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by BrynM · 2003-05-01 05:48 · Score: 1

Yes you can develop and compile windows apps under linux. I don't know which free compilers will do it, but I've used Kylix with success. Can anyone else point out GPL or free compilers that do the same?

--
US Democracy:The best person for the job (among These pre-selected choices...)
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by ElGuapoGolf · 2003-05-01 05:48 · Score: 4, Interesting

Well, the install takes about a half hour. Maybe more, maybe less, depends on your hardware. This will install the OS, OpenOffice.org's office suite, multimedia stuff, etc. If you want a DVD player, thanks to our friend the DMCA, you'll have to go grab some rpm's and install them, about 5 minutes of your time.

Installing a copy of Tribes 2 or UT2003 will take a few minutes. There are other games. Does that answer the gaming question?

Of course, you'll want to install other stuff, and whatnot. Roughly setting up, timewise, is going to be a little less than setting up with windows. //Rant
Now, as a developer, who's done both Win and *nix development, you couldn't really find any way to put a nice spin on Windows development. And, by development, I'm not talking about writing some cute little VB database front ends.

I'm talking about writing backend stuff. Data handling stuff. Servers. Things where windows just doesn't do well. Need to share objects? COM? Who came up with that horrible idea. regsvr32? WTF is up with that? //End Rant
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by ElGuapoGolf · 2003-05-01 05:59 · Score: 1

This is semi-related, but the latest JBuilder lets you build native wrappers around your Java applications. So you can compile your Java app to a .exe, or a .bin, or what have you...

Kinda neat.
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by larsoncc · 2003-05-01 06:08 · Score: 1

I did notice a little note in my UT 2003 package that said that it runs under Linux (UT 2003 is currently my favorite "new" game for PC).

***By the way...

Your rant about COM development rings true (especially sharing objects). But I don't have the luxury of doing things any other way (income, it's all about the recession economy income, my friend). And when the choice is mastery of one platform versus 2-inch deep knowledge of two platforms (one of which isn't used at work), I have to choose mastery.

And in my own personal rant...

I've seen plenty of developers screw up BOTH the cute VB front end, AND the database back end.

--
Video Game News, FAQs, etc
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by ElGuapoGolf · 2003-05-01 06:19 · Score: 1

More rantings...

I dunno... as someone who learned the "windows way" secondary, I'm always amazed at how bad some "pure" windows folk are.

Ever see a VB coder not use Option Explicit? I sure have. Ever see odd variables defined in the scope of one loop then referenced waaaaay outside that loop in a VB program? I have. Does that work? Yes. Is that a good practice? No.

Not to say that you don't see that in other languages. You do. In some languages you dont' see that at all (Java), but those languages have their own problems. But at least with, say, Java, I can build a class and just slap it onto the classpath, put it in a jar, whatever, and it works. I don't need to logon to the box as an administrator, copy my object over, register it, and then set up my program. And I don't need to remember to do that if I upgrade it.

Fact is, developing on windows isn't very good. And around here (NYC area) there are as manyJ2EE/java jobs as there are VB jobs. And VB jobs tend to pay less. Simple economics there.
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by niceandsunny · 2003-05-01 08:20 · Score: 1

What's different now?

I can't really speak for the four-year old distro you tried since I've only been using Linux for a year, but from what I understand, KDE and Gnome weren't even close to the usability of Windows.
Today, I would say it's almost there, not quite, but almost. However, don't forget that it makes up for that in other areas, for instance you won't have all those crap DLLs and registry keys accumulating on your system as you install / uninstall programs.

Can I install Linux and be productive in less than 5 hours? Can I insert a CD and have the install routine work?

I have installed RedHat and Suse several times on different computers and it was always easy as 1-2-3. That is not to say that there isn't old hardware that won't work or is a pain in the butt to get working, but in my experience the install process has always been as hassle-free as with Windows.

Are there any games yet?

There are not too many native Linux versions of popular games, but a large number of games reportedly run under Wine or WineX.

Can I develop Windows applications from within Linux now? Or at least run VS or VS.NET?

I found this Usenet message from somebody saying they were able to run VS under Wine, albeit not perfectly (no debugging). I gather you use VS all day developing Windows apps, so it's probably worth booting into Windows since you will want to test your application in a Windows environment, etc.

Windows is a very good operating system (mostly because of Linux), and I was happy with it until out of curiosity I gave Linux a try. I only use Windows for games now.
Both have their ups and downs. Do check out Linux, it's nothing like it was when you tried it four years ago.

Harry
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by StarTux · 2003-05-01 08:44 · Score: 1

No harm in learning both :).

Games wise, check www.tuxgames.com and also www.happypenguin.com and www.linuxgames.com to get an idea. Games is one of its weakest areas, but thi year there has certainly been a pickup. Like with looking for a car, research first pays off later.

Yes you can be productive within 5 minutes of starting up, actually I was productive right away. Again this depends on what you do.

If you're going to get SuSE 8.2, which is what I use please do yourself a favor, sign up at the suse mailing list here to ask more questions and cut out the ./ trolls. The one you want is suse-linux-e@suse.com.

http://www.suse.com/us/private/support/mailingli st s/index.html

Don't listen to anyone that says stay where you are comfortable, because you've shown an interest, why not try it out?

StarTux
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by Joe+Tie. · 2003-05-01 10:58 · Score: 1

Can I develop Windows applications from within Linux now?

You'll still want to have windows around to test the results every once and awhile, but WxWindows might be worth looking into. I don't know if it would have everything you need, but I've been very impressed with it. In theory, you should be able to compile your code for Linux, Mac, or Windows, and have the results look and run as a native application on all platforms. I wouldn't recommend doing a crosscompile and never checking out the results on windows, but for the most part I've been quite happy with the crossplatform development WxWindows opens up. For me, the end result is just having to reboot into windows to do a little tweaking every couple weeks, and I've never really ran into any major problems. I've also been using python wrappers around it (wxpython) for a few months , and have been even more blown away. After wxpython was installed on my windows partition, it was as simple as copying over my code and watching as it ran, with no changes, on a totally different operating system than I'd done the development on. The reverse should be equally true though. Get a handle on WxWindows development in windows, and your programs should only need a little tweaking to work in OS X or Linux.

You might want to take a look at Knoppix , to see how you take to Linux. It's basically a Debian install which runs entirely off of a CD, never touching your hard drive. Mandrake or Suse would have a lot more in terms of configuration utilities, but Knoppix should at least give you a good idea of where Linux has gone in the past few years.

--
Everything will be taken away from you.
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by mousse-man · 2003-05-01 13:14 · Score: 1

I'm MCSE as well. And lo behold, I have a very good command of Unix as well (except installing Winmodems, but that's another issue with RH 9), and I actually prefer RH9. No, don't take me for a zealot, but except for gaming, I rarely start up windows. Why?

To explore into this, one must understand that I don't have a CS background. I'm kind of a mechanic. And in Linux, I can go and fine-tune things, at the expense that configuring something is sometimes more difficult. But at least there I can tune it. And if I shoot my system, I don't have to repair it using an intransparent process. In fact, in 99% of the cases, inserting a knoppix CD and mounting my partition in read-write allows me to fix the problem. I can't do that with Windows much too often without buggering the registry or transforming my system into a barebones again. And, oh, my Linux systems don't proactively talk back to distro manufacturer unless I want them to.

If I want to use my favorite development tool (Emacs), I have to install a truckload of stuff on my Win box. On Linux, presto, you can have it. And there are free IDEs even on Linux.

Also, on Windows, lots of stuff is awfully expensive to license, or a PITA to install because of Cygwin requirements. And even after Cygwin, it's still a Windows box. And for a server license, I need to fork over some serious money, which I'm unwilling to do. And furthermore, due to the fact that Linux is less sensitive against virii, I have one problem less.

Basically, I need something that will work for 4 weeks when I'm away, getting my mail, and serve a few webpages and filter spam. And it's definitely cheaper and more fun on Linux. Yet a big part of my income is still tied to Windows as well. Still....but I'm trying to change this a bit.
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by the-dude-man · 2003-05-01 14:40 · Score: 1

I was a microsoft devloper, and a hardcore microsoft beliver for years, I have almost every microsoft cert you can imagine (even those ones with the fancy +i on the end!) And after using windows and devloping in windows for years, it took 48 hours to get me hooked on Linux.

Mind you linux is a very steep learning curve if its your first *inx operating system. It took me about 2 weeks of 18 hour days to figure out the OS when i started. So its not for the faint of heart.

However, the good news is the learning curve is lograthmic....once the inital pain is over, it gets more fun.

Bottom line, its useful to know linux, its a fast growing operating system. Its not going to burn you to learn it. Linux is pretty fun because once you know it inside out you can do pretty much anything you want with it.

Personally i started with a redhat distro, and then moved to a Gentoo distro after a few months. You may Want to consider starting with a SuSE distro until you have a good fel for the os.

Like i said you can Do just about anythingwith linux once you figure it out, however, your going to have to learn it first, knowing how to code is defiantly an advantage for prospective linux users, but not a requirement. Once you get the feel for the enviornment,and a feel for the Enviornment, and the tools used in the enviornment, you will be able to devolp windows programs AND run them (when you learn the ins and outs of wine and vmware) However, like i said, this knowledge is gonna coast you some hair if this is your first *inx enviornment.

However, personally, i started in Linux about 8 months ago, and I now have some code in the iptables conntrak modules. So its not going to take you years to learn linux by any means. But you may want to bring a few cases of beer home on nights were your trying to sift thru the vast online forums lookng for an answer to your question, or just trying to figure something out.

Another problem is the people who use Linux advance fairly quickly, to he point were after a year or two, many people forget what its like learning linux for the first time. I've personally found myself malicly typing RTFM! a few times. If it was for my recent initation into linux i proably wouldnt have thought twice about it.

That being said, linux is a powerful and fun os once you know it, its costly to learn, but there are big payoffs depending on what your doing. If your a devloper, understanding the unix side of devlopment is going to help you in your current devlopment. We have also seen an increasing number of unix tools being ported (some might say ripped off) to windows. So you may have an advantage there as well.

Bottom line, weather Linux is going to be worth learning for you is a decision that only you can make. For me, learning it set my carrer and my skills ahead a good 10 years in a matter of months. But for some people the pain of learning linux dosnt pay of. Weather or not its going to be worth it is ultimatly a decision only you can make.
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by debest · 2003-05-01 17:48 · Score: 1
What's different now?
More mature in almost every way. But then, so is Windows. I'd say that the gap of end-user maturity is closing, though, and fast. It will likely never close entirely: Microsoft has, you know, revenue from which to fund improvements. But Linux is getting very close to "good enough" for a great many Newbies.

Can I install Linux and be productive in less than 5 hours?
Depends on what you mean by "productive".

Will you be able to open up a word processor that looks very much like MS Word and use it like Word? Yes you will. Will you be able to open up existing, complex MS Word documents and edit them? Not likely. Will you be able to find a program that lets you edit video and make MPEG movies? Yup. Will these programs work with the slickness and polish of Premiere or Final Cut? Nope. Can you run a web authoring tool? Sure. Will it be Dreamweaver or GoLive? Sorry.

See where I'm going here? The tools available to a Linux user are not the same as those to a power Windows user. To many, the point of a computer is to be productive, not to spend time leaning a tool. The effort to relearn techniques, accept the lack of a feature available in a Windows app, or losing the ability to open Windows app documents are more than enough to keep most people on Windows.

Can I insert a CD and have the install routine work?
In some circumstances. For instance, if you install Crossover Office on your Linux machine, a large number of Windows business applications (including Office XP and Photoshop 7) will install just like on Windows. Other apps aren't so lucky.

Are there any games yet?
Some, and many are recent releases. Most, however, are purely Windows games and will never be released on Linux.

Can I develop Windows applications from within Linux now? Or at least run VS or VS.NET?
If you're going to develop for Windows, do it on Windows. It's probably possible, but it makes to sense to do so.

It all comes down to two things, in my opinion:
1. User ineritia: Windows is the first (and so far only) OS that got widespread adoption on PCs. As a result, most people know how to use a Windows PC. Getting these people to learn a new way of doing something is against human nature: we find something that works, we tend to resist change.
2. Developer inertia: Related to user inertia, developers will concentrate on the platform with the most users, and create more polished work for that platform. Right now, that's Windows.
It seems that the decision to switch from Windows to Linux should be made if you have a philosophical reason to support Free software (or oppose Microsoft software), or you require your PC to do something that Windows cannot do (increased stability, thin-client capablity, etc.), or you simply can't afford to buy Microsoft's product any longer.

The only truly fair way to compare Windows and Linux is to take completely green users (never used a computer before) and sit them down in front of fully set up and configured computers. I think that you'd find that the Linux users would be just as productive or more so in such a test. But Linux, arriving long after Windows had attained dominance, is now burdened with having to satisfy not only Linux users, but hardened Windows users such as yourself. Think about it: what if Linux had been first and held 90-odd percent of the desktop market? What if it was Windows that had to not only be good at "being Windows", but also had to fight to get pre-installed on PCs, had to install easily on an existing Linux machine (without trashing the existing OS), had to perfectly open all the documents made by proprietary Linux programs, had to run all the proprietary Linux games, had to write drivers for hardware because the manufacturers refuse to release drivers for anything but Linux, etc. etc. And they'd still have it far easier than Linux actually faces, because due to the openness of L
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Look at the tomato! Isn't it sad? He can't dance! Poor tomato!
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by larsoncc · 2003-05-01 22:07 · Score: 1

Just FYI - you answered my questions. Which many others DID NOT. Many others used the questions as a chance to rant.

I honestly and truly appreciated this response.

And yeah, I'll be giving Linux a try (but keeping my Windows Ghost).

Thanks.

--
Video Game News, FAQs, etc
Re:OK, so maybe I'll give this "Linux" thing a try by debest · 2003-05-02 03:04 · Score: 1

No problem. Actually I too used the opportunity to rant (I'm sure you noticed), but you don't seem to have minded too much.

Hope you get from Linux what you can. It's all about freedom to me. Some people are convinced that Microsoft has to die and Linux must rule. I feel that everyone should use what their own needs and values dictate. I don't have any problem with people and companies for whom their answer is a MS product. Do what makes sense to you.

--
Look at the tomato! Isn't it sad? He can't dance! Poor tomato!

Don't forget apt! by Phantasmo · 2003-05-01 05:43 · Score: 4, Informative

There's an apt repository for SuSE 8.2.

--

The US Army: promoting democracy through unquestioned obedience

Re:Don't forget apt! by Makarakalax · 2003-05-01 07:10 · Score: 3, Interesting

I use APT with SuSE and have found it to be excellent (although I can't compare it with other rpm distros that have apt-repositories).
I haven't used YaST to update since I installed APT4RPM, I get newer versions of important packages like Mozilla and KDE, I can update via a cron job and I dist-upgraded from 8.0 to 8.1 solely with APT, I also plan to upgrade from 8.1 to 8.2 this weekend or the next.
I've experienced very few problems using APT, although I imagine Debian's packaging works better with APT since .debs are packaged with APT in mind and SuSE doesn't officially support APT.
The documentation for SuSE APT4RPM is outstanding and thorough and the mailing-lists are helpful and informative.
If you use SuSE you should really be using APT as well.
I'm not on the project or anything, just a satisfied user!
Re:Don't forget apt! by mcgroarty · 2003-05-01 07:44 · Score: 1

But does it do dselect? I want dselect before I'm ready to consider anything non-Debian. (Serious)
Re:Don't forget apt! by Makarakalax · 2003-05-01 08:19 · Score: 1

No, there's no dselect. I didn't realise dselect was so good, in fact I don't really know what it is - package selection tool isn't it? I do have a debian box, I'll have to go check dselect out. I've never used it before.

El Reg by Becquerel · 2003-05-01 05:44 · Score: 1

El Reg wouldn't be the same without the pomopus, dry, sarcasm of british humour.

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My spelling isn't bad, I'm evolving the language

From the source: SOO-suh by jtheory · 2003-05-01 05:54 · Score: 1

SuSE, pronounced soo'-suh, comes from the German acronym, "Software und Systementwicklung (Software and System Development).

Sheesh... expecting people to click links and suchlike.

--
There are only 10 types of people: those who understand decimal, those who don't, and, uh, 8 other types I forget.

Yup. by DJ+FirBee · 2003-05-01 05:55 · Score: 0, Troll

"Wow, the Register can actually be nice?"

Yes, Michael, the Register can be nice. Also, they can spell. Also, they don't have dupe stories every fifteen minutes.

Also, they probably won't toss an insult your way because you are a meaningless geek wannabe in a field of real tech journalists.

HA!

Your momma is a whore Michael !!!

Re:Torrent link by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 05:56 · Score: 0

SuSE_Linux_8.2_Pro_5_ISO_set

Good day.

Re:The regsiter can be nice by BrynM · 2003-05-01 05:57 · Score: 1

Holy shit! I turned off my subscription and saw the Dell ad! It sucks! It makes the entire top region of the screen a link for Dell! I'm sending Taco a message witha a screenshot and a link to this thread to let him know.

--
US Democracy:The best person for the job (among These pre-selected choices...)

Don't Bother by Tony · 2003-05-01 05:57 · Score: 4, Insightful

The truth is, if you see no reason to switch to Linux, then you probably shouldn't. If you like your current environment, and don't feel a political, philosophical, or technical imperative to switch, don't.

There are many reasons to switch to Linux; the protection of our future rights and freedoms is not least (philosophical and political imperatives). Linux is more stable than XP in my experience, but not by that much (technical). MS-Windows still has all the games, though. (Although, I have to say: I would rather play a game on my PS2 than on my computer.)

Linux installs within about an hour. You should be productive within a couple of hours after that, but you will spend the next 20 years learning. (Of course, you better spend the next 20 years learning no matter what system you choose.)

If you want to develop MS-Windows programs, for God's sake, man, use MS-Windows! Don't drive yourself crazy trying to do some devilishly-complicated scheme, when the simple solution is, well, simple.

I believe it is dangerous to support Microsoft in any way. Their history has shown they will destroy any emergent technology simply to retain a lock on "innovation." If you are doing anything remotely interesting, they are likely to either buy you up (good for you), or kill you (bad for you). Either way, you benefit Microsoft more than yourself.

I also believe you are giving up your rights by using Microsoft products. Their EULA are becoming draconian; at some poing, you will have no rights at all.

Linux brings back the fun in computing, both at the systems level, and at the development level. I haven't had so much fun with a system since the old Apple ][ days. Of course, I've been using Linux for almost 10 years now, so it's been a long fun jag.

If these arguments do not appeal to you, then you probably have nothing to gain by moving to Linux. Stick with what you have. Don't kill yourself by attempting a switch.

However, if you'd like to see what the fun is all about, pull out an old PII computer and install away. Play with it, integrate it with your home network, start exploring the things that interest you. You can have the best of both worlds, you know. It's not an either/or proposition.

But, no matter what you do, have fun. Keep one eye on the future, but don't let yourself become blind to the present: have extreme amounts of fun.

After all, that's what life is all about.

--
Microsoft is to software what Budweiser is to beer.

Re:Don't Bother by larsoncc · 2003-05-01 06:17 · Score: 1

Yeah, for me, fun would be what it's all about. Because I know I'm not becoming some Unix guru overnight - let alone some kind of configuration master.

I'm not thinking it's "all or none", either. I've got Ghost, so no big whoop. See, what I'm really wondering about is... Are all the kinks worked out? Am I going to be frustrated trying it.

Cause if I do this, it's going to be on my GOOD computer, not some back alley thing I abandoned 3 years ago.

I don't know about all the political stuff... I mean, for as much as Microsoft is bad for being profitable, I can see Open Source being bad because I don't want to see a bunch of programmers working for free. I mean, unless you're a monk or something, you're just not making a living through charity!

So, I don't get too deep and philisophical about my computer. I trust that someone somewhere will care enough about it to get it done right, and that's where that little thought train ends. You have to trust others eventually in life, I figure my OS is as good a place to start as any...

--
Video Game News, FAQs, etc
Re:Don't Bother by lostboy2 · 2003-05-01 06:22 · Score: 1

Wow. Best post ever. :)
Well said.
Re:Don't Bother by larsoncc · 2003-05-01 06:24 · Score: 1

By the way, does Ghost RUN under Linux? Or do I have to do the boot disk nonsense?

Say I get a Linux config I want to keep - how do I keep that?

--
Video Game News, FAQs, etc
Re:Don't Bother by yoshi_mon · 2003-05-01 06:44 · Score: 1

Cause if I do this, it's going to be on my GOOD computer, not some back alley thing I abandoned 3 years ago.

While if you want to run X you will need at least a decent computer, one of the great things about *nix is that it can run great on just about anything.

But of course it all depends on what you want from the OS. If you want to run X with all sorts of stuff then your going to need a decent computer. (Mind you I didn't say GOOD because really, even with a bunch of stuff turned on in X it's still more efficent than Windows.)

--

Really, I know what I'm doing...Ohhhh, look at the shiny buttons!
Re:Don't Bother by Tony · 2003-05-01 07:04 · Score: 1

I'm not thinking it's "all or none", either. I've got Ghost, so no big whoop. See, what I'm really wondering about is... Are all the kinks worked out? Am I going to be frustrated trying it.

Dude, if you ever find an OS with all the kinks worked out, let us know. If you ever find an OS that isn't frustrating, let us know. You will become one of the most celebrated geeks of all time.

In my experience, all operating systems suck. Some just suck less.

I have proposed two Linux slogans, both of which are copped from someone else (blatant plagarism!):

"Linux: It sucks less."

And:

"Of course Linux is user friendly! It's just very picky about its friends."

--
Microsoft is to software what Budweiser is to beer.
Re:Don't Bother by Dunkirk · 2003-05-01 08:28 · Score: 3, Interesting

I also believe you are giving up your rights by using Microsoft products. Their EULA are becoming draconian; at some poing, you will have no rights at all.

Have you read Red Hat's service agreements for the new "Enterprise" line? It'll shock you. They're not much different any more. We just printed ours out yesterday to read the fine print.

Don't believe me? How about, by agreeing, you give Red Hat the right to walk into your building at take stock of all your software. How's that for "Microsoft-like?"

We're going to be cancelling our contract. Which, by the way, you MUST do in writing, 60 days before the end, or you WILL be held accountable for another year's worth of your agreement. How's that for "IBM-like?"

The lines are getting fuzzier these days, fellow geeks. Please vote with your dollars. I'm not against Linux companies making money, but when a company changes your terms IN THE MIDDLE OF THE TERM, then there needs to be some karmic retribution.

--
Acts 17:28, "For in Him we live, and move, and have our being."
Re:Don't Bother by ctid · 2003-05-01 09:35 · Score: 1

That certainly sounds unreasonable, and I don't blame you for dropping Red Hat. The main thing is that there are alternatives in the Linux world. When you say, "The lines are getting fuzzier these days, fellow geeks.", you mean the lines between Red Hat and Microsoft are getting fuzzier. As you suggest, there are loads of other Linux companies out there.

What I like about the Linux world is that we don't need to fight huge battles against Red Hat - although vigilance is always required, IMO. We can let the market punish Red Hat if their policies are unreasonable. This has already started with your company's decision to ditch them.

--
Reality is defined by the maddest person in the room
Re:Don't Bother by runderwo · 2003-05-01 13:44 · Score: 1

I can see Open Source being bad because I don't want to see a bunch of programmers working for free. I mean, unless you're a monk or something, you're just not making a living through charity!
Please expound on how Open Source is equivalent to programmers working for free, or that open source software is equivalent to charity.
It sounds like you may need to learn a little more about Open Source, Free Software, the differences between them, and the different ways in which both of them interface with a capitalist economy.

--
LRC, the best-read libertarian site on the web
Re:Don't Bother by Cro+Magnon · 2003-05-05 02:50 · Score: 1

The big difference is that if RedHat goes too far, it's not that hard to switch to Mandrake or SuSe. There ARE no alternatives to Microsoft.

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Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.

Re:The regsiter can be nice by buswolley · 2003-05-01 06:00 · Score: 1, Offtopic

thanks that made the -2 mod i got worth it.

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A Good Troll is better than a Bad Human.

moron gelatinous re-views by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 06:02 · Score: 0

re-posted from an earlier yet un-re-scored post.

this
was extracted buy using an eyecon0meter(gpl) scan of this
site, before & after application of va lairIE's patentdead
corepirate ?pr? PostBlock(tm) device.

all for a little more monIE?

let the music pay?

eXPplain US away as pairannoyed if you will?

[OT] Plus no anonymous checkbox? by jtheory · 2003-05-01 06:09 · Score: 1

I don't seem to have the checkbox to post anonymously anymore. It was there earlier today...

Hmm. The "annoy the non-subscribers" campaign has begun....

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There are only 10 types of people: those who understand decimal, those who don't, and, uh, 8 other types I forget.

DON'T CLICK ABOVE LINK by J.+J.+Ramsey · 2003-05-01 06:18 · Score: 1

Not unless you want to see silliness about "pimps" and "hos". Definitely *not* about SuSE security.

check out fou4s by 23 · 2003-05-01 06:20 · Score: 1

For me, fou4s has been a real blessing. It's basically a bash script and drop-in replacement for the yast update tool.

Works beautifully (also on older versions and different hardware than x86), is easy to configure and can be dropped into cron.daily nicely.

If you are not planning on upgrading soon (such as myself, waiting for it to show up on the ftp servers), you might want to check it out.

cheers, Roland

Re:check out fou4s by jonfelder · 2003-05-01 07:16 · Score: 1

Well, I have upgraded...but before with 8.1 I used apt4rpm. Basically it enables apt-get for rpm based distros.
There's even a special page for SuSE. http://linux01.gwdg.de/apt4rpm/
I believe it will even let you upgrade to 8.2 ala the way debian does. However, I'm a bit scared to do that.

The Register, playing nice ? by cyberchondriac · 2003-05-01 06:33 · Score: 1

Well, since SuSE isn't an American product,they probably felt no gratutious need to bash it.
SuSE's been my distro of choice for a couple of years now though, and it'll probably pick up a lot of Mandrake users now that they've fallen by the wayside.
(wonder how the Register felt 'bout them ?)

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Look back up at my post, now look back down, you're on the Internet. Now look back up. I'm a signature.

Re:The Register, playing nice ? by Smid · 2003-05-01 23:33 · Score: 1

>Well, since SuSE isn't an American product,they >probably felt no gratutious need to bash it.

Erm, are you mad? Or do you have a chip on your shoulder?
Re:The Register, playing nice ? by cyberchondriac · 2003-05-02 05:26 · Score: 0, Flamebait

Neither, smid. As alluded to in the originating thread, the Register is rarely kind, but additionally, there seems to be something of an anti-American backlash in the british tabs these days, so it seemed kinda apropo... or funny, take your pick.
To be fair, and show that I didn't think the article was truly slanted because SuSE is german, I admitted that I use it myself, in leiu of Red Hat, for instance.

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Re:The Register, playing nice ? by Smid · 2003-05-03 06:49 · Score: 1

Well, I've never found the register anti-american. It is anti microsoft, and critical of intel, but they are not the only companies in the US, contrary to what MS says. Sun seems to get even handed coverage, redhat fine and linux in general too.

download? by geekBass · 2003-05-01 06:42 · Score: 1

Where can I download suse 8.2 from? I have looked around and only hint I found was that they only have live-eval for download and although it is free,you need to get it from someone who already has it. I don't get it.

Re:download? by twener · 2003-05-01 08:51 · Score: 1

There is no SuSE 8.2 FTP version yet. It's released a month or so after the evaluation version which was just released.
Re:download? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 09:50 · Score: 0

you can get the live eval on any of the suse mirrors. (as of a week after the release date) Otherwise, wait a month after the release (April 11) and there will be an FTP version available. However, SuSE is TOTALLY worth the $40 for the standard edition. The professional is worth the $80 also. Just go buy it and support this clean, polished distro.

GPL is a wonderful thing by Landaras · 2003-05-01 06:47 · Score: 1

You can get the CDs / DVD from sources other than SuSE. Burnt discs are being auctioned / sold all the time. I paid $30 (that includes fast shipping) to get my 8.2 Pro discs, and it was money very well spent.

I run a consulting business, and I have at least one client who is looking to migrate servers and desktops to Linux in 6 - 12 months. SuSE will be my distro of choice when that time comes.

--
My legal education, in nifty podcast format

Re:GPL is a wonderful thing by Suppafly · 2003-05-01 07:10 · Score: 1

You can get the CDs / DVD from sources other than SuSE. Burnt discs are being auctioned / sold all the time. I paid $30 (that includes fast shipping) to get my 8.2 Pro discs, and it was money very well spent.

I run a consulting business, and I have at least one client who is looking to migrate servers and desktops to Linux in 6 - 12 months. SuSE will be my distro of choice when that time comes.

Generally, the cd layout is copyrighted, so it is illegal.. and questionably immoral to just make a copy of a cd that someone else paid them for. Besides, if you are going to pay $30 for warez, why not pay the $45 for the real thing and get the support that comes along with as well as giving back from the company.
Re:GPL is a wonderful thing by Landaras · 2003-05-01 07:21 · Score: 1

Show me specific law where the software distributed on SuSE 8.2 is either not GPL (or similar) or under a free-beer license. As far as the cd layout being copyrighted, I'm not familiar with that. Again, please give me a specific case to back up your claim.

As far as morality goes, SuSE has used their right to build upon GPL'd software. This right comes with the responsibility to give their customers the rights of the GPL, which includes the right to resell it.

Don't call something "warez" when it's not.

And for the record, I paid $40 retail for boxed SuSE 8.1 Personal, and am yet to use my support incidents. The only reason I was looking to upgrade was to get native KDE 3.1 support. None of my local retailers carried any SuSE 8.2 products yet, and I stumbled upon a reseller through half.com.

I think SuSE makes a great product, and have no problem supporting them financially (as I have in the past). SuSE will be continue to get plenty of financial support from me and from my recommendations to clients.

--
My legal education, in nifty podcast format
Re:GPL is a wonderful thing by twener · 2003-05-01 07:55 · Score: 2

> Show me specific law where the software distributed on SuSE 8.2 is either not GPL (or similar) or under a free-beer license.

Read the YaST license: "It is forbidden to reproduce or distribute data carriers which have been reproduced without authorisation for payment without the prior written consent of SuSE Linux AG or SuSE Linux."
Re:GPL is a wonderful thing by Spudley · 2003-05-01 09:29 · Score: 1

Show me specific law where the software distributed on SuSE 8.2 is either not GPL (or similar) or under a free-beer license. As far as the cd layout being copyrighted, I'm not familiar with that. Again, please give me a specific case to back up your claim.

YaST for one. You not allowed to copy YaST, so you'd have to strip it from the distribution if you wanted to share... but then why bother going with SuSE if you're going to do that?

Also, I hear they've included a licenced commercial copy of Main Actor in 8.2. You probably don't want to be copying that either.

And certainly older versions included Star Office, which is also commercial, though I think they've switched to Open Office now, so that may be a moot point.

Other than that, it's mostly freely distributable, and you would naturally be most welcome to copy it. But don't forget to check the licences on everything, in case there's a few other small goodies they've include that aren't free...

--
(Spudley Strikes Again!)
Re:GPL is a wonderful thing by Kev+Vance · 2003-05-01 13:27 · Score: 1

OpenBSD.

You are free to FTP the source and binarie and make your own bootable CDs, but copying the CDs you purchase infringes the layout copyright.

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F0 07 C7 C8

Have always admired their effort by floydman · 2003-05-01 06:57 · Score: 1

I had to experiences with SuSE, one was with SuSE 6, and the other was with United Linux(which i think is all SuSE, SCO did not strike a keyboard in that project). SuSE 6 was actually in the old, but back then, it was amazing. As for United LInux, i am impressed. I installed it on P4, with Nivida, and it was very smooth, no problems at all, also have installed it on VMware which was also quite smooth, and no trouble at all.
One thing i like about SuSE is the Reiser file system, its quite neat, quite fast when it comes to large files. /*Why is there a penguin on my sceen?!*/

--
The lunatic is in my head

Mandrake builds it into file managers by Sits · 2003-05-01 06:59 · Score: 1

Mandrake have built Samba support into Konqueror and Nautilus since around Mandrake 9.0 (or maybe the version before). This allows you to select a directory, press the right mouse button over it and choose share.

The catch is you will need to make sure that the user is in the fileshare group or is allowed to share directories over the network by using the diskdrake --fileshare tool.

My experience with SuSE 8.2 by MrDingDong · 2003-05-01 07:01 · Score: 1, Troll

First off, I've been using Linux since V1.2.8 - Slackware - and I've installed SuSE 6.4, 7.0, 8.0, 8.2 and maybe a couple of others. I am a Solaris sysadmin (15 yrs+) during the day, so I know my way around Unix a bit.

Last Saturday I started upgrading my 8.0 machine to 8.2 and went through inserting all the CDs. Finally the SuSE procedures took over to finish things up. Well.... it got to SuSEconfig.tetex at 91% complete and it hung. I power cycled the machine and it did the same thing all over again.

Luckily I had a Mondo backup of all my files, so I bit the bullet and decided to do a clean install. That went OK, but it took me a long time to get all the software I want to run back up and running again. In fact I'm still working on it!

One major problem I'm having still is with ALSA and sound. It doesn't "just work". I have a Turtle Beach Santa Cruz sound card. I got no sound at all after the first boot up following the install. (And I know to unmute the device, etc.) I downloaded the latest ALSA stuff just to be safe and built it all. At this point, I can use xmms to play mp3s etc, but system sounds in KDE 3.1 still don't work. Not that I need that, but I do like things to work like they should even so. I have another box running SuSE 8.0 with the same sound card and sound works on that, but I can't see why that one works and this 8.2 box doesn't. Very frustrating. And this 8.2 box used to do sound fine when it was 8.0. It looks like I'm going to have to become a KDE expert to get dopey system sounds to work - but why do I have to? Why can't something simple like that "just work"?

I had problems with the Cyrus IMAPD server, and in the course of trying to fix it, I tried to rebuild it from source. No luck. Apparently there has been some change in header files (varargs.h vs. stdarg.h) in gcc 3.0 and so Cyrus IMAPD does not even compile. SuSE does supply a compiled version of the server, so I focused on getting that to work. It took some time, but I finally got it to go... but it was no cakewalk. And I have a lot of experience with this software.

Also, I use a lot of Dan Bernstein's software like qmail and djbdns. Be aware that his software does not compile with the new gcc compiler either. There is a problem with "extern int errno" in his header files. You have to replace that with #include errno.h. I found that somewhere on Usenet after having it drive me crazy for a few hours.

And also, it is useful to speak German if you want to use SuSE. The Yast2 tool is cool, but the package descriptions and a lot of the messages are mostly in German with some occasional English, even though I set LANG=en_US in the environment. I haven't really looked into this too much because it isn't that important, but it is a nuisance. Why do I even have to have it on my list at all?

And forget about support from SuSE. Check out their Web site and you'll see that if you buy the Prof. version you get 60 days support, but dig a little deeper and you will see that they support next to nothing of any substance. Just stuff like how do you change a password I guess.

So.. SuSE 8.2 is OK, but be prepared to be patient and to have to work to get it working right. I wish someday someone would put out a Linux distro that does "just work" out of the box. I don't mind doing configurations and installs and stuff, but having to deal with compile errors and SEGVs and the like, is not too much fun. I know its not SuSE's fault that apparently gcc 3 breaks a lot of compiles, but it still is something else that I have to deal with. It's been a week now starting with a clean install and it still isn't really right yet....

Re:My experience with SuSE 8.2 by the-dude-man · 2003-05-01 15:02 · Score: 1

void rant
{
These are problems you *can* have with any linux or Unix distro. However, they are annyoing, and very commenplace in many distros unfortunatly. There IS alot of information on just about everything out there, but the problem is it amounts to a hudge mountain of information that you have to sift thru to find what you need. Which i agree...is annyoing.

The problem here is SuSE and Redhat, and other distros like them arnt really that targetted to users who want to do advnaced things in them.you can do these advanced things, but compared to distros like gentoo, or BSD (freeBSD or openBSD) its like climbing a mountian!.

i actually left redhat for Gentoo, and I've moved alot of my clients off of SuSE to gentoo for those reasons.

If your looking to stick with the linux kernel, but want something that "just works" I'd have to say gentoo. The website gentoo.org provides great instructions that you can just follow and get the job done. And with ports, i've never had a problem compilign configureing and installing a pice of software since i went gentoo. Even compiling things like kde 3.1 went like clockwork. If your looking for stuff that will just work gentoo is probably what your looking for, i type energe then walk away and have a coffee and come back and its working. (or in the event its something major like X or KDE go to bed and wake up the next morning).moreover, i have a crontab with one line: emerge rsync && emerge -u world that runs every night, and all the software on my box is checked and updated if there is a newer version avialable, and the results are mailed to me so i can read up on what got installed overnight. its great!

Mind you, gentoo moves closer to traditional unix that most distros, so its really only appropriate for power users or sys admins.

The problem with distros like SuSE and Redhat, is not that they are "bad" distros, but they are targeted at a different audience. Judging by your experience, I'd say SuSE is not the distro for you.

The thing about linux is there isnt one "ideal" distro. Invariably everyone is going to find a particular distro they like, depending on what they do with the box. They can all be made to do the same things, but some have to be kciked in the pants a bit to do some things, while others will just make them work on their own. Your experience with SuSE dosnt make it a bad distro, but i know i didnt like it for what i was doing, and chances are you need to find a new distro for what your doing :)
return;
}

Re:Torrent link by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 07:23 · Score: 0

Heh heh, danke !!

Yes, but check versions... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 07:27 · Score: 0

Here's their documentation...
http://service1.symantec.com/SUP PORT/ghost.nsf/77f 66aec9f5339088825665f005ecd6e/b343f521f647fd1b8825 6caf00755887?OpenDocument

Suspect Pronounciation by neverbeeninariot · 2003-05-01 07:40 · Score: 1

man, i have no idea but his first name is kaiser....

nbiar.

Linux ISO by Futurepower(R) · 2003-05-01 07:45 · Score: 1

Linux ISO has SuSE live-eval 8.2.

Why does VB get such a bashing? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 07:48 · Score: 0

Using it for anything beyond a report writer or Access front end should be a no no, but it does those 2 functions really-really well.

I do agree though on Windows sux for server apps. Just routine things like trying to manage transaction logs is a pain and often unreliable.

Michael didn't say it, doorknob by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 08:00 · Score: 0

"technoid_" said it. Haven't we been through this?

Turtle Beach??? by revbob · 2003-05-01 08:03 · Score: 1

So lemme get this straight -- you're dissing SuSE Linux because a Turtle Beach sound card won't light up on it?

Think back to when you were trying to get that sound card to play on Windows? Remember? That was the time you invented a half dozen brand new cusswords.

They sound great (the first time I got a SoundBlaster Platinum something or other after a TB Tropez Plus, I took one listen and said "You've got to be kidding"), but they're hell to get running on any computer and OS.

It wasn't Michael, fucknut by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 08:11 · Score: 0

It was "technoid_" who said it. Don't get me wrong, I think Michael's a total fag myself, but you come across as a moron when you post things like that.

Re:Pronunciation by Get+Behind+the+Mule · 2003-05-01 08:21 · Score: 1

(Score -19: Way Off Topic)

Note that in german you can read pronounciation even if you have never heard the word before. German pupils can usually read - if not very fluently - after 3 months in school!

I agree that German othography is very phonetic, much more so than English. Which is a fancy way of saying that you spell words pretty much the way you pronounce them. But your claim about 3 months has the ring of an invented statistic, and I think I can judge because I have a son in the German schools. Can you cite a source?

I wonder if a semi-unification of writing and speech, like unifying the writing of sylables (something like "nite" instead of "night") would help the iliteracy problem in the US in any way.

As an American who has lived in Germany for over fifteen years, I think I'm qualified to say that this is a load of Käsequark.

German literacy is that much better than American literacy because most Germans recognize that good education is a valuable social goal worth paying for. Of course, no one really likes paying higher taxes, but they see the value in it and do it. So the schools are much better funded, teachers are paid much better, and the teaching profession enjoys much more respect; sometimes in recent years, it's been almost impossible to get a teaching job, because so many people were trying to get in. The result is that schools attract much better talent and provide a much better atomsphere for learning.

Many Americans, on the other hand, are appallingly skinflinted about education, pay very little tax but whine about taxes like nothing else you can possibly imagine, and hence pay teachers much lower wages and much less respect. Some of them seem to believe in sprinkling magic pixie dust with bizarre social experiments like voucher systems, when in fact the problem is really very simple: You get what you pay for.

Your idea about changing English spelling is similar to the recent bit of extreme silliness in Germany with the "reformed spelling rules", according to which "daß" is now "dass". This boondoggle was supposed to make German spelling easier to learn because it's more "logical", although it's turned out to be no more logical than the system that came before it, and has only made things much more confusing. This is typical of the weird idea prevalent in Europe that some sort of institute or committee can dictate rules of language (people tell me that I'm not allowed to write "daß", so I always write "daß" just to piss them off). For some reason, many people over here don't realize that language is a biological, evolutionary phenomenon which is not under the control of "official rules", and the "language institutes" and "academies" are just committees of self-important idiots.

One thing I've learned coming from one country and living in another: some pretty ridiculous ideas can get a powerful grip on whole societies.

--
Always keep a sapphire in your mind

Today, I answer your prayers. by FreeLinux · 2003-05-01 08:24 · Score: 2, Informative

Do you mean like this?

Behold, he is the Quizat Haderac

Re:Today, I answer your prayers. by BrynM · 2003-05-01 08:29 · Score: 1

(kneeling at the oracle) I tried Ksamba, but couldn't get it to work or load and didn't get much help from anyone regarding it (this may be why SuSE doesn't include it). Good answer though. Have you gotten it to work?

--
US Democracy:The best person for the job (among These pre-selected choices...)

wrong on anatomy by b17bmbr · 2003-05-01 08:43 · Score: 1

bush is not another word for cunt. bush refers to the hair that would grow in the pubic region, as in "did you see her bush". however, the cunt is actually the vaginal region which woul dinclude the lips, the clit, and the actual vag, the hole. of course, being a slight, it would be analogous to a guy being called a dick. yet for women it is much worse, whereas the male genitalia is like man, outward, forceful, and simplistic, the vagina is inside, very personal, secretive and special, requiring gentility. so to cal a woman a cunt is to deride the very nature of her womanhood.

being a "dick", while an insult is sometimes a desirable male epithet, while for a woman, there can be no positive to be seen from being a cunt. ostracized by women, ignored or treated callously by men, the cunt is an outcast.

cunt is as powerful and emotive a word for women a the n-word is for blacks. bush is just slang for pubes. so, bush cannot be another word for cunt. cheers,

--
My problem? I was perfectly gruntled, until some numbnuts came by and dissed me.

Re:The regsiter can be nice by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 08:57 · Score: 0

Not just successful Americans, any Americans. They have been trying to get here, from whatever shithole they are living in now, for the last couple hundred years. Look at the number of immigrants that have come to the U.S. from europe.

I Stand Corrected by Landaras · 2003-05-01 09:05 · Score: 1

I contacted SuSE and you are quite correct. I have just purchased the appropriate 8.2 Professional discs directly from them, and am in contact with my reseller to ensure that he is aware of the license. I thank you for bringing this to my attention.

Even with the additional outlay of cash, I believe SuSE 8.2 to be well worth it. Thank you again for showing me the relevant language.

--
My legal education, in nifty podcast format

Spelling (was Re:Pronounciation) by jpetts · 2003-05-01 09:17 · Score: 1

would help the iliteracy problem in the US in any way.

Or even in Germany :-)

--
Call me old fashioned, but I like a dump to be as memorable as it is devastating - Bender

APT for .rpm dists= pretending to be a real dist by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 10:07 · Score: 0

C'mon fellas. Stopping trying to make your .rpm-based dist pretend to be a real dist. Get a real dist.

To update or ! to update... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 11:43 · Score: 0

I usually avoid the .0's. Currently i'm still using 7.2 which works absolutly fine. Now i'm not sure if i should use the "never change a running system" paradigm or if i should once more go trought the hell of updating suse (updates are usually a lot harder than a new install in my experience and it get's harder if you changed a lot in the system by yourself). I'd really like to see the new stuff (still using kde2 for example), but i really ain't sure if it's worth the stress...

Mhm, or would it be worth switching to another distro like debian or gentoo? I heard updates are not so problematic there... hard decission!

Re:To update or ! to update... by towatatalko · 2003-05-01 14:23 · Score: 0

It depends on what you what the system to do. For desktop I settled on Xandros Desktop Deluxe 1.0, which is better equipped for desktop use than most distros I've seen or used. For example I can open up my "c:/NTFS" partition with MS Windows and copy files from there wile working in KDE, or can login into Windows domain without a lot of Samba configuration, or have my Photoshop 6.0 installed and running as well as MS Office, which is done with CrossOver Office that comes with Deluxe edition of Xandros, etc., (otherwise it is a separate product that cost around $57 alone - new version 2.0 just came out).

Some people say why should MS apps be used while running Linux desktop. But that's a hard-line attitude and not business-like, because if you got a legal copy of MS Office and don't want to install Windows OS, still you can use it in Linux with CrossOver Office. Since Gimp is too limited for me and I need PowerPoint for my classes and presentations and OpenOffice or Star Office will not do things that I need, I'm happy with that solution of running MS apps on Xandros. Also in that category is Visio - a very useful tool, not to mention that I hope to run AutoCAD as well in the near future.

The only problem I have so far is that Java VM support in Internet Explorer 5.5/6.0 in CO Office has some problems, which is required for some applets to run such as financial streaming stock market data. But definitely, I can live without any rpm major Linux distribution that is out there including their newer version.

--

IP was invented for the sake of lawsuits.
Re:To update or ! to update... by grolschie · 2003-05-01 16:35 · Score: 1

Mhm, or would it be worth switching to another distro like debian or gentoo? I heard updates are not so problematic there... hard decission!

Debian is the way to go. No problemo to upgrade. With Gentoo you wait for ages while packages compile. If you really want that, you can compile your own optimized packages in Debian too. The Debian security and stability is second to none in the GNU/Linux arena.

I run the so-called "unstable" version (ie "Sid") of Debian so I get all the latest bells, whistles and sirens. Smooth as. I have become an update junkie, and download the latest version of everything daily. ;-)
Re:To update or ! to update... by pair-a-noyd · 2003-05-01 19:20 · Score: 1

Mandrake 9.0 sucked. I had a LOT of trouble with it.
But I stuck with it through thick and thin.

I set several friends up on it and they did pretty good but they left things alone as I set them up. They are NOT power users, very much n00bz..

I was forever power tweaking mine and it was hell.
I told one friend, "Your sh*t works because MY sh*t is f*cked up"... In other words I am the guinea pig for everyone else.

I was so pissed with MDK 9.0 that I tried Suse 8.1 and it was totally screwed. Constant and FREQUENT lock up. No kernel panic, just rock hard lock ups. I gave up on Suse 8.1 after two weeks and by that time Mandrake 9.1 was out. I wiped my disks clean and started totally fresh with 9.1 and it's worked pretty darn good since then, very few problems for me and my friends love 9.1, they like the eye candy more than anything..

That aside, I *LIKED* Suse 8.1, when I could keep it running. It looked nice, it seemed pretty nice but it was far too flakey for me. I am looking forward to try 8.2 as I have a few spare machines I could try it on first.

But for now, I'm going to keep Mandrake 9.1 on my main #1 machine and yes, I will forever stay away from the .0's
I should have remembered that lesson from the DOS days. I still have a factory original copy of IBM DOS 1.0, 2.0, 3.0, etc... I even have the tech reference manuals and the techinal repair manuals for PC, XT and AT's that I filched from a place I used to work as a tech, way back when..
Re:To update or ! to update... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 22:41 · Score: 0

Yeah, i've heard of long compile times for gentoo. If the stories are true it takes dayes to build up a complete new system. But once it is up, it should not hurt so much to update existing packages, or am i wrong there?

But Update junkie sounds like what i'd be if it where easier :) Only that i'm using an old suse for which mostly no packages exist, so every time i update it takes me ages and i've learned to be really careful, cause it often did also take ages to recover my system.
Re:To update or ! to update... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-01 23:43 · Score: 0

Clue:
You don't have one if you can't get a suse distro
up and keep it up.
I've used suse since 6.2 and only 7.3 was obviously bugged out.
Re:To update or ! to update... by pair-a-noyd · 2003-05-02 03:23 · Score: 1

Dude,

Clue.

Mobo/IRQ issues..
Re:To update or ! to update... by grolschie · 2003-05-02 11:32 · Score: 1

Always backup config files (eg: /etc/X11/XF86Config-4 ) to floppy. That way you can install/update as you like with minimal starting over.

With SuSE is pays to format and start over rather than upgrading from one to another. With Debian, not so.

With Gentoo I have heard bad stories about long compile times with updates also.

Hanging on to the Windows "thing" by kupci · 2003-05-01 17:01 · Score: 1

Here's one of my biggest reasons for using Linux. Control. You are the master of your domain, not M$. In fact, if you want to tinker with the OS, go for it.

I'd also be wondering about a company that sends back data (who knows what) when you register the OS. There was a big brouhaha about this a while back. Also, and I haven't verified this, but a colleague running XP claims that while he is surfing the net, the OS is sending data to m$.com. Now, he hasn't run a dump on the connection, but I'd be interested if anyone has any details on this, could be just a config issue, or just totally wrong, but (and here's the rub) I wouldn't put it past M$ to track every surfer's habits similar to doubleclick - this is valuable information.

Yeah, I think Windows has improved a bit, especially now with the competition from Linux. Look at their divulging the source code to the Chinese gov. and you get an idea of the tremendous influence Linux has had. Also, it's interesting to see the new Server 2003 ads the expound on the money saved. How you save money when you are spending not only for the license, new hardware required, cost to test and to upgrade your network etc etc - but hey that's marketing, always a schmooze. By the time you even begin to recoup your investment, there's Server 2005, after all that's the business model. I recall a while back when M$ was trumpeting some feature which was essentially something that had always been in Unix (ln -s I think, but according to M$ this was their extraordinary innovation).

So if you're a Windows Developer in a Windows World, but interested in peering into the skies at the other planets rest assured you can dabble with since, unlike M$, many popular tools are available for Linux are just as available for Windows since as open source they run happily on NT as on Unix. Furthermore, you can try cygwin or even Knoppix. As for VS studio, dunno, although you can check out the MONO project. There have been some threads recently of running VisualFoxPro on Linux using Wine, so maybe VB too... Better yet, take a look at the Eclipse project from which you could write any sort of scripts, PHP or whatever. KDevelop is amazing also - very familiar to the windows developer, don't fret, the Linux world is not requiring you to learn vi or Emacs..

Also, the new Linux distros are *very* cool in that much is already installed and configured for you. For example, I went to install mysql on my Mandrake box, when I realized I already had a version installed and running. One of the nice features of Mandrake which allows you to select the type of server you are running, i.e. database, web, games, file server, and install the appropriate packages.

Therefore, as far as installing Linux and being productive, you'd be surprised at how easy it is. In fact, check some comparisons at cnet, you might find that Windows config is actually more of a pain than Linux, my take is that this is because Linux is almost always installed rather than pre-installed like Windows. So by nature it has to be good, if not better than Windows. My personal experience with this has been that Windows (at least older versions, not sure about XP) is that it paints you into a corner and can be twice as frustrating as Linux upgrades.

Games. Linux could use some improvement here, but then you could get a PS2 or xbox, too right? Anyway, if you're interested in the vast expanding worlds of open source, grab a copy of SuSE, RedHat or Mandrake. You won't be disappointed.

Yeah, C# is out, there's a flicker of interest perhaps, but fleeting, who wants to go backwards? Too little, too late. I used to browse MSDN, eagerly await the latest copy of VS, get wrapped up in COM, and well, years have past and I haven't looked back since.

Re:My experience with SuSE 8.2 and gcc 3.3 by Ella+the+Cat · 2003-05-01 20:30 · Score: 1

I wasn't too happy when rebuilding stuff that had built out of the box under SuSE81 but threw up lots of errors using gcc 3.3 - mjpegtools and its various libraries and mplayer plugins, but with one exception these were minor problems with casts and initialisations or C++ back compatibility (stick LL or ULL on the end of constant long long values, use strstream not sstream in place of strstream.h). The exception was a piece of assembly code in the jpeg_mmx code that said a label appeared twice, turned out to be over zealous optimisation at -O6, (figured out with help from a friend), fixed by using __attribute__ ((noinline)). There's a typo in the zoran_update script that took a few minutes to fix.

I learned a bit more about fixing code and writing better code. I'm grateful to SuSE for introducing me to gcc 3.3.

I've done 2 upgrades and 1 died, so I had to do a clean install, but thanks to sensible partitioning my home directory didn't get trashed.

Thing is, I'm not complaining. It just seems petty to expect any Linux distro to be perfect, and what's the point of having the source if you don't want t get your hands a little dirty?

PS - If anyone knows why ctrl-alt-backspace doesn't let me quit my X server under SuSE82, with or without DontZap set, much appreciated

They modded you as Troll?!? by Anonymous Coward · 2003-05-02 02:23 · Score: 0

For saying 8,2 is OK?!?
Wow.
the moderators around here must be:
1) 12 years old
2) unable to listen to any sort of criticism, valid or not

I'm constantly amazed why people mod things the way they do.

Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes - suggestion by floorten · 2003-05-02 02:34 · Score: 1

If your Compaq comes with one of those recent Intel motherboards with on-board ethernet, the problem is the ethernet driver. Disable the ethernet, or download an alternative driver (kernel module) from the Intel site. Although the on-board ethernet detects correctly, the hardware is subtley different on the on-board version to the stand-alone version, and this difference causes a total system lockup, when using the pre-supplied kernel module.

Re:SuSE 8.2 freezes - suggestion by oever · 2003-05-02 03:24 · Score: 1

This does not explain the fact that other distro's do not freeze. Or does it?

--
DNA is the ultimate spaghetti code.

290 comments